As a child growing up in the 1960's, sixpences were my favourite coins and my first pocket money was sixpence a week. Blackbirds are my favourite bird. My Grandmother taught me to stop, listen and love their song. As I write this now, in mid March, Blackbirds have, in just the past week or so, begun singing at dawn again, though it will be a while before I hear the best of their singing which will come in the evenings as they mark their territories. . So Sing A Song Of Sixpence is, and always was, my favourite nursery rhyme and I am glad to learn of it's possible origins and meanings. Incidentally, one sunny summer Sunday afternoon last year, I strayed into a pub I visit infrequently on the fringes of my territory in South Shropshire. There I met a chap who showed me an Elizabeth I silver sixpence, dated 1561, which he had discovered that afternoon with a metal detector. I held it in my palm for a few moments and it felt magical.
This part amazed me about minstrels being paid sixpence to sing a song. I don’t know if the currency had changed but in the early 1960’s sixpence for a child was quite a reasonable sum, it would buy two packets of crisps for example. So if the coinage hadn’t changed sixpence back in the late 1500’s I would have thought would have been quite a tidy sum to pay someone.
Real artifitial inteligence voice. Nothing in life is real anymore not your food not the people you interact with, and definately not the voices you hear on the net.
Lagu 3 kupang Saku penuh padi (pocket full of rice, rye changed to rice as it is not a grain we plant and consume) Datang burung hitam (black bird flew in) Masuk dalam kuali (into the wok or pan) Bila sudah masak (once cooked) Burung nyanyi saja (the birds just sing) Tentu sedap dimakan (must be delicious) Beri pada Raja (serve to the King) Raja dalam rumah (The king is in the house [interesting to note it didn't say the king in the castle or palace]) Buat kira-kira (doing mathematics [not counting money]) Suri dalam dapur (PermaiSURI is the word for Queen but here it is suri, the wife is the exact meaning, she is in the kitchen) Makan roti gula... hey (eating sugared bread.... hey) Dayang tepi kolam (royal maid is beside a pond) Mahu jemur tepung (wants to dry flour) Datang burung hitam (come a black bird) Pagut batang hidung (peck her nose) This the Malay version, with slight changes in lyrics. 1stly i think this was sung and written by folks in the North of Peninsular Malaysia. Only we use kupang to depict cents or pence. Other places use the word sen. The song is also sung with different rythym than the Sic Pence song.
I love the amount of detailed research you put into these videos. I’ve always wondered at the significance of 24 blackbirds. As a child in the US, I thought the pocket full of rye was to feed the birds when they were released. There was an animated version of this that showed the birds singing to the king when he cut it open. My innocent child’s mind never questioned that the birds were alive inside the pie.
The song is also used in a book by Agatha Christy, that’s how I know this song. I’m Dutch and it’s not part of our nursery rimes. The nose thing always bothered me, because it was the only impossible part of the song. But the magpie stealing a false nose make sense.
Incredible research , detective work , analysis and insight. The last and first explanations seem the most plausible, while the first offering seems the most literal as it appears an English tale that would tend towards the home grown explanation. I studied typography at college, yes I'm that old, and we used the pica measurement curiously with pica referring to Magpies there are folk legends that Magpies could talk. Ive heard it said that this notion of talking Magpies was connected to the typographic unit, words being translated into print.
This from the online Britannica: Their brain-to-body-mass ratio is outmatched only by that of humans and equals that of aquatic mammals and great apes. Magpies have shown the ability to make and use tools, imitate human speech, grieve, play games, and work in teams. Many other online references to magpies mimicking human speech together with parrots, crows, and ravens.
We have several The Pye Family Memorials in our All Saint's Church and a street named after him. He was the son of Henry Pye senior who owned the manor house here. Growing up we have always been told that the rhyme was about him and our town for decades dined out on the notoriety of that event. When Henry senior died in 1766 he left his son with debts of fifty thousand pounds.....and then the manor house burned down, nowadays I would class that as having a bad day. Great story telling again.🤗🤗
I thought the rhyme referenced the Catholic persecutions, ie the 24 blackbirds were priests and they were burned. I have no idea about the origination of the following verses.
If you are going to reference the printing of the bible as a theory, it's interesting to note that the original author of the English bible translated from Latin was Tyndall. He was tried and burned for heracy for his translation work- yet a few years later, that book (now called the king James bible) was the accepted text of the church of England. So pie or pyre could refer to Tyndall. Perhaps counting money is a reference to the king profiting as the author was dead.
This is the first time I’ve listened to “The Resurrectionist”. Her voice and unique content required me to subscribe. Beautifully executed with period art, analysis of the period’s use of language and historical social knowledge is superb. Thank you. ❤❤
@@The-Resurrectionists I’m honored with your personal comment. I’m a painter interested in the many nuances humans use to communicate with each other. I’m old enough to remember when Don McLane came out with the song “American Pie”. My friends and I could spend days trying to figure out the symbolism. As my work developed over the years I have become focused on visual symbolism, all beginning with the realization that we are informed and fashioned in subliminal ways. Thanks again
Same. This came up on my recommended videos and I ended up subscribing after watching half of this. I love stuff like this anyway but her voice makes it even better. I usually listen to creepypasta videos to fall asleep to but these will be even better
@maureenfitzpatrick440 I've always loved songs with symbolism like that too. One I love is "Hotel California" by the Eagles, I used to wonder what that all really meant! Thank you for watching my channel and for your lovely comments: do you have any work online at all? I'd love to look :)
I always knew it with the very last line, " she made such a commotion that little Jenny wren, flew down into the garden and put it on again".... does this have any significance at all? or perhaps it was only added so that small children wouldn't be upset!
Exactly that! The rhyme persisted for nearly a century before the maid's nose was replaced by the wren, likely due to its upsetting ending for children. It gave it a more light-hearted tone, and enabled the playful "got your nose" game with a child at the end of the rhyme. Thanks for watching 🖤☺️
Absolutely love the background music - very mystical faerie. Reminds me of a peaceful summer night watching fireflies! Never outgrew faerie tales & nursery rhymes!
My Darkling friend, this must be one of your best, the work you do to delve into the forgotten history is wonderful, I send many dark blessings to you 🌔🧙♀️🕷
Wow - I'd always assumed it was about the times just before the French Revolution; the first three verses being about the follies of France's royalty, whilst the 'maid' represented the desperate peasants. Eg, the upper classes' follies (blackbirds) were hurting those living off the land (in the garden). Every day I'm a-learnin'! 👩🎓 Thank you for another brilliant video! 🖤🖤
Forced to kiss the hem of the queen’s gown and giving birth within days of each other to children fathered by the same man is one certainly one recipe for tensions.
Somewhen in the 70's I heard that the rhyme was to do with the growth of protestantism. The blackbirds be protestants sing their beliefs. The version I knew it was a blackbid (protestant) pecking off the maids nose, in other words, she had been converted and loosing her nose (or sole) because of it. So, the rhyme could be a warning by the Roman Catholic Church that you would go to hell in you became a protestant. Interesting point about Magpies. Their latin name is Pica Pica. Love this series. Hopefully, there will be many more interpritations of rhymes in your series. Thank you.
Jolly interesting video. The only theory I was familiar with was the one about Henry VIII and the blackbirds being clergy. It has a coherence and triggers some thoughts about what it was that the ‘singing’ revealed. In this case it could be a Catholic rhyme in origin used unwittingly by Protestants. However, the evidence included even in this video suggests that it is later than the Reformation. The language appears quite modern, at least mostly.
I once read this one was about the black death and it claiming kings, queens and maids alike. The pocket full of rye being the the different herbs people carried not just cover the smell but many claims that many warded of disease
I used to work in mythology research and I'm almost sure the rye does not symbolize herbs. Today, they both look like "plants, seeds, grain, whatever...". But in earlier centuries, it was "medicine" vs. "food". Rye was one of the basic ingredients for basic food, like wheat and meat today, or rice in Asia. One doesn't write "Aspirin", meaning "steak" 🙂
Nursery rhymes like Fairy Tales have dark origins and even darker meanings. While I won't say which of the possible origins is true and factual (I really don't have any idea.), I liked listening to all of the possible truths.
It's interesting that though this was a Rhyme started in the United Kingdom I remember my Dad, Mom and Grandparents shared this with us as we were growing up in the early 1960's.
It's a shame we don't have any unquestionable link from these rhymes to their origin. It would be so much more fascinating to know the exact origin of all these childhood nursery rhymes. I wonder though....about the ring around the rosey. I was told it came from the black plague. And each verse was more or less explained. But I bet it too has some lost history. Sing a Song of Sixpence was one of my faves as a child. So, all of this does hold intrigue.
I had a panic attack when I was grabbed by my friends to play ring around the rosey. I knew exactly what that song entailed. I refused to play along trying to tell them what they were singing about but they didn't care and I was weird. The world was cut to a third in some counts even by half count it was devastating. It's actually telling ppl how to protect yourself and in the end it doesn't matter we are all turned into ash. Up until the advent of modern antibiotics it was still killing. It has never needed to change its way of killing Ypestis is a wicked killer. It's actually killing the cougar population around the grand canyon a forest ranger died of it. His favorite female cougars collar didn't move for 18hrs which means the animal is dead. He tracked her down and found her body. Took it back to the station and he did a necepay without any protection. He died of the exact disease caused by Ypestis 😳. Now they aren't allowed to touch the animals. So it's still killing in this century. Scary stuff, any encephalitis, anthrax, ebola, nothing was as devastating as the black death.
I like the wider view of it bc we do change little by little to add to them It is a great respect to them. I'm not sure where today's folks get all up in a bunch over ppl painting their face. When imagination is the most sincere form of flattery!! A saying that should be brought up by ppl more often. Imho
@@heatherreeve9802 There are a lot of wild creatures that carry it. Armadillos carry it and so do groundhogs. But yeah, it's weird that they made a children's verse out of anything to do with it. It's not even cautionary.
I feel that it's about Henry the VIII. Many clergy persons were gotten rid of at the time, I think. Henry was a Protestant and the religious civil wars followed. It's seems the best fit for the rhyme as the others are more of a stretch, I think. Good series...I like it!
Henry was a most steadfast Catholic. The Reformation was a power grab, allowing Henry the possibility of a male heir, and the land and wealth of the monasteries. Henry changed nothing about the church services, though he did deliver the English language Bible.
A wonderful video! Just a thought:'Who Killed Cock Robin' would be an interesting rabbit hole to dive down for a future episode!Much to ponder about that nursery rhyme!👍👍👍🇬🇧❤️❤️❤️🐊🐊🐊
she made such a comotion that little Jenny Wren flew down into the garden and popped it on again... dad used to sing the song to me ad my sister, pretend to peck off our noses and pop his thumb up and then stick it on again.
Wow, thank you for these beautifully done videos. I recall reading that the 24 birds referred to the 24 hours of the day and that it might have astronomical or astrological significance. The pocket (or bag) of rye has always puzzled me, though referring to beer if it was a drinking song is an interesting possibility.
I always looked upon it as the pie was a scandal of some kind, and the birds singing were people spilling the secrets. I always connected the maid as possibly the origin of the scandal, and her nose being snapped off as a punishment for spreading the secrets or rumors.
Excellent content! I always loved this nursery rhyme!mom made up a little tune and sang this to us. At the end, she would quickly pinch the ends of our noses as she said "ssssnIPPED off'er nose!" We loved it. And then the grandkids loved it. The playfulness took away any bother the morbidness might have caused us.
I do believe that I have fallen in love with this channel (and perhaps its narrator) though I am not at all sure why it has taken this long to do so. Please keep up your most excellent and fascinating work.
All fascinating possibilities! I wonder at the use of the word rye. Given that rye mold, or ergot, produced hallucinations. Not that it fits into any theory… Just caught my attention.
As a history buff since childhood, I have truly enjoyed many of the videos describing 17th century events. I have a paternal ancestor a Mr. John Williams born 1610 and it's a treat to imagine all that he witnessed during those years.😁
I was always looking out for birds when hanging out the wash. But i did hear of ' cutting off your own nose to spite your face'. In Greek and Roman times an mistress had nose cut off. If you were of means a plastic surgery could be preformed.
Thank you for fascinating info and glimpses of history behind nursery rhymes! A few of them I did know something about. In the early 80's my brother and sisters formed a small satirical theatre group. One performance was on nursery rhymes and, oh boy, the things we learned in that research! That performance was of course titled "Mother Goosed".
Not about the origin, but a subsequent reference. In the Little House series, one of the books recounts the Ingalls family having their crops depleted by blackbirds eating the grain. Pa shoots the birds and Ma makes a blackbird pie out of them. Laura recounts how they were inspired by the rhyme.
A very well researched video. Just to tie in with the change to four and twenty naughty boys, interestingly another rhyme that appeared in Gammer Gurton's Garland also featured four and twenty. Four-and-twenty tailors went to kill a snail, The best man amongst them durst not touch her tail; She put out her horns like a little Kyloe cow; Run, tailors, run, or she’ll kill you all e’en now.
"24 naughty boys" reminds me of that number turned around in the Bible, 2 Kings 2:23-24. After a group of naughty boys who called prophet Elisha a "baldhead", he cursed them, then God sent 2 she-bears that tore 42 of the boys apart. (Notice how the verse has the numbers 2 and 24.)
I think the first French court explanation fits beautifully. Is there a version in the French language and culture anyone? If the answer is no, then I think it can be almost excluded from the list: why should it be preserved in English but not in the land where it occurred?
Me too, and I used to work in mythology research. It fits perfectly and explains everything. Except perhaps the "nose out of joint" - there, I think, one of the meanings referring to a missing nose as a sign of adultery, or syphillis contracted while committing adultery, would fit better.
I always wonder about the similar story of "the Seven Goatlings(?) and the Wolf". The wolf tricks the kid goats to let him in. Six of the baby- goats get eaten by the wolf but one who hid in the clock gets away, and when the Mothergoat comes home. Together they save the ones inside the wolf. These two stories tend to connect.
I must begin with a note congratulating you on your diction, choice of subject matter, and illustrations. They are all a superb antidote to the #%^* on UA-cam When my mother was reading “Sing a song of sixpence, a pocket full of rye” to me I thought it rather weird that people would carry rye in their pockets. Now, some 70 years later I clicked on another meaning for pocket. My mother would buy pockets of potatoes, oranges, etc from the greengrocer. A pocket was a hessian sack that stood about knee high. It would hold enough rye to bake this kind of pie.
Wow, very interesting, thanks! Only a king's pie wouldn't have been made out of rye (that was for "black bread", less refined and more nourishing, for the lower classes).
I love your content. I recall nursery rhymes coming up semi frequently during my research throughout my studies in cultural anthropology. What was more interesting was they came up again during my studies in medical anthropology. Most of my fellow classmates selected specializations such as Egyptology. Whereas I chose to specialize in diseases and illnesses in Britain from 9th-17th centuries. And then I had a colleague who was a linguistic anthropologist. He would dissect language and meanings. I'm so glad I found your channel. It's very well researched.
In Scotland, Bean-nighe(washer women) are sometimes described as not having a nose, and they are typically seen washing laundry in a stream(sort of matches one of the descriptions). The clothes they are washing are of the person doomed to die. There’s likely no connection with the poem, but now I’m wondering if the no nose thing has a mean origin 😮
Fabulous as always! You research so deeply & then spin such beautiful tales! I was of the opinion that the rhyme was linked to Henry VIII and the dissolution of the monasteries, but you have compelling arguments for many other theories...perhaps the rhyme was indeed a fusion from different eras? Thanks!
Hi. I love your channel. This is the first time that I’ve left a comment on one of your videos. I love learning about the stories behind the nursery rhymes, but I was also thinking that I’d like to hear the stories behind fairytales as well.
My favorite nursery rhyme! This one, Hey Diddle Diddle, amd Three Little Kittens were ones that i repeated constantly as a child. Now as an adult who loves history and mystery, I love this channel!
In book "Emblemata" that was popular in 17 th century in first table picture 13 is an image of flying little birds to a cherry tree the description of symbol is that "eagles are gathering where the dead body is"
Yes indeed! These are great posts: informative and well written and no small part of them is the beautiful voice with wonderful articulation of the presentation. it’s a different accent than mine and I enjoy that as well. it amazes me that anyone could think this was artificial intelligence it’s sparkles with human intelligence.
I had heard the Henry James Pye theory before. He was probably England's worst poet laureate, and apparently had a penchant for avian themed poetry. Rest of the video was enlightening. Thanks
I suspect the origin is more ancient. The first verse detailing Druids burning Roman prisoners in a wicker man, *Four and twenty naughty boys bak'd in a Pyre* followed by the druidic tradition of feeding those remains to Seahawks, Ravens, etc while the local cheiftan presides. The second verse is Roman troops exacting their revenge by attacking the unguarded children at their chores with the parents indoors and unaware.
I think the first explanation given might be the closest. I don't think people, especially children, are very interested in transmitting secret code through rhymes that much, anyway. It comes out the way it does because it's funny and good to sing whether it makes sense or not in reference to "persons living or dead".
I like the version about the maid Henrietta "hanging out her laundry" as an older way of what we call "airing out one's dirty laundry in public". I think the depiction of her public disdain for the Queen comfortably fits that verse.
11:05 Biblical references do not include nose-cutting for adultery. You are thinking of Ezekiel 23 where God is speaking to Israel and Judah analogously as prostitutes/adulterers who go after oppressive empires instead of trusting in God. The monologue there indicates what these empires themselves will do to these “women”, i.e., Israel and Judah, to “punish you according to their own standards” of warfare, which included the horrors of cutting off noses and ears, killing by the sword, burning people, and taking their sons and daughters of the slain as captives. So the punishment for the Hebrews’ “adultery”, figuratively speaking, was invasion; so cutting off the nose was not prescribed or described as a punishment for adultery itself. The list of horrors of warfare were what the Assyrians and Babylonians would do when they invaded because that’s what they did in warfare among other acts. That said, I’m enjoying this channel. Interesting discussions.
Thanks! I was wondering about that. Half of my family are theologians and this mention in the video very much did not ring true. Not straightforward enough and too mutilating. The Israeli punishment for adultery was stoning.
Okay, I was wondering about why anyone would have rye in their pocket. Maybe, it was not originally rye but rue which medieval superstition associated with powers of protection from evil and people put it in pouches and carried it about. This again suggests an older origin to at least the first verse. I think it was the 16th century that may be the source of this first verse. Rue was also associated with grief and mourning. Shakespeare knew this as we can gather from Hamlet. However, a parlour was not a room a Queen inhabited back then it was not a term used for a room in a house until the 18th century. Prior to that monks under vows of silence went to designated rooms called 'Parlers' were they could speak. No doubt due to French being a common tongue of diplomacy and being used in many European courts the word moved into wider meaning first amongst the aristocracy. So this agsun suggests a later origin for the second verse onward.
Someone in the comments here said "pocket" meant "a small sack". Which would explain why there's "pocket" in some version and "sack" in others - they're a similar thing.
How I do wish that I could have lived in the time when the king & the queen & the nobility lived, & I would have certainly loved to be & see all of the animals & the people who lived in that time period & I would certainly have loved to be a part of the inhabitants who lived in any part of the World 🌍 during the Medieval times ❤😊
Would the sixpence and a pocket full of rye refer to a working man’s (very low) wages, and the fact that he either had rye bread or rye whiskey in his pocket which was often all that kept the poorer working class going? So it’s like a commentary of the poor man’s lot compared to the ridiculousness of the wealthy baking live birds in a pie etc.
I once met a lady in the early seventies, she was in her late eighties and she said she had eaten a pie with birds in it. I forget whether she said it was blackbirds or starlings. Bit of a shock to me at the time.
Thank you for taking us down such a fascinating vortex of historical beliefs based on reality or pure imagination, forever reflective of the strongly weakened position of women who tended to be used as monetary pawns, carnal objects or breeding stock. It is also clear that given a little skill and determination , it is actually possible to twist historical facts into any meaning that takes your fancy !
Starlings, crows and ravens were eaten by commoners. Crows and ravens are still eaten with the breast flesh compared to duck flesh without the oil. Therefore, pies made from these avian sources weren’t uncommon. The surprise pies also make more sense.
In my youth several decades ago, we ate fat Robins and the large King Woodpeckers, both were quite good. Dad had grown up in the Great Depression, and the poor families like his ate anything they could hunt. Dad would also gather "Skunk Cabbage" as we did our Squirrel hunting.
Yeah, either it was really the huge festive cake as described in the first explanation, or the 24 is just a symbolic number meaning "a lot" (two dozen).
I would think that while this story took 20 minutes to tell, it took years to research. Fascinating. And thank you.
Thank you so much!
As a child growing up in the 1960's, sixpences were my favourite coins and my first pocket money was sixpence a week. Blackbirds are my favourite bird. My Grandmother taught me to stop, listen and love their song. As I write this now, in mid March, Blackbirds have, in just the past week or so, begun singing at dawn again, though it will be a while before I hear the best of their singing which will come in the evenings as they mark their territories. .
So Sing A Song Of Sixpence is, and always was, my favourite nursery rhyme and I am glad to learn of it's possible origins and meanings.
Incidentally, one sunny summer Sunday afternoon last year, I strayed into a pub I visit infrequently on the fringes of my territory in South Shropshire. There I met a chap who showed me an Elizabeth I silver sixpence, dated 1561, which he had discovered that afternoon with a metal detector. I held it in my palm for a few moments and it felt magical.
You, are a kindred spirit, my friend. I think in a similar way.
@@79klkw Thankyou, my friend. Blackbirds and Sixpences are some of the little things which weave into a beautiful world.
What a beautiful memory, thank you for sharing. 💙
This part amazed me about minstrels being paid sixpence to sing a song.
I don’t know if the currency had changed but in the early 1960’s sixpence for a child was quite a reasonable sum, it would buy two packets of crisps for example. So if the coinage hadn’t changed sixpence back in the late 1500’s I would have thought would have been quite a tidy sum to pay someone.
The part about the maids nose makes me think of syphilis as that caused many a person in those days to lose a nose
I thought this too.
@@dann5268 My mind also went in that direction.
The lady voice-over has a remarkably beautiful speaking voice.
I'm pretty sure it's a real woman's voice. LOL
Real artifitial inteligence voice. Nothing in life is real anymore not your food not the people you interact with, and definately not the voices you hear on the net.
Agreed!!
@@jasminegoin5006most can't get simple words or names right. This is the best I've heard so far. It goes well with the content.
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
She made such a commotion
that little Jenny Wren
flew down into the garden
and put it back again
Yes! That part!
Lagu 3 kupang
Saku penuh padi (pocket full of rice, rye changed to rice as it is not a grain we plant and consume)
Datang burung hitam (black bird flew in)
Masuk dalam kuali (into the wok or pan)
Bila sudah masak (once cooked)
Burung nyanyi saja (the birds just sing)
Tentu sedap dimakan (must be delicious)
Beri pada Raja (serve to the King)
Raja dalam rumah (The king is in the house [interesting to note it didn't say the king in the castle or palace])
Buat kira-kira (doing mathematics [not counting money])
Suri dalam dapur (PermaiSURI is the word for Queen but here it is suri, the wife is the exact meaning, she is in the kitchen)
Makan roti gula... hey (eating sugared bread.... hey)
Dayang tepi kolam (royal maid is beside a pond)
Mahu jemur tepung (wants to dry flour)
Datang burung hitam (come a black bird)
Pagut batang hidung (peck her nose)
This the Malay version, with slight changes in lyrics. 1stly i think this was sung and written by folks in the North of Peninsular Malaysia. Only we use kupang to depict cents or pence. Other places use the word sen. The song is also sung with different rythym than the Sic Pence song.
@80sforever3 Fascinating🧚♂️
I love the amount of detailed research you put into these videos. I’ve always wondered at the significance of 24 blackbirds. As a child in the US, I thought the pocket full of rye was to feed the birds when they were released. There was an animated version of this that showed the birds singing to the king when he cut it open. My innocent child’s mind never questioned that the birds were alive inside the pie.
The song is also used in a book by Agatha Christy, that’s how I know this song. I’m Dutch and it’s not part of our nursery rimes. The nose thing always bothered me, because it was the only impossible part of the song. But the magpie stealing a false nose make sense.
Cruciform SaXe long “brooch” and pin💉? 👁☠️👁
"A Pocketful of Rye." I always loved Geraldine McKeown's version best.
Incredible research , detective work , analysis and insight. The last and first explanations seem the most plausible, while the first offering seems the most literal as it appears an English tale that would tend towards the home grown explanation. I studied typography at college, yes I'm that old, and we used the pica measurement curiously with pica referring to Magpies there are folk legends that Magpies could talk. Ive heard it said that this notion of talking Magpies was connected to the typographic unit, words being translated into print.
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️ And thank you for sharing your insight: that's an interesting angle regarding Magpies talking, and it makes complete sense!
This from the online Britannica: Their brain-to-body-mass ratio is outmatched only by that of humans and equals that of aquatic mammals and great apes. Magpies have shown the ability to make and use tools, imitate human speech, grieve, play games, and work in teams. Many other online references to magpies mimicking human speech together with parrots, crows, and ravens.
Magpies have been known to talk as mimics, certain individuals being fairly talented
I used to have a typewriter before word processors came along. It had three daisy wheels with different sized fonts and pica was one.
I think your first, historically based analysis is most feasible! I learned many of the old nursery rhymes when I was a child !
We have several The Pye Family Memorials in our All Saint's Church and a street named after him. He was the son of Henry Pye senior who owned the manor house here. Growing up we have always been told that the rhyme was about him and our town for decades dined out on the notoriety of that event. When Henry senior died in 1766 he left his son with debts of fifty thousand pounds.....and then the manor house burned down, nowadays I would class that as having a bad day. Great story telling again.🤗🤗
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️ That's very interesting regarding your town!
I thought the rhyme referenced the Catholic persecutions, ie the 24 blackbirds were priests and they were burned. I have no idea about the origination of the following verses.
The part about the blackbirds baked in the pie always disturbed me as a kid, and now, even more! People can be such cruel monsters 😣
they didnt bake the birds just the pie crust
@@Bakugou261 ok I guess I misheard it... that makes more sense! Thanks!
Ditto
@@PersephoneRising333 And Persephone resurrects life with Her rising! 3Xs3!
@@Lee-jh6cr 🥰🙌🌜🌝🌛
If you are going to reference the printing of the bible as a theory, it's interesting to note that the original author of the English bible translated from Latin was Tyndall. He was tried and burned for heracy for his translation work- yet a few years later, that book (now called the king James bible) was the accepted text of the church of England. So pie or pyre could refer to Tyndall. Perhaps counting money is a reference to the king profiting as the author was dead.
This is the first time I’ve listened to “The Resurrectionist”. Her voice and unique content required me to subscribe. Beautifully executed with period art, analysis of the period’s use of language and historical social knowledge is superb. Thank you. ❤❤
Thank you so much for the kind words! I'm so happy you're enjoying my channel 🖤☺️
@@The-Resurrectionists I’m honored with your personal comment. I’m a painter interested in the many nuances humans use to communicate with each other. I’m old enough to remember when Don McLane came out with the song “American Pie”. My friends and I could spend days trying to figure out the symbolism. As my work developed over the years I have become focused on visual symbolism, all beginning with the realization that we are informed and fashioned in subliminal ways. Thanks again
Same. This came up on my recommended videos and I ended up subscribing after watching half of this. I love stuff like this anyway but her voice makes it even better. I usually listen to creepypasta videos to fall asleep to but these will be even better
@maureenfitzpatrick440 I've always loved songs with symbolism like that too. One I love is "Hotel California" by the Eagles, I used to wonder what that all really meant! Thank you for watching my channel and for your lovely comments: do you have any work online at all? I'd love to look :)
@melodyvalentine8779 Thank you so much! That's incredibly sweet 🖤☺️
I always knew it with the very last line, " she made such a commotion that little Jenny wren, flew down into the garden and put it on again".... does this have any significance at all? or perhaps it was only added so that small children wouldn't be upset!
Exactly that! The rhyme persisted for nearly a century before the maid's nose was replaced by the wren, likely due to its upsetting ending for children. It gave it a more light-hearted tone, and enabled the playful "got your nose" game with a child at the end of the rhyme. Thanks for watching 🖤☺️
Is it upsetting for children? Or is it an adult's perspective?
It didn't bother me in the least 😂@@christopherlawley1842
This channel is awesome!!!
We all grew up with these stories, great twist.❤🎉😊
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
Absolutely love the background music - very mystical faerie. Reminds me of a peaceful summer night watching fireflies! Never outgrew faerie tales & nursery rhymes!
My Darkling friend, this must be one of your best, the work you do to delve into the forgotten history is wonderful, I send many dark blessings to you 🌔🧙♀️🕷
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
Wow - I'd always assumed it was about the times just before the French Revolution; the first three verses being about the follies of France's royalty, whilst the 'maid' represented the desperate peasants. Eg, the upper classes' follies (blackbirds) were hurting those living off the land (in the garden). Every day I'm a-learnin'! 👩🎓
Thank you for another brilliant video! 🖤🖤
I love the lay out of your videos. Gives the listener chance to come to their conclusion...without having to over think. Keep up the fab work ❤
Thank you 🖤☺️
Thoroughly enjoyed the longer video, as always, well done❤
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
Forced to kiss the hem of the queen’s gown and giving birth within days of each other to children fathered by the same man is one certainly one recipe for tensions.
Somewhen in the 70's I heard that the rhyme was to do with the growth of protestantism. The blackbirds be protestants sing their beliefs. The version I knew it was a blackbid (protestant) pecking off the maids nose, in other words, she had been converted and loosing her nose (or sole) because of it.
So, the rhyme could be a warning by the Roman Catholic Church that you would go to hell in you became a protestant.
Interesting point about Magpies. Their latin name is Pica Pica.
Love this series. Hopefully, there will be many more interpritations of rhymes in your series. Thank you.
Doesn't explain the queen eating honey or the blackbirds, though. It explains some motifs but doesn't explain the whole story (or the two stories).
Jolly interesting video. The only theory I was familiar with was the one about Henry VIII and the blackbirds being clergy. It has a coherence and triggers some thoughts about what it was that the ‘singing’ revealed. In this case it could be a Catholic rhyme in origin used unwittingly by Protestants. However, the evidence included even in this video suggests that it is later than the Reformation. The language appears quite modern, at least mostly.
Thank you! Yes the "singing" does seem to suggest a confession of some kind. It's certainly an intriguing one!
I once read this one was about the black death and it claiming kings, queens and maids alike. The pocket full of rye being the the different herbs people carried not just cover the smell but many claims that many warded of disease
That's an interesting angle! Like the herbs that were put into plague doctor's masks? I can see how they might look like blackbirds...
I used to work in mythology research and I'm almost sure the rye does not symbolize herbs. Today, they both look like "plants, seeds, grain, whatever...". But in earlier centuries, it was "medicine" vs. "food". Rye was one of the basic ingredients for basic food, like wheat and meat today, or rice in Asia. One doesn't write "Aspirin", meaning "steak" 🙂
This one is unusual .but the line about the bird pecking a false silver or metallic nose rings true to me . Thanks once again for your insight .
Glad you enjoyed it 🖤
Yes, the one that says 'Along came a magpie..." Magpies are drawn to shiny things.
Nursery rhymes like Fairy Tales have dark origins and even darker meanings. While I won't say which of the possible origins is true and factual (I really don't have any idea.), I liked listening to all of the possible truths.
It's interesting that though this was a Rhyme started in the United Kingdom I remember my Dad, Mom and Grandparents shared this with us as we were growing up in the early 1960's.
It's a shame we don't have any unquestionable link from these rhymes to their origin. It would be so much more fascinating to know the exact origin of all these childhood nursery rhymes. I wonder though....about the ring around the rosey. I was told it came from the black plague. And each verse was more or less explained. But I bet it too has some lost history. Sing a Song of Sixpence was one of my faves as a child. So, all of this does hold intrigue.
I had a panic attack when I was grabbed by my friends to play ring around the rosey. I knew exactly what that song entailed. I refused to play along trying to tell them what they were singing about but they didn't care and I was weird. The world was cut to a third in some counts even by half count it was devastating. It's actually telling ppl how to protect yourself and in the end it doesn't matter we are all turned into ash. Up until the advent of modern antibiotics it was still killing. It has never needed to change its way of killing Ypestis is a wicked killer. It's actually killing the cougar population around the grand canyon a forest ranger died of it. His favorite female cougars collar didn't move for 18hrs which means the animal is dead. He tracked her down and found her body. Took it back to the station and he did a necepay without any protection. He died of the exact disease caused by Ypestis 😳. Now they aren't allowed to touch the animals. So it's still killing in this century. Scary stuff, any encephalitis, anthrax, ebola, nothing was as devastating as the black death.
I like the wider view of it bc we do change little by little to add to them It is a great respect to them. I'm not sure where today's folks get all up in a bunch over ppl painting their face. When imagination is the most sincere form of flattery!! A saying that should be brought up by ppl more often. Imho
@@heatherreeve9802 There are a lot of wild creatures that carry it. Armadillos carry it and so do groundhogs. But yeah, it's weird that they made a children's verse out of anything to do with it. It's not even cautionary.
You must know this from pastlife?
*Imitation
That was fantastic! Well done, from the visuals to the narration I was captivated!
Thank you! I'm so happy you enjoyed it 🖤☺️
I feel that it's about Henry the VIII. Many clergy persons were gotten rid of at the time, I think.
Henry was a Protestant and the religious civil wars followed. It's seems the best fit for the rhyme as the others are more of a stretch, I think. Good series...I like it!
Henry 8 was catholic, i believe. Even after the reformation. He still practiced catholic rituals, only did recognize the Pope.
Henry was a most steadfast Catholic. The Reformation was a power grab, allowing Henry the possibility of a male heir, and the land and wealth of the monasteries. Henry changed nothing about the church services, though he did deliver the English language Bible.
A wonderful video! Just a thought:'Who Killed Cock Robin' would be an interesting rabbit hole to dive down for a future episode!Much to ponder about that nursery rhyme!👍👍👍🇬🇧❤️❤️❤️🐊🐊🐊
oh thank you for the suggestion! I'd forgotten all about 'who killed cock robin', I loved it as a child : great idea! 🖤☺️
she made such a comotion that little Jenny Wren flew down into the garden and popped it on again... dad used to sing the song to me ad my sister, pretend to peck off our noses and pop his thumb up and then stick it on again.
Wow, thank you for these beautifully done videos. I recall reading that the 24 birds referred to the 24 hours of the day and that it might have astronomical or astrological significance. The pocket (or bag) of rye has always puzzled me, though referring to beer if it was a drinking song is an interesting possibility.
You are very welcome! :) 🖤 I also think the 24 birds certainly means the 24 hours in a day.
Superb research and narrative. I do thing the 1st explanation and addition of the last two verses are the most plausible. Good visuals as well. ❤
I always looked upon it as the pie was a scandal of some kind, and the birds singing were people spilling the secrets. I always connected the maid as possibly the origin of the scandal, and her nose being snapped off as a punishment for spreading the secrets or rumors.
Excellent content! I always loved this nursery rhyme!mom made up a little tune and sang this to us. At the end, she would quickly pinch the ends of our noses as she said "ssssnIPPED off'er nose!" We loved it. And then the grandkids loved it. The playfulness took away any bother the morbidness might have caused us.
I do believe that I have fallen in love with this channel (and perhaps its narrator) though I am not at all sure why it has taken this long to do so. Please keep up your most excellent and fascinating work.
Thank you so much 🖤☺️
Another fantastic video - keep it up!
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
All fascinating possibilities! I wonder at the use of the word rye. Given that rye mold, or ergot, produced hallucinations. Not that it fits into any theory… Just caught my attention.
As a history buff since childhood, I have truly enjoyed many of the videos describing 17th century events. I have a paternal ancestor a Mr. John Williams born 1610 and it's a treat to imagine all that he witnessed during those years.😁
I was always looking out for birds when hanging out the wash. But i did hear of ' cutting off your own nose to spite your face'. In Greek and Roman times an mistress had nose cut off. If you were of means a plastic surgery could be preformed.
This was a really interesting video and I'm so glad I found this channel. I will be taking a deep dive into all your videos.
Thank you so much :)
I just wanted to say thank you so very much for making these intresting vidéos . I also agree with Gordon ! Your voice is wonderful 😊.
Thank you so much! Really appreciate your kind words 🖤☺️
Thank you for fascinating info and glimpses of history behind nursery rhymes! A few of them I did know something about. In the early 80's my brother and sisters formed a small satirical theatre group. One performance was on nursery rhymes and, oh boy, the things we learned in that research! That performance was of course titled "Mother Goosed".
Not about the origin, but a subsequent reference. In the Little House series, one of the books recounts the Ingalls family having their crops depleted by blackbirds eating the grain. Pa shoots the birds and Ma makes a blackbird pie out of them. Laura recounts how they were inspired by the rhyme.
Yikes!!!
A very well researched video. Just to tie in with the change to four and twenty naughty boys, interestingly another rhyme that appeared in Gammer Gurton's Garland also featured four and twenty.
Four-and-twenty tailors went to kill a snail,
The best man amongst them durst not touch her tail;
She put out her horns like a little Kyloe cow;
Run, tailors, run, or she’ll kill you all e’en now.
"24 naughty boys" reminds me of that number turned around in the Bible, 2 Kings 2:23-24. After a group of naughty boys who called prophet Elisha a "baldhead", he cursed them, then God sent 2 she-bears that tore 42 of the boys apart. (Notice how the verse has the numbers 2 and 24.)
Four-and-twenty is another way of saying "two dozen". Basically - a lot. "Dozen" was a common counting unit.
I think the first French court explanation fits beautifully. Is there a version in the French language and culture anyone? If the answer is no, then I think it can be almost excluded from the list: why should it be preserved in English but not in the land where it occurred?
I do think the first explanation, about the wedding and the exchange of funds, is the right one.
Me too, and I used to work in mythology research. It fits perfectly and explains everything. Except perhaps the "nose out of joint" - there, I think, one of the meanings referring to a missing nose as a sign of adultery, or syphillis contracted while committing adultery, would fit better.
Thank you for another good and interesting romp through the old rhymes! I really like the work you do. B.
You're very welcome! Glad you enjoyed again, thank you for your ongoing support it's really appreciated 🖤☺️
Another excellent video!!!
I always wonder about the similar story of "the Seven Goatlings(?) and the Wolf".
The wolf tricks the kid goats to let him in.
Six of the baby- goats get eaten by the wolf but one who hid in the clock gets away, and when the Mothergoat comes home. Together they save the ones inside the wolf.
These two stories tend to connect.
Just found your channel and love the concept.
New subscriber here. 😃👍
Thank you so much and welcome! 🖤☺️
I must begin with a note congratulating you on your diction, choice of subject matter, and illustrations. They are all a superb antidote to the #%^* on UA-cam
When my mother was reading “Sing a song of sixpence, a pocket full of rye” to me I thought it rather weird that people would carry rye in their pockets. Now, some 70 years later I clicked on another meaning for pocket. My mother would buy pockets of potatoes, oranges, etc from the greengrocer. A pocket was a hessian sack that stood about knee high. It would hold enough rye to bake this kind of pie.
Wow, very interesting, thanks! Only a king's pie wouldn't have been made out of rye (that was for "black bread", less refined and more nourishing, for the lower classes).
Wow you really went deep this time. Can't see some of these bawdy stories being taught to children, more like music halls and drinking houses.
I love your content. I recall nursery rhymes coming up semi frequently during my research throughout my studies in cultural anthropology. What was more interesting was they came up again during my studies in medical anthropology. Most of my fellow classmates selected specializations such as Egyptology. Whereas I chose to specialize in diseases and illnesses in Britain from 9th-17th centuries. And then I had a colleague who was a linguistic anthropologist. He would dissect language and meanings. I'm so glad I found your channel. It's very well researched.
In Scotland, Bean-nighe(washer women) are sometimes described as not having a nose, and they are typically seen washing laundry in a stream(sort of matches one of the descriptions). The clothes they are washing are of the person doomed to die.
There’s likely no connection with the poem, but now I’m wondering if the no nose thing has a mean origin 😮
Fabulous as always! You research so deeply & then spin such beautiful tales! I was of the opinion that the rhyme was linked to Henry VIII and the dissolution of the monasteries, but you have compelling arguments for many other theories...perhaps the rhyme was indeed a fusion from different eras? Thanks!
Hi. I love your channel. This is the first time that I’ve left a comment on one of your videos. I love learning about the stories behind the nursery rhymes, but I was also thinking that I’d like to hear the stories behind fairytales as well.
Thank you! There's definitely a few fairy tales I'd like to do videos on at some point: quite a few have dark origins!
Totally love this. Thanks.
Thank you so much! So happy you enjoyed it 🖤☺️
In my little book, it was “along came a blackbird and snipped of her nose!”
Fascinating video, nursery rhymes have always intrigued me.
"Come into the Garden Maude" could then be taken for nothing to do with matter horticultural at all.
Just discovered your channel , what a wonderful narrator's voice , thankyou for sharing your wonderful work 😊😊
Thank you so much! :) 🖤
My favorite nursery rhyme! This one, Hey Diddle Diddle, amd Three Little Kittens were ones that i repeated constantly as a child. Now as an adult who loves history and mystery, I love this channel!
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
@@The-Resurrectionists you're welcome! So glad i found y'all 😄
The Royal family haven't changed much
Wow a great video. that story about the queen and the mistress was like 😮😮😮! So interesting!
sixpence for entertainment is also mentioned in midsummer nights dream
In book "Emblemata" that was popular in 17 th century in first table picture 13 is an image of flying little birds to a cherry tree the description of symbol is that "eagles are gathering where the dead body is"
7:40 Well, the pirate code is really more guidelines that hard and fast rules.
Continue with the enjoyable presentations, like this historical tale was.
Thank you so much! Glad you enjoyed :) 🖤
This is an awesome concept, excellent content
Yes indeed! These are great posts: informative and well written and no small part of them is the beautiful voice with wonderful articulation of the presentation. it’s a different accent than mine and I enjoy that as well. it amazes me that anyone could think this was artificial intelligence it’s sparkles with human intelligence.
Wonderful, this was my suggestion and I'm thrilled 😊
Thanks for the idea! Hope you enjoyed it 🖤☺️
@@The-Resurrectionists very much so, you always do an incredible job of research and your delivery is perfect 👌🏼
The birds in a pie was a gimmick to impress guests at the table.
The rest 🥴.
Maybe the rhyme is common man taking the mic out of the rich?
My family used to own the land diagonally across Bath Creek from Edward Teach's (Blackbeard) house in Bath, NC.
oh wow how wonderful! Thank you for sharing 🖤☺️
I always thought the nose thing was a reference to syphilis.😮
I had heard the Henry James Pye theory before. He was probably England's worst poet laureate, and apparently had a penchant for avian themed poetry. Rest of the video was enlightening. Thanks
Thank you so much! 🖤☺️
I suspect the origin is more ancient. The first verse detailing Druids burning Roman prisoners in a wicker man, *Four and twenty naughty boys bak'd in a Pyre* followed by the druidic tradition of feeding those remains to Seahawks, Ravens, etc while the local cheiftan presides. The second verse is Roman troops exacting their revenge by attacking the unguarded children at their chores with the parents indoors and unaware.
I think the first explanation given might be the closest. I don't think people, especially children, are very interested in transmitting secret code through rhymes that much, anyway. It comes out the way it does because it's funny and good to sing whether it makes sense or not in reference to "persons living or dead".
Fantastic Series. Very interesting, educational and informative ❤ Much more of this type of content please.😊
I like the version about the maid Henrietta "hanging out her laundry" as an older way of what we call "airing out one's dirty laundry in public". I think the depiction of her public disdain for the Queen comfortably fits that verse.
Really enjoyed that - Thank you very much.
Glad you enjoyed it 🖤☺️
As a child I always wondered how the blackbirds sang after being cooked!😂
Another thought provoking video. Great work
Thanks for watching! 🖤☺️
11:05 Biblical references do not include nose-cutting for adultery. You are thinking of Ezekiel 23 where God is speaking to Israel and Judah analogously as prostitutes/adulterers who go after oppressive empires instead of trusting in God. The monologue there indicates what these empires themselves will do to these “women”, i.e., Israel and Judah, to “punish you according to their own standards” of warfare, which included the horrors of cutting off noses and ears, killing by the sword, burning people, and taking their sons and daughters of the slain as captives. So the punishment for the Hebrews’ “adultery”, figuratively speaking, was invasion; so cutting off the nose was not prescribed or described as a punishment for adultery itself. The list of horrors of warfare were what the Assyrians and Babylonians would do when they invaded because that’s what they did in warfare among other acts. That said, I’m enjoying this channel. Interesting discussions.
Thanks! I was wondering about that. Half of my family are theologians and this mention in the video very much did not ring true. Not straightforward enough and too mutilating. The Israeli punishment for adultery was stoning.
Okay, I was wondering about why anyone would have rye in their pocket. Maybe, it was not originally rye but rue which medieval superstition associated with powers of protection from evil and people put it in pouches and carried it about. This again suggests an older origin to at least the first verse. I think it was the 16th century that may be the source of this first verse. Rue was also associated with grief and mourning. Shakespeare knew this as we can gather from Hamlet. However, a parlour was not a room a Queen inhabited back then it was not a term used for a room in a house until the 18th century. Prior to that monks under vows of silence went to designated rooms called 'Parlers' were they could speak. No doubt due to French being a common tongue of diplomacy and being used in many European courts the word moved into wider meaning first amongst the aristocracy. So this agsun suggests a later origin for the second verse onward.
Someone in the comments here said "pocket" meant "a small sack". Which would explain why there's "pocket" in some version and "sack" in others - they're a similar thing.
Please, could you do your magic on The Queen of Hearts? Many thanks!
How I do wish that I could have lived in the time when the king & the queen & the nobility lived, & I would have certainly loved to be & see all of the animals & the people who lived in that time period & I would certainly have loved to be a part of the inhabitants who lived in any part of the World 🌍 during the Medieval times ❤😊
Also powdered wigs were also used to help hide syphilis scars and sores on the head
Would the sixpence and a pocket full of rye refer to a working man’s (very low) wages, and the fact that he either had rye bread or rye whiskey in his pocket which was often all that kept the poorer working class going? So it’s like a commentary of the poor man’s lot compared to the ridiculousness of the wealthy baking live birds in a pie etc.
I once met a lady in the early seventies, she was in her late eighties and she said she had eaten a pie with birds in it. I forget whether she said it was blackbirds or starlings. Bit of a shock to me at the time.
Thank you for taking us down such a fascinating vortex of historical beliefs based on reality or pure imagination, forever reflective of the strongly weakened position of women who tended to be used as monetary pawns, carnal objects or breeding stock. It is also clear that given a little skill and determination , it is actually possible to twist historical facts into any meaning that takes your fancy !
Glad you enjoyed! 🖤☺️
Starlings, crows and ravens were eaten by commoners. Crows and ravens are still eaten with the breast flesh compared to duck flesh without the oil. Therefore, pies made from these avian sources weren’t uncommon. The surprise pies also make more sense.
In my youth several decades ago, we ate fat Robins and the large King Woodpeckers, both were quite good. Dad had grown up in the Great Depression, and the poor families like his ate anything they could hunt. Dad would also gather "Skunk Cabbage" as we did our Squirrel hunting.
Great video, very well done. Thank you. 😊😊
Glad you enjoyed it! 🖤☺️
Truly adore the way you do this. I'm proud to be a darkling.
When I was a kid I really liked that song of sixpence. I'm old now.
It must have been an enormous pie to hold 24 blackbirds, which are large birds to start with.
Yeah, either it was really the huge festive cake as described in the first explanation, or the 24 is just a symbolic number meaning "a lot" (two dozen).
You know I wonder if Bo Peep is actually about a female shepherd that lost her sheep