@@clackman622He’s a character from an already represented franchise. As big as he is, cloud is bigger, and he realistically cannot be kept in a cut this big
Videos like this are why I'm convinced Smash Bros will never cut half of Ultimates roster. I could totally see 25 cuts max but everything else would be too severe.
@@AeonKnigh432 ice climbers were cut for tech limits though. Same reason why Zelda got split from transforming into sheik, would load too many characters.
@@AeonKnigh432as long as the technology / release gimmicks allow for it, icies most likely will remain. Otherwise you are correct, Dr mario or even Lucas or Mewtwo are probably more likely
@@gringusgamingi think mewtwo and greninja stay. I can maybe see mewtwo cut IF Pokemon trainer is back. The only reason greninja over mewtwo would be since we are going back to Kalos in the next Pokemon game and it can be possibly a redone rep
@@wooperman6960 I don't think the next smash game will come around within window you would want to promote legends ZA but u never know. If it did, greninja would probably be the pick. That said, I would imagine that most pokemon would be staying just by virtue of the fact that they are pokemon
Vs. Ice Climber 1985 Arcade Nintendo Vs. Series Ice Climber 1985 Famicom/NES [13] Ice Climber 1985 NEC PC-8801 Published by Hudson Soft Ice Climber 1988 Famicom Disk System Port of Vs. Ice Climber Ice Climber-e 2002 e-Reader Barcoded cards, readable with e-Reader and Game Boy Advance. Ice Climber 2004 Game Boy Advance Classic NES Series Ice Climber 2007 Wii Virtual Console Ice Climber 2011 3DS Virtual Console Ice Climber 2013 Wii U Virtual Console Ice Climber 2018 Nintendo Switch Nintendo Switch Online VS. Ice Climber 2019 Nintendo Switch Arcade Archives Bet you feel real dumb rn
ROB deserves to stay. He literally SAVED the video game industry, ya don't just cut him. No, I'm not biased, and no, I do not have an authentic Japanese ROB on my shelf making me say this...
Combining echo fighters into existing characters as high tier (unlockable) skins would allow all echoe fighters to be technically cut while keeping them on the roster.
@PipS03 yes imagine like classic mode would unlock a classic skin, story mode would unlock echo skins, something like hovering would unlock a sports based skin (ie: mario tennis, strikers etc..) and playing say 10, 20, 50, 100, 500, 1000, etc..matches unlocks the pallette skins with the highest number unlocking gold skins or something.)
"The OG's are immune" Thank frickin god, if Fox actually didn't appear again it would have been the last straw after the lack of starfox in the switch era.
That’s not entirely true, at least for earlier games. During Melee’s development, they were gonna replace Ness with the “at the time” Mother 3 protagonist but with Mother 3 being stuck in development hell, they just reincorporated Ness. Either way I can’t see fox leaving due to its impact on melees community and the use of the super fx chip allowing for early 3d rendering on consoles.
Cutting Ike is actually such a weird decision, he's the most popular Fire Emblem male character and gives that heavyweight variety to the Fire Emblem cast. Especially if you look at current state of the Fire Emblem franchise and how often Ike is considered the #2 lord right after Marth when it comes to honoring its history
In fact, Ike is even considered the most popular male character (together with Lynn, the most popular female character) according to many polls. He is also the only non 'Lord' in the fransche, making him a very unique protagonist After Marth, Ike is the nummer 2 most deserving FE character to be in the roster
Honestly. Imo Robin gets the spot and not Byleth, but if anyone wants to argue Ike or Byleth get the spot I understand. Lucina can just be a skin for Marth. Edit: I understand what he means now. He's counting echo fighters and the OGs as a single spot. I think he could have made it a bit more clear than he did, since he provided an infographic showing the echo fighters phasing back in, seeming to have their own spots
what? I thought he said meta knight stays Brawl made MK an integral part of the smash universe and roster with subspace emissary and brawl meta knight being a legendary broken OP character also you should pray not prey
There’s no such thing as the perfect cut, the moment you cut just one single character, you’ve cut someone’s main. No matter what you do, there will always be more disappointment then those happy.
I was surprised at how much I agreed with this list until the echo fighters came in. I was happy to let ALL of them go because your baby mode roster was actually super good representation wise
@@ismailahmed4542 i believe he was talking about botw link, correct me if im wrong, but you do not collect the triforce, and the game doesn’t remotely hint of link having it, despite yl having it from when he came back in time in oot, and ww link fished it up
@@infinityheart_tm9270With Joker I see him as very replaceable For example if the next Smash releases near Persona 6 or a Persona 2 remake. Tatsuya or the new protagonist would be better picks
I personally don't like how he cut Greninja when they're the most popular Pokémon in the world. I swear half the people cutting the Smash Ultimate roster fall in the trap of "Oops! All Gen 1"
Keeping only gen 1 pokemon is most definitely not an authentic representation of the franchise. Pokemon has grown so much since gen 1 and keeping only characters from the first game(s) is ridiculous.
yeah and i had no clue what he was talking about with excluding pkmn trainer bc it's multiple fighters in one. if anything u should include him if you'll have less overall characters pkmn trainer doesnt count as 3 characters it counts as one
@@icecontrol1 you play them as one. Taking at zero suit Samus I understand because they're different characters on the selection screen but they are both Samus. I feel like it's silly to take out a good character like pk trainer just because it's 3 in 1. The key word there is "in 1"
@@thishandleisntakenyethaha In general, the reason why characters are cut is because of workload. Realistically, even if pokemon trainer is one whole, it requires the work for three characters. Even ignoring the way that smash numbers them, you can just intuit that the one character slot takes up the work of three characters. That's why in Sm4sh, they removed Squirtle and Ivy, but kept Charizard.
@@t3dp589 that's fair but that's not the sole reason for cutting characters in a future title. maybe they might want to flesh out their smaller roster more. i just figured something different than others i guess
I honestly think King Dedede should have been cut instead of little mac, like I know that 'there are hardly any superheavies' but considering how the choices were between that and axing an entire franchise with one rep (which he specifically mentioned he would go out of his way to not do) than I'd say cutting Dedede is the clear choice.
@@pr0_gam3r37I think MK’s smash legacy of being busted in Brawl warrants a pick over Dedede. If you’re good enough to have a meta game centralize around you, you deserve a spot.
I think seph should’ve represented rpg villians since he is the one of the most iconic villians in gaming history But to be fair square enix is gonna be a bitch when trying allow him into the next game ( this includes cloud aswell)
The thing is, I think it's more important that we focus more on the nintendo side of the roster than what people think about. I understand that guest characters are important and are what drive the hype for every new smash game, bur whenever someone makes one of these cut videos they always want to try to keep the biggest names like cloud, joker, or sora. I know their important for gaming as a whole and representing any franchise in smash is a big deal but I strongly believe keeping a lot these characters as one time inclusions would leave a better legacy for them, and would keep the roster feel fresh for any other potential inclusions for the next smash game.
I completely agree with that, in fact I think that some third party characters should be the first ones to go. Of course I do think a lot of them are amazing inclusion to smash, but especially with how many were introduced during the DLC, a lot of them feel really unspecial and that kills the whole point of having third party characters in the first place. Imo we should only keep the medium defining inclusion being Pac Man, Mega Man, Sonic, Ryu, Cloud and Steve. As much as I may love Snake or Joker and their respective games, I don't think they are as industry defining as just really good games, and they didn't really entered pop culture like the other did, and Kazuya and Hero may come from gendra defining franchises, but they themeselves are not really on the same footing. I think it's just very telling to see the reaction to all of these characters reveal, though some of the may make "sense" on paper, the excitement behind the inclusion of Cloud is incomparable to the way people reacted to hero (which is by the way not even a character, doesn't help it to become iconic). I think that it's important to maintain the third party spots for really exciting characters rather than making them feel trivial.
@@artimist0315 I agree with all that; except your comment on "Steve." Metal Gear as a series did a LOT for the gaming industry. Steve prints money. He's on par with Spyro for Skylanders and the bird from angry birds. He's certainly a money maker, but not important as a whole. Snake and Kayzua are still more important and I would say the "SIMS" guy would be more important than Steve. Someone from the Lego franchise as well. I could very well play SMASH without Steve and be fine.
I loved this until the very end when I looked at the final roaster and realized almost half of it is characters people universally dislike fighting against
@@LeoEmber that's not what I meant. According to your logic then the rules are on Baby-mode. They share a number on the character roster, #28 and #28ε being Pit and Dark Pit. In baby mode character's and their echos are different fighters, in the normal mode of this challenge they aren't, they're the same fighter. (You can set your settings to have echos on the same slot as their counterpart.)
the biggest problem with these videos isnt how correct or incorrect they are, is that there is no way they are cutting that many so every attempt is clearly wrong.
Eh, I feel like halving the roster would ultimately be a good decision that doesn't seem too out of left field especially since a good chunk of the fanbase expects it.
@@castform7 nobody on the fan base agree on who to cut tho, and most do that as a thought exercise, they dont really believe that many gonna be cut. smash never cut that many, and it just doesnt make sense to do that.
@@castform7it’s a double edged sword, the main appeal of Ultimate was the fact that nobody was getting cut. Halving the roster would be sure to alienate a lot of people and as someone who lost their main and wasn’t able to really mesh with another character until they were brought back as DLC, I can’t blame anyone for feeling betrayed if all the characters they enjoy playing are gone.
But shouldn't the sequel which assumingly is going to be a bigger game be able to contain all the characters from the previous game plus add more characters on top of that? So actually they shouldn't need to cut anyone right?
I surprisingly agree with everything but the Meta Knight cut. So iconic for his brawl status. He was so broken he was unofficially banned in every friend group I had 😂
I mean fair, but baby mode wasn’t *actually* a thing for me. I made all 41 cuts before I even started writing the script. Min-Min and Seph were never fighting for priority behind the scenes, she only “lasted longer” cuz I specifically saved the franchise cuts for the end of the vid
@@ProtendoLet’s see, the most iconic villain of a long lasting series versus a game that almost nobody cares about with a character that everyone hates in-game, seems fair to me
I agree with the choice because Roy barely represents his own game in Smash, let alone a good rep for the series. Roy was put in before his game was even made and in his own game he's one of the weakest characters who needs constant protection from others to succeed. He's outdated and his game has not been localized anywhere outside of Japan meaning many people who want to play the game with Roy in it have to use a fan patch and learn that he actually sucks in his own game.
This felt like watching that one World of Light trailer where everyone get picked off one by one all over again. Really solid choices though, but personally I'd cut Ridley over Little Mac just because I've never liked how weirdly tiny Ridley is. This video must have been very painful to make, I salute you sir
I’m glad I’m not the only one who felt that way about Ridley. I remember watching the trailer thinking he looked weird from the jump, and seeing him standing next to Mario all awkwardly slouched up like that was almost comical to me. His amiibo’s pretty badass tho.
Sakurai was hesitant to add ridley for years because that would mean scaling him way down and limiting his ability to fly freely. Honestly he should have stuck to his guns and refused to add him instead of giving into peer pressure. Not every character is a good fit for smash no matter how iconic they may be
every prediction video is "🤓 uhm marios not getting in nor pikachu.. actually every character from melee or 64 is cut but wii fit and minmin stays and also corrin and bayonetta"
Did you write this after watching only the baby mode cuts? I think you did~ Even if he did keep minmin in the end, it aligns with one of the main rules he set for this, which is to keep as many different games and franchises represented as possible, so he wouldn't have done it wrong, just wrong by your -biased- standards
@@CitryteYTah yes the funny low blow of "your biased teehee🤓" You say that but he literally kept the FE cast because muh main characters and cut toon link and young link immediately after the video almost seems sarcastic his reason for keeping min min was really week and could be used for anyone LMAO he cut sephiroth because "not new franchise and third party bad" after keeping Byleth because muh best selling FE game this guy isnt real💀
@@MoopersYT Putting aside that you probably seethe hard at any roster cut that doesn't completely remove Fire Emblem, cutting toon/young link and sephiroth is also in line with his rule to keep as many franchises as possible, and he eventually cut Byleth too. The only franchises to come out with more than 1 rep left are the ones that had more than one rep in smash 64, the only exceptions being Kirby because Dedede is a heavyweight, and Zelda, which still has 3 reps despite Toon Link being cut! Being mad he followed rules he set from the start is wild 💀
By his definition a franchise must have more than a single game. The Wii Fit series has more than one game while Ice Climbers only ever appears in virtual rereleases
I was ALMOST about to admit this is the best "cut the roster in half" video, until you cut Pokemon Trainer. And then Diddy Kong. And then R.O.B. And then it just went downhill from there.
While ROB has a nice fanbase in smash his legacy is being one of the most useless accessories for the NES, the other 2 really hurt, banning all ?in1 automatically is not my favorite choice, and diddy... don't make it harder than it has to be.
@@snil4I’d argue ROB is a representation from Gaming Hardware/Accessories, which are a big part of Gaming. Plus, he’s the whole reason gaming is still even a thing, as he was Nintendo’s way of repopularizing it.
@@snil4 R.O.B. is way more than just representing Nintendo peripherals. He also represents Nintendo toys too, as he was marketed as one to literally save the video game industry. And it goes without saying that he not only represents the two games he plays with, but also the Subpace Emissary, which is cleverly shown in his series icon. THAT'S why cutting R.O.B. would be a big deal, on top of having a nice fanbase. You'd be cutting out a big piece of Nintendo's history, a huge representative of Smash's own history, and just a fun, unique fighter in general. It's too bad most people don't see that, and all they see is "most useless accessory for the NES" when he's way more than that.
fun thought exorcies although i do find it funny how many youtubers attempt to cut the roster to pre brawl sized proportions which would probally kill most interest in the series
Keeping as many franchises as possible sounds like a good idea, until you realize how many 3rd parties there are with one fighter. Keeping Bayonetta, Joker, and Terry over Diddy, K. Rool and Meta Knight just wouldn't work
Ike is the most popular Fire Emblem character BY FAR, and he's treated as a huge deal in modern FE games like Awakening, Heroes, and Engage. Greninja and Lucario got 1st and 2nd place in a recent official pokemon popularity poll. The former had also won another official poll prior and his home region, Kalos, is getting a new game next year, and the latter is pretty much a secondary mascot for the series and will get shoved into just about anywhere GF/TPC can put him in. Another heavily popular character in her home series is Rosalina, and Mario can definitely afford 5 veterans in the next game even if it suffers heavy roster cuts. Finally as a more personal opinion, I would like the next smash game to focus more on Nintendo characters again. Yes the guest characters are cool and hype but I feel that most are fine as a one time special event. I would keep no more than 7 of them for the next game, and we'll probably get more 3rd party newcomers anyways. Still, always fun to see people's takes on what the next smash roster could look like :)
Yeah I agree, the 3rd party reps are hype as hell, but iirc Nintendo and Square Enix have had a tumultuous relationship as far as smash goes, and the core of smash has been Nintendo characters. I think the most interesting move might be to cut most if not all of the 3rd parties, and then add new 3rd parties in the Smash 6 DLC
The problem with those polls is that they have an extreme selection bias towards the kind of fans that are active in the online Pokemon community, and follow the series' every release very closely. If you want a look at what Pokemon are actually universally the most popular, you need to look towards what sells merchandise. Pikachu, the starters, Meowth, Snorlax, Gengar, Eevee, *and Mewtwo* make up the overwhelming majority of all Pokemon representation out in the real world. And the real world is being weighed in this ruleset. I can almost buy the argument for Lucario, but he's certainly not a secondary mascot, not by a mile. Greninja certainly had some time in the sun, but its time as especially relevant to the series is over. I kind of agree on Ike, and that he certainly should be prioritized over Byleth and Robin. But it would just be really awkward to not prioritize seniority when the only options left to cut are him and Marth. It's the reason why he didn't go for Isabelle over Villager.
about that Ike statement… other characters are also treated as huge deals. And heroes is a gacha game, practically almost every character has some amount of alts, such as corrin (mainly female I think), Ike, marth, edelgard, etc. having tons of them. I won’t deny Ike is one of the most popular characters but saying “by far” is probably a little bit of an overstatement.
If I have one really big critique with your list,I personally feel you kept too many 3rd Party characters. yeah yeah I know Smash is considered this big celebration of gaming and what not, but at the end of the day it's still a Nintendo crossover game featuring guets. And no matter what, all the 1st and even 2nd Party characters should get priority. I don't mean to say that you can't have any at all, but I do feel like a majority need to be booted. With that said, fun thought experiment.
Yeah, being real the only 3rd party that i can see always being there is Sonic, everyone else is a coin toss Sora though is 100% gone lol, no way Disney plays ball again
@@icecontrol1 Ryu Joker Snake and Cloud have staying power off series popularity. Especially in Japan where it’s more important to be popular for a smash slot.
@@icecontrol1 I don't see Megaman or Pacman gone either. The former was placed in an early area of "World of Lite" and got some of the best Spirits too. Considering how little Capcom does with him these days, someone in the Smash dev team REALLY likes him.
The pain in my chest I felt while watching this was immeasurable. Meta knight? META KNIGHT? Ive always believed that kirby needs MORE reps, but seeing him getting cut left a scar.
I doubt Meta Knight or ANY Kirby character would ever be cut, I mean the franchise is the creation of Sakurai so there is no way he would cut one of his creations
Most yes. Some are basically locked. Like there's no universe in which sonic gets cut. Ryu is probably very safe. Everyone else is up in the air, most likely due to rights. Sora is very unlikely. Minecraft would be huge but it's up to now nice Microsoft is feeling. Joker, dragon age and snake are coin flips
Kinda agree with you there aside from Marth he's probably the next best known fire emblem character. But if we were to only have 3 FE characters I think it would be how it originally was in the video Marth, Robin, and Byleth.
they'd proably keep marth over everyone else, but by every metric marth is not the most popular fire emblem character, ike lucina and byleth are above him
2 things I would change, ZERO bias/jokes. 1. Keep Lucas. He’s awesome and I’d probably die if he was completely axed outside Japan. Instead, cut Ness, he’s a ripoff of Lucas, somehow, even though he came first. 2. Add Link from Link: The Faces of Evil. I feel he’d be even a better addition than Young Link and Toon Link combined and would add some nice representation to the best LOZ game.
Sephiroth definitely needs to stay in my opinion because FINAL FANTASY 7 will have to go back to 2 songs again I think people want Sephiroth cut from the game because he's not a Broken character
if they HAD to cut characters for a reboot for whatever reason, this is good. however i do think that a new smash bros would *try* keep the characters nintendo own themselves at the very least, and just ditching the crossover characters. (we would get new ones of course)
@@eddywcbfbayonetta has been a Nintendo exclusive since the WiiU, but semantics aside, I agree with you on that. I’d add cloud to that list
How are you cutting Pokémon trainer? It’s one slot not three right? And it captures exactly what the franchise is about with having multiple monsters and switching them out. And the alt colours referencing different characters from the franchise. Not cutable
People keep talking about there being no way the next Smash game actually makes cuts as drastic as this popular thought experiment, but my big theory for the announcement trailer of the next Smash game is it being "Nobody is Here" that essentially recreates the "Everyone is Here" trailer playing in reverse and the base roster of the game explicitly excluding any character that has been playable before in the franchise (until maybe some free DLC a while after the game's launch to bring back the staples anyway), focusing on making trophy characters, alternate versions of character not tied to the established moveset legacy, and other such examples playable instead.
@@Hewer86 It's as viable as cutting the roster in half. (But, yeah, it's a long shot improbability that would make no sense from a practical standpoint. Though, some other Nintendo controlled series have made equally radical shifts, so it's only close to zero instead of being actually zero chance of happening. Can never truly predict exactly what they'll cook up next, both for good and ill.)
Depends. Some third parties are more guaranteed than others. Like even if he's third party, there's no universe where sonic doesn't stay. Most others are debatable
In the normal cut, I was honestly expecting Meta Knight to survive over Dedede through the Smash history aspect simply because nobody's ever forgetting how OP Brawl Meta was
Main obvious thing I would do is cutting more third parties and not seeing the original 12 as sacred, but I respect your perspective. When you cut literally every pokemon beyond Jigglypuff, it just boils down to Jigglypuff vs Mewtwo anyway.
- Lucario has also had perfect attendance in Pokémon since Gen 4 & his popularity rivals that of the Gen 1 'Mons, with Greninja being the #1 Pokémon period. Your Pokémon picks in general are too Gen 1-heavy. - Animal Crossing is big enough for both Villager & Isabelle to stay, and the latter is WAY too popular with the masses. - Pyra/Mythra represents the best-selling entry of Xenoblade. - In terms of coming down to the wire, wouldn't cutting Robin & having Lucina rep Awakening make more sense? And yeah, I agree that they aren't cutting the roster in half. 50 characters (counting newcomers) is the absolute floor in my eyes, especially with Studio S seemingly developing Smash again alongside Sakurai for Smash 6 based on some job listings.
In the baby mode section, where echos and fighters weigh equally, Robin is a better pick than Lucina imo. Not only is he the main character / avatar you play as during the game, but his moveset is more unique than Lucina's and represents magic users in Fire Emblem. In the final roster Lucina is the better pick due to her status as an Echo meaning that she comes along free with Marth, and so sacrificing another slot to Fire Emblem isn't worth it.
While I can see the reason to keep Pyra Mythra, I do not see the reason over keeping Shulk, which is always the challenging thing with “who to keep vs who to cut”. They may be from the best selling entry, but ultimately Shulk ties into their game and series in a way they can't in reverse given coming after (barring changes retconned into Definitive Edition for cohesion, which don't directly include them). You can also argue a bigger iconic factor with Shulk comparitive to Pyra and Mythra. While those two are huge outside of their own game, their Smash legacy is short, and the MC of their own game was cut, and they only made it in halfway through the final set of DLC. Meanwhile, Shulk immediately got a huge boost thanks to being in Smash (no part in fact to confirming the ESRB leak), and I want to personally argue that Shulk with the Monado 1 is way more iconic for the series as a whole. When it comes down to it, I think Shulk is better and more known as “the face of Xenoblade”, and if you can only afford one slot, it's harder to argue for Pyra and Mythra over that. Let alone TWO slots, which Pyra and Mythra would take as 2 in 1 fighters
I think that in the version which includes echoes all the echoes of characters which were in the remaining roster were kept, so that roster did have Lucina as an awakening rep but not Robin (or Chrom)
26:12 Doing the half cut challenge does make it much easier to predict which cuts Smash 6's roster actually will have since there will probably be less cuts than what we did in our challenge.
YOU CAN'T CUT R.O.B! He's _iconic!_ Smash Bros. is one of the only reasons people even know he exists, and he was _very_ important for Nintendo's history. If not for R.O.B. Nintendo would have had a lot more struggle getting a foothold in the western gaming market. If Smash Bros. is about representing video game history, then R.O.B. has to stay, even if just for the novelty of it. I would say he's up there with Captain Falcon and Ness for being iconic characters remembered through Smash Bros. more than their games of origin.
Not to be like "AcTuAlLy" but no, he was in Mario Kart DS, so smash isn't the only reason people remember him. But to be fair I totally agree with you.
Cutting 41 characters is insane. I understand cutting characters that have identical movesets within the same franchise. But the fact that you said "robin is safe" and then at the end go "robin is probably the most replaceable" is wild.
I'll give my opinion as quick as posible, we asume all chatacters keep their current playstyles. We go back to Melee's roster (we recombine shiek and Zelda), then we cut the clones(Pichu, Dr, ylink, falco) and Mewtwo. We then add Ike, Inkling, K. Rool, Dedede, Ridley(as a superheavy), Lucario and maybe Banjo. And then we have 5 slots for brand new chatacters. And finally, we re work ganondorf into something playable
I'm 100% saying it, Puff and Yoshi are BLESSED by first twelve privellege in this list. You could make arguments for quite a few reps who got who could also be cut in favour of another one in smash, such as Ness and Lucas, but even he's now a (sort of) fan favourites and largely known because of smash, it wouldn't be the same without him, I feel even he's far less replaceable than Yosi and Jigglypuff. But seeing MEWTWO get cut before Puff, one of the most iconic Pokémon surpassed by the puff is wild. Pikachu, he's the icon of the franchise, he's almost as untouchable as Link or Mario.
@Mike-di3mo that's fair but when the Smash Bros roster does include: Charizard, Squirtle, Mewtwo and Pikachu, I think they can spare 1 of the other most recognisable pokemon slots, jigglypuff is probably the most expendable of them, but first twelve status saved em in this particular video. Also amazed the character I didn't get flack for being Yoshi, even if I do think if he was added in Melee and considered a Mario character, he woulda been thrown right out.
Nah you definitely are wrong for Yoshi lol Cutting him is actually wild. One of the most popular Mario characters, has his own series of games, and part of the OG 12 to boot.
@@shyguyrocks1 he's popular but if we're cutting half the entire cast including whole series reps and OG characters, he seems pretty replaceable. I'm just saying he woulda been on the cutting block if he wasn't an original 12.
@@potato1341 that's the Pokémon trainer and yeah this video puff was only kept for being apart of the og 12 but I'm sure if he knew he would keep puff because puff is just really iconic and recognizable as well has having a unique move set so no puff isn't the one that should be cut first itshould be squirtle
from my understanding those pokemon poll results that got greninja as "the most popular" are dubious. voting was segmented by regions and everyone was allowed to vote for a pokemon from each region. Kalos aka greninjas regions is well known for having by far the least amount of pokemon in it. So he was in significantly less competition for a vote than his other top tiers
I can clearly tell that you are unfamiliar with Pokemon, as you break rule 2 with it. You kept Pikachu, Jigglypuff, and Mewtwo while cutting Pichu, PT, Lucario, Greninja, and Incineroar. You kept 3 Gen 1 pokemon and nothing else. Mewtwo is cool and all, but he was cut before (twice if you wanna count Smash 4's base roster), so he isn't necessary for Smash's identity. As for who would replace him, it is down to Lucario and Greninja due to their popularity. Given that you cut the only other Ninja on the roster in Shiek, that is who I am leaning to.
Is why the whole "kepping the OG 12" is so dumb Jigglypuff has no reason to be there anymore, as even Sakurai has tried to cut her two times by now, if a reboot happens she is 100% going to be removed
I don't know why only keeping Gen 1 is being treated as a bad thing by everyone here. Greninja's time in the spotlight has been over for years and Incineroar has basically never been popular enough to be worth saving here. Lucario maybe has an argument but Mewtwo is probably still more recognizable to the average person.
@@MrStarman926 Exactly. I'm no genwunner, but it's undeniable that gen 1 had the most impact on popular culture. _By far._ Mewtwo is timeless. Greninja ain't. That being said, I'm sure Smash 6 will include a contemporary Pokemon rep from gen 11 (or whatever else happens to be out at the time).
I don’t understand if your counting the Pokémon trainer as 3 characters (wich is wrong because they take up one slot) then can’t you just choose one of them to keep?
they count as 1 slot in the game, but on the official smash website theyre counted as 3 separate characters, same as pyra/mythra. its probably just to get a larger sounding roster, but they are counted as unique characters
>Mewtwo spared while Lucario and Greninja are booted "...let him cook" >Mewtwo cut immediately after to further slim down the roster NINTENDO MUST NEVER SEE THIS VIDEO.
All three mii fighters should at least stay, considering they represent the archetypes of characters in the game. Although they should turn gunner into a mage.
Why can’t we just have Smash Ultimate to be constantly updated, remastered, ported, etc? After watching this, what would be the point of the next Smash if pretty much everything is basically being cut.
Can’t believe Lucas was cut. I understand where your coming from, but literally all Mother 3 content outside of Japan is in Smash. As much as it’s hard to keep Lucas, I think you should have kept him because he’s just plain awesome. All jokes aside I think this cut was about as perfect as you could get. I would personally cut Terry and Bayonetta and replace them with Lucas and Diddy Kong but those are just my personal hopes, and don’t realistically make sense.
I have an assumption that Echo Fighters actually do matter when it comes to cutting characters. They still take work to put in the game and had to be negotiated for. But since they were later inclusions, I expect they're a low priority for the team. If anything you'd cut the Echo Fighters first and not replace them, but they could either come back as their own unique Fighter or they continue to be clones if there’s time to include them. Still, I like your presentation and thought process. It's just impossible to judge which characters to cut until we hear anything about a new game.
I can’t believe you kept Dedede instead of Meta Knight. He should’ve been a shoe-in on his legacy alone because of how nerfed his kit became after “Brawl Meta-Knight”
“I don’t think anyone is capable of doing this incorrectly”
Cuts Mario
cuts SEPHIROTH
Bro I was shookith
How are you gonna make a Nintendo game full of crossovers even from outside of Nintendo without Mario.
Jigglypuff is just Pokémon Kirby. Cut.
@@clackman622He’s a character from an already represented franchise. As big as he is, cloud is bigger, and he realistically cannot be kept in a cut this big
Videos like this are why I'm convinced Smash Bros will never cut half of Ultimates roster. I could totally see 25 cuts max but everything else would be too severe.
The most likely cuts will be echoes, fighters that have been cut before (like Snake and Ice Climbers) and Fire Emblem characters.
@@AeonKnigh432 ice climbers were cut for tech limits though. Same reason why Zelda got split from transforming into sheik, would load too many characters.
@@AeonKnigh432as long as the technology / release gimmicks allow for it, icies most likely will remain. Otherwise you are correct, Dr mario or even Lucas or Mewtwo are probably more likely
@@gringusgamingi think mewtwo and greninja stay. I can maybe see mewtwo cut IF Pokemon trainer is back. The only reason greninja over mewtwo would be since we are going back to Kalos in the next Pokemon game and it can be possibly a redone rep
@@wooperman6960 I don't think the next smash game will come around within window you would want to promote legends ZA but u never know. If it did, greninja would probably be the pick. That said, I would imagine that most pokemon would be staying just by virtue of the fact that they are pokemon
“I’m only cutting entire franchises as a last resort.”
*immediately cuts Ice Climbers with no hesitation*
He said a franchise has to have more than one game. A one off isn't a franchise.
Vs. Ice Climber 1985 Arcade Nintendo Vs. Series
Ice Climber 1985 Famicom/NES [13]
Ice Climber 1985 NEC PC-8801 Published by Hudson Soft
Ice Climber 1988 Famicom Disk System Port of Vs. Ice Climber
Ice Climber-e 2002 e-Reader Barcoded cards, readable with e-Reader and Game Boy Advance.
Ice Climber 2004 Game Boy Advance Classic NES Series
Ice Climber 2007 Wii Virtual Console
Ice Climber 2011 3DS Virtual Console
Ice Climber 2013 Wii U Virtual Console
Ice Climber 2018 Nintendo Switch Nintendo Switch Online
VS. Ice Climber 2019 Nintendo Switch Arcade Archives
Bet you feel real dumb rn
@@king_slimy8859That's just ports and slight variations of the same game
@@AveryTare No way......
It's not possible......
Ice Climbers has fallen.....
@@king_slimy8859 billions must club seals...
ROB deserves to stay. He literally SAVED the video game industry, ya don't just cut him.
No, I'm not biased, and no, I do not have an authentic Japanese ROB on my shelf making me say this...
I'm a rob Main myself and I really don't want to see him be cut
Combining echo fighters into existing characters as high tier (unlockable) skins would allow all echoe fighters to be technically cut while keeping them on the roster.
cool idea
Except some echo fighters are too different, like most of the fire emblem characters
@HuneeBruh but in a newer game just to save space all they really need to do is skin um and change the particle effects
So Costumes as a new reward for completing classic mode? ay, ay..
@PipS03 yes imagine like classic mode would unlock a classic skin, story mode would unlock echo skins, something like hovering would unlock a sports based skin (ie: mario tennis, strikers etc..) and playing say 10, 20, 50, 100, 500, 1000, etc..matches unlocks the pallette skins with the highest number unlocking gold skins or something.)
The fact that Jigglypuff's Classic Mode was about the Original 12 speaks volumes about her impact in Smash over her own franchise.
Or it shows she ain’t interesting enough to make a real classic mode route 💀
@@eanderson9599It IS a real classic mode.
Jigglypuff can easily be cut
I disagree, get the balloon out of the game
@@regionfuego6 LOL no
”The characters responsible for the series most pivotal reveals haven't gone anywhere”
King K. Rool: *sad croc noises*
Am I the only one who remembers the sepithroth trailer?
Meta knight:
"The OG's are immune"
Thank frickin god, if Fox actually didn't appear again it would have been the last straw after the lack of starfox in the switch era.
As they should be
Star Fox is just one of those franchises that will languish in obscurity until the next Smash Bros.
That’s not entirely true, at least for earlier games. During Melee’s development, they were gonna replace Ness with the “at the time” Mother 3 protagonist but with Mother 3 being stuck in development hell, they just reincorporated Ness. Either way I can’t see fox leaving due to its impact on melees community and the use of the super fx chip allowing for early 3d rendering on consoles.
@ChipTuneOtakuYT yeah apparently ness was considered for cut a few times, and that fact terrifies me
@@ericmorgan1583 i wish ness was gone so bad. pk fire gives me a sight-induced lobotomy
Cutting Ike is actually such a weird decision, he's the most popular Fire Emblem male character and gives that heavyweight variety to the Fire Emblem cast. Especially if you look at current state of the Fire Emblem franchise and how often Ike is considered the #2 lord right after Marth when it comes to honoring its history
Yeah like no shot you cut Ike right away and not robin
FE should not have as many reps as Pokemon.
In fact, Ike is even considered the most popular male character (together with Lynn, the most popular female character) according to many polls.
He is also the only non 'Lord' in the fransche, making him a very unique protagonist
After Marth, Ike is the nummer 2 most deserving FE character to be in the roster
@@solarsunne4950 That is not his point bro. This has nothing to do with Pokémon
@@solarsunne4950you're right it should have more
It’s crazy how we cut Lucina just to put Lucina back in and cut Byleth.
Because the final list included echoes as their own characters meaning more unique characters had to be cut. He first did "baby mode"
Honestly. Imo Robin gets the spot and not Byleth, but if anyone wants to argue Ike or Byleth get the spot I understand. Lucina can just be a skin for Marth.
Edit: I understand what he means now. He's counting echo fighters and the OGs as a single spot. I think he could have made it a bit more clear than he did, since he provided an infographic showing the echo fighters phasing back in, seeming to have their own spots
I agree. Marth, Ike, Roy, Roben, already they deserve a spot instead of copy-paste Marth
BRO SEEING META KNIGTH BEING CUT WAS PAINFUL
(i prey for the kirby trio to never leave)
THATS WHAT IM SAYING
Sakurai wouldn't let that happen
what? I thought he said meta knight stays
Brawl made MK an integral part of the smash universe and roster with subspace emissary and brawl meta knight being a legendary broken OP character
also you should pray not prey
@@arcticpossi_schw1siantuntija42 He cut him in the non baby-mode cut
Same
When you fight for your friends but no one fights for you
Corrin moment
That's a Corrin and Ike moment. (Corrin is my favorite character and while this was not unexpected I am the big sad)
ike should never be in another smash game again unless they bring jason adkins voice back
Word
@@bearzdlc2172as an Ike main I prefer his Ultimate voice just saying. Before he sounded kinda ridiculous
There’s no such thing as the perfect cut, the moment you cut just one single character, you’ve cut someone’s main. No matter what you do, there will always be more disappointment then those happy.
Say it louder for the people in the back!
Nah, ain’t no way someone actually mains Dr. Mario
@@thecdog09 Is this bait? You'd genuinely be so surprised.
Cutting an FE character wouldn't be a big of a deal since y'know... reskins and lot of them, same with dark samus, dark pit, daisy, etc.
Disappointment is not out weighing joy if Banjo gets booted
I was surprised at how much I agreed with this list until the echo fighters came in. I was happy to let ALL of them go because your baby mode roster was actually super good representation wise
“We gotta leave the triforce trio”
Proceeds to leave the only link who canonically does not carry the triforce
@@ismailahmed4542 i believe he was talking about botw link, correct me if im wrong, but you do not collect the triforce, and the game doesn’t remotely hint of link having it, despite yl having it from when he came back in time in oot, and ww link fished it up
Brawl gave Metaknight a legacy in Smash. Too iconic to cut
Gnw cannot be cut, he’s been in every game since melee and nearly his entire identity came from smash, it’s basically his home at this point
I’d axe Bayo in place of GnW. Either that or Joker out of spite.
I agree actually
That’s a great point
@@infinityheart_tm9270With Joker I see him as very replaceable
For example if the next Smash releases near Persona 6 or a Persona 2 remake.
Tatsuya or the new protagonist would be better picks
I just pictured Qbert in wreck it ralph so hard. Sorry buddy, we'll miss you.
Smash is home to Captain Falcon as well.
16:04
Lists mostly gunner costumes
*Proceeds to pick brawler*
Make it make sense.
You still get the helmets
I think that when he said he’d choose brawler for simplicity, he was just saying ‘keep a Mii’ and brawler didn’t need to be the specific one
Brawler is the most well-designed Mii by far
@@LARAUJO_0fax
Pokémon got robbed here. “I’m not bias” nah you don’t dump charizard and then dump mewtwo as soon as you have 7 echo fighters in your lap.
he literally said theres inherent bias in the argument he never said he wasnt biased
Title: ' Cutting Half the Smash Roster OBJECTIVELY Correctly'
Intro: 'this is my opinion and I have bias'
@@trueblade3636 lmao
I personally don't like how he cut Greninja when they're the most popular Pokémon in the world. I swear half the people cutting the Smash Ultimate roster fall in the trap of "Oops! All Gen 1"
Cutting Sephi over Min Min is actually mental 💀
Yeah
Min Min rocks.
@@MakeVarahHappen Flop of a franchise lmfao
Keeping only gen 1 pokemon is most definitely not an authentic representation of the franchise. Pokemon has grown so much since gen 1 and keeping only characters from the first game(s) is ridiculous.
yeah and i had no clue what he was talking about with excluding pkmn trainer bc it's multiple fighters in one. if anything u should include him if you'll have less overall characters pkmn trainer doesnt count as 3 characters it counts as one
@@thishandleisntakenyethaha what are you even talking about, they quite literally count as 3 lol
The series has them as fighters 33, 34 and 35
@@icecontrol1 you play them as one. Taking at zero suit Samus I understand because they're different characters on the selection screen but they are both Samus. I feel like it's silly to take out a good character like pk trainer just because it's 3 in 1. The key word there is "in 1"
@@thishandleisntakenyethaha In general, the reason why characters are cut is because of workload. Realistically, even if pokemon trainer is one whole, it requires the work for three characters. Even ignoring the way that smash numbers them, you can just intuit that the one character slot takes up the work of three characters. That's why in Sm4sh, they removed Squirtle and Ivy, but kept Charizard.
@@t3dp589 that's fair but that's not the sole reason for cutting characters in a future title. maybe they might want to flesh out their smaller roster more. i just figured something different than others i guess
Losing Meta Knight was a major hit to me, but Mac was like loosing a limb
LITTLE MAC NOOOOOOOO
I automatically went, "no! My boy!" when he was cut. I get why Pit gets to stay, but that was that painful.
I honestly think King Dedede should have been cut instead of little mac, like I know that 'there are hardly any superheavies' but considering how the choices were between that and axing an entire franchise with one rep (which he specifically mentioned he would go out of his way to not do) than I'd say cutting Dedede is the clear choice.
@@genericmalename6087 He still kept DARK PITT! DARK MOTHERFUCKIN PITT!
@@pr0_gam3r37I think MK’s smash legacy of being busted in Brawl warrants a pick over Dedede. If you’re good enough to have a meta game centralize around you, you deserve a spot.
SEEING SEPHIROTH GET CUT FELT LIKE I WAS STABBED BY HIM
I think seph should’ve represented rpg villians since he is the one of the most iconic villians in gaming history
But to be fair square enix is gonna be a bitch when trying allow him into the next game ( this includes cloud aswell)
RIGHT??
YES
Especially after keep lips lick
or whatever she is called
@@MiddoTD I had never heard of sephiroth until smash
I'm sorry, but cutting G&W and Mewtwo before cutting Bayo is instant-admission-to-psych-ward level bonkers
Totally
He kept mr game and watch and mewtwo to what the hell are you talking about
@@TSH3890blud did not watch the full video
imo bayonetta was justified as a must keep cutting mewtwo and game and watch was so painfull though
i feel like jigglypuff should have been cut over mewtwo jiggglypuff is iconic but not as iconic or well known as mewtwo
My biggest pet peeve is when people portray their personal opinion as a Objective fact
I heavily disagree with cutting Meta Knight. It had a massive smash legacy with how broken it was in Brawl. So many tournaments banned him
Also its freaking meta knight he cool
Meta Knight probably has the greatest smash impact ever. I feel like nowadays every time there’s a broken character they always compare it to brawl MK
Yeah absolutely especially since I main him in ultimate
The thing is, I think it's more important that we focus more on the nintendo side of the roster than what people think about. I understand that guest characters are important and are what drive the hype for every new smash game, bur whenever someone makes one of these cut videos they always want to try to keep the biggest names like cloud, joker, or sora. I know their important for gaming as a whole and representing any franchise in smash is a big deal but I strongly believe keeping a lot these characters as one time inclusions would leave a better legacy for them, and would keep the roster feel fresh for any other potential inclusions for the next smash game.
Steve Minecraft
I agree
I completely agree with that, in fact I think that some third party characters should be the first ones to go. Of course I do think a lot of them are amazing inclusion to smash, but especially with how many were introduced during the DLC, a lot of them feel really unspecial and that kills the whole point of having third party characters in the first place. Imo we should only keep the medium defining inclusion being Pac Man, Mega Man, Sonic, Ryu, Cloud and Steve. As much as I may love Snake or Joker and their respective games, I don't think they are as industry defining as just really good games, and they didn't really entered pop culture like the other did, and Kazuya and Hero may come from gendra defining franchises, but they themeselves are not really on the same footing.
I think it's just very telling to see the reaction to all of these characters reveal, though some of the may make "sense" on paper, the excitement behind the inclusion of Cloud is incomparable to the way people reacted to hero (which is by the way not even a character, doesn't help it to become iconic). I think that it's important to maintain the third party spots for really exciting characters rather than making them feel trivial.
True but tbh they should at least bring 2 big reps.. Tbh Cloud and Sora are two great safe picks.
@@artimist0315 I agree with all that; except your comment on "Steve." Metal Gear as a series did a LOT for the gaming industry. Steve prints money. He's on par with Spyro for Skylanders and the bird from angry birds. He's certainly a money maker, but not important as a whole. Snake and Kayzua are still more important and I would say the "SIMS" guy would be more important than Steve. Someone from the Lego franchise as well. I could very well play SMASH without Steve and be fine.
as a young link main, understandable.
I feel the same as a Corrin main
It's not understandable
@@TricksterLawlet1 link is enough. not enough space for duplicates
I loved this until the very end when I looked at the final roaster and realized almost half of it is characters people universally dislike fighting against
that's what I was thinking he completely ignored the gameplay of it
keeping Mega Man, Min Min, Sonic, Olimar, and Villager is illegal
@@KingObliv yeah but gameplay is subject to change in the next game
@@skyguy1236 that's unlikely they rarely change movesets
"We have to choose between Punch-Out and Kid Icarus" Me in my bed GET RID OF DARK PITT!!!!!!!
That would mean getting rid of Pit as well, they share a spot
@@Ratelps he’s an echo fighter and plus on my switch they share different spots
@@LeoEmber that's not what I meant. According to your logic then the rules are on Baby-mode. They share a number on the character roster, #28 and #28ε being Pit and Dark Pit. In baby mode character's and their echos are different fighters, in the normal mode of this challenge they aren't, they're the same fighter. (You can set your settings to have echos on the same slot as their counterpart.)
the biggest problem with these videos isnt how correct or incorrect they are, is that there is no way they are cutting that many so every attempt is clearly wrong.
Eh, I feel like halving the roster would ultimately be a good decision that doesn't seem too out of left field especially since a good chunk of the fanbase expects it.
Keep dreaming
@@castform7 nobody on the fan base agree on who to cut tho, and most do that as a thought exercise, they dont really believe that many gonna be cut. smash never cut that many, and it just doesnt make sense to do that.
@@castform7it’s a double edged sword, the main appeal of Ultimate was the fact that nobody was getting cut. Halving the roster would be sure to alienate a lot of people and as someone who lost their main and wasn’t able to really mesh with another character until they were brought back as DLC, I can’t blame anyone for feeling betrayed if all the characters they enjoy playing are gone.
But shouldn't the sequel which assumingly is going to be a bigger game be able to contain all the characters from the previous game plus add more characters on top of that? So actually they shouldn't need to cut anyone right?
I surprisingly agree with everything but the Meta Knight cut. So iconic for his brawl status. He was so broken he was unofficially banned in every friend group I had 😂
This dude disapperear after 2 day.
Banned in a decent amount of competitive tournaments too!
keeping min min (in baby mode) and cutting sephiroth is wild
I mean fair, but baby mode wasn’t *actually* a thing for me. I made all 41 cuts before I even started writing the script. Min-Min and Seph were never fighting for priority behind the scenes, she only “lasted longer” cuz I specifically saved the franchise cuts for the end of the vid
That's exactly what I said
Me too exactly what i said
@@ProtendoLet’s see, the most iconic villain of a long lasting series versus a game that almost nobody cares about with a character that everyone hates in-game, seems fair to me
@@GameofMatiascome on, don't act like what he commented didn't make sense
The next game is Super Smash Brother. Mario is the only fighter.
Funny. 😑
“I don’t think anyone is capable of doing this incorrectly” you should be saying i don't think anyone is capable of doing this perfect
Bro didn't even explain why Roy's gotta go, bro just said "aight get out". 😭
Lame ass irrelevant ass one off self insert for a lame ass B-tier nintendo franchise with like 1/10th of the roster specifically representing it alone
Cutting half of the reason fire emblem made it to the west is crazy
so real @@TheGodRellik
I agree with the choice because Roy barely represents his own game in Smash, let alone a good rep for the series. Roy was put in before his game was even made and in his own game he's one of the weakest characters who needs constant protection from others to succeed. He's outdated and his game has not been localized anywhere outside of Japan meaning many people who want to play the game with Roy in it have to use a fan patch and learn that he actually sucks in his own game.
This felt like watching that one World of Light trailer where everyone get picked off one by one all over again. Really solid choices though, but personally I'd cut Ridley over Little Mac just because I've never liked how weirdly tiny Ridley is. This video must have been very painful to make, I salute you sir
I’m glad I’m not the only one who felt that way about Ridley. I remember watching the trailer thinking he looked weird from the jump, and seeing him standing next to Mario all awkwardly slouched up like that was almost comical to me. His amiibo’s pretty badass tho.
That's a great idea actually. The next Smash game should cut every single character except for Kirby.
@@SnsyBehold! Kirby Fighters 3.
Sakurai was hesitant to add ridley for years because that would mean scaling him way down and limiting his ability to fly freely. Honestly he should have stuck to his guns and refused to add him instead of giving into peer pressure. Not every character is a good fit for smash no matter how iconic they may be
@@lamontyaboy718 they should've just made him heavier and a little bigger and a little less slouched
“You can’t do this wrong”
gives 2 characters from the first generation of the most successful fictional franchise ever, but keeps fucking minmin
every prediction video is "🤓 uhm marios not getting in nor pikachu.. actually every character from melee or 64 is cut but wii fit and minmin stays and also corrin and bayonetta"
Did you write this after watching only the baby mode cuts? I think you did~ Even if he did keep minmin in the end, it aligns with one of the main rules he set for this, which is to keep as many different games and franchises represented as possible, so he wouldn't have done it wrong, just wrong by your -biased- standards
He kept three and they were the only pokemon he kept
@@CitryteYTah yes the funny low blow of "your biased teehee🤓"
You say that but he literally kept the FE cast because muh main characters and cut toon link and young link immediately after the video almost seems sarcastic his reason for keeping min min was really week and could be used for anyone
LMAO he cut sephiroth because "not new franchise and third party bad" after keeping Byleth because muh best selling FE game this guy isnt real💀
@@MoopersYT Putting aside that you probably seethe hard at any roster cut that doesn't completely remove Fire Emblem, cutting toon/young link and sephiroth is also in line with his rule to keep as many franchises as possible, and he eventually cut Byleth too. The only franchises to come out with more than 1 rep left are the ones that had more than one rep in smash 64, the only exceptions being Kirby because Dedede is a heavyweight, and Zelda, which still has 3 reps despite Toon Link being cut! Being mad he followed rules he set from the start is wild 💀
Excluding the pokemon trainer and counting the trainer’s pokemon, the miis, pyra, and mythra as separate characters, you have cut 43/89 fighters
at wii fit: "this will be our first franchise cut"
Ice Climbers: "ayo you hear that shit, Nana?"
By his definition a franchise must have more than a single game. The Wii Fit series has more than one game while Ice Climbers only ever appears in virtual rereleases
Sephiroth be like: You can't get rid of me if Cloud stays. I ALWAYS come back you insignificant being.
"I...will never be a memory."
@@acsound Exactly!
Always comes back? So he’s like William Afton?
Well, not really actually, since Afton’s dead now, but still
Sephiroth once again intervened
I was ALMOST about to admit this is the best "cut the roster in half" video, until you cut Pokemon Trainer. And then Diddy Kong. And then R.O.B. And then it just went downhill from there.
While ROB has a nice fanbase in smash his legacy is being one of the most useless accessories for the NES, the other 2 really hurt, banning all ?in1 automatically is not my favorite choice, and diddy... don't make it harder than it has to be.
waluigi with a power glove shouldve replaced rob in sm4sh
@@snil4I’d argue ROB is a representation from Gaming Hardware/Accessories, which are a big part of Gaming. Plus, he’s the whole reason gaming is still even a thing, as he was Nintendo’s way of repopularizing it.
@@snil4 R.O.B. is way more than just representing Nintendo peripherals. He also represents Nintendo toys too, as he was marketed as one to literally save the video game industry. And it goes without saying that he not only represents the two games he plays with, but also the Subpace Emissary, which is cleverly shown in his series icon.
THAT'S why cutting R.O.B. would be a big deal, on top of having a nice fanbase. You'd be cutting out a big piece of Nintendo's history, a huge representative of Smash's own history, and just a fun, unique fighter in general. It's too bad most people don't see that, and all they see is "most useless accessory for the NES" when he's way more than that.
rob and diddy? lmaooo the hell is your criteria
fun thought exorcies although i do find it funny how many youtubers attempt to cut the roster to pre brawl sized proportions which would probally kill most interest in the series
Keeping as many franchises as possible sounds like a good idea, until you realize how many 3rd parties there are with one fighter.
Keeping Bayonetta, Joker, and Terry over Diddy, K. Rool and Meta Knight just wouldn't work
I agree with basically everything cut during Baby Mode, except for Falco. Man's so iconic he spawned an entire modding community
Ike is the most popular Fire Emblem character BY FAR, and he's treated as a huge deal in modern FE games like Awakening, Heroes, and Engage.
Greninja and Lucario got 1st and 2nd place in a recent official pokemon popularity poll. The former had also won another official poll prior and his home region, Kalos, is getting a new game next year, and the latter is pretty much a secondary mascot for the series and will get shoved into just about anywhere GF/TPC can put him in.
Another heavily popular character in her home series is Rosalina, and Mario can definitely afford 5 veterans in the next game even if it suffers heavy roster cuts.
Finally as a more personal opinion, I would like the next smash game to focus more on Nintendo characters again. Yes the guest characters are cool and hype but I feel that most are fine as a one time special event. I would keep no more than 7 of them for the next game, and we'll probably get more 3rd party newcomers anyways.
Still, always fun to see people's takes on what the next smash roster could look like :)
Yeah I agree, the 3rd party reps are hype as hell, but iirc Nintendo and Square Enix have had a tumultuous relationship as far as smash goes, and the core of smash has been Nintendo characters. I think the most interesting move might be to cut most if not all of the 3rd parties, and then add new 3rd parties in the Smash 6 DLC
The problem with those polls is that they have an extreme selection bias towards the kind of fans that are active in the online Pokemon community, and follow the series' every release very closely. If you want a look at what Pokemon are actually universally the most popular, you need to look towards what sells merchandise. Pikachu, the starters, Meowth, Snorlax, Gengar, Eevee, *and Mewtwo* make up the overwhelming majority of all Pokemon representation out in the real world. And the real world is being weighed in this ruleset.
I can almost buy the argument for Lucario, but he's certainly not a secondary mascot, not by a mile. Greninja certainly had some time in the sun, but its time as especially relevant to the series is over.
I kind of agree on Ike, and that he certainly should be prioritized over Byleth and Robin. But it would just be really awkward to not prioritize seniority when the only options left to cut are him and Marth. It's the reason why he didn't go for Isabelle over Villager.
As painful as it is, cutting third parties would make this a lot easier
about that Ike statement… other characters are also treated as huge deals. And heroes is a gacha game, practically almost every character has some amount of alts, such as corrin (mainly female I think), Ike, marth, edelgard, etc. having tons of them.
I won’t deny Ike is one of the most popular characters but saying “by far” is probably a little bit of an overstatement.
@@MrStarman926id keep Ike over byleth but keep robin for the same reasons ROB is in smash. ROB, in a way, saved nintendo and robin saved fire emblem.
If I have one really big critique with your list,I personally feel you kept too many 3rd Party characters. yeah yeah I know Smash is considered this big celebration of gaming and what not, but at the end of the day it's still a Nintendo crossover game featuring guets.
And no matter what, all the 1st and even 2nd Party characters should get priority. I don't mean to say that you can't have any at all, but I do feel like a majority need to be booted.
With that said,
fun thought experiment.
Yeah, being real the only 3rd party that i can see always being there is Sonic, everyone else is a coin toss
Sora though is 100% gone lol, no way Disney plays ball again
That and Lucina over Robin of all things...
Lucina was an echo fighter of marth, that’s why she stayed@@nah4467
@@icecontrol1 Ryu Joker Snake and Cloud have staying power off series popularity. Especially in Japan where it’s more important to be popular for a smash slot.
@@icecontrol1
I don't see Megaman or Pacman gone either. The former was placed in an early area of "World of Lite" and got some of the best Spirits too. Considering how little Capcom does with him these days, someone in the Smash dev team REALLY likes him.
Watching you cut fighters was the most stressful thing I've watched in awhile lol.
if i were nintendo, i'd do an "everyone's here" every 5 games.
lmao
Sonic was left in 🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🔥
YESSSSSSS
The pain in my chest I felt while watching this was immeasurable. Meta knight? META KNIGHT? Ive always believed that kirby needs MORE reps, but seeing him getting cut left a scar.
Kirby is very underrepresented imo, but if you’re cutting half the roster entirely, I can _almost_ understand cutting Meta Knight.
Almost.
I doubt Meta Knight or ANY Kirby character would ever be cut, I mean the franchise is the creation of Sakurai so there is no way he would cut one of his creations
@@Thatoneguy64243 Considering it took three games to get Dedede despite being considered for Melee (and I _think_ 64 too?), he absolutely could.
Imagine how I felt as a little Mac main being cut at the finish line
I respect the people who has the balls to actually call the cut they created objective and put rules to make it so.
Nintendo will cut most of the 3rd partys.
Yeah I'm sure they're expensive/difficult to license. I'd say Joker, Sora and Snake are as good as gone
Crazy, the game would lose toouch scale
It's inevitable, since the game creators would have to jump through hoops again in terms of legal matters for 3rd party characters.
OK, but cutting sonic is a no go even if he gets cut that means knuckles and shadow even tails, we have no chance of getting in
Most yes. Some are basically locked. Like there's no universe in which sonic gets cut. Ryu is probably very safe. Everyone else is up in the air, most likely due to rights. Sora is very unlikely. Minecraft would be huge but it's up to now nice Microsoft is feeling. Joker, dragon age and snake are coin flips
We better get Freddy Fazbear as compensation if this is the roster.
I jumped up from my seat and clapped my hands when Robin got cut.
who?
look… this isn’t BAD. but… man, it hurt like hell.
the bias is strong for sure
"OG 12 isn't going anywhere"
Thank god Luigi is safe
How does someone not call Ike iconic, I thought he was the most iconic, most recognizable Fire Emblem character at this point
Kinda agree with you there aside from Marth he's probably the next best known fire emblem character. But if we were to only have 3 FE characters I think it would be how it originally was in the video Marth, Robin, and Byleth.
Now my list would just be my top 3 favorites
Corrin, Ike, Byleth
Feel a bit bad for Marth though.
His full name is Ike Onic.
@@davo560 yeah, my list would be Corrin, Lucina, & Ike, but I would have a hard time giving up Chrom & Byleth, I play a lot of Fire Emblem characters
they'd proably keep marth over everyone else, but by every metric marth is not the most popular fire emblem character, ike lucina and byleth are above him
2 things I would change, ZERO bias/jokes.
1. Keep Lucas. He’s awesome and I’d probably die if he was completely axed outside Japan. Instead, cut Ness, he’s a ripoff of Lucas, somehow, even though he came first.
2. Add Link from Link: The Faces of Evil. I feel he’d be even a better addition than Young Link and Toon Link combined and would add some nice representation to the best LOZ game.
Please. If you're going to add a Faces of Evil rep, add Morshu.
Cutting Diddy Kong and Sephiroth with no hesitation is criminal
Sephiroth definitely needs to stay in my opinion because FINAL FANTASY 7 will have to go back to 2 songs again I think people want Sephiroth cut from the game because he's not a Broken character
It's kinda interesting that you cut characters that were made more iconic by Smash over like... Min Min, Joker, Simon/Richter, or Terry.
They should cut all of the characters besides the Miis
Other way around.
this is a genius idea because then every other character can just be a mii costume
Miitopia 2 lmao
i love miitopia
@@SavageJarJar you understand my vision
if they HAD to cut characters for a reboot for whatever reason, this is good. however i do think that a new smash bros would *try* keep the characters nintendo own themselves at the very least, and just ditching the crossover characters. (we would get new ones of course)
Sonic pacman mega man and Bayonetta seem like the most likely 3rd party characters to stay
@@eddywcbfsonic at least for sure, sega and nintendo know whats up
I can see Cinderace and Meowscarada being the GEN nine and GEN eight reps
@@eddywcbfbayonetta has been a Nintendo exclusive since the WiiU, but semantics aside, I agree with you on that. I’d add cloud to that list
Cutting shiek and greninja and not keeping one seems evil
How are you cutting Pokémon trainer? It’s one slot not three right? And it captures exactly what the franchise is about with having multiple monsters and switching them out. And the alt colours referencing different characters from the franchise. Not cutable
It’s 3 slots, 33/34/35
People keep talking about there being no way the next Smash game actually makes cuts as drastic as this popular thought experiment, but my big theory for the announcement trailer of the next Smash game is it being "Nobody is Here" that essentially recreates the "Everyone is Here" trailer playing in reverse and the base roster of the game explicitly excluding any character that has been playable before in the franchise (until maybe some free DLC a while after the game's launch to bring back the staples anyway), focusing on making trophy characters, alternate versions of character not tied to the established moveset legacy, and other such examples playable instead.
I don't think a Smash game without Mario and friends is remotely feasible, "nobody is here" doesn't sound like the most profitable marketing strategy
@@Hewer86 It's as viable as cutting the roster in half.
(But, yeah, it's a long shot improbability that would make no sense from a practical standpoint. Though, some other Nintendo controlled series have made equally radical shifts, so it's only close to zero instead of being actually zero chance of happening. Can never truly predict exactly what they'll cook up next, both for good and ill.)
Realistically I feel like if they're cutting for the next game, they'd only cut 3rd party characters, but add other new 1st party characters
Depends. Some third parties are more guaranteed than others. Like even if he's third party, there's no universe where sonic doesn't stay. Most others are debatable
whos gonna tell them they had a typo in "the pefect cut"
Wow, I read that multiple times and didn’t notice.
It’s trademarked
He needed the copyright to be original
Title: ' Cutting Half the Smash Roster OBJECTIVELY Correctly'
Intro: 'this is my opinion'
In the normal cut, I was honestly expecting Meta Knight to survive over Dedede through the Smash history aspect simply because nobody's ever forgetting how OP Brawl Meta was
Main obvious thing I would do is cutting more third parties and not seeing the original 12 as sacred, but I respect your perspective.
When you cut literally every pokemon beyond Jigglypuff, it just boils down to Jigglypuff vs Mewtwo anyway.
Jigglypuff is my main I love jigglypuff
And Jigglypuff won here. We'd only have Pika and Jiggles for Pokemon in this video that's kind of insane actually
- Lucario has also had perfect attendance in Pokémon since Gen 4 & his popularity rivals that of the Gen 1 'Mons, with Greninja being the #1 Pokémon period. Your Pokémon picks in general are too Gen 1-heavy.
- Animal Crossing is big enough for both Villager & Isabelle to stay, and the latter is WAY too popular with the masses.
- Pyra/Mythra represents the best-selling entry of Xenoblade.
- In terms of coming down to the wire, wouldn't cutting Robin & having Lucina rep Awakening make more sense?
And yeah, I agree that they aren't cutting the roster in half. 50 characters (counting newcomers) is the absolute floor in my eyes, especially with Studio S seemingly developing Smash again alongside Sakurai for Smash 6 based on some job listings.
do you happen to have a link or some screenshots for these job listings? had never heard about this
Ofc Lucario is popular if you’re a zoomer or furry lol
In the baby mode section, where echos and fighters weigh equally, Robin is a better pick than Lucina imo. Not only is he the main character / avatar you play as during the game, but his moveset is more unique than Lucina's and represents magic users in Fire Emblem. In the final roster Lucina is the better pick due to her status as an Echo meaning that she comes along free with Marth, and so sacrificing another slot to Fire Emblem isn't worth it.
While I can see the reason to keep Pyra Mythra, I do not see the reason over keeping Shulk, which is always the challenging thing with “who to keep vs who to cut”. They may be from the best selling entry, but ultimately Shulk ties into their game and series in a way they can't in reverse given coming after (barring changes retconned into Definitive Edition for cohesion, which don't directly include them).
You can also argue a bigger iconic factor with Shulk comparitive to Pyra and Mythra. While those two are huge outside of their own game, their Smash legacy is short, and the MC of their own game was cut, and they only made it in halfway through the final set of DLC. Meanwhile, Shulk immediately got a huge boost thanks to being in Smash (no part in fact to confirming the ESRB leak), and I want to personally argue that Shulk with the Monado 1 is way more iconic for the series as a whole.
When it comes down to it, I think Shulk is better and more known as “the face of Xenoblade”, and if you can only afford one slot, it's harder to argue for Pyra and Mythra over that. Let alone TWO slots, which Pyra and Mythra would take as 2 in 1 fighters
I think that in the version which includes echoes all the echoes of characters which were in the remaining roster were kept, so that roster did have Lucina as an awakening rep but not Robin (or Chrom)
I refuse to believe you cut Robin and Meta Knight BEFORE Min-Min
Bro arms was so peak
@@tryiconic8446 yeah but just only one game until there’s an arms two good try
26:12 Doing the half cut challenge does make it much easier to predict which cuts Smash 6's roster actually will have since there will probably be less cuts than what we did in our challenge.
13:01 "The Pefect Cut"
YOU CAN'T CUT R.O.B! He's _iconic!_ Smash Bros. is one of the only reasons people even know he exists, and he was _very_ important for Nintendo's history. If not for R.O.B. Nintendo would have had a lot more struggle getting a foothold in the western gaming market. If Smash Bros. is about representing video game history, then R.O.B. has to stay, even if just for the novelty of it. I would say he's up there with Captain Falcon and Ness for being iconic characters remembered through Smash Bros. more than their games of origin.
Not to be like "AcTuAlLy" but no, he was in Mario Kart DS, so smash isn't the only reason people remember him. But to be fair I totally agree with you.
@@stupidperson8780I totally forgot he was in that game
@@adielwilson8749says a lot about his iconic status 😭
@@stupidperson8780He was also in a lot of WarioWare games
Yes! He also had quite the role in subspace emissary, so that's another reason to make him stay.
Since you're keeping Snake can you also give him his butt back?
Cutting 41 characters is insane. I understand cutting characters that have identical movesets within the same franchise. But the fact that you said "robin is safe" and then at the end go "robin is probably the most replaceable" is wild.
Robin is super iconic from a gameplay perspective and as a fan of the series
Honestly to god seeing Sephiroth get cut felt like getting stabbed by him
“Ridley is almost one of the largest icons in the smash bros bubble”
Almost… too large for smash?
I'll give my opinion as quick as posible, we asume all chatacters keep their current playstyles. We go back to Melee's roster (we recombine shiek and Zelda), then we cut the clones(Pichu, Dr, ylink, falco) and Mewtwo. We then add Ike, Inkling, K. Rool, Dedede, Ridley(as a superheavy), Lucario and maybe Banjo. And then we have 5 slots for brand new chatacters. And finally, we re work ganondorf into something playable
There's one problem with cutting clones. If we do that, what justification do we have for keeping Luigi?
25:27 i would definitely cut bayonetta and re-ad Metaknight due to his immense importance to smash, basically being an entire game.
Absolutely agree
Ice Climbers are so unique. And Sheik is an iconic Smash character
@hiilikepizza3197Sheik is only talked about at great lengths nowadays because of Smash lol.
When the standards are this high, it only makes sense to cut alternate versions of the same character. Nothing is lost outside of gameplay
I'm 100% saying it, Puff and Yoshi are BLESSED by first twelve privellege in this list. You could make arguments for quite a few reps who got who could also be cut in favour of another one in smash, such as Ness and Lucas, but even he's now a (sort of) fan favourites and largely known because of smash, it wouldn't be the same without him, I feel even he's far less replaceable than Yosi and Jigglypuff. But seeing MEWTWO get cut before Puff, one of the most iconic Pokémon surpassed by the puff is wild. Pikachu, he's the icon of the franchise, he's almost as untouchable as Link or Mario.
Puff is like top 10 most recognizable pokemon so the orginal 12 really isn't the only reason puff should stay
@Mike-di3mo that's fair but when the Smash Bros roster does include: Charizard, Squirtle, Mewtwo and Pikachu, I think they can spare 1 of the other most recognisable pokemon slots, jigglypuff is probably the most expendable of them, but first twelve status saved em in this particular video. Also amazed the character I didn't get flack for being Yoshi, even if I do think if he was added in Melee and considered a Mario character, he woulda been thrown right out.
Nah you definitely are wrong for Yoshi lol
Cutting him is actually wild. One of the most popular Mario characters, has his own series of games, and part of the OG 12 to boot.
@@shyguyrocks1 he's popular but if we're cutting half the entire cast including whole series reps and OG characters, he seems pretty replaceable. I'm just saying he woulda been on the cutting block if he wasn't an original 12.
@@potato1341 that's the Pokémon trainer and yeah this video puff was only kept for being apart of the og 12 but I'm sure if he knew he would keep puff because puff is just really iconic and recognizable as well has having a unique move set so no puff isn't the one that should be cut first itshould be squirtle
cut everyone but mega man and i will still be happy
from my understanding those pokemon poll results that got greninja as "the most popular" are dubious. voting was segmented by regions and everyone was allowed to vote for a pokemon from each region. Kalos aka greninjas regions is well known for having by far the least amount of pokemon in it. So he was in significantly less competition for a vote than his other top tiers
I can clearly tell that you are unfamiliar with Pokemon, as you break rule 2 with it. You kept Pikachu, Jigglypuff, and Mewtwo while cutting Pichu, PT, Lucario, Greninja, and Incineroar. You kept 3 Gen 1 pokemon and nothing else. Mewtwo is cool and all, but he was cut before (twice if you wanna count Smash 4's base roster), so he isn't necessary for Smash's identity. As for who would replace him, it is down to Lucario and Greninja due to their popularity. Given that you cut the only other Ninja on the roster in Shiek, that is who I am leaning to.
Is why the whole "kepping the OG 12" is so dumb
Jigglypuff has no reason to be there anymore, as even Sakurai has tried to cut her two times by now, if a reboot happens she is 100% going to be removed
@@icecontrol1 Again, and I may have wrong opinions. But if she's on the OG 12, she's staying, I'm sorry.
I don't know why only keeping Gen 1 is being treated as a bad thing by everyone here. Greninja's time in the spotlight has been over for years and Incineroar has basically never been popular enough to be worth saving here. Lucario maybe has an argument but Mewtwo is probably still more recognizable to the average person.
@@icecontrol1 Rest is an iconic smash move, get outta here
@@MrStarman926 Exactly. I'm no genwunner, but it's undeniable that gen 1 had the most impact on popular culture. _By far._ Mewtwo is timeless. Greninja ain't.
That being said, I'm sure Smash 6 will include a contemporary Pokemon rep from gen 11 (or whatever else happens to be out at the time).
I don’t understand if your counting the Pokémon trainer as 3 characters (wich is wrong because they take up one slot) then can’t you just choose one of them to keep?
they count as 1 slot in the game, but on the official smash website theyre counted as 3 separate characters, same as pyra/mythra. its probably just to get a larger sounding roster, but they are counted as unique characters
I'd be fine returning to just Charizard
Yea that kinda got me confused too, its one slot 😭 I think he should stay, hes really unique that he can switch three chracters
So why keep Jigglypuff? 😫
>Mewtwo spared while Lucario and Greninja are booted
"...let him cook"
>Mewtwo cut immediately after to further slim down the roster
NINTENDO MUST NEVER SEE THIS VIDEO.
Cutting Rob actually made me cry a bit.
5 minutes in and I'm already disappointed with no steve cut
All three mii fighters should at least stay, considering they represent the archetypes of characters in the game.
Although they should turn gunner into a mage.
As a Mii Gunner main, I wholeheartedly support the change to mage
they can easly make the mii a unique caracter slot with all of them in the same spot just name mii fighter but you have gun,sword and fight inclue
Why can’t we just have Smash Ultimate to be constantly updated, remastered, ported, etc?
After watching this, what would be the point of the next Smash if pretty much everything is basically being cut.
The 4/5 of my mains got cut
Greninja - gone
Meta knight - gone
Ice climbers - gone
Young link - gone
Kirby - safe
Can’t believe Lucas was cut. I understand where your coming from, but literally all Mother 3 content outside of Japan is in Smash. As much as it’s hard to keep Lucas, I think you should have kept him because he’s just plain awesome.
All jokes aside I think this cut was about as perfect as you could get. I would personally cut Terry and Bayonetta and replace them with Lucas and Diddy Kong but those are just my personal hopes, and don’t realistically make sense.
Dedede stays and ZSS is banished to the void? I’m fine with this. Shame to see K. Rool go though.
I have an assumption that Echo Fighters actually do matter when it comes to cutting characters. They still take work to put in the game and had to be negotiated for. But since they were later inclusions, I expect they're a low priority for the team.
If anything you'd cut the Echo Fighters first and not replace them, but they could either come back as their own unique Fighter or they continue to be clones if there’s time to include them.
Still, I like your presentation and thought process. It's just impossible to judge which characters to cut until we hear anything about a new game.
Worst cut is meta knight
I can’t believe you kept Dedede instead of Meta Knight. He should’ve been a shoe-in on his legacy alone because of how nerfed his kit became after “Brawl Meta-Knight”
I‘d trade mac for peach anyday, which would save king k rool