Bought my first EV in December. BYD Seal. Simply the best vehicle I have ever driven with over 40 years of having my drivers licence. I test drove 5 different EV's. Legacy automakers are on notice.
I envy you! I am looking to replace my Lexus IS with a Seal eventually. I'm just waiting for the update because I feel the current suspension tune is not quite right
I envy you! I am looking to replace my Lexus IS with a Seal eventually. I'm just waiting for the update because I feel the current suspension tune is not quite right
Here in Brazil BYD is doing very well. They have a good product with a good price, we bought a dolphin and it's an excellent car especially in the city!
@@SERGIO-cr6uyIn Brazil, the cost of refueling a petrol car is 5 times the cost of an EV full recharge. I don’t think that even our high taxes will shorten that difference significantly.
Elon Musk footage from few years back criticising BYD and Chinese electric cars hasn't aged very well especially when Tesla's are made in China and use BYD batteries
To be honest, when I saw that interview I scoffed also. I remember that BYD model and it was pretty bad. Elon Musk himself has said that BYD will become Tesla’s biggest competitor. I remember an episode of Top Gear with Jeremy Clarkson and James May going to China and driving a slew of Chinese cars. Most of the episode involved them making fun of the Chinese makes but at the end of the episode they said that felt that we would all be purchasing Chinese cars in the future. That future is happening now. The Biden administrarton has got it and is doing everything it can to increase EV and battery manufacturing in the US. Europe seems to want to moan about protectionism (not that it might not be unfounded) but Europe needs to pull its finger out and increase manufacturing prowess.
This is what we need as consumers, since BYD launched in Ireland most of the manufacturers have started to drop prices. In my opinion, even at the discounts they've still got a way to go in order to be on par with the standard equipment included with the likes of BYD. VW is a perfect example, dropped prices by 10k for entry models but by the time one is specced up to match BYD you end up putting that back on the price tag.
BYD isn't doing massive sales in Ireland. I've seen a few BYD taxis but mostly it's MGs of which I own one. SIMI has the sales stats, but it's about 3x as many MGs were sold vs BYD. Ora sold 32 cars in the entire year so it's basically dead. I test drove a BYD Seal after Christmas and it seems like a reasonable car (except for putting the indicators on the wrong side of the stalk vs every other vehicle) and the dealer said they had 50 on backorder. I suspect therefore that the Seal and Dolphin will sell better than the Atto 3 did. But the odd thing about the Seal is it's quite expensive compared to its main rival the Model 3. To put in perspective, the reason I was test driving the Seal was because my wife was thinking of it or a Model 3 and wanted my opinion. In the end she saw Tesla selling a brand new Model Y RWD for €42,000 which is €7000 *less* than the base spec Seal. So she has ordered that instead.
@@drxym very true! The MG4 is a great example and with the Dolphin the likes of the ID3 might get on par sometime soon. I can't remeber is Peugeot or Renault is collaborating with Geely now too so even more options coming to the market in that segment. I'm waiting for a Seal myself and outside of Tesla there's very little comparable choice. There's nothing wrong with the Tesla just comes down to preference of the indivual buyer between the two manufacturers. Hope the MY goes well for yas 😊
Here in Brazil, the launch of the BYD Dolphin saw most EVs of similar or smaller sizes drop their prices by up to 15%. I'm very curious as to how the other brands will react to the Seagull (Dolphin Mini here) coming here in February at an even lower price point. Incidentally, the Dolphin only came here at the end of June and still managed to be the best selling EV in the country for the whole of 2023. A new model becoming the best selling car in its segment in the same year it was released is already impressive; it managing to do that despite being from an almost unknown brand in the country, and having only 6 months of sales to compete with the incumbents which were selling for the whole year, was unheard of.
@@FabioCapela that's great to hear, people need to realise that the new comes to our markets like BYD have been making EVs a lot longer than the European manufacturers and that brand loyalty needs to be put to the side.
Compared to Canada, Australia is so far ahead of us, our options are so limited and the EVs we can buy are expensive and not at the level of these Chinese brands. We are not only far behind but our attitudes are getting ever more protectionist. I'm envious of your market and the future of your market. The only thing that will wreck your market is trying to build EVs in Australia and putting up tariffs. Do what you do best and buy your cars from China and you will gain a competitive advantage.
@@limsim5225 No issues with the cold. I seen lots and lots of Teslas driving around in cold Alberta (-30c typical). Also my friend who has Tesla has never had any problems during winter driving.
Unless the US change their attitude to China, Canada will not import a single Chinese car due to, you know, national security issues as those cars contains spyware that can allow Chinese government to interfere the election and the money they make will be used to purchase weapons to suppress Uyghurs in Xinjiang.
Chinas EVs are so excellent because there are over 300+ EV manufacturers in China that has to compete with each other, so they are forced to innovate or get left behind, which is why each of their product they offer has to be the highest quality standard and the most affordable . Elon Musk even said himself this week, "Chinese automakers will 'demolish' global rivals without trade barriers", thats why the U.S government wants to ban Chinese EV makers and EU wants to raise tarrifs.
Exactly, there are more EV manufacturers competing in the Chinese market than there are in the rest of the world. This naturally means that prices go down while value goes up. The only hope foreign manufacturers could have would be if they show that they are able to succeed in the Chinese market .
Also the Chinese were smart enough to go with Tesla's auto fashion, high tech, updatable and minimalist interior, some of the Chinese companies even started new started new EV companies to I think appear new, fresh and high tech. Not many people believe legacy auto will be as good or as high tech asTesla
The Chinese car and EV sector is highly subsidized and politicized as a government initiative to dominate this industry globally. According to consulting firm AlixPartners, direct government subsidies to electric and hybrid vehicles (note EXCLUDING other transportation) was $57Bn b/w 2016 and 2022. Now with the EU investigating the subsidies, they've switched to a $72Bn tax incentive package for the same manufacturers over the next 4 years. That is just for the vehicle manufacturers, the subsidies to the upstream suppliers is much harder to track. According Nikkei Asia, CATL the largest battery supplier in China received $400m in direct subsidies in the first 6 months of 2023. Lastly, what foreigners are typically unaware of is the cheap financing provided to state directed industries in China. The Chinese banks provide very low cost and long term NON-COMMERCIAL loans to industries that the government directs. For most businesses in China, they are unable to obtain bank loans beyond 3 years and typically bank lending rates have been 5-7% range over the past decade. But if you investigate the solar industry from a decade ago, Chinese banks provided 10+ year loans at 2-3% or even lower funding, calling these structured/project financing, but in reality these were backed by guarantees and government directives. On that basis, the amount of low cost long term funding for the EV/car sector in China could be in the hundreds of billions. The EV sector will track that of the solar sector. Once China feels it is sufficiently dominant globally, it will withdraw all the subsidies. And just like the solar sector, 90% of the companies will go bankrupt, along with their so-called "warranties" and post sale purchase. In summary China never competes on a level playing field, it seeks to take over certain sectors it sees as strategic on global basis and will seek to use this as economic coercion/leverage. EU and any other markets that are seeking to cooperate with China should be aware of these. Furthermore the draconian "net zero" policies being pursued by western politicians is playing right into the Chinese strategy and all such politicians should be investigated for their personal income to check for conflict of interests. Enjoy handing money to an authoritarian state that will use its economic leverage to force you onto your knees.
Explain the chips subsidies that U.S just passed through congress? Your arguments is always whataboutism lol. Don't hate Chinas advancements and be happy because you're allowed to buy affordable things all thanks to China.
@@ruleoftwo6174 No that is one wall of text coated in hypocritic western bullshit. Western vehicle manufacturers both are and have received massive government subsidies all the way back to the beginning of the 20th century. To demand global south countries not subsidise industry have been a common western tactic to keep the GS underdeveloped, but the west subsidies their own industry and China`s economy have grown enough for China to exert its sovereignty over its production sector in the same way western nations did and does over their own manufacturing and since China does it better the west is hypocritically complaining.
A great presentation by Simone really well thought out. I can’t believe the negativity in some of the comments by viewers about EVs and sheer ignorance about the quality of Chinese vehicle manufacturing. I don’t know where commentators are getting these ideas but it is not from recent reviews of Chinese vehicles made and written by people whose job it is to critically evaluate new vehicle releases. Keep up the good work Fully Charged and once again it’s great to hear a review from Australia.
US spent 300 million dollars each year to Anti-China propaganda and train journalists how to write negative article about China, no wonder so many people know nothing about China but hate everything about China,sad.
@@darrylweidenhofer Ah, so you prefer to lgnore reaI-worId facts, data and history in favour of an artificiaI worId view created by those with whom you closely associate? I think you're the one in a cuIt, my guy.
@TD1237 for a start you don't know me and what I believe. Gm has cancelled their electric cars so has Toyota Gm is next. The second biggest electric charging company in Aus just went broke
Inflation on EVs in the US? Everywhere else on earth prices are coming down. In Europe Tesla lowered it's prices like 3 times within the past year. They've shaved somewhere in the vicinity of 25% off the price on new vehicles, in order to be able to compete with the chinese. Actually, not just the chinese. They are also competing with their own used cars, since the second hand market for EVs has exploded.
even Chinese don't buy it, in Europe this EV's are blocking all ports bcz they can't sell it! it's a huge failure, the quality is bad! they only produced only EV bcz they are relatively easy to build, but the reliability is bad!
Here in Malta, the local VW dealer seems to have given up getting the VW ID 3 and ID 4. I am sure it is because it had a hard time selling any of them when the MG4 is across the road and the BYD Atto can be purchased here for thousands less.
Oh wow, coming across another Maltese on Fully Charged! Agreed 100%. I was at Fully Charged Live in Amsterdam, and noticed a couple of things. First of all, most legacy automakers refused to attend. Goes to show how seriously they're taking the EV revolution. But also, seeing cars from the likes of Zeekr particularly, as well as Tesla, all under one roof, it doesn't take very long to realise that the non-EU vehicles are simply better by almost every metric. I have been in a Porsche Taycan once, and without any doubt, the Zeekr 001 had better materials used for the interior. And the best? Retail price of 60,000 euro, compared to the over 50,000 of a VW ID4 made with cheap plastic and a crappy infotainment system. It's honestly a no-brainer, and they'd better be pulling their socks up - along with the Japanese too.
@@wallace6228 We don't have any local representation for NIO. Plus I personally don't see their selling point, other than battery swapping, which I find to be added complexity.
@@lucaandreamifsudbuhagiar9375 It depends the definition of "better car" because there is no way a Zeekr is beter than Porsche Taycan not in performance nor charging speed, or simply driving quality. I don t think so. And the 2025 Taycan or the coming Macan E will even blow the competition away. The segment where chinese will do great is mid segment. When it comes to high end segment Porsche and other german brand like Audi, Mercedes will dominate at least in Europe and likely the US.
@@Ben734 Mate, that is absolutely not true. The citizens of Australia deserve to be able to buy a cheap, quality, green car. It's up to USA, Germany, Italy and Japan to come up with equivalent, with equivalent price, or better. The people of Australia are not responsible for these Combustion Car makers (and Petrol extortions) making huge profits at our expense. Our government is responsible for our interests, not theirs. Having these Combustion car makers and Petrol extortionist IS A NATIONAL SECURITY for the people.
@@dranzacspartan8002 Unfortunately sarcasm doesn't translate over the internet. I only wish we get Chinese EVs in the states to force some competition here. But of course it's a "national security" threat, as usual, here in the US.
@@Ben734 Ha ha! Got you! What I've picked up is to conclude with "/s" at the end of the statement. I've got caught out many times myself. Someone pointed this out to me, so I'm passing it forward. Great to chat with rational people.
Wont happen, chines cares are only this cheap because the ccp is subsodising every car to undercut the global market. If you buy chines cares you support supression of 1,4 billion people by the ccp and support there war efforts against the west. Chines cars should be banned for sale in western countrys. And not only because of political reasons, the qulity is just subpar and i do not rhink that there is a chines word for quality controll.
Completely agree with your closing remarks. The more competition there is, the better it is for us as consumers. Car prices have been too high for too long. Blows my mind that European law makers are spinning the increase in competitive pressure from Chinese automakers and the collapse of car prices for consumers is something bad.
The collapse in car prices is bad for the German economy and workers, that's what the problem is. It's the same reason why Japan is dragging it's heels: too many vested interests.
The point is that the automakers industry is one of the biggest employers. Therefore, there is a discussion whether there carbon emission reductions worth the jobs that will be lost to China. There is no easy solution.
When Australia-China relationship continues to improve, I am confident that Chinese EV manufacturers would invest in Australia and malke EV as Australian cars.
No. Au market is too small to setup a car factory. From business point of views. That was why most car manufacturers stopped factories in Au in the past. Not every cost effective. Only less than 30 people and no countries bordered with Au comtiminent. Unlike eu.
What on earth makes you think the Australia-China relationship is going to improve? China is basically turning into big North Korea. Xi is hardly focused on improving relations with democratic countries. Note how China has recently sentenced to death an Australian citizen on questionable charges, hasn't removed tariffs on Aussie wine and other goods etc.
Australia, like the United States, is not a reliable and truly free economy country. It is a political country, so it is impossible to have its own high automobile manufacturing industry.
One extra point why the Chinese manufacturers are so successful Down Under: China is a major export market for both Australia and New Zealand. We both have Free Trade Agreements, and the cars don’t incur tariffs here.
In NZ 90% of our milk powder goes there, plus kiwi fruit etc, etc, in return we import just about everything that is manufactured like solar panels and batteries and so on. Bunnings would have a hard time if that connection was cut.
Unless you’re in the Australian wine, beef and wheat industries which incurred Chinese tariffs of >%120 because Australia hurt President Xi’s fee fees in 2020 for the hideous crime of calling for an inquiry in to the origin of Covid. Have you forgotten already?
Excellent reporting Simone. Really interesting material which is on the minds of most Aussie potential EV purchasers. The BYD Dolphin is a standout favourite of mine but @15:49, the swept area of the rear wiper blade is tiny. Makes you question whether it's worth having it. See you at Electrify Everything.
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Brands do not care. Everything from phone companies to home construction companies. Chasing the new customer, and they do not give a damn about their existing customers. Car insurance is a great example. Watch your premium go up in year 2. I now change insurance companies almost every year. Much better premiums as a new customer, than as a renewing one.
What brand loyalty? Everything is made with the cheapest junk from the cheapest supplier, who is often in China anyway. No car brand is designing and making their own parts anymore they are just assembling random crap (It doesn't matter if it's ICE or EV it's all the same)
If you look back history, Germany products were used to be described as trash by British. Just similar to all the distrust on Chinese products right now. Sometimes preconception hold people back from reality, just be open minded.
Here in Thailand, many Chinese EV brands here now and Thailand is quite big EV market from few years ago with price policy support from Thai government and support EV charge infrastructure. Now Thailqnd is going to be a manufactured hub for EV nrands.
When we shut down our car industry in Australia we also lost our skills. Now we just modify US barges by changing them over to right-hand drive. Australian design rules for cars need to be dumped too. They were there to protect our car industry. There's no reason we can't do what the Kiwis do and accept a car if it meets UK standards. I don't believe we'll make cars here again. We don't have the national fervour for it anymore. Our politicians and industry leaders are happy to dig up and ship out the raw materials and pocket the loot. We used to be the lucky country now we're just dumb as f**k.
Totally agree. The problem is we are not innovative. We don't invent or produce anything new. The only thing we have been doing is using our land for mining or farming. Mining can only last for so long, and farming? it will be only as good until another country gives a better price. I would love to see Australia put more resources into producing and keeping tech in Australia. I'm not too smart, but maybe an Australian funded university dedicated to STEM that filters into Australian sponsored companies. I mean China has a share in many companies which brings in profit. Might be time that Australians try some China modelling instead of just following the U.S.
I think it's called resource-curse, often associated with resource rich, yet underdeveloped sub-Saharan Africa -- obviously the petro-rich Norway is an exception here.
To get market share, Tesla introduced really good EVs for top $$$ prices, outside of normal ICE cars. They did well, so other manufacturers rushed in to copy Tesla. However that exposed the budget sector (= normal ICE car prices) ready to be snapped up by anyone able. So guess what happened? All I need, personally, is a decent reliable A to B car. I don't care about gadgets, I don't want wall to wall computers and infotainment; I want to go from A to B at a sensible price in an everyday car. Would be nice if the sound system is good; thats it. I can wind up and down my own windows. Building sensible everyday EVs is what the Chinese are now doing. Other manufacturers - can stop their price gouging or collapse.
The small EVs from China sold in Australia are still more expensive than a similarly sized ICE car. Cheapest Corolla hybrid. $32K + ORC Cheapest eV MG4 51. $40k + ORC. Cheapest petrol MG5 sedan $25k driveaway. It's the ICE vehicles from China that are significantly cheaper
@@rjbiker66 That will change very soon. In the EU an MG4 costs around €32k. In April this year, the Citroën dealers are flooded with the €24k costing Citroën ë-C3 with a 320km range, LFP batteries, 100kW charging. That is about in the same class as the MG4, but €7k cheaper. In September Renault will come on the market with the Renault R5 E-Tech with 400km range, prices start around €25k. At the moment the Chinese can get away with overpricing their EV's, coarse the EU and USA build EV's start at €40k and up. When the Stellantis EV's come with those prices, China will follow.
Exactly. We have a lovely Mercedes saloon- and a plain, old people mover on its last tyres. A cheap hatchback for dogs and builderstuff would be lovely too❤
Tesla pursues environmental protection just like Apple removes the charging head and removes many additional components. I think they can get rid of the dashboard and replace the seats with wooden ones, which will be more environmentally friendly.
The real problem is *NOT* the loss of expertise in the West (after all we are _"100 years ahead in combustion engine"_ manufacturing). The real problem is all the big traditional car companies spent 20 years bad mouthing and fighting against EVs. Not one single traditional car maker even tried to make a true pure EV until just the last couple years (GM kinda sorta made a half decent effort for a while). Tesla was violent shock therapy to the traditional car manufactures. Sadly, it may be too little too late.
China made it their goal to develop and produce evs 9 years ago because of this '100 year' reason. There ev policy is common knowledge, so all the legacy auto makers knew this was Chinas' auto future and yet did nothing about it. Now they are paying the price.
There are many reasons why it's hard for Australians to manufacture cars: - "High salary", As a developed country, Australia has a high average salary and shorter working hours, which raise the cost of manufacturing. - "Dutch disease", Australia exports a lot of natural resources, which leads to an unusually high exchange rate for the Australian dollar. It reduces the competitiveness of industrial exports. - "Smaller scale", Australia's auto market is not large - which leads to a weaker scale effect and higher margin cost on manufacturing. In addition, there are many more reasons regarding education, immigration policy, culture, etc. So for now, it seems that maintaining stable trade relations, improving EV laws, and increasing investment in grid-charging facilities are favorable choices. Australia has the opportunity to realize the most advanced energy supply system (through EVs, digital grid, and renewable energy) as soon as possible, to operate solutions and services for foreign countries to profit.
Salary is not the primary issue. Because current automobile manufacturing uses a large number of automated assembly lines. Low-level workers are almost no longer needed.
Australia should focus on things it is good at: FARMING. It has huge land mass good weather, and plenty of customers around the world. Its a pleasure and satisfaction to feed more and more people.
To be honest, I think I speak for several people when I say I am somewhat ENVIOUS that Australia is getting the EV's & the Ute's/Pickups that we will never see in Canada... Choices & Options with respectable pricing will get butts in seats and fast. It would be great to see Australian Made EV's ! You have everything needed in your own yard for a complete sector in OZ. There are options from Partnerships or gathering the current "specialty" makers in AU together.
Hi from Oz, it is awesome to finally get some RHD EVs in Oz, there's ACE EV company in Oz, hopefully they're still going. I'm sure if Canada did a Norway and carbon taxed ICEV and incentivised EVs it could happen, or would that make the US angry or jelly, hope Canada can get some EVs soon.
It would be good to see Aussie made EVs but the last couple of governments did all they could to shut down our vehicle manufacturing industry, I doubt we have the infrastructure now to be competitive.
@@stuartcoyle1626 the ACE EV is probably going to have a lot of Chinese parts, if they sell enough they could make some parts them selves or someone might make them, I think we still make some auto parts. I'm guessing they'll press the panels. So hopefully not impossible.
@@FrunkensteinVonZipperneck Agreed. We still have the mentality of just digging stuff up, throwing it in a ship and exporting it only to re-import it when someone else has done the work of extracting/refining/smelting.
One advantage of living in Australia, something like 50% of the houses now have solar. Charge for free. With solar feeding the grid, we have now had some weekend summer days where the entire country is being powered by solar.
The Model 3 didn't sell that well, the Model Y did. So I think the impact will be minor unless BYD drop the price of the seal or release the cheaper smaller battery version. Real test may be when the larger Seal is released here
Sandy Munro summed up the Chinese push very well. He said the Chinese have been playing chess for a long time while legacy OEMs have been playing checkers, presumably thinking they were in the same game.
What a great presenter and with a real accent, not sounding like an extra of 'It ain't half hot mum'. Also, a brilliant display showing that our first nations people are world class.
Thanks for a very interesting report! Please keep it up. Altho i am still in shock from what Elliott said: A Chinese company makes an EV that is better than the Mercedes and for 1/3 the price! 1/3!!!?
@@SmaziSmau-zn7jyThat's actually true if you've actually drove one... German cars needs to do better , their days of just counting on brand name is gone .. Consumers are smart nowadays 😊
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
tried a Chinese EV once in China last year, I know my next car will be EV, quiet, easy to drive, smart, no need to go to patrol station anymore for daily use.
It's good to have competition across the sector. Maybe the legacy car makers will stop forcing the giant heavy expensive SUV EVs onto the market when they start seeing affordable Chinese EVs taking over. They will either adapt and improve their own lineup or they will be forgotten.
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Great presentation EVs do change things, because more than ICE they open the potential for additive manufacture. This style of manufacture is less dependent on scale so could provide Australia new opportunities. There is a problem though, government regulations make it hard to get anything going.
BYD and other Chinese EV won't get a chance to make it to Canada, because Canada is following the US with many restrictive rules. Seems like Australia, Japan, and western Europe, many Chinese brands made it ashore. However, considering policies that are implemented in the EU, not sure how long any Chinese brand can stay there.
@@futo Mexico is the backdoor key. I'm not too worried about these so called import controls. They ban or restricted nVidia from exporting chips to China, but in the end, it still ended up in China. Money will go where money wants to go.
While we experience dual revolutions in industry and technology, we're also witnessing the effects of the differences between market-controlled and centrally controlled economies. For all the talk about communism vs. democracy, the Chinese have maintained a laser focus for decades on becoming *the* vertically integrated powerhouse in manufacturing. And western governments have been all too eager to facilitate the gutting domestic manufacturing sectors, bowing to corporate masters in search of greater and greater profits. Of course this is all extremely short sighted. For, as countries rely ever more on foreign suppliers, they become increasingly dependent on those foreign countries; particularly those that care first and foremost for that which is within their own borders. As countries achieve manufacturing dominance, they expand into technology. This inevitably results in the now seriously weakened market-controlled economies being relegated to mere consumers. This is a downward spiral that doesn't end well for western economies. Technology is, as they say, a double-edged sword. For, with domestic reserves of anything from lithium to sodium, as well as access to renewable energy generation from solar, wind, hydro, geothermal and/or tidal, most nations now have the ability to achieve energy, industrial and economic independence. In the case of Australia, it makes zero sense to export lithium to China for processing and battery manufacture, only to have said batteries power vehicles manufactured in and exported from China. Heck, even if a country didn't have a base for things like steel or aluminum manufacturing, vehicle chassis can even be made from carbon fiber. Countries such as Australia, the UK and others *must* stand up battery and vehicle manufacturing capabilities. Either that, or they wait for the day when they're left with few choices but to import most of the products needed for their countries to function. Just as with climate change, this shift is gradual. Nonetheless, it's very real and comes with potentially devastating consequences should presidents, prime ministers and legislatures continue to ignore reality.
Yes, the Reagan/Thatcher era was the end of either country and the UK in particular being actual producers of goods. We don't make anything in the UK. That's one of the reasons why Brexit was always going to be a disaster because when you are a country that merely pieces together imported parts from other countries it's REALLY STUPID to reduce your ability to import parts from other countries. Brand loyalty is another important issue. I had three Ford Fiestas and when I was ready to swap to an EV Ford had nothing suitable for me. So I went to Nissan and their Leaf has served me very well for eight years. It's no good sticking to a brand if they can't offer you a better blend of function and affordability than the new boy on the block. The legacy motor companies should have moved far more quickly on this. Now they are fighting for their lives and many of them are fighting dirty - in many cases quite literally as they produce more gas guzzlers when they're supposed to be reducing them.
@@viktorianas By a Japanese company that only came here as a gateway to the European market and is only staying because of the government's post Brexit bribe.
Unlike western governments China does not have fossil fuels corporate overlords who pull the strings of government to meet their profit goals. Logical that China would go straight to EVs as they have very little oil and gas reserves. The efficiency of EVs of every type and size surely is lowering their use of oil for transportation significantly.
The point is that we are living in an EV dictatorship. There are other options instead of batteries, such as renewable fuels and fuel cell. But the western governments are imposing that the only option is battery tech, since they don’t want to depend on ethanol from 3rd world economies. Doing so, they are letting China dominate the carmakers industry.
Over the last 15 years I have been reading over the internet that BYD EVs are rubbish, explosive, bad quality. And now BYD is already one of the leading EV manufacturer in the world.
There’s some very negative views about EV’s on this channel. Does anyone on here remember the Swiss Watch industry in the 1970’s? It used to be absolutely massive! Everyone had a Swiss watch. The Swiss Rolex / Omega watches we see today are all that remain of it. No one ever talks about Timex or is even aware of them now. The Japanese digital quartz watch took over at scale in the late 70’s and early 80’s and the mechanical mainspring (wind-up) Swiss watch just faded away… Digital grew from strength to strength and has predominately become…An Apple iPhone. Something quite different! It a paradigm shift in thinking and we’re living through it again right now. Take care.
Chery also makes non EV cars which we get in South Africa and Chery is easily my favourite car brand now. Their cars are brilliant. Their 2 litre turbo has excellent power and their build and material quality is simply amazing. A Chery Tiggo 8 for example costs half the price of a Mercedes GLB yet it has more technology and way way better build and material quality. The Mercedes feels like a cheap product yet costs double the Chery. Brand loyalty is definitely dead because consumers are tired of being taken for a ride by excessively high prices and minimal features from legacy manufacturers. Can't wait for Chery's EVs.
I think the best case for Australia is battery production, that I think will be exported to Thailand/Malaysia and the USA (since we have a free trade agreement that still gives subsidise in the USA) to build the vechicals. We have high labour cost (yay) which makes it hard to compete but we have great universities and a highly educated populace. So highly automated manufacturing like battery manufacturing can happen but car production requires far more workers.
We already mine plenty of minerals that are shipped across the planet to be refined and shipped back. There is at least one Aussie company about to produce batteries suited to our climate much better than the imports intended for Europe etc.@@rjbiker66
@@rjbiker66 Shipping batteries requires far fewer ships (and emissions) compared to shipping the raw materials to make a battery, or shipping the vehicles that use the battery. Far better to ship just the battery, and then 'assemble' the vehicle at the destination
I don't think wages costs are such a big deal. Modern battery factories are so highly automated they don't employ a lot of people. I imagine supply chain and energy costs, for example, would be more important.
China started its foundemental research in EV techonology since Project 863, a set of pilot research projects announced in march(3rd month) 1986. Which means China had been working on this for almost 40 years. Project 863 research area includes mainly Biotechnology, Space, Information technology, Laser technology,Automation Energy, New materials later add on : Telecommunications (1992) Marine technology (1996)
@@tooltalk If that's what your verdict is, then there really isn't any need to expIain to you. You'd just d eny any real information in favour of what suits you best.
@@tooltalk Nothing of it is stolen. Some of it might come from technology transfer, but nothing of what is sold to international markets from China is stolen. Something might be claimed stolen, but that is like claiming Iraq had WMD`s in 2003.
Ah some communist party mythology. All the parts in a modern EV are technologies developed across the globe, what China does incredibly well is manufacture consumer goods, they skipped having to develop, refined, clean engines and have leap frogged ahead. Doesn't take anything away from the achievement, but mythology is not required.
Excellent segment covering a good deal of subtopics in well less than twenty minutes. Excellent host with an excellent persona, outlook and researched opinion devoid of disingenuous politics. Bravo. We will all net benefit from the Chinese EV boom.
1. Chinese cars sell more expensive in Europe, this will worsen as the new anti-China tariffs drop. 2. Chinese cars barely have any brand recognition/acceptance, they'll need a few more years to gain ground.
Partly due to Chinese brands needing to build showrooms and service centres, etc... the costs of which are added onto the sale price (pushing prices up)
By what measure? Average new asking sale cost of model launched or discounts Vs asking price available... Both trends in Europe counter your statement, they haven't gone down that far but they are coming down but stop making things up
Yeah, instead EU is crying about how China is giving their car industry subsidies... As if Germany and France weren't doing that themselves... While still failing to produce price competitive products...
The problem in Australia's small market is the dealers; at the cheap end of the market there is very little in it for them - low prices and minimal servicing will make them unwilling to sell the cheaper brands.
@@theharper1 I am talking about the difference between dealer distribution and manufacturer direct. Manufacturers can have showrooms, test drives etc. Like Apple stores. But specifically would I buy without test driving - only if I knew the experience already (eg model S vs model 3, or having been in an uber etc)
I think dealers will be fine for some time yet. EVs still need servicing and some of these cars have somewhat rare parts for 12v battery, tyres, wipers etc. plus auto mechanics trained in electric drive systems that won't be widely available so people will be inclined to go back to the dealer for replacements & repairs. That'll change eventually of course as EVs become more common place but there is still income to be had here. Also, I think the markup on these Chinese cars for dealers must be pretty large compared to some manufacturers.
AFFORDABILITY should be the number 1 priority for any government that wants its citizens to adopt EVs. Luxury EVs can't be adopted by masses. Customers want more variety and something affordable especially when its their first ever experience on an EV
One things for sure is that competition stimulates better value and innovation as manufacturers try to win customers. About time too as buying a car has become unaffordable for many.
Family adopted first EV with BYD ATTO3 and loving it as family city ride in Kuala Lumpur, us family “fight over” it and logic whoever travel most days got to use it alternative to our ICE fleet 😎
It's eminently stoppable assuming other auto manufacturers pull their fingers out of their backsides and produce compelling vehicles to compete with what China is making. I have an MG 4 in Ireland and there was simply nothing else out there for the same price and performance. The nearest Euro vehicles, things like the ID.3 or Renault Megane cost more money with worse spec so why am I as a consumer going to buy those other cars? I actually *wanted* a Megane until I saw the price and how the RHD version had a gimped screen and so I changed my mind. That said, I don't see BYD cars being as good value as they should be. Cars like the Atto 3 aren't the same value proposition as an MG 4 and that probably explains why there are so few of them in Ireland. And the Ora brand is basically dead as a doornail - they didn't even sell 50 cars despite extensive advertising - again too expensive. When I collected my MG last May the dealer told me he knew someone who had hundreds of Oras in stock in every spec because nobody was buying them. I wonder what happened to them now that 2024 has rolled around.
The Chinese prefer to have a lot of space for rear passengers and this leads to a smaller boot. This is the case with the Ora Cat and it is expensive, weird looking and has an impractical boot, so nobody wants it. The BYD Dolphin has room in the back but the boot is a little bit on the small side, but it will sell because it is such a good car. It is hard for these manufacturers because they have to start from almost nothing. MG already had a dealer network so is easier to sell its cars. Also the MG was tuned in the UK for European markets and that certainly helped. I have seen loads of MG4 EV cars in the UK with only Tesla cars being more popular. There is certainly a market for EVs if the price, specification and quality is right. I will probably buy the Dolphin next year.
they are all shipped from China so the costs are similar, in NZ the Atto 3 is much more competitive and sells well, but I could not get used to the interior design, so that is why I have an MG.
Free market and a free world, buy as you wish. But consider that supporting companies that our an Ally will have knock on positive consequences to your market, versus the alternative. Everyone buys something from China, but these purchases there are alternatives, imo.
I just got the BYD Dolphin in Finland. For me the options were the MG4 and the Dolphin. I did consider the ID3 but it's just way too expensive and doesn't feel even close to as premium as the Dolphin. The premium feel and LFP batteries were also the reason i chose the Dolphin over the MG4, even though it was a good bit more expensive.
Byd Atto 3,dominates sales here in ASEAN. MG is the second best selling brand in Thailand, after Byd. While in Malaysia it's also Atto 3 in top spot while MG brand should be coming soon. with Malaysia where
We need a UK car industry that is self-sufficient, with a secure supply chain, able to scale up to make EVs affordable. Look at Renault and the up-coming R5, etc.
BYD did suck 10 years ago lol. In China BYD was literally a meme and a standard for low quality cheap cars. Its reputation only started to change in recent years as they figure out how to build good EVs.
Since the end of 2019 I am trying to find all Chinese BEV manufacturers. Just found two additional ones yesterday. I personally don't dig a car but one of those BEV cargo trikes for less than €800. China will now tank the entire US, European and Japanese legacy auto industry.
Finally there are car companies who make cars offer good quality, more functionalities, more advanced technology, and most of all reasonable price tag. What more can anyone ask for? This should be a good thing for the consumers. I hope consumers around the world should realize that you have been cheated and ripped off by the superficially high price tag set by your greedy auto companies and system you are living in. For example, the cost of an iPhone 15 is no more than $20UDS but Apple sells it for no less than $1600USD. That is the reality of how American companies cheated and ripped off American consumers and consumers around the world.
I’m in eastern Canada. We can’t get China produced cars here. Considering the way our PM handled politics with the Chinese leader, I believe we’re not going to see any soon…😢
@@herrwolf5184 No, we have a representative democracy and right now, it's a disaster. And our EV market is god awful, very expensive, no decent choices. I'd take Australia over Canada any day.
I have no issues with Chinese EV's. I currently have a Kona Electric and when the lease ends this year I might have a BYD Atto 3. I'm interested in tech and how a car makes life easier.
@@MrGearoid65 it's perfect to be honest. I don't have to worry about battery degredation and I can lease newer cars with newer battery tech when it comes out.
As is typical, the BIG brands had the advantage and blow it. GM, Ford, etc are all very good at this. Most new EV’s are $60K and go way up. The average buyer is struggling just to put groceries on the table and can’t afford this. So the Chinese will own the affordable car market, just like with TV’s and most everything else.
Who would have thought that normal people who want a cheap vehicle that goes A to B would become popular... All i want is a car that goes from A to B and sometimes to C has no useless infotament crap that when it breaks costs fortune to repair. The less car has all that modern crap tech the better.
There is at least one thing that could cause problems for the Chinese EV manufacturers. Military problems in the Taiwan Strait. Like it or not, as long as the PRC claims sovereignty over the island of Taiwan, geopolitics will play a role in the worldwide availability of Chinese EVs.
The problem is not China claiming sovereignty over their own territory, but western countries US in particular meddling in Chinese internal affairs funding separatism within Chinese territory. You can contemplate how US or where ever you live would have reacted to Chinese overtly funding and arming separatists in your countries territory.
Suggestion: Ask your remote interviewed people to look at the camera. Remind them it may be a podcast, but it’s also on UA-cam. (How do you feel when talking with someone that never looks at you?)
We have moved to a global economy, as we didn't want to do the factory work and people moved away from that. We need to remember how much we get from China, otherwise we will leave them with all of the resources and have to pay double for something made at home!
Change the tax rules... abolish LCT, stamp duty _and_ FBT* on BEVs! That would probably *double* BEV uptake. Oh, and don't make BEVs pay a 'mileage tax' to make up for fuel excise losses, rego should cover it. (*No convoluted rules for exemption, just exempt BEVs, period.)
I agree, we need to do this for the people and the planet, we're poisoning our selves, are we smart or just selfish. All the particulates are cancer causing, we need to tax these cancer causing vehicles out of existence. Lets hope there's some affordable vehicles soon.
Let's hope Australia's charging infrastructure is forging ahead, making great strides throughout the cities and country in preparation for accelerated EV adoption on that continent. Aussies already have twice the rooftop solar production that we do in the US and continuing to add to their solar production---both rooftop and commercial and building out effective charging networks for those who live in apartments, etc. Very inspiring show, people! Thank you! Peace
Interestingly BYD has a product that would be great for Australia the Seagull but the BYD distributor will not bring it here. A small EV for less than 20g is a game changer for EV uptake. So once again we are being dictated to about what we can have. The changes that were previously proposed when the car manufacturing was being wound up would have stopped this situation. We were meant to be able to import our own cars if manufacturers weren't willing to bring their product here. On a separate note having 800v based cars would be a plus for us, hopefully they make it to Oz 😊
@@ADudesRotary I'm sure the seagull will be sold here it might need so minor tweeking so it receives a 5 star ANCAP safety rating. Dont be surprised if it arrives sometime in 2025.
Bought my first EV in December. BYD Seal. Simply the best vehicle I have ever driven with over 40 years of having my drivers licence. I test drove 5 different EV's. Legacy automakers are on notice.
Wait till it gets older.
What makes you think it won't last long? Do you know how many Taxi drivers choose EV car as cab in last decade?@@miskatonic6210
Less mechanical parts less problems, less worries.
I envy you! I am looking to replace my Lexus IS with a Seal eventually. I'm just waiting for the update because I feel the current suspension tune is not quite right
I envy you! I am looking to replace my Lexus IS with a Seal eventually. I'm just waiting for the update because I feel the current suspension tune is not quite right
Here in Brazil BYD is doing very well. They have a good product with a good price, we bought a dolphin and it's an excellent car especially in the city!
we bought a dolphin and it's an excellent car -only in the city!
The quality of China EV is very good.
A few years ago, there were no China cars in Malaysia, but now China cars can be seen everywhere.
@@jogana6909There 3 major races in Malaysia We LOVED one another YES !
@@SERGIO-cr6uyIn Brazil, the cost of refueling a petrol car is 5 times the cost of an EV full recharge. I don’t think that even our high taxes will shorten that difference significantly.
and will last about 2 years---wake up
Elon Musk footage from few years back criticising BYD and Chinese electric cars hasn't aged very well especially when Tesla's are made in China and use BYD batteries
Lol, that's true. Tbf he probably didn't even believe what he was saying. That guy says anything to make gain popuIarity.
To be honest, when I saw that interview I scoffed also. I remember that BYD model and it was pretty bad. Elon Musk himself has said that BYD will become Tesla’s biggest competitor. I remember an episode of Top Gear with Jeremy Clarkson and James May going to China and driving a slew of Chinese cars. Most of the episode involved them making fun of the Chinese makes but at the end of the episode they said that felt that we would all be purchasing Chinese cars in the future. That future is happening now.
The Biden administrarton has got it and is doing everything it can to increase EV and battery manufacturing in the US. Europe seems to want to moan about protectionism (not that it might not be unfounded) but Europe needs to pull its finger out and increase manufacturing prowess.
Things change
Chinese EVs were terrible at the time. They’re now not too bad, and Elon has stated that they are who he sees as competition for Tesla.
Nothing Elon says ages well ...
It is a good thing that Australian consumers have more choices.
In the states, we cannot buy any Chinese car, that is very bad
I want these choices in Canada!
The sales price of the same model in Australia is much lower than that in Europe.
This is what we need as consumers, since BYD launched in Ireland most of the manufacturers have started to drop prices. In my opinion, even at the discounts they've still got a way to go in order to be on par with the standard equipment included with the likes of BYD. VW is a perfect example, dropped prices by 10k for entry models but by the time one is specced up to match BYD you end up putting that back on the price tag.
BYD isn't doing massive sales in Ireland. I've seen a few BYD taxis but mostly it's MGs of which I own one. SIMI has the sales stats, but it's about 3x as many MGs were sold vs BYD. Ora sold 32 cars in the entire year so it's basically dead. I test drove a BYD Seal after Christmas and it seems like a reasonable car (except for putting the indicators on the wrong side of the stalk vs every other vehicle) and the dealer said they had 50 on backorder. I suspect therefore that the Seal and Dolphin will sell better than the Atto 3 did. But the odd thing about the Seal is it's quite expensive compared to its main rival the Model 3. To put in perspective, the reason I was test driving the Seal was because my wife was thinking of it or a Model 3 and wanted my opinion. In the end she saw Tesla selling a brand new Model Y RWD for €42,000 which is €7000 *less* than the base spec Seal. So she has ordered that instead.
@@drxym very true! The MG4 is a great example and with the Dolphin the likes of the ID3 might get on par sometime soon. I can't remeber is Peugeot or Renault is collaborating with Geely now too so even more options coming to the market in that segment. I'm waiting for a Seal myself and outside of Tesla there's very little comparable choice. There's nothing wrong with the Tesla just comes down to preference of the indivual buyer between the two manufacturers. Hope the MY goes well for yas 😊
@@ateiviz ID.3 is really really cheap in China, with cars like Dolphin entering more markets I would see VW dropping the price of ID.3 really hard
Here in Brazil, the launch of the BYD Dolphin saw most EVs of similar or smaller sizes drop their prices by up to 15%. I'm very curious as to how the other brands will react to the Seagull (Dolphin Mini here) coming here in February at an even lower price point.
Incidentally, the Dolphin only came here at the end of June and still managed to be the best selling EV in the country for the whole of 2023. A new model becoming the best selling car in its segment in the same year it was released is already impressive; it managing to do that despite being from an almost unknown brand in the country, and having only 6 months of sales to compete with the incumbents which were selling for the whole year, was unheard of.
@@FabioCapela that's great to hear, people need to realise that the new comes to our markets like BYD have been making EVs a lot longer than the European manufacturers and that brand loyalty needs to be put to the side.
Compared to Canada, Australia is so far ahead of us, our options are so limited and the EVs we can buy are expensive and not at the level of these Chinese brands. We are not only far behind but our attitudes are getting ever more protectionist. I'm envious of your market and the future of your market. The only thing that will wreck your market is trying to build EVs in Australia and putting up tariffs. Do what you do best and buy your cars from China and you will gain a competitive advantage.
You can thank our man-child prime minister for that. By doing all of USA 's bidding and making enemies with the world's largest EV makers.
Isn't Canada too cold for EVs to perform well?😢
@@limsim5225 No issues with the cold. I seen lots and lots of Teslas driving around in cold Alberta (-30c typical). Also my friend who has Tesla has never had any problems during winter driving.
Unless the US change their attitude to China, Canada will not import a single Chinese car due to, you know, national security issues as those cars contains spyware that can allow Chinese government to interfere the election and the money they make will be used to purchase weapons to suppress Uyghurs in Xinjiang.
@@limsim5225 It’s only too cold for the poorly prepared that don’t understand their cars.
Chinas EVs are so excellent because there are over 300+ EV manufacturers in China that has to compete with each other, so they are forced to innovate or get left behind, which is why each of their product they offer has to be the highest quality standard and the most affordable . Elon Musk even said himself this week, "Chinese automakers will 'demolish' global rivals without trade barriers", thats why the U.S government wants to ban Chinese EV makers and EU wants to raise tarrifs.
Exactly, there are more EV manufacturers competing in the Chinese market than there are in the rest of the world. This naturally means that prices go down while value goes up. The only hope foreign manufacturers could have would be if they show that they are able to succeed in the Chinese market .
Also the Chinese were smart enough to go with Tesla's auto fashion, high tech, updatable and minimalist interior, some of the Chinese companies even started new started new EV companies to I think appear new, fresh and high tech. Not many people believe legacy auto will be as good or as high tech asTesla
The Chinese car and EV sector is highly subsidized and politicized as a government initiative to dominate this industry globally.
According to consulting firm AlixPartners, direct government subsidies to electric and hybrid vehicles (note EXCLUDING other transportation) was $57Bn b/w 2016 and 2022. Now with the EU investigating the subsidies, they've switched to a $72Bn tax incentive package for the same manufacturers over the next 4 years.
That is just for the vehicle manufacturers, the subsidies to the upstream suppliers is much harder to track. According Nikkei Asia, CATL the largest battery supplier in China received $400m in direct subsidies in the first 6 months of 2023.
Lastly, what foreigners are typically unaware of is the cheap financing provided to state directed industries in China. The Chinese banks provide very low cost and long term NON-COMMERCIAL loans to industries that the government directs. For most businesses in China, they are unable to obtain bank loans beyond 3 years and typically bank lending rates have been 5-7% range over the past decade. But if you investigate the solar industry from a decade ago, Chinese banks provided 10+ year loans at 2-3% or even lower funding, calling these structured/project financing, but in reality these were backed by guarantees and government directives. On that basis, the amount of low cost long term funding for the EV/car sector in China could be in the hundreds of billions.
The EV sector will track that of the solar sector. Once China feels it is sufficiently dominant globally, it will withdraw all the subsidies. And just like the solar sector, 90% of the companies will go bankrupt, along with their so-called "warranties" and post sale purchase.
In summary China never competes on a level playing field, it seeks to take over certain sectors it sees as strategic on global basis and will seek to use this as economic coercion/leverage. EU and any other markets that are seeking to cooperate with China should be aware of these. Furthermore the draconian "net zero" policies being pursued by western politicians is playing right into the Chinese strategy and all such politicians should be investigated for their personal income to check for conflict of interests.
Enjoy handing money to an authoritarian state that will use its economic leverage to force you onto your knees.
Explain the chips subsidies that U.S just passed through congress? Your arguments is always whataboutism lol. Don't hate Chinas advancements and be happy because you're allowed to buy affordable things all thanks to China.
@@ruleoftwo6174 No that is one wall of text coated in hypocritic western bullshit. Western vehicle manufacturers both are and have received massive government subsidies all the way back to the beginning of the 20th century. To demand global south countries not subsidise industry have been a common western tactic to keep the GS underdeveloped, but the west subsidies their own industry and China`s economy have grown enough for China to exert its sovereignty over its production sector in the same way western nations did and does over their own manufacturing and since China does it better the west is hypocritically complaining.
A great presentation by Simone really well thought out. I can’t believe the negativity in some of the comments by viewers about EVs and sheer ignorance about the quality of Chinese vehicle manufacturing. I don’t know where commentators are getting these ideas but it is not from recent reviews of Chinese vehicles made and written by people whose job it is to critically evaluate new vehicle releases. Keep up the good work Fully Charged and once again it’s great to hear a review from Australia.
US spent 300 million dollars each year to Anti-China propaganda and train journalists how to write negative article about China, no wonder so many people know nothing about China but hate everything about China,sad.
Sorry I'm not in this cult.
@@darrylweidenhoferso he’s talking facts and you emotion
@@darrylweidenhofer Ah, so you prefer to lgnore reaI-worId facts, data and history in favour of an artificiaI worId view created by those with whom you closely associate? I think you're the one in a cuIt, my guy.
@TD1237 for a start you don't know me and what I believe. Gm has cancelled their electric cars so has Toyota Gm is next. The second biggest electric charging company in Aus just went broke
We need Chinese EVs in the US!! We need to the competition to drive the price down. The inflation in auto sales is crazy here!
US: Chinese EVs are a National Security threat
the automobile union will organize protest to press us politicians to block importing Chinese cars
Inflation on EVs in the US? Everywhere else on earth prices are coming down. In Europe Tesla lowered it's prices like 3 times within the past year. They've shaved somewhere in the vicinity of 25% off the price on new vehicles, in order to be able to compete with the chinese. Actually, not just the chinese. They are also competing with their own used cars, since the second hand market for EVs has exploded.
even Chinese don't buy it, in Europe this EV's are blocking all ports bcz they can't sell it! it's a huge failure, the quality is bad! they only produced only EV bcz they are relatively easy to build, but the reliability is bad!
@@Ezekiel903lies...😂
You've won me over by your open-mindedness and friendliness.
Here in Malta, the local VW dealer seems to have given up getting the VW ID 3 and ID 4. I am sure it is because it had a hard time selling any of them when the MG4 is across the road and the BYD Atto can be purchased here for thousands less.
Oh wow, coming across another Maltese on Fully Charged! Agreed 100%. I was at Fully Charged Live in Amsterdam, and noticed a couple of things. First of all, most legacy automakers refused to attend. Goes to show how seriously they're taking the EV revolution. But also, seeing cars from the likes of Zeekr particularly, as well as Tesla, all under one roof, it doesn't take very long to realise that the non-EU vehicles are simply better by almost every metric. I have been in a Porsche Taycan once, and without any doubt, the Zeekr 001 had better materials used for the interior. And the best? Retail price of 60,000 euro, compared to the over 50,000 of a VW ID4 made with cheap plastic and a crappy infotainment system. It's honestly a no-brainer, and they'd better be pulling their socks up - along with the Japanese too.
@@lucaandreamifsudbuhagiar9375 couldn’t agree more.
if you ever try NIO, might be your another option
@@wallace6228 We don't have any local representation for NIO. Plus I personally don't see their selling point, other than battery swapping, which I find to be added complexity.
@@lucaandreamifsudbuhagiar9375 It depends the definition of "better car" because there is no way a Zeekr is beter than Porsche Taycan not in performance nor charging speed, or simply driving quality. I don t think so. And the 2025 Taycan or the coming Macan E will even blow the competition away.
The segment where chinese will do great is mid segment. When it comes to high end segment Porsche and other german brand like Audi, Mercedes will dominate at least in Europe and likely the US.
And without our Government Tariffs added to the Chinese EV's, it would be even cheaper for us to buy. Come on Gov, drop the Tariffs.
Not possible... Chinese EV's that are tariff free become national security risks...
@@Ben734 Mate, that is absolutely not true. The citizens of Australia deserve to be able to buy a cheap, quality, green car. It's up to USA, Germany, Italy and Japan to come up with equivalent, with equivalent price, or better.
The people of Australia are not responsible for these Combustion Car makers (and Petrol extortions) making huge profits at our expense. Our government is responsible for our interests, not theirs. Having these Combustion car makers and Petrol extortionist IS A NATIONAL SECURITY for the people.
@@dranzacspartan8002 Unfortunately sarcasm doesn't translate over the internet. I only wish we get Chinese EVs in the states to force some competition here. But of course it's a "national security" threat, as usual, here in the US.
@@Ben734 Ha ha! Got you! What I've picked up is to conclude with "/s" at the end of the statement. I've got caught out many times myself. Someone pointed this out to me, so I'm passing it forward. Great to chat with rational people.
Wont happen, chines cares are only this cheap because the ccp is subsodising every car to undercut the global market. If you buy chines cares you support supression of 1,4 billion people by the ccp and support there war efforts against the west. Chines cars should be banned for sale in western countrys. And not only because of political reasons, the qulity is just subpar and i do not rhink that there is a chines word for quality controll.
Completely agree with your closing remarks. The more competition there is, the better it is for us as consumers. Car prices have been too high for too long.
Blows my mind that European law makers are spinning the increase in competitive pressure from Chinese automakers and the collapse of car prices for consumers is something bad.
If they face the same treatment in China, why can t they act the same in Europe ?
The collapse in car prices is bad for the German economy and workers, that's what the problem is. It's the same reason why Japan is dragging it's heels: too many vested interests.
The point is that the automakers industry is one of the biggest employers. Therefore, there is a discussion whether there carbon emission reductions worth the jobs that will be lost to China. There is no easy solution.
When Australia-China relationship continues to improve, I am confident that Chinese EV manufacturers would invest in Australia and malke EV as Australian cars.
No. Au market is too small to setup a car factory. From business point of views. That was why most car manufacturers stopped factories in Au in the past. Not every cost effective. Only less than 30 people and no countries bordered with Au comtiminent. Unlike eu.
@@keyboardmanyoutube3189 🤣
What on earth makes you think the Australia-China relationship is going to improve? China is basically turning into big North Korea. Xi is hardly focused on improving relations with democratic countries. Note how China has recently sentenced to death an Australian citizen on questionable charges, hasn't removed tariffs on Aussie wine and other goods etc.
Get rid of the unions and you might get a chance to compete with
the Chinese. American unions are in the pocket of the manufactures.
Australia, like the United States, is not a reliable and truly free economy country. It is a political country, so it is impossible to have its own high automobile manufacturing industry.
One extra point why the Chinese manufacturers are so successful Down Under: China is a major export market for both Australia and New Zealand. We both have Free Trade Agreements, and the cars don’t incur tariffs here.
In NZ 90% of our milk powder goes there, plus kiwi fruit etc, etc, in return we import just about everything that is manufactured like solar panels and batteries and so on. Bunnings would have a hard time if that connection was cut.
Don’t we have a 5% tariff on EVs in Aus?
@@TerryHickey-xt4mf That's a Win-Win, good for both China and NZ.
Unless you’re in the Australian wine, beef and wheat industries which incurred Chinese tariffs of >%120 because Australia hurt President Xi’s fee fees in 2020 for the hideous crime of calling for an inquiry in to the origin of Covid. Have you forgotten already?
@@wattlebough [forced labour in Xinjiang ] also originally from Australia
Competition is always good for consumers
Excellent reporting Simone. Really interesting material which is on the minds of most Aussie potential EV purchasers.
The BYD Dolphin is a standout favourite of mine but @15:49, the swept area of the rear wiper blade is tiny. Makes you question whether it's worth having it.
See you at Electrify Everything.
You guys are lucky. I'm in Canada and I would love to buy a BYD Seal. The only option we have is tesla :(
Same in USA 😢
Is the Tesla produced in the Shanghai factory in China?
And Vinfast😂
@@seekx2y556 us and canadian teslas are built in the us somewhere
@@paolohouvinfast is junk.
You ain’t even seen the best ones. Just tried Huawei s7 last week and it’s two generations ahead the BYDs available in Australia
I love Chinese EVs. I am very satisfied by having Seal BYD. ❤❤❤
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Great to see local Aussie FCL video. We're loving our Chinese EV's down under. 👍
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Its good to see brand loyalty is dead.
I’ve recently learnt a hard and very expensive lesson. Brand loyalty is no longer something I take into consideration.
Brands do not care. Everything from phone companies to home construction companies. Chasing the new customer, and they do not give a damn about their existing customers.
Car insurance is a great example. Watch your premium go up in year 2. I now change insurance companies almost every year. Much better premiums as a new customer, than as a renewing one.
What brand loyalty? Everything is made with the cheapest junk from the cheapest supplier, who is often in China anyway. No car brand is designing and making their own parts anymore they are just assembling random crap (It doesn't matter if it's ICE or EV it's all the same)
.. it never really existed in the UK.. unless you count loyalty to German engineering!
German car manufacturers have only “brand” value left. My two German cars cost significantly more to maintain after only 5 years.
If you look back history, Germany products were used to be described as trash by British. Just similar to all the distrust on Chinese products right now. Sometimes preconception hold people back from reality, just be open minded.
Here in Thailand, many Chinese EV brands here now and Thailand is quite big EV market from few years ago with price policy support from Thai government and support EV charge infrastructure. Now Thailqnd is going to be a manufactured hub for EV nrands.
When we shut down our car industry in Australia we also lost our skills. Now we just modify US barges by changing them over to right-hand drive. Australian design rules for cars need to be dumped too. They were there to protect our car industry. There's no reason we can't do what the Kiwis do and accept a car if it meets UK standards. I don't believe we'll make cars here again. We don't have the national fervour for it anymore. Our politicians and industry leaders are happy to dig up and ship out the raw materials and pocket the loot. We used to be the lucky country now we're just dumb as f**k.
Yes, it's really about lack of ambition. The ALP at least have some but with an LNP government you can forget about it.
Totally agree. The problem is we are not innovative. We don't invent or produce anything new. The only thing we have been doing is using our land for mining or farming. Mining can only last for so long, and farming? it will be only as good until another country gives a better price. I would love to see Australia put more resources into producing and keeping tech in Australia. I'm not too smart, but maybe an Australian funded university dedicated to STEM that filters into Australian sponsored companies. I mean China has a share in many companies which brings in profit. Might be time that Australians try some China modelling instead of just following the U.S.
I think it's called resource-curse, often associated with resource rich, yet underdeveloped sub-Saharan Africa -- obviously the petro-rich Norway is an exception here.
@@demonwombatofdoom8391 >> Might be time that Australians try some China modelling instead of just following the U.S.
Ultimately it’s our politicians that drive us down a road which is sometimes a dead end or full of pot holes . Uk is the same as, industry gone.
To get market share, Tesla introduced really good EVs for top $$$ prices, outside of normal ICE cars. They did well, so other manufacturers rushed in to copy Tesla. However that exposed the budget sector (= normal ICE car prices) ready to be snapped up by anyone able. So guess what happened?
All I need, personally, is a decent reliable A to B car. I don't care about gadgets, I don't want wall to wall computers and infotainment; I want to go from A to B at a sensible price in an everyday car. Would be nice if the sound system is good; thats it. I can wind up and down my own windows.
Building sensible everyday EVs is what the Chinese are now doing. Other manufacturers - can stop their price gouging or collapse.
The small EVs from China sold in Australia are still more expensive than a similarly sized ICE car.
Cheapest Corolla hybrid. $32K + ORC
Cheapest eV MG4 51. $40k + ORC.
Cheapest petrol MG5 sedan $25k driveaway.
It's the ICE vehicles from China that are significantly cheaper
@@rjbiker66 That will change very soon. In the EU an MG4 costs around €32k.
In April this year, the Citroën dealers are flooded with the €24k costing Citroën ë-C3 with a 320km range, LFP batteries, 100kW charging.
That is about in the same class as the MG4, but €7k cheaper. In September Renault will come on the market with the Renault R5 E-Tech with 400km range, prices start around €25k.
At the moment the Chinese can get away with overpricing their EV's, coarse the EU and USA build EV's start at €40k and up.
When the Stellantis EV's come with those prices, China will follow.
Exactly. We have a lovely Mercedes saloon- and a plain, old people mover on its last tyres. A cheap hatchback for dogs and builderstuff would be lovely too❤
Tesla pursues environmental protection just like Apple removes the charging head and removes many additional components. I think they can get rid of the dashboard and replace the seats with wooden ones, which will be more environmentally friendly.
@@rjbiker66minus EV rebates?
Great episode, can't wait for Sydney
I really enjoyed watching this upload, Simone - found it fascinating.
Thanks... 🙂
The real problem is *NOT* the loss of expertise in the West (after all we are _"100 years ahead in combustion engine"_ manufacturing). The real problem is all the big traditional car companies spent 20 years bad mouthing and fighting against EVs. Not one single traditional car maker even tried to make a true pure EV until just the last couple years (GM kinda sorta made a half decent effort for a while).
Tesla was violent shock therapy to the traditional car manufactures. Sadly, it may be too little too late.
China made it their goal to develop and produce evs 9 years ago because of this '100 year' reason. There ev policy is common knowledge, so all the legacy auto makers knew this was Chinas' auto future and yet did nothing about it. Now they are paying the price.
BMW did with i3
Interesting insight into the Australian EV market - thanks, Simone. ps I liked the broken up title page separating each section. 👏👏
There are many reasons why it's hard for Australians to manufacture cars:
- "High salary", As a developed country, Australia has a high average salary and shorter working hours, which raise the cost of manufacturing.
- "Dutch disease", Australia exports a lot of natural resources, which leads to an unusually high exchange rate for the Australian dollar. It reduces the competitiveness of industrial exports.
- "Smaller scale", Australia's auto market is not large - which leads to a weaker scale effect and higher margin cost on manufacturing.
In addition, there are many more reasons regarding education, immigration policy, culture, etc.
So for now, it seems that maintaining stable trade relations, improving EV laws, and increasing investment in grid-charging facilities are favorable choices.
Australia has the opportunity to realize the most advanced energy supply system (through EVs, digital grid, and renewable energy) as soon as possible, to operate solutions and services for foreign countries to profit.
Salary is not the primary issue. Because current automobile manufacturing uses a large number of automated assembly lines. Low-level workers are almost no longer needed.
Aussie workers are not known of their work efficiency and productivity.
Australia should focus on things it is good at: FARMING. It has huge land mass good weather, and plenty of customers around the world. Its a pleasure and satisfaction to feed more and more people.
To be honest, I think I speak for several people when I say I am somewhat ENVIOUS that Australia is getting the EV's & the Ute's/Pickups that we will never see in Canada... Choices & Options with respectable pricing will get butts in seats and fast.
It would be great to see Australian Made EV's ! You have everything needed in your own yard for a complete sector in OZ. There are options from Partnerships or gathering the current "specialty" makers in AU together.
Hi from Oz, it is awesome to finally get some RHD EVs in Oz, there's ACE EV company in Oz, hopefully they're still going. I'm sure if Canada did a Norway and carbon taxed ICEV and incentivised EVs it could happen, or would that make the US angry or jelly, hope Canada can get some EVs soon.
It would be good to see Aussie made EVs but the last couple of governments did all they could to shut down our vehicle manufacturing industry, I doubt we have the infrastructure now to be competitive.
@@stuartcoyle1626 the ACE EV is probably going to have a lot of Chinese parts, if they sell enough they could make some parts them selves or someone might make them, I think we still make some auto parts. I'm guessing they'll press the panels. So hopefully not impossible.
Oz could refine all that Lithium - now shipped to China - TESLA would buy the lot, eligible for US incentives, due to trade agreements…
@@FrunkensteinVonZipperneck Agreed. We still have the mentality of just digging stuff up, throwing it in a ship and exporting it only to re-import it when someone else has done the work of extracting/refining/smelting.
Cheap BYD cars is what the US needs. No young people can/want to pay $30k for a car!
but,.. communism...
@@xvbd6067Story of the US for centuries. Any country with different views or systems of governing won't be allowed to exist freely.
@@TD1237 yup, its just the excuses they give for hating who ever is not them is so weak that its insulting
BYDs are deathtraps
I mean MKBHD is proof there's at least one young person willing to pay much more for a car 😅. But yeah I get your point.
If we changed the way electrity prices are calculated, EVs would make even better sense
One advantage of living in Australia, something like 50% of the houses now have solar. Charge for free. With solar feeding the grid, we have now had some weekend summer days where the entire country is being powered by solar.
You're kidding me@@RickKean
Can’t wait to see how the seal goes in 2024. Will the tesla model 3 sell as well as it did in 2023?
No because everyone who wants one has one
Everyone that wants an ICE car already has one, I guess they won’t sell either.
The Model 3 didn't sell that well, the Model Y did. So I think the impact will be minor unless BYD drop the price of the seal or release the cheaper smaller battery version.
Real test may be when the larger Seal is released here
Sandy Munro summed up the Chinese push very well. He said the Chinese have been playing chess for a long time while legacy OEMs have been playing checkers, presumably thinking they were in the same game.
What a great presenter and with a real accent, not sounding like an extra of 'It ain't half hot mum'. Also, a brilliant display showing that our first nations people are world class.
Thanks for a very interesting report! Please keep it up. Altho i am still in shock from what Elliott said: A Chinese company makes an EV that is better than the Mercedes and for 1/3 the price! 1/3!!!?
That's just not true. Don't believe everything you seee on the internet.
This is 100% true. German makers needs to make better products
@@SmaziSmau-zn7jyThat's actually true if you've actually drove one... German cars needs to do better , their days of just counting on brand name is gone ..
Consumers are smart nowadays 😊
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
I don't care - but in the US Merc can't shift their metal for love nor money!
tried a Chinese EV once in China last year, I know my next car will be EV, quiet, easy to drive, smart, no need to go to patrol station anymore for daily use.
you will get it soon
It's good to have competition across the sector. Maybe the legacy car makers will stop forcing the giant heavy expensive SUV EVs onto the market when they start seeing affordable Chinese EVs taking over. They will either adapt and improve their own lineup or they will be forgotten.
Don’t buy from Chinese owned companies like Volvo, Polestar, MG, BYD and so on. China is a dictatorship with no human rights or democracy. Giving them our money will backfire. Just like EU learned from doing business with Putin
Great presentation
EVs do change things, because more than ICE they open the potential for additive manufacture. This style of manufacture is less dependent on scale so could provide Australia new opportunities.
There is a problem though, government regulations make it hard to get anything going.
Congratulations Australia, congratulations BYD! cheers from Canada 👍🏻
BYD and other Chinese EV won't get a chance to make it to Canada, because Canada is following the US with many restrictive rules. Seems like Australia, Japan, and western Europe, many Chinese brands made it ashore. However, considering policies that are implemented in the EU, not sure how long any Chinese brand can stay there.
@@futo there is a trade ' w a r ' , etc. happening
@@futo Mexico is the backdoor key. I'm not too worried about these so called import controls. They ban or restricted nVidia from exporting chips to China, but in the end, it still ended up in China. Money will go where money wants to go.
Why are you congratulating the CCP? YUCK!!!
The principles of free market economics are only applicable in situations where Chinese brands do not pose a significant challenge or risk.
Elon Musk talked about Chinese EVs days before. He said, "They're extremely good."
I am sorry, but they are crap!
Keep them simple and keep the price down. Safety and reliability... forget all of the unnecessary stuff.
like lane keep assist in my MG, permanently turned off, the dealer did it for me! alas it sounds like we cannot even do that on 2024 models😭
While we experience dual revolutions in industry and technology, we're also witnessing the effects of the differences between market-controlled and centrally controlled economies. For all the talk about communism vs. democracy, the Chinese have maintained a laser focus for decades on becoming *the* vertically integrated powerhouse in manufacturing. And western governments have been all too eager to facilitate the gutting domestic manufacturing sectors, bowing to corporate masters in search of greater and greater profits.
Of course this is all extremely short sighted. For, as countries rely ever more on foreign suppliers, they become increasingly dependent on those foreign countries; particularly those that care first and foremost for that which is within their own borders.
As countries achieve manufacturing dominance, they expand into technology. This inevitably results in the now seriously weakened market-controlled economies being relegated to mere consumers. This is a downward spiral that doesn't end well for western economies.
Technology is, as they say, a double-edged sword. For, with domestic reserves of anything from lithium to sodium, as well as access to renewable energy generation from solar, wind, hydro, geothermal and/or tidal, most nations now have the ability to achieve energy, industrial and economic independence.
In the case of Australia, it makes zero sense to export lithium to China for processing and battery manufacture, only to have said batteries power vehicles manufactured in and exported from China. Heck, even if a country didn't have a base for things like steel or aluminum manufacturing, vehicle chassis can even be made from carbon fiber.
Countries such as Australia, the UK and others *must* stand up battery and vehicle manufacturing capabilities. Either that, or they wait for the day when they're left with few choices but to import most of the products needed for their countries to function.
Just as with climate change, this shift is gradual. Nonetheless, it's very real and comes with potentially devastating consequences should presidents, prime ministers and legislatures continue to ignore reality.
Great presentation and good to see it filmed in Adelaide which was the car making capital of Australia
Yes, the Reagan/Thatcher era was the end of either country and the UK in particular being actual producers of goods. We don't make anything in the UK. That's one of the reasons why Brexit was always going to be a disaster because when you are a country that merely pieces together imported parts from other countries it's REALLY STUPID to reduce your ability to import parts from other countries.
Brand loyalty is another important issue. I had three Ford Fiestas and when I was ready to swap to an EV Ford had nothing suitable for me. So I went to Nissan and their Leaf has served me very well for eight years. It's no good sticking to a brand if they can't offer you a better blend of function and affordability than the new boy on the block. The legacy motor companies should have moved far more quickly on this. Now they are fighting for their lives and many of them are fighting dirty - in many cases quite literally as they produce more gas guzzlers when they're supposed to be reducing them.
What battery degradation do you have after 8yrs
The irony of your post is that you drive an EV made in the Uk...
@@viktorianas By a Japanese company that only came here as a gateway to the European market and is only staying because of the government's post Brexit bribe.
@@trevorberridge6079 so you lost EU market and have a record high immigration, congratulations 👏🎉
Our government are doing their best, bless 'em! 🤣
Thanks for your videos. Great to see an Australian presenter.
I don't see aborigines here.
Just bought a BYD Dolphin in Australia, the entry Dynamic with the smaller battery - incredibly impressed.
Unlike western governments China does not have fossil fuels corporate overlords who pull the strings of government to meet their profit goals. Logical that China would go straight to EVs as they have very little oil and gas reserves. The efficiency of EVs of every type and size surely is lowering their use of oil for transportation significantly.
Good points
The point is that we are living in an EV dictatorship. There are other options instead of batteries, such as renewable fuels and fuel cell. But the western governments are imposing that the only option is battery tech, since they don’t want to depend on ethanol from 3rd world economies. Doing so, they are letting China dominate the carmakers industry.
Over the last 15 years I have been reading over the internet that BYD EVs are rubbish, explosive, bad quality. And now BYD is already one of the leading EV manufacturer in the world.
There’s some very negative views about EV’s on this channel.
Does anyone on here remember the Swiss Watch industry in the 1970’s? It used to be absolutely massive! Everyone had a Swiss watch.
The Swiss Rolex / Omega watches we see today are all that remain of it. No one ever talks about Timex or is even aware of them now. The Japanese digital quartz watch took over at scale in the late 70’s and early 80’s and the mechanical mainspring (wind-up) Swiss watch just faded away…
Digital grew from strength to strength and has predominately become…An Apple iPhone. Something quite different!
It a paradigm shift in thinking and we’re living through it again right now.
Take care.
Chery also makes non EV cars which we get in South Africa and Chery is easily my favourite car brand now. Their cars are brilliant. Their 2 litre turbo has excellent power and their build and material quality is simply amazing. A Chery Tiggo 8 for example costs half the price of a Mercedes GLB yet it has more technology and way way better build and material quality. The Mercedes feels like a cheap product yet costs double the Chery. Brand loyalty is definitely dead because consumers are tired of being taken for a ride by excessively high prices and minimal features from legacy manufacturers. Can't wait for Chery's EVs.
I think the best case for Australia is battery production, that I think will be exported to Thailand/Malaysia and the USA (since we have a free trade agreement that still gives subsidise in the USA) to build the vechicals. We have high labour cost (yay) which makes it hard to compete but we have great universities and a highly educated populace. So highly automated manufacturing like battery manufacturing can happen but car production requires far more workers.
Why build batteries here to ship half way around the world?
We already mine plenty of minerals that are shipped across the planet to be refined and shipped back. There is at least one Aussie company about to produce batteries suited to our climate much better than the imports intended for Europe etc.@@rjbiker66
@@rjbiker66 Shipping batteries requires far fewer ships (and emissions) compared to shipping the raw materials to make a battery, or shipping the vehicles that use the battery. Far better to ship just the battery, and then 'assemble' the vehicle at the destination
I don't think wages costs are such a big deal. Modern battery factories are so highly automated they don't employ a lot of people. I imagine supply chain and energy costs, for example, would be more important.
@@logicalChimp so is that how manufacturers do it now?
I would have thought they built batteries close to where the cars are made.
Your summary of the EV situation is bang on. The death throes of Reagan and Thatcher.
China started its foundemental research in EV techonology since Project 863, a set of pilot research projects announced in march(3rd month) 1986. Which means China had been working on this for almost 40 years.
Project 863 research area includes mainly Biotechnology,
Space, Information technology, Laser technology,Automation
Energy, New materials
later add on : Telecommunications (1992)
Marine technology (1996)
>> Which means China had been working on this for almost 40 years.
@@tooltalk If that's what your verdict is, then there really isn't any need to expIain to you. You'd just d eny any real information in favour of what suits you best.
@@TD1237 >> If that's what your verdict is, then there really isn't any need to expIain to you.
@@tooltalk Nothing of it is stolen. Some of it might come from technology transfer, but nothing of what is sold to international markets from China is stolen. Something might be claimed stolen, but that is like claiming Iraq had WMD`s in 2003.
Ah some communist party mythology. All the parts in a modern EV are technologies developed across the globe, what China does incredibly well is manufacture consumer goods, they skipped having to develop, refined, clean engines and have leap frogged ahead. Doesn't take anything away from the achievement, but mythology is not required.
Excellent segment covering a good deal of subtopics in well less than twenty minutes. Excellent host with an excellent persona, outlook and researched opinion devoid of disingenuous politics. Bravo. We will all net benefit from the Chinese EV boom.
When they started to appear in europe I thought "good, now the prices must come down for ev from legacy car companies". Sadly that hasn't happened
Also of note is that Chinese cars brought to Europe have huge price mark ups compared to what they sell for back home.
1. Chinese cars sell more expensive in Europe, this will worsen as the new anti-China tariffs drop.
2. Chinese cars barely have any brand recognition/acceptance, they'll need a few more years to gain ground.
Partly due to Chinese brands needing to build showrooms and service centres, etc... the costs of which are added onto the sale price (pushing prices up)
By what measure? Average new asking sale cost of model launched or discounts Vs asking price available... Both trends in Europe counter your statement, they haven't gone down that far but they are coming down but stop making things up
Yeah, instead EU is crying about how China is giving their car industry subsidies... As if Germany and France weren't doing that themselves... While still failing to produce price competitive products...
what a great analysis and interview no bs just good report
The problem in Australia's small market is the dealers; at the cheap end of the market there is very little in it for them - low prices and minimal servicing will make them unwilling to sell the cheaper brands.
Yep. That's why we would probably all be better off without the traditional dealer model. Rather a direct model based on customer experience
@wadetubman would you buy a car without trying it?
@@theharper1 I am talking about the difference between dealer distribution and manufacturer direct. Manufacturers can have showrooms, test drives etc. Like Apple stores. But specifically would I buy without test driving - only if I knew the experience already (eg model S vs model 3, or having been in an uber etc)
I think dealers will be fine for some time yet. EVs still need servicing and some of these cars have somewhat rare parts for 12v battery, tyres, wipers etc. plus auto mechanics trained in electric drive systems that won't be widely available so people will be inclined to go back to the dealer for replacements & repairs. That'll change eventually of course as EVs become more common place but there is still income to be had here. Also, I think the markup on these Chinese cars for dealers must be pretty large compared to some manufacturers.
you are able to test drive Tesla or Polestar or BYD @@theharper1
Great video, thanks
AFFORDABILITY should be the number 1 priority for any government that wants its citizens to adopt EVs. Luxury EVs can't be adopted by masses. Customers want more variety and something affordable especially when its their first ever experience on an EV
One things for sure is that competition stimulates better value and innovation as manufacturers try to win customers. About time too as buying a car has become unaffordable for many.
Family adopted first EV with BYD ATTO3 and loving it as family city ride in Kuala Lumpur, us family “fight over” it and logic whoever travel most days got to use it alternative to our ICE fleet 😎
It's eminently stoppable assuming other auto manufacturers pull their fingers out of their backsides and produce compelling vehicles to compete with what China is making. I have an MG 4 in Ireland and there was simply nothing else out there for the same price and performance. The nearest Euro vehicles, things like the ID.3 or Renault Megane cost more money with worse spec so why am I as a consumer going to buy those other cars? I actually *wanted* a Megane until I saw the price and how the RHD version had a gimped screen and so I changed my mind. That said, I don't see BYD cars being as good value as they should be. Cars like the Atto 3 aren't the same value proposition as an MG 4 and that probably explains why there are so few of them in Ireland. And the Ora brand is basically dead as a doornail - they didn't even sell 50 cars despite extensive advertising - again too expensive. When I collected my MG last May the dealer told me he knew someone who had hundreds of Oras in stock in every spec because nobody was buying them. I wonder what happened to them now that 2024 has rolled around.
The Chinese prefer to have a lot of space for rear passengers and this leads to a smaller boot. This is the case with the Ora Cat and it is expensive, weird looking and has an impractical boot, so nobody wants it. The BYD Dolphin has room in the back but the boot is a little bit on the small side, but it will sell because it is such a good car. It is hard for these manufacturers because they have to start from almost nothing. MG already had a dealer network so is easier to sell its cars. Also the MG was tuned in the UK for European markets and that certainly helped. I have seen loads of MG4 EV cars in the UK with only Tesla cars being more popular.
There is certainly a market for EVs if the price, specification and quality is right.
I will probably buy the Dolphin next year.
they are all shipped from China so the costs are similar, in NZ the Atto 3 is much more competitive and sells well, but I could not get used to the interior design, so that is why I have an MG.
Free market and a free world, buy as you wish. But consider that supporting companies that our an Ally will have knock on positive consequences to your market, versus the alternative. Everyone buys something from China, but these purchases there are alternatives, imo.
I just got the BYD Dolphin in Finland. For me the options were the MG4 and the Dolphin. I did consider the ID3 but it's just way too expensive and doesn't feel even close to as premium as the Dolphin. The premium feel and LFP batteries were also the reason i chose the Dolphin over the MG4, even though it was a good bit more expensive.
Byd Atto 3,dominates sales here in ASEAN. MG is the second best selling brand in Thailand, after Byd. While in Malaysia it's also Atto 3 in top spot while MG brand should be coming soon.
with Malaysia where
Great video that discusses the Chinese EV in a non-political way but on the facts and merits of the cars on their own.
We need more affordable Chinese vehicles in the UK
We need a UK car industry that is self-sufficient, with a secure supply chain, able to scale up to make EVs affordable. Look at Renault and the up-coming R5, etc.
@@Nikoo033 yeah... NO. wages are too high, and the local market is not so big to incentivise investment in new car plants.
@@johnsmith-cw3wo there are 38 million cars in the UK, that’s a decent market. Plus, industries export.
This is a very informative piece as every episode I've watched.
Australia used to build Mitsubishi and Toyota cars, not just Holdens and Fords.
In malaysia BYD is doing well.
2023 visibility of BYD EV is once a month until year end twice a week.
Now Feb 2024 i met BYD EV on road daily.
Elon was laughing at BYD in 2011 during his interview, now BYD is the one having the last laugh...hahahahaha!!!!!!!
BYD did suck 10 years ago lol. In China BYD was literally a meme and a standard for low quality cheap cars. Its reputation only started to change in recent years as they figure out how to build good EVs.
They will both fail, mark my words...
I like the mindset of this lady!
Since the end of 2019 I am trying to find all Chinese BEV manufacturers. Just found two additional ones yesterday.
I personally don't dig a car but one of those BEV cargo trikes for less than €800.
China will now tank the entire US, European and Japanese legacy auto industry.
Solar power panel on roof to charge your EV in OZ. Perfect combination ❤ Love from NZ
genius
Congratulations on your choice of presenter in Australia. 👍👏👏
Hey, that's Simone from Cartell TV! Did you guys merge, or is just for one video?
She has been on presenting for FC before.
Love my atto 3! Best car ive ever owned!
It was weird seeing my Australian home city in the background of a UK based show 👍👍👍
I have only been to Adelaide once many many moons ago but remember how flat it seemed, and the city surrounded by parklands.
@@TerryHickey-xt4mf yes it optimizes the quip - " its a nice place to live but I wouldn't want to visit there! "
Yes, I was pleased to see it was filmed in Adelaide too.
Wish BYD was here in America we just have luxury EVs that cost upwards of a 100k
Even if BYD come to America, your American electric grid infrastructure can't handle EV charging. Upgrade your infrastructure first
Finally there are car companies who make cars offer good quality, more functionalities, more advanced technology, and most of all reasonable price tag. What more can anyone ask for? This should be a good thing for the consumers. I hope consumers around the world should realize that you have been cheated and ripped off by the superficially high price tag set by your greedy auto companies and system you are living in. For example, the cost of an iPhone 15 is no more than $20UDS but Apple sells it for no less than $1600USD. That is the reality of how American companies cheated and ripped off American consumers and consumers around the world.
Excellent insight.
People laugh at the BYD Seal. Thinking it is named after an animal. Too late to realise it is actually a seal of fate.
I’m in eastern Canada. We can’t get China produced cars here. Considering the way our PM handled politics with the Chinese leader, I believe we’re not going to see any soon…😢
We sure won’t get ANYTHING! from India.
atlest you have democracy
@@herrwolf5184 No, we have a representative democracy and right now, it's a disaster. And our EV market is god awful, very expensive, no decent choices. I'd take Australia over Canada any day.
@@rebymthat is a democracy
i guess EV is not a good choice for canadian because of your weather.
8:13 no it didn’t. BYD sales include New Energy Vehicles, which also include PHEVs… so not all pure BEV
BYD passed Telsla in NEVs in 2022. In Q4-2023 it passed Tesla in BEVs. Obviously in 2024 it will grow that lead.
@@rebym ah, did it…? must have missed that last Q4 one… 👍
The global car markers have been taking the piss for years in aus and the chinese filled the gap
Australia industry can not make cars that Australians can afford to buy. The wages are too high. The government taxes are too high.
I have no issues with Chinese EV's. I currently have a Kona Electric and when the lease ends this year I might have a BYD Atto 3. I'm interested in tech and how a car makes life easier.
sell your soul to the CCP
Interesting that you're leasing. That makes perfect sense to me at this stage in the evolution towards electric car use.
@@MrGearoid65 it's perfect to be honest. I don't have to worry about battery degredation and I can lease newer cars with newer battery tech when it comes out.
@@nagi-springfield93 don't think they are in the same category.
As is typical, the BIG brands had the advantage and blow it. GM, Ford, etc are all very good at this. Most new EV’s are $60K and go way up. The average buyer is struggling just to put groceries on the table and can’t afford this. So the Chinese will own the affordable car market, just like with TV’s and most everything else.
Who would have thought that normal people who want a cheap vehicle that goes A to B would become popular...
All i want is a car that goes from A to B and sometimes to C has no useless infotament crap that when it breaks costs fortune to repair. The less car has all that modern crap tech the better.
How is Australia 🇦🇺 known how to speak about real competition and not about bombing any countries that stand in their way ❤❤
Simone is not in cartell tv anymore??😢😢
There is at least one thing that could cause problems for the Chinese EV manufacturers. Military problems in the Taiwan Strait. Like it or not, as long as the PRC claims sovereignty over the island of Taiwan, geopolitics will play a role in the worldwide availability of Chinese EVs.
The problem is not China claiming sovereignty over their own territory, but western countries US in particular meddling in Chinese internal affairs funding separatism within Chinese territory. You can contemplate how US or where ever you live would have reacted to Chinese overtly funding and arming separatists in your countries territory.
Suggestion: Ask your remote interviewed people to look at the camera. Remind them it may be a podcast, but it’s also on UA-cam. (How do you feel when talking with someone that never looks at you?)
Doesn’t bother me if they have something interesting to say.
We have moved to a global economy, as we didn't want to do the factory work and people moved away from that. We need to remember how much we get from China, otherwise we will leave them with all of the resources and have to pay double for something made at home!
We weren’t asked. Government/big business saw a chance to make huge profits and took it. Now look at us (the UK). So bloody depressing.
Change the tax rules... abolish LCT, stamp duty _and_ FBT* on BEVs! That would probably *double* BEV uptake. Oh, and don't make BEVs pay a 'mileage tax' to make up for fuel excise losses, rego should cover it.
(*No convoluted rules for exemption, just exempt BEVs, period.)
I agree, we need to do this for the people and the planet, we're poisoning our selves, are we smart or just selfish. All the particulates are cancer causing, we need to tax these cancer causing vehicles out of existence. Lets hope there's some affordable vehicles soon.
Is NIO entering Australia? Their battery swappable EVs are unique.
australian labor is too expensive, market is too small, hence gm/holden/ford left. that's what thailand is for, to build their rhd cars
Let's hope Australia's charging infrastructure is forging ahead, making great strides throughout the cities and country in preparation for accelerated EV adoption on that continent. Aussies already have twice the rooftop solar production that we do in the US and continuing to add to their solar production---both rooftop and commercial and building out effective charging networks for those who live in apartments, etc. Very inspiring show, people! Thank you! Peace
Will not be surprised if the Chinese invest in Australia's charging network.
Interestingly BYD has a product that would be great for Australia the Seagull but the BYD distributor will not bring it here. A small EV for less than 20g is a game changer for EV uptake. So once again we are being dictated to about what we can have. The changes that were previously proposed when the car manufacturing was being wound up would have stopped this situation. We were meant to be able to import our own cars if manufacturers weren't willing to bring their product here.
On a separate note having 800v based cars would be a plus for us, hopefully they make it to Oz 😊
You'd be the first to whinge when your cheap self imported EV broke and you couldnt get it repaired.
@@wizzyno1566 I import cars often, no whining on my part.
@@ADudesRotary I'm sure the seagull will be sold here it might need so minor tweeking so it receives a 5 star ANCAP safety rating. Dont be surprised if it arrives sometime in 2025.
about half of the evz in NZ are imported leafs (no local distributor) but they still seem to be popular here even now.
@@wizzyno1566
Some vehicles probably don't meet arcane ADRs. On low margin vehicles it could be too costly to adapt.