QUESTIONS COMMENT THREAD: What questions do you have? Reply to this comment so I can see it better! This video was out early for patrons AND MY FANTASTIC UA-cam MEMBERS for those interested in watching videos early next time!
What do you think about the la-la-las used repeatedly in Hadestown? Are they too pop-sounding for a musical theater show or do they have purpose like some of the pop sounds in Poison?
It's funny you mention it because I actually talked about that in one of my other videos I think, though I can't remember which one hahaha. The reason why the use in Hadestown is so genius is because Orpheus can only sing "Lalalala" because the Gods have forgotten the song of their love. He sings that because the world doesn't actually know the words to Persphone and Hades' song. I think it's extremely smart. Orpheus only knows the melody of Persphone and Hades' song, but not the words, it gives this "it's on the tip of my tongue" yearning.
Question! When talking about those essential aspect of songs - the 'I want' song - how much of that is an essential for Western songs? Bc it seems like this is a more recent Disney invention that applies to this century of musical culture. Do songs and musicals in the East, South, and Northern cultures have this sort of thing? Is it a necessary function to have in musicals? What differences are there in the cultures that can create these sort of staple tropes. Western values in individualism informs the popularity in an 'I want' song but what would Eastern values in community result in?
So in terms of the “I Want” song, I use Disney examples because they are most easily accessible, but it goes alllllllll the way back to shows from the 1940s. So definitely not a recent thing at all! But yeah still within this century I suppose xD When it comes to musicals elsewhere, it’s important to note that we basically have “operas, plays and musicals” when it comes to theatre. (There’s other things too but just to keep it very basic) - Operas are pretty much sung all the way through so all of the characters thoughts are conveyed through song. So it’s hard to say whether there’s an “I Want” song per se cause they be singing all the time 😂 to me an opera is where they sing everything whereas a musical is where they decide to sing because words are not enough. I don’t know a lot about individual types of opera in other cultures, but I think it’s safe to say there’s almost a constant stream of consciousness in opera to some extent. Whereas musicals stop and start. What I DO know though - even musicals made for/in Japan tend to follow musical theatre conventions. For example, The Death Note Musical has “I Want” songs and that was written for a Japanese audience in mind, though by an English composer and lyricist before being translated into Japanese. As far as I understand (though I could be wrong) - in terms of Japan specifically their music takes a lot from Jazz and musical theatre, and jazz and musical theatre are inherently connected. There are actually cases where in Japan they will write new “I Want” songs for characters - for example, the all-female musical theatre revues have a hierarchy where the woman playing the male lead is most important. So for Anastasia the musical - even though it’s about Anastasia, they wrote Dimitri more songs because he didn’t have enough of a “lead” to be the “leading star.” In order to maintain the idea the female performer playing the male part was most important they needed to give Dimitri more presence basically lol. With that said - you’ll actually see that sometimes a lot of anime OPs seem like “I Want” songs. There’s a lot of storytelling within things like Vocaloid for example. Other cultures usually have opera, whereas the idea of a “musical” is American, so musicals are sort of “exported” to places like Japan, Korea, etc. But you can still see a jazz and musical theatre influence in their pop music which I actually think is interesting.
More on that as well: idk how interested y’all are in the J-Pop / J-Rock side of things, but that’s part of the reason why I love a lot of Japanese music specifically. Think about Usseewa for example, if you heard it: The rough translation is something like this of the first verse: I was an honor student being young Before I realized, I was already grown up A train of thought like a knife Which I didn't have that with me But I'm not having enough fun Something is missing These troubles better are somebody's fault I'm just confused today Now I’d suggest looking up an English version because obviously that’s a very rough translation. But think about that. It’s not really a generic song - we have a character in the text here. We find out the characters backstory, that all their life they have been an honour student - but now they’re an adult and their life is empty. All the promised adults made them about working hard and being rewarded weren’t true. So we find out their troubles and in the verse they allude to “wanting more”, and through the rest of the song they find out what that is. I think Japanese J-pop / J-rock does have a lot of individualism because it’s a way to rebel against the idea of a collective. And that’s what this song specifically does. But if you look at a lot of Japanese music, it’s interesting how much more they use “I” or “Me” and have this sort of story arc going on compared to western pop songs.
From the way I read the song, it's meant to end like that as Angel doesn't know what he wants but 'out of this hell', he has forgotten what there is outside of it and so, he doesn't know what he wants apart from 'something to live for', which I feel is very relatable. You can't wish for something you don't know, you can't think of, you can't wish for more money if you don't know what it is or what it does. He has nothing to want because he has nothing to live for and if he has nothing to live for, how can he wish for more than freedom from this situation?
I understand what you mean but something we were taught in school is that characters should have “a best case scenario, a worst case scenario, and the most likely case.” - he can not know for sure what will happen but we still dream and have ideas. We fantasize about our lives. I think you’d be hard pressed to find a person who truly doesn’t know - everyone has some sort of fantasy. And this is a story anyway, so to me, Angel has to know.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch this is exactly why having strict rules everyone has to follow kills art, just let Vivzie tell her story, if the character doesn’t know because he literally has no way out, he doesn’t know periodt😭 not everything has to go by a book that was written 2 decades ago
“Let Vivzie tell her story” She already did. And some people who were excited for the show like me were disappointed. Is there a reason why we can’t talk about that? Not to mention that it may be “her story” but theatre is a team sport, and there are multiple times throughout the season where it seems likely, if not certain, the songwriters were not allowed to “step on the toes” of the scriptwriters (see Whatever It Takes and how nothing of a song that is). I want them to tell the story at their best possibly capacity and this is not their best: probably because they wrote 16 songs in 8 weeks 🥴🥴🥴🥴
😭😭😭😭 yeah Stayed Gone was especially painful. People were saying I wasn’t even a real fan of the show and hadn’t watched the episode - even tho we have reactions on our other channel!
Playing devils advocate here. The Helluva Universe, which Hazbin was originally a part of gets insane amounts of hate everyday from peopke who dont even watch the shows, just hating it because they hate Vivziepop. So I kinda get why they shoot first ask questions later
@@boo9781 Yeah it's veered pretty far off from its original premise but it's become something more fulfilling to watch because of that. Maybe it's just bc I have low patience for episodic shows but I think it'd get pretty old if it's just "characters get a client request, go to human world, hijinks insue, kill target, lol, repeat". They still do that but we see less of it now because the show *wants* to be more character focused and plot driven than it did at first. And personally I much prefer the characters the way they are now compared to the pilot's one-dimensional versions. The writing is up to personal taste.
..... Why can't they HIRE you??? 😭😭😭😭 "Yeah, yeah, yeah" is actually much deeper and it works in this pop song because Angel Dust is actually saying yes and no. He does want Val and wants to continue to sin but doesn't due to his passions issues. The internal struggle of his passions. ☦ Such a brilliant use of the Pop song. I don't like the uses of yeah yeah yeah or la la la, too. But in this case, it works because of the story. Lots of modern music today are from the devil. Vivian did her research. That's WHY the use of the POP song worked. It's demonic.
I’m looking for a job I am on my knees 😂 but yeah I totally agree with that part. The pop world IS demonic, so it’s really good in that regard. Despite the mystery problem I outline half way through, it makes a lot of sense why they decided to use pop music to me!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I understand. I don't like the mystery issue in the song, too. In order to understand the song, you have to research Angel Dust's back story which is not a good idea in animation. His back story should come first then this song so that the viewers would understand it better in the series. I understand what Viv was trying to do because Christianity is full of revelations, dreams, mystery, hopefulness and sadness. She just wanted to make a What if Christianity AU musical which I'm fine with. LOL. But yeah, they should definently hire you. Most of the songs are not that good and needs revisions. I guess they ran out of money and time? Anyways if I were a director or producer like Viv, I would have hired you! 😭
They ran out of time, and they tried to please everyone. I’ve been looking at a kneecapped Radio Demon for the last few months, as well as a being a historian who is looking at the fact that Vox has Canonized that Hell only became up to modern tech speed 7 years ago when Alastor left, as well as Alastor’s major power only occurring after his deal, which has hamstrung Alastor as a character, and should have changed the _entire_ layout of Hell and Vox never would have nicked WiFi from the surface. Not to mention _that isn’t how being a radio host works_ and… I am having to actively sit on my hands knowing I probably won’t fit with Viv and the crew to not attempt to come in and help them fix their magic/reality problem. Because the plot hole that got made by not understanding A) future shock, and B) how radio works and how that is all WiFi, and all cell service is radio based, has actively created a reality where the concept of physical space and time has ceased to exist. Making people control various tech without understanding how that tech was developed off each other, means you might do something bad/dumb and they’ve managed to just nose dive their world building into the ground.
@@Crisjola Actually, incorrect. Ancient technology and modern technology had existed ever since the early 1900s and way before that time. Egyptians and Sumarians used bacteries and electrcity. I took film class and found that our gov are at least 80 years ahead of us. I mean, neurolink and MRNA vax had existed for so many years now which was admitted by our government. I had family members that worked in the gov. But yeah, the world building and lore are terrible.
@@Featheryfaith7 oh I’m not here to debate if the gov’t is about 50-80 years ahead of us in tech, I’m former physics and left the concept joining of the CIA because I didn’t wish to be deleted but I had considered it originally because I knew they were ahead and I wished to specialize in nano robotics. However, I’m not talking about wha you are, I’m talking about what the average person has access to and can do world building with and needs to understand about science and etc to put a demon like Alastor in control of the radio and then make Vox his main rival. Vox would act a very particular way, as would Al, and both of them not acting that way and Vox basically handing Alastor the keys to his empire by going wireless is just… the math isn’t mathing.
I feel like Angel's actual I want song is going to be in the second season, after he finds that thing *to* hope for. Now he has the hotel found family and has been able to open up to husk and not only not be rejected, but get closer, so in season two we'll probably see him finally let himself be himself enough to find his want instead of just hiding away.
I really like this, especially after Husk helps him to find another identity apart from the porn star angel identity that he can’t keep up because it’s destroying him
I hope so. I am worried though because apparently S2 is going to have more songs but like.... they only had 8 weeks to write the 16 songs they had in Season 1!
Exactly, when I first listened I didn't really like it and thought it was quite useless until everyone kept talking about it, so I decided to break it down more.
Personally, for me, I feel like it lacks subtext. Like the show wants to be so adult and so edgy with it seems but then it just goes out of its way to tell us. “Oh angel’s hurt angels gulping up this poison from Valentino.” And I think personally that addict did a much better job at portraying Angel as a Character: the mask he wears and his pain, even what he wants. And the visuals especially are just so good. Plus the fact is he shares this song with Cherri, so they can write a song for Angel that displays who he is while giving half the song to his best friend! Edit: Never mind, apparently Addict was a fan made song. But Viv did add the end were Angel lets his mask slip, which I think is probably my favorite part of the song (so good on her I guess).
I think Angel Dust as a character reflects a larger problem in character writing, where pity is used in place of endearment. Pity hits us in all three parts of the rhetorical triangle - logos, ethos, and pathos - and makes us feel good. To me, at least, I found Angel's constant jokes irritating. Showing us he's actually sad is an attempt to make him less annoying. Now, you can't go online and say "I found Angel annoying" because then someone on Twitter will call you a name for not being sympathetic enough. As for your argument that musicals are built around hopefulness, it's important to remember that a lot of early Broadway people were Jews. They or their ancestors escaped persecution to live a better life, but found new challenges in America. You'll notice a lot of old Broadway stories are about fitting into a new crowd or dealing with prejudice or escaping where you are. Broadway has always been about hope. A dreary musical of commiserating in misery feels wrong to the medium itself.
The thing is that the show isn't hopeful at all and is written terribly. The hilarious irony and clowning around. The whole point of the show subconsciously by Viv. And I might have to rewrite using philosophy... The universe will never work according to God. ☦ I agree to disagree. I understand what Vivian was trying to do because I'm Orthodox. If you're not Christian, then you won't get it. I do see life as a musical too. It's hopeful but yet depressing.
While I do disagree with the idea that Poison is bad, I do think you articulated your points well enough to warrant understanding. Some dislike Poison, some adore Poison, and some think Poison is average, and that's perfectly alright. It all comes down to taste.
Thank you! I don’t think the song is bad per say but I do think the thing I mention at the mid way point (no spoilers 😂) is something that needs to be addressed. But the song itself, I think, is not terrible.
i like poison because it shows how trauma survivors hide their pain underneath an idealized version of themself, while the actual imagery of the song shows what's actually happening and how angel literally has to disassociate and disappear just like real victims
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch After revisiting this video, I have to ask: How did you get such a high quality version of the instrumental? And can I please have it?
I think I just found it on UA-cam! If I can figure out which video it was in particular I'll link it but I finished this video a while ago so I don't know if I have the link! But I'm sure it's out there somewhere haha
This is why I really enjoy this channel because even though Poison is my second favorite song after Loser Baby you are pointing out a lot stuff in this song I definitely didn't think of , also do you think Loser Baby has One Fatal Flaw since it's considered the most popular song from Hazbin Hotel ?
holy shit incredible analysis poison is (still) my favorite song from hazbin hotel and yet there's so much stuff i didn't even notice until you pointed them out here great work and great video 👍
Imo in the post-chorus "baby" is supposed to rhyme with "I'll be" since in the song the "yo-o-o-ours" is like the "oh-oh-oh-oh" before so the "I'll be" fits better after "that's the way you got me" sorta like: "oh-oh-oh-oh" "any way you want me baby" "that's the way you got me, I'll be" "yo-o-o-ours" idk i hope what i was trying to say made sense haha 😅
My favourite part of the song is literally those first two lines. Never thought about how the "yeah yeah yeah" could have an additional meaning in the lyrics. neat
I'm personally not very attached to Hazbin, but your videos help me so much!!! I find a lot of song lyric videos boring, so yours really help me with good examples and reasoning.
I do think it being a Pop Song was a good choice, its commercialized and "glamorous" like the buisness he's in under Valentino. I will make a reach here so like take this with a LOT of salt, the Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, could be a "Yes Valentino, Yes Valentino, Yes Valentino." That Val wants.
I came here to basically say this! Also, Angel isn't a ~musical theatre~ type of character, I doubt that he'd choose to express himself with classic theatre tunes. Using a pop song for Angel's number is a character choice, as well as a stylistic one to represent the environment he's in. The glitz and glamour of pop music hides the grit of the industry it rises from, same as his experience with s3x w0rk.
I agree. Poison would not work as a traditional broadway tune, because it doesn't reflect Angel Dust as a character. Angel is essentially Hell's version of real world idols. Think celebrities like Miley Cyrus or Rupaul Charles. _That_ is who Angel Dust is, and Poison reflects that.
About how blatant of a Pop song "Poison" is, I always wondered if it HAD to be a pop song as some sort of censureship. The topic is pushing the boundaries of what is normally allowed to be shown so much that they couldn't make it a regular musical number like the others because that would have Angel, Valentino, and every other character in it actually interact in a "normal" way. By making it a fast paced pop song and the story on-screen like a music video they can avoid that all of this ever really feels like a Scene in the plot which I think was most likely needed to get this included at all.
I always thought the more fast paced pop beat was supposed to portray a sense of desperation and panic. It felt very frantic to me, and I think that's part of the reason why I forgive the pop production.
The Latam Spanish dubbing changed the "yeah, yeah, yeah" to "oh baby" And I think ties the lyrics better, examples: «…every night a new love, oh baby» and «How many of your lies I endured, oh baby» Nice video! 💕
I'd argue that in System of a Down's song BYOB, the use of lalala is used well. It's a HEAVY song, but the lalala is used as a good transition into the more poppy chorus. The chorus is poppy because the song is criticizing the glamorization and the "fun" of going into war. So, I think that's a good use of the filler words.
Talking about how you should set up a pattern in the lyrics if you want to surprise your audience reminds me of Mr. Brightside, which I think is a perfect example of this "Now I'm falling asleep and she's calling a *cab*" "While he's having a smoke and she's taking a *drag*" "Now they're going to bed and my stomach is *sick*" "And it's all in my head but she's touching his *chest*" Chest doesn't rhyme with sick, even though we expect a rhyming word there, and it leads into the chorus, also helping us understand how the singer feels disoriented
11:18 This is really random but in "Blame Canada" theres one lyric that goes "With all their beady little eyes. And flapping heads so full of lies" and I've been really obsessed with that lyric. Nice to see another fan of the eyes-lies rhyme
I love your videos so much! It's clear you're very passionate about musical theatre and hearing you analyze every little detail (like I sometimes do when watching/reading my favorite media) is very interesting. I really like Poison as well as the other songs from Hazbin, but it's great to learn all the ins and outs of how the music and lyrics actually are intended to work. Keep up the awesome work!
I honestly feel like not making it an I want song is actually intentional, because he doesn't *know* what he wants. His soul is contractually bound to Val, so he doesn't see any way out, and he has all the indulgences he could want and the best they can do for him is shut it out for a while. The way he sees it, he's completely stuck, so he can't even imagine what to hope for.
I do wish that he had an idea though. Because the funny thing about humans tends to be that even when we're hopeless, we still imagine things anyway, we just think we can't possibly have them. Our imaginations run wild without us, and I'd love to see a version of this song where maybe Angel is so "addicted" to multiple things like partying because when he blacks out he actually goes somewhere where his mind can freely think about a dream.
another great video! your vids really feel like talking to a friend, it's always so nice :) i personally just sort of like poison, its about in the middle of my hazbin song ranking. fun to dance to, but not a lot of substance. i always thought the red-hot eyes/red-hot lies thing was a very r/im14andthisisdeep lyric, but i have a bigger appreciation for it now. im not a native english speaker, so i wasnt aware of all the different meanings that that adjective has. and yeah, i get the confusion around molly for people who only got into the show when the series came out. i was personally a pre-series fan so i knew about her (a speedpaint of her and angel dust was actually my introduction to hazbin), but i can imagine it can feel weird to find out that angel apparently has a secret sister you never knew about lmao. i think it wouldve been really neat if angel had an "i want" song, but oh well 😭😭😭
Awwwww thank you so much! I’ve started to keep non-English speakers more in mind lately (same with the “Yeah Yeah Yeah” explanation) cause of some of the comments I was getting before, I’m really glad it was helpful! I hope Angel will get another song eventually. Hopefully Season 2 will be better than season 1 in terms of addressing these sorts of criticisms 💖
I think it could've been interesting for angel to sing something along the lines of "Everything is horrible here, I wish I could live free and do simply relax but it's impossible so why should I fight for the impossible?" yaknow, give Angel the goal of resting and rebuilding his life at his own rithym but maintaining the hopelessness of not him feeling like he's able to reach that goal
I totally agree. I made a video on Happy Day In Hell as well and this is basically what I suggested for an Angel section in that song, rewriting it to have the entire cast. So Angel would be like “If I could be free from the contract it would be a happy day in hell” And then everyone would sing their own section with their desires!
I disagree with your thoughts on “Fillin’ up my glass but it’s always hollow.” I thought it was a clever metaphor for addition, no matter how much you have you can’t get enough the “glass” is always hollow.
I know that’s what they wanted to go for but it would have been more clever if they were able to use a more correct word. Cause like I said a glass can’t be really be hollow so it ends up just not making sense.
I think maybe you would enjoy analyzing Starkid lyrics, especially Nerdy Prudes Must die songs. Also I really love your dedication and knowledge, and performance! Its really, really entertaning!
Thank you so much! Sometimes I don't like Starkid cause they feel much more like "parody" or "making fun of theatre" then trying to be genuine - but I think they are at their best when they are genuine, like the songs in Twisted. I'd love to cover Twisted someday!
I think the pop style works for Angel Dust, but I felt like Addict was more effective while going for something similar. I figure a big part of it is that it's more catchy (and if nothing else, a pop song should be catchy =P) but it also has a leg up on the point that a musical song is meant to tell you something new about a character, as at the time of Addict it would be easy to dismiss Angel as being a shallow irreverent character based on the pilot, but Addict gives you a lot more about the character (as well as Cherry Bomb). It also ends on a more hopeful note though I don't really mind songs being more despairing or hopeless but then I would prefer it to go a little harder but then the song is basically about Angel dissociating through his abuse so it makes sense to sound vacuous...but then knowing it's supposed to sound that way doesn't make it better to listen to.
I wonder if anyone would be interested in me going over Addict even though it's not "canon" anymore! But yeah I feel like Addict did a bit better in terms of giving us information compared to this song.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I think it could be interesting...lyrically I'm actually not sure which I like better between Addict and this one. Addict I think is funnier, but it also seems to take place at an earlier point where Angel can still joke about or brush off what he's going through more easily. Plus I think Hazbin was going more for a dark comedy at first, but ended up being more serious, so they couldn't quite go for a song about Angel's abuse that sounds so light-hearted (even if you have other jokes playing on similar themes in the show =P)
good analysis, i just randomly got recommended this vid, probably because i listen to poison so much lol and while i love the song, and im usually not a big pop person, its probably my favorit from the show. i have said before on twitter how its kinda a weird song because its the only song in the show that is not literal, the lyrics are about how Angel is addicted to Val and the life style i guess, but the music video is all about how he puts up this front to cope, right? how he switches on his persona on camera and dances along with whatever horrid thing Val wants him to do. and my interpretation of that is that he cant even admit to himself that he does that, not until Husk confronts him later and he breaks down crying :( so to me the song is ment to be more of a look in to his mind, so yeah maybe a pity song but it also shows us how messed up he is, like we get to see behind the fasad even before he admits it to himself.
Thank you! Yeah I just wish they had either introduced this song before we had those lines from Husk about Angel being fake (because then it delivers the info about the fake persona from the get go) or they had added just a little bit more. But I do think the lyrics are better than people are claiming.
My favorite song from the series. It’s a lot like ADDICT sure but that doesn’t make it bad. They both have their strong points. We can clearly see that and hear in the final verse just how much the “poison” is hurting Angel physically, mentally, and emotionally. Hell in the episode it literally ends with him collapsing on the studio balcony crying. It’s just utterly heartbreaking but it’s an amazing song to listen to and while the visuals are uncomfortable, that’s the whole point. I also really love what they did with the remix of the song by TheLivingTombstone that came out April 1st in celebration of Angel Dust’s birthday. Adding some lines from Val really gives a creepy vibe to the song and as much as I want to hate it because it’s Val, my least favorite character, for obvious reasons, I can’t help but love the addition of his lines into the song. 🎵What’s the worst part of this Hell? I can only blame myself🎵 “Good boy” 😬😳
Yeah, I've seen a lot of people compare Addict and Poison to each other, but I don't think they can be compared like that. They are both Angel Dust songs but they exist in different circumstances, and so of course they're going to be different you know? Like they serve a different purpose. I still wish this was an I want song, but it's lyrics are more meaningful than people think for sure!
Yeah. Also episode 4 is my favorite. It’s definitely the hardest to watch. There’s great action in the penultimate scene when Angel and Husk kill the shark gangster demons outside the bar, cute moments between Charlie and Vaggie sprinkled in like Vaggie lovingly carrying Charlie off to bed as Charlie sobs hysterically after Angel thanks her for caring about him, the jokes that are in the episode are absolutely hilarious and always have me laughing. Then you have the main plot and how tragic it is. It’s always utterly heartbreaking to me and I cry every single time even though I already know what’s going to happen. The scene in Angel’s dressing room is definitely the hardest part to watch. Seeing Val beat and yell at Angel is devastating, as is Angel’s terrified “no” after Val forcibly touches his chest. It’s so hard to see that happen because just before Angel used his robe to cover his chest because Val had a hand reached towards Angel trying to touch him or pull his chest fluff. The fact the camera doesn’t pan away and shows the moment so clearly with Val looking down at Angel with that perverted smile…💔😭 Poor Angel. It’s just so heartbreaking and props to the team for portraying it in such a realistic way.
You know brining up how Poison feels kinda empty because its not a traditional "I Want Song" (i.e., character exploration/establishment) and works off what was told to the audience about the character outside of the song i kinda realized that Hazbin misses the mark in general on being a traditional stage musical. I decided to liaten to the soundtrack and pretended that i had no knowledge of the series which is the ultimate test for the effectiveness of a musical's songwriting. At the end of nearly 20 pieces (which is a lot) i did not come away with a solid grasp of the plot because only maybe 4 of them are actively about the ongoing story and no real understanding of the characters. The only characters who actively sing about their desires and goals (which tells the audience that they are important/are the main characters) are Vox (beating Alastor), Pentious (apologizing and repenting), and Carmila (protecting her daughters). All of these are either secondary or tertiary characters and none of their goals interlace with each other. Thats a problem. Basically at the end of roughly 20-30min of music (which is the main point of interaction an audience has with a musical) if you dont watch the actual show you barely understand what the story is about and the only characters you really know anythibg about only have maybe 5 or so combined minutes of actual dialouge across nearly 4 hours of content.
This is REALLY interesting, and that's why this sort of exercise is really important. We have to imagine we've never seen the show before and try to see what we can understand, but a lot of writers don't tend to do this anymore sksksksk.
I think it could still be perceived as an I want song in a way. Like you said, songs like Part of Your World and Go The Distance both have what the character wants in the title, and in a way, Poison does too. It's showing in the song how Angel hates his situation but keeps coming back to Valentino, not just because he's bound by him, but also because he was, at some point, genuinely drawn to Valentino, and might have even loved him. So even though he knows it's hurting him, he still wants his poison, he still wants that high. That wasn't really something that was addressed beforehand in the episode, or even in the show. We felt bad for him because we were only shown the bad, shown what Valentino was doing to him. But until Poison, it wasn't really ever shown that the choice to keep going back was somewhat voluntary (just pouring this outta my brain lmao it probably doesn't make sense but who knows)
I know what you mean but I’d argue that the reason why it’s more of an “I Am” song is because Angel Dust “IS” poisoned whereas an “I Want” would be more like “I’m in this situation but my dream is to reunite with my family” or something. Like you’re right about the songs content but what would differentiate it is the idea of Angel Dust talking about what he wants beyond. Cause it’s showing us too much information we already know. I wonder if part of the problem is the show was too afraid to write songs that were “too integral” to the narrative. It reads more like the script was written without the songs in mind and the songs were added after. Vs writing the script and having the song be part of the script. Because a lot of songs suffer from this issue.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch That last part makes a lot of sense and I totally think that's what happened. It's weird to me though, because if you look at the songs in Helluva Boss, they all serve a purpose, they all fuel the narrative, and I wouldn't cut a single one. It makes me think that Hazbin was just rushed and not nearly as much thought was put into it as there should have been.
Late to the party here, but as much as I still really enjoy Hazbin for what it is in the creative climate (Inspired to the roof!), Vivzie's character arcs give a lot of "Tim Burton B-plot" where they sometimes leave more questions than they answer. In my opinion, as a dabbling musician who writes his own material, there's a fine line between expressing a problem in the form of song (or any way you couldn't otherwise) and just commiserating with no clear resolution. It's a universal issue, and I'd be lying if I said I don't struggle with it. Hehe I think "Poison" is an ok song on its own. Its simplicity and repetition match the cyclical nature of addiction. Though I can see how its execution- especially in the context of the show as a whole, and how it was marketed in the first place- doesn't reconcile. And in regards to people struggling with addiction and abuse irl (Assuming the writers intended Angel Dust to resonate that deeply), this might tug some collars. Just my two cents.
I absolutely love this! I learned a lot about song writing and structure from your videos! If you ever get the chance I hope you can get into breaking down Steven Universe songs since I've only ever heard good things about them from a fan perspective but not from a song writer perspective
I think the song can work well as a recap for those who for a reason or another don't want to see the whole epsiode. They still get the picture what is happening but they don't have to witness the potentially triggering material.
Poison is more or less Angel's unheard cry for help. Due to the beat of the music the listeners who would be seeing it in the shows universe can just dismiss what the singer is saying because the beat of the song is too addicting. Or the classic "victim dismissal" attitude that is given towards people such as Angel. At the point in the story this song is used, Angel has spent over 70 years in Hell. He has likely been used and abused before Valentino. He also has literal blood family members who range from not very nice-complete monsters in Hell who want to make sure he isn't a problem for them in any way. Even his closest friend Cherri, is someone he does put at an arms length distance no just so she won't be dragged into his problems, but also so she doesn't turn against him herself. He is also from a culture where trust is limited and not openly given. Even though he knows he has people around him at the hotel that he can talk to about what is happening. He doesn't know them or trust them well enough to let them know about his situation because that means admitting to allowing things to happen to him because of the contract. Charlie means well, but she's been sheltered much of her life so she is trying to help sinners with no real understanding of her own people. Angel also has been beaten down enough by Valentino's abuse and lies to believe that even if Charlie does know whats going on, she still wouldn't be able to do anything to help him. Even later on in the episode, when he is telling Husk that if he ruins himself enough then maybe Val would tire of him. However, I do believe Angel is aware that when Val feels gotten all he can get out of the Spider, he would just eliminate him completely. So, Angel has accepted that non-existance would be preferable to where things are now.
I don’t know if this is talked about in the vid btw I just started it and thought of that when u mentioned it being the only pop song while the rest was musical theatre
Thank you so much for the video! I adore Hazbin Hotel and i enjoy your videos as I am extremely bad in music analysis and theory. Poison and Stayed Gone are two of my four favorite songs (More than anything, Loser Baby) and your videos don’t change but, but recognizing their flaws is super important still. Do you plan to make more videos on Hazbin Hotel or even Helluva Boss?
Thank you so much! And yes, absolutely! October is going to be a little different because I want to do all "Halloween Themed" content (Villain songs, Nightmare Before Christmas etc lol) but I am working on a Hazbin Hotel script for not this upload but the next upload! I will hopefully cover every song one day, even if it takes a while (like ideally doing one Hazbin song a month until I do all of them). In terms of Helluva Boss, I have watched it and react to it on my main channel. I had a script in progress for the Solitas and Blitzo song but I'm not sure if I'll ever do Helluva Boss since there are so many. Maybe when I'm caught up with all the Hazbin Hotel songs since I'll need more to do!
Hey, I haven’t watched the video yet but during the intro you talk about how you don’t really like pop songs and I’d just like to suggest listening to Mili, I’m not sure if you’ll like them but I think they’re a really great band :D Also… I’d prolly freak out if ya ever analyzed Alien Stage 👀 its a series of music videos that tell a story, made by a UA-camr called Vivinos. It’s in Korean (there’s official English subtitles tho) so I don’t know about the rhyme analyzation. Sorry, it’s the only thing on my mind rn cause round 6 just came out and i definitely didn’t cry :’)
It's interesting - you're the second person who has suggested this to me in the past 24 hours! And the other comment wasn't even on this channel, it was on my gaming channel! I'll have to seriously check it out!!
Hazbin Hotel's songs are catchy but I can't lie, some of these lyrics make me skull emoji when I actually think about them for too long I'm still asking myself wth "Sugar on the cream" even MEANSSSSSS
Honestly, I really wish you could analyse 'Loser Baby' because I see a lot of discourse around the community about it and I think it'd be cool to know what you think about it!
Poison is my favorite song in the show, and I don’t mean to be someone who can’t listen to their favorite shows take criticism, but 90% of these criticisms feel very academic and nitpickey. I don’t really care if Poison isn’t a good “I want” song, I don’t really care if it’s not a good “I am” song. It’s a certified fucking BANGER and that’s all that matters to me. Ps. Loved the video, while I don’t always agree the academic criticisms are interesting to learn about and you expand my perspective on music regularly.
What I will say about this: a song being a banger is not the same as a song being good for the story or the plot. I understand why this sentiment happens but there's a difference between "this song is a bop for me to listen to as I do ______" compared to the idea that it serves the story to the best it can. And so when I talk about these things it's less about the song not being "good" but the song being good for the narrative, and this show just has way too many narrative issues that the songs could have fixed because of how much information songs can pack in in a short period of time compared to a script.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch ahhh I see. when I wrote this comment I believe I misunderstood your intentions. I thought you were criticizing the piece of music, not the story that it’s a part of. That is my mistake. Thank you for clarifying!
Yeah for a musical especially the issue of “song” and “story” to me is inseparable. Like personally that’s why I don’t analyze songs that are part of shows I haven’t watched, because how could I give a proper in-depth exploration without knowing the context the song was placed in? To me it has to be “analyzing the song as part of this show” Vs just analyzing it as a piece of music that exists.
“Commiserating” is the word of the day! I actually almost feel bad for calling Poison bait outright, because I’m really not sure if that was actually a conscious choice now. There was clearly SOME thought put into the structure of the song and you’ve given me a new appreciation for it. Ultimately though, you’re right that the song has no real purpose narratively and that’s a bigger fish to fry than “pop song bad”. Actually, this explains why I found Loser Baby so much more compelling than Poison despite the fact that Poison is supposed to be the more ‘serious’ character driven piece.
Ahhh I only saw this right now, thank you so much!! That's what I want people to understand when they're like "but the song is a banger tho" etc etc - it's not that the song ISN'T a banger but there's a difference between "this is fun to listen to in my every day life" and "This is necessary for the story and keeps us coming back to the story". Because honestly I don't think I need to watch Hazbin Hotel S1 again for some time, and I'm not coming back to listen to the songs either... there has to be some sort of reason why I can watch this multiple times instead of just seeing every episode twice.
Yeah a couple people have said that, it threw me off a bit because “I’ll be yours” is a full sentence. But it would be “I’ll be. Yours.” If that’s the rhyme in a way 😂😂
33:45 maybe a line that could have worked here is "I keep gettin' my fill but still I stay hollow". I don't know if that's actually any good cadence-wise tho
I thought that the pop sound was a clever choice, since the audience is disensitised to sexualization of singers in pop music. It was kinda giving me 'All you wanna do'
People have been bringing this to my attention recently and I'm like... what????? They wanted all this broadway talent but didn't hire broadway writers? I mean when they do well they are GOOD (like Loser Baby) but.... what....
I think that that thing you call hopelesness in today's songs and narratives is not it. It's more about, not changing, not puting in the work. We can see so many Mary Sues in modern media, so many characters that never develop, that are perfect just the way they are and their only problem is they need to realize that. And it works both ways - I love redemption arcs but they are gone right now. Villains are either pure evil scumbags with no redeeming qualities, given a mix of everything we hate in society and other poeple bashed together OR misunderstood uwu's that actually were good all this time and did nothing wrong / were manipulated by the former one. No changing, no realizing you did something wrong on a deeper level than "we need to say sorry to our friends!". And consequences of your own actions don't aply. They are always injust, or artificial. Angel didn't do anything wrong, he was tricked, but he blames himself because he just has such a good and pure heart! Basically, "this situation is shity right? Don't worry we feel bad for you and you are right to feel bad." End of the message. It's about validation, not progression. Patting on the head, because "nothing is ever your fault" so "you can't fix this either, why bother trying". That's how I see it at least.
Yeah I think that's a fair analysis as well! I think it's actually a connected issue (the hopelessness / validation cycle) - I think in real life right now, we feel like our lives are hopeless and there's nothing we can do to change it. And to some extent, I feel like that's not a wrong way to feel. Like as an example, the job market is REALLY bad right now, so many people are unemployed and struggling to find a job and it's not their fault. And so we want to be told that things like that are not our fault, or not indicative of our worth and our value. However, at the same time, or the flip side of that: I know personally as a performer I could be doing more to train. When I don't book an audition even though I do my best, part of me also knows "I should have practiced x, y and z more, I should have set more time away from UA-cam and Job Hunting to run through some dances" etc etc. I think that we've lost the nuance of knowing that some things in life aren't our fault or within our control, but also acknowledging when we do things or do not do things that could be within our control, if that makes sense. Characters are written to be "relatable" and to validate the concerns of the audience - instead of having a character validate those concerns but also try to fight against their current circumstances. It's difficult with Angel because abuse is much more serious than say, something like a job. But I think they couldn't handle the nuance of "Angel is not at fault for being abused. However, what he is at fault for is how he treats other people around him. He makes people uncomfortable by touching them in ways they don't appreciate or making jokes at their expense or only seeing them as objects (like Husk). And Angel can be a victim but also still do wrong and need to be kinder." I honestly think it would be more compelling if Angel didn't "always" have a pure heart, but instead fought to be "good" because he wants to be better than someone like Val. He wants to have friends, not be above other people, etc etc.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Yes! Totally agree. I'm Polish so I also see a lot of those issues as an americacentrism bleeding through the mentality of creators (bu t that might be just me beeing salty haha). Yes, it's a problem with explanation VS excuse about how Angel and other characters treat people. Like "they were abused so it's okay, or even DMIRABLE that they are now awfull". Sounds like coping by the creators themselves sometmes. I agree that the thing with Angel is waaay more complex but just see specks of the same issues in this song I see in "lighther" cases. There is also problem with points of view and objective good / bad guys. Especially in the show where characters are suppose to be morally gray, but the creators don't seem to really know what that grayness actually means let alone how to express it, so they end up with "it's okay when we do it but not okay when the antagonists do it, because WE are the main characters". Kind of like with the idea of treating SA in the show. When we have Angel's beeing taken really seriously etc, but then having Sir Pentious or Moxxie SA'd for a joke. It makes it seem like the show has to TELL US instead of showing because it holds itself together with "trust me bro" and "because I said so" rules. (sorry if I run around in circles in that message, It's late at night here :' D)
How about Love is For Peasants from Barbie Island Princess? I always found it so genius, fun and well-written! Also I love listening to you, you are just so smart and sweet!
What you said about staying gone probably is why I like milky melodies version better. Also I would maybe like to see a video on you comparing milky melodies hazbin rewrites and her villain origin rewrites as well as Lydia the Bard's Disney's princesses villain song series and how they rewrite the original song. A comparison of the two. Especially Lydia's version of this wish considering how bad that song was.
Yeah I totally understand that! My videos are more about the songs in the narrative vs the songs as they resonate with like, people individually and why! I appreciate you listening to the criticism!
Poison always felt like, the show runners loved the song too much NOT to include it despite them not needing the song. I actually haven't watched the show but I think the episode has another song in it too, right? Loser baby. So the episode already has a song, no need for Poison, but the show runners loved it so much they refused to cut it despite the show not needing it to work.
I think the point is though that not all episodes should be required to have two songs. An episode should have three songs if it needs to, or only one it if needs to. But every episode having two as a hard rule is not a good idea lol.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuchOh btw, 33:20 "Hollow doesn't really work with a glass" PREACH IT! I would've taken advantage of Angel's Italian accent to stretch the word "SHALLOW", like as if saying the glass is always the same no matter what. In English, we use the word "shallow" to mean that it's flat, uninteresting, repetitive. It would allude to the idea that nothing has changed for Angel It also could be a metaphor for SHALLOW waters. Waters that lack depth, as if referring to the fact that his life is lacking. It has no purpose as far as he knows.
This is the first time where I agree that breaking the format is actually a real detriment to one of the Hazbin songs because I feel like it's the only one so far that doesn't really fit its purpose in the story. Stayed gone makes sense to be messy because it's Vox trying to run publicity before Alastor can butt in and interrupt. Carmilla being sloppy in respectless makes sense because the point of it is Velvette trying to pick at her nerves and destabilize her authority. But in poison, the song is meant to almost be our way of sharing Angel's masking and dissociation from his circumstances, so it's probably the song in the whole show where staying "steady" has the biggest importance.
Yeah I totally agree. This is something we need to keep in mind when talking about if a song is "good" or "bad", like I'm mostly concerned with the song being good as it's intertwined with the story as opposed to people commenting about how much they like it and it being fun to listen to. That's great, but not what I'm after lol.
There is no hope in song! And that's why we love this show. There is no sweetness, like it will be good and now don't be afraid. No, life is f***t up, we made mistakes and now we have to live with them, face the consequences. Not Disney tra la la and now unicorns and rainbows (pre LGBT meaning, just childish love and happiness without worries and problems). And even permanently happy happy and emotional incompetent, and whole life sheltered Charlie saw the harshness of this world. And even and the end there is glimpse of hope, but everyone now know, that the way will not be happy and easy. Just like in the real world, other people don't care about you, the boss will try to destroy you, the bank want to make deal with you and then you are on the bank leash you put the mask or other 'god loving' people will make your live hell. You are loosing trust in people, expect the betrayal. You have to drink that poison what life serve you and if you don't find your fellow bartender and eat this 💩 together you will drawn in that poison till the sad end... This show is just about our lives...about our hell where rules are constantly braked, where hurt regular people like us has no power to fight back. Where governments trap us in their stupid wars, new ways of entrapment are implemented 'for ecology'. It's not Disney movie...
If there is no hope in the show, it shouldn’t be a musical. You know that not every musical is Disney, right? Sweeney Todd is about a murderer and it’s probably one of the darkest shows on broadway. But at the end of the show there’s still two characters who “get away”. Same with Les Mis - tons of people dying, but the lovers get to escape. Same with Hunchback of Notre Dame (which IS Disney) - Esmeralda dies, but the point of the ending is that despite her death, her death was the catalyst for the people of Paris fighting back. Orpheus turns back at the end of Hadestown (which is also about hell!) but the hopefulness is that despite how the story ends, we sing it anyway. If there is no hope in the story, the story shouldn’t be a musical. Because this is a medium with a long history of having that element in its storytelling.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch And that's why this medium is great for breaking rules. There was a lot of platformer games, happy collecting points for childen and then Grand Theft Auto came. Totally diferent approach, outragous, brutal. People sad - this can't be, they brake the rules! And now GTA is huge franchize, set the path for others. With strict, safe musical you can predict what will happen. The heros are full of hope and you kinda see that before. In Hazbin when Husk sing "You think your life is wrekt" - you predict that now he will say - it will be good, you saw that in so many musicals before. NO! He sad that it's bad and you su**. In poison Angel has breakdown. He has no hope for change, he is done. What he want from life? What life? There is no life for him. Give character soul? He doesn't have right to his soul anymore! Doing somethink totally diferent make it interesting. You simply just can't predict nothing anymore. Whats missing in Hazbin? Predictivity. After music education you expect how it will work, you study it, deconstruct. Now you can't be sure anymore.
The video game example isn’t very good - because what we’re talking about is maintaining the same skeleton but filling it with different content. GTA has the same skeleton as many games, but it has different CONTENT. Loser Baby is actually a good example because it has a good skeleton, but becomes unpredictable as you said. But you can’t use Loser Baby and apply that to all the other songs because Loser Baby is the only song that does this successfully and perfectly. Songs must be both surprising and inevitable. It must be predictable but also shocking. That’s the problem. The only way to be genuinely shocking is to have the predictability contrasted with the uniqueness. If it’s just surprise after surprise, it seems like a mess.
Poison is a great song to listen to. & Yes, I really love this song. But I have to agree with you that Poison is functionably terrible! Like. I'm trying to make my own parody of poison(for personal reasons). But no matter what I do. It's so hard to place complex words & stay on beat... 😭
Yeah that's what I want more people to hopefully understand - it's not that the song is bad to listen to in terms of like... idk, in the car and you're jamming - it's just the story purpose could have been much stronger.
Your channel and your personality screams Criticism is my love language And also if it's not Too much of a big deal.Can you please do loser baby next on the hazbin list Because I Really wanna see your thoughts on that But i'm also very scared because it's my favourite song in general
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch btw your can-do like atidude and happy look and extremly joyfull Mannerisms is Extremely infectious When I watch your videos I smile too much i simply love it
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch J-pop is better than western pop, yes, but western pop isn't inherently bad. It's like gotten candy, has no nutritional value, but tastes good, and isn't going to harm you in moderation. Also, no idea if this counts as pop, but I loved the song cotton candy in Helluva boss episode 8 of season one, the episode where Ke$ha guest stared, idk, it felt thematically appropriate
So why I can't stop hearing Hazbin rules braking songs, but not rules friendly Disney songs? Academic static rules are now so boring, because this is EVERYWHERE. Maybe it's catchy. And in Poison 'going backwards' because his mental state is deteriorating. And because hell is not perfect (obviously) songs should be perfect too. This is not 'perfect Disney fairytale'. And this pop-like is not matching? It's like Anthony's mask. It's not real, music theatrey, himself. He is acting just like masses expect from acting of p**n star.
I use Disney examples because they are most accessible, but these aren’t “Disney rules” - they are broadway musicals rules. There are stories on broadway about similar things (like Sweeney Todd for example), Little Shop of Horrors, Hadestown, and they still follow this structure. They aren’t Disney stories at all LOL.
I think you’re the first person who has ever said something is actually worst than I’ve said 🤣 like everyone tries to convince me it’s better and I’m wrong but this is “it’s worst and you’re wrong” 😂😂
The biggest of problems for me is definitely the use of "dissassociate" when the correct wording would be "dissociate". It always hurts my soul to the point i have despised the music.
@@sweetbnuyhi, english degree here, that’s incorrect. Disassociate is just fine here. It’s not a mistake. Both words would work just fine. Sure, disassociate is more of a general term rather than specifically referring to trauma. That doesn’t make it incorrect.
While I disagree with everything bc I think the way you regard musical theater is a super narrow space reduced to the traditional I think the video was interesting, in my opinion hazbin hotel is one of the best musicals of the last years and it’s interesting how different profesional can have perspectives so different
I appreciate you leaving a nice comment even if you disagree! I wouldn't consider myself as overly traditional though - for me it's more so that the story should be above else and something Hazbin really tends to struggle with is making the songs story relevant. Like I have no issue with the songs being in a more "pop-style" sound but I do think that the bare minimum needs to be "if the song is removed the story can't function" and for this song, "Whatever It Takes" and a few of the other ones they just don't justify themselves well enough. And the reason why these rules exist isn't because someone wrote them down in a book and expected everyone else to obey, but rather, they were developed based on the findings of artists working on their own shows. It's not like "having a story-irrelevant song is UNACCEPTABLE" because some old guy said so but more like "Hey, if you do this audiences tend to get annoyed because they feel like you wasted their time". Not everyone will but especially with other songs (like Whatever It Takes) which I just uploaded, the majority of the comments are people saying either they forgot this song existed or they were annoyed by how pointless it was. I hope that helps to explain the perspective a little bit!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I’m sorry but I truly disagree about saying that this song doesn’t justify itself. What that rule means is that a song that does not contribute anything to the show is a bad song, but poison is not that, poison does not move the story forward but it makes you stop and think about angel. Poison is a song that studies and digs into Angels character to a point where without poison we wouldn’t really understand him, it’s his song, it shows us what he has to deal with every day, how he copes with it, how he wears a mask in order to survive the poison he is addicted to but is slowly killing him, poison is made to show the viewer what angel truly is like without his mask to a point no scene of Val abusing him could. It may not move the story but without it we wouldn’t really understand his arc and we spetially wouldn’t drop tears of joy while hearing loser baby, it’s like saying part of that world is a bad song because it doesn’t move the story forward and it’s just character exposition we could see the surface of watching her scenes fighting her father. I truly believe people are being extremely mean to hazbin hotel for some reason, it obviously has problems but I think the internet has decided to destroy this womans career because they simply don’t like her (I’m obviously not talking about you, I just wanna say what I fell about the monstruous hate the show is receiving)
I mention this in the video though (probably closer to the end) but I think the issue with that is, is that the script is too afraid for the song to be "too important" and so all the details you bring up are already in the script during this episode. I don't think this song helped me understand Angel because I already understood Angel from prior episodes and the things that happen before and after this song. For example, I already understood Angel wearing a mask because we see this at the very beginning of Episode 4. I understand what you're saying that character exposition is as useful as moving the plot forward (I would say character exposition or an "I Am" song IS still moving the plot forward) - but for me I needed something more. Like my example about Angel mentioning his sister or his family, something that simple would have made the song "worth it" for me. If they continue to be afraid to make details song-exclusive, the songs will continue to be watered down. It also doesn't help that even though this technically isn't the show, if you've been interested in Hazbin Hotel for a long time, you would have already seen Addict, which also explains this. The show obviously needs to cater to new fans but I don't know if new fans OR old fans really learned anything they didn't already know in terms of this being a character exploration.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch bruh, the mask thing is never implied in the episode until the song began, that was the point it was made explicit, before there are forshadowing so you could have got but it’s from this song on where we are introduced to this concepts. the blame he feels as he thinks in the end it was him who got himself in the situation, how he knows that this life is slowly killing him but he is still addicted to it like an addicting poison, how he has no hope about the future and he is willing to keep dying in this hell he is in, how he uses his mask as a way to fell superior to the situation and he thinks he is in control. All of those things are introduced and studied during the song having not really a proper introduction before it. Beforehand we were exposed to Angel being controlled and abused by his boss, his fear of Val, his submission to him but that’s just the surface of his character, it’s the song that really builds the character and makes a complex and incredibly well written character, without the song we would only see him as a sasy boy who is a false because he suffers from sexual and laboral abuse, it’s in the details where the sauce is. All this info is used after the song of course but the important thing is that the plot presumes you have heard the song in order to work upon the info it brought u. Also I don’t think talking about Ángels family would have been a smart move, it would be way out of nowhere (as this song is about Ángels suffering) and it would present a thematic contrast so hard it would take you out of the song.
I'm pretty sure I showed a clip of the mask thing! There's a line where Husk says something to Angel and Angel responds "I'm an actor", and that's where the mask concept is laid on really thick before the song even starts. Husk makes too many comments about Angel's persona being a front and superficial to be a revelation when we reach the song. I also believe that Angel's demeanour changing when he sees Val's messages happens in this episode but also in an episode before this one. But I don't have my Amazon Prime subscription anymore so I can't check right this minute lol. Basically I don't think there's "enough" sauce, even though I see what you're saying. The song reinforces that Angel is a complex character, but it doesn't exclusively plant the idea that Angel is complex because we see that in prior episodes, in the pilot and also in Addict. I don't think anyone before this song was thinking "man, Angel is a really one-note character who is just sassy and sometimes really mean". So it doesn't come across as a revelation. In terms of Angel's family, I think that the reason why it would have been a good idea is because Angel needs a reason to want to change outside of Val - and joining his family in Heaven and finally being a "good kid" or a "good brother" would be compelling. Like we understand Angel wants to get away from Val, but what would he do after? I think that's something that the show needed to dig into more. It wouldn't be out of left field if the song explored how Angel was an addict in life, and now once again poisoned in death. Proud of Your Boy from Aladdin is able to accomplish this angle of Aladdin screwing up over and over again and wanting to be better, but not knowing how to be. Obviously the song is about Angel's suffering but it doesn't JUST need to be commiserating. The suffering would be stronger if it was contrasted by what Angel sees as the ideal life, or what would bring him happiness.
I absolutely love your videos, I would gladly watch some isolated discussions on other disney movies like the ones you have mentioned here Its great to see commentary on works in theater and other . in fact I grow to be infatuated with them because of this channel ! Looking forward to more 🦦
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QUESTIONS COMMENT THREAD: What questions do you have? Reply to this comment so I can see it better! This video was out early for patrons AND MY FANTASTIC UA-cam MEMBERS for those interested in watching videos early next time!
What do you think about the la-la-las used repeatedly in Hadestown? Are they too pop-sounding for a musical theater show or do they have purpose like some of the pop sounds in Poison?
It's funny you mention it because I actually talked about that in one of my other videos I think, though I can't remember which one hahaha. The reason why the use in Hadestown is so genius is because Orpheus can only sing "Lalalala" because the Gods have forgotten the song of their love. He sings that because the world doesn't actually know the words to Persphone and Hades' song. I think it's extremely smart. Orpheus only knows the melody of Persphone and Hades' song, but not the words, it gives this "it's on the tip of my tongue" yearning.
Question! When talking about those essential aspect of songs - the 'I want' song - how much of that is an essential for Western songs? Bc it seems like this is a more recent Disney invention that applies to this century of musical culture. Do songs and musicals in the East, South, and Northern cultures have this sort of thing? Is it a necessary function to have in musicals? What differences are there in the cultures that can create these sort of staple tropes. Western values in individualism informs the popularity in an 'I want' song but what would Eastern values in community result in?
So in terms of the “I Want” song, I use Disney examples because they are most easily accessible, but it goes alllllllll the way back to shows from the 1940s. So definitely not a recent thing at all! But yeah still within this century I suppose xD
When it comes to musicals elsewhere, it’s important to note that we basically have “operas, plays and musicals” when it comes to theatre. (There’s other things too but just to keep it very basic) - Operas are pretty much sung all the way through so all of the characters thoughts are conveyed through song. So it’s hard to say whether there’s an “I Want” song per se cause they be singing all the time 😂 to me an opera is where they sing everything whereas a musical is where they decide to sing because words are not enough. I don’t know a lot about individual types of opera in other cultures, but I think it’s safe to say there’s almost a constant stream of consciousness in opera to some extent. Whereas musicals stop and start.
What I DO know though - even musicals made for/in Japan tend to follow musical theatre conventions. For example, The Death Note Musical has “I Want” songs and that was written for a Japanese audience in mind, though by an English composer and lyricist before being translated into Japanese. As far as I understand (though I could be wrong) - in terms of Japan specifically their music takes a lot from Jazz and musical theatre, and jazz and musical theatre are inherently connected. There are actually cases where in Japan they will write new “I Want” songs for characters - for example, the all-female musical theatre revues have a hierarchy where the woman playing the male lead is most important. So for Anastasia the musical - even though it’s about Anastasia, they wrote Dimitri more songs because he didn’t have enough of a “lead” to be the “leading star.” In order to maintain the idea the female performer playing the male part was most important they needed to give Dimitri more presence basically lol.
With that said - you’ll actually see that sometimes a lot of anime OPs seem like “I Want” songs. There’s a lot of storytelling within things like Vocaloid for example. Other cultures usually have opera, whereas the idea of a “musical” is American, so musicals are sort of “exported” to places like Japan, Korea, etc. But you can still see a jazz and musical theatre influence in their pop music which I actually think is interesting.
More on that as well: idk how interested y’all are in the J-Pop / J-Rock side of things, but that’s part of the reason why I love a lot of Japanese music specifically. Think about Usseewa for example, if you heard it:
The rough translation is something like this of the first verse:
I was an honor student being young
Before I realized, I was already grown up
A train of thought like a knife
Which I didn't have that with me
But I'm not having enough fun
Something is missing
These troubles better are somebody's fault
I'm just confused today
Now I’d suggest looking up an English version because obviously that’s a very rough translation. But think about that. It’s not really a generic song - we have a character in the text here. We find out the characters backstory, that all their life they have been an honour student - but now they’re an adult and their life is empty. All the promised adults made them about working hard and being rewarded weren’t true. So we find out their troubles and in the verse they allude to “wanting more”, and through the rest of the song they find out what that is.
I think Japanese J-pop / J-rock does have a lot of individualism because it’s a way to rebel against the idea of a collective. And that’s what this song specifically does. But if you look at a lot of Japanese music, it’s interesting how much more they use “I” or “Me” and have this sort of story arc going on compared to western pop songs.
I think that analysis on the song's outro is exactly why you'll see people say that its Anthony talking there, not Angel Dust
Exactly!
From the way I read the song, it's meant to end like that as Angel doesn't know what he wants but 'out of this hell', he has forgotten what there is outside of it and so, he doesn't know what he wants apart from 'something to live for', which I feel is very relatable.
You can't wish for something you don't know, you can't think of, you can't wish for more money if you don't know what it is or what it does.
He has nothing to want because he has nothing to live for and if he has nothing to live for, how can he wish for more than freedom from this situation?
I understand what you mean but something we were taught in school is that characters should have “a best case scenario, a worst case scenario, and the most likely case.” - he can not know for sure what will happen but we still dream and have ideas. We fantasize about our lives. I think you’d be hard pressed to find a person who truly doesn’t know - everyone has some sort of fantasy. And this is a story anyway, so to me, Angel has to know.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch this is exactly why having strict rules everyone has to follow kills art, just let Vivzie tell her story, if the character doesn’t know because he literally has no way out, he doesn’t know periodt😭 not everything has to go by a book that was written 2 decades ago
“Let Vivzie tell her story” She already did. And some people who were excited for the show like me were disappointed. Is there a reason why we can’t talk about that? Not to mention that it may be “her story” but theatre is a team sport, and there are multiple times throughout the season where it seems likely, if not certain, the songwriters were not allowed to “step on the toes” of the scriptwriters (see Whatever It Takes and how nothing of a song that is). I want them to tell the story at their best possibly capacity and this is not their best: probably because they wrote 16 songs in 8 weeks 🥴🥴🥴🥴
I highly doubt these writers thought that far ahead.
Hazbin fans inability to take criticism is insane even with someone like you who seems to LIKE the content they can’t take it in good faith
😭😭😭😭 yeah Stayed Gone was especially painful. People were saying I wasn’t even a real fan of the show and hadn’t watched the episode - even tho we have reactions on our other channel!
Playing devils advocate here. The Helluva Universe, which Hazbin was originally a part of gets insane amounts of hate everyday from peopke who dont even watch the shows, just hating it because they hate Vivziepop. So I kinda get why they shoot first ask questions later
@@user-pi3hd2bt3ftbf, helluva boss is written terribly, to the point that the pilot has actually nothing to do with the actual show
@@boo9781 Yeah it's veered pretty far off from its original premise but it's become something more fulfilling to watch because of that. Maybe it's just bc I have low patience for episodic shows but I think it'd get pretty old if it's just "characters get a client request, go to human world, hijinks insue, kill target, lol, repeat". They still do that but we see less of it now because the show *wants* to be more character focused and plot driven than it did at first. And personally I much prefer the characters the way they are now compared to the pilot's one-dimensional versions. The writing is up to personal taste.
I'm a Hazbin Hotel fan, and I love Calxiyn's dissections of these songs. It's very informative and helped make me appreciate music more.
.....
Why can't they HIRE you??? 😭😭😭😭
"Yeah, yeah, yeah" is actually much deeper and it works in this pop song because Angel Dust is actually saying yes and no. He does want Val and wants to continue to sin but doesn't due to his passions issues. The internal struggle of his passions. ☦
Such a brilliant use of the Pop song. I don't like the uses of yeah yeah yeah or la la la, too. But in this case, it works because of the story. Lots of modern music today are from the devil. Vivian did her research. That's WHY the use of the POP song worked. It's demonic.
I’m looking for a job I am on my knees 😂 but yeah I totally agree with that part. The pop world IS demonic, so it’s really good in that regard. Despite the mystery problem I outline half way through, it makes a lot of sense why they decided to use pop music to me!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I understand. I don't like the mystery issue in the song, too. In order to understand the song, you have to research Angel Dust's back story which is not a good idea in animation. His back story should come first then this song so that the viewers would understand it better in the series. I understand what Viv was trying to do because Christianity is full of revelations, dreams, mystery, hopefulness and sadness. She just wanted to make a What if Christianity AU musical which I'm fine with. LOL. But yeah, they should definently hire you. Most of the songs are not that good and needs revisions. I guess they ran out of money and time? Anyways if I were a director or producer like Viv, I would have hired you! 😭
They ran out of time, and they tried to please everyone. I’ve been looking at a kneecapped Radio Demon for the last few months, as well as a being a historian who is looking at the fact that Vox has Canonized that Hell only became up to modern tech speed 7 years ago when Alastor left, as well as Alastor’s major power only occurring after his deal, which has hamstrung Alastor as a character, and should have changed the _entire_ layout of Hell and Vox never would have nicked WiFi from the surface.
Not to mention _that isn’t how being a radio host works_ and… I am having to actively sit on my hands knowing I probably won’t fit with Viv and the crew to not attempt to come in and help them fix their magic/reality problem. Because the plot hole that got made by not understanding A) future shock, and B) how radio works and how that is all WiFi, and all cell service is radio based, has actively created a reality where the concept of physical space and time has ceased to exist. Making people control various tech without understanding how that tech was developed off each other, means you might do something bad/dumb and they’ve managed to just nose dive their world building into the ground.
@@Crisjola Actually, incorrect. Ancient technology and modern technology had existed ever since the early 1900s and way before that time. Egyptians and Sumarians used bacteries and electrcity. I took film class and found that our gov are at least 80 years ahead of us. I mean, neurolink and MRNA vax had existed for so many years now which was admitted by our government. I had family members that worked in the gov. But yeah, the world building and lore are terrible.
@@Featheryfaith7 oh I’m not here to debate if the gov’t is about 50-80 years ahead of us in tech, I’m former physics and left the concept joining of the CIA because I didn’t wish to be deleted but I had considered it originally because I knew they were ahead and I wished to specialize in nano robotics.
However, I’m not talking about wha you are, I’m talking about what the average person has access to and can do world building with and needs to understand about science and etc to put a demon like Alastor in control of the radio and then make Vox his main rival. Vox would act a very particular way, as would Al, and both of them not acting that way and Vox basically handing Alastor the keys to his empire by going wireless is just… the math isn’t mathing.
As someone who knows NOTHING about music, I really enjoyed this
Thank you so much!!
I feel like Angel's actual I want song is going to be in the second season, after he finds that thing *to* hope for. Now he has the hotel found family and has been able to open up to husk and not only not be rejected, but get closer, so in season two we'll probably see him finally let himself be himself enough to find his want instead of just hiding away.
I really like this, especially after Husk helps him to find another identity apart from the porn star angel identity that he can’t keep up because it’s destroying him
I hope so. I am worried though because apparently S2 is going to have more songs but like.... they only had 8 weeks to write the 16 songs they had in Season 1!
The thing with Poison is that you really, really need to read into it to get some of the lyric choices. On a first listen it feels a bit hollow
Yeah exactly! Even those “Yeah Yeah Yeah”s mean something!
Exactly, when I first listened I didn't really like it and thought it was quite useless until everyone kept talking about it, so I decided to break it down more.
Personally, for me, I feel like it lacks subtext. Like the show wants to be so adult and so edgy with it seems but then it just goes out of its way to tell us. “Oh angel’s hurt angels gulping up this poison from Valentino.” And I think personally that addict did a much better job at portraying Angel as a Character: the mask he wears and his pain, even what he wants. And the visuals especially are just so good. Plus the fact is he shares this song with Cherri, so they can write a song for Angel that displays who he is while giving half the song to his best friend!
Edit: Never mind, apparently Addict was a fan made song. But Viv did add the end were Angel lets his mask slip, which I think is probably my favorite part of the song (so good on her I guess).
I think Angel Dust as a character reflects a larger problem in character writing, where pity is used in place of endearment. Pity hits us in all three parts of the rhetorical triangle - logos, ethos, and pathos - and makes us feel good. To me, at least, I found Angel's constant jokes irritating. Showing us he's actually sad is an attempt to make him less annoying. Now, you can't go online and say "I found Angel annoying" because then someone on Twitter will call you a name for not being sympathetic enough.
As for your argument that musicals are built around hopefulness, it's important to remember that a lot of early Broadway people were Jews. They or their ancestors escaped persecution to live a better life, but found new challenges in America. You'll notice a lot of old Broadway stories are about fitting into a new crowd or dealing with prejudice or escaping where you are. Broadway has always been about hope. A dreary musical of commiserating in misery feels wrong to the medium itself.
Astor? What in the Hell are you doing here??
@@SavouryGalette Cal is my friend!
@@astorrhymemaster I didn't know that, that's really cool.
Two of my favorite song analysis UA-camrs are friends.
@@SavouryGaletteWAIT UR RIGHT??? THAT'S SO COOL
The thing is that the show isn't hopeful at all and is written terribly. The hilarious irony and clowning around. The whole point of the show subconsciously by Viv. And I might have to rewrite using philosophy...
The universe will never work according to God. ☦
I agree to disagree. I understand what Vivian was trying to do because I'm Orthodox. If you're not Christian, then you won't get it. I do see life as a musical too. It's hopeful but yet depressing.
While I do disagree with the idea that Poison is bad, I do think you articulated your points well enough to warrant understanding.
Some dislike Poison, some adore Poison, and some think Poison is average, and that's perfectly alright. It all comes down to taste.
It's actually a brilliant use of the POP song to tell a story because modern songs are demonic, really. Vivian did her research...
Thank you! I don’t think the song is bad per say but I do think the thing I mention at the mid way point (no spoilers 😂) is something that needs to be addressed. But the song itself, I think, is not terrible.
i like poison because it shows how trauma survivors hide their pain underneath an idealized version of themself, while the actual imagery of the song shows what's actually happening and how angel literally has to disassociate and disappear just like real victims
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch After revisiting this video, I have to ask: How did you get such a high quality version of the instrumental? And can I please have it?
I think I just found it on UA-cam! If I can figure out which video it was in particular I'll link it but I finished this video a while ago so I don't know if I have the link! But I'm sure it's out there somewhere haha
This is why I really enjoy this channel because even though Poison is my second favorite song after Loser Baby you are pointing out a lot stuff in this song I definitely didn't think of , also do you think Loser Baby has One Fatal Flaw since it's considered the most popular song from Hazbin Hotel ?
I think Loser Baby may be the only song I think is 100% perfect, but I still need to take a look at it! No spoilers XDD
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Awesome I look forward to your video on Loser Baby 🙌
holy shit incredible analysis
poison is (still) my favorite song from hazbin hotel and yet there's so much stuff i didn't even notice until you pointed them out here
great work and great video 👍
Thank you so much!
Imo in the post-chorus "baby" is supposed to rhyme with "I'll be" since in the song the "yo-o-o-ours" is like the "oh-oh-oh-oh" before so the "I'll be" fits better after "that's the way you got me"
sorta like:
"oh-oh-oh-oh"
"any way you want me baby"
"that's the way you got me, I'll be"
"yo-o-o-ours"
idk i hope what i was trying to say made sense haha 😅
Ohhhhhhh that makes sense to me! Not exactly a perfect rhyme but I’ll take it haha.
Came here to say this
My favourite part of the song is literally those first two lines.
Never thought about how the "yeah yeah yeah" could have an additional meaning in the lyrics. neat
Yeah those two have the brain tickling alliteration!!
I'm personally not very attached to Hazbin, but your videos help me so much!!! I find a lot of song lyric videos boring, so yours really help me with good examples and reasoning.
It makes me so happy to hear I can make learning fun for you guys! I hope y’all found this one funny, I put a lot of editing into it 🤣
I do think it being a Pop Song was a good choice, its commercialized and "glamorous" like the buisness he's in under Valentino.
I will make a reach here so like take this with a LOT of salt, the Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, could be a "Yes Valentino, Yes Valentino, Yes Valentino." That Val wants.
I like that interpretation of the “Yeah Yeah Yeah” too!
I came here to basically say this! Also, Angel isn't a ~musical theatre~ type of character, I doubt that he'd choose to express himself with classic theatre tunes. Using a pop song for Angel's number is a character choice, as well as a stylistic one to represent the environment he's in. The glitz and glamour of pop music hides the grit of the industry it rises from, same as his experience with s3x w0rk.
I agree. Poison would not work as a traditional broadway tune, because it doesn't reflect Angel Dust as a character. Angel is essentially Hell's version of real world idols. Think celebrities like Miley Cyrus or Rupaul Charles. _That_ is who Angel Dust is, and Poison reflects that.
About how blatant of a Pop song "Poison" is, I always wondered if it HAD to be a pop song as some sort of censureship.
The topic is pushing the boundaries of what is normally allowed to be shown so much that they couldn't make it a regular musical number like the others because that would have Angel, Valentino, and every other character in it actually interact in a "normal" way.
By making it a fast paced pop song and the story on-screen like a music video they can avoid that all of this ever really feels like a Scene in the plot which I think was most likely needed to get this included at all.
I always thought the more fast paced pop beat was supposed to portray a sense of desperation and panic. It felt very frantic to me, and I think that's part of the reason why I forgive the pop production.
The Latam Spanish dubbing changed the "yeah, yeah, yeah" to "oh baby" And I think ties the lyrics better, examples: «…every night a new love, oh baby» and «How many of your lies I endured, oh baby»
Nice video! 💕
I'd argue that in System of a Down's song BYOB, the use of lalala is used well. It's a HEAVY song, but the lalala is used as a good transition into the more poppy chorus. The chorus is poppy because the song is criticizing the glamorization and the "fun" of going into war. So, I think that's a good use of the filler words.
Talking about how you should set up a pattern in the lyrics if you want to surprise your audience reminds me of Mr. Brightside, which I think is a perfect example of this
"Now I'm falling asleep and she's calling a *cab*"
"While he's having a smoke and she's taking a *drag*"
"Now they're going to bed and my stomach is *sick*"
"And it's all in my head but she's touching his *chest*"
Chest doesn't rhyme with sick, even though we expect a rhyming word there, and it leads into the chorus, also helping us understand how the singer feels disoriented
i’ll be honest i’ve listened to mr brightside a bunch of times and i still expect him to say ‘she’s touching his dick’
11:18
This is really random but in "Blame Canada" theres one lyric that goes "With all their beady little eyes. And flapping heads so full of lies" and I've been really obsessed with that lyric. Nice to see another fan of the eyes-lies rhyme
I love your videos so much! It's clear you're very passionate about musical theatre and hearing you analyze every little detail (like I sometimes do when watching/reading my favorite media) is very interesting. I really like Poison as well as the other songs from Hazbin, but it's great to learn all the ins and outs of how the music and lyrics actually are intended to work. Keep up the awesome work!
Awwwww thank you so much! I hope to continue making more 💖💖 as long as you guys keep enjoying them!
I honestly feel like not making it an I want song is actually intentional, because he doesn't *know* what he wants. His soul is contractually bound to Val, so he doesn't see any way out, and he has all the indulgences he could want and the best they can do for him is shut it out for a while. The way he sees it, he's completely stuck, so he can't even imagine what to hope for.
I do wish that he had an idea though. Because the funny thing about humans tends to be that even when we're hopeless, we still imagine things anyway, we just think we can't possibly have them. Our imaginations run wild without us, and I'd love to see a version of this song where maybe Angel is so "addicted" to multiple things like partying because when he blacks out he actually goes somewhere where his mind can freely think about a dream.
"the audience are like FISH" im d y i n g XD using that
Lol thank you, I love coming up with the most ridiculous way to explain these things
another great video! your vids really feel like talking to a friend, it's always so nice :) i personally just sort of like poison, its about in the middle of my hazbin song ranking. fun to dance to, but not a lot of substance. i always thought the red-hot eyes/red-hot lies thing was a very r/im14andthisisdeep lyric, but i have a bigger appreciation for it now. im not a native english speaker, so i wasnt aware of all the different meanings that that adjective has.
and yeah, i get the confusion around molly for people who only got into the show when the series came out. i was personally a pre-series fan so i knew about her (a speedpaint of her and angel dust was actually my introduction to hazbin), but i can imagine it can feel weird to find out that angel apparently has a secret sister you never knew about lmao.
i think it wouldve been really neat if angel had an "i want" song, but oh well 😭😭😭
Awwwww thank you so much! I’ve started to keep non-English speakers more in mind lately (same with the “Yeah Yeah Yeah” explanation) cause of some of the comments I was getting before, I’m really glad it was helpful!
I hope Angel will get another song eventually. Hopefully Season 2 will be better than season 1 in terms of addressing these sorts of criticisms 💖
I think it could've been interesting for angel to sing something along the lines of "Everything is horrible here, I wish I could live free and do simply relax but it's impossible so why should I fight for the impossible?" yaknow, give Angel the goal of resting and rebuilding his life at his own rithym but maintaining the hopelessness of not him feeling like he's able to reach that goal
I totally agree. I made a video on Happy Day In Hell as well and this is basically what I suggested for an Angel section in that song, rewriting it to have the entire cast. So Angel would be like “If I could be free from the contract it would be a happy day in hell” And then everyone would sing their own section with their desires!
Some of the people in the comments aren’t making the fan base look any better-😭😭😭
Sorry you have to deal with them
YEAH I don't know if people realize that LOL
I disagree with your thoughts on “Fillin’ up my glass but it’s always hollow.” I thought it was a clever metaphor for addition, no matter how much you have you can’t get enough the “glass” is always hollow.
I know that’s what they wanted to go for but it would have been more clever if they were able to use a more correct word. Cause like I said a glass can’t be really be hollow so it ends up just not making sense.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I know, sorry. They could said flask.
I think maybe you would enjoy analyzing Starkid lyrics, especially Nerdy Prudes Must die songs.
Also I really love your dedication and knowledge, and performance! Its really, really entertaning!
Thank you so much! Sometimes I don't like Starkid cause they feel much more like "parody" or "making fun of theatre" then trying to be genuine - but I think they are at their best when they are genuine, like the songs in Twisted. I'd love to cover Twisted someday!
I think the pop style works for Angel Dust, but I felt like Addict was more effective while going for something similar. I figure a big part of it is that it's more catchy (and if nothing else, a pop song should be catchy =P) but it also has a leg up on the point that a musical song is meant to tell you something new about a character, as at the time of Addict it would be easy to dismiss Angel as being a shallow irreverent character based on the pilot, but Addict gives you a lot more about the character (as well as Cherry Bomb). It also ends on a more hopeful note though I don't really mind songs being more despairing or hopeless but then I would prefer it to go a little harder but then the song is basically about Angel dissociating through his abuse so it makes sense to sound vacuous...but then knowing it's supposed to sound that way doesn't make it better to listen to.
I wonder if anyone would be interested in me going over Addict even though it's not "canon" anymore! But yeah I feel like Addict did a bit better in terms of giving us information compared to this song.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I think it could be interesting...lyrically I'm actually not sure which I like better between Addict and this one. Addict I think is funnier, but it also seems to take place at an earlier point where Angel can still joke about or brush off what he's going through more easily. Plus I think Hazbin was going more for a dark comedy at first, but ended up being more serious, so they couldn't quite go for a song about Angel's abuse that sounds so light-hearted (even if you have other jokes playing on similar themes in the show =P)
good analysis, i just randomly got recommended this vid, probably because i listen to poison so much lol and while i love the song, and im usually not a big pop person, its probably my favorit from the show. i have said before on twitter how its kinda a weird song because its the only song in the show that is not literal, the lyrics are about how Angel is addicted to Val and the life style i guess, but the music video is all about how he puts up this front to cope, right? how he switches on his persona on camera and dances along with whatever horrid thing Val wants him to do. and my interpretation of that is that he cant even admit to himself that he does that, not until Husk confronts him later and he breaks down crying :(
so to me the song is ment to be more of a look in to his mind, so yeah maybe a pity song but it also shows us how messed up he is, like we get to see behind the fasad even before he admits it to himself.
Thank you! Yeah I just wish they had either introduced this song before we had those lines from Husk about Angel being fake (because then it delivers the info about the fake persona from the get go) or they had added just a little bit more. But I do think the lyrics are better than people are claiming.
My favorite song from the series. It’s a lot like ADDICT sure but that doesn’t make it bad. They both have their strong points. We can clearly see that and hear in the final verse just how much the “poison” is hurting Angel physically, mentally, and emotionally. Hell in the episode it literally ends with him collapsing on the studio balcony crying. It’s just utterly heartbreaking but it’s an amazing song to listen to and while the visuals are uncomfortable, that’s the whole point. I also really love what they did with the remix of the song by TheLivingTombstone that came out April 1st in celebration of Angel Dust’s birthday. Adding some lines from Val really gives a creepy vibe to the song and as much as I want to hate it because it’s Val, my least favorite character, for obvious reasons, I can’t help but love the addition of his lines into the song.
🎵What’s the worst part of this Hell? I can only blame myself🎵
“Good boy”
😬😳
Yeah, I've seen a lot of people compare Addict and Poison to each other, but I don't think they can be compared like that. They are both Angel Dust songs but they exist in different circumstances, and so of course they're going to be different you know? Like they serve a different purpose. I still wish this was an I want song, but it's lyrics are more meaningful than people think for sure!
Yeah. Also episode 4 is my favorite. It’s definitely the hardest to watch. There’s great action in the penultimate scene when Angel and Husk kill the shark gangster demons outside the bar, cute moments between Charlie and Vaggie sprinkled in like Vaggie lovingly carrying Charlie off to bed as Charlie sobs hysterically after Angel thanks her for caring about him, the jokes that are in the episode are absolutely hilarious and always have me laughing. Then you have the main plot and how tragic it is. It’s always utterly heartbreaking to me and I cry every single time even though I already know what’s going to happen. The scene in Angel’s dressing room is definitely the hardest part to watch. Seeing Val beat and yell at Angel is devastating, as is Angel’s terrified “no” after Val forcibly touches his chest. It’s so hard to see that happen because just before Angel used his robe to cover his chest because Val had a hand reached towards Angel trying to touch him or pull his chest fluff. The fact the camera doesn’t pan away and shows the moment so clearly with Val looking down at Angel with that perverted smile…💔😭 Poor Angel. It’s just so heartbreaking and props to the team for portraying it in such a realistic way.
You know brining up how Poison feels kinda empty because its not a traditional "I Want Song" (i.e., character exploration/establishment) and works off what was told to the audience about the character outside of the song i kinda realized that Hazbin misses the mark in general on being a traditional stage musical.
I decided to liaten to the soundtrack and pretended that i had no knowledge of the series which is the ultimate test for the effectiveness of a musical's songwriting. At the end of nearly 20 pieces (which is a lot) i did not come away with a solid grasp of the plot because only maybe 4 of them are actively about the ongoing story and no real understanding of the characters. The only characters who actively sing about their desires and goals (which tells the audience that they are important/are the main characters) are Vox (beating Alastor), Pentious (apologizing and repenting), and Carmila (protecting her daughters). All of these are either secondary or tertiary characters and none of their goals interlace with each other. Thats a problem.
Basically at the end of roughly 20-30min of music (which is the main point of interaction an audience has with a musical) if you dont watch the actual show you barely understand what the story is about and the only characters you really know anythibg about only have maybe 5 or so combined minutes of actual dialouge across nearly 4 hours of content.
This is REALLY interesting, and that's why this sort of exercise is really important. We have to imagine we've never seen the show before and try to see what we can understand, but a lot of writers don't tend to do this anymore sksksksk.
I think it could still be perceived as an I want song in a way. Like you said, songs like Part of Your World and Go The Distance both have what the character wants in the title, and in a way, Poison does too. It's showing in the song how Angel hates his situation but keeps coming back to Valentino, not just because he's bound by him, but also because he was, at some point, genuinely drawn to Valentino, and might have even loved him. So even though he knows it's hurting him, he still wants his poison, he still wants that high. That wasn't really something that was addressed beforehand in the episode, or even in the show. We felt bad for him because we were only shown the bad, shown what Valentino was doing to him. But until Poison, it wasn't really ever shown that the choice to keep going back was somewhat voluntary (just pouring this outta my brain lmao it probably doesn't make sense but who knows)
I know what you mean but I’d argue that the reason why it’s more of an “I Am” song is because Angel Dust “IS” poisoned whereas an “I Want” would be more like “I’m in this situation but my dream is to reunite with my family” or something. Like you’re right about the songs content but what would differentiate it is the idea of Angel Dust talking about what he wants beyond. Cause it’s showing us too much information we already know.
I wonder if part of the problem is the show was too afraid to write songs that were “too integral” to the narrative. It reads more like the script was written without the songs in mind and the songs were added after. Vs writing the script and having the song be part of the script. Because a lot of songs suffer from this issue.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch That last part makes a lot of sense and I totally think that's what happened. It's weird to me though, because if you look at the songs in Helluva Boss, they all serve a purpose, they all fuel the narrative, and I wouldn't cut a single one. It makes me think that Hazbin was just rushed and not nearly as much thought was put into it as there should have been.
Late to the party here, but as much as I still really enjoy Hazbin for what it is in the creative climate (Inspired to the roof!), Vivzie's character arcs give a lot of "Tim Burton B-plot" where they sometimes leave more questions than they answer.
In my opinion, as a dabbling musician who writes his own material, there's a fine line between expressing a problem in the form of song (or any way you couldn't otherwise) and just commiserating with no clear resolution. It's a universal issue, and I'd be lying if I said I don't struggle with it. Hehe
I think "Poison" is an ok song on its own. Its simplicity and repetition match the cyclical nature of addiction. Though I can see how its execution- especially in the context of the show as a whole, and how it was marketed in the first place- doesn't reconcile.
And in regards to people struggling with addiction and abuse irl (Assuming the writers intended Angel Dust to resonate that deeply), this might tug some collars. Just my two cents.
You're like my favorite UA-camr I learn so so much in all of your vids and I'm so glad you're sharing ur thoughts w us 🩷
I absolutely love this! I learned a lot about song writing and structure from your videos! If you ever get the chance I hope you can get into breaking down Steven Universe songs since I've only ever heard good things about them from a fan perspective but not from a song writer perspective
Awwww thank you so much! I would love to, hopefully I’ll get to them someday!
I agree that Poison is lacking in terms of delving into Angel’s desires, I believe in ✨Addict ✨ supremacy
Yeah, I wish they gave us a little more!
I think the song can work well as a recap for those who for a reason or another don't want to see the whole epsiode. They still get the picture what is happening but they don't have to witness the potentially triggering material.
I disagree - in terms of the visuals of the song *is* the most triggering material imo.
As lyrics, the first version published was just a lyric video without the visuals.
24:00 - THIS this THISSSSS YESSS (i love this part)
Poison is more or less Angel's unheard cry for help. Due to the beat of the music the listeners who would be seeing it in the shows universe can just dismiss what the singer is saying because the beat of the song is too addicting. Or the classic "victim dismissal" attitude that is given towards people such as Angel.
At the point in the story this song is used, Angel has spent over 70 years in Hell. He has likely been used and abused before Valentino. He also has literal blood family members who range from not very nice-complete monsters in Hell who want to make sure he isn't a problem for them in any way. Even his closest friend Cherri, is someone he does put at an arms length distance no just so she won't be dragged into his problems, but also so she doesn't turn against him herself. He is also from a culture where trust is limited and not openly given.
Even though he knows he has people around him at the hotel that he can talk to about what is happening. He doesn't know them or trust them well enough to let them know about his situation because that means admitting to allowing things to happen to him because of the contract. Charlie means well, but she's been sheltered much of her life so she is trying to help sinners with no real understanding of her own people. Angel also has been beaten down enough by Valentino's abuse and lies to believe that even if Charlie does know whats going on, she still wouldn't be able to do anything to help him.
Even later on in the episode, when he is telling Husk that if he ruins himself enough then maybe Val would tire of him. However, I do believe Angel is aware that when Val feels gotten all he can get out of the Spider, he would just eliminate him completely. So, Angel has accepted that non-existance would be preferable to where things are now.
Maybe it’s a different style because a bunch(if not all) of it is in Angel’s head
I don’t know if this is talked about in the vid btw I just started it and thought of that when u mentioned it being the only pop song while the rest was musical theatre
Thank you so much for the video! I adore Hazbin Hotel and i enjoy your videos as I am extremely bad in music analysis and theory. Poison and Stayed Gone are two of my four favorite songs (More than anything, Loser Baby) and your videos don’t change but, but recognizing their flaws is super important still.
Do you plan to make more videos on Hazbin Hotel or even Helluva Boss?
Thank you so much! And yes, absolutely! October is going to be a little different because I want to do all "Halloween Themed" content (Villain songs, Nightmare Before Christmas etc lol) but I am working on a Hazbin Hotel script for not this upload but the next upload! I will hopefully cover every song one day, even if it takes a while (like ideally doing one Hazbin song a month until I do all of them).
In terms of Helluva Boss, I have watched it and react to it on my main channel. I had a script in progress for the Solitas and Blitzo song but I'm not sure if I'll ever do Helluva Boss since there are so many. Maybe when I'm caught up with all the Hazbin Hotel songs since I'll need more to do!
Hey, I haven’t watched the video yet but during the intro you talk about how you don’t really like pop songs and I’d just like to suggest listening to Mili, I’m not sure if you’ll like them but I think they’re a really great band :D
Also… I’d prolly freak out if ya ever analyzed Alien Stage 👀 its a series of music videos that tell a story, made by a UA-camr called Vivinos. It’s in Korean (there’s official English subtitles tho) so I don’t know about the rhyme analyzation. Sorry, it’s the only thing on my mind rn cause round 6 just came out and i definitely didn’t cry :’)
It's interesting - you're the second person who has suggested this to me in the past 24 hours! And the other comment wasn't even on this channel, it was on my gaming channel! I'll have to seriously check it out!!
Hazbin Hotel's songs are catchy but I can't lie, some of these lyrics make me skull emoji when I actually think about them for too long
I'm still asking myself wth "Sugar on the cream" even MEANSSSSSS
IM STILL THINKING ABOUT IT LOL
It's probably supposed to be like the phrase 'icing on the cake'.
@@OpheliaTerat oh I completely get that now but at the same time it's like-
That saying literally doesnt exist 💀???
Sugar on the cream is actually slang from when alastor was alive!
same with "that's the tea"
staring at the thumbnail as a percy jackson fan
I need to know what this means LOL
Honestly, I really wish you could analyse 'Loser Baby' because I see a lot of discourse around the community about it and I think it'd be cool to know what you think about it!
Can you explain what the discourse is? But yes it’s absolutely on my list!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch It's basically people with no media literacy saying that Husk is victim blaming Angel.
I probably should have also mentioned, don't worry, I will do every single song eventually!
Poison is my favorite song in the show, and I don’t mean to be someone who can’t listen to their favorite shows take criticism, but 90% of these criticisms feel very academic and nitpickey.
I don’t really care if Poison isn’t a good “I want” song, I don’t really care if it’s not a good “I am” song. It’s a certified fucking BANGER and that’s all that matters to me.
Ps. Loved the video, while I don’t always agree the academic criticisms are interesting to learn about and you expand my perspective on music regularly.
Exactly! Not everything has to fit into the neat strict traditional musical theater structure, we like Poison BECAUSE it's a tragic banger
What I will say about this: a song being a banger is not the same as a song being good for the story or the plot. I understand why this sentiment happens but there's a difference between "this song is a bop for me to listen to as I do ______" compared to the idea that it serves the story to the best it can. And so when I talk about these things it's less about the song not being "good" but the song being good for the narrative, and this show just has way too many narrative issues that the songs could have fixed because of how much information songs can pack in in a short period of time compared to a script.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch ahhh I see. when I wrote this comment I believe I misunderstood your intentions. I thought you were criticizing the piece of music, not the story that it’s a part of. That is my mistake. Thank you for clarifying!
Yeah for a musical especially the issue of “song” and “story” to me is inseparable. Like personally that’s why I don’t analyze songs that are part of shows I haven’t watched, because how could I give a proper in-depth exploration without knowing the context the song was placed in? To me it has to be “analyzing the song as part of this show” Vs just analyzing it as a piece of music that exists.
Stayed hon is great. But it’s good inside of itself. Not because of it self.
This deals with a touchy matter that is s*xual assault within the male victims should handle with care which this song does not
“Commiserating” is the word of the day! I actually almost feel bad for calling Poison bait outright, because I’m really not sure if that was actually a conscious choice now. There was clearly SOME thought put into the structure of the song and you’ve given me a new appreciation for it. Ultimately though, you’re right that the song has no real purpose narratively and that’s a bigger fish to fry than “pop song bad”. Actually, this explains why I found Loser Baby so much more compelling than Poison despite the fact that Poison is supposed to be the more ‘serious’ character driven piece.
Ahhh I only saw this right now, thank you so much!! That's what I want people to understand when they're like "but the song is a banger tho" etc etc - it's not that the song ISN'T a banger but there's a difference between "this is fun to listen to in my every day life" and "This is necessary for the story and keeps us coming back to the story". Because honestly I don't think I need to watch Hazbin Hotel S1 again for some time, and I'm not coming back to listen to the songs either... there has to be some sort of reason why I can watch this multiple times instead of just seeing every episode twice.
24:10 i think its supposed to rhyme with "ill be"
Yeah a couple people have said that, it threw me off a bit because “I’ll be yours” is a full sentence. But it would be “I’ll be. Yours.” If that’s the rhyme in a way 😂😂
33:45 maybe a line that could have worked here is "I keep gettin' my fill but still I stay hollow". I don't know if that's actually any good cadence-wise tho
I thought that the pop sound was a clever choice, since the audience is disensitised to sexualization of singers in pop music. It was kinda giving me 'All you wanna do'
Yeah I was thinking of Six as well!
Btw, I looked up the songwriters, and it seems like they have no training or experience in writing for musical theatre.
They're well-versed in writing fan songs, lol.
People have been bringing this to my attention recently and I'm like... what????? They wanted all this broadway talent but didn't hire broadway writers? I mean when they do well they are GOOD (like Loser Baby) but.... what....
The Mori Calliope shirt goes hard
Ahhh thank you so much!!
I think that that thing you call hopelesness in today's songs and narratives is not it. It's more about, not changing, not puting in the work. We can see so many Mary Sues in modern media, so many characters that never develop, that are perfect just the way they are and their only problem is they need to realize that. And it works both ways - I love redemption arcs but they are gone right now. Villains are either pure evil scumbags with no redeeming qualities, given a mix of everything we hate in society and other poeple bashed together OR misunderstood uwu's that actually were good all this time and did nothing wrong / were manipulated by the former one. No changing, no realizing you did something wrong on a deeper level than "we need to say sorry to our friends!". And consequences of your own actions don't aply. They are always injust, or artificial. Angel didn't do anything wrong, he was tricked, but he blames himself because he just has such a good and pure heart! Basically, "this situation is shity right? Don't worry we feel bad for you and you are right to feel bad." End of the message. It's about validation, not progression. Patting on the head, because "nothing is ever your fault" so "you can't fix this either, why bother trying". That's how I see it at least.
Yeah I think that's a fair analysis as well! I think it's actually a connected issue (the hopelessness / validation cycle) - I think in real life right now, we feel like our lives are hopeless and there's nothing we can do to change it. And to some extent, I feel like that's not a wrong way to feel. Like as an example, the job market is REALLY bad right now, so many people are unemployed and struggling to find a job and it's not their fault. And so we want to be told that things like that are not our fault, or not indicative of our worth and our value.
However, at the same time, or the flip side of that: I know personally as a performer I could be doing more to train. When I don't book an audition even though I do my best, part of me also knows "I should have practiced x, y and z more, I should have set more time away from UA-cam and Job Hunting to run through some dances" etc etc. I think that we've lost the nuance of knowing that some things in life aren't our fault or within our control, but also acknowledging when we do things or do not do things that could be within our control, if that makes sense. Characters are written to be "relatable" and to validate the concerns of the audience - instead of having a character validate those concerns but also try to fight against their current circumstances.
It's difficult with Angel because abuse is much more serious than say, something like a job. But I think they couldn't handle the nuance of "Angel is not at fault for being abused. However, what he is at fault for is how he treats other people around him. He makes people uncomfortable by touching them in ways they don't appreciate or making jokes at their expense or only seeing them as objects (like Husk). And Angel can be a victim but also still do wrong and need to be kinder." I honestly think it would be more compelling if Angel didn't "always" have a pure heart, but instead fought to be "good" because he wants to be better than someone like Val. He wants to have friends, not be above other people, etc etc.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch Yes! Totally agree. I'm Polish so I also see a lot of those issues as an americacentrism bleeding through the mentality of creators (bu t that might be just me beeing salty haha).
Yes, it's a problem with explanation VS excuse about how Angel and other characters treat people. Like "they were abused so it's okay, or even DMIRABLE that they are now awfull". Sounds like coping by the creators themselves sometmes. I agree that the thing with Angel is waaay more complex but just see specks of the same issues in this song I see in "lighther" cases. There is also problem with points of view and objective good / bad guys. Especially in the show where characters are suppose to be morally gray, but the creators don't seem to really know what that grayness actually means let alone how to express it, so they end up with "it's okay when we do it but not okay when the antagonists do it, because WE are the main characters". Kind of like with the idea of treating SA in the show. When we have Angel's beeing taken really seriously etc, but then having Sir Pentious or Moxxie SA'd for a joke. It makes it seem like the show has to TELL US instead of showing because it holds itself together with "trust me bro" and "because I said so" rules.
(sorry if I run around in circles in that message, It's late at night here :' D)
Your videos help me understand musicals and appreciate the media more
Ahhhh thank you so much!! I'm so glad to hear that, and I hope I can continue doing this for a long time!
Amazing video, I love your analysis!
Thank you so much!
How about Love is For Peasants from Barbie Island Princess? I always found it so genius, fun and well-written! Also I love listening to you, you are just so smart and sweet!
Don't worry, every Barbie movie song will be covered someday!
What you said about staying gone probably is why I like milky melodies version better. Also I would maybe like to see a video on you comparing milky melodies hazbin rewrites and her villain origin rewrites as well as Lydia the Bard's Disney's princesses villain song series and how they rewrite the original song. A comparison of the two. Especially Lydia's version of this wish considering how bad that song was.
Ohhh I'll have to check that out! I know about Lydia but now Milky Melodies!
13:52 ok but duck tales makes it work because how that say it the ooh's sound like woohoo 's because the show is about exciting adventures
I will always give a pass to Duck Tales!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch woohoo! 😂
Do you think you would do videos on theme songs? Maybe they could at least make for good shorts
Tbh Poison is my favorite song in the whole show
Edit: not that the criticism isn’t valid, I just personally love the along despite the flaws
Yeah I totally understand that! My videos are more about the songs in the narrative vs the songs as they resonate with like, people individually and why! I appreciate you listening to the criticism!
Poison always felt like, the show runners loved the song too much NOT to include it despite them not needing the song. I actually haven't watched the show but I think the episode has another song in it too, right? Loser baby. So the episode already has a song, no need for Poison, but the show runners loved it so much they refused to cut it despite the show not needing it to work.
All episodes have two songs
I think the point is though that not all episodes should be required to have two songs. An episode should have three songs if it needs to, or only one it if needs to. But every episode having two as a hard rule is not a good idea lol.
Oh my God! Someone agrees! Have you done an analysis of "More Than Anything"? I LOVE that song, and personally think it's the best one in the show.
Not yet, but I want to do a song analysis for every single song!!!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuchOh btw, 33:20 "Hollow doesn't really work with a glass"
PREACH IT! I would've taken advantage of Angel's Italian accent to stretch the word "SHALLOW", like as if saying the glass is always the same no matter what. In English, we use the word "shallow" to mean that it's flat, uninteresting, repetitive. It would allude to the idea that nothing has changed for Angel
It also could be a metaphor for SHALLOW waters. Waters that lack depth, as if referring to the fact that his life is lacking. It has no purpose as far as he knows.
why are you guys complaining about OP (is that how you say in YT) being "to nitpicky and critical" let the girl have FUN have you *seen* her URL?
Ikr, it's almost like they clicked on a critical video of their own free will haha. I don't get it at all
Do you think you could ever do a ranking of the songs, from worst to best?
Yes, after I’m done reviewing all of them I’d love to do that! Though it’ll probably take a couple months at this rate 😂
This is the first time where I agree that breaking the format is actually a real detriment to one of the Hazbin songs because I feel like it's the only one so far that doesn't really fit its purpose in the story. Stayed gone makes sense to be messy because it's Vox trying to run publicity before Alastor can butt in and interrupt. Carmilla being sloppy in respectless makes sense because the point of it is Velvette trying to pick at her nerves and destabilize her authority. But in poison, the song is meant to almost be our way of sharing Angel's masking and dissociation from his circumstances, so it's probably the song in the whole show where staying "steady" has the biggest importance.
Yeah I totally agree. This is something we need to keep in mind when talking about if a song is "good" or "bad", like I'm mostly concerned with the song being good as it's intertwined with the story as opposed to people commenting about how much they like it and it being fun to listen to. That's great, but not what I'm after lol.
You should look at more than anything
I want to do every song eventually!
Off topic but I like your Mori shirt
Thank you so much!!
Weather it's bad or not i still love this song regardless but good to hear some constructive criticism
Thank you for watching!
Love the video!😁
Thank you so much!!
There is no hope in song!
And that's why we love this show. There is no sweetness, like it will be good and now don't be afraid. No, life is f***t up, we made mistakes and now we have to live with them, face the consequences. Not Disney tra la la and now unicorns and rainbows (pre LGBT meaning, just childish love and happiness without worries and problems). And even permanently happy happy and emotional incompetent, and whole life sheltered Charlie saw the harshness of this world. And even and the end there is glimpse of hope, but everyone now know, that the way will not be happy and easy. Just like in the real world, other people don't care about you, the boss will try to destroy you, the bank want to make deal with you and then you are on the bank leash you put the mask or other 'god loving' people will make your live hell. You are loosing trust in people, expect the betrayal. You have to drink that poison what life serve you and if you don't find your fellow bartender and eat this 💩 together you will drawn in that poison till the sad end...
This show is just about our lives...about our hell where rules are constantly braked, where hurt regular people like us has no power to fight back. Where governments trap us in their stupid wars, new ways of entrapment are implemented 'for ecology'. It's not Disney movie...
If there is no hope in the show, it shouldn’t be a musical. You know that not every musical is Disney, right? Sweeney Todd is about a murderer and it’s probably one of the darkest shows on broadway. But at the end of the show there’s still two characters who “get away”. Same with Les Mis - tons of people dying, but the lovers get to escape. Same with Hunchback of Notre Dame (which IS Disney) - Esmeralda dies, but the point of the ending is that despite her death, her death was the catalyst for the people of Paris fighting back.
Orpheus turns back at the end of Hadestown (which is also about hell!) but the hopefulness is that despite how the story ends, we sing it anyway. If there is no hope in the story, the story shouldn’t be a musical. Because this is a medium with a long history of having that element in its storytelling.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch And that's why this medium is great for breaking rules. There was a lot of platformer games, happy collecting points for childen and then Grand Theft Auto came. Totally diferent approach, outragous, brutal. People sad - this can't be, they brake the rules! And now GTA is huge franchize, set the path for others. With strict, safe musical you can predict what will happen. The heros are full of hope and you kinda see that before. In Hazbin when Husk sing "You think your life is wrekt" - you predict that now he will say - it will be good, you saw that in so many musicals before. NO! He sad that it's bad and you su**. In poison Angel has breakdown. He has no hope for change, he is done. What he want from life? What life? There is no life for him. Give character soul? He doesn't have right to his soul anymore! Doing somethink totally diferent make it interesting. You simply just can't predict nothing anymore. Whats missing in Hazbin? Predictivity. After music education you expect how it will work, you study it, deconstruct. Now you can't be sure anymore.
The video game example isn’t very good - because what we’re talking about is maintaining the same skeleton but filling it with different content. GTA has the same skeleton as many games, but it has different CONTENT.
Loser Baby is actually a good example because it has a good skeleton, but becomes unpredictable as you said. But you can’t use Loser Baby and apply that to all the other songs because Loser Baby is the only song that does this successfully and perfectly.
Songs must be both surprising and inevitable. It must be predictable but also shocking. That’s the problem. The only way to be genuinely shocking is to have the predictability contrasted with the uniqueness. If it’s just surprise after surprise, it seems like a mess.
Poison is a great song to listen to. & Yes, I really love this song. But I have to agree with you that Poison is functionably terrible!
Like. I'm trying to make my own parody of poison(for personal reasons). But no matter what I do. It's so hard to place complex words & stay on beat... 😭
Yeah that's what I want more people to hopefully understand - it's not that the song is bad to listen to in terms of like... idk, in the car and you're jamming - it's just the story purpose could have been much stronger.
This was so good!!!
Thank you so much!
Your channel and your personality screams Criticism is my love language And also if it's not Too much of a big deal.Can you please do loser baby next on the hazbin list Because I Really wanna see your thoughts on that But i'm also very scared because it's my favourite song in general
Thank you so much! Don’t worry, I would love to do Loser Baby - I think it’s the best song in the entire show and I can’t wait to discuss why 🥰🥰🥰
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch OMG i have bin blest by your presence
Btw me english no good
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch btw your can-do like atidude and happy look and extremly joyfull Mannerisms is Extremely infectious When I watch your videos I smile too much i simply love it
10:08 - internal rhyme ocorre e nada acontece feijoada lol
Have you watched the show?
Yup!: ua-cam.com/play/PL6iN70H9RZS1EUM8mK9wK8hSrAWGNO1SA.html&si=Xxdiq75hN-02KO1l
she has reactions on her main channel. she has two other analysis talking about how she has watchen the show. what do you think
@@BlancS.C.Sorry, you're right I should ask if she has any actual music theory credentials. Thank you for correcting me
Yup, my degree is in musical theatre performing arts where we learned how to sing/act/dance but also did music theory and songwriting!
Yes, she has.
I always interpreted shoulda more like should have
Hazbin is catchy-
have you watched Dear Evan Hansen? I would love to see your opinion on the I want songs in that
Well the question becomes: do you like Dear Evan Hansen? Because you may not want to hear what I think after all haha.
Wow.
I hope you enjoy the video!
Wait... Why the disrespect for pop? As a fan of J-pop (principly Miku) pop can be VERY deep, like, have you heard Odds and Ends by miku?
J-Pop is different compared to Western pop! That's why I'm wearing a Calliope Mori shirt lol. I love Vocaloid
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch J-pop is better than western pop, yes, but western pop isn't inherently bad. It's like gotten candy, has no nutritional value, but tastes good, and isn't going to harm you in moderation. Also, no idea if this counts as pop, but I loved the song cotton candy in Helluva boss episode 8 of season one, the episode where Ke$ha guest stared, idk, it felt thematically appropriate
I’m eating your videos
Yay, thank you!
So why I can't stop hearing Hazbin rules braking songs, but not rules friendly Disney songs? Academic static rules are now so boring, because this is EVERYWHERE. Maybe it's catchy. And in Poison 'going backwards' because his mental state is deteriorating. And because hell is not perfect (obviously) songs should be perfect too. This is not 'perfect Disney fairytale'. And this pop-like is not matching? It's like Anthony's mask. It's not real, music theatrey, himself. He is acting just like masses expect from acting of p**n star.
I use Disney examples because they are most accessible, but these aren’t “Disney rules” - they are broadway musicals rules. There are stories on broadway about similar things (like Sweeney Todd for example), Little Shop of Horrors, Hadestown, and they still follow this structure. They aren’t Disney stories at all LOL.
Okay so, I agree with only a little bit of this.
But
"red hot eyes" and "red hot lies" is such a bad lyric I'm so sorry
I think you’re the first person who has ever said something is actually worst than I’ve said 🤣 like everyone tries to convince me it’s better and I’m wrong but this is “it’s worst and you’re wrong” 😂😂
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I seriously love that song but the second i hear that, I just facepalm a bit
The biggest of problems for me is definitely the use of "dissassociate" when the correct wording would be "dissociate". It always hurts my soul to the point i have despised the music.
Oh I didn’t notice that!
@@sweetbnuyhi, english degree here, that’s incorrect. Disassociate is just fine here. It’s not a mistake. Both words would work just fine. Sure, disassociate is more of a general term rather than specifically referring to trauma. That doesn’t make it incorrect.
While I disagree with everything bc I think the way you regard musical theater is a super narrow space reduced to the traditional I think the video was interesting, in my opinion hazbin hotel is one of the best musicals of the last years and it’s interesting how different profesional can have perspectives so different
I appreciate you leaving a nice comment even if you disagree! I wouldn't consider myself as overly traditional though - for me it's more so that the story should be above else and something Hazbin really tends to struggle with is making the songs story relevant. Like I have no issue with the songs being in a more "pop-style" sound but I do think that the bare minimum needs to be "if the song is removed the story can't function" and for this song, "Whatever It Takes" and a few of the other ones they just don't justify themselves well enough.
And the reason why these rules exist isn't because someone wrote them down in a book and expected everyone else to obey, but rather, they were developed based on the findings of artists working on their own shows. It's not like "having a story-irrelevant song is UNACCEPTABLE" because some old guy said so but more like "Hey, if you do this audiences tend to get annoyed because they feel like you wasted their time". Not everyone will but especially with other songs (like Whatever It Takes) which I just uploaded, the majority of the comments are people saying either they forgot this song existed or they were annoyed by how pointless it was. I hope that helps to explain the perspective a little bit!
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch I’m sorry but I truly disagree about saying that this song doesn’t justify itself. What that rule means is that a song that does not contribute anything to the show is a bad song, but poison is not that, poison does not move the story forward but it makes you stop and think about angel. Poison is a song that studies and digs into Angels character to a point where without poison we wouldn’t really understand him, it’s his song, it shows us what he has to deal with every day, how he copes with it, how he wears a mask in order to survive the poison he is addicted to but is slowly killing him, poison is made to show the viewer what angel truly is like without his mask to a point no scene of Val abusing him could. It may not move the story but without it we wouldn’t really understand his arc and we spetially wouldn’t drop tears of joy while hearing loser baby, it’s like saying part of that world is a bad song because it doesn’t move the story forward and it’s just character exposition we could see the surface of watching her scenes fighting her father. I truly believe people are being extremely mean to hazbin hotel for some reason, it obviously has problems but I think the internet has decided to destroy this womans career because they simply don’t like her (I’m obviously not talking about you, I just wanna say what I fell about the monstruous hate the show is receiving)
I mention this in the video though (probably closer to the end) but I think the issue with that is, is that the script is too afraid for the song to be "too important" and so all the details you bring up are already in the script during this episode. I don't think this song helped me understand Angel because I already understood Angel from prior episodes and the things that happen before and after this song. For example, I already understood Angel wearing a mask because we see this at the very beginning of Episode 4. I understand what you're saying that character exposition is as useful as moving the plot forward (I would say character exposition or an "I Am" song IS still moving the plot forward) - but for me I needed something more. Like my example about Angel mentioning his sister or his family, something that simple would have made the song "worth it" for me. If they continue to be afraid to make details song-exclusive, the songs will continue to be watered down. It also doesn't help that even though this technically isn't the show, if you've been interested in Hazbin Hotel for a long time, you would have already seen Addict, which also explains this. The show obviously needs to cater to new fans but I don't know if new fans OR old fans really learned anything they didn't already know in terms of this being a character exploration.
@@CalxiynCaresTooMuch bruh, the mask thing is never implied in the episode until the song began, that was the point it was made explicit, before there are forshadowing so you could have got but it’s from this song on where we are introduced to this concepts. the blame he feels as he thinks in the end it was him who got himself in the situation, how he knows that this life is slowly killing him but he is still addicted to it like an addicting poison, how he has no hope about the future and he is willing to keep dying in this hell he is in, how he uses his mask as a way to fell superior to the situation and he thinks he is in control. All of those things are introduced and studied during the song having not really a proper introduction before it. Beforehand we were exposed to Angel being controlled and abused by his boss, his fear of Val, his submission to him but that’s just the surface of his character, it’s the song that really builds the character and makes a complex and incredibly well written character, without the song we would only see him as a sasy boy who is a false because he suffers from sexual and laboral abuse, it’s in the details where the sauce is. All this info is used after the song of course but the important thing is that the plot presumes you have heard the song in order to work upon the info it brought u. Also I don’t think talking about Ángels family would have been a smart move, it would be way out of nowhere (as this song is about Ángels suffering) and it would present a thematic contrast so hard it would take you out of the song.
I'm pretty sure I showed a clip of the mask thing! There's a line where Husk says something to Angel and Angel responds "I'm an actor", and that's where the mask concept is laid on really thick before the song even starts. Husk makes too many comments about Angel's persona being a front and superficial to be a revelation when we reach the song. I also believe that Angel's demeanour changing when he sees Val's messages happens in this episode but also in an episode before this one. But I don't have my Amazon Prime subscription anymore so I can't check right this minute lol. Basically I don't think there's "enough" sauce, even though I see what you're saying. The song reinforces that Angel is a complex character, but it doesn't exclusively plant the idea that Angel is complex because we see that in prior episodes, in the pilot and also in Addict. I don't think anyone before this song was thinking "man, Angel is a really one-note character who is just sassy and sometimes really mean". So it doesn't come across as a revelation.
In terms of Angel's family, I think that the reason why it would have been a good idea is because Angel needs a reason to want to change outside of Val - and joining his family in Heaven and finally being a "good kid" or a "good brother" would be compelling. Like we understand Angel wants to get away from Val, but what would he do after? I think that's something that the show needed to dig into more. It wouldn't be out of left field if the song explored how Angel was an addict in life, and now once again poisoned in death. Proud of Your Boy from Aladdin is able to accomplish this angle of Aladdin screwing up over and over again and wanting to be better, but not knowing how to be. Obviously the song is about Angel's suffering but it doesn't JUST need to be commiserating. The suffering would be stronger if it was contrasted by what Angel sees as the ideal life, or what would bring him happiness.
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I hope you enjoyed it!
I absolutely love your videos, I would gladly watch some isolated discussions on other disney movies like the ones you have mentioned here Its great to see commentary on works in theater and other . in fact I grow to be infatuated with them because of this channel ! Looking forward to more 🦦
Thank you so much! I’ll absolutely do Disney song discussions soon! I’m working on a few right now!
i onlky remember the chorus
Oh dear!