Our school had a crisis in the mid 80's when we heard that in order to test for black belt we would have to fly to Korea and the cost was prohibitive. A lot of schools broke away at that time.
@@SenseiIchi I stuck with them, as the cost was far too much. I wound up moving to another state, and have had no formal training since the early '90s. I still consider it my core art, however. I recall a statement our instructor said when asked why he chose Tang Soo instead of a more 'realistic' method, he being California Highway Patrol officer. He said that if you wanted to learn to fight, you could go to (a notorious biker bar whose name I have forgotten) and slap the biggest fellow there. You will learn to fight very quickly. If you want to learn an art that you can do for the rest of your life, find a classical style like Tang Soo. At 58 it is still something I can do and enjoy!
@@claud1961 Hahah yes! That is fantastic advice, give that man a medal! I'm happy to hear that you are still training in Tang Soo Do, where abouts are you living and training?
Claud Wolf that’s great you’re training with your son. My father and I have the strongest bond because he will forever be my teacher and mentor. Keep it going !
Although I trained in a different Martial Art, there was a major division after the Master died in Isshinryu Karate. Many in Okinawa went their own way. The son in law was granted Master and the son had bitter feelings towards his father. B4 his death, he gave his son his blessings. In the early 80's, we had to make the same choice as you between either the son in law, or the son. I chose the fathers son. Much has changed also. We didnt have all.the colored belts in the 70's. White, green, brown and black. Now it's all the colored belts. I dont teach anymore due to medical problems. But, I never quit teaching the old ways I was taught. It was tough conditioning of arms, stomach, legs and shins. I miss it. But kidney disease, open heart surgery and conquering colon cancer has taken its toll . Take care sir ....
Wow that is quite the story. I hope the decision you made ended up being the best one. I'm sorry to hear of your medical illnesses, I hope you are healthy and well. Stay strong and thank you for commenting.
I had a very similar experience training in Goju-Ryu. Same belts with the exception of White to yellow, than green and so fourth. Heavy on the physical conditioning and sparring every class. Part of the reason I think martial arts gets such a bad rap now is because so many schools leave those two ingredients out of their curriculum. You can't really learn practical application without learning how to use it while in a similar situation like sparring.
@@nomadronin7361 When I originally trained in the USArmy, I had a sensei who was trained by the famed Hank Slomanski. As well as Master Shimabuku and his son in law. The training was much different back then. Kotucky tai was always done. Makiwara was also done. 1 on 1 contact fighting to the take down. 1 on 2 as well. The other. Fighters always wore kendo armor, to limit injuries. It was pretty brutal back in the 1970's. I started teaching at shodan. I also.studied Goju Ryu in the mid eighties to learn how Isshinryu was made, as well as Chito Ryu. Both chito and Isshinryu are so close, I feel one was copied . Just my opinion ...
As a young Marine Military Policeman stationed in Okinawa in the 70s, I used to stand post occasionally with an Okinawan Security Guard named Angi Uezu. When I got promoted to Corporal, I was moved to the Criminal Investigation Office, across the parking lot, and worked with an Okinawan Criminal Investigator named Takayoshi "Bill" Nagamine. I never studied under either, but I did visit Master Uezu at his dojo. I only stayed in Okinawa for one year and at the time didn't realize how close I was to the center of the traditional martial arts world. On one occasion I had to report to the Provost Marshal with "Bill" Nagamine. As we entered the building, we passed through the Desk Sergeant's area where the Security Guards were gathered for their shift. Angi Uezu was there and he and "Bill" Nagamine nodded to each other and he said to me, "Hello, Craig-san!"
Far too much politics in today's Martial Arts. Plus many systems have made Black Belt so easy that it's ridiculous. Basically it's if you have the promotion fee, you passed. I stopped asking for promotions long, long ago. What rank was Bruce Lee? Was he concerned with belt rank or learning from every system he came in contact with? Mr. Miyagi had it right when he said to Daniel "Belt only mean no need rope to hold up pants."
bruce lee was more of an actor than a martial artist, so who cares what he thinks, nothing wrong with having a belt system when done right, the only way to get away from politics is to get away from people, where's there's people there are politics
Remember that the only reason that belts turned black originally was due to the fact there was no laundry service. So all the colors encountered in training eventually stained the fabric of the uniform and belt. Eventually all those stains turned the belt black (blackish)
@@danielhaire6677 yes offf course but this is north america, a belt system is a great reward system that works very well when applied properly, if i don't want belts I'll do kickboxing or krav maga, my black belts are real black belts
I am a member of the IMA under GM Ki Yun Yi who was a former instructor at Osan AFB while GM Norris was training there. Thank you for sharing the history. Tang Soo!!
I have basic TV. One channel plays 7 hours of Walker, Texas Ranger a day from 10 till' 5..❤ It actually got me thru 2 months of sobriety, assigned by my probation officer..💀🖤
@OLD Beer Buzzard i was blessed in the facr that all of my martial arts senseis . Would respect your blackbelt even if you come from a different system. Their thought process was you are more than able to grasp the basics of a system. You would still be trained by lower belts which can be humbling, but it is all about learning , and sharing with one another. Martial arts all of it is correlated, despite all of the BS some of these teachers blow up our ass about their system being better. Blah blah blah!
I liked your story! It's true, I remember the day I tested for BB very clearly. I showed up for training and my instructor just said, "You are testing for BB today!" That's it. His name was Sung Mok Ko, who passed at 10th Dan last year. He was a first generation Korean here in the US. He studied with Choi and who knows who else in Korea and Japan. I have Je do Kwan and Moo Duk Kwan patches and my style was very TSD like. Best!!
Haha wow, I couldn't imagine that happening. I guess if you're ready to be a black belt, then you should be ready to test at any time right? Wow to have a teacher coming direct from the source is pretty amazing, luck you. Id be interested to train in Moo duk kwan or soo bak do, just to see the similarities and differences.
@@SenseiIchi Thank you so much for a reply! After I passed the test, which included running out through the streets on December 30th in cold and icy Chicago and talking to the class about what the martial arts meant to me, Mr Ko took off the black belt he was wearing and tied it around my waist. I still wear that old tattered irreplaceable belt to this day when training. I have at least four other belts, but nothing feels the same as that old friend.
Holy cow that is an amazing way to earn a black belt! Sounds like a scene from a movie almost, I don't blame you not wanting to take that belt off. When I first earned my black belt, I slept with it around my waist. Always remember that day!
@just a niceguy I don't think he was your teacher. My knowledge of the Korean language is not that good, but I think these are two different people. SMK did Jidokwan and maybe Mudokwan, but never mentioned Hapkido. He did have a Korean friend of his visit one time who was trained in Hapkido. I remember thinking "If he got his hands on me, I was done." lol
I remember my Bb teat as He Stated. Many Masters from Korea present. I gave 200% . Did basic form 1- Bassai non stop giving all every move ringing wet uniform. I was wound so tight I think I may have hurt the ranking instructors I had to "Free fight at once". I don't know if that was usual but did what they asked. Remember looking dong when bowing to see feet turning brused. I never wore pads cause it slowed down and Telegraphed move. LOVED THEM DAYS.
Thank you, sir, for your history lesson. I've only met Mr. Norris (very briefly) a couple times, but I am a huge fan of Mr. Johnson, who is a mentor of my instructor, Joe Corley, and who has taught a few seminars for us when I was chief instructor at one of Mr. Corley's schools.
You got your black belt fast! It took me 7 years to get my black belt in Tang Soo Do from Duke Tirschel. I started when I was five and tested successfully at 12. I remember after we did our katas Mr. Norris, Mr. TIrschel, and Mr. Burnette said to remain standing at attention and left the room. They came back after what seemed like forever to see if we were still at attention. It turned out that they went to lunch and had been gone for nearly an hour. Not one of us had moved a muscle. I don't know if that's a normal part of the examination or not but I won't ever forget it.
I have been in the Arts since 1969. At most times, with the training and everything else we have been taught and been thru, I feel like we are a dying breed when it comes to the arts.
Sir, Thank you for sharing. Tomorrow, we will test 13 TKD students for Kukkiwon Black Belts. Reasonable people can debate the necessity of Korean sanctioning. What surprised and saddened me was the selfish timing, not the decision displayed by Chuck Norris. This day should have been focused on the students. Instead he made it about him. Clearly you were good with it and he became an amazing success. Can’t imagine doing that to my students students as they are walking into the dojang to test.
My instructor trained under CS Kim and Did training and tested under Grand Master Hwang Kee. I began training with him in 1985. My black belt test was pretty hard and long. I still adhere to that tradition. In 29 years of teaching I have given out 14 black belts. I do have to agree about it being a business thing with Korea. It's a shame, but that is how it is most of the time. My master ended up breaking away from CS. Kim in the early '90s. And I feel our training improved immensely
@@SenseiIchiRed belt testing is ridiculous. Nonsense. Belts are a scam. There should be 3 levels: novice, intermediate, & advanced. No belts. I've beaten most "black belts" I fought to a pulp. 😁
A day you'll never forget, Mine was 40+ years ago in front of Masters that barely spoke English. I KICKED ASS.😂.lol.i had to do best to represent my MASTER INSTRUCTOR Man BOK SONG. Any of those guys could smack a fly off your forehead with Back round house kick. DWEE TOLOW CHAGEE. ( HOW EVER SPELLED) CHERISH THOSE MEMORIES brother and Congratulations.
I remember the day it happened. We met at the Torrance school. Red belts and above were given the choice to stay with Korea or with Mr. Norris. The Chuck Norris system was a mixed martial style Mr. Norris created. We were unique, not Korean. Korean Tang Soo Do practitioners denounced us as not being Tang Soo Do. They were right. We were Chuck Norris system, the first mixed martial artists. Dennis has forgotten Bob Barrow, his instructor from white to red. Dennis and I fought together several times on Bob's Torrance school team. When our team competed we took home 95% of the tournament hardware. Thank you Bob Barrow.
Chuck Norris was criticised heavily for giving Black Belts to children who had only about a year in training. It seems that the business was most important over the art. And, to increase business get publicity. To quote P.T. Barnum: “I don't care what the newspapers say about me as long as they spell my name right.”
Established in 1974.Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa began his training with Chuck Norris in 1970. In 1974 he opened the Tarzana Karate Studio, then later moved to Thousand Oaks, to open the first T.O/Westlake Karate studio in 1987. His son, Justin Ichikawa (and T.O. Westlake head instructor), started his training when he was 3 years old in 1988. Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa earned his 9th Degree black belt in 2010, and Grandmaster Justin Ichikawa earned his 7th Degree black belt in 2015.
My journey was just as complex. I trained in Kajukembo, Shotokan, and Taekwondo. I was not always able to find a school near to me that shared the philosophies that I aspired toward. Rather than fast snap kick roundhouse kicks, I preferred high kicks with POWER. When I was in the Vietnam war there were always TKD Masters teaching at every airbase I was assingned to. They were, however, awarding Black Belts in 6 months. I did not feel that students could be qualified to test for Jo Kyo Nim at 6 months of training. I went a Shotokan school. I did finally find a Taekwondo school in my town being taught by a Kyo Bu Nim Black Belt. He was not happy with being passed over for his Sa Dan (4th Degree) so many times. He had started training at the same time as the Oh Dan (5th Degree BB) who had inherited the Do Jang from their Master Instructor. My Instructor did BRAK AWAY from The school that awarded My Kukkiwon sanctioned Black Belt. The result was that I earned my Il Dan and am certified in Seoul, Korea at the Kukkiwon. My Kyo Sa Nim Ee Dan allows me to train students up to one level before mine. I cannot train any student to their 2nd degree. I also cannot train a student to participate in the Olympics.
..who cares about tests! Ive been practicing 20yrs now and never cared about a ridiculous over expensive piece of cloth! Just bring it on for a real test!
Robd collector I care about tests. Give me something to work towards, gets me excited about something, makes me nervous. Good for you tho, are you still actively training?
I know a man who got his black belt in Japan, he was a white belt for about 3 years and then one day his instructor gave him a green belt, he was simply told "You are ready for this now", after a few years of being a green belt he was presented with his black belt. He said it was never anything formal and there were never testing cycles. You just trained and if the Master saw what he felt was the proper arc of learning and discipline you would be promoted. But all they had were White, Green, and Black belts.
Unfortunately, today’s USA karate requirements are a joke, from simple basics to advanced techniques. I started in ‘67 at one of Chuck Norris’s schools in Chula Vista, California. The only advertisement was large letters painted on a store-front window with KARATE written across it. Talk about bare cupboards. But the instructors, usually Red-belts, were awesome. I was there for less than a year, when I was called into service but, some of the best techniques that have followed me through different systems are worth executing to today. I truly miss those days!
This is always the case. Our family has operated a TSD organization for decades, my father was promoted to 10th Dan about five years ago (he started training in Korea in 1959 and continued all his life alongside his military career). We cut ties with Korea in 1991 for several reasons but one of them being the most common one: the door only swings one way, THEIR way. Fees, fees, fees, but promotions, certificates, and all else took forever to approve or recieve. Also, there's the common myth that "they're the best". They're not. The Koreans learned that very quickly with us. We have better fighters and more dedicated students and teachers. Also, a lot always git held up because of all the personal quarrels among themselves (the same people teaching and demanding courtesy and respect among peoples).
I am a martial artist as well, and I have went on to make my own school and am teaching my own style that is a combination of two styles that I have learned over 20 years of training and learning. I catch a lot of heck for it. I have been told that what I am doing is a dishonor to my teachers and the way of martial arts. Yet I don’t understand how.
Don't listen to that nonsense. Martial arts is an expression of your self and you take whatever you have learned and create whatever you want. Never let anyone decide or dictate how you live your life. Keep on keepin on! Tang Soo!
@@barrettokarate True talk. The moment you become a black belt you are expected to start exploring true knowledge starting from the most basic techniques. This enable you to fit techniques to situations and your physique. This is known as personal knowledge and it's the true path to self realization. This principle is general and it applies to all areas of human experience. When I replaced Shotokan Karate with Golf, I found myself on a similar journey.
This happened in Kang Duk Won as well, My instructors teacher Robert J Babich, decided not to join the TKD association at the time in the late 60s and early 70s and as a result, was no longer able to use the name. He decided to use the name Kwon Bup, simply because it was the name of a book his instructor gave him. I recently received my 3rd degree in Kwon Bup. Recently my instructor retired and although I know the whole system, will no longer be certified for higher ranking, but I don't care, I have the knowledge and that is what counts.
I tested before Raul Hernandez and Larry Rogers in"81" and again in "83" for 2nd black before Dick Terschell and a large panel of visiting black belts in Atlanta. I worked out for 11 years until I faded out of it when I could not seem to get a school going. I like that you have built an advanced program for black belts!
That sounds like quite the dais you've had to preform in front of . It is tough to get a school going that is for sure. Building that traction and gaining a following isn't easy. Thank you, our advanced program continues to change and grow to make this better, challenging and to create a better black belt.
@@SenseiIchi It was the very best testing performance I had ever achieved and at the time I never imagined I could ever drop out. Are you still part of the Chuck Norris system?
Awesome history lesson Sir!. Love to hear more recollections. I also earned my Black Belt in the 1970's as well. I earned mine under the Late Grand Master Sang Soo "Tiger" Kim in NYC who was a student of Hwang Kee. Things were much different in the 1970's. Classes were Hard, some might say brutal, 3/4 power contact in sparring (And you sparred every day), and unless your injury meant you were going to the hospital you continued practicing. And yes Black Belt testing was Pass/Fail and Sparring for your Black Belt test meant at least four matches. Two with Brown Belts and Two with Black Belts and you had better show that you wanted it. Oh and back then you waited anywhere from 8-12 months for your certificate to arrive from the Kukkiwon.
Thats great I got my black belt with Late Grand Master Pong Ki Kim from queens N.Y. . In my test I had judges Like Tiger Kim and his brother Byung Min Kim. Moo Duk Kwan
I can relate, my first. T k d teacher in Melbourne started teaching here as a red belt a ka brown belt. But had to go to Korea to get tested they made it , really hard for him
Our school is still old school. Color belts get a 30 day notice before testing, black belts get 6 months notice. No stripes, no pre-tests. If you fail a color belt you don’t test for a year. If you fail black belt you leave the school.
Wow this is amazing Sensei Ichi! I always wondered how and why, Master Chuck Norris had branched off, from the original, main and central Tang Soo Do organisation in South Korea! It is good to see that your father, Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa, was once graded for his initial black belt examination, by both master Pat Johnson, as well as Master Chuck Norris. Unfortunately such things, regarding politics, financial greed and social, ethical discord, are not only occurrences in Tang Soo Do. In our own Kyokushin Karate system, after our founder Sosai Oyama Masutatsu passed away, many of the senior branch chief instructors, began to bicker and dispute amongst themselves, who should succeed him, as the widely accepted head of Kyokushin Karate, world wide! Many chose to break away, forming their own organisation, to collect fees from dojos throughout the world, under their association. As your father mentioned, with us similarly, many Kyokushin Karate schools have severed their ties with Japan, the native motherland of our Kyokushin Karate. Given that like with Tang Soo Do in South Korea, Kyokushin Karate in Japan was also only interested in collecting grading fees, to issue out the belts, certificates, in exchange for monetary revenue, without actually examining the actual gradings world wide, despite them being filmed and sent to the assessing committee in Japan. Thus these days many Kyokushin Karate schools, operate autonomously, or in collaboration, with Kyokushin Karate groups, outside of Japan. As Master Dennis Ichikawa mentioned here in this video, many of us, myself included remember the first time we graded for our first degree black belt. Grading standards have become more academically organised, in terms of the assessing curriculum, also the refinement, polishing and perfectioning of the techniques, compared to its earlier years. Thank you for sharing this great interview of your father with us, yielding us an insight of how and why Master Chuck Norris, as well as Master Pat Johnson, decided to branch off, from the original South Korean, Tang Soo Do organisation. I hope all is well with you, your students and loved ones Sensei Ichi. Greetings from Melbourne, Australia 🇦🇺 ☺ ✌ 👍, as always. Osu! Juan.
A great story, thank you for sharing it. I myself was a part of C.S. Kim's ITF for a number of years, I found the politics manageable but somewhat annoying. My primary issue, as far as it went, was with how unrealistic the training was. It lacked any grappling and minimal realistic striking drills/training, it was not bad, but could use some improvement in its curriculum. I agree that having a solid black belt curriculum is extremely important. So long as it is not simply learning increasingly esoteric variations of the same drills and standing wrist locks and so on of course.
By the time you have your own students, in a lot of cases with TDK / Karate / TSD schools, is that the relationship that you have with your teacher has become a business one. We don't know what happened here. I have been through a similar "break up" between my friends and our sah bum nim many years ago. There probably was a bunch of issues that were bubbling the background for a while. In that situation, you do what's right for your business and your students. Some times people just grow in different directions.
All i know is my best friend's nephew was over his house recently. He's in Middle school, about 12 going on 13? We were in the yard on a nice day. I had heard before that he was a black belt. I was like "black belt already? How long's he been taking Karate?" "Oh, about 4 years.." So in the yard I was simply curious and nicely asked him to do a few moves a couple of kicks for me. Wow, he could barely execute a good Roundhouse kick w/ out losing his balance. I had heard that some schools just hand out black belts after the kid goes a few years and the parents pay enough money over that time etc.
Sensei Ichi very impressive about your dad. I study Korean Tang Soo Do. I started when I just turned 5 years old. I’m now 11. I just got my black belt 2 months ago. So it took me almost 6 years to get my black belt in Tang Soo Do. It’s very difficult to get a black belt in Tang Soo Do. You have to also know the academic parts. Basically learning the Korean language and the history. I am proud to be a Tang Soo So practitioner. My current goal is to get my 3rd degree before I graduate high school. I also have a black belt in TKD. Good luck to you maybe we will meet up on a conference someday. What dan are you?
@@kimuseni Thank you, I love my father he is one of the greatest men I know and I can only hope to be as great as him one day. Congratulations on achieving your Black belt that is a very great feeling ! Never stop training, a black belt is a white belt that never quit and a grandmaster is a black belt that never quit. If you ever see me at a Martial arts event be sure to come up and say hello! I am a 7th dan, started training at age 3.
@@kimuseni no offense but many took credit for teaching Master Norris in Korea. There were several Asst Instructors, CS Kim, CI Kim,Ki Yun Yi, Ki Yul Yu but on record Grandmaster Jae Chul Shin was the head instructor at Osan Air Base while Master Norris was there. My father was also there around the end of Master Norris deployment and after. Master Norris Dan# 2819 my fathers is 5845 under original Moo Duk Kwan.
@Karate Kid 916 no offense taken. Thanks for the info. My grandmaster is Moo Duk Kwan Pin # 475. His instructor in Korea was Master Se Jhoon Oh (Pin # 26). Master Oh was a student of Grandmaster Hwang Kee, Tang Soo Do's founder.
My Fiancee's son trains. It's $200 for a black belt, that does not include test fees. The Money goes to Grandmaster Lee, president of the Mudo Federation. When I tested for my black belt, it was $45. No political fees.
I don't know about your school. But I charge more than $200 for a black belt. But I pay $130 just for their belts. I get them from a very good company. They are very well made and they are embroidered very nicely. I base the cost of my testing on what it cost me to get the black belt and certificates. Plus I pay my examiners to sit on the board
I feel gaining a black belt inside three years is a sham. I trained nearly ten hard years to gain mine, competing at full contact and semi at international level, also kata competitions, along the way .Summer camps etc. Kyokushinkai. Hanshi Arneil was my examiner.
3 years nowadays would be a sham. But 50 years ago, those guys trained at least 6 hours a day 6 days a week. For 3 years. That adds up to 5 years of training these days. I got my black belt in 6 years, training twice a week, which I think is fair. But if anyone trains as much as they did back then, 3 years is more than enough time.
Chuck Norris teacher was my teacher. I don't blame him for breaking with him. I experienced things that weren't right with koreans. The teacher that I'm talking about is jae joon kim. I left him too...
Hmm... You have a video with Camarillo Shotokan's Sensei Shawn (the place where I started Martial Arts) and now this Tang Soo Do studio appears to be from T.O, Westlake. Something tells me you guys are close by.
hello sensei ichi, big fan of your channel! Just wondering what you think of the chuck norris ufaf system? Been reading a lot about it and wondering if you think just as good or practical as traditional tang soo do. i read that it has bjj and krav maga incorporated in it as well and wondering if studying that art over traditional tang so doo perhaps mixed in with bjj would be better. any thoughts or opinions from any experience you have with that system would be greatly appreciated. thanks a lot!
1974 -- Remembering our school (Bob Burbidge, Woodland Hills Tang Soo Do) visiting and training with Tarzana Karate (Tang Soo Do) Wood floor. Better learn to fall. Tang Soo!!
Great video on a turning point in TSD history in America! Clarification, please? There's an image of GM Jae Chul Shin from WTSDA at the start of the video but WTSDA didn't form until 1982. Wouldn't the organization in Korea that the testing letters been sent to have been Moo Duk Kwan; at the time, headed by GM Hwang Kee? In 1970, Jae Chul Shin would have been in America.
@@barrettokarate correct 100%. My father was GM Shins right hand and assisted in creating WTSDA. GM Shin tried his best to get Chuck there at the founding of WTSDA but he was unsuccessful. Chuck was over the politics of Korea by then and unfortunately it took my dad quite a few more yrs to figure this out. I'm not a random troll btw. Find me on FB n I'll gladly share some of the historical docs I have from the founding of WTSDA. No matter where you stand just train hard. Tang Soo!! Gm Ishikawa looks great BTW glad he's still at it.
I've been skinny my whole life, now age 68 July of 2021. I started Kyokushin in '68 just before high school. In my first month, I moved away from home and next door to my 2 favorite instructors. The school taught 1 1/2 hrs/day, 3 days/wk. Half of the training was standing around or doing worthless warmups. Not very worthwhile for survival. The other half was the usual standing in one place while punching and kicking which again wasn't very worthwhile for survival. But at their home, I trained 5 hrs/day 7 days/wk for 8 years, learning mostly pressure point fighting, ballistic strikes and one strike, one kill techniques. Because of my 35 hr/wk training, I excelled in ranks and won every fight. After paying $500 for my 3rd black belt tests, at a time when a 2 bedroom apartment was only $350 and I was struggling to pay rent, my head instructor, Steven Michael Senne, said he's not going to give me my 3rd black belt because he heard that I said if I wasn't going to get my black belt I was going to quit. Kyokushin was my life. It saved my life. I was going to be in it forever. But when I was looked down on from the people I admired most in the world, and was told they heard something I would have never said even on a bad day, and losing my rent utilities and food money for an entire month, I was so devastated that I quit and fell into a deep state of depression for a whole year. Steven and his 2 minion Master instructors bumped into me at the park and insulted me so much that I attacked them and beat the crap out of them. I then went on to study Kung Fu under Kam Yuen, Reseda CA, for 3 years, then 10 years of kickboxing under undefeated world champion Benny the jet Urquidez in Van Nuys CA. And studied Judo for 3 yrs from a friend at home. I built my own gym in my old age and now I still train 3 hrs/day from watching UA-cam videos. Always a bad taste in my mouth from my original Karate system.
Wow, that whole ordeal sounded so dumb. Why stress out the students who are in testing for black belt? Why make them choose between Korea and a certain instructor? If he had received the certificate from Korea why not just give those out after the test? Chuck Norris is weird. Why break away from the motherland of the art and the grandmasters over there? Its not just business. They don't have to see you test but trust their students who are instructors judgment. Keeping an art organized is important. Now we have all of these random organizations and things like Chuk Kuk Do.
MY I ask. What year did your father break off from Mr Norris? My instructor Master Lane began in 1980. We teach American Tang Soo Do, but he’s still active in the Chuck Norris System. Because what we teach is the older version though it’s really not up to date with why you see in the CNS today. From what I see we do much more of what you guys do, but I believe your dad was part of the NTC, and not UFAF correct? That would be wear we separate, but again very similar. I saw you doing a video in which you said you were talking a break. Good for you. It is important to do so from time to time. Take your time and come back strong, the martial arts need energy of gentlemen like you!
I want to say the influence of China from Japan. Also American TSD has implemented more outside arts into its system... Judo, jujitsu, Krav maga, Hapkido etc.
@@SenseiIchi The truth is that there were splits in the original Kwans over the unification of the Korean Taesoodo Association (renamed the Korean Taekwondo Association in 1965). Some of the Moo Do Kwan people converted to Taekwondo to be part of the unification, while others remained in the Soo Bahk Do Tang Soo Do organization with GM Hwang Kee.
I started TKD in my mid teens in the mid 80's. Talking to some people who train in TKD now, it seems like it has become lax. An instructor I spoke with a few years ago was surprised with the warm up techniques and kicking practices, saying she thought it was unnecessary but I disagree. The training pushed your body and made you better as you conquered your own challenges. I did not go through to black belt 3 below black before deciding to more practice at home to explore what best suits me without instructors pulling me in line for not being traditional. Black tip grading were always fascinating to observe.
1. I was very nervous just before my BB Test, I was never so happy to have something over with. 2. You said your test was not long, the is suggestive as I have seen some that are 24 hours long, ours are 2 hours.... 3. We have classes for BB's the issue is many people get the 1st degree and they are done and out of the percentage that stays many are gone after 2nd degree.
In Judo if you compete a lot, you gain enough points that you're notified of your promotion to shodan. Some test but most make black belt via competition.
Chuck Norris est une veritable encyclopedie vivante . Il possede le plus haut grade au monde 9 ou 10 Eme dan de Tang Soo Do . Respect a vous Maitre !!!
Chuck norris est vraiment génial. Je vais peut-être le rencontrer cette année! Si je le fais, je devrai en faire une vidéo pour poster sur ma chaîne, restez à l'écoute ... Merci pour vos commentaires!
I thought family members weren't allowed to watch black belt exams? My family wasn't allowed to. They weren't even allowed to watch my junior black belt exam.
One steps is when one student attacks another with one punch and the defender will create a defense routine against the punch. It teaches us how to block a strike, movement and counters. It also teaches how to follow up with fluid combinations, as well as sweeps, throws and takedowns. We do them with Kicks as well.
@@LucasVigor Yes! We have 3 steps as well. We do 4 attacks with single punches, then 3 step punching, then one step kicking and finally 3 step kicking.
Very interesting story, but the thumbnail was a little misleading for me. I train with the WTSDA, founded by Grandmaster Shin (the gentleman in the thumbnail). I felt it suggested that KCN Shin was the entity that Chuck Norris separated from, but in reality, KCN Shin had already left the MDK that the Korean Masters were running by 1973 and had "retired" from the martial arts until founding the WTSDA in 1982. Still, it was very interesting to hear.
They say the only thing wrong with Korean martial arts are the Koreans. Cool explanation, and having been through that a couple of times (5th Dan) I can relate, it killed my love of Taekwondo
@@peposo7 Sadly, from what I have witnessed, money talks. When I took my first Dan, all i needed was the time spent training between grades and to be simply good enough to progress. Then they began to see money could be made in the £1000s, you had to have attended this course and that course ( no different to a normal training session )register with this society and that association and all at a premium (IE, Basic first aid qualification, through a local authority would cost around £5 a head if you got say 10 people, through various associations it would be £100 )some just , invented to make money and then there was 2 a year, then 4 a year, then one a month.Being told we charge not enough for a lesson, I could go on and on as it sounds as if I am bitter, which I am not .My 6th dan was going to set me back somewhere near £600, which is why I never progressed. Saying that, I loved my time as a student and teacher, plus I got to meet some amazing people and some that I still call friends to this day
@@SenseiIchi So right, I loved my training at times with the Koreans and I learned a lot and was very privledged to travel and train in S Korea, but when as a 5th Dan, you got to a training session in S Korea and have a 2nd Dan teaching you a yellow belt lesson as if we were ignorant, its ridiculous, his face was a picture when he found out that a majority of grades were higher than he was and walked off away from his stage with a PA holding an umbrella so he didnt get sunburnt. :)
@@kevallison so it could be said that in that school instance, if you're interested in the martial/fighting skill attributes/concept, there is no need to go further a certain rank.
The US Tang Soo Do or now Soo Bak Do is the very best in TSD and trace their roots back to Grand Master Hwang Kee and his son. They are very good and had a school in Springfield, New Jersey, USA.
Very cool. I knew two of his Tang Soo Do Chodans in the 90s and I used to train with them. I taught one of them Aikido and exposed him to GoJu Ryu karate my style of Okinawan karate.
The old days were WAY better than how Karate is taught today
my father in law 9th Dan under Chuck Norris...89 still teaching.
What's his name?
hi there Tip Potter.. I have 45 years Kenpo and Escrima. 70 and still learning . Blessings!
I went to high school with Bob Burbridge....always a tough guy.rip
Sensei Ichi ...Tip Potter. Also went to high school with Bob Burbridge.
Any rank past third Dan is usually token award for devotion to the style / organisation.
Our school had a crisis in the mid 80's when we heard that in order to test for black belt we would have to fly to Korea and the cost was prohibitive. A lot of schools broke away at that time.
Woo that sounds just like my father's story. What path did you choose?
@@SenseiIchi I stuck with them, as the cost was far too much. I wound up moving to another state, and have had no formal training since the early '90s. I still consider it my core art, however. I recall a statement our instructor said when asked why he chose Tang Soo instead of a more 'realistic' method, he being California Highway Patrol officer. He said that if you wanted to learn to fight, you could go to (a notorious biker bar whose name I have forgotten) and slap the biggest fellow there. You will learn to fight very quickly. If you want to learn an art that you can do for the rest of your life, find a classical style like Tang Soo. At 58 it is still something I can do and enjoy!
@@claud1961 Hahah yes! That is fantastic advice, give that man a medal!
I'm happy to hear that you are still training in Tang Soo Do, where abouts are you living and training?
@@SenseiIchi Fairfield, Iowa. I train where I can! Out of 4 children, only 1 son has much of an interest, so we train together.
Claud Wolf that’s great you’re training with your son. My father and I have the strongest bond because he will forever be my teacher and mentor. Keep it going !
Although I trained in a different Martial Art, there was a major division after the Master died in Isshinryu Karate. Many in Okinawa went their own way. The son in law was granted Master and the son had bitter feelings towards his father. B4 his death, he gave his son his blessings. In the early 80's, we had to make the same choice as you between either the son in law, or the son. I chose the fathers son.
Much has changed also. We didnt have all.the colored belts in the 70's. White, green, brown and black. Now it's all the colored belts. I dont teach anymore due to medical problems. But, I never quit teaching the old ways I was taught. It was tough conditioning of arms, stomach, legs and shins.
I miss it. But kidney disease, open heart surgery and conquering colon cancer has taken its toll .
Take care sir ....
Wow that is quite the story. I hope the decision you made ended up being the best one.
I'm sorry to hear of your medical illnesses, I hope you are healthy and well.
Stay strong and thank you for commenting.
I had a very similar experience training in Goju-Ryu. Same belts with the exception of White to yellow, than green and so fourth. Heavy on the physical conditioning and sparring every class. Part of the reason I think martial arts gets such a bad rap now is because so many schools leave those two ingredients out of their curriculum. You can't really learn practical application without learning how to use it while in a similar situation like sparring.
@@nomadronin7361
When I originally trained in the USArmy, I had a sensei who was trained by the famed Hank Slomanski. As well as Master Shimabuku and his son in law.
The training was much different back then. Kotucky tai was always done. Makiwara was also done. 1 on 1 contact fighting to the take down. 1 on 2 as well. The other. Fighters always wore kendo armor, to limit injuries.
It was pretty brutal back in the 1970's. I started teaching at shodan. I also.studied Goju Ryu in the mid eighties to learn how Isshinryu was made, as well as Chito Ryu. Both chito and Isshinryu are so close, I feel one was copied . Just my opinion ...
As a young Marine Military Policeman stationed in Okinawa in the 70s, I used to stand post occasionally with an Okinawan Security Guard named Angi Uezu. When I got promoted to Corporal, I was moved to the Criminal Investigation Office, across the parking lot, and worked with an Okinawan Criminal Investigator named Takayoshi "Bill" Nagamine. I never studied under either, but I did visit Master Uezu at his dojo. I only stayed in Okinawa for one year and at the time didn't realize how close I was to the center of the traditional martial arts world. On one occasion I had to report to the Provost Marshal with "Bill" Nagamine. As we entered the building, we passed through the Desk Sergeant's area where the Security Guards were gathered for their shift. Angi Uezu was there and he and "Bill" Nagamine nodded to each other and he said to me, "Hello, Craig-san!"
Far too much politics in today's Martial Arts. Plus many systems have made Black Belt so easy that it's ridiculous. Basically it's if you have the promotion fee, you passed. I stopped asking for promotions long, long ago. What rank was Bruce Lee? Was he concerned with belt rank or learning from every system he came in contact with? Mr. Miyagi had it right when he said to Daniel "Belt only mean no need rope to hold up pants."
He had a tan belt from JC penny... You like?!
bruce lee was more of an actor than a martial artist, so who cares what he thinks, nothing wrong with having a belt system when done right, the only way to get away from politics is to get away from people, where's there's people there are politics
Remember that the only reason that belts turned black originally was due to the fact there was no laundry service. So all the colors encountered in training eventually stained the fabric of the uniform and belt. Eventually all those stains turned the belt black (blackish)
@@danielhaire6677 yes offf course but this is north america, a belt system is a great reward system that works very well when applied properly, if i don't want belts I'll do kickboxing or krav maga, my black belts are real black belts
Truth
I am a member of the IMA under GM Ki Yun Yi who was a former instructor at Osan AFB while GM Norris was training there. Thank you for sharing the history. Tang Soo!!
Thank you for watching and commenting!
I have basic TV. One channel plays 7 hours of Walker, Texas Ranger a day from 10 till' 5..❤ It actually got me thru 2 months of sobriety, assigned by my probation officer..💀🖤
Good for you. Keep it up, the answers are never at the bottom of a bottle. You got this!
1005 days sober…🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻
Love walker Texas ranger. Have the whole thing on DVD.
Politics in Martial Arts are stressful to deal with.
Very very stressful!
the reason i no longer teach
Yes they are. Especially for those of us who want to just train.
@OLD Beer Buzzard i was blessed in the facr that all of my martial arts senseis . Would respect your blackbelt even if you come from a different system. Their thought process was you are more than able to grasp the basics of a system. You would still be trained by lower belts which can be humbling, but it is all about learning , and sharing with one another. Martial arts all of it is correlated, despite all of the BS some of these teachers blow up our ass about their system being better. Blah blah blah!
@@who301tent415 Exactly!
This is awesome! I really enjoy the history examination of the arts by those who were a part of it. Thanks for sharing this!
Thank you, there is more to come!!
I liked your story! It's true, I remember the day I tested for BB very clearly. I showed up for training and my instructor just said, "You are testing for BB today!" That's it. His name was Sung Mok Ko, who passed at 10th Dan last year. He was a first generation Korean here in the US. He studied with Choi and who knows who else in Korea and Japan. I have Je do Kwan and Moo Duk Kwan patches and my style was very TSD like. Best!!
Haha wow, I couldn't imagine that happening. I guess if you're ready to be a black belt, then you should be ready to test at any time right?
Wow to have a teacher coming direct from the source is pretty amazing, luck you. Id be interested to train in Moo duk kwan or soo bak do, just to see the similarities and differences.
@@SenseiIchi Thank you so much for a reply! After I passed the test, which included running out through the streets on December 30th in cold and icy Chicago and talking to the class about what the martial arts meant to me, Mr Ko took off the black belt he was wearing and tied it around my waist. I still wear that old tattered irreplaceable belt to this day when training. I have at least four other belts, but nothing feels the same as that old friend.
Holy cow that is an amazing way to earn a black belt! Sounds like a scene from a movie almost, I don't blame you not wanting to take that belt off. When I first earned my black belt, I slept with it around my waist. Always remember that day!
@just a niceguy I don't think he was your teacher. My knowledge of the Korean language is not that good, but I think these are two different people. SMK did Jidokwan and maybe Mudokwan, but never mentioned Hapkido. He did have a Korean friend of his visit one time who was trained in Hapkido. I remember thinking "If he got his hands on me, I was done." lol
I remember my Bb teat as He Stated. Many Masters from Korea present. I gave 200% . Did basic form 1- Bassai non stop giving all every move ringing wet uniform. I was wound so tight I think I may have hurt the ranking instructors I had to "Free fight at once". I don't know if that was usual but did what they asked. Remember looking dong when bowing to see feet turning brused. I never wore pads cause it slowed down and Telegraphed move. LOVED THEM DAYS.
Thank you, sir, for your history lesson. I've only met Mr. Norris (very briefly) a couple times, but I am a huge fan of Mr. Johnson, who is a mentor of my instructor, Joe Corley, and who has taught a few seminars for us when I was chief instructor at one of Mr. Corley's schools.
Chuck Norris has always been an independent entity. There's a cool Chuck Norris joke there that my morning brain can't figure out...
Chuck norris IS the independent entity
You got your black belt fast! It took me 7 years to get my black belt in Tang Soo Do from Duke Tirschel. I started when I was five and tested successfully at 12. I remember after we did our katas Mr. Norris, Mr. TIrschel, and Mr. Burnette said to remain standing at attention and left the room. They came back after what seemed like forever to see if we were still at attention. It turned out that they went to lunch and had been gone for nearly an hour. Not one of us had moved a muscle. I don't know if that's a normal part of the examination or not but I won't ever forget it.
I have been in the Arts since 1969. At most times, with the training and everything else we have been taught and been thru, I feel like we are a dying breed when it comes to the arts.
Sir, Thank you for sharing. Tomorrow, we will test 13 TKD students for Kukkiwon Black Belts. Reasonable people can debate the necessity of Korean sanctioning. What surprised and saddened me was the selfish timing, not the decision displayed by Chuck Norris. This day should have been focused on the students. Instead he made it about him. Clearly you were good with it and he became an amazing success. Can’t imagine doing that to my students students as they are walking into the dojang to test.
That and a lack of explanation as to exactly why he had decided to break with the headquarters in Korea.
My instructor trained under CS Kim and Did training and tested under Grand Master Hwang Kee.
I began training with him in 1985. My black belt test was pretty hard and long. I still adhere to that tradition. In 29 years of teaching I have given out 14 black belts.
I do have to agree about it being a business thing with Korea. It's a shame, but that is how it is most of the time.
My master ended up breaking away from CS. Kim in the early '90s. And I feel our training improved immensely
I love the history you shared. While most black belt tests are special. Your red belt test was historic.
Thank you!
@@SenseiIchiRed belt testing is ridiculous. Nonsense. Belts are a scam. There should be 3 levels: novice, intermediate, & advanced. No belts. I've beaten most "black belts" I fought to a pulp. 😁
The day I tested and received my black belt in Tang soo Do Moo duk Kwan is one of the happiest days in my life. Even if it’s 25 years ago.
A day you'll never forget, Mine was 40+ years ago in front of Masters that barely spoke English. I KICKED ASS.😂.lol.i had to do best to represent my MASTER INSTRUCTOR Man BOK SONG. Any of those guys could smack a fly off your forehead with Back round house kick. DWEE TOLOW CHAGEE. ( HOW EVER SPELLED) CHERISH THOSE MEMORIES brother and Congratulations.
This man makes a very important point about the Black Belt he said it was “the Beginning of my Journey”, not the end as far too many people believe.
Martial arts is a journey, not a destination.
I remember the day it happened. We met at the Torrance school. Red belts and above were given the choice to stay with Korea or with Mr. Norris.
The Chuck Norris system was a mixed martial style Mr. Norris created. We were unique, not Korean.
Korean Tang Soo Do practitioners denounced us as not being Tang Soo Do. They were right. We were Chuck Norris system, the first mixed martial artists.
Dennis has forgotten Bob Barrow, his instructor from white to red. Dennis and I fought together several times on Bob's Torrance school team. When our team competed we took home 95% of the tournament hardware. Thank you Bob Barrow.
Chuck Norris tested for his 4th Dan in 1970 at the club I belonged to in Wyandotte, Michigan.
Chuck Norris was criticised heavily for giving Black Belts to children who had only about a year in training. It seems that the business was most important over the art. And, to increase business get publicity. To quote P.T. Barnum:
“I don't care what the newspapers say about me as long as they spell my name right.”
good to know - paid for that cheap rug on his head
Shocking.
Yeah, he franchised out like Mc Donald's.
My buddy said to never join a dojo that’s part of a corporate chain of dojos
He should be critisized for giving belts to kids with only a years training . He started the Mcdojo schools
This sort of thing happened to me shortly after my 2nd dan black belt test. Big ego's + business interests don't usually mix well.
Established in 1974.Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa began his training with Chuck Norris in 1970. In 1974 he opened the Tarzana Karate Studio, then later moved to Thousand Oaks, to open the first T.O/Westlake Karate studio in 1987. His son, Justin Ichikawa (and T.O. Westlake head instructor), started his training when he was 3 years old in 1988. Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa earned his 9th Degree black belt in 2010, and Grandmaster Justin Ichikawa earned his 7th Degree black belt in 2015.
This is a good thing. I like the old way. Thanks for sharing this video. I love you Chuck Norris and Gena. 💗😍👊💙
My journey was just as complex. I trained in Kajukembo, Shotokan, and Taekwondo. I was not always able to find a school near to me that shared the philosophies that I aspired toward. Rather than fast snap kick roundhouse kicks, I preferred high kicks with POWER. When I was in the Vietnam war there were always TKD Masters teaching at every airbase I was assingned to. They were, however, awarding Black Belts in 6 months. I did not feel that students could be qualified to test for Jo Kyo Nim at 6 months of training. I went a Shotokan school.
I did finally find a Taekwondo school in my town being taught by a Kyo Bu Nim Black Belt. He was not happy with being passed over for his Sa Dan (4th Degree) so many times. He had started training at the same time as the Oh Dan (5th Degree BB) who had inherited the Do Jang from their Master Instructor. My Instructor did BRAK AWAY from The school that awarded My Kukkiwon sanctioned Black Belt.
The result was that I earned my Il Dan and am certified in Seoul, Korea at the Kukkiwon. My Kyo Sa Nim Ee Dan allows me to train students up to one level before mine. I cannot train any student to their 2nd degree. I also cannot train a student to participate in the Olympics.
..who cares about tests! Ive been practicing 20yrs now and never cared about a ridiculous over expensive piece of cloth! Just bring it on for a real test!
Robd collector I care about tests. Give me something to work towards, gets me excited about something, makes me nervous. Good for you tho, are you still actively training?
@@SenseiIchi , maybe the guy who isn't bothered about tests is more focused on self improvement and drives his own motivation to a higher standard.
Rowdy Yates there are many roads up the mountain.
@@SenseiIchi , that mountain is life.
TEST ARE BASE ON RULES !!!! THERE ARE NO RULES IN THE STREETS.!!!!.😎🙏👍📚📖📚...
I know a man who got his black belt in Japan, he was a white belt for about 3 years and then one day his instructor gave him a green belt, he was simply told "You are ready for this now", after a few years of being a green belt he was presented with his black belt. He said it was never anything formal and there were never testing cycles. You just trained and if the Master saw what he felt was the proper arc of learning and discipline you would be promoted. But all they had were White, Green, and Black belts.
Unfortunately, today’s USA karate requirements are a joke, from simple basics to advanced techniques. I started in ‘67 at one of Chuck Norris’s schools in Chula Vista, California. The only advertisement was large letters painted on a store-front window with KARATE written across it. Talk about bare cupboards. But the instructors, usually Red-belts, were awesome. I was there for less than a year, when I was called into service but, some of the best techniques that have followed me through different systems are worth executing to today. I truly miss those days!
This is always the case. Our family has operated a TSD organization for decades, my father was promoted to 10th Dan about five years ago (he started training in Korea in 1959 and continued all his life alongside his military career). We cut ties with Korea in 1991 for several reasons but one of them being the most common one: the door only swings one way, THEIR way. Fees, fees, fees, but promotions, certificates, and all else took forever to approve or recieve. Also, there's the common myth that "they're the best". They're not. The Koreans learned that very quickly with us. We have better fighters and more dedicated students and teachers. Also, a lot always git held up because of all the personal quarrels among themselves (the same people teaching and demanding courtesy and respect among peoples).
Jae Joon Kim tested every two months. The fee was about $30...
Very fast to earn your black belt.
I am a martial artist as well, and I have went on to make my own school and am teaching my own style that is a combination of two styles that I have learned over 20 years of training and learning. I catch a lot of heck for it. I have been told that what I am doing is a dishonor to my teachers and the way of martial arts. Yet I don’t understand how.
Don't listen to that nonsense. Martial arts is an expression of your self and you take whatever you have learned and create whatever you want. Never let anyone decide or dictate how you live your life. Keep on keepin on! Tang Soo!
@@barrettokarate True talk. The moment you become a black belt you are expected to start exploring true knowledge starting from the most basic techniques. This enable you to fit techniques to situations and your physique. This is known as personal knowledge and it's the true path to self realization. This principle is general and it applies to all areas of human experience. When I replaced Shotokan Karate with Golf, I found myself on a similar journey.
This happened in Kang Duk Won as well, My instructors teacher Robert J Babich, decided not to join the TKD association at the time in the late 60s and early 70s and as a result, was no longer able to use the name. He decided to use the name Kwon Bup, simply because it was the name of a book his instructor gave him. I recently received my 3rd degree in Kwon Bup. Recently my instructor retired and although I know the whole system, will no longer be certified for higher ranking, but I don't care, I have the knowledge and that is what counts.
Just wanna say "Thanks, too Chuck for breaking all them boards"
chuck norris doesnt need korea, korea needs chuck norris
Happens. A lot of politics in Martial Arts... pretty common.
Great story,I really enjoyed listening how things were back then
Why thank you, I'll tell my padre you enjoyed it. He really likes hearing that people actually like and care about his old stories. Want more?!
This man is blessed by me never a step out of line for you
I tested before Raul Hernandez and Larry Rogers in"81" and again in "83" for 2nd black before Dick Terschell and a large panel of visiting black belts in Atlanta. I worked out for 11 years until I faded out of it when I could not seem to get a school going. I like that you have built an advanced program for black belts!
That sounds like quite the dais you've had to preform in front of .
It is tough to get a school going that is for sure. Building that traction and gaining a following isn't easy.
Thank you, our advanced program continues to change and grow to make this better, challenging and to create a better black belt.
@@SenseiIchi It was the very best testing performance I had ever achieved and at the time I never imagined I could ever drop out. Are you still part of the Chuck Norris system?
We are not no.
The declaration of independence finally happened with Chuck!!! Kudos!!!LOL
I trained with Sea Choi a Hapkido master in 1970. He had a trophy from Chuck Norris that said best instructor 1968.
hahah wow, that is quite the award to receive from chuck.
@@SenseiIchi
Bon Soo Han and Sea Choi were good friends.
Jun Chun trained with Sea Choi.
Bon Soo Han is a legend !
Hey man, I think I know you from a forum back in the day. Were you on SCBR?
Awesome history lesson Sir!. Love to hear more recollections. I also earned my Black Belt in the 1970's as well. I earned mine under the Late Grand Master Sang Soo "Tiger" Kim in NYC who was a student of Hwang Kee. Things were much different in the 1970's. Classes were Hard, some might say brutal, 3/4 power contact in sparring (And you sparred every day), and unless your injury meant you were going to the hospital you continued practicing. And yes Black Belt testing was Pass/Fail and Sparring for your Black Belt test meant at least four matches. Two with Brown Belts and Two with Black Belts and you had better show that you wanted it. Oh and back then you waited anywhere from 8-12 months for your certificate to arrive from the Kukkiwon.
Thats great I got my black belt with Late Grand Master Pong Ki Kim from queens N.Y. . In my test I had judges Like Tiger Kim and his brother Byung Min Kim. Moo Duk Kwan
I can relate, my first. T k d teacher in Melbourne started teaching here as a red belt a ka brown belt. But had to go to Korea to get tested they made it , really hard for him
Jack Rozinsky?
@ yes
Chuck norris probably doesn't know it but jae joon kim and his sons talked about him behind his back for that......
Our school is still old school. Color belts get a 30 day notice before testing, black belts get 6 months notice. No stripes, no pre-tests. If you fail a color belt you don’t test for a year. If you fail black belt you leave the school.
I was awarded my black belt last week. 23 years after I started taekwondo! My instructor does not hand them out to just anyone!
Congratulations ! That is no joke a serious well earned rank. You must be an exceptional black belt after 23 years of training.
Sensei Ichi - Well… I don’t know about that, but my instructor seems to think so.
You must trust in that. You can't go wrong.
Congrats
Wow this is amazing Sensei Ichi! I always wondered how and why, Master Chuck Norris had branched off, from the original, main and central Tang Soo Do organisation in South Korea! It is good to see that your father, Grandmaster Dennis Ichikawa, was once graded for his initial black belt examination, by both master Pat Johnson, as well as Master Chuck Norris. Unfortunately such things, regarding politics, financial greed and social, ethical discord, are not only occurrences in Tang Soo Do.
In our own Kyokushin Karate system, after our founder Sosai Oyama Masutatsu passed away, many of the senior branch chief instructors, began to bicker and dispute amongst themselves, who should succeed him, as the widely accepted head of Kyokushin Karate, world wide!
Many chose to break away, forming their own organisation, to collect fees from dojos throughout the world, under their association. As your father mentioned, with us similarly, many Kyokushin Karate schools have severed their ties with Japan, the native motherland of our Kyokushin Karate. Given that like with Tang Soo Do in South Korea, Kyokushin Karate in Japan was also only interested in collecting grading fees, to issue out the belts, certificates, in exchange for monetary revenue, without actually examining the actual gradings world wide, despite them being filmed and sent to the assessing committee in Japan.
Thus these days many Kyokushin Karate schools, operate autonomously, or in collaboration, with Kyokushin Karate groups, outside of Japan. As Master Dennis Ichikawa mentioned here in this video, many of us, myself included remember the first time we graded for our first degree black belt. Grading standards have become more academically organised, in terms of the assessing curriculum, also the refinement, polishing and perfectioning of the techniques, compared to its earlier years.
Thank you for sharing this great interview of your father with us, yielding us an insight of how and why Master Chuck Norris, as well as Master Pat Johnson, decided to branch off, from the original South Korean, Tang Soo Do organisation. I hope all is well with you, your students and loved ones Sensei Ichi. Greetings from Melbourne, Australia 🇦🇺 ☺ ✌ 👍, as always. Osu! Juan.
A great story, thank you for sharing it. I myself was a part of C.S. Kim's ITF for a number of years, I found the politics manageable but somewhat annoying. My primary issue, as far as it went, was with how unrealistic the training was. It lacked any grappling and minimal realistic striking drills/training, it was not bad, but could use some improvement in its curriculum. I agree that having a solid black belt curriculum is extremely important. So long as it is not simply learning increasingly esoteric variations of the same drills and standing wrist locks and so on of course.
I also trained under C.S. Kim for about 15 years.
Chuck Norris draws a line in the sand, do you stay with Chuck or go with Korea?
Don't you mean the sand creep up, and drew itself behind Chuck Norris? :)
Ed Lam hahahah classic!
You remain loyal to the one who trained you 🐯
@@sonnygallo5662 No matter what?
By the time you have your own students, in a lot of cases with TDK / Karate / TSD schools, is that the relationship that you have with your teacher has become a business one. We don't know what happened here. I have been through a similar "break up" between my friends and our sah bum nim many years ago. There probably was a bunch of issues that were bubbling the background for a while. In that situation, you do what's right for your business and your students. Some times people just grow in different directions.
Having a black belt curriculum is so important. Excellent decision.
Very very important.
@@SenseiIchi"Important" for what? For making money! That's it.😂
You always passed jae joon kim's test. Nobody failed. Kim's karate Academy was the most talked about school in all of detroit.....in a bad way.
All i know is my best friend's nephew was over his house recently. He's in Middle school, about 12 going on 13? We were in the yard on a nice day. I had heard before that he was a black belt. I was like "black belt already? How long's he been taking Karate?" "Oh, about 4 years.." So in the yard I was simply curious and nicely asked him to do a few moves a couple of kicks for me. Wow, he could barely execute a good Roundhouse kick w/ out losing his balance. I had heard that some schools just hand out black belts after the kid goes a few years and the parents pay enough money over that time etc.
@@brianmucha6426 That is exactly how it was with jae joon kim. Kim's Karate Academy. They are located in brandon florida now...
@@brianmucha6426 , they will be raffling them next Brian. It's become a joke with some styles.
@@Steaks652 No it has not become a joke, It has been a joke for the last 40 years with these koreans.
Thank you for sharing. Tang soo...
I’m a 1st degree black belt in Tang Soo Do. My grandmaster is C.I. Kim. Chuck Norris was a student of my grandmaster.
That is beyond cool! I'm really jealous.
Sensei Ichi very impressive about your dad. I study Korean Tang Soo Do. I started when I just turned 5 years old. I’m now 11. I just got my black belt 2 months ago. So it took me almost 6 years to get my black belt in Tang Soo Do. It’s very difficult to get a black belt in Tang Soo Do. You have to also know the academic parts. Basically learning the Korean language and the history. I am proud to be a Tang Soo So practitioner. My current goal is to get my 3rd degree before I graduate high school. I also have a black belt in TKD. Good luck to you maybe we will meet up on a conference someday. What dan are you?
@@kimuseni Thank you, I love my father he is one of the greatest men I know and I can only hope to be as great as him one day.
Congratulations on achieving your Black belt that is a very great feeling ! Never stop training, a black belt is a white belt that never quit and a grandmaster is a black belt that never quit.
If you ever see me at a Martial arts event be sure to come up and say hello!
I am a 7th dan, started training at age 3.
@@kimuseni no offense but many took credit for teaching Master Norris in Korea. There were several Asst Instructors, CS Kim, CI Kim,Ki Yun Yi, Ki Yul Yu but on record Grandmaster Jae Chul Shin was the head instructor at Osan Air Base while Master Norris was there. My father was also there around the end of Master Norris deployment and after. Master Norris Dan# 2819 my fathers is 5845 under original Moo Duk Kwan.
@Karate Kid 916 no offense taken. Thanks for the info. My grandmaster is Moo Duk Kwan Pin # 475. His instructor in Korea was Master Se Jhoon Oh (Pin # 26). Master Oh was a student of Grandmaster Hwang Kee, Tang Soo Do's founder.
My Fiancee's son trains. It's $200 for a black belt, that does not include test fees. The Money goes to Grandmaster Lee, president of the Mudo Federation. When I tested for my black belt, it was $45. No political fees.
I don't know about your school. But I charge more than $200 for a black belt. But I pay $130 just for their belts. I get them from a very good company. They are very well made and they are embroidered very nicely. I base the cost of my testing on what it cost me to get the black belt and certificates. Plus I pay my examiners to sit on the board
@@TSD972 The belt must be made out of Gold.
I hated the politics too when I was taking martial arts. Wish it was possible to keep it pure from any politics
WOW!!!! This is why Chuck NORRIS is so respected in the Martial Arts community!!!!!!
Are you with ME or are you with Korea?!!!!!!?
You don't tell Chuck Norris what to do. You mail him a letter and ask him what you can do for him.🙃
I feel gaining a black belt inside three years is a sham. I trained nearly ten hard years to gain mine, competing at full contact and semi at international level, also kata competitions, along the way .Summer camps etc. Kyokushinkai. Hanshi Arneil was my examiner.
I feel like the tobacco industry is a sham too.
3 years nowadays would be a sham. But 50 years ago, those guys trained at least 6 hours a day 6 days a week. For 3 years. That adds up to 5 years of training these days. I got my black belt in 6 years, training twice a week, which I think is fair. But if anyone trains as much as they did back then, 3 years is more than enough time.
Spot on!!!!
@@spockvskhan4561 8 years for my first dahn in Tae Kwon Do. And it was a 3 hour exam PLUS a one hour physical conditioning test.
Doesn't Steve Arneil and Steve Morris have beef with one another? Morris rejected all karate and said its useless while saying his method is better
Chuck Norris teacher was my teacher. I don't blame him for breaking with him. I experienced things that weren't right with koreans. The teacher that I'm talking about is jae joon kim. I left him too...
What was issue? People keep talking about politics. What particular issue was it?
Always follow Chuck Norris!!!!!!🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲🇺🇲
Mr.Norris to his credit besides being 1 of the all time premier martial artists is also a John Wayne American.
True true
we did something similar in our dojo when ISKF split from JKA. About 2/3 went with JKA
Who did you go with?
Osu! Ichi Sensei, I chose to go with JKA. Our head sensei was JKA, I respected him and I felt loyalty to him.
Hmm... You have a video with Camarillo Shotokan's Sensei Shawn (the place where I started Martial Arts) and now this Tang Soo Do studio appears to be from T.O, Westlake. Something tells me you guys are close by.
We are, we are.
Kudos
Awesome stuff
That was a very smart move that Norris made in leaving jae joon kim.....
Anytime the original is ignored the new always suffers
hello sensei ichi, big fan of your channel! Just wondering what you think of the chuck norris ufaf system? Been reading a lot about it and wondering if you think just as good or practical as traditional tang soo do. i read that it has bjj and krav maga incorporated in it as well and wondering if studying that art over traditional tang so doo perhaps mixed in with bjj would be better. any thoughts or opinions from any experience you have with that system would be greatly appreciated. thanks a lot!
Hi..what year did you achieve your black belt, and was this at the studio on Hawthorne Blvd?
I started in that studio in 1973..
My father earned his black belt in 1973, the studio was in Sherman oaks on Ventura Blvd.
By Presidential decree every time Chuck Norris trims his beard the whiskers are gathered and buried at Arlington cemetery with full honors
1974 -- Remembering our school (Bob Burbidge, Woodland Hills Tang Soo Do) visiting and training with Tarzana Karate (Tang Soo Do) Wood floor. Better learn to fall. Tang Soo!!
Great video on a turning point in TSD history in America!
Clarification, please? There's an image of GM Jae Chul Shin from WTSDA at the start of the video but WTSDA didn't form until 1982. Wouldn't the organization in Korea that the testing letters been sent to have been Moo Duk Kwan; at the time, headed by GM Hwang Kee? In 1970, Jae Chul Shin would have been in America.
That!
@@barrettokarate correct 100%. My father was GM Shins right hand and assisted in creating WTSDA. GM Shin tried his best to get Chuck there at the founding of WTSDA but he was unsuccessful. Chuck was over the politics of Korea by then and unfortunately it took my dad quite a few more yrs to figure this out. I'm not a random troll btw. Find me on FB n I'll gladly share some of the historical docs I have from the founding of WTSDA. No matter where you stand just train hard. Tang Soo!! Gm Ishikawa looks great BTW glad he's still at it.
Much Respect
With all do respect but im confused? My tang soo do school didn't have black belts but instead have midnight blue belts....?
I've been skinny my whole life, now age 68 July of 2021. I started Kyokushin in '68 just before high school. In my first month, I moved away from home and next door to my 2 favorite instructors. The school taught 1 1/2 hrs/day, 3 days/wk. Half of the training was standing around or doing worthless warmups. Not very worthwhile for survival. The other half was the usual standing in one place while punching and kicking which again wasn't very worthwhile for survival. But at their home, I trained 5 hrs/day 7 days/wk for 8 years, learning mostly pressure point fighting, ballistic strikes and one strike, one kill techniques. Because of my 35 hr/wk training, I excelled in ranks and won every fight. After paying $500 for my 3rd black belt tests, at a time when a 2 bedroom apartment was only $350 and I was struggling to pay rent, my head instructor, Steven Michael Senne, said he's not going to give me my 3rd black belt because he heard that I said if I wasn't going to get my black belt I was going to quit. Kyokushin was my life. It saved my life. I was going to be in it forever. But when I was looked down on from the people I admired most in the world, and was told they heard something I would have never said even on a bad day, and losing my rent utilities and food money for an entire month, I was so devastated that I quit and fell into a deep state of depression for a whole year. Steven and his 2 minion Master instructors bumped into me at the park and insulted me so much that I attacked them and beat the crap out of them. I then went on to study Kung Fu under Kam Yuen, Reseda CA, for 3 years, then 10 years of kickboxing under undefeated world champion Benny the jet Urquidez in Van Nuys CA. And studied Judo for 3 yrs from a friend at home. I built my own gym in my old age and now I still train 3 hrs/day from watching UA-cam videos. Always a bad taste in my mouth from my original Karate system.
My good friend is Mr.Norris’ Black Belt #2!
Wow, that whole ordeal sounded so dumb. Why stress out the students who are in testing for black belt? Why make them choose between Korea and a certain instructor? If he had received the certificate from Korea why not just give those out after the test?
Chuck Norris is weird. Why break away from the motherland of the art and the grandmasters over there? Its not just business. They don't have to see you test but trust their students who are instructors judgment. Keeping an art organized is important. Now we have all of these random organizations and things like Chuk Kuk Do.
@@andersd8956 Ya but say draw a line in the sand at TESTING and make a dramatic thing and cause people to have that kind of anxiety is so petty.
MY I ask. What year did your father break off from Mr Norris? My instructor Master Lane began in 1980. We teach American Tang Soo Do, but he’s still active in the Chuck Norris System. Because what we teach is the older version though it’s really not up to date with why you see in the CNS today. From what I see we do much more of what you guys do, but I believe your dad was part of the NTC, and not UFAF correct? That would be wear we separate, but again very similar.
I saw you doing a video in which you said you were talking a break. Good for you. It is important to do so from time to time. Take your time and come back strong, the martial arts need energy of gentlemen like you!
We are a Korean Tang so Doo school, what is the difference between American and Korean Tang so do ?
I want to say the influence of China from Japan. Also American TSD has implemented more outside arts into its system... Judo, jujitsu, Krav maga, Hapkido etc.
@@SenseiIchi The truth is that there were splits in the original Kwans over the unification of the Korean Taesoodo Association (renamed the Korean Taekwondo Association in 1965). Some of the Moo Do Kwan people converted to Taekwondo to be part of the unification, while others remained in the Soo Bahk Do Tang Soo Do organization with GM Hwang Kee.
The hardest/best day of my life was the day I tested for my black belt
What's the difference between American tang soo do and moo duk kwan tang soo do? Or is it the same thing?
Great story, did he train with Ron Pohnel who teaches and competes in Hawaii? He's still active and knocking on 70 years of age.
Very interesting story. I know there is always more to it. But I value the narrative
Thank you? There is always more to every story, my father is just telling it from his perspective on the day of his test, many moons ago...
When chuck norris cut ties with korea, he cut the land so there's north and south.
I thought in dangsu do you were referred to as Sabom nim not Sensei.
Hey did you do your black belt test with Kang UK Lee? He is Dan Number 70. I ask because he made my style of tang soo do
1973.. few years ago.... time flies
I started TKD in my mid teens in the mid 80's. Talking to some people who train in TKD now, it seems like it has become lax. An instructor I spoke with a few years ago was surprised with the warm up techniques and kicking practices, saying she thought it was unnecessary but I disagree. The training pushed your body and made you better as you conquered your own challenges. I did not go through to black belt 3 below black before deciding to more practice at home to explore what best suits me without instructors pulling me in line for not being traditional.
Black tip grading were always fascinating to observe.
1. I was very nervous just before my BB Test, I was never so happy to have something over with.
2. You said your test was not long, the is suggestive as I have seen some that are 24 hours long, ours are 2 hours....
3. We have classes for BB's the issue is many people get the 1st degree and they are done and out of the percentage that stays many are gone after 2nd degree.
In Judo if you compete a lot, you gain enough points that you're notified of your promotion to shodan. Some test but most make black belt via competition.
Chuck Norris est une veritable encyclopedie vivante . Il possede le plus haut grade au monde 9 ou 10 Eme dan de Tang Soo Do . Respect a vous Maitre !!!
Chuck norris est vraiment génial. Je vais peut-être le rencontrer cette année! Si je le fais, je devrai en faire une vidéo pour poster sur ma chaîne, restez à l'écoute ... Merci pour vos commentaires!
I thought family members weren't allowed to watch black belt exams? My family wasn't allowed to. They weren't even allowed to watch my junior black belt exam.
What are "one-steps"? Thanks.
One steps is when one student attacks another with one punch and the defender will create a defense routine against the punch. It teaches us how to block a strike, movement and counters. It also teaches how to follow up with fluid combinations, as well as sweeps, throws and takedowns. We do them with Kicks as well.
@@LucasVigor Yes! We have 3 steps as well. We do 4 attacks with single punches, then 3 step punching, then one step kicking and finally 3 step kicking.
Lucas Vigor we had those in Taekwondo three-step fighting.
Very interesting story, but the thumbnail was a little misleading for me. I train with the WTSDA, founded by Grandmaster Shin (the gentleman in the thumbnail). I felt it suggested that KCN Shin was the entity that Chuck Norris separated from, but in reality, KCN Shin had already left the MDK that the Korean Masters were running by 1973 and had "retired" from the martial arts until founding the WTSDA in 1982. Still, it was very interesting to hear.
Agreed, i found the thumbnail to also be a clickbait. At least there wasn't a personal attack in the video Towards Grandmaster Shin
They say the only thing wrong with Korean martial arts are the Koreans. Cool explanation, and having been through that a couple of times (5th Dan) I can relate, it killed my love of Taekwondo
What do you mean? I thought they were very strict with their training(generally speaking).
Without the Koreans, they wouldn't have the art unfortunately. Thank you, I'll be having my father tell more stories like this. So get ready!!
@@peposo7 Sadly, from what I have witnessed, money talks. When I took my first Dan, all i needed was the time spent training between grades and to be simply good enough to progress. Then they began to see money could be made in the £1000s, you had to have attended this course and that course ( no different to a normal training session )register with this society and that association and all at a premium (IE, Basic first aid qualification, through a local authority would cost around £5 a head if you got say 10 people, through various associations it would be £100 )some just , invented to make money and then there was 2 a year, then 4 a year, then one a month.Being told we charge not enough for a lesson, I could go on and on as it sounds as if I am bitter, which I am not .My 6th dan was going to set me back somewhere near £600, which is why I never progressed. Saying that, I loved my time as a student and teacher, plus I got to meet some amazing people and some that I still call friends to this day
@@SenseiIchi So right, I loved my training at times with the Koreans and I learned a lot and was very privledged to travel and train in S Korea, but when as a 5th Dan, you got to a training session in S Korea and have a 2nd Dan teaching you a yellow belt lesson as if we were ignorant, its ridiculous, his face was a picture when he found out that a majority of grades were higher than he was and walked off away from his stage with a PA holding an umbrella so he didnt get sunburnt. :)
@@kevallison so it could be said that in that school instance, if you're interested in the martial/fighting skill attributes/concept, there is no need to go further a certain rank.
Chuck Norris didn't cut ties with Korea, it was the ties that cut Korea with him!
hahaha nice, nice.
US Tang Soo Do the same as Chun Kuk Do? Or UFAF?
TheGrafton12 no there was another split when he started ufaf. Pat Johnson took over ustsd
Can someone explain why Korea was testing for a karate belt? They actually wanted people to fly to Korea to test? Ridiculous!
No. Is sending applications over there by mail.
The US Tang Soo Do or now Soo Bak Do is the very best in TSD and trace their roots back to Grand Master Hwang Kee and his son. They are very good and had a school in Springfield, New Jersey, USA.
Yes Soo Bahk Do Moo Duk Kwan's HQ is still active in Springfield and is owned by Grand Master Hwang Kee's son (Hwang Hyun Chul)
Very cool. I knew two of his Tang Soo Do Chodans in the 90s and I used to train with them. I taught one of them Aikido and exposed him to GoJu Ryu karate my style of Okinawan karate.
Yup! Right behind the big Wine store...I used to teach Taekwondo just a couple of blocks away...
@@tkd7thdan Oh hahaha if you're still in the area you should come to check it out and maybe try/watch a class?
we Wish Happy Investigation For busy technikals in this Art ITS Fortune thankx