It was my understanding that 'bugging out' with a .22 rifle had to do with survival and hunting, not man killing. The advantage was light weight = more rounds of ammo.
@@michealnelson5179 Not me. I want to be surrounded by people I trust and who trust me. Going it alone works until you sprain an ankle. Having a solid community behind you is the only sane solution to prepping. Pro tip: If you live in a blue state, move to somewhere where you can trust your neighbors.
I allways keep a mini gun in the nightstand , it covers all the bases. I just have to remember to put on my slippers before I use it because it's hell wading thru all that hot brass on the floor.
This is really interesting. Based on testing videos and such I concluded that .380 was serviceable and most are concealable enough easy for daily carry. I'm really impressed that .380 stands up so well in real world use. Its always nice to have real data to corroborate or disprove conclusions.
Been carrying. 380 for a while and I agree. It's a fantastic round consistently overlooked and underrated. It's just enough for a possible encounter on the street or in a confined area and the small guns still hold a good amount of rounds in comparison to larger micro-compact calibers.
They left out something VERY important, and that is hit/miss. How many times to people miss with pistols? How often do they miss with a shotgun or rifle? They ONLY focused on the hits, not the misses. Shotgun hit percentage is very high. Pistol is very low.
James McClane - Thanks',... and welcome home from a fellow Patriot, been a decent life and we're a couple of the lucky ones that have been able to live it. Now that I'm old I think of all those young guy's that never had the chance.
I choose my caliber the same way I choose the platform, what I’m comfortable with. I carried a S&W model 66 .357 magnum as a Detroit police officer and had total confidence in it, when I was finally advised (pressured) into going with an auto loader, I opted for a para ordinance P-14 .45 acp because I was confident in the caliber from my time in the service. A 9mm probably would have been sufficient, but it all boiled down to what I was use to and trusted.
For a police officer the ability of the bullit to penetrate vehicles is also more important than for the general public carrying guns for self defense. I think that was the main idea with the .357 Magnum in the first place.
I got a Glock 21 in .45 ACP not because .45 is any better, but because the size of the pistol felt reassuring. I also have an AR15 that's a civilian-legal version of my old M4. That platform is familiar to me, and I know for a fact that it'll get the job done, even if the attacker has body armor. However, if I could have no other firearm, I'd take my old Winchester 1300 Defender. While buckshot or even slugs won't defeat body armor per se, slugs will pulverize whatever they hit, most likely killing the target, or at least stopping him.
@@Octopussyist .357 is one hell of a round. Its statistics are about the only caliber that surprised me; I really thought it would be more effective. 125-grain hollow points do horrendous damage. I shot rabbits with both .44 Magnum and .357 Magnum in Alaska. The .44 just made a .42-inch (look it up, .44 Magnum is actually .42 inches) hole through the head while the .357 Magnum reduced the head to mush.
@@thatguy22441 it depends on the type of ammo. 125 Grain .357 Mag Or us it's 'brother' the .357 SIG Which was designed to copy the .357 mag's power in automatic pistols are the best for day to day carry for revolvers and pistols. The 240-grain .44 mag hollow point will only show it's stoping power once it is unleashed when something dangerous charges at you. For 'normal' situations .357 mag or/SIG is perfect. But if you need that little inch of extra power or you you just want to be on the safe side when a bear attacks that you will be able to stop it .44 is the deal.
30 yrs in law enforcement and all I was taught was year after year was bullet placement. If you can’t shoot accurately with a 45 or 44 then you might have much, much better stopping power with a 9mm or .380. It’s all about who’s shooting.
john harris no argument here. I own a Ruger redhawk .45 for bear protection up here in Alaska. For me personally I love it but my edc is a 9mm because I feel a wee bit more accurate with it (and it’s a heck of a lot smaller).
john harris for the brownies up here for sure. 335 grain hard cast lead. They’re palm pounders but at close to mid range will devastate any animal up here.
357 mag is my favorite cartridge, but I find myself carrying my Taurus tcp 380 more often than not because of convenience. It’s always good to see data backing in up
I was a police officer in the early to middle 80's. Our dept. weapon was the S&W 66. At that time very few depts. allowed the use of semi-autos. Our dept. did a lot of study on the 357. It was the choice caliber for a lot of depts. At longer distances, the 357 excelled statistically. The problem was , at point blank range where 85 % of police shootings occured, the 357 had a tendency to pass though an assailant . The 357 just didn't mushroom enough because of the high velocity. Our dept. settled on a 158 gr. 38 +p, semi-jacketed hp. This round was perfectly capable of penetrating auto windshields and seemed to have good ability to stop a threat at close range. I did carry 357 ammo as backup and never felt under gunned.
@@rodvan-zeller6360 depends on what bullets were shot like the ole fashion 125 gr at 1450 fps sjhp fragment and expand violently on impact i dont use those for backup hog guns because they tend to not penetrate enough but 158 gr tends to hold more weight and if it's a spicy one 158 at 1400 fps then although it's going fast it retains enough weight to punch through I'm not sure what they issued yall but that is just what I've seen on pigs in texas
@@rodvan-zeller6360 for example 75 gr 5.56 compared to 45 gr 5.56 75 gr is actually used for hog hunting and probably the best option where as 45 gr basically falls apart on impact barely penetrating as much as 9mm speed paired with lighter weight bullets means less penetration unless its it's a bullet not made to expand like hardcast solid copper etc
Worth pointing out that a rifle has a much longer engagement distance too. That could easily make the difference between winning and losing a fire fight and, IMO, makes up for the increased weight. Not to mention how much better it is for hunting.
i dont think that hunting maters in personal defence and you ar mostlikly on close dictences for sellf difense if you end up in a distenc gun fir r fight you are extremly unlaky or in th wrong place.
@@jannis8978 much easier to aim a rifle at pretty much any range, velocity doesn’t matter at close range but handling does, and you can aim a rifle much better at any distance than a handgun
@@1ch0r41 Unless you live within 200 yards of anyone. Use your brain or turn it in. There's a line for responsible gun owners and you're not eligible. Yes rifles are easier to handle, collateral damage is not.
"missing" is the missing factor here. Rifles are easier to aim. Also a smaller pistol round should be easier to hit shot 2 & up. Another point for .380 perhaps. Definitely a point for "use a rifle if you can. Use the pistol in a self-def caliber you're good with if you can't."
@@eb4305 Prepper channel though Erok. Your point is suited better for a general self-defense channel. Hopefully anyone reading is sensible enough to leave the 5.56 in the gun safe in the middle o town.
Excellent information, though one point needs addressing. Saying that a 22lr rifle is a shit choice as a bug out rifle, needs to be put into context. ' Bug out' isn't necessarily only self defense. With this in mind, consider the following : 1. Living off the land, as in shooting to eat, a 22 rifle is a great choice, as it'll kill most things, and fairly quietly, which is important for a number of reasons. 2. If you're ' bugging out', you can ambush people / animals with head shots. One shot kills up to 100 yards should be regarded as fairly easy. 3. You can quite conceivably, easily carry 1500 rounds of 22lr in a small backpack. 4. 22lr ammo can be found anywhere. 5. Hose down an atracker with a load of 22lr, and they WILL die. 6. Minimal noise signature compared to other calibres, and effectively silent using subsonic. 7. Carry CCI Velocitor and subsonic, and you are in a very good position.
@@phillipcooper3209 i recall reading somewhere that around 1 in 10 people shot in the head survive that being said they would suffer damage to the brain or other areas
That's why I have a Ruger PC Carbine Chassis model, and a Glock 19. Both use easily carried 9mm, and both use the same magazine. Both will also fit in a backpack.
I just saw the video and had one major complaint about the bug out situation, the reason most want the .22 is because you can carry a lot more ammo than the others and you would not have it to kill attackers but the kill small game for food without drawing much attention to yourself with louder ammo types. To bug out is to move and evade, not fight a war. Most would still have a good pistol for protection from attackers but the .22 rifle is the best for quiet shooting, especially with a silencer, for food.
l was a law enforcement officer for 35 years in California. last 12 years was a Coroner's Detective. Also, sniper, rangemaster, and firearm instructor. l always said all you need is one well placed bullet.
A Austin Texas PD 👮🏻♂️ Sgt took out a armed attacker near a 🏥 with his PD issue .40S&W. He fired the M&P pistol at recorded range of 104 yards! 😯 That was impressive. Years ago, a USAF security police shot a felon with a AK rifle. The enlisted SP used a 9mm M9, 89 yards. ✔
@@meat-hook True, but keep in mind most gun fights occur in less than 20 feet. That's according to FBI statistics. Even more so, many occur at 10 feet or less. If you cannot put holes in an 8-1/2 X 11 piece paper consistently at the range, at 20 feet or less, then you will definitely have problems in the real world.
"Pistols put holes in people. Rifles put holes through people. Shotguns, at the right range with the right load, will physically remove a chunk of sh*t off of your opponent and throw that sh*t on the floor." -Clint Smith
@@GabrielAlves-fw7bj only if you hit them in the right place. And then only if their not high outta their minds on something like pcp. Then you had better have that shotgun handy.
I disagree with the conclusions on 410 handgun rounds. Look up ballistic tests for them on UA-cam. They do an awful job. Paul Harrell has some videos on the Taurus Judge.
I agree with you. The narrator missed spread pattern with shotguns. A 410 with a 3 inch barrel spreads a lot more than a 20 inch 12gauge. but there are some 410 loads that are devastating inside of 10 yards. Plus they also shoot 45lc. Not my favorite choice though.
I think one of the key points he made on the 410 handgun was multiple rounds. Even with massive spread, you should be able to hit your target with at least two of the five rounds, which is inside of the "max number of hits incapacitate" when compared to other pistols.
The biggest point he missed with the .410 pistol is that in a 3" barrel you are going to lose a lot of velocity, which will greatly degrade performance. Also he "assumes" that .410 will be 1/2 as effective as 12 ga., but then only cuts their advantage in half. 12 ga. has an 86% success rate half of that is 43% giving then 10% less effectiveness not 15% more.
Buy whatever suits you best. If you like a particular platform but you're stuck between deciding on caliber, go with the most abundant caliber. The rounds will be more readily available and probably less expensive.
This is excellent. The only thing missing is how many shots are missed vs on target with a pistol vs a rifle because it' doesn't matter how effective a round is unless it hits a target and can be well placed. Just a quick trip to the range you see very qickly the ease of accurately shooting a 556 rifle vs a handgun.
I'd have to go look at the study he used, but my guess would be the one stop shot difference between rifles and handguns is based on the first hit, not necessarily the first shot if its a miss. It would have been interesting to see how many altercations are ended by missed shots scaring the attacker off. But you are very correct in saying that a rounds effectiveness doesn't matter if the shot is missed. He also said the study used data and interviews from Military conflicts. This leads me to believe that most of the data for rifles, is M4's using xm193, m88 ball, etc. None of which expand, and out of 14" barrels, don't reliably tumble. I would find it very interesting to see what effective rate rifles have, if the data is limited to rifles using expanding self defense/hunting ammo. My guess is that it would be a bit higher than what the study showed.
John Garcez well yeah, but when talking about handguns vs rifles, thats kinda cheating a little bit. I mean sure, an AR pistol is technically a handgun, but if it weren’t for some stupid ass regulations on sbrs, pretty much all ar pistols would be short rifles from the get go. But yes, 5.56 “pistols”, especially with good expanding rounds, are very effective compared to a normal handgun.
So when 9mm and 45 ACP perform near identically, why bother carrying a 7 shot 1911 with considerable recoil, when you can have 17 or more rounds of 9mm?
For me it's a theoretical discussion anyways, since live in a place where I can't legally own a gun, nor legally defend myself with anything... so quit crying about capacity limits.
I agree with a movie (Black Lagoon) on that size doesn't matter as long as you're the one that scores first. In that regard recoil is certainly a bad thing, as it reduces the chance of follow up shots and may cause you to screw up the first shot, due to lack of practice... So even with restricted capacities, you would probably do better with smaller ammo and you might even profit of having more ammo and training, due to costs.
What about cost per round? I can get a 100rd box of 9mm for $36 a Bass Pro. It makes training a lot cheaper. The more you train the better your accuracy. If it's cost prohibitive to train the less training you can do.
This was very interesting. I carry a Glock 42 .380 because it is light, and I figure a gun I'm more willing to carry is better than the one left at home, and also if I'm being completely honest I'm not the best shot. So the 42 is significantly easier for me to shoot accurately, and faster with follow up shots. So for these reasons I've concluded this was a better carry gun for me than one of my larger 9mm options. Now after seeing these statistics I'm even more confident with my choice.
Check out the DB9GEN4, it’s much smaller then the Glock 42 and it’s rated for 9mm+P, I hate 9mm in a full-size gun but once you put 9mm in a pistol that weighs 16oz fully loaded then it becomes perfect for power/size ratio.
@@iLLBiLLsRoastBeatsthe 43 has more recoil than the 42, and makes follow up shots slower for me. So better ballistics for less accuracy in my case is not worth it.
I've had alotta Berettas; 92 full sized 9mm, 92 compact 9mm and, a Beretta 380 84..And I've fired Colt 1911's a lot. The 1911 felt like a brick in my hand, always was moving around between shots. The 9mm Berettas were much better in the grips, but I was Always faster and more accurat with the 380!? Firing double taps or three round bursts, the 380 made me a champ on the pistole range. huh.
A test I do first time at the range with a firearm, is I dump the mag fairly quickly just doing point shoot. If I have a decent grouping I feel confident it will work as a carry pistol, if it is all over the place I know I am more likely to have a erratic shots when in a stressful situation. For instance the smaller Sig P938 I have much better groupings with than the larger Walther PPS. I sold the PPS and regularly carry the 938.
I almost died laughing at the end of this video. The way that "454 Casull" shows up on screen along with the gun and starts zooming in as the music gets louder towards the end is comedic genius. I guess we have no choice now!!
A .22 is probably considered a good bug out gun for survival because it's light, the ammo (was) cheap and plentiful, and is very effective at hunting small game, "Bugging out" doesn't necessarily mean you're looking for a defensive firearm.
Is nobody sees you sure. If you have to meet people, having a open rifle means your a possible threat. Also moving around a rifle is extremely annoying. Take in mind a 22lr shot from a 16inch barrle cci ammo has the same kenetic energy of a 32acp shot from a 3inch barrel. If your hunting small game ditch the 22 and take the .32 mouse gun, you can carry more ammo even if the 32 ammo is a bit heavier because the gun loaded weights 16 ounces. The 22 rifle weights 64 ounces (4lb). Convert 3lb of rifle weight to 32ammo and if you set out 8lb for ammo and gun, you actually have more rounds of 32acp than 22lr buy having 3lb more ammo. In pretty much no way is a 22lr from a rifle better than a 32acp in mouse gun that like a tomcat. Even for distance at 25 yards, which is meaningless. A 32acp is more accurate from the handgun than rifle 22lr since 22lr has too much inconsistencies in velocity and so light wind pushes .
This past week I was working on a job and had a 18 year old young man with me. A crazed neighbor fired a pump shotgun in the air and came at us very quickly screaming and shouting to get on the ground and we were trespassing. Several things he said lead me to quickly deduct that he wasn't mentally competent and that really heightened my concern. We had not left the shoulder of the road and were on state property, legal and not trespassing. I was on the driver side of my truck at the bed with the door open and the young man was on the passenger side, where the neighbor was approaching. The neighbor with the shotgun pointing, was making a b-line for the young man and yelling for him to get on the ground...he complied. I however, had a choice to make that was a little more difficult; This is the day I didn't have my .38. I could run through an open field, leaving the unarmed young man with no cover or I could pull my 5 shot .22 and stand my ground behind the cover of my vehicle against a shotgun. The moment I felt my pocket for that .22 was like no other. I knew it would never stop him and I was going to die, but that was my choice. Miraculously I remembered while at my farm, I had stuck my .44 magnum revolver between the driver seat and the game changed. Why? Because there was no doubt in my mind, with my proficiency with my .44 I would stop the threat in one shot. Confidence was key in the dialogue that was to follow. I stood my ground, keeping the man's attention off the young man, until he lowered his weapon and I de-escalated the threat through communication. I never showed the man that I had a weapon, so as not to challenge or provoke and I engaged him in conversation from behind cover. I was able to call 911 and the day ended without any bloodshed. I learned several things; One, I care more about others lives and am willing to sacrifice my own, even if they want to kill me. Two, never carry a gun that cannot stop an angry armed person in one shot. Last but not least, the most important defense against a threat is prayer and a level head. Looking back, we did everything perfectly and no better outcome or choices could have been made and I thank God for that.
@Wilson Turner I find comfort and confidence is two main factors for my EDC. When I bought my first carry gun, it was an open carry .45 ACP. That was short lived and never was practical with most of my clothing. I always felt like it made me more of a target than secure in defense. I then decided to carry the tried an true .38 revolver inside the waist band. I love revolvers, always have. I like shooting them. I don't like shorting my slide action autos. I just don't. I have been shooting all of my 40ish years and owned firearms as a child. However, I keep trying to find a slide action that I like to carry. Yesterday I carried a Taurus 9mm with 13+1 and plan to carry it today. I am extremely proficient with this firearm, but don't like it. It is a love hate relationship with autos. "I know her well and understand her, but it's why I don't like her."😁 Anyway, I also have an American Arms 5 shot .22 revolver that is always on me and I mean always. It is my backup (belly gun/under the chin gun). In a situation like I faced, though I can group the little American Arms 5 shot at 7 yards within 8", the stopping power is not there and 8" is not enough accuracy to defend against a shotgun from behind cover. However, I was going to stand my ground with what I had, but that meant taking the fight to him. I would have had to leave cover at some point to confront him with intension of getting too close for him to use the shotgun. I would have to be inside his muzzle. On the flip side, when I realized the .44 magnum was in the truck, I knew I had the accuracy and the one shot stopping power to end the threat at any point and I could maintain my cover. At that instant I didn't have to read him or the situation to formulate a move to get closer. I could simply stand my ground, keep his attention, and hope he reasoned himself out of it, the lawman would arrive, or any positive outcome. Now, some may say it was stupid to think I could effectively or even safely get close enough to him to stop him before I got shot. There are scenarios all over YT addressing this. However, in this particular situation, he had no idea that I was armed and was pinning us down in a manner that he did not need to advance on us from his position. He was within 3-4 yards at all times. There were a couple of times I left cover with my license in hand or cell phone (telling him the neighbor was on the line) where I was getting closer. He obviously was weary of allowing me too close, which I was aware of, but me getting belly to belly or belly to back wasn't out of the question. That being said, the best scenario took place and this option was averted, thank God...to Him be the praise. So, confidence is key in any situation and lack of confidence is unpredictable. Thankfully, my assailant was confident, because it made him somewhat predictable. Know the capability of your firearm and know your proficiency. It makes no since to draw on a shotgun with a .22 pistol, unless you are being fired on already. It isn't like he would have ran away. And seeing how he had no cover to take, the likelihood of him not firing back wasn't an option.
As in any Real defensive posture situation you are praying that YOU don’t have to be the one to shoot! However, fight or flight is a very primitive response that can be hard to manage. Choosing the Best Response is what is taught to our LE community! No person here may/would respond in the same manner as you were able to. Given the same situation people will interpret a threat differently and respond by their past experiences with threats/firearms, prior training if any, and the potential legal ramifications that challenge Our decisions! What I NEVER want to occur is what happened in Seal Beach, California! A lady (going through a divorce) working in a hair salon was going to die because her soon to be ex-husband had decided this. In killing her he ALSO shot and killed six other people and then himself! I told myself that I would never want to die in such a meaningless manner! From that day on, I carried a Glock 30 SF which holds 10 rounds of .45 ACP. I have a legal lockbox in my car. And carry the pistol easily in on my left inner ankle.
Wilson Turner WT? I too live in the same Commie State as you do. I will give you some FYI. Be cautious with “Trigger Jobs.” District Attorney’s are very well informed on each weapon’s trigger pull weight. The difference could be enough to what may perceived as intentional vs accidental discharge. ANY civilian accidental discharge means excessive response to a threat and or poor-no training on the use of your weapon ! Our state also lacks in a “Castle Doctrine” which in Texas for example. You can use lethal force for just witnessing a crime (not against you!) but something as minor as two men climbing through a window and thus breaking-entering a home. (SEE UA-cam 911 call). An armed citizen carrying his cell phone was recorded by 911 operator who TOLD HIM “leave it be let the police handle it!” He ignored that advice and still shot & killed both of them! He was later found not guilty. But what he did was reasonable? Well if my teenage daughter was visiting that house...Sure! But this man knew neither the house or the people that lived there!
My choice just has to be the 357 magnum. Dual purpose, Light bullets for PSD, heavy bullets for Hunting. Handloading really brings out the best for the 357 mag. 2nd reason, all 38sp ammo can be used. Third plus, a Revolver and Rifle same ammo. With handloading you can tailor the ammo for its purpose. Separate Loadings for the revolver, 4in barrel and rifle with a 22in barrel. Velocity increase with pistol ammo loadings using the 22in rifle is between 250-700 fps increase. Example, 125gn XTP bullet loaded to 1150 fps for the 4in pistol, same round in the 22in rifle 1700 fps. Turns groundhogs inside out. No matter what you have in your hand it's still Bullet Placement, Bullet Placement, Bullet Placement. If you can't hit within 1 inch of your point of aim, then get to the range and PRACTICE. With my 22s, bolt, auto rifles and a revolver, I'll never go hungry. Tons of fun to shoot, lots of ammo in a tiny space. When needed to, Step it up a notch, I reach for my 357s, Rifle, 3x9x40 scope and Revolver with Target Sights, I handload both. Factory 357 ammo is about $1.00 + per round, with handloading my ammo costs for the 357, LHCSWC bullets .23 cents per round, for the XTP bullet, .43 cents per round. Versatility is the keyword here. The 357 fits this. My handgun caliber of choice. Handgun and Rifle tough to beat.
Most people are the "Terrorist/Killer" ...AKA A well placed shot. Most are shooting in defense, in retaliation and most aren't lining up/taking the time. That's why Most Cops are shooting like IDIOTS 20 round from 2 cops that hit the suspect 2
I disagree. Carry your preference whilst balancing optimum capacity with what caliber you are quickest and most accurate with. Also consider economics. You should really practice with your SD ammo and not ball/target ammo for you carry piece. I am most accurate with my super redhawk in .44 magnum but i am not lugging around that beast daily. Ill go with my lefty friendly FNX 9 with 17+1 rounds of 124 grain gold dots that i know function reliably and can afford to practice with 2 times a month. I am a bit quicker with my series 70 1911 vs my FN but ammo cost and the 10 extra rounds of ammo in my 9mm more than outweigh the pros of my 1911.
Very good advice. I have always said get the biggest thing you can shoot comfortably. I like .357 but any thing above that (and depending on the gun even that can be too much) and I start to not be as accurate and flinch. As for the .454 I say I shot one and after 3 rounds gave it back because I couldn't hit anything with it.
@OP, trust me a .380 will drop someone with well placed shots but I'd prefer to carry a .357 if you have restrictions, where you can still use a .38 spc bullet(yes u can use both bullets in most if not all. 357 mags
@@jacobgeary9811 Well placed shots are a luxury during the stress of an actual gun fight. It is hard enough for the average shooter to make well placed shots on a non moving paper target with NO stress. Let's assume they can do this consistently on a paper range target. Now let's change the environment and situation as follows: Two armed threats kick in your door and you have your trusty .380 on your hip. Your adrenaline pumps and your vision narrows and you must consciously make effort to control it's impact on your marksmanship and assessment of the situation. Now add that both targets are moving. Well placed shots will only result from shear luck. By well placed I assume the definition are shots that will cease the central nervous system from functioning such as a shot that will REACH the spine if it is well centered horizontally or a shot to the head. Have you every tried to hit a moving head with a handgun? Even if you hit the head, it needs to be in the critical T area that will ensure lights out instantly. Any other shot with a .380 to the spine will most likely not reach the spine that is buried by organs. A .380 is a poor choice, but if that is what one is limited to, then high capacity mags are your friend and one must shoot till the threat ceases or is incapacitated so that you can THEN and ONLY THEN, take a well placed shot.
Thank you. The information was a lot to digest and put into a video format. You did a great job at it. The take away here is know your sidearm and know your own capabilities as practice makes the difference as well as knowing when to just get out of harms way first.
I mean, none of this information is really wrong, but most people pick the 22 as a survival weapon because it has better precision than a handgun, and is better suited for dropping smaller animals like rabbits than it is people. Hence, "survival" not "combat". The 22 rounds are also a shitload cheaper, and take up much less space.
Yes the idea of the 10/22 as a survival rifle is entirely about hunting, hunting quietly, and hunting long-term because the ammo doesn't take up a lot of space so you can store plenty. If you're worried about zombies, use something else.
Lol rough week ,great place to book a bugout tour here is the itinerary #1 start in the south side/*should you get turned around end up in Gary Indiana next of Kinn will be notified. #2 lunch included location the Loop any and all garbage/French for dumpsters from the finest restaurants. We encourage snacking on route. Remember its isn't a race even though Patches O'Brien made in 3 hours our trips are at your pace and always remember to have fun * the persons are not paid actors #3 north side you've made it ,well most!!!!?
If your neighbor removed the alarms and locks from his house, because having those things made his neighbors feel like criminals, wouldn't you laugh when his house is burglarized? Philadelphia outlawed bullet proof glass storefronts, because it made the citizens feel like criminals. That's like if Florida outlawed flood preparedness, because the people who prepared for the events that regularly occur caused people who were unprepared to be afraid of possible hurricanes/floods.
Another factor that i often consider is the price of practice rounds. A person who shoots a caliber that has cheaper practice rounds is likely to be able to afford more practice and thus have a higher accuracy
This is true only to a certain point, there are multiple variables to this. For example, military training, also talent is involved in shooting. I have met people who were pretty decent shots with a rifle after maybe 10 shots, and others who despite military training and thousands of practice rounds were bad. I know it's anecdotal, I'm just adding some caveats to what you said.
Uhh, in a certain sense. Life is exactly like grinding in an rpg. You could almost say that some rpg games get inspiration from real life Funny aint it?
It doesn't take long to acclimate to a new gun/caliber. If you understand what is in your hands, it's good in a survival scenario. You don't need 40 hours behind a .223 to understand how to shoot it. A couple hundred rounds is fine... A couple thousand if you are talking about magazine changes.
This is all true but having regular practice sessions is important If you want to be responsible. Nothing anyone will say will ever convince me that practicing more won't make you better Especially in a high stress situation. Even if you only practiced once every 2 months with a few 100 rounds The price difference between a 9 mm and a 45 adds up. That combined with data from a code that I wrote For Compressible aerodynamics About the rate of energy dispersion through a ballistics medium, Has led me to choose the 9 mm as My preferred handgun round.
Some thing not discussed for bug-out options was the availability of certain types of rounds/cartridges. 9mm, 223/5.56, 38 special/357, 7.62x39 and 12ga are most likely going to widely available. At least for a while..
If we learned anything from covid, it's that no caliber will be available anywhere in a real time of crisis. If SHTF, what you got stocked up is all you're gonna have.
I think most folks who recommend a .22 as a "bug out gun" are thinking in terms of the abundance of small game vs large game when considering the availability of food in a realistic survival situation as opposed to the cinematic "Mad Max" version of survival that has taken hold of the imagination since the beginning of the nuclear age.
I think there are probably more squirrels than big game and they also tend to breed faster and have large litters. I'm also not sure that any fool can kill a squirrel. I'm probably wrong about all this though; a biologist would have to chime in to know for sure.
Also ammo weight/capacity/fire rate. Due to the low weight, carrying higher capacity drums/mags is much more practical. Allowing for more shots, and due to a lower recoil allows faster, more accurate shooting.
The narrator is evaluating 22lr as a bug out weapon considering only combat. A good bug out weapon should be able to feed you also. 22lr is good for this. It's also more quiet, especially suppressed. Lastly, 500 rounds of 22lr is easier to carry than 500 rounds of 223 or 12 gauge. That's important if you are bugging out and not prepped to stay where you are.
I still say 22 rifle is better, it has longer (more accurate)range than pistols, you can push out 3 rounds accurately at distance to put you back on top of pistols .close range I agree on larger pistol caliber. Also a 22 mag hp was never mentioned, I have blown a jack rabbit's head clean off,so I'm sure it would blown a targets arm off...also I've read and heard 22 mag can pierce body armor,that is why there are so few pistols made in that caliber...anyway just my opinion
This is a good video with valuable info. As a nurse at a Level 1 trauma hospital. Ive seen many people survive mutiple shots from every caliber and walk away.
I'm 70 and 60 years ago, my Grandfather told me, "Boy (he called me boy), I'd rather be chased by an amateur with a Tommy gun than an expert with a .22". Since my Paw Paw was the smartest, wisest man that I've ever heard of, I believe him. He trained me to hit what I aim at and I do OK. I have a 9mm and .357 Smith, but I carry a Ruger SR22 for protection. Personally, I think my chances are pretty good, as I train @ 15 meters, double taps, with either hand. Shoot what you can and be pretty good at it.
I would not tote a .22mag or .22LR pistol. You need to be at a CQB range to really have any impact, add that you need to fire 3-4 times. 💥 A thug or crook on drugs may not drop either. I say the 9mm +P is ✔. As is the 165gr JHP 🚔 .40 or a 10mm. Min for a CCW or 2nd gun is a .380acp or .38spl +P. No 🐁 guns!
@@DavidLLambertmobile Of course, depends on whether you can hit anything. At 15 yards, if you cannot put 2, in one second, into a 3 inch circle, you'd better stay home. And yes, a .22lr in the head or heart will drop anyone, anywhere, and they are somewhat larger than 3 inches. BTW, until 1984 the most common murder weapon was a .22lr. Today it is third or fourth, depending on survey.
What I've learned from this is that 1) Shot placement is everything 2) Therefore training shot placement is everything 3) You should choose a caliber that is cheap enough to train lots with so your shot placement is on point 4) You should choose a caliber that makes shot placement as easy as possible 5) You should choose a caliber that offers high mag capacity in case you need more shots for effective shot placement 6) .45 only dropped people on the first shot 5% more often than 9mm 7) You should choose 9mm.
And my argument against the .45 vs. the 9mm is. Find me a .45 handgun that holds 17-20 rounds in the magazine? 9mm ammo is cheaper so you can practice more...less recoil means better follow up shots if needed...the advantages of the 9mm over the .45 are almost endless. All for an almost insignificant difference in stopping power.
Like the video overall! However, your myth busting on 22lr for bugout is based on the wrong logic. I never heard anyone claim the 22lr for buyout is purely for self defense. It is more about being to CARRY MORE AMMO AND HUNT WITH IT while it could also serve as some form of protection. It is not solely about self defense as a bugout gun. In addition, a 22lr is quieter than larger caliber rifles, not revealing your position or running off game for the table. Also, your 410 vs 12 gauge comparison doesn’t take into account barrel length. A 410 pistol with a 2 in barrel will not be 1/2 as effective as a 12 ga shotgun with an 18in barrel.
Sean You Know Who thats exactly what i was thinking. If shit were to hit the fan and i needed to get out quick. The 22 will be going with me and maybe my fn57 for close quarters.
Nah, if a 6 year old points a 10 gauge at me, im putting my hands up, even if I think there is no chance that his first shot will knock him right on his arse.
I agree!! A 357 or 44 mag has such a loud noise and recoil it's no fun shooting them. I ended up with a 38 police special, fun to shoot and less abusive. Still has good stopping power!!! Of course it depends on where you hit them and the range you want to cover. My 357 was good at hitting targets at medium ranges where the 38 is more of an up close gun. Semi auto's are fun to shoot but the tendency in hunting situation to just spray bullets at a target is very common. One shot one kill is the right mindset for hunting but in self defense I suppose firepower and stopping power are prime factors. That being said it still boils down to what you feel comfortable with, your more apt to shoot well with a gun you like!!!
I read the EXACT report a few years back in a gun magazine. At the time I carried 10mm. Shortly thereafter I switched to 380 because additional reports I read found the #1 CONTRIBUTING FACTOR was tactful draw (Tactful being least telegraphed and hardest to detect) and the #2 CONTRIBUTING FACTOR was easy of carry. A Ruger LCP carries in the pocket very easily behind a wallet. An armed attacker is 95% likely to approach you with a gun in one hand and the other hand empty while he observes his surroundings and holds his hand out to collect your affects within one pace of you. This is why a tactful draw is so imperative. While reaching for your wallet you draw with one hand, take half a step toward his body while canting your body away from his weapon and blading yourself to the attacker, grasp the slide of his weapon with your non-firing hand and drop two shots into center-mass. I'm most cases you win and he takes the room-temperature challenge. Of course, the easiest way to stop an attack is to prevent one with purpose and deterrence. The ADT Sign on your lawn, NRA sticker on your car, and Ruger hat during the day indicates you're armed and it's best to move on. This is deterrence. Next, don't go through dark alleys, rundown parking structures, and bad parts of town. This is purpose. There's always the one dipshit who tries it, however. That's why you have a gun. I carry a gun when I'm not expecting trouble. I carry an AR15 when I am.
Let's face facts. That argument with be fought till the end of time. The only hard truth is this, Any gun regardless of caliber is far better than NO GUN !!!
Great video.... I've long thought this way, that as long as it's not a mouse caliber, any handgun will be sufficient with good shot placement. What this video doesn't cover is that the bug out for .22lr case involves hunting small game... A necessary food source.
22lr if you read the report had the best one stop to the head. better then every other handgun caliber. what really matters is if you can hit while under stress especially if you have the shreiking going on. a lot of people on their first time in such a situation without ear pro find a 357 magnum incredibly painful to fire.
@BulletSpoung - Forgive me for my ignorance but how is a .22LR cartridge going to chamber and fire in a barrel with a 5.56x45 chamber? Even with the correct .22LR bolt, if it could hold the cartridge on the bolt face using the extractor and get it to fire, isn't the .22 case completely unsupported and the bullet having to jump some empty space before it gets to the rifled part of the barrel if it's a 5.56 barrel and chamber? This sounds impossible to me. Surely you'd have to change the bolt AND barrel for one with the correct chamber? Even if you could get it to work, your 5.56 magazine is not going to work holding .22LR either. Even if you use it as a single shot, all the other problems I just mentioned will stop it working anyway.
They are not pussy, police cars are not spaceships equiped with warp drives, they can't reach the victim instantaneously when victim called 911--to be honest, every cop want their car got a warp drive under the hood.
Unless the gun is in the hand of a kid because some fuckwit failed to secure it properly and kept it under his/her pillow etc, or in the hands of someone bent on self harm and suicide (or drunk, angry, upset etc). Or the gun is in the hand of a criminal because they stole it, or think they need it for self-defence against householders they intend to rob. Responsible gun ownership is great (though there are still problems) but irresponsible gun ownership is a fucking nightmare. Now look about you, look at your street or the folks at work. How many of them are the kind of annoying, dumb, over-excitable dimwit you wouldn't trust with a pair of scissors. Now imagine them in a stressful situation with a gun in hand.... Its not hard to see the problem. Think about how many shitty drivers there are and then wonder at how everyone thinks they are great at driving. It's the same with everything, including guns. Everyone will say, "I'm responsible", but that is simply not the case. Is there an answer? Not one that springs to mind. But the love for firearms, the unhealthy obsession demonstrated so often is very troubling. I see videos of idiots carrying semi-automatic rifles about the streets, while wearing body armour and looking for a confrontation with cops so they can bleater about "their rights". Well what about their responsibilities? Like the responsibility not to fucking terrify everyone who sees them and thinks they are crazy-ass lunatics with guns. I have kids. If I saw some nutter wandering past my house like that I would be pulling the kids inside and hoping the dumb fuck didn't do something stupid, like accidentally put a round right through something I might want to keep, like my wife's head for instance (or my fridge, I keep my beer in there). The problem isn't guns, its idiots (with guns).
A couple things I would like to point out that is likely throwing off some data: 1. On the .32 cal, it is a tricky round. Most people carry the wrong ammo. See most hollow points in .32 actually never open, which causes poor performance. Also many rounds are underpowered in .32 so some people just carry FMJ instead to get the proper penetration depth, but again this makes for poor performance. There are only two rounds known to hit the penetration depths set by the FBI to be considered optimal for defense. That is Hornandy XTP, and Underwood xtreme cavitators. If everyone carried one or the other of those rounds in .32 cal, I think you would see results on par with .380. Also as far as "failures" go, Keltec P32 probably makes up 75% or more of all .32 cal pistols. Again most people don't know you need to take 2,000 grit sand paper with a dowl rod and buff the feed ramp. This dramatically improves the reliability. 32 cal is not a caliber you can just simply pick up, throw any ammo in, and bet your life on it. It requires the knowledge neccessary for proper ammo selection to make the gun perform at its peak. 2. You speculate on the .410 handgun ammo by saying "if its half of the performance of a 12 gauge shotgun"... ok... seriously?! Even a 18" barrel .410 shotgun will likely have only HALF the knockdown of a 12 gauge with a 18" barrel. Now factor in that you have reduced the barrel from 18 inches to 3 or 4 inches, and you have dramatically decreased your velocity, as well as caused your spread of BBs to be so large so quickly that it becomes somewhat ineffective past about 20 feet. Go watch some videos on the Taurus Judge at 20 feet. It's spread is wide enough to hit two people across their entire body. This means half your BBs would miss one person. Also there are videos of people showing that a significant amount of powder never gets burned off when you fire .410 buckshot shells from the pistol, again this is lost power. Personally I think the .410 pistols are good for very close ranges (15 feet max). Me personally I would not want a firearm that restricts me to that range. My hallway and livingroom are both over 25 feet across. Give me a 9mm pistol or a 12 gauge shotgun before a .410 pistol. As far as which caliber is best to carry... well when I use to sell guns, I always told buyers the best caliber is the one that you have on you when someone tries to hurt you or your family. I have seen many women get talked into purchasing larger, heavy 9mm or .40 cal handguns, only to get tired of lugging it around in their purse so eventually they leave it at home or in the car. The largest hand cannon in the world does no good at home or in the car. I recommend to most people getting a small gun such as a Ruger LCP 2 (.380), or a Glock 43, or even a Keltec P32 (.32 cal) for recoil sensitive people. If the Keltec P32 is chosen though, a feed ramp buff is absolutely neccessary as well as carrying Hornand XTP or Underwood Xtreme Cavitors as they are the only two rounds that cause a larger wound channel as well as reaching over 12 inches of penetration in ballistic gel tests.
@Steven Pace I read that whole thing, and you could have stated the main idea with just one sentence and deleted the rest: ".32 Cal is not a caliber you can simply pick up, throw any ammo in and bet your life on".
When I was studying martial arts as a teenager I noticed that my instructor, who occasionally worked as a VIP bodyguard, was carrying a pistol under his jacket. Me being a smartass 16 year old asked him why he needed it if he was such a badass. He said "I have trained and competed at a very high level for over two decades. Hand to hand I could probably beat 99% of the people I ever encounter. But I would lose 100% of the time against a gun." Zen moment of pure enlightenment achieved...thank you Sensei!
I took a class with a "high speed" K security instructor who, by practice toted his pistol, loaded mag empty barrel 🤔. What some armed officers call Condition lll. He stated the reason was to not have any loaded guns near the "principle"(client). I myself disagree with this logic but the EP, security world is full of hammer head nitwits & head cases. 🙄
That's not really the point though. Nobody wants that, but rather the question is, how many shots will it take to incapacitate the person. That's effectiveness
@@JohnDavis-im1oy You're arguing that just because you don't want to be shot by a pellet gun means that because you also don't want to be shot by a gun means nothing.
@@JohnDavis-im1oy Man I really don't want to be blown to shreds by an 80mm mortar round but i also don't want to be hit in the face by a rubber ball so I guess both of these situations hold the same gravity.
It's true! The hard part is mastering the wrist-snap when you whip it at an assailant's head, however the *thunk* of impact and subsequent confusion at the roll of quarters sized projectile rolling on the ground are likely to incapacitate. No bulky firearm needed!
It sounds more like all you have to do is hit the attacker a few times to have a good chance of getting away in a self defense situation. Not a lot of training is needed to do that, especially up close.
Fudmottin, unless they're shooting back. If your first shot doesn't kill/incapacitate, there is a very good chance threat/enemy will return fire. So, first shot kill/incapacitate is extraordinarily important and the best way to assure this is by shot placement....meaning practice/training with firearm is crucial. Another point in a pepper situation to consider is conservation of all crucial supplies for greatest chance of survival.
I've never been on the two way range. So I honestly can't say how well I would do in that situation. I can connect with paper targets and pop ups OK. But they aren't shooting back. As far as preparedness goes, my biggest threat (IMO) is a major storm. Long power outages and closed roads suck. Sandy hit my area. That was an experience I don't want to repeat.
Fudmottin, I agree with you. I think the biggest threat will be weather related. A loss of power for extended period, cutoff from outside world, and no law enforcement is the most likely "prepper" scenario encounter I personally might find myself in the middle of. Second is probably civil unrest and a need for personal/family protection for an extended "lawless" period. I think training is important, but I also don't think any of us truly know how we will react/do in a situation when we're faced by a sudden, instantaneous threat. That's where we hope training and muscle memory clicks in and takes over for us. If we need time to think, it might be too late and we may end up another fatal statistic. If we are facing an "end times" scenario I've already accepted that I'm a goner anyway😉. I'll hold off the zombies as long as possible so friends, neighbors, and those I care about can get far away, but I'll be meeting my maker soon afterward.
Not being an Expert by any means, but i recall reading about Stopping Power many years ago and remember one thing about it and that is Bullet Speed when hitting the Target was much more a factor than Caliber size. That correlates to this Videos finding of Long Guns vs Pistols. Than there’s still the configuration of the Bullet itself . Overall a very informative video!
Flawed conclusions... the reason people recommend the .22lr for bug out isn't that it is the best choice for self defense against human attacks, but rather the combination of low ammo cost, ammo weight, ammo availability, and the capability of the round to drop small game. Small game out-masses large game by significant margins, and (properly placed) the round can even stop medium sized game with consistency. As for the .410 being more powerful than standard defense rounds, I see another possibility flawed estimation. The benefit of the shotgun isn't merely the number of pellets, but the length of barrel for the gas pressures to build up speed. A short barrel pistol, especially a revolver, cannot generate those numbers since the pellets exit often before all the powder is burned and pressure is released at the gap in the front of the cylinder. (Also, 000 is smaller than 00 buckshot, but that is a trivial problem comparatively)
I agree on the 22L 100%, As for the 410 I have the same reason as with the 22L. Having rounds that can be used in either a hand gun or riffle/shotgun is a good combo. The 410 fits that the same as a 22L. Now if there was an AR that could swap out between 22L and 410. Oh yeah there is, LOL. But $$$ rules in most cases and the 22L wins on that. I myself like to be silent and my arrows and bolts are, and can be reused. I don't want to make noise or traces for the 1st 4 weeks while the fools kill each other and starve out. Gun shots most likely will bring in a firefight. Smoke makes your location seen. My low cost pistols are modified Cobra 80lb crossbow pistols. They can shoot the same bolts as my 175lb crossbow or those tiny but fast ones they come with. A pump bb/pellet gun is cheap, quiet and good for bushy tailed tree rats that can be cooked with a solar cooker. No smoke, no noise. I also have 3/8 oak dowels that I treat with Minwax wood hardener. It waterproofs and hardens the oak. Making bolts and arrows while waiting for things to clear solves any boredom and it's quiet so you can listen to the perimeter. My PVC bows are designed to eliminate the archers paradox, so stiff oak arrows work great and hit hard. My design is private, but there lots of vids on PVC bows even compact bug out designs. My only problem is my BP meds will run out and I'll croak anyway, LOL
@@Alwis-Haph-Rytte if your talking blood pressure meds you might try pickle juice... My dad drank it for years and it helped him. You could try it at home on top of your meds if you have the means to check it at home or spend a few hours at a store that has one of those booths for you to check it. Obviously don't try to use it as a substitute until you've proven to yourself that it a good remedy. Good luck man.
John, Thanks, but my BP is really bad. I'm taking 3 prescribed meds, it was 4, had to stop it because was harming my kidneys. I do take over the counter meds and herbs trying to fix the 30 years of ibuprofen I've had to take daily from injuries at Fort Benning. But I don't get any help or treatment from the VA. So basically I'll hold the front line till meds run out, LOL I've got some survival ideas for barter. If people know how to make wine/mead, they can also make an alcohol wash that can be flavored with flavor-aid or kool-aid. Add lots of barter sugar to bunker. Tobacco grows easy and is also used as an insecticide in gardens. Bleach or pool chlorine is good, but don't forget Lysol spray to kill some body funk. It was originally made as a cooter spray for women. These things get overlooked because it's long term survival. Lots of salt is also needed for food preservation. If I was younger and healthier, I'd raise honey bees at the bug out shelter. Great cover for what is hidden and excuse for regular visits. Have them caged well in iron to keep out bears and people. Have game cams hidden in fake hives to know who comes around. Fake hives can also be arrow and bow hoards. a 4x4 post can be hollowed out to hold them as the posts are used inside as the 4 corners to hold hive together. Storing guns this way is a bad idea and I'm sure illegal in most states. Salt and sugar can be stored this way. But must be tightly sealed. Yeah lots of ideas, but health sucks. So I'll be stuck on the front line like a good Infantry Soldier, LOL I've kinda went off track from the video, but it helps me practice my one finger typing and spelling. Now I'll go mow the damn grass before it rains, LOL
@ good catch, I withdraw the 000 comment. In another video they recommend a long barreled .410, that could chamber .454 or .45 long. That would be a great firearm, and its only flaw is cost for the ammo types. It is great for anti-personnel, and has types of ammo that would also be good for game of almost any size. I still have a .22lr in my bag, but my carry weapon is a .45. I would like to get one of the big revolvers, but price concerns have stopped me to date.
VB, you are absolutely correct! "I'd rather hit with a .22 than miss with a .45" "One in the hand is better than 2 in the safe" Fact is, no one wants to get shot with either one
I agree which made the Smith and Wesson slim 45 my choice now, just less rounds- but if i need more than one round it will surprise me after thirty years of 100 effectiveness in imminent threat scenarios! The 357 magnum , and 44 magnum had my insurance company want to triple my rate coverage for a reason.......
In the early 1900s General Pershing was in the Phillipines putting down an inserection he noted that the standard .38 would not stop a charging enemy. He called for a trial of the new browning 1911semiauto in .45acp. He found the 45 had more stopping power, for the next 75 years that was the standard issue for all military services and is still used by many units now
Great video - going to throw this out there for bugout: pellet rife (like Lewis & Clark used) so that you can hunt small game without attracting extra attention from gunpower bullet noise. Ammo is much lighter as well. Just an observation.
Another thing to note, something with a pellet velocity you can adjust (raise, ideally to bag larger game) works great for this concept. The crossman variable pumps are a great, small and modifiable option
I just started getting into wheel guns. I have recently acquired a Model 19 4” and a 686 6”. The 19 is sized well for comfortable OWB carry, and the 686 really just for fun.
If that's the gun you're most comfortable carrying and have the best accuracy with, it's the gun you should be carrying, and the one you'll be most deadly with.
@@huntertoledo8989 I agree, My regular carry is a P938. I shot tighter groups out of the box than all my other 9mm pistols (some full size). It just points naturally for me and is supriseingly easy to shoot even tho it is such a small peice. Easy to carry, easy to shoot. Rarely not on my side.
If you’re carrying a 357 with any kind of a short barrel you’re just getting a lot more muzzle blast with very little effect. The 357 needs a longer barrel to get up to speed.
Don’t depend on a one shot stop. Ever! Keep shooting till the assailant goes down and does not get up. And when they go down, make sure they’re really down. Don’t take your eye of of them or turn your back on them. You take your attention off of them and a “dead” person will still be alive enough to shoot you while they’re on the ground.
Many years ago I saw an interesting quote from a special forces guy who had "been there--done that"--"No enemy is dead until his head is separated from his body more than 10 feet"
Great data, This really makes me feel better about mostly only carrying my pocket 380, even though I have a few 9mm carry pistols. For my job I often have to leave my pistol in my vehicle, this is much more practical than dealing with a hip holster.
@@rifleshooterchannel208it's data points that were compiled after looking at a ton of shootings to see how lethal the calibers are. what do you mean it's anecdotal? Lol
@@kalebporter1529 It’s not real data, there’s no proof of the those actual shootings happening nor is there any basis for scientific comparison even if they _did_ happen. Therefore, _anecdotal._
@@schm147 Tests in properly calibrated ballistics gel and seeing if your chosen caliber and bullet combo meets FBI specifications for handgun wounding effectiveness.
What is the best handgun caliber? That is easy. The handgun that has the most plentiful ammunition available. No gun is any good if you can't get ammunition for it.
The best way to put it is the one that you can shoot straight with and has the cheapest and most plentiful ammo. Because no calibers going to work if you can't shoot straight and can't afford the rounds.
Generally, finding ammunition would be a problem only after the SHTF. My bug out bag includes a 9mm, .357 and .45 so I good with almost anything I would be likely to come across.
I rarely give thumbs up. You got it though. I've probably seen hundreds of this sort of video, and I can't emphasize this enough, but this is, hands down, the finest video comparing firearm defensive options on the Web. What is by far the most important is where you hit, and how quickly and accurately you can follow up. Something many people fail to consider - there is no caliber magic. Whether .22 or 30-06, a hit to the desending aorta is the end, and quickly, too in the majority of cases. .22 will always rank highly for bugout because its not all about defense. It is a multi purpose tool with very light ammo, it is possible to carry on your person enough to feed yourself and another for months. Different tools for different purposes.
An interesting analysis video. Massad Ayoob I believe did a similar study a while back (after the famous Miami FBI shootout that lead to the FBI adopting the 10mm round) that indicated the Federal 125B .357 Magnum load to be the most effective. That being said, this was an excellently researched study, and kudos to you for putting it together in a concise and understandable video.
I'm not saying u won't need to kill someone. the fact that people choose the 22lr is for hunting in bug out as well as the weight size and availability of ammo
@@petter5721 the 22lr stinger is maybe the best 22lr made but still far behind 17 hmr which is also far from being a human killer :) 80 feet-pounds at 109 yards (100 meters)
instead of focusing on small details and obsessing about caliber and numbers, go to the range this weekend. pick whatever gun you feel like and go shoot it twice a month. nothing is effective if you buy it, put 100 rounds in it. and leave it on your nightstand.
EXACTLY this is what I tell everyone new to guns. I say "go to the range, shoot all the guns, pick the one that put the most bullets on target". Everyone is different but at this point, for home defense, glock/sig/hk/springfield/etc.... are all going to be reliable enough
The range really isn't good enough though. The biggest thing that separates a veteran with combat experience from a civillain is the ability to think while under extreme stress. We've heard on TV before about how police shot 37 times and completely missed the attacker they were trying to take out. When you get extremely stressed, you get pumped full of adrenaline, your hands shake, you get tunnel vision, and your reaction time goes to crap. Shooting at the range is better than nothing, but there's only so much that can teach you. The other thing this study left out, is you can't become a stat if you miss your target. Pistol caliber carbines are so much more effective than pistols because its so much easier to be accurate with them, even when you have the adrenaline shakes, since you have a stock. As such, I would argue that a good bugout solution would be a "perfect pair" pistol caliber. By that, I mean a concealable carbine and backup pistol that share magazines/ammo. An example of this would be a Glock 17 and a Keltec Sub 2000. You could fit both in a backpack, they are very light, and you can carry several preloaded magazines that will fit in either tool. Regarding body armor, shots to the groin or head can alleviate that concern, and a Sub 2000 9MM can be fired rapidly enough (especially with 30 round magazines), that your chance of hitting either and stopping the fight are very quick. There's a lot of big blood vessels there in the groin, and it will drop somebody if they've been shot in the dick, hips, or thighs with a +P hollowpoint 9mm I promise you.
DumbDuck44 I had a mountain lion attack my dog. You’re so right. My motor skills took a crap on me. The fight or flight response in the body is a son of a bitch. However, all may range training helped me pick up that front sight. Long story short my dog treed it and I had her at gun point. I live in CA so I didn’t shoot (mountain lions are protected). Also, I had to calculate my backdrop under stress, the cat was between me and my nearest neighbor (150 yards). I don’t think I could ever get used to that feeling, but I can see why it’s addicting. My arms felt like they were tingling for a week.
There are a lot of people who view the Taurus Judge and S&W Governor as gimmick guns, I did as well but bought one for the fun of it. While I dismiss it as a carry gun because of it's size, in my opinion it is not a gimmick. Shooting Nobel Sport 3 ball .40 buck it will shoot about an 8 inch 5 shot group at 7yds. That's 15 .40 cal holes in an eight inch area in five shots. I'm no expert, and am not claiming this is what you should shoot, but shooting it and finding ammo that it liked, proved to me it has it's place.
They're probably much more effective now that ammo is specifically made for them. When they first came out only the regular long gun ammo was available.
I love the comment, that he felt like the 9MM would have been more effective if it had used hollow points. Hell, you could say that about any of the calibers, but the 38 Special would probably have benefited the most since so many shootings using the 38 used the old round nose, 158 grain bullets that so many owners of these guns bought back when they bought the gun, and still have half a box or more left.
I was always taught that you get the right size pistol for your hand regardless of whether it's .45, 9mm or any non .22 caliber. The reason being that comfort (and training, ie: range practice) leads to confidence which leads to accuracy in hostile situations. Accuracy above caliber is going to stop an aggressive confrontation (ie: Shots to legs, joints, head, etc).
Yea I agree Eddie. I love the 92fs it fits me like a glove and my friend loves the p226 but I find it uncomfortable. We are similar sized guys as well. Need to find a more modern and slightly smaller gun that fits my hand as well.
If you can shoot a guy in the kneecap as he's bum-rushing you with a knife and you don't get cut, congrats. We can't all be speedy, snipers or crack-shots like that in any case. In my basement I could hit a 1" target from 15' consistently with a .25 cal. pistol, but in under stress with a moving target, good luck even clipping a man's arm while aiming for the sternum with a scoped air rifle from the same distance. Trust me, I know from experience. That's why I keep a shotgun and every other weapon I've had, the 1st round or load in the magazine or chamber was always filled with birdshot and/or 98% capsaicin nonivamide powder to get hits on target fast, easy, slow the sucker down a bit and buy time for a more accurate follow-up shot with a bigger projectile if needed. If you're defending you're at a disadvantage, anyway. The situation you describe would apply best to the average shooter in target practice, standoffs, from a distance and cover, or if that average shooter is also the assailant or a bystander just outside the assailant's field of vision in a very convenient moment. I won't say it's impossible, but I wouldn't count on it. Your advice about choosing the weapon that best fits your hand seems good, I just don't agree with your reasoning behind it if that advice was meant for the new or average shooter. Accuracy would be improved, but more likely to the extent you could pop an assailant's lung or 2 withing the 1st couple seconds and few shots in a sudden, violent incident. Most people aren't going to be taking brain stem shots through the eye sockets, shooting each testicle out of the sack for each step a thug continues to advance or lung-heart-spinal cord combo shots. Nor would it be like the zombie apocalypse movies where 2/3 bullets make it through the brain stem, like the '30s, when you could simply draw down in Hollywood and pretend to shoot an actor's kneecap, big toe or gun out of the hand straight from the hip and all lightening fast.
Rarely does anyone buy a .22 for self-defense. They get one for small game hunting and plinking/target shooting. But for weaker individuals who simply cannot handle the recoil or weight of a bigger caliber, or for locations that prohibit certain types of guns, having a basic .22 to defend your home is better than not having anything at all.
If you can't handle the recoil of a .22lr you must be a 104 year old dying woman. Hell, I'm not even convinced they have recoil. Even for a sensitive shooter, a .380 (not a tiny little subcompact though - those can kick a little) should be great. Even .32acp is a better option than .22lr.
Well I know the 22lr is not rated high for self defense but if someone is shooting me with a 22lr say with a high capacity clip that sure as hell is going to stop me. Nobody wants to get shot with anything especially about 20 or 30 rounds of 22lr. I have a 22wmr pistol that holds 30 rounds and I damn sure wouldn't want to be hit with it multiple times!
The Redhawk Alaskan is an option in that department. And there's also the Taurus Raging Judge (2-513039) that can fire .454, .45Long Colt, and .410 gauge.
I carry a S&W Governor. I CAN conceal it at times. most of the time I don't bother to even try to conceal it, and wear it on my theigh in VERY plain sight.
Markius Fox... The Taurus Raging Judge makes for an amazing center counsel gun. With a .410 gauge round loaded, you only have to point in the general direction of the assailant chest, pull the trigger and put a 4-6 inch spread on them at 10-15 ft. SO if they are at your window and demand you turn over your vehicle to them... at that range, they would have no chance and you don't even have to aim properly.
Well, the one you have is the one you buy, so you still have to sift through the information and make a decision. Unless you want to walk into a gun shop and close your eyes and "eenie meenie miney moe" to select your firearm.
Some people will say you must carry a full size 45acp, or full size 9mm. Anything smaller is terrible for self defense. However, on hot summer days, they leave their powerful guns at home, because they are wearing shorts, and a t-shirt. I carry my tiny snub nose 38spl in my pocket all the time everywhere I go. Yes, Everywhere!! Simply- The little gun in my pocket protects better than than the big, powerful handgun in the safe.
@ Spencer Boaz best by default not by merit. tho shooting the bad guy with a 22 might only piss him off so he decides to kill you instead of just rob you
The reason 22lr out if a rifle is underestimated here is that two factors are unanalyzed here. First, incapacitation is an ambiguous standard. 22lr rifle fire will make anyone keep their head down and or break off an attack. Both of those reactions are victories and highly desireable. Secondly, with almost no recoil out of a ruger 10/22, you can fan that trigger and put 10 rounds on target in very little time. Real world I spoke at length with a dad whose 10 year old son put 2 rounds in the chest of a home invader who gurgled up chunks of lung tissue as he dropped to the floor. Lethality is more complex than inferred by this study. Poachers use 22lr for a reason. Shot placement is enhanced if you train a lot, easy to do with cheap ammo, and 22lr is lethal to the head, ask any mafia hitman who double tapped head shots with 22lr revolvers over the decades. They had yhrir choice of calibers. They chose 22lr. Or ask your family doctor if two rounds of 22lr is surviveable. By the way, they are professionals. Not only are second, third, fourth, fifth, well you get the idea, quicker to make, they are more accurate. Just like the nod mr. shotgun gets for putting 9 pellets on target at once, a rapid flurry of 22 is equally devastating. And in a survival context, 22lr is cheaper, so you can get more bang for your buck. When you use it all up, given an equal budget, the 22lr far out distances pricier ammo. You will still have ammo to use while mr big caliber ran out years ago. So endurance goes to the 22lr. If someone points a gun at me, the last thing I am going to do is study the muzzle to guess caliber size. I am going to get out of the line of fire. Its not all about incapacitation as the gold standard. You get some new holes in you that God didn't give you, you are gonna die in shtf scenario. That is information we will react to. If you hear bullets striking right by you, you arent going to be saying to yourself, self, what caliber IS that? Is it that the lousy mouse gun 22lr that I scorn as relatively harmless as I sip diet coke and eat doritos typing b.s. on the internet like I am a navy seal? Or is that a bigger caliber I might need to take seriously? Hmmmmm, let me sit here and listen to a couple more shots to get a better idea. Duh. Really? Deterrence is a super valid goal. Sorry, though you might favor other calibers, and I sure as hell do too, 22lr is a super high value instrument of deterrence and lethality. You gotta think deeper than this study suggests. It isn't a very studied study. Its not complex enough or researched enough relative to real world life. Thats just my 2 cents.
Remote Viewer 1 Another plus for 22lr is for someone who is severely recoil sensitive can put 7 rounds of 22lr in a person in a home defense situation in the same time it takes a 20 year old to fire one round of 12 gauge. Yeah 22lr may suck when you talk about 1 round but you can shot one semi automatic 5 to 8 rounds per second especially if the trigger has been modified.
Hell there are folk that died one or to weeks later from 22LR or shorts and had good surgeons working on them. Its hard to find all the holes from splatter when it hits bone. Some had 3 surgery's and still died. It will kill you grave yard dead. It can drop you or a deer where you stand. DEAD!
What I gleaned from the study is that a .22 isn't as effective if you hit non vital areas, which it wouldn't be. The whole multiple hits incapacitation failure (anywhere) determined attacker only implies a bunch of shots to the limbs (or air), as does the much lower 1 shot "anywhere" .22 stop percentage . The one shot stoppage (head/torso) is high for the .22 as frankly any hole in the heart lungs, or brain is going to put anyone down , despite their determination. I also have to point out the obvious, law enforcement and gun enthusiast use the "large caliber". People who shoot more often. .22 lr covers a much less gun experienced swath of the public. More than likely, the average .22 lr either sits in an unused closet or buried under a box of kotex in toyota camry glove compartment, chambered in the same ammunition that was purchased for it originally. . The fact it did that well, to me, reinforces how unnecessary a large caliber round is, in the majority of cases. To be honest, lower lethality (if that is something the .22 indeed offers) is more of a feature than a bug, IMO. Which I honestly don't know that the word "stop" means, in this context. Does it mean the attack is stopped or the attacker? A wounded attacker can run away and never be caught, in that case the gun stopped that attack, but not that attacker.
Randall Berry President Raegan's docyor said he really sweated bullets over the presidents wounds from 22lr. Specifically, his concern wasn't find the bullet; it had broken a rib, pinctured a lung, and caused serious internal bleeding. Just a 22lr, right? What worried him was what you said. The bullet splatter inside the body. His nightmare was a flake of the bullet, a mere flake, transiting to the brain through normal circulation and causing a fatal brain hemmorage. Or a couple flake.
my 1911 got me through VN it will do the job now. You have to go with what you are comfortable and confident with. For those rare times i can't conceal it I carry a bond arms 410 000
@@mmabagainHey! Ya wanna hear the shortest joke I know? okay! Baby seal walks into a bar........ No. That's it. That's the whole joke. Never mind..............................
Unlike the others being disrespectful, thank you for your service. I'm surprised though, that if you're comfortable with the 1911 platform, you chose a derringer for a pocket pistol. What about a small 1911 like the Kimber Micro 9, Sig P938 or the Sig P238 which has almost the exact dimensions of a Bond Arms Snake Slayer? Why not an LCP II, M&P bodyguard or another small .380Auto, a snub revolver or even something like the Glock 36 if you want to stay with .45 caliber, but be pocket sized? I'm just straight up curious why you'd pick a derringer given how many options there are on the market.
"Elifritz, (who took most of his shooting data from the military) thinks that the 9mm rounds were ball ammo and if they had been hollowpoints the numbers would have been higher for the 9mm." Guess what, that would also apply to 45acp, military uses ball 45 as well....
This is comparable to what I've heard from hospital data. Approx. 2/3 of people shot with a pistol will live and 3/4 of people shot with a rifle anywhere center mass will die before an ambulance arrives.
Many 5.56 rounds fail to stop. There are lots of war stories about it. It's the reason we use heavier calibers for deer hunting / etc. At the same time, those people shot with 5.56 don't have a very high percentage in the grand scheme of things to make it to a hospital unless they're next to a team with trauma knowledge and kit. Still agree, probably one of the best calibers to defend life with aside from a shotgun. Seems easier for the inexperienced to use it.
10% of people can't have their mind changed. You're welcome to take that risk with a psychotic or possibly drugged up person in your home with his/her hands around your wife. I'm not going to purposely plan to take that risk though.
The sad part at the end is that the pistol is one of the worst when it comes to recoil control. It's up there with the Desert Eagle and Elephant gun. xD
...but your imagination would be wrong. It's slightly uncomfortable for some people. I have a video of a female friend shooting my .454... she was all laughs once she understood the power. Yes, she said her hands hurt after 6 rounds, but she said it with a smile.
It's amazing how well my 380 edc did in the study. Magnum Research has several big rifle calibers. One that comes to mind first is the 30-30. They also have 444 Marlin, 45-70, 44-40, 45 long Colt and several other sizes. The down side is the power. To big for killing squirrel and rabbit. Why not a 357 lever action like Henry that can shoot 38 special also. Everything meets the one goal. Lots of practice and a top quality gun in one package.
A 410 shotgun might have a chance of being "half as effective" as the 12ga shotgun, but, a 410 pistol in comparison to a 12ga shotgun is just two different ballgames completely (no comparison).
Even formulated for handguns, you will still not have nearly the same amount of pressure build (ie velocity) up behind the wad that you will with the much longer barrel space of the shotgun. A quick search shows the judge pistol at 800fps vs 1200+ out of a 410 shotgun. Energy is velocity squared so the shot gun pellets are carrying over twice the energy.
Yeah indeed. Half the number of pellets doens't mean half the effectiveness if those pallets are also going a lot slower. That would be like saying a 22lr is just as effective as a 223.
I think he's making the opposite point. Its not as good as a shotgun, but better than a centerfire pistol round. It qualities should be noted as a better pistol option, not a half as good shotgun option.
@John Doe bugout does not mean you will be the only human trying to stay alive. you will most definitely encounter others, some friendly some not. if you have other weapons then a 22 will nicely fill a niche. if you have only one then, as the voice stated, a 22 would be foolish.
If someone breaks in my house I have 40 grain high velocity hollow points for them! I for sure wouldn’t want to get shot by a 22. Al though I would prefer a 10mm to defend my life!
@@boedude8496 A) In a bugout situation you likely won't be able to carry an arsenal with you. Your priorities should be one or maybe two handguns that are light and reliable, that you are proficient with. B) In a bugout situation your priority should be to avoid conflict wherever possible. Daydreams about fighting off post-apocalyptic biker gangs are just that - daydreams. Regardless of the firearm you're carrying, getting into a scuffle with groups of potentially armed people is a sure way to get yourself killed. C) .22lr might not be ideal but it's certainly adequate for defending yourself. I've seen people empty ten round magazines from a 10/22 in two seconds while staying on target. It has its pros and cons like any other caliber, but it gets the job done. In short, if you have no choice but to bugout and all you've got is your little .22 rifle, then you should be all good unless you plan to be getting into firefights. Someone comes at you to get your stuff, and you put five rounds into him in a second, I don't think he'll be coming at you any more. If it will bring down a pig, it will bring down a human.
@@orionslaver432 1) most likely if i am bugging out then a million others in my area will be too. it will be virtually impossible to avoid others, especially in the first weeks. 2) why am i bugging out? most everything in your plan depends on where you live, where you are going, and why. here we have one direction to go to get away, and that is to the mountains. vast area but takes a while for multiple millions to spread out. not all will be armed but a large % is and its growing. obviously avoiding shootouts is in everyone's best interest. if its a shtf situation then most will be quick to be confrontational. if not, great. 3) biker or inner city gangs are not on my list of things to fear in the immediate future. ive never had dreams of wars with them and i don't play video games. the mountains are full of predators aside from people. wolves and bear cats and coyotes etc are very numerous and will notice the invasion and be quick defend their young and territory. the chances of needing a higher power weapon is quite high. 4) a bugout bag is not empty sitting in my closet waiting to be filled with whatever i happen to have handy at the time. it is a 'bag' that already contains the weapons and ammo and items needed to get me bare bones thru the immediate situation and near future. if the only rifle i have is a 22 then of course it would be in the bag. since i have (imho) better options it is not. if i could bring it additionally i would, but not at the expense of something better. in ideal circumstances a 22 can take down various animals but only a fool prepares for ideal circumstances. bring whatever you want. not my place to tell you different. i will be prepared for needing more and be happy if it is never necessary
The optimistic rating to the .410 revolver ignores the greatly reduced velocity of short barrel revolvers versus a real buckshot load from a real shotgun. Each pellet from the revolver will carry barely one third the energy of the same pellet from a 12 gauge. Also, the revolvers tend to scatter their pellets wildly so that even at 10 paces some pellets will entirely miss the target whereas a real shotgun would blast a 6 inch cluster of devastation. There really is no basis of comparison, a Wingmaster is a deadly weapon, a Judge is a joke.
The Taurus Raging Bull isnt a joke Gives you the option of 45 Long Colt, 454 or 410 If you think 410 out of a Revolver is a joke, why don't you volunteer to be shot by one
Try watching the bolo round penetration videos.3" Judge shoots through 3/4 inch plywood and 2 shed walls behind it. If that's a joke you must think nothing short of a Abrams tank to be sufficient.
True. .25 & .32 have great numbers, because I can guarantee you that the men who carry those "outdated" calibers are older, experienced shooters. Who most likely calmly placed their first shot under extreme pressure.
"Wild" Bill Hickok fired a single bullet from 75 yards from a pistol with the same power as a 32, which got him tried for murder and acquitted for self defense. If you can put a 22 magnum through the heart, it will incapacitate 100% of the time.
Even then, never expect 1 shot will stop. Two in the chest, one in the head, another in the head to confirm. Walk them up from center of mass to the head. *It's the only way to ensure your safety.* Plus, dead criminals can't sue you or testify against you. The 2nd in the head will probably get questioned by police, so obviously that would only apply to WROL scenarios, such as no-go zones.
I'd prefer either caliber over .22 if I had more money. I notice a lot of issues trying to fire rimfire ammo, Same with Winchester center-fire ammo. Also, consider most guns that are used to fire .25 or .32 are usually old, cheaply made guns that require a bit more TLC than usual to get into good working order. I usually use some lube and +P ammo to fix my cheap gun problems. More often than not, a weapon's what you make of it. People told me Piettas were junk. I had 1 for years, lubed it up, broke it in, put it through hell, snapped a hand spring, blew a few cylinders apart, stretched the frame, fixed it up, tuned it up and kept right on shooting until the day I sold it recently and now a friend is enjoying it as I have my slam fire 12GA shotgun with 12 .32 cal. balls in a reloaded shell, couple cans of pepper spray and not much more planned except maybe a .410 Derringer or semi-auto .380 build or another antique firearm for carrying next year. I'm 32 and started shooting firearms when I was 23, when my life depended on it in a bad neighborhood. I'm not an old fart yet, though.
There is no "best". It all depends on the shooter. For my ex-wife the 357 was her choice because she was squeamish about shooting someone. She could load a 5 shot pistol with a snake load,, 2 38 specials, then 2 357s. If the snake load made an intruder leave that was all she needed. If she had to go all the way to the 357s she new the intruder intended great bodily harm and needed to be killed. For me the 380 is my choice. At 7 yards I can hit center mass with every round. My hands are too small and arthritic to handle a 9mm. Like I said, it all depends on the shooter.
I own a glock 19 in 9mm but i also own a Browning 1911 .380 that fits my smaller hands better. I wish gun makers would make more models that are ergonomically friendly to smaller hand individuals in calibers 9mm or larger.
really good job talking about issues of "statistical significance" in a way that the lay person should be able to understand. Also really good ways to help us see what stats might be biased throughout the video as well. I may use the beginning of this video as an example in my Research Methods class!
@Uganda Knuckles True to a certain extent, but a 22 that enters the skull doesnt exit. It hits the other side, fragments and basically becomes a miniature brain frag grenade.
Yeah if you can make a perfect shot just 1 time under pressure, for me better a .45 acp that facilitate things, and that thing of the .22 being lethal in the head is just a joke, a .45 or 9 mm have a lot more chance to pass the two sides of the head leaving a big hole through the hole brain and leaving a massive crack to the cranium (more the .45) so tell me if that is not more lethal than a .22
"Stopping power" is the ultimate fudd gauge. Anytime someone starts talking seriously about stopping power, you should probably stop listening. There's a lot more physics involved with firearms ballistics than the average pawnshop reject is going to understand and what it takes to get an attacker to stand down or be incapacitated largely depends on the situation and target. The 9mm statistically does so well at personal defense because it does so many things well and has a lot of mass-produced, high-quality ammunition and guns made in it's caliber, same with 5.56. Any firearm that you are proficient and comfortable with, that actually has the ballistic power to penetrate skin and bone deep enough, is what you should carry or keep on hand.
Yep. Shot placement is key, regardless of caliber. Read a story the other day about a 74 yr. old woman getting a 1 shot 1 kill with her .22 on a home invader. .
@@CrimsonKingOkie Not really. That's kind of my point though, you can't rely on accuracy in self-defense situations either, even if you are an expert shooter, and doubly so if you aren't. "Stopping power" isn't some magic number, nor is it the ability under ideal target situations to hit a golf ball at 100yds. You will likely not be in ideal conditions any time you're in a self-defense situation. That's why you shoot center mass and hope to hit as many vital organs as possible to incapacitate your attacker. Can a .22 do that? Sure... will a .22 do that without extremely well-placed or lucky shots within it's magazine capacity better than calibers more suited to defense? Very likely not. I don't want to rely on luck when I have someone rushing at me from a blind spot in the dark in the middle of the night when I just got out of bed. I want to fire off as many rounds as I can reasonably squeeze out and know that if I at least hit anything center mass, either the fight is taken out of the attacker or the hits are going to be lethal. Of course the .22 you have beats the hell out of the .45 you don't, so once again, make us out of what you can.
@vachief Unarmored targets being hit at closer ranges is something the .45 seems to do well. It's a big bullet that hits reasonably hard and does a lot of hydrostatic damage on penetration. That's one of the reasons it was so successful in the trenches of WWI. Add any significant range, obstruction, or body armor to the situation though and it suddenly isn't as effective as some other rounds.
.22 great for small game. Which is most of what you'll encounter when in a bug out situation. Birds(big and small), rabbits, squirrels, etc. can be taken. Firing a .22 round draws less attention as well. It's also versatile. There are revolvers, semi-auto pistols, bolt action rifles, semi-auto rifles in .22 cal.
Every bullet fired at you is too large. Every bullet you fire at an assailant is too small.
Well said, Pugiron.
You always find what you lost in the last place you look for it.
@@gsp49 Sometimes in the next to last place, ifffffffffffffffffffffffff you look further.
Bravo...
Amen.
It was my understanding that 'bugging out' with a .22 rifle had to do with survival and hunting, not man killing. The advantage was light weight = more rounds of ammo.
Exactly. It’s to hunt small game.
So... The Judge plus R 10/22 and go.
If you are getting in gun fights, you're doing something wrong.
@@jwrosenbury exactly. You want to be the Tarkov ninja scav, not the Chad.
@@michealnelson5179 Not me. I want to be surrounded by people I trust and who trust me. Going it alone works until you sprain an ankle.
Having a solid community behind you is the only sane solution to prepping.
Pro tip: If you live in a blue state, move to somewhere where you can trust your neighbors.
I allways keep a mini gun in the nightstand , it covers all the bases. I just have to remember to put on my slippers before I use it because it's hell wading thru all that hot brass on the floor.
HA HA HA!
Oh ! Don't forget to plug your power cord into the wall outlet! Otherwise you won't have any hot brass on the floor.
🤣👌
100 rounds per second is always your friend.
By
This is really interesting. Based on testing videos and such I concluded that .380 was serviceable and most are concealable enough easy for daily carry. I'm really impressed that .380 stands up so well in real world use. Its always nice to have real data to corroborate or disprove conclusions.
I suspect the 380 was used at closer ranges or were easier to shoot accurately due to less recoil. Too many variables left out.
@@lazybear236It is an aggregate of real world data. The reason it stands up so effectively isn't important.
Been carrying. 380 for a while and I agree. It's a fantastic round consistently overlooked and underrated. It's just enough for a possible encounter on the street or in a confined area and the small guns still hold a good amount of rounds in comparison to larger micro-compact calibers.
"There's no replacement for shot placement" --- Paul Harrell
(I suspect someone else said it first, but I learned it from Paul)
They left out something VERY important, and that is hit/miss. How many times to people miss with pistols? How often do they miss with a shotgun or rifle? They ONLY focused on the hits, not the misses. Shotgun hit percentage is very high. Pistol is very low.
@@n2omike it’s up to you to develop skill. Like anything, it comes with practice and more practice.
No replacement for displacement
@@n2omike I tried fitting a shotgun in my pocket holster but it didn’t work.
@@steviesevieria1868 that’s why you stick it down your pants. Shotgun = best ccw confirmed.
In a life or death situation any gun is better than no gun.
Amen brother! Welcome home...1971 anloc, chulai
James McClane - Thanks',... and welcome home from a fellow Patriot, been a decent life and we're a couple of the lucky ones that have been able to live it. Now that I'm old I think of all those young guy's that never had the chance.
@@USARMYvietnamVET1969 Yes sir, Lost a lot of good friends and a close cousin. You take care of yourself and thanks for sharing some of the same dirt.
@@USARMYvietnamVET1969 true but if you have time to prepare and choose your gun, choose the best option.
Thom - I will agree with that statement.
".38, 9mm, .40, 10mm, or .45, they're all quicker than 911"
-Sun Tzu, probably
Unless its a Springfield 911
If There's An Afterlife And He Has Educated Himself On Modern Weapons Then He Probably Has Said Something Similar To That. :P
That was a showcase joke.
So is 22 and 380...
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
I choose my caliber the same way I choose the platform, what I’m comfortable with. I carried a S&W model 66 .357 magnum as a Detroit police officer and had total confidence in it, when I was finally advised (pressured) into going with an auto loader, I opted for a para ordinance P-14 .45 acp because I was confident in the caliber from my time in the service. A 9mm probably would have been sufficient, but it all boiled down to what I was use to and trusted.
For a police officer the ability of the bullit to penetrate vehicles is also more important than for the general public carrying guns for self defense. I think that was the main idea with the .357 Magnum in the first place.
I got a Glock 21 in .45 ACP not because .45 is any better, but because the size of the pistol felt reassuring. I also have an AR15 that's a civilian-legal version of my old M4. That platform is familiar to me, and I know for a fact that it'll get the job done, even if the attacker has body armor. However, if I could have no other firearm, I'd take my old Winchester 1300 Defender. While buckshot or even slugs won't defeat body armor per se, slugs will pulverize whatever they hit, most likely killing the target, or at least stopping him.
@@Octopussyist .357 is one hell of a round. Its statistics are about the only caliber that surprised me; I really thought it would be more effective. 125-grain hollow points do horrendous damage. I shot rabbits with both .44 Magnum and .357 Magnum in Alaska. The .44 just made a .42-inch (look it up, .44 Magnum is actually .42 inches) hole through the head while the .357 Magnum reduced the head to mush.
@@thatguy22441 Marshall Sanow stats agree, 125 gr 357 can't be beat, one shot stops. Certain 9 sig loads same. Anything in the 90's percentile.
@@thatguy22441 it depends on the type of ammo.
125 Grain .357 Mag
Or us it's 'brother' the .357 SIG
Which was designed to copy the .357 mag's power in automatic pistols are the best for day to day carry for revolvers and pistols.
The 240-grain .44 mag hollow point will only show it's stoping power once it is unleashed when something dangerous charges at you.
For 'normal' situations .357 mag or/SIG is perfect. But if you need that little inch of extra power or you you just want to be on the safe side when a bear attacks that you will be able to stop it .44 is the deal.
30 yrs in law enforcement and all I was taught was year after year was bullet placement. If you can’t shoot accurately with a 45 or 44 then you might have much, much better stopping power with a 9mm or .380. It’s all about who’s shooting.
as Ed McMahon used to say you are correct sir
A 45 will leave an exit wound 4-5 times larger than a 9MM.
john harris no argument here. I own a Ruger redhawk .45 for bear protection up here in Alaska. For me personally I love it but my edc is a 9mm because I feel a wee bit more accurate with it (and it’s a heck of a lot smaller).
@@ieatcaribou7852 I have an HKVP9SK and love it. Are you using full house loads in your Redhawk?
john harris for the brownies up here for sure. 335 grain hard cast lead. They’re palm pounders but at close to mid range will devastate any animal up here.
357 mag is my favorite cartridge, but I find myself carrying my Taurus tcp 380 more often than not because of convenience. It’s always good to see data backing in up
I was a police officer in the early to middle 80's. Our dept. weapon was the S&W 66. At that time very few depts. allowed the use of semi-autos. Our dept. did a lot of study on the 357. It was the choice caliber for a lot of depts. At longer distances, the 357 excelled statistically. The problem was , at point blank range where 85 % of police shootings occured, the 357 had a tendency to pass though an assailant . The 357 just didn't mushroom enough because of the high velocity. Our dept. settled on a 158 gr. 38 +p, semi-jacketed hp. This round was perfectly capable of penetrating auto windshields and seemed to have good ability to stop a threat at close range. I did carry 357 ammo as backup and never felt under gunned.
Speed is what helps expansion bullet construction was probably the reason
@@jorgesolis9468 The speed overcame the bullet expansion surface area
@@rodvan-zeller6360 depends on what bullets were shot like the ole fashion 125 gr at 1450 fps sjhp fragment and expand violently on impact i dont use those for backup hog guns because they tend to not penetrate enough but 158 gr tends to hold more weight and if it's a spicy one 158 at 1400 fps then although it's going fast it retains enough weight to punch through I'm not sure what they issued yall but that is just what I've seen on pigs in texas
@@jorgesolis9468 Thank you for the reply. Agreed we have unknown variables
@@rodvan-zeller6360 for example 75 gr 5.56 compared to 45 gr 5.56 75 gr is actually used for hog hunting and probably the best option where as 45 gr basically falls apart on impact barely penetrating as much as 9mm speed paired with lighter weight bullets means less penetration unless its it's a bullet not made to expand like hardcast solid copper etc
Worth pointing out that a rifle has a much longer engagement distance too. That could easily make the difference between winning and losing a fire fight and, IMO, makes up for the increased weight. Not to mention how much better it is for hunting.
i dont think that hunting maters in personal defence and you ar mostlikly on close dictences for sellf difense if you end up in a distenc gun fir r fight you are extremly unlaky or in th wrong place.
@@jannis8978 much easier to aim a rifle at pretty much any range, velocity doesn’t matter at close range but handling does, and you can aim a rifle much better at any distance than a handgun
@@1ch0r41 Unless you live within 200 yards of anyone. Use your brain or turn it in. There's a line for responsible gun owners and you're not eligible. Yes rifles are easier to handle, collateral damage is not.
"missing" is the missing factor here. Rifles are easier to aim. Also a smaller pistol round should be easier to hit shot 2 & up. Another point for .380 perhaps. Definitely a point for "use a rifle if you can. Use the pistol in a self-def caliber you're good with if you can't."
@@eb4305 Prepper channel though Erok. Your point is suited better for a general self-defense channel. Hopefully anyone reading is sensible enough to leave the 5.56 in the gun safe in the middle o town.
Excellent information, though one point needs addressing.
Saying that a 22lr rifle is a shit choice as a bug out rifle, needs to be put into context.
' Bug out' isn't necessarily only self defense.
With this in mind, consider the following :
1. Living off the land, as in shooting to eat, a 22 rifle is a great choice, as it'll kill most things, and fairly quietly, which is important for a number of reasons.
2. If you're ' bugging out', you can ambush people / animals with head shots. One shot kills up to 100 yards should be regarded as fairly easy.
3. You can quite conceivably, easily carry 1500 rounds of 22lr in a small backpack.
4. 22lr ammo can be found anywhere.
5. Hose down an atracker with a load of 22lr, and they WILL die.
6. Minimal noise signature compared to other calibres, and effectively silent using subsonic.
7. Carry CCI Velocitor and subsonic, and you are in a very good position.
Fondel Maddick Henry ar7 as simply a survival rifle, it belongs in the bag, but I would take something for self defense as well
Any headshots to any living creature is a killshot
I´ve seen people shooting 22´s guns so fast and accurate that it doesn´t matter whatever caliber gun you brought to a duel with those guys.
@@phillipcooper3209 i recall reading somewhere that around 1 in 10 people shot in the head survive that being said they would suffer damage to the brain or other areas
That's why I have a Ruger PC Carbine Chassis model, and a Glock 19. Both use easily carried 9mm, and both use the same magazine. Both will also fit in a backpack.
I just saw the video and had one major complaint about the bug out situation, the reason most want the .22 is because you can carry a lot more ammo than the others and you would not have it to kill attackers but the kill small game for food without drawing much attention to yourself with louder ammo types. To bug out is to move and evade, not fight a war. Most would still have a good pistol for protection from attackers but the .22 rifle is the best for quiet shooting, especially with a silencer, for food.
My official replica Lord of the rings battle sword can block any caliber bullets. It is also %100 effective at never getting me laid.
Same with my katana.
@@taylordavison6849 I don't need a sword for the second part. I'm all the effectiveness that I need.
@@raskolnikovsghost2701 Said every pretentious neckbeard ever. This whole thing was a joke, bruh.
@@taylordavison6849 Duh, mine too lol. R/woosh.
I know right!!
l was a law enforcement officer for 35 years in California. last 12 years was a Coroner's Detective. Also, sniper, rangemaster, and firearm instructor. l always said all you need is one well placed bullet.
A Austin Texas PD 👮🏻♂️ Sgt took out a armed attacker near a 🏥 with his PD issue .40S&W. He fired the M&P pistol at recorded range of 104 yards! 😯 That was impressive. Years ago, a USAF security police shot a felon with a AK rifle. The enlisted SP used a 9mm M9, 89 yards. ✔
Yeah, I got aim small miss small as a kid rammed home, way before Gibson was even in movies.
It wasn't discussed but maybe there's maximum accuracy from 0.380 ACP to 9mm. That might explain success.
All good in theory, but hitting well in a firefight isn't as easy as hitting at the range.
@@meat-hook True, but keep in mind most gun fights occur in less than 20 feet. That's according to FBI statistics. Even more so, many occur at 10 feet or less. If you cannot put holes in an 8-1/2 X 11 piece paper consistently at the range, at 20 feet or less, then you will definitely have problems in the real world.
TL:DR
Hot peices of lead flying at mach 1 are pretty good deterents regardless of size.
And that .454 Casull is the ONLY choice
except if the target has level 3a body armor
Walter White
Tell me where I made the statement that most criminals wear body armor. It seems you have jumped to a conclusion.
Walter White
Idk my man, I just pointed out a piece of information that was in the video.
@daAnder71 *peices
"Pistols put holes in people. Rifles put holes through people. Shotguns, at the right range with the right load, will physically remove a chunk of sh*t off of your opponent and throw that sh*t on the floor."
-Clint Smith
12gauge 3inch magnum slugs make for a bad day even if you have body armor
@@danieljonhson6367 trauma pads.
Also I only recommend plate carriers and 4+ level plates but that's just me.
@@daltongarrett7117 Shoot again and again , and they fall down due to massive trauma
@@GabrielAlves-fw7bj only if you hit them in the right place. And then only if their not high outta their minds on something like pcp. Then you had better have that shotgun handy.
I disagree with the conclusions on 410 handgun rounds. Look up ballistic tests for them on UA-cam. They do an awful job. Paul Harrell has some videos on the Taurus Judge.
I agree with you. The narrator missed spread pattern with shotguns. A 410 with a 3 inch barrel spreads a lot more than a 20 inch 12gauge. but there are some 410 loads that are devastating inside of 10 yards. Plus they also shoot 45lc. Not my favorite choice though.
I think one of the key points he made on the 410 handgun was multiple rounds. Even with massive spread, you should be able to hit your target with at least two of the five rounds, which is inside of the "max number of hits incapacitate" when compared to other pistols.
The biggest point he missed with the .410 pistol is that in a 3" barrel you are going to lose a lot of velocity, which will greatly degrade performance. Also he "assumes" that .410 will be 1/2 as effective as 12 ga., but then only cuts their advantage in half. 12 ga. has an 86% success rate half of that is 43% giving then 10% less effectiveness not 15% more.
@@joejones5491 That's a lie. Why would you say something so ignorant ?
@@joejones5491 And you had 4 ignorant people give your no content troll channel a thumbs up based on a lie. My God people are stupid .
Props to the .380 acp...doing the same work as the big boys...
Funny how more information can make a decision harder rather than easier.
So you’re saying buy all of them, right?
Yes
And a samurai sword
Just in case every thing else fails .
Buy whatever suits you best. If you like a particular platform but you're stuck between deciding on caliber, go with the most abundant caliber. The rounds will be more readily available and probably less expensive.
Or perhaps a better pair of running shoes.
Guns are a waste of time. Save your money and just get a rocket launcher.
This is excellent. The only thing missing is how many shots are missed vs on target with a pistol vs a rifle because it' doesn't matter how effective a round is unless it hits a target and can be well placed. Just a quick trip to the range you see very qickly the ease of accurately shooting a 556 rifle vs a handgun.
Greg Colin True. Most people shooting with a rifle are not spraying and praying. They mean to hit their target the first time.
Rifles are more accurate that's not even debatable.Handguns on the other hand just depends on what caliber the person shoots best.
I'd have to go look at the study he used, but my guess would be the one stop shot difference between rifles and handguns is based on the first hit, not necessarily the first shot if its a miss. It would have been interesting to see how many altercations are ended by missed shots scaring the attacker off. But you are very correct in saying that a rounds effectiveness doesn't matter if the shot is missed.
He also said the study used data and interviews from Military conflicts. This leads me to believe that most of the data for rifles, is M4's using xm193, m88 ball, etc. None of which expand, and out of 14" barrels, don't reliably tumble. I would find it very interesting to see what effective rate rifles have, if the data is limited to rifles using expanding self defense/hunting ammo. My guess is that it would be a bit higher than what the study showed.
I think you forgot about AR 5.56 pistols. They are still more effective than a handgun round and way easier to carry than a full sized rifle.
John Garcez well yeah, but when talking about handguns vs rifles, thats kinda cheating a little bit. I mean sure, an AR pistol is technically a handgun, but if it weren’t for some stupid ass regulations on sbrs, pretty much all ar pistols would be short rifles from the get go. But yes, 5.56 “pistols”, especially with good expanding rounds, are very effective compared to a normal handgun.
So when 9mm and 45 ACP perform near identically, why bother carrying a 7 shot 1911 with considerable recoil, when you can have 17 or more rounds of 9mm?
edi some states aren’t free states, and have magazine capacity limits, making the extra magazine capacity a mute point. 🤷♂️
Reach Victoria even in wny you can still have hi cap pistols
My thoughts exactly. Just load up with the nastiest JHP 9mm rounds you can find and hit 'em where it hurts.
For me it's a theoretical discussion anyways, since live in a place where I can't legally own a gun, nor legally defend myself with anything... so quit crying about capacity limits.
I agree with a movie (Black Lagoon) on that size doesn't matter as long as you're the one that scores first. In that regard recoil is certainly a bad thing, as it reduces the chance of follow up shots and may cause you to screw up the first shot, due to lack of practice...
So even with restricted capacities, you would probably do better with smaller ammo and you might even profit of having more ammo and training, due to costs.
Basically what I have been saying for years in regards as to the best man stopping round. I wouldn’t want to get hit by any of them.
What about cost per round?
I can get a 100rd box of 9mm for $36 a Bass Pro.
It makes training a lot cheaper.
The more you train the better your accuracy. If it's cost prohibitive to train the less training you can do.
This was very interesting. I carry a Glock 42 .380 because it is light, and I figure a gun I'm more willing to carry is better than the one left at home, and also if I'm being completely honest I'm not the best shot. So the 42 is significantly easier for me to shoot accurately, and faster with follow up shots. So for these reasons I've concluded this was a better carry gun for me than one of my larger 9mm options. Now after seeing these statistics I'm even more confident with my choice.
Check out the DB9GEN4, it’s much smaller then the Glock 42 and it’s rated for 9mm+P, I hate 9mm in a full-size gun but once you put 9mm in a pistol that weighs 16oz fully loaded then it becomes perfect for power/size ratio.
The Glock 43 is essentially the same size as the 42 (maybe a couple extra mm) and holds 9mm. It’s my go to carry
@@iLLBiLLsRoastBeatsthe 43 has more recoil than the 42, and makes follow up shots slower for me. So better ballistics for less accuracy in my case is not worth it.
I've had alotta Berettas; 92 full sized 9mm, 92 compact 9mm and, a Beretta 380 84..And I've fired Colt 1911's a lot.
The 1911 felt like a brick in my hand, always was moving around between shots. The 9mm Berettas were much better in the grips, but I was Always faster and more accurat with the 380!?
Firing double taps or three round bursts, the 380 made me a champ on the pistole range. huh.
A test I do first time at the range with a firearm, is I dump the mag fairly quickly just doing point shoot. If I have a decent grouping I feel confident it will work as a carry pistol, if it is all over the place I know I am more likely to have a erratic shots when in a stressful situation. For instance the smaller Sig P938 I have much better groupings with than the larger Walther PPS. I sold the PPS and regularly carry the 938.
The narrator could have easily been in fallout new vegas
Ballistics. Ballistics never changes.
new Vegas
@@iDatedMyPizza Try the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. mods on the Nexus for Fallout. Better than both.
@@FallingHelium lolol you guys are funny my friends!😎
Or red dead redemption
I almost died laughing at the end of this video. The way that "454 Casull" shows up on screen along with the gun and starts zooming in as the music gets louder towards the end is comedic genius. I guess we have no choice now!!
A .22 is probably considered a good bug out gun for survival because it's light, the ammo (was) cheap and plentiful, and is very effective at hunting small game, "Bugging out" doesn't necessarily mean you're looking for a defensive firearm.
Then enjoy getting smoked by bandits and looters
Even better with a suppressor
Is nobody sees you sure. If you have to meet people, having a open rifle means your a possible threat.
Also moving around a rifle is extremely annoying.
Take in mind a 22lr shot from a 16inch barrle cci ammo has the same kenetic energy of a
32acp shot from a 3inch barrel.
If your hunting small game ditch the 22 and take the .32 mouse gun, you can carry more ammo even if the 32 ammo is a bit heavier because the gun loaded weights 16 ounces. The 22 rifle weights 64 ounces (4lb).
Convert 3lb of rifle weight to 32ammo and if you set out 8lb for ammo and gun, you actually have more rounds of 32acp than 22lr buy having 3lb more ammo.
In pretty much no way is a 22lr from a rifle better than a 32acp in mouse gun that like a tomcat.
Even for distance at 25 yards, which is meaningless. A 32acp is more accurate from the handgun than rifle 22lr since 22lr has too much inconsistencies in velocity and so light wind pushes .
Doesnt do any good if it jams.
I think it was a great study, thank you for taking the time and sharing it with us.
use the one that you know how to use correctly and accurately. That's the one that will work best for you.
This past week I was working on a job and had a 18 year old young man with me. A crazed neighbor fired a pump shotgun in the air and came at us very quickly screaming and shouting to get on the ground and we were trespassing. Several things he said lead me to quickly deduct that he wasn't mentally competent and that really heightened my concern. We had not left the shoulder of the road and were on state property, legal and not trespassing. I was on the driver side of my truck at the bed with the door open and the young man was on the passenger side, where the neighbor was approaching. The neighbor with the shotgun pointing, was making a b-line for the young man and yelling for him to get on the ground...he complied. I however, had a choice to make that was a little more difficult; This is the day I didn't have my .38. I could run through an open field, leaving the unarmed young man with no cover or I could pull my 5 shot .22 and stand my ground behind the cover of my vehicle against a shotgun. The moment I felt my pocket for that .22 was like no other. I knew it would never stop him and I was going to die, but that was my choice. Miraculously I remembered while at my farm, I had stuck my .44 magnum revolver between the driver seat and the game changed. Why? Because there was no doubt in my mind, with my proficiency with my .44 I would stop the threat in one shot. Confidence was key in the dialogue that was to follow. I stood my ground, keeping the man's attention off the young man, until he lowered his weapon and I de-escalated the threat through communication. I never showed the man that I had a weapon, so as not to challenge or provoke and I engaged him in conversation from behind cover. I was able to call 911 and the day ended without any bloodshed. I learned several things; One, I care more about others lives and am willing to sacrifice my own, even if they want to kill me. Two, never carry a gun that cannot stop an angry armed person in one shot. Last but not least, the most important defense against a threat is prayer and a level head. Looking back, we did everything perfectly and no better outcome or choices could have been made and I thank God for that.
Sun Tzu says; "The Supreme Art of War is to subdue your enemy without fighting."
The Art of War.
@Wilson Turner I find comfort and confidence is two main factors for my EDC. When I bought my first carry gun, it was an open carry .45 ACP. That was short lived and never was practical with most of my clothing. I always felt like it made me more of a target than secure in defense.
I then decided to carry the tried an true .38 revolver inside the waist band. I love revolvers, always have. I like shooting them. I don't like shorting my slide action autos. I just don't.
I have been shooting all of my 40ish years and owned firearms as a child.
However, I keep trying to find a slide action that I like to carry. Yesterday I carried a Taurus 9mm with 13+1 and plan to carry it today. I am extremely proficient with this firearm, but don't like it. It is a love hate relationship with autos. "I know her well and understand her, but it's why I don't like her."😁
Anyway, I also have an American Arms 5 shot .22 revolver that is always on me and I mean always. It is my backup (belly gun/under the chin gun).
In a situation like I faced, though I can group the little American Arms 5 shot at 7 yards within 8", the stopping power is not there and 8" is not enough accuracy to defend against a shotgun from behind cover. However, I was going to stand my ground with what I had, but that meant taking the fight to him. I would have had to leave cover at some point to confront him with intension of getting too close for him to use the shotgun. I would have to be inside his muzzle.
On the flip side, when I realized the .44 magnum was in the truck, I knew I had the accuracy and the one shot stopping power to end the threat at any point and I could maintain my cover. At that instant I didn't have to read him or the situation to formulate a move to get closer. I could simply stand my ground, keep his attention, and hope he reasoned himself out of it, the lawman would arrive, or any positive outcome.
Now, some may say it was stupid to think I could effectively or even safely get close enough to him to stop him before I got shot. There are scenarios all over YT addressing this. However, in this particular situation, he had no idea that I was armed and was pinning us down in a manner that he did not need to advance on us from his position. He was within 3-4 yards at all times. There were a couple of times I left cover with my license in hand or cell phone (telling him the neighbor was on the line) where I was getting closer. He obviously was weary of allowing me too close, which I was aware of, but me getting belly to belly or belly to back wasn't out of the question. That being said, the best scenario took place and this option was averted, thank God...to Him be the praise.
So, confidence is key in any situation and lack of confidence is unpredictable. Thankfully, my assailant was confident, because it made him somewhat predictable. Know the capability of your firearm and know your proficiency. It makes no since to draw on a shotgun with a .22 pistol, unless you are being fired on already. It isn't like he would have ran away. And seeing how he had no cover to take, the likelihood of him not firing back wasn't an option.
As in any Real defensive posture situation you are praying that YOU don’t have to be the one to shoot! However, fight or flight is a very primitive response that can be hard to manage. Choosing the Best Response is what is taught to our LE community! No person here may/would respond in the same manner as you were able to. Given the same situation people will interpret a threat differently and respond by their past experiences with threats/firearms, prior training if any, and the potential legal ramifications that challenge Our decisions! What I NEVER want to occur is what happened in Seal Beach, California! A lady (going through a divorce) working in a hair salon was going to die because her soon to be ex-husband had decided this. In killing her he ALSO shot and killed six other people and then himself! I told myself that I would never want to die in such a meaningless manner! From that day on, I carried a Glock 30 SF which holds 10 rounds of .45 ACP. I have a legal lockbox in my car. And carry the pistol easily in on my left inner ankle.
Wilson Turner WT? I too live in the same Commie State as you do. I will give you some FYI. Be cautious with “Trigger Jobs.” District Attorney’s are very well informed on each weapon’s trigger pull weight. The difference could be enough to what may perceived as intentional vs accidental discharge. ANY civilian accidental discharge means excessive response to a threat and or poor-no training on the use of your weapon ! Our state also lacks in a “Castle Doctrine” which in Texas for example. You can use lethal force for just witnessing a crime (not against you!) but something as minor as two men climbing through a window and thus breaking-entering a home. (SEE UA-cam 911 call). An armed citizen carrying his cell phone was recorded by 911 operator who TOLD HIM “leave it be let the police handle it!” He ignored that advice and still shot & killed both of them! He was later found not guilty. But what he did was reasonable? Well if my teenage daughter was visiting that house...Sure! But this man knew neither the house or the people that lived there!
Well said. The psychological side of proper gun usage is so often overlooked.
My choice just has to be the 357 magnum.
Dual purpose, Light bullets for PSD, heavy bullets for Hunting.
Handloading really brings out the best for the 357 mag. 2nd reason, all 38sp ammo can be used. Third plus, a Revolver and Rifle same ammo. With handloading you can tailor the ammo for its purpose. Separate Loadings for the revolver, 4in barrel and rifle with a 22in barrel. Velocity increase with pistol ammo loadings using the 22in rifle is between 250-700 fps increase. Example, 125gn XTP bullet loaded to 1150 fps for the 4in pistol, same round in the 22in rifle 1700 fps. Turns groundhogs inside out.
No matter what you have in your hand it's still Bullet Placement, Bullet Placement, Bullet Placement.
If you can't hit within 1 inch of your point of aim, then get to the range and PRACTICE.
With my 22s, bolt, auto rifles and a revolver, I'll never go hungry. Tons of fun to shoot, lots of ammo in a tiny space.
When needed to, Step it up a notch, I reach for my 357s, Rifle, 3x9x40 scope and Revolver with Target Sights, I handload both.
Factory 357 ammo is about $1.00 + per round, with handloading my ammo costs for the 357, LHCSWC bullets .23 cents per round, for the XTP bullet, .43 cents per round.
Versatility is the keyword here. The 357 fits this. My handgun caliber of choice. Handgun and Rifle tough to beat.
I can remember loading a box of 50 .44 mag rounds for about $2 (cast bullets, probably $3.50 for jacketed). Damn times have changed!
A well placed shot with a bb gun is better than a miss with a cannon. Shoot the largest caliber you are capable of being accurate with.
Most people are the "Terrorist/Killer" ...AKA A well placed shot.
Most are shooting in defense, in retaliation and most aren't lining up/taking the time. That's why Most Cops are shooting like IDIOTS 20 round from 2 cops that hit the suspect 2
little Finkle great advice ! Now how do you get a perp to bend over and spread em? Haha🤣
Watch this ua-cam.com/video/XbJ_r2DUbK4/v-deo.html and tell me a bb hit is more effective. Note: The tank missed.
I disagree. Carry your preference whilst balancing optimum capacity with what caliber you are quickest and most accurate with. Also consider economics. You should really practice with your SD ammo and not ball/target ammo for you carry piece. I am most accurate with my super redhawk in .44 magnum but i am not lugging around that beast daily. Ill go with my lefty friendly FNX 9 with 17+1 rounds of 124 grain gold dots that i know function reliably and can afford to practice with 2 times a month. I am a bit quicker with my series 70 1911 vs my FN but ammo cost and the 10 extra rounds of ammo in my 9mm more than outweigh the pros of my 1911.
Very good advice. I have always said get the biggest thing you can shoot comfortably. I like .357 but any thing above that (and depending on the gun even that can be too much) and I start to not be as accurate and flinch. As for the .454 I say I shot one and after 3 rounds gave it back because I couldn't hit anything with it.
just came across this channel. Nice soft music, an interesting premise, good use of statistics. Fine work here.
Titus Ponrathnam yep I subscribed keep up the great work!
Mark Berenger stop talking so factual when you truly know shit, and are at best, making an educated guess
Its good to know that the .380 acp is actually a really good round, being a brazilian civilian who is restricted to .38 spl and .380 acp.
@@JohnDavis-im1oy most animals have denser muscles and skin than humans, lol your "animal tests" dont prove shit.
@OP, trust me a .380 will drop someone with well placed shots but I'd prefer to carry a .357 if you have restrictions, where you can still use a .38 spc bullet(yes u can use both bullets in most if not all. 357 mags
Eae vc mora no rio?
@@JohnDavis-im1oy Your numbers are incorrect. 380's average over 200 ft lbs and reasonably top out around 240.
@@jacobgeary9811 Well placed shots are a luxury during the stress of an actual gun fight. It is hard enough for the average shooter to make well placed shots on a non moving paper target with NO stress. Let's assume they can do this consistently on a paper range target. Now let's change the environment and situation as follows: Two armed threats kick in your door and you have your trusty .380 on your hip. Your adrenaline pumps and your vision narrows and you must consciously make effort to control it's impact on your marksmanship and assessment of the situation. Now add that both targets are moving. Well placed shots will only result from shear luck. By well placed I assume the definition are shots that will cease the central nervous system from functioning such as a shot that will REACH the spine if it is well centered horizontally or a shot to the head. Have you every tried to hit a moving head with a handgun? Even if you hit the head, it needs to be in the critical T area that will ensure lights out instantly. Any other shot with a .380 to the spine will most likely not reach the spine that is buried by organs. A .380 is a poor choice, but if that is what one is limited to, then high capacity mags are your friend and one must shoot till the threat ceases or is incapacitated so that you can THEN and ONLY THEN, take a well placed shot.
Thank you. The information was a lot to digest and put into a video format. You did a great job at it. The take away here is know your sidearm and know your own capabilities as practice makes the difference as well as knowing when to just get out of harms way first.
I mean, none of this information is really wrong, but most people pick the 22 as a survival weapon because it has better precision than a handgun, and is better suited for dropping smaller animals like rabbits than it is people. Hence, "survival" not "combat". The 22 rounds are also a shitload cheaper, and take up much less space.
yes
Yes the idea of the 10/22 as a survival rifle is entirely about hunting, hunting quietly, and hunting long-term because the ammo doesn't take up a lot of space so you can store plenty. If you're worried about zombies, use something else.
the ruger mark 2 is so accurate and easy to shoot it's almost like a rifle
I have no problem using a browning buckmark for self defense if I have to, especially if it has a long barrel
9mm rifle/carbine - how about that for a great balance? Got some foot pounds too!
"1700+ shooting incidents.."so he spent one week in Chicago? lol
1700 shooting incidents = 20 minutes, in Democrat occupied Chicago.
seems legit..
Lol rough week ,great place to book a bugout tour here is the itinerary #1 start in the south side/*should you get turned around end up in Gary Indiana next of Kinn will be notified.
#2 lunch included location the Loop any and all garbage/French for dumpsters from the finest restaurants. We encourage snacking on route. Remember its isn't a race even though Patches O'Brien made in 3 hours our trips are at your pace and always remember to have fun * the persons are not paid actors
#3 north side you've made it ,well most!!!!?
what is funny about the wild violence in chicago, largely affecting minorities whom the anti-American lefitsts have abused for decades?
If your neighbor removed the alarms and locks from his house, because having those things made his neighbors feel like criminals, wouldn't you laugh when his house is burglarized?
Philadelphia outlawed bullet proof glass storefronts, because it made the citizens feel like criminals. That's like if Florida outlawed flood preparedness, because the people who prepared for the events that regularly occur caused people who were unprepared to be afraid of possible hurricanes/floods.
Another factor that i often consider is the price of practice rounds. A person who shoots a caliber that has cheaper practice rounds is likely to be able to afford more practice and thus have a higher accuracy
This is true only to a certain point, there are multiple variables to this. For example, military training, also talent is involved in shooting. I have met people who were pretty decent shots with a rifle after maybe 10 shots, and others who despite military training and thousands of practice rounds were bad. I know it's anecdotal, I'm just adding some caveats to what you said.
Uhh, in a certain sense. Life is exactly like grinding in an rpg. You could almost say that some rpg games get inspiration from real life
Funny aint it?
@@TheVerinen2 Ofcourse it is! You have 15-20 levels of tutorial, then 40-50 levels of grinding and 10-15 levels of game content in the end.
It doesn't take long to acclimate to a new gun/caliber. If you understand what is in your hands, it's good in a survival scenario. You don't need 40 hours behind a .223 to understand how to shoot it. A couple hundred rounds is fine... A couple thousand if you are talking about magazine changes.
This is all true but having regular practice sessions is important If you want to be responsible. Nothing anyone will say will ever convince me that practicing more won't make you better Especially in a high stress situation. Even if you only practiced once every 2 months with a few 100 rounds The price difference between a 9 mm and a 45 adds up. That combined with data from a code that I wrote For Compressible aerodynamics About the rate of energy dispersion through a ballistics medium, Has led me to choose the 9 mm as My preferred handgun round.
Some thing not discussed for bug-out options was the availability of certain types of rounds/cartridges. 9mm, 223/5.56, 38 special/357, 7.62x39 and 12ga are most likely going to widely available. At least for a while..
If we learned anything from covid, it's that no caliber will be available anywhere in a real time of crisis. If SHTF, what you got stocked up is all you're gonna have.
I think most folks who recommend a .22 as a "bug out gun" are thinking in terms of the abundance of small game vs large game when considering the availability of food in a realistic survival situation as opposed to the cinematic "Mad Max" version of survival that has taken hold of the imagination since the beginning of the nuclear age.
Potato farm, here we come
.22 also meets most of the characteristics of money......durability, portability, divisibility, uniformity, limited supply, and acceptability
I don't understand your analogy. EDIT: I don't know what I wasn't grasping when I replied. I actually do get it and you're right. Good analogy.
I think there are probably more squirrels than big game and they also tend to breed faster and have large litters. I'm also not sure that any fool can kill a squirrel. I'm probably wrong about all this though; a biologist would have to chime in to know for sure.
Also ammo weight/capacity/fire rate. Due to the low weight, carrying higher capacity drums/mags is much more practical. Allowing for more shots, and due to a lower recoil allows faster, more accurate shooting.
The narrator is evaluating 22lr as a bug out weapon considering only combat. A good bug out weapon should be able to feed you also. 22lr is good for this. It's also more quiet, especially suppressed. Lastly, 500 rounds of 22lr is easier to carry than 500 rounds of 223 or 12 gauge. That's important if you are bugging out and not prepped to stay where you are.
A .177 pellet gun can feed me. I can carry 500 plus rounds in my pocket.
I still say 22 rifle is better, it has longer (more accurate)range than pistols, you can push out 3 rounds accurately at distance to put you back on top of pistols .close range I agree on larger pistol caliber. Also a 22 mag hp was never mentioned, I have blown a jack rabbit's head clean off,so I'm sure it would blown a targets arm off...also I've read and heard 22 mag can pierce body armor,that is why there are so few pistols made in that caliber...anyway just my opinion
A few fish hook and line can feed you too, but not as fun to talk about!
David now you are carrying 2 sets of magazines and 2 types of ammo. Not what I call saving weight.
The .22 has killed many people just ask Bobby Kennedy.
This is a good video with valuable info. As a nurse at a Level 1 trauma hospital. Ive seen many people survive mutiple shots from every caliber and walk away.
lol yep. Bet you have seen people die from a 22 LR. Weeks later to because they couldn't find all the holes from splatter when it hit bone.
Randall Berry A young girl shot herself in stomach and she was cut open from chest to belly. She survived! That one 22 did alot of damage
Was this due to the hydrostatic shockwave going through the body? Does such a thing exist?
trplpwr The 22 bullet bouncing around
I see, thanks
I'm 70 and 60 years ago, my Grandfather told me, "Boy (he called me boy), I'd rather be chased by an amateur with a Tommy gun than an expert with a .22". Since my Paw Paw was the smartest, wisest man that I've ever heard of, I believe him. He trained me to hit what I aim at and I do OK. I have a 9mm and .357 Smith, but I carry a Ruger SR22 for protection. Personally, I think my chances are pretty good, as I train @ 15 meters, double taps, with either hand. Shoot what you can and be pretty good at it.
Good on ya old-timer. lol
I love my SR 22 carry it a lot.
22 if you can aim is the best
I would not tote a .22mag or .22LR pistol. You need to be at a CQB range to really have any impact, add that you need to fire 3-4 times. 💥 A thug or crook on drugs may not drop either. I say the 9mm +P is ✔. As is the 165gr JHP 🚔 .40 or a 10mm. Min for a CCW or 2nd gun is a .380acp or .38spl +P. No 🐁 guns!
@@DavidLLambertmobile Of course, depends on whether you can hit anything. At 15 yards, if you cannot put 2, in one second, into a 3 inch circle, you'd better stay home. And yes, a .22lr in the head or heart will drop anyone, anywhere, and they are somewhat larger than 3 inches. BTW, until 1984 the most common murder weapon was a .22lr. Today it is third or fourth, depending on survey.
What I've learned from this is that
1) Shot placement is everything
2) Therefore training shot placement is everything
3) You should choose a caliber that is cheap enough to train lots with so your shot placement is on point
4) You should choose a caliber that makes shot placement as easy as possible
5) You should choose a caliber that offers high mag capacity in case you need more shots for effective shot placement
6) .45 only dropped people on the first shot 5% more often than 9mm
7) You should choose 9mm.
And my argument against the .45 vs. the 9mm is. Find me a .45 handgun that holds 17-20 rounds in the magazine? 9mm ammo is cheaper so you can practice more...less recoil means better follow up shots if needed...the advantages of the 9mm over the .45 are almost endless. All for an almost insignificant difference in stopping power.
Yeah, you pretty much hit the nail on the head
Well said my friend
Carry a 9mm and 357.
I have a 9mm
I use this voice in my head before I do something silly.
Then I rethink my decisions.
I read that in the voice
Check out an old Catapillar Equipment safety video called "Shake Hands With Danger"
Haha: awesome comment dude!
Y’all really saying all the things we all think about. Stop giving out our code.
Like the video overall! However, your myth busting on 22lr for bugout is based on the wrong logic. I never heard anyone claim the 22lr for buyout is purely for self defense. It is more about being to CARRY MORE AMMO AND HUNT WITH IT while it could also serve as some form of protection. It is not solely about self defense as a bugout gun. In addition, a 22lr is quieter than larger caliber rifles, not revealing your position or running off game for the table.
Also, your 410 vs 12 gauge comparison doesn’t take into account barrel length. A 410 pistol with a 2 in barrel will not be 1/2 as effective as a 12 ga shotgun with an 18in barrel.
Sean You Know Who thats exactly what i was thinking. If shit were to hit the fan and i needed to get out quick. The 22 will be going with me and maybe my fn57 for close quarters.
agreed 100% ...... the video has a number of conceptual flaws to rationalize the end conclusion
you mean 410 pistol vs 410 long gun? a 410 is compareable to a 9mm. its not even close to a 12 gauge in any way
@@Donkeythrash yup....410 shotgun is not a gauge..... .410 is quite literally a caliber .... 41 cal
a really good video though..... very good
The Ellifritz study is the best information available on this subject.
This was oddly relaxing. Nice work.
The best gun to use is the one you can put steel on target with.
The biggest hand cannon in the world is useless if you can't hit your target.
I.e. Pulp fiction
Nah, if a 6 year old points a 10 gauge at me, im putting my hands up, even if I think there is no chance that his first shot will knock him right on his arse.
I agree!! A 357 or 44 mag has such a loud noise and recoil it's no fun shooting them. I ended up with a 38 police special, fun to shoot and less abusive. Still has good stopping power!!! Of course it depends on where you hit them and the range you want to cover. My 357 was good at hitting targets at medium ranges where the 38 is more of an up close gun. Semi auto's are fun to shoot but the tendency in hunting situation to just spray bullets at a target is very common. One shot one kill is the right mindset for hunting but in self defense I suppose firepower and stopping power are prime factors. That being said it still boils down to what you feel comfortable with, your more apt to shoot well with a gun you like!!!
Only a fool wouldn't. Who knows what he has loaded or how much that 6 year old has practiced with it.
EXCLUDING 12/10 gauge Buck shot;-) Home defense you are going to hit the guy regardless.
I read the EXACT report a few years back in a gun magazine. At the time I carried 10mm. Shortly thereafter I switched to 380 because additional reports I read found the #1 CONTRIBUTING FACTOR was tactful draw (Tactful being least telegraphed and hardest to detect) and the #2 CONTRIBUTING FACTOR was easy of carry. A Ruger LCP carries in the pocket very easily behind a wallet. An armed attacker is 95% likely to approach you with a gun in one hand and the other hand empty while he observes his surroundings and holds his hand out to collect your affects within one pace of you. This is why a tactful draw is so imperative. While reaching for your wallet you draw with one hand, take half a step toward his body while canting your body away from his weapon and blading yourself to the attacker, grasp the slide of his weapon with your non-firing hand and drop two shots into center-mass. I'm most cases you win and he takes the room-temperature challenge.
Of course, the easiest way to stop an attack is to prevent one with purpose and deterrence. The ADT Sign on your lawn, NRA sticker on your car, and Ruger hat during the day indicates you're armed and it's best to move on. This is deterrence. Next, don't go through dark alleys, rundown parking structures, and bad parts of town. This is purpose. There's always the one dipshit who tries it, however. That's why you have a gun. I carry a gun when I'm not expecting trouble. I carry an AR15 when I am.
Wesley Mills add the U.S. flag to your front porch or driveway pole and you've got the full set of 'indicators'. ;-)
Let's face facts. That argument with be fought till the end of time.
The only hard truth is this, Any gun regardless of caliber is far better than NO GUN !!!
Troof
Fax no 📠
Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.
Great video.... I've long thought this way, that as long as it's not a mouse caliber, any handgun will be sufficient with good shot placement.
What this video doesn't cover is that the bug out for .22lr case involves hunting small game... A necessary food source.
With an AR-15 you can use both 5.56X45 and 22LR with only changing the bolt. If you have a suppressor you can also use it with both.
Yes, and it also doesn't address the weight of the ammunition. Nor cost! .22 lr is a bad choice for your every day carry though.
Jason Henley agreed sir
22lr if you read the report had the best one stop to the head. better then every other handgun caliber. what really matters is if you can hit while under stress especially if you have the shreiking going on. a lot of people on their first time in such a situation without ear pro find a 357 magnum incredibly painful to fire.
@BulletSpoung - Forgive me for my ignorance but how is a .22LR cartridge going to chamber and fire in a barrel with a 5.56x45 chamber? Even with the correct .22LR bolt, if it could hold the cartridge on the bolt face using the extractor and get it to fire, isn't the .22 case completely unsupported and the bullet having to jump some empty space before it gets to the rifled part of the barrel if it's a 5.56 barrel and chamber?
This sounds impossible to me. Surely you'd have to change the bolt AND barrel for one with the correct chamber? Even if you could get it to work, your 5.56 magazine is not going to work holding .22LR either. Even if you use it as a single shot, all the other problems I just mentioned will stop it working anyway.
A gun in hand, beats 2 cops on the phone
Matt H true, the cops can't get to your place in 30 seconds, but an intruder can kill you and be gone in less than 30 seconds.
They are not pussy, police cars are not spaceships equiped with warp drives, they can't reach the victim instantaneously when victim called 911--to be honest, every cop want their car got a warp drive under the hood.
Unless the gun is in the hand of a kid because some fuckwit failed to secure it properly and kept it under his/her pillow etc, or in the hands of someone bent on self harm and suicide (or drunk, angry, upset etc). Or the gun is in the hand of a criminal because they stole it, or think they need it for self-defence against householders they intend to rob. Responsible gun ownership is great (though there are still problems) but irresponsible gun ownership is a fucking nightmare. Now look about you, look at your street or the folks at work. How many of them are the kind of annoying, dumb, over-excitable dimwit you wouldn't trust with a pair of scissors. Now imagine them in a stressful situation with a gun in hand.... Its not hard to see the problem. Think about how many shitty drivers there are and then wonder at how everyone thinks they are great at driving. It's the same with everything, including guns. Everyone will say, "I'm responsible", but that is simply not the case. Is there an answer? Not one that springs to mind. But the love for firearms, the unhealthy obsession demonstrated so often is very troubling. I see videos of idiots carrying semi-automatic rifles about the streets, while wearing body armour and looking for a confrontation with cops so they can bleater about "their rights". Well what about their responsibilities? Like the responsibility not to fucking terrify everyone who sees them and thinks they are crazy-ass lunatics with guns. I have kids. If I saw some nutter wandering past my house like that I would be pulling the kids inside and hoping the dumb fuck didn't do something stupid, like accidentally put a round right through something I might want to keep, like my wife's head for instance (or my fridge, I keep my beer in there).
The problem isn't guns, its idiots (with guns).
Gortmundy
You have a point. Gun ownership is a serious responsibility, not to be taken lightly.
gortmundy01 I definitely see what you mean about over excited people.
A couple things I would like to point out that is likely throwing off some data:
1. On the .32 cal, it is a tricky round. Most people carry the wrong ammo. See most hollow points in .32 actually never open, which causes poor performance. Also many rounds are underpowered in .32 so some people just carry FMJ instead to get the proper penetration depth, but again this makes for poor performance. There are only two rounds known to hit the penetration depths set by the FBI to be considered optimal for defense. That is Hornandy XTP, and Underwood xtreme cavitators. If everyone carried one or the other of those rounds in .32 cal, I think you would see results on par with .380. Also as far as "failures" go, Keltec P32 probably makes up 75% or more of all .32 cal pistols. Again most people don't know you need to take 2,000 grit sand paper with a dowl rod and buff the feed ramp. This dramatically improves the reliability. 32 cal is not a caliber you can just simply pick up, throw any ammo in, and bet your life on it. It requires the knowledge neccessary for proper ammo selection to make the gun perform at its peak.
2. You speculate on the .410 handgun ammo by saying "if its half of the performance of a 12 gauge shotgun"... ok... seriously?! Even a 18" barrel .410 shotgun will likely have only HALF the knockdown of a 12 gauge with a 18" barrel. Now factor in that you have reduced the barrel from 18 inches to 3 or 4 inches, and you have dramatically decreased your velocity, as well as caused your spread of BBs to be so large so quickly that it becomes somewhat ineffective past about 20 feet. Go watch some videos on the Taurus Judge at 20 feet. It's spread is wide enough to hit two people across their entire body. This means half your BBs would miss one person. Also there are videos of people showing that a significant amount of powder never gets burned off when you fire .410 buckshot shells from the pistol, again this is lost power. Personally I think the .410 pistols are good for very close ranges (15 feet max). Me personally I would not want a firearm that restricts me to that range. My hallway and livingroom are both over 25 feet across. Give me a 9mm pistol or a 12 gauge shotgun before a .410 pistol.
As far as which caliber is best to carry... well when I use to sell guns, I always told buyers the best caliber is the one that you have on you when someone tries to hurt you or your family. I have seen many women get talked into purchasing larger, heavy 9mm or .40 cal handguns, only to get tired of lugging it around in their purse so eventually they leave it at home or in the car. The largest hand cannon in the world does no good at home or in the car. I recommend to most people getting a small gun such as a Ruger LCP 2 (.380), or a Glock 43, or even a Keltec P32 (.32 cal) for recoil sensitive people. If the Keltec P32 is chosen though, a feed ramp buff is absolutely neccessary as well as carrying Hornand XTP or Underwood Xtreme Cavitors as they are the only two rounds that cause a larger wound channel as well as reaching over 12 inches of penetration in ballistic gel tests.
@Steven Pace I read that whole thing, and you could have stated the main idea with just one sentence and deleted the rest: ".32 Cal is not a caliber you can simply pick up, throw any ammo in and bet your life on".
When I was studying martial arts as a teenager I noticed that my instructor, who occasionally worked as a VIP bodyguard, was carrying a pistol under his jacket. Me being a smartass 16 year old asked him why he needed it if he was such a badass. He said "I have trained and competed at a very high level for over two decades. Hand to hand I could probably beat 99% of the people I ever encounter. But I would lose 100% of the time against a gun." Zen moment of pure enlightenment achieved...thank you Sensei!
Very well said, thank you.
Smart man
It is said that even Bruce Lee himself carried a 38 Special.
Was your sensei the late Charlie P. Contrares who passed away in August 2007 from Phoenix Arizona ?
He concealed carried a .380.
I took a class with a "high speed" K security instructor who, by practice toted his pistol, loaded mag empty barrel 🤔. What some armed officers call Condition lll. He stated the reason was to not have any loaded guns near the "principle"(client). I myself disagree with this logic but the EP, security world is full of hammer head nitwits & head cases. 🙄
Iv shot all these pistol
calibers .25 acp to .500 SW
I don't wanna be down range of any of them.
That's not really the point though. Nobody wants that, but rather the question is, how many shots will it take to incapacitate the person. That's effectiveness
@@JohnDavis-im1oy Most pellet guns can't kill you. .25 acp and 22lr are small but can easily kill you. It's a big difference
@@JohnDavis-im1oy So comparing any firearm to pellet guns in that way is a false equivalency.
@@JohnDavis-im1oy You're arguing that just because you don't want to be shot by a pellet gun means that because you also don't want to be shot by a gun means nothing.
@@JohnDavis-im1oy Man I really don't want to be blown to shreds by an 80mm mortar round but i also don't want to be hit in the face by a rubber ball so I guess both of these situations hold the same gravity.
Can we all agree that 50 BMG is the best concealed carry round?
That part
Cal 12 makes bigger holes.
Any suggestions for a 50 BMG holster for concealed carry ???
LOL...a .50 BMG doesn't fit in my pocket...so how can a handgun that is considered, "Conceal-carry".
It's true! The hard part is mastering the wrist-snap when you whip it at an assailant's head, however the *thunk* of impact and subsequent confusion at the roll of quarters sized projectile rolling on the ground are likely to incapacitate. No bulky firearm needed!
That's a whole lot of research to say "train more"
A Mejia amen!
It sounds more like all you have to do is hit the attacker a few times to have a good chance of getting away in a self defense situation. Not a lot of training is needed to do that, especially up close.
Fudmottin, unless they're shooting back. If your first shot doesn't kill/incapacitate, there is a very good chance threat/enemy will return fire.
So, first shot kill/incapacitate is extraordinarily important and the best way to assure this is by shot placement....meaning practice/training with firearm is crucial.
Another point in a pepper situation to consider is conservation of all crucial supplies for greatest chance of survival.
I've never been on the two way range. So I honestly can't say how well I would do in that situation. I can connect with paper targets and pop ups OK. But they aren't shooting back.
As far as preparedness goes, my biggest threat (IMO) is a major storm. Long power outages and closed roads suck. Sandy hit my area. That was an experience I don't want to repeat.
Fudmottin, I agree with you. I think the biggest threat will be weather related. A loss of power for extended period, cutoff from outside world, and no law enforcement is the most likely "prepper" scenario encounter I personally might find myself in the middle of. Second is probably civil unrest and a need for personal/family protection for an extended "lawless" period.
I think training is important, but I also don't think any of us truly know how we will react/do in a situation when we're faced by a sudden, instantaneous threat.
That's where we hope training and muscle memory clicks in and takes over for us. If we need time to think, it might be too late and we may end up another fatal statistic.
If we are facing an "end times" scenario I've already accepted that I'm a goner anyway😉. I'll hold off the zombies as long as possible so friends, neighbors, and those I care about can get far away, but I'll be meeting my maker soon afterward.
Not being an Expert by any means, but i recall reading about Stopping Power many years ago and remember one thing about it and that is Bullet Speed when hitting the Target was much more a factor than Caliber size.
That correlates to this Videos finding of Long Guns vs Pistols.
Than there’s still the configuration of the Bullet itself .
Overall a very informative video!
Flawed conclusions... the reason people recommend the .22lr for bug out isn't that it is the best choice for self defense against human attacks, but rather the combination of low ammo cost, ammo weight, ammo availability, and the capability of the round to drop small game. Small game out-masses large game by significant margins, and (properly placed) the round can even stop medium sized game with consistency.
As for the .410 being more powerful than standard defense rounds, I see another possibility flawed estimation. The benefit of the shotgun isn't merely the number of pellets, but the length of barrel for the gas pressures to build up speed. A short barrel pistol, especially a revolver, cannot generate those numbers since the pellets exit often before all the powder is burned and pressure is released at the gap in the front of the cylinder. (Also, 000 is smaller than 00 buckshot, but that is a trivial problem comparatively)
I agree on the 22L 100%, As for the 410 I have the same reason as with the 22L. Having rounds that can be used in either a hand gun or riffle/shotgun is a good combo. The 410 fits that the same as a 22L. Now if there was an AR that could swap out between 22L and 410. Oh yeah there is, LOL. But $$$ rules in most cases and the 22L wins on that.
I myself like to be silent and my arrows and bolts are, and can be reused. I don't want to make noise or traces for the 1st 4 weeks while the fools kill each other and starve out. Gun shots most likely will bring in a firefight. Smoke makes your location seen. My low cost pistols are modified Cobra 80lb crossbow pistols. They can shoot the same bolts as my 175lb crossbow or those tiny but fast ones they come with. A pump bb/pellet gun is cheap, quiet and good for bushy tailed tree rats that can be cooked with a solar cooker. No smoke, no noise. I also have 3/8 oak dowels that I treat with Minwax wood hardener. It waterproofs and hardens the oak. Making bolts and arrows while waiting for things to clear solves any boredom and it's quiet so you can listen to the perimeter. My PVC bows are designed to eliminate the archers paradox, so stiff oak arrows work great and hit hard. My design is private, but there lots of vids on PVC bows even compact bug out designs.
My only problem is my BP meds will run out and I'll croak anyway, LOL
Adam Drinkwater yep 👍
@@Alwis-Haph-Rytte if your talking blood pressure meds you might try pickle juice... My dad drank it for years and it helped him. You could try it at home on top of your meds if you have the means to check it at home or spend a few hours at a store that has one of those booths for you to check it. Obviously don't try to use it as a substitute until you've proven to yourself that it a good remedy. Good luck man.
John, Thanks, but my BP is really bad. I'm taking 3 prescribed meds, it was 4, had to stop it because was harming my kidneys. I do take over the counter meds and herbs trying to fix the 30 years of ibuprofen I've had to take daily from injuries at Fort Benning. But I don't get any help or treatment from the VA. So basically I'll hold the front line till meds run out, LOL
I've got some survival ideas for barter. If people know how to make wine/mead, they can also make an alcohol wash that can be flavored with flavor-aid or kool-aid. Add lots of barter sugar to bunker. Tobacco grows easy and is also used as an insecticide in gardens. Bleach or pool chlorine is good, but don't forget Lysol spray to kill some body funk. It was originally made as a cooter spray for women. These things get overlooked because it's long term survival. Lots of salt is also needed for food preservation.
If I was younger and healthier, I'd raise honey bees at the bug out shelter. Great cover for what is hidden and excuse for regular visits. Have them caged well in iron to keep out bears and people. Have game cams hidden in fake hives to know who comes around. Fake hives can also be arrow and bow hoards. a 4x4 post can be hollowed out to hold them as the posts are used inside as the 4 corners to hold hive together. Storing guns this way is a bad idea and I'm sure illegal in most states. Salt and sugar can be stored this way. But must be tightly sealed.
Yeah lots of ideas, but health sucks. So I'll be stuck on the front line like a good Infantry Soldier, LOL I've kinda went off track from the video, but it helps me practice my one finger typing and spelling. Now I'll go mow the damn grass before it rains, LOL
@ good catch, I withdraw the 000 comment. In another video they recommend a long barreled .410, that could chamber .454 or .45 long. That would be a great firearm, and its only flaw is cost for the ammo types. It is great for anti-personnel, and has types of ammo that would also be good for game of almost any size. I still have a .22lr in my bag, but my carry weapon is a .45. I would like to get one of the big revolvers, but price concerns have stopped me to date.
The best handgun is the one you're the most competent with and are actually going to carry. A .22 on your hip is better than a .45 in your nightstand.
VB, you are absolutely correct!
"I'd rather hit with a .22 than miss with a .45"
"One in the hand is better than 2 in the safe"
Fact is, no one wants to get shot with either one
ever heard of a ranger with a small iron on his hip?
I agree which made the Smith and Wesson slim 45 my choice now, just less rounds- but if i need more than one round it will surprise me after thirty years of 100 effectiveness in imminent threat scenarios! The 357 magnum , and 44 magnum had my insurance company want to triple my rate coverage for a reason.......
Amen. Practice, practice, practice.
@@Transgender-ProphetMohammed
He would still be faster than Texas Red!
In the early 1900s General Pershing was in the Phillipines putting down an inserection he noted that the standard .38 would not stop a charging enemy. He called for a trial of the new browning 1911semiauto in .45acp. He found the 45 had more stopping power, for the next 75 years that was the standard issue for all military services and is still used by many units now
my thick sexy .45 appreciates the flattery 😍
I understand the bad guys in the Philippines were hopped up on drugs so it took a very powerful weapon to stop them.
Even a well worn 1911 has a good trigger. This enables better shot placement. This is much more important than the slug you're throwing.
The 45 is obsolete. I know many don’t want to hear that but it’s the plain truth.
These were often against drugged up attackers.
Great video - going to throw this out there for bugout:
pellet rife (like Lewis & Clark used) so that you can hunt small game without attracting extra attention from gunpower bullet noise. Ammo is much lighter as well.
Just an observation.
If I have to live off rabbits that I shoot, then I’m m dead anyway. I carry a pocket LCRx for self-defense. That’s my only weapons need.
Another thing to note, something with a pellet velocity you can adjust (raise, ideally to bag larger game) works great for this concept. The crossman variable pumps are a great, small and modifiable option
I found this video to be both entertaining and informative! However: In regard to a carry firearm, I don't plan on retiring my 357 anytime soon ;)
I just started getting into wheel guns. I have recently acquired a Model 19 4” and a 686 6”. The 19 is sized well for comfortable OWB carry, and the 686 really just for fun.
If that's the gun you're most comfortable carrying and have the best accuracy with, it's the gun you should be carrying, and the one you'll be most deadly with.
@@huntertoledo8989 I agree, My regular carry is a P938. I shot tighter groups out of the box than all my other 9mm pistols (some full size). It just points naturally for me and is supriseingly easy to shoot even tho it is such a small peice. Easy to carry, easy to shoot. Rarely not on my side.
100% agree. I carry a GP100 chambered in 357 magnum and I don't plan on retiring that beauty.
If you’re carrying a 357 with any kind of a short barrel you’re just getting a lot more muzzle blast with very little effect. The 357 needs a longer barrel to get up to speed.
Who tf gets up from getting shot with a 44 magnum
Enemies that are deaf and you missed the target because you flinched?
Someone loaded up on 3 xanax bars or a few hits of PCP could do it. Those types are known to hulk through gunfire and tasings.
My mother-in-law.
I tell you, that woman is evil.
@@leftcoaster67 i dont flench when shooting my sw 69. Not that i would have it as my edc. I have a glock 20 for that.
@@leftcoaster67 but thats alot of horse power. I could probs land 3 or 4 and idgaf who you are or what your on youre not getting up from that.
Don’t depend on a one shot stop. Ever! Keep shooting till the assailant goes down and does not get up. And when they go down, make sure they’re really down. Don’t take your eye of of them or turn your back on them. You take your attention off of them and a “dead” person will still be alive enough to shoot you while they’re on the ground.
KILL
Yeah except in the cases where there's more than one assailant! Now you're in trouble
Many years ago I saw an interesting quote from a special forces guy who had "been there--done that"--"No enemy is dead until his head is separated from his body more than 10 feet"
anybody worth shooting is worth shooting twice.. or more. When your life is in danger don't cheep out. Use it all.
Stabbed in the back with a Bowie knife 32 times....suicide not ruled out 😝😝😝😝
Great data, This really makes me feel better about mostly only carrying my pocket 380, even though I have a few 9mm carry pistols. For my job I often have to leave my pistol in my vehicle, this is much more practical than dealing with a hip holster.
This isn’t real data. It’s anecdotes.
@@rifleshooterchannel208it's data points that were compiled after looking at a ton of shootings to see how lethal the calibers are. what do you mean it's anecdotal? Lol
@@kalebporter1529 It’s not real data, there’s no proof of the those actual shootings happening nor is there any basis for scientific comparison even if they _did_ happen.
Therefore, _anecdotal._
@@rifleshooterchannel208lol ok bro. What should we be looking at instead?
@@schm147 Tests in properly calibrated ballistics gel and seeing if your chosen caliber and bullet combo meets FBI specifications for handgun wounding effectiveness.
What is the best handgun caliber? That is easy. The handgun that has the most plentiful ammunition available. No gun is any good if you can't get ammunition for it.
The best way to put it is the one that you can shoot straight with and has the cheapest and most plentiful ammo. Because no calibers going to work if you can't shoot straight and can't afford the rounds.
@@rubiks15 Barley and guns do not mix well.
Generally, finding ammunition would be a problem only after the SHTF. My bug out bag includes a 9mm, .357 and .45 so I good with almost anything I would be likely to come across.
@@rubiks15 pocket p90 is more accurate.
Agreed. A gun without ammo is just an expensive paperweight.
I rarely give thumbs up. You got it though. I've probably seen hundreds of this sort of video, and I can't emphasize this enough, but this is, hands down, the finest video comparing firearm defensive options on the Web.
What is by far the most important is where you hit, and how quickly and accurately you can follow up.
Something many people fail to consider - there is no caliber magic. Whether .22 or 30-06, a hit to the desending aorta is the end, and quickly, too in the majority of cases.
.22 will always rank highly for bugout because its not all about defense. It is a multi purpose tool with very light ammo, it is possible to carry on your person enough to feed yourself and another for months. Different tools for different purposes.
An interesting analysis video. Massad Ayoob I believe did a similar study a while back (after the famous Miami FBI shootout that lead to the FBI adopting the 10mm round) that indicated the Federal 125B .357 Magnum load to be the most effective.
That being said, this was an excellently researched study, and kudos to you for putting it together in a concise and understandable video.
The best caliber? The one you’re willing to carry. I carry a Ruger LCP .380. It fits in my pocket. A .45 ? I won’t carry a brick all day.
I agree. Comfort is mandatory for me too Bruh
the 22. is about hunting in a bugout not killing people
22lr Stinger high velocity will fore sure kill a person a 100 meters
The Italian Mafia disagrees with you.
I'm not saying u won't need to kill someone. the fact that people choose the 22lr is for hunting in bug out as well as the weight size and availability of ammo
@@petter5721 the 22lr stinger is maybe the best 22lr made but still far behind 17 hmr which is also far from being a human killer :) 80 feet-pounds at 109 yards (100 meters)
maxxmann24 more people are killed by .22s every year than all other rounds combined.
instead of focusing on small details and obsessing about caliber and numbers, go to the range this weekend. pick whatever gun you feel like and go shoot it twice a month.
nothing is effective if you buy it, put 100 rounds in it. and leave it on your nightstand.
EXACTLY this is what I tell everyone new to guns. I say "go to the range, shoot all the guns, pick the one that put the most bullets on target". Everyone is different but at this point, for home defense, glock/sig/hk/springfield/etc.... are all going to be reliable enough
The range really isn't good enough though. The biggest thing that separates a veteran with combat experience from a civillain is the ability to think while under extreme stress. We've heard on TV before about how police shot 37 times and completely missed the attacker they were trying to take out. When you get extremely stressed, you get pumped full of adrenaline, your hands shake, you get tunnel vision, and your reaction time goes to crap. Shooting at the range is better than nothing, but there's only so much that can teach you. The other thing this study left out, is you can't become a stat if you miss your target. Pistol caliber carbines are so much more effective than pistols because its so much easier to be accurate with them, even when you have the adrenaline shakes, since you have a stock. As such, I would argue that a good bugout solution would be a "perfect pair" pistol caliber. By that, I mean a concealable carbine and backup pistol that share magazines/ammo. An example of this would be a Glock 17 and a Keltec Sub 2000. You could fit both in a backpack, they are very light, and you can carry several preloaded magazines that will fit in either tool. Regarding body armor, shots to the groin or head can alleviate that concern, and a Sub 2000 9MM can be fired rapidly enough (especially with 30 round magazines), that your chance of hitting either and stopping the fight are very quick. There's a lot of big blood vessels there in the groin, and it will drop somebody if they've been shot in the dick, hips, or thighs with a +P hollowpoint 9mm I promise you.
joh joh exactly right
Oh man, I’ve been doing it wrong, I put several thousands rounds through mine 😉
DumbDuck44 I had a mountain lion attack my dog. You’re so right. My motor skills took a crap on me. The fight or flight response in the body is a son of a bitch. However, all may range training helped me pick up that front sight. Long story short my dog treed it and I had her at gun point. I live in CA so I didn’t shoot (mountain lions are protected). Also, I had to calculate my backdrop under stress, the cat was between me and my nearest neighbor (150 yards). I don’t think I could ever get used to that feeling, but I can see why it’s addicting. My arms felt like they were tingling for a week.
There are a lot of people who view the Taurus Judge and S&W Governor as gimmick guns, I did as well but bought one for the fun of it. While I dismiss it as a carry gun because of it's size, in my opinion it is not a gimmick. Shooting Nobel Sport 3 ball .40 buck it will shoot about an 8 inch 5 shot group at 7yds. That's 15 .40 cal holes in an eight inch area in five shots. I'm no expert, and am not claiming this is what you should shoot, but shooting it and finding ammo that it liked, proved to me it has it's place.
They're probably much more effective now that ammo is specifically made for them. When they first came out only the regular long gun ammo was available.
I love the comment, that he felt like the 9MM would have been more effective if it had used hollow points. Hell, you could say that about any of the calibers, but the 38 Special would probably have benefited the most since so many shootings using the 38 used the old round nose, 158 grain bullets that so many owners of these guns bought back when they bought the gun, and still have half a box or more left.
I was always taught that you get the right size pistol for your hand regardless of whether it's .45, 9mm or any non .22 caliber. The reason being that comfort (and training, ie: range practice) leads to confidence which leads to accuracy in hostile situations. Accuracy above caliber is going to stop an aggressive confrontation (ie: Shots to legs, joints, head, etc).
Eddie Martinez
Horseshit. Get a 9mm Glock.
Eddie Martinez
Try this vid:
ua-cam.com/video/DsJSrxQ_MFw/v-deo.html
Yea I agree Eddie. I love the 92fs it fits me like a glove and my friend loves the p226 but I find it uncomfortable. We are similar sized guys as well. Need to find a more modern and slightly smaller gun that fits my hand as well.
If you can shoot a guy in the kneecap as he's bum-rushing you with a knife and you don't get cut, congrats. We can't all be speedy, snipers or crack-shots like that in any case. In my basement I could hit a 1" target from 15' consistently with a .25 cal. pistol, but in under stress with a moving target, good luck even clipping a man's arm while aiming for the sternum with a scoped air rifle from the same distance. Trust me, I know from experience. That's why I keep a shotgun and every other weapon I've had, the 1st round or load in the magazine or chamber was always filled with birdshot and/or 98% capsaicin nonivamide powder to get hits on target fast, easy, slow the sucker down a bit and buy time for a more accurate follow-up shot with a bigger projectile if needed. If you're defending you're at a disadvantage, anyway. The situation you describe would apply best to the average shooter in target practice, standoffs, from a distance and cover, or if that average shooter is also the assailant or a bystander just outside the assailant's field of vision in a very convenient moment. I won't say it's impossible, but I wouldn't count on it. Your advice about choosing the weapon that best fits your hand seems good, I just don't agree with your reasoning behind it if that advice was meant for the new or average shooter. Accuracy would be improved, but more likely to the extent you could pop an assailant's lung or 2 withing the 1st couple seconds and few shots in a sudden, violent incident. Most people aren't going to be taking brain stem shots through the eye sockets, shooting each testicle out of the sack for each step a thug continues to advance or lung-heart-spinal cord combo shots. Nor would it be like the zombie apocalypse movies where 2/3 bullets make it through the brain stem, like the '30s, when you could simply draw down in Hollywood and pretend to shoot an actor's kneecap, big toe or gun out of the hand straight from the hip and all lightening fast.
yeah... I've also heard shooting instructors say that "comfort" while shooting is extremely overrated.
Rarely does anyone buy a .22 for self-defense.
They get one for small game hunting and plinking/target shooting.
But for weaker individuals who simply cannot handle the recoil or weight of a bigger caliber, or for locations that prohibit certain types of guns, having a basic .22 to defend your home is better than not having anything at all.
Cletus Kasady, as the saying goes, a well placed .22 is infinitely better than a clean miss with a .44 mag.
If you can't handle the recoil of a .22lr you must be a 104 year old dying woman. Hell, I'm not even convinced they have recoil. Even for a sensitive shooter, a .380 (not a tiny little subcompact though - those can kick a little) should be great. Even .32acp is a better option than .22lr.
.22 revolver would help negate misfires as well
Well I know the 22lr is not rated high for self defense but if someone is shooting me with a 22lr say with a high capacity clip that sure as hell is going to stop me. Nobody wants to get shot with anything especially about 20 or 30 rounds of 22lr. I have a 22wmr pistol that holds 30 rounds and I damn sure wouldn't want to be hit with it multiple times!
Cletus Kasady yup, and no recoil lets you rapid fire 5 or 10 rds on target quickly, definitely not worthless for defense
"...that's right officer, I conceal carry a 454 Casual....."
The Redhawk Alaskan is an option in that department. And there's also the Taurus Raging Judge (2-513039) that can fire .454, .45Long Colt, and .410 gauge.
I carry a S&W Governor. I CAN conceal it at times. most of the time I don't bother to even try to conceal it, and wear it on my theigh in VERY plain sight.
SmokeDogNY420 hahaha
*Casull
Markius Fox... The Taurus Raging Judge makes for an amazing center counsel gun. With a .410 gauge round loaded, you only have to point in the general direction of the assailant chest, pull the trigger and put a 4-6 inch spread on them at 10-15 ft. SO if they are at your window and demand you turn over your vehicle to them... at that range, they would have no chance and you don't even have to aim properly.
Hands down best video I've seen In a long time, great job 👍
Its just my thought , but the best gun to have is the one you have when you need it .
Well, the one you have is the one you buy, so you still have to sift through the information and make a decision. Unless you want to walk into a gun shop and close your eyes and "eenie meenie miney moe" to select your firearm.
Some people will say you must carry a full size 45acp, or full size 9mm. Anything smaller is terrible for self defense. However, on hot summer days, they leave their powerful guns at home, because they are wearing shorts, and a t-shirt. I carry my tiny snub nose 38spl in my pocket all the time everywhere I go. Yes, Everywhere!! Simply- The little gun in my pocket protects better than than the big, powerful handgun in the safe.
@ Spencer Boaz
best by default not by merit. tho shooting the bad guy with a 22 might only piss him off so he decides to kill you instead of just rob you
@@boedude8496 Or, he might decide to seek medical attention...100 percent of the rounds that hit an eye will end sight in that eye.
@@DonMeaker
if you are fortunate enough to make that shot. if it were that easy then special forces and leos would be using 22s
The reason 22lr out if a rifle is underestimated here is that two factors are unanalyzed here. First, incapacitation is an ambiguous standard. 22lr rifle fire will make anyone keep their head down and or break off an attack. Both of those reactions are victories and highly desireable. Secondly, with almost no recoil out of a ruger 10/22, you can fan that trigger and put 10 rounds on target in very little time. Real world I spoke at length with a dad whose 10 year old son put 2 rounds in the chest of a home invader who gurgled up chunks of lung tissue as he dropped to the floor. Lethality is more complex than inferred by this study. Poachers use 22lr for a reason. Shot placement is enhanced if you train a lot, easy to do with cheap ammo, and 22lr is lethal to the head, ask any mafia hitman who double tapped head shots with 22lr revolvers over the decades. They had yhrir choice of calibers. They chose 22lr. Or ask your family doctor if two rounds of 22lr is surviveable. By the way, they are professionals. Not only are second, third, fourth, fifth, well you get the idea, quicker to make, they are more accurate. Just like the nod mr. shotgun gets for putting 9 pellets on target at once, a rapid flurry of 22 is equally devastating. And in a survival context, 22lr is cheaper, so you can get more bang for your buck. When you use it all up, given an equal budget, the 22lr far out distances pricier ammo. You will still have ammo to use while mr big caliber ran out years ago. So endurance goes to the 22lr. If someone points a gun at me, the last thing I am going to do is study the muzzle to guess caliber size. I am going to get out of the line of fire. Its not all about incapacitation as the gold standard. You get some new holes in you that God didn't give you, you are gonna die in shtf scenario. That is information we will react to. If you hear bullets striking right by you, you arent going to be saying to yourself, self, what caliber IS that? Is it that the lousy mouse gun 22lr that I scorn as relatively harmless as I sip diet coke and eat doritos typing b.s. on the internet like I am a navy seal? Or is that a bigger caliber I might need to take seriously? Hmmmmm, let me sit here and listen to a couple more shots to get a better idea. Duh. Really? Deterrence is a super valid goal. Sorry, though you might favor other calibers, and I sure as hell do too, 22lr is a super high value instrument of deterrence and lethality. You gotta think deeper than this study suggests. It isn't a very studied study. Its not complex enough or researched enough relative to real world life. Thats just my 2 cents.
Remote Viewer 1 Another plus for 22lr is for someone who is severely recoil sensitive can put 7 rounds of 22lr in a person in a home defense situation in the same time it takes a 20 year old to fire one round of 12 gauge. Yeah 22lr may suck when you talk about 1 round but you can shot one semi automatic 5 to 8 rounds per second especially if the trigger has been modified.
Hell there are folk that died one or to weeks later from 22LR or shorts and had good surgeons working on them. Its hard to find all the holes from splatter when it hits bone. Some had 3 surgery's and still died. It will kill you grave yard dead. It can drop you or a deer where you stand. DEAD!
What I gleaned from the study is that a .22 isn't as effective if you hit non vital areas, which it wouldn't be. The whole multiple hits incapacitation failure (anywhere) determined attacker only implies a bunch of shots to the limbs (or air), as does the much lower 1 shot "anywhere" .22 stop percentage . The one shot stoppage (head/torso) is high for the .22 as frankly any hole in the heart lungs, or brain is going to put anyone down , despite their determination. I also have to point out the obvious, law enforcement and gun enthusiast use the "large caliber". People who shoot more often. .22 lr covers a much less gun experienced swath of the public. More than likely, the average .22 lr either sits in an unused closet or buried under a box of kotex in toyota camry glove compartment, chambered in the same ammunition that was purchased for it originally. . The fact it did that well, to me, reinforces how unnecessary a large caliber round is, in the majority of cases. To be honest, lower lethality (if that is something the .22 indeed offers) is more of a feature than a bug, IMO. Which I honestly don't know that the word "stop" means, in this context. Does it mean the attack is stopped or the attacker? A wounded attacker can run away and never be caught, in that case the gun stopped that attack, but not that attacker.
+ 1000. You can carry thousands of 22Lr and a light rifle all day/night long.
Randall Berry President Raegan's docyor said he really sweated bullets over the presidents wounds from 22lr. Specifically, his concern wasn't find the bullet; it had broken a rib, pinctured a lung, and caused serious internal bleeding. Just a 22lr, right? What worried him was what you said. The bullet splatter inside the body. His nightmare was a flake of the bullet, a mere flake, transiting to the brain through normal circulation and causing a fatal brain hemmorage. Or a couple flake.
my 1911 got me through VN it will do the job now. You have to go with what you are comfortable and confident with. For those rare times i can't conceal it I carry a bond arms 410 000
@@JohnDavis-im1oy You weren't with him in Nam. You're the joke, not him.
@@mmabagainHey! Ya wanna hear the shortest joke I know? okay!
Baby seal walks into a bar........
No. That's it. That's the whole joke.
Never mind..............................
Unlike the others being disrespectful, thank you for your service. I'm surprised though, that if you're comfortable with the 1911 platform, you chose a derringer for a pocket pistol. What about a small 1911 like the Kimber Micro 9, Sig P938 or the Sig P238 which has almost the exact dimensions of a Bond Arms Snake Slayer? Why not an LCP II, M&P bodyguard or another small .380Auto, a snub revolver or even something like the Glock 36 if you want to stay with .45 caliber, but be pocket sized? I'm just straight up curious why you'd pick a derringer given how many options there are on the market.
I toted a worn out 1911a1 .45acp in 1990 🇰🇷. Would I pick a 1911 .45 in 2021? Maybe not. There are many + choices in 9x19mm .40, 10mm, .357magnum.
I really appreciate your deep-dive analytical approach, so I just subscribed. Thank you.
"Elifritz, (who took most of his shooting data from the military) thinks that the 9mm rounds were ball ammo and if they had been hollowpoints the numbers would have been higher for the 9mm." Guess what, that would also apply to 45acp, military uses ball 45 as well....
John Ouellet if you are in a firefight with a 9mm that’s serious shit because you should be using your rifle
EXACTLY!!!!
This is comparable to what I've heard from hospital data. Approx. 2/3 of people shot with a pistol will live and 3/4 of people shot with a rifle anywhere center mass will die before an ambulance arrives.
Many 5.56 rounds fail to stop. There are lots of war stories about it. It's the reason we use heavier calibers for deer hunting / etc. At the same time, those people shot with 5.56 don't have a very high percentage in the grand scheme of things to make it to a hospital unless they're next to a team with trauma knowledge and kit.
Still agree, probably one of the best calibers to defend life with aside from a shotgun. Seems easier for the inexperienced to use it.
I was implying after one to several hits.
Keep in mind that in the military they are limited to ball ammo. For civilian defensive purposes this isn't the case.
your point is not to kill, just change their mind!!!!
10% of people can't have their mind changed. You're welcome to take that risk with a psychotic or possibly drugged up person in your home with his/her hands around your wife. I'm not going to purposely plan to take that risk though.
So...this was an ad for .454 cassul??
Exactly.
The sad part at the end is that the pistol is one of the worst when it comes to recoil control. It's up there with the Desert Eagle and Elephant gun. xD
@@AircraftFTW I could imagine firing something with more energy than a small rifle out of your hands would be very uncomfortable indeed
...said the person that never shot one. The recoil on a Casull is not that bad at all, if you are prepared for it.
...but your imagination would be wrong. It's slightly uncomfortable for some people. I have a video of a female friend shooting my .454... she was all laughs once she understood the power. Yes, she said her hands hurt after 6 rounds, but she said it with a smile.
Great video. I have always loved the way statistics speak and re-establish the truth for literally everything.
Meh, depends on how the statistics are presented. They lend themselves to overt manipulation.
It's amazing how well my 380 edc did in the study. Magnum Research has several big rifle calibers. One that comes to mind first is the 30-30. They also have 444 Marlin, 45-70, 44-40, 45 long Colt and several other sizes. The down side is the power. To big for killing squirrel and rabbit. Why not a 357 lever action like Henry that can shoot 38 special also. Everything meets the one goal. Lots of practice and a top quality gun in one package.
A 410 shotgun might have a chance of being "half as effective" as the 12ga shotgun, but, a 410 pistol in comparison to a 12ga shotgun is just two different ballgames completely (no comparison).
M. S. L.
Exactly. That was total bullshit.
Even formulated for handguns, you will still not have nearly the same amount of pressure build (ie velocity) up behind the wad that you will with the much longer barrel space of the shotgun. A quick search shows the judge pistol at 800fps vs 1200+ out of a 410 shotgun. Energy is velocity squared so the shot gun pellets are carrying over twice the energy.
Yeah indeed. Half the number of pellets doens't mean half the effectiveness if those pallets are also going a lot slower. That would be like saying a 22lr is just as effective as a 223.
I think he's making the opposite point. Its not as good as a shotgun, but better than a centerfire pistol round. It qualities should be noted as a better pistol option, not a half as good shotgun option.
The .22LR is used in a bugout to get you food via small game, not defense.
@John Doe
bugout does not mean you will be the only human trying to stay alive. you will most definitely encounter others, some friendly some not. if you have other weapons then a 22 will nicely fill a niche. if you have only one then, as the voice stated, a 22 would be foolish.
If someone breaks in my house I have 40 grain high velocity hollow points for them! I for sure wouldn’t want to get shot by a 22. Al though I would prefer a 10mm to defend my life!
@@boedude8496 A) In a bugout situation you likely won't be able to carry an arsenal with you. Your priorities should be one or maybe two handguns that are light and reliable, that you are proficient with.
B) In a bugout situation your priority should be to avoid conflict wherever possible. Daydreams about fighting off post-apocalyptic biker gangs are just that - daydreams. Regardless of the firearm you're carrying, getting into a scuffle with groups of potentially armed people is a sure way to get yourself killed.
C) .22lr might not be ideal but it's certainly adequate for defending yourself. I've seen people empty ten round magazines from a 10/22 in two seconds while staying on target. It has its pros and cons like any other caliber, but it gets the job done.
In short, if you have no choice but to bugout and all you've got is your little .22 rifle, then you should be all good unless you plan to be getting into firefights. Someone comes at you to get your stuff, and you put five rounds into him in a second, I don't think he'll be coming at you any more.
If it will bring down a pig, it will bring down a human.
@@orionslaver432
1) most likely if i am bugging out then a million others in my area will be too. it will be virtually impossible to avoid others, especially in the first weeks.
2) why am i bugging out? most everything in your plan depends on where you live, where you are going, and why. here we have one direction to go to get away, and that is to the mountains. vast area but takes a while for multiple millions to spread out. not all will be armed but a large % is and its growing. obviously avoiding shootouts is in everyone's best interest. if its a shtf situation then most will be quick to be confrontational. if not, great.
3) biker or inner city gangs are not on my list of things to fear in the immediate future. ive never had dreams of wars with them and i don't play video games. the mountains are full of predators aside from people. wolves and bear cats and coyotes etc are very numerous and will notice the invasion and be quick defend their young and territory. the chances of needing a higher power weapon is quite high.
4) a bugout bag is not empty sitting in my closet waiting to be filled with whatever i happen to have handy at the time. it is a 'bag' that already contains the weapons and ammo and items needed to get me bare bones thru the immediate situation and near future.
if the only rifle i have is a 22 then of course it would be in the bag. since i have (imho) better options it is not. if i could bring it additionally i would, but not at the expense of something better. in ideal circumstances a 22 can take down various animals but only a fool prepares for ideal circumstances.
bring whatever you want. not my place to tell you different. i will be prepared for needing more and be happy if it is never necessary
@
haha now that's funny ☺
"attacker stops when a bullet hits anywhere on their body".
Hell yes!
The optimistic rating to the .410 revolver ignores the greatly reduced velocity of short barrel revolvers versus a real buckshot load from a real shotgun. Each pellet from the revolver will carry barely one third the energy of the same pellet from a 12 gauge. Also, the revolvers tend to scatter their pellets wildly so that even at 10 paces some pellets will entirely miss the target whereas a real shotgun would blast a 6 inch cluster of devastation. There really is no basis of comparison, a Wingmaster is a deadly weapon, a Judge is a joke.
The Taurus Raging Bull isnt a joke
Gives you the option of 45 Long Colt, 454 or 410
If you think 410 out of a Revolver is a joke, why don't you volunteer to be shot by one
A 410 with #4 buckshot at close range is no joke!
@@EricTheActor805 wonder about a choke on a Governor or a judge for the 000. .410...
@@EricTheActor805 it's really horrible. The pellets fly eveywhere and have no velocity. It operates on video game physics
Try watching the bolo round penetration videos.3" Judge shoots through 3/4 inch plywood and 2 shed walls behind it. If that's a joke you must think nothing short of a Abrams tank to be sufficient.
Want a 1 stop shot? Practice.
True.
.25 & .32 have great numbers, because I can guarantee you that the men who carry those "outdated" calibers are older, experienced shooters. Who most likely calmly placed their first shot under extreme pressure.
did you watch? .25 and .32 do not have good numbers.
"Wild" Bill Hickok fired a single bullet from 75 yards from a pistol with the same power as a 32, which got him tried for murder and acquitted for self defense. If you can put a 22 magnum through the heart, it will incapacitate 100% of the time.
Even then, never expect 1 shot will stop. Two in the chest, one in the head, another in the head to confirm. Walk them up from center of mass to the head. *It's the only way to ensure your safety.* Plus, dead criminals can't sue you or testify against you. The 2nd in the head will probably get questioned by police, so obviously that would only apply to WROL scenarios, such as no-go zones.
I'd prefer either caliber over .22 if I had more money. I notice a lot of issues trying to fire rimfire ammo, Same with Winchester center-fire ammo. Also, consider most guns that are used to fire .25 or .32 are usually old, cheaply made guns that require a bit more TLC than usual to get into good working order. I usually use some lube and +P ammo to fix my cheap gun problems. More often than not, a weapon's what you make of it. People told me Piettas were junk. I had 1 for years, lubed it up, broke it in, put it through hell, snapped a hand spring, blew a few cylinders apart, stretched the frame, fixed it up, tuned it up and kept right on shooting until the day I sold it recently and now a friend is enjoying it as I have my slam fire 12GA shotgun with 12 .32 cal. balls in a reloaded shell, couple cans of pepper spray and not much more planned except maybe a .410 Derringer or semi-auto .380 build or another antique firearm for carrying next year. I'm 32 and started shooting firearms when I was 23, when my life depended on it in a bad neighborhood. I'm not an old fart yet, though.
There is no "best". It all depends on the shooter. For my ex-wife the 357 was her choice because she was squeamish about shooting someone. She could load a 5 shot pistol with a snake load,, 2 38 specials, then 2 357s. If the snake load made an intruder leave that was all she needed. If she had to go all the way to the 357s she new the intruder intended great bodily harm and needed to be killed. For me the 380 is my choice. At 7 yards I can hit center mass with every round. My hands are too small and arthritic to handle a 9mm. Like I said, it all depends on the shooter.
I'm glad your ex did what worked for her, but I wouldn't ever bank on a second shot.
I too have small arthritic hands. For once I wish someone would do a talk on weapons for women with small hands who are seniors with arthritis.
I own a glock 19 in 9mm but i also own a Browning 1911 .380 that fits my smaller hands better. I wish gun makers would make more models that are ergonomically friendly to smaller hand individuals in calibers 9mm or larger.
Sig sauer makes a 22 compact. There is the walther in 22, the p22. Both of those should be good for someone with weaker hands. easy shooting
@@nevadafurtrapper68 Look at the Smith & Wesson M & P Shield 9mm that could be a good choice for you.
really good job talking about issues of "statistical significance" in a way that the lay person should be able to understand. Also really good ways to help us see what stats might be biased throughout the video as well. I may use the beginning of this video as an example in my Research Methods class!
Depends upon shot placement,,, a .22 to the face is going to make anybody take notice.
If you have time to line up a perfect shot. If the attacker is already close, you won't have much luck with aiming.
@Uganda Knuckles True to a certain extent, but a 22 that enters the skull doesnt exit. It hits the other side, fragments and basically becomes a miniature brain frag grenade.
Yeah if you can make a perfect shot just 1 time under pressure, for me better a .45 acp that facilitate things, and that thing of the .22 being lethal in the head is just a joke, a .45 or 9 mm have a lot more chance to pass the two sides of the head leaving a big hole through the hole brain and leaving a massive crack to the cranium (more the .45) so tell me if that is not more lethal than a .22
William Gilley survive sure but will stop someone
Bill Randall Yes if you’re are a hit man, in that case I would carry probably a .32 for conceal ability.
"Stopping power" is the ultimate fudd gauge. Anytime someone starts talking seriously about stopping power, you should probably stop listening. There's a lot more physics involved with firearms ballistics than the average pawnshop reject is going to understand and what it takes to get an attacker to stand down or be incapacitated largely depends on the situation and target. The 9mm statistically does so well at personal defense because it does so many things well and has a lot of mass-produced, high-quality ammunition and guns made in it's caliber, same with 5.56. Any firearm that you are proficient and comfortable with, that actually has the ballistic power to penetrate skin and bone deep enough, is what you should carry or keep on hand.
Yep. Shot placement is key, regardless of caliber. Read a story the other day about a 74 yr. old woman getting a 1 shot 1 kill with her .22 on a home invader. .
@@CrimsonKingOkie Not really. That's kind of my point though, you can't rely on accuracy in self-defense situations either, even if you are an expert shooter, and doubly so if you aren't. "Stopping power" isn't some magic number, nor is it the ability under ideal target situations to hit a golf ball at 100yds. You will likely not be in ideal conditions any time you're in a self-defense situation. That's why you shoot center mass and hope to hit as many vital organs as possible to incapacitate your attacker. Can a .22 do that? Sure... will a .22 do that without extremely well-placed or lucky shots within it's magazine capacity better than calibers more suited to defense? Very likely not. I don't want to rely on luck when I have someone rushing at me from a blind spot in the dark in the middle of the night when I just got out of bed. I want to fire off as many rounds as I can reasonably squeeze out and know that if I at least hit anything center mass, either the fight is taken out of the attacker or the hits are going to be lethal. Of course the .22 you have beats the hell out of the .45 you don't, so once again, make us out of what you can.
@vachief Unarmored targets being hit at closer ranges is something the .45 seems to do well. It's a big bullet that hits reasonably hard and does a lot of hydrostatic damage on penetration. That's one of the reasons it was so successful in the trenches of WWI. Add any significant range, obstruction, or body armor to the situation though and it suddenly isn't as effective as some other rounds.
vachief wrong. Marsoc carries Glock 19 now.
vachief use google asshole
A 22 is the bug out gun because you can carry 1000 rounds in your pockets
Well in that case I will just use my Daisy centerline BB gun
.22 great for small game. Which is most of what you'll encounter when in a bug out situation. Birds(big and small), rabbits, squirrels, etc. can be taken. Firing a .22 round draws less attention as well. It's also versatile. There are revolvers, semi-auto pistols, bolt action rifles, semi-auto rifles in .22 cal.
@@moncorp1 yeah you get a heanry 22lr with suppressor you can 1 shot ratcoons at least
moncorp1 Inc Not true. I have a friend that kills hogs with a .22
@@bigfella2111 and I've seen more hardcore racoons than punk humans
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