My biggest hope is that they just use this story to erase everything about the Multiverse. It's such a failed concept and removes any sense of consequence in the MCU. I really like Nando's take since it basically offers an avenue for doom to erase the other timelines.
@@carpyet9507 yeah other than both seasons of Loki and multiverse of madness. Those were probably the only decent things to come out of the multiverse saga.
@@carpyet9507 The multiverse isn't a failed concept, nor does it remove any consequences. Most of the releases in this saga have nothing to do with the multiverse.
@@johnman8398 Yeah, but the biggest releases do (Multiverse of Madness, Loki, Deadpool and Wolverine), all were centered around a multiverse. If you like it, that's perfectly fine. I just find it difficult to understand the true weight of an entire universe dying seriously when it's represented by some strings on a TVA monitor.
“Avengers! We need to fall back, he’s too dangerous!” *Doctor strange’s portal appears, and Walter White steps through* “I am the danger.” *Miles swings through the portal* “What’s up, Danger?”
The only thing I would have changed is that Watcher is looking for a universe without 3 people. Thanos, Stark and Doom. And the MCU-616 would still work. Other than that, love it.
I love the fighting Loki at the end idea, entirely because I can see the ending of Doomsday being Doom sitting on that throne and doing his classic fingers pose
Hate the idea of Loki being killed again tho. I know he has died several times in the MCU but I genuinely feel like this time his death would do a huge disservice to the arc Loki got in his series. It could also feel like a repetition of his death in Infinity War by Thanos. I would much prefer if Loki survived the fight and potentially team up with Thor and the Avengers in Secret Wars to defeat Doom. Thor needs to find out about his brother’s sacrifice and I really believe it would a Wasted opportunity for Secret Wars to Not feature an emotional reunion between Thor and Loki.
But if Doom does that, what will he do next? That "throne" is a curse, anyone that sits in it can't leave. If Doom just takes it from Loki and goes away, it will make Doom seem like the biggest idiot in the multiverse. And even if he makes up some bs in order to cancel that curse, that's just gonna ruin the whole point of it. This isn't a Deadpool movie, it has to take what happened before and make it matter, else it'll only ruin itself and everything else altogether.
@@radrno7 Loki is using the throne to let multiverse flourish. Doom will use it to create his own universe. I`m imagining him pulling and ripping all the "timeline roots", transforming them into his iconic tree-throne from secret wars.
Nando. Please go back and listen to the song Black Sabbath - Iron Man that plays during the ending credits of Iron Man 1. The song is about a dude to travels to the past to warn people about the end of the world, only to become a frustrated Iron Man that causes the end of the world.
Woah so like Tony Stark was always Doom In this universe Doom was a refuge orphan adopted by the Starks He tries to save the world multiple times and ends up almost destroying it, Civil War, IM3, Ultron, Infinity War, etc.
@@kdusel1991 not really… they’re still alternate realities In one universe Doom grew up as Tony, in another he’s just Doom It’s still Tony, we just learn that he was born in Latveria, it’s still the same guy
It actually makes sense that Doom comes in right now. He Who Remains set up a time loop where every time he dies, the loom overloads and melts down and resets the multiverse. He designed it so that Loki is forced to come back and keep him alive, but through an act of self-sacrifice, Loki found a way to essentially replace He Who Remains. The TVA still prevents multiversal war, but now they do it by hunting fledgling Kangs before they can meddle with time. So with constant multiversal Kang suppression, NOW a character like Doom can come into being. Kang and Strange both recognize that the multiverse is growing to the point of incursion. So multiversal war may just be inevitable after all... so if not Kang, then it would be someone like Doom. And if not Doom, then someone else... as they say in Avengers 1, "There are always men like you"
I LOVE how your Doom got the name Doctor Doom because he was constantly warning everyone about the incoming doom and it was Reed who gave it to him! It makes much more sense then being his ACTUAL surname. Even now he's defined by his nemesis and can't escape him.
VERY smart to incorporate The Marvels' quantum bands. I think everybody forgot that movie casually cracked interdimensional travel at the end like it was nothing
@@NandovMovieswhat do you think about Deadpool and Wolverine because I have been thinking about Cassandra Nova and I thought of Madcap should have been the villain as he is a more personal threat to Wade as his healing powers are far superior to both Deadpool and Logan as he was rumoured to be played by Jim Carry and also I heard about a rumour that the Masters of evil will be in this movie?
I can see them creating thematic parallels between Tony Stark Doom botching to save his mother due to Reed and MCU 616 Tony Stark finding out Winter Soldier killed his parents. They might use the loss of his parents as a canon event.
I think it would be interesting if Doom came from John Krasinski's Reed Richard's universe and the whole reason he rose to power would be because of how Wanda essentially doomed that universe (pun unintended)
I'm seriously worried they won't give Doom the proper time needed to explore his character. A Doom special presentation showing his origins and background with the FF would be amazing.
Thanos got barely a few cameos before he was one of cinemas greatest movie villains within only 2 movies of development. They have the ability to pull it off, but will they is the question. They need some top notch writing talent and I just don't see it
They definitely are gonna show his face it may have a scar or something but it needs to look luke rdj for everybody to feel some sort of personal connection
@@Nolabray21no it doesn’t. Why is everyone so obsessed with this dumb spiderman interaction. He can just play Doom without showing his face and if they do it’s disfigured and unrecognizable. Like…News flash, the penguin??? Y’all can’t fathom an actor playing a different role being covered, having a different voice but the penguin is displaying right in front of us of how he can perfectly do it. You guys overthinking the face part. People will already know it’s RDJ. They won’t need to show him. BOOM. Done. Now imagine he gives such a chilling, gruesome, performance where we don’t even recognize him? That’s the goal I feel. You know him as Ironman but he’s about to give a performance so distant from Iron man you won’t even believe us the same actor. They already publicly announced his casting. They won’t need to double down on showing him
Yeah because Doom’s face is supposed to be very messed up like Darth Vader from Star Wars. But since they did hire RDJ I reckon they will have be like a big scar but not purely burnt.
I mean, I couldn't too, until I saw this. However, ultimately I still think someone else should take up the role, so they can do with Doom what RDJ did with Iron Man.
You missed a major point that being that Binary has the bands and a variant of Ms. Marvel in the Marvel Zombies show has them so the whole 616 is the only world with the bands dosent work unless maybe you’re saying those universes died to incursions by the time doomsday comes around
Definitely on board with the Time Runs Out template for Avengers: Doomsday. One small thing (a nitpick you might say) about the pitch is that in the Postcredits scene of The Marvels, where Monica is in the X Mansion with Beast. Binary (Monica's Mom) is wearing that universe's Quantum Bands, so they are not unique.
They recon things all the time. A one point the infinity gauntlet was on as guard, then later that was retconned to be a fake and thanos later had the real one made? Or remade or whatever but it doesn't matter the MCU overall storyline has always been incoherent, just doesn't matter if they are fun enough movies.
@@Lyger101 Seems disingenuous for you to say that. More like: Marvel always forgets every single sub plot so I wouldn't be surprised if that pcs isn't addressed later.
"Possible setup that I got elsewhere". In the FF universe, the Winter Soldier kills Anthony Stark and his wife earlier in that timeline, shortly after Tony's birth. Tony is adopted by the Von Doom family and named Victor. He's raised as Doctor Doom in Latveria.
This was my idea aswell, and I've posted it on reddit a few times. Great minds think alike 🤣 I think it definitely fits a little better by making Doom a Stark variant, and I think there's more drama to be mined there aswell with characters like Spiderman trying to convince Doom he can be a hero like 616 Tony. Not to mention it leaves room for a proper 616 Doom later down the line
@@Dynosaur42 That's really the best point! I still want room for "Doom proper" in 616. Somehow If a 616 Doom can be revealed at the end of Secret Wars as the true hidden architect of the incursions, and disposing of or trapping Tony/Doom in the Void or Battleworld.
This was amazing!! Can you do one of how they could make side-stepping Kang from building him up as the next big deal only to vanish into obscurity work narratively?
I haven't seen anyone else bring up the idea in speculation videos yet, but I think there's a chance that big reality tree Loki could serve a role similar to what Molecule Man(?) does in the newer Secret Wars, where he's basically the person holding Battle World together, though I'm not sure why he'd be working with Doom (or Kang prior to rewrite) at this point in his arc
Awesome ideas for how this could work. I pretty much agree with everything, though I do have one small change that doesn't really effect the story or anything, rather than the Fantastic Four choosing to go to the Sacred Timeline I could see it more as they have to do a last second Multiverse jump to save themselves from being destroyed along with their Earth and it jumps them to a random Universe, that being the Sacred Timeline, like the Multiverse just kinda throws them into that Universe rather than them choosing to go there specficially. Doom would probably already be there or follows them shortly thereafter after saving himself previously. I could see the Reed and Doom feud be a thing from a long time ago, but I also like your idea of it being a more recent thing we see more or less in real time.
Damn you're right. I mean, yes of course but let's say only the ones in our Universe work. Binary's are just for fashion. Or you also need the Ten Rings to do this. Something like that.
Really solid story structure and excellent motivations here - especially how Doom would characterize Reed not helping out. My only quibble - that would get worked out in actual scripting, I'd hope - is there's a little too much Macguffin Chasing going on between summoning Galactus, getting the power cosmic, the Watcher, the Beyonders, the quantum bands, etc. Even though those fit neatly into the existing MCU history it still feels a little bit much for Average Moviegoer. But setting up Doom this way is a great way to make him ,as you alluded to, right but fixing it the wrong ways or right but for the wrong reasons.
The only way RDJ works as Doom is if he never removes the mask, so he can be Doom without also being a Stark variant. RDJ and MCU Tony are awesome but their story is done. Doom is an awesome character all on his own with a storied history and fans. The RDJ-Doom story needs to be entirely separate. Edit: I agree with all the replies that they didn't pay RDJ not to show RDJ, I'm just saying it's not going to work. It's too comic booky; they either have to ignore that Doom looks like Tony or get bogged down in the particulars of how and why that is. Since I doubt they'll try another Rhodey "I'm here, deal with it" then the latter is going to waste too much of Doom's limited story time in these movies. They should have cast someone else, but since they didn't I'm hoping RDJ came back for the challenge of a masked character, not just the pay day.
But he wouldn't be a Stark variant if we saw his face, because he's not Stark. And technically, at least as far as my own brain interprets things, variants are only alternative versions of someone from other timelines, not universes. So if RDJ Doom is from a different universe, he is definitionally not a variant, just as Chris Evans Human Torch is not a Cap variant, or how Tobey Maguire or Andrew Garfield's Spider-Men are not variants of Tom Holland's 616 Spider-Man.
There’s like a zero percent chance that they bring him in and don’t use the element of his face or likeness being a factor. There were plenty of other really great actors without that angle. Even ones who’d generate hype.
So, he is playing Victor Von Doom. That’s confirmed by the Russos and it seems to be this Doom is from the universe the Fantastic Four are in. So, why cast RDJ? Why not an Easter European? I agree and I would’ve preferred that BUT! There is a story here. If I’m Marvel doing Doomsday I’d have TWO stories. One is Doctor Doom in Earth 616 growing in power trying to save the multiverse (so he can rule it) and the other is his origins. Each story moves forward and the flashbacks should either be similar to or juxtapose what’s currently happening. For example, if Doom is invading Wakanda for Vibranium then we should see him in Latveria in a flashback protecting his people, making sure they rest well. If Peter is struggling over the loss of Aunt May and able to move forward we should see Doom going to heel trying to free his mother, unable to move on. When we see Doom finally wear THE mask that’s when in present day we see it come off and he looks like Tony Stark but with a scratch. I think him looking like Stark can add more to his insecurities. Before he could see himself and was embarrassed, now he can’t even see himself so he’s trying tk do more, trying to compensate by being greater then Stark to prove to Richards and himself he is superior. It should add to Doom’s insecurities. He has to share a face with an icon What I love about Doom is how he is a character based around the question “how can we be a perfectionist when we are so imperfect” I think we can explore that still.
If Marvel I certainly would not be casting RDJ as Doctor Doom. It is such a bad decision, it does nothing but shows people just how dull you are. Also, your theories are nice but they just mean nothing, forget about theorizing what's gonna happen or thinking about comics, because comics have nothing to do with these movies. Title maybe, but nothing else.
2nd comment is crazy, would love a pitch for these upcoming movies before loads of info arrives and corners, or nando is bright enough to be original later on to make one soon to the real story on the big screen
The quote RDJ said made me think that perhaps just like Iron Man he will bring the Avengers together the difference is this time as Doctor Doom he will bring them together as the villain instead of the hero. It's a new mask and the same task, and to quote Nick Fury "There was an idea. To bring together a group of remarkable people to see if they could become something more. To see if they could work together to fight the battles that they never could." So well written and frankly it works. The guy who was there greatest hero is now the greatest threat. Also that story line where Tony Stark and Victor von Doom swapped minds could still come into play here. What If...? is a big part of the Multiverse saga being our first way into the Multiverse without time travel.
One problem: we learned in agatha all along and deadpool and wolverine that all copies of the darkhold were destroyed in all realities besides the TVA'S Void. Otherwise this is flawless.
Likely a combination of 2 stories, 1 where Doctor Doom steals all the vibranium in Wakanda and Talokan. And a redone version of Secret Wars 2 where the Beyonder comes to Earth.
Am I the only one thinking he's gonna just be Evil Tony Stark? Like, that's the character. Tony and Reed are contemporaries but Tony's dad respected Reed more cause he came from nothing but Tony had lots of money. Like Cap and Tony in Avengers 1 but they don't end up getting along and Tony decided to destroy Reed cause vengeance. The Doctor Doom persona just came about unintentionally
His best run recently aside from secret war is infamous Ironman so the comparison makes sense. He is also parallel to Dr Strange as he would be a better sorcerer Supreme
I genuinely love everything you said it’s the perfect way to blend the movies with the comics The only thing I’d change is that I’d have doom be a major player in Dr strange 3 because at the end of multiverse of madness it’s very obvious that they’re adapting time runs out for 3 and doom is a big part of that story
11:05 i think finding a way to fit the "peace in our time" quote from Age Of Ultron here would do a nice call back and twist. Having Doom that we know that looks like Tony under the mask use say this but with a dark edge to it would be a great parallel.
The problem with your idea about the bands existing in 616 because it lacks a Tony Stark and a Thanos is that the bands did not just appear after Avengers Endgame, but at least one was on earth and in the possession of Kamala Kahn’s grandmother at the same time when both Tony Stark and Thanos were both on the same planet. So theoretically either one of them could have found them.
Maybe they'll explain Tony and Doom looking the same by have Doom already be scared when we start (not enough that we can't see his face clearly for acting but enough that characters probably wouldn't point out the similarities) and we only see RDJ without the scars in flashbacks, so the MCU characters can't see him.
I seem to have a memory of someone on the "Mostly Nitpicking" podcast episode about "Far From Home" commenting derisively that Doctor Doom would have a grudge against Stark rather than Richards. Oh, if only.... 😂
This is a great idea and I love different pulls from the comics it still baffles me that Marvel deters directors and writers from reading the comics. For the sake adaptation it should be about embracing, and building upon the source material not ignoring it.
IMO for this to work Doom has to keep his mask on so all the characters won't constantly see this bad guy as one that looks just like Tony Stark. It also has to make it so that all the storylines with Kang ( Loki Seasons 1 and 2, Quantumania ) still fit the overall narrative without anything being retconned.
The only way that i can see this truly working, is if we never get a face reveal for Doom. They cant even make it through 1 scene with everyones nano tech helmets melting away at this point though.
I still think the Council of Kangs should be involved somehow, even if Doom is the main villain. The Kangs could have a macguffin that characters need and be a obstacle for everyone including Doom. It then becomes a race to get to it first. To add some tension, have the Avenger, Thunderbolts, Fantastic Four and Doom all be in conflict with one another as they all have different reasons. The movie will end with Doom getting it and that leads to Secret Wars. They then win against doom in Secret Wars because they all work together instead of being in conflict
I'm predicting, based on the "new mask, same task", that Doom's mission is to put a suit if armor around the world to protect from Galactus but fails and he and the 4 get warped to MCU earth and shenanigans ensue
Tbh I am sick of Loki constantly dying. The current variant especially, since his death will literally cheapen his sacrifice in Loki S2, an eternity of loneliness to give the multiverse a chance to thrive. Let him escape and assemble his own team of Avengers like he does in the comics!!
I feel Feige isnt gonna make reed vs doom the center of secret wars, mainly because the movie is called Avengers: Secret Wars not just "Secret Wars", unless they want to make F4 apart of the avengers lol.
All the best* villains are heroes of their own story. The nearly impossible task is portraying such villains without distracting from the main story: the heroes' story. It's only with hindsight or a different perspective that you realise their story and motivation is just as real and deep as the one you see on first watching. First time you watch infinity war you think it's the Avengers' story. Later rewatching you realise it's actually Thanos' story. By stark contrast, Ivan vanko was just there to be a foil to iron man in IM2, and it shows Im rewatching breaking bad atm and this is so clear, so well done. Every character is the main of their own story, and it's how they overlap with each other that makes the story compelling *as in well executed; entertaining; with enough emotional depth to be a satisfying character within the larger story
Ngl i doubt you're gonna see this but I've been tryna learn to screenwrite and I've been watching you for a bit and I really love how passionate you are about your script pitches, so I guess i'm asking if you have any advice for me?
The verse where they recast Kang with Denzel, Washington is absolutely eating better than our universe is going to be. They may still make this work, I still have a little bit of hope, but I truly believe that sticking to the villain that you’re building up over multiple movies and seriesbeen a better call than slapping a bad guy and a toy onto these movies without any buildup
If y'all think people aren't gonna be excited about RDJ Doom, go watch the crowd reaction to the reveal. Heck, I'm super interested in the story implications! It doesn't ruin Tony Stark's sacrifice, the same way Deadpool and Wolverine doesn't ruin Logan.
It can work *AS LONG* as he is Victor Von Doom. Not a Tony Stark variant I’m still not happy with it. I’m sure RDJ will do a great job but there’s no way marvel couldn’t find a Romani actor to play Doom. They stumbled on perfect casting for Ms. Marvel from a complete unknown, surely they can do it again for Doom. It just feels cheap
I do think that people will be excited but the crowd reaction isn’t really the best way to gauge it because I’m pretty certain a lot of the hype was just because they didn’t expect RDJ to be there
@@user-gh5sd2nm5y because there’s no way they cast RDJ without the intention of doing some Iron Man variant nonsense. It’s too important of casting to not be intentional
First time watching one of your videos. Not a bad plot at all. There definitely has to be a confrontation early on in Doomsday with Peter and Doom. I can't wait to see how that goes down. You got yourself a brand new Sub.
There’s no way they’re not gonna show his face. If it was another actor than sure don’t show him. But it’s RDJ, the wow factor when he takes off his mask & the avengers see him with absolute shock will be worth it for the audience
I think the gradual line of villains for The avengers to face is pretty decent. 1st you have Dr Doom, 2nd is Kang the Conqueror, and 3rd is Galactus. Have the silver surfer act as an end credit signifier of what's to come (Galactus) for both F4 &/or the Avengers films. Just give the fantastic 4 time to have their own movies and fight with Doctor Doom before they have to share him with the rest of the multiverse, PLEASE!!??
One change... Doom trusted Reed... He didn't call Galactus. The world eater came anyway, but they weren't ready and were unable to stop the destruction of their world. Doom was right, better to call The World Eater and fight on your terms at the right time... Reed was wrong.
They should keep it with getting scared trying to save his mother from mephisto and Reed is responsible for his failure that should be his grudge against Reed, if you remember in civil war when stark fought buck and cap, stark tell cap that bucky killed his mom. It be a nice little nod and kind of show similarities of doom and stark
I love the story. My initial thoughts though: 1) Doesn't Maria Rambeau have Quantum bands in the X-men universe shown at the end of The Marvels? 2) I was under the impression that Loki was safekeeping the timelines of the 616 universe, not the multiverse beyond. (a contentious subject, I know)
This version of doom could be as smart and fight skilled as Sherlock rich as Stark but focus on more subtle techniques like bullet proof fabrics, infused Vibranium (keeps ties with Ulysses’s Klaw) and disguise to survive and help make the world safer and better in his eyes. He is more interested in the magic and power his universe has to offer still being a man of science and gadgets.
He would still be interested in Mind Stone but for its ability to grant powers, not realizing it would grant him more power but also alter his mind revealing the multiverse to him and showing him how to stop Thanos (or at least making him aware of Thanos who could have stone at this point.) he faces Thanos with help of Fantastic four and defeat him. Doom and Reed part ways as they disagree on how to deal with threats including Galactus who tempts him to become his herald. Doom accepts (gets power cosmic) but then betrays Galactus after Galactus defeats all or most of the Fantastic Four (I think Jonny can survive for future stories as his character has lots of growth to go through, like Last Ronin maybe he sacrifices himself to slow down Doom)
we couldn't even go one avengers movie without RDJ 💀
when you say it like that, it's genuinely hilarious.
My biggest hope is that they just use this story to erase everything about the Multiverse. It's such a failed concept and removes any sense of consequence in the MCU. I really like Nando's take since it basically offers an avenue for doom to erase the other timelines.
@@carpyet9507 yeah other than both seasons of Loki and multiverse of madness. Those were probably the only decent things to come out of the multiverse saga.
@@carpyet9507 The multiverse isn't a failed concept, nor does it remove any consequences. Most of the releases in this saga have nothing to do with the multiverse.
@@johnman8398 Yeah, but the biggest releases do (Multiverse of Madness, Loki, Deadpool and Wolverine), all were centered around a multiverse. If you like it, that's perfectly fine. I just find it difficult to understand the true weight of an entire universe dying seriously when it's represented by some strings on a TVA monitor.
Stage 3: Bargaining
“Dormmamu, I’ve come to bargain”, Dormammu in this instance is Fiege
depression will probably follow once the movie actually comes out
Yea
@@skakee10 acceptance will be when the reboot happens
@@skakee10and acceptance will come with comic book nerds finally move on with their lives…..
probably gonna take a couple decades😂
At the the end of the Fantastic Four: First Steps. Doom appears from behind a door a goes “hey it’s me Doctor Doom” end credits
I mean to be fair if he didn’t say that we would think he was Iron Man
Dies of Peak
Eternals did it first with Blade 😂
A whole fantastic four movie just for the end credit to be the only meaningful set up for the next
I am... Doom
DOOM you looking for this
Stares blankly as I, an Avenger, don’t laugh at your joke. ;)
But I understood that reference.
@@MadMackSkillzIt def deserves more likes then the already played out, I hate you 3k jokes.
@@MadMackSkillz I understood that reference!
@@Byronic19134agreed I hate you 3k is getting old now.
that's actually hilarious
When Doom says “I hate you 3000…” Chills.
Ikr
💀💀💀💀💀🥶🥶🥶
“Avengers! We need to fall back, he’s too dangerous!” *Doctor strange’s portal appears, and Walter White steps through* “I am the danger.”
*Miles swings through the portal* “What’s up, Danger?”
@@goonishereva Are you in the writers room rn as you comment this? You better be.
I’d laugh
The only thing I would have changed is that Watcher is looking for a universe without 3 people. Thanos, Stark and Doom. And the MCU-616 would still work.
Other than that, love it.
Why wouldn’t 616 have a Doom
@@LuisFernandez-jp8wt you could ask the same for the fantastic 4
I love the fighting Loki at the end idea, entirely because I can see the ending of Doomsday being Doom sitting on that throne and doing his classic fingers pose
I don't know much about doom so I'm imagining his iconic finger pose just being him flipping everyone off
Hate the idea of Loki being killed again tho. I know he has died several times in the MCU but I genuinely feel like this time his death would do a huge disservice to the arc Loki got in his series. It could also feel like a repetition of his death in Infinity War by Thanos.
I would much prefer if Loki survived the fight and potentially team up with Thor and the Avengers in Secret Wars to defeat Doom. Thor needs to find out about his brother’s sacrifice and I really believe it would a Wasted opportunity for Secret Wars to Not feature an emotional reunion between Thor and Loki.
But if Doom does that, what will he do next? That "throne" is a curse, anyone that sits in it can't leave. If Doom just takes it from Loki and goes away, it will make Doom seem like the biggest idiot in the multiverse. And even if he makes up some bs in order to cancel that curse, that's just gonna ruin the whole point of it. This isn't a Deadpool movie, it has to take what happened before and make it matter, else it'll only ruin itself and everything else altogether.
@artemisqueen2003 WHAT YOU SAID also lol my name is Artemis! What's up sista
@@radrno7 Loki is using the throne to let multiverse flourish. Doom will use it to create his own universe. I`m imagining him pulling and ripping all the "timeline roots", transforming them into his iconic tree-throne from secret wars.
Nando.
Please go back and listen to the song Black Sabbath - Iron Man that plays during the ending credits of Iron Man 1. The song is about a dude to travels to the past to warn people about the end of the world, only to become a frustrated Iron Man that causes the end of the world.
He first goes forward then back.
Ooh, okay, now that is interesting. Imagine a rendition of Black Sabath to better drive the lyrics home
Woah so like
Tony Stark was always Doom
In this universe Doom was a refuge orphan adopted by the Starks
He tries to save the world multiple times and ends up almost destroying it, Civil War, IM3, Ultron, Infinity War, etc.
@@Gibbypastraminah I don't like that idea. It ruins tony's sacrifice during endgame
@@kdusel1991 not really… they’re still alternate realities
In one universe Doom grew up as Tony, in another he’s just Doom
It’s still Tony, we just learn that he was born in Latveria, it’s still the same guy
“That up there… that’s the Battleworld”
😂
It actually makes sense that Doom comes in right now. He Who Remains set up a time loop where every time he dies, the loom overloads and melts down and resets the multiverse. He designed it so that Loki is forced to come back and keep him alive, but through an act of self-sacrifice, Loki found a way to essentially replace He Who Remains. The TVA still prevents multiversal war, but now they do it by hunting fledgling Kangs before they can meddle with time. So with constant multiversal Kang suppression, NOW a character like Doom can come into being. Kang and Strange both recognize that the multiverse is growing to the point of incursion. So multiversal war may just be inevitable after all... so if not Kang, then it would be someone like Doom. And if not Doom, then someone else... as they say in Avengers 1, "There are always men like you"
I LOVE how your Doom got the name Doctor Doom because he was constantly warning everyone about the incoming doom and it was Reed who gave it to him! It makes much more sense then being his ACTUAL surname. Even now he's defined by his nemesis and can't escape him.
"Doctor Doom over here." - Sue Storm Fan4stic
VERY smart to incorporate The Marvels' quantum bands. I think everybody forgot that movie casually cracked interdimensional travel at the end like it was nothing
Oh yeah wasn’t beast there too
...wait according to the intro, this also means that we got the "Secret Invasion" we got because of Nando.😂
uhhh uhhhh no. all the other ones except that one.
@@NandovMoviesAnt-Man and the Wasp Quantumania?
I mean you'd be surprised how different a film can become because of producer notes lol
@@NandovMovieswhat do you think about Deadpool and Wolverine because I have been thinking about Cassandra Nova and I thought of Madcap should have been the villain as he is a more personal threat to Wade as his healing powers are far superior to both Deadpool and Logan as he was rumoured to be played by Jim Carry and also I heard about a rumour that the Masters of evil will be in this movie?
@@srstriker6420Jim Carrey needs to play Molecule Man.
I can see them creating thematic parallels between Tony Stark Doom botching to save his mother due to Reed and MCU 616 Tony Stark finding out Winter Soldier killed his parents. They might use the loss of his parents as a canon event.
I think it would be interesting if Doom came from John Krasinski's Reed Richard's universe and the whole reason he rose to power would be because of how Wanda essentially doomed that universe (pun unintended)
Cap: "If we don't avenge our fallen comrades, then this team is doomed"
Tony: "Say that again"
"You look like Tony Stark"
"I'm not though, I'm Victor Von Doom"
Such brilliant casting.
I'm seriously worried they won't give Doom the proper time needed to explore his character. A Doom special presentation showing his origins and background with the FF would be amazing.
bro, they aren't even givin him his own face and character and you are here waiting for origins stories SMH
Thanos got barely a few cameos before he was one of cinemas greatest movie villains within only 2 movies of development. They have the ability to pull it off, but will they is the question. They need some top notch writing talent and I just don't see it
@@metalface_villain😂😂 face
@@Shell-iq6cxyeah Thanos appeared physically in a few movies but there were teases of him throughout most of the movies in the infinity saga.
You think they're going to give RDJ a special presentation? LOL!
Never show RDJ's face. It's the only way it works.
They're gonna show his face cause they need that interaction with Spider-Man
They definitely are gonna show his face it may have a scar or something but it needs to look luke rdj for everybody to feel some sort of personal connection
@@Nolabray21no it doesn’t. Why is everyone so obsessed with this dumb spiderman interaction. He can just play Doom without showing his face and if they do it’s disfigured and unrecognizable. Like…News flash, the penguin??? Y’all can’t fathom an actor playing a different role being covered, having a different voice but the penguin is displaying right in front of us of how he can perfectly do it. You guys overthinking the face part. People will already know it’s RDJ. They won’t need to show him. BOOM. Done. Now imagine he gives such a chilling, gruesome, performance where we don’t even recognize him? That’s the goal I feel. You know him as Ironman but he’s about to give a performance so distant from Iron man you won’t even believe us the same actor. They already publicly announced his casting. They won’t need to double down on showing him
@@SinkfieldHoops More than a hundred million dollars just for a news that goes out of circle in a week ? That certainly is a bold move.
Yeah because Doom’s face is supposed to be very messed up like Darth Vader from Star Wars. But since they did hire RDJ I reckon they will have be like a big scar but not purely burnt.
I can’t imagine RDJ as Doom. I genuinely cannot see it in my head
I honestly couldn't either until I saw someone rewrite his Lewis Strauss rant to be about Reed instead of Oppenheimer and I could see the potential
If it helps, he'll probably have a mask on
I mean actors can plan many roles. So we never saw rdj as tony and yet he did it. Chris Evans did Cap after doing Johnny Storm. And so forth.
Watch Oppenheimer and RDJ is Victor Von Doom and Cillian Murphy is Reed Richards
I mean, I couldn't too, until I saw this. However, ultimately I still think someone else should take up the role, so they can do with Doom what RDJ did with Iron Man.
You missed a major point that being that Binary has the bands and a variant of Ms. Marvel in the Marvel Zombies show has them so the whole 616 is the only world with the bands dosent work unless maybe you’re saying those universes died to incursions by the time doomsday comes around
All I want for doomsday is Loki getting a CRAZY fight with doom. Either he doesn't show up so he doesn't die or he sacrifices himself for everything
Yeah this channel is amazing.
Nando is the only person that can make me not tottaly mad by rdj as doom
Definitely on board with the Time Runs Out template for Avengers: Doomsday. One small thing (a nitpick you might say) about the pitch is that in the Postcredits scene of The Marvels, where Monica is in the X Mansion with Beast. Binary (Monica's Mom) is wearing that universe's Quantum Bands, so they are not unique.
With how that movie went that easy enough to ignore as not alot of folks saw the film or that ending. Easy retcon to be edited out.
Time runs out, also known as we'll rip the title, but it won't be Time Runs Out it'll be another generic MCU "world ending" movie where no one dies.
They recon things all the time. A one point the infinity gauntlet was on as guard, then later that was retconned to be a fake and thanos later had the real one made? Or remade or whatever but it doesn't matter the MCU overall storyline has always been incoherent, just doesn't matter if they are fun enough movies.
@@Lyger101I don't think she was wearing them. I don't think Binary needs the quantum bands in order for her powers to work
@@Lyger101 Seems disingenuous for you to say that. More like: Marvel always forgets every single sub plot so I wouldn't be surprised if that pcs isn't addressed later.
"Possible setup that I got elsewhere". In the FF universe, the Winter Soldier kills Anthony Stark and his wife earlier in that timeline, shortly after Tony's birth. Tony is adopted by the Von Doom family and named Victor. He's raised as Doctor Doom in Latveria.
This was my idea aswell, and I've posted it on reddit a few times. Great minds think alike 🤣 I think it definitely fits a little better by making Doom a Stark variant, and I think there's more drama to be mined there aswell with characters like Spiderman trying to convince Doom he can be a hero like 616 Tony. Not to mention it leaves room for a proper 616 Doom later down the line
@@Dynosaur42 That's really the best point! I still want room for "Doom proper" in 616. Somehow If a 616 Doom can be revealed at the end of Secret Wars as the true hidden architect of the incursions, and disposing of or trapping Tony/Doom in the Void or Battleworld.
Plus it justifies the Downey Jr. casting better. Yeah I'm really hoping this is the way the movies go about it.
This was amazing!! Can you do one of how they could make side-stepping Kang from building him up as the next big deal only to vanish into obscurity work narratively?
I haven't seen anyone else bring up the idea in speculation videos yet, but I think there's a chance that big reality tree Loki could serve a role similar to what Molecule Man(?) does in the newer Secret Wars, where he's basically the person holding Battle World together, though I'm not sure why he'd be working with Doom (or Kang prior to rewrite) at this point in his arc
Awesome ideas for how this could work. I pretty much agree with everything, though I do have one small change that doesn't really effect the story or anything, rather than the Fantastic Four choosing to go to the Sacred Timeline I could see it more as they have to do a last second Multiverse jump to save themselves from being destroyed along with their Earth and it jumps them to a random Universe, that being the Sacred Timeline, like the Multiverse just kinda throws them into that Universe rather than them choosing to go there specficially. Doom would probably already be there or follows them shortly thereafter after saving himself previously.
I could see the Reed and Doom feud be a thing from a long time ago, but I also like your idea of it being a more recent thing we see more or less in real time.
the quantum bands were also in the x-men universe monica rambeau landed in binary had them both on in the post credit scene
Damn you're right. I mean, yes of course but let's say only the ones in our Universe work. Binary's are just for fashion. Or you also need the Ten Rings to do this. Something like that.
Really solid story structure and excellent motivations here - especially how Doom would characterize Reed not helping out. My only quibble - that would get worked out in actual scripting, I'd hope - is there's a little too much Macguffin Chasing going on between summoning Galactus, getting the power cosmic, the Watcher, the Beyonders, the quantum bands, etc. Even though those fit neatly into the existing MCU history it still feels a little bit much for Average Moviegoer. But setting up Doom this way is a great way to make him ,as you alluded to, right but fixing it the wrong ways or right but for the wrong reasons.
The only way RDJ works as Doom is if he never removes the mask, so he can be Doom without also being a Stark variant. RDJ and MCU Tony are awesome but their story is done. Doom is an awesome character all on his own with a storied history and fans. The RDJ-Doom story needs to be entirely separate.
Edit: I agree with all the replies that they didn't pay RDJ not to show RDJ, I'm just saying it's not going to work. It's too comic booky; they either have to ignore that Doom looks like Tony or get bogged down in the particulars of how and why that is. Since I doubt they'll try another Rhodey "I'm here, deal with it" then the latter is going to waste too much of Doom's limited story time in these movies. They should have cast someone else, but since they didn't I'm hoping RDJ came back for the challenge of a masked character, not just the pay day.
But he wouldn't be a Stark variant if we saw his face, because he's not Stark. And technically, at least as far as my own brain interprets things, variants are only alternative versions of someone from other timelines, not universes. So if RDJ Doom is from a different universe, he is definitionally not a variant, just as Chris Evans Human Torch is not a Cap variant, or how Tobey Maguire or Andrew Garfield's Spider-Men are not variants of Tom Holland's 616 Spider-Man.
There’s like a zero percent chance that they bring him in and don’t use the element of his face or likeness being a factor.
There were plenty of other really great actors without that angle.
Even ones who’d generate hype.
Well, keeping his face always covered would make zero sense. Especially considering that they are paying him 80 million dollars for each movie 🤣
Everybody will be sold by the time he makes his first post credit appearance.
There is literally no chance of this doom not being a Tony stark variant
Great video. As always. Alittle bit exposition heavy, but, thats okay. I honestly would love it if they did this in Doomsday and Secret Wars.
Yeah facts but I think this is just a pitch and the objects would be spread more naturally throughout the films
So, he is playing Victor Von Doom. That’s confirmed by the Russos and it seems to be this Doom is from the universe the Fantastic Four are in. So, why cast RDJ? Why not an Easter European? I agree and I would’ve preferred that BUT! There is a story here.
If I’m Marvel doing Doomsday I’d have TWO stories. One is Doctor Doom in Earth 616 growing in power trying to save the multiverse (so he can rule it) and the other is his origins. Each story moves forward and the flashbacks should either be similar to or juxtapose what’s currently happening. For example, if Doom is invading Wakanda for Vibranium then we should see him in Latveria in a flashback protecting his people, making sure they rest well. If Peter is struggling over the loss of Aunt May and able to move forward we should see Doom going to heel trying to free his mother, unable to move on.
When we see Doom finally wear THE mask that’s when in present day we see it come off and he looks like Tony Stark but with a scratch.
I think him looking like Stark can add more to his insecurities. Before he could see himself and was embarrassed, now he can’t even see himself so he’s trying tk do more, trying to compensate by being greater then Stark to prove to Richards and himself he is superior. It should add to Doom’s insecurities. He has to share a face with an icon
What I love about Doom is how he is a character based around the question “how can we be a perfectionist when we are so imperfect” I think we can explore that still.
If Marvel I certainly would not be casting RDJ as Doctor Doom. It is such a bad decision, it does nothing but shows people just how dull you are. Also, your theories are nice but they just mean nothing, forget about theorizing what's gonna happen or thinking about comics, because comics have nothing to do with these movies. Title maybe, but nothing else.
2nd comment is crazy, would love a pitch for these upcoming movies before loads of info arrives and corners, or nando is bright enough to be original later on to make one soon to the real story on the big screen
Dude this is so fire. If your plans don't come out I just want more story times and what ifs w your narratives
The quote RDJ said made me think that perhaps just like Iron Man he will bring the Avengers together the difference is this time as Doctor Doom he will bring them together as the villain instead of the hero. It's a new mask and the same task, and to quote Nick Fury "There was an idea. To bring together a group of remarkable people to see if they could become something more. To see if they could work together to fight the battles that they never could." So well written and frankly it works. The guy who was there greatest hero is now the greatest threat. Also that story line where Tony Stark and Victor von Doom swapped minds could still come into play here. What If...? is a big part of the Multiverse saga being our first way into the Multiverse without time travel.
I love it! Great job of putting this together in the context of what we already know
One problem: we learned in agatha all along and deadpool and wolverine that all copies of the darkhold were destroyed in all realities besides the TVA'S Void.
Otherwise this is flawless.
Man, them monologues had me in CHILLS! BRILLIANT
Now this just makes me want to have nando narrate a doom audiobook
Likely a combination of 2 stories, 1 where Doctor Doom steals all the vibranium in Wakanda and Talokan. And a redone version of Secret Wars 2 where the Beyonder comes to Earth.
Am I the only one thinking he's gonna just be Evil Tony Stark? Like, that's the character. Tony and Reed are contemporaries but Tony's dad respected Reed more cause he came from nothing but Tony had lots of money. Like Cap and Tony in Avengers 1 but they don't end up getting along and Tony decided to destroy Reed cause vengeance. The Doctor Doom persona just came about unintentionally
His best run recently aside from secret war is infamous Ironman so the comparison makes sense. He is also parallel to Dr Strange as he would be a better sorcerer Supreme
I genuinely love everything you said it’s the perfect way to blend the movies with the comics The only thing I’d change is that I’d have doom be a major player in Dr strange 3 because at the end of multiverse of madness it’s very obvious that they’re adapting time runs out for 3 and doom is a big part of that story
Two vids in one day??? Thank you king 🤧
Legitimately lots of great ideas in this video!
11:05 i think finding a way to fit the "peace in our time" quote from Age Of Ultron here would do a nice call back and twist. Having Doom that we know that looks like Tony under the mask use say this but with a dark edge to it would be a great parallel.
The problem with your idea about the bands existing in 616 because it lacks a Tony Stark and a Thanos is that the bands did not just appear after Avengers Endgame, but at least one was on earth and in the possession of Kamala Kahn’s grandmother at the same time when both Tony Stark and Thanos were both on the same planet. So theoretically either one of them could have found them.
Maybe he could be after the 10 rings instead? They said they were sending off a beacon or something but never followed up on that.
This is such a strong way to do it. I legit hope they make this!!!
Maybe they'll explain Tony and Doom looking the same by have Doom already be scared when we start (not enough that we can't see his face clearly for acting but enough that characters probably wouldn't point out the similarities) and we only see RDJ without the scars in flashbacks, so the MCU characters can't see him.
I seem to have a memory of someone on the "Mostly Nitpicking" podcast episode about "Far From Home" commenting derisively that Doctor Doom would have a grudge against Stark rather than Richards.
Oh, if only.... 😂
This is a great idea and I love different pulls from the comics it still baffles me that Marvel deters directors and writers from reading the comics. For the sake adaptation it should be about embracing, and building upon the source material not ignoring it.
IMO for this to work Doom has to keep his mask on so all the characters won't constantly see this bad guy as one that looks just like Tony Stark. It also has to make it so that all the storylines with Kang ( Loki Seasons 1 and 2, Quantumania ) still fit the overall narrative without anything being retconned.
I genuinely hope we don’t get a tell not show version of dr dooms origin. His origin is one of the most compelling parts of his character
The only way that i can see this truly working, is if we never get a face reveal for Doom. They cant even make it through 1 scene with everyones nano tech helmets melting away at this point though.
I like it I hope you’re right on. I bet you’re very accurate. Looking forward to those movie in particular
I really wish Nando was in charge of some MCU stuff
It’s funny how any hope I have for this role is in how little they call attention to it.
Yeah, I feel like it’s for the best not to. I feel like calling attention to it just makes it worse imo
they should re name the movie to avengers: morbsday where morbius destroys the marvel universe
When Dr. Doom said "clearly, you don't own an air fryer" I shat my pants and tears rolled down my eyes
I still think the Council of Kangs should be involved somehow, even if Doom is the main villain.
The Kangs could have a macguffin that characters need and be a obstacle for everyone including Doom. It then becomes a race to get to it first. To add some tension, have the Avenger, Thunderbolts, Fantastic Four and Doom all be in conflict with one another as they all have different reasons.
The movie will end with Doom getting it and that leads to Secret Wars. They then win against doom in Secret Wars because they all work together instead of being in conflict
Adventures of Dr. Doom & the 3 Body Problem
I'm predicting, based on the "new mask, same task", that Doom's mission is to put a suit if armor around the world to protect from Galactus but fails and he and the 4 get warped to MCU earth and shenanigans ensue
Wow this is amazing
Correction, Waldron did watch Wandavision, it was Raimi who didnt. Just putting it out there.
Tbh I am sick of Loki constantly dying. The current variant especially, since his death will literally cheapen his sacrifice in Loki S2, an eternity of loneliness to give the multiverse a chance to thrive. Let him escape and assemble his own team of Avengers like he does in the comics!!
I feel Feige isnt gonna make reed vs doom the center of secret wars, mainly because the movie is called Avengers: Secret Wars not just "Secret Wars", unless they want to make F4 apart of the avengers lol.
“The media labeled me: Dr. Doom.” BARS 🔥🔥🔥
All the best* villains are heroes of their own story. The nearly impossible task is portraying such villains without distracting from the main story: the heroes' story. It's only with hindsight or a different perspective that you realise their story and motivation is just as real and deep as the one you see on first watching.
First time you watch infinity war you think it's the Avengers' story. Later rewatching you realise it's actually Thanos' story. By stark contrast, Ivan vanko was just there to be a foil to iron man in IM2, and it shows
Im rewatching breaking bad atm and this is so clear, so well done. Every character is the main of their own story, and it's how they overlap with each other that makes the story compelling
*as in well executed; entertaining; with enough emotional depth to be a satisfying character within the larger story
Ngl i doubt you're gonna see this but I've been tryna learn to screenwrite and I've been watching you for a bit and I really love how passionate you are about your script pitches, so I guess i'm asking if you have any advice for me?
yesss we needed this video
RDJ: You couldn't live with your own failure. Where did that bring you? Back to me.
Killed it, bro!!
Either we never see his face, problem solved. Or Doom is a Stark variant which happened in the comics so not difficult.
The verse where they recast Kang with Denzel, Washington is absolutely eating better than our universe is going to be. They may still make this work, I still have a little bit of hope, but I truly believe that sticking to the villain that you’re building up over multiple movies and seriesbeen a better call than slapping a bad guy and a toy onto these movies without any buildup
Doctor Doom takes out Pepper Potts and becomes Dr. Pepper.
Yo Doomlings is actually a lot of fun. My buddies and I play it all the time, W sponsorship
A round of applause, my friend. Well done.
This video will end up being much better than whatever slop disney puts out.
If y'all think people aren't gonna be excited about RDJ Doom, go watch the crowd reaction to the reveal. Heck, I'm super interested in the story implications! It doesn't ruin Tony Stark's sacrifice, the same way Deadpool and Wolverine doesn't ruin Logan.
It can work *AS LONG* as he is Victor Von Doom. Not a Tony Stark variant
I’m still not happy with it. I’m sure RDJ will do a great job but there’s no way marvel couldn’t find a Romani actor to play Doom. They stumbled on perfect casting for Ms. Marvel from a complete unknown, surely they can do it again for Doom. It just feels cheap
I do think that people will be excited but the crowd reaction isn’t really the best way to gauge it because I’m pretty certain a lot of the hype was just because they didn’t expect RDJ to be there
Wow. People at an event meant to generate hype got hype.
Really shocking stuff.
@@goonisherevathey explicitly said at the reveal that he is playing Victor Von Doom. I don’t know why people are confused
@@user-gh5sd2nm5y because there’s no way they cast RDJ without the intention of doing some Iron Man variant nonsense. It’s too important of casting to not be intentional
I think the studios should watch these channels. That monologue is fire.
First time watching one of your videos. Not a bad plot at all. There definitely has to be a confrontation early on in Doomsday with Peter and Doom. I can't wait to see how that goes down. You got yourself a brand new Sub.
There’s no way they’re not gonna show his face. If it was another actor than sure don’t show him. But it’s RDJ, the wow factor when he takes off his mask & the avengers see him with absolute shock will be worth it for the audience
Honestly, I liked the Doom monologue more because it felt more personal and had more details.
5:55 Doctor Doom’s origin & exposition
11:05 The Watcher’s exposition
I think the gradual line of villains for The avengers to face is pretty decent. 1st you have Dr Doom, 2nd is Kang the Conqueror, and 3rd is Galactus. Have the silver surfer act as an end credit signifier of what's to come (Galactus) for both F4 &/or the Avengers films. Just give the fantastic 4 time to have their own movies and fight with Doctor Doom before they have to share him with the rest of the multiverse, PLEASE!!??
"The names Doom...DR DOOM." *roll credits*
One of the only theories I can behind 100%!!
I will assume that Wanda will be the one teaching Dr. Doom's Magic.
Fantastic, probably could have woven the 10 rings in there somehow
One change... Doom trusted Reed... He didn't call Galactus. The world eater came anyway, but they weren't ready and were unable to stop the destruction of their world. Doom was right, better to call The World Eater and fight on your terms at the right time... Reed was wrong.
Doomlings is an AWESOME card game I got it like a year ago. Play with my fiancé very often
They should keep it with getting scared trying to save his mother from mephisto and Reed is responsible for his failure that should be his grudge against Reed, if you remember in civil war when stark fought buck and cap, stark tell cap that bucky killed his mom. It be a nice little nod and kind of show similarities of doom and stark
Just finding out I subscribed to the second channel and had no idea this one existed!
“So you’re telling me we’re some kind of Secret Wars?”
I love the story. My initial thoughts though:
1) Doesn't Maria Rambeau have Quantum bands in the X-men universe shown at the end of The Marvels?
2) I was under the impression that Loki was safekeeping the timelines of the 616 universe, not the multiverse beyond. (a contentious subject, I know)
Timelines = multiverse in TVA/Loki. For example, in Loki its mentioned that branching timelines spawn the multiverse kangs.
This version of doom could be as smart and fight skilled as Sherlock rich as Stark but focus on more subtle techniques like bullet proof fabrics, infused Vibranium (keeps ties with Ulysses’s Klaw) and disguise to survive and help make the world safer and better in his eyes. He is more interested in the magic and power his universe has to offer still being a man of science and gadgets.
He would still be interested in Mind Stone but for its ability to grant powers, not realizing it would grant him more power but also alter his mind revealing the multiverse to him and showing him how to stop Thanos (or at least making him aware of Thanos who could have stone at this point.) he faces Thanos with help of Fantastic four and defeat him. Doom and Reed part ways as they disagree on how to deal with threats including Galactus who tempts him to become his herald. Doom accepts (gets power cosmic) but then betrays Galactus after Galactus defeats all or most of the Fantastic Four (I think Jonny can survive for future stories as his character has lots of growth to go through, like Last Ronin maybe he sacrifices himself to slow down Doom)
Victor von Doom walks on stage, cameras flashing... "I am the Doctor Doom"... The room erupts... Roll credits.
I appreciate the shout out to the trope "Reed Richards is Useless".
The MCU could go with the route that doom is the sole survivor from Dumonmu realm. Having to use the dark magic there to escape.