Mach 4 has been my workhorse last couple of months. I already have 200+ miles in them. I know it’s probably not ideal but I use them for easy runs, long runs, tempo runs and progression runs. They’re not especially fast but the fit is good and they’re comfortable enough (lockdown is honestly almost too good, I barely tie the laces) Edit: 9+ miles = recovery run?!
I switch between my Clifton 7s and Mach 4s just depending on how my legs feel. If I’m a little tired and need some easy miles I grab the Cliftons. If I’m felling good to go and want to go a little faster the Mach 4s are my choice.
@@pietercoucke3855 I do. But I did find the Mach 4s run a little bit narrow compared to the Cliftons. It took a few runs for me to get it broke in since I have a wider foot.
I love my Mach 4s. Light and fit like a glove. Great shoe for people with narrower feet. I think those with more wider feet will struggle with it, but for me it's perfect
I’m excited for my Clifton 8s to come in. I have the Pegasus 37 which seems similar to Mach 4 in terms of faster daily trainers. Hoping the Clinton 8 makes a great companion for easy and long runs. Also my first Hoka shoe! Let’s see what all the talk is about.
@@pureEron1994 Love the Clifton! I can see why many love Hoka. For me a must have in a running rotation as it makes my daily runs pretty effortless. On days when I don’t feel like running, I put Hokas on and they just take care of getting me through the run.
Great review, thank you. Just bought a pair of Mach 4 (not worn yet) - my first Hoka after years of Saucony and Brooks. Can't wait to run some miles in them
I just did my first run in the Mach 4 today. It replaced my easy run I usually did with the Clifton 7. I found the Mach 4 to be a smoother ride, plenty cushioned, capable of picking up the pace and overall, just less bulky than my Clifton 7. Also felt the Mach 4 fit me better than the Clifton; a little roomier I believe in the upper. I'm interested to see how the Mach will hold up over the 400 miles I typically get from my Cliftons. I'm going to replace the Clifton 7 with the Mach 4 going forward. Will see how the Mach 4 does on my long runs during marathon training. I'm also going to keep my Hoka Rincons for faster/shorter runs. Thanks for another helpful review, Mike!
So how did it preform on a long run? I have the clifton 7 but im looking for a replacement. The thing is though sometimes a get a blister on my right foot arch(flat foot) Not sure if should go for another pair of Hoka.
@@MauriceG85 I like the Mach 4 for long runs up to about 13 miles or so. Longer than that, and when focusing on running slowly, I prefer the extra cushion in the Clifton 7.
Well, in the last few months I have become "Hoka-fied." First I got the Clifton 7, next the Mach 4, and today I ordered the Bondi 6 on clearance. For racing I would use the Mach 4, the Clifton 7 will be used as a daily trainer. The Bondi 6 will be a recovery and comfort shoe. I agree, I didn't need them all but I am experimenting. The fun and the fast one is the Mach but variety is the spice life.
Still loving my Mach 4 after 200miles but had my first small draw back yesterday on a loose gravel trail, that exaggerated heel flare collected a little gravel throughout the long run. But still my go to daily trainer so far this year!
Great review and running video from the Hokas. I am recently running on Mach 4 and have older Clifton 6 and Bondi 6. Thinking about buying the new Clifton 8, waiting for the new collours to see first .
@@ingolfurbirgisson7060 I haven't ran in the Rincons but I did try a Rincon 1 on and I I think they are a bit more narrow than the Machs. I remember them being more snug around my pinky toe.
Mach 4 is an ‘okay’ light-weight basic trainer. If you’re not doing fast workouts, the Clifton is a better option for long runs and has the right amount of cushioing. I personally think the Mach needs more cushioning if doing long runs. Just my $0.02. :)
I would incline myself to the Mach 4 as I like to add a touch of speed during some of my runs. I have very good memories while using the Rincon last year but the Mach 4 seems the perfect all in one.
I really love the Mach 4. I also prefer a roomy toe box and with this shoe I never have to worry about sore toes. I use it for everything from repeats to hills and even ran the NYC Half in them hitting a PR. Can’t wait for your review of the Mach 5.
I very much enjoyed the analyses of those two shoes. I don't own nor do I plan to buy either of these shoes because I have enough daily trainers in my rotation currently. But your comparisons are just so detailed that I simply enjoy your descriptions and experiences with these shoes.
I've got both because I like to alternate my daily trainers. It allows me to "save" the Mach 4 when I want to do a shorter tempo run without buying the Rincon
Thanks. Video is exactly what I needed. On my 5th pair of Cliftons and will buy a pair of Machs today. I lost some weight and now looking to improve my speed and think Machs are worth a trial.
Very helpful review, thanks a lot! I'm a minimalist runner and run on Bedrock Sandals and Newtons. Gained extra bit of weight during pandemic and trying to shed them with comfort using the Mach 4 and love the shoes. I'm a bit worried about reliability of the sole, therefore looking at a pair of Cliftons as an alternative to extend the life of the Mach.
The Mach 4 is a clear winner to me. It will be a while for me, but I’m interested to see how the Mach 4 stands up beyond 100 miles from a durability standpoint.
Check the Mach 4 500 miles (yes, with two 0's) review by Ben is Running if you haven't seen that already. Seems like they are holding pretty well for him.
One of the deal breakers and differences for me....Clifton has wide 2e options. I tried both (previous Clifton and Mach 4), and my feet made it an easy choice.
I bought the Clifton 8 after a long choice between them and the March 4, as I prefer longer runs. If I don't have enough speed, I'll look for something like the March 4 :)
So far, the Rincon 2 is my favorite shoe because of the energy return but I am putting more miles in the Clifton 8 because of my concern for Rincon 2 durability. I only have 2 runs so far in my Mach 4s but they feel exactly the same as my Rincon 2s. Whichever shoe delivers the most mile wins. For now, it looks like I'll have trouble getting 250 miles out the Rincons. I usually get 450-500+ miles out of my shoes. With the exposed midsole on the Mach 4s, I have the same doubts as I have with the Rincons. Great shoes to run in but I hate to pay up for shoes I can only get maybe 20 runs in.
Could just be me but the Clifton 8 felt much more firm (just tried it on in a store, no actual running miles). It also felt incredibly narrow under my foot in the midsole. The Mach 4 imo was much softer and feels more stable under foot. I bought the Mach 4 today and looking forward to trying them out!
I just bought the Clifton 8's and have started running in them. I am enjoying the experience as an intermediate runner just getting back into running. What additional shoe model should I consider adding to my running shoe rotation? A Hoka Mach 4 or another Clifton 8 or Saucony Endorphin Pro 2 or a race specific shoe like the Asics Speed Max? that you are running for Tokyo? I do like the Hoka fit but then I also like the New Balance fit as well. I am training on running a Marathon in late May or June - 16 week training plan. It has been 4-5 years since I ran my last marathon. Love your channel. Thanks.
@@grevillesreview268 Average 25 miles per week. My thoughts so far are good. However, I don't think they will be too durable as soles will probably wear out faster than other shoes. Otherwise, good shoes.
Another good review Mike. I still have a few mikes in my Clifton 6s and now I have a pair of Carbo X 2, I may still go for the Clifton next time. Looks like I would get on with both though.
Liberate is softer but my ankles always hurt the day after a workout in them because of how flexible they are. SL20 has a definite snap to it but it’s also firmer. Liberate is lighter too. Honestly not sure which I prefer though. I think the liberate would barely win, but it’s really close
@@christiangroendyk7198 I'd give my vote for the SL20. The Liberate is kinda like the RebelV2's younger sibling. Except that the Rebel at least isnt too thin on the forefoot midsole. To me the Liberate's flaw is that it bottoms out in long distances. Perhaps only good for heel strikers. The SL20 shines for any striker.
I’m also getting pinky toe issues lately too. Good to know that the Mach 4 doesn’t cause that for you. I’m about to replace the Rincon 2 (comfortable for me)
I have had several different pairs of Hoka shoes. I have had the Clifton (including the Clifton 8), Bondi (different generations), Rincon, and Challenger ATR. I have never been able to get a good heel lockdown on the Cliftons and all I do is put a lot of walking miles on them. For some reason they just don't seem to fit as well as other models.
I thought that the Clifton 8 would had been my ideal shoe. Everything from HOKA feels perfect (bondi/ speedboat/ rincon) Every time I try the Clifton though, I get this intense arch-poking sensation as if it’s a stability shoe! What am I missing? Doesn’t it bother runners with no feet and stride issues?
Agree with your thoughts, like the Mach 4 more, wish it had a tad bit more padding/durability, rincon and Clifton are too narrow... more so than nike shoes
Use to be to much easier when we just had training shoes and race flats 😀. I would love to do most of my running in the rocket x such a good shoe. I use my clifton 7 as basically a trail shoe.
I run in both, and I continue to find the Rincon lighter, faster and firmer than the Mach 4. The Mach 4 is more comfortable (fit and ride), and I think it will be the better long run option - but I've run a marathon in the Rincon before, so that shoe can still handle the longer runs, too. I'm using the Mach 4 now as a replacement to my Clifton 7, and I'm alternating the Mach 4 and the Rincon. Just one man's opinion!
Cheers for the review Ko, you have cleared up a lot of questions regarding these shoes, as I use the Clifton for all my long distance runs and races 6 hour up to 100 miles and have always had the question at the back of my mind, would the Mach 4 be a better choice??... Great review 👍
Running warehouse counts the insole if it's not removable. Some brands like Asics only count the stack mm if the foam itself. I.e. the Metaracer is listed as a higher stack on RW vs Asics themselves
I’m not sure RW is measuring each shoe though, that’s the thing. Most people (except perhaps road trail run and sometimes Ben Johnson) are reciting numbers that are given to them or sourced elsewhere.
Hmm, wish I had seen this before I ordered my Clifton 8. Oh well, we'll see when it arrives. Hope the width of the shoe is fine... I did read somewhere that the Clifton was on the wider side of Hoka though
Hi Mike, great videos and i am a fan of your channel! Have you come across the issue of wearing down your shoe heels (rather quickly) ending up with holes in the heel of your shoes? Great if you have any tips for an upcoming video. Cheers
Too bad the availability of the Mach4 in Canada, in my size, is non-existent. Loved the Rincon until about 250KM when the midsole felt like it went flat as a pancake. Thankfully I have a pair of Endo speed, Novablast and Carbon X v1's to get me through this summer/fall.
I’m about 150 miles into the M4’s and am loving the nimble, responsive, cushioned feel of them, I’m seeing pretty decent wear however on the outsole. Would you recommend switching between these and Clifton 8’s for my daily miles or just getting a backup pair of Mach’s?
Thank you so much for your videos! Could you recommend a rotation line up, your top 3 ? Currently considering Hoka Arahi 6, Hoka Clifton 8, Hoka Mach 6, Asics Novablast 3, Asics Nimbus Gel 25 when it comes out in a few weeks, Saucony Triumph 20, Saucony Endorphin Speed 3, New Balance 880 V12, Nike React Pegasus Trail 4 for the winter running. Open to any suggestions and recommendations. Thanks a lot 🙏🏻
Love the Mach 4...but I may switch back to the Clifton. The midsole on the Mach 4 has held up fine but the outsole is looking worn. I'm at about 200 miles in mine. Don't know if it's going to make it much past 300. I hope on the next iteration they keep it the same but maybe some outsole rubber on the bottom. Then it would be the absolute perfect daily trainer.
I haven't run in the Clifton 8 yet but I have the Mach 4 and I already find them very soft underfoot (the Profly foam layer) so if you feel it's firmer than the Clifton, this is is that the clifton must be very, very soft. I have 8 different Hoka models and the Mach 4 is the one where I have the most room (and also the most comfortable) in terms of upper.
please an advice !! i hesitate between hoka clifton 8 / hoka one one arahi 5 / hoka one one BONDI 7 / Hoka One One Rincon 2 wich one i should take? thanks for your return
@@joseflino2700 Hi Josef, I will give you my opinion but you should know that it is on a personal basis, maybe my preferences will not be the same for you. The clifton 8 I have not tested I could not tell you my thoughts on it. For the Ahari you should know that there is a density differnce in the sole, it is made for runners with pronator strides, to correct it. The Bondi 7 is the sneaker in the range with the highest cushion, the highest stack height, if you are mainly looking for the cushioned side it is top, for easy runs or recovery or around 60% VMA is top and all weight users. For the Rincon 2, hyper light models and therefore for light runners, there is a user weight limit for this model, it is more suitable for speed exercises on track or road. Be careful if you've never worn a Hoka One One, I was surprised the first time by the little space in the upper, at the toe box, it's tight. It can be misleading seeing the big midsole, the model where I have the most room (for my standard foot - not wide, not narrow) is the Mach 4.
@@dylannowak3226 many thanks for you quick answer, your advice is much useful and appreciated, in fact, the utility of the shoes for me is only for walking, it is impossible for me to run or do any race because that I wear an orthosis due to complex fractures that I had on my left leg and I also i would like specify that i have a flat feet, the doctor advised me to walk often in order to consolidate the bone, I need a light shoes, having an opening area that allows me to insert my foot which is placed in the orthosis, it must also be comfortable, not too tight, stable, anti-slip to avoid slipping or having an accident and finally it should have an excellent cushioning so as not to provide too much effort in my rehabilitation sessions which consists, as I said, on the exercise of walk that varies between 2 km and 6 km (2to 3 times by week),to be honest the list of the shoes that i have is this, i need to buy 3 shoes , give me an advice about 3 or 4 from the list having the specifications that i said, the list is:hoka clifton 8 / hoka one one arahi 5 / hoka one one BONDI 7 / Hoka One One Rincon 2/hoka mach 4/new balance 1080 /11 /NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM 880V11/new balance fuelcell elite /NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM beacon v3/NEW BALANCE 990 V5/NEW BALANCE FUELCELL REBEL V 2/puma deviate nitro/adidas adios adizero pro /Adidas Boston 9/adidas sl 20/saucony endorphine pro /SAUCONY RIDE 14/acics gel cumulus 23 /Asics Nimbus 22 Lite/REBOOK FLOATRIDE ENERGY 3 /Reebok LONG NAME Energy 2/Reebok FFE 2 thanks again for your help and return, it's much appreciated
@@joseflino2700 You're welcome, indeed it's a pretty delicate case, and there are a lot of factors to take into account and it's very difficult from a distance, but I'll try to do my best. So from what you have described to me, the models that come to mind that seem most appropriate to your situation are models of the brand BROOKS, more particularly the following: - BROOKS Adrenaline GTS - BROOKS Glycerin GTS Why BROOKS and these models because: - Weight level: they are quite light - The fit of the upper is wide enough while keeping good support at the midfoot and heel support, a fairly wide toe box, room for the forefoot and a good enough opening for insertion of the foot. - Comfort: excellent because they are equipped with DNA LOFT cushioning, a mixture of several materials including silicon and then air for extremely comfortable cushioning. - Non-slip: the rubber present in quantity on the outer sole provides very good grip, moreover the thickness of this rubber / outer sole is thick which allows to have a good grip on several types of soil / terrain. versatile models married to strategically placed grooves so that the sneaker is flexible for the good unrolling of the foot during the stride. - And finally stability: It is the acronym GTS (GuideRails: their maintenance system) It is the one that I recommend because different from the others like the Duomax of Asics, or that of Hoka because they are double density of foam in the midsole, while the Brooks GuideRails is a gutter system that supports the foot and creates the straightest stride possible so that the ankles and knees stay as aligned as possible. Metaphorically it's like the protection system on the sides of a bowling alley for children, so that the ball stays on the lane along the throw, there it is the same so that the foot remains in the axis while throughout the stride. So much for the models that come to mind first. Then in your list: there are good shoes that will meet some of your expectations but not all at the same time, those that seem to me to be the most complete in your requests are the 2 models that I have described to you (always from my point of view). personal view). Ex: You mentioned the NEW BALANCE FUELCELL REBEL V2: For the cushioning it will be excellent but for the stability of the midsole not great. For the ASICS NIMBUS LITE or CUMULUS 23: also good cushioning, coupled with good support on the other hand the fit is quite narrow, really tight. For the Hoka: same as Asics good cushioning, good support but the fit is really tight, except the wider MACH 4. For Adidas: SL20 has the LightStrike foam which is reactive and light but which will be too firm for you, the Boston more or less the same feeling, a little more cushioning and dynamism with the Boost but the stack height is quite low (not enough cushioning) until the boston 9 of course because the 10 will come out and total change with lightstrike pro but also a lot of lightstrike and its firmness. For models: Adidas Adizero Adios Pro / Saucony Endorphin Pro & New Balance FuelCell RC Elite these are models with technologies to perform it is not very suitable for just walking, the carbon plate inside can play a stabilizing role but at the same time give the shoe too much rigidity for your foot roll (zero flexibility). For the NEW BALANCE models with FRESH FOAM technology I think this would be one of the most suitable models for you in the list, because good cushioning, good stack height, good support of the foot and space in the vamp but not stride support system (The 2 Brooks models will be more complete for you) And finally concerning REEBOK I do not know their models because I believe that they are not too efficient in the field of running I had tried 3 previous models which did not appeal to me so I stopped this brand while running ( personal opinion ). Here, I hope that will help you in your choices and good luck with your rehabilitation and do not let go, determination & motivation are the main driving force! Support from France
@@dylannowak3226 I could never thank you enough for this precious advices and for the time you have devoted to me, I will without any hesitation order the models that you have recommended to me (BROOKS Adrenaline GTS - BROOKS Glycerin GTS) for the Adrenaline GTS you mean version 21? regarding the model glycerin ,i saw in the comment of the users that i should take the model 11 WIDE ,the model Wide is mean GTS ,it's the same thing??? "the Glycerin 19 WIDE is more expensive but more comfortable, stable and durable than the Glycerin 19 basic", what do you think? for the new balance i will purchase the fresh form technology, i did appreciated this one: the NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM beacon v3 what do you think about? As i told you before the only exercise allowed to me is walking because i lost the functionality of my knee so i cannot bend it, so for this purpose (walking) and regarding the Nike brand I hesitate between these 3 models and I would like to have your advice to choose one from those: the more appropriate and effective for me: Nike Air Zoom Pegasus 38 extra large/ Nike ZoomX Invincible flynit / nike infnity react 2 flynit ??? in other hand what do you think about the PUMA VELOCITY NITRO and ADIDAS SOLAAR BOOST 19? Finally the last point that i would like discuss is this !! i have five others Brooks models in my list, i need to advice if i should order one additional shoe from them (brooks hyperion TEMPO / brooks hyperion elite 2 / brooks levitate 4 / brooks revel 4 / brooks Ghost 13)????? many many thank again for your much appreciated support that help to much better to buy the shoes for the next years and i that i will using and for my long rehabilitation treatment
Which one would be close to the Rincon 2? Mach4 are hurting the sides of my feet. Thinking about trying the Clifton 8. Just cant seem to get the Rincon 2
What’s the best overall daily trainer (most daily training will be at a higher pace/tempo/race day shoe? Need a do it all shoe, can only pick one. Any responses help, thanks!
When Hoka isn't a option for slow long runs which should I buy? I'm more into cushioning and comfort than speed. I own the clifton 7 wide but sadly I'm getting some blisters on foot arch due a flat foot. Not sure if should go for another pair of Hoka.
I have the rocket x for my speed day. I’ve been using the brooks adrenaline for everyday training. Which will be the better replacement for the brooks?
I’d probably recommend the Clifton out of these two options, as it is more stable than the Mach, and will likely be closer to what you are accustomed to (and presumably enjoy) in the stability shoe that is the Adrenaline
Wow I have the Mach 4 and always think it’s a squeeshy shoe that can move pretty fast if I want to so Clifton 8 must be really soft Is it softer then the invincible?
Such a tough question I have both, they’re similar except for the midsole and I think the rincon is lighter but I prefer the more dialed in fit of the Mach 4 upper. I’d say the rincon may be able to do ever so slightly higher paces but the farther you go the more the Mach 4 wins for me given the midsole. The rincon 2 starts to give me hotspots after 10 miles. Hope this helps
The clifton 7 felt dead to me right out of the box. No Rocker feel and firm under foot. Furthermore it’s extremely narrow and i even felt the edges of the inner sole. The inside of the heel torn open on both shoes after 250 km. Also the laces are ridiculous long. Very disappointed. After watching your review i’ll give the mach 4 a shot. If thats the same experience hoka is done for me..
These running montages deserve their own video, they're so relaxing 👍
Fantastic comparison, I’ve never run in the Clifton lineup yet and I wondered what the difference was so you’ve cleared that up really well! Thanks 👌
Mach 4 has been my workhorse last couple of months. I already have 200+ miles in them. I know it’s probably not ideal but I use them for easy runs, long runs, tempo runs and progression runs. They’re not especially fast but the fit is good and they’re comfortable enough (lockdown is honestly almost too good, I barely tie the laces)
Edit: 9+ miles = recovery run?!
I switch between my Clifton 7s and Mach 4s just depending on how my legs feel. If I’m a little tired and need some easy miles I grab the Cliftons. If I’m felling good to go and want to go a little faster the Mach 4s are my choice.
Do you have the same size in both shoes?
@@pietercoucke3855 I do. But I did find the Mach 4s run a little bit narrow compared to the Cliftons. It took a few runs for me to get it broke in since I have a wider foot.
Agree, but also Machs aren’t as durable (for me) as the Clifton’s are.
I love my Mach 4s. Light and fit like a glove. Great shoe for people with narrower feet. I think those with more wider feet will struggle with it, but for me it's perfect
I’m excited for my Clifton 8s to come in. I have the Pegasus 37 which seems similar to Mach 4 in terms of faster daily trainers. Hoping the Clinton 8 makes a great companion for easy and long runs. Also my first Hoka shoe! Let’s see what all the talk is about.
So what's the verdict?
I am really interested
@@pureEron1994 Love the Clifton! I can see why many love Hoka. For me a must have in a running rotation as it makes my daily runs pretty effortless. On days when I don’t feel like running, I put Hokas on and they just take care of getting me through the run.
Love my Mach 4 so far!
Such a pleasant surprise for 2021
Great review, thank you. Just bought a pair of Mach 4 (not worn yet) - my first Hoka after years of Saucony and Brooks. Can't wait to run some miles in them
Its been over a year now, did you go back to Saucony or Brooks? Are you still running in Hokas?
I just did my first run in the Mach 4 today. It replaced my easy run I usually did with the Clifton 7. I found the Mach 4 to be a smoother ride, plenty cushioned, capable of picking up the pace and overall, just less bulky than my Clifton 7. Also felt the Mach 4 fit me better than the Clifton; a little roomier I believe in the upper. I'm interested to see how the Mach will hold up over the 400 miles I typically get from my Cliftons. I'm going to replace the Clifton 7 with the Mach 4 going forward. Will see how the Mach 4 does on my long runs during marathon training. I'm also going to keep my Hoka Rincons for faster/shorter runs. Thanks for another helpful review, Mike!
So how did it preform on a long run? I have the clifton 7 but im looking for a replacement. The thing is though sometimes a get a blister on my right foot arch(flat foot) Not sure if should go for another pair of Hoka.
@@MauriceG85 I like the Mach 4 for long runs up to about 13 miles or so. Longer than that, and when focusing on running slowly, I prefer the extra cushion in the Clifton 7.
Well, in the last few months I have become "Hoka-fied." First I got the Clifton 7, next the Mach 4, and today I ordered the Bondi 6 on clearance. For racing I would use the Mach 4, the Clifton 7 will be used as a daily trainer. The Bondi 6 will be a recovery and comfort shoe. I agree, I didn't need them all but I am experimenting. The fun and the fast one is the Mach but variety is the spice life.
Still loving my Mach 4 after 200miles but had my first small draw back yesterday on a loose gravel trail, that exaggerated heel flare collected a little gravel throughout the long run. But still my go to daily trainer so far this year!
how did the outsole hold up on gravel?
Still holding up well, can easily see it reaching 400 miles or more of my mixture of road and compacted gravel trail running
The dog on the outtake reminds me of your running buddies back in New Vienna😁
Great review and running video from the Hokas. I am recently running on Mach 4 and have older Clifton 6 and Bondi 6. Thinking about buying the new Clifton 8, waiting for the new collours to see first .
Did u buy?
I have both, 8’s were my first Hokas
😮
Fit my foot like a pair of socks.
I had to get my Clifton 6s in wide to get them to feel right but the Mach 4s fit me surprisingly well even without a wide option.
Good to know! Do you have the Rincons? How do the Machs compare to them in wideness (if you have them).
@@ingolfurbirgisson7060 I haven't ran in the Rincons but I did try a Rincon 1 on and I I think they are a bit more narrow than the Machs. I remember them being more snug around my pinky toe.
@@AlexC5110 Thanks!
Mach 4 is an ‘okay’ light-weight basic trainer. If you’re not doing fast workouts, the Clifton is a better option for long runs and has the right amount of cushioing. I personally think the Mach needs more cushioning if doing long runs. Just my $0.02. :)
I would incline myself to the Mach 4 as I like to add a touch of speed during some of my runs. I have very good memories while using the Rincon last year but the Mach 4 seems the perfect all in one.
I really love the Mach 4. I also prefer a roomy toe box and with this shoe I never have to worry about sore toes. I use it for everything from repeats to hills and even ran the NYC Half in them hitting a PR. Can’t wait for your review of the Mach 5.
I very much enjoyed the analyses of those two shoes. I don't own nor do I plan to buy either of these shoes because I have enough daily trainers in my rotation currently. But your comparisons are just so detailed that I simply enjoy your descriptions and experiences with these shoes.
I've got both because I like to alternate my daily trainers. It allows me to "save" the Mach 4 when I want to do a shorter tempo run without buying the Rincon
Just ran in my new Mach 4s today. Amazing shoes for my running style. Love them. I may be getting another pair!
Thanks. Video is exactly what I needed. On my 5th pair of Cliftons and will buy a pair of Machs today. I lost some weight and now looking to improve my speed and think Machs are worth a trial.
what kind of distances were you doing in the cliftons? jus got my 8s - want to try build to 10km - 21km this year
Thanks!!! Best review/comparison and exactly what I wanted to hear
Very helpful review, thanks a lot! I'm a minimalist runner and run on Bedrock Sandals and Newtons. Gained extra bit of weight during pandemic and trying to shed them with comfort using the Mach 4 and love the shoes. I'm a bit worried about reliability of the sole, therefore looking at a pair of Cliftons as an alternative to extend the life of the Mach.
Thanks. This review helped me to decide. Dig your reviews.
glad to hear it!
Love my mach 4s. My go to shoe in my rotation. Only run I don't use them on is recovery and that's only to save the miles I put on them.
These videos are always great, would love to see a mach 4 vs rebel 2
much appreciated for the video, was torn between these two, for me i'm going to be grabbing the Mach 4's
The Mach 4 is a clear winner to me. It will be a while for me, but I’m interested to see how the Mach 4 stands up beyond 100 miles from a durability standpoint.
Check the Mach 4 500 miles (yes, with two 0's) review by Ben is Running if you haven't seen that already. Seems like they are holding pretty well for him.
One of the deal breakers and differences for me....Clifton has wide 2e options. I tried both (previous Clifton and Mach 4), and my feet made it an easy choice.
Great point!!
@@kofuzi which hoka do you recommend for 95% of the time walking, and 5% short sprints???
Been an ASICS guy for years now but I’m ready to switch to these Hoka’s everyone has been raving about. Probably go with the Clifton.
it's a great place to start
Very precise and clear comparison 👌👍
Great review, I agree with you on a little more room in the toe box for the pinky toe.
If you're reading this, get the Rebel v2 instead
Hahaha
One of my biggest faults of 2021 was not buying the Mach 4 right away. Has been sold out EVERYWHERE in Canada in my size since the release day. ARGH!
Really? I would not have expected that!
What’s your size, I have an extra pair!!!
@@kofuzi I know, very unexpected!
@@jp05598 I'm a size 10.5US! :)
@@BrendonCamm shoot, I’m a 9!
I bought the Clifton 8 after a long choice between them and the March 4, as I prefer longer runs. If I don't have enough speed, I'll look for something like the March 4 :)
Enjoyed the motoring analogies to describe the rides!
So far, the Rincon 2 is my favorite shoe because of the energy return but I am putting more miles in the Clifton 8 because of my concern for Rincon 2 durability. I only have 2 runs so far in my Mach 4s but they feel exactly the same as my Rincon 2s. Whichever shoe delivers the most mile wins. For now, it looks like I'll have trouble getting 250 miles out the Rincons. I usually get 450-500+ miles out of my shoes. With the exposed midsole on the Mach 4s, I have the same doubts as I have with the Rincons. Great shoes to run in but I hate to pay up for shoes I can only get maybe 20 runs in.
Could just be me but the Clifton 8 felt much more firm (just tried it on in a store, no actual running miles). It also felt incredibly narrow under my foot in the midsole. The Mach 4 imo was much softer and feels more stable under foot. I bought the Mach 4 today and looking forward to trying them out!
I just bought the Clifton 8's and have started running in them. I am enjoying the experience as an intermediate runner just getting back into running. What additional shoe model should I consider adding to my running shoe rotation? A Hoka Mach 4 or another Clifton 8 or Saucony Endorphin Pro 2 or a race specific shoe like the Asics Speed Max? that you are running for Tokyo? I do like the Hoka fit but then I also like the New Balance fit as well. I am training on running a Marathon in late May or June - 16 week training plan. It has been 4-5 years since I ran my last marathon. Love your channel. Thanks.
hi. what kind of distances have you done in your Clifton 8s just out of interest? I just got a pair - very marshmellowy LOL
@@grevillesreview268 Average 25 miles per week. My thoughts so far are good. However, I don't think they will be too durable as soles will probably wear out faster than other shoes. Otherwise, good shoes.
Another good review Mike. I still have a few mikes in my Clifton 6s and now I have a pair of Carbo X 2, I may still go for the Clifton next time. Looks like I would get on with both though.
Liberate vs SL20 please, Mike.
Oooh. I like that one
Liberate is softer but my ankles always hurt the day after a workout in them because of how flexible they are. SL20 has a definite snap to it but it’s also firmer. Liberate is lighter too. Honestly not sure which I prefer though. I think the liberate would barely win, but it’s really close
@@christiangroendyk7198 I'd give my vote for the SL20. The Liberate is kinda like the RebelV2's younger sibling. Except that the Rebel at least isnt too thin on the forefoot midsole. To me the Liberate's flaw is that it bottoms out in long distances. Perhaps only good for heel strikers. The SL20 shines for any striker.
@@mercurytoad I agree about the bottoming out. I just use a different shoe for warmup so I’m only running maybe 5-6 miles total in it
I’m also getting pinky toe issues lately too. Good to know that the Mach 4 doesn’t cause that for you. I’m about to replace the Rincon 2 (comfortable for me)
I have had several different pairs of Hoka shoes. I have had the Clifton (including the Clifton 8), Bondi (different generations), Rincon, and Challenger ATR. I have never been able to get a good heel lockdown on the Cliftons and all I do is put a lot of walking miles on them. For some reason they just don't seem to fit as well as other models.
Hoka probably has the most variability in terms of sizing. Its frustrating
have a good Saturday Mike! : )
I thought that the Clifton 8 would had been my ideal shoe. Everything from HOKA feels perfect (bondi/ speedboat/ rincon) Every time I try the Clifton though, I get this intense arch-poking sensation as if it’s a stability shoe! What am I missing? Doesn’t it bother runners with no feet and stride issues?
I feel exactly the same.
Agree with your thoughts, like the Mach 4 more, wish it had a tad bit more padding/durability, rincon and Clifton are too narrow... more so than nike shoes
I had the Clifton 7 but felt pain wearing it due to the high arc and had to change to the Mach 4. Is the high arc still present in the Clifton 8?
The tail design is great for taking off the shoes after a run. 😆🏃♂️🏃♂️
Use to be to much easier when we just had training shoes and race flats 😀.
I would love to do most of my running in the rocket x such a good shoe. I use my clifton 7 as basically a trail shoe.
What about Mach 4 vs Rincon 2? That would be my dilemna. I would appreciate your point of view.
Second this!!
Third
fourth!
I run in both, and I continue to find the Rincon lighter, faster and firmer than the Mach 4. The Mach 4 is more comfortable (fit and ride), and I think it will be the better long run option - but I've run a marathon in the Rincon before, so that shoe can still handle the longer runs, too. I'm using the Mach 4 now as a replacement to my Clifton 7, and I'm alternating the Mach 4 and the Rincon. Just one man's opinion!
Cheers for the review Ko, you have cleared up a lot of questions regarding these shoes, as I use the Clifton for all my long distance runs and races 6 hour up to 100 miles and have always had the question at the back of my mind, would the Mach 4 be a better choice??... Great review 👍
Running warehouse counts the insole if it's not removable. Some brands like Asics only count the stack mm if the foam itself. I.e. the Metaracer is listed as a higher stack on RW vs Asics themselves
I’m not sure RW is measuring each shoe though, that’s the thing. Most people (except perhaps road trail run and sometimes Ben Johnson) are reciting numbers that are given to them or sourced elsewhere.
Clifton has a wide version which is not available for the mach4.
I bought both. Mach 4 for faster runs, Clifton 8 for longer miles.
That’s a good plan!
geez with one comment you answer my burning question. I plan to do 10km - 21km with my new clifton 8s this year. hope they up for it.
Hmm, wish I had seen this before I ordered my Clifton 8. Oh well, we'll see when it arrives. Hope the width of the shoe is fine... I did read somewhere that the Clifton was on the wider side of Hoka though
hope you can get in the right size.
Yay! More dog footage!
I was hoping he’d follow along for a bit longer
Excellent channel, new subscriber.
Would you say Mach 4 fits to size or does it fit better 1/2 size down ?
Hi Mike, great videos and i am a fan of your channel! Have you come across the issue of wearing down your shoe heels (rather quickly) ending up with holes in the heel of your shoes? Great if you have any tips for an upcoming video. Cheers
I’ve never come across that. The shoe would need replacing long before you wore a hole through the heel
Too bad the availability of the Mach4 in Canada, in my size, is non-existent. Loved the Rincon until about 250KM when the midsole felt like it went flat as a pancake. Thankfully I have a pair of Endo speed, Novablast and Carbon X v1's to get me through this summer/fall.
I’m about 150 miles into the M4’s and am loving the nimble, responsive, cushioned feel of them, I’m seeing pretty decent wear however on the outsole. Would you recommend switching between these and Clifton 8’s for my daily miles or just getting a backup pair of Mach’s?
I had the same problem with certain hot spots in the toe box with the Clifton 8. Hoping the Mach 4 will be better
Always a great review!! Great!
Thank you so much for your videos! Could you recommend a rotation line up, your top 3 ? Currently considering Hoka Arahi 6, Hoka Clifton 8, Hoka Mach 6, Asics Novablast 3, Asics Nimbus Gel 25 when it comes out in a few weeks, Saucony Triumph 20, Saucony Endorphin Speed 3, New Balance 880 V12, Nike React Pegasus Trail 4 for the winter running. Open to any suggestions and recommendations. Thanks a lot 🙏🏻
ua-cam.com/video/MTGsIyhJlO0/v-deo.html
@@kofuzi thank you
The difference is the legend David goggins wears one of them.
What about P38 vs Mach 4?
Can’t wait to see it
Love the Mach 4...but I may switch back to the Clifton. The midsole on the Mach 4 has held up fine but the outsole is looking worn. I'm at about 200 miles in mine. Don't know if it's going to make it much past 300. I hope on the next iteration they keep it the same but maybe some outsole rubber on the bottom. Then it would be the absolute perfect daily trainer.
12:20 - "Grizzlies can run up to 35 mph. Better keep up that cardio." Hilarious!
Hey brother!!!! will you be running the houston chevron marathon?? January 15th
currently planning on cheering from the sidelines
I haven't run in the Clifton 8 yet but I have the Mach 4 and I already find them very soft underfoot (the Profly foam layer) so if you feel it's firmer than the Clifton, this is is that the clifton must be very, very soft.
I have 8 different Hoka models and the Mach 4 is the one where I have the most room (and also the most comfortable) in terms of upper.
please an advice !! i hesitate between hoka clifton 8 / hoka one one arahi 5 /
hoka one one BONDI 7 / Hoka One One Rincon 2 wich one i should take? thanks for your return
@@joseflino2700 Hi Josef, I will give you my opinion but you should know that it is on a personal basis, maybe my preferences will not be the same for you.
The clifton 8 I have not tested I could not tell you my thoughts on it.
For the Ahari you should know that there is a density differnce in the sole, it is made for runners with pronator strides, to correct it.
The Bondi 7 is the sneaker in the range with the highest cushion, the highest stack height, if you are mainly looking for the cushioned side it is top, for easy runs or recovery or around 60% VMA is top and all weight users.
For the Rincon 2, hyper light models and therefore for light runners, there is a user weight limit for this model, it is more suitable for speed exercises on track or road.
Be careful if you've never worn a Hoka One One, I was surprised the first time by the little space in the upper, at the toe box, it's tight. It can be misleading seeing the big midsole, the model where I have the most room (for my standard foot - not wide, not narrow) is the Mach 4.
@@dylannowak3226 many thanks for you quick answer, your advice is much useful and appreciated, in fact, the utility of the shoes for me is only for walking, it is impossible for me to run or do any race because that I wear an orthosis due to complex fractures that I had on my left leg and I also i would like specify that i have a flat feet, the doctor advised me to walk often in order to consolidate the bone, I need a light shoes, having an opening area that allows me to insert my foot which is placed in the orthosis, it must also be comfortable, not too tight, stable, anti-slip to avoid slipping or having an accident and finally it should have an excellent cushioning so as not to provide too much effort in my rehabilitation sessions which consists, as I said, on the exercise of walk that varies between 2 km and 6 km (2to 3 times by week),to be honest the list of the shoes that i have is this, i need to buy 3 shoes , give me an advice about 3 or 4 from the list having the specifications that i said, the list is:hoka clifton 8 / hoka one one arahi 5 /
hoka one one BONDI 7 / Hoka One One Rincon 2/hoka mach 4/new balance 1080 /11
/NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM 880V11/new balance fuelcell elite
/NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM beacon v3/NEW BALANCE 990 V5/NEW BALANCE FUELCELL REBEL V 2/puma deviate nitro/adidas adios adizero pro
/Adidas Boston 9/adidas sl 20/saucony endorphine pro
/SAUCONY RIDE 14/acics gel cumulus 23
/Asics Nimbus 22 Lite/REBOOK FLOATRIDE ENERGY 3
/Reebok LONG NAME Energy 2/Reebok FFE 2 thanks again for your help and return, it's much appreciated
@@joseflino2700 You're welcome, indeed it's a pretty delicate case, and there are a lot of factors to take into account and it's very difficult from a distance, but I'll try to do my best.
So from what you have described to me, the models that come to mind that seem most appropriate to your situation are models of the brand BROOKS, more particularly the following:
- BROOKS Adrenaline GTS
- BROOKS Glycerin GTS
Why BROOKS and these models because:
- Weight level: they are quite light
- The fit of the upper is wide enough while keeping good support at the midfoot and heel support, a fairly wide toe box, room for the forefoot and a good enough opening for insertion of the foot.
- Comfort: excellent because they are equipped with DNA LOFT cushioning, a mixture of several materials including silicon and then air for extremely comfortable cushioning.
- Non-slip: the rubber present in quantity on the outer sole provides very good grip, moreover the thickness of this rubber / outer sole is thick which allows to have a good grip on several types of soil / terrain. versatile models married to strategically placed grooves so that the sneaker is flexible for the good unrolling of the foot during the stride.
- And finally stability: It is the acronym GTS (GuideRails: their maintenance system) It is the one that I recommend because different from the others like the Duomax of Asics, or that of Hoka because they are double density of foam in the midsole, while the Brooks GuideRails is a gutter system that supports the foot and creates the straightest stride possible so that the ankles and knees stay as aligned as possible. Metaphorically it's like the protection system on the sides of a bowling alley for children, so that the ball stays on the lane along the throw, there it is the same so that the foot remains in the axis while throughout the stride.
So much for the models that come to mind first.
Then in your list: there are good shoes that will meet some of your expectations but not all at the same time, those that seem to me to be the most complete in your requests are the 2 models that I have described to you (always from my point of view). personal view).
Ex: You mentioned the NEW BALANCE FUELCELL REBEL V2: For the cushioning it will be excellent but for the stability of the midsole not great.
For the ASICS NIMBUS LITE or CUMULUS 23: also good cushioning, coupled with good support on the other hand the fit is quite narrow, really tight.
For the Hoka: same as Asics good cushioning, good support but the fit is really tight, except the wider MACH 4.
For Adidas: SL20 has the LightStrike foam which is reactive and light but which will be too firm for you, the Boston more or less the same feeling, a little more cushioning and dynamism with the Boost but the stack height is quite low (not enough cushioning) until the boston 9 of course because the 10 will come out and total change with lightstrike pro but also a lot of lightstrike and its firmness.
For models: Adidas Adizero Adios Pro / Saucony Endorphin Pro & New Balance FuelCell RC Elite these are models with technologies to perform it is not very suitable for just walking, the carbon plate inside can play a stabilizing role but at the same time give the shoe too much rigidity for your foot roll (zero flexibility).
For the NEW BALANCE models with FRESH FOAM technology I think this would be one of the most suitable models for you in the list, because good cushioning, good stack height, good support of the foot and space in the vamp but not stride support system (The 2 Brooks models will be more complete for you)
And finally concerning REEBOK I do not know their models because I believe that they are not too efficient in the field of running I had tried 3 previous models which did not appeal to me so I stopped this brand while running ( personal opinion ).
Here, I hope that will help you in your choices and good luck with your rehabilitation and do not let go, determination & motivation are the main driving force! Support from France
@@dylannowak3226 I could never thank you enough for this precious advices and for the time you have devoted to me, I will without any hesitation order the models that you have recommended to me (BROOKS Adrenaline GTS
- BROOKS Glycerin GTS) for the Adrenaline GTS you mean version 21? regarding the model glycerin ,i saw in the comment of the users that i should take the model 11 WIDE ,the model Wide is mean GTS ,it's the same thing??? "the Glycerin 19 WIDE is more expensive but more comfortable, stable and durable than the Glycerin 19 basic", what do you think? for the new balance i will purchase the fresh form technology, i did appreciated this one: the NEW BALANCE FRESH FOAM beacon v3 what do you think about?
As i told you before the only exercise allowed to me is walking because i lost the functionality of my knee so i cannot bend it, so for this purpose (walking) and regarding the Nike brand I hesitate between these 3 models and I would like to have your advice to choose one from those: the more appropriate and effective for me: Nike Air Zoom Pegasus 38 extra large/ Nike ZoomX Invincible flynit / nike infnity react 2 flynit ??? in other hand what do you think about the PUMA VELOCITY NITRO and ADIDAS SOLAAR BOOST 19? Finally the last point that i would like discuss is this !! i have five others Brooks models in my list, i need to advice if i should order one additional shoe from them (brooks hyperion TEMPO / brooks hyperion elite 2 / brooks levitate 4 / brooks revel 4 / brooks Ghost 13)????? many many thank again for your much appreciated support that help to much better to buy the shoes for the next years and i that i will using and for my long rehabilitation treatment
The disclosure segment in every video is unnecessary. Just put it in the description if you’re concerned.
or just skip the portion. It's timestamped.
With the Clifton doesn't the EVA turn hard after a while?
I just ordered clifton 8 if the toe box to narrow I send them back maybe I should look at the mach 4
Which one would be better as a casual daily shoe ( more of a heel
Strike )
How soft is the Clifton compared to say the novablast 2? Novablast 2 was too soft for me and gave me all kinds of foot and ankle problems
Which one would be close to the Rincon 2? Mach4 are hurting the sides of my feet. Thinking about trying the Clifton 8. Just cant seem to get the Rincon 2
great balanced review , please do me a favour by letting me know how can i get them in India its hard to find retailer showrooms here
What’s the best overall daily trainer (most daily training will be at a higher pace/tempo/race day shoe? Need a do it all shoe, can only pick one. Any responses help, thanks!
the return of dog running buddies!
To run a marathon in three hours and twenty minutes which one would you recommend? Thank you
When Hoka isn't a option for slow long runs which should I buy? I'm more into cushioning and comfort than speed. I own the clifton 7 wide but sadly I'm getting some blisters on foot arch due a flat foot. Not sure if should go for another pair of Hoka.
How about the NB Fresh Foam More v3?
Hmm... I already have a pair of Rincon 2, which kind of serves the same purpose as the Mach 4?
I have the rocket x for my speed day. I’ve been using the brooks adrenaline for everyday training. Which will be the better replacement for the brooks?
I’d probably recommend the Clifton out of these two options, as it is more stable than the Mach, and will likely be closer to what you are accustomed to (and presumably enjoy) in the stability shoe that is the Adrenaline
Wow I have the Mach 4 and always think it’s a squeeshy shoe that can move pretty fast if I want to so Clifton 8 must be really soft Is it softer then the invincible?
can this be use by an high arch foot runner? why yes and why not? thanks
What do you think of using the Mach 4 for the Tunnel marathon?
I think it’s be nice, so long as it’s not muddy. But I think I could probably say that for just about any shoe I’d consider for that race
Need review for invincible vs clifton 8
The Clifton 7 and the Mack 4 are both narrow for me but I want a runner. Which one would you suggest the Clifton 8 or the Mack 5
It sounds like you’ve tried each of the shoes. I will recommend the one you liked more.
Hey, anyone ever try Mach Supersonic? Which one better Clifton 8 or Mach Supersonic?
Mach4 or Rincon2?
Such a tough question I have both, they’re similar except for the midsole and I think the rincon is lighter but I prefer the more dialed in fit of the Mach 4 upper. I’d say the rincon may be able to do ever so slightly higher paces but the farther you go the more the Mach 4 wins for me given the midsole. The rincon 2 starts to give me hotspots after 10 miles. Hope this helps
there will be a rincon 3 rather soonish i believe.
How do the shoes compare in terms of both midfoot and toebox width?
What’s the stack height of the Clifton 8 when including the midsole?
Do the Machs have the weird arch plate on the instep?
i like hoka
im looking for a shoe that comfortable and used for walking 3 miles a day. Actually i will be wearing this shoe everyday for everything.
What do you think of the Rincon 2?
The clifton 7 felt dead to me right out of the box. No Rocker feel and firm under foot. Furthermore it’s extremely narrow and i even felt the edges of the inner sole. The inside of the heel torn open on both shoes after 250 km. Also the laces are ridiculous long. Very disappointed. After watching your review i’ll give the mach 4 a shot. If thats the same experience hoka is done for me..
Do you need a wide?
How are these for us with wide feet?
Mach 4 for sure. Liked the Clifton 6, hated the Clifton 7. Clifton 8 looks feels better but still not as good as Mach 4.
Machs are more comfortable. So much softer.