Star Trek Discovery 5.03 "Jinaal" REVIEW
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- Опубліковано 6 жов 2024
- Time to visit Star Trek's most trans planet - Trill.
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shoutout to Saurians raising their children communally without them knowing who birthed them, love that for them
Reminds me of a character in the Novel, "Long way to a small angry planet" by Becky Chambers. The Saurians and one of the characters has a similar family set up.
Yeah I love that
Its so refreshing to see Saru and T'Rina fight, they're still so cute. And I agree with you, I thought after the unification of Vulcans and Romulans, that Vulcans are now open with interracial marriages, yet they're still have the Victorian attitude towards it.
And also, maybe the Adira and Gray storyline could continue in the upcoming Star Trek Academy.
P.S.
It is so refreshing to see a Ferengi bartender again.
I hope we see one of the adults in Adira’s life tell them how important it is for Adira and Grey to spend time apart and figure themselves out. Because they aren’t an ordinary couple who found that long distance didn’t work. They were each others everything from a very young age, and they each need to figure out who they are apart from the other.
I honestly hope they don't address them anymore. That whole story has always felt like a space filler. Neither character has added any real value to the story. Not to mention Adira's character is irritating to me. Adira makes Tilly tolerable!
Bingo!
Yes! This! There was quite literally a codependency between the two of them. Their relationship always felt trauma bonded, so I think it’s mature on both of their parts to be apart. And I think it’s a good opportunity for the show to examine a bit of that dynamic!
@@svh01 Love Adira and Tilly. You, on the other hand...
@@Donnagata1409 Don't care what you think of me. I don't know you and you don't me. Back on the subject, I don't like the characters because they're quirky and awkward to a flaw. Every now and again Tilly steps and shows some backbone like.when she took the recruits to that planet. Adira is ALWAYS awkward. She always acts like someone that's been abused. Adira hasn't brought any value to the show as a character, At least Tilly has been a moral compass on the show. I'll say it for what it is, Adira and Gray are examples of diversity gone wrong. Staments and Cubler are vital characters that HAPPEN to be gay. They feel like natural members of the crew and people can feel invested in them as characters. Adira and Gray feels shoehorned in. There hasn't been any real growth in their story arch. As a matter of fact it felt like a repeat of the last time they addressed their story. For the second time we had to hear that they on different paths and they can't hold each back from their growth. The interaction brought nothing to the story but help it feel cluttered. If they removed that whole story the episode wouldn't have missed it.
Something I loved. Cruz really captured the joie de vivre of having a human body, a recurring theme throughout Trek.
One thing this entire easter egg hunt of a season touches on, indirectly, is the need for an entity's power to be matched by their wisdom and empathy.
The progenitors' knowledge is just about ultimate power, and therefore it's fair that the tests to acquire it measure those qualities.
I want a spin-off about Saru and T'Rina on the Federation Council
'West wing' Meets Star Trek following President Rylik with Saru and T'rina as major characters?
@@OmegablueWolfwith strong Babylon 5 energy between various ambassadors and their respective dramas? Yes please!
I think it was an odd choice to go to all the trouble of discovering Grey's psychic ghost was real in the S3 finale, figuring out how to put him into an Altan Soong android body, and then very quickly shuffling him off the show afterward. Feels like the writers hit a "now what?" point after wrapping up that story and didn't really know where else to go with him.
That is definitely a problem that seems to have plagued this show: not really knowing what to do with their characters, occasionally putting them into interesting situations/dynamics and then...not having any idea where to go from there, often even undoing/dropping it. Much as certain characters work and there is a general vibe of "the crew get along and really like each other", the individual crew/characters outside of maybe 3 or 4 still feel so poorly drawn and used (Detmer and Owosekun are definitely the two I hit upon). Spoiler-y, but it became so much more of a thing for me an episode later.
I rather liked the complete ordinariness of the breakup; for all that they've been through and all they represent, they are just two young people finding their way. How many high school sweethearts break up on the first trip home from college. It's sad, but it happens and maybe it will lead to interesting stuff, they already set up Reno being there as the wise aunt
I'm a little bit disappointed in Saru not opening his conversation with T'rina like "Your subordinate talked to me about..." but to agree with him immediately. I thought he would be wiser. But maybe it is do to lack in experience in intimate relationships.😊
It felt a little bit sitcom.
But he explained that he avoids conflict. Thats why
That's what he SHOULD have done! And that's the point of that whole storyline and what he had to learn. And what I totally liked about it was that T'rina's reaction was just about like yours: a little bit disappointed. She pointed out his mistake to him, he agreed and then it's fine. Also, she knows her subordinate can be a little shit, but she knows what she's getting and is willing to work with him for what he does bring to the table, and that's a professional relationship, different from a personal partner like Saru.
We got stuff shot in a quarry. Super Doctor Who of Discovery to do that.
10:00 the riddle was a check to make sure the one looking for Bix actually knew the previous step of the chain. That they weren't sequence breaking. Any other question besides one that was *directly* linked to the previous clue wouldn't have worked as a check.
The first check was knowing what a Romulan puzzle box was. Then deciphering the diary's mention of Twin Moons. Then that it was a Romulan who wrote the journal, thus, the hidden 'entrance' hiding the real clue. Now the contents of the poem, which you could only know if you had actually been there. Every step thus far has had a check to make sure you're coming at this from the correct path. I'm sure the next step will be a question about Trill, and so on.
It's a kind of checksum, alongside the password of actually knowing where to look.
Another trope is also the fact that having Rainer sort of speed-reading through meeting the crew, is yet another addressing of how Discovery has treated all the Bridge crew since the beginning. We get to see each of them, but only really quickly without much real depth. Funny enough, this is probably also the most we've actually had a chance to just experience who these characters are since Pike had them introduce themselves in season 2.
I was almost shocked to see they actually have names.
The writers are guilty of the same flaws they lampooned with Rainer. It is ironic. Rainer strikes me as a collection of traits so far. I agree 100 percent with Jesse that Rainer is, in part, a response by the writers to some criticisms of the show. But now he is kind of a red herring character because his conduct is so extreme that it is farcical.
THIS IS WHY WE DESERVE FILLER EPISODES
@@TroutBoneless They only have 12-15 episodes a season, it's not like the old days with 25 episode seasons and they *need* to have filler episodes.
I suspect Disco’s writers and showrunners are aware of fans’ criticisms about the un-developed bridge crew characters and now they’re TROLLING us by introducing the all-new “Delta Shift” bridge crew in this episode. WHY!?!
This epitomizes “Creatives” today: If anyone DARES to criticize them, they will double down and throw it back in their face, just to spite them. It’s petty and indicative of deep-seeded insecurity.
I just love how T'Rina looks at Saru. That tiny smile when she talks to him is an outrageous emotional display! She is absolutely besotted, as one should be towards Doug Jones.
I love their whole body language. The looks and touches. It feels appropriate for reserved characters but still really intimate and the body language is appropriately free of human relationship clichees (Or at least what would be used to demonstrate the same feeling for human characters on a show like Discovery. I always say what was normal for humans in different places and times on our own single world is often much more "out there" that what Star Trek shows use to show that some Aliens are very different from humans. :D)
Star Trek Relationships are always chancy at best, and so a "Breakup" is a rather tame resolution to their difficulties. 💙💙
Yeah usually they get sucked into a spacetime anomaly or killed by a sentient cloud or something
I can't believe we went to Trill, and the writers didn't mention Adira having a symbiont once. It seems like they just kind of forgot about them being joined after the pretty amazing setup provided in Season 3's Forget Me Not (which is one of my favorite of DIS's episodes). It bears no relevance to their character or even skill set any longer - they're just a generic young person now, which is really head-scratching. Why not build the one cool thing about a character into the depiction?
I have this exact same critique of Adira as a character. The writing has really neglected them.
Good point.
I feel like that was a little bit why they were allowed to stay for the otherwise Trill only (well except for the very very end) ceremony in the end of the episode, but it could have been mentioned more explicitely as you could also argue they were just there to hang out with their friend.
I havent watched the episode yet as im only watching the spoiler free sections, but i have to say based on that:
I feel like Adira and Gray have kind of been wasted in the series. The moment Gray got a body it feels like the show had nothing more to do or say with either of them and thats a bit of a shame.
Also hot take, i generally enjoy Captain Reiner more than Captain Shaw who i found kind of just dipped over into being an asshole
Yeah, Adira and Gray kind of have no real story and it's a shame. DISCO suffered from developing its supporting cast.
Captain Shaw did not do enough to redeem himself in terms of his bigotry towards 7/9. Polaski did so much more during the course of her season on TNG to redeem herself concerning her bigotry towards data and grow and learn and yet those same fans loving Shaw probably hate her.
My thoughts on Rayner after the first two episodes: he's there to show that even reactionary white men have a place in a progressive society if they can adapt. And for them to being able to adapt they have to be taken as seriously and treated with as much kindness as everyone else. Also it's a process 😅
That’s funny, reactionary white men! I guess that’s a fare label for that crowd. When I read that it made me think of all the haters that don’t like Discovery and call it woke( what ever that means?). If all different types of people being in Star Trek or other shows is being woke, well then woke is a good thing. I happen to be 58 and white and sometimes I have trouble thinking in a more modern way. I was born and raised in San Francisco and have been around diverseness my whole, I can understand how people that grew up else where are struggling with our ever changing society. But it’s always been like this, it’s just people are being allowed to be who they are. Anyway funny how you put that about old white guys. Discovery has been good. Season 4 not great, season 3 burn endings a-little dumb. And all and all Discovery show and crew have been very good, I don’t understand the haters.
8:39 I love this idea because in nature several animals have unique individual features similar to our finger print. The back fins of sharks for instance are as uni as our finger prints. The stripes of tigers likewise have such a uniqueness or the ears of elephants.
Rainer is such a breath of fresh air on this show. I was cheering during his 20-word interrogation scenes. He and Tilly together recreate some of the Pulaski/Data dynamics that I really loved back in the day.
Those scenes also showcased how absurdly ancillary most of the non-core characters we are meant to care about actually are. I learned more about Reece in his one scene than I had in 4 seasons with him.
I’m finding this season a lot like Orville S3-trying to capitalise on the best elements of the series while shedding the worst elements (mostly). As much as I appreciate the representation, Grey/Adira stories sit firmly in that worst elements category.
I think also it's so funny to get on the "Discovery is too emotional! Picard was totally stiff and formal and stayed away from his crew too." and not realize that like, yes, and that was kind of a character flaw that he works on throughout the series, gradually opening up, and finally at the end of All Good Things, joining the other senior staff for a poker game. Learning to open up to at least some of the crew was his personal growth over the series. And not every captain needs to go through the same arc.
Also, they had to hide the Progenitor's tech because the Dominion War was on and they didn't want anyone to notice that the one Progenitor we see was played by the same actress as the Female Changeling.
I like the distinction between partner and protector. Your partner should help protect you when you’re bring attacked, not make choices for you to prevent attack ever occurring.
I loved this part of the episode. There are times when Trek does a really good job in portraying the challenges faced in relationships (see Miles and Kako on Deep Space 9), and this is one.
I can't say I'm totally surprised by the Gray/Adira breakup. I have frequently found Gray to be kind of an underbaked, one-note character who might be a little irritating to be around for long stretches. Gray is the sort of person who desperately needs a second hobby.
Ian Alexander is a phenomenal actor. _Discovery,_ unfortunately, gave them nothing to work with.
I thought Gray's most interesting plotline was when he served as Zora's therapist-I think letting him fill the role of ship's counselor (and let Culber go back to doing physical medicine) would have been a great way to truly integrate him into the crew.
Also: please correct me if I've used any incorrect pronouns-a cursory search said Ian uses they/them, but IIRC *_Gray_*_ the character_ is always referred to as he/him.
I really felt that ever since Adira and Gray were introduced, and especially once Gray got a body that the writers didn't really seem to know what to do with their relationship.
It does bother me a bit that most of the queer relationships we’ve had in new trek have been broken apart in one way or another. Gray and Adira are probably the least egregious of them because it actually makes some sense considering their stories and they handled it very maturely. I do wish we’d gotten more with them though. They never got a ton of screen time, particularly Gray.
I loved this episode. It was so fun to see Wilson Cruz play Jinaal, this disembodied ghost possessing Culber. So much fun!
He made me think of when René Auberjonois temporarily hosted Curzon-fairly subtle differences in voice and demeanor making it clear that a different person was driving that body.
As I live near the french border...I have seen things. There's another trans themed story that has mechanically been pruned from the main story line. I am not a conspiracy person but.....I do notice coincidences. Also the wig this episode almost made me cry. Whoever installed that lace front should be tarred and feathered. Last week I saw the whole wig cap poking out of the back. This week someone failed to pluck the front and braided the baby hairs and installed the thing too far back. I guess the braided wig is depressing canon? I hope we get movies one day with proper black hair budget.
Two things I absolutely loved about this episode: Saru and T'Rina being so gentle and loving towards each other, and Cruz being an absolute king in portraying a distinctly different character without it feeling hammy. I'm not much of an analyst, but this episode was just an overall joy to watch.
So, I was left with a question for trans folks as well as people in less conventional types of relationships though:
I've been wondering about what others thought about the Gray/Adira break-up, and especially the mention of different kinds of relationships and how it was handled here. When Gray mentioned the 'different kinds of relationships', I was a bit nervous about how it would all play out if they would've gone for e.g. an open or a poly relationship. NOT because I don't think that kind of relationships shouldn't have representation in Trek, but because I was weary of how the only canonically trans couple being in for example an open relationship could feed into this 'trans or LGBTQ equals promiscuous' - narrative.
So being perfectly honest: I was relieved they didn't go that route, but then stopped to examine what that meant about me and feared it might mean I cared more about respectability politics than actual people who ARE trans, and/or are in these kinds of relationships. So if anyone feels they have some time to kill and doesn't mind to share their opinion or educate a stranger in a UA-cam comment section: please feel free to share your thoughts🖖
Thank you for saying what you say about Starfleet as a military. Often times I see people who have served in the US military assuming a position of authority on how Starfleet should work with a dismissal to the actual context. Yes, they know more about the structural details than a civilian. They know more about combat situations than a civilian. But ultimately, Star Trek is universal and I don’t think any of us can truly claim to have a totally holistic view of what it should be. And this is not just with the newer shows: people give Riker shit for not having it with Jellico without understanding that Starfleet is not as rigid as a 21st century military and that the show has more to say than just what the proper military protocol is for a situation.
It's always been weird to see ppl go “see Jellico is a great captain, the best even!” when what he did was turn a functioning ship and crew on its head right before a very important task with complete disregard of the chaos it would bring to operations in the immediate timeframe.
@@sonicsean34 and assumed a certain lack of competency and battle readiness from the people who pushed back the Borg. He’s like the avatar of all those people who say the Federation was naive and stupid before the Borg and Dominion came kicking the door down. His value as a negotiator and ability to recognize when someone he personally doesn’t like is the best fit for a job are his best qualities, otherwise he’s depicted as overly militaristic and a disruption. And as much as people say he’s the most realistic military CO in the franchise, an example of Starfleet being a different type of organization is showcased when, smug as Riker as and hardass as Jellico is, he *asks* Riker to pilot that shuttle instead of just spitting out an order. The military hierarchy of Starfleet as I see it exists to *encourage* cooperation between officers and ensure proper response to crisis situations. The people do not exist in service of the organization, even if some of them treat people around and themselves like that’s the case.
First of all, I just want to say that I really love how they're tying Discovery this season with stories related to the TNG-era! And I feel that's what the show needed just to make it more exciting than ever before! Although, I still wish the show were renewed for at least one more season -- Season 6.
And secondly, although it was sad to see Adira & Gray break-up, I've already had a feeling that it was inevitable. That's because, in the middle of Season 4, when Adira came back & and they were asked about Gray, I could tell that Adira's feelings for him wasn't as strong as it was when we first saw the two of them in the 3rd Season.
It's unfortunate that in the real world dominated by toxic negativity & hatred, there are many relationships end on an extremely negative note. But I'm glad Adira & Gray ended their relationship on a more mutual & positive note. However, we will have to consider the possibility that they will reunite by the end of the season. And I know this season is just heating up! ❤
I was worried that Rayner was just going to be another asshole character and i agree with your description of him walking a fine line. Im glad they paired him with Tilly and the way they used her to call him out without it just emphasising his negative traits. Looking forward to seeing where they go with him, i feel like hes got a secret thats important to the ongoing "Indiana Jones" plotline
The fact she is facing these same issues with her students is telling. Discovery’s mission in this century has been to bring back the joy and light that is the utopia they come from to a society that forgot how to be a utopia. It’s one of the reasons I really love the jump to this future when many fans hate this future. Seeing discovery succeed at bringing back utopia is very satisfying, especially as an audience member keenly aware of how bleak our world is.
@@Ulriquinhosame. Seeing how it can be restored after a large shock makes me far more hopeful than any kind of “and then it never failed in any way” ending.
Sociable people really nonchalantly saying "connection is a choice". I really related to Rayner (Reinc?) this ep, and can think of several friends that fit that struggle too, one may want to connect, but simply lack the tools to do so, it reminded me of Barkley if he wasn't awkward and rose trough the ranks, very smart, very good at what he does but lacking people skills, and that can be a huge roadblock to something as essential as to getting a job, even if you are by far the best at it, you still need to "be cool".
I was actually expecting Wilson Cruz to just take his shirt off. I'm not gay, but that man is a gem. Like holy shit, is he ripped. He looks super fucking soft and kindhearted (which he probably is), but I'm about 69% certain he's a bear. I only vaguely know what that term means, which I'm only 69% sure. That, and 69 is a sexy number. Though maybe a bit unrealistic. I don't think it's healthy for someone to he held upside down with all that blood rushing to their head all for an act pleasure.
Seems I got carried away there. But I fully expect Wilson to take his shirt off at some point this season and show off his shredded torso.
Are you sure you’re not gay? You seem to think about gay sex more than I do. Yeah, I’m gay.
@@richardvinsen2385 Quite sure. The 69 thing has always been something I've thought about, the bear thing is a bit of linguo I heard in a few UA-cam videos (run by gay dudes), and I wish I could look as good as Wilson Cruz does.
Who’s being held upside down? You’re generally both laying down…
@@kaitlyn__L Yes, but that's not how the number itself looks.
@@kaitlyn__L Oh, let him have his sexual fantasy!!
Does every line from every character in every scene have to be uttered in a whisper?
18:04 THIS! Discovery has had a soft spot in my heart SPECIFICALLY because of the queer and trans rep. I’m trans femme but I felt so seen in the transmasc Gray AND the NB Adira (for differently but equally valid ways). Disco captured my heart with them. This breakup better not last because it’s so rare I feel authentically seen that way in media as a trans person
Firstly, let me thank you for all that you do. I find you extremely interesting and all your subject matter. I haven’t been to California in 22 years. Maybe if I get that there again soon we could talk sometime I would love that. I really wanna go to my cousin she’s in North San Francisco just over the bridge I’ll let you know 😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢😢
16:35 Actually, Anarchist militias function with even more egalitarian structures. Officers are voted upon by those they will command up to generals of whole armies. Command and strategy are as much as possible decided upon directly democratically. The command hierarchy only truly becomes a thing when on the battlefield. Officers and a chain of command allows quick battlefield decisions that can’t be voted upon in the time when lives are on the line. So if the Federation were Anarchist in theory Star fleet of this Federation of Communes (the idea of the Federation is deeply anarchist, the CNT is a federation of federated unions) COULD be a military and still even less hierarchal than Starfleet. Two examples of this are the CNT-FAI militias during the Spanish Revolution and the Ukrainian Anarchist Black Army during the Russian Civil War.
Hello, Jess. Great review. I love Raynar. I love the interview sequence as well. Pretty much better than the double-episode season premiere IMHO.
THANKS for this!!!! Compliment: S5 of #StarTrekDiscovery is the eighth season of #startrektng with updated storytelling styles and a more interesting cast. It took a long time for this pioneering #StarTrek show to find its space/place and it's not bad that, for its last season, after so much experimentation and unevenness, it decided on a familiar and comfortable storytelling tradition. And Rayner, a Riker/Worf/Jellico combo, is one of those people you have to work to understand. As we see from this episode, Tilly has *work* to do with him--if she so chooses to accept that and do it.
The other trope they're hitting with Rainer for Discovery is that (almost) every White Male character on the show is an asshole. Except for Pike and the fact that Rainer is an alien. However, I don't think he's going to stay that way.
I hope he does retain those traits as that style of Captain has been absent since Mirror Lorca's demise, very reminiscent of Jellico in TNG.
As it stands, I think the likely outcomes are either him going out in a blaze of glory/ martyrdom/ similar, or he'll change and be in Academy.
I always felt that Adira and Grey were a bit too codependent to be healthy, especially since they shared the same body. You're right, they are young and young people break up. But I think that's good. Adira was so dependent on their relationship with Grey that I was worried about them. I wish there had been more setup to this episode breakup, but I also understand how messy and abrupt breakups can happen. I would believe that Adira didn't realize they wanted to break up until they got to Trill. How old is Adira? I feel like they are like 18. I had breakups way more abruptly when I was that age, especially the one breakup where my partner moved away and then came back and everything was different. I feel like the breakup we see is a good thing for young people to see. Sometimes it really do be like that, no matter how good you were together.
I just hope we get to see at least Adira dealing with the reality of whats happened in the next episode. I want this to be a story that would have helped me when I was around 18.
Tho i do also understand the importance of showing queer relationships working, so maybe it would have been good to show the relationship continuing for a while. Maybe this episode could have shown them both trying to make it work and realizing for the first time that it might not, but choosing to continue anyway out of love. And then in a later episode we get the breakup, after showing them trying their best for a few episodes
I believe it is pretty much implied that Adira wanted to break up with Gray in the previous episode, considering how they barely contacted each other during the previous months and how their lives have been good and fruitful despite of it. I was not surprised one bit by the turn of event. In fact, I was sure it would end up that way when Gray departed for Trill during the last season. As we say in French : "Loin des yeux, loin du coeur."
Thanks Jessie 🖖Love your enthusiasm and insights.
Rainer is along the same character vibe as Jellico and Shaw, with showing a different, yet completely valid point of view from that if the main protagonists, and I've always liked that in Trek.
I think that you're generally right about the problem with the Adira / Grey story. It doesn't feel like the overall relationship was developed well enough for us to feel like its end has as much weight as it should have.
I think this has a lot to do with one of the core weaknesses of Discovery as a show -- it's not really an ensemble show. The main protagonist of every episode is pretty much the same. Consequently, we really never get to know the secondary characters. Certainly not in any way close to how we got to know them on TNG / DS9 / VOY. If we'd spent more time with them, if there had been Adira episodes along the way, maybe things would be different.
Really hate to be cynical but is Rayner being lined upped to be another Shaw?
I don't *think* so, but he definitely does have a lot of Shaw in his characterization.
That’s my fear too. Rehashing an archetype that worked well in another show. That’s not necessarily a terrible thing, but they need to show us why Reyner like this. Shaw worked as a character because we learned what was driving him (hatred of the Borg, survivors guilt, imposter syndrome) and because Todd Stashwick is unusually good at playing an asshole who doesn’t seem sus
@@MagicSnaily See, I think we know a lot already about why Rayner is like this. He is a product of the scrappy, downtrodden post-Burn Starfleet that only survived the Burn by the skin of its teeth.
In this way, he is a lot like Kirk in The Undiscovered Country: adjusting uncomfortably to the peace he had a hand in winning.
Where I think we're headed with this is that he doesn't have to be a dinosaur that can't live in this brave new world, if he's willing to build connections to it, however grumpily.
@@pjlusk7774yeah, I guess we have gotten a fair bit about him. TBH I’m just not finding it particularly interesting; older war-hardened asshole trying to figure out how to function in a kinder gentler world is something we’ve all seen before.
I absolutely hope they do something different with the character, if Trek taught me anything it taught me to have hope, it just kinda feels like ,"this worked in Picard, let's do it again", love for a character is organic, it's rarely manufactured......let's see where it goes.
RE: Grey and Adira, I was thinking, listening to their reasons, that this could be the start of the best, most healthy, friends with benefits relationship since Troi and Riker and I love that.
Another great review Jesse. ❤ I haven’t seen this one yet but your critique of the unearned emotional moments with the breakup is largely how I feel about much of DICSO’s writing. Season 5 is pretty good so far. A lot of pacing and scale improvements, and welcome focus on characters. But a lot of the drama isn’t “too emotional” at all. It’s that it sometimes feels contrived. That being said I’m enjoying this season much more than all of the previous.
Wilson Cruz is definitely one of the best parts of this show, and this episode highlighted the range and dynamic acting he can do. I know this might be controversial, but Culber's the only reason I've cared about the primary couple of this show, I've always disliked Stamets, he's never worked as a character for me, but I find Culber such a great character that I just want things to work out for him. Cruz has been one of the most charismatic people on this show, followed by Anson Mount's Pike and then...Book, I guess? Book and Culber scenes are just so good because they just both ooze charisma and likeability, makes whatever happens in their scene so much more interesting and the two always seem to sell it.
As I mention in my response to the episode 2 review (which I wrote a few minutes ago, I'm watching these in a break of binging the season, I've seen 6/10 so far), I feel the show starts to really stretch itself too much at this point. Much as I love Saru and his story's somewhat interesting, by putting so much focus on happenings outside of the Discovery story, they're underserving some of the characters there. For instance, this feels like it should've been a bigger episode for Adira, but instead I can only think of maybe 3 or 4 scenes for the character, and one is the setup scene that made me go "Jett Reno? Oh no, somehow I wasn't spending the last two episodes asking where Jett was and now that's all I'll be doing until Jett's on the screen again", whereas the others just fell flat for me, despite feeling like this should've been an emotional crux. (Oh, just got to the part where Jessie tackles that - and I agree with the criticism, and I think some of that is that this show often puts plot ahead of character, despite wanting to appear otherwise, but also I think the writers are just bad at writing relationships and sometimes realize that so they break couples up) Rayner's stuff worked for me a lot, partly because I love CKR and he's got this character perfectly down, but it unfortunately helped highlight for me that characters like Detmer, Owosekun, Rhys, etc. don't really get much outside of the occasional reference or appearance, which saddens me, especially for Detmer & Owo - this gets really emphasized for me next episode, so I'll hit on it again then.
This episode also furthered my mixed emotions about the overarching treasure hunt: the clue became much more of a MacGuffin for the broader plot than being an integral part of it, which bothers me a little, and they ratchet up the stakes a little more this episode (next episode does more, I'll talk about it then), but it seems a decent enough...framing device?
Finally getting to the spoiler part of this review (I start typing when I hit play, sometimes I pause because it's disrupting the thought I'm typing, I'm weird, leave me alone) and I am glad Jessie talks about the poem from the previous episode and the "riddle" at the start of this one. Not sure why, but when they were reading the initial 4 verses, I didn't think "Betazed" I thought "Trill" and was confused why they thought "Betazed", then felt vindicated (insert Holt gif) when the final line made them think "Trill". That said, this episode's riddle being "what were you supposed to have thought it was" just seemed idiotic, would've preferred something along the lines of what we get later on: a test of the person's character, even if it's oblique, rather than "how were you almost a dumbass".
I really loved the way that Tilly had obviously counted her words before telling of Rayner, so that the final insult would be word 21. Feels appropriately Tilly for her to do that.
Doesn't change the fact she is an insubordinate idiot.
Uhh jessie... Why don't you just put the bottom magnetic on the top? Lol
I was just going to comment how I have that same. Jakar figure in a box somewhere probably in my storage unit or is that your car? I can’t really tell exactly remember which one I have right now.
That last conversation between Burnham and Culber made me think about the Bill Watterson book The Mysteries. I quite enjoy it.
I don't love Rayner, but I like the complexity of what they tried to do with his flawed debut. We start off thinking he's got a master plan, but he's really just broken. Or both? Curious to see if there will be a comeuppance with Burnham next episode when she finds out that he only grudgingly followed the letter of her orders while defying the spirit.
Just seen the news that Lower Decks will end with its 5th season later this year and Strange New Worlds is getting a 4th season
Mike's statement that five seasons of _any_ show is a friggin' miracle during the Streaming Era makes sense, but I'm so bummed.
That said, maybe the characters will get to crossover to other shows, and I'll finally get the Tendi + Rok-Tahk hug I've been praying to see.
Great review, Jessie! I agreed with all your points. My least interesting part of the episode was Adira and Gray.
I sort of knew beforehand that they were going to breakup. It''s a shame, because I like both characters.
This episode was very Star Trekkian in its theme. 👍
I think Adira and her boyfriend, Gray, breaking up is a nice bit of "normalcy" to a relationship ending but they didn't really have that much of a relationship in the first place.
I think the boob joke you were looking for was “The metallic badge kept falling down because my boobs are attractive”. 😁
Unzip for the unzip throne!
The monsters in this episode reminded me of the Id monster from Forbidden Planet.
I do find both Adira and Gray to be kinda wasted in the show.
It feels like they did just enough to get LGBT recognition and then just shoved them to the side (I even have issues with the writers glomping them with Culber and Stamets cos it felt like they partitioned off all the lgbt characters together so they only had to deal with them occasionally.)
It’s a huge shame cos I loved Ian Alexander when he was in The Last of Us 2 and have been so disappointed at how he has been used as Gray.
Speaking of Culber I was surprised they didn’t tie it in with him being resurrected himself when allowing a deadman some time in the sun.
Regarding the mystery tho it’s kinda dumb how small it feels cos you have hundreds of billions of stars in our galaxy and the crew are guessing planets correctly by “It has nice blue water” is kinda silly even if you limit it to what was traversable in TNG ERA (even Michael figuring out the planet with the two moons last week was a long shot for why that one planet HAD to be it) it was mildly mitigated this week by making it a cooperation between 5 members of different species, cos I had also wondered why would a Romulan hide the clue on a Federation world
I’m certain that Disco’s writers are aware of the criticisms of the un-developed bridge characters and instead of course correcting, they’ve doubled down and introduced new “Delta Shift” bridge characters, just to TROLL the fans. It’s Disco’s last season and it’s already in the can, so it’s not like they care about ratings or viewership anymore. (Did they ever?)
Also because this is Disco’s final season, I’m certain that some of Discovery’s crew is going to die, but the writers are too gutless to kill off the original bridge crew, which is why they’re introducing a crop of Red Shirts to have their cake and eat it too. Faulkner famously said, “In writing, you must kill all your darlings.” Disco’s writers are clearly incapable of doing that.
I suspect that the writers and showrunners are deluded enough to believe that Disco will get a feature film or revival series someday, so they want to preserve their “characters”. Saru was sidelined to protect his character; I guarantee that Commander Rayner will die by the end of the season, just like Captain Shaw in Picard S3. The problem is that Rayner is portrayed so over-the-top unlikable, his inevitable death won’t mean anything, so what’s the point?
I also dislike the “tell, don’t show” method of developing the two villains by the Disco crew spewing exposition and expressing sympathy for them because of their tragic backstories. Why not SHOW the villains more and have them reference their origins and motivations? This is Writing 101 stuff, but Disco’s writers don’t understand the basics - or they’re so arrogant they won’t follow the rules.
It’s incredibly frustrating because Strange New Worlds has good writing and it feels like a traditional Star Trek series - while also having FUN and experimenting with the musical and Lower Decks cross-over episodes. Whereas Disco keeps making the same mistakes and refuses to course correct, which is why the series is ending and I feel that most fans are NOT upset about it.
I’m infinitely more upset about the recent announcement that ST Lower Decks is ending after Season 5! I sincerely hope that Netflix will pick up the series, like they did with Prodigy.
while I don't have any particular notes for this breakup--i appreciate that they handle it maturely and still love each other--i am pretty disturbed by the trend that whenever modern trek wants to make a point about relationships not working out, it seems to pick on the queer ppl
I was much more concerned with the B plot (Saru) than the A plot on trill… and that felt like classic Trek to me haha
Rainer to me feels like two things: he’s the classic grumpy old white man with the heart of gold trope, -I also felt like he was speaking from a neurodiverse point of view (not autistic but someone who’s brain/life formed in trauma, like someone with cpstd: he needs facts over feelings, he wants connection but he has low trust, he’s a utilitarianist INTJ like Seven in Voyager except he grew up during a time of war and resource scarcity, and that formed his character and he has to learn how to put down that “filter” or “shield” he carries)
The Vulcan purists: I actually liked it, it felt like a throwback to how “slow” Vulcan culture changes compared to human culture (they are literally still struggling with racism 1000 years later after T’pol + Trip, Sarek and Amanda… and that feels real for how long it took them to unify with Romulans and travel the stars prior to the federation: they are a very slow to change culture)
Rayner really falls into that Mike Ehrmantraut Jonathan Banksian Character traits in all the best ways for me
Oh it most definitely got hot in here. Not to objectify anyone, but Wilson Cruz is absolutely gorgeous on top of being an amazing actor and all around great human being by all accounts!
Personally picking up ST:2 and Genesis device storyline a bit.
The test of character was nice, but it seems like there are some pretty easy options to deal with the parents without hurting them. "Hey Discovery, these critters have optical camo, but I bet they show up just fine on sensors. How about you just beam them up and hold them in the pattern buffer for five minutes while we check this rock out?"
Just go with one of the Troi jumpsuits. Those were boob compatible for communicators
Did you not mention the reveal at the end of the episode that Moll bugged Adira?
"infinite diversity in infinite combinations" except when it comes to genetics, apparently.
I like the Discovery having emotional awareness, I just wish they'd not have those heartfelt conversations in the middle of time-sensitive crises and firefights. But I'm enjoying this season, though the groveling at the altar of religion at the end was kind of out of place. Particularly with reference to the Trill thing, not even the godlike technology.
Her Name is not T'Rinn, but T'Rina. There's an A in it. You keep saying it wrong 😅
Nice review ❤
I wonder if you will watch the fallout series and make some reviews for it^^
they dropped all the episodes at once tonight and I was busy on the binge 😇
and I like it very much, that you made these rewatches of the older episodes from DISCO
Wouldn't it be interesting if the Breen turned out to be one of the few species not seeded by the progenitors?
I really hope nothing in canon ever reveals the Breen's true form-as _Solo_ painfully established, the primary effect of explaining "Noodle incidents" is to smash people's headcanons.
Since you asked, my headcanon, btw, is that they're fluffy space koalas, and the reason they wear the suits is that they know no one would take them seriously if their true appearance was known.
Just put the one magnet you have on the top of the badge... ;)
Keep workin' that zipper Jessie!
I love your insights into the storylines and characters! But, please, you get T'RINA's name wrong each time you bring her up. She's one of my favorite characters!
T'Rina. Her name is T'Rina.
I love you Jesse. But it’s T’rina right?
Jessie pulling OFF that 32nd century uniform tho
Her combadge doesn’t seem to agree tho
Wait, that's G'kar there
Vulcan purists ARE racists in my opinion, and the topic definitely isn't new. The novel Spock's World (which isn't canon I know, but it's a great book and from the TOS era!) already had the idea that there might be a Vulcan movement to secede from the Federation.
You are wonderful. We love you very much 💘
Ahh, love right back at you.
♦️♦️♦️♦️♦️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♦️♦️
stealing again from picard season 3, discovery mow has their shaw...
“Gene Roddenberry would’ve been proud for that joke” - Jessie “Gender” Earl, 2024
@jessie - youtube is being an arse and hiding your stuff from me. As for this series, i'm enjoying it but i do wonder if Harrison Ford and Sean Connery are going to appear at some point or if there'll be a rehash of Wrath of Khan when they complete the quest. The Quest is a classic story arc but please do something more original with it.
I have kind of a bone to pick with this season because I started working on my 23rd century era Mirror Universe fanfic and then here comes this show hinting at an appearance by none other than the ISS Enterprise NCC-1701 in its trailers and throwing a wrench in everything I’m trying to do
Sounds like a whiney crybaby episode. I’m happy you go through all this so I don’t have to watch it. I can go watch some TNG now. Love your videos!!
Rayner also reminds me a bit of Jellico from Chain of Command