It's been over two whole decades and it's finally here... I can't believe I'm seeing the day AoE2 is adding in extended details to before hidden stats. What a time to be alive!!
My only question is why it took so long to get this setting in the first place. Clearly it can be done in some capacity since its a setting you can change in AoE3 before DE, so it just baffles me that it took them this long for AoE2's base game.
The funny thing is that the Huns struggled in the regular Nomad map due to the water element. Giving them a scout may help them quite a bit on that map to remove the irony. :B
I don't think a scout on nomad is a good idea. I would cetrainly take away the sheep converting ability at least, but still it seems very strong to get the intel on other players...
@@nejnovejsiThey’re still behind in eco since they can’t build a dock for surface fishing or building a fishing eco. The horse scout that steals sheep is at least a compensation.
@@nejnovejsi I think it would especially be nice if they couldn't convert enemy sheeps, although that would probably be a very un intuitive mechanic. Getting your scouting sheeps converted by enemy horses running around seems like a pain
Gotta hand it to the devs to continue to develop and balance this game. I haven’t picked it up since my son was born last year. I will gladly show him this game when he’s older though.
yeah, true, but I think there are just too many types for this to be practical UI-wise. Like, I bet it would confuse scare people away more than it would help : p
@@user-sl6gn1ss8p AoE3 unit cards display that information fully and yea at first glance it feels like being jumpscared by excel, but afterwards it's not too terrible
As a player who prefers civs with mostly defensive monks & monasteries, I heartily welcome the new tech and the Faith discount. The price on Faith has always been extortionate.
One issue that I had with the game was the invisible techs. You see 20 knights vs 20 berserkers. Can you win that fight? You can see the upgrades, if they are upgraded to elite version, but there was no way to check if they had chieftains. Now with the UI update this one disappears. So cool
Would be nice if they put passive techs like that as a "buff" icon when you click on the unit. I.e., showing whether or not archers have Thumb ring/Parthian Tactics, Siege Engineers, Ballistics etc.
3 monk changes I suggested on Reddit a few weeks ago are now part of the game, all almost exactly as I'd hoped they'd be! * Conversion intervals limited from 4-10 to 5-7 -> devs did almost exactly that (80% is now 5-7)! * A pre-Faith tech for castle age: done! * Quicker healing from monks in between: done! (before I used the monk patrol trick so they healed much more effeciently) I'm so happy and grateful the devs read our suggestions and get to work on them if they agree. It's honestly quite rare devs are this motivated and quick to react. The pathing issues must be extremely difficult to solve, but I do hope they try to figure out all of the issues and their root causes. Every patch it seems to become more ridiculous. I've been having immobile trebs for a while now. They just don't move after re-packing several at a time very often, often resulting in them getting destroyed when I should be able to run away with them and sometimes this leads to a loss I would've won otherwise. Then the insane detours vils and armies often make to go from A->B are getting worse too. A vil that has a free path from a freshly constructed building towards a gold pile or something, often makes an incomprehensible detour, sometimes leading towards its death or worse: opening a gate and letting the enemy in. These things are super annoying, but I do understand they might be nearly impossible to figure out and fix.
I feel like the Hun change will skyrocket their win rate on nomad style maps where you start without a scout. The difference between having a horse and having to only scout with sheep/ wasting a vill/ waiting to feudal is huge.
I honestly feel like they will become hands down OP on nomad maps. Exploration is absolutely one of the most important things on nomad, you can now shut down sheepscouting from your enemy, eat your sheep instead of scouting with them, find really big amounts of sheep for free and have basically arabia style scout abilities for yourself. I hope they at least take out the sheep conversion, or huns might be banned in every tournament match with nomad being picked.
For a utility unit, it's amazing how OP castle rushing as Bohemians is. Hussite Wagons went from defensive utility units to basically Rommel's Ghost Division several hundred years early. Fitting with how Hussite Wagons are Bohemian and a huge amount of the German Tank Corps in early WW2 was made up of Czech tanks. At least Elite Hussite Wagons remain the same, just with a longer training time, so the unit is not yet nerfed into uselessness. And it was all because of Castle rushing Bohemian players.
So funny how initially everyone called the unit " very situational at best, probably won't see pro usage" and that thinking didn't change until pretty recently.
If they are already improving the game's UI my Idea for Bonus Damage would be that when you select a unit and hover over an enemy unit there should be 1-3 Plus icons (+) if the unit deals Bonus damage and 1-3 Minus icons if the enemy unit deals a bonus against the selected unit.
One Note about the extended Infos. They are quite useful ingame as you can see upgrades on your opponents you could not see before (thumbring, murder holes, torsion engines etc). The interesting thing is that you can see villager gather rates as well (even with civ bonuses) which even leads to some funny numbers like Tatars showing that they collect sheep half the speed (due to how their bonus is implemented) and you can even see if your opponent has for example double bit axe on the gathering speed which will hopefully lead to some new tricks in the pro scene. Also SOTL didnt mention the biggest change in this patch, that they changed the guard tower icon ;)
HUGE huzzah for the UI changes! I'm all for more/better info in-game for really any game. It's more reliable and should, theoretically, be updated instantly upon being changed so that there's not a lag between a patch and the wiki getting updated. Plus, it just takes the immersion out for a whole lot of games (admittedly less an issue with AoE lol) if I have to tab out and scour a wiki, likely stumbling across a whole lot of spoilers that I never wanted.
The Huns change is 100% with the classic Nomad map with water in mind were Huns are by far the worst civ due to no dock start. On map like Land Nomad Huns aren't that bad and will be super steong now.
The changes to Monks are appreciated. I have been an advocate of less randomness for the unit for a while now. I do wonder how this will affect the Aztecs though. Stacking Monks and getting some lucky conversions was quite a big part of their gameplay so it seems like another, although indirect, nerf to the CIV. There's been quite a few direct and indirect nerfs to the Aztecs over the past couple of years so I wonder how this will play out. It felt like previously it could be argued that Aztecs are top tier Civ at top level so they don't need buffs and nerfs are not that big of a deal, but this is not consistent with their approach to Chinise if the new changes are anything to go by.
@@se6369 agree overall but this is probably a good change in this case. I think they remove too much randomness but monks could use a bit more prediction.
@@se6369 I 100% agree with your statement! I also think a lot of people asking for a fixed monk conversion time would change their mind once they would actually play with it.
I *knew* the Georgians were going to get nerfs to either their castle-hill defense bonus or their repair discount. I always suspected the combination of the two would make castle-drops unreasonably powerful for them.
So they didn't rework conversion times to be a uniform distribution, but they still reduced the RNG by just narrowing the window and increasing the probability per tick. Interesting
7:40 I wonder if the LOS buff isn't surprisingly strong overall. It means you will find all of your resources MUCH faster, which saves time and frees up your attention.
I feel like the whole "Huns free scouting horse when building new TC on nomad maps" could open a floodgate of map-dependent civilization advantages. Not sure if that sounds good or not
Yeah I don't like that. Huns don't need a buff either. However I like the idea of a civ starting with a Horse in addition to their scout. It's the bonus of one of my custom civ ideas, the Khazars.
Great video, I love Huns and nomad maps so keen for that and really like hindustanis as well so excited for that. Hope we see more to other left out civs too. More Persian style changes would be amazing
Very interesting changes! As an amateur balance designer, I'm very pleased to see the changes developers continue to make to their game. It's refreshing to see the thinking they had in the balance changes (when you know and follow the game of course).
The stat thing is indeed a welcomed change. Please extend it further. It would be nice to see which particular tech upgrade improved a units' stat. For instance, if you researched a blacksmith upgrade, it would be nice to see an info button that you can click to see which of those 4 upgrades affected the unit and in what way. This might seem pointless to pro or veteran players, but would be very helpful for newbies like me. Hate it or love it, I find Dota 2 would be a decent reference for how the devs implemented a "stat sheet" in the UI. All in all, the Aoe2 devs are doing a phenomenal job.
Super excited about this! Not only does this add better balance; but gives proof that they are working hard on the game and we can expect other things like pathing to improve also!
now they should keep on adding more unique tech tree units for each civ like the savar, more specific architecture to older civs, a couple mor QoL changes and I think we could say we got the actual age of empires 3 everyone wanted
As somebody who has no right to have an opinion (haven't played AoE2 in a few years and therefore never even touched the new civs, though I can at least say I consume way too much AoE2 content on YT lol) I gotta say it does make some sense that the devs are holding off on buffs to the new civs and I agree with SotL that it's best to not react too much to the current poor winrates. It seems like they definitely need some more time for people to figure them out considering their unique mechanics and buffing them now could very easily cause a lot of issues down the line if it turns out that all the players needed was some more time working out strats and getting comfy. Best to leave things largely alone atm and not muddy the waters so they can see more clearly where they might need buffs/nerfs in the future once everything settles down.
While I agree that attack ground on scorpions would be amazing, it would cause a major problem for the current way scorpions function. Since Scorpions do pass-through damage, it can hit any unit directly in front as long as it shoots at something further back within its range. Meaning an attack ground could allow the scorpion to attack adjacent units nullifying its minimum range requirement.
@@solorollo9756 I guess I didn’t explain the issue well. It is not about attack grounding inside the minimum range. It is about attack grounding beyond the minimum range, and letting the pass-through damage hit everything within its minimum range on its way to the location chosen for the attack ground. Currently everything in the game that can attack ground does not do pass-through damage like scorpions do.
I love the Georgians start personally. Is very difficult but also refreshing since we don't have many civilizations with unique starts that have to be practiced with. I think we should just wait and see if the civs will improve over time, they are just too complicated for now on land maps especially
@@Booklat1 You get a bunch of 60 of them together and their mutual-boost bonus turns them into a near-invincible block of death. I'm not surprised that property is getting nerfed.
I was blown away by all the calls for buffing Georgians. Because I play team RM, the first 2 Georgian players I played against were below my elo, and I easily raided them to death on Arabia. But as soon as the map was easily wallable (oasis, etc), I found out that monaspa was just a guaranteed win. 0 army composition or management necessary. I was losing game after game to monaspa fielded by players 300 elo below me. Every Georgian player just went monaspa in castle age and became unkillable. If you are unfortunate enough to have a civ like poles with no halb, it was just a matter of spectating the deaths of 100s of pikes, (micro'd) arbs, castles, and your opponent didn't even click the monaspa after sending them forward. A very good nerf if you ask me, and I don't think you could consider balancing the civ until all that accidental bonus damage was gone
Here's to hope that this addition is only the beginning! The devs are probably struggling to find a way to show bonus damage values without too much clutter.
Could you perhaps make a video about how many land units you have to hit with demolition ships for it to be cost-effective? You have made such an analysis about petards, concluding that they are most of the time not cost-effective. However, demolition ships have much higher attack and a larger blast radius, making it easier to pay back their cost when attacking bunched up land units in shallows. I know it's a situation restricted to certain maps, but I think if you can pull it off on a hybrid map, it can be highly cost-effective. You don't have to hit a lot of, for example, trebuchets, to be cost-effective with demo ships. Heavy demolition ships take down a generic trebuchet in two hits, but cost less than half of a trebuchet, so that's cost-effective even if only one trebuchet is hit per demo ship. With some other units, for example gold-intensive infantry or archers, I'm certain you can easily get some great value out of demo ships as well. What I can't estimate is if heavy demo ships would be a valid anti-trash unit with bottomed out market prices. ... in addition to possible cost-effectiveness, there's also the aspect of being able to destroy an enemy army without risking most of your own, either because you are rebuilding your forces and need more time, or because you have an army and plan to attack once you've blown up the enemy's forces. This aspect however is difficult to quantify.
Ok, so I tabulated the Savar nerf, and aside from the 1-hit nerf vs generic arbalester (and by extension elite longbow, because they have the same HP and armour) and generic elite/imperial skirm, it's also a 1-hit nerf against a fairly short list of other units/civs (assuming post-imp). For unique units, the Camel Archer, Conquistador, Ratha and War Wagon take an additional hit (so does the slinger, but who's building them against Persians?). It's also a nerf against all three Elite Elephant Archers, the Burmese heavy cav archer, and against the four hand cannoneers that are missing ring armour (Burgundians, Franks, Georgians and Gurjaras). Against Genitours, it's a nerf if they have all the armour upgrades (including Parthian Tactics), but otherwise there's no change.
Giving scorpions attack ground would probably be more confusing than anything for a lot of players. Particularly due to their pass through damage. Is the spot I select going to do the most damage? Negate pass through? The terminal end or first potential impact? Confusing for players on the low end and serving the "micro nerd" sector of the high end players... perhaps too well? Eh, I'm not too strongly opinionated about it, but not in favor atm.
Doubt you'll be out of a job, seeing how you yourself are a big part of why people come here. You're an excellent host and the information would not be as interesting without you. I have not played the game since the very early 2000ths, yet here I am, watching your channel and keeping up with the game because of you. You're doing great and are a valued member of the community :)
2 weeks later and I don't have the Extended Units Stats available + there are some new bugs in Editor. Once again updates I never asked for are bringing joy to my life.
As someone who almost exclusively plays Poles, I'm excited to try out the tweak to folwark cost. I'm not a great player, but the opening for Poles always has felt a little bumpy with the extra wood cost on it.
Large number of organ guns can crush cavaliers easily but struggle against paladins, after patch even the knights with 3rd armor upgrade can handle them…… However, they will be much better at fighting eagles and huskarls 🤔
@@forsakenquery Before patch, they deal 3x5 damage against cavaliers, 2x5 damage against paladins, 2x5 damage against eagles and huskarls. After patch, they will deal 2x5 against cavaliers, 1x5 against paladins, and 3x5 against eagles and huskarls, elementary school level maths my friend.
A lot of good small changes in this patch. Something I would appreciate is the chance to set the map to only the diamond, without all the UI around it that it's not useful and doesn't allow you to click on the actual terrain. Even though I use the Transparent UI mod, I can't click on the surroundings of the map.
Looks great SOTL thanks for the update, looking forward to trying out the new changes especially the Chinese and also using the extended stats, and stuff, Huns look OP on Nomad, my goodness.
do you even know what "OP" means they are no where near OP they are the worst civ on nomad officially they can't build dock at the start because no wood
Just saying being able to scout with something other than a slow moving sheep is going to be a good advantage, and a nice trade off for being late to dock.
Speaking of unit priorities, I would still *love* a priority attack setting where you could select whether a unit focuses villagers, infantry, buildings, siege, etc. They'd still attack whatever's near depending on their attack stance, but it'd make large pushes much more focused.
Oh please yes!. "Where's my goddamned army? Oh, it's over there on the other side of the map after chasing a bunch of trade carts they couldn't catch." That behaviour of prioritising trade carts over EVERYTHING else even if the carts are faster than the units drives me INSANE!
Hmm, I wonder what this change does to imperfect monk micro where multiple monks are used to convert a unit at the same time. This might have some impact especially with the tech researched (multiple monks converting at once only costing one monk).
Who thought that monaspa needed buff? In video it’s said that some people thought that georgians needed buff as a civ due to low win rate no? Am I missing something?
I think the Huns nomad bonus is really cool - it gives them something on a map that you'd otherwise think should be really strong for them, without changing their balance for other maps where they're already relatively fair.
9:55 the huns scout on nomad is given because huns can't afford to build a dock and tc with starting resources, so other civs who do this and fish boom get a lead. This is just to compensate so you don't have to go "aahrr, I randomed Huns" on nomad.
The change to monks is WAY overdue. Massive RNG swings are not uncommon and really take something away from the game for me. Really glad they're finally addressing this.
Randomness is only good sometimes. It's not believable that soldiers are deserting basically just as quick as eachother. This ruins immersion and makes the game more boring and predictable. Monk RNG is exciting. Will it pay off, or will it not?
@@se6369 - yes, some randomness, but if this change works how it's meant too, it should tighten up that spread to make it less drastic on the outcome of the game.
Huns still can't immediately make a dock on nomad, right? In that case it should have been highlighted that it's a crazy change for land nomad starts while not changing the state of things on nomad at the top level.
With the folwark giving 5 population space and costing as much as a house and a mill together, it never really messed with a build order, just not building the house that would normally be built before the mill, but a reasonable buff to just make the folwark a free house at the same cost as a mill.
With 3 on wood I always found that first forager villager was pretty close to walking back by the time the wood for a folwark came in, and it was just an extra thing to remember to place that. It's been a little while since I played Poles so maybe my memory is overestimating the hassle.
How did you miss that Aztec monks are now going to be even more tanky with a new tech added? Can they survive a siege onager now and not just the onager?
I would love to see +1malee armour for catafaracts. With all new units like Savar or Monaspa i feel like even as their antyinfantry role they could do better.
GOOD NEWS SOTL! Your christmas wish has already been fulfilled by the devs. You've got the "extended tooltips" on (see 0'30), and if you turn it off, it'll become exactly as you'd like it to be. 🙂
Can you do a conversion video comparing old and new? And can you show if Bengalis elephant conversion is nerfed as their bonus was not changed in the PUP?
Speaking of tooltips... The tooltip position can't be changed via mods. I prefer having my resource bar right above the buttons section, but the tooltip always gets above it then.
Was in Salted-Pepper's chat during a stream... discussing Devotion where the idea of increasing minimum time instead of both Min & Max was put out there. For the cost as it is now it's just too cheap. So it's again something about do we need the price increased where it hurts the idea of going for it every single game (i.e. the Faith Problem, just a bit smaller in scope) or do reduce its effectiveness, but make it more available to get. The Huns shouldn't be allowed to play with Vietnamese on the same Nomad map and the opponent can always choose that civ if they wish.
Don't think anything happens to Huns. You can already play a very powerful Nomad combo of Burmese + Lithuanians and people aren't complaining that much.
@@kane_lives Was joking, but the 100 food is really the only main bonus until castle. If you're destroying water & massing fishing ships in Feudal, because the enemy didn't get water & you're safe enough. Your castle timing is good & you're going to have a better eco in early Castle to have #s of knights for example versus stronger knights of Lith. Arambai are a pain potentially, but it's all situational there & not nearly as bad as Conquistadours.
It's been over two whole decades and it's finally here... I can't believe I'm seeing the day AoE2 is adding in extended details to before hidden stats. What a time to be alive!!
It’s time for my weekly pinching myself that AOE2 is still alive and improving
i remember playing when i was like 6 ish and now i smile knowing its outlasted almost all AAA titles that are considered the mainstay of the industry
My only question is why it took so long to get this setting in the first place. Clearly it can be done in some capacity since its a setting you can change in AoE3 before DE, so it just baffles me that it took them this long for AoE2's base game.
They did not call DE version a love letter for nothing 😂
They should show all Hidden bonuses too, just like in AoE3 :D
Finally the Aztec monk can reach 100 hp instead being stuck at 95
What a great remark! I don't think many people would think about this so suddenly.
This also annoyed me for years as well lmao
* new change *
now, monastery techs give aztec monks only 4.95 extra HP.
@@agustinfranco0 Calm down there Satan.
@@agustinfranco0jajajajaja
Having an intermediate technology between nothing and double protection against conversion is a very good idea. Faith costs too much.
Seems pretty true to real life where priests have private jets. 😄
Nerfing the very nada civ persians lol
Also has the advantage that you can give some civs which should have lesser protection at least one weaker tech instead of all or nothing
But what's really important is the extra +5HP it gives to Aztec monks.
The God-Emperor of Man: "Tell me about it."
The funny thing is that the Huns struggled in the regular Nomad map due to the water element. Giving them a scout may help them quite a bit on that map to remove the irony. :B
They were bottom tier on Nomad because they couldn't build a dock at start. Now I guess they'll be decent on Nomad and crazy good on Land Nomad.
I don't think a scout on nomad is a good idea. I would cetrainly take away the sheep converting ability at least, but still it seems very strong to get the intel on other players...
@@nejnovejsiThey’re still behind in eco since they can’t build a dock for surface fishing or building a fishing eco. The horse scout that steals sheep is at least a compensation.
@@nejnovejsi think about Vietnamese bonus, that is strong as well in nomad
@@nejnovejsi I think it would especially be nice if they couldn't convert enemy sheeps, although that would probably be a very un intuitive mechanic. Getting your scouting sheeps converted by enemy horses running around seems like a pain
SOTL will NEVER be out of the job due the UI changes 🙌
We will always need you to tell us the implication of each civ bonus and unit stats
woah
different colors at least!@@aoecaviler943
yea we need Spirit! Like what damage does a tatar treb do hitting a Georgian castle uphill down from a cliff.
0:15 that's not a bug Spirit, that's a bird.
Dad jokes detected 😂
Gotta hand it to the devs to continue to develop and balance this game. I haven’t picked it up since my son was born last year. I will gladly show him this game when he’s older though.
Your son was born last year? He’s old enough already-what are you waiting for?
He's old enough, better start early with some t90 videos and sotl videos
His first words will be “where’s the taco?”
Extended Unit Stats was a long due change, but it still sorely misses the Bonuses and Armor Types from the unit cards, which I think is more critical.
yeah, true, but I think there are just too many types for this to be practical UI-wise.
Like, I bet it would confuse scare people away more than it would help : p
@@user-sl6gn1ss8p yeah, just imagine clicking a mameluke...
@@user-sl6gn1ss8p AoE3 unit cards display that information fully and yea at first glance it feels like being jumpscared by excel, but afterwards it's not too terrible
@@user-sl6gn1ss8p Just copy Age of Mythology by having a button that opens up an in-game wiki window.
@@Drak77TVstill that jumpscare and that Ui is better designed than the aoe 2 one
I absolutely love how the devs simply listened to the community and pro feedback on monks, thought of a good new tech and implemented it. Great!
As a player who prefers civs with mostly defensive monks & monasteries, I heartily welcome the new tech and the Faith discount. The price on Faith has always been extortionate.
One issue that I had with the game was the invisible techs. You see 20 knights vs 20 berserkers. Can you win that fight? You can see the upgrades, if they are upgraded to elite version, but there was no way to check if they had chieftains. Now with the UI update this one disappears. So cool
you can't see bonus damage in the extended stats. that one remains, but something like the Bulgarian 33% uu can be seen
same advantage to you. the opponent also dont know if u have stirrup researched or not.
Would be nice if they put passive techs like that as a "buff" icon when you click on the unit. I.e., showing whether or not archers have Thumb ring/Parthian Tactics, Siege Engineers, Ballistics etc.
AoE 4 solved this problem by having these kinds of upgrades actually change the weapon the unit is carrying.
AoE 4 solved no problems 😂
3 monk changes I suggested on Reddit a few weeks ago are now part of the game, all almost exactly as I'd hoped they'd be!
* Conversion intervals limited from 4-10 to 5-7 -> devs did almost exactly that (80% is now 5-7)!
* A pre-Faith tech for castle age: done!
* Quicker healing from monks in between: done! (before I used the monk patrol trick so they healed much more effeciently)
I'm so happy and grateful the devs read our suggestions and get to work on them if they agree.
It's honestly quite rare devs are this motivated and quick to react.
The pathing issues must be extremely difficult to solve, but I do hope they try to figure out all of the issues and their root causes.
Every patch it seems to become more ridiculous. I've been having immobile trebs for a while now. They just don't move after re-packing several at a time very often, often resulting in them getting destroyed when I should be able to run away with them and sometimes this leads to a loss I would've won otherwise.
Then the insane detours vils and armies often make to go from A->B are getting worse too. A vil that has a free path from a freshly constructed building towards a gold pile or something, often makes an incomprehensible detour, sometimes leading towards its death or worse: opening a gate and letting the enemy in.
These things are super annoying, but I do understand they might be nearly impossible to figure out and fix.
I feel like the Hun change will skyrocket their win rate on nomad style maps where you start without a scout.
The difference between having a horse and having to only scout with sheep/ wasting a vill/ waiting to feudal is huge.
I honestly feel like they will become hands down OP on nomad maps. Exploration is absolutely one of the most important things on nomad, you can now shut down sheepscouting from your enemy, eat your sheep instead of scouting with them, find really big amounts of sheep for free and have basically arabia style scout abilities for yourself. I hope they at least take out the sheep conversion, or huns might be banned in every tournament match with nomad being picked.
For a utility unit, it's amazing how OP castle rushing as Bohemians is. Hussite Wagons went from defensive utility units to basically Rommel's Ghost Division several hundred years early. Fitting with how Hussite Wagons are Bohemian and a huge amount of the German Tank Corps in early WW2 was made up of Czech tanks.
At least Elite Hussite Wagons remain the same, just with a longer training time, so the unit is not yet nerfed into uselessness. And it was all because of Castle rushing Bohemian players.
I have the feeling they are slowly becoming the AOE 3 war wagons (which were prussians but from bohemia none the less).
THEY'RE THE PANZER ELITE
BORN TO COMPETE
So funny how initially everyone called the unit " very situational at best, probably won't see pro usage" and that thinking didn't change until pretty recently.
If they are already improving the game's UI my Idea for Bonus Damage would be that when you select a unit and hover over an enemy unit there should be 1-3 Plus icons (+) if the unit deals Bonus damage and 1-3 Minus icons if the enemy unit deals a bonus against the selected unit.
Maybe color it yellow to show that its just a temporary bonus.
I've been advocating for a "castle age faith" tech since forever. Now the devs went a step beyond and kept the imp tech with a disount! Happy days!
One Note about the extended Infos.
They are quite useful ingame as you can see upgrades on your opponents you could not see before (thumbring, murder holes, torsion engines etc).
The interesting thing is that you can see villager gather rates as well (even with civ bonuses) which even leads to some funny numbers like Tatars showing that they collect sheep half the speed (due to how their bonus is implemented) and you can even see if your opponent has for example double bit axe on the gathering speed which will hopefully lead to some new tricks in the pro scene.
Also SOTL didnt mention the biggest change in this patch, that they changed the guard tower icon ;)
Something I always wanted top see, that has SC, it's the number of kills of the unit. Hope to see that one day
HUGE huzzah for the UI changes! I'm all for more/better info in-game for really any game. It's more reliable and should, theoretically, be updated instantly upon being changed so that there's not a lag between a patch and the wiki getting updated. Plus, it just takes the immersion out for a whole lot of games (admittedly less an issue with AoE lol) if I have to tab out and scour a wiki, likely stumbling across a whole lot of spoilers that I never wanted.
The Huns change is 100% with the classic Nomad map with water in mind were Huns are by far the worst civ due to no dock start. On map like Land Nomad Huns aren't that bad and will be super steong now.
The changes to Monks are appreciated. I have been an advocate of less randomness for the unit for a while now. I do wonder how this will affect the Aztecs though. Stacking Monks and getting some lucky conversions was quite a big part of their gameplay so it seems like another, although indirect, nerf to the CIV. There's been quite a few direct and indirect nerfs to the Aztecs over the past couple of years so I wonder how this will play out. It felt like previously it could be argued that Aztecs are top tier Civ at top level so they don't need buffs and nerfs are not that big of a deal, but this is not consistent with their approach to Chinise if the new changes are anything to go by.
If anything it's a buff, their monks can get +5 hp in castle age and in total
Ask the pros - Aztec aren't top tier anymore
Less randomness=boring game based only on stats and calculated numbers. More randomness is realistic, people are different!
@@se6369 agree overall but this is probably a good change in this case. I think they remove too much randomness but monks could use a bit more prediction.
@@se6369 I 100% agree with your statement! I also think a lot of people asking for a fixed monk conversion time would change their mind once they would actually play with it.
4:00 that lady in Devotion icon has really big palms
I have been asking for years why the unit speed stat has not been included and its finally here!!!!!!! Im so happy!!!!!
I *knew* the Georgians were going to get nerfs to either their castle-hill defense bonus or their repair discount. I always suspected the combination of the two would make castle-drops unreasonably powerful for them.
Huns should get change that Tarkans should once again make the flaming sound when they attack something.
So they didn't rework conversion times to be a uniform distribution, but they still reduced the RNG by just narrowing the window and increasing the probability per tick. Interesting
+1 for this suggestion 1:35 (display cost and hotkey only)
sus post made 2 hours before the release of this video
@@Hovezipwnchannel and patreon members probably get early access
Is the extra monistary tech technically an aztec buff?
7:40 I wonder if the LOS buff isn't surprisingly strong overall. It means you will find all of your resources MUCH faster, which saves time and frees up your attention.
I feel like the whole "Huns free scouting horse when building new TC on nomad maps" could open a floodgate of map-dependent civilization advantages. Not sure if that sounds good or not
Yeah I don't like that. Huns don't need a buff either.
However I like the idea of a civ starting with a Horse in addition to their scout. It's the bonus of one of my custom civ ideas, the Khazars.
Huns really do need it.
Great video, I love Huns and nomad maps so keen for that and really like hindustanis as well so excited for that. Hope we see more to other left out civs too. More Persian style changes would be amazing
Very interesting changes!
As an amateur balance designer, I'm very pleased to see the changes developers continue to make to their game.
It's refreshing to see the thinking they had in the balance changes (when you know and follow the game of course).
The monk changes might help newer players use monks more often which may increase some civilizations with good monks overall winrate
Thanks Spirit for the asmr!
The stat thing is indeed a welcomed change. Please extend it further. It would be nice to see which particular tech upgrade improved a units' stat.
For instance, if you researched a blacksmith upgrade, it would be nice to see an info button that you can click to see which of those 4 upgrades affected the unit and in what way.
This might seem pointless to pro or veteran players, but would be very helpful for newbies like me.
Hate it or love it, I find Dota 2 would be a decent reference for how the devs implemented a "stat sheet" in the UI.
All in all, the Aoe2 devs are doing a phenomenal job.
Forge +1 attack on melee units, fletching +1 attack on ranged units
Etc
How can this possibly be misconstrued?
@@solorollo9756i think ots more armor that needs to be clarified. Cavalry archers for example dont get upgraded by cavalry armor.
Super excited about this! Not only does this add better balance; but gives proof that they are working hard on the game and we can expect other things like pathing to improve also!
now they should keep on adding more unique tech tree units for each civ like the savar, more specific architecture to older civs, a couple mor QoL changes and I think we could say we got the actual age of empires 3 everyone wanted
I've been asking for locked under construction gates for ages!!!!!
As somebody who has no right to have an opinion (haven't played AoE2 in a few years and therefore never even touched the new civs, though I can at least say I consume way too much AoE2 content on YT lol) I gotta say it does make some sense that the devs are holding off on buffs to the new civs and I agree with SotL that it's best to not react too much to the current poor winrates. It seems like they definitely need some more time for people to figure them out considering their unique mechanics and buffing them now could very easily cause a lot of issues down the line if it turns out that all the players needed was some more time working out strats and getting comfy. Best to leave things largely alone atm and not muddy the waters so they can see more clearly where they might need buffs/nerfs in the future once everything settles down.
atack ground on scoprions is such a good idea, would be much more scary to push with archers units into an area where there is a siege workshop
While I agree that attack ground on scorpions would be amazing, it would cause a major problem for the current way scorpions function. Since Scorpions do pass-through damage, it can hit any unit directly in front as long as it shoots at something further back within its range. Meaning an attack ground could allow the scorpion to attack adjacent units nullifying its minimum range requirement.
@@lucasducas_aoeum… mangonels also have minimum range requirement and can’t attack ground within that range lol…
@@lucasducas_aoe that would be noticeable when you have a big mass of scorps, wich i think is not that unfair tbh
Just make their projectiles do no damage to units that are too close.
@@solorollo9756 I guess I didn’t explain the issue well. It is not about attack grounding inside the minimum range. It is about attack grounding beyond the minimum range, and letting the pass-through damage hit everything within its minimum range on its way to the location chosen for the attack ground. Currently everything in the game that can attack ground does not do pass-through damage like scorpions do.
You missed the reduction to the Cavalier tech research time from 100 to 80 second
Ratha's now finally looking like a decent option for Bengalis. Previously I just stuck with their elephants and light cavalry.
Rathas will still lose to crossbows. Crossbows. How is this possible lol.. that giant thing loses to a freaking crossbow
@@solorollo9756 i dont think they lose vs xbow ... on fortress i see them winning vs chokunu always and chok. shoud be better then xbow
@@RomaInvictusSPQR I only say it because it’s happened to me. Neither party had any upgrades
I love the Georgians start personally. Is very difficult but also refreshing since we don't have many civilizations with unique starts that have to be practiced with.
I think we should just wait and see if the civs will improve over time, they are just too complicated for now on land maps especially
Nah it sucks
Some people were expecting the Monaspa to be buffed and anyone who actually played them was expecting the opposite.
What a deadly unit.
Idk how anyone thinks they need a buff
They're so cheap
@@Booklat1 You get a bunch of 60 of them together and their mutual-boost bonus turns them into a near-invincible block of death. I'm not surprised that property is getting nerfed.
They were better tarkans. Now they will be still good shock cavalry.
I was blown away by all the calls for buffing Georgians. Because I play team RM, the first 2 Georgian players I played against were below my elo, and I easily raided them to death on Arabia. But as soon as the map was easily wallable (oasis, etc), I found out that monaspa was just a guaranteed win. 0 army composition or management necessary. I was losing game after game to monaspa fielded by players 300 elo below me. Every Georgian player just went monaspa in castle age and became unkillable. If you are unfortunate enough to have a civ like poles with no halb, it was just a matter of spectating the deaths of 100s of pikes, (micro'd) arbs, castles, and your opponent didn't even click the monaspa after sending them forward.
A very good nerf if you ask me, and I don't think you could consider balancing the civ until all that accidental bonus damage was gone
Ever TC sniped with them? It's like TC sniping with Shotels, except these units somehow do it way better whilst still being a vastly superior unit.
Bruh how you gonna make hidden stats visible and leave out the single most important group of hidden stats in the game.
Here's to hope that this addition is only the beginning! The devs are probably struggling to find a way to show bonus damage values without too much clutter.
Could you perhaps make a video about how many land units you have to hit with demolition ships for it to be cost-effective?
You have made such an analysis about petards, concluding that they are most of the time not cost-effective. However, demolition ships have much higher attack and a larger blast radius, making it easier to pay back their cost when attacking bunched up land units in shallows.
I know it's a situation restricted to certain maps, but I think if you can pull it off on a hybrid map, it can be highly cost-effective. You don't have to hit a lot of, for example, trebuchets, to be cost-effective with demo ships. Heavy demolition ships take down a generic trebuchet in two hits, but cost less than half of a trebuchet, so that's cost-effective even if only one trebuchet is hit per demo ship. With some other units, for example gold-intensive infantry or archers, I'm certain you can easily get some great value out of demo ships as well.
What I can't estimate is if heavy demo ships would be a valid anti-trash unit with bottomed out market prices.
... in addition to possible cost-effectiveness, there's also the aspect of being able to destroy an enemy army without risking most of your own, either because you are rebuilding your forces and need more time, or because you have an army and plan to attack once you've blown up the enemy's forces. This aspect however is difficult to quantify.
I like your question. The AI has blown away many of my units in the shallows with Demoships. I want to do that!
One suggestion. There's the beginner tech tip, the cost only version you proposed, but there should be a hidden bonus version.
Can't wait to play this whilst listening to Depeche Mode's "Songs of Faith and Devotion".
Ok, so I tabulated the Savar nerf, and aside from the 1-hit nerf vs generic arbalester (and by extension elite longbow, because they have the same HP and armour) and generic elite/imperial skirm, it's also a 1-hit nerf against a fairly short list of other units/civs (assuming post-imp).
For unique units, the Camel Archer, Conquistador, Ratha and War Wagon take an additional hit (so does the slinger, but who's building them against Persians?). It's also a nerf against all three Elite Elephant Archers, the Burmese heavy cav archer, and against the four hand cannoneers that are missing ring armour (Burgundians, Franks, Georgians and Gurjaras).
Against Genitours, it's a nerf if they have all the armour upgrades (including Parthian Tactics), but otherwise there's no change.
Giving scorpions attack ground would probably be more confusing than anything for a lot of players. Particularly due to their pass through damage. Is the spot I select going to do the most damage? Negate pass through? The terminal end or first potential impact? Confusing for players on the low end and serving the "micro nerd" sector of the high end players... perhaps too well? Eh, I'm not too strongly opinionated about it, but not in favor atm.
Doubt you'll be out of a job, seeing how you yourself are a big part of why people come here. You're an excellent host and the information would not be as interesting without you. I have not played the game since the very early 2000ths, yet here I am, watching your channel and keeping up with the game because of you. You're doing great and are a valued member of the community :)
Please Please Please have a option to disable "voice" on click/order for buildings/animal units
2 weeks later and I don't have the Extended Units Stats available + there are some new bugs in Editor. Once again updates I never asked for are bringing joy to my life.
Damn, 1999 and still going strong
I like the new monk tech but i'm not sure how I feel about the change with RNG. I feel liked that randomness added some excitement to the game.
Can you please, for the love of ornlu the wolf, ask or make/made a tutorial on the editor please, how to add technologies or train units
As someone who almost exclusively plays Poles, I'm excited to try out the tweak to folwark cost. I'm not a great player, but the opening for Poles always has felt a little bumpy with the extra wood cost on it.
I love you spirit of the, always on time, law
Large number of organ guns can crush cavaliers easily but struggle against paladins, after patch even the knights with 3rd armor upgrade can handle them……
However, they will be much better at fighting eagles and huskarls 🤔
How do you figure ?
@@forsakenquery Before patch, they deal 3x5 damage against cavaliers, 2x5 damage against paladins, 2x5 damage against eagles and huskarls.
After patch, they will deal 2x5 against cavaliers, 1x5 against paladins, and 3x5 against eagles and huskarls, elementary school level maths my friend.
A lot of good small changes in this patch. Something I would appreciate is the chance to set the map to only the diamond, without all the UI around it that it's not useful and doesn't allow you to click on the actual terrain. Even though I use the Transparent UI mod, I can't click on the surroundings of the map.
You forgot that the units now have a ability to timeshift and that the pathing is worse then EVAAAA! :P Good content as always!
Looks great SOTL thanks for the update, looking forward to trying out the new changes especially the Chinese and also using the extended stats, and stuff, Huns look OP on Nomad, my goodness.
HUNS ARE THE WORST CIV FOR NOMAD WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT
do you even know what "OP" means they are no where near OP they are the worst civ on nomad officially they can't build dock at the start because no wood
Just saying being able to scout with something other than a slow moving sheep is going to be a good advantage, and a nice trade off for being late to dock.
They’ll also make up for the food this way by finding a lot more sheep if they want to farm those.
It would be good, now with all the updates that the infantry has had and soon the monks, to do an updated review of the Aztecs :D
Thanks for making all this easy to understand great video
Speaking of unit priorities, I would still *love* a priority attack setting where you could select whether a unit focuses villagers, infantry, buildings, siege, etc.
They'd still attack whatever's near depending on their attack stance, but it'd make large pushes much more focused.
Oh please yes!. "Where's my goddamned army? Oh, it's over there on the other side of the map after chasing a bunch of trade carts they couldn't catch." That behaviour of prioritising trade carts over EVERYTHING else even if the carts are faster than the units drives me INSANE!
Tbh, sicilians are recently improving not due the last patch but T90. 🙃
Hmm, I wonder what this change does to imperfect monk micro where multiple monks are used to convert a unit at the same time.
This might have some impact especially with the tech researched (multiple monks converting at once only costing one monk).
Remember huns were last place on nomad because they didn't have enough wood for a starting dock with TC, pretty curious what their new rank will be
Imo a range of 40 - 60 % winrate is really healthy. In a best of 10 that basically coming down to the last match
If only it had a stat for kill count, but still a really nice addition.
And wololo count
1:14 Does the "Toggle Extended Tooltips" option do what you had in mind?
I have no idea why you thought the Monaspa would get anything but a nerf. You should watch the Warlords QFs between Villese and Viper.
Who thought that monaspa needed buff? In video it’s said that some people thought that georgians needed buff as a civ due to low win rate no? Am I missing something?
I think the Huns nomad bonus is really cool - it gives them something on a map that you'd otherwise think should be really strong for them, without changing their balance for other maps where they're already relatively fair.
I been wanting extra stats for so long. To many hidden bonuses
9:55 the huns scout on nomad is given because huns can't afford to build a dock and tc with starting resources, so other civs who do this and fish boom get a lead. This is just to compensate so you don't have to go "aahrr, I randomed Huns" on nomad.
The change to monks is WAY overdue. Massive RNG swings are not uncommon and really take something away from the game for me. Really glad they're finally addressing this.
Randomness is only good sometimes. It's not believable that soldiers are deserting basically just as quick as eachother. This ruins immersion and makes the game more boring and predictable. Monk RNG is exciting. Will it pay off, or will it not?
@@se6369 - yes, some randomness, but if this change works how it's meant too, it should tighten up that spread to make it less drastic on the outcome of the game.
@0:14 pretty sure that's a bird there, not a bug. No need for thanks!
Huns still can't immediately make a dock on nomad, right? In that case it should have been highlighted that it's a crazy change for land nomad starts while not changing the state of things on nomad at the top level.
With the folwark giving 5 population space and costing as much as a house and a mill together, it never really messed with a build order, just not building the house that would normally be built before the mill, but a reasonable buff to just make the folwark a free house at the same cost as a mill.
With 3 on wood I always found that first forager villager was pretty close to walking back by the time the wood for a folwark came in, and it was just an extra thing to remember to place that. It's been a little while since I played Poles so maybe my memory is overestimating the hassle.
the new monastery tech should also very slightly buff Aztecs
How did you miss that Aztec monks are now going to be even more tanky with a new tech added?
Can they survive a siege onager now and not just the onager?
I would love to see +1malee armour for catafaracts. With all new units like Savar or Monaspa i feel like even as their antyinfantry role they could do better.
GOOD NEWS SOTL! Your christmas wish has already been fulfilled by the devs. You've got the "extended tooltips" on (see 0'30), and if you turn it off, it'll become exactly as you'd like it to be. 🙂
No new „old” return of Rome campaigns coming soon? 😩
Ohh extended unit stats sound amazing!
Dude you should do a video of the best team combos like an old video you did, but now we got even more civs!
Can you do a conversion video comparing old and new? And can you show if Bengalis elephant conversion is nerfed as their bonus was not changed in the PUP?
spirit you're gonna have tot pick up the pace now haha
HAHAAH Hera looking at the dromon, feeling the sweat and heat.
Why are they buffing dromons?
Speaking of tooltips... The tooltip position can't be changed via mods.
I prefer having my resource bar right above the buttons section, but the tooltip always gets above it then.
EXTENDED STATS!!! Now if only they'd redo the ending timeline graph to make sense
The previous patch muedered my framerate and made it impossible to play online, hoping for optimization
Hera - Dromons are broken!
Meanwhile Devs - Ok, we need to buff Dromons!
Or are they worse now against high armor units?
This is a big nerf in many situations
thank you for this educative content
All good but.. devs misspelled "Fog of War in the minimap" wrong again. 😕
Please next ui change should focus on mini map showing fog of war just like in aom, aoe4, sc2, lol, dota...
Horse: Sup, wanna come to my factions, my bosses want your flesh to eat.
Sheep: Sure, let's go!
0:40 Basically they took this from Aoe 3, but I doubt they give credit to Aoe 3, but even so Aoe 2 needed it a lot.
Was in Salted-Pepper's chat during a stream... discussing Devotion where the idea of increasing minimum time instead of both Min & Max was put out there. For the cost as it is now it's just too cheap. So it's again something about do we need the price increased where it hurts the idea of going for it every single game (i.e. the Faith Problem, just a bit smaller in scope) or do reduce its effectiveness, but make it more available to get.
The Huns shouldn't be allowed to play with Vietnamese on the same Nomad map and the opponent can always choose that civ if they wish.
Don't think anything happens to Huns. You can already play a very powerful Nomad combo of Burmese + Lithuanians and people aren't complaining that much.
@@kane_lives Was joking, but the 100 food is really the only main bonus until castle. If you're destroying water & massing fishing ships in Feudal, because the enemy didn't get water & you're safe enough. Your castle timing is good & you're going to have a better eco in early Castle to have #s of knights for example versus stronger knights of Lith. Arambai are a pain potentially, but it's all situational there & not nearly as bad as Conquistadours.