Your your the only gentleman that gives the ranch fairy set ups honest review. Everyone else talks a lot of nonsense without the actual work put in too the set thank you
Great video. You actually tested his theories, not just discredit his thinking . Troys videos were the first videos I watched when I started building my arrows a few years ago. As a western state hunter I couldn't do the 550+ arrows. I settled on 504gr at 14.2 foc. I took things from RF, MFJJ, Aaron Snyder and built a arrow to suit my taste out west. The fact that the RF challenges conventional archery thinking and makes people loose there minds makes me like the guy.
Im also out West and new to bowhunting. Ive been following the same guys as you for compound but have a 568gr arrow for my recurve based on Snyder's experiences. Compound shooting is an entirely new thing for me, but I like the extra range it gives. Are you shooting compound or trad? Whats your arrow setup?
Literally exactly what I did. But I’m not even western. Eastern whitetail. 504g arrow 60lbs 29.5” draw. They shoot like darts. No im not at 300fps but im right around 278-281fps. But again im not out west shooting 50-60yds plus. I have a 35-40yd limit but haven’t had to shot past 25. Only starting my third year bow hunting. Last two years have gotten does and absolutely blew through furthest ran was roughly 50yrds. But like you I took a little bit of info from all them and built the perfect arrow for ME and what IM CONFIDENT in. Good luck this season!
Great show and great review. Open mindedness is a rare commodity now days. In case you're wondering, I snorted the Fairy dust several years ago. I shoot 680gr with 200gr single bevel 28% FOC, 68lbs 29" draw. I limit myself to 40yds. It's awesome!
Good video I’ve been bow hunting 40 years and have been down many paths of light and heavy arrows, mechanical and fixed blades, compound and longbow. Hands down arrows leaning around 500 gr and cut on contact broad heads are the winners. You made excellent points in your close, it comes down to knowing your equipment and practicing in hunting scenarios.
Superb video! Thanks for documenting and sharing. I’ve been following Troy for a while now and upgraded my set up to at least “late teenager” arrows (ha!) before last season and found similar results. The confidence to take the shot knowing the arrow would penetrate effectively allowed me to shoot a young buck and a ~140”, probably 4-year old buck at 7 and ~17 yards respectively, both quartering to. For the first buck, the arrow was sticking out the hind quarter, fully in tact when I found him. The second, the buck turned and snapped the arrow into two pieces, the broadhead end passed through and was never found in the tall grass. The fletched end was still in him, somehow, when I found him. Both had 0 blood (probably because of the high entry) and both fell around 80 yards away. Thankfully I knew which way they ran and the search was very quick.
I was glad this video showed up in my feed. I met Troy in April. I won the Hog Hunt raffle he promoted for the Ashby Bowhunting Foundation. I met Rob Nielson the current president of the foundation. I also met Jeremy Johnson... one of, if not the best archery elk hunters in the country... i also got to meet the Doc himself. After spending 4 days with these guys, i got to review the Natal Study by listening to docs stories. Picking his brain was like entering a whole new world. I've been shooting 550gn single bevel for years after having some tough recoveries with a Sevr. Troy inspired me to start a channel. I'm currently following docs arrow build, including vane tuning... something nobody does. I've got the build on the channel. 655gn, 27.2% FOC and these things fly like absolute lasers out to 95 yards. IN HEAVY WIND!!! I've never had an arrow that shoots so well. I cannot wait to put it through an elk this september. Troy is ridiculously smart, and genuinely wants to help people be more successful. If people were more open minded, and actually tried it like you did, they would be pleasantly surprised. Good video and review, man. I'm giving you a sub.
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE feel free to check out the build. The process takes some patience, and there's a lot to keep up with. But it's been well worth the effort so far. Have a great day, and God Bless.
I think the biggest takeaway here is the fact that you took the time to properly sharpen your broad heads, a razor sharp head reduces drag and increases hemorrhage(the main reason animals die from archery). Arrow weight arguments will never be settled but know one can deny that a razor sharp head kills faster and penetrates further. To me this is the most important factor and unfortunately too many people don't take the time to ensure that this is done before heading to the woods. In my experience a well balanced arrow with a scary sharp head on the end of it has never failed me.
On double lung shots animals are just as much and if not more suffocating vs bleeding out. The next time you clean a deer feel the lungs and the cavity. They both have the same membrane and lubricating fluid. When you breathe out its easy to understand that you crush your lungs empty. Whats less obvious is that when you breathe in you increase the size of the cavity that the lungs can be in and you create a negative pressure between the lungs and the cavity. That negative pressure helps inflate the lungs as they are drawn towards the cavity wall. A double lung shot puts a few holes in this negative pressure zone and it no longer works so the deer cant breath in.
Heavier fixed broad head arrows are the end all be all. More mass equals a quicker kill. Using a heavier arrow you don't need 300fps. Far less actually.
Very fair review. Great job, and your wrap up is spot on. An arrow not going completely through a Whitetail, or even Mule Deer for that matter, should give anyone pause, but it also doesn't mandate focusing on only a couple of points like arrow mass or FOC. Your more comprehensive assessment is greatly appreciated.
20 yrs ago I was shooting 750gr arrows out of a 70lb compound and all my shots were pass throughs from 5 to 38yds. Heavy arrows always win when the shot hits bones. I have a 27'' draw length, I see all these shows with guys that have 30inch + draw at 70lbs and get a lot of half arrow penetration......speed is important but momentum always gets you a pass through. Shoot what you want if its accurate. My choice always leans on the heavy side. Greta video! Cheers
The heavier arrow comes into play when you hit bone. That is going to happen someday. Shot placement is very important, but the animal may change the shot even on speed setups. That said, shot the heaviest arrow you can with the trajectory that is acceptable to you with the best quality broadband you can afford and make sure it is as sharp as you can get it. Let it eat.
@@zip1233I suppose you’ve never hunted in fog. I suppose you’ve never went to range an animal and accidentally ranged brush between you or tall grass. Faster is always going to mean more forgiveness.
I absolutely loved this video. And I loved your point about looking at the aspects that affect arrow penetration and apply the ones that make sense for you. I am 6'2, and I have a 6'6 wingspan. So my "true" draw length is like 38-39". I think I shoot a 34" draw length to account for clothing and because that's what I could get my bow to. So I shoot a LONG arrow. Which helps with weight, just because I'm already shooting that much arrow. I did put a 1/2 in 1/2 out insert and a 175gr broadhead so I'm up around 660 total grains. And I LOVE my set up. But that's what works FOR ME. And I'd never get after someone else shooting what works for them. Ultimately, most of your shots were perfectly placed (the one doe was high like you said, but still lethal) and I've had that dreaded moment where you release and the deer moves just slightly and the arrow goes straight into the center of it's shoulder. So... me personally, I'd rather be safe than sorry. But again, that's just me and what works for me.
I also went heavy last year for my crossbow, but I think one of the major steps was learning about nock tuning.. New shafts were nock tuned and used a heavy single bevel. Two large Kansas deer down within 40 yards and easy blood trails with pass throughs. Your comments about accurate ranging were right on the money. Works very well for short range hunting.
I went from 608 grains down to 484 on my main set up. I still got two pass throughs on two mature bucks up in the northeast. I wanted a flatter trajectory even though the 608 grain set up worked well the season before in two bucks. Still had above 15% FOC.
@@fireinmybones86 I agree, I’m shooting 70 lbs at 26.5DL and seasons before was shooting a much lighter set up. I lost a big deer due to him being a little quartering to and getting like 3 inches of penetration. I was shooting 384 grs with a shwacker. My local shop is all about speed. So, they push those types of arrows with lower GPI. I started building own arrows and went to the extreme and now have the balance I want.
@@critter852004 I just picked up u my bow again after some 20+ years of the wife moving it to clean etc. An older Hoyt Magnetec shooting 241’ at 56#, the shop closer to me is the same way All about speed, it’s a matter of what I want. I’m handing the money across the country for You to build what I want, if you want to shoot a heavier set up, tell the dude don’t give two shits about What he wants or thinks. Trust me when that Buck walks in and like Troy says “They Don’t Pose for the shot” and one of these cats hits a good set of bone and loses a deer with a Speed set up their gonna walk around for the next 3 years talking about the Monster that took their arrow and ran off
I’ve seen plenty of Deer fall to all different types of Broad heads. The two factors that they had in common are proper shot placement and scary sharp.
Agree, wet shaving sharp or sharper will cause more hemorrhaging for 2 reasons. Rubber band like veins are cut instead of pushed and the clotting reaction is reduced. Think about how cutting your finger with a razor blade bleeds and won’t stop like a cut from a less sharp blade.
Great breakdown, I enjoy this style of review over past performance. You're only competing against yourself at the end of the day, keep up the good work sir!
As a traditional archer, I have been exclusively hunting these similar setups since 2008....actually, worked with Dr. Ashby on a penetration study for Trad Gang in 2011....my typical setups are in the upper 500;s to lower 600 grains with setups from 27% EFOC to 30-% Ultra EFOC....350 gn to 400 gns up front....typically, make 80 to over 100 hunts per deer season...the single bevel penetration is unmatched in my experience however, I still prefer consistent easy to read blood trails. I shouldn't be this way since, I have excellent deer dogs....your video has provided some very useable information to the archery community.
I’m shoot of a fairly similar set up to this because I’ve swapped completely traditional bow hunting. I have a roughly 525 grain set up 180 ft./s. So far I’ve taken one doe with this set up hit a rib and still had a complete pass-through at 25 yards she ran just shy of 100 yards before dying. I’ve gone out several times so far this season but haven’t had any good shots and the only one I’ve taken was a running coyote at 30 yards which I unfortunately missed.
great video- thanks for sharing. Now that you know this set up worked pretty flawlessly, drop 50 grains and repeat for '24 and see if you see the same results. The year after that- drop another 50 grains- find the threshhold between speed and weight.
Great video! Glad to see someone went and gave this an honest effort, did the pros and cons and understands you don’t have to go to the absolute extreme of RF suggestions, rather find that medium that is ideal for your set up. Thank you sir!
I think the biggest take away from this video is this guy had the most epic season bow hunting ever. If I get a chance at one shooter buck a season I’m lucky, much less 4!
great review of this setup. Tip for new and even experience hunters. blood trail often has more to do with how high the entrance and exit holes are on the vitals of a deer. high shots with bows or rifles will often not have good blood trails. exit holes that are low often bleed a lot. I shot a buck in 20" of snow with a 45-70. buck ran 45-50 yards, there wasnt a single spec of blood in the snow. that taught me, I better really look for a deer when there is no snow because just because there is no blood doesnt mean you missed!
Great Stuff! I've found everything you talked about to have the exact same results as my experiences. I'm shooting 70# @ 28" w/ 250gr upfront with a total weight of 528gr. I've kille several pigs and deer with this setup, all with pass-throughs at ranges 10-45 yards.
520 seems to be the typical magic bow number. Really anything within 500-600 grains if you have perfect arrow flight and sharp heads anywhere in this medium setup range is devastating to all animals on the planet. Assuming ranges of 10-50 yards.
Guys out there I’m from Ohio where mostly are deer avg size as a yearling would be considered a nice size deer down south. I’ve harvested 4 deer with an Easton sonic/ 50 grain brass insert and 100 grain g5 dead meat. Nocturnal nocks. Shooting a Hoyt rx7 64 lbs 28.5 draw total arrow weight was 412, 4 deer shot at 4 dead deer. 4 pass through shots 37 furthest shot closest 18. Not one deer went passed 100 yards. Troy is passionate but overbearing to say the least. I like blood trials i will stick with what works for me.
If you buy more heads, look into iron Will. They also sell a wide option. Great quality steel that you can re sharpen but they also sell replacement blades for $40
I have experimented with 400 to 595 grain arrows. I landed at 508 grains and they do great for me on pigs and deer. I am happy and confident on any between 470-525 for me. I shoot the victory rip xv elite 28” nocturnal knock 2.5” vanes 150grain ethics insert outsert and 125 grain tooth of the arrow solid broadhead. They have been flawless so far. You just have to do you with what you are confident in.
i shot 3 doe this year and i got pass throughs 2 out of 3 shots. shooting 65lbs at 29" and my farthest shot was 25 yards max. my broadhead is the 150 grain stinger buzzcut/bleeders. only reason id switch at all now is if the single bevel magnus is a killer and i suspect it is!!
Good vid here dude. I love to tinker and have gone way down this rabbit hole. From 590 to 410 and ended up with arrows around 485 with an expandable (gasp). I do have a 585 with a single bevel on it in the quiver for situations where shots are very short, under 20 yards. End of the day, go hunt, and shoot em in the right spot.
I love the video, Great Job! I don’t hunt with an arrow setup as heavy as you used but I am on the heavier side(515gr.) I’ve done some changes and now my arrow is flying better than ever. I do believe there is a HAPPY MEDIUM on arrow weight. Again great video.👍👍
I agree about Luke 11:17. Exactly why UA-camrs doing things that don't benefit the whole community should stop. They're creating division. It usually boils down to selfishness. Fame, Legacy, hunting gear and access to more hunting opportunities with disregard to those it hurts. That's division.
Couldn’t agree more brother! I don’t have to bash someone just because I don’t fully agree with them. I have good friends that we don’t agree on many things.
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE I agree. There's a difference between bashing someone for how the hunt and bringing awareness to things that are detrimental to hunting. I guess at the end of the day I hope I can be a better Christian and help close that gap. I'm not perfect either. United, we should be.
Great video! I often get caught up in questioning myself about using a slightly heavier arrow because of the pin gap issue that you discussed. However, I hunt in Michigan and the areas that I hunt are way too thick to shoot what I would consider an ethical shot from anything beyond about 30 yards (for me anyway). The honest truth is, a pass-through to me is far more valuable than the chance that I’ll get a great blood trail from an expandable/light setup.
A couple of points I need to make. I shoot Prime compounds & recurves. The one thing in common is the Blackeagle X-Impact's. The Victory VAP TKO'S also work but I shoot the Valkyrie Centerpin system. The inserts/outserts r specifically designed for the X-Impact's. My compound is @ 63 pounds with a 30" draw length. 250 spine X-Impact with 570 grain total weight with 22.50% FOC & a Valkyrie short Jag which is 210 grains with a 60 grain component that the head screws into. Same setup with the recurve. But the # is 52 &,the 400 spine arrow is 495 grains with 27% FOC. The bare shaft tuning with this setup is incredible. I can say that the Bloodtrail is ridiculous & that short Jag just keeps going with a much better Bloodtrail than a single bevel. 30 years ago the NAP was similar. They had the sharpest blades but the design only gave great internal bleeding with very poor Bloodtrails. The Valkyrie 3 blade busts through bone like a single bevel but it also cuts & doesn't dull until the shaft stops deep into a log. My only research has been on large MN deer. I am a farmer & I can't travel. Thanks for the video & your breakdown. I'm glad u r able to go from state to state. Keep it up. That past doe by the way iis exactly the spot that I call an Aortic Blast. Nowhere near the spine but totally lethal. I will take that shot from a 🌳 💯 % of the time @ close range quartering in.
You hit the nail on the head in many aspects. Listen if you are having huge space gaps in your setup going heavier you are entering or are in diminishing returns. Ashby is awesome Troy is awesome we are not killing Cape buffalo and rhino or elephant in North America. Moose is the toughest we got. Do not put your setup into diminishing returns. Eds study has one major take away that’s always missed. Go as heavy as you can with a trajectory that is still suitable for you. The kinetic energy machine determines the sweet spot. Compounds, recurve, long bows, crossbows all variations with different draw lengths ect ect will have different sweet spots but they all be the same in respects to numbers. 250-290 +/- 10 or so fps 0.6-0.8 slugs of momentum 95-110 ft/lb KE If you are in this range you are perfect. Speed matters ke matters momentum matters having a super slow projectile with low ke and high momentum is just as useless as stupid fast high KE and low momentum. The pin gaps and or chevron gaps let’s you know if you are doing something right or wrong. My crossbow has higher spaces with lighter arrows than it does with 520 at 600 plus things get really wonky so I use 520. 350 is really fast but that drop is just as fast at 50 yards and has no momentum and it hurts the crossbow as well shoulders lol. My recurve 600 is absolutely no problem and it’s a 50 lb while the crossbow is 200lbs. Let the machine tell you what it wants to eat.
My reservation regarding heavy arrows is for Mule Deer where getting within the 20y range is not very common. And you kinda answer it when you shot the doe. Anyhow, I appreciate your commitment to go through a full season of hunting to test it.
Plenty of people kill mule deer sub 20 yards, is it harder than getting within 100 and lobbing an arrow...yes. My reservation about lighter arrows and longer shot distances is wounded animals.
Back in the seventies, heavy arrows and fixed broad heads were about all that was available . I have better results with expandable broad heads and arrows with 100 grain inserts . Arrows shafts around 8 grains per inch. Blood trails are better on average although not normally necessary because most I watch or hear fall. Adding front of center weight and good arrow flight will improve the performance of all broadheads.
Love your content I’m a new subscriber and I love your message. I’ll be sticking around. God bless hope to cross paths in the hunting industry some day.
Balance is king and i believe heavier does carry advantages. Shoot a slingshot with 3 mm terra bands and bb ammo to an mdf board. It would jam into the board. Make 4 bands 2 inches with a taper. And it will jam a little deeper. Switch the bb ammo for a 12 mm lead shot. Shoot it with the 3mm bands and watch it bounce off. Then shoot it with the 4 band 2 inchers the lead shot will blow through the mdf like its paper. I believe you have to put in as much foc possible before you start loosing too much speed.
How heavy were your arrows before this setup? 580gn will definitely work but I've never wanted for more penetration when using anything between 455-500gn, shooting 70-77 pounds, and most with single bevel broadheads.
I shoot 30in 300 spine easton fmj 5mm basic insert up front with 100gr 2 blade mechanical and a lighted knock in back and shooting these with a v3 31 @ 72lbs 29.5in draw Total arrow weight is about 525gr and I have NEVER been more accurate and had penetration this damn amazing. I have had no issues with bones and 2 blade mechanicals I even broke the leg bone on exit from a straight down qrt away type of shot. Havnt lost a deer in the 4-5 yrs I've been using this setup
All close shots. I guess I'm not hearing or seeing anything on these particular shots that wouldn't have had really any different results with a 425 grain arrow and a good expandable. I'm just now seeing the failures in the field that should be driving the change to these "adult arrows" as the fairy puts it. In the end hunt with whatever makes you happy. Who cares what anyone else thinks or is using. I'll stick with a low to mid 400 grain set-up and a quality expandable.
Complelety agree! I would argue that the blood trail from an expandable is a very important part of the equation. I used a ranch fairly style setup the last couple of years and came very close to not finding deer that were shot in good spots (right around the shoulder). Those holes are trash city. The deer definitely die but if you're hunting thick stuff its just not awesome.
Completely agree with you. I killed about two dozen deer the past two falls with a 450ish grain arrow and mechanicals. Not a single arrow didn’t 100% pass through. 74# bow, 29” draw length, and tuned bareshafts to 30 yards before putting the grim reapers on the leading end. I’ve been down the heavy rabbit hole and the odds of hitting a shoulder knuckle only increased due to the larger pin gaps. Even then, that telephone pole with a tiny fixed head out front didn’t go through a knuckle.
I’m sure you guys are busy but if you ever do get the time to do anymore real world testing like this video. I would love to see the same heads on 420 grain arrows and near 600 grain arrows both with 15% foc minimum and see the differences. I’d like to see if it’s more the heads or the actual weight.
The older I get the more I'm convinced that most archery shots on deer just shouldn't be taken... unless they're within 25 or 30 yards and perfectly broadside, no matter what arrow and broadhead. Ive lost several and seen so many deer lost from high shots, single lung shots, shoulder shots etc. There's so many things that can happen and so much room for error.
425gr going as close to 300fps is deadly on whitetails out to 40yrds imo. Listen to people who's walls a filled with trophy archery whitetails. Don't buy the snake oil!
@@ranchosendero It can be unless you hit a twig, have a bad angle, hit a couple inches too high, or an inch forward and hit shoulder... I shoot an 80 lb bow and 150 grain broadheads and I've lost several. Mainly a couple inches high and one direct shoulder hit. Watch the guys that hunt real places, like the hunting public, dan infalt and others and you'll see how common it is to wound deer or lose them. They have it happen at least once or twice every season. And the guys with all those big deer also get to hunt Iowa Illinois and Kansas literally every single day of season
@@ranchosenderoyou can have a full wall if you hunt for 30 years shoot 100s of animals and lose over half of them too. I will trust and listen to 30 years of science and experience compared to the bouncing off shots with “what in the hell, how did that happen.”
I have a 29” draw and went to 560 gr setup with 200 up front and felt like I lost too much speed and distance at that weight so I dropped it to a 500gr total setup with 187gr up front and feel like it’s perfect at 70lb draw weight
I would like to see a trajectory comparison at different distances between a 580-ish and a 460-ish arrow. I hunt some really thick areas where I feel like the trajectory of a heavier arrow will not allow me to thread the needle on the shots I take.
Yeah, I kept an open mind, built an entire setup based on the ranch fairy bs, and it fell extremely short where I hunt. You’re not going to have much luck with this setup out west hunting mule deer and coues deer, I promise you that. If all you ever do is tree stand hunt out to 20 yards, more power to you.
I use the grim reaper whitetail specials razor tip. No where near the experience you have. But the 175lb 8pt I got last year was 20yd double lung. Ran 40yds and dropped. Had good blood after the first 10 yds. Good size entry and massive exit
I can’t remember the data but he goes over arrow drop with heavy arrows and short draw lengths. While it is some it’s not as much as one might believe But the energy is still there and ample. Great video.
I shoot a heavier arrow. My build is hand loaded for my bow my shooting and the limitations I set for myself to make ME more confident in the woods. With that being said math doesn't lie. And if you go back on a lot of RF's videos he says for deer 550 is perfectly fine, as long as you have perfect store flight and the single bevel. The single bevel is the mechanical advantage because it applies torque and rotation after contact. However if your confidence is in the (flapper) mechanical broad head, and you have the luxury of being more selective with your shot, do what you do. As long as it's ethical and puts the animals down quickly.
First off, 4 of the top 5 items in the Ashby reports are addressed in selecting the proper equipment (look at Grizzlystiks tapered arrows with extreme FOC & structurally sound designs using single bevel Samurai broadheads of razor sharp 440C stainless steel. Their setups cover all of these incredibly important issues). Arrow flight is therefore the only item that archery hunters need to focus on once the right arrow shafts/inserts & broadheads are chosen. This is assuming you have a decent bow that can deliver consistently accurate & properly spined & straight arrows out of. Then you can choose the arrow weight based on your quarry. For example, elk-sized game & above need more penetration power than do javalina or coues whitetail in Arizona, so a 650gr. build is more appropriate for the larger game like elk etc. Virginia whitetails can & do get big, so a heavier than light arrow setup is more appropriate for them, but perhaps not as heavy as elk-sized or larger game should be hunted with. The rest is up to the shooter being an accurate shot & then the equipment to take proper care of the meat!
I shot a doe with a 425 grain arrow. 100 grain G5 montec fixed head, didn’t go 20 yards. Shot straight through the heart. It’s all about shot placement and hitting vitals. People read too much into arrow setups.
I've hunted with 430 grain arrows out of my compound for almost 20 years. Fixed blades do work, and I've had passthroughs on every deer I've shot with it. However, shooting traditional bows for over 10 years has taught me that arrow setups absolutely matter. Also, those 100 grain points suck because they're just disposable razors - and expensive ones at that! You have to buy a new one damn near every shot! I urge you to keep and open mind and try it before you knock it. Using a compound bow, a 650 grain arrow will have more energy on impact than a 450 grain arrow will have AT LAUNCH. That equals massive penetration factor, especially if you mess up and strike the humerous/scapula. Because most of my shots in 20 years have been under 20 yards, I have switched to heavier arrows because of what traditional archery taught me.
Loved your point at the end. There are those who do not like hunting, let alone archery hunting. Let's be as lethal as we can and not give a foothold to the anti hunting crowd.
Awesome 👏 test results thanks for sharing your findings from a stellar venison 🍖🥩 acquisition season and four great bucks 🦌 that anyone would be proud of. Great remarks and actually going down Ed’s list, sadly most folks only focus on one thing and don’t look into the rest. Arrows are like hammers in that there are different size ones that do better in one task vs another.
One thing I want to point out, that most misinterpret from Dr. Ashby's reports, and has been discussed on Ranch Fairy... is that Arrow Mass is item 6, but heavy 650 grain arrows are item 12. Basically, item 6 is to be interpreted as "have enough mass, to capture your bows energy, and get the job done" Item 12 is "if you encounter heavy bones, 650 grain is required to have a near guarantee of pass-through" Nowhere does it say you must shoot heavy arrows... only that IF you encounter heavy bones (spine, scapula, etc.) ...but especially on large game like Elk, Moose, Bear, Bison. This is why I want to see modern equipment used for an upated Ashby Report. If you check 11/12 boxes with a super fast, expandable setup, of top-quality construction, and descent mass... I think you'll be fine as long as you don't need to shoot a cape-buffalo in the shoulder. Great video, and I love Dr. Ashby's research and interviews!!!
My thoughts are The blood trans are hard but if you only have to track fifty yards then its like no deal at all the farther I've had to track one is 60 yards with a 654 grain arrow and a grizlystick samari 200 grain
Great bucks! None of those hits really tested the arrow setup tho. Shots straight through the ribs like that don’t take a ton of energy to get a pass through. I tend to shoot on the heavier side simply because most of my shots are close (average for my last ten bucks is 9.8 yards) and I like to shoot them far forward in the vital V. I’m also not afraid to take a 1/4 to shot and put it in front of the shoulder (at close range of course). A heavier arrow and solid fixed blade works great for those types of shots. I will say that if someone tends to hit farther back (we all have that buddy lol) a bigger head is better in that situation. I think a good middle of the road setup at around 550gr with a solid fixed blade is a great setup for whitetail. With the longbow I like to be over 600gr. I shot a doe through both shoulders with a 630 gr arrow and VPA single bevel and it buried to the fletching and she was down inside 60 yards.
Loved the video. I too went Ranch Fairy 600 grain single bevel. Killed two nice deer last year and like you have the confidence to put the BH close to the shoulder. Thanks for the bible verse at the end!
Big fan of Troy and his knowledge! I switched my set up for both my compound and traditional bows based on his research and the Ashby studies. First deer I killed with that set up and I was sold! Troy knows what it takes to kill animals and every bow hunter should consider lethality (which includes accuracy) over everything else. Quick and ethical kills is the goal!
Usually what i recommend when someone asks for advice for arrows is to at least consider RF. “Adult arrows” do work and are definitely worth trying but i will never, ever, tell somebody that RF arrows are end all be all and anything else is wrong. I used to be on the RF bandwagon and i ended up leaving. I saw some very cultish things in that group and decided i couldn’t support it. I’m not gonna be part of a cult where some of the members think they have final say in what arrow build somebody shoots.
Just like hunting with a 3 pound spear. Yeah it works close, but further away won't work. Back in late 90s I used a 50 lb draw weight an a 330 grain arrow for everything I killed as a teen. I used a walmart muzzy 125 grain an had pass threw on all my bucks. I have video of 200lb boar I stuck threw the heart, pass threw, an sprayed blood 5 feet out of both sides.
As a bowhunter and a former guide I say - Whatever you do, experiment and do what works for you, your budget, your hunting environment, the game you are going for, your skill set and your equipment. Heavier set ups tend to be more forgiving on impact. Lighter set ups tend to be more forgiving with accuracy. There are pros and cons to both setups and I have seen both fail epically as a guide. I was not guiding in a state that allowed mechanicals at the time so I have no comment on those but when you are looking at your set up you have to really put every thing together. For me I only hunt hunt with a R/D Longbow and my arrow set up shooting out of a 52# bow with my draw length is a 621 Grain Total with 19 % FOC . Shooting 3 Blade VPA 200 grain heads, 100 grain inserts with AAE PHNX Hybrid vanes. I break several "rules" with traditional. Shooting "vanes" designed for traditional and shooting off a rest but I dont really care because I like it. With my set up I am going for a slight drop in my gaps because I need to have shorter point on and shorter gaps just to improve my aiming. For a guy that shoots only instinctive it becomes more of an issue with what trajectory the archer likes seeing. I also hunt in pretty dense and wet areas so my shooting lanes are shorter. I have never shot at anything over 30 yards.
Man, I really appreciate you taking the time to reply with a thoughtful answer to the pros and cons of each side. At the end of the day, we think people should shoot what gives them confidence and at the end of the day go out and get experience and then make changes. It doesn’t have to be perfect for start and it’ll get better over time.
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE Well said. I distance myself from online debate about it typically because everyone has a different experience and circumstance but they want to argue as if everyone is experiencing the same thing . As a guide if we were on the "wet side" of the mountain we would recommend a completely different set up than if we were hunting open dry country on the dry side. However at the end of the day it came down to "Are you confident? Does it do the job? " I can tell someone that 4 blade bleeders are not great for 15 yard shots out of a tree in rain conditions in dense green forest because I have seen that set up fail so many times but if that set up is what puts the arrow in the deadly V then that is what you need to use.
The first thing many archers think when they hear FOC is HEAVY ARROW, NOT INTERESTED. Actually, the ASHBY emphasis is on broadheads that can survive heavy bone strikes, improved arrow flight via FOC, using A LIGHTER SHAFT with a HEAVIER POINT. Add the science of the bone splitting performance of a single bevel and your arrow lethality goes up exponentially. The emphasis that Ashby and Ranch promote is to aim at the most lethal part of the kill zone, which is forward in the rib cage crowding the shoulder. This holds the largest blood vessels in the lungs, the heart itself, and the arteries coming off the heart. If you hit here, the deer will go down much quicker, either in sight, or you may hear it go down just out of sight, no blood trail needed. A side plus is that many times these arrow systems will completely pass thru and you get an arrow refund.
If this is the case why does the ashby study end up recommending 650+ gr for whitetails, and why does ranch fairy say things like "550gr is where you stop wounding game to death" It is absolutely a push for heavy high foc arrows, with little single bevel 2 blades.
If the goal is to kill the animal as quickly as possible, by shooting it in the most lethal spot, why are we then told to do so with the smallest heads? If the goal is to dispatch game quickly you will not do that faster on a large scale by creating less tissue damage.
Whitetails within 20 yards, doesnt matter. Considering The Ranch Fairy doesn't tune his bow, his arrows aren't flying efficiently from the jump, so he has to over tune his arrow and make it weigh ridiculous amounts to absorb all of the bows shortcomings. Dont snort the fairy dust.
It would have been nice to know what bow, draw length and draw weight you shot these arrows out of. It is part of the data that makes a different and helps people compare. A guy shooting 80lbs at 31” is not the same as a 57lbs 28 1/2”draw guy.
The one thing that can’t be denied is ranch fairy has opened people eyes and not just opening a package screwing on a head and taking off into the woods I wonder how many people actually checked or knew how sharp the head was before just trying to kill a deer with it
@@dbuckner902010 I've only been into archery's hunting for a few years now, and I can tell you it's scary how many idiots can't hold a fist sized ground at 20 who are out there hunting. Ran into some guy last weekend at the range who got one last year but I legit watched him hit his release mid pull and shoot and arrow 300 yards off into the woods. Buddy had no idea what his arrow set-up was and was just ordering the cheapest arrows off Amazon.
This is good for short shots 20-30yds. This would be garbage hunting out west where 60 yds is pretty typical. I shoot a 420g arrow, 60lb limbs, with a 27” draw and have a complete pass threw at 60 yds with a fixed G5 double lung. Blood trail sucks though.. luckily I haven’t lost an animal yet but going to try an expandable in increase my draw weight to 65lb. I’ll take Dudley’s advice over the fairy
Good job! 15% foc is right at the bottom of what Troy recommends though. Most of the Australian arrow company’s arrows have about 60g outserts. So this, even with a 125g broad head gives reasonable foc. Took 2 Billy goats with one shot, complete pass through both when I switched. Van Diemen single Bevel. I find it hard to believe you guys shoot piss ant 100g fancy broad heads on just a 10g insert at game like deer!
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE drew deer creek this year. I’m pretty excited. Not sure if you have or not. But do you have any information on your experience? Key takeaways?
I would expect all these kills would have had the same results with a lighter set up. I went this way for two years and went back to the 425gr with a good fixed head. I shot 60 ls and 27" draw. The 550 arrow i was shooting was devastating to my trajectory. Resulting in high hits and deer ducking the arrow more than normal. I thing broad head design and sharpness play a huge roll. A good fixed head on a 400 gr arrow to be a good balance for myself.
Switched to s 550gr setup with 150gr cut on contact a few years ago. Killed 10 deer since then, and every single 1 has fallen in sight, and every single arrow passed through. Hard to argue with actual results. My bow is setup at 28.5" draw, 62lbs, and deadly out to 45. When you hunt deer in the woods, and not over a feeder or food plot, youre not getting a shot past 40 anyways. Side note, watch troy and rocketmans research on kinetic energy at distance. A heavier arrow has less energy loss at 60 yards, than a light arrow. Its just facts, and unfortunately too many people cant accept they might be wrong
I’m new to bow hunting myself, but I spent some time prodding people on archery forums about the RF setup. I learned quickly that RF haters often make two distinct claims. First, deer will jump out of the way of your slow arrows. And second, no arrow will penetrate shoulder consistently. Weight doesn’t matter. Another common theme I’ve noticed is the people who make these claims shoot sub-500 with mechanical broadheads exclusively. Yet the people who shoot 500+ with SB heads constantly prove them wrong. I’m not saying 500+ SB heads are the only way to go because I have no authority to do so, but I am saying that people will make claims about things they know nothing about! And I plan on switching to 500-550 gr SB heads myself after watching a 100gr COC head fold on contact with a rib in a perfect broadside shot and fail to pass through
Got a double lung pass through at 52 yards with my v3x 33 at 65# this season on a nice buck In an open field. 525 grain micro diameter arrow with a sevr 2.0. I’ve killed many deer with the exact arrow setup between 60-70# on multiple bows with zero issues. It hits hard and crushes bones. Sure a fixed blade would do the job better but I’ve been using sevrs for years and practice with em at multiple ranges so I know exact arrow flight and with the results I’ve gotten out of em I probably won’t change anytime soon. I’m not positive the fps of the older bows but I would think you’d be alright. Whitetails aren’t hard to get good penetration on unless you hit shoulder blades. Even in that case I shot a buck a few years back at 60# 27.5 draw with a Hoyt vector and I was using a rage hypodermic with around a 415 grain arrow at 30 yards and it went through the shoulder being a double lung shot and the arrow stuck in the offside shoulder. No pass through but the deer didn’t make it 50 yards before piling up. Ranch fairy’s testing is primarily done on hogs with thick skin and he usually only tests with fixed blades. From my findings a heavier arrow even with sevrs still get optimal energy and penetration vs a lighter arrow with a fixed blade. Which is why traditional guys shoot heavy arrows. The extra kinetic energy definitely helps but there comes a point where I feel heavier arrows aren’t needed like say over 550 grains for a whitetail. Most whitetail guys I’d say use 425-475 grain arrows give or take to get the best mix of kinetic energy and not have tons of arrow drop. I’m sure there are kids out there running sevr 1.5s with lighter draw weights because they will still open with lighter draws from only being held shut with the rubber bands but having good FOC definitely comes into play also. They even market them for lower poundage/ short draw users. Something I’ve actually used for brodhead testing before was an elk shoulder blade that I purchased at a farm and home store marketed as a dog chew to see how much penetration I’d get based off of different brodheads. You may be able to do something similar if you’re skeptical.
Awesome video! I will say that I believe your pass throughs are not because your arrow is heavy, but rather because of your Broadhead selection. I think it would be neat if you kept this format for next year but shot a 425gr arrow with the same single bevel broadhead. Also, you made good shots and that is the most important thing.
Good video. But remember to note that The importance of Arrow Weight is not in the top 5 factors. But when you hit bone the Arrow weight becomes one of the top 3 factors for penetration. I’m not making that up, it comes from Dr. Ashby.
I also shoot Thunderheads 100s and 430 grain arrows. It is very, very rare that I don’t get a complete pass through and great bloodtrail. Everyone of these deer you shot, I would have had a complete pass through with my setup. Zero chance I ever go heavier than what I’m shooting now or ever use micro arrows. 👍
Use code HA10 at checkout for 10% VPA Broadheads! Or don’t. Up to you :) thanks folks!
Your your the only gentleman that gives the ranch fairy set ups honest review. Everyone else talks a lot of nonsense without the actual work put in too the set thank you
Thank you for the kind words!
Great video. You actually tested his theories, not just discredit his thinking . Troys videos were the first videos I watched when I started building my arrows a few years ago. As a western state hunter I couldn't do the 550+ arrows. I settled on 504gr at 14.2 foc. I took things from RF, MFJJ, Aaron Snyder and built a arrow to suit my taste out west. The fact that the RF challenges conventional archery thinking and makes people loose there minds makes me like the guy.
Im also out West and new to bowhunting. Ive been following the same guys as you for compound but have a 568gr arrow for my recurve based on Snyder's experiences. Compound shooting is an entirely new thing for me, but I like the extra range it gives. Are you shooting compound or trad? Whats your arrow setup?
Literally exactly what I did. But I’m not even western. Eastern whitetail. 504g arrow 60lbs 29.5” draw. They shoot like darts. No im not at 300fps but im right around 278-281fps. But again im not out west shooting 50-60yds plus. I have a 35-40yd limit but haven’t had to shot past 25. Only starting my third year bow hunting. Last two years have gotten does and absolutely blew through furthest ran was roughly 50yrds. But like you I took a little bit of info from all them and built the perfect arrow for ME and what IM CONFIDENT in. Good luck this season!
Great show and great review. Open mindedness is a rare commodity now days. In case you're wondering, I snorted the Fairy dust several years ago. I shoot 680gr with 200gr single bevel 28% FOC, 68lbs 29" draw. I limit myself to 40yds. It's awesome!
Good video I’ve been bow hunting 40 years and have been down many paths of light and heavy arrows, mechanical and fixed blades, compound and longbow. Hands down arrows leaning around 500 gr and cut on contact broad heads are the winners. You made excellent points in your close, it comes down to knowing your equipment and practicing in hunting scenarios.
This is the same thing I landed on after 30+ years of hunting experience. My recovery rate has drastically increased with this simple setup rules.
Superb video! Thanks for documenting and sharing. I’ve been following Troy for a while now and upgraded my set up to at least “late teenager” arrows (ha!) before last season and found similar results. The confidence to take the shot knowing the arrow would penetrate effectively allowed me to shoot a young buck and a ~140”, probably 4-year old buck at 7 and ~17 yards respectively, both quartering to. For the first buck, the arrow was sticking out the hind quarter, fully in tact when I found him. The second, the buck turned and snapped the arrow into two pieces, the broadhead end passed through and was never found in the tall grass. The fletched end was still in him, somehow, when I found him. Both had 0 blood (probably because of the high entry) and both fell around 80 yards away. Thankfully I knew which way they ran and the search was very quick.
Awesome story. Goodluck this season!
I was glad this video showed up in my feed. I met Troy in April. I won the Hog Hunt raffle he promoted for the Ashby Bowhunting Foundation. I met Rob Nielson the current president of the foundation. I also met Jeremy Johnson... one of, if not the best archery elk hunters in the country... i also got to meet the Doc himself.
After spending 4 days with these guys, i got to review the Natal Study by listening to docs stories. Picking his brain was like entering a whole new world.
I've been shooting 550gn single bevel for years after having some tough recoveries with a Sevr. Troy inspired me to start a channel. I'm currently following docs arrow build, including vane tuning... something nobody does.
I've got the build on the channel. 655gn, 27.2% FOC and these things fly like absolute lasers out to 95 yards. IN HEAVY WIND!!!
I've never had an arrow that shoots so well. I cannot wait to put it through an elk this september.
Troy is ridiculously smart, and genuinely wants to help people be more successful. If people were more open minded, and actually tried it like you did, they would be pleasantly surprised.
Good video and review, man. I'm giving you a sub.
Thank you my friend. 💪🏻
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE feel free to check out the build. The process takes some patience, and there's a lot to keep up with. But it's been well worth the effort so far.
Have a great day, and God Bless.
@@PersonalBestOutdoors I’ll check it out!
I think the biggest takeaway here is the fact that you took the time to properly sharpen your broad heads, a razor sharp head reduces drag and increases hemorrhage(the main reason animals die from archery). Arrow weight arguments will never be settled but know one can deny that a razor sharp head kills faster and penetrates further. To me this is the most important factor and unfortunately too many people don't take the time to ensure that this is done before heading to the woods. In my experience a well balanced arrow with a scary sharp head on the end of it has never failed me.
You obviously haven't shot heavy arrows lol its devastating
On double lung shots animals are just as much and if not more suffocating vs bleeding out. The next time you clean a deer feel the lungs and the cavity. They both have the same membrane and lubricating fluid. When you breathe out its easy to understand that you crush your lungs empty. Whats less obvious is that when you breathe in you increase the size of the cavity that the lungs can be in and you create a negative pressure between the lungs and the cavity. That negative pressure helps inflate the lungs as they are drawn towards the cavity wall. A double lung shot puts a few holes in this negative pressure zone and it no longer works so the deer cant breath in.
@@tolt1776I have and there isn’t a difference if my set ups had enough to pass through in the first place.
Heavier fixed broad head arrows are the end all be all. More mass equals a quicker kill. Using a heavier arrow you don't need 300fps. Far less actually.
@@AliceWilson-w9m So a 600 grain arrow through the heart kills faster than a 400 grain arrow through the heart? Not likely.
Very fair review. Great job, and your wrap up is spot on. An arrow not going completely through a Whitetail, or even Mule Deer for that matter, should give anyone pause, but it also doesn't mandate focusing on only a couple of points like arrow mass or FOC. Your more comprehensive assessment is greatly appreciated.
20 yrs ago I was shooting 750gr arrows out of a 70lb compound and all my shots were pass throughs from 5 to 38yds. Heavy arrows always win when the shot hits bones. I have a 27'' draw length, I see all these shows with guys that have 30inch + draw at 70lbs and get a lot of half arrow penetration......speed is important but momentum always gets you a pass through. Shoot what you want if its accurate. My choice always leans on the heavy side. Greta video! Cheers
Piss missile... I've never heard that one. Great video. I love shooting the heavy arrow set up. It works for me.
Haha, glad you liked that one.
The heavier arrow comes into play when you hit bone. That is going to happen someday. Shot placement is very important, but the animal may change the shot even on speed setups. That said, shot the heaviest arrow you can with the trajectory that is acceptable to you with the best quality broadband you can afford and make sure it is as sharp as you can get it. Let it eat.
What about mis-judging yardage in thick woods? Wouldn’t that lead you to wanting the tightest pin gaps you can get?
@@forgerat get a range finder and know your setup.
@@zip1233I suppose you’ve never hunted in fog. I suppose you’ve never went to range an animal and accidentally ranged brush between you or tall grass. Faster is always going to mean more forgiveness.
@@forgerat if you don't know the ranges you're hunting at you shouldn't be hunting with a bow, end of the story.
@@zip1233 hahahaha YOU shouldn’t be hunting with a bow if you can’t keep the damn arrow outta the shoulder knuckle dork
I absolutely loved this video. And I loved your point about looking at the aspects that affect arrow penetration and apply the ones that make sense for you. I am 6'2, and I have a 6'6 wingspan. So my "true" draw length is like 38-39". I think I shoot a 34" draw length to account for clothing and because that's what I could get my bow to. So I shoot a LONG arrow. Which helps with weight, just because I'm already shooting that much arrow. I did put a 1/2 in 1/2 out insert and a 175gr broadhead so I'm up around 660 total grains. And I LOVE my set up. But that's what works FOR ME. And I'd never get after someone else shooting what works for them. Ultimately, most of your shots were perfectly placed (the one doe was high like you said, but still lethal) and I've had that dreaded moment where you release and the deer moves just slightly and the arrow goes straight into the center of it's shoulder. So... me personally, I'd rather be safe than sorry. But again, that's just me and what works for me.
@@hunt_trap_fish thanks for the comment brother. I hope you have a great season!
I also went heavy last year for my crossbow, but I think one of the major steps was learning about nock tuning.. New shafts were nock tuned and used a heavy single bevel. Two large Kansas deer down within 40 yards and easy blood trails with pass throughs. Your comments about accurate ranging were right on the money. Works very well for short range hunting.
I went from 608 grains down to 484 on my main set up. I still got two pass throughs on two mature bucks up in the northeast. I wanted a flatter trajectory even though the 608 grain set up worked well the season before in two bucks. Still had above 15% FOC.
I'm shooting a TAW of 484gn too. 19% FOC. I think it's a good balance of speed and mass. Now to keep practicing...
@@fireinmybones86 I agree, I’m shooting 70 lbs at 26.5DL and seasons before was shooting a much lighter set up. I lost a big deer due to him being a little quartering to and getting like 3 inches of penetration. I was shooting 384 grs with a shwacker. My local shop is all about speed. So, they push those types of arrows with lower GPI. I started building own arrows and went to the extreme and now have the balance I want.
@@critter852004
I just picked up u my bow again after some 20+ years of the wife moving it to clean etc. An older Hoyt Magnetec shooting 241’ at 56#, the shop closer to me is the same way All about speed, it’s a matter of what I want. I’m handing the money across the country for You to build what I want, if you want to shoot a heavier set up, tell the dude don’t give two shits about What he wants or thinks. Trust me when that Buck walks in and like Troy says “They Don’t Pose for the shot” and one of these cats hits a good set of bone and loses a deer with a Speed set up their gonna walk around for the next 3 years talking about the Monster that took their arrow and ran off
Great video! And great job actually testing the setups. Thanks for providing the recap.
I’ve seen plenty of Deer fall to all different types of Broad heads. The two factors that they had in common are proper shot placement and scary sharp.
Proper shot 100% but Troy talks about when they move which they always do
@@glennl9630
Unfortunately, this is a fact and wouldn’t be in a perfect world but we are very far from it.
@user-cv1jf1wq2m fact what?? That different broadheads have killed deer you Don't say
Agree, wet shaving sharp or sharper will cause more hemorrhaging for 2 reasons. Rubber band like veins are cut instead of pushed and the clotting reaction is reduced. Think about how cutting your finger with a razor blade bleeds and won’t stop like a cut from a less sharp blade.
Great breakdown, I enjoy this style of review over past performance. You're only competing against yourself at the end of the day, keep up the good work sir!
As a traditional archer, I have been exclusively hunting these similar setups since 2008....actually, worked with Dr. Ashby on a penetration study for Trad Gang in 2011....my typical setups are in the upper 500;s to lower 600 grains with setups from 27% EFOC to 30-% Ultra EFOC....350 gn to 400 gns up front....typically, make 80 to over 100 hunts per deer season...the single bevel penetration is unmatched in my experience however, I still prefer consistent easy to read blood trails. I shouldn't be this way since, I have excellent deer dogs....your video has provided some very useable information to the archery community.
I’m shoot of a fairly similar set up to this because I’ve swapped completely traditional bow hunting. I have a roughly 525 grain set up 180 ft./s. So far I’ve taken one doe with this set up hit a rib and still had a complete pass-through at 25 yards she ran just shy of 100 yards before dying. I’ve gone out several times so far this season but haven’t had any good shots and the only one I’ve taken was a running coyote at 30 yards which I unfortunately missed.
great video- thanks for sharing. Now that you know this set up worked pretty flawlessly, drop 50 grains and repeat for '24 and see if you see the same results. The year after that- drop another 50 grains- find the threshhold between speed and weight.
Not a bad idea!
Excellent! Especially the ending.
Thank you brother!
It's not about HEAVY ARROWS. It's about more FOC and ultra sharp and strong heads.
Great video! Glad to see someone went and gave this an honest effort, did the pros and cons and understands you don’t have to go to the absolute extreme of RF suggestions, rather find that medium that is ideal for your set up. Thank you sir!
Thank for you the kind words my friend!
I think the biggest take away from this video is this guy had the most epic season bow hunting ever. If I get a chance at one shooter buck a season I’m lucky, much less 4!
We're only allowed 2 bucks per season in Illinois. He must have property tags to be able to harvest multiple bucks.
Absolute best video I have seen on the subject. Thank you.
great review of this setup. Tip for new and even experience hunters. blood trail often has more to do with how high the entrance and exit holes are on the vitals of a deer. high shots with bows or rifles will often not have good blood trails. exit holes that are low often bleed a lot. I shot a buck in 20" of snow with a 45-70. buck ran 45-50 yards, there wasnt a single spec of blood in the snow. that taught me, I better really look for a deer when there is no snow because just because there is no blood doesnt mean you missed!
Great Stuff! I've found everything you talked about to have the exact same results as my experiences. I'm shooting 70# @ 28" w/ 250gr upfront with a total weight of 528gr. I've kille several pigs and deer with this setup, all with pass-throughs at ranges 10-45 yards.
520 seems to be the typical magic bow number. Really anything within 500-600 grains if you have perfect arrow flight and sharp heads anywhere in this medium setup range is devastating to all animals on the planet. Assuming ranges of 10-50 yards.
@@chrisruzsa2798 I agree!
Guys out there I’m from Ohio where mostly are deer avg size as a yearling would be considered a nice size deer down south. I’ve harvested 4 deer with an Easton sonic/ 50 grain brass insert and 100 grain g5 dead meat. Nocturnal nocks. Shooting a Hoyt rx7 64 lbs 28.5 draw total arrow weight was 412, 4 deer shot at 4 dead deer. 4 pass through shots 37 furthest shot closest 18. Not one deer went passed 100 yards. Troy is passionate but overbearing to say the least. I like blood trials i will stick with what works for me.
If you buy more heads, look into iron Will. They also sell a wide option. Great quality steel that you can re sharpen but they also sell replacement blades for $40
I have experimented with 400 to 595 grain arrows. I landed at 508 grains and they do great for me on pigs and deer. I am happy and confident on any between 470-525 for me. I shoot the victory rip xv elite 28” nocturnal knock 2.5” vanes 150grain ethics insert outsert and 125 grain tooth of the arrow solid broadhead. They have been flawless so far. You just have to do you with what you are confident in.
i shot 3 doe this year and i got pass throughs 2 out of 3 shots. shooting 65lbs at 29" and my farthest shot was 25 yards max. my broadhead is the 150 grain stinger buzzcut/bleeders. only reason id switch at all now is if the single bevel magnus is a killer and i suspect it is!!
Good vid here dude. I love to tinker and have gone way down this rabbit hole. From 590 to 410 and ended up with arrows around 485 with an expandable (gasp). I do have a 585 with a single bevel on it in the quiver for situations where shots are very short, under 20 yards. End of the day, go hunt, and shoot em in the right spot.
You've got that right!
I love the video, Great Job! I don’t hunt with an arrow setup as heavy as you used but I am on the heavier side(515gr.) I’ve done some changes and now my arrow is flying better than ever. I do believe there is a HAPPY MEDIUM on arrow weight. Again great video.👍👍
Great video, lots of good info 👍🏼
I agree about Luke 11:17. Exactly why UA-camrs doing things that don't benefit the whole community should stop. They're creating division. It usually boils down to selfishness. Fame, Legacy, hunting gear and access to more hunting opportunities with disregard to those it hurts. That's division.
Couldn’t agree more brother! I don’t have to bash someone just because I don’t fully agree with them. I have good friends that we don’t agree on many things.
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE I agree. There's a difference between bashing someone for how the hunt and bringing awareness to things that are detrimental to hunting. I guess at the end of the day I hope I can be a better Christian and help close that gap. I'm not perfect either. United, we should be.
Great video! I often get caught up in questioning myself about using a slightly heavier arrow because of the pin gap issue that you discussed. However, I hunt in Michigan and the areas that I hunt are way too thick to shoot what I would consider an ethical shot from anything beyond about 30 yards (for me anyway). The honest truth is, a pass-through to me is far more valuable than the chance that I’ll get a great blood trail from an expandable/light setup.
Glad you enjoyed it brother!
A couple of points I need to make. I shoot Prime compounds & recurves. The one thing in common is the Blackeagle X-Impact's. The Victory VAP TKO'S also work but I shoot the Valkyrie Centerpin system. The inserts/outserts r specifically designed for the X-Impact's. My compound is @ 63 pounds with a 30" draw length. 250 spine X-Impact with 570 grain total weight with 22.50% FOC & a Valkyrie short Jag which is 210 grains with a 60 grain component that the head screws into. Same setup with the recurve. But the # is 52 &,the 400 spine arrow is 495 grains with 27% FOC. The bare shaft tuning with this setup is incredible. I can say that the Bloodtrail is ridiculous & that short Jag just keeps going with a much better Bloodtrail than a single bevel. 30 years ago the NAP was similar. They had the sharpest blades but the design only gave great internal bleeding with very poor Bloodtrails. The Valkyrie 3 blade busts through bone like a single bevel but it also cuts & doesn't dull until the shaft stops deep into a log. My only research has been on large MN deer. I am a farmer & I can't travel. Thanks for the video & your breakdown. I'm glad u r able to go from state to state. Keep it up. That past doe by the way iis exactly the spot that I call an Aortic Blast. Nowhere near the spine but totally lethal. I will take that shot from a 🌳 💯 % of the time @ close range quartering in.
Unlike driving, the middle of the road seems to be the spot to be at on arrows.
Thanks for the report; greatly appreciated, brother!
I am curious about your recurve setup, if you don't mind sharing it.
Black eagle rampage traditonal arrows. They were around 510. I want them to be way heavier.
You hit the nail on the head in many aspects.
Listen if you are having huge space gaps in your setup going heavier you are entering or are in diminishing returns.
Ashby is awesome Troy is awesome we are not killing Cape buffalo and rhino or elephant in North America. Moose is the toughest we got.
Do not put your setup into diminishing returns.
Eds study has one major take away that’s always missed.
Go as heavy as you can with a trajectory that is still suitable for you.
The kinetic energy machine determines the sweet spot.
Compounds, recurve, long bows, crossbows all variations with different draw lengths ect ect will have different sweet spots but they all be the same in respects to numbers.
250-290 +/- 10 or so fps
0.6-0.8 slugs of momentum
95-110 ft/lb KE
If you are in this range you are perfect. Speed matters ke matters momentum matters having a super slow projectile with low ke and high momentum is just as useless as stupid fast high KE and low momentum.
The pin gaps and or chevron gaps let’s you know if you are doing something right or wrong.
My crossbow has higher spaces with lighter arrows than it does with 520 at 600 plus things get really wonky so I use 520. 350 is really fast but that drop is just as fast at 50 yards and has no momentum and it hurts the crossbow as well shoulders lol.
My recurve 600 is absolutely no problem and it’s a 50 lb while the crossbow is 200lbs.
Let the machine tell you what it wants to eat.
My reservation regarding heavy arrows is for Mule Deer where getting within the 20y range is not very common. And you kinda answer it when you shot the doe. Anyhow, I appreciate your commitment to go through a full season of hunting to test it.
Plenty of people kill mule deer sub 20 yards, is it harder than getting within 100 and lobbing an arrow...yes. My reservation about lighter arrows and longer shot distances is wounded animals.
Can use other factors to achieve the ranged shots: FOC, cut on contact, perfect flight, correct spine
@@nickallport1874then you need to learn how to shoot long range, and quit blaming your gear.
Back in the seventies, heavy arrows and fixed broad heads were about all that was available . I have better results with expandable broad heads and arrows with 100 grain inserts . Arrows shafts around 8 grains per inch. Blood trails are better on average although not normally necessary because most I watch or hear fall. Adding front of center weight and good arrow flight will improve the performance of all broadheads.
I like 550 grains, but I also shoot 50 yards and under.
Love your content I’m a new subscriber and I love your message. I’ll be sticking around. God bless hope to cross paths in the hunting industry some day.
Thank you, man! We appreciate it. Look forward to crossing paths someday!
Balance is king and i believe heavier does carry advantages. Shoot a slingshot with 3 mm terra bands and bb ammo to an mdf board. It would jam into the board. Make 4 bands 2 inches with a taper. And it will jam a little deeper. Switch the bb ammo for a 12 mm lead shot. Shoot it with the 3mm bands and watch it bounce off. Then shoot it with the 4 band 2 inchers the lead shot will blow through the mdf like its paper. I believe you have to put in as much foc possible before you start loosing too much speed.
Nice job
How heavy were your arrows before this setup? 580gn will definitely work but I've never wanted for more penetration when using anything between 455-500gn, shooting 70-77 pounds, and most with single bevel broadheads.
I shoot 30in 300 spine easton fmj 5mm basic insert up front with 100gr 2 blade mechanical and a lighted knock in back and shooting these with a v3 31 @ 72lbs 29.5in draw Total arrow weight is about 525gr and I have NEVER been more accurate and had penetration this damn amazing. I have had no issues with bones and 2 blade mechanicals I even broke the leg bone on exit from a straight down qrt away type of shot. Havnt lost a deer in the 4-5 yrs I've been using this setup
All close shots. I guess I'm not hearing or seeing anything on these particular shots that wouldn't have had really any different results with a 425 grain arrow and a good expandable. I'm just now seeing the failures in the field that should be driving the change to these "adult arrows" as the fairy puts it. In the end hunt with whatever makes you happy. Who cares what anyone else thinks or is using. I'll stick with a low to mid 400 grain set-up and a quality expandable.
Complelety agree! I would argue that the blood trail from an expandable is a very important part of the equation. I used a ranch fairly style setup the last couple of years and came very close to not finding deer that were shot in good spots (right around the shoulder). Those holes are trash city. The deer definitely die but if you're hunting thick stuff its just not awesome.
Completely agree with you. I killed about two dozen deer the past two falls with a 450ish grain arrow and mechanicals. Not a single arrow didn’t 100% pass through. 74# bow, 29” draw length, and tuned bareshafts to 30 yards before putting the grim reapers on the leading end.
I’ve been down the heavy rabbit hole and the odds of hitting a shoulder knuckle only increased due to the larger pin gaps. Even then, that telephone pole with a tiny fixed head out front didn’t go through a knuckle.
I’m sure you guys are busy but if you ever do get the time to do anymore real world testing like this video. I would love to see the same heads on 420 grain arrows and near 600 grain arrows both with 15% foc minimum and see the differences. I’d like to see if it’s more the heads or the actual weight.
That’s a great idea. I will give that a try this season. Thanks for the idea!!
Can you drop any info on that sharpening tool? Looks pretty slick. Thanks
Here is the link to the one I bought: a.co/d/6eqtIUb
Thank you @@HUNTERSADVANTAGE
The older I get the more I'm convinced that most archery shots on deer just shouldn't be taken... unless they're within 25 or 30 yards and perfectly broadside, no matter what arrow and broadhead. Ive lost several and seen so many deer lost from high shots, single lung shots, shoulder shots etc. There's so many things that can happen and so much room for error.
Good points. You start introducing a lot of factors out of your control at further distances.
425gr going as close to 300fps is deadly on whitetails out to 40yrds imo. Listen to people who's walls a filled with trophy archery whitetails. Don't buy the snake oil!
@@ranchosendero It can be unless you hit a twig, have a bad angle, hit a couple inches too high, or an inch forward and hit shoulder... I shoot an 80 lb bow and 150 grain broadheads and I've lost several. Mainly a couple inches high and one direct shoulder hit. Watch the guys that hunt real places, like the hunting public, dan infalt and others and you'll see how common it is to wound deer or lose them. They have it happen at least once or twice every season. And the guys with all those big deer also get to hunt Iowa Illinois and Kansas literally every single day of season
@@ranchosenderoyou can have a full wall if you hunt for 30 years shoot 100s of animals and lose over half of them too. I will trust and listen to 30 years of science and experience compared to the bouncing off shots with “what in the hell, how did that happen.”
I have a 29” draw and went to 560 gr setup with 200 up front and felt like I lost too much speed and distance at that weight so I dropped it to a 500gr total setup with 187gr up front and feel like it’s perfect at 70lb draw weight
I would like to see a trajectory comparison at different distances between a 580-ish and a 460-ish arrow. I hunt some really thick areas where I feel like the trajectory of a heavier arrow will not allow me to thread the needle on the shots I take.
Yeah, I kept an open mind, built an entire setup based on the ranch fairy bs, and it fell extremely short where I hunt. You’re not going to have much luck with this setup out west hunting mule deer and coues deer, I promise you that. If all you ever do is tree stand hunt out to 20 yards, more power to you.
I use the grim reaper whitetail specials razor tip. No where near the experience you have. But the 175lb 8pt I got last year was 20yd double lung. Ran 40yds and dropped. Had good blood after the first 10 yds. Good size entry and massive exit
Great review, you are very well spoken.
I can’t remember the data but he goes over arrow drop with heavy arrows and short draw lengths. While it is some it’s not as much as one might believe But the energy is still there and ample. Great video.
I shoot a heavier arrow. My build is hand loaded for my bow my shooting and the limitations I set for myself to make ME more confident in the woods. With that being said math doesn't lie. And if you go back on a lot of RF's videos he says for deer 550 is perfectly fine, as long as you have perfect store flight and the single bevel. The single bevel is the mechanical advantage because it applies torque and rotation after contact. However if your confidence is in the (flapper) mechanical broad head, and you have the luxury of being more selective with your shot, do what you do. As long as it's ethical and puts the animals down quickly.
Very nice! I like the heavier set up , not crazy , 400 arrow 150 magnus !
First off, 4 of the top 5 items in the Ashby reports are addressed in selecting the proper equipment (look at Grizzlystiks tapered arrows with extreme FOC & structurally sound designs using single bevel Samurai broadheads of razor sharp 440C stainless steel. Their setups cover all of these incredibly important issues). Arrow flight is therefore the only item that archery hunters need to focus on once the right arrow shafts/inserts & broadheads are chosen. This is assuming you have a decent bow that can deliver consistently accurate & properly spined & straight arrows out of.
Then you can choose the arrow weight based on your quarry. For example, elk-sized game & above need more penetration power than do javalina or coues whitetail in Arizona, so a 650gr. build is more appropriate for the larger game like elk etc. Virginia whitetails can & do get big, so a heavier than light arrow setup is more appropriate for them, but perhaps not as heavy as elk-sized or larger game should be hunted with.
The rest is up to the shooter being an accurate shot & then the equipment to take proper care of the meat!
I shot a doe with a 425 grain arrow. 100 grain G5 montec fixed head, didn’t go 20 yards. Shot straight through the heart. It’s all about shot placement and hitting vitals. People read too much into arrow setups.
I've hunted with 430 grain arrows out of my compound for almost 20 years. Fixed blades do work, and I've had passthroughs on every deer I've shot with it. However, shooting traditional bows for over 10 years has taught me that arrow setups absolutely matter. Also, those 100 grain points suck because they're just disposable razors - and expensive ones at that! You have to buy a new one damn near every shot!
I urge you to keep and open mind and try it before you knock it. Using a compound bow, a 650 grain arrow will have more energy on impact than a 450 grain arrow will have AT LAUNCH. That equals massive penetration factor, especially if you mess up and strike the humerous/scapula.
Because most of my shots in 20 years have been under 20 yards, I have switched to heavier arrows because of what traditional archery taught me.
Real science we can trust!
Loved your point at the end. There are those who do not like hunting, let alone archery hunting. Let's be as lethal as we can and not give a foothold to the anti hunting crowd.
Any chance you shot it across a chronograph?If so what was your your fps.?
@@t.r.martin8947 my FPS was 252
Awesome 👏 test results thanks for sharing your findings from a stellar venison 🍖🥩 acquisition season and four great bucks 🦌 that anyone would be proud of.
Great remarks and actually going down Ed’s list, sadly most folks only focus on one thing and don’t look into the rest.
Arrows are like hammers in that there are different size ones that do better in one task vs another.
One thing I want to point out, that most misinterpret from Dr. Ashby's reports, and has been discussed on Ranch Fairy... is that Arrow Mass is item 6, but heavy 650 grain arrows are item 12.
Basically, item 6 is to be interpreted as "have enough mass, to capture your bows energy, and get the job done"
Item 12 is "if you encounter heavy bones, 650 grain is required to have a near guarantee of pass-through"
Nowhere does it say you must shoot heavy arrows... only that IF you encounter heavy bones (spine, scapula, etc.) ...but especially on large game like Elk, Moose, Bear, Bison.
This is why I want to see modern equipment used for an upated Ashby Report. If you check 11/12 boxes with a super fast, expandable setup, of top-quality construction, and descent mass... I think you'll be fine as long as you don't need to shoot a cape-buffalo in the shoulder.
Great video, and I love Dr. Ashby's research and interviews!!!
My thoughts are The blood trans are hard but if you only have to track fifty yards then its like no deal at all the farther I've had to track one is 60 yards with a 654 grain arrow and a grizlystick samari 200 grain
Great bucks! None of those hits really tested the arrow setup tho. Shots straight through the ribs like that don’t take a ton of energy to get a pass through. I tend to shoot on the heavier side simply because most of my shots are close (average for my last ten bucks is 9.8 yards) and I like to shoot them far forward in the vital V. I’m also not afraid to take a 1/4 to shot and put it in front of the shoulder (at close range of course). A heavier arrow and solid fixed blade works great for those types of shots. I will say that if someone tends to hit farther back (we all have that buddy lol) a bigger head is better in that situation. I think a good middle of the road setup at around 550gr with a solid fixed blade is a great setup for whitetail. With the longbow I like to be over 600gr. I shot a doe through both shoulders with a 630 gr arrow and VPA single bevel and it buried to the fletching and she was down inside 60 yards.
Loved the video. I too went Ranch Fairy 600 grain single bevel. Killed two nice deer last year and like you have the confidence to put the BH close to the shoulder. Thanks for the bible verse at the end!
You bet!
Well stated. Grateful for the honest testing. May the Lord bless you as you provide meat for your family.
Awesome video!!! I wonder why #4 had a great blood trail and the others did not.
I am interested in that as well. The best I can come up with is that blood trails are variable. You never hit it in the same spot with the same angle.
Big fan of Troy and his knowledge! I switched my set up for both my compound and traditional bows based on his research and the Ashby studies. First deer I killed with that set up and I was sold! Troy knows what it takes to kill animals and every bow hunter should consider lethality (which includes accuracy) over everything else. Quick and ethical kills is the goal!
The problem is the accuracy. A 650 grain arrow is off by feet if you make even the slightest error in ranging an animal.
@@progradepainting3755accuracy should never be a problem. These upper 500s to heavier set ups are for 30 and under shots.
Love the scripture at the end❤ God bless
So you drew the ammo plant! Been trying for 8 damn years!
It took me 5
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE my buddy at work drew 3 years in a row! Can you believe that shit 😂
@@mikeguy9668 Sounds about right haha. That the luck of the draw in a bonus point system haha.
Usually what i recommend when someone asks for advice for arrows is to at least consider RF. “Adult arrows” do work and are definitely worth trying but i will never, ever, tell somebody that RF arrows are end all be all and anything else is wrong.
I used to be on the RF bandwagon and i ended up leaving. I saw some very cultish things in that group and decided i couldn’t support it. I’m not gonna be part of a cult where some of the members think they have final say in what arrow build somebody shoots.
Did the change in your arrow set up quiet down your bow? What were the effects of the heavier arrow on you bow?
It was very quiet and the bow tuned beautifully. My bow liked the arrow and setup but it slowed it down substantially
Just like hunting with a 3 pound spear. Yeah it works close, but further away won't work.
Back in late 90s I used a 50 lb draw weight an a 330 grain arrow for everything I killed as a teen. I used a walmart muzzy 125 grain an had pass threw on all my bucks. I have video of 200lb boar I stuck threw the heart, pass threw, an sprayed blood 5 feet out of both sides.
As a bowhunter and a former guide I say - Whatever you do, experiment and do what works for you, your budget, your hunting environment, the game you are going for, your skill set and your equipment.
Heavier set ups tend to be more forgiving on impact. Lighter set ups tend to be more forgiving with accuracy. There are pros and cons to both setups and I have seen both fail epically as a guide. I was not guiding in a state that allowed mechanicals at the time so I have no comment on those but when you are looking at your set up you have to really put every thing together.
For me I only hunt hunt with a R/D Longbow and my arrow set up shooting out of a 52# bow with my draw length is a 621 Grain Total with 19 % FOC . Shooting 3 Blade VPA 200 grain heads, 100 grain inserts with AAE PHNX Hybrid vanes.
I break several "rules" with traditional. Shooting "vanes" designed for traditional and shooting off a rest but I dont really care because I like it. With my set up I am going for a slight drop in my gaps because I need to have shorter point on and shorter gaps just to improve my aiming. For a guy that shoots only instinctive it becomes more of an issue with what trajectory the archer likes seeing.
I also hunt in pretty dense and wet areas so my shooting lanes are shorter. I have never shot at anything over 30 yards.
Man, I really appreciate you taking the time to reply with a thoughtful answer to the pros and cons of each side. At the end of the day, we think people should shoot what gives them confidence and at the end of the day go out and get experience and then make changes. It doesn’t have to be perfect for start and it’ll get better over time.
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE Well said. I distance myself from online debate about it typically because everyone has a different experience and circumstance but they want to argue as if everyone is experiencing the same thing . As a guide if we were on the "wet side" of the mountain we would recommend a completely different set up than if we were hunting open dry country on the dry side.
However at the end of the day it came down to "Are you confident? Does it do the job? " I can tell someone that 4 blade bleeders are not great for 15 yard shots out of a tree in rain conditions in dense green forest because I have seen that set up fail so many times but if that set up is what puts the arrow in the deadly V then that is what you need to use.
The first thing many archers think when they hear FOC is HEAVY ARROW, NOT INTERESTED. Actually, the ASHBY emphasis is on broadheads that can survive heavy bone strikes, improved arrow flight via FOC, using A LIGHTER SHAFT with a HEAVIER POINT. Add the science of the bone splitting performance of a single bevel and your arrow lethality goes up exponentially. The emphasis that Ashby and Ranch promote is to aim at the most lethal part of the kill zone, which is forward in the rib cage crowding the shoulder. This holds the largest blood vessels in the lungs, the heart itself, and the arteries coming off the heart. If you hit here, the deer will go down much quicker, either in sight, or you may hear it go down just out of sight, no blood trail needed. A side plus is that many times these arrow systems will completely pass thru and you get an arrow refund.
If this is the case why does the ashby study end up recommending 650+ gr for whitetails, and why does ranch fairy say things like "550gr is where you stop wounding game to death"
It is absolutely a push for heavy high foc arrows, with little single bevel 2 blades.
If the goal is to kill the animal as quickly as possible, by shooting it in the most lethal spot, why are we then told to do so with the smallest heads? If the goal is to dispatch game quickly you will not do that faster on a large scale by creating less tissue damage.
@@papajohnsy6659 Heavy bone strikes
I snorted fairy dust, and I’m happy with it.
I shoot a 718 piss middle from my 70# setup, and a 767,867, and 1020 Lincoln log from my 90# setup.
Whitetails within 20 yards, doesnt matter.
Considering The Ranch Fairy doesn't tune his bow, his arrows aren't flying efficiently from the jump, so he has to over tune his arrow and make it weigh ridiculous amounts to absorb all of the bows shortcomings.
Dont snort the fairy dust.
It would have been nice to know what bow, draw length and draw weight you shot these arrows out of. It is part of the data that makes a different and helps people compare. A guy shooting 80lbs at 31” is not the same as a 57lbs 28 1/2”draw guy.
The one thing that can’t be denied is ranch fairy has opened people eyes and not just opening a package screwing on a head and taking off into the woods I wonder how many people actually checked or knew how sharp the head was before just trying to kill a deer with it
@@dbuckner902010 I've only been into archery's hunting for a few years now, and I can tell you it's scary how many idiots can't hold a fist sized ground at 20 who are out there hunting. Ran into some guy last weekend at the range who got one last year but I legit watched him hit his release mid pull and shoot and arrow 300 yards off into the woods.
Buddy had no idea what his arrow set-up was and was just ordering the cheapest arrows off Amazon.
Great video very informative. With this upcoming election everyone needs to hear Luke 11:17
Agree brother!
This is good for short shots 20-30yds. This would be garbage hunting out west where 60 yds is pretty typical. I shoot a 420g arrow, 60lb limbs, with a 27” draw and have a complete pass threw at 60 yds with a fixed G5 double lung. Blood trail sucks though.. luckily I haven’t lost an animal yet but going to try an expandable in increase my draw weight to 65lb. I’ll take Dudley’s advice over the fairy
What sharpening tool is shown in this video? Anyone know?
This is the one: a.co/d/fiXL1Xe
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE Thanks!
Good job! 15% foc is right at the bottom of what Troy recommends though. Most of the Australian arrow company’s arrows have about 60g outserts. So this, even with a 125g broad head gives reasonable foc. Took 2 Billy goats with one shot, complete pass through both when I switched. Van Diemen single Bevel.
I find it hard to believe you guys shoot piss ant 100g fancy broad heads on just a 10g insert at game like deer!
Can I ask what Unit you hunted on McCallester?
Hominy
@@HUNTERSADVANTAGE drew deer creek this year. I’m pretty excited. Not sure if you have or not. But do you have any information on your experience? Key takeaways?
I would expect all these kills would have had the same results with a lighter set up. I went this way for two years and went back to the 425gr with a good fixed head. I shot 60 ls and 27" draw. The 550 arrow i was shooting was devastating to my trajectory. Resulting in high hits and deer ducking the arrow more than normal. I thing broad head design and sharpness play a huge roll. A good fixed head on a 400 gr arrow to be a good balance for myself.
Switched to s 550gr setup with 150gr cut on contact a few years ago. Killed 10 deer since then, and every single 1 has fallen in sight, and every single arrow passed through.
Hard to argue with actual results. My bow is setup at 28.5" draw, 62lbs, and deadly out to 45. When you hunt deer in the woods, and not over a feeder or food plot, youre not getting a shot past 40 anyways.
Side note, watch troy and rocketmans research on kinetic energy at distance. A heavier arrow has less energy loss at 60 yards, than a light arrow. Its just facts, and unfortunately too many people cant accept they might be wrong
At 60 yards the heavier arrow had more energy than the light arrow at the bow
I’m new to bow hunting myself, but I spent some time prodding people on archery forums about the RF setup. I learned quickly that RF haters often make two distinct claims. First, deer will jump out of the way of your slow arrows. And second, no arrow will penetrate shoulder consistently. Weight doesn’t matter. Another common theme I’ve noticed is the people who make these claims shoot sub-500 with mechanical broadheads exclusively. Yet the people who shoot 500+ with SB heads constantly prove them wrong. I’m not saying 500+ SB heads are the only way to go because I have no authority to do so, but I am saying that people will make claims about things they know nothing about! And I plan on switching to 500-550 gr SB heads myself after watching a 100gr COC head fold on contact with a rib in a perfect broadside shot and fail to pass through
Flappers are mechanicals the lighter arrows are twizzlers 😂😂😂
I switched to adult arrows with 175 fixed upfront and I blow threw bone now
27.5" DL at 65#, old DXT solo cam.. is this enuff to run a 500+ grain arrow set up with a rear deploying Sevr 1.75?
Probably shouldn't. Shoot a stinger or a slick trick and actually get penetration
Got a double lung pass through at 52 yards with my v3x 33 at 65# this season on a nice buck In an open field. 525 grain micro diameter arrow with a sevr 2.0. I’ve killed many deer with the exact arrow setup between 60-70# on multiple bows with zero issues. It hits hard and crushes bones. Sure a fixed blade would do the job better but I’ve been using sevrs for years and practice with em at multiple ranges so I know exact arrow flight and with the results I’ve gotten out of em I probably won’t change anytime soon. I’m not positive the fps of the older bows but I would think you’d be alright. Whitetails aren’t hard to get good penetration on unless you hit shoulder blades. Even in that case I shot a buck a few years back at 60# 27.5 draw with a Hoyt vector and I was using a rage hypodermic with around a 415 grain arrow at 30 yards and it went through the shoulder being a double lung shot and the arrow stuck in the offside shoulder. No pass through but the deer didn’t make it 50 yards before piling up. Ranch fairy’s testing is primarily done on hogs with thick skin and he usually only tests with fixed blades. From my findings a heavier arrow even with sevrs still get optimal energy and penetration vs a lighter arrow with a fixed blade. Which is why traditional guys shoot heavy arrows. The extra kinetic energy definitely helps but there comes a point where I feel heavier arrows aren’t needed like say over 550 grains for a whitetail. Most whitetail guys I’d say use 425-475 grain arrows give or take to get the best mix of kinetic energy and not have tons of arrow drop. I’m sure there are kids out there running sevr 1.5s with lighter draw weights because they will still open with lighter draws from only being held shut with the rubber bands but having good FOC definitely comes into play also. They even market them for lower poundage/ short draw users. Something I’ve actually used for brodhead testing before was an elk shoulder blade that I purchased at a farm and home store marketed as a dog chew to see how much penetration I’d get based off of different brodheads. You may be able to do something similar if you’re skeptical.
Awesome video! I will say that I believe your pass throughs are not because your arrow is heavy, but rather because of your Broadhead selection. I think it would be neat if you kept this format for next year but shot a 425gr arrow with the same single bevel broadhead. Also, you made good shots and that is the most important thing.
4 big bucks in one year is crazy.
Good video. But remember to note that The importance of Arrow Weight is not in the top 5 factors. But when you hit bone the Arrow weight becomes one of the top 3 factors for penetration. I’m not making that up, it comes from Dr. Ashby.
I also shoot Thunderheads 100s and 430 grain arrows. It is very, very rare that I don’t get a complete pass through and great bloodtrail. Everyone of these deer you shot, I would have had a complete pass through with my setup. Zero chance I ever go heavier than what I’m shooting now or ever use micro arrows. 👍
Awesome video
Thank you!!