The only thing i disagree with in this vid is adding garchomp to hoenn. garchomp already overshadows flygon enough without being found on the same route
Love your videos! Fun fact: Hoenn was originally meant to be a soft reboot like Unova, but GF added in some Kanto and Johto Pokémon just to fill out the Pokédex a bit more.
The more I think about it, the more confused I get on Mantine not being included in the original Hoenn dex. It is based on manta rays, which notably love warm oceans and have a habitat that stretches out _just enough_ to include southern Japan. Hoenn, being based on Kyushu, is literally the furthest south you could go in mainland Japan, being significantly further south than its debut region of Johto. Additionally, its stat and previously version exclusive counterpart in Skarmory is featured _prominently_ in the region. Mantine could have been Wallace's lead (maybe over Tentacruel or even Gyarados) to mirror Steven leading with Skarmory, further connecting the two trainers beyond saying that they're friends through direct dialogue.
The more you speak about this, the more I am convinced that somebody paid to keep Mantine out of the games. It absolutely should've been in Hoenn. Must be a conspiracy 🤔 lmao, jk, but seriously, it should've been in Hoenn.
Fun fact: electrode traps being in the magma hideout is why I completely missed the master ball in my original playthrough. I wanted to avoid them. Magby and Magmar I think would definitely not happen without Elekid and Elektabuzz tagging along since they’re counterparts. Worth noting that the Gible line are a lot more of a cave pokemon than a desert pokemon. They have appeared in deserts via Kalos 113 and Ha’ina Desert in SuMo, but the majority of their other locations are in caves.
Always fascinated at takes about Luvdisk and Alomomola because the answer is like not hidden. Gen 5 was a soft reset with new Pokemon that referenced older ones but no old ones directly. Luvdisc not becoming Alomomola is the same reason Throh and Sawk aren’t nee Tyrogue evos
The Jigglypuff line should be replaced with the Clefairy line. It makes sense to find them in Meteor Falls. Pokémon from space in a place where a lot of meteors have crashed
Nice video! There's plenty of pokémon that could fit the Hoenn region. A pokémon I think would be perfect is Minior: I can easily imagine them in Meteor Falls. :)
Some pokemon that I think definitely should've been added to Hoenn are: Lapras - Hoenn had a shocking lack of Surfing encounters outside of Wingull and Tentacool, so this would've been a great addition. Back when gen 3 came out, they were still super hesitant about making lapras a random encounter since it was still rare then, but Lapras was found in Kanto & Johto which are nearby, and we know Lapras can still thrive in tropical oceans. Would also help with the Ice type diversity. Mantyke/Mantine - Another Surfing encounter for Hoenn. Would make perfect sense that the manta ray pokemon would be in Hoenn Shellos/Gastrodon - A dive encounter outside of Chinchou and Clamperl. Shellos was planned to be a Hoenn Pokémon originally , so they should have readded them. Finneon/Lumineon - A dive/fishing encounter. Really no reason other than it's a pretty fish that I think would fit and it's a forgettable pokemon that I think could use more love lol. Really, any pokemon that ORAS used for the national dex DEXNAV could work and I could see fitting very well since that was Gamefreaks official way to loophole new pokemon into being "native" to Hoenn. Zorua, Sandile, Clauncher, Skrelp, Venipede, Sewaddle, Deino, Skorupi, Yanma, Qwilfish were all added with the Dexnav and they fit the region perfectly. Even some pokemon introduced later like Wattrel, Dewpider, Grubbin, Tatsugiri, and Cutiefly could all fit. One thing I would like to see if they ever do a legends in Hoenn is Hoenn regional forms! A Hoennian Mantine, Staryu, or Tentacruel would be cool to see.
Larvesta and Volcarona were practically made to be a part of the Scorched Slab. They're based on the same Japanese legend and it would give that location something!
There's already a 3 stage Ground/Dragon line in Hoenn - Trapinch, Vibrava, and Flygon. Adding the Garchomp line would just take away from the Flygon line's prominence. Doduo and Dodrio must absolutely be swapped for Misdreavus and Mismagius. It gives the region more ghost types too. You should look into adding pokemon to the dex. The dex number itself is largely an arbitrary restriction, and adding more pokemon could help. You could stick to removing pokemon only if they fill a similar niche to the pokemon being added. Great video! When's the next region review coming?
I mean... Psyduck is probably in the Hoenn Dex because its the favorite Pokemon of Junichi Masuda. The only game it technically didn't appear in was Black and White (I say technically, since Golduck was in and you could breed for Psyduck anyways) and it wasn't in Sword and Shield, but later got added in, in the DLC. I would take out Magikarp/Feebas, not only because Gyarados is massively popular, but the Gyarados would also overshadow the Wingull line and Mantine. Instead, i would put in Elekid and Electabuzz, since they are counterparts with Magby/Magmar and it would be odd if they don't get included with the replacements if Magby/Magmar make it in + Gen 3 Hoenn is seriously lacking in Electrike types (See what i did there). Fun Fact: Shellos and Gastrodon were originally going to be in the Hoenn Dex, but were ultimately cut. Maybe because the region already had 2 Water/Ground lines in Marshtomp/Swampert and the Whicash line. Scovillain is another pick from Gen 9 that would fit really well.
Fun fact! The Shellos lines were originally supposed to be in Hoenn, they had art and sprites/back sprites made up all for it, but ended up being held off and released in Sinnoh instead. So that perfect fit feeling is definitely warranted 😂
Thank for the video Sabrina, great as always ❤ Personally I would also swap Vileplume line for the Victreebel line. Tropical jungles are literally Victreebel habitat and I think Victreebel line fits way better in Hoenn than in Kanto
A great Pokémon to inhabit Hoenn would be Gligar. They're known to fly down so they could live in Jagged Pass. A Ground Type nearby the volcano is fitting. Besides, they could only be found in DP by using the Emerald cartridge.
Maybe controversial but my favourite dex is Unova. I feel like the other dexes are either too large to have a true regional identity or are just horribly HORRIBLY balanced. (Fire types underrepresented in Sinnoh, good Pokemon underrepresented in Johto, etc.)
In fairness, Fire being underrepresented in Sinnoh and Ice being underrepresented in Hoenn very much makes sense lore-wise, them being the coldest and warmest regions respectively.
@@TheHistorySoldiernah, Sinnoh ain’t getting off that easy mate! Hoenn had 6 ice types across 6 lines all brand new with Spheal-Sealeo-Walrein, Snorunt-Glalie, and Regice. The only one that had lore was Regice who is a legendary golem and the others just exist in Shoal Cave somehow. Also hail form Castform so technically 7 all new ice types. Sinnoh introduced the obligatory starter line Magmortar who is a trade Evo of an old line, and Heatran. Rotom HEAT wasn’t even a fire type until Gen 5! Heatran legitimately could have been their backdoor into adding fire types into the region too. Just explain how in the massive cave systems there are warm sections where fire types like to gather, and have the lore be dormant Heatran sleeping deep beneath these “warm spots” in the caves. I could totally see Slugma and Torkoal just hanging out in a deep corner of some random unusually warm cave(system).
@@spooky5063 at this point I like the 400 pokemon Pokedex for a single region ..... But it has to be low on legendaries and specialty pokemon like paradoxes if at all possible. But having larger counts for convergent and regional forms should be a good chunk of dexes now. And to me personally I don't like how many alolan Pokemon have made it to the last two main regions. SV DLC don't count. Those are supposed to be isolated islands. Personally I think every region should have close to exclusives, unless regions are extremely close to one another like the first 4 gens were
@@spooky5063 understand this if we come back to Kanto..... The actual dex is 182 with all the new evolutions. And that's not counting Houndoom, houndour and murkrow and honchcrow that would technically open up cuz of their location in gold and silver. Or seivii islands putting even more jhoto pokemon in the game
I was almost certain you would have put the tyrantar line into the desert over garchomp line. Garchonp kind of steps on Flygons toes Heliolisk definitely belongs in hoenn
I like these ideas of the overhaul for the regional dex! And I find it ironic as the Shellos line were mentioned as they were originally meant for Ruby and Sapphire but weren’t added due to time constraints.
13:59 I wouldn't want the garchomp line in Hoenn personally. I think it would take the attention away from the Hoenn native Flygon a bit too much, especially if Trapinch and Gible are found in the same place
Have Trapinch be a giftmon from someone in the region and when you fully evolve it, it turns into a Regional Variant Flygon as a way to tell everyone something new is on the horizon and you can breed Trapinch that evolve into normal Flygon. That way we can get both, get lore about the ecosystem, and we have a new Flygon we've been craving along with speculation about what the place is like that this one came from.
I do think the Abra line should be replaced, if anything to not compete/steal the spotlight from Hoenn's own psychics, most notably Gardevoir, as in Gen3 both are pure Psychic 3-stage lines. That would also give pokémon like Grumpig and Solrock/Lunatone a bit more of a niche.
Sabrina upload, good day confirmed. I eally enjoy the replacement of mons that didn't debut in the region aspect, and taking into account the differences between gens. Makes me wish all remakes took the approach you came up with.
Steelix, Aggron and Garchomp together... Hoenn be having the most dangerous caves to stroll through!! Not to forget Team Magma! Really loving the Hoenn content so far, thank you!!
Considering Mantine's counterpart Skarmory is in Hoenn and even on Steven's team, it could be cool to see Mantine on Wallace's Emerald team as a parallel.
The biggest problem with this video is the unnecessary restriction of dex size. Honestly I don't think this made the regions dex any better, just different. Replacing pokémon just means you end up with different diversity That being said you definitely DO need some restrictions. So I'd probably pick an arbitrary number like 50 or 100 and only add that many to a dex in future videos.
Keep Doduo / Dodrio, replace the Abra line with the Venopede line. You are right to want more bugs in the rainforest region. Also I liked the idea of Mankey and Primeape. Though I think Aipom and Ambipom for ORAS. Thoughts?
Of the group you asked about Heliolisk is my pick. All of its abilities are weather based which is perfect for Hoenn. Imagine it in a double battle next to Castform. I'm totally not biased, but adding Inkay is a great choice. More aquatic Pokemon that aren't water types is a great way to mix up the water route encounters. I feel it would be perfect in the water around Mt. Pyre. Hoenn also has a small outer space theme too which I wish we saw. Clefairy from Kanto is an easy choice and adds back a moon stonw evolution lost with Jigglypuff. And Minior would fit too outside of Gen 6. Meteor falls is an obvious location to find both.
Great video and I like some of these inclusions. Especially Exeggcutor! It's a palm tree! What is more tropical than a palm tree? And I do like the inclusion of more fire types like Magmar, I mean there is a volcano there so it's nice to see a bit more fire types being included, and would be a great Pokemon for Flannery and help cut down on the repeated team members like having both a Numel and Cammerupt. Same with Glacia's repeat teams too, adding a Jynx would help a lot. And yes! Adding in a few more water types would help with some of that water diversity, adding some variety than just Tentacool and Wingull lines. Ooh adding in Garchomp would help Drake with repeat Pokemon too! Hmm for the Heliolisk, Gliscor, and Mismagius, I think I'll go with Mismagius, for one another great Pokemon for Mt Pyre and will give Phoebe more Ghost type options is welcome too. Now for the Abra line replacement, I'm probably voting for the Venipede line because I agree poisonous bugs in a tropical region make the most sense but I do like the Tynamo line too so hmm not sure there. I say keep Geodude since Roxanne uses that unless we want to swap that out with Roggenrola. While I think Caterpie and Weedle are great Pokemon for a tropical region, I don't want them to take away from Wurmple's spotlight but Paras would be a great addition to the region. I can see Bellsprout being available and it feels weird to have Oddish and not have Bellsprout since they were counterparts for a while. I love the inclusion of Maractus in the desert and Blitzle in the Safari Zone too! And yeah a shame Alola wasn't around yet because Bruxish, Bounsweet, Sandygast, and Dhelmise to name a few would all be great inclusions to Hoenn.
A lot of really great choices ! I’m personally on team Scolipede for the potential three-stage replacement, since I love the evil lil wheel. Fletchling and Roggenrola are close seconds for me. In terms of the bonus round, someone who I think would fit and wasn’t mentioned (and definitely isn’t just my bias speaking) is Skiddo and Gogoat ? The region is pretty mountainous (even aside from the large volcano, the map shows a lot of mountains all across the mainland, maybe enough to justify a mountain goat) and with Hoenn being all about relationships, Gogoat’s ability to feel the emotions of people that touch its horns feel very fitting ! I’d also have some justification for Cramorant around Sootopolis specifically - from what i can tell, cormorant fishing is a thing in Japan, and adding a Pokémon all focused on diving around Sootopolis feels like a great fit ! All around, this deep dive into Hoenn’s potential was very fun, and I’m very excited to see what you do with future regions !
For the gen 6 changes, the Doduo line for the Misdreavus line and the Abra line for the Tynamo line work, but one thing I noticed is there would be an additional entry to the regional dex with Mantyke, so instead of garchomp. Maybe a 2 stage line and Mantyke would be better, since Garchomp would overshadow my favorite antlion. A two stage line that came to mind for this is the Sneasle line, which could give Glacia a team of Glalie, Froslass, Jynx, Weavile, and Walrein when considering the initial gen 3 changes.
I like how you mention (and basically are admitting is wrong) that you will call Gen 1 & 2 Pokemon Kanto and Johto because you like it. Cause they aren't Kanto or Johto Pokemon. Hell, Kanto and Johto are practically 1 region, and the generational Pokemon are all mixed around
As many people said, Garchomp way too easily overshadows Flygon. But... I have a replacement for all three members that I think could work really well. Litwick, Lampent, and Chandelure. I mean, Mt. Pyre, the place where you find ghost types and graves, has a fire-based name. It just makes sense. Plus, they feed on the life force of others, and many people flock to the graveyard to grieve. And just to make them even better, they also give us both more ghost representation but also fire type representation in a region flooded with water Pokémon. AND the line learns Energy Ball, making them actually decent when facing their aqueous foes.
I think the Abra line is fine to stay in Hoenn. They don't feel particularly out of place, and unless we have a in-lore explanation of Teleport's limitations somewhere, I like the idea that you can find Abra in almost any region.
I think the Koffing line fits really well into fiery path and therefore should stay. Darumaka could replace something else and appear on the slope of the volcano.
Geodude line: I like the Fetchender line. They could be on Mt. Chimney and in the forest around Fortree. Could have one or both of Flannery and Winona have one. Alakazam: I like the Tyamo line because its more variety in the waters and adding more electric types. Eels are plentiful in reefs and rocky waters of which Hoenn has plenty. I think Lapras is a must for the surfing and for Glacia.
If I had my way, I’d also add the Pyroar line in the Safari zone. We’d have a good Safari lineup then: Rhyhorn, Girafarig, Xatu, Phanpy Zebstrika & Pyroar.
I definitely think the Helioptile line is the best fit of the ones you proposed in that section of the video; I also think, since you said you wanted to keep the Dex totals the same, you didn't account for Mantyke in Gen 6, therefore I suppose you could replace the Abra line with Mantyke + another two-stage of the ones mentioned. I also think it's quite weird that the Cleffa line isn't found in or near Meteor Falls in any way, and, tbh, was sure you were gonna replace the Igglybuff line with them, especially when you mentioned the Moon Stone probably being the reason for their inclusion in the first place. Other than that, I'd say I agree and/or understand the changes you've proposed! Overall, I think Yanma being found in the forest routes sorrounding Fortree, the Wiglett line, Pyukumuku, Pincurchin and so many others in the Dive spots, perhaps even Minior near or at Meteor Falls... There are a lot of Pokémon that could fit Hoenn's environments.
Hi Sabrina, thanks a lot for the new video :) Sorry didn't contribute this time to ideas, kind of didn't have any, was like dam that's complicated stuff with pokedex overhaul xd
I think the lutantis family fits well hoen. As well as sewadle line. Goomy could be found on rainy areas. I would scrap growlithe from mount pyre though. Perhaps leaving houndour on his place.
After having finished the first half, here's a first comment: As a professional Koffing and Weezing enjoyer because of their inclusion in Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, I'd be sad to see them leave. Though, to be fair, the reason why I love Koffing and Weezing in Hoenn is because of the fact that they can dominate the Beauty contest category despite, y'know looking like they do, with the amazing set of Haze, Sunny Day, Fire Blast, and Explosion. The next closest thing for that wonderful set is Golem, that also gets these moves, minus Haze, but y'know, I get it. Otherwise I fully agree with your ideas of which Pokémon could be replaced and most of the substitutions. I'm generally not a fan of having only a single evolutionary line that requires a specific stone to evolve in a game, but Hoenn in Gen 3 already has that problem with the Fire Stone (Vulpix), Thunder Stone (Pikachu), and Sun Stone (Sunkern in Emerald only), so it's... Tolerable. Mantine and the Octillery line would have been perfect in those games, and the inclusion of the Primeape line, Yanma, and Misdreavus are also inspired choices. Exeggcute & Exeggcutor are also obvious but really good fits.
Setting aside my bias in favor of Roggenrola et al, what occurs to me about Abra's line is that - aside from a single route with a low probability of Ralts - they're the only psychics you can get before the fighting-type gym. Granted, Taillow and Wingull are flyers, and you mentioned putting Exeggcute in somewhere, but it may be a factor worth considering.
Abra/Kadabra/Alakazam should be replaced by Gastly/Haunter/Gengar & in the Gen 6 portion you added Mantine but forgot that in Gen 4 it got a pre evolution in Mantyke.
Geodude line should be replaced by the sandile line instead of the gible line and abra line should be replaced by the tynamo line. Keeps flygon relevant and replaces the earlier loss of electrode.
Kind of laughing over how so many Pokemon you suggested are like a friend of mine's favorite pokemon. Like we both really love gen 3 but this video almost feels like it was written specifically for him lol.
I think you def restrict yourself a lot be swapping Pokémon out for other Pokémon that it doesn’t really help the diversity for the sea routes and should just add more water types and keep the types you want or add some to some places as it shouldn’t really matter the amount of of pokemon you can get or if they were invented yet or not as it is all speculative and stuff you would do to fix it I get having rules for it but I think the rules should be a bit less strict when it comes to pokemon that aren’t legendaries etc
As much as I love the Abra line, I think the Tynamo line would be a better fit for the region. As for Dodu, from the options you presented, I would pick Gligar I think. Now, regarding pokemon you didn't mention (unless I missed them for some reason >.
Aside from the very weak Nincada (who loses the type when it evolves), Geodude is the only Ground-type Pokémon available before Wattson if you don't pick Mudkip. Swapping it out for a desert exclusive Gible would remove that option.
Hoenn is not tropical 😑 Real life Hoenn is Kyushu It has the same humid subtropical climate as the rest of southern Japan (including the counterparts of Johto and Kanto) The only part that is tropical is the remote southern islands
As much as I love that line i think the Abra line should also be replaced - there are way too many similarities between them and the Ralts line which comes earlier. I think replacing them with the Gastly line (in Dewford cave + Mt Pyre) would be good so that Phoebe has another Ghost-type.
Did someone say bring Smoochum and Jynx to Shoal Cave for more Ice-Type diversity? I want more Ice-Types more than anyone else, but adding Smoochum and Jynx are non-options. It doesn't make much sense, but I'd rather see Swinub and Piloswine or Sneasel and Delibird.
Um I personally don’t think Applin should be Hoenn since from my experience Apples need a climate where there is a autumn I also feel that considering this was thd gen to introduce Ralts that abra shouldn’t be in the region. Also I favor more ghosts type for Phoebe and lapras for the ice specialist
This is less about new pokemon and more about a particular pair of evolutinary Hoenn lines It has always bugged me that we go Bagon-Shellgon-Salamance when in the same game we have another flying dragon named FlyGON. Now I don't think 'Salamance' would be a good name to cap off the trapinch line, but like, that would just be one new name needed. Back to the video topic mostly, with the replacements, I would maybe look at type specialists that need a little help before making any major decisions, and on the bug end, I probably wouldn't add any other standard butterfly/moth pokemon because the Wurmple line already covers both (Being my favorite concept of a lepidopteran pokemon line mostly, even if modern day I would make a few changes)
You didn't overhaul the Pokedex....... All you did for the most part is just suggest a dozen pokemon that could replace some others, and you were not stalwart in your choices. If you continue this series, don't be wishi-washy.
I'll never get over Solrock and Lunatone not being in SUN and MOON.
And so far we don't have any game where you can have Solrock, Lunatone AND Minior at the same time D:
I was equally pissed about Unown X and Y Formes not being in X and Y.
What can we say??? They don't like the tropics.....
Same
I'll never get over how underwhelming Wela Volcano is. Literally nothing to do there
The only thing i disagree with in this vid is adding garchomp to hoenn. garchomp already overshadows flygon enough without being found on the same route
That's a really good.point. Flygon definitely has its shining moment in Hoenn, and I think maybe Garchomp would take away from its glory.
Love your videos!
Fun fact: Hoenn was originally meant to be a soft reboot like Unova, but GF added in some Kanto and Johto Pokémon just to fill out the Pokédex a bit more.
Shellos and Gastrodon were originally designed for Hoenn but didn’t make the cut in the game. They’re a literal perfect fit.
True but if I couldn't use Gastrodon in a gen 4 run I would probably cry
The more I think about it, the more confused I get on Mantine not being included in the original Hoenn dex. It is based on manta rays, which notably love warm oceans and have a habitat that stretches out _just enough_ to include southern Japan. Hoenn, being based on Kyushu, is literally the furthest south you could go in mainland Japan, being significantly further south than its debut region of Johto. Additionally, its stat and previously version exclusive counterpart in Skarmory is featured _prominently_ in the region. Mantine could have been Wallace's lead (maybe over Tentacruel or even Gyarados) to mirror Steven leading with Skarmory, further connecting the two trainers beyond saying that they're friends through direct dialogue.
The more you speak about this, the more I am convinced that somebody paid to keep Mantine out of the games. It absolutely should've been in Hoenn. Must be a conspiracy 🤔 lmao, jk, but seriously, it should've been in Hoenn.
Fun fact: electrode traps being in the magma hideout is why I completely missed the master ball in my original playthrough. I wanted to avoid them.
Magby and Magmar I think would definitely not happen without Elekid and Elektabuzz tagging along since they’re counterparts.
Worth noting that the Gible line are a lot more of a cave pokemon than a desert pokemon. They have appeared in deserts via Kalos 113 and Ha’ina Desert in SuMo, but the majority of their other locations are in caves.
Always fascinated at takes about Luvdisk and Alomomola because the answer is like not hidden. Gen 5 was a soft reset with new Pokemon that referenced older ones but no old ones directly. Luvdisc not becoming Alomomola is the same reason Throh and Sawk aren’t nee Tyrogue evos
The Jigglypuff line should be replaced with the Clefairy line. It makes sense to find them in Meteor Falls. Pokémon from space in a place where a lot of meteors have crashed
13:08 you forgot that Mantine now has a pre-evolution in Mantyke
mantyke was added in gen 4!
Nice video! There's plenty of pokémon that could fit the Hoenn region. A pokémon I think would be perfect is Minior: I can easily imagine them in Meteor Falls. :)
Some pokemon that I think definitely should've been added to Hoenn are:
Lapras - Hoenn had a shocking lack of Surfing encounters outside of Wingull and Tentacool, so this would've been a great addition. Back when gen 3 came out, they were still super hesitant about making lapras a random encounter since it was still rare then, but Lapras was found in Kanto & Johto which are nearby, and we know Lapras can still thrive in tropical oceans. Would also help with the Ice type diversity.
Mantyke/Mantine - Another Surfing encounter for Hoenn. Would make perfect sense that the manta ray pokemon would be in Hoenn
Shellos/Gastrodon - A dive encounter outside of Chinchou and Clamperl. Shellos was planned to be a Hoenn Pokémon originally , so they should have readded them.
Finneon/Lumineon - A dive/fishing encounter. Really no reason other than it's a pretty fish that I think would fit and it's a forgettable pokemon that I think could use more love lol.
Really, any pokemon that ORAS used for the national dex DEXNAV could work and I could see fitting very well since that was Gamefreaks official way to loophole new pokemon into being "native" to Hoenn. Zorua, Sandile, Clauncher, Skrelp, Venipede, Sewaddle, Deino, Skorupi, Yanma, Qwilfish were all added with the Dexnav and they fit the region perfectly. Even some pokemon introduced later like Wattrel, Dewpider, Grubbin, Tatsugiri, and Cutiefly could all fit.
One thing I would like to see if they ever do a legends in Hoenn is Hoenn regional forms! A Hoennian Mantine, Staryu, or Tentacruel would be cool to see.
I disagree with Garchomp. Let Flygon have its game.
Larvesta and Volcarona were practically made to be a part of the Scorched Slab. They're based on the same Japanese legend and it would give that location something!
There's already a 3 stage Ground/Dragon line in Hoenn - Trapinch, Vibrava, and Flygon. Adding the Garchomp line would just take away from the Flygon line's prominence.
Doduo and Dodrio must absolutely be swapped for Misdreavus and Mismagius. It gives the region more ghost types too.
You should look into adding pokemon to the dex. The dex number itself is largely an arbitrary restriction, and adding more pokemon could help. You could stick to removing pokemon only if they fill a similar niche to the pokemon being added.
Great video! When's the next region review coming?
I mean... Psyduck is probably in the Hoenn Dex because its the favorite Pokemon of Junichi Masuda. The only game it technically didn't appear in was Black and White (I say technically, since Golduck was in and you could breed for Psyduck anyways) and it wasn't in Sword and Shield, but later got added in, in the DLC.
I would take out Magikarp/Feebas, not only because Gyarados is massively popular, but the Gyarados would also overshadow the Wingull line and Mantine. Instead, i would put in Elekid and Electabuzz, since they are counterparts with Magby/Magmar and it would be odd if they don't get included with the replacements if Magby/Magmar make it in + Gen 3 Hoenn is seriously lacking in Electrike types (See what i did there).
Fun Fact: Shellos and Gastrodon were originally going to be in the Hoenn Dex, but were ultimately cut. Maybe because the region already had 2 Water/Ground lines in Marshtomp/Swampert and the Whicash line.
Scovillain is another pick from Gen 9 that would fit really well.
Fun fact! The Shellos lines were originally supposed to be in Hoenn, they had art and sprites/back sprites made up all for it, but ended up being held off and released in Sinnoh instead. So that perfect fit feeling is definitely warranted 😂
Thank for the video Sabrina, great as always ❤
Personally I would also swap Vileplume line for the Victreebel line. Tropical jungles are literally Victreebel habitat and I think Victreebel line fits way better in Hoenn than in Kanto
A great Pokémon to inhabit Hoenn would be Gligar. They're known to fly down so they could live in Jagged Pass.
A Ground Type nearby the volcano is fitting. Besides, they could only be found in DP by using the Emerald cartridge.
Maybe controversial but my favourite dex is Unova. I feel like the other dexes are either too large to have a true regional identity or are just horribly HORRIBLY balanced. (Fire types underrepresented in Sinnoh, good Pokemon underrepresented in Johto, etc.)
In fairness, Fire being underrepresented in Sinnoh and Ice being underrepresented in Hoenn very much makes sense lore-wise, them being the coldest and warmest regions respectively.
@@TheHistorySoldiernah, Sinnoh ain’t getting off that easy mate! Hoenn had 6 ice types across 6 lines all brand new with Spheal-Sealeo-Walrein, Snorunt-Glalie, and Regice. The only one that had lore was Regice who is a legendary golem and the others just exist in Shoal Cave somehow. Also hail form Castform so technically 7 all new ice types.
Sinnoh introduced the obligatory starter line Magmortar who is a trade Evo of an old line, and Heatran. Rotom HEAT wasn’t even a fire type until Gen 5! Heatran legitimately could have been their backdoor into adding fire types into the region too. Just explain how in the massive cave systems there are warm sections where fire types like to gather, and have the lore be dormant Heatran sleeping deep beneath these “warm spots” in the caves. I could totally see Slugma and Torkoal just hanging out in a deep corner of some random unusually warm cave(system).
Fire being underrepresented in Sinnoh wouldn't be an issue if there wasn't Levitate Bronzor everywhere
@@spooky5063 at this point I like the 400 pokemon Pokedex for a single region ..... But it has to be low on legendaries and specialty pokemon like paradoxes if at all possible. But having larger counts for convergent and regional forms should be a good chunk of dexes now. And to me personally I don't like how many alolan Pokemon have made it to the last two main regions. SV DLC don't count. Those are supposed to be isolated islands. Personally I think every region should have close to exclusives, unless regions are extremely close to one another like the first 4 gens were
@@spooky5063 understand this if we come back to Kanto..... The actual dex is 182 with all the new evolutions. And that's not counting Houndoom, houndour and murkrow and honchcrow that would technically open up cuz of their location in gold and silver. Or seivii islands putting even more jhoto pokemon in the game
13:16 Possibly an oversight, but you didn't mention adding mantyke
Definitely an oversight. I ALWAYS forget Mantyke. Poor lil thing. 🤦♀️
I was almost certain you would have put the tyrantar line into the desert over garchomp line. Garchonp kind of steps on Flygons toes
Heliolisk definitely belongs in hoenn
I like these ideas of the overhaul for the regional dex!
And I find it ironic as the Shellos line were mentioned as they were originally meant for Ruby and Sapphire but weren’t added due to time constraints.
13:59 I wouldn't want the garchomp line in Hoenn personally. I think it would take the attention away from the Hoenn native Flygon a bit too much, especially if Trapinch and Gible are found in the same place
Have Trapinch be a giftmon from someone in the region and when you fully evolve it, it turns into a Regional Variant Flygon as a way to tell everyone something new is on the horizon and you can breed Trapinch that evolve into normal Flygon. That way we can get both, get lore about the ecosystem, and we have a new Flygon we've been craving along with speculation about what the place is like that this one came from.
Now that you mention it, I totally agree. Flygon deserved it's moment in the spotlight, which it unfortunately lost in the very next generation.
I do think the Abra line should be replaced, if anything to not compete/steal the spotlight from Hoenn's own psychics, most notably Gardevoir, as in Gen3 both are pure Psychic 3-stage lines. That would also give pokémon like Grumpig and Solrock/Lunatone a bit more of a niche.
And the Eelektross line looks very Hoenn-y
Sabrina upload, good day confirmed. I eally enjoy the replacement of mons that didn't debut in the region aspect, and taking into account the differences between gens. Makes me wish all remakes took the approach you came up with.
The Expanded Safari Zone Pokemon were NOT added to the Dex. Ruby, Sapphire and Emerald all had the same amount of Pokemon
Steelix, Aggron and Garchomp together... Hoenn be having the most dangerous caves to stroll through!! Not to forget Team Magma!
Really loving the Hoenn content so far, thank you!!
Considering Mantine's counterpart Skarmory is in Hoenn and even on Steven's team, it could be cool to see Mantine on Wallace's Emerald team as a parallel.
It's so great to see that your channel is growing ☺️
There are almost no fire types for a game centered around a FREAKIN VOLCANO!!!?? .... that's the fix I'd make. Fire types.
The biggest problem with this video is the unnecessary restriction of dex size.
Honestly I don't think this made the regions dex any better, just different. Replacing pokémon just means you end up with different diversity
That being said you definitely DO need some restrictions. So I'd probably pick an arbitrary number like 50 or 100 and only add that many to a dex in future videos.
I was about to take my daily walk and saw the video drop, tis a good day 😊
Personally, I wouldn't add the Gabite line to the dex because they'd take away from the Trapinch line as dessert-dwelling ground/dragon line
Keep Doduo / Dodrio, replace the Abra line with the Venopede line. You are right to want more bugs in the rainforest region. Also I liked the idea of Mankey and Primeape. Though I think Aipom and Ambipom for ORAS. Thoughts?
Of the group you asked about Heliolisk is my pick. All of its abilities are weather based which is perfect for Hoenn. Imagine it in a double battle next to Castform.
I'm totally not biased, but adding Inkay is a great choice. More aquatic Pokemon that aren't water types is a great way to mix up the water route encounters. I feel it would be perfect in the water around Mt. Pyre.
Hoenn also has a small outer space theme too which I wish we saw. Clefairy from Kanto is an easy choice and adds back a moon stonw evolution lost with Jigglypuff. And Minior would fit too outside of Gen 6. Meteor falls is an obvious location to find both.
Great video and I like some of these inclusions. Especially Exeggcutor! It's a palm tree! What is more tropical than a palm tree? And I do like the inclusion of more fire types like Magmar, I mean there is a volcano there so it's nice to see a bit more fire types being included, and would be a great Pokemon for Flannery and help cut down on the repeated team members like having both a Numel and Cammerupt. Same with Glacia's repeat teams too, adding a Jynx would help a lot. And yes! Adding in a few more water types would help with some of that water diversity, adding some variety than just Tentacool and Wingull lines.
Ooh adding in Garchomp would help Drake with repeat Pokemon too! Hmm for the Heliolisk, Gliscor, and Mismagius, I think I'll go with Mismagius, for one another great Pokemon for Mt Pyre and will give Phoebe more Ghost type options is welcome too. Now for the Abra line replacement, I'm probably voting for the Venipede line because I agree poisonous bugs in a tropical region make the most sense but I do like the Tynamo line too so hmm not sure there. I say keep Geodude since Roxanne uses that unless we want to swap that out with Roggenrola.
While I think Caterpie and Weedle are great Pokemon for a tropical region, I don't want them to take away from Wurmple's spotlight but Paras would be a great addition to the region. I can see Bellsprout being available and it feels weird to have Oddish and not have Bellsprout since they were counterparts for a while. I love the inclusion of Maractus in the desert and Blitzle in the Safari Zone too! And yeah a shame Alola wasn't around yet because Bruxish, Bounsweet, Sandygast, and Dhelmise to name a few would all be great inclusions to Hoenn.
Oof that use of Pokemon Mystery Dungeon Time/Darkness soundtracks just sent all my core memories bouncing around my head!!
A lot of really great choices ! I’m personally on team Scolipede for the potential three-stage replacement, since I love the evil lil wheel. Fletchling and Roggenrola are close seconds for me. In terms of the bonus round, someone who I think would fit and wasn’t mentioned (and definitely isn’t just my bias speaking) is Skiddo and Gogoat ? The region is pretty mountainous (even aside from the large volcano, the map shows a lot of mountains all across the mainland, maybe enough to justify a mountain goat) and with Hoenn being all about relationships, Gogoat’s ability to feel the emotions of people that touch its horns feel very fitting ! I’d also have some justification for Cramorant around Sootopolis specifically - from what i can tell, cormorant fishing is a thing in Japan, and adding a Pokémon all focused on diving around Sootopolis feels like a great fit ! All around, this deep dive into Hoenn’s potential was very fun, and I’m very excited to see what you do with future regions !
For the gen 6 changes, the Doduo line for the Misdreavus line and the Abra line for the Tynamo line work, but one thing I noticed is there would be an additional entry to the regional dex with Mantyke, so instead of garchomp. Maybe a 2 stage line and Mantyke would be better, since Garchomp would overshadow my favorite antlion. A two stage line that came to mind for this is the Sneasle line, which could give Glacia a team of Glalie, Froslass, Jynx, Weavile, and Walrein when considering the initial gen 3 changes.
I think Frillish/Jellicent would make a great add for the remakes as an exclusive for the Abandoned Ship area and maybe surrounding routes!
I like how you mention (and basically are admitting is wrong) that you will call Gen 1 & 2 Pokemon Kanto and Johto because you like it.
Cause they aren't Kanto or Johto Pokemon. Hell, Kanto and Johto are practically 1 region, and the generational Pokemon are all mixed around
Hell yeah, new Saffron City TV video
Love that Spinda background
This is such a fun concept for a video!
As many people said, Garchomp way too easily overshadows Flygon. But... I have a replacement for all three members that I think could work really well.
Litwick, Lampent, and Chandelure. I mean, Mt. Pyre, the place where you find ghost types and graves, has a fire-based name. It just makes sense. Plus, they feed on the life force of others, and many people flock to the graveyard to grieve. And just to make them even better, they also give us both more ghost representation but also fire type representation in a region flooded with water Pokémon. AND the line learns Energy Ball, making them actually decent when facing their aqueous foes.
I think the Abra line is fine to stay in Hoenn. They don't feel particularly out of place, and unless we have a in-lore explanation of Teleport's limitations somewhere, I like the idea that you can find Abra in almost any region.
I think the Koffing line fits really well into fiery path and therefore should stay. Darumaka could replace something else and appear on the slope of the volcano.
Geodude line: I like the Fetchender line. They could be on Mt. Chimney and in the forest around Fortree. Could have one or both of Flannery and Winona have one.
Alakazam: I like the Tyamo line because its more variety in the waters and adding more electric types. Eels are plentiful in reefs and rocky waters of which Hoenn has plenty.
I think Lapras is a must for the surfing and for Glacia.
If I had my way, I’d also add the Pyroar line in the Safari zone.
We’d have a good Safari lineup then: Rhyhorn, Girafarig, Xatu, Phanpy Zebstrika & Pyroar.
the tynamo line to replace the abra line would be great to encounter while diving in hoenn
I definitely think the Helioptile line is the best fit of the ones you proposed in that section of the video; I also think, since you said you wanted to keep the Dex totals the same, you didn't account for Mantyke in Gen 6, therefore I suppose you could replace the Abra line with Mantyke + another two-stage of the ones mentioned.
I also think it's quite weird that the Cleffa line isn't found in or near Meteor Falls in any way, and, tbh, was sure you were gonna replace the Igglybuff line with them, especially when you mentioned the Moon Stone probably being the reason for their inclusion in the first place.
Other than that, I'd say I agree and/or understand the changes you've proposed! Overall, I think Yanma being found in the forest routes sorrounding Fortree, the Wiglett line, Pyukumuku, Pincurchin and so many others in the Dive spots, perhaps even Minior near or at Meteor Falls... There are a lot of Pokémon that could fit Hoenn's environments.
Hi Sabrina, thanks a lot for the new video :) Sorry didn't contribute this time to ideas, kind of didn't have any, was like dam that's complicated stuff with pokedex overhaul xd
Oh that's totally ok! No worries! 😊 I still really appreciate all of your support! Thanks SilkTouch!
@@saffroncitytv Thank You
I think the lutantis family fits well hoen. As well as sewadle line. Goomy could be found on rainy areas. I would scrap growlithe from mount pyre though. Perhaps leaving houndour on his place.
NEW SAFFRON VIDEO LETS GO
After having finished the first half, here's a first comment:
As a professional Koffing and Weezing enjoyer because of their inclusion in Ruby/Sapphire/Emerald, I'd be sad to see them leave. Though, to be fair, the reason why I love Koffing and Weezing in Hoenn is because of the fact that they can dominate the Beauty contest category despite, y'know looking like they do, with the amazing set of Haze, Sunny Day, Fire Blast, and Explosion.
The next closest thing for that wonderful set is Golem, that also gets these moves, minus Haze, but y'know, I get it.
Otherwise I fully agree with your ideas of which Pokémon could be replaced and most of the substitutions. I'm generally not a fan of having only a single evolutionary line that requires a specific stone to evolve in a game, but Hoenn in Gen 3 already has that problem with the Fire Stone (Vulpix), Thunder Stone (Pikachu), and Sun Stone (Sunkern in Emerald only), so it's... Tolerable. Mantine and the Octillery line would have been perfect in those games, and the inclusion of the Primeape line, Yanma, and Misdreavus are also inspired choices. Exeggcute & Exeggcutor are also obvious but really good fits.
i mean doduo & dodrio are based on dodo and kiwi birds, so the tropical environment of hoen is great
Setting aside my bias in favor of Roggenrola et al, what occurs to me about Abra's line is that - aside from a single route with a low probability of Ralts - they're the only psychics you can get before the fighting-type gym. Granted, Taillow and Wingull are flyers, and you mentioned putting Exeggcute in somewhere, but it may be a factor worth considering.
Can I just say I love your nails? 🤩 I have the same shade and it always looks so good!
Why thank you! It really is a gorgeous color. Too bad I don't have many clothes that match with it 🤣
Here we go! 💪💪💪
The problem with taking out the Abra line in Gen 6, is that Mega Alakazam exists, and you can get the Alakazite before Post-Game.
Abra/Kadabra/Alakazam should be replaced by Gastly/Haunter/Gengar & in the Gen 6 portion you added Mantine but forgot that in Gen 4 it got a pre evolution in Mantyke.
Dang! I always forget about Mantyke 🤦♀️
We're winning today folks
Geodude line should be replaced by the sandile line instead of the gible line and abra line should be replaced by the tynamo line. Keeps flygon relevant and replaces the earlier loss of electrode.
Lets be honest guys, who else thought slugma + macargo line was new to hoenn? 6 year old me sure did
Jigglypuff does fit hoenn as the meteor falls area is perfect for them. Jigglypuff has lore around meteors
That's Clefairy, not Jigglypuff.
Hell yes, let's go 😎
I hope you like the video! Let me know what you think about the swaps!
Always assumed jigglypuff and psyduck were in because of anime popularity
Kind of laughing over how so many Pokemon you suggested are like a friend of mine's favorite pokemon. Like we both really love gen 3 but this video almost feels like it was written specifically for him lol.
I think you def restrict yourself a lot be swapping Pokémon out for other Pokémon that it doesn’t really help the diversity for the sea routes and should just add more water types and keep the types you want or add some to some places as it shouldn’t really matter the amount of of pokemon you can get or if they were invented yet or not as it is all speculative and stuff you would do to fix it I get having rules for it but I think the rules should be a bit less strict when it comes to pokemon that aren’t legendaries etc
As much as I love the Abra line, I think the Tynamo line would be a better fit for the region. As for Dodu, from the options you presented, I would pick Gligar I think.
Now, regarding pokemon you didn't mention (unless I missed them for some reason >.
Aside from the very weak Nincada (who loses the type when it evolves), Geodude is the only Ground-type Pokémon available before Wattson if you don't pick Mudkip. Swapping it out for a desert exclusive Gible would remove that option.
Hoenn is not tropical 😑
Real life Hoenn is Kyushu
It has the same humid subtropical climate as the rest of southern Japan (including the counterparts of Johto and Kanto)
The only part that is tropical is the remote southern islands
You forgot gen 4 added Mantyke as a baby form of Mantine
As much as I love that line i think the Abra line should also be replaced - there are way too many similarities between them and the Ralts line which comes earlier.
I think replacing them with the Gastly line (in Dewford cave + Mt Pyre) would be good so that Phoebe has another Ghost-type.
Considering it was kind of a soft reboot for the series, I would say it's not too bad. I think it's better than the first two generations
I know it's out of scope but I do wonder where you would put regieleki and regidrago. New Mauville and... I guess Meteor Falls?
What would the running Triathletes use if Doduo and Duduo are gone?
Did someone say bring Smoochum and Jynx to Shoal Cave for more Ice-Type diversity? I want more Ice-Types more than anyone else, but adding Smoochum and Jynx are non-options. It doesn't make much sense, but I'd rather see Swinub and Piloswine or Sneasel and Delibird.
hi Sabrina!! ❤
Um I personally don’t think Applin should be Hoenn since from my experience Apples need a climate where there is a autumn
I also feel that considering this was thd gen to introduce Ralts that abra shouldn’t be in the region.
Also I favor more ghosts type for Phoebe and lapras for the ice specialist
This is less about new pokemon and more about a particular pair of evolutinary Hoenn lines
It has always bugged me that we go Bagon-Shellgon-Salamance when in the same game we have another flying dragon named FlyGON. Now I don't think 'Salamance' would be a good name to cap off the trapinch line, but like, that would just be one new name needed.
Back to the video topic mostly, with the replacements, I would maybe look at type specialists that need a little help before making any major decisions, and on the bug end, I probably wouldn't add any other standard butterfly/moth pokemon because the Wurmple line already covers both (Being my favorite concept of a lepidopteran pokemon line mostly, even if modern day I would make a few changes)
*Salamence
Am I available in your region?
Cutie
You didn't overhaul the Pokedex....... All you did for the most part is just suggest a dozen pokemon that could replace some others, and you were not stalwart in your choices. If you continue this series, don't be wishi-washy.