Moog Subsequent 37 : Not for Everyone (1 year review)
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- Опубліковано 6 сер 2024
- I usually don't take that long to review and give my opinion about gear I own..
But this one caused me a lot of frustration... and really wanted to take the time to be sure to don't jump to conclusion...
Well guess what, this synthesizer is probably the best sounding synthesizer I tried, still though.. couldn't make it fit my track...
🔥 You can grab my Subsequent 37 Melodic House & Techno Bank here : audioreakt.com/collections/fr...
⌚ Timeline:
00:00 Intro
00:26 What I love
05:22 What I Hate
07:44 What I overlooked
14:51 Better than clone or Vst Emulation ?
16:08 Not for everyone
🎛️ Effect used with the Sub37 : • How to get inspired qu...
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I've also just released a Melodic House & Techno Preset bank for the Moog Subsequent 37. You can find out more here : audioreakt.com/collections/frontpage/products/moog-subsequent-37-melodic-house-techno-presets
Looks matter. Great honesty.
i have the moog grandmother
thanks for this man, i just got on and very much excited to dig into some of the features you pointed out - i have a feeling this one is actually going to be a good fit after looking at it objectively
Have fun man, it's a joy too play with !
I bought the sub37 when it first came out. I sent it to Moog last year to get it upgraded to subsequent37 for $350, and they paid return shipping. The upgrade was well worth it. The sub37 was my first analog synth, and will definitely be keeping it. Might be looking for a moderately priced voyager in the near future. great review! you really unpacked your reservations with the synth as it fits into your music, instead of dissing its sound, well done.
thanks man, it's a great synth indeed !
You gotta add the Feedback AND the Filter Drive to the list of features that not many synths have. Add to that a dedicated square sub and this thing just screams. The VST and digital patch saving is a HUGE feature that made me choose this over the Matriarch/Grandmother. I totally love mine, and would say for harder styles it works great, but agree it's all about what sound you're going for.
yeah true! it's always depend, it can sound nasty but still feel it sound to "modern" somehow for my track, I don't know it's hard to explain, but I know I've tried couple of time to incorporate in my tracks and never really fit. I have the mother-32,dfam and subh and I don't have this problem at all..wierd
@@audioreakt hmm interesting. yes different sounds for different folks! for me it straddles that modern / vintage quite nicely, and i love the digital patch storage, especially for pulling up stuff when playing live. the modern sound could very well have to do with the features i called out...
Thats just your opinion as it seems.
The sub is so stiff and cristal clear and hifi. Maybe some don't like that. I hope that dosn't hurt your feelings that not everyone loves the sub.
Thank you for review very useful.
Thanks mate, glad you liked it !
I have to say, I love this topic. I dreamt of owning the Sub37. year after year i saved and watched everything about it. Now that I have it I am blown away by the greatness of it, but I noticed it is challenging to fit the sounds in a track. I will not get rid of it as I love it and fits in my work, but its definitely a challenge to fit it in most track styles.
yes I have the same problem here haha
Guys I owe the Moog model d and I was having the same problem as you in the beginning,these synths are way to powerful and they occupy a lot of space in the mix,the secret is to lower the volume almost to the minimum and then bring it up with a good Saturator and compressor,filter it at your taste and there you go… and bus processing is also very important,I believe Stephan bodzin is doing the same
@@xavierf2229 yes you are right, they take a lot of space, but still, it doesn't fit with the type of drum I do for example, it's hard to explain, for example with an 808 kit drum, it sounds amazing, with a 909 kit, I found it harder to make it sound well together....
@@xavierf2229 o
I think with the subsequent 37 you really need to eq out all unnecessary frequencies within a sound.
It just has such a full rich sound it will overpower if not.
The modwheel is sensitive indeed, especially when it comes to the pitch amount, but you can change that. Press the controllers button in the mod 1 bus, then go to ctrl 4 amount en dial in 50%, this way its a lot less sensitive. it's not very intuitive though. thanks for the video!
thanks for tips, I didn't know ! to be honest it's annoying that you have to do it, it should be something calibrated better...maybe there is a reason...
@@audioreakt you're welcome. i don't know either why its so sensitive. all i know is that you can set the 4 controls to a % and then it's less or more sensitive, but it is a bit too mathematic for me :) have a nice day my friend.
My fav synth of all time. Sound,price,versatility,keybed,overall finish. A little future classic imho.
oh it's already a classic !
Thanks for your honest review! It was a synth I was eyeballing for a while (I played one at my friends place and it sounded AMAZING!), and decided against it, mostly due to size and price. Your review makes me happy for my decision - I wish more people in the music community were so open about gear fitting different needs (in almost all reviews everyone is super happy about the gear - and yet they then change it for something else…)
You're welcome. The things with review is most of them are global, they are here to show you how a synth work/sounds but in a wide way, so they have to fit any music genre, so hard for the reviewer to give opinion for each electronic music genre or to be very specific... they can say what they like or no, but if they do a different music style than you , what they don't like you might love it and opposite...Thats why I also started making review, to give this techno point of view , and even like with this synth, you can see it goes deeper, because even within techno, it's not always a best suit according to the type of techno...
@@audioreakt Oh, you produce mainly techno? You would LOVE the PRO 3
@@kierenmoore3236never been convinced by the demo, def need to try it out myself but live in the mniddle of nowhere and it's hard for me to try it...plus i usually buy desktop synth know, as I never used the keyboard of a synth...
@@audioreakt Fair. There aren’t many great demos of it online. Just sent this one to a friend, as it’s not a bad one - though he’s into more classic synth sounds … ua-cam.com/video/c_e1dPxEkxM/v-deo.htmlsi=G-egPJ7jDE9awpX5
You can set the modulation wheel to lfo rate etc , it’s in the menus
Oh my bad, I thought I read something on the Manuel but could find it again, I am gonna double check deeper
@@audioreakt I confirm, you can totally do it!
I have had mine for a few months. I thought about a Moog Subsequent 25, but I wanted the 37 keys, additional presets & other extras. It's a Moog, and a genuine monster. I'm not much of a tweaker, but slightly altering the presets is working well for me. It's not a workstation with 2,000 sounds, but it is a world class sound that is imitated like crazy, but this is the original.
I am the complete opposite haha, if it was a rack version I would have bought it....anyway yeah the sounds is really good and really inspiring !
Well, usually when you have 2000 presets, only about 200 are not overlap and stand out for usability. With the subsequent, you can buy patches that others have created, if you aren’t into sound construction.
Its a moog
I am not a tweaker
Nothing more to say.
Great video. You might try the Strymon Deco with the Subsequent 37 and turn up the saturation. Naturally you can do this either in the mixer, feedback, or post filter drive, but the Deco may give the synth the tone you want. I think it sounds pretty good.
And try FMR Audio’s Really Nice Compressor, or for a more gooey sound (my preference), you can use their Really Nice Leveling Amplifier. These are also fantastic on the Moog Mother 32.
And if all that doesn’t work, you could just use the Mother 32. LOL.
thanks for the recommendation, I did have a mother 32 at one point which was indeed suiting me better than the sub37... but I kept the sub37 because it's just sounding too good, I have the subHarmonicon who replace the mother 32 to a certain extend now...
The Sub37 was my first analogue synth I bought when I decided to go back to hardware. I've not had a problem in integrating it's sound into my music. I use it mainly for bass, I don't mind using just one oscillator, although with two oscillators duo mode means I can play two parts with lead and bass then blend it with the Korg Prologue's chords playing everything live for a big and powerful sound. I suppose it depends on what type of sound suits your music. For me it's great. Personally I don't think I need another Moog.
yeah it's a great synth, if I was doing more melodic stuff it would be perfect, but for example, right now I prefer the DFAM, which is more my cup of tea !
@@audioreakt The Drummer From Another Mother (DFAM) is more percussive in use. When it was released I did contemplate getting it but I can tune in drum sounds on the Sub37 if I really want to so I decided to pass on it. I also had a Drumbrute which gave me the analogue drum sound that I used at the time. Obviously the DFAM can do a lot more than just drum sounds and if space is a premium then the DFAM and a Mother 32 are a great combination. For me though, the Sub37 can be used for percussive and for melodic and it can be beefy with weight or screeching and harsh plus anything in between.
Whatever instruments we have if we really delve into it and learn it's full capabilities I believe we can surprise a lot of people with what an instrument can do.
For what I would use it for, this is still my dream synth. I preform live with instruments paired with Ableton Live and this synth seems to the fit my needs the most. Having the ability to have the software control the synth while my hands are full is extremely valuable to my play style. Also loading presets for each individual track would save me from having to manually patch it in-between songs. Really loved this review, it was very well done and I totally understand all your points mentioned. I guess I’ll truly know if this synth is the right fit when I get the chance to use it live. We’ll see! Hahah
To be fair I wished it was my dream synth because it sound so good and the touch and feel is incredible too... The sounds even though is beautiful, I couldn't make it fit my track but I am not giving up and hope that one day I will find a way to use it in my track because is a very fun piece to play with, and like you said the software is a plus to easily switch between patch or even when you want to reopen old project...
I sold mine, I liked it, but it was far too aggressive. I do miss the moog filter. It sounded incredible, but I’m more into poly synths. I do remember the BPM wasn’t adjustable on the arp / sequencer via the screen. When I had it, it only had tap tempo. Did they update that?
really , for me I feel quite the opposite, it sound too dreamy and not rough and edgy... I don't have it with me right now, I but I think the rate is in heartz and if you want to be by bpm you have to activate sync.
Thank you for the tutorial, I really love those kind of sounds but can't afford (also dont have the space) for a hardware unit like this. Which VST would you recommend?
you're welcome, yeah it's pricey and huge, I didn't realise it before but was so surprise when I took it out of the box.... I think the closest would be DIVA from u-he.
I’ll add to this, I had (and sold) a subsequent 37 and did a side by side comparison of it and The Legend by Synapse Audio and I actually preferred some patches on The Legend. Honestly it sounds so good. Check it out.
Yeah I often forgot about the legend, there is the monark by NI too which sound goos
Great, honest (useful!) review. Thank you!
Have you tried/compared with the Pro 3, at all?!
Thanks, not tbh I never tried a sequential actually... But if I buy a sequential wil probably be a poly
@@audioreakt Great sounds just pour out of their VCO polys … the others, you need to work harder for them, that’s all. 😎👍🏼
gorgeous synthesizer. I sold my moog voyager. I am thinking of getting one of these
yes it's sound beautiful !
Each one of your complaints is addressable, except the size of the instrument. You could of lessened modulation sensitivity by reducing how far forward the wheel was. You can get pink noise to sound like white with filter adjustments. And why it doesn't work in your music is a function of what your music is like, not the Moog's fault. No synth fits every style of music. Your totally right about the sound, it's beautiful...
Someone mentioned about the modulation in the menu, my fault. I am curious how you can get pink noise sounding like white noise ? About the synth doesn't fit my music you're totally right is not moog fault, but what I meant is that to me the sub37 sound very modern, compare to the mother32 for exemple which I found more raw/analog (even though the sub37 is analog too). And for people who produce the more raw kind of techno, i would say the mother 32 is a better choice than sub37
When it comes to bottom end, the S37 blows every other synth of mine out of the water, incl. a Poly D, MatrixBrute, let alone poly synths.
yeah indeed there is some beauty in it !
I own an OB6 and i can honestly say the Sub 37, for me the con being mono, is more of my favorite and so much more fun with a lot of character built into it.
Check out the Vermona Mono Lancet 15. Bottom end is amazing on it! I played thr Sub 37 at a friends place and I was not impressed by the bottom end compared to my Vermona.
@@MakingMadBeats I don‘t know the Vermona, but it doesn‘t seem to have as many mod capabilities as the Moog.
@@RayyMusik That' s right! It is a very basic synth but it sounds damn good. Very punchy and creamy. It was my first analog synth and great for learning subtractive synthesis.
I completely get where you're coming from. But before you let this synth go, try pushing it through a fuzz pedal, like the AFA Godeater or something similar. I love my Sub 37, but mostly for progressive house. I'm looking to get a Eowave Quadrantid Storm for techno. It's tiny and sounds brilliant.
yeah I try to add some more rough effect , and it work but then you loose this "beautiful" signature sound... I won't sell it, because I am gonna try harder and I am gonna make it work for my track, I already use it couple of time in my track and start to like it, but I still need to find a way haha... Yeah defo for progressive house and melodic techno it's a must have !
The cheapest way to get top notch raw organic moog sound in hardware, is a behringer model d. Really.
Hi, nice review and interesting for me. You think it would work as a bass for rock band?
well depend what are your expectation, if you expect it to sound like your classic bass player sound no, but as replacement hell yeah it's pretty good sounding with a nice low end !
How do you like your 3 semi modular moog setup compared? are you able to recreate the sound or has the sub 37 still a personal charakter different from these units? just wondering how individual synth sounds can get even when they share alot of components.
Two different synth hence this video. The semi modular are more "rough" and raw by default and are kind of more "analog". Where the sub37 is very modern sounding (even though it's also analog), but also very soft and creamy, but also very full in term of sound, which can be tricky to incorporate in your track. For my track I prefer the semi modular as is fit more my style, but the sub37 is "better" sounding to be honest
12:24 how do you do this arpegio 😮 i love it ❤ i so near to "invisible" tracks of NTO or Paul Kalkbrenner
Do you think i can do the same with my poly d or a vst ?
spot on, it was very much inspired by that track. I don't know, you can do that with the moog because of the duo mode, which is kind of paraphonic I think, not sure if you can do the same with the poly d...
@@audioreakt thk you for you respond 😊
do you have a tutorial for make arpegio like this in ableton ? or something like that 😁
i love this style of techno
I@@kenimegan266 not especially but I do have a n'to tutroial here : ua-cam.com/video/LQxtbD3C5vo/v-deo.html
How do you feel about this synth now that 2 years has passed? I have the sub 37 too but Im feeling the same way as you. Sometimes it’s too dark and smooth to fit into my tracks. I think I’d be happier with a more aggressive/buzzier sounding synth. I’m considering swapping it for a matriarch but idk
I still have it but rarely use it for my own production,m I use it to create loop or sound for my sample pack mainly.
Sounds like the Matriarch would be a good option for you. It has white noise, rather than pink, too …
@@kierenmoore3236 yep I did end up trying the matriarch and liked it way more. I need patch storage though so I am hoping the upcoming rumored Moog is the answer lol
@@Rizamusic The Super Bowl Moog? ‘Moog Mirror’, perhaps. Yes, I’m looking forward to more info/sound samples of this new Moog. 🧐 lol
Have you tried the sequential pro 3?
I’m curious how it would work for you?
Never, but probably the same than for the sub37, sound beautiful but too beautiful to me, like when I listen to demo, I am like, it sounds so good, but then I don't want what happen with the 37 to happen again...
I forgot to mention something: the sub 37 is the Bodzin sound, not the subsequent 37. The sub 37 has that old timey flavor to it while the subsequent 37 is more modern sounding. Might want to check out comparison videos of the two.
I've checked but don't find that there is that much of a difference...
@@dondiegodelavega1695 I don't now tbh but don't think there is a big differnece between the two to be hnoest !
Hello love your channel. Is there an other portable synth close it?? Thank you
Close to it*
Moog minautor
Perfect timing, I'm just now looking at buying this, interesting to see if it's for me or not.
hope it will help decide !
I thought about buying the Sub 37, I ended up buying the Sub 25 and the Korg Prologue 16. I can get the same sound from the Sub 25 as the Sub 37 and also have a true 16 voice polyphonic synth with the Korg, I would have bought the Sub 37 but at the end of the day it’s still only paraphonic, if it had even 4 voice polyphony I would have spent the extra money on the Sub 37. I love the Sub 25 though, great sounding and fun the play synth.
for sure the sub25 is a great compromise !
Why not process the output with some sort of effect processor
I do but even if I try to make it dirty, still sound too beautiful and modern haha..
So for something more raw as you said: what would be your goto in this pricerange?
moog dfam
@@audioreaktnot even comparable, both are great, DFAM is way simpler, less capable and it is a percussion synth. Subsequent is a super deep synth, I urge you to dig deeper and truly learn all that the Subsequent 37 is capable of.
Hello, so what would be the best techno synth instead of SUB37?
Dépend the techno subgenre, but overall I would say the microfreak is a must have, small footprint, cheap, sound goods and very wide palette of sounds. DFAM is a must if you do hypnotic/raw techno. If you want that fat moog bass, minotaur is a cheaper alternative to the sub37
What are you talking about VST at 4:51 ? Link ??
the vst editor of the moog subsequent 37 that come with the synth. It's just a vst that can control your moog, it does not make sound
necesito ese aparato❤
Modern Classic synthesized to be honest...
Sub 37 has that dirty sound and makes really great deep bass. Subsequent 37 sounds great for bright leads and bass.
Yeah I get that dirty side he can have but somehow haven't find yet a way to make it fit my track, but I will keep trying haha
@@audioreakt Hrm…maybe try reducing the cutoff a bit or using the filter envelope to make the sound small. I find that the harmonics are too rich for the sounds to be fully open.
@@Underview yeah I tried that, I try to add effect to make it sound weird and so on, but still somehow it doesn't sound like I whish...but I won't give up and I will manage to fully integrate it...
@@audioreakt Well, if you like that digital sound of vsti’s I would get a peak, summit or virus ti 2. Sub 37 has sort of that old timey feel to it.
I believe that the perfect synth for you might be Moog Dfam.. Instant techno machine..
I bought it recently and indeed that fits me better than the sub37, the dfam is so good
yeah i love moog synths
that fat sounds haha !
@@audioreakt yep. if i just had the money...
I plan on getting this synthesizer still.
I own several different synths, and pianos, as well as a number of different guitars and basses.
My takeaway after all these years is that I view each instrument as a different tool in the chest.
All instruments have their charms and quirks, and the SS 37 is no different.
It's still a fantastic synth at a great price point with all the fatness and creaminess you expect from Moog.
Oh yes, fattiness and creamyness are the exact adjectives
Pro 3 or Subsequent 37, I can't decide
I never tried the pro3 but I would say the pro 3 is more versatile, the sub37 does one thing but does it better than any other synth
What delay and reverb were you running through?
Ableton delay and reverb
Myself, I have the Sub 37 Tribute Edition. Much look the same. With that, I have the Eventide Space.
Nice combo!
yo añadi ruido blanco por input para corregir el fallo imperdonable,byee
Merci pour cette vidéo elle tombe vraiment à pique je parlai de m’en acheter un hier justement (si tu habites dans le sud de la France je veux bien te le prendre) je préfère ne pas l’acheter via internet mais je sais pas si je peux le trouver facilement comme a woodbrass ou autres
non non mais je ne le vend pas, je croyais l'avoir dis dans la video mais je l'ai surement couper au montage : je le garde parceque de une , j'abandonne pas si facilement, et de deux, je m'en sert pour mes pack de samples aussi... et de 3, ca reste un synthetiser mythique des temps modern, au meme titre que le Model D a l'epoque... and puis sa sonne aussi, bref impossible de m'en separer meme si je l'utlisie moins que les autres..
@@audioreakt ah autant pour moi j’ai peut être mal compris aussi ^^ oui c’est vraiment un synthé magnifique j’espère ne pas avoir trop de mal a en trouver, seul le manque de with noise me dérange un peu. En tout cas j’espère que tu pourras en arriver à une bonne utilisation par rapport a tes productions et ça m’intéresserait de savoir comment tu as « procédé »
Ouais je referais une vidéo plus tard, quand j'aurai vraiment maîtriser le truc. .
@@audioreakt ha tu parles français aussi
Have mine since it cam out and I could not agree with you more… love it but never use it
glad to hear I am not the only one, I think a lot of people feel like this... I still kept it and feel like If I sell it, I will regvret it..
strange, "cannot fit into my track". its understood not every instrument for everyone or particular style, sub37 for techno, ok maybe not. so i was watching to learn something new about my sub37cv.... but what puzzled me really comparing to mother 32, that fits better, wander what the difference on the same moog base. getting this one with subharmonicon and dfam.
probably will be moogmagedon for me, but im liking it personally with differences and complexity and sound, which is for me. and i do play electronic.
cannot really explain it, i feel the mother 32 is more raw/edgy compared to the sub37 which is more smooth/modern sounding. I can say the same with the DFAM, pretty agressive and nasty. I feel the Subharmonicon kind of fits in between, can be nice and smooth (not as much as the sub37) but can also be more raw/edgy... But I don't give up, I kept my sub37 and I will find one day a way to make it fit haha
I get all nearly these sounds with the MiniBrute 2…
well done ! I found the sub37 to be a bit more smoother than the minibrute 2s
@@audioreakt yo tengo los dos,y me flipan los dos,pero moog es mucho moog,no se pueden comparar,simple,caracter diferentes y es lo que me gusta,saludos
Sub 37 has lower headroom so it is sounding much more agressive
thanks I didn't know that one!
I sold mine for a Pro 3 SE.
Are you happy with the pro 3 se or do you regreat?
You are referring to "MOOG DISEASE" That's been around for as long as Moog has.....Thier synths are FAT, they sound GREAT when you play them by themselves. Every aspect is just delicious....but....There's a reason people still swear by the JX-3P, even though people say it "Lacks low-end"....That lack of low-end, that "pre-EQ" real-estate consideration a JX-3P has is the very quality that makes it a GREAT synth to play in an enable...IT PLAYS WELL WITH OTHERS!....Synth geeks want that FAT sound and often don't consider how a full spectrum element is going to fit into a mix...NOT VERY F%$KING WELL!....People have said this about Moogs for as long as I can remember. They are best used in tracks where they synth it's self is 90% of the musical "Rhythm track" Moogs work best when they have some drums, and a "little" bit of something else, that isn't too overbearing, coming in and out as you track dictates. And then a vocal...a Moog doesn't like to share the playground. It's best featured on it's own. NOT good synths for "band" work. Much better for minimal, heavy bassline/riff/type stuff....It's something to beware of for ANYONE buying a MOOG. You are NOT the first person to have that issue.
I am glad you commented because I didn't know about that "disease" but I can totally relate to that. Especially with the sub37. I own the dfman and subharmonic on where I don't have this problem and find to fit with other elements easier than the sub37. But still it's a great synth, when you see what Stephan bodzin does with, it's sounds incredible, but like what you said, it's the case with bodzin as he only have few drum and 1-2 Moog layer like bass and lead and maybe an arp but that's it !
The intro music is awful. Not for most. How ironic since this is about audio design. Good start. Update: Very good video and perspective.
haha cheers, yeah it's a techno music related youtube channel so not to everyone taste I agree, glad you liked the video past that haha, cheers !
İf you dont like sell it to me😀
I love to play with it 😊
"Guilty"?? "Ashamed" because you use one oscillator???? Are you crazy??? How old are you? Just do whatever you want!!!!
haha I know, but you know you spemd more than a grand in a synthesizer for on the end using just in a simple way, I know that sophisticated patch doesn't mean good sounds (it's often even the opposite) but was just my feeling and wanted to share that it can happen the same to other people...
It's too big! Lol.
Also, your voice is too loud!
haha to be honest for me footprint is important as like to have all my synth accessible without moving my ass from my chair or bending my back or standing... I realised that if a synth is out of reach or more difficult to access than another, I will use it less often... yeah I know my voice is too loud, I am still asking myself how I could missed that when I edited the video...
Man, you should really work on your english accent. I started watching the video with subtitles on so I can understand what you are saying and after 5 minutes it was getting really tiresome, so I stopped watching. I don't think there is something wrong with the video itself, but the way you talk renders it unwatchable and it's a real pity.
Most overrated synth ever, i just cant get used to it.
it's not overrated at all, it's not because you don't like that is overrated. the build quality and the sound are over the top, that why it's so popular.