The Stolen Walrus - How An Irishman Tried To Join The Luftwaffe
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- Опубліковано 2 лют 2024
- On the 9th January 1942 a Supermarine Walrus was intercepted over the Irish Sea and forced to land at RAF St Eval in Cornwall. This is the story.
Music: ‘Honeysuckle’ by Honeyroot.
Maps: National Museum Of Scotland and my own collection.
Photos: Air-Britain, Jack Meaden and others. Contact me if you want a credit in the description.
Newspapers and Journals: British Newspaper Archive and others.
Aerial photos: ‘Britain From Above’ and others.
With thanks to the RTE Archive and Pat Malone.
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• Marian Finucane RTE 20...
• Marian Finucane RTE 20...
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This is absolutely fascinating. Thank you.
Great video. Thank you. Amazing story. Could I offer one correction, of something often misreported in the UK. The 50,000 Irishmen who fought for the allies were not blacklisted, just those who deserted the Irish defence forces to do so (approx 5,000). No army takes desertion lightly, especially in a time of crisis. After the war those men were spared individual trials for desertion but blacklisted from government jobs. Given the amount of state employment at the time, it was no small punishment.
The Irish Army expanded hugely from 1939 because of the fear of invasion by either the British who had departed in 1922 or the Germans. The Treaty ports, Cork Harbour and forts, Bere Island and Lough Swilly had been retained by Britain until 1938 and during WW1 had been important in combatting Uboat operations. After Hitlers invasion of Russia in 1941 and US entry into the war in Dec 41 the threat of invasion by either country receded. By then the expanded Irish Army was well trained but there was a serious national need for winter fuel as coal was not available so in 1942 onwards large numbers of trained soldiers were sent to the bogs to cut and harvest turf. Having joined the Army to fight an invasion many decided that turf cutting was not for them and deserted. Some just went home to their farms but many crossed the border and enlisted in the British Army which welcomed them as already trained infantry soldiers with D-day nearing. Some were caught on the way north and were court-martialled but were generally treated leniently.
My father was an Emergency infantry officer who enlisted in 1939 and was commissioned in 1940. A solicitor before the war he was transferred to the Army Legal Service in 1943 because of the desertion problem.
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@@johnbanim978 That's fascinating, thanks for posting.
It's true that Emergency Order 362 only applied to the 5000 deserters but De Valera made it clear that anyone who'd fought for the allies was viewed with suspicion. In my view he was a loathsome individual who brought much suffering to Ireland from the Civil War onwards and had much to do with the murder of the big fella.
@FlyingForFunTrecanair Hmm. I have the impression most Irish people know of neighbours or relatives who fought with the Allies and had no great problem on their return. His intent may have been to make noises to satisfy FF supporters. I know through family about a secret Irish Army trip to the border to collect a couple of RN officers who toured the coast advising on locations for lookout posts, so I don't think he was particularly opposed to the Allies, despite the shameful message of condolences to the German Legation on Hitler's death. He certainly never espoused any Nazi-type views or policies. Not that I am a fan. They say that (unlike other patriots) there is no street or road in Dublin called after Dev because they couldn't find one long enough or crooked enough.
I believe it was in 2013 that the Irish government finally apologised for the way that those Irish men, and women, who had served with the British military in W.W.II were treated upon their return, it’s now believed that the number of Irish citizens that did so exceeded 75,000.
Can you imagine what went through that young man's mind? I can understand his loyalty to the Irish cause but the Nazi regime was monstrous . How did he square that circle? Thanks, as always, Nick, i look forward to your history lessons.
Presumably because he was a Nazi sympathiser….like DeValera who sent the Republics sympathy’s to Germany on the death of Hitler.
Indeed. Why did he try to fly to France to volunteer for the Luftwaffe when he could have flown to Cornwall and volunteered in the RAF, which is what he did later anyway?
@@doglover31418it was the mindset of the times. He was an Irish republican so in his mind it was “the enemy of my enemy is my friend”. He may not have been aware of the evil of the nazi regime or maybe he did not care.
Yes, a dichotomy indeed. Be sure to look at the film description as there are a couple of interesting links.
@@stephenwhelan2515 I wonder if the trip to Cornwall resulted in Thornton learning far more about the horror of the Nazi cause and a change of mindset?
I am glad the aircraft is still with us.
An amazing slice of luck.
Good to hear from you again, Nick! That was yet another captivating bit of history, and I'm glad the Walrus was rescued! Hope you and yours are doing well, and getting ready for nice weather! All the best!
Hi Karl, all very busy with flying and messing around. In Bangkok tonight, on one of those quick dash around the world jobs!
@@FlyingForFunTrecanair One night in Bangkok and the world's your oyster!!
LOL Hope you have a safe journey there and back again... Soon your home base will have encouraging flying weather again. Stay well!!
It's Sunday morning and I enjoyed this video as I ate my breakfast. I'm an old aviation geek in Texas. My ancestors were at war with each other in WW2. I'm Irish on my dad's side. Always wanted to visit the lands of my ancestors (and especially the air museums and museum ships).
Also enjoyed the enlightening comments from other viewers!
Thanks, yes, all comments welcome and enjoyed.
Bravo! What a fun story. The name walrus fits the type a large lumbering biplane amphibian.
Yes, lumbering and with great character!
Terrific as always! The Walrus is a favorite of mine. Did not know they built so many of them. I believe some were used by the Royal Navy, catapulted off warships. Wish there was one preserved in the US to see.
They were versatile machines, my dream warbird I suppose. Other Supermarine products are so common!
Amazing story, thanks for sharing. I studied this period of Irish history at university and still find it fascinating.
My pleasure, it's a great story.
Very interesting clip.
Thank you for that fascinating little bit of Air Corps history that I was not aware of.
My pleasure 🙂
As someone who was employed in aviation for all my working life - from RAAF blackhander and other military roles, to civilian ATC at several international airports - I love aviation history.
My grandfather was in 460SQN RAAF and his Wellington was shot down just off the Dutch coast in 1942. The sole survivor, he spent the rest of the war as a German POW.
Having read all my grandfather’s diaries of the time, although he was involved in some of notable Bomber Command actions of the time and had some hard reflections on just what it meant it drop bombs on cities, it is his anecdotes of the small, human happenings that were most impactful on me.
I enjoy your ‘smaller’ (as compared to the larger events overtaking the world at the time) stories of the pre-war and war period. Thanks for researching and producing them.
It's good fun researching the less well known stuff, this story was a delight to uncover.
an interesting story.
thanks for linking the interviews.
My pleasure. I’m not sure I was really meant to, hence being ‘unlisted’ 🤔
Mad lads those Irish. It must have been pretty hard to never talk about trying to join Germany while flying for the RAF.
Yes, indeed; Thornton was quite a character.
Very interesting. I had heard about it years ago. Rineanna became Shannon Airport after WW2 and was a vital Atlantic refuelling point. The Irish govt invested in an industrial estate and Shannon is now a major town with much employment in industries and services. The airport is still important with flights to the UK, USA & Europe
I fly into Shannon quite often, sometimes just for fuel, other times for a crew swop. It's not so much of a god forsaken bog these days!
That was a pleasure to watch and listen to, very well researched and presented, a human voice instead of computer generated with an American accent that cannot pronounce words correctly. This is a fascinating story and you also touched upon another, the victimisation of the Irish that served in the Allied cause upon their return to Ireland after the war. Thank you, I have subscribed.
Thank you. Anglo-Irish relations are always tricky but thousands came and joined in when they were needed. Great people!
@@FlyingForFunTrecanair I sadly have to agree but its a Century now since independence and we have all now been born after that so it would be nice if we could put the errors of our ancestors behind us. I'm English and have a great respect for the Irish people I have known , worked with, and been friends with.
@@tango6nf477 I concur with your every word.
Tried to join the Luftwaffe, and later succeeded in joining the RAF - there just seems to be something delightfully 'Irish' about this. :)
Yes, it's certainly quite 'Irish'!
Fantastic... Thanks for posting 👍🏼
My pleasure!
Utterly fascinating story. Thank you!
Thank you, one of those stories that you couldn't make up!
If you open and read the film description, you'll find a couple of links to more information that I've uploaded as 'unlisted'.
What a great story! Wg Cdr Kellett continued to fly until a late age, having a terrifying strip near his farm in Kent. Among other things he had an Auster, Luton Major and Beagle Pup. I see his son fairly regularly and was at school with his grandson. He also commanded 303 Sqn during the Battle of Britain.
Oh excellent, thanks for the info. The CFI at our local flying club had his first flying job with Kellett over 50 years ago.
Another delightful clip - thanks as ever Nick. Looking forward to more!
Thank you 🙂
As always, a wonderful video. So important to recall these memories before they're forever lost.
Most definitely 👍
Great story, and that the plane survives.
Yes, both are quite remarkable. It would be good if the Walrus wore its true identity.
Fascinating story.
Indeed, it's been several months in the making.
Lovely story Nick. Chris in Devon.
Thanks Chris 👍
Excellent 😅
It's a super story!
An Irishman, a deserter and a Nazi walk into a bar...
😂😂
Couldn't make it up. I'll look out for that Walrus when i next visit the museum.
It's such a good story and I was surprised how little was known about it. The research took ages but an Anglo-Irish friend helped steer me in the right direction.
That’s so interesting.
It's almost unbelievable but all true!
What an age that was.
Yes indeed.
not quite up there with Paddy Finucane, but a nice try.
It was certainly a different approach to wanting to join in the bunfight.
I'm a bit confused by the meaning of the Irish terms Nationalist and Republican in this time period. In been Spain a committed Republican would have been pro-socialist/communist/anti-Christian, while a Nationalist would have been pro-fascist/Nazi or simply anticommunist.
It's complicated......
Grand story. I wonder, if Thornton had joined the Luftwaffe and survived the war, if deValera would have banned his return?
The South was clearly much colder towards Germany but possibly they couldn’t be more severe to military deserters according to which side they joined? Dev was obsessive with legal and diplomatic technicalities such as offering his respects on the death of the German head of state in April 1945! Was Thornton a dismissed civilian when he joined the R.A.F.?
@@givenfirstnamefamilyfirstn3935 Yes, he had been dismissed after his trial.
Yes, I wonder. De Valera was an odd fish at best.
@@FlyingForFunTrecanair So Thornton would have been refused repatriation to Eire if he'd gone to the Germans by deserting the IFC. But post-war, after joining the RAF as a civilian, and de-mobed -- he should not have been. Unless they held the first case against him.
@@HootOwl513 There are many questions for which we will never know the answer. Were there any Irishman in the Freikorps?
Only deserters from the Irish Defence Forces were black listed. As both the British and Germans had plans to invade Ireland, they were needed at home. There was no problem Irish citizens joining the allied forces.
There was little point in the British invading Ireland and a German invasion would have been near impossible. They never managed 22 miles across to Dover, in spite of all the usual Nazi bluster.
Hindsight is great but in 1940 the Nazi juggernaut looked unstoppable. Germany had draw up two separate plans but wouldn’t have been achievable without a successful invasion of Great Britain.
Churchill wanted the treaty ports back and was angry that Ireland remained neutral. Remember he had already invaded neutral Norway but got his ass kicked.
Luckily his generals talked him out of an invasion of Ireland as they recognised that a friendly Ireland was much better than trying to subdue the population. The British and Irish were already cooperating in many (un-neutral) ways which resulted in Plan W in the case of a German invasion.
Why on earth did the Brits let this man join the RAF when the obvious danger was that he would desert and fly his aircraft to the Germans. If he wanted combat he could have just come over to Britain and join up as indeed thousands of Republican Irishmen did. Not to fight for Britain particularly, but to defeat fascism.
I believe he probably had a master class in what utter shits the Nazis were after his unofficial trip to the UK. He married an Englishwoman, Served in the RAF and lived in Kent for the rest of his life. He was young, impulsive, anti-authority and many other things but not a traitor.
Yes, but you can only judge someone by their past. They took a hell of a gamble. He could have given the Nazis a British fighter and a propaganda victory. As a dedicated Irish Republican he must have regarded the Brits as the enemy. @@FlyingForFunTrecanair
@@dp-sr1fd The RAF didn’t do their homework? Many of the answers died with Thornton in 2006.
The Chetniks were NOT partisans.
What were they then, Johnny Boy? Aren't you the chap who flew the Mosquito on a foggy Christmas Eve?
My mistake, your fault; indeed they were Serbian Nationalists. Party poopers rather than partisans.
@@loomisgruntfuttock Yep…‚‚twas me. Had to guide a Vampire with electrics fail.
@@MothaLuva Amazing that your testicles fitted into the cockpit of a Mosquito.