(234) The Classes Of Wolf 359
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- Опубліковано 15 бер 2024
- In today's VERY Special Episode of Truth Or Myth, we're taking an Alpha Canon look at the Battle of Wolf 359, and the starships, along with their classes, that participated in that tragic event!! So turn your video up to 4K resolution and I Hope you enjoy! :)
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"We are fighting the most dangerous foe that the Federation has ever encountered and they are coming for Earth." "Give me all the Oberth's you can muster!"
Lol
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics It's know as the Jenkins battle theory... it's not well regarded
I should say not LOL
And Miranda class flying ⚰️s
We only have three left! We... don't know what happened to the others.🤗
Every time there's a Star Trek topic about the Battle of Wolf 359 it caughts my attention.
Catches mine too ;) :P
A cadet on an Oberth Class Ship during the Battle of Wolf 359: He He I am in danger.
LOL Poor cadet LOL
Well let's hope he was on the only one surviving ship of the dispatched fleet...an oberth 😂
It's amazing how they had to bring out 100-year-old ships to fight, basically anything that had offensive weapons. That said, the science vessel could also have been there to use its dedicated sensors for tactical data to the fleet, but unfortunately got caught up in the overall firefight.
Thankfully things fared better in the battle of Sector 001 with those beautiful battle ready vessels. Lessons were learned in a hard and tragic way.
I enjoy these insights in Alpha Canon. Thanks.
In a stunning turn of events... the Borg cube was destroyed... single handedly by that Oberth class ship. 🫡🥰🤪😂😂😂
And the Klingon Empire was defeated by triples.
BOTH completely canon LOL :P
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics wtf.
@DeadBoy ?
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics no just tripping the fact that they can both be Cannon and yet we're not originally.
for sure need a video on shipd from battle of 001 and just for fun the millennium falcon
We'll see ;) :P
Aah ! I'm too emotionally invested in the Miranda Class . I can't take this !
Lol My condolences! ;)
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics , gulp . Thanks !
Anytime ;)
13:40 "It is unknown why Starfleet decided to dispatch a vessel of this class to engage the Borg..."
Some Starfleet Admiral: "Maybe the Oberth's tendency to go boom will help take the Borg with them?"
Ah, yes... the Kamikaze Maneuver. You're going to die anyway, so take someone with you. 😀
Although many of these ships were kitbashes, there were some great designs. It would have been great to have seen a couple of the other Galaxy projects vessels on screen during TNG. there is some fantastic CGI work out there but there is something special about models.
Though I love Digital Models (lol obviously) there is still something to be said about Physical Models!
I can’t believe they didn’t give TNG the TOS DVD treatment all of the digital “improvements”. I want to see the battle of Wolf 359 fit in there with bad CGI and my favorite kitbash New Orleans class.
Still LOTS of time ;)
"...Wolf 359 was an inside job..." Star Trek: Lower Decks.
LOL
Thanks to Wolf 359, Starfleet pulled it's head out of its "Golden Age" ass and put warships back on the menu boys!
Well, at least ship classes that could defend themselves, and also adapt to the various situations they would encounter...
Would love to see how you would fill in the gaps for the Frontier Day Massacre! I mean the loss of ships in the battle with space dock and the Titan, as well as the "culling" of starfleet's senior officers on board each ship and star base would make for a great story!
The return of the OG Truth or Myth. 😊
For at least this 1 episode lol
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics 😄🖖 Live long and prosper my good Tri-nary.
Peace, and long life!
Surprised no ship tried a Holdo Manuver into the cube.
Great update! The revised visual presentation is amazing!!
Thanks so much! Glad you enjoyed the update :)
think i would have split the fleet in two so it was circling, hitting the two sides of the cube, leaving the cubes flight path unobstructed so any damaged ships would fall away rather then being used in the later stages and damage on the cube would bore away into the centre. No idea if it would have worked but should resulty in less casulties to similar effect. As for the oberth, unless they were experimental section ships, its difficult to imagin them having better or newer tech than the Galaxy and its brethren so i'd leave them to one side ready to colect the life pods and sweep up with tractor beams.
Excellent video thank you for making it
Glad you enjoyed it! You're welcome!
I wish they would do a mini movie about the battle. I love when ST shows space battles but they are too short. A movie could add depth to the story and would be cool visually.
Still LOTS of time ;)
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics I don't have the skills at all with the computer in any way shape or form to do the videos you do which I consider to be superb. But I would love to see you do it or somebody who can really do justice with CGI. Of course what I envision would be not just spaceships flying around shooting at each other but the entire lead up, Admirals issuing orders, ships and crews being introduced at least in some way, rendezvous and briefings and of course each ship named and numbered. I'd like to see the old Connies and Mirandas giving a good account of themselves. I can envision what I want to see but I would have no idea how to make it and certainly getting actors and stuff would make it even more of a production which CBS or Paramount would need to do. It may even need a serial of say 6 episodes to do it justice and put on Paramount + maybe.
In a battle of tactical formations and strategy……. An disorganized attack would’ve probably done more damage
It always bothered me that the Saratoga went into battle with civilians aboard. If they didn't have time to drop them off somewhere, they could have put them in escape pods and shuttles before entering the area of battle. Also, in my head canon Enterprise D offloaded civilians and non-essential personal early on in the events of "Best of Both Worlds" and that it simply wasn't mentioned on screen. This is why they could literally use the saucer in combat as a decoy. The idea that they would have done that with civies on board would be insane.
very nice infromtione video like it very much
Many many thanks Dom :)
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics Fan fiction videos will have a field day with different, angles and perspectives from the battle of Wolf 359.
Nice Video❤
Thank you! 😊
Never forget Stardate 44002.3
Amen! :)
Were there any projects to refit the ambassador class to function like it was supposed to?
Look up the Narendra Class and the Niagara Class, I think those are good examples of what if the Ambassador worked as it was supposed to be
We, have encountered... THE BORG!
The battle of wolf 359 aftermath was starfleels wake-up call
Indeed, they had gotten so complacent, creating luxury liners with a fraction of the power they should have had!
It’s crazy that Star Fleet threw those Oberth class ships at that Borg cube. Talk about tossing kittens at a hungry crocodile.
LOL I know right? :P
No grain of star dust? That doesn't sound right 😅
LOL Nope, just the facts in this one!
I enjoy your content but am pretty new to the channel. I am curious why you suspended the history of the various seasons/series. The latest one I can see is TNG season 5 from a couple years back. Are there others that I am missing? will they be continued?
Where's the background music from?
UA-cams Audio Library!
I wounder how long an Obearth class ship lasted against a Borg Cube ??
I thought I read somewhere that Admiral Hanson's flagship in the script documents was designated "U.S.S. Auriga". I could be wrong though.
Also, where is the Melbourne-class variation of the Nebula? Or is that a Beta ship?
I think the Nebula class USS Melbourne is still considered Beta canon. Haven't checked the remastered version of Best of Both Worlds pt. 2 but I don't think the hull registry on the Nebula wreckage is legible, so officially the only USS Melbourne we've ever seen on screen at Wolf 359 is the retcon from Emissary that made the Melbourne an Excelsior.
No, there was no name given for Hansons Flagship at the Battle!
As for the Melbourne, since registries couldnt be seen on screen during the Best of Both Worlds Part 2, canonically, the Melbourne is the Excelsior Class vessel seen at the beginning of the DS9 episode Emissary. So there is no Mebourne-class or variation, making it neither Alpha or Beta Canon!
The galaxy class that was lost during the battle was the U.S.S. Leeroy Jenkins
- source, i made it up😊
Seems legit. I’ll allow it. 👍
When you say "participated"...
yes?
Why wasn't the Millennial Falcon there ?
that was the Battle of Sector 001
Question: Why were Oberth class ships in the battle?
My Answer: Starfleet was probably throwing everything that had weapons they could scramble into the fleet.
Which would be ridiculous! You dont send starships that have barely any offensive or defensive capabilities in to a battle!
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics They are armed. Not well armed but they can fight, and in a situation like that I could easily imagine Starfleet being desperate enough to send anything they have with a working Phaser bank. Also even once the ships inspired by the events of Wolf 359 entered service they still had Oberths in the fleet for the Battle of Sector 001 so they clearly aren't useless in a fight
Yeah, nothing you've said here changes my above comment! Also I never said they werent armed, I said they " have barely any offensive or defensive capabilities!"
Now is it me or my silver but I remember distinctly Admiral Hanson was aboard the Melbourne as his flagship.
Nope, it was never stated or seen in the episode that Admiral Hanson was on the Melbourne. Also the Script says he was on a Galaxy Class starship and the episode showed him on the same Battle Bridge Riker uses in the episode!
The Borg may have done the Federation a favor by forcibly retiring several ships and crew from Starfleet service.
Errrrrrrrrr....
The consultation class that was there deserves it's own episode
There was more than 1 there, and they have never been identified!
i know there was a federation class refit there .. thats the conny 2ndary hull you see in the wreckage.
It isnt, canon tells us it was just 2 regular Connie Hulls!
Two Connie’s in this battle shows that during the dominion war off screen there were in fact Connie’s still in the fleet
No it doesnt... Just because 2 Connies were in the battle of Wolf 359, doesnt mean that 5 years later they were ANY still in service... So Im not sure why you've made this connection?
I know the Oberth is combat in in-affective and people like to trash talk it however I alwies seen there use as a AWAX system. Today if you base you option on there combat abilities they are useless If you look at how they can use information warfair and help other aircraft and other combat vessels and vehicles track acquire and engage they are worth there wate in latnum
Lol yeah no, that is definitely not what the Oberth has or was ever used for! We know that your idea is incorrect as canon has been clear about the Oberth Class!
I do have to wonder if the unnamed Connies were drone-controlled ships.
No, as is that technology existed, no ships would have had crews at the battle, and 11000 wouldnt have lost their lives!
I think I would have sent those same thirty nine starships on auto pilot to engage the borg and immediately plot a course into the cube at maximum warp
That wouldn't work on so many levels!
First, going to warp drops the starship in to a layer of subspace, so it wouldn't hit the ship.
Second, the Borg would have been able to detect any vessel going in to warp, and would have destroyed them long before they were able to do so.
Third, autopilot in Star Trek is never reliable.
So a good effort, but never would have worked!
@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics the deflector is still used at warp to move particles out of the ships way at warp, so whether in subspace or not, a ship still has an effect on normal space. If autopilot is not reliable then utilize skeleton crews to get the ships to wolf 359 then beam them to a select number of vessels that could leave the combat area. Then the ships could jump to warp from multiple vectors into the cube while simultaneously detonating their torpedo payloads at maximum yield.
Right, because errant particles exist in subspace... So nothing you have said here changes my previous comment... Sorry to tell you, but you have nothing!
No mention of the miraculous survival of the USS RIghteous? They made a whole computer game about it, you know. It's Called Star Trek: Borg.
No, because the USS Righteous is NOT Canon, its a computer game!
I'm willing to accept your decision, but I don't understand it. It had John de Lancie, it was written by a TNG writer, and even used Star Trek sets. Why no love?@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics
Because it isnt canon... It doesnt matter who is in it, it's still a video game and doesnt fit the criteria of this video!
I guess what I'm really asking is: Why is it not canon? I mean I presume your criteria is the show is what counts above all else, but why does the computer game not also count? Is there some official rule that you're holding yourself to?@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics
Yes, the definition of what is canon in Star Trek... IE ONLY things in Episode or Movie form, branded as Trek, by the owners of Trek is canon. Video Games, Comic Books, Novels, Manual etc are not canon, and are meaningless to the show! They are what's called Beta Canon, which is licensed Material that again, has no meaning to the shows themselves!
All the old ships should have just rammed the cube to start the battle from all sides and self destructed as they impacted. All the new ships could have mopped up what was left of it.
Uh no, that wouldnt have worked, as the Borg would have long prepared for such a scenario!
STO for some reason added a Akira and Centaur class to the battle
Yes, and STO is not canon for that very type of reason!
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics I know STO is not canon but I have no idea why they would put those two classes in the battle since everyone knows they came into service because of the battle
Artistic License? Lol
I thought the Melbourne was supposed to be a Nebula?
It was supposed to be a Nebula Class vessel, but was not actually seen in the Best of Both Worlds as such... Thus when DS9 did that littler snippet of the battle at the beginning of the episode, and they made the Mebourne an Excelsior Class, that became canon!
Why wasn't the Defiant there ?
Uh, because it wasnt invented until AFTER this battle...
Thank you
Starfleet: wolf 359 was a massacre, the worst defeat ever faced by the federation when the Borg first made contact
2nd battle of Chinoka:...
The difference is the loss of life... 11000 in Wolf 359, Chintoka, very few! The loss of all those ships at Chintoka (property) doesn't really = a massacre!
I'm probably going to be ripped apart but I think the Freedom class is pig ugly.
Send in the mob!!!! :P
How can they go where no one has gone before, when they meet people? Lol. I understand, it's from our perspective.
Exactly... You answered your own question!
What would I have done differently? I'd have ships ram the cube.
That wouldnt have worked, as Im sure the Borg would be prepared for such an action!
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics I'm not so sure. Picard would never have thought about it so idk. As you say, "Just a little bit of Star Trek fun." :)
You think Captain Picard wouldnt have thought about a starship Ramming the Cube? Given he thought that in Nemesis, he most defintely would have... BUT More importantly, in the 1000s of years that the Borg existed and were assimilated, you think NO ONE would have tried ramming it? That is impossible, so again, the Borg would have already prepared for such an action! :) And of course it's all in good fun, but that doesn't mean you cant be told when your idea is incorrect! 😁
At least the Cheyenne class uss ahwahee survived wolf 359 and took part in the blockade at the Klingon border to stop romulan interference in the Klingon civil war
That IS one of the possible surviving ships!
I read it in the official starships collection and it's name is seen on a fleet display in redemption pt 2 and confirms it was salvaged from wolf 359
Well first, the official starship collection manual is not canon, and therefore meaningless!
Second, the Endeavor was there, and was still around afterwards, making it an equally viable candidate for being the sole survivor!
Third, there is NOTHING in canon, or on a display screen, suggesting which, if any starship, was salvaged!
No, again see the comment I left above!
There was no Galaxy Class at the Battle, fans have proved it.
No they havent, and yes there was... 🙄 Please refer to memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Battle_of_Wolf_359 to better understand the topic you're trying to discuss!
Calling Starfleet arrogant for being unprepared for the Borg feels like calling a school championship rugby team arrogant for being unprepared for the All-Blacks.
No it isnt, and that comparison is just silly... Starfleet went ahead and made Luxury Liners instead of vessels that could protect its people... THAT is the height of arrogance, and anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional!
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics Luxury liners that were at least a match for the top-of-the-line warships anyone else could produce, including classes that were described as "a powerhouse" as part of constant design innovation.
When they discovered a new threat that came out of nowhere they attempted to make countermeasures but they weren't ready in time because the Borg were too fast and research takes time. Then they were crushed due to the Borg assimilating all of the tactical and technical information in Picard's mind. Despite all of that, Starfleet prevailed with ingenuity and guile. And after that they learned and adapted and their anti-Borg research came to fruition.
I just don't see arrogance anywhere in there.
It was nowhere near a match for most. The Galaxy Class was beaten around and outmatched many MANY times. It was far weaker than the DDerdiex Class Warbird, See Tinman. And even without shields, the Flagship of the Federation SHOULD have been able to handle a single, retired, Bird of Prey, but couldnt.
So all the signs of arrogance are there, you just have to be willing to open your eyes and see them!
@@TriAngulumStudiosAudioComics It was slightly weaker than a D'Deridex but potent enough that Tomalak was convinced 2 warbirbs vs 3 BoPs and a Galaxy was not a fight he'd live through.
You can destroy any ship in a BoP if you can bypass it's shields and they refuse to fire back more than once. That was a failure of command, and an incredibly silly fight scene, rather than a failure of design.
No No No, even without shields, the flagship, this marvellous powerhouse that refuse to see the arrogance in SHOULD hase been able to outfight a 20 year old, retired, defective BofP, hands down, and nothing you can say will change that reality! And that is CLEARLY a failure in design.
Also yes, Tomalak was far more worried about the Bird of Prey than the Enterprise, which tells you something right there LOL And bear in mind, those were not the small Birds of Prey but the Large Versions, full battleships! So it had nothing to do with the Weak Galaxy class.
You may not like the reality, and choose not to see it, but it still stands... Starfleet grew complaisant and arrogant, even Picard says so himself. And so does Sisko in the Second Season of DS9, not his exact words, but the meaning is there!
Anyhow, it's been fun debating this with you but Im ending this conversation here, as you're now just running in circles! Take care, and keep Trekin'
(Thread CLOSED- No further Comments Will Appear)
Here/HEAR is how an Oberth class can engage the Borg...and defeat it...two ships approach from diverse courses...one uses automation to set a course, " THROUGH ", the Borg ship...then beam over to the other Oberth ,WARP the now unoccupied ship ,"through", the borg ship, as the other Oberth ship ," has beamed," the crew off, and now jumps to warp in another direction 🙄, LLAP👍🖖🙏😇💯%!
That wouldn't work on so many levels!
First, going to warp drops the starship in to a layer of subspace, so it wouldn't hit the ship.
Second, the Borg would have been able to detect any vessel going in to warp, and would have destroyed it long before it was able to do so.
Third, transporting personnel during the battle on a manoeuvring starship, would have been a very hazardous endeavour.
So a good effort, but never would have worked!