@@gadro333 Basically that TheWhat was the smartest person in figuring out the course but because of random events it took him just as long, like if Sherlock Holmes solved a mysterious case only to randomly die. But really I just wanted to use the phrase "Sherlock Holmes got fucking railed by a meteorite."
That was the only time in the entire video I felt bad. For the entire time I tested it I figured the movement classes were the only ones able to make it up, so I added the upper layer to make Engineer (what I thought was the easiest class at the time) more of a puzzle. I definitely should have added a parkour or something if you managed to make it up as Medic, Heavy, Sniper, or Spy.
Im honestly surprised that no one thought of the sandman or wrap assassain when he said "melee only" for the button. That was my immediate thought, even if it probably wouldn't work.
@@VakovoSheggorri wouldn't the sand man baseball bat or the ornament bounce off the invisible wall since in one of the clip the force and nature shot by one of them got blocked by the invisible wall
You think the big red text of "Wearer cannot carry the intelligence briefcase or PASS Time JACK" on the jumpers would be a red flag when capturing the intel
I swear this meme will be repeated until the heat death of the universe. We'll tell our children about this, then they will tell their children and so on. Y'know, this meme has always seemed like a strange case to me.
troll maps in TF2 have always seemed like a strange case to me. On one hand if you hate how a map works but love how it looks it's nice to have another option to choose from. But on the other hand, troll maps usually function differently from their counterpart. And I've always thought it would be neat if cool looking maps like the highertower had more of an identity than "Its hightower but for tall people" So I took a large number of troll maps currently available in the custom games and gave them their own set of trolls ranging from "Slightly modified version to the original map" to "Completely new map idea that's not balanced at all but a ton of fun."
It kinda interesting that the map show how your victims solve a problem and what is their main strength. FshOnAstick: knowledge (He the only one of the bunch that doesn't use the sticky jumber, and have the most way of getting up the ramp) TheWhatshow: creativity (He can create a creative way to solve a problem, and experiment more with the load out.) Zenithzv: consistency (He the only one get up there via brute scout gameplay.) But also because of these attribute it also somewhat fuck them over. Fish have a lot of false positive because of how much he know. The what show take too much risk (an aspect of creativity) .Zenithzv seer consistency prevent him from experimenting and find some of the obvious way to solve thing. There are other factor as well like luck and risk taking but ehh.
It would've been hilarious if after they finally got back with the intel, they realized they still had to capture it 2 more times like all other ctf maps
9:00 I hate that I know this reference. Minnesotaburns was a Call of Duty UA-camr in the early 2010s who made videos where he trolled kids on Xbox Live by challenging them to 1v1s and fucking with the rules like adding headshots only without telling them
TheWhat: figured out strats quickly, was very unlucky all around 46 minutes, 57 seconds Zenith: raged the most, figured things out at a moderate pace 48 minutes, 57 seconds Fish on a Stick: had the wackiest strats of all 3, chad Demoknight 51 minutes, 51 seconds
FSOAS just charging in head first, grabbing the intel, and charging back out is the greatest victory in this video. Well, that, and him making it in as Heavy. That was insane and I felt bad for him. Personally, I would’ve given him free access into the room as any class at that point lol
troll maps in TF2 have always seemed like a strange case to me. On one hand if you hate how a map works but love how it looks it's nice to have another option to choose from. But on the other hand, troll maps usually function differently from their counterpart. And I've always thought it would be neat if cool looking maps like the highertower had more of an identity than "Its hightower but for tall people" So I took a large number of troll maps currently available in the custom games and gave them their own set of trolls ranging from "Slightly modified version to the original map" to "Completely new map idea that's not balanced at all but a ton of fun."
ended up getting a time of 16:34, thermal thruster for button, then loose cannon + trimping to get up to intel, then loose cannon to get the intel, then finally charging down before trap comes back edit: i think if you remove the initial trial and error, on the completion it would be about 40 seconds, but actually grinding to get that in one run would be hell (i am actually trying this)
Yooooo GB ! Very nice video you got here, ggs to whatshow, fish and zenith for playing your INSANE map. I am actually a troll level player in SMM2 and been in that community for a while. It's soooo interesting to see you creating your own trolls level in tf2 that isn't driven by a player's triggers (deathrun gameplay) and I wanted to comment something that is awesome and that I could do an entire video around if I had motivation : Contraption Troll ethic ! Basicaly it's a way of juicing optimaly the most of your player emotions, wills, fun and anger. Il will just post this here, if you or anyone wanted to create another trollmap cause I would love to see this getting a proper group in the TF2 community. When SMM troll creators begin to make that kind of levels they where very much like your first part, the ramp of doom, lot of janks and spam of rng/chaotic timed event and projectiles across the map. More and more by the years, metas and anti metas florished for rafined trolls that are more close to the second part of the map, created in a way that the player find .. how to say that... consistency ? in the way he die and why he died. Here is basically, in bad order. A list of the rules you can apply to yourself for changing the "that's bullshit" emotion (good but dangerous for ragequit or getting stuck in a 30mn brainless try and die chokehold) in a delicious "I'm so dumb" reactions each death. - If a player die by a troll, He should quickly have in head, preferably in 1 death , how to avoid it. (I know TF2 contrario to SMM is 9 classes and mor like a thousand ways of navigating in a map with rocket jump, speed boosts, double jumps... but the tips stay the same proportionnaly. The goal here is to help your player getting in a "I have to do that, and that, and that" mindset and reducing the "What's the bumper hitbox dude ?" into a more like "Oh... yeah I forgot the bumper" that goes particulary with the hidden and "surprise" trolls. The ultimate goal can be analysed in your "rope and button" part : first troll, the starting bump, then The mid one, then the invisible wall. Whatshow seem to get into the trial and error mindset pretty quick, but maybe you can design something that reveal itself when you get bumped into, just for having on the kill cam a brief and fair way of seeing the hitbox or the event that trigger the troll Maybe TF2 specifically can help with stuff we don't have in SMM like death message. (" You got bumped in an invisible wall and die horribly" message ?). It make your maps shorter cause obviously a big part of that one was about trying and trying and trying the ramp of doom, But it make fair rage, and fair rage can glue your player's ass to the seat for a looong time and be extremely fun for the viewers - Pace your restart time. So this one is more about timing comedy and the feeling of backtracking. Essentially you want to put always the most, time consuming trolls at the beginning of the map (or aftrer a CP) and the most RNG at the end. The goal is to manipulate the patience of your player in a way that it continue to feel that the "I know how to do it now, i can do it now" when they pass a troll, and you do that by having also a bit of "I know by heart the start of the level, and i'm consistent a passing it, so i can actually do the last rng bullshit stuff" mindset. Remember that you have to control and be aware of what proportion of "getting of it with bennet" you want, cause in a way, die-restart-redo is a mini "getting over it" level design, but feel extremly different to "I got to the top and die by a last hidden wall". Both can be fun. but control the erasing of progression. - If the player isn't suppose to be there/ try this path they have the right to know, basically, they have the right to know where to go and preferably in what order. (Even if you can make very good puzzle card/door stuff, but it's a deticated troll and the "zone" and it's limits where your use that kind of trolls should be cleary visible, ("i'm out the labyrinth now" should preferably be true when your testers say this sentence) Your map did great with that, even with the "I gonna brute force and find my way on the ramp directly" 15 minutes your testers did. The vocal hints are good in this case, and a good way of placing your testers on the right track. Hints can be a bit anti-fun for some player, but you can rafined that by showing/don't tell rule. - Twice twice control is also mandatory. That can be applied to an exact troll or the feeling of the map in general. Twice twice are a specific trolls where you copy/past a past troll that your players did already, but change the outcome. Let's say your testers have to make an intricate triple jump with scout for going from A to B, So they take a couple of try, think about the scout air control, pass the troll , and get themself after some rooms in an other kind of the same design. you can manipulate their mind with same colors or same specific plaforms for having them doing the same inputs. And that's give you specific consistency of knowing what key my testers gonna push and what class they will be. If you can control that, by using specific visual cue, or something that they learn doing with your map and then get's trolled for learning the muscle memory of it is GREAT. Ultimately everything is a twice twice, cause troll is a gameplay of learning and so you gonna use the learned actions and reverse troll it like god intended to. In SMM or cat mario gameplay the first "twice twice" was the "3 same jump, but the last is a death trap" , and know we have a "is this the same room than before ?" meta and even a "Is this the same map than the last one ?" when the troll community in SMM got hystorically and known maps from specific creators. - "Pick a pipe" control. I didn't saw "pick a pipe" troll in your map, and kudos to that. Pick a pipe trolls are specific trolls where there gonna be a very shown, very "lazy" 2 way path where one is a direct death and the other is the good one. They are very known in deathruns, and.. can be very poor design when used first degree. not saying that in a bad way, lazy and false sense of lazyness is a great thing to manipulate in trolls, you just have to be aware of it and play "with" not "against" your testers TLDR : Controling the diversity and repetition of trolls categories and learning to empathise with your testers by asking yourself "If I didn't know this map, could a be missguided into doing a certain thing for 1hour" is the basic and efficient way to go designing trolls. Also, I don't want to make you doing trolls this specific way, I thing the existence of deathruns in TF2 and the specificity of TF2 gameplay should change a lot of stuff from SMM troll community. But I can give some of this know tips in SMM for getting more sharp in this wonderful discipline. Afterall You actually did each tips of my list at least one time in your map ! TY for your content, and the awesome video, there is a loooot more of it that I could talk about, all the metas and anti metas, all the flavor and the manipulation you can do. Even what's the gmod/tf2 community already had in there troll history with Horror maps or deathrun, but this wll be for another time take care everyone.
Aahahahahaha great video! The map is pretty good, well done! I liked zenith being really angry and changing his voice. I also liked Fish on a stick getting up there with 2 classes that none of the others figured out, also nice trick jump to get the intel. But we all know THE WHAT SHOW was the real gamer here, and if rng was on his side he could have gotten way better time.
Next time when in a similar type of situation , go do a 10 min wall sit , then finish your essay . Then during the 6 minute of the wall sit , smile and say : I am not even winded , I could finish the essay right now
37:38 You _could_ get the intel that way, if you get up there - there's respawning ammo packs, so if you brought the wrangler you could sentry-jump up to it. Not sure it'd help on the downhill, though.
Missed opportunity to have a secret button that disables everything behind a secret breakable wall in spawn
And it's invisible, and there's no hint at all, not even a slightly different detail in the wall
Who says there isn't?
@@M644theawesomegreat blue lmao
@@davisdf3064FNAF 3 Moment.
@@redactedoktoris there actually something like that? or do you mean the typing a number into the wall tiles like a phone
Fish had the most creative ideas.
Whatshow was the one who understood the assignment best.
Zenith brought the rage to the rage game
No replies, let me fix that
The siblings
zenith did it faster than fish btw
You can hear each of our wills slowly die as the video goes on
Comment from tsw with no replies? Seems like a strange case
wills always seemed like a strange case to me
@@ambi_cc8464the shat hhow
Just dying inside as the video goes on
@@ambi_cc8464tsw? the show what?
1) Everyone forgot how to airblast
2) Everyone forgot that jumper weapons can't carry Intel
29:05, they did not all forget to airblast.
@@TheShinyFeraligatr That's more than 20 mins of NOT airblasting at all.
The arrows were immune to airblast like the stickies were
@@nulljaeger3850 37:48 an arrow gets reflected.
@@TheUndeadslayer22113:07
TheWhat having all the brainpower but none of the luck is like if Sherlock Holmes got fucking railed by a meteorite.
LOL HOW IS THAT SO ACCURATE
Brainpower has always been a strange case to me
WHAT DOES THIS MEAN 😭😭😭😭
@@gadro333honestly i dont even know but it made me laugh
@@gadro333 Basically that TheWhat was the smartest person in figuring out the course but because of random events it took him just as long, like if Sherlock Holmes solved a mysterious case only to randomly die.
But really I just wanted to use the phrase "Sherlock Holmes got fucking railed by a meteorite."
fucking hearing zenith literally dying inside after he realises that he can't grab the intel with the sticky jumper is so funny
I love how EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM forgot the jumpers couldnt pick up the intel.
i actually didnt know that, i dont use jump weapons. i just use gunboats.
Nobody actually caps in capture the flag
@@wadespencer3623I’ve had games where people did and it pissed me off
@@wadespencer3623you forgot that scout always rushing to intel😅
@@OsholitloTF2 ☝🤓
"im getting really mad, and this isnt just for the video" - cuts to an ad for therapy
the difference is between their frustrations at the traps and ours at late stage consunerism
Getting trolled in TF2 has allways seemed like a strange case to me
Weapon reskins in tf2 have always seemed like a strange case to me
zenith pls edit your comment to fix the always
i beg
you gotta feel the thunger
thunger feel the thunger
3:39 This part was wild. I nearly coughed out loud.
Zenith maxing out his mic gain is like the audio equivalent of an ace attorney breakdown
TheWhat Show's luck always seemed like a strange case to me.
Is not luck, is a part of interloper arg how did you not notice
@@orlandodanielgonzalezalcar3360 he's just rephrasing "weapon reskins in tf2 have always seemed like a strange case to me" Thing
@@MacNZ-_-He knows of the bit dude
@@lordz19 misunderstandings involving jokes in comment sections on tf2 videos have always been a strange cast to me
@@MacNZ-_-
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! IS HEEEEEEEEEEEEE???
TheWhat: Scout is clearly the correct option.
Zenith: Scout is probably the best?
FSoaS: *_demoknight tf2_*
Vs giant fuking asteroid
The focus (and horrible luck) of TheWhat, the unbridled rage of Fish, and the hostility of Zenith are an incredible dynamic.
never heard fish rage so hard, that's new
TheWhat was so good that he still finished in the first place despite his bad luck
@@dukecatfishjunior6291he got close many times when talking about the kunai.
@dukecatfishjunior6291 Watch him talk about the Kunai or the Scorch Shot.
i love how TheWhat wasn't even raging at this - he was just having a whale of a time.
I was so sad Fish's Heavy plan couldn't work. It felt really out of the box.
Should've given a wheelchair ramp with heavy on it if you managed to get up there like with the engie troll at the end
That was the only time in the entire video I felt bad. For the entire time I tested it I figured the movement classes were the only ones able to make it up, so I added the upper layer to make Engineer (what I thought was the easiest class at the time) more of a puzzle. I definitely should have added a parkour or something if you managed to make it up as Medic, Heavy, Sniper, or Spy.
@@Great_BlueAll you'd really need to do is pull those creates in the corner out a little bit, close enough to strafe into the existing entrance.
@@Great_Blue but how engie is supposed to get up?
@@AliceLoverdrive sentry boosting
A collaboration between Valefisk and Great Blue would be diabolical.
It would definitely be a strange case
Yes
“I made a torture tf2 map”
- Vale
Ten year long video
One must imagine 3 tf2 youtubers happy
they're sisyfussin
" You're gonna Solar Light it? " I love how that's become the " You're gonna Demoknight it? " Fitting for that channel :D
Uncle Dane when he has to destroy all of his level 3 building because his teammate uses the Persian Persuader
Uncle Dane when he has to destroy all of his level 3 buildings because his teammate uses the Persian Persuader
"What if there was Touhou but all boys?"
It returns to haunt us.
Touhou Fortress is immortal.
Like Pyro Mokou
You called? Yes Touhou x Team Fortress 2 is eternal
its stalker obviously
Touhou but actually good characters
"I'm gonna find something you didn't account for"
*Opens console*
_I'm going to do what is called a pro gamer move_
“You think you can jump over MY PERFECTLY CRAFTED TF2 MAP?!”
-Great Blue
Jumping over my perfectly crafted tf2 map has always seemed like a strange case to me
you can't hear that without the gabriel voice
@@somedude4087 Scout, turn back now, for you will be crossing the will of BLUE.
I was fully expecting a “ You think you can Short Circuit up MY perfectly crafted hill?”
The realization of "I HAVE THE STICKY JUMPER" was one of, if not the, best moments in the video
The breaking of a man XD
I FORGOT THE DOLL type beat
@alternatejamey4050 I know exactly what you're talking about.
I tip my hat to you, one legend to another
He could get there with a normal one then jumper but thats more effort for 0 reason
Im honestly surprised that no one thought of the sandman or wrap assassain when he said "melee only" for the button. That was my immediate thought, even if it probably wouldn't work.
Wouldn't the projectile bounce off the wall?
@@Kyo23415 i am confused, can you explain?
@@VakovoSheggorri wouldn't the sand man baseball bat or the ornament bounce off the invisible wall since in one of the clip the force and nature shot by one of them got blocked by the invisible wall
reverse escape rooms have always seemed like a strange case to me
Every bulding is a reverse escape room if you wait till the doors are locked
@@Tufhhuyy zamn never thought of it that way
Blue probably had the biggest shit eating grin on his face seeing them get past the door with the Rocket Jumper/Sticky Jumper.
the fact one of em tried bonk at the very beginning once, failed once, and decided bonk wasn't the answer for the next dozens of minutes baffles me
Wasn't it shown that Bonk got disabled near the top of the mountain?
@yoshifan33 not in the initial attempt. It was show clearly on the second attempt a while later, that bonk was accounted for
You think the big red text of "Wearer cannot carry the intelligence briefcase or PASS Time JACK" on the jumpers would be a red flag when capturing the intel
TF2 youtubers randomly forgetting all TF2 knowledge has always seemed like a strange case to me
To be fair, how often do people even use the jumper weapons on CTF, and how many people actually play for the objective there
troll maps have always seemed like a strange case to me
care to elaborate? no?
I swear this meme will be repeated until the heat death of the universe. We'll tell our children about this, then they will tell their children and so on. Y'know, this meme has always seemed like a strange case to me.
troll maps in TF2 have always seemed like a strange case to me. On one hand if you hate how a map works but love how it looks it's nice to have another option to choose from. But on the other hand, troll maps usually function differently from their counterpart. And I've always thought it would be neat if cool looking maps like the highertower had more of an identity than "Its hightower but for tall people" So I took a large number of troll maps currently available in the custom games and gave them their own set of trolls ranging from "Slightly modified version to the original map" to "Completely new map idea that's not balanced at all but a ton of fun."
Yea.
you gotta feel the thunger
fish trying to iron-bomber into the window and accidentally picking up the intel is the embodiment of “Task Failed Successfully”
Had it not been for RNG, thewhatshow would've finished in like 30-20 mins.
You can tell TheWhat is an actual gamer. Not just with creative thinking but experimenting with everything.
I feel like this map would be significantly easier if the short circuit was in its pre-plasma ball projectile state.
Agreed
The Short Circuit plasma ball update has always been a strange case to me.
Or if they airblasted the projectiles
@@skinwalker69420 you cannot airblast that wall of arrow
@@nicolasturetta7959you can airblast that one sticky bomb
It kinda interesting that the map show how your victims solve a problem and what is their main strength.
FshOnAstick: knowledge (He the only one of the bunch that doesn't use the sticky jumber, and have the most way of getting up the ramp)
TheWhatshow: creativity (He can create a creative way to solve a problem, and experiment more with the load out.)
Zenithzv: consistency (He the only one get up there via brute scout gameplay.)
But also because of these attribute it also somewhat fuck them over. Fish have a lot of false positive because of how much he know. The what show take too much risk (an aspect of creativity) .Zenithzv seer consistency prevent him from experimenting and find some of the obvious way to solve thing.
There are other factor as well like luck and risk taking but ehh.
It would've been hilarious if after they finally got back with the intel, they realized they still had to capture it 2 more times like all other ctf maps
"sv_cheats 1"
"noclip"
"god"
actually in source it's "buddha"@@edfreak9001
4:48 "put the music on" "Woaowngh"
LMFAOOOO
9:00 I hate that I know this reference. Minnesotaburns was a Call of Duty UA-camr in the early 2010s who made videos where he trolled kids on Xbox Live by challenging them to 1v1s and fucking with the rules like adding headshots only without telling them
40:40 Zenith has entered his villain arc.
You should make a version for Fish only where every trap is a critical Scorch Shot projectile.
Make him have to *use* it, too.
40:43 Zenith is me whenever I see a comment on an air disaster video saying,"good thing the camera man survived".
TheWhat: figured out strats quickly, was very unlucky all around
46 minutes, 57 seconds
Zenith: raged the most, figured things out at a moderate pace
48 minutes, 57 seconds
Fish on a Stick: had the wackiest strats of all 3, chad Demoknight
51 minutes, 51 seconds
Truly balanced
@@TheWhatShowas all things should be
A "skill always beats luck" moment
Zenith was like the brawn’s and the what was the brains I noticed test subject 1867 zenith displayed signs of rushing the test
@@smiller6986waht
Fish may have been the slowest, but I feel like he deserves the win for winning with strats the map didn't account for
Getting up the hill as Heavy alone is a monumental feat.
Taking a shower in 50 arrows in tf2 has always seemed like a strange case to me
As a tf2 player, taking a shower has always seemed like a strange case to me
@@glowingdeathclaw3560 ha nice
now i need to see some speedruns on this map, i wanna see the strats and world record get figured out over time in this silly rage map lmao
Troll maps in tf2 have always been a strange case to me
FSOAS just charging in head first, grabbing the intel, and charging back out is the greatest victory in this video. Well, that, and him making it in as Heavy. That was insane and I felt bad for him. Personally, I would’ve given him free access into the room as any class at that point lol
troll maps in TF2 have always seemed like a strange case to me. On one hand if you hate how a map works but love how it looks it's nice to have another option to choose from. But on the other hand, troll maps usually function differently from their counterpart. And I've always thought it would be neat if cool looking maps like the highertower had more of an identity than "Its hightower but for tall people" So I took a large number of troll maps currently available in the custom games and gave them their own set of trolls ranging from "Slightly modified version to the original map" to "Completely new map idea that's not balanced at all but a ton of fun."
This sounds like an actual script from one of his videos
24:53
Zenith: "This is a easily map in the world dude." *miss the landing panics*
me: "You were saying?"
Great Blue suddenly becoming Valefisk is something we didn't know we needed.
thats a fucking LEGENDARY crossover event holy shit.
@@vastowen4562"I made campaign of North africa in TF2"
Great Blue suddenly becoming Valefisk was always a strange case to me
if thewhat had better luck he wouldve been done in like 20 mins
This is blues' specialty, trolling his friends who get too cocky on his maps or games 😂
Boromir being skewered by orc arrows always seemed like a strange case to me
I'm glad to know that i'm not the only one with the shittiest luck in all of probability odds.
The WhatShow, you're now my new favourite youtuber lmao
13:39 Achilles lore
Ok but whose lore is that then? 3:45
@@kormannn1bophades, from the legend of bophades knutts
Lmao@@simperorbubba_link8441
It was so impossible that he hit the family guy dead pose 5:40
I'm gonna be honest I only just realized you and FSOAS are different people
forgetting the jumper weapons stop you grabbing the intel is so painful, genius stuff
I like how nobody bothered to airblast like until half an hour into the challenge
Zenith: Are you trolling me rn?
Blue Out loud offended: No!
Blue in his mind: 100% Yes
Me: "wait this feels like desert bu-"
*it's desert bus*
"OH YOU SNEAKY B-"
Thewhat asking if you were controlling it was probably his PTSD from another video of yours
It wasn't until I rewatched this that I realized how much TheWhat would have *demolished* this without his bad luck.
Map beating styles :
TWS: trigger launch block
Zenith: trigger launch block
FSOAS: SCOTLAND FOREVEEEEEEEEER
The ultimate plot twist would be forcing a BLU victory when capping the intel
One must imagine tf2 youtubers happy
something ive noticed by 22:00, no ones tried the Base Jumper to get to the button, likely with the Liberty Launcher-
One must imagine Blue's friends happy
"You have to bring the Intelligence back"
*Uses the Sticky Jumper*
hiii
@@TotalNormalFry hi
ended up getting a time of 16:34, thermal thruster for button, then loose cannon + trimping to get up to intel, then loose cannon to get the intel, then finally charging down before trap comes back
edit: i think if you remove the initial trial and error, on the completion it would be about 40 seconds, but actually grinding to get that in one run would be hell (i am actually trying this)
Where is the map download?
"Playing to 3 captures" just might have broken them
This is the TF2 equivalent of "Getting Over It".
One must imagine TheWhatShow happy
eyyyyyy bugcat!
(totally didn’t confused it for catbug
Scarily reminds me of Valefisk.
You two have coffee or somethin?
What a strange case
angry FSOAS is not real. he can't hurt you
angry FSOAS:
any mention of scorch shot or kunai
i like how you say "you can use any weapon as long as you bring the intel back" then everyone ends up using the jumper weapons
Yooooo GB !
Very nice video you got here, ggs to whatshow, fish and zenith for playing your INSANE map. I am actually a troll level player in SMM2 and been in that community for a while. It's soooo interesting to see you creating your own trolls level in tf2 that isn't driven by a player's triggers (deathrun gameplay) and I wanted to comment something that is awesome and that I could do an entire video around if I had motivation : Contraption Troll ethic !
Basicaly it's a way of juicing optimaly the most of your player emotions, wills, fun and anger. Il will just post this here, if you or anyone wanted to create another trollmap cause I would love to see this getting a proper group in the TF2 community.
When SMM troll creators begin to make that kind of levels they where very much like your first part, the ramp of doom, lot of janks and spam of rng/chaotic timed event and projectiles across the map. More and more by the years, metas and anti metas florished for rafined trolls that are more close to the second part of the map, created in a way that the player find .. how to say that... consistency ? in the way he die and why he died.
Here is basically, in bad order. A list of the rules you can apply to yourself for changing the "that's bullshit" emotion (good but dangerous for ragequit or getting stuck in a 30mn brainless try and die chokehold) in a delicious "I'm so dumb" reactions each death.
- If a player die by a troll, He should quickly have in head, preferably in 1 death , how to avoid it. (I know TF2 contrario to SMM is 9 classes and mor like a thousand ways of navigating in a map with rocket jump, speed boosts, double jumps... but the tips stay the same proportionnaly. The goal here is to help your player getting in a "I have to do that, and that, and that" mindset and reducing the "What's the bumper hitbox dude ?" into a more like "Oh... yeah I forgot the bumper" that goes particulary with the hidden and "surprise" trolls. The ultimate goal can be analysed in your "rope and button" part : first troll, the starting bump, then The mid one, then the invisible wall. Whatshow seem to get into the trial and error mindset pretty quick, but maybe you can design something that reveal itself when you get bumped into, just for having on the kill cam a brief and fair way of seeing the hitbox or the event that trigger the troll
Maybe TF2 specifically can help with stuff we don't have in SMM like death message. (" You got bumped in an invisible wall and die horribly" message ?). It make your maps shorter cause obviously a big part of that one was about trying and trying and trying the ramp of doom, But it make fair rage, and fair rage can glue your player's ass to the seat for a looong time and be extremely fun for the viewers
- Pace your restart time.
So this one is more about timing comedy and the feeling of backtracking. Essentially you want to put always the most, time consuming trolls at the beginning of the map (or aftrer a CP) and the most RNG at the end. The goal is to manipulate the patience of your player in a way that it continue to feel that the "I know how to do it now, i can do it now" when they pass a troll, and you do that by having also a bit of "I know by heart the start of the level, and i'm consistent a passing it, so i can actually do the last rng bullshit stuff" mindset. Remember that you have to control and be aware of what proportion of "getting of it with bennet" you want, cause in a way, die-restart-redo is a mini "getting over it" level design, but feel extremly different to "I got to the top and die by a last hidden wall". Both can be fun. but control the erasing of progression.
- If the player isn't suppose to be there/ try this path they have the right to know, basically, they have the right to know where to go and preferably in what order.
(Even if you can make very good puzzle card/door stuff, but it's a deticated troll and the "zone" and it's limits where your use that kind of trolls should be cleary visible, ("i'm out the labyrinth now" should preferably be true when your testers say this sentence)
Your map did great with that, even with the "I gonna brute force and find my way on the ramp directly" 15 minutes your testers did. The vocal hints are good in this case, and a good way of placing your testers on the right track. Hints can be a bit anti-fun for some player, but you can rafined that by showing/don't tell rule.
- Twice twice control is also mandatory.
That can be applied to an exact troll or the feeling of the map in general. Twice twice are a specific trolls where you copy/past a past troll that your players did already, but change the outcome. Let's say your testers have to make an intricate triple jump with scout for going from A to B, So they take a couple of try, think about the scout air control, pass the troll , and get themself after some rooms in an other kind of the same design. you can manipulate their mind with same colors or same specific plaforms for having them doing the same inputs. And that's give you specific consistency of knowing what key my testers gonna push and what class they will be. If you can control that, by using specific visual cue, or something that they learn doing with your map and then get's trolled for learning the muscle memory of it is GREAT. Ultimately everything is a twice twice, cause troll is a gameplay of learning and so you gonna use the learned actions and reverse troll it like god intended to. In SMM or cat mario gameplay the first "twice twice" was the "3 same jump, but the last is a death trap" , and know we have a "is this the same room than before ?" meta and even a "Is this the same map than the last one ?" when the troll community in SMM got hystorically and known maps from specific creators.
- "Pick a pipe" control.
I didn't saw "pick a pipe" troll in your map, and kudos to that. Pick a pipe trolls are specific trolls where there gonna be a very shown, very "lazy" 2 way path where one is a direct death and the other is the good one. They are very known in deathruns, and.. can be very poor design when used first degree. not saying that in a bad way, lazy and false sense of lazyness is a great thing to manipulate in trolls, you just have to be aware of it and play "with" not "against" your testers
TLDR : Controling the diversity and repetition of trolls categories and learning to empathise with your testers by asking yourself "If I didn't know this map, could a be missguided into doing a certain thing for 1hour" is the basic and efficient way to go designing trolls. Also, I don't want to make you doing trolls this specific way, I thing the existence of deathruns in TF2 and the specificity of TF2 gameplay should change a lot of stuff from SMM troll community. But I can give some of this know tips in SMM for getting more sharp in this wonderful discipline. Afterall You actually did each tips of my list at least one time in your map !
TY for your content, and the awesome video, there is a loooot more of it that I could talk about, all the metas and anti metas, all the flavor and the manipulation you can do. Even what's the gmod/tf2 community already had in there troll history with Horror maps or deathrun, but this wll be for another time
take care everyone.
I'm guessing next you're gonna troll TF2 youtubers by making them become Sisyphus
(Pushing a bomb cart only for the cart to fall down again)
I can tell that one song was from an old Marble game I used to play. Considering how these guys are being flung around, it's a fitting choice.
Imagine if he put Scorch shot flares as the only projectile
23:12 *”FUCK”* Dumbledore said calmly
46:24
Seven minutes in and I'm surprised by the lack of BASE Jumper.
Exactly
strange case, huh
They'll just get yeeted anyway considering the several anti cheese triggers.. and jumper weapons prevent you from collecting intelligence.
@@metayoshi1712that stat only applies to the orange weapons
not the parachute
this is his perfectly crafted map and you cannot fly and get past all through the obstacles
finally...they made getting pubstomped simulator
Zenith casually making it super far just by walking is hilarious
i love how at 5:35 zenith does a perfect family guy death pose.
Aahahahahaha great video!
The map is pretty good, well done!
I liked zenith being really angry and changing his voice.
I also liked Fish on a stick getting up there with 2 classes that none of the others figured out, also nice trick jump to get the intel.
But we all know THE WHAT SHOW was the real gamer here, and if rng was on his side he could have gotten way better time.
Zenith's "I HAVE THE STICKY JUMPerrrrr..." fucking KILLED me
troll maps have always seemed like a strange case to me
the fact that nobody thought to just switch to blue team to never take damage always felt like a strange case to me
Then you can't grab the intelligence.
Your mother always felt like a strange case to me
4:02 how did they not realize they can't get the briefcase with the jumpers?
Watchin this instead of finishing my essay that’s due tomorrow (no extensions are possible and i have one sentence done)
Next time when in a similar type of situation , go do a 10 min wall sit , then finish your essay . Then during the 6 minute of the wall sit , smile and say : I am not even winded , I could finish the essay right now
@@34rolento1 you see what I said was in fact sarcastic and not true next time in a situation like this search up “how to understand sarcasm”
18:36 😂sounded like spongebob crying at pearls dance
37:38 You _could_ get the intel that way, if you get up there - there's respawning ammo packs, so if you brought the wrangler you could sentry-jump up to it. Not sure it'd help on the downhill, though.
“This is like if Jesus Christ made a map”
At first it was funny but not even half way through i just started feeling bad for them
And this is how Great Blue got kicked out of the chucklenuts
FSOAS' shout at 23:11 sounds so genuine and full of anger
Use f.a.n to get the button, Gunboats+lib launcher to get up hill faster, then just get intel then rush down
Please make this a bigger map for multiple people to play on.
this but every 7 minutes a single homing rocket spawns on the ramp