High End Multimeter KPS DMM9000BT vs FLUKE 87V multimeter for the Electrician or Bench Work
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- Опубліковано 10 лис 2023
- In this video 'High End Multimeter KPS DMM9000BT vs FLUKE 87V multimeter for the Electrician or Bench Work', I'll review the KPS DMM9000BT multimeter.
#DMM9000BT #DMM4500PV #solarmultimeter #KPSmultimeter #HIGHENDMULTIMETER
Link to KPS DMM9000BT multimeter:
amzn.to/487jd9L
ebay.us/BYOyuv
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It is very nice to see alternatives to Fluke. Pricing is out of control.
Yes I agree - but I think the tide is changing;)
Considering that you can get a 12 bit oscilloscope for 299, the pricing of the multimeters is completely bonkers. Why can't anybody make a decent meter for 100 bucks?
Thanks for the review, but in all honesty, comparing it against a fluke, 87 is like shooting fish in a barrel; fluke is just so over priced that you have to really be in industry to justify it; and then it’s more of a well we’ve limited our legal-liability because we bought this bonanza fide meter!
I think the real test should’ve been between the Hoki DT - 4281 and the KPS 9000 BT. Right now on Amazon, the Hoki is $370 which puts it in line with this meter here, so that to me that should’ve been the comparison.
So in your mind, is KPS better than the Hoki; what would your wallet do.
Also, I can appreciate the fact that when somebody gives you a meter to review, it makes it hard to demean it by saying that there is something in its price category that still beats it (?).
Anyway, I do really appreciate your reviews no matter what because at least we’re getting a good engineers view of the product.
I’m trying to buy a high-end DMM, but other finances keep getting in the way and with Christmas coming up just probably shot that deal as well!
Thanks again and 73 😊
Thank you! I agree with you! I only show the 87 because it is what people know. I think this meter aligns very closely to the FLIR 93, but I do think the Hioki is at the top of the game. I am going to do a video with high end multimeter - which I don't think the 87 will make the cut.
Eddie, I bought my Fluke 87 used and calibrated, on ebay. I also got my 177 used and calibrated, from ebay. I paid about 150 USD for each. I have had no problems with either one over the last 2.5 years or so, and I would recommend going this route for anyone wanting to buy excellent American built meters!
Thanks for your feedback - and great recommendation. But we are also not all lucky enough to find those kind of deals. I bought the 189 which is the best meter ever sold by FLUKE IMHO. But it cost money and time to repair, and I paid a bit more than you did. The 189 is close in performance to the DMM9000BT but buying a new meter you get a new meter with faster and better features than the 189 - and certainly the 177.
Used meters on are not always in mint shape.
Hello. Can I ask the name of the ebay seller for these used calibrated meters please?
Another great review, Eddie. I'm a hobbyist user (civil engineer for profession) and while my Aneng AN870 is fine for basic testing in electronics, I do miss better input protection and features like LoZ and autohold. After reading a review and seeing teardown photos of this meter, I realised I can't trust it on CAT II and above locations, which would be very useful in my area.
I'm looking for a relatively affordable DMM with decent protection and the mentioned features that isn't Fluke or Keysight level, and this video was exactly what I was looking for, thanks! 👍
edit: a clamp meter recommendation would be great as well!
Brymen is the only somewhat affordable option I've found with good protection. LoZ is great for discharging capacitors while testing power supplies i couldn't do without it
Thanks for your feedback! There are other meters with 3rd party safety testing and LoZ like the Klein MM700 that I reviewed. Here's the link to Amazon - it is around $113; amzn.to/47Dgq7F
Yes the Brymen meters are fantastic and priced fairly. I think you are the first to recommend discharging caps - I think that might be brilliant!!
@@KissAnalog Thanks for the recommendatio Eddie.
@offspringfan89 for LoZ check out the HIOKI DT4261. For input protection, this DMM has the mechanical input shutter from the high-end DMMs and it is CATIII 1000V rated. HIOKI currently builds 15 different clamp meters for various applications. What do you need to measure?
it would be interesting to see the inside, (currently there are no inside photos on the web) and look at the build quality, range switch contacts,, pcb, input protection, see if it has any trim pots etc. Also Joe Smith should test one and see if he can fry it with voltage transients or wear out the range switch...
Thanks! You're right - I need to do an under the hood on this meter.
Thank you for your review! We appreciate you sharing your thoughts!
Thank you! I really do like this meter - very nicely designed;)
HI Eddie, fantastic review Eddie. Thank you. 👍
Thanks so much!
Thank you for the review. I had all these scope meters in my shopping basket for a while, then in the end I talked myself out and saved some money 🤣. The basic model of an ASIC based DMM is well known and hasn't changed much during the last decades! What's changed are the enclosure, brand name, color, etc. Some are slightly faster, safer or more precise but the basics has remained the same because there is nothing new under the sun. Having said that, these days calculators are becoming cell phones and classic DMMs are becoming oscilloscopes thank to cheaper FPGAs BUT you can't reinvent the wheel 🤣 or 🎅 or 👠! Can I finish the job with a neon tester? Yes you can. Can I troubleshoot a faulty equipment with the cheapest $1 DMM? Yes you can. Can I bring the faulty equipment to my workshop where I can hook it up to my 20MHz analog oscilloscope that I picked up from the bin instead of troubleshooting it at the roof top with one of those fancy 90000 counts inverted colour LCD scope meters with a graded digital phosphor feature? Yes you can. Can I use my grandpa's analog meter, btw it has dB? Yes you can 😧. These gadgets are not necessity but if you want and have disposable income, you can buy them to satisfy your desire 😉.
Thank you! This is fantastic feedback! I agree - we can do the job today (most jobs) with equipment from the past. But, buying older equipment is sometimes over priced and often need repairs. So I think today we look for good value at a good price - and not look for the name brand stuff that is priced based on that name. We can get equipment today that far exceeds what we could 10 years ago - at amazing prices - if we don't buy blindly the brand names.
Why do people still think that 87V is the best choice for electronics, it is slow and old, which has its advantages but not for 99% of users.
Today Brymen 869s rule!
You are so right!! I only show the 87V as it is so well known and respected. But I'm glad to see that so many are bringing up this point - we can finally start moving on.
@@KissAnalogOK, now I understand Your choice, 87 is on the market of the centurys, so it is a reference base because it is a well-known product.👍
Don't forget to mention when this question comes up that there are said to be scads of test/troubleshooting procedures out there, including at defense contractors, military and elsewhere which were specifically written around an 87V. (How do YOU spell ISO9001?) The cost of finding, updating and certifying those procedures to work with a different meter with long-term availability, or to change them to be generic to any meter would be quite costly. Purchasing departments that are trying to make a reasonable purchase for the new technician loading up his tool kit and asking for a DMM just want to order one thing and be done with it. They used to say that nobody ever got fired for buying IBM. Same with these legacy DMMs.
I think this is a myth or something that is folklore now.
I was in the Air Force and have worked in the defense industry for many years with 5 different defense contractors. I've also been in the field on Navy ships working the electrical system and communications. I have yet to see one of these examples.
I've designed a lot of equipment for the military. Whenever I have written test procedures it is 'use this piece of equipment or equivalent'. I've asked before and I'll ask again - can anyone show me a document that says to use this 87V only??
Can you believe that an expensive contract given to a vendor would come back with using this commercial piece of equipment - or I guess your equipment is just SOL?? No way that could happen.
Always cool to just read the comments like research. Have never heard of the Brymen 869 Multimeter, but off to lookup and discover a Fluke pricing alternative.
"Fluke makes a couple averaging meters nowadays... Why?"
I believe there are two reasons:
1) no TRMS on a low-end meter (like the 101) is to 'protect' the higher end meters
2) no TRMS on a higher-end meter (83V) is because large customers like the military have procedures written for that type of meter and don't want to change the procedures. For an organization that large, there's a massive cost to updating procedures and it introduces a risk for errors.
Great question! I think it is an urban legend that a Fluke was called out or had to be used for any particular test. Has anyone shown a single test document that says this? Also, this would cry favoritism - which is illegal.
I've been working in the defense industry for many years for some of the largest companies in defense. And I have written many test procedures.
You can not write a test procedure calling out a non military controlled item. Fluke does not sell military versions. Test procedures might call out a brand name but will always declare to use that or equivalent.
Some test procedures call out an average voltage reading - not RMS. Because that was prevalent in the day. But most will accept an RMS reading. And I doubt that there is any of that equipment still around.
I think the real reason is - that they were approved for purchasing - and a lazy equipment manager does not see a reason to go back thru the process of getting more vendors approved. And many do not care and think Fluke is just fine. I can tell you that I thought that way until staring this channel. The 80 series Fluke has been around for over 20 years. I was just used to using them.
I believe it is a APPA meter, not that I have ever seen anybody selling them.
I have one very similar (Maybe the same) called "Benning MM12". I am missing a uA range on it, but except from that it is a good meter and did get included in my roundup of high-end meters.
Great feedback! Yes APPA and KPS are both owned by MGL international. I think Benning is not part of MGL so that meter must be private labeled for them.
Probably, Benning have a couple of very nice meter, including my favorite low current clamp meter (CW11) I have not seen it anywhere else (I have no idea who manufactures it).
I believe Benning is a good brand in Europe with focus on Germany (For specific applications, the MM12 is dedicated to advanced electrician work) and KPS may be similar in the US.
Electricians often use solenoid Voltage testers that require several mA, low z input. Induced Voltages from nearby cables displays on high z meters, which is useful to electricians around docks and hot tubs etc.. So, I need more toys maybe.
Thanks for pointing this out. I have one of those - I'll have to show it;)
Try a Brymen BM867 or a Brymen BM869 as these are 50,000 count meters as a default and can be switched into a 500,000 count mode meter.
Thanks - great meters!
32:19, uhuh, got you. still slower on capacitance test for sure. nice review as always.
Thanks so much! These KPS meters are great!
Where is it made?
Who is KPS? MGL?
How long have they been in business?
Warranty? Repairs?
Accuracy?
Calibration?
Accessories?
What else do they make?
US distributors? (Amazon, eBay don't count)
Thanks for asking: KPS is part of MGL International and they have been around for over 30 years. They own other companies too - like the company that owns Fluke owns a number of companies. Mastech and Power Probe are part of MGL. They have a 3 year warranty that is pretty good for multimeters. I talked about the accuracy - it is better than the 87V and has more counts (40k vs 20k) so a high-end meter. As I showed, it comes with thermal probe, test leads with alligator clips, and a magnetic holder. It also comes with Bluetooth app that is free as well as the cable for the opto output with free computer software. They make an entire line of multimeters including a very impressive line of clamp on meters. The are an international company so in some places you will find these meters under the APPA name or Benning (I think in Germany). Why doesn’t Amazon count? They have a fantastic free shipping option and one of the best return policies out there.
@@KissAnalog
Regarding accuracy, I wasn't referring to advertised accuracy but actual accuracy, are they a trustworthy manufacturer.
As far as Amazon is concerned, I realize they have a great return policy, but typically I don't want to buy something because i can return it, i want it to work as stated, and since I have never heard of KPS, I thought perhaps it was another of Amazons weird off brands with no reliable after sale customer service once the return window has closed.
It just seemed like an out of nowhere brand like so many other things these days.
Fluke gets the $$$ because they can, they are reliable and have been around forever, they are accountable. They have their fair share of short comings as you mentioned but they're a rock solid company.
I don't think I mentioned it before but I did enjoy your review, very thorough. 👍
Thanks for the review. The KPS looks exactly like the new Power Probe DM500MAX. Take a look if you get a chance.
Thanks for pointing that out! They are part of the same parent company;)
This is a OEM product from apptech the build this DMM even for other company’s like Benning. This are good multimeter with a very stable reading over a long time. We use then in our company for years.
Thank you for this great information!
It is very nice that you can buy green meters in addition to those yellow, blue and red ones! 🤓
LOL yes it is;)
On the KPS, when you finally find the QR code, I'd make a sticker copy of that code, and affix it to the back of the meter, so it's never lost again. KPS really should have done that. Can you do a review on the Hioki meter that you have there? It looks like the DT4282? I'd also like to see you do some videos on the NanoVNA , and the TinySA, and compare these to your high end VNA and bench spectrum analyzer. I wish someone would make a CHEAP isolation probe for our relatively low end Siglent, Rigol, and Owon scopes that most of us have. A video on putting together a basic electronics bench for newbies would be great: This video might be directed not just directly to a kid, but also to parents who have questions (especially at near Christmas Time!) as to what do purchase, basics, to better, to stellar. Three price points, covers the junior high kid, the high school kid, and the kid who is going to pursue a technical certificate or professional engineering degree. (They call it different things in different countries, you know, so the distinctions can become somewhat blurry, I think it's "PE" in some parts of the US/Camada.)Do you hold an amateur radio license? As I think that you are around my same age (63) your journey is quite interesting to me. Today? Kids don't realize that today we have even low end equipment with specifications that we could not have dreamed of, as "back in the day" we read our mirrored analog scales(thinking that every one of us discovered Ohm's Law for the first time in History😅), and oscilloscopes were enormous in weight and price! We of course back then had a Hicock or an Eico, or an RCA (later VIZ) or a Heathkit, but we dreamed of Tektronix, Unobtainium on our Paper Boy Budgets...😅73 DE W8LV BILL
Thanks Bill - I totally agree with you! I appreciate all your input;)
Yes - I think I must have thought it would be on the box so I didn't notice. I do have the TinySA. I have two, so maybe I'll give one away;)
Nice.
Thank you! Cheers!
Keysight U1272 or Brymen 869s is excelent High-End. Fluke 87V is not high-end, its compare aple with pears.
Great options for high end meters - thank you!
@@KissAnalog my favorite for everyday use is U1272 🙂
That meter lines up very closely to the DMM9000BT, but it does cost about $200 more;) I have wanted to pick one up but I spent so much already - I have to be super selective these days.
The kps dmm looks nice. Seems similar to the flir you reviewed some time ago.
It would be interesting to see the frequency response of the current measurement ranges (ua, ma and a) for all those meters you have there at some point. I have never seen anyone doing that sort of test. Most only check the frequency response on the voltage measurements.
Thanks for your feedback! I'll try to keep this in mind;)
Hey Eddy could you please let me know if this has duty cycle and beep on a good diode junction? Appreciate all the material, very helpful........
So this is what happened to Brett Favre after retirement. He is an electronics hobbyist now.
LOL - everyone needs a hobby;)
I get the feeling that Fluke knows if they put a few more counts on the 17b display, if made it RMS capable and just a bit more accurate and released it in the North America market in a big way then they would never sell anything else. And so it stays an averaging 4000 count meter hidden away in the China/India market.
Thanks for that feedback! It has been my theory that they killed the 189 because it would have killed the 87. IMHO
You may want to update your summary text, it's from the matrix power supply video.
Thank you! I was in too big of a hurry to post;)
❤❤❤
Thank you!
Could you please tell us if you succeeded in connecting it to the mobile phone app? I'm thinking of "upgrading" from an 87-V to the DMM9000BT mainly for the Bluetooth app and data logging function.
Yes - here it is;) ua-cam.com/video/M3iMoKgSPrs/v-deo.html
I'm a diesel equipment technician and would like to see more mechanic oriented meters reviewed. Also how exactly does the RPM feature work on those? Is it just a Hz measurement with some extra logic? Thanks
Thanks for the great suggestions;)
once again the visa card is going to take a beating :( lol...
Then use the Mastercard, problem solved 😌
Perfect solution!
LOL - but you will like it;)
At some point, this all becomes a matter of meter features and not meter sensitivity. Who really has the need to measure 1/100 of a volt? Very few do, specialized professionals, engineers looking at bias voltages and circuit design. But for the average layman, 90%+ of us... NOT. There is no sane reason to drop $500 for a high-resolution, high-sensitivity meter if a person is not in a profession that demands it. Save your money and purchase another piece of needed test equipment.
Thanks for your feedback. But remember, this is a review for High End Multimeters - so not for everyone. But also, the resolution (number of digits) is not the only thing that makes it high end. The dB function, and AC+DC reading is big as well. But maybe one of the biggest is the wide bandwidth which is great for Audio work. Most meters are only good up to 1kHz, and these bad boys go up to 100Khz or near that.
Would you be able to give an alternative for fluke 1587? Plz and thank you
Thanks for asking. Funny this subject has come up a couple of times just in the last few days. I'll do a quick review comparison very soon. Here's a great meter that I have (I also have the Fluke): amzn.to/3SbOy5O
This device is very similar to the APPA 506
Yes they have the same parent company:)
Canadian Friend wins again !
Nice job Jason!
no beep on diode mode!!
come on!! its a must.
Yes I like the beep too - but so many do not do that.
This is Appa multimeter.
Yes they are both owned by MGL
Greetings.
87v. Low Z and Low pass filter not the same thing.
So true - thanks for pointing this out. The 87V does not have both. It does have the LowZ which is great for Phantom voltage issues as I explained, but Low Pass Filter is also very useful as I explained and demonstrated. I showed how it filters out higher frequencies - above 400 Hz. In some meters it is named VFD for Variable Frequency Drives. I hope I had made this clear in my video. The KPS meter as both.
Not complaint ect. Almost did not respond. Comes from good place. 87v has low pass filter. No low z.
Thanks for your feedback! We have to remember the Fluke is a very old design - like 20 years. So there are new features and some that were only available on the high end meters that are more common today. I show the 87V not because it is good compassion but because so many know it;)
no teardown? why...
It is coming today;) I made it separate because it was pretty detailed and took some time;)