I feel like some of the hate towards Rapha also comes from the fact that they are trying to produce good, fashionable kit which if we are to look at the history of cycling kit was not always the case. Some people will automatically go against it for that reason saying it puts too much emphasis on aesthetic. I think the “good look” is a great thing because it will make more people feel good dressed in lycra and so it has the potential for making the sport itself trendier - ultimately, if you are the kind of person who dresses in a slightly more fashionable way, why wouldn’t you translate that to your cycling kit. Lastly, I think Rapha starters a great trend then followed by brands such as PNS, MAAP, etc, where besides great quality clothing they also promote cycling through beautifully made documentaries, challenges and overall create a trendy culture around cycling. For me, that is very important especially for a sport which used to be (on an amateur level) dominated by slightly older men. In terms of quality, I find Rapha and Castelli to be on similar levels yet we never hear of memes about Castelli riders.
I get what you are saying to a degree however "a sport which used to be (on an amateur level) dominated by slightly older men" I do not recognise this at all, I think you are confusing it with a sport that wasn't deemed to be cool until the year 2012 which just happened to coincide with team sky success and the 2012 Olympics and the ongoing success of both of these teams in the years that have followed, however those of us that have done the sport since our teens know for a fact it was not anymore dominated by older men then than it is now if anything there are more older men cycling now than ever. this leads directly into the Rapha hate. Rapha is seen as an extravagant poser brand by many which along with high-end bling bikes, Rapha is mainly accessible to older people who have had good careers and thus now have money to burn (why cycling is sometimes referred to as the new golf) in turn pushing up the price of bicycle equipment, guys coming into the sport late looking the part but without any knowledge or experience or knowing any of the unwritten etiquettes who in turn have helped push equipment prices to extreme levels. It's great that more people are into cycling now however it's easy to understand some of the irrational judgement on brands like Rapha. I don't like Rapha myself, I can afford it these days but I know I don't need to, I can't really explain it other than an irrational prejudice that in my experience links brands like Rapha with a lack of knowledge of etiquette and community. My prejudices are obviously often wrong but that's a prejudice I guess. As for fashion Rapha isn't particularly anymore fashionable than any other brand, cycling fashion like any fashion evolves and changes a few years ago team kits were loud and garish and that was the fashion then, fashion changes team kits are now more subtle and thus non-team cycling fashion is also more subtle there may be a time when the garish and loud awfulness returns, let's hope not.
Too much snobbery in the cycling community. Who gives a rats what anyone wears, whether it’s Rapha or an oversized tie-dye t-shirt. Nice vid. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Absolutely spot on. I find the rapha gear very comfortable though and try to buy the all black ones so you can't see the logo so folk don't think I'm a knob lol. I know folk that wear castelli and moan about it but purely wear it for its name 😂
I fell in love with Rapha about 10 years ago back when I couldn’t afford it. Once I was in the position where I could I started picking up some pieces of their kit. I agree their customer support is top notch. Haters gonna hate. Oh well. Really enjoying your videos. Keep doing what you’re doing!
Exactly my thinking. I like how you are primarily guided by rationality, objectivity and common sense and can step outside of the mold, seeing things from a distance, which is a sign of healthy stoicism. Mocking people for whatever reason is a form of wasteful childish identification, spending energy on outside factors instead of one's own personal journey. It runs counter to the overall philosophy of personal improvement (often combined with togetherness) that is so central to cycling. Kudos for that.
I said in a post on Federico's post - some aspects of cycling (never was the case) become like a private golf club, the look, the kit etc. Being a bikey was a working mans sport, not elitist!!!! I love how Frederico looks at this aspect - i don't give a rats ass about people commenting. i have latest kit and retro. great vid again
Your analogies are spot on! I just rode from Oregon to San Francisco a few days ago and noticed many in San Francisco wearing Rapha on the Golden Gate Bridge etc. In my opinion Rapha has always done exceptional marketing. Marketing works. In fact I’m about to order a Pro Team Training jersey! Quality also sells. Thank you for your video.
Bought mine all second hand. Very good and still going strong. Found some Castelli bib shorts in a second hand shop for 5 pounds the other day. Excellent too.
I’m a newer cyclist and ride both road and gravel. Rapha’s materials and cuts in the PTT line are my absolute favorite. Hands down. The core not so much, I passed a couple of those on. Ive picked up 4-5 Pro Team training both long and short sleeve in archive sales and they’re a big bank for your buck! They may no longer have the matching socks but I tend to shy away from pulling the matchy-matchy look….Low key “Rapha Rider” here. The cut and fabric performance are what’s most important to me. Thanks for your breakdown. Wear what you want!
Trying out new brands and highend expensive stuff is part of of the hobby. My journey in road cycling is very similar to yours actually. Tried most of the brands looking for value. Found perfect products alongside real dissappointing ones from big brands and settled with the ones I like from different brands. As long as you are happy with your choices and money spent on them its not business of others to judge. Having said that for me rapha rider is the one who overlooks other brands and stick to rapha no matter what. Keep up the good work really enjoying your content. Thanks.
I very recently bought this jersey in the same colour. I’ve always worn Assos and the prices for a performance fitting jersey have gone through the roof. The only reason I bought a Rapha jersey was because I was in a shop that stocked rapha and I could see it and try it on, and at £85 it is relatively cheap (yes I know it’s an obscene amount still, but I said relatively!) It seems rapha prices have stayed stable and everyone else’s have soared. Anyway, I’m really pleased with it and although all my other kit will stay Assos, I will be wearing rapha jerseys for now. Good video, thanks.
I stumbled on this video and I appreciate the time and information you provided. After trying several different brands over a few years, I ultimately tried Rapha based on another review about three years ago and never looked back. Customer service, fit, construction, and materials are all top notch. So yeah they have their haters but I think it’s from people used to spending $30 on a jersey that fits like a bed sheet and bibs with pads made of tissue paper. Industry wise, Rapha forced other brands to step up their game. Sometimes I hear the snickering, but I don’t care. If you’re worried or have issues with what I’m wearing, you’re on the bike for all the wrong reasons… 🤷🏽♂️🍻
Thank you! I believe you are right and it seems that now there are more value propositions in the range as well. You can't deny that Rapha had such a strong impact on cycling clothing style and image.
Cyclowarriorx i also stumbled on this nice review. I think like you Veloharmony gave me a nudge to buy Rapha. I'm no bike snob or at all wealthy but the pro team garments are a different grade. The Pro line cut is a far better choice for this guy being a slim/athletic build.
@@danielmoorhouse6506 I’m glad it helped. I started looking at the kit I purchased as an investment similar to the bike, etc.. Also having someone tell me you spend more money trying to save money in cycling really struck a note with me. So I get what I can, when I can and you’re right, the Pro line is far better and the only ones in their line up I get. Happy cycling Daniel and stay safe!
I recently purchased a jersey myself and found that I liked the material that they were using for their Core line just as you had as well as a Brevet. Other jerseys I have most certainly differ in fit and access to pockets, but functionally I can identify which jersey is meant for which purpose. Like you said, why they call their certain line of products by different names most likely portray their suggested usage. I'm quite fond of the brand thanks to a friend that introduced me to them.
my favourite are sportful and castelli - been the best bang for my buck, fit me best. Cycling kit 20 years and more back was sheer dreadful, along with a lot of bike shops. Kit for me has been the biggest improvement throughout cycling. Look at cold weather kit now to in the past, look at wet weather kit light years apart - wear what feels right looks right and what you have worked for - as long as you get out on the bike- Great video, Best attitude on here towards cycling culture uk -loving the channel great find!
Thank you so much, I'm happy you are enjoying the videos! I'm lucky, I started cycling seriously with great available kit on the market. I only tried one item from Sportful and it did not fit me, maybe I should give it another go.
Have lots of cycling kit including Rapha (of course), Giordana, Le Col and several jerseys of other brands I pick up when abroad - love them all. Cycling is full of all types including the “don’t need” brigade, but what’s need got to do with it 😊
i have just ordered a pro team training jersey for women from john lewis for £42, so glad to hear this pro team fits better! i'm 5 ft 9, so a little taller than ave. please don't take it the wrong way but both look fantastic on you!
rapha created a culture around the brand from it's inception, and they did a great job. in cycling it seems to be an english brand (or cyclist) is only better than being an american brand (or cyclist). i say this with truth and sarcasm... roadies are snobs, mountain bikers are way more relaxed and just glad to have you there and gravel is now what mtb was in the 80's. and, rapha is no more in cost than any other high level kit out there. they laid the ground work for le col, maap, eliel, torm etc. great discussion and review as always.
Cycling is definitely one of those sports/pastimes/hobby where there's an element of "all the gear and no idea", and I suspect for the Rapha-haters, the brand contributes significantly to that. There's probably also a bit of "he drives a Aston Martin so he must be a prick" in this! Personally, Rapha gear is great especially if you pick up a good deal in their Archive Sale (which is on now...)
I must admit I love my Rapha Core Jersey. Decent price for a decent jersey. Super Comfortable, smooth fabric. The bottom sticks nicely and I honestly, dont feel it on. For me, the same cannot be said of another high end brand, Assos. So yes - perhaps there is 'Rapha Rider' or perhaps a 'body type' that best suits a specific line or designer. Beautiful, Italian Sidi Shoes for example, are painfully narrow for me, but the S Works Torch in the same size and I am Cinderella.
The Pro Team Training Jersey is the sweet spot in terms of value in the lineup for Rapha. Like you, I first dabbled with the Core and was severely disappointed with how it fit, felt, and looked. Re: the Rapha Rider, I think people generally have a negative view of Rapha due to the idea of having to pay to be part of Rapha Cycling Club. Also, being owned by a private equity firm that's associated with the Walton family (Walmart) really turned people off, at least from what I see here in the US. Most of these people likely aren't aware (or care) how much Steuart and Tom Walton advocate for cycling.
Interesting, thanks for the info. Sometimes these private equity firms lose track of the core values, but I agree the Pro Team Training line is a good proposition
Hey Federico great vid !!! I too wear Rapha , in the beginning I was a bit of a hater but I reached out to buy some and I absolutely love the pro team training kit it fits like a glove !! The core is very much more a relaxed fit but still looks ok . I also have Castelli kit which I like too, but Rapha seem to have more designs and appear more able to engineer better a community . DHB make good kit i I they they strike a really good balance between value and style ( you have get the Lab kit which is like their pro aero type kit) . Anyways I think people shouldn’t hate just embrace all kit and styles as at the end of the day we’re all in it for one thing the enjoyment of two wheels and a bit of suffering up hill . Keep up the good work.
Thanks Richard, I agree. Most of the time these brands that start as a niche proposition get some hate when they become mainstream. It's a natural evolution where the initial customer don't feel unique and special anymore. I like dhb as well, I got an aeron bib that is one of my favourite!
Thanks I enjoy your videos. I appreciate how you explain the perceptions then explain your thoughts on the matter. I don’t ride full kit, but if I did it would be Rapha or similar styling, very nice kits.
The information about pockets and back side of core jersey is very useful. I have considered to buy this one, but after your experience I don't want core jersey. The pro jersey looks awesome! 👍
Thank you! In London they have a great flagship store, so it's easy to try on different styles. Otherwise you just need to order and return if needed. The pro team training is good value and fits great.
I am enjoying your take on the cycling sport very much. I think that there is a lot of elitism and snobbery in the sport unfortunately. My belief is that it stems from competitiveness and insecurity. Wear what you like and ride what you like and don't give a damn what other people think, that's how I roll 🤣 Also you are spot on about motorcycling too! Congratulations on 1K subs, I suspect this is just the beginning...
I am a fan of Rapha gear and if wearing it pisses someone off then its worth the extra expense. I really don't care what people wear to cycle in, what bike they have or how much it costs. Everyone has their own budgets and limits. The only thing you can control is your attitude about these things. Just be yourself.
Can I ask what you mean? From my knowledge, RCC have almost daily rides for different skill levels, dedicated women rides, social ones, events&workshops, etc. I was thinking of joining it for that reason so I’m curious what you mean
@@Handoresmya I’m just commenting on where I think the meme originates. Rapha seems to be targeting a wider audience now, so the meme might not be as relevant.
I was part of an RCC chapter here and the experience sort of turned me off the brand. Before that, I had jerseys, gloves (too delicate) and shirts from Rapha. I'll stick with PedalEd, ASSOS and Q36.5 for now for my gear.
Just feel free ,everything is just a process of finding your self . I think Rapha is just easy to find a way in to cycling. And by the way, everything is expensive when you riding a road bike! Do what you can do and don’t prove it to other people just prove it to yourself. Much love buddy ❤
I felt a bit opposed to brands like Rapha because of the high price and couldn't think of a reason to buy it. Until I was in need of mid-season long sleeve jersey and found a big sale on them. I mix and match with brands still, but jersey wise they are amazing I feel both in fit, quality and comfort. I go for the Core line (not lightweight) here because of the weather in Belgium + the zipper pocket is great! I'm not the biggest fan of their bibs though, I've the feeling my Castelli Competizione has way better support and compression than any rapha bib I've tried
Lol UCI approved. Funny. Nice video. Pro training jerseys are perfect fit. The aero jerseys are even better. For anyone that is considering to buy Rapha or the other brands, best to go to shop first to try. Nice video.
Hi! Is there any modern colourful designs you like? I tend to wear endura clothing for cycling. Mostly MTB. But I would like to wear interesting modern road jerseys sometimes but I prefer non racy but fun and bright designs that don’t have 50 sponsors on them. (Most of my road jerseys look like this)
Actually I don't have many colourful jerseys, mostly black, couple of reds (my red Endura is nice), white and grey. Somehow I prefer plain colours, but should try one maybe
@@fede1275 dark colours naturally look good , particularly on tanned and darker skin! I live in a very cold country and I enjoy the contrast! Last week I seen someone wear a body suit with multi coloured tessellated triangles (think 80s aesthetic) on their road bike and I thought it was very striking and unique 👌
I think it’s because it’s not a US brand. I felt the same way but I just bought my first Rapha pro tights and they’re nice. I was compelled to try it out because it’s so popular here in SF.
great video, and approach of the subject. Humans build social constructs to feel safe and relate to others at a fundamental level, which are largely comparative parking spaces of error. Personally, wish I could get Rapha service , in a 7mesh design, with the Assos chamois:)
Man....! You look awesome and superfit...you should go in to detais and elaborate more on fitness...!! I believe part of the hate comes from the "euro style " rules on the bike...! And Rapha are taking the hit because it could be not considered to be super hardcore racing brand. I personally own a couple of pieces ( more affordable ones) and truth be told the fit is not of the best ones although I love the way they look...!! Great and classy episode...!!
Thank you so much! Actually initially I was going to talk about fitness, in my opinion there is still misguided information sending people in the wrong directions. Then the lockdown happened and cycling took over. Will work on the fitness side when I have more time.
There's definitely a stigma attached to Rapha, personally I couldn't care less about what other people think, they make very comfortable good quality clothing. When ever the subject comes up with other cyclists, the opinion I hear the most is the type of riders that wear their clothes "Big bear belly banker types" who spend loads of money on a top of the range Pinarello, cover themselves in head to toe in Rapha, but can hardly cycle more than 10 miles. Or the type that just want everyone to know they where Rapha. I get these opinions to a point, I guess if cycling fashion really matters to you, you could always go with brands that are less mainstream, but personally, I really couldn't care less what people think, they are comfortable and well made.
You are right and I believe that stigma is unjustified. I met so many great riders wearing Rapha, but at the same time there is nothing wrong to own a Dogma and ride short distance or slow. Everyone can embrace cycling as log as there is respect and education.
The people make the brand snobby. Rapha is just well known and people like to pick on em. But there’s other brands that are more expensive, i.e Assos. I chose Rapha because there’s a store in my city. I can go and try on stuff. I’m not a skinny cyclist. I wear XXl jerseys and L bib shorts. So having a physical location helps. The clothes are cool and stylish. Their warranty is top notch. I’ve received 50 percent credit for bibs that I’ve had for 2 years. Can’t complain. The quality and materials are top grade.
Thanks for the info, but most importantly is there a sizing difference between Core and Pro Team? I have seen a few reviews recommending going up a size from Core to Pro Team...can you confirm? Thx
Yes 👍🏼 why buy a lesser product if you can afford a better one. No one asks why you drive a Ferrari and not a Fiat. Rapha has great fit, very good quality and also looks good. I tried other brands and always go back to Rapha.
You got me thinking :) Somehow there’s also the brand mockery does have some justification. Rapha, as well as other brands like for example Castelli, makes excellent stuff. They are expensive for that reason. Things go totally wrong, when they use the brand name to sell rubbish. It goes even more wrong when there’s a community who religiously praise a brand without being critical. In the end, it is bad for the serious consumer who thinks s/he can trust a particular brand. So basically, this is about brands that use a high standard and that are willing to keep their own standard. At the end of the day, those brands will deserve to be praised. A good example of this is Apple. At first many people were skeptical. But Apple always keep their promise. They commit to their very high standards. Mocking them is nowadays a bit irrational. If you are willing to pay the price you get good stuff. If you don’t need that level of quality or performance you can get also good stuff from plenty of other brands. So if Rapha is willing to sell mediocre items for a ridiculous price just because they think they can get away with it they are in the end to blame for the “Rapha Rider” .
Yes, spot on. You definitely feel betrayed when a big brand asks for a premium on a mediocre product just for the name. Usually dangerous to buy the "accessible" lines of prestigious brands.
No, I sold my Rapha kit. As I now collaborate with Siroko, I have everything I need. I still use Castelli Gabba and Perfetto though, as they are quite unique.
Thankyou for the video, I'm considering purchasing rapha and would be interested in your height and weight to compare and decide weather the medium or large would be better, I'm 5'9" 165lbs.
Ciao Federico, I've been riding in Rapha (& other brands) for a while. Pro Team (training or race) are really thight, the core is much more relaxed, you should try to go one size down and you'll have a much better fit on what you complained. That said training is cheaper and and less aero compared to race, but both really racey fit. Ciao e complimenti!
Ciao Livio e grazie! Somehow the Pro Team Training fits me better than the Core, it seems that the Core is a bit short for me in the back. I haven’t tried the race kit, bit too expensive for me at the moment.
Love that jersey I may get long sleeve one only cause it looks cool! Yer I find that with core it curls up at the back and pockets are small and I Prefare a bit of a longer sleeve but still got few colours. How do you get the offer??
The offer was available on Rapha website on their core range, maybe a year and half ago. I saw SportPursuit having discounted Rapha kit from time to time, but they sell out in half an hour or so. With the core jersey I also use a Nike Pro long sleeve base layer, it makes a nice long sleeve jersey combo.
i can’t force myself to pay that much money for something that’s made in China however i have to admit i do have a few of their items but never where them because of the Rapha rider:) I think Rapha itself is responsible for that. it seems about 5 years someone in Rapha decided to send everyone with a cycling oriented youtube channel their kits. some where proper cyclists but some simply went for coffee in their pro kits:) in cycling everyone wants to stand out. that’s why most people try to customize their bikes to look different or wear a “unique” kits and i think Rapha lost that uniqueness. Since then i’ve tried a few different brands and i have to say the prices Rapha charges are i bit too much. For me LaPassione is a good balance between the quality and value. Love their simplistic designs this year and bibs are outstanding. Not sponsored:) Good luck with a channel sir!
In where I live, people are “big” on “status symbol”. Consequently, the distributors & shops know that well and sell them at full price (or even higher), and ‘brag’ them as status symbol rather than appreciation of good quality. Some nouveau riche are happy when they can show off the buying power (think people wearing shirts, shoes with HUGE Gucci, Balenciaga, D&G logos, or some pathetic nouveau riche deliberately trying to show they have Rolex Sub etc.), and that’s where the infamous label originated from IMO. I wear Rapha frequently because I think Rapha makes good products; the cut, the fabric, the durability, and the design (mostly). Interesting topic 👌
Somehow our social settings will have us choosing items to differentiate us from other groups and associate with our target ones. Next would be for PAS or Maap to get identified with a Rapha rider maybe. Nothing wrong with showing off, as long as you are a well behaved cyclists I guess 😀
I have a similar problem with a long sleeve core jersey. The rear pockets are really too high to reach while riding. I can barely get my phone out when I stop riding. Are you saying the pockets are lower and easier to reach on the pro jersey?
Yes, the pro jersey is better as it does not rise up as much as the core. Still it's not a long cut at the back, but it's in line with other race jersey I have, like Castelli.
very good review. i trust your judgement when it comes to product quality, so yeah i guess rapha does provide good value for money, unfortunately it's still out of my range :)
I think a similar stigma is attached to ASSOS. It’s either “All the gear and no idea” or Rapha dressed riders are regarded as rather aloof and unfriendly, not saying hello or waving to other cyclists on the road, often because they are not members of a club. Club cyclists will usually wear their club kit whilst riding. I think this attitude is more of a London thing though. Not noticed any Rapha stereotyping up in the Midlands. Rapha is good quality kit. I’ve always regarded it as being too expensive, but it looks like they’ve brought out cheaper ranges recently.
So true..im here in New York and the riders that wear rapha(including myself)are always cool and down to earth..I think the snobbish thing came from the London riders..
I have only rarely heard the RR term used and it seemed to be used in a generic context to embrace riders that only ever seem to wear very dark (almost always black) clothes while riding an equally dark coloured bike.
Hi, I got the pro training jersey in the same size L as the Core as I don't mind the tight fit. I don't know if pro team (not branded "training") are even tighter. If you can return get both sizes!
Training jersey looks good on you. I only have the long sleeve core jersey which is good for cooler weather. Like the look of the pro team line but it's too expensive.
the training jersey is just as good as a an aero jersey from rapha i have this training jersey its tight and aero..and the best part is its COMFORTABLE! its just as good as an race jersey so yeah.......also this jersey is little warmer so i wear it from 65 to 74 degres and yeah it looks good too!
Absolutely, it is a great product. I can imagine the embarrassment in the marketing meeting when they had to differentiate this product from the more expensive stuff. Let's say is only for training...😂
I guess some of the hate might come down to the marketing. Rapha really wants to embody this top-shelf, best-in-the-business idea which might annoy some people who don‘t want to / cannot spend the money rapha asks. You can of course still be a serious rider in kits that cost half of what rapha is asking, but rapha makes it look like you really need their stuff to perform. They also were the first brand to follow this cycling couture idea, which becomes more and more popular these days with brands like MAAP, Pas Normal, La Passione and personally I know people who care more about the sexiness of their Instagram-feed than the actual cycling. But then again, as long as they enjoy cycling this way, who am I to judge? It’s their time and their money and if they should get too annoying I can simply drop them.
Congratulations on passing 1k subs Federico! Think your channel deserves to have many more. On the Rapha thing, I like their aesthetic as it is more stylish than some of the frankly ugly sportswear brands. I think there are some people in the cycling community (who think all carbon bikes are “Chinese crap” for example) who feel the need to scorn anything they think is expensive or modern…if you are not grinding up the hills on a steel bike with rim brakes wearing cheap old kit then you are a rich amateur loser!
Very nice! Federico you need to write another email to rapha, to get a discount code for the channel, you have the skills to articulate a very good deal, I'm sure.
First time hearing about the "Rapha Rider" memes/hate. I am planning to switch from Gore to Rapha just because they have the best repair policy - I've been burned with Gore build quality and their repair policy too many times
Personally, I think that we do not need any luxury brands, especially in today's more conscious times. No, we don't need the best, even if we can afford it. No, it is not worth paying more for design or aesthetics. This applies not only to Rapha, but to all the brands you have mentioned.
I understand where you are coming from, but it is not easy to define the right balance. I am trying to buy items that for me are a good value proposition. The same item could be very expensive for some and cheap for someone else.
I think the "pro" jerseys are expensive than "pro training" jerseys because the "pro" ones uses different materials at different parts of the jersey, like underarms etc might have materials that wick sweat faster.
I tried the Rapha core bib and it did not live up to its price tag. For the price, Casteli FAR 4 bibs are better. I also tried out a mid-tier jersery, and while it was nice, it was nowhere near as nice as Assos stuff. From what I gather, Rapha is for people that are into branding/fashion, more so.
I have to agree, Rapha Core range makes more sense with the discount and not at list price. The Pro Team Training jersey seems good value even at list price. Never tried Assos, maybe in the future.
Cycling is all about branding, fashion and elitism. What are you on about 😂😂😂 how many cyclists you come across at any cycling event that are down to earth and judgement free? Mostly are on their high horse thinking they are hot crap 🤣🤣🤣
While I like my Rapha jerseys I was heavily disappointed by their pro team autumn/ winter jacket. It just was too cold... Nothing pro about that. Sold it.
I think there is a good bit of jealousy behind these Rapha rider memes. I think if you’re a beginner or intermediate Cyclist, and can you purchase top level kit, that makes you smart! My best, ASSOS and Castelli kits have lasted me 10 years
I think most of the dislike comes from their marketing / branding strategy. Way back in the late '00s I always felt like they were putting out a message that 'if you ride 100 miles in the rain in our gear you'll be part of the cool kids club' and trying too hard to show how 'cool' their brand was. Given their new status (only 3-4 years old) at the time, I think it got the reputation as being a poseur brand. I don't think the RCC and the closed nature of sponsored events helped, nor some of their promo videos. Assos and Castelli haven't gotten the same level of hate over the years and they are just as or more expensive as Rapha (high end Assos is bonkers.) That said, I'm planning to order a pair of the Core bibs next week and give the brand a shot as I do like the minimal aesthetic look their clothing has.
You are right, maybe the different brand positioning and style has created some reactions. Definitely they changed the cycling clothing style and in my opinion in a good way. I am a bit of a poseur myself, so I guess I fit in!
@@fede1275 I do like their minimalist / simple style and colors available. And thanks for showing the two jersey cuts, I am contemplating a jersey too and seeing the fit difference is very helpful. Its funny, after your video I tried to watch Rapha's video on the Core product line and quit after 1min of a 2.5min video. They hadn't covered any details of the items that far in, just covering 'lifestyle' of the actors they wanted to portray (writer with writers block, parent wanting to get out of the house, former competitive cyclist now just enjoying riding.). But I'm going to buy some kit next week and maybe ascend to poseur status, we will see. :)
Rcc is about the cool kids stuff which i find funny. What are youse, in high school or something 😂 a friend of mine was part of rcc before the store shut down because they went broke. He told me he can ride with the group if you have click with someone. Its like they entertain you if have the money, if not then go kick rocks. Its just part of elitism in cycling unfortunately.
@@PhiyackYuh I'm not in high school and have been riding since before Rapha existed. Which is why their advertising strategy has been a turn off for me since the beginning. What you say about RCC, doesn't have to be the norm. YMMV, but what I have noticed with experienced (15+ years) cyclists and high level amateurs is, if anything, they are anti-elitist. They don't care what bike you ride. They don't care if you have $500 or $40 bibs. They don't care if you shave your legs or not. To mangle a phrase, 'Legs talk, bullsh*t walks.' The 'elitism' issues I've seen are with 'lifestyle' focused people or less experienced (
I just like to wear rapha clothes and I am not a skilled bike rider. I just like the fabrics and how comfortable I feel wearing them on the bike. I don't know where this meme comes from.
Thank you. A few years ago (before cycling) I started to focus on better training technique in the gym, better nutrition and correct nutrient ratio. I never had a weight problem, but I look better now than in my early 30s. I actually wanted to talk about that when I started the channel, then cycling got in the way...
@@Tuffjobs I know, at the end of the day however you want to describe it, what we eat comparing to what we burn is what defines our bodies. The complicated thing is that is easier for some to reach and maintain consistently a slight calorie deficit, while for some others it is almost impossible. I know I'm lucky and could do that easily, for some others it's not so easy.
It seems like you just can’t get it right as someone who simply wants to ride for fun. 😂 Getting looked down on if you have no money to spend, getting sneared at if you do have money to spend. 🤪
I know, you are right. In Italy (Rome) I have been riding motorbikes (very few cyclist in the city) and there is not a single hi vis yellow or orange in sight. I should change it really. I always run lights on anyway.
@@fede1275 Rome wasn't buit for cyclicts, was it?))). But traffic from Gorizia via Trieste to Piran is more than moderate making you feel safe and lose your mind to the surrounding valleys.
@@fede1275 As for the subject, I didn't even consider Rapha as too mainstream (perhaps, I miss out something in my life). I'm 191cm tall, and I totally understand what you are talking about when you talk about jersey riding up the back. But I've had different sets and jerseys: Alpinestars (more for XC), Attaquer and Santic. But my heart is with Cafe du Cycliste. These jerseys are styled like grandmother's nightrobe and made of sea foam. And their Josephine bibs give my bum that tenderness I would experience from my mother's hands on my first day)) 🙄
Maybe Rapha would have fewer haters if the users could muster even the slightest of nods ( # Kill Bill ) in return to a friendly greeting from a fellow cyclist. 🤣🤣🤣
@@lookpro.rideslow This is Exactly why people hate on Rapha users and how road cycling and the elitist element within it particularly is off putting to a lot of people. Read my comment again - I wasn’t asking for a wave… but the slightest of nods would be nice. Thankfully I have moved to Brazil now and the cycling community here is incredibly open and friendly and you can always rely on a greeting or encouragement or a friendly gesture. I rode an 80 km race yesterday and there was a massive amount of mutual encouragement in the non- elite race. And nope I am not hurt at all; it’s just another example of how good manners are a thing of the past. Enjoy your too cool for school grumpiness😉
@@marcdaniels9079 oh I’m not grumpy at all. I ride in Chicago and those Rapha “elitists” you refer to wave at all the time. Very rare that we see cyclists that do not wave or say hello, or are just generally friendly. Associating a specific brand with shitty attitudes from people is ridiculous.
Rapha riders to me are the posers who cycle around regents park or similar parks in london and park their 8k bike with deep section carbon wheels outside a cafe and basically spend a fortune just to fit in with the crowd. If some ex pro or local hitter rocked up wearing an alternative brand, they would automatically follow suit. Its no different to the other copy-cat group who insist on using handle bar bags every ride when they have never bike-packed anywhere....and they only do this because they saw someone influential on youtube do it. People a free to spend money how they wish but so many lack imagination and are so insecure that they have to fit in with their mates.
Yes, but let's not be too harsh, we all try to fit in with the crowd, in a way or another. I'm happy wearing my Rapha jersey and I'm also happy with Van Rysel or no brand. Now if someone would want to give me an 8k bike to complete my Rapha kit I'll be most grateful 😄😄
There is only one good brand which is Pissei. Sorry, but you spend a lot of time thinking public image. You wear Rapha... In general people that spend a lot of time thinking about what others may think wear Rapha. For the most, I do not really care. But, a good race jersey does save you more watts then you think. I prefer Pissei. Why are you wearing a jersey that runs half way up your back?
Rapha tends to be very pretentious as a brand, especially if you go to their stores. That colors riders who wear Rapha. Their entry level clothing isn't much more expensive then other high end brands (e.g., Castelli), but the marketing of the brand is what irks people. Enough that there is even a satire website that mocks Rapha. Cycling is a very bougie sport and Rapha epitomes that bougie attitude to the nth degree. Going into their shops is eyerolling. And, I say that as someone who likes Rapha clothing because it looks less colorful and garish, which at my age, works better.
To each his own, but Rapha is for the cycling world's fashion victims. But you have to give them credit for their marketing and molding a certain, very self-conscious segment of buyers into now identifying as "Rapha riders".
I feel like some of the hate towards Rapha also comes from the fact that they are trying to produce good, fashionable kit which if we are to look at the history of cycling kit was not always the case. Some people will automatically go against it for that reason saying it puts too much emphasis on aesthetic. I think the “good look” is a great thing because it will make more people feel good dressed in lycra and so it has the potential for making the sport itself trendier - ultimately, if you are the kind of person who dresses in a slightly more fashionable way, why wouldn’t you translate that to your cycling kit. Lastly, I think Rapha starters a great trend then followed by brands such as PNS, MAAP, etc, where besides great quality clothing they also promote cycling through beautifully made documentaries, challenges and overall create a trendy culture around cycling. For me, that is very important especially for a sport which used to be (on an amateur level) dominated by slightly older men.
In terms of quality, I find Rapha and Castelli to be on similar levels yet we never hear of memes about Castelli riders.
You explained extremely well!!
The 'good look' all too often involves being dressed head to toe in black, against a blacked out bike, with a tiny blinking red light for comfort.
@@John_Wood_ I am very guilty then
@@John_Wood_ GUILTY! - it’s a good look tho
I get what you are saying to a degree however "a sport which used to be (on an amateur level) dominated by slightly older men" I do not recognise this at all, I think you are confusing it with a sport that wasn't deemed to be cool until the year 2012 which just happened to coincide with team sky success and the 2012 Olympics and the ongoing success of both of these teams in the years that have followed, however those of us that have done the sport since our teens know for a fact it was not anymore dominated by older men then than it is now if anything there are more older men cycling now than ever. this leads directly into the Rapha hate. Rapha is seen as an extravagant poser brand by many which along with high-end bling bikes, Rapha is mainly accessible to older people who have had good careers and thus now have money to burn (why cycling is sometimes referred to as the new golf) in turn pushing up the price of bicycle equipment, guys coming into the sport late looking the part but without any knowledge or experience or knowing any of the unwritten etiquettes who in turn have helped push equipment prices to extreme levels. It's great that more people are into cycling now however it's easy to understand some of the irrational judgement on brands like Rapha. I don't like Rapha myself, I can afford it these days but I know I don't need to, I can't really explain it other than an irrational prejudice that in my experience links brands like Rapha with a lack of knowledge of etiquette and community. My prejudices are obviously often wrong but that's a prejudice I guess.
As for fashion Rapha isn't particularly anymore fashionable than any other brand, cycling fashion like any fashion evolves and changes a few years ago team kits were loud and garish and that was the fashion then, fashion changes team kits are now more subtle and thus non-team cycling fashion is also more subtle there may be a time when the garish and loud awfulness returns, let's hope not.
Too much snobbery in the cycling community. Who gives a rats what anyone wears, whether it’s Rapha or an oversized tie-dye t-shirt. Nice vid. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
Absolutely spot on. I find the rapha gear very comfortable though and try to buy the all black ones so you can't see the logo so folk don't think I'm a knob lol. I know folk that wear castelli and moan about it but purely wear it for its name 😂
agree
I fell in love with Rapha about 10 years ago back when I couldn’t afford it. Once I was in the position where I could I started picking up some pieces of their kit. I agree their customer support is top notch. Haters gonna hate. Oh well. Really enjoying your videos. Keep doing what you’re doing!
Exactly my thinking. I like how you are primarily guided by rationality, objectivity and common sense and can step outside of the mold, seeing things from a distance, which is a sign of healthy stoicism. Mocking people for whatever reason is a form of wasteful childish identification, spending energy on outside factors instead of one's own personal journey. It runs counter to the overall philosophy of personal improvement (often combined with togetherness) that is so central to cycling. Kudos for that.
Thank you very much for that. Yes, I try to improve and look at things from the outside perspective as much as I can. With a bit of humour as well.
I said in a post on Federico's post - some aspects of cycling (never was the case) become like a private golf club, the look, the kit etc. Being a bikey was a working mans sport, not elitist!!!! I love how Frederico looks at this aspect - i don't give a rats ass about people commenting. i have latest kit and retro. great vid again
Your analogies are spot on! I just rode from Oregon to San Francisco a few days ago and noticed many in San Francisco wearing Rapha on the Golden Gate Bridge etc. In my opinion Rapha has always done exceptional marketing. Marketing works. In fact I’m about to order a Pro Team Training jersey! Quality also sells. Thank you for your video.
Federico I love your videos, so simple and chill yet very precise and informational. Thank you a ton:)
Glad you like them!
Bought mine all second hand. Very good and still going strong. Found some Castelli bib shorts in a second hand shop for 5 pounds the other day. Excellent too.
Good, there are always people changing interests and sports, leaving behind little used kit.
I’m a newer cyclist and ride both road and gravel. Rapha’s materials and cuts in the PTT line are my absolute favorite. Hands down. The core not so much, I passed a couple of those on. Ive picked up 4-5 Pro Team training both long and short sleeve in archive sales and they’re a big bank for your buck! They may no longer have the matching socks but I tend to shy away from pulling the matchy-matchy look….Low key “Rapha Rider” here. The cut and fabric performance are what’s most important to me. Thanks for your breakdown. Wear what you want!
Trying out new brands and highend expensive stuff is part of of the hobby. My journey in road cycling is very similar to yours actually. Tried most of the brands looking for value. Found perfect products alongside real dissappointing ones from big brands and settled with the ones I like from different brands. As long as you are happy with your choices and money spent on them its not business of others to judge. Having said that for me rapha rider is the one who overlooks other brands and stick to rapha no matter what. Keep up the good work really enjoying your content. Thanks.
Thank you!
I very recently bought this jersey in the same colour. I’ve always worn Assos and the prices for a performance fitting jersey have gone through the roof. The only reason I bought a Rapha jersey was because I was in a shop that stocked rapha and I could see it and try it on, and at £85 it is relatively cheap (yes I know it’s an obscene amount still, but I said relatively!) It seems rapha prices have stayed stable and everyone else’s have soared. Anyway, I’m really pleased with it and although all my other kit will stay Assos, I will be wearing rapha jerseys for now. Good video, thanks.
I stumbled on this video and I appreciate the time and information you provided. After trying several different brands over a few years, I ultimately tried Rapha based on another review about three years ago and never looked back. Customer service, fit, construction, and materials are all top notch. So yeah they have their haters but I think it’s from people used to spending $30 on a jersey that fits like a bed sheet and bibs with pads made of tissue paper. Industry wise, Rapha forced other brands to step up their game. Sometimes I hear the snickering, but I don’t care. If you’re worried or have issues with what I’m wearing, you’re on the bike for all the wrong reasons… 🤷🏽♂️🍻
Thank you! I believe you are right and it seems that now there are more value propositions in the range as well. You can't deny that Rapha had such a strong impact on cycling clothing style and image.
Cyclowarriorx i also stumbled on this nice review. I think like you Veloharmony gave me a nudge to buy Rapha. I'm no bike snob or at all wealthy but the pro team garments are a different grade. The Pro line cut is a far better choice for this guy being a slim/athletic build.
@@danielmoorhouse6506 I’m glad it helped. I started looking at the kit I purchased as an investment similar to the bike, etc.. Also having someone tell me you spend more money trying to save money in cycling really struck a note with me. So I get what I can, when I can and you’re right, the Pro line is far better and the only ones in their line up I get. Happy cycling Daniel and stay safe!
I recently purchased a jersey myself and found that I liked the material that they were using for their Core line just as you had as well as a Brevet. Other jerseys I have most certainly differ in fit and access to pockets, but functionally I can identify which jersey is meant for which purpose. Like you said, why they call their certain line of products by different names most likely portray their suggested usage. I'm quite fond of the brand thanks to a friend that introduced me to them.
my favourite are sportful and castelli - been the best bang for my buck, fit me best. Cycling kit 20 years and more back was sheer dreadful, along with a lot of bike shops. Kit for me has been the biggest improvement throughout cycling. Look at cold weather kit now to in the past, look at wet weather kit light years apart - wear what feels right looks right and what you have worked for - as long as you get out on the bike- Great video, Best attitude on here towards cycling culture uk -loving the channel great find!
Thank you so much, I'm happy you are enjoying the videos! I'm lucky, I started cycling seriously with great available kit on the market. I only tried one item from Sportful and it did not fit me, maybe I should give it another go.
Have lots of cycling kit including Rapha (of course), Giordana, Le Col and several jerseys of other brands I pick up when abroad - love them all. Cycling is full of all types including the “don’t need” brigade, but what’s need got to do with it 😊
Congrats on the exponential growth Federico!
Thank you, I am now trying to stay on top of the comments 😅
i have just ordered a pro team training jersey for women from john lewis for £42, so glad to hear this pro team fits better! i'm 5 ft 9, so a little taller than ave. please don't take it the wrong way but both look fantastic on you!
Thank you 😄😄
Thank you for all the enjoyable and informative videos. Congratulations on the 1k subs!
rapha created a culture around the brand from it's inception, and they did a great job. in cycling it seems to be an english brand (or cyclist) is only better than being an american brand (or cyclist). i say this with truth and sarcasm...
roadies are snobs, mountain bikers are way more relaxed and just glad to have you there and gravel is now what mtb was in the 80's.
and, rapha is no more in cost than any other high level kit out there. they laid the ground work for le col, maap, eliel, torm etc. great discussion and review as always.
Cycling is definitely one of those sports/pastimes/hobby where there's an element of "all the gear and no idea", and I suspect for the Rapha-haters, the brand contributes significantly to that. There's probably also a bit of "he drives a Aston Martin so he must be a prick" in this!
Personally, Rapha gear is great especially if you pick up a good deal in their Archive Sale (which is on now...)
I must admit I love my Rapha Core Jersey. Decent price for a decent jersey. Super Comfortable, smooth fabric. The bottom sticks nicely and I honestly, dont feel it on. For me, the same cannot be said of another high end brand, Assos. So yes - perhaps there is 'Rapha Rider' or perhaps a 'body type' that best suits a specific line or designer. Beautiful, Italian Sidi Shoes for example, are painfully narrow for me, but the S Works Torch in the same size and I am Cinderella.
The Pro Team Training Jersey is the sweet spot in terms of value in the lineup for Rapha. Like you, I first dabbled with the Core and was severely disappointed with how it fit, felt, and looked. Re: the Rapha Rider, I think people generally have a negative view of Rapha due to the idea of having to pay to be part of Rapha Cycling Club. Also, being owned by a private equity firm that's associated with the Walton family (Walmart) really turned people off, at least from what I see here in the US. Most of these people likely aren't aware (or care) how much Steuart and Tom Walton advocate for cycling.
Interesting, thanks for the info. Sometimes these private equity firms lose track of the core values, but I agree the Pro Team Training line is a good proposition
Keep up the great content, and you’ll be at 100k subscribers very soon.
Thank you!
Someone your videos really relax me 😅. Loving it 😍
😊 thank you
Hey Federico great vid !!! I too wear Rapha , in the beginning I was a bit of a hater but I reached out to buy some and I absolutely love the pro team training kit it fits like a glove !! The core is very much more a relaxed fit but still looks ok . I also have Castelli kit which I like too, but Rapha seem to have more designs and appear more able to engineer better a community . DHB make good kit i I they they strike a really good balance between value and style ( you have get the Lab kit which is like their pro aero type kit) . Anyways I think people shouldn’t hate just embrace all kit and styles as at the end of the day we’re all in it for one thing the enjoyment of two wheels and a bit of suffering up hill . Keep up the good work.
Thanks Richard, I agree. Most of the time these brands that start as a niche proposition get some hate when they become mainstream. It's a natural evolution where the initial customer don't feel unique and special anymore. I like dhb as well, I got an aeron bib that is one of my favourite!
Thanks I enjoy your videos. I appreciate how you explain the perceptions then explain your thoughts on the matter. I don’t ride full kit, but if I did it would be Rapha or similar styling, very nice kits.
I appreciate that!
The information about pockets and back side of core jersey is very useful. I have considered to buy this one, but after your experience I don't want core jersey. The pro jersey looks awesome! 👍
Thank you! In London they have a great flagship store, so it's easy to try on different styles. Otherwise you just need to order and return if needed. The pro team training is good value and fits great.
I am enjoying your take on the cycling sport very much. I think that there is a lot of elitism and snobbery in the sport unfortunately. My belief is that it stems from competitiveness and insecurity. Wear what you like and ride what you like and don't give a damn what other people think, that's how I roll 🤣 Also you are spot on about motorcycling too! Congratulations on 1K subs, I suspect this is just the beginning...
Thank you! On the style side I am a conscious poser, but I am trying to also make fun of it 😄
I am a fan of Rapha gear and if wearing it pisses someone off then its worth the extra expense. I really don't care what people wear to cycle in, what bike they have or how much it costs. Everyone has their own budgets and limits. The only thing you can control is your attitude about these things. Just be yourself.
I cycled yesterday in my Rapha kit, it was a good day. Didn't have to use my AK...
In a nutshell mate👍
I think the Rapha stigma comes more from the RCC group rides. Just recently found your channel and have enjoyed watching your videos.
Thank you, I would need to look more into the RCC aspect, well noted
Can I ask what you mean? From my knowledge, RCC have almost daily rides for different skill levels, dedicated women rides, social ones, events&workshops, etc. I was thinking of joining it for that reason so I’m curious what you mean
@@Handoresmya I’m just commenting on where I think the meme originates. Rapha seems to be targeting a wider audience now, so the meme might not be as relevant.
@@Handoresmya not sure either, I would like to know what others think. If I now remember correctly I saw a couple of memes with RCC specifically
I was part of an RCC chapter here and the experience sort of turned me off the brand. Before that, I had jerseys, gloves (too delicate) and shirts from Rapha. I'll stick with PedalEd, ASSOS and Q36.5 for now for my gear.
Thanks Federico! Enjoyable content.
Many thanks!
I currently have 3 of the pro team aero jerseys, and I like them a lot. The cut is similar to the training jersey.
Just feel free ,everything is just a process of finding your self .
I think Rapha is just easy to find a way in to cycling.
And by the way, everything is expensive when you riding a road bike!
Do what you can do and don’t prove it to other people just prove it to yourself.
Much love buddy ❤
Well said!
Extremely well put
My man you are a steryotipe :) I thought you represent Italian Cycling very well. Good work keep it up
Thank you 👍👍
I felt a bit opposed to brands like Rapha because of the high price and couldn't think of a reason to buy it. Until I was in need of mid-season long sleeve jersey and found a big sale on them. I mix and match with brands still, but jersey wise they are amazing I feel both in fit, quality and comfort.
I go for the Core line (not lightweight) here because of the weather in Belgium + the zipper pocket is great! I'm not the biggest fan of their bibs though, I've the feeling my Castelli Competizione has way better support and compression than any rapha bib I've tried
If it makes you feel good. Why not? Haters will always hate.
Lol UCI approved. Funny.
Nice video. Pro training jerseys are perfect fit. The aero jerseys are even better.
For anyone that is considering to buy Rapha or the other brands, best to go to shop first to try.
Nice video.
👍 👍
I love the Rapha snobbery thats why I wear it to put two fingers up to the snobs I ride a hybrid Cannondale 1000s of miles throughout the year
I don't understand Rapha snobbery really. A sub hate group whitin lycra users, where all lycra users are already hated by everyone else 😂
Good info, as always. Thank you.
Hi! Is there any modern colourful designs you like? I tend to wear endura clothing for cycling. Mostly MTB. But I would like to wear interesting modern road jerseys sometimes but I prefer non racy but fun and bright designs that don’t have 50 sponsors on them. (Most of my road jerseys look like this)
Actually I don't have many colourful jerseys, mostly black, couple of reds (my red Endura is nice), white and grey. Somehow I prefer plain colours, but should try one maybe
@@fede1275 dark colours naturally look good , particularly on tanned and darker skin! I live in a very cold country and I enjoy the contrast! Last week I seen someone wear a body suit with multi coloured tessellated triangles (think 80s aesthetic) on their road bike and I thought it was very striking and unique 👌
I think it’s because it’s not a US brand. I felt the same way but I just bought my first Rapha pro tights and they’re nice. I was compelled to try it out because it’s so popular here in SF.
You hit the point. Thanks!
great video, and approach of the subject. Humans build social constructs to feel safe and relate to others at a fundamental level, which are largely comparative parking spaces of error. Personally, wish I could get Rapha service , in a 7mesh design, with the Assos chamois:)
Well said!!
@@diesel9677 yes, but is difficult if not impossible to avoid that mechanism. I guess it's an evolutionary trait
Man....! You look awesome and superfit...you should go in to detais and elaborate more on fitness...!!
I believe part of the hate comes from the "euro style " rules on the bike...! And Rapha are taking the hit because it could be not considered to be super hardcore racing brand.
I personally own a couple of pieces ( more affordable ones) and truth be told the fit is not of the best ones although I love the way they look...!!
Great and classy episode...!!
Thank you so much! Actually initially I was going to talk about fitness, in my opinion there is still misguided information sending people in the wrong directions. Then the lockdown happened and cycling took over. Will work on the fitness side when I have more time.
There's definitely a stigma attached to Rapha, personally I couldn't care less about what other people think, they make very comfortable good quality clothing. When ever the subject comes up with other cyclists, the opinion I hear the most is the type of riders that wear their clothes "Big bear belly banker types" who spend loads of money on a top of the range Pinarello, cover themselves in head to toe in Rapha, but can hardly cycle more than 10 miles. Or the type that just want everyone to know they where Rapha. I get these opinions to a point, I guess if cycling fashion really matters to you, you could always go with brands that are less mainstream, but personally, I really couldn't care less what people think, they are comfortable and well made.
You are right and I believe that stigma is unjustified. I met so many great riders wearing Rapha, but at the same time there is nothing wrong to own a Dogma and ride short distance or slow. Everyone can embrace cycling as log as there is respect and education.
Exactly 💯
The people make the brand snobby. Rapha is just well known and people like to pick on em. But there’s other brands that are more expensive, i.e Assos. I chose Rapha because there’s a store in my city. I can go and try on stuff. I’m not a skinny cyclist. I wear XXl jerseys and L bib shorts. So having a physical location helps. The clothes are cool and stylish. Their warranty is top notch. I’ve received 50 percent credit for bibs that I’ve had for 2 years. Can’t complain. The quality and materials are top grade.
It all makes sense, in London they have a great store as well. I like my Rapha kit.
@@fede1275 that’s for the reply. Keep up the great work
Thanks for the info, but most importantly is there a sizing difference between Core and Pro Team? I have seen a few reviews recommending going up a size from Core to Pro Team...can you confirm? Thx
I would not go up a size, for me Large is okay but is a race fit. I guess people who enjoy beer more than me might need to size up with the Pro Team.
Yes 👍🏼 why buy a lesser product if you can afford a better one. No one asks why you drive a Ferrari and not a Fiat. Rapha has great fit, very good quality and also looks good. I tried other brands and always go back to Rapha.
Great video. What is your height and weight or measurements?
Thank you, I'm 185cm, 86Kg. Around 105cm chest.
You got me thinking :) Somehow there’s also the brand mockery does have some justification. Rapha, as well as other brands like for example Castelli, makes excellent stuff. They are expensive for that reason. Things go totally wrong, when they use the brand name to sell rubbish. It goes even more wrong when there’s a community who religiously praise a brand without being critical. In the end, it is bad for the serious consumer who thinks s/he can trust a particular brand. So basically, this is about brands that use a high standard and that are willing to keep their own standard. At the end of the day, those brands will deserve to be praised. A good example of this is Apple. At first many people were skeptical. But Apple always keep their promise. They commit to their very high standards. Mocking them is nowadays a bit irrational. If you are willing to pay the price you get good stuff. If you don’t need that level of quality or performance you can get also good stuff from plenty of other brands. So if Rapha is willing to sell mediocre items for a ridiculous price just because they think they can get away with it they are in the end to blame for the “Rapha Rider” .
Yes, spot on. You definitely feel betrayed when a big brand asks for a premium on a mediocre product just for the name. Usually dangerous to buy the "accessible" lines of prestigious brands.
Really enjoying your vids! Ciao
Grazie mille!
Are you still a Rapha rider?
I never see you wear the gear anymore. 13:08
No, I sold my Rapha kit. As I now collaborate with Siroko, I have everything I need. I still use Castelli Gabba and Perfetto though, as they are quite unique.
Thankyou for the video, I'm considering purchasing rapha and would be interested in your height and weight to compare and decide weather the medium or large would be better, I'm 5'9" 165lbs.
No problem, I am between 6' and 6'1", 190lbs. I would go medium if you don't mind the race fit.
@@fede1275 👍
Ciao Federico, I've been riding in Rapha (& other brands) for a while. Pro Team (training or race) are really thight, the core is much more relaxed, you should try to go one size down and you'll have a much better fit on what you complained. That said training is cheaper and and less aero compared to race, but both really racey fit. Ciao e complimenti!
Ciao Livio e grazie! Somehow the Pro Team Training fits me better than the Core, it seems that the Core is a bit short for me in the back. I haven’t tried the race kit, bit too expensive for me at the moment.
Love that jersey I may get long sleeve one only cause it looks cool! Yer I find that with core it curls up at the back and pockets are small and I Prefare a bit of a longer sleeve but still got few colours. How do you get the offer??
The offer was available on Rapha website on their core range, maybe a year and half ago. I saw SportPursuit having discounted Rapha kit from time to time, but they sell out in half an hour or so. With the core jersey I also use a Nike Pro long sleeve base layer, it makes a nice long sleeve jersey combo.
@@fede1275 cheers fellow cyclist x
I too prefer the Pro Team kit. It has got more expensive though. The Pro Team pads are really good.
Yes, the Pro Team line seems very nice, pricey though. This Pro Team Training one is actually good value.
i can’t force myself to pay that much money for something that’s made in China however i have to admit i do have a few of their items but never where them because of the Rapha rider:) I think Rapha itself is responsible for that. it seems about 5 years someone in Rapha decided to send everyone with a cycling oriented youtube channel their kits. some where proper cyclists but some simply went for coffee in their pro kits:) in cycling everyone wants to stand out. that’s why most people try to customize their bikes to look different or wear a “unique” kits and i think Rapha lost that uniqueness. Since then i’ve tried a few different brands and i have to say the prices Rapha charges are i bit too much. For me LaPassione is a good balance between the quality and value. Love their simplistic designs this year and bibs are outstanding. Not sponsored:) Good luck with a channel sir!
Thank you! LaPassione kits look really great, I looked at their website a few times, maybe will try in the future!
In where I live, people are “big” on “status symbol”. Consequently, the distributors & shops know that well and sell them at full price (or even higher), and ‘brag’ them as status symbol rather than appreciation of good quality. Some nouveau riche are happy when they can show off the buying power (think people wearing shirts, shoes with HUGE Gucci, Balenciaga, D&G logos, or some pathetic nouveau riche deliberately trying to show they have Rolex Sub etc.), and that’s where the infamous label originated from IMO. I wear Rapha frequently because I think Rapha makes good products; the cut, the fabric, the durability, and the design (mostly). Interesting topic 👌
Somehow our social settings will have us choosing items to differentiate us from other groups and associate with our target ones. Next would be for PAS or Maap to get identified with a Rapha rider maybe. Nothing wrong with showing off, as long as you are a well behaved cyclists I guess 😀
@@fede1275 well said!
I have a similar problem with a long sleeve core jersey. The rear pockets are really too high to reach while riding. I can barely get my phone out when I stop riding. Are you saying the pockets are lower and easier to reach on the pro jersey?
Yes, the pro jersey is better as it does not rise up as much as the core. Still it's not a long cut at the back, but it's in line with other race jersey I have, like Castelli.
very good review. i trust your judgement when it comes to product quality, so yeah i guess rapha does provide good value for money, unfortunately it's still out of my range :)
Well up to this price for the pro team training jersey yes, I would not go for a jersey that is too expensive for now, over £100 is a bit much for me
@@fede1275 i see. most of rapha jersey lineup is above US$ 300 in my country. i consider that as luxury product based on value & functionality
I think a similar stigma is attached to ASSOS. It’s either “All the gear and no idea” or Rapha dressed riders are regarded as rather aloof and unfriendly, not saying hello or waving to other cyclists on the road, often because they are not members of a club. Club cyclists will usually wear their club kit whilst riding. I think this attitude is more of a London thing though. Not noticed any Rapha stereotyping up in the Midlands.
Rapha is good quality kit. I’ve always regarded it as being too expensive, but it looks like they’ve brought out cheaper ranges recently.
It might well be a London thing, you are right
So true..im here in New York and the riders that wear rapha(including myself)are always cool and down to earth..I think the snobbish thing came from the London riders..
I have only rarely heard the RR term used and it seemed to be used in a generic context to embrace riders that only ever seem to wear very dark (almost always black) clothes while riding an equally dark coloured bike.
I am definitely guilty then, like dark and black attire...
@@fede1275 Regarding Rapha, if you have not seen this you might find it interesting. ua-cam.com/video/y0rMzAcG0sk/v-deo.html
@@pcmjpcmj6854 Very interesting, thanks
Hi,should I size up for the pro team jersey?Or should I stay the same size with the core jersey?
Hi, I got the pro training jersey in the same size L as the Core as I don't mind the tight fit. I don't know if pro team (not branded "training") are even tighter. If you can return get both sizes!
@@fede1275 okay thank you very much!
Training jersey looks good on you. I only have the long sleeve core jersey which is good for cooler weather. Like the look of the pro team line but it's too expensive.
In the current environment the Pro Team Training jersey is a decent value, prices have soared in general.
the training jersey is just as good as a an aero jersey from rapha i have this training jersey its tight and aero..and the best part is its COMFORTABLE! its just as good as an race jersey so yeah.......also this jersey is little warmer so i wear it from 65 to 74 degres and yeah it looks good too!
Absolutely, it is a great product. I can imagine the embarrassment in the marketing meeting when they had to differentiate this product from the more expensive stuff. Let's say is only for training...😂
I guess some of the hate might come down to the marketing. Rapha really wants to embody this top-shelf, best-in-the-business idea which might annoy some people who don‘t want to / cannot spend the money rapha asks. You can of course still be a serious rider in kits that cost half of what rapha is asking, but rapha makes it look like you really need their stuff to perform.
They also were the first brand to follow this cycling couture idea, which becomes more and more popular these days with brands like MAAP, Pas Normal, La Passione and personally I know people who care more about the sexiness of their Instagram-feed than the actual cycling. But then again, as long as they enjoy cycling this way, who am I to judge? It’s their time and their money and if they should get too annoying I can simply drop them.
Yes, great considerations, that is a reasonable overview!!
Congratulations on passing 1k subs Federico! Think your channel deserves to have many more. On the Rapha thing, I like their aesthetic as it is more stylish than some of the frankly ugly sportswear brands. I think there are some people in the cycling community (who think all carbon bikes are “Chinese crap” for example) who feel the need to scorn anything they think is expensive or modern…if you are not grinding up the hills on a steel bike with rim brakes wearing cheap old kit then you are a rich amateur loser!
Thank you! I was surprised as well, I like Rapha and I'm happy I got the new jersey!
Very nice! Federico you need to write another email to rapha, to get a discount code for the channel, you have the skills to articulate a very good deal, I'm sure.
I wish I was that powerful!
FYI: Volume is not as high as other video. Not a criticism.
You are right, will be better next time
First time hearing about the "Rapha Rider" memes/hate. I am planning to switch from Gore to Rapha just because they have the best repair policy - I've been burned with Gore build quality and their repair policy too many times
Yes, not sure why and definitely not justified. I would avoid basic lines like Core, the rest is of a great quality.
Personally, I think that we do not need any luxury brands, especially in today's more conscious times. No, we don't need the best, even if we can afford it. No, it is not worth paying more for design or aesthetics. This applies not only to Rapha, but to all the brands you have mentioned.
I understand where you are coming from, but it is not easy to define the right balance. I am trying to buy items that for me are a good value proposition. The same item could be very expensive for some and cheap for someone else.
@@fede1275 I get what you mean but we can all agree that Rapha is a luxury brand - hence "Rapha rider" :)
I think the "pro" jerseys are expensive than "pro training" jerseys because the "pro" ones uses different materials at different parts of the jersey, like underarms etc might have materials that wick sweat faster.
Generally you get what you pay for I like their kit and didn’t realise it would irritate the odd middle class,middle aged cyclist that’s a bonus then.
Yes, it' irritating when sometimes you realise you paid too much for lower quality. Not this case luckily with the Pro Training jersey.
I think there's also a bit of jealousy involved in these things. I just adhere to "live and let live"
I tried the Rapha core bib and it did not live up to its price tag. For the price, Casteli FAR 4 bibs are better. I also tried out a mid-tier jersery, and while it was nice, it was nowhere near as nice as Assos stuff. From what I gather, Rapha is for people that are into branding/fashion, more so.
I have to agree, Rapha Core range makes more sense with the discount and not at list price. The Pro Team Training jersey seems good value even at list price. Never tried Assos, maybe in the future.
@@fede1275 I assume the Rapha pro team kit is on par with Assos rs equipe line, just more fanciful.
Cycling is all about branding, fashion and elitism. What are you on about 😂😂😂 how many cyclists you come across at any cycling event that are down to earth and judgement free? Mostly are on their high horse thinking they are hot crap 🤣🤣🤣
While I like my Rapha jerseys I was heavily disappointed by their pro team autumn/ winter jacket. It just was too cold... Nothing pro about that. Sold it.
The problem with haters is ….. they’re gonna hate 🤷🏾♂️
I know, not good 😄
I think there is a good bit of jealousy behind these Rapha rider memes. I think if you’re a beginner or intermediate Cyclist, and can you purchase top level kit, that makes you smart! My best, ASSOS and Castelli kits have lasted me 10 years
I think most of the dislike comes from their marketing / branding strategy. Way back in the late '00s I always felt like they were putting out a message that 'if you ride 100 miles in the rain in our gear you'll be part of the cool kids club' and trying too hard to show how 'cool' their brand was. Given their new status (only 3-4 years old) at the time, I think it got the reputation as being a poseur brand. I don't think the RCC and the closed nature of sponsored events helped, nor some of their promo videos. Assos and Castelli haven't gotten the same level of hate over the years and they are just as or more expensive as Rapha (high end Assos is bonkers.) That said, I'm planning to order a pair of the Core bibs next week and give the brand a shot as I do like the minimal aesthetic look their clothing has.
You are right, maybe the different brand positioning and style has created some reactions. Definitely they changed the cycling clothing style and in my opinion in a good way. I am a bit of a poseur myself, so I guess I fit in!
@@fede1275 I do like their minimalist / simple style and colors available. And thanks for showing the two jersey cuts, I am contemplating a jersey too and seeing the fit difference is very helpful. Its funny, after your video I tried to watch Rapha's video on the Core product line and quit after 1min of a 2.5min video. They hadn't covered any details of the items that far in, just covering 'lifestyle' of the actors they wanted to portray (writer with writers block, parent wanting to get out of the house, former competitive cyclist now just enjoying riding.). But I'm going to buy some kit next week and maybe ascend to poseur status, we will see. :)
@@craigg9742 they have to sell the image and dream, don't they? Part of the enjoyment anyway, like posing 😄
Rcc is about the cool kids stuff which i find funny. What are youse, in high school or something 😂 a friend of mine was part of rcc before the store shut down because they went broke. He told me he can ride with the group if you have click with someone. Its like they entertain you if have the money, if not then go kick rocks. Its just part of elitism in cycling unfortunately.
@@PhiyackYuh I'm not in high school and have been riding since before Rapha existed. Which is why their advertising strategy has been a turn off for me since the beginning. What you say about RCC, doesn't have to be the norm. YMMV, but what I have noticed with experienced (15+ years) cyclists and high level amateurs is, if anything, they are anti-elitist. They don't care what bike you ride. They don't care if you have $500 or $40 bibs. They don't care if you shave your legs or not. To mangle a phrase, 'Legs talk, bullsh*t walks.' The 'elitism' issues I've seen are with 'lifestyle' focused people or less experienced (
I just like to wear rapha clothes and I am not a skilled bike rider. I just like the fabrics and how comfortable I feel wearing them on the bike. I don't know where this meme comes from.
@@chrishalle1982 don't worry, now it's all about Maap and PAS Normal wearers 😂
How did you get so skinny? You should do a video on diet and nutrition! I’m enjoying your content. L
Thank you. A few years ago (before cycling) I started to focus on better training technique in the gym, better nutrition and correct nutrient ratio. I never had a weight problem, but I look better now than in my early 30s. I actually wanted to talk about that when I started the channel, then cycling got in the way...
@@fede1275 I just cycled 350 miles in May for a cancer charity fundraiser and gained 5kg! What’s that all about 😏
@@Tuffjobs I know, at the end of the day however you want to describe it, what we eat comparing to what we burn is what defines our bodies. The complicated thing is that is easier for some to reach and maintain consistently a slight calorie deficit, while for some others it is almost impossible. I know I'm lucky and could do that easily, for some others it's not so easy.
It seems like you just can’t get it right as someone who simply wants to ride for fun. 😂 Getting looked down on if you have no money to spend, getting sneared at if you do have money to spend. 🤪
Yes, I guess everyone would try to use something to feel superior in some other way, how so paleolithic we are
I think you summed it up, there is a happy middle ground
I wear Rapha because I can't stand the red scorpion logos on my rear with Castelli.
Especially when the Scorpion decides to sting, it's in its nature 😂
Who cares what brands are worn by whatever lever rider. Ride stress free and judgement free
Federico, come on man ya Italian and ya supposed to have style burn the Rapha and get some Castelli :P
Haha, trying to be balanced. Got a couple of Castelli as well, beware they run small!
Federico, you don't seem to care much about visibility with your MIB style.
I know, you are right. In Italy (Rome) I have been riding motorbikes (very few cyclist in the city) and there is not a single hi vis yellow or orange in sight. I should change it really. I always run lights on anyway.
@@fede1275 Rome wasn't buit for cyclicts, was it?))).
But traffic from Gorizia via Trieste to Piran is more than moderate making you feel safe and lose your mind to the surrounding valleys.
@@fede1275 As for the subject, I didn't even consider Rapha as too mainstream (perhaps, I miss out something in my life). I'm 191cm tall, and I totally understand what you are talking about when you talk about jersey riding up the back. But I've had different sets and jerseys: Alpinestars (more for XC), Attaquer and Santic. But my heart is with Cafe du Cycliste. These jerseys are styled like grandmother's nightrobe and made of sea foam. And their Josephine bibs give my bum that tenderness I would experience from my mother's hands on my first day)) 🙄
@@VlasTrunov Will look at Cafe' du Cycliste, thank you!
Rapha Riders - invisible to car drivers.
I try to compensate with lights always on
Maybe Rapha would have fewer haters if the users could muster even the slightest of nods ( # Kill Bill ) in return to a friendly greeting from a fellow cyclist. 🤣🤣🤣
Oh poor baby. Nobody waves at you and you’re hurt?
@@lookpro.rideslow This is Exactly why people hate on Rapha users and how road cycling and the elitist element within it particularly is off putting to a lot of people. Read my comment again - I wasn’t asking for a wave… but the slightest of nods would be nice. Thankfully I have moved to Brazil now and the cycling community here is incredibly open and friendly and you can always rely on a greeting or
encouragement or a friendly gesture. I rode an 80 km race yesterday and there was a massive amount of mutual encouragement in the non- elite race.
And nope I am not hurt at all; it’s just another example of how good manners are a thing of the past.
Enjoy your too cool for school grumpiness😉
@@marcdaniels9079 oh I’m not grumpy at all. I ride in Chicago and those Rapha “elitists” you refer to wave at all the time. Very rare that we see cyclists that do not wave or say hello, or are just generally friendly. Associating a specific brand with shitty attitudes from people is ridiculous.
@@lookpro.rideslow So why all the sarcasm then ? If you ride in Surrey in England I can assure you it’s a different story.
@@marcdaniels9079 cause it’s banter and I wanted to wind you up. 🙃
Buy cheap buy twice! even more so when it comes to cycling kit.
Yes, it's generally true. Not for some Van Rysel jersey I have thought, relatively cheap but great quality.
Rapha riders to me are the posers who cycle around regents park or similar parks in london and park their 8k bike with deep section carbon wheels outside a cafe and basically spend a fortune just to fit in with the crowd. If some ex pro or local hitter rocked up wearing an alternative brand, they would automatically follow suit. Its no different to the other copy-cat group who insist on using handle bar bags every ride when they have never bike-packed anywhere....and they only do this because they saw someone influential on youtube do it. People a free to spend money how they wish but so many lack imagination and are so insecure that they have to fit in with their mates.
Yes, but let's not be too harsh, we all try to fit in with the crowd, in a way or another. I'm happy wearing my Rapha jersey and I'm also happy with Van Rysel or no brand. Now if someone would want to give me an 8k bike to complete my Rapha kit I'll be most grateful 😄😄
you're a funny guy. i like your channel👍
There is only one good brand which is Pissei. Sorry, but you spend a lot of time thinking public image. You wear Rapha... In general people that spend a lot of time thinking about what others may think wear Rapha. For the most, I do not really care. But, a good race jersey does save you more watts then you think. I prefer Pissei. Why are you wearing a jersey that runs half way up your back?
Will look into it, thank you
Void is much better than rapha.
Looks nice, seems in the higher price bracket though
Stop saying my name 😒 😤 I hate it!
You might be entitled to some royalties 😂😂
A lot of the cycling community are horrible people, particularly in Australia
So far my experience has been positive, but I heard some others have had issues. Fingers crossed...
@@fede1275 great chanel, I just subscribed..your safety road video was amazing, Grazie mille!
@@MarcraM82 grazie a te! I'm glad you enjoyed it! 👍👍
Rapha tends to be very pretentious as a brand, especially if you go to their stores. That colors riders who wear Rapha. Their entry level clothing isn't much more expensive then other high end brands (e.g., Castelli), but the marketing of the brand is what irks people. Enough that there is even a satire website that mocks Rapha.
Cycling is a very bougie sport and Rapha epitomes that bougie attitude to the nth degree. Going into their shops is eyerolling.
And, I say that as someone who likes Rapha clothing because it looks less colorful and garish, which at my age, works better.
Now I need to translate bougie and work out the meaning! 😄
To each his own, but Rapha is for the cycling world's fashion victims. But you have to give them credit for their marketing and molding a certain, very self-conscious segment of buyers into now identifying as "Rapha riders".
I guess once they became mainstream they might have been victims of their own success.
lol another useless review
Trying to improve
Useless to who? As a newbie rider this video talking about the social aspect was very informative
@@anac5656 I hoped so
@@anac5656 to me, I only can talk for myself. I don't talk for others. easy ...