The Ford F-150 Lightning IS DONE! Depreciation CRISIS!
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- Опубліковано 16 бер 2024
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On this week's episode of RYGTBKM, the Ford F-150 Lightning depreciates to a ridiculous degree; the Jeep Gladiator is STUPIDLY overpriced; and dealers continue to hold their predatory "Upside Down/Payoff Sales Events" for people underwater on their car loans. - Розваги
This is the point where the car manufacturers and dealers say…it’s not our fault. It’s a matter of time before they start asking for government bailouts.
It's already baked in the cake. The manufacturers will say the government forced them to build EVs so the government owes them a bailout.
manufacturers yes stealerships no.
After the run up in prices and ridiculous dealer markups I hope our government says “nope.”
You are absolutely right - although Ford avoided the 2009/2010 Auto Bailout, this will be a foundational shift for the industry.
That's the problem with government intrusion into markets. They pushed the EV market with their agenda. The market did not want this. However, since they pushed for this nonsense, government bureaucrats may have to bail out the manufacturers which, in turn, means the tax payer will have to pay for this bill. Unfortunately, no one, including consumers are willing to see a major part of the economy fail. Especially government because it clearly shows how inept they are. What's even worse is that not witnessing a severe economic downturn doesn't teach manufacturers or the populace on why government intrusion into markets is madness. Economics is incredibly complex due to its stochastic nature. Carelessly, politicians haven't learned this and will never learn this. Capitalism is about having winners and losers. The losing part is just as important as the winning part because it teaches you what not to do.
A great example is how Toyota has done the research and proven EV's are not the way to go. They're far more destructive to environment and are higher in energy costs.
To be clear, government does have function. But it is certainly almost always wrong at wanting to predict economic goals.
I just checked the Jeep dealer in Reno, NV, they have %15 off a 2023 Gladiator, then immediately add a 15% dealer markup.
They obviously haven't learned the truth yet. I imagine they have a lot of new jeeps to choose from on their lot.
Yep welcome to las vegas.
There’s a jeep dealer taking $11k, but $58k for a Rubicon is still crazy.
I think a Jeep is way too expensive at 35K, but thats me.
PREACH. I feel bad for people that are buying modern Jeep’s, a lot of them do not list the test of time with grace.
Yes, it's just you. If new Jeeps were $35k they wouldn't be able to make them fast enough.
@@ItsEverythingElse Incorrect, count me in as well. I’ll stick with my Landcruisers and Tundras.
@@AnimationByDylan Who in their right mind is laying 35k for a Jeep Compass??! Will those even make it to 100k?
They're so cheaply made a basic jeep should be 35K.
Ford has the right idea with the Bronco, a 40K base price and build up as you need.
Yes,Ray, I 100% tune in for the dad stories. The car data is good too, but really it’s the personalities that keep me coming back.
I love my dad and am so glad we get to hangout with everyone here on UA-cam!
The bad decisions made by the CEOs will cost their companies dealers and employees dearly that’s the sad part.
EXACTLY. Here is a very sobering statistic of the modern CEO and their “beacons of leadership”. According to the Wall Street Journal, nearly 70% of all corporate acquisitions since 1990 have failed to meet their benchmarks for which they were purchased. To put this another way, a monkey flipping a coin gets it right more than these guys….buy a huge margin. Most corporations and their shareholders would be better off with much less “leadership”. When the average American truly understands this…fill in the blank.
But the CEO’s will still get 10’s of millions. I swear corporate America is a bad joke/pyramid scheme
@@woodrmp1 We are in a very dark period of time with a generation or two of horrendous leaders. They rely on bean counters and consultants to make decisions that do nothing but cost shareholders money and employees their jobs. A great quote from the recently deceased legend Charlie Munger…”If I need a consultant to tell me how to run my business I shouldn’t be in the damn position I am in”.
Shareholders are going to take a 'bath' as well, if not Already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
to be fair this is driven by gov't regulations and the manufacturer not fighting back.
Funny, I just did an auto trader search nation for the F-150 lighting platinum, i could not find many under 80k. So something fishy going on here if that is the cash buy out and they are turning them around for 80k.
My guess is algorithm pricing. Comp sees prices dropping on 23s and big sales (some hyper low extremes) and you get that outlier offer.
They don't sell. Dealers don't want them.
EV demand across the board has dried up as the market has become saturated just as automakers brought additional production capacity online that was planned during the pandemic shortages. It’s really a perfect storm and used EV prices in general are the leading indicator, not the Lightning specifically.
Wonder how the long term health of the EV batteries will be after sitting on a lot rotting for a couple of years….
Unironically as long as it’s not stored at peak charge it’ll be fine. What wears out batteries is large amounts of energy being put through them, whether thats through use or through storage in hot/freezing conditions.
It’s the reason you can leave a phone in a drawer for years and it will fire up with no issue. It was never exposed to any stress
The batteries are not long term to begin with.
Wonder what the long term health of a ICE motor or transmission will be after sitting for a couple of years. Both Ram and Ford have new ICE 2022's for sale.
@@roywall8169 It has to last 8 years by law or the manufacturer has to replace it.
@@Michael-pi8ps But you aren't addressing corrosion. Anything sitting on a lot for a couple of years is going to corrode.
Fellow over in England bought a Porsche Taycan... Way over 100k pounds when he wrote the check. After fighting with charging on the road for a couple of years, wanted to trade it in on a 911 porche... The Porsche dealer said he would get about a 40k trade in on the ICE car... Sheesh
To bad for him. 911s hold their value exceptionally well, whereas the Taycan’s are the exact opposite
And the Porsche dealer also told they guy they have a plethora of used Taycans and would not take his Taycan in trade. One buying service offered him about 20K pounds.
@@SignalCorps1 When they were new, people had stars in their eyes. Now it's tears.
A neighbour sold his Taycan, was fed up with charging and bought a Panamera
I saw that video...anyone who buys an EV is crazy.
I love it when the 3 amigos get together, Ray, Brandon and Zach. These guys are really tuned into what's really going on, and they know the market based on experience. I wanted to buy a new truck back in early 2023, but Ray and Zach keep saying, wait it out they will come down, be patience. So, 2 weeks ago the Ram dealer in my area, Northern Alberta, Canada listed most of the base model 2023 Ram 1500's 25% off MRSP. I ended up buying a new 2023 Ram 1500 Crew Cab Express listed at 67,150 for 51,300 cdn. ( or 49,580 down to 37,873 US dollars). It was 25% off of MSRP and it wasn't a fully loaded pickup but it was what I was looking for. Thanks you guys, I did listen to your advice and I think I did really good waiting for this deal. Take care.
Now it's our time to screw the dealers who shamelessly gouged us two years ago!
What's funny is that dealers are selling those used ones with low mileages for around $80-90K. It really cracks me up. Dealers still think they can sell this thing for that kinds of prices.🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
That's why it was low-balled. They think they can make big profits with it. They wanted to get it for 40K and sell it for 80K. They could even be colluding with the offers.
They have no choice! If they let the Lightning price fall it would be a disaster for EV's!
It’s not dealers , it’s the ( Stupid people ) who agree to pay this ridicules amount of money !……
@@thomasdaum1927 truck prices are too high in general.
@@XKS99 And that’s why you don’t buy not to mention the phoney charges they add to the contract !……
that's why it's called a Lightning... and just as quick as lightning that's how fast it depreciated.
didnt they double the price of those things in the covid heyday? that is when you could even find them.
😂
Ugly piece of crap that has to have a generator in it to go on a trip
Best quote ever!!
😂
I want a ford lightning. Where can I buy someone’s lightly used one for 39k?
Me too!!!!!
Me three
Me four
You can't. It's more anti EV nonsense. Minimum cost in canada for a platinum is currently 85k
@@ReignOfCobra EVERYTHING is ALWAYS more expensive in Canada!!! But your wages are higher & u have great healthcare though.
Remember when I said a few months ago that prices needed to come down 30% and negotiate from there? Also remember when Ray said that would never happen? I think I might have low-balled the reduction!
Ray is still a car salesman at heart
No, we do not remember what you said a few months ago,
@@jerrylundegaard2592 yes you do. Haha
@@JA-zh5xi Actually I do not, you fled the interview before you said it.
Go to any Home Depot -- the parking lot will be filled with 6 or 7 year old Rams and F150s, from carpenters, tradesmen, electricians. You think any of them are going to spend $70,000 -- about $900 a month -- on an electric truck? Or maybe you are a large established A/C repair place -- sixty employees, ten trucks. You need to replace five of the trucks. Are you going sign up for $350,000 in finance obligation for five basic work trucks? Especially when half the electric charging stations are always out of order! Get real, Ford.
And for most trades fuel cost really are not a problem. Most guys drive to a job site and park the rest of the day while they are working. It's not that big a deal to burn a few gallons of gas per day to get to work and back. An electric delivery van or maybe garbage truck could make sense since they are on all day and make a lot of stops.. but your average contractor has no use for an EV truck.
Range alone makes a ev a no go. While most days a ev Transit would meet my needs there are days that 300 plus miles are needed. It would take a guaranteed 400 mile range loaded to make me consider one. My van weights 8K pounds with just my gear in it
@@jonsaircond8520 How much heavier with a battery??!!!!!!!TOO MUCH
@@industrialathlete6096 well I think trading a drive train for battery it's not much more. Problem is these ev's do not do well under load and range would be way less than stated.
And Newsom in California continually raising electrical rates. He wants to be president. Save us ....
Why would any bank finance a disaster like this?
Ask Bob Iger. Someone is financing Disney in their crash.
My friend bought a platinum lightning in Canada a couple of years ago during the panic for $140,000 CDN just to get one of the first ones. It has been to the dealer at least 7-8 times for repairs and is worth something like $40,000 CDN today. That is a $100,000 CDN depreciation in a little over 2 years. My 22 Lariat F 150 which I bought at the same time has depreciated maybe $15,000 - $20,000.
The EV bubble is bursting. Tesla should thank the lord that COVID happened, if that insanity had not taken place and the craziness of the 4 years following….I think this bubble would have hit much earlier.
So that averages out at a little over $4100 loss and depreciation every month, sounds like a pretty good investment to me if you’d like to lose money
@@marshallforeman2051 He is filthy rich so he could care less but I still bug him about it.
@@markadler8968unless you are a billionaire, wasting money is still stupid….
@@woodrmp1 Oh he doesn't like to waste money, that is why he is rich. He didn't expect the freefall depreciation he got on his truck. He said that is the last EV he will ever buy as his Tesla dropped over 50% in value as well.
Thought y'all were car guys? Did you not watch Sandy Munroe's teardown of the Ford Lightening and the Mach-e?
Ray. I am surprised, you know ...
Just like the old days before Zach was born, the automakers are back to designing product obsolescence.
Here is a tip:
Compare the manufacturers' preventative maintenance schedules between a Ford Lightening and a Cybertruck or a Mach-e and a Model Y.
Sandy hasn't torn down his Cybertruck, but when he does, you can sure as heck that there will not be any product obsolescence in a Tesla designed vehicle. The big three simply can not resist, and they are strangled by dealerships.
If I could buy a Lightning Platinum with few miles in the low $40k range i would trade my 2018 Lariat asap. But you can't find any for sale at that price. There are leftover 2023s for $62k, which is still too much if the trade value is $40k.
I'm good with used Lariat for $45k
I'm 100% buying a used Trailblazer SS this year. Will all these new car market issues affect my purchase of a 15yo+ used vehicle tomorrow, or should I wait things out?... LOVE yalls channel !
I did the "cash offer" on my Tacoma and got around $5k offers on it. The closest "for sale" listing is around $20k with double the miles and more.
Saw an ad on TV for the 2023 F-15 Lightning with a teaser of $15,000 off, but in the fine print it's only $7500 off of MSRP and the other $7500 is a tax credit. Don't think that offer is going to move the needle on sales figures very much.
If it is still taking tax credits for folks to buy EVs….I think we can safely say that the EV phenomenon is not sustainable.
So how is the tax credit applied? Is it a true 7500 dollars in my pocket or is it just a percentage tax rebate that is now taxable income in the form of a stimulus check?
@@billo3797 I believe it just comes off the top, like a write off for a business…so whatever your federal tax rate is x 7500, would be your true benefit.
@@billo3797 It’s a tax credit, so it is subtracted from taxes owed. This is compared to a tax deductions which is subtracted from of taxable income. Credits are more advantageous than deductions, however on a personal front, I’m not a fan of EVs or tax credits by the government for anything, but this is how it works.
taxes are legal theft from the govn't.
Consider a year ago they were putting Lightning buyers on a waiting list at $10K over MSRP.
Here is the thing for me. With new fancy technology, you can’t overpriced the market. They are so greedy with it, it’s not funny. I’m currently just putting the feelers out with getting a EV truck…. But if you want to sell me one, price better be down to $50k. I’m perfectly fine with waiting.
It’s not even EV issue, it’s an MSRP issue.
Exactly. I get tired of the "save the planet " nonsense. How can EVs save the planet when most of them are priced out of 99% of the planets population range?
They cant make an affordable "EV truck". Large SUV's and trucks are are terrible use-case for electrification because they need massive, heavy and expensive batteries to provide some reasonable level of range due to their much higher drag coefficient than a car.
@@lot2196 Because it's not the car itself saving the planet. it's funding the ECOSYSTEM of technology to use a more diversified sources of energy. "priced out of 99% of the planets population range" is absurd nonsense. Pricing is NOT RELEVANT when the manufacturing supply chain scale is currently soo small. There is not enough vehicles to exist to make it dirt cheap yet. FYI Power electronics like inverters, BMS and batteries can be used on more things than just vehicle.
I’d be curious what the results would be with a Lightning pro. When you have a single model that is priced from $40-96k with arguably minor changes between models, it’s not surprising that a top spec would be worth little more than entry level, during times of price sensitivity.
Looking around the cheapest Lightning platinum I can find in the US with close to 10k miles is $61k. While certainly a big hit if you paid retail it’s a far cry from $39k. Dealers may not want to buy them, they are worth way more than $39k on the secondary market.
Dealer asking 61k you can probably negotiate another 15% off that number. So you could possibly get that truck for around 52k? It couldn't hurt to throw an offer at 48 and see what they do.
Ok so where would I buy a lightning platinum for 39k?
For ~$39k, I may be interested.
As a point of comparison what would Car Edge give for a Toyota Tocoma or Honda Ridgeline percentage wise?
We purchased a 2022 pro and put 7600 on it before selling it for $700 less than we purchased it. The truck was great, but the mileage loss was too much in wintertime. Several places we drove to for the farm were not possible in the winter, even if we preconditioned the battery and had a full charge. I'm shocked at some of the prices on your video.
They’re all over our area selling for $35-43k with less than 15k miles on them.
Hint? That's 1 vehicle. Looking on line at several sites - - the prices on used are much higher.
Plus, you are unlikely to pay MSRP for it these days.
@@bills6093 If you do your a fool, that's from someone who was directly in the business for 54 years.
Are dealer markups included when calculating depreciation? Because you said msrp.
It bugs me that Many people paid above msrp for a lot of ice cars which are not accounted for in depreciation calculations.
Visited a jeep Dealer here in SE PA yesterday. I didn't see any sign of any large discounts on new Jeeps. The new Jeeps still had the markup stickers on them. The used Jeeps had discount stickers, though.
Go to a different dealership then. All dealers are different.
A non electric Platinum is just as expensive. $93000 is a stupid price for any pickup, gas or electric and that's really the issue
The moral of the story is don't use caredge to get bids on your car. My friend just sold his after one year and 9k miles. He got $11k less than he paid a year ago new.
These guys are kind of a joke..
That ain't happening. They are all over auto trader for $20k off sticker at least. XLTs for $39k lariats for $45k. I've seen 22 Lariat with 207 miles for $57k original sticker was $80k
Tried to get a kelley blue book value on a 2023 Lightning. They won't give a number!
I bought a 2022 Nissan Rogue SV Sport, it had 1OK miles on it. I paid exactly 22K for it. I got it from Echopark in Thornton Colorado. No dealer fees, no prep fees, just tax/registration fees. Was this a good deal, I couldnt/cant find anything that was as close to that price and milege on the used car. I did pay cash but only told them at the very end. No trade in. Please tell me if I made a good or bad decision. I watch your youtube page each week and love your advice.
Thanks for doing the tip of the toe analysis on the Ford Lightning resale value. I wish it had been a little deeper, as I'm wondering if this won't be the same story for the Cyber truck in a year or less. The one "upside down" deal that seems to have one bright spot, that is if you could make an otherwise favorable deal to this, and get rid of a dud model you're saddled with, and into a better new model. Not everyone looks deep enough into the history of models and work by other metrics. Styling, relationships, word of mouth, models of a particular year that were reliable can be factors too, and even good models can have a particular unit that was a Lemmon right out of the factory. So yeah, even someone with eyes open could go for that, maybe the interest rate is lower than any other trade they could make. That could be
the incentive. It's not the deal to end all deals, but may be for a few, it's an escape hatch.
I looked at new gladiators in December. Even with the 15 percent off they seemed overpriced for what you get. I was just looking for a pickup truck. I got a new, fancy full size GM product for about 25 percent off and less dollars than the gladiator. More comfortable, less compromises, better trade in value. The Ford local places still had markUPs equal to or greater than the manufacturer discounts 😂. Ford is in LALA land, except on their EVs, which no one wants here (rural Texas).
My dad bought a 2023 wrangler rubicon xtreme recon last year for his mountain house in Costa Rica. I got to drive it last week. Awesome off road chops for sure and a great vehicle for down there, but crazy expensive for what you get. It’s half the vehicle of my F150 Platinum but the same price. Half the size, half the power, less features. Way overpriced IMO. Those 35 inch tires don’t cost THAT much lol.
Regardless of price, you did the right thing. If you’re looking for a pick up truck, Gladiators should never be considered. Gladiators are for people that want a Jeep and need a bit more utility.
OK I bought my Lightning XLT SR a little over a year ago for 49K after the incentives and govt rebate. It has an 8 year battery warranty by Ford. I use it on my farm and I never take long trips in it nor do I ever intend to. It is the best riding most useful truck I have ever owned, and as a side note its super quick. I simply could not afford a new gas truck at the time for 70K to get a similar feature set. So if the truck is completely dead at 8 years it will have cost me around 6K per year to own. Oh and did I mention that it gets around 70mpg equivalent when charged on the farm @ 13 cents per kwh? Oh and there is the use of the 7.2KW power from the truck to run my 240v welder that I forgot to mention as well.
Yup, it’s a good farm truck.
Dude, you sound like AI! Your grammar algorithm is very good (for a farmer). Lol
So Ford should promote independent farmers as that may be their only market lol ! Glad it worked out for you though.
I am just saying that there are a lot of uses for trucks other than using them as family cars. Like they were originally intended to be used for example, WORK. @@Chris-bz6wl
So, you're saying short F on the NYSE! Got it, thanks for the tip!
I had a reserve for an F150 lightning on Day 1. They raised the price 3 times via email. They screwed around and sold the highest trims to the rich after they surveyed. When I finally received an email for my order a year later they claimed the base trim was somehow "out of stock" and I could only buy a really expensive model.
Hmm
I’ve noticed the dealerships where I’m from are not wanting to move off prices on used 1-3 year old trucks. I think they assume if you want it enough you will buy it regardless.
@bigcountry8726
They're wrong.
So then don't buy from them. Call others outside your area. Once you are given a vin# of one that is reasonably priced, drive over there & buy only when you are offered a much lower price.
I know people that paid over 110k for a lighting 2 years ago when it first came out.
You know mentally challenged humans
I almost bought one, buy the president of Ford gave an honest appraisal about how that vehicle just isn’t where it should be (or something to that effect). So I decided to wait and watch.
Those are the kinds of people you want to avoid being around or being friends with!
@@CRHarneyIII why would I care? It’s not my money.
In Texas you have to pay taxes on the rebates. So even they are discounted the states collects taxes on the sticker. The states can do things to help but never will.
Just bought new trans cooler lines for my 22 year old truck.. ill keep fixing.. not paying those over inflated prices.
Give me what the MFG are smoking!
Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds... HAAA HAAA, Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds....
My feeling is that Stelantis will need to lower their prices by 50% by year end to get rid of old stock or else ask for bailouts or go bankrupt in North America. I would hope they get turned down for any bailouts and taxpayers should demand there are no bailouts if they request one because they made millions not to long ago when they were taking advantage of people when purchasing a vehicle during the shortages and even after there were no shortages.
Ford F-150 Lightning Platinum: $91,995. 2024 Ford F-150 Lightning: $54,995. Used price for the Ford F-150 Lightning Platinum according to you: $39,200. It seems to me that the problem is with the upcharge on the Platinum name. Drive new off the lot and face the depreciation values.
At least the manufacturer isn't Boeing. The assisted steering would force you off the road. The doors would fall off because it's missing bolts. Past production people would refuse to carpool with you unless you were driving a model that came off the line prior to 1991. And the management facilities would relocate to Mars because they were too close to the manufacturing plant because they can get sucked-in to the problems with their actual manufacturing facility.
That's absolutely insane! You would have to be Nuts to even consider that truck!
A guy who plays softball for another team in the league I play in bought one of these a year or two ago. It attracted a lot of attention. We start league play this Thurs eve, if he's there with his truck I'll subtly ask him if he's happy with it.
Be nice, no one could have predicted this.
@@johndvoracek1000 Funny how no one--politicians making EV mandates, auto CEOs, EV buyers, and EV evangelists--did absolutely no research. This was entirely predictable and all those people should be ruthlessly mocked... and the politicians handing out taxpayer money should be held financially responsible. What an absolute shitshow.
@@johndvoracek1000 Huh? No one? Prices went crazy. Anyone who bought a new car in the last three years is nuts.
I know someone who paid 50k over sticker for one when they first came out, totaling almost 170k with taxes and fees. He went to go trade it in a year later and got offered just under 50k. He’s now over 100k in negative equity on the truck. Absolutely unreal how people fall for these EV scams
Trimflation is hardly an EV-specific problem. If dealers can sell minor cosmetic and powertrain upgrades for 5 digit markups, they're going to. People have been buying into that garbage for years with ICE vehicles too.
LOL this has nothing to do with EVs, It's just the Debt bubble automotive market needs to burst. Those high priced Jeep and RAM models are not EV and in the same financial hell.
Here in Quebec city Canada, Facebook marketplace has been flooded by all these unsold 2023 trucks that have piled-up on the already overflowing dealers lots. It looks like a fire sale, but they don't want to lower the prices much. It's ridicule.
I have used this tactic plenty of times over the past 3 years to gauge the actual value of a car for sale. However, I think we are now at a point where dealers really don't want anymore inventory unless they can steal a vehicle from a desperate customer in which case they will take on another used vehicle. It's like trying to buy a foreclosed house. The bank isn't going to simply take the highest offer at a foreclosure sale/auction unless it meets what they want to get out of the property. I think if you are trading in on a vehicle they stand to profit from in the deal, then you may get an offer just slightly below the actual used retail value.
This doesn’t add up. There’s no way a platinum offer is 40k with 500 miles. I call bs
easy to prove one way or another - go find out, get back to us.
Yea, 6 different sites show 60k+ for used std range models all around the East Coast. Got my ext range for 65k. Inflated cost? Maybe, but I love it and all it's features. And being a 1st generation, of course it'll be more $ for us 1st adopters.
EV resale has been horrendous, and even Porsche isn’t immune with its Taycan models dropping almost 50% in a couple years. I’ve always told friends the last few years that if they insist on getting an EV, they MUST lease it to protect themselves on the inevitable downside.
@@993mike I believe that's for new vehicles anyway and especially now due to inflated prices. And it does hit EVs a bit more since many are 1st generations models and no one knows how reliable used EVs will be. The drop just isn't as crazy as this video suggests.
While you're telling me about the Jeep, an add broke in calling it a legacy purchase.
I did the same with a new Wagoneer, very similar results.
Love it .
At the car show yesterday I was at all the makers were there and they had an electric section and no one was in it when it was packed. 😂
Are you doing this analysis of the Ford Lighting PRO or the PLATINUM? The Platinum has an MSRP of $91k. The PRO has an MSRP of $49K. Then the $39k would seem more reasonable.
I tune in for the stories, always a small joy in this crazy world
Works out to a loss of only $110 per mile. A new world record, perhaps?
I saw a 2024 Tahoe High Country sticker at $96k and a 2024 Yukon Denali sticker at $105k.
My guess is most people trading in that soon weren't prepared for EV ownership, so the dealers can take them to the cleaners on the trade.
This isn't an apples to apples situation. This is a complete fuel system switch, and unfortunately the lack of education across the spectrum (buyers, dealers, manufacturers, etc) makes it difficult to make an educated decision on the purchase. Results in people switching to EVs without being prepared, getting a sour taste, then trading in on a low just to get out of it.
Just for the relative interest, CarGurus in my area are selling used F150 Lighting Platinums for $65k, so they're making a roughly $25k markup on that truck. 30% depreciation is still a beating, but it's mainly fleecing the seller trying to back out of their transition.
In my area dealers won’t sell you anything if you’re trading with negative equity. You either have to pay the difference on spot, or negotiate like crazy
Great video as always...love the cross-channel collab!
So, does Ford (and Stellantis/CDJR) have to reduce existing Lightning inventory by 30%? 40%? 50%? This is bankruptcy territory...
This site is amazing where you guys talking about these dealerships when they where marking vehicles up 15 percent above MSRP.
I would pay $40k for a brand new ford f150 lighting platinum with 500 miles on the clock. That seems reasonable.
Dealer cash offers aren't exactly representative of what you could get for a vehicle.
It’s exactly what you’d be offered when trading it in.
@@theresacatalani 100% wrong. Dealers can't sell cars, the last thing they want is to buy a car from you. Try it yourself, call a dealer, ask em what they'll give you for a trade-in, then ask how much just to buy your car. It'll be 1/3 if you're lucky. Most will tell you they're not in the business of buying people's used cars. They wanna move the cars they already have.
CEO of Hertz resigns over Tesla fiasco. I guess EV sales/values keep getting worse !!
Last year when I was dropping off my gasoline powered Hertz car I was told that almost every Tesla they had was being returned with depleted batteries, no one was charging the cars before returning them. They had requests for them but you can’t send out a vehicle with almost no charge.
@@mikecumbo7531 Also Hertz was blind sided by Tesla. Every Tesla price cut cost Hertz in that it lowered the residual value of the car. Funny how a good thing like lowering car prices can toss such a monkey wrench into the works. This should be a good thing. What do you suppose will happen to world used car prices when the $20K or $30K Tesla rolls off the line in numbers.
39,200 is actually less than 39,999, the price that was originally announced for the Lightning.
How? If you like it and you drive it until the wheels fall off, depreciation doesn’t matter.
Feeling so much better about the 96 Previa I got for $1500 before the pandemic and am still driving.
jeeps offerin up to 31 percent off in my area
Post your area code, I’m heading your way.
Still wouldn’t buy one with your money!
@@sinjin1259 salt lake city
Used Lightning Platinums are in the $65k-70k range. Anyone accepting $39k for a sell back is a fool.
According to Kelly Blue Book a 2022 Lightning Platinum with 12K miles as a trade value of $54K and a private party sale of $60K.
They used the CarGurus for the base model and compared that price to the Platinum and most of the commenters here bought it. I realized it when I did the comp myself. 🤦🏻♂️
Great deal for the second buyer
No internal combustion powered car in history has ever depreciated that much ever!
Nobody making IC cars ever cut new car prices like EV makers are doing. Because they can't. For some reason lower cost to consumer is being spun as a bad thing! This is excellent.
Jaguar, Aston, Maserati. 🙄
Well, in normal times Dodge products depreciated AGGRESSIVELY. I think we are returning to normalcy. I can’t wait!
Heh..if I were in the market for a F 150 Lightning and saw it for $39500, I’d immediately go and get it. Goes to show you that carmakers got too greedy. $39,500 is much more in line with how much people can afford.
but then you would be stuck with a used lightning.....
That would be $39,499.99 more than it's worth
But in 5 years it will be worthless scrap metal for the shredder. $40k gone.
I wish I had a way to bookmark these comments and see where this ends up in 2029
So you wouldn’t mind losing half your money in 2 years on buying an EV truck?
Does Msrp already include a profit margin like MAP pricing does for other products?
Yes, we turn in for the stories
I bought a Gladiator, I don't plan to sell it. Odds are it will be my last vehicle I buy (52 and keep them 15 + years) or when I buy another vehicle in near 15 years odds are I will just keep it around as a pickup to carry things. But you are right, if I was only keeping it for 3-4 years it would be a HORRIBLE idea.
Also they are not going to make anywhere as many vehicles because they are not selling.
Yep…my bought new meticulously maintained F150 (garaged, annual rust sprayed, low fluid change intervals) will be 7 this year. Planning to run it another 10 and give it to my son.
Gladiator is much more practical than a Wrangler - you can use it for hauling and towing. Heavy duty truck.
Best buy now might be an used EV if you can live with one.
I was really wanting to move to a 2023 F150 Lightning from a 2015 5 litre….
The 5.0 is still going strong at 170k km and should last me another 9 years….
Now I’m realizing my 2015 will have better resell 10 minutes after I would drive the lightning off the lot….
I have a 2003 Avalanche with only 65k miles on it. I paid $24k for it new and it is paid off. I only drive it when I need to move something big. Glad I kept it. It’s still a nice truck.
I just sold my old 2004 with well over a quarter million miles. The Avalanche was a great vehicle, i just wish the roof came off.
I found a 2024 Audi ETron GT with 4000 miles that originally cost $117,000 for sale at a Dodge dealership for $51,000. The demand for electric cars is so low that there is no incentive for dealers to offer anywhere near the original value to buy used vehicles.
A guy just did a video. He wanted to trade in his Taycan for a used 911. The Porsche dealer won't even take Taycans in trade. They are all over the lot.
Was it a manufacture buyback? I see a few of those around the pricing you mentioned
@@user-uv3ho8dc7q
Well it sounded like someone bought this Audi and then just decided he didn’t want an electric car. I’m guessing there are lots of people who think electric cars are great and only then realize the drawbacks after buying one
@@williampotter2098that’s crazy! I think lots of car companies are regretting going all in on electric
When I hear F150 lightning i think V8 supercharged . Why would they use same name for battery car !
Because it is faster, has more HP and Torque.
@@danharold3087 looks like the old lightning will keep there value better . 20 year old one is still worth 20-30 k
@@eclipseusa1 Ford made less than 28K 2nd generation lightnings (1999 to 2004) . Ford made more than 24K 2023 lightnings. Do you see the problem with comparing these? So while I agree it is not making the point you intended.
I was thinking the old 2nd gen lightnings would be worth more. But much of the value on these old trucks is condition.
I don't know what is going to happen, but like Zach says. Something is going to have to happen. Dealers can not sustain pricing like this. Hard to feel sorry for them. But I'm afraid of what may happen if any one of the big three goes belly up!
A Ford dealer in my area has a NEW 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning Platinum for $96,000 [Price includes: $7500 - EV Tax Credit 32370 (Exp. 12/31/2024)]. They list the mileage as 4,722 miles. A 2022 listed as new with 4,722 miles????
I leased my Lightning Lariat, love it, gave my gf my SRT Jeep. She took the Lightning for 3-days, wants to drive it all the time now. Probably one of the most comfortable vehicles I’ve ever driven, better than my X5M. I’d love to keep it, but I leased it for this exact reason, when my 36 months is up, it’s Ford’s problem. I do have to admit though, I don’t miss gas stations or hitting the brakes - the one pedal function is the best option on the truck.
u got off easy with leasing instead of financing
@@Key-ey1zm exactly why I leased, residual was too unknown to risk purchasing outright
@@flaviuskern225 wish I would of leased few years ago now card worth $35k less lol. Now in the future I’m only going to buy used so depreciation would be slower. And if I ever buy new again in the future I’d probably lease instead of finance
Our manufacturers are committing suicide by betting all-in on EVs. This whole EV hysteria is pure madness.
This is what happens when tge market is driven by politicians instead of consumers.
There are countless examples of how the government mandated solutions today inevitably become tomorrow's problems.
I'll stick with gas. If this ev changeover ever happens gas will be decreasing in price
Meanwhile Telsa laughs at you and continues to take over the family car market.
"But it doesnt go vroom vroom!" Its the new call of the dinosaurs. 🤣
@666dynomax Thats not how economy of scale works bud, you should google that, it might save ya a lotta pain in the future.
No, it’s not we’ll all be there within years. Remember when we got cell phone… and then the first smart phone?
Great story Ray keep them coming !……
is there any vehicle in the US that isnt in a depreciation crisis? after all, a few years ago, 20 year old used vehicles were selling for the MSRP they sold when new? just a thought are all dealers in the US upside down on their inventory?
If someone can find me a F150 Lightning Platinum with 500 miles for $40k...I'll buy it.
Hell I’ll pay $50k. I have had my Lightning Pro since July 2022 and it’s an amazing truck. Would love to have the platinum for $40-50k.
It's not about what you can buy it for it's about what you can get out of it for😅
@@user-bv3wo2qh1dEXACTLY. It’s like trying to sell jewelry for its appraised value….
That’s the problem with this depreciation argument. The dealers will sell you the used one they just paid 40k for a great deal at 65k.
Battery replacement costs of buying a used EV because who knows how much life is left, much higher monthly insurance costs, public charging headaches (when you do find a charger will it be working?), range anxiety, real world actual range and not even mentioning what cold weather does to the range, the ever-present thermal runaway fire risks, the environmental damage caused by lithium mining, runaway acceleration, EV acceleration & regen causing motion sickness. So many reason to buy an EV!
EV acceleration & regen causing motion sickness is a load of crap. the rest is correct, but that last one is just plain B.S.
@@Ruteger100 There is more BS in there. Every one of these ~2 year old trucks started life with 8 years and 100K mile warranty on the battery. If it falls bellow 70% SOH it gets replaced. The finding a charger is history as soon as Ford makes enough supercharger adapters.
Sounds like someone that isn't interested in an EV, lots of tropes in this statement. But whatever.....
Stop with the insane lies. All you did was COPY & PASTE a script you were programmed to spam. None of that has any real world technical accuracy. Just fear mongering nonsense.
"environmental damage caused by lithium mining" not much in the Australian outback using Hard Rock ore mining. Way better than extracting oil and the 1000lbs battery last the entire 300,000 mile lifespan of the vehicle.
Not to vary too off the subject, last Thanksgiving holiday a couple who had a hybrid Ford car - let me ride with them of course I paid for the gas. All I could do is shake my head at the systems of the vehicle.
Although, I really really like the label Ford Lightning.. It sounds like an adventure vehicle. And jeeps are way too noisy inside and out. That just defeats the travel in my opinion.
I really do appreciate the heads up in the industry Fellas!
For those prices, the Lightning should come with "special" attachments that make the driver feel really, really good! My God.
$39,200 is still $20k to high for that thing. It's basically worthless.
As a current Lightning owner, I’d take two at $39k. They are awesome trucks!
@@matthewburns7584 Sure, as long as you understand you get about 100 miles range pulling 3,000lbs and are speed limited to 60 mph in order to get power and wait for it to get up to speed...begging the truck to get up a grade.
@@mikenimmick3920 The lightning has more HP, Torque, and a torque curve that ICE pickups can only dream about. Your like the stable owner scoffing at model T's.
@@danharold3087 Go pull something. My buddy had one. it's a friggin joke. Available power is auto decreased when he began to pull the trailer. The battery life was a joke. Cool truck...as long as you use it like a station wagon.
@@mikenimmick3920 I do use mine as a station wagon and it is amazing. It’s crazy fast, has decent range at 245 full charge, plenty of storage and saves me $200-300 a month in gas. I don’t do much towing and if I do it’s light around town stuff so it works for me. But seriously, I need a $40k Platinum asap…..
Ev`s biggest scam ever .
👍. Yep, the whole thing is an joke.
It goes along with their climate/global warming scam. NYC was covered under a mile of ice and then it all melted while mankind was still living in caves.
Can i get opinions on a 2024 honda crv hybrid sport touing?????
They’ll need to move to 0% 84 months plus the 15-20k off they are to get them moving. My local small ford dealer has had 3 since July 2023. Unfortunately most people need to finance, and the difference on an 80k truck(with discount) between 7 @ 6.5 and 7 @ 0 is about $250 a month
BYD is laughing how easy this EV market is going to be to take over !
Yes, BYD has a tremendous opportunity to lose a staggering amount of money, PROVIDED they can keep the vehicles from burning down long enough.