like others have stated, what they were going for with 6 is a lot like 12's arc, but it just wasn't the right era for it, so they had to cut it short. Shame, really, but at least we have Big Finish now.
Yeah, the sad reality is that while JNT was phenomenal at endings, he wasn't good at BEGINNINGS. Same applies to 5, who had a bland beginning to his run but a fantastic ending that made it worth it (I really strongly feel "Earthshock" should be where people start with him, since it's the real beginning as far as his arc is concerned). I think people would have thought the same thing about 6 and 7, in that their rocky started runs were ultimately worth it, had they been allowed to be seen through to conclusion. Interestingly, 6 (unlike 7) actually had an ultimate character-arc and ending planned, and the firing of Baker killed it before it ever really got started. Big Finish sort of based their run of 6th Doctor audio stories off of this idea, even bringing back the Valeyard as the CRUX of this arc as intended (though probably not in the WAY he was meant to be that crux). Specifically, they revealed the (SPOILERS, READ BELOW)... which gives 6 a resolved character-arc he didn't get in the show. Honestly, listen to Big Finish if you want a true arc for 6. Him and 8 are the only ones I'll recommend in that regard, because for them the audio stories are genuinely essential. SPOILERS: ...The Valeyard is not truly his "12th/13th" incarnation, as the Master claimed, but an alternate 7th Doctor in which the Doctor becomes evil. At the moment 6 is about to regenerate into him, he prevents this timeline by sending a mental projection back to slightly earlier in his 6th incarnation that causes him to die sooner (and become 7 instead). Thus heroically and selflessly sacrificing himself, in a complete character 180 and full-circle bookend to his arc, to save the universe from his own selfishness...
So damn true. Imagine if Season 23 was just the stories we saw in the Matrix playing like a normal season. And instead of The Ultimate Foe as the finale we get one half of an episode for the trial, the other half in the confession dial, second episode in the confession dial and the cliffhanger being that The Master reveals The Valeyards identity. Episode 3 would play as a better version of The Ultimate Foe with The Sixth Doctor sacrificing himself for Gallifrey, proving to the Time Lords that his incorrigible meddling is necessary
It still had some amazing tracks back then, the Genesis Dalek theme, and especially the 60's cybermen theme, which I honestly prefer to the modern cyber theme
@@Icelandic_Sand I actually found out just recently the 60s cybermen theme is actually stock music from some other production. And the track's called Space Adventure. But I still hear it as the 60s cybermen theme no matter where it originated from. And I agree, definitely prefer it to the modern theme.
A lot of Classic Who music has definitely aged quite a bit (and to be fair, the music Series 1 of modern Who is very much of its time as well), but there's a lot fantastic stuff there. Most of Season 18, Paddy Kigsland's scores in particular, are brilliant and atmospheric. Peter Howell's stuff is also great, but it's more heavily synthetic. Dominic Glynn and Mark Ayres also did fantastic work. I think Ghost Light and Survival have some of the best music in Doctor Who's history. I do have a soft spot for the more... aged stuff as well, though. When I'm in the right mood, nothing beats Malcolm Clarke's weird abrasive synth noises or Keff McCullochs epic spamming of orchestra hits.
So much potential the 6th Doctor would have impacted fondly if someone like Moffat wrote for Colin Baker's time on the show. Somewhere in the multiverse, there is an episode of the 6th Doctor went through the 12th's confession dial, and not just nominated a hugo award, but won, and Colin Baker stayed playing as the Doctor for a few more seasons.
Sadly an underrated Doctor showing the darker side of him. They managed to recapture some of that darker overtone with the 12th and managed to pull off this related episode. This is the one person in all of space and time who would seer a line through every moment of existence if it meant saving people. What he went through just to save Clara. Missy perhaps the one who reminded us that the Doctor walks a darker path than we think we see. She gave him an army to prove that point. As 11th said, "Good people don't need rules, today is not the day to find out why I have so many." 6th and 12th exemplify the being behind those eyes. The reason the rules exist to as 12th said "keep me to the mark!". On Gallifrey, he confesses he went too far after staying in the dial for so long. And that's why the Doctor should never travel alone, they need someone to remind them they have these rules to make sure he/she saves people.
@@sykeassai that’s true I’d like to imagine an alternate version of history where the show is cancelled in ‘93 rather then ‘89 but I don’t think that could have been Ideally I’d give Colin five seasons (1984 - 1989), allowing Sylvester his three years till ‘93.
This is such a perfect fit for Six! Mysterious Voice: "There's no way out of this one, Doctor. Death is your inevitable sentence!" Doctor: "How many seconds in eternity... How many? The shepherd's boy said: There's this mountain of pure diamond. It takes an hour to climb it and an hour to go around it. Every hundred years, a little bird comes and sharpens its beak on the diamond mountain. And when the entire mountain is chiseled away, the first second of eternity will have passed. Oh, you must think that's a very long time, don't you? Many "YARDS" away from seeing it all crumble? Personally, I think that's one really sharp BEAK!"
i always feel bad for 6, 7, 8, 12 and 13 cuz they always get hate and i rarely ever see anyone saying "they did well with what they had and i thought they were good" but not everyone just says its there fault when the people at fault are the writers (i have started a war against myself. shit)
I don't know about that. 12 is 100% looked upon incredibly fondly in retrospect, I'd wager and say he's one of the most popular doctors now. Everyone says 6 would've been fantastic as the doctor if he was given better scripts. While the TV movie is shit the audio books saved 8, I mean there's a reason that a 8 series is probably the most requested spin-off. 7 is a similar way, people love 7's last two seasons, the Curse of Fenric and Revelation of the Daleks especially. As for 13, no one hates currently airing Doctor Who more than Doctor Who fans. I'm sure in a few years 13 will be looked upon more fondly.
@@mr.randomguys7629 i hope 13 will be liked more because i thought she did ok and most of the people i know hate peters series and him as the doctor :/
Honestly the writing in 12's era was on the same level as in 10 and 11's. 7's is overall very good too as seasons 25 and 26 are some of the best DW out there which makes up for how bad season 24 was. With 6 I would say season 22 is actually very strong overall and season 23 is solid, his era's writing is underrated tbh. In terms of acting in the role Capaldi is ummatched but I also adore Mcgann in the role (fingers crossed for that spinoff) along with Colin and Mccoy, I even think Jodie was good in the role.
This is such a great take on the track but I think the image is really underrated. Has this weird ominous feeling akin to a 3D rendered PS1 game cut scene. Don't know what it is, think it's the texture of the wall and strange way it contrasts with the doctor.
Ok heaven sent would of fit the whole story arch of six way better, just imagine this selfish and vain doctor sacrificing himself over and over, damaging himself punching this wall over and over to save some human girl, fits like a glove.
If it was 4 instead of 12, I think it would end much sooner because 4th Doctor's body is younger and stronger than 12th Doctor's body. The punches would be stronger.
"Peri...be my pal. Tell me...am I a good man?"
Completely fits.
dare i say, it kinda fits him better.
A story like Heaven Sent would work very well with Six, and an entire "Am I a good man ?" story arc would have been incredible.
I believe that was what they were going for but unfortunately it was cut off
Totally! The writers for Six didn't develop his character well enough to show the "grumpy" man was a good man under the caustic exterior!
like others have stated, what they were going for with 6 is a lot like 12's arc, but it just wasn't the right era for it, so they had to cut it short. Shame, really, but at least we have Big Finish now.
Yeah, the sad reality is that while JNT was phenomenal at endings, he wasn't good at BEGINNINGS. Same applies to 5, who had a bland beginning to his run but a fantastic ending that made it worth it (I really strongly feel "Earthshock" should be where people start with him, since it's the real beginning as far as his arc is concerned). I think people would have thought the same thing about 6 and 7, in that their rocky started runs were ultimately worth it, had they been allowed to be seen through to conclusion.
Interestingly, 6 (unlike 7) actually had an ultimate character-arc and ending planned, and the firing of Baker killed it before it ever really got started. Big Finish sort of based their run of 6th Doctor audio stories off of this idea, even bringing back the Valeyard as the CRUX of this arc as intended (though probably not in the WAY he was meant to be that crux). Specifically, they revealed the (SPOILERS, READ BELOW)... which gives 6 a resolved character-arc he didn't get in the show. Honestly, listen to Big Finish if you want a true arc for 6. Him and 8 are the only ones I'll recommend in that regard, because for them the audio stories are genuinely essential.
SPOILERS: ...The Valeyard is not truly his "12th/13th" incarnation, as the Master claimed, but an alternate 7th Doctor in which the Doctor becomes evil. At the moment 6 is about to regenerate into him, he prevents this timeline by sending a mental projection back to slightly earlier in his 6th incarnation that causes him to die sooner (and become 7 instead). Thus heroically and selflessly sacrificing himself, in a complete character 180 and full-circle bookend to his arc, to save the universe from his own selfishness...
he would beat the shit out of the thing there chasing him
Personally, I think that's a hell of a version.
Personally, I think that's a hell of a comment.
If I didn’t know better, I'd say I travelled 29 years into the past...
Where ya getting 29 from my guy
@@tesseract5569 The Episode Heaven Sent was released in 2015, and Colin Baker last played The Doctor in 1986. 2015 - 1986 = 29
@@TheMajinHermit Ahhh good point. I didn't consider the release date of the episode lmao
"Whoever you are... If you had any part of killing Peri... know that you should be afraid. Because, I AM The Doctor, whatever you like it... or not."
@ryantowellhigh off Regeneration energy
THE REAL TRIAL OF A TIMELORD
So damn true. Imagine if Season 23 was just the stories we saw in the Matrix playing like a normal season. And instead of The Ultimate Foe as the finale we get one half of an episode for the trial, the other half in the confession dial, second episode in the confession dial and the cliffhanger being that The Master reveals The Valeyards identity. Episode 3 would play as a better version of The Ultimate Foe with The Sixth Doctor sacrificing himself for Gallifrey, proving to the Time Lords that his incorrigible meddling is necessary
If the show had tracks like this one back in the day I'm sure many episodes would have aged way better than they have
It still had some amazing tracks back then, the Genesis Dalek theme, and especially the 60's cybermen theme, which I honestly prefer to the modern cyber theme
@@Icelandic_Sand The 1970's unit theme is great too.
@@mr.randomguys7629 Are you referring to the music in "The Ambassadors of Death" by any chance whenever unit's on the move?
@@Icelandic_Sand I actually found out just recently the 60s cybermen theme is actually stock music from some other production. And the track's called Space Adventure. But I still hear it as the 60s cybermen theme no matter where it originated from. And I agree, definitely prefer it to the modern theme.
A lot of Classic Who music has definitely aged quite a bit (and to be fair, the music Series 1 of modern Who is very much of its time as well), but there's a lot fantastic stuff there. Most of Season 18, Paddy Kigsland's scores in particular, are brilliant and atmospheric. Peter Howell's stuff is also great, but it's more heavily synthetic. Dominic Glynn and Mark Ayres also did fantastic work. I think Ghost Light and Survival have some of the best music in Doctor Who's history. I do have a soft spot for the more... aged stuff as well, though. When I'm in the right mood, nothing beats Malcolm Clarke's weird abrasive synth noises or Keff McCullochs epic spamming of orchestra hits.
So much potential the 6th Doctor would have impacted fondly if someone like Moffat wrote for Colin Baker's time on the show. Somewhere in the multiverse, there is an episode of the 6th Doctor went through the 12th's confession dial, and not just nominated a hugo award, but won, and Colin Baker stayed playing as the Doctor for a few more seasons.
Colin could have done it the longest if they asked him
Listen to The Holy Terror audio! Not quite a Heaven Sent, but some similarities and so well done.
Sadly an underrated Doctor showing the darker side of him. They managed to recapture some of that darker overtone with the 12th and managed to pull off this related episode.
This is the one person in all of space and time who would seer a line through every moment of existence if it meant saving people. What he went through just to save Clara. Missy perhaps the one who reminded us that the Doctor walks a darker path than we think we see. She gave him an army to prove that point. As 11th said, "Good people don't need rules, today is not the day to find out why I have so many."
6th and 12th exemplify the being behind those eyes. The reason the rules exist to as 12th said "keep me to the mark!". On Gallifrey, he confesses he went too far after staying in the dial for so long. And that's why the Doctor should never travel alone, they need someone to remind them they have these rules to make sure he/she saves people.
@@ItsButterBean1020 True but then would we have had Sylvester Mccoy as 7th and Ace?
@@sykeassai that’s true
I’d like to imagine an alternate version of history where the show is cancelled in ‘93 rather then ‘89 but I don’t think that could have been
Ideally I’d give Colin five seasons (1984 - 1989), allowing Sylvester his three years till ‘93.
This is such a perfect fit for Six!
Mysterious Voice: "There's no way out of this one, Doctor. Death is your inevitable sentence!"
Doctor: "How many seconds in eternity... How many? The shepherd's boy said: There's this mountain of pure diamond. It takes an hour to climb it and an hour to go around it. Every hundred years, a little bird comes and sharpens its beak on the diamond mountain. And when the entire mountain is chiseled away, the first second of eternity will have passed. Oh, you must think that's a very long time, don't you? Many "YARDS" away from seeing it all crumble? Personally, I think that's one really sharp BEAK!"
Hell of a bird
@@sheridan5175 6th wouldn't really say that.
@@keelanbarron928 but it isn’t as funny
I read that in colin bakers voice
@@willemdafuck8433 damn that’s crazy
i always feel bad for 6, 7, 8, 12 and 13 cuz they always get hate and i rarely ever see anyone saying "they did well with what they had and i thought they were good" but not everyone just says its there fault when the people at fault are the writers
(i have started a war against myself. shit)
I don't know about that. 12 is 100% looked upon incredibly fondly in retrospect, I'd wager and say he's one of the most popular doctors now. Everyone says 6 would've been fantastic as the doctor if he was given better scripts. While the TV movie is shit the audio books saved 8, I mean there's a reason that a 8 series is probably the most requested spin-off. 7 is a similar way, people love 7's last two seasons, the Curse of Fenric and Revelation of the Daleks especially. As for 13, no one hates currently airing Doctor Who more than Doctor Who fans. I'm sure in a few years 13 will be looked upon more fondly.
@@mr.randomguys7629 i hope 13 will be liked more because i thought she did ok and most of the people i know hate peters series and him as the doctor :/
Honestly the writing in 12's era was on the same level as in 10 and 11's. 7's is overall very good too as seasons 25 and 26 are some of the best DW out there which makes up for how bad season 24 was. With 6 I would say season 22 is actually very strong overall and season 23 is solid, his era's writing is underrated tbh.
In terms of acting in the role Capaldi is ummatched but I also adore Mcgann in the role (fingers crossed for that spinoff) along with Colin and Mccoy, I even think Jodie was good in the role.
well series 12 was great fun untill timeless children which ruined it but i think 13 herself was good. just not her run@@_MyNameIsAJ_
@@_MyNameIsAJ_ well either way i enjoyed it you didnt all is fair and lets agree to disagree
"You....killed Peri"
"If you had anything to do with her death, and you are not afraid, then you understand nothing at all."
omg what a neat idea, love it!
@@hellsw0rth 💕
this really helps to highlight all the parallels between 6 and 12 nicely. Well done!
Fitting too since half of 12 is 6.
can we get colin baker to read out the dialogue from the episode and then add it to this video?
I hope someone does this at a convention! That’d be amazing
This is such a great take on the track but I think the image is really underrated. Has this weird ominous feeling akin to a 3D rendered PS1 game cut scene. Don't know what it is, think it's the texture of the wall and strange way it contrasts with the doctor.
Ok heaven sent would of fit the whole story arch of six way better, just imagine this selfish and vain doctor sacrificing himself over and over, damaging himself punching this wall over and over to save some human girl, fits like a glove.
I haven’t seen Classic Who but this is such a cool arrangement
This slaps! And Heaven Sent would work so well with 6! Good job!!
I needed this.
Me too, James!
Wow! You should do more like this
Man this is beautiful!! I love this!!
Wow! Love this version.
Oh, I really like this! Wouldn't sound out of place in an old CD-ROM game.
Death is for the weary, sleep is for the dead!
Gorgeous!
Amazing work!
He would do anything to save perri
Very cool idea and well made.
We need a story with 6th alone and after trial of a time Lord I'm thinking after he drops off mel have him stuck in a time loop in his TARDIS for eons
Great stuff
Only hearing this version, did I first realise that the track resembles 'Truman Sleeps' (from 'Truman Show' OST).
very cool
you should've used the blue coat for the thumbnail
Good idea! I imagine this as something that happens during ToaTL but the blue coat is a good idea.
Should be Evelyn not Peri.
Fantastic arrangement.
Thank you! Curious why you’d think Evelyn would be more appropriate? I don’t disagree btw. Just curious!
@@hellsw0rth 6 had a far deeper friendship with her. Peri's my 2nd fave companion but Evelyn is his best friend by far.
@@DiamandaHaganthat, and she was 6’s Donna
👍
If it was 4 instead of 12, I think it would end much sooner because 4th Doctor's body is younger and stronger than 12th Doctor's body. The punches would be stronger.
How much sooner?
It would only take 3 billion years.
O-M-G. Pure masterpiece, even better than the original.
Did this goated music is available on streaming platforms like spotify deezer and so on ?
Alas no. The originals certainly are but the versions I’ve produced are only on UA-cam for now.
@@hellsw0rthhaaww I'd love to add this on my deezer Doctor Who playlist 😂😭😭
Isso é perfeito, isso me inspira.🫂
Wow, I was actually thinking about doing exactly this months ago
Do you know where I can find this midi? I'd still like to take a crack at it.
Some MIDI files I’ve had for years but some wonderful files are on Musecore
@@hellsw0rthheres my current WIP "crack at it" ua-cam.com/video/VyKliC5vhz8/v-deo.html
no. just no.
Well you're no fun are you
👀