I have over 5,000 vinyl records and what I use to clean them very successfully is the German product called DISKO ANTISTAT II. I had a catastrophe where they were stored as a friends, (no names - TONY !!😁), ceiling collapsed in their Attic and they didn't know. Plaster dust and rain got into the records, but after getting some of the sleeves that were totally ruined off the records, I've cleaned them up to almost brand spanking new. All except for 23 outta 5.000. My record collection started in 1973. I recommend Disko Antistat II. It comes as a complete kit, trough, holding wheel, It has goat hair bristle brush & comes with sealing tool to protect labels (does 7 inch and 78s equally well too), 12 record drying rack & funnel and loads of filters to reuse the solution that comes with it. You can also buy the solution separately. Got mine from Amazon. Cheers, Clive - Spyda Music Productions 😎
This is the way! I love mine, absolutely fantastic product and I do not understand why we don't all use it. The anti static gun by comparison is absolutely terrible; it only removes like a quarter of the static buildup
You’re relentless “Pursuit” for improvements with well tested results is one of the many reasons I watch. Credibility through the roof. Watching your new Vinyl journey that started around the same time as mine has been a blast these past years. Great job Terry as always.
Thank you very much, I really appreciate the kind words and sentiment meant here, it means a lot. The next video will be of interest to you too. Going live tomorrow all being well
yeah really! I understand and empathize with the idea of feeling uncomfortable with not knowing what you are doing. Once you know what you are doing, if you find that you are merely trading in one bag of anxiety for another one, then you have do decide when to let go of being right and try to get to being happy. "It" is not going to happen, you are going to happen. Get the "anti static" inner sleeves and some decent outer sleeves, clean up. Or... do the digital thing. When you have records or cds - you have them, and that is that. When you have streaming and all that other stuff, you have physical space in your home but you don't have records or cds. This is pretty much how I see it.
I still love my vinyl, but like some others here I was converted at an early age... 1985 - I was 15 years old and walking through K-Mart with my mom. At the time, my cassette based Walkman was the best sounding thing I had ever heard. K-Mart had a brand new CD player on display with headphones hanging next to it. Having never heard a CD before, I had to try. I put on those headphones and pressed the play button. It was Tears for Fears - Songs From the Big Chair. As the intro to "Shout" began, I literally thought the gates of Heaven had opened to me and I had possibly just passed away in the K-Mart. I think I may have had a tear come out of one eye. To this day, that was a legitimate out of body experience I will never forget. The sound was that good! Music listening was never the same again, and I really don't miss much about the older formats. I still have my Technics SL-QL1 linear tracker connected to an Anthem amp, and I love to play my old albums from the 80's. It is purely for the ritual and that it just kind of "takes me back". I LOVE to hear the cracks and pops - that's part of the experience. I am an avid audiophile still, and have a massive CD collection after becoming a rock radio personality in the 90's. I've heard many formats and nothing has ever topped the experience of that K-Mart CD player for me!
Born in ‘55, I grew up with vinyl and used it consistently till CDs came along. But, I’ve held on to my collection, many of which are classics today. I recently decided to buy a new turntable and set up an audio component system in my home office and am enjoying those old records, pops and all, just reliving great memories of the greatest rock music ever made, just the way I heard it back then. Priceless!!!
To maintain the quality of your vinyl records, it's essential to handle your brushes properly. Avoid touching them with your hands, as oils and dirt can transfer to the brush and, subsequently, to your records, affecting their sound quality. When using a static brush, ensure you touch the metal part during application to ensure an effective cleaning process. Before returning your record to its sleeve, use an antistatic device to eliminate any static buildup. I've found this method to be the most effective in reducing static, though I haven't found a record sleeve that completely eliminates it. With these practices, you can better preserve the integrity of your vinyl collection. Best of luck, and enjoy your music! - Robert
Get a strong turntable light, see all those Carbon bristles on your album? Throw those damn brushes away and us a MoFi pad or similar, a bulb blower and camel hair brush to finish off any leftover lint. If static is an issue, a Destat or Zero Stat work great.
I was hoping someone would comment on him touching the brushes. I have a version of the cheaper brush and the way I use it is with the record spinning on the turntable, just let it glide over the surface and slowly move it from the inside out. The bristles can ride inside the grooves that way.
Record cleaning is a rabbit hole - and a very expensive one to fall down, given that the Degritter 2 costs £2500. I've been cleaning vinyl for 45 years now and, at the age of 60, have finally found my ideal solution (literally). After some research I decided to buy 10mls of generic Tergitol. This cost me £5. Then I bought 4 microfibre cloths from Aldi (£1.99). After giving up on trying to get distilled water I just use double filtered and boiled tap water.Each of my 4 cloths has it's dedicated function (Wiping, washing, rinsing and drying). I then play the record, as this is part of the cleaning process, as some residue will be picked up by the stylus, depending on the condition of the record, cleaning the stylus after every 2 or 3 tracks. In all the process takes around 15 minutes per album (plus the playing time). Ok, it's a bit more hands-on than a machine, but not much.The other thing I will mention is the most miraculous of all. Stylus cleaning. Get yourself a Melamine sponge (I use Mr Siga, about £2 in hardware shops, also known in America as Magic Eraser) and gently drop your stylus onto it using the cueing arm. Do not scape it or move it around as this will damage the stylus. Just lift it up and down 2 or 3 times. Then play the record and prepare to be amazed. Of course, like everyone, you will not believe that this will work. No one does until they try it. I certainly didn't. But this little tweak has me using my 40 year old cartridge with it's original stylus (Ortofon ff15e mk2) on an LP12, and wondering why I considered buying a new one. My 45+ year old vinyl now sounds better than it ever has before and all for less than a tenner. Phew....
Go to your nearest aquarium centre and get Reverse Osmosis (RO) water for next to nothing. Its purified water. My last 50ltr refill cost £4.50/$7. It will usually have been UV treated to kill any bacteria. But you can add some sodium meta-bisulphite (1g per 5ltrs water) to kill off any remaining bacteria in the water if it hasn't been UV treated, or if you're unsure. I live in a very hard water area, so I use it for ironing, steam mop, window cleaning etc as well, as all the limescale is removed in the RO process.
10mls of generic Tergitol for £5 - 2 table spoons for a fiver! I've sneezed nearly as much! Explain how much you use please and in the wiping and/or washing?
for what they charge for vinyl, everything should come in antistatic sleeves and be pristine !! cheap bastards out to maximize profits by bending over the customers !!
... and to think that what they're selling is a piece of vinyl in a piece of cardboard! Think of all the money they make out of really old re-issues! At least we can be thankful there still is a vinyl industry,, even if they over-charge everything. By the way, is any vinyl record printed these days actually analogue? That is a more pertinent question in my book...
I thoroughly enjoyed this video. But I will never understand people spending heaps of money trying to make vinyl sound as perfect as possible. Part of the fun is the clicks and pops... it has always just added to the experience for me. If I need to hear a song in perfect clarity it is surely available online somewhere. Putting on an LP is about watching that record turn and letting the imperfections in the medium create an ambience of its own. But to each their own.
Exactly. I thought that was point in vinyl collecting these days, for the clicks and depth of the sound. That background noise makes it feel a bit more real than some digital music on a CD..
I heard a few less ticks after the 2nd cleaning. What I have found is the lined inner sleeves, like the Mofi, actually charge the records with static electricity when they are slid in and out. A brand new record in the anti-static sleeve has such a high static electrical charge that I can hold the inner sleeve by it's bottom corners, with the open side straight down, and the record will NOT fall out. The lined inner sleeves they used to use in the British Decca pressings, to me, were far superior to anything we have now. Using several of the carbon type brushes, including those with metal handles electrically connected to the brushes, like you found, actually charges the records with static electricity. After brushing the records, I use a ZeroStat gun to neutralize the charge. Playing the record creates static electricity from the friction of stylus running through the grooves. When playing the other side of the record, you should zap it with a static-removing device. I use a VPI RCM to wet-clean and vacuum dry the records. As long as the record vacuums no more than 3 revolutions, static electricity is eliminated. Ticks and pops can be eliminated playing through a special device or like when I record to hard drive, as I do with all my records, a computer program will eliminate most of them . One of my pet peeves is the rubbing sound in the quiet or dead grooves of the records. To me, it was very prominent in all your sample. It can be cut back electronically, but then you will also lose some of the sounds you want to hear on the record. I am in the U.S. and it seems that the pressing companies here use a higher quality vinyl mix for premium quality records, compared to what I find in E.U. pressings. I believe that Pallas in Germany uses a vinyl mix as good as used in the U.S. The Optimal Media pressings are some of the noisiest.
I just love the way this topic just keeps going round and round 😂 PS: it’s a shame the ‘Degritter’ doesn’t dry and then play the record: an opportunity missed I recon. PPS: I’m nearly 70 and fortunately managed to move on from actually getting bothered by all this decades ago (I do look after my vinyl). Good thing too, otherwise my age related tinnitus would have me pulling what hair I have left out at the roots. PPPS: the surprises with the sleeve inserts you had might be due to humidity, both when the record is put in, when it is taken out and how much ‘rubbing’ of the plastic on the record as you do both (which includes the pace at which they are removed and put in and if the sleeve is folded over the vinyl as it rubs over the vinyl during removal) - this last just to prove I can do nerdy with vinyl 😅 PPPPS: Static is a physics thing due to rubbing (the electrons, say, are literally rubbed off). Rubbing = static. Some materials (the brush/sleeve/vinyl itself) -> more static per ‘rub’. A really good anti-static removal tool would have the properties of that battery powered hairdryer thingy which ‘neutralises’ the charge. If your brush was metallic (bristles + handle, and yes, I realise the issue) and earthed by a wire like the one round your wrist, that would remove static and would be cheaper (but more cumbersome) that your hairdryer.
Yes around and around... 78/45/33 1/3 a complete revolution and some more,vinyl can be addictive an expensive hobby let alone time consuming in search of the holy grail,i did take note in your post,and curious in the future to try 👍
This was a very thorough review! I see no comments on the lead-in groove noise, but I heard only a very subtle improvement. That doesn't convince me to clean a brand new record unless I hear a problem beforehand. I've improved noisy LPs by cleaning them with a 2-step process by hand, so I know it can produce dramatic results. I would recommend an anti-static gun, which costs about 1/4 the price of the battery device Terry was using (it does not need to be used every time a record is played), plus a carbon fiber brush. My gun is still firing after 40 years of use! And yes, I buy more CDs than LPs these days.
If I didn't already own a destat I probably would have bought the anti static gun when I first started as I was getting a lot of things together all at once and its expensive when you do. However its been working for years so yes its a few quid but if you get good use out of it and you know with 100% confidence it works and we do then I think its worth it.
Don't forget that brand new vinyl records contain a protective oil residue on their surface - that's what you smell and it's applied to protect the top side of the record below and the underside of the record above as they are stacked on top of each other in the manufacturing plant. That oil residue is then transferred onto your stylus on playback, which attracts other dust particles to stick on, therefore, affecting clean stylus transport travelling through the groove - I'm sure you seen the x100s film playback of this on UA-cam. And that's why we clean new records.
Born in 1960 I grew up with vinyl and like most that grew up with it we hated it, most preferred the sound and convenience of tape. It was the greatest day in my audio life when CDs were invented.
I was born a few years later than you & since 1997 have bought only new CD's. I have budget CD players & several high end record players. I enjoy listening to my old vinyl records & often turn them into CDR's & listen to them that way! Only the best vinyl is better than CD. CD replay has improved but so has vinyl. CD can be rather monotonous & lack true tonal colour. On the other hand vinyl can lack clarity.
It baffles me how modern vinyl lovers forget this. Vinyl was never satisfactory and when CD came along we were glad to toss vinyl out the door. I do get the whole tactile and visual experience, nicely engineered tables arms and carts... But don't tell me you like vinyl because it sounds better, lol.
I've been collecting vinyl since I was young courtesy of my fathers pub jukebox. I now have too many albums to count. Some vinyl are just poor quality, others come with imperfections, some are damaged through accidents, others have residue from the manufacturing process. I deal with them by separating all records that have finger prints, dirty or just pop. Next I clean them with a paper towel using IPA Isopropyl alcohol and finally clean them with my Degritter 2 machine. This works well in 90% of cases making even new records sound better. Over the years I've tried many approaches, but the above method has proven the most successful.
Forget the paper towel when using Isopropyl. Use a goat hair brush instead. Cover the vinyl in isopropyl and work it into the groove with the brush, than brush round in line with the groove a few times and the cleaning results are fantastic. Then you can use you machine if you must or simply just rinse off.
Love your approach, so much better than some others’ approach to cleaning. I’ve long maintained that having one tank with cleaning solution (whatever one you like, but preferably without rubbing alcohol) and one with just distilled water for rinsing is the way to go. There’s one UA-camr who has a setup with circulation and filtration, but it’s the same water and cleaning solution. Fact is, whatever cleaning solution that’s used, there will be residue, which will gunk up the grooves and the needle. Sure, it’s not a lot, but with lots of plays, it will accumulate. I also appreciate your approach with real measurements. Well produced and well put together. Thank you for the awesome content and your effort and passion for the vinyl community.
Thanks for making this video it has most of the reasons I don’t have any interest in buying vinyl all in one video, to sum it up in a one word “inconvenient” 😀
Wow... color me extremely impressed. Your enthusiast+ (...pro-thusiast? haha, just came up with that) approach to addressing these issues is a breath of fresh air in a sea of "experts" and "audiophiles" bestowing us with their infallible knowledge. 🙄 It's about time someone with a sense of logic, good ears, and an enjoyable personality breathes some new life into exploring ways of overcoming these difficult to overcome issues that plague serious record listening. You said nobody would want to watch an hour-long video on this subject, but I hit the subscribe button immediately after this was over because I'm certainly looking forward to more of this!
Excellent information!! Thanks for putting this together very informative. Too bad records are so expensive as it is in a comeback mode you would think all interested parties would work to keep the prices in check but not so much.
This is a brilliant episode Thank you. Crikey albums used to cost £3.50 in Woolworths! I always preferred the early paper sleeves with no plastic liner these stopped static but when the plastic-lined ones came out then static became a big problem. In the 70's records were made of thicker and denser vinyl these records were not affected by static as much as the later thinner albums of the 80's which you could get quite a belt off!
Hi Terry, Great video. Thank you for making and showing it on UA-cam. I also bought over a year ago now and use the FMX-003 Electrostatic Tester to check the static on my records. It's a great measuring and diagnostic tool ! I have a had the same experiences as you Terry regarding static on records even after I have cleaned my records on my Keith Monks Classic RCM (the one the BBC Archive Dept used to use!) using the Keith Monks Discovery Cleaning Fluids (when there is zero static directly after cleaning my records) and then putting them in Mofi Anti-Static Inner Sleeves. As soon as I take them out of the record sleeve I have quite a bit of static. So what I do to heavily reduce the static on the record is as follows; From the sleeve put record direct onto the TT platter (I have a Kuzma XL DC TT), clamp record to platter using the Kuzma screw threaded Spindle Clamp, then take my Milty Zerostat 3 gun and zap the record in four places at each axis 90 degrees to each other of the record with four slow trigger pulls and releases at each axis position. Then directly after this anti-static treatment I blow any settling dust with a 'Giotto' bulb blower (the largest one in the series), start up the platter and lower my stylus. Then take a reading with my FMX-003 Tester. This method always heavily reduces the static on the surface of the record. When I have finished playing one side of the record and take the record off the platter I can hear the static coming back, so I repeat the above process when I play the other side of the record. Then after I have played the record, before I put it back in it's Mofi anti-static inner sleeve, I give it a couple of zaps with my Zerostat gun and remove any dust with my 'Giotto' bulb blower. I have tried various so called 'anti-static' brushes but all of them have failed in reducing the static as soon as you brush the record with them and then check with my FMX-003 Tester. Either a manual bulb blower (like I use) or a canister of pure clean compressed air to blow away any surface dust is the way to go. I have also found especially in the UK winter that a humidifier and Ionizer helps in general dust and static in the air. I see by your TT in this video you have a DS Audio ION-001 ? Is it any good ? I was thinking some time ago in buying the CSPort IME1 ! It is very expensive though for what it is (like most things in the HiFi world I guess !) Also thinking of buying an Ultrasonic Record Cleaner to use after the pre-wash & main wash & rinse I do on my Keith Monks Classic RCM as even after using this RCM I still hear some crackles and pops on some records (especially the old & second hand ones, but also on some brand new records too ! as I am a critical listener i.e. mainly use my Headphone System - Hifiman EF1000 Amp with Susvara Headphones connected to my CH Precision P1 with X1 Phono Stage which is connected to my Kuzma 4Point 11" Tonearm fitted with an MSL Eminent Ex cartridge). Thinking at the moment the best path to take ??? i.e. buy a KLaudio LP-200T URCM (only gives 40kHz ultrasonic frequency but can be fitted with a 5 LP auto changer and a Silencer Cabinet which would also stop any dust in the room air entering) or the Degritter MK2 (only gives 120kHz ultrasonic frequency, no LP auto changer and no Silencer Cabinet - although guess I could make one for it) or the DIY route with an Elma Elmasonic Ultrasonic Record Cleaning Bath (gives dual 35kHz and 80kHz ultrasonic frequencies but Transducers fitted to the bottom of the Bath) fitted with the Kuzma RD Ultrasonic Cleaning Spinner Kit (to clean say up to 5 LPs together at any one time) and a cocktail of cleaning fluids (but this system takes up a lot of space if I go for two tanks i.e. one for washing and one for rinsing plus the filter and pumping systems for each tank etc. plus the maintenance of the equipment !) Also note that with Ultrasonic Cleaning, in order to get right into the bottom of the record grooves to clean them of debris, even 120kHz (from the Degritter) may not be a high enough frequency (bubble diameter still larger than the bottom of the record groove) and you need to go higher i.e. 200+ kHz ! However, after using my Keith Monks Classic RCM and I wanted a semi automated and of little fuss type of machine, currently the Degritter MK2 is the best choice on the commercial market due to it's 120kHz ultrasonic frequency, whereas the KLaudio with its 40kHz ultrasonic frequency wont be as beneficial after using the Keith Monks Classic RCM compared to the Degritter. Best current solution though would be to have both the Degritter and KLaudio URCMs along with my Keith Monks Classic RCM, but the cost is huge ! How are you finding the Degritter MK2 Terry ? Do you get good results ?
Back in the day, I used the discwasher brand. Sleaves , brush, cleaner, anti stat gun, then a hardener for the stylus, a anti vibration matt, a disc weight. It all worked well together.
Bought a new old stock Discwasher D4 about a year ago after going through several other completely disappointing modern brushes. Excellent in the 80s and it still is today. 👍
I love hearing the pops and crackling on vinyl records, older records that were made a very long time ago sound so good i don't mind the popping the noise is what gives the vinyl records a unique sound.
First things first: When a record is stuck in the sleeve due to static, breathe gently into the sleeve a couple of times, and be careful to not cough or spit unto the record or the sleeve. This will remove enough static for you to be able to get the record out with no accidents ocurring to the record (dropping it, grabbing the surface etc.). More humidity = less static. Please be aware that in the 'dry' (=cold) season, lots of humidity can disappear from the air, creating lots of static, and artificial carpets can and will do the same. Woollen carpets is the answer IMO. In this season of the year, house plants unfortunately require less water than they do in the summer. Watering your house plants could mean a difference in the indoors humidity level. Secondly: Plasma (arc) lighters can be just as efficient as antistatic guns, and cost only a fraction. A side note: My old records carry no static worth mentioning, only the recently bought ones. This tells me that I'd never spend money on a Furutech destat III, because with a little time, it's really no longer necessary. A last question: Can a mat carry static? Looks like it, doesn't it? Could be interesting to know which mat materials are the best/worst in that regard.
Happily most old sleeves will have fallen apart at the glued seams and the inner sleeve will have ripped so one can just pull it back from the record instead of sliding it out ! Just as cd plastic covers will have broken at the hinges and one can easily let the cover fall off at the right angle !
Watching this video made me realise how much time I spend on preparing my records before I listen to them. I wash once, put into the MoFi sleeve. When listening, I brush and zerostat the record. Happy days.
Thank you! Love the scientific approach as so many vinyl process reviews are totally subjective. I've been very curious about the Furutech Destat but the price has been off-putting because I had no evidence it would do what it claims. Living in the desert SW of the United States static can be a real issue year round (just as it can be in the dry of winter elsewhere). Also loved the vid you produced about record cleaning using the microscope. I despise clicks and pops which deters my vinyl playback love. The dynamics of the sound etc... are great but the sudden inclusion of a click or pop really kills the mood!
I've been collecting and listening to records since the 70s. My first album was Kimono my House by Sparks; I still have it and still love it. At the age of 13 I just slung it on the record player and enjoyed it. It still plays great. My point is you can get too hung up on listening to quality rather than just playing music and loving it. If your ears are scanning for pops and clicks you will hear them over everything. I now have a lot of records, I store them properly, give them a quick swoosh with a carbon fibre brush then lose myself in the music.
I loved the content because you put the woke into it and had the quantitive results. I've learned a valuable lesson from wife who isn't fond of house work and dusting. She has purchased air cleaners for her asthma and they have the wonderful effect of keeping my records in a better environment. The units she bought have an electrostatic system with a HEPA filter. (Multi -Tech). They work and the cost was 400 bucks and the cost of electricity to run them continuously. What a difference in the quality to your lungs and records!. The filter comes with a monitoring system light for cleaning the system. HEPA filter is washable.
Very interesting video, I always learn things from these tests, thanks. So what about that DS Audio Monument that was seen on some parts of the video bombarding the record with magic green light and therefore eliminating static load as you play the record? I know it is the most expensive way but the question is how does it compared to the other process steps you tested?
Wild enthusiasm for this craft, I respect that. I still use Gorilla wood glue, clean after with Nitty Gritty, and then a final distilled water wet wipe to remove any leftover impurities. It works great. And static? I literally hold a dryer sheet in my hands close to my turntable, lightly just touching the record. That works too. I’d like to get one of those static testers. Thanks for the vid.
Thanks for watching the video, I think I should have given a better summary, clearly all the anti static sleeves are better than any your records come in.
I love playing records, and I like good gear, and I even like cleaning my records and fiddling with stuff, but I genuinely have love the physical and musical experience since my first 300$ turntable and 69$ record washing device. I not have a $3500 turntable but still enjoy the heck out of it and my kids use it all the time. Have fun but try not to stress too much about it. It’s really a lot of fun for the whole family and if you find things getting in the way of that (and with a bit of OCD I am always tempted to) I would suggest showing those things the door. But I genuinely love the content! You are the real McCoy
Definitely a lot of talk :) Why don't you try a Zerostat (Which works 100%) which is far cheaper than your expensive brush and the extremely expensive furutech? In addition, the cheap project must be discharged by running it over the spindle of your turntable.
when i look back to my teenage years...life was so much more simplier...buy a record..play the record, repeat...cleaning...never on the radar...stylus...never again on the oh i must get a new one.....move on 40 years...what the hell has happened...OCD about cleaning..paranoid about stylus..great video
Buy a turntable, put the record on the turntable, put the needle on the record. Press the start button. Now you know everything you need to know. You are welcome.
22:45 That is essentially an ionizer. Some hair dryers come with air ionizers that can be switched on even when the dryer is on the cold air setting. I have never tired using a hair dryer on a vinyl record so if anyone does I'd be interested in the results. Of course you do not want to use a hair dryer on the hot air setting to remove the static from a vinyl record!
Great video! Regarding static, I'm hoping Part 2 will include a test of the Zerostat 3 gun, a less expensive alternative to the Furutech DeStat III that doesn't require batteries. Vinyl enthusiasts have been using them seemingly since the dawn of time. Since it's such a well-established accessory, I'd love to know how it stacks up against the other products you've tested here.
Retest the brush so that you are holding the metal part as you brush. I think you will get a different result. Pretty sure. Thanks for the great video!
A quick reply. Thank you for doing this! So many people have opinions, but rarely based on real tests! Now, I'm going to try to find more affordable options to yours if they are available. The Degritter itself is as expensive as my turntable itself was ;) But it's so nice and so many people like it a lot....
I highly recommend using a carbon record brush (remember to rub it on some earthed metal before use) and as others here have said, a stylus gel pot to clean your stylus frequently. Fun fact: a lot of decks don't have a grounded spindle. If it is grounded most of the static from the vinyl goes to ground and not through your stylus. This simple modification does make a real difference.
This test was using a carbon brush and you see the results they can still add static. I did test with and without the turntable being grounded and that didnt seem to make any noticeable difference, similar to me being grounded and the tester being grounded. I tried as many different things as I could think of. Carbon alone is not the answer you see that very quickly doing this testing
Don't use those gel type things to clean your stylus they're not good people done some research into them and leave a residue behind, best to use blu tack make a inch ball of blue tank leave it on your turn table just dip your stylus into it and now and again remassage the blu tack, make sure you massage it before you use it good five minutes
Terry, I’m amazed at the lengths to which you go to find these solutions, so well done for effort. Here’s what I do: 1 clean the record once before first play on my Pro-Ject VCE using the Pro-Ject fluid diluted using distilled water, per the instructions. 2 play the record without using any so-called anti-static voodoo devices or brushes with the lid down on my record deck. 3 put the record in an MA Recordings dual fibre sleeve, available from Russ Andrews in the UK. Result: absolutely no dust whatsoever accumulates on my records. They never need cleaning again and they slide effortlessly out of the sleeve every time I wish to play them. To clarify, I use a Linn LP12 turntable which has a full contact metal bearing mounted on an alloy sub-chassis. The sub-chassis is earthed to the phono pre-amp using the separate earth lead on the interconnects. It maybe my regimen of cleaning and the MA sleeves or it may be the static on the record is draining away through the spindle. Either way, if there is static present I can’t detect it and it’s certainly not attracting dust during play.
I am going to try those sleeves as they look different. I started with the VCE and the project fluid I bought loads of it and mixed up two different dilutions 10 and 20%. I cleaned records in the degritter that had previously been cleaned on the VCE and I could hear they sounded better after. In case you get a chance to test this take it and see what you think. The degritter is a lot of money and it’s not a perfect solution but there are some advantages to it you can hear that
Very informative video regarding current items available to clean, store and reduce static for records. I was able to detect a slight difference between the no clean and twice cleaned playback. Just think the cost, time and inconvenience required to clean and check static level takes away from the simple pleasure of listening to them.
Back in the 70's, the original Discwasher company made the D-Stat mat for your turntable and it worked extremely well to get rid of static electricity.
Terry, I have a Mk1 Degritter and I to use a second rinse tank filled with distilled water. To clean records I usually use the longest cycle but after the first wash I press the button on the left which brings my machine back to the wash program and give it a second long wash straight away and before the record dries. That gives me two long washes before I have to use the rinse tank and it go's into the drying mode. It saves time and some hassle switching tanks, not sure if this is possible on the MkII but give it a try.
Interesting as yes you have to go through the whole thing when really you don’t need to. Do you press the left button when it tells you to put the second tank in essentially cancelling the process and starting again?
@@PursuitPerfectSystem Yes, when it asks you to insert the rinse tank press button/ knob on the left once and it should take you back to the wash cycle giving you two washes before a rinse and dry.
Great informative video Terry, I love my vinyl journey and the rituals associated with better playback. The thing that bugs me is the poor pressings and sound quality right off the bat regardless of how much you clean or remove the static. It's got to the point now that I check out the pressing company and sound studio before buying vinyl. I've had too many horrible recordings that they only get played once then become wall art.
Wow.... i didnt realise you could make the easiest/least effort to use record cleaning machine on the market and overcomplicate matters and make it a chore! Ive had a Degritter mk1 for 4 years and its done 1500+ washes. Ive personally found it takes just one heavy wash to clean any record (and a sole light wash will do for new ones in anti stat sleeves) which also results in static removal. Ive only used distilled water with a teets worth of the Degritter fluid. I honestly feel no need to go to the lengths you do with yours sir! Thanks to the Degritter i use no brush or static eliminators but i DO always use anti stat sleeves. While it does wash the grooves well its ultimately quite a gentle process (which is good) but i have found that most new records get quieter after 3 play throughs as well (especially the US plant pressings) so that is proof that the Degritter isnt a complete miracle worker alone. What it cant do is reduce pressing flaws and every record has an audible noise floor but some are alot worse than others. I reckon well over 50% of my modern pressings from GZ Media and Optimal who produce the vast majority of releases in the EU/UK market have non fills/stitching and other issues to boot. No amount of Degritting can help here. Also the Degritter is a tool for large collections of folks who want to wash/play alot of records quite frequently. I find a 5litre bottle of distilled water does 3 tank fulls. The tank must be emptied and replenished after 1 week regardless of it youve washed 1 record or maxxed out and washed 50 which will require some top ups from the bottle to reach as each wash does consume water. This means washing records for the sake of it upfront and getting the most out of the water. I have spent £100s washing so far! All that being said, with a collection of 2500+ records and a value on Dcogs that makes me think ive gone too far i can still look at the Degritter as a good value cleaner as its less than 3% of my collections supposed median value. Its a pleasure to use and the amount of TIME ive saved by washing with this machine is worth ALOT in itself. If my collection was 100-200 i wouldnt have bothered with one but there ye go, Just my two pennies! NB: "DOL" label records are best avoided!
They designed it to be used with 2 tanks, I don’t see how that is making it a chore? It’s designed to be used with 2 tanks so one can be a wash and the other a rinse it’s how the machine works. Maybe it can make your process even better if you consider doing it that way too.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem When i spoke with the makers of the Degritter and trialled some different experimental surfactant they sent me there was no mention of this being at all necessary. In fact its designed to clean records very effectively with zero surfactant and i can confirm it does just that. The filter clearly does its job fine too. For me the reason to own a Degritter is the automated ease of use and sheer time it saves as a result. As it gets my records quieter than i could have ever imagined anyway, i think i will happily continue as is and am happy to potentially miss out. Just wanted to share some long term ownership experiences 👍
Fair enough Tom, there is a video where someone looks at record grooves under a microscope checking the effectiveness of Tergikleen that was what sold it to me to use it - if I had time I would find the link for you, but it was easy to discover, I found it
@@PursuitPerfectSystem I might try it, i just have no issue with my existing method and sometimes the can of worms is best left unopened! My biggest issue with records is crappy pressings from certain plants and the amount of non fills that come with them which no machine can alleviate. Most recently my biggest surface noise change came from leaving elliptical tipped carts behind and switching to microline. Has convinced me to stick with this oft frustrating method of music playback!
That I totally understand, its my job to open the can though mate, its what I enjoy to some degree but I find it stressful as well. I havent quite got my head around the different cartridges tips etc, thats another of my frustrations, I like to know the differences so I can find what I like etc. Its hard its so complex
Great, formative video. I particularly was interested in the anti-static gun, but that one seems pricey! Any chance you could compare some cheaper ones and see if they are as effective?
One thing that isn’t usually talked about is pops and clicks from damage to the vinyl itself. You can run your record as many times as you want in any record cleaning machine of your choosing. But if the vinyl’s damaged, nothing will get rid of the clicks and pops. The other thing that usually isn’t mentioned is dirt on the stylus. This too can produce pops and clicks. What people need to remember is that when you clean your records, you need to clean your stylus as well. It’s best to get into the habit of cleaning your stylus not only every time you clean your records, but every time you play a record as well. This will not only improve the sound, but your records and stylus will last longer and damage to the record can be mostly avoided as well.
I disagree... for years now, on the worst records, just plain and simple wood glue on side A, let the LP sit for a day, peel off, flip to side B, repeat. For about 5 bucks at home depot, Titebond II or III does the trick. I had an old LP bought on Ebay that had a mint sleeve, etc.. but was full on pops and clicks... after the wood glue it was pristine, just like the day if was pressed.
@@cvee2614 How can you disagree about cleaning the stylus? By all means clean you records with wood glue, but then what? Are you suggesting that record is now clean forevermore? Of course it's not and it will attract just as much dust as any other record.
I'm in my late 60's, I knew and experienced all this 40 years ago. That's why I eventually got rid of my vinyl albums and never looked back; I had hundreds of them. I'm a musician and don't need the "ritual" and the extra baggage, just the music please. Most of this tendency towards any medium is what you are playing the music on and your listening preferences. If you do vinyl, every damn cartridge, speaker, and everything in the chain changes the sound dramatically; same for digital depending on the DAC and other variables. So ultimately who's to say which actually sounds better with so many playing and listening variables? So to me it boils down to avoiding the things you cannot change like ticks, pops, and other distortions. Those are the things in vinyl that's part of their sound that I don't like and refuse to live with. All I want to hear is the musical performance and nothing else. To me as a performer it would be like being on the stage and adding tics, pops, and warbling to my music. I don't think the audience would appreciate that; not with jazz or classical anyway.
I clean mine on a vac wash,then i put them into anti static sleeves, the biggest improvement was when i changed my turntable to a rega p8 with alpheta 3 mc, it seems to be less affected by pops etc yet the quality of the music is top tier
For how expensive the Degritter is I don't think there was enough of a difference. Yes, I did hear the differences between one and two cleanings, but I think the pressing / vinyl formulation has inherent noise that won't come out. I think a lower priced solution be it the Spin Clean or a Record Doctor vacuum cleaner does well enough, and I use a Furutech DeStat III to get rid of static, it's effective and so easy to use. I use the DeStat III first then brush off the record with my vintage Discwasher brush. I find that the dust comes off the record much more easily once the static is removed. To really insure you remove noise the solution is the Sweet Vinyl Sugarcube, of which there are several models available. They are expensive, but they work so effectively it's like magic. I I have the SC-2 which also records and know that the Sugarcube is an indispensable part of my system.
Now you have seen the tester data, maybe your adding static to the record again brushing it after the destat, if the static is high before thats likely the sleeve as I showed, I think destat after brushing makes more sense so maybe before and after for you but that takes a long time and is a lot of work
Back in the late 70's I had a device called the Phase Linear Autocorrelator 1000. IIRC, it cost about $350 back then. It was a dynamic range expander and had a circuit to remove pops in the record surface. It worked well and I used it for years. Was lost/stolen during a move. Today,, I don't buy a lot of LPs, but if I find a dirty one, I clean it with my Record Doctor cleaner and use Titebond II on the surface. It does a good job of pulling off embedded particles from the surface lowering pops, etc. YMMV
Great video, Terry!! Vinyl prices are just getting really ridiculous..And the quality control from certain pressing plants dotted around the globe leave a lot to be desired... >>.P. (in Japan* ex-Scotland)
Thanks for your efforts Terry. Turntables and vinyl are a hobby unto themselves, with so much to learn. It's understandable why a lot of people stuck with CDs and, well, digital streaming. But I love it, for all its quirks. On a side note: I bought the vinyl of Come Away With Me and find it unlistenable, as it seems to be mastered very hot, so that sibilance is distorted on most tracks. How have you found your pressing? Or did I just buy the 'vanilla' version?
I have found it to be terrible and just assumed I had a bad one. I was seeing so called experts saying how amazing this lp is as it’s all analogue but mine sounds like shite.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem Yeah, that's a shame. Just looked online about it: It seems there are no decent version out there. There's an 'Analogue Productions' version which seems to have mixed results; some say it's great, while others say it's noisy with pops and clicks and a skewed balance... I dunno. I do expect there to be an 'audiophile 45rpm pressing' at some point in the future, but I also expect that it will be priced for audiophiles. Lucky us.
I’ve gone between using a carbon brush on the deck whilst it’s spinning and nothing but letting the stylus do its thing. Since occasionally having a record get stuck playing the same revolution due to crud deep in the groove and also creating scratches I feel it’s best to use a brush. Some incidents proved to be really difficult to shift the blob..I also use the Disco Antistat bath which makes records look good and static free but I’m sure it sometimes doesn’t get deep enough as the ball of fluff on the stylus proves. When I’ve used a carbon brush on my spinning record, I’ve found it charges the record-this saves money from having to buy one of those decks with an attached vacuum pump-it just means I have to peel my mat off the back afterwards. It’s an interesting subject that seems to cause confusion for most of us, me included. Vinyl is an insulator so placing it on a platter mat doesn’t necessarily cause it to totally discharge. I think with the platter mat you’re sort of creating a capacitor/ van der graff generator, with the hopefully earthed platter then the mat and vinyl as the dielectric and then yourself and brush as the other electrode charging it all up-The spindle is say touching the vinyl but it’s an insulator so most of the record won’t be discharged. I found out that you should have the platter earthed though as when I lowered my Rega RB300 arm by removing a shim I didn’t realise that unscrewing the nut underneath the top plinth , I caused the earth foil to fracture. I started playing records afterwards with regular discharges through the cartridge and then realised what had happened. I used some thin copper slug tape to repair the situation. Perhaps having either side of the vinyl earthed equalises the potential out-but leaves the charge still there on the vinyl. I’m probably talking a load of rubbish but I definitely need the platter to be earthed. I suspect the stylus charges the vinyl up as well with friction?
Yeah, the Disco bath thing is pretty good, although I tend to leave the liquid in there a long time, so I'm not really sure how much good it's actually doing my records! It does seem to clean them up okay, especially if they're properly filthy and skippy.
All joking aside and I'm not mocking your technical explanation - but actually so much of these static issues are caused simply by the user skiffing their feet over a nylon carpet, or whilst wearing nylon socks, or nylon content house slippers, then touching their record. They've charged themselves up to the max straight onto the record.
I had an old tape of "McCartney" from 1970, so I recently purchased a new vinyl pressing at a reasonable price, and in the middle of one of the sides there was a nasty pop for about 10 revolutions and it looked like there was a speck of something (?) in the mold that shouldn't have been there; one day it annoyed me to the point where I really tried to clean it off the grooves and I managed to get the "speck" off without any damage, and after that the record played fine.. this was new vinyl fresh out of the package.. I've seen the same thing with a couple of CDs over the years; it's rare but it happens. not sure what goes on in some of the factories where these things come from!😉 The Takeaway here is you can't expect these disks to be clean, even when you are buying them new..🤬
@@peterlarkin762 Interesting! My main gripe about CD's is also about the packaging. It's not a big deal to fabricate unbreakable cases. They crack and break so easily that it's a slap in the face really... whether it's CD or vinyl, the "packaging" is usually a bad joke..
I’ve watched hours of videos on this topic, and yours is one of the clearer ones I’ve viewed. Could be a bit better though. I would consider an ‘outline’ approach. Identify the challenges (dust, oily dirt, static). Describe the tools (Dry Clean = brush or cloth; Wet Clean = Plain Bath, Electrically Aided Bath; Static = Wand or DeIonizer). Then report methods used and results achieved. You could probably use much of the same footage, just frame it a bit better. On the other hand, your conversational style, and your passion, came across quite well, too. So maybe don’t mess with what works for you.
Paper inner sleeves -- which is how virtually all LPs were packaged (some classical titles aside) until fairly recently -- are more than just stat-icky dust magnets. They shed little bits of fibrous debris that can muck up your record. I prefer MoFi-style vinyl and rice paper inners, which I find easier to handle because the rice paper stiffens them a bit. (The all-vinyl ones tend to cling to the records, and I don't like the rounded-bottom ones because there's less material you can grab onto and they are more likely to move around inside the cardboard jacket.) BTW, I dig that linear-tracking turntable you have. I've never seen that brand before (but I'm in the US).
This is a quite comprehensive review of up-to-date record care products. New collectors should start here. Of course it should be mentioned that paper sleeves are to be avoided - especially if the paper is bleached - and cardboard sleeves are simply the devil! I very much look forward to the record mat episode. What a great idea to do a review of such products" The last thing remotely resembling something of this sort that I can recall must have been a record mat review/endorsement in What Hi-Fi back in the nineties!
Yeah, yeah... I'm going to try to pretend I'm not envious #PursuitPerfectSystem ! [This youtube comment deletion thing is really getting annoying! I'm re-posting this in the hope it will appear this time!]
I think it's a constant thing that they still haven't fixed #PursuitPerfectSystem It started not too many months ago but now it is just really bad. I find that every time I reply back to a reply to a comment I have made, my reply always gets deleted. This time I have tried replying to my initial comment instead and using hash-tags to notify the person I'm replying to and it seems to have worked so far (fingers crossed).
Its not deleted but I manage all the comments to stop all the scammers and such getting through, there was a real problem with some time ago. Plus sometimes there are trolls and haters and I don't overly moderate but some has to be done. But there are issues today where I am authorising the comment but it still doesn't go through and I have to keep doing it.
Humidity control in the room is very important and possibly earth grounding an underlying anti static mat so the static charge has somewhere to go. Room humidity above 55% will nearly eliminate static on any surfaces.
I buy nice records and clean them once and that's it. Never have static issues and never worry about slight crackles in the silent parts. I think it's literally what makes vinyl worth while.
I inherited some very well loved records which were initially used by a radio station in the 70s. Played dry, they sounded kinda rough and screechy. I then cleaned them once with clear water and cleared the groove with microfibre cloth (I know, fibres will get loose, I didn‘t care. I then applied window cleaner directly from the pump bottle. The alcohol didn’t hurt the material as far as I can tell. I brushed it during playback. The window cleaner also leaves a thin film of parafine wax. You’ll have to remove the buildup every song during the first playback, but it will be just fine for the next maybe 5 or 6 listening sessions. Now, modern LPs might be more finicky, but my old stuff really improves with this low maintenance process.
If you brush records during playback you add a lot of static to them, my testing showed that as a consistent behaviour so I wouldn't advise that. Before you drop the stylus brushing might or might not add static but once its playing the chances are much higher, again based on my testing.
Way back in the 70's I owned an Impulse Noise Reduction Unit. This unit plugged in between the TT and the preamp. It basically replaced the pop with a sample of the music being played.
I use various felt/fibre brushes to remove dust; an original Zerostat to neutralize static; and the Parks Audio Puffin MAGIC feature to declick/pop, if necessary.
While I’m new to most of this, I chose the Nagoaka Anti static sleeves. Have not tested the actual results but I do like that form factor and they’re easy to use.
Though my main source is digital, i still own a pretty good vinyl setup, Terry. I got rid of 95% plus of pops and clicks by using an almost industral ultra sonic cleaner fixed to a motor with 15 minutes runs - more if it's old. I use warm pure distilled water and a small amount of pure acohol. It seems to work.
The sound has a lot to do with the listening experience but there’s more to it than that. There’s something about vinyl that just feels more organic. It seems like there’s more of a human element that draws a younger crowd like myself. It’s sort of a brief escape from the digital realm. Also nostalgia. As a kid I spent hours with my dad’s records on a decent system back in the early to mid eighties.
I still have loads of vinyl from the 70's & 80's. Don't believe for a moment that any of my records is better than the equivalent CD. I suppose some people prefer taking a journey on a steam train rather than a TGV...each to his own.
I disagree... for years now, on the worst records, just plain and simple wood glue on side A, let the LP sit for a day, peel off, flip to side B, repeat. For about 5 bucks at home depot, Titebond II or III does the trick. I had an old LP bought on Ebay that had a mint sleeve, etc.. but was full on pops and clicks... after the wood glue it was pristine, just like the day if was pressed.
Back in the 80s when I still bought records, I used a great product, Permostat by Stanton. It was a liquid that came in a spray bottle. You applied it once before you played the record, and you didn’t have any problems with clicks and pops after that. I think it’s still available.
I'm plagued by static, have tried everything - particularly unimpressed by the Milty anti-stat gun. But the Furutech Destat III really does look like the magic ingredient, more important than anything else. If you had a limited sum to invest and could choose between upgrading from vacuum to Degritter, or buying a Destat III it seems the latter is the obvious option. I wonder if I dare take the plunge. A very stimulating video!
All You need Is a Sweetvinyl Sugarcube SC1 Mini, This will take away all Noise without touching the Music. I have had mine for the last three years, and It Is the best thing I have ever bought. And It Is up-gradable as well. Set the dial at no more than 5. If you have to set It more than that. Then best place for that record, Is the bin. None of these cleaners will get rid of everything. Good Luck, and thanks for sharing.
I have the Nagaoka sleeves which seem to work well, but they are a pain to return the disc to the outer sleeve. Hint: don't run your fingers through the bristles of your cleaning brush - you are adding skin oils to the strands.
Great review. I would like to have seen you use the Furutech directly on the TT. I've been using the Thunderon antistatic brush on both the record and the platter mat. This method indefinitely dissipates static.
Hello, Appreciate your work! Nice to hear fresh outlook. I've been on vynolium since a kid. Always used Nagoka and Tonar half round type for ultra-scratchy cardboard sleeves and Goldring Poly-lined-Paper to replace scratchy paper. Good to see the performance differences! Nagoka Carbon Fibre Brush - Never Touched Bristles with greasy fingers (tut tut) lol Not done much cleaning but have an ultrasonic cleaner ready to convert one day... Static meter insightful. Who makes it? Brushing an insulator = Van de Graaff Generator but removing dust a must... Führertech Destat looks a superb cure! (Curious to see if £65 Zerostat works). Interesting, Blue vynolium compound seems to hold higher charge than black. Maybe the black is dyed with carbon... Also, wonder how an industrial anti-static gun (chynaa £70) or industrial desktop air ioniser compares with £400 fürershaften? PS. Love how savvy poster found cleaning solution for tenth price. Always read ingredients... Confucius said: Never confuse Führertech Brush with makeup brush...
I love that Norah Jones album its my Sunday morning chill out pleasure. I only have it on CD though i may have to try the vinyl because ive just got a Rega P3 turntable.
Excellent video. But - you have to touch the metal on the Furitec brush WHILE BRUSHING. You touched it for a moment and then brushed it while not touching the metal. The act of dragging the brush fibers across the vinyl does generate static, and by touching the metal (preferably if you are grounded) you dissipate that static as you brush.
The cheap carbon brushes work just fine, while the record is spinning move the brush towards the middle of the record slowly and in one motion, make sure it does the whole record.. I do it 3 times and I never have dust on my needle after playing the record.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem no dust on the stylus after practically every play. Just go slowly moving the brush towards the center of the record. I do it 3 times, cleaning the brush in between, which is simple with these brushes, away from the record of course.
Other items for your journey. US audiophile label MA recordings has special record sleeves from Japan, similar to CD sleeves inside some MoFi gold CD's. Harder to slide in some cardboard record covers, but static free. If not DJ ing, 3M Dots (rated at 0.6 lb) from office supply store can prevent some platter mats from slipping and use the same glue as 3M Post it notes. As 70's Revox TT platters are not flat. From Australia is the Les Davis magic mat (imported into the US) and easily gotten from US Amazon is the Hibiki Carbon Fiber Slipmat from Vinyl supply Co. Can't afford the super cleaning machines, so have settled on the Hart record brush available from Ebay made in the UK to clean the record on the TT before playing in place of the carbon and felt brushes.
A simple cheap plasma arc lighter is quite good at eliminating static from records. You hold it a small distance from the surface about an inch or two away about the same as the Destat device. Mover it around the whole surface, pretty much the same as the Destat device going around the record. You can even do it while it’s spinning on the turntable without any problems. It’s cheap and easy and best of all it works well.
I have over 5,000 vinyl records and what I use to clean them very successfully is the German product called DISKO ANTISTAT II. I had a catastrophe where they were stored as a friends, (no names - TONY !!😁), ceiling collapsed in their Attic and they didn't know. Plaster dust and rain got into the records, but after getting some of the sleeves that were totally ruined off the records, I've cleaned them up to almost brand spanking new. All except for 23 outta 5.000. My record collection started in 1973. I recommend Disko Antistat II. It comes as a complete kit, trough, holding wheel, It has goat hair bristle brush & comes with sealing tool to protect labels (does 7 inch and 78s equally well too), 12 record drying rack & funnel and loads of filters to reuse the solution that comes with it. You can also buy the solution separately. Got mine from Amazon. Cheers, Clive - Spyda Music Productions 😎
This is the way! I love mine, absolutely fantastic product and I do not understand why we don't all use it. The anti static gun by comparison is absolutely terrible; it only removes like a quarter of the static buildup
You’re relentless “Pursuit” for improvements with well tested results is one of the many reasons I watch. Credibility through the roof. Watching your new Vinyl journey that started around the same time as mine has been a blast these past years. Great job Terry as always.
Thank you very much, I really appreciate the kind words and sentiment meant here, it means a lot. The next video will be of interest to you too. Going live tomorrow all being well
How I Stopped Worrying and Learned to Love Vinyl. When you stop worrying about all the imperfections, the true beauty of vinyl comes shining through.
Dr. Strangelove!
yeah really! I understand and empathize with the idea of feeling uncomfortable with not knowing what you are doing. Once you know what you are doing, if you find that you are merely trading in one bag of anxiety for another one, then you have do decide when to let go of being right and try to get to being happy. "It" is not going to happen, you are going to happen. Get the "anti static" inner sleeves and some decent outer sleeves, clean up. Or... do the digital thing. When you have records or cds - you have them, and that is that. When you have streaming and all that other stuff, you have physical space in your home but you don't have records or cds. This is pretty much how I see it.
Hahaha
I've got a record that almost sizzles with light scratches and imperfections but the base recording is so good that it's not bothersome at all.
Bingo. If i want it to sound perfect I just go to CD.
I still love my vinyl, but like some others here I was converted at an early age...
1985 - I was 15 years old and walking through K-Mart with my mom. At the time, my cassette based Walkman was the best sounding thing I had ever heard. K-Mart had a brand new CD player on display with headphones hanging next to it. Having never heard a CD before, I had to try. I put on those headphones and pressed the play button. It was Tears for Fears - Songs From the Big Chair. As the intro to "Shout" began, I literally thought the gates of Heaven had opened to me and I had possibly just passed away in the K-Mart. I think I may have had a tear come out of one eye.
To this day, that was a legitimate out of body experience I will never forget. The sound was that good! Music listening was never the same again, and I really don't miss much about the older formats. I still have my Technics SL-QL1 linear tracker connected to an Anthem amp, and I love to play my old albums from the 80's. It is purely for the ritual and that it just kind of "takes me back". I LOVE to hear the cracks and pops - that's part of the experience.
I am an avid audiophile still, and have a massive CD collection after becoming a rock radio personality in the 90's. I've heard many formats and nothing has ever topped the experience of that K-Mart CD player for me!
Born in ‘55, I grew up with vinyl and used it consistently till CDs came along. But, I’ve held on to my collection, many of which are classics today. I recently decided to buy a new turntable and set up an audio component system in my home office and am enjoying those old records, pops and all, just reliving great memories of the greatest rock music ever made, just the way I heard it back then. Priceless!!!
To maintain the quality of your vinyl records, it's essential to handle your brushes properly. Avoid touching them with your hands, as oils and dirt can transfer to the brush and, subsequently, to your records, affecting their sound quality. When using a static brush, ensure you touch the metal part during application to ensure an effective cleaning process. Before returning your record to its sleeve, use an antistatic device to eliminate any static buildup. I've found this method to be the most effective in reducing static, though I haven't found a record sleeve that completely eliminates it. With these practices, you can better preserve the integrity of your vinyl collection. Best of luck, and enjoy your music! - Robert
Get a strong turntable light, see all those Carbon bristles on your album?
Throw those damn brushes away and us a MoFi pad or similar, a bulb blower and camel hair brush to finish off any leftover lint.
If static is an issue, a Destat or Zero Stat work great.
I was hoping someone would comment on him touching the brushes. I have a version of the cheaper brush and the way I use it is with the record spinning on the turntable, just let it glide over the surface and slowly move it from the inside out. The bristles can ride inside the grooves that way.
Record cleaning is a rabbit hole - and a very expensive one to fall down, given that the Degritter 2 costs £2500. I've been cleaning vinyl for 45 years now and, at the age of 60, have finally found my ideal solution (literally). After some research I decided to buy 10mls of generic Tergitol. This cost me £5. Then I bought 4 microfibre cloths from Aldi (£1.99). After giving up on trying to get distilled water I just use double filtered and boiled tap water.Each of my 4 cloths has it's dedicated function (Wiping, washing, rinsing and drying). I then play the record, as this is part of the cleaning process, as some residue will be picked up by the stylus, depending on the condition of the record, cleaning the stylus after every 2 or 3 tracks. In all the process takes around 15 minutes per album (plus the playing time). Ok, it's a bit more hands-on than a machine, but not much.The other thing I will mention is the most miraculous of all. Stylus cleaning. Get yourself a Melamine sponge (I use Mr Siga, about £2 in hardware shops, also known in America as Magic Eraser) and gently drop your stylus onto it using the cueing arm. Do not scape it or move it around as this will damage the stylus. Just lift it up and down 2 or 3 times. Then play the record and prepare to be amazed. Of course, like everyone, you will not believe that this will work. No one does until they try it. I certainly didn't. But this little tweak has me using my 40 year old cartridge with it's original stylus (Ortofon ff15e mk2) on an LP12, and wondering why I considered buying a new one. My 45+ year old vinyl now sounds better than it ever has before and all for less than a tenner. Phew....
Thanks for these "economical" tips, which I'll try as soon as I get the chance.👍
Awesome stroke of sanity!
The Audio Elites will try to silence you... hehe
Go to your nearest aquarium centre and get Reverse Osmosis (RO) water for next to nothing. Its purified water. My last 50ltr refill cost £4.50/$7. It will usually have been UV treated to kill any bacteria. But you can add some sodium meta-bisulphite (1g per 5ltrs water) to kill off any remaining bacteria in the water if it hasn't been UV treated, or if you're unsure. I live in a very hard water area, so I use it for ironing, steam mop, window cleaning etc as well, as all the limescale is removed in the RO process.
I use it the same way 😀
10mls of generic Tergitol for £5 - 2 table spoons for a fiver! I've sneezed nearly as much! Explain how much you use please and in the wiping and/or washing?
for what they charge for vinyl, everything should come in antistatic sleeves and be pristine !! cheap bastards out to maximize profits by bending over the customers !!
I cant argue with that 😁
... and to think that what they're selling is a piece of vinyl in a piece of cardboard! Think of all the money they make out of really old re-issues! At least we can be thankful there still is a vinyl industry,, even if they over-charge everything.
By the way, is any vinyl record printed these days actually analogue? That is a more pertinent question in my book...
Totally agree, mate. 100%
@@Stelios.PosantzisI get that vinyl is expensive but I think you are severely underestimating the effort it takes to press a quality record.
I agree.
I thoroughly enjoyed this video. But I will never understand people spending heaps of money trying to make vinyl sound as perfect as possible. Part of the fun is the clicks and pops... it has always just added to the experience for me. If I need to hear a song in perfect clarity it is surely available online somewhere. Putting on an LP is about watching that record turn and letting the imperfections in the medium create an ambience of its own. But to each their own.
I collect black metal music on vinyl and couldn’t agree more
🤘☹️🖤☮️
Exactly. I thought that was point in vinyl collecting these days, for the clicks and depth of the sound. That background noise makes it feel a bit more real than some digital music on a CD..
I heard a few less ticks after the 2nd cleaning.
What I have found is the lined inner sleeves, like the Mofi, actually charge the records with static electricity when they are slid in and out.
A brand new record in the anti-static sleeve has such a high static electrical charge that I can hold the inner sleeve by it's bottom corners, with the open side straight down, and the record will NOT fall out.
The lined inner sleeves they used to use in the British Decca pressings, to me, were far superior to anything we have now.
Using several of the carbon type brushes, including those with metal handles electrically connected to the brushes, like you found, actually charges the records with static electricity. After brushing the records, I use a ZeroStat gun to neutralize the charge.
Playing the record creates static electricity from the friction of stylus running through the grooves. When playing the other side of the record, you should zap it with a static-removing device.
I use a VPI RCM to wet-clean and vacuum dry the records. As long as the record vacuums no more than 3 revolutions, static electricity is eliminated.
Ticks and pops can be eliminated playing through a special device or like when I record to hard drive, as I do with all my records, a computer program will eliminate most of them .
One of my pet peeves is the rubbing sound in the quiet or dead grooves of the records. To me, it was very prominent in all your sample. It can be cut back electronically, but then you will also lose some of the sounds you want to hear on the record. I am in the U.S. and it seems that the pressing companies here use a higher quality vinyl mix for premium quality records, compared to what I find in E.U. pressings. I believe that Pallas in Germany uses a vinyl mix as good as used in the U.S. The Optimal Media pressings are some of the noisiest.
I'll never forget the sight of you cleaning the record while grounded.
😂
I just love the way this topic just keeps going round and round 😂 PS: it’s a shame the ‘Degritter’ doesn’t dry and then play the record: an opportunity missed I recon. PPS: I’m nearly 70 and fortunately managed to move on from actually getting bothered by all this decades ago (I do look after my vinyl). Good thing too, otherwise my age related tinnitus would have me pulling what hair I have left out at the roots. PPPS: the surprises with the sleeve inserts you had might be due to humidity, both when the record is put in, when it is taken out and how much ‘rubbing’ of the plastic on the record as you do both (which includes the pace at which they are removed and put in and if the sleeve is folded over the vinyl as it rubs over the vinyl during removal) - this last just to prove I can do nerdy with vinyl 😅 PPPPS: Static is a physics thing due to rubbing (the electrons, say, are literally rubbed off). Rubbing = static. Some materials (the brush/sleeve/vinyl itself) -> more static per ‘rub’. A really good anti-static removal tool would have the properties of that battery powered hairdryer thingy which ‘neutralises’ the charge. If your brush was metallic (bristles + handle, and yes, I realise the issue) and earthed by a wire like the one round your wrist, that would remove static and would be cheaper (but more cumbersome) that your hairdryer.
Yes around and around...
78/45/33 1/3 a complete revolution and some more,vinyl can be addictive an expensive hobby let alone time consuming in search of the holy grail,i did take note in your post,and curious in the future to try 👍
This was a very thorough review! I see no comments on the lead-in groove noise, but I heard only a very subtle improvement. That doesn't convince me to clean a brand new record unless I hear a problem beforehand. I've improved noisy LPs by cleaning them with a 2-step process by hand, so I know it can produce dramatic results. I would recommend an anti-static gun, which costs about 1/4 the price of the battery device Terry was using (it does not need to be used every time a record is played), plus a carbon fiber brush. My gun is still firing after 40 years of use! And yes, I buy more CDs than LPs these days.
If I didn't already own a destat I probably would have bought the anti static gun when I first started as I was getting a lot of things together all at once and its expensive when you do. However its been working for years so yes its a few quid but if you get good use out of it and you know with 100% confidence it works and we do then I think its worth it.
Don't forget that brand new vinyl records contain a protective oil residue on their surface - that's what you smell and it's applied to protect the top side of the record below and the underside of the record above as they are stacked on top of each other in the manufacturing plant. That oil residue is then transferred onto your stylus on playback, which attracts other dust particles to stick on, therefore, affecting clean stylus transport travelling through the groove - I'm sure you seen the x100s film playback of this on UA-cam. And that's why we clean new records.
Born in 1960 I grew up with vinyl and like most that grew up with it we hated it, most preferred the sound and convenience of tape. It was the greatest day in my audio life when CDs were invented.
Same
I was born a few years later than you & since 1997 have bought only new CD's. I have budget CD players & several high end record players. I enjoy listening to my old vinyl records & often turn them into CDR's & listen to them that way! Only the best vinyl is better than CD. CD replay has improved but so has vinyl. CD can be rather monotonous & lack true tonal colour. On the other hand vinyl can lack clarity.
could not be more wrong
It is true that you have to have a good cleaning machine. Back in the day we didn't have those. A £500 vacuum machine will do the job.
It baffles me how modern vinyl lovers forget this. Vinyl was never satisfactory and when CD came along we were glad to toss vinyl out the door. I do get the whole tactile and visual experience, nicely engineered tables arms and carts... But don't tell me you like vinyl because it sounds better, lol.
I've been collecting vinyl since I was young courtesy of my fathers pub jukebox. I now have too many albums to count. Some vinyl are just poor quality, others come with imperfections, some are damaged through accidents, others have residue from the manufacturing process. I deal with them by separating all records that have finger prints, dirty or just pop. Next I clean them with a paper towel using IPA Isopropyl alcohol and finally clean them with my Degritter 2 machine. This works well in 90% of cases making even new records sound better. Over the years I've tried many approaches, but the above method has proven the most successful.
Forget the paper towel when using Isopropyl. Use a goat hair brush instead. Cover the vinyl in isopropyl and work it into the groove with the brush, than brush round in line with the groove a few times and the cleaning results are fantastic. Then you can use you machine if you must or simply just rinse off.
Love your approach, so much better than some others’ approach to cleaning. I’ve long maintained that having one tank with cleaning solution (whatever one you like, but preferably without rubbing alcohol) and one with just distilled water for rinsing is the way to go. There’s one UA-camr who has a setup with circulation and filtration, but it’s the same water and cleaning solution. Fact is, whatever cleaning solution that’s used, there will be residue, which will gunk up the grooves and the needle. Sure, it’s not a lot, but with lots of plays, it will accumulate. I also appreciate your approach with real measurements. Well produced and well put together. Thank you for the awesome content and your effort and passion for the vinyl community.
Thanks for making this video it has most of the reasons I don’t have any interest in buying vinyl all in one video, to sum it up in a one word “inconvenient” 😀
Wow... color me extremely impressed. Your enthusiast+ (...pro-thusiast? haha, just came up with that) approach to addressing these issues is a breath of fresh air in a sea of "experts" and "audiophiles" bestowing us with their infallible knowledge. 🙄 It's about time someone with a sense of logic, good ears, and an enjoyable personality breathes some new life into exploring ways of overcoming these difficult to overcome issues that plague serious record listening.
You said nobody would want to watch an hour-long video on this subject, but I hit the subscribe button immediately after this was over because I'm certainly looking forward to more of this!
Excellent information!! Thanks for putting this together very informative. Too bad records are so expensive as it is in a comeback mode you would think all interested parties would work to keep the prices in check but not so much.
Try collecting northern or modern soul vinyl then you will see some very expensive prices.
This is a brilliant episode Thank you. Crikey albums used to cost £3.50 in Woolworths! I always preferred the early paper sleeves with no plastic liner these stopped static but when the plastic-lined ones came out then static became a big problem. In the 70's records were made of thicker and denser vinyl these records were not affected by static as much as the later thinner albums of the 80's which you could get quite a belt off!
Man, you're going up! Exclusive, expensive records, Bergmann and German Physiks!
Hi Terry, Great video. Thank you for making and showing it on UA-cam.
I also bought over a year ago now and use the FMX-003 Electrostatic Tester to check the static on my records. It's a great measuring and diagnostic tool !
I have a had the same experiences as you Terry regarding static on records even after I have cleaned my records on my Keith Monks Classic RCM (the one the BBC Archive Dept used to use!) using the Keith Monks Discovery Cleaning Fluids (when there is zero static directly after cleaning my records) and then putting them in Mofi Anti-Static Inner Sleeves. As soon as I take them out of the record sleeve I have quite a bit of static. So what I do to heavily reduce the static on the record is as follows; From the sleeve put record direct onto the TT platter (I have a Kuzma XL DC TT), clamp record to platter using the Kuzma screw threaded Spindle Clamp, then take my Milty Zerostat 3 gun and zap the record in four places at each axis 90 degrees to each other of the record with four slow trigger pulls and releases at each axis position. Then directly after this anti-static treatment I blow any settling dust with a 'Giotto' bulb blower (the largest one in the series), start up the platter and lower my stylus. Then take a reading with my FMX-003 Tester. This method always heavily reduces the static on the surface of the record. When I have finished playing one side of the record and take the record off the platter I can hear the static coming back, so I repeat the above process when I play the other side of the record.
Then after I have played the record, before I put it back in it's Mofi anti-static inner sleeve, I give it a couple of zaps with my Zerostat gun and remove any dust with my 'Giotto' bulb blower.
I have tried various so called 'anti-static' brushes but all of them have failed in reducing the static as soon as you brush the record with them and then check with my FMX-003 Tester. Either a manual bulb blower (like I use) or a canister of pure clean compressed air to blow away any surface dust is the way to go.
I have also found especially in the UK winter that a humidifier and Ionizer helps in general dust and static in the air.
I see by your TT in this video you have a DS Audio ION-001 ? Is it any good ?
I was thinking some time ago in buying the CSPort IME1 ! It is very expensive though for what it is (like most things in the HiFi world I guess !)
Also thinking of buying an Ultrasonic Record Cleaner to use after the pre-wash & main wash & rinse I do on my Keith Monks Classic RCM as even after using this RCM I still hear some crackles and pops on some records (especially the old & second hand ones, but also on some brand new records too ! as I am a critical listener i.e. mainly use my Headphone System - Hifiman EF1000 Amp with Susvara Headphones connected to my CH Precision P1 with X1 Phono Stage which is connected to my Kuzma 4Point 11" Tonearm fitted with an MSL Eminent Ex cartridge).
Thinking at the moment the best path to take ??? i.e. buy a KLaudio LP-200T URCM (only gives 40kHz ultrasonic frequency but can be fitted with a 5 LP auto changer and a Silencer Cabinet which would also stop any dust in the room air entering) or the Degritter MK2 (only gives 120kHz ultrasonic frequency, no LP auto changer and no Silencer Cabinet - although guess I could make one for it) or the DIY route with an Elma Elmasonic Ultrasonic Record Cleaning Bath (gives dual 35kHz and 80kHz ultrasonic frequencies but Transducers fitted to the bottom of the Bath) fitted with the Kuzma RD Ultrasonic Cleaning Spinner Kit (to clean say up to 5 LPs together at any one time) and a cocktail of cleaning fluids (but this system takes up a lot of space if I go for two tanks i.e. one for washing and one for rinsing plus the filter and pumping systems for each tank etc. plus the maintenance of the equipment !)
Also note that with Ultrasonic Cleaning, in order to get right into the bottom of the record grooves to clean them of debris, even 120kHz (from the Degritter) may not be a high enough frequency (bubble diameter still larger than the bottom of the record groove) and you need to go higher i.e. 200+ kHz !
However, after using my Keith Monks Classic RCM and I wanted a semi automated and of little fuss type of machine, currently the Degritter MK2 is the best choice on the commercial market due to it's 120kHz ultrasonic frequency, whereas the KLaudio with its 40kHz ultrasonic frequency wont be as beneficial after using the Keith Monks Classic RCM compared to the Degritter. Best current solution though would be to have both the Degritter and KLaudio URCMs along with my Keith Monks Classic RCM, but the cost is huge !
How are you finding the Degritter MK2 Terry ? Do you get good results ?
Mate .. I applaud you in your efforts .. thanks for sharing .. it’s no dibby dibby nonsense ..!we’ve all been there .. ❤
The Precision Aqueous Cleaning method is just oh so much better than any other cleaning method for removing both debris and static.
yes,i can attest to that! the best cleaning system i"am aware of!
Thanks for this. Has helped me to stop concerning myself with alot of the nonsense in the vinyl collection hobby.
Back in the day, I used the discwasher brand. Sleaves , brush, cleaner, anti stat gun, then a hardener for the stylus, a anti vibration matt, a disc weight. It all worked well together.
Bought a new old stock Discwasher D4 about a year ago after going through several other completely disappointing modern brushes. Excellent in the 80s and it still is today. 👍
I love hearing the pops and crackling on vinyl records, older records that were made a very long time ago sound so good i don't mind the popping the noise is what gives the vinyl records a unique sound.
I still prefer my old Discwasher brush and anti-static fluid.44 years of use and still does the best job!
First things first:
When a record is stuck in the sleeve due to static, breathe gently into the sleeve a couple of times, and be careful to not cough or spit unto the record or the sleeve. This will remove enough static for you to be able to get the record out with no accidents ocurring to the record (dropping it, grabbing the surface etc.).
More humidity = less static. Please be aware that in the 'dry' (=cold) season, lots of humidity can disappear from the air, creating lots of static, and artificial carpets can and will do the same. Woollen carpets is the answer IMO.
In this season of the year, house plants unfortunately require less water than they do in the summer. Watering your house plants could mean a difference in the indoors humidity level.
Secondly:
Plasma (arc) lighters can be just as efficient as antistatic guns, and cost only a fraction.
A side note:
My old records carry no static worth mentioning, only the recently bought ones. This tells me that I'd never spend money on a Furutech destat III, because with a little time, it's really no longer necessary.
A last question:
Can a mat carry static? Looks like it, doesn't it?
Could be interesting to know which mat materials are the best/worst in that regard.
Happily most old sleeves will have fallen apart at the glued seams and the inner sleeve will have ripped so one can just pull it back from the record instead of sliding it out ! Just as cd plastic covers will have broken at the hinges and one can easily let the cover fall off at the right angle !
Watching this video made me realise how much time I spend on preparing my records before I listen to them. I wash once, put into the MoFi sleeve. When listening, I brush and zerostat the record. Happy days.
Thank you for this informative video! I loved it Terry :) This would be so useful for other new vinyl users
Thank you! Love the scientific approach as so many vinyl process reviews are totally subjective. I've been very curious about the Furutech Destat but the price has been off-putting because I had no evidence it would do what it claims. Living in the desert SW of the United States static can be a real issue year round (just as it can be in the dry of winter elsewhere). Also loved the vid you produced about record cleaning using the microscope. I despise clicks and pops which deters my vinyl playback love. The dynamics of the sound etc... are great but the sudden inclusion of a click or pop really kills the mood!
Thanks for the comprehensive review! I use the Milty Zerostat 3 Anti-Static Gun, which works and doesn’t need batteries 👍
Me too. It really works. You can easily prove it with some rice paper record sleeves.
Same here!
Superb gadget and I showed it working on a video
Damn! Your Records are really really clean.
Great video. Knowledge is power .
When it comes to sleeves, I found this brand ‘invest in vinyl’ you get 50 3 mil outer and 50 rice paper inner for 25 bucks. Love them!
I've been collecting and listening to records since the 70s. My first album was Kimono my House by Sparks; I still have it and still love it. At the age of 13 I just slung it on the record player and enjoyed it. It still plays great. My point is you can get too hung up on listening to quality rather than just playing music and loving it. If your ears are scanning for pops and clicks you will hear them over everything. I now have a lot of records, I store them properly, give them a quick swoosh with a carbon fibre brush then lose myself in the music.
Disaster production on that Kimono. Muff Winwood did it I believe. Shoulda been known as Muffled.
I loved the content because you put the woke into it and had the quantitive results. I've learned a valuable lesson from wife who isn't fond of house work and dusting. She has purchased air cleaners for her asthma and they have the wonderful effect of keeping my records in a better environment. The units she bought have an electrostatic system with a HEPA filter. (Multi -Tech). They work and the cost was 400 bucks and the cost of electricity to run them continuously. What a difference in the quality to your lungs and records!. The filter comes with a monitoring system light for cleaning the system. HEPA filter is washable.
Very interesting video, I always learn things from these tests, thanks. So what about that DS Audio Monument that was seen on some parts of the video bombarding the record with magic green light and therefore eliminating static load as you play the record? I know it is the most expensive way but the question is how does it compared to the other process steps you tested?
Wild enthusiasm for this craft, I respect that. I still use Gorilla wood glue, clean after with Nitty Gritty, and then a final distilled water wet wipe to remove any leftover impurities. It works great. And static? I literally hold a dryer sheet in my hands close to my turntable, lightly just touching the record. That works too. I’d like to get one of those static testers. Thanks for the vid.
the wood glue idea seems like too much work on a larger collection. I still carefully wash mine in the sink with warm water.
Thanks for watching the video, I think I should have given a better summary, clearly all the anti static sleeves are better than any your records come in.
Great information! I learned a ton!
I love playing records, and I like good gear, and I even like cleaning my records and fiddling with stuff, but I genuinely have love the physical and musical experience since my first 300$ turntable and 69$ record washing device. I not have a $3500 turntable but still enjoy the heck out of it and my kids use it all the time. Have fun but try not to stress too much about it. It’s really a lot of fun for the whole family and if you find things getting in the way of that (and with a bit of OCD I am always tempted to) I would suggest showing those things the door. But I genuinely love the content! You are the real McCoy
Zero stat gun does pretty good not perfect that’s what radio stations did back in the day but I’m sure filtering is used to
We used a zero stat along with d4 fluid and diskwasher cleaner before carting music for air play
Definitely a lot of talk :)
Why don't you try a Zerostat (Which works 100%) which is far cheaper than your expensive brush and the extremely expensive furutech? In addition, the cheap project must be discharged by running it over the spindle of your turntable.
i like the pops and clicks. reminds me its analog.
when i look back to my teenage years...life was so much more simplier...buy a record..play the record, repeat...cleaning...never on the radar...stylus...never again on the oh i must get a new one.....move on 40 years...what the hell has happened...OCD about cleaning..paranoid about stylus..great video
Ive been using vinyl since 1966 because thats all we had .and its mostly excellent, because the family always looked after our records 😊
Buy a turntable, put the record on the turntable, put the needle on the record. Press the start button. Now you know everything you need to know. You are welcome.
22:45 That is essentially an ionizer. Some hair dryers come with air ionizers that can be switched on even when the dryer is on the cold air setting. I have never tired using a hair dryer on a vinyl record so if anyone does I'd be interested in the results. Of course you do not want to use a hair dryer on the hot air setting to remove the static from a vinyl record!
Great video! Regarding static, I'm hoping Part 2 will include a test of the Zerostat 3 gun, a less expensive alternative to the Furutech DeStat III that doesn't require batteries. Vinyl enthusiasts have been using them seemingly since the dawn of time. Since it's such a well-established accessory, I'd love to know how it stacks up against the other products you've tested here.
Retest the brush so that you are holding the metal part as you brush. I think you will get a different result. Pretty sure. Thanks for the great video!
A quick reply. Thank you for doing this! So many people have opinions, but rarely based on real tests! Now, I'm going to try to find more affordable options to yours if they are available. The Degritter itself is as expensive as my turntable itself was ;) But it's so nice and so many people like it a lot....
People like the Humminguru its like a smaller much more affordable version
@@PursuitPerfectSystem I had never heard of that, but it looks great! Thanks! Hope it doesn't talk French to me though as I am a bit (much) rusty..
Interesting stuff indeed! Well done.
Jim🏴🙂
I highly recommend using a carbon record brush (remember to rub it on some earthed metal before use) and as others here have said, a stylus gel pot to clean your stylus frequently.
Fun fact: a lot of decks don't have a grounded spindle. If it is grounded most of the static from the vinyl goes to ground and not through your stylus. This simple modification does make a real difference.
This test was using a carbon brush and you see the results they can still add static. I did test with and without the turntable being grounded and that didnt seem to make any noticeable difference, similar to me being grounded and the tester being grounded. I tried as many different things as I could think of. Carbon alone is not the answer you see that very quickly doing this testing
Don't use those gel type things to clean your stylus they're not good people done some research into them and leave a residue behind, best to use blu tack make a inch ball of blue tank leave it on your turn table just dip your stylus into it and now and again remassage the blu tack, make sure you massage it before you use it good five minutes
Thanks! Objective data is always helpful...
4:09 4-9kV! I never expected this! You learn something new every day...
Same there is a lot when they are new
Very nice review as always. Would have been nice to see how the Milty Zerostat gun compares.
Thanks got you covered here ua-cam.com/video/oz2xevWUlWo/v-deo.html
@@PursuitPerfectSystem awesome! Thanks for the link
I'll watch it in a bit. Subscribed! All the best.
Terry, I’m amazed at the lengths to which you go to find these solutions, so well done for effort. Here’s what I do:
1 clean the record once before first play on my Pro-Ject VCE using the Pro-Ject fluid diluted using distilled water, per the instructions.
2 play the record without using any so-called anti-static voodoo devices or brushes with the lid down on my record deck.
3 put the record in an MA Recordings dual fibre sleeve, available from Russ Andrews in the UK.
Result: absolutely no dust whatsoever accumulates on my records. They never need cleaning again and they slide effortlessly out of the sleeve every time I wish to play them.
To clarify, I use a Linn LP12 turntable which has a full contact metal bearing mounted on an alloy sub-chassis. The sub-chassis is earthed to the phono pre-amp using the separate earth lead on the interconnects. It maybe my regimen of cleaning and the MA sleeves or it may be the static on the record is draining away through the spindle. Either way, if there is static present I can’t detect it and it’s certainly not attracting dust during play.
I am going to try those sleeves as they look different. I started with the VCE and the project fluid I bought loads of it and mixed up two different dilutions 10 and 20%. I cleaned records in the degritter that had previously been cleaned on the VCE and I could hear they sounded better after. In case you get a chance to test this take it and see what you think. The degritter is a lot of money and it’s not a perfect solution but there are some advantages to it you can hear that
Very informative video regarding current items available to clean, store and reduce static for records. I was able to detect a slight difference between the no clean and twice cleaned playback. Just think the cost, time and inconvenience required to clean and check static level takes away from the simple pleasure of listening to them.
You don’t need to check the static I am doing that for the purposes of the video to show the differences in the products :)
Back in the 70's, the original Discwasher company made the D-Stat mat for your turntable and it worked extremely well to get rid of static electricity.
Terry, I have a Mk1 Degritter and I to use a second rinse tank filled with distilled water. To clean records I usually use the longest cycle but after the first wash I press the button on the left which brings my machine back to the wash program and give it a second long wash straight away and before the record dries. That gives me two long washes before I have to use the rinse tank and it go's into the drying mode. It saves time and some hassle switching tanks, not sure if this is possible on the MkII but give it a try.
Interesting as yes you have to go through the whole thing when really you don’t need to. Do you press the left button when it tells you to put the second tank in essentially cancelling the process and starting again?
@@PursuitPerfectSystem Yes, when it asks you to insert the rinse tank press button/ knob on the left once and it should take you back to the wash cycle giving you two washes before a rinse and dry.
Great informative video Terry, I love my vinyl journey and the rituals associated with better playback. The thing that bugs me is the poor pressings and sound quality right off the bat regardless of how much you clean or remove the static. It's got to the point now that I check out the pressing company and sound studio before buying vinyl. I've had too many horrible recordings that they only get played once then become wall art.
When buying older records, always seek out first pressings. Avoid re-pressings.
Wow.... i didnt realise you could make the easiest/least effort to use record cleaning machine on the market and overcomplicate matters and make it a chore!
Ive had a Degritter mk1 for 4 years and its done 1500+ washes. Ive personally found it takes just one heavy wash to clean any record (and a sole light wash will do for new ones in anti stat sleeves) which also results in static removal. Ive only used distilled water with a teets worth of the Degritter fluid. I honestly feel no need to go to the lengths you do with yours sir! Thanks to the Degritter i use no brush or static eliminators but i DO always use anti stat sleeves.
While it does wash the grooves well its ultimately quite a gentle process (which is good) but i have found that most new records get quieter after 3 play throughs as well (especially the US plant pressings) so that is proof that the Degritter isnt a complete miracle worker alone. What it cant do is reduce pressing flaws and every record has an audible noise floor but some are alot worse than others. I reckon well over 50% of my modern pressings from GZ Media and Optimal who produce the vast majority of releases in the EU/UK market have non fills/stitching and other issues to boot. No amount of Degritting can help here.
Also the Degritter is a tool for large collections of folks who want to wash/play alot of records quite frequently. I find a 5litre bottle of distilled water does 3 tank fulls. The tank must be emptied and replenished after 1 week regardless of it youve washed 1 record or maxxed out and washed 50 which will require some top ups from the bottle to reach as each wash does consume water. This means washing records for the sake of it upfront and getting the most out of the water. I have spent £100s washing so far!
All that being said, with a collection of 2500+ records and a value on Dcogs that makes me think ive gone too far i can still look at the Degritter as a good value cleaner as its less than 3% of my collections supposed median value. Its a pleasure to use and the amount of TIME ive saved by washing with this machine is worth ALOT in itself.
If my collection was 100-200 i wouldnt have bothered with one but there ye go,
Just my two pennies!
NB: "DOL" label records are best avoided!
They designed it to be used with 2 tanks, I don’t see how that is making it a chore? It’s designed to be used with 2 tanks so one can be a wash and the other a rinse it’s how the machine works. Maybe it can make your process even better if you consider doing it that way too.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem When i spoke with the makers of the Degritter and trialled some different experimental surfactant they sent me there was no mention of this being at all necessary. In fact its designed to clean records very effectively with zero surfactant and i can confirm it does just that. The filter clearly does its job fine too. For me the reason to own a Degritter is the automated ease of use and sheer time it saves as a result. As it gets my records quieter than i could have ever imagined anyway, i think i will happily continue as is and am happy to potentially miss out.
Just wanted to share some long term ownership experiences 👍
Fair enough Tom, there is a video where someone looks at record grooves under a microscope checking the effectiveness of Tergikleen that was what sold it to me to use it - if I had time I would find the link for you, but it was easy to discover, I found it
@@PursuitPerfectSystem I might try it, i just have no issue with my existing method and sometimes the can of worms is best left unopened!
My biggest issue with records is crappy pressings from certain plants and the amount of non fills that come with them which no machine can alleviate. Most recently my biggest surface noise change came from leaving elliptical tipped carts behind and switching to microline. Has convinced me to stick with this oft frustrating method of music playback!
That I totally understand, its my job to open the can though mate, its what I enjoy to some degree but I find it stressful as well. I havent quite got my head around the different cartridges tips etc, thats another of my frustrations, I like to know the differences so I can find what I like etc. Its hard its so complex
Great, formative video. I particularly was interested in the anti-static gun, but that one seems pricey! Any chance you could compare some cheaper ones and see if they are as effective?
Yes now I have paid for the tester it makes sense to look at a few different other things, but it will take me a little bit of time to get there
@@PursuitPerfectSystem I’m patient 🙂
Haha :)
One thing that isn’t usually talked about is pops and clicks from damage to the vinyl itself. You can run your record as many times as you want in any record cleaning machine of your choosing. But if the vinyl’s damaged, nothing will get rid of the clicks and pops.
The other thing that usually isn’t mentioned is dirt on the stylus. This too can produce pops and clicks. What people need to remember is that when you clean your records, you need to clean your stylus as well. It’s best to get into the habit of cleaning your stylus not only every time you clean your records, but every time you play a record as well. This will not only improve the sound, but your records and stylus will last longer and damage to the record can be mostly avoided as well.
I disagree... for years now, on the worst records, just plain and simple wood glue on side A, let the LP sit for a day, peel off, flip to side B, repeat. For about 5 bucks at home depot, Titebond II or III does the trick. I had an old LP bought on Ebay that had a mint sleeve, etc.. but was full on pops and clicks... after the wood glue it was pristine, just like the day if was pressed.
@@cvee2614 How can you disagree about cleaning the stylus? By all means clean you records with wood glue, but then what? Are you suggesting that record is now clean forevermore? Of course it's not and it will attract just as much dust as any other record.
I'm in my late 60's, I knew and experienced all this 40 years ago. That's why I eventually got rid of my vinyl albums and never looked back; I had hundreds of them. I'm a musician and don't need the "ritual" and the extra baggage, just the music please. Most of this tendency towards any medium is what you are playing the music on and your listening preferences. If you do vinyl, every damn cartridge, speaker, and everything in the chain changes the sound dramatically; same for digital depending on the DAC and other variables. So ultimately who's to say which actually sounds better with so many playing and listening variables? So to me it boils down to avoiding the things you cannot change like ticks, pops, and other distortions. Those are the things in vinyl that's part of their sound that I don't like and refuse to live with. All I want to hear is the musical performance and nothing else. To me as a performer it would be like being on the stage and adding tics, pops, and warbling to my music. I don't think the audience would appreciate that; not with jazz or classical anyway.
I clean mine on a vac wash,then i put them into anti static sleeves, the biggest improvement was when i changed my turntable to a rega p8 with alpheta 3 mc, it seems to be less affected by pops etc yet the quality of the music is top tier
Very interesting thank you, someone with something useful to add is what comments sections should be for :)
For how expensive the Degritter is I don't think there was enough of a difference. Yes, I did hear the differences between one and two cleanings, but I think the pressing / vinyl formulation has inherent noise that won't come out. I think a lower priced solution be it the Spin Clean or a Record Doctor vacuum cleaner does well enough, and I use a Furutech DeStat III to get rid of static, it's effective and so easy to use. I use the DeStat III first then brush off the record with my vintage Discwasher brush. I find that the dust comes off the record much more easily once the static is removed. To really insure you remove noise the solution is the Sweet Vinyl Sugarcube, of which there are several models available. They are expensive, but they work so effectively it's like magic. I I have the SC-2 which also records and know that the Sugarcube is an indispensable part of my system.
Now you have seen the tester data, maybe your adding static to the record again brushing it after the destat, if the static is high before thats likely the sleeve as I showed, I think destat after brushing makes more sense so maybe before and after for you but that takes a long time and is a lot of work
Hmm - if you are using a Sugarcube , you have lost the magic of listening to a vinyl record , just buy a DAC instead
Back in the late 70's I had a device called the Phase Linear Autocorrelator 1000. IIRC, it cost about $350 back then. It was a dynamic range expander and had a circuit to remove pops in the record surface. It worked well and I used it for years. Was lost/stolen during a move. Today,, I don't buy a lot of LPs, but if I find a dirty one, I clean it with my Record Doctor cleaner and use Titebond II on the surface. It does a good job of pulling off embedded particles from the surface lowering pops, etc. YMMV
Great video, Terry!! Vinyl prices are just getting really ridiculous..And the quality control from certain pressing plants dotted around the globe leave a lot to be desired... >>.P. (in Japan* ex-Scotland)
What are you worried about that for when living in Japan? Japanese vinyl qualities are very good.
Thanks for your efforts Terry. Turntables and vinyl are a hobby unto themselves, with so much to learn. It's understandable why a lot of people stuck with CDs and, well, digital streaming. But I love it, for all its quirks. On a side note: I bought the vinyl of Come Away With Me and find it unlistenable, as it seems to be mastered very hot, so that sibilance is distorted on most tracks. How have you found your pressing? Or did I just buy the 'vanilla' version?
I have found it to be terrible and just assumed I had a bad one. I was seeing so called experts saying how amazing this lp is as it’s all analogue but mine sounds like shite.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem Yeah, that's a shame. Just looked online about it: It seems there are no decent version out there. There's an 'Analogue Productions' version which seems to have mixed results; some say it's great, while others say it's noisy with pops and clicks and a skewed balance... I dunno. I do expect there to be an 'audiophile 45rpm pressing' at some point in the future, but I also expect that it will be priced for audiophiles. Lucky us.
Love your channel. A suggestion. When you reference prices could you also mention US pricing? Thank you.
I’ve gone between using a carbon brush on the deck whilst it’s spinning and nothing but letting the stylus do its thing. Since occasionally having a record get stuck playing the same revolution due to crud deep in the groove and also creating scratches I feel it’s best to use a brush. Some incidents proved to be really difficult to shift the blob..I also use the Disco Antistat bath which makes records look good and static free but I’m sure it sometimes doesn’t get deep enough as the ball of fluff on the stylus proves. When I’ve used a carbon brush on my spinning record, I’ve found it charges the record-this saves money from having to buy one of those decks with an attached vacuum pump-it just means I have to peel my mat off the back afterwards. It’s an interesting subject that seems to cause confusion for most of us, me included. Vinyl is an insulator so placing it on a platter mat doesn’t necessarily cause it to totally discharge. I think with the platter mat you’re sort of creating a capacitor/ van der graff generator, with the hopefully earthed platter then the mat and vinyl as the dielectric and then yourself and brush as the other electrode charging it all up-The spindle is say touching the vinyl but it’s an insulator so most of the record won’t be discharged. I found out that you should have the platter earthed though as when I lowered my Rega RB300 arm by removing a shim I didn’t realise that unscrewing the nut underneath the top plinth , I caused the earth foil to fracture. I started playing records afterwards with regular discharges through the cartridge and then realised what had happened. I used some thin copper slug tape to repair the situation. Perhaps having either side of the vinyl earthed equalises the potential out-but leaves the charge still there on the vinyl. I’m probably talking a load of rubbish but I definitely need the platter to be earthed. I suspect the stylus charges the vinyl up as well with friction?
Yeah, the Disco bath thing is pretty good, although I tend to leave the liquid in there a long time, so I'm not really sure how much good it's actually doing my records! It does seem to clean them up okay, especially if they're properly filthy and skippy.
All joking aside and I'm not mocking your technical explanation - but actually so much of these static issues are caused simply by the user skiffing their feet over a nylon carpet, or whilst wearing nylon socks, or nylon content house slippers, then touching their record. They've charged themselves up to the max straight onto the record.
I had an old tape of "McCartney" from 1970, so I recently purchased a new vinyl pressing at a reasonable price, and in the middle of one of the sides there was a nasty pop for about 10 revolutions and it looked like there was a speck of something (?) in the mold that shouldn't have been there; one day it annoyed me to the point where I really tried to clean it off the grooves and I managed to get the "speck" off without any damage, and after that the record played fine.. this was new vinyl fresh out of the package.. I've seen the same thing with a couple of CDs over the years; it's rare but it happens. not sure what goes on in some of the factories where these things come from!😉
The Takeaway here is you can't expect these disks to be clean, even when you are buying them new..🤬
100%... It's not that rare - probably get contaminated as soon as they are put in a paper sleeve.
@@peterlarkin762 Interesting! My main gripe about CD's is also about the packaging. It's not a big deal to fabricate unbreakable cases. They crack and break so easily that it's a slap in the face really... whether it's CD or vinyl, the "packaging" is usually a bad joke..
I’ve watched hours of videos on this topic, and yours is one of the clearer ones I’ve viewed. Could be a bit better though. I would consider an ‘outline’ approach. Identify the challenges (dust, oily dirt, static). Describe the tools (Dry Clean = brush or cloth; Wet Clean = Plain Bath, Electrically Aided Bath; Static = Wand or DeIonizer). Then report methods used and results achieved. You could probably use much of the same footage, just frame it a bit better.
On the other hand, your conversational style, and your passion, came across quite well, too. So maybe don’t mess with what works for you.
Terry, you must try to get hold of a SweetVinyl SugarCube SC-2 Plus to play with - would make a great video too!
Thats cheating :)
@@PursuitPerfectSystem 🤣
Paper inner sleeves -- which is how virtually all LPs were packaged (some classical titles aside) until fairly recently -- are more than just stat-icky dust magnets. They shed little bits of fibrous debris that can muck up your record. I prefer MoFi-style vinyl and rice paper inners, which I find easier to handle because the rice paper stiffens them a bit. (The all-vinyl ones tend to cling to the records, and I don't like the rounded-bottom ones because there's less material you can grab onto and they are more likely to move around inside the cardboard jacket.) BTW, I dig that linear-tracking turntable you have. I've never seen that brand before (but I'm in the US).
Great video. I listened to my Super Audio CD in full while this video was covering all the cleaning required to listen to vinyl. 😂
To be fair I am surprised you had enough SACD to last the length of this video given how few there are available, jokes roll both ways
I have 264 now
This is a quite comprehensive review of up-to-date record care products. New collectors should start here.
Of course it should be mentioned that paper sleeves are to be avoided - especially if the paper is bleached - and cardboard sleeves are simply the devil!
I very much look forward to the record mat episode. What a great idea to do a review of such products" The last thing remotely resembling something of this sort that I can recall must have been a record mat review/endorsement in What Hi-Fi back in the nineties!
I am hoping to have the video out by Sunday, Monday would be better for me but its not a good day to post a serious video
Yeah, yeah... I'm going to try to pretend I'm not envious #PursuitPerfectSystem !
[This youtube comment deletion thing is really getting annoying! I'm re-posting this in the hope it will appear this time!]
YT is bad today, I am having real issues with the comments keep going away and I have to keep authorising them
I think it's a constant thing that they still haven't fixed #PursuitPerfectSystem
It started not too many months ago but now it is just really bad.
I find that every time I reply back to a reply to a comment I have made, my reply always gets deleted.
This time I have tried replying to my initial comment instead and using hash-tags to notify the person I'm replying to and it seems to have worked so far (fingers crossed).
Its not deleted but I manage all the comments to stop all the scammers and such getting through, there was a real problem with some time ago. Plus sometimes there are trolls and haters and I don't overly moderate but some has to be done. But there are issues today where I am authorising the comment but it still doesn't go through and I have to keep doing it.
Humidity control in the room is very important and possibly earth grounding an underlying anti static mat so the static charge has somewhere to go. Room humidity above 55% will nearly eliminate static on any surfaces.
I buy nice records and clean them once and that's it. Never have static issues and never worry about slight crackles in the silent parts. I think it's literally what makes vinyl worth while.
I inherited some very well loved records which were initially used by a radio station in the 70s. Played dry, they sounded kinda rough and screechy. I then cleaned them once with clear water and cleared the groove with microfibre cloth (I know, fibres will get loose, I didn‘t care. I then applied window cleaner directly from the pump bottle. The alcohol didn’t hurt the material as far as I can tell. I brushed it during playback. The window cleaner also leaves a thin film of parafine wax. You’ll have to remove the buildup every song during the first playback, but it will be just fine for the next maybe 5 or 6 listening sessions. Now, modern LPs might be more finicky, but my old stuff really improves with this low maintenance process.
If you brush records during playback you add a lot of static to them, my testing showed that as a consistent behaviour so I wouldn't advise that. Before you drop the stylus brushing might or might not add static but once its playing the chances are much higher, again based on my testing.
Way back in the 70's I owned an Impulse Noise Reduction Unit. This unit plugged in between the TT and the preamp. It basically replaced the pop with a sample of the music being played.
I use various felt/fibre brushes to remove dust; an original Zerostat to neutralize static; and the Parks Audio Puffin MAGIC feature to declick/pop, if necessary.
While I’m new to most of this, I chose the Nagoaka Anti static sleeves. Have not tested the actual results but I do like that form factor and they’re easy to use.
Though my main source is digital, i still own a pretty good vinyl setup, Terry.
I got rid of 95% plus of pops and clicks by using an almost industral ultra sonic cleaner fixed to a motor with 15 minutes runs - more if it's old. I use warm pure distilled water and a small amount of pure acohol. It seems to work.
The sound has a lot to do with the listening experience but there’s more to it than that. There’s something about vinyl that just feels more organic. It seems like there’s more of a human element that draws a younger crowd like myself. It’s sort of a brief escape from the digital realm. Also nostalgia. As a kid I spent hours with my dad’s records on a decent system back in the early to mid eighties.
I'm glad I gave up my vinyl addiction 25 years ago. No matter how hard I worked at it, always hiss and pop.
I still have loads of vinyl from the 70's & 80's. Don't believe for a moment that any of my records is better than the equivalent CD. I suppose some people prefer taking a journey on a steam train rather than a TGV...each to his own.
I disagree... for years now, on the worst records, just plain and simple wood glue on side A, let the LP sit for a day, peel off, flip to side B, repeat. For about 5 bucks at home depot, Titebond II or III does the trick. I had an old LP bought on Ebay that had a mint sleeve, etc.. but was full on pops and clicks... after the wood glue it was pristine, just like the day if was pressed.
Back in the 80s when I still bought records, I used a great product, Permostat by Stanton. It was a liquid that came in a spray bottle. You applied it once before you played the record, and you didn’t have any problems with clicks and pops after that. I think it’s still available.
I'm plagued by static, have tried everything - particularly unimpressed by the Milty anti-stat gun. But the Furutech Destat III really does look like the magic ingredient, more important than anything else. If you had a limited sum to invest and could choose between upgrading from vacuum to Degritter, or buying a Destat III it seems the latter is the obvious option. I wonder if I dare take the plunge. A very stimulating video!
All You need Is a Sweetvinyl Sugarcube SC1 Mini, This will take away all Noise without touching the Music. I have had mine for the last three years, and It Is the best thing I have ever bought. And It Is up-gradable as well. Set the dial at no more than 5. If you have to set It more than that. Then best place for that record, Is the bin. None of these cleaners will get rid of everything. Good Luck, and thanks for sharing.
I have the Nagaoka sleeves which seem to work well, but they are a pain to return the disc to the outer sleeve.
Hint: don't run your fingers through the bristles of your cleaning brush - you are adding skin oils to the strands.
I am using analogis wash`n`play, one bottle mixed in 5 liter destiled water, it really removes antistatic from the records
Great review. I would like to have seen you use the Furutech directly on the TT.
I've been using the Thunderon antistatic brush on both the record and the platter mat. This method indefinitely dissipates static.
Hello,
Appreciate your work! Nice to hear fresh outlook.
I've been on vynolium since a kid.
Always used Nagoka and Tonar half round type for ultra-scratchy cardboard sleeves and Goldring Poly-lined-Paper to replace scratchy paper.
Good to see the performance differences!
Nagoka Carbon Fibre Brush - Never Touched Bristles with greasy fingers (tut tut) lol
Not done much cleaning but have an ultrasonic cleaner ready to convert one day...
Static meter insightful. Who makes it?
Brushing an insulator = Van de Graaff Generator but removing dust a must...
Führertech Destat looks a superb cure! (Curious to see if £65 Zerostat works).
Interesting, Blue vynolium compound seems to hold higher charge than black. Maybe the black is dyed with carbon...
Also, wonder how an industrial anti-static gun (chynaa £70) or industrial desktop air ioniser compares with £400 fürershaften?
PS. Love how savvy poster found cleaning solution for tenth price. Always read ingredients...
Confucius said: Never confuse Führertech Brush with makeup brush...
I love that Norah Jones album its my Sunday morning chill out pleasure. I only have it on CD though i may have to try the vinyl because ive just got a Rega P3 turntable.
Don’t expect a miracle from it :)
This is why a have a great SACD player.
Excellent video.
But - you have to touch the metal on the Furitec brush WHILE BRUSHING. You touched it for a moment and then brushed it while not touching the metal. The act of dragging the brush fibers across the vinyl does generate static, and by touching the metal (preferably if you are grounded) you dissipate that static as you brush.
The cheap carbon brushes work just fine, while the record is spinning move the brush towards the middle of the record slowly and in one motion, make sure it does the whole record.. I do it 3 times and I never have dust on my needle after playing the record.
As you see in the video you may remove dust but you may also be adding static to the record, highly likely that you are.
@@PursuitPerfectSystem no dust on the stylus after practically every play. Just go slowly moving the brush towards the center of the record. I do it 3 times, cleaning the brush in between, which is simple with these brushes, away from the record of course.
Interesting tests.
Have you tested paper sleeves with antistitic foil inside them?
Other items for your journey. US audiophile label MA recordings has special record sleeves from Japan, similar to CD sleeves inside some MoFi gold CD's. Harder to slide in some cardboard record covers, but static free. If not DJ ing, 3M Dots (rated at 0.6 lb) from office supply store can prevent some platter mats from slipping and use the same glue as 3M Post it notes. As 70's Revox TT platters are not flat. From Australia is the Les Davis magic mat (imported into the US) and easily gotten from US
Amazon is the Hibiki Carbon Fiber Slipmat from Vinyl supply Co. Can't afford the super cleaning machines, so have settled on the Hart record brush available from Ebay made in the UK to clean the record on the TT before playing in place of the carbon and felt brushes.
A simple cheap plasma arc lighter is quite good at eliminating static from records.
You hold it a small distance from the surface about an inch or two away about the same as the Destat device.
Mover it around the whole surface, pretty much the same as the Destat device going around the record. You can even do it while it’s spinning on the turntable without any problems.
It’s cheap and easy and best of all it works well.