If you still have the 12-60 leica, could you record a shot to show how it looks when shooting manual exposure @ 2.8 and zoom from 12 to 60mm. I'd like to see if the change to f/4 makes the shot too dark by comparison and thus unusable.
I have to ship it back today but I will see if I can do it before I send it back! If not I will do it with the MKI tomorrow. Any particular settings you would like to see?
i actually prefer the camera dual IS only over the others. how did you get it to look so natural and "unsharp"? did you blur it? sometime footage looks so sharp it looks amateurish.
KnightVision Media thank you! I didn't realize there were two kinds of Dual IS available. I'll definitely play your video again to see how big the differences are and if it justifies selling/buying the new versions.
There most certainly are :) Dual IS I is from the GX85, and older lenses with the G85 and GH5. The new Dual IS II is more fine-tuned for the lens and sensor stab to work together.
I'm just uploading a straight comparison between the mk1 and mk2 lenses. I did a running test with the Gimbal to really show the shakes and the MK2 is the clear winner!
Thanks for doing this test! I'm definitely getting the GH5 this Spring, but I'm having trouble deciding which lens to go with at first. I'm stuck between the 12-35 mkii, and the Leica 12-60. Which did you like most, and why? I'm not concerned about special-case uses as I have some FD glass and can always rent lenses for jobs, but as far as a kit lens that will stay on the camera most of the time, which would you recommend?
Joe Oberster personally I would go 12-60 Leica for the higher quality optics and longer reach. The dual is II is a bonus too! But I will say the 12-35mk I is an incredible lens and one that won't be leaving my camera anytime soon :)
Is the image quality of the 12-60 Leica significantly better than the 12-35 mkII that you wouldn't miss the fixed 2.8 aperture across all the focal lengths? If you still have both lenses with you, would it be possible to have an aperture and image quality comparison? That would be amazing! 🙌
very helpful to see theses comparisons. could you possibly do a test of the 12-35II at 2.8 and same shot with leica 12-60mm at 2.8 pls ? i ordered the lit with 12-35II then read the mark 1 was getting firmware update to dual is2, and didn't seem worth the extra money for the mk2, then the panasonic guy said after using the 12-60 leica he couldn't see himself using the 12-35 mk2 again , so i ordered the leica kit! now panasonic said mark 1 12-35 won't be dualis2. did i order the right lens ? 12-60 leica looked soft in your test. which lens did you like?? thanks for your opinion
I unfortunately just sent the MK2 back to Panasonic this morning :( I just finished shooting a MK1 vs MK2 comparison running on the gimbal as well as handheld! Unfortunately the MK 1 isn't getting the update to Dual IS 2 due to hardware limitations as far as I know. The 12-60 is incredible!
KnightVision Media great test, this camera is awesome ! Could you also make a test of ISO 3200 & 6400 on the GH5 and in the same confidtion on 6d/5dmark3 or A6300? I will appreciate ! :)
Thank you! This thing is a beast. I have lots of footage to share when I get a chance to edit it! I will be doing several ISO tests this week so be sure to check it out here later this week. I could compare the GH5 with 12-35mm f2.8 to the Canon 5D mkiii with 24-70 at those isos for a comparison for you.
Man,that Ronin / Dual IS combo is SERIOUS. Warp stabilizer can't save shaky footage and even if it does, it degrades it IMHO. Is there Dual IS 1 or you just refer to the GH5 / 12-35 mk1 combo?? I thought there was only Dual IS 2 with the use of the mk2 version of the lenses.. Anyway, thx a lot for the test!!
It's buttery buttery smooth ;) I agree, I use warp stabilizer only when it's to get rid of small bumps and rolling shutter. Dual IS (1) is just referred to as Dual IS when you use lenses like the 12-35 and 35-100 mkI models on cameras like the GX85 and G85. It happened so fast that the GX85 was the first sensor that supported Dual IS, but by the time the G85 came out, they had already created a new stabilizer and a lens to support Dual IS 2, but the other lenses still work in Dual IS mode just not 2
So, GH5 has 2 modes of DUAL IS?? Both DUAL IS 1 & DUAL IS 2 ?? Well, I think that Ronin is money SO well spent.. It's really professional, it looks like cinematic movement.. I thought that GH5 with DUAL IS 2 would eliminate the need for a gimbal stabilizer, but it's not there yet, even with the use of warp stabilizer ( for handheld footage )
I've seen so many videos of the GH5 in the past week must be easily about 40 or more and everytime i've seen the Panasonic 12-35mm lens i've not liked it, the clarity is ok'ish but the image looks a tad soft compared to other lenses. I wasn't sure so I Googled the lens and saw a review on Ephotozine which showed the resolution the lens can capture and it's not great. The best lens i've seen videos from is the Sigma 18-35mm although the bad thing is it doesn't come in four thirds mount so you need an adapter and then can't use autofocus. I'm getting a GH5 in a few weeks time and after reading many reviews of lenses and watching videos i'll be getting the Panasonic 25mm f1.7 Leica DG for a starter lens and then a few weeks later a Sigma 19mm f2.8 and then later this year an Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 75mm f1.8.
Why use Warp Stabilizer with these settings when it makes look so ugly, artificial, the jello jitter, it looks terrible. I don't mean to be overcritical of the test because I do appreciate the effort of putting this together but from all footage I've seen so far, I don't know if it was done on purpose but this was a pretty bad handheld test, it was pretty much all over the place except the gimbal ones. Again, I say that because I've seen some pretty good handheld DUAL IS footage out there and it look very stable, even walking backwards but in this test, it didn't look even stabilized, maybe it's simply something you are not particularly good at or something, but it makes it harder to evaluate and set some parameters when I know I've seen better. Thanks for taking your time and making this test.
I was in a rush for daylight or I would have done a better job probably haha. I have gotten much better results moving slower, but I was also dodging chunks of ice on the sidewalk and trying to keep the tracking on his face. The warp stabilizer was just to show an example, but of course you can get much better results when planning for it, I just wanted to get as many different lenses and options in a short amount of time :) I will do some better tests this week though so stay tuned!
No problem, looking forward to it. As I said it's just that when things are a bit all over the place, it's hard to set parameters to make proper comparisons with things I've seen. So I can't quite know how much better or worse something is and it ends up with more questions than answers. I don't mean to be demanding but based on what you just said, I would say, when you are in a rush or you know you can't quite pull off what you want, make it simpler but execute it well, it will always be better to have a bit less but well executed than an extensive and detailed one that can't be as useful. At least I think it matters, but that's up to each person. Thanks!
Well, first of all, I'm not against including it, I criticized the fact that it was poorly done, be it because of user or because of the plugin limitation, it doesn't matter. More importantly, I've seen tons of DUAL IS + Gimbal footage and not once I've seen people asking for any software stabilization, well, simply because it's not really needed and this is the first time I've seen someone doing it as well. Gimbal's weakness is the Y axis when people walk, you don't need to cause artifacts when panning the camera, for instance. Don't mix things up.
I have used my GX85 and G85 for tracking shots in the past as long as I was careful with my walk and used my arms to absorb the bounce I was able to get some great stuff! But yes, with the gimbal and IS you can get some insanely smooth shots. Add warp stabilizer on top of that and it will be flawless
Have seen some really steady shots with the GX85 with different lenses. Even with only the inhouse stabilization. Walking will be hard but handheld panning and tilting should work out great I guess.
I accidentally wrote (OFF) for the second Leica 12-60 shot, but that one is with it on.
If you still have the 12-60 leica, could you record a shot to show how it looks when shooting manual exposure @ 2.8 and zoom from 12 to 60mm. I'd like to see if the change to f/4 makes the shot too dark by comparison and thus unusable.
could you do a running test with the roninm + 12-35mm II?
I have to ship it back today but I will see if I can do it before I send it back! If not I will do it with the MKI tomorrow. Any particular settings you would like to see?
Have a look at this video, hopefully it gives you a good idea! I just finished it.
ua-cam.com/video/z5-LamMSicg/v-deo.html
This is very informative, massive thanks!!
You are very welcome! I will be releasing several other videos putting the lenses side by side
Is that last shot Dual IS 2 (ON) ?
orange42 yes it is, I noticed that afterwards :(
i actually prefer the camera dual IS only over the others.
how did you get it to look so natural and "unsharp"?
did you blur it?
sometime footage looks so sharp it looks amateurish.
Do you have comments on gimbal work for apertures lower than 4?
Thanks for this! So no Dual IS for the first generation 12-35 and 35-100?
dacloo they have dual is, not dual is 2. Only new lenses will have dual is 2
KnightVision Media thank you! I didn't realize there were two kinds of Dual IS available. I'll definitely play your video again to see how big the differences are and if it justifies selling/buying the new versions.
There most certainly are :) Dual IS I is from the GX85, and older lenses with the G85 and GH5. The new Dual IS II is more fine-tuned for the lens and sensor stab to work together.
I'm just uploading a straight comparison between the mk1 and mk2 lenses. I did a running test with the Gimbal to really show the shakes and the MK2 is the clear winner!
Thanks for doing this test! I'm definitely getting the GH5 this Spring, but I'm having trouble deciding which lens to go with at first. I'm stuck between the 12-35 mkii, and the Leica 12-60. Which did you like most, and why? I'm not concerned about special-case uses as I have some FD glass and can always rent lenses for jobs, but as far as a kit lens that will stay on the camera most of the time, which would you recommend?
Joe Oberster personally I would go 12-60 Leica for the higher quality optics and longer reach. The dual is II is a bonus too!
But I will say the 12-35mk I is an incredible lens and one that won't be leaving my camera anytime soon :)
KnightVision Media so the Leica has the same comparability with the IS as the 12-35 mkii does?
Is the image quality of the 12-60 Leica significantly better than the 12-35 mkII that you wouldn't miss the fixed 2.8 aperture across all the focal lengths? If you still have both lenses with you, would it be possible to have an aperture and image quality comparison? That would be amazing! 🙌
Pedro Gomes unfortunately
I had to give back the camera and lenses :( but I have to say the extra reach was well worth the f4 aperture!
very helpful to see theses comparisons. could you possibly do a test of the 12-35II at 2.8 and same shot with leica 12-60mm at 2.8 pls ?
i ordered the lit with 12-35II then read the mark 1 was getting firmware update to dual is2, and didn't seem worth the extra money for the mk2,
then the panasonic guy said after using the 12-60 leica he couldn't see himself using the 12-35 mk2 again , so i ordered the leica kit!
now panasonic said mark 1 12-35 won't be dualis2.
did i order the right lens ? 12-60 leica looked soft in your test. which lens did you like??
thanks for your opinion
I unfortunately just sent the MK2 back to Panasonic this morning :( I just finished shooting a MK1 vs MK2 comparison running on the gimbal as well as handheld!
Unfortunately the MK 1 isn't getting the update to Dual IS 2 due to hardware limitations as far as I know. The 12-60 is incredible!
thanks for the reply. encouraging about the 12-60 leica :-) look forward to you next videos
KnightVision Media great test, this camera is awesome ! Could you also make a test of ISO 3200 & 6400 on the GH5 and in the same confidtion on 6d/5dmark3 or A6300? I will appreciate ! :)
Thank you! This thing is a beast. I have lots of footage to share when I get a chance to edit it!
I will be doing several ISO tests this week so be sure to check it out here later this week. I could compare the GH5 with 12-35mm f2.8 to the Canon 5D mkiii with 24-70 at those isos for a comparison for you.
Thank you very much, i am subscribing your channel and can't wait for results :) Regards !
Man,that Ronin / Dual IS combo is SERIOUS.
Warp stabilizer can't save shaky footage and even if it does, it degrades it IMHO.
Is there Dual IS 1 or you just refer to the GH5 / 12-35 mk1 combo?? I thought there was only Dual IS 2 with the use of the mk2 version of the lenses..
Anyway, thx a lot for the test!!
It's buttery buttery smooth ;)
I agree, I use warp stabilizer only when it's to get rid of small bumps and rolling shutter.
Dual IS (1) is just referred to as Dual IS when you use lenses like the 12-35 and 35-100 mkI models on cameras like the GX85 and G85. It happened so fast that the GX85 was the first sensor that supported Dual IS, but by the time the G85 came out, they had already created a new stabilizer and a lens to support Dual IS 2, but the other lenses still work in Dual IS mode just not 2
So, GH5 has 2 modes of DUAL IS?? Both DUAL IS 1 & DUAL IS 2 ??
Well, I think that Ronin is money SO well spent.. It's really professional, it looks like cinematic movement..
I thought that GH5 with DUAL IS 2 would eliminate the need for a gimbal stabilizer, but it's not there yet, even with the use of warp stabilizer ( for handheld footage )
I've seen so many videos of the GH5 in the past week must be easily about 40 or more and everytime i've seen the Panasonic 12-35mm lens i've not liked it, the clarity is ok'ish but the image looks a tad soft compared to other lenses. I wasn't sure so I Googled the lens and saw a review on Ephotozine which showed the resolution the lens can capture and it's not great. The best lens i've seen videos from is the Sigma 18-35mm although the bad thing is it doesn't come in four thirds mount so you need an adapter and then can't use autofocus. I'm getting a GH5 in a few weeks time and after reading many reviews of lenses and watching videos i'll be getting the Panasonic 25mm f1.7 Leica DG for a starter lens and then a few weeks later a Sigma 19mm f2.8 and then later this year an Olympus M.Zuiko Digital 75mm f1.8.
TAKE A LOOK THIS SMAL DEVICE SteadXP
i don't like the warp stabilizer. if fucks with the image. the ronan WITH the dual IS is TOO STEADY!!! to me.
just camera dual IS on is perfect.
Why use Warp Stabilizer with these settings when it makes look so ugly, artificial, the jello jitter, it looks terrible.
I don't mean to be overcritical of the test because I do appreciate the effort of putting this together but from all footage I've seen so far, I don't know if it was done on purpose but this was a pretty bad handheld test, it was pretty much all over the place except the gimbal ones.
Again, I say that because I've seen some pretty good handheld DUAL IS footage out there and it look very stable, even walking backwards but in this test, it didn't look even stabilized, maybe it's simply something you are not particularly good at or something, but it makes it harder to evaluate and set some parameters when I know I've seen better.
Thanks for taking your time and making this test.
I was in a rush for daylight or I would have done a better job probably haha. I have gotten much better results moving slower, but I was also dodging chunks of ice on the sidewalk and trying to keep the tracking on his face.
The warp stabilizer was just to show an example, but of course you can get much better results when planning for it, I just wanted to get as many different lenses and options in a short amount of time :)
I will do some better tests this week though so stay tuned!
No problem, looking forward to it. As I said it's just that when things are a bit all over the place, it's hard to set parameters to make proper comparisons with things I've seen. So I can't quite know how much better or worse something is and it ends up with more questions than answers. I don't mean to be demanding but based on what you just said, I would say, when you are in a rush or you know you can't quite pull off what you want, make it simpler but execute it well, it will always be better to have a bit less but well executed than an extensive and detailed one that can't be as useful. At least I think it matters, but that's up to each person. Thanks!
You know very well that if he hadn't included it the first thing someone would say is "why didn't you try using WS as well?"
Well, first of all, I'm not against including it, I criticized the fact that it was poorly done, be it because of user or because of the plugin limitation, it doesn't matter. More importantly, I've seen tons of DUAL IS + Gimbal footage and not once I've seen people asking for any software stabilization, well, simply because it's not really needed and this is the first time I've seen someone doing it as well. Gimbal's weakness is the Y axis when people walk, you don't need to cause artifacts when panning the camera, for instance. Don't mix things up.
wow dual IS 2 is so much better than dual IS 1
I noticed quite a difference as well. I'm going to put the two lenses head to head so you can see them side by side
Thanks! Lots like a big difference from what I can see. I will still be using gimbal but nice if its possible to make small moves without shakes.
I have used my GX85 and G85 for tracking shots in the past as long as I was careful with my walk and used my arms to absorb the bounce I was able to get some great stuff! But yes, with the gimbal and IS you can get some insanely smooth shots. Add warp stabilizer on top of that and it will be flawless
Have seen some really steady shots with the GX85 with different lenses. Even with only the inhouse stabilization. Walking will be hard but handheld panning and tilting should work out great I guess.
Can't wait!
Fuck warp stabilizer