Legends is old canon. Disney labeled the EU books that are considered old canon as Legends. And dubbed them the Legends canon. So yeah it's canon but a separate canon. Disney is simply rebooting the franchise with a new canon which TCW and Rebels are apart of. But Legends is an old canon meaning the original canon. Any book marked Legends are books that don't contradict the movies and were already deemed canon. So Disney called it the Legends canon. So Star Wars has two canons. One old and the other one being a new reboot. The Legends canon and New canon.
+John Reeves I wish sometime in the future they keep writing for the Legends canon, that's the main reason people were pissed about the New continuity.
When you pick and mix your own complementary style and raise it to a high degree like Marek rather than focus on a single style like Duku that does not necessarily mean you are a jack of all trades and not a master of one. No it could also mean you are a master of your own personal style that simply draws inspiration and elements from existing schools.
Anony Mash As Bruce Lee once put it: “Absorb what is useful, Discard what is not, Add what is uniquely your own..." I think this perfectly describes how a TRUE Battlemaster should approach combat. While Galen is no Battlemaster, I think he took this principle to heart and made something out of it.
However, interesting point to bring up might be the Makashi doctrine of practical efficiency- Form II emphasizes discarding the ineffective elements and specializing the technique to fit the practitioner. So it could be said that Dooku was no less versatile than a Battlemaster, he simply personalized his single method rather than trying to learn several forms.
Or one could say that form two is not a true form in and of itself but a school of combat that requires the student to personalize their own form; much like form seven in that respect. I can see what you are saying but I would say that he was not as versatile as Qui gon jin for example not because of a limitation of the form but because he refused to go beyond his own comfort zone.
Anony Mash I never thought to compare it to Form 7, interesting! It's ironic that Dooku championed the practice of a single form, but chose a form that emphasized customization. In terms of versatility, I'll qualify by saying that it's impossible to make a blanket statement about specialists vs hybrids, this is more my personal observations. I regard Dooku's swordmanship as far superior to that of Qui-Gon or Marek. Prior to his defection, Dooku's only equals were Mace Windu and Yoda- both specialists who employed forms 7 and 4. Throughout the war, Dooku quite handily defeated scores of Jedi, and was only brought down by a combination of Anakin's application of Djem So and Darth Sidious's interference. To me, this is an indicator that Dooku *does* possess a large degree of versatility, as his only equals were individuals of equal or greater power who specialized in a single lightsaber form. I don't mean to diminish hybrid styles at all- they have been proven to be quite effective, I just have yet to see an application that can compete with top-tier specialists. Perhaps an argument could be made for Kyle Katarn or Darth Vader?
I rather suspect that the series uses top tier duelists to showcase or introduce the forms. I also suspect that is one of the ways they visually inform us about the character; a narative tool if you will. I do want to see more variety in the new cannon. One thought though; an additional vulnerability of miashi: Light pikes. The two handed spear or glaive stance gets you almost overwhelming reach, a massive advantage in terms of leverage and the ability to launch rapid fire stabbing attacks from head to toe. You also have a huge amount of surface area to parry with. A guy with a saber against a guy with a pike will always be at a disadvantage except in extreme close quarters and enclosed spaces. This isn't helped by the fact that the spear is inherently a much more user frendly weapon to learn with, perhaps the very easiest weapon to begin with. When you are still learning how not to cut yourselft in half with you sabre the guy with the pike is already battle ready and mastering more complex forms. Less than a week compared to over a year to get the basics down. Mikashi is particularly screwed because it struggles against blast deflection (and it will feel like you are going against an automatic blaster if the spearman has his way) and it depends on darting footwork against a longer reach. Also the amount of mass and leverage you are going up against will make the usual parries extremely difficult to pull off. Now on the other hand a Wookie Mikashi master with a light pike would be a terrifying opponent for pretty much anyone to face. IT amps up the strength of the style and mitigates its weaknesses; just don't depend on it for blast deflection and you will be fine.
EvanNova95 I'm kind of curious as to when we'll see more great work out of you. You do such great vs series videos. I've been wondering what kind of matchups you can create, since there's so many options left.
EvanNova95 Alright thanks. Just an idea for a matchup: Githany vs Lumiya. It occured to me after I originally commented that this has yet to be done, as far as I know.
Not sure I would consider Marek the 'inferior' swordsman. His use of Juyo may be more controlled, but given the style's proclivities, that is an accomplishment in and of itself, and also makes him similarly unpredictable to the Count. I also suspect it may be a contradictory notion to say the Count would try to press in closer in lightsaber combat: faster, stronger, and more skilled opponents have tried to do this to Marek and failed. I also personally feel one of the Count's most significant weaknesses, the one that truly killed him, is being overlooked: his staggering arrogance.
@@matthewmann8969 no but honestly he may as well have. Dooku removes Obi-wan from the fight by himself seemingly with no problem at all and in the novelization Palpatine specifically tells Dooku to hold back against Anakin and turn him to the dark side but also to kill Obi-wan. This means Dooku likely could have killed Obi-wan anytime he wanted and only Anakin gave him a challenge, and eventually overcame him.
@@MrEffectfilmsIf there fight started out one on one from the start, start up, or starting then I would say Anakins winning over Dooku was legitametely his and his alone just like how Windu fought Sidious with three other Jedi Masters with him not by himself from the very forefront yeah.
Dooku is and always will be one of my favorite Sith Lords of all time along with Malak, Sion, Malgus, Vader, and Marka Ragnos. I will always root for Dooku win or lose!
His form 2 makashi is so clean the opening part of the obi/ani vs dooku where he is spinning around deflecting every attack swiftly and wasting no movement
Count Dooku, I argue is probably one of the most underrated Sith/characters within Star Wars. To be fair, I can understand why. Despite Christopher Lee portraying the role, Lucas made Dooku(and the rest of the cast) seem incredibly stupid/ dull. Yet, in Legends I found myself liking Dooku, especially during Yoda Dark Rendezvous and the ROTS novelization. I'd honestly love to, if I ever had a chance to write a book, decide to write a book about Dooku. Specifically, about his younger years when he joined the Jedi order. I'd love to explore his relationship between him and Yoda, along with Qi-Gon. And also how Dooku became such a gifted swordsman. Some could argue this seems fruitless as we'll already know Dooku's conclusion, but if the Han Solo Trilogy by A.C Crispin taught me anything, it is that you can tell compelling stories even if they have a predestined conclusion. And that's something as I'm not the biggest Han Solo fan.
Dooku is underrated by some, but not all. Most fans know Sidious is the reason Dooku lost to Anakin, but Dooku was not a character Lucas up-played and so he never got a strong fanbase. He is interesting, and I think a novel about him would serve SW fans well. I also think Windu is the same type of character...many believe him overrated, but I disagree.
He has fatigued from 1v2 him and kenobi and had to lavishly spend his reserves to remove him from the fight , fatigued taunting and not trying to kill anakin , and the fact the anakin was form 5 specialist added to his defeat. In fact it was stated in the novels that he managed to meet all of anakins strikes while all of this was happening so if he had the intention to kill he could have.
Nah I don't see how Galen would lose to Dooku since he had practiced all forms since he was training as a child and knows all the weaknesses of each form. Dooku only uses one most of the time. Not only that but he was a prodigy when it came to using the force in different applications.
Dooku is also trained in and knows all forms since a child and knowing more styles does not make you a better fighter. And Galen is no amazing master with the saber who knows how to beat anyone, Dooku is a far more skilled and experienced fighter. Galen has not used any force ability that Dooku either hasn't used or seen.
dooku got his force shield broken by savage oppress and force choked to death along with ventress. And not to mention that starkiller was able to pull a star destroyer out of the sky. Was dooku able to do that I don't think so.
xXDeathMetalThrasherXx he redirected it. Still though, just gripping a star destroyer and pulling it down is a feat that is incredibly impressive and cannot be overlooked at all.
I like your videos and i'm not saying anything about the outcome of this versus but i still think you underestimated Starkiller a little bit. How come his force repulse wasn't even mentioned while discussing force powers. Dude could turn multiple targets in ashes..literally. Can't remember Dooku doing that.
***** Galen Marek's telekinetic attacks would at least stagger the Count, which would be enough for Marek to gain a tactical advantage. Galen would exploit this advantage as he is no reckless fighter.
Dooku is more tactical than Galen and has way more experience. Also based on what you said why wouldn't/couldn't Dooku do the same as he more honed abilities than Galen.
***** Well, it is Starkiller's ability fair enough. But i can't agree that Dooku would've blocked his repulse so easily. Honestly if hit i doubt he would be able to block it at all. This is about Starkiller not Galen Marek so i don't have anything against the outcome of the video.
***** Yeah I was kind of thinking of the outcome and saying to my self that it was correct but if starkiller from TFU2 replaced Galen then this would have been alot closer.
Hm... First the _real_ Darth Maul beats Galen, now it's Lord Tyranus' turn. Not bad. I wonder why PROXY wasn't given a Tyranus training module. Would've been nice to see him use it against Galen.
DarthWill3 There are two possible reasons why Vader considered it unnecessary. 1. Perhaps he actually believed he did defeat Dooku, and thought that if he could do it in his young foolish days, it would be no problem for Galen. 2. Maybe he didn't believe Training against a Makashi Master wasn't needed, since it was such a Rare Form to see.
josiah jenks And let's not forget Asajj Ventress. She would've made such an awesome training module. Two curved-hilt lightsabers that can be made into a double-bladed one... I mean, that would've been so unpredictable!
DarthWill3 It's Assajj Ventress. She has a good Theory on Fighting. She just doesn't have a Good Grip on Battling. While she was a Challenge for Mace ONCE, she still got Crushed by Anakin, Humiliated by Obi Wan, was equally matched with Wimpy Disney Canon Grevious, failed to Defend against Ahsoka's Offense, and Lost to Plo Koon when He had a BROKEN ARM. *Though I will give her credit for obliterating Luminara Unduli.*
DarthWill3 I know you spelled it right. I was saying it like Yeah, it's Ventress, no one really powerful. And yes, she wasn't too bad. But these shortcomings and failures force me to see her in a Bad Light. *Though I was somewhat kind to her by not mentioning the time she lost to Dooku when he was only partially awake, under a Drug that dulled his senses, and she had two other Nightsisters with her.*
Disagree with the verdict. You made it seem like Marek couldn't break Dooku's Force shield, which he already did against Vader. Starkiller not being able to penetrate the Sith Acolytes is a game mechanic...
Wollf Myth if you're bringing Dooku's ability to bring down a bridge and small ship into this, then you should also consider Starkiller's ability to bring down an entire Star Destroyer. Just sayin'.
***** You mean Suited Vader was a shadow of Pre suited Vader at the time. Anakin and Vader even the Pre suited ones where different Identities sure they where both arrogant but Anakin was much more focused then Vader was and I am referring to both the Pre suit Anakin and Pre suit Vader. And yes Sidious was toying with both Marek and Maul and Savage the part in the deleted scene where Maul broke through Sidiouses force shield was just ridiculous unless Sidious let it happen the same way he allowed Windu to kick him in the face.
marinus18 Yeah, they tend to overpower and overrate/hype him SO much. I seriously know people who legitimately think Galen/Starkiller is the most powerful Jedi/Sith/Force User EVER in existence...lmfao at that.
Justin Yatsko He fought against 2 jedi knights and 1 jedi master and struggled against all 3. Darth Vader even specifically says that Kazden Paratus is stronger in the force than Galen is. Also it's heavily hinted that Ramn Kota is a superior duelist and that Shaak Ti is superior in both.
Rahm Kota was a master actually and a Jedi general. Kazdan was considered more powerful then Galen at the time but Galen was confirmed to have grown in power throughout the events of TFU. Shaak was a Council member. Rahm and Galen stalemated and Shaak only did as well as she did because of numerous circumstances in her favor.
His abilities were that great. Only second to the emperor...A reason the emperor wanted him as his new apprentice to replace Vader. But he sacrificed himself...even Yoda didn't do that.
@@schwiftycats No, not even close. Galen Marek was not as skilled a lightsaber master as Vader, his Force abilities were less varied and developed than Vader's, and he was no genius strategist or tactician. He was about on par with the likes of Darth Maul at worst, or Anakin Skywalker at best. He was good, and possessed potential. He never achieved it. The only reason he bested Vader was because he was intimately familiar with Vader's weaknesses, and spammed them. The only way he blocked Palpatine's Lightning was due to a partial Oneness with the Force. He was skilled, and had potential, but he punched above his weight-class several times. Shaak Ti gave him his victory out of pity, Vader wasn't at his best, and Sidious was playing with his food, and was only surprised that he deflected his lightning. Galen Marek was skilled, but he wasn't that skilled.
@@austinkersey2445 Here is a video from a popular UA-camr known as Seth the programmer who has been known for being quite knowledgeable in putting up fights against fictional characters such as Star Wars. m.ua-cam.com/video/5J0cCy7H5WE/v-deo.html He puts Galen Marak on top of dooku in terms of tiers and I think he does justice in proving it right. The time stamp for dooku’s tier is 15:15 The time stamp for Galen marak tier is 17:33
@@MemesCreed I know. I disagree with it immensely, even though he makes a good enough case. Galen is just not as developed as Dooku, he is not as skilled, and his power does not make enough of a difference to even it out. He would be a threat to Dooku, but he would not overcome him. His telekinesis is less refined, his telepathy is virtually nil, and his lightning is his only real surprise when he runs it along his blade. He isn't bringing anything to the table that the good Count can't counter. Marek is capable, for instance, I would say he could beat Legends Ventress or Kit Fisto. That's about where he caps out in my opinion. He could have been more had he lived longer, but he didn't.
@@austinkersey2445 okay I’ll try to go too all your points. While you are correct that dooku is more experienced this also came with age and so kinda slowed down the count needing to exert more force power to contend with the likes of obi wan and anakin at the same time which was stated that the reason he lost was because, anakin used form 5 combat (which Galen also uses) but also he was just to tired to compete. Also to say Galen marak isn’t at least close to skilled is dooku is a bit of a downplay this is the person who was trained by Vader the second most powerful person in the galaxy only below plapatine his entire life who even you can not doubt can destroy dooku. Now as for his force abilities not being strong again even at a young age when Vader was going to kill Galen’s father he said and I quote “where is your master?” Because he sensed someone much stronger than the father(which was Galen). Also on top of that his fight with Vader should prove his force powers can contend with Vader as am pretty sure I saw a scene in the fight where he ragdolled Vader into a wall. Also he was considered a revolutionary force user because not only did he have the lighting blade but a another force ability no one not even luke had access which was the giant ball of electricity he lets out in his ultimate which you can see in his trailer even I don’t know how dooku could counter that. Let’s not even mention the fact that another reason he won the Vader fight was because, he was much faster than him also that the Vader he fought was comparable to yoda which if I remember correctly forced dooku to run retreat.
He was ordered to take it easy and surrender which he did take it easy at 1st but he tried towards the end once anakin started using the darkside but that overwhelmed him. Dooku is one of the best duelist and very powerful but anakin kept getting closer to beating him through the war and the darkside gave him a boost in power. In the novel for ROTS dooku even said anakin was the best form 5 duelist he’d ever seen
As a heavy fan of both Dooku and anakin/vader I got to say you have it 100% right. At the beginning Dooku was supposed to pick on and Bully Anakin into joining the sith. But once Dooku who saw, that that boy's good, he had to go all out even drawing on the dark side to keep up. By the end he was just straight up defeated. It was a good scrap
in honor to a great man as christopher lee, i am loving this video due to how truly in depth you are getting into the specifics of both combatant. which is why i continue to come back. and this is so far the best versus video yet that i have seen
This made my day; I feel that Galen Marek is such a Gary Sue, so overwhelming and strong and noble that the Force Unleashed series basically tried to make him the new, better Luke Skywalker. I'm glad to see you think that Dooku would still be able to handle him, despite the OPness to his character. :)
Read the novel which was considered the real canon depiction of the force unleashed story. He isn't that powerful in the novel. Starkiller is honestly overrated. His feats are also downplayed in the novel.
Dark Rendezvous is canon. It's the origin story of Dooku. Disney said only the novels after the original trilogy are non-canon. Darth Bane and Pleagus are canon. They confirmed that. Meaning Path to Power and Darth Pleagus novel are canon. All the novels about them are canon. Plus Force Unleashed 1 is said to be canon. Not 2. Lucas said they are canon. And Disney can't just make them non- canon or the story would not make sense. The old republic is canon too. That is important to the story. Same with Bane and Pleagus. And the Darth Vader novels are canon because they take place during the great Jedi Purge. So that has to be canon. Disney again said only the EU after the Return of the Jedi are non-canon. Not the ones before it.
LucasFilm, I believe, released a list of the chronology a few months ago, stating that the films, the Clone Wars and Rebels series, as well as the new novels this year, are the only things that are canon. Everything else was rebranded as Legends.
Yep. The only changes that I REALLY disagree with were taking out the EU stuff that happened between the films, as well as stuff that happened just before Episode I. To be honest, I always felt that the Pre-Episode I stuff and the Post-Episode VI stuff did not resonate very well with the saga that George Lucas created. Granted, those two eras added an interesting element to the story, but it just didn't feel right. That's why I'm thankful that those two eras are no longer canon, and just Legends, especially Star Wars: Legacy. I know that I might get some flack for these statements, but I'm just putting my personal truth and opinions out there with the hope that they are treated with the respect that I treat everyone else's opinions about what is, in my opinion, the best fictional universe EVER.
It's almost ironic how the description of Dooku's height went, considering that he was played by Christopher Lee who was the tallest professional actor alive (even more ironic is who took his place at his death, Liam Neeson). R.I.P. Christopher Lee
Excellent. A focus on highly advanced and speculative levels on both the techical and tactical aspects of the characters, combined with excellently fitting background-music that easily blends into the video itself (especially the Microseries-clip with Dooku and Grievous).
+Mattae Weavs you said marvel and thats only because marek knew what darth vaders fighting styles and tactics were thats why marek won against vader if marek and vader had a duel of the fates and knew nothing about eachother vader would win
+burning ninja06 but also remember he took on palpatine right after whos was well above vader in my opinion showing how physically im shape he is fighting 2 sith lords in a row where as dooku was clearly winded after dualing obi wan and anakin in AOTC
but you have to remember palpatine's not physically in shape in terms of physical abilities but it is a good feat I would agree but he wasn't fighting palpatine it was more of a force battle plus he had 'died' anyways so
Tyler Knard and plus I think dooku was just toying with obi wan and anikan but in that battle in aotc I felt like dooku was one of those kids you tried to saber battle when you were 7 and all they did is try to stab you #cheapdooku #iforgottherewerehashtags
burning ninja06 he was clearly toying with obi wan no doubt but he clearly had a much harder time fighting anakin as he pushed a fast paced fight and sidious fought mace, maul and yoda not that long before the force unleashed, it would only be a few year difference, even if it was a force battle he clearly got the better of sid slamming him to the ground, he COULD have killed him but didn't so i still starkiller takes the fight
Excellent matchup though not a hugely surprising outcome. Galen was an unpredictable Force-powered wrecking ball but I don't see him as having the level of finesse and experience to deal with one of the greatest combative duos in Jedi history (Obi Wan/Anakin), while Dooku routinely handled them with ease. It took masters on the tier of Yoda or Windu to really make the Count sweat (without outside interference or plot convenient stupidity of course). Well researched and enlightening as usual Jensaarai, I look forward to more. If I may ask, based on Evannova's recent Vader v. Caedus showdown (personally don't entirely agree with Evan on his evaluation of Caedus but the final outcome was fair)--how well do you see the Count faring against the Solo turned Sith? My personal opinion is that Dooku would hand the young upstart a defeat, though not easily. Just curious on where you'd stand.
Dooku would crush him. Starkiller has more raw power but Dooku is more experienced, more skilled, more agile and probably better force user. Starkiller is probably the most overrated Star Wars character.
Given Dooku's approach to the dark side, I'm not sure if he would be able to wake the power within Galen to the point that Vader did. Dooku as you remember preffered a much more loose connection to the dark side and rellied more on his intelligence and lightsaber skills rather than raw power.
why dose everyone say Marek losses? he beat Darth Freaking Vader and stood up to the Emperor. I can see Star Killer not beating Doocu because his training wasn't to make him the best but I think Marek would have a better shot then that.
@@ironinquisitor3656 dookus lightning isnt half as strong and Vader also wasnt just a djem so specialist he added alot of mikashi and the hours of training marathons he did with vader I'm sure he would have picked up on mikashi plenty
While I'll contend that there are some truly staggering deficiencies with Marek's abilities, I think his inability to penetrate force shields, and likewise make one, was a game mechanic to prevent the player from rag dolling the bosses. But that's just my opinion.
Defeats his master. Stands toe to toe with his masters master. Manages to pull down star destroyer. Then after all these amazing feats he gets defeated by an eighty year old. What the actual fuck?
+Kevin Wilson But if you watch his other vs videos, he'll say that somebody like yoda loses to vader because he's too much of a one trick pony with his ataru..SMH...
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra Your statement doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Yoda and Sidious were masters of each lightsaber style and were pretty much untouchable except for someone on their level which would only end as a stalemate. Would you say they were too wide spread as well. I highly doubt it. Having more tools to choose from in a toolbox is a whole lot better than having only a philips screwdriver no matter how good that screwdriver is.
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra I STILL think that knowing more than one style can trump just the one. If you were to pit a ufc fighter against a pure boxer, more times than not the ufc will win because they have more to draw on such as judo, jujitsu, grappling etc. Now if said ufc fighter chooses to fight and use only boxing as a technique, then the odds are in the boxer's favor. Can you see where im coming from? sorry if i sounded aggressive in my last statement.
This is a focused, sourced, legitimate breakdown. Very impressive because it does not sugar coat either Character. Really excellent job for the community. Dooku was not in his prime when he faced Anakin and he was disrupted by Palpatine... A younger Dooku would I think may even have beaten Yoda! Of course he was a Jedi then... I liked the Martial Breakdown of Makashi and Form 5 .... The best technically I have seen on UA-cam. Jensaarai1 is turning into the acknowledged expert on the 7 Forms. A Martial Theorist that martial artists can learn from. My main take-away question is: You said that Dooku had studied how to beat the different Forms: What is your technical ways he broke down each style? How does each Form get overcome by Makashi? I definitely have new respect for the deadliness of Dooku and Makashi and now want a Dooku movie! An old man rampage!!!!
I really don't understand when people just throw the "not in their prime" argument out there. Dooku became MORE deadly as he got older, not less. His age was a serious hurdle for him, but his skill increase massively overshadowed his body's decline.
@@unbelievablytrash9458 Yeah, I don't get this argument either. Dooku did lose physical attributes due to age, but his greater skill gained through consistent study, practice, and practical application made him all the more dangerous for it. He is even stated to be in great physical shape for his age, and is still more than capable as a hand-to-hand combatant. It's just that strength was never his style, as he used a dexterity-based form and thus focused on that attribute. He probably also put some time into honing his stamina and agility, as he does avoid or sidestep attacks rather than tank them, and he has some impressive staying power for a man in his mid-eighties by the time of his death. Point is, he was still plenty capable in the more physical aspects of combat, but he was never about direct confrontation. His lightsaber skill, immense power and skill in the Force, and ingenius strategic and tactical mind grant him an insane skill advantage against 99.99% of the Star Wars universe. Quite honestly, the only people who are definitively beating Dooku are the top ten Jedi of all time and the top five Sith. Even then, I think he can defeat at least members on either list. My opinion on who those are is as follows: Jedi: 1. Grandmaster Luke Skywalker 2. Yoda 3. Kyp Durron 4. Kyle Katarn 5. Jaina Solo Fel 6. Corran Horn 7. Mace Windu 8. Satele Shan 9. Cade Skywalker 10. Mara Jade Skywalker Honorable Mentions: Nomi Sunrider, Revan, Kol Skywalker (he was a monster, but we don't have many feats besides the admittedly impressive few we have), An'ya Kuro, Shaak Ti, Plo Koon, Obi-Wan Kenobi, and Jaden Korr (potentially, especially if we got some more material with him) Sith: 1. Darth Sidious 2. Darth Krayt 3. Darth Vitiate 4. Darth Malgus 5. Darth Bane/Darth Vader (I flip-flop on this all the time) Honorable Mentions: Dooku/Darth Tyranus, Darth Revan, Darth Malak, Darth Plagueis, and Darth Traya
KING CODGAMING the fact that Niman doesn’t usually include Makashi, 1,3,4,5 but I don’t know if Marek’s training taught him proper defense against Makashi
I just wanted to say that you are my absolute favorite. I love all you videos, and the way you present the information has been a big help to me. I've been trying to learn as much as I can about star wars lately. you, grey jedi, and Evan nova have helped a lot .
Excellently done and I loved the use of Zorro's soundtrack. It embody's Dooku's fighting style and even his idealistic personality (Zorro having been an idealistic outlaw). Absolutely perfect description for a largely underrated character. I don't fully agree with the part about Anakin only winning because of Sidious' anger coaching on the side, as it only influenced Anakin's decision to kill Dooku, but everything else was bang on!
Good match, been a while since I saw a video from you, and I like your attempt at a narrative-style verdict like Antoine's videos. Here's a few matches that might be of interest to you: 1. Anakin Skywalker vs Darth Maul 2. Count Dooku vs Darth Bane A couple of team battles that might be interesting below.. I know these take more time, but some inspiration for down the road perhaps: 1. Anakin Skywalker + Ahsoka Tano vs Count Dooku + Asajj Ventress (prior to betrayal), two master/student pairs that had an unfortunate end 2. Obi-Wan Kenobi + Anakin Skywalker vs Darth Bane + Darth Zannah, two powerful duos from their respective time periods
It's actually explained in the novel Labyrinth of Evil: Dooku didn't blame the Sith for killing Qui-Gon, he blamed the Jedi for getting him killed. And when Sidious "explained" himself to Dooku, Dooku believed had found a like mind who shared his views, and came to regard Qui-Gon's death as a necessary evil.
I don't know why I was worried that Marek would win. You always approach these duels so well. I liked The Force Unleashed, but God I hate Starkiller fanboys. Dooku was a master duelist, a proficient user of Dun Moch, a precise and powerful force user. The Force Unleashed novel, which since game mechanics should NEVER BE CONSIDERED CANON has the more accurate depiction of Marek's abilities, shows a potentially powerful, but ultimately amateur Force User. Having powerful AOE attacks does not make you a Force God -.-" I just.. I've grown to hate this character, and it really is not the fault of the writers. Granted he was pretty bland when you get down to it, but not hateable. Darth Tyranus stomps the young upstart
Marek beats Vader but can't beat Dooku whom vader beat before even reaching his max potential. You can't say "Marek looses because I don't like him". Thats as much of a joke as this videos results.
+Hikou72 You're using ABC logic. That is a flawed method. One fight does not determine skill set. Look at Dooku's skill set, you'll see that he emerges as a clear victor. The Force Unleashed... Was a mess of a game. Fun, but misleading. Pre-prime Vader is not necessarily stronger than Anakin Skywalker pre-cybernetics. Listen, I didn't dislike The Force Unleashed, it just wasn't very representative of the various skill sets of Force users. Mainly because Lucas had a heavy hand in it, and he likes to ignore the EU.
Didact13 I agree that the force unleashed was pretty ridiculous and its good for it to be non canon. I'm just stating thst if there was a guy who could pull a stsr destroyer out of the sky, beat Vader, and fight Sidious he would have beaten someone like Dooku. But yeah I still loved The Force Unleashed although ridiculous. It was just good fun to be super powerful.
Hikou72 Did not pull a Star Destroyer out of the sky, he redirected it. Sidious was toying with him, it was pre-prime Vader so it wasn't that impressive. I enjoyed the game. I have the Ultimate Sith Edition steelbook, snagged it for 15 bucks.
If you played the game, Starkiller did more damage to Vader than Luke could've ever done to him. And no Sidious did not toy with him. You can clearly see he protects himself and orders guards to help him.
This battle should've been over before it started. Galen defeated Vader AND the Emperor while injured and fighting off a bunch of assohles before inbetween and sometimes during both fights. Galen is the clear winner.
kylo ren Galen couldn't keep up with them? Says who? He never fought Yoda or Windu. As I said before he defeated the two most powerful Sith single handed along with a ton of minor force users and soldiers. Dooku wouldn't stand a chance.
Galen only beat Vader not sidious, and if Galen ever did fight yoda or windu, he would surely be beaten. dooku is also par with Darth sidious in lightsaber combat
kylo ren He just finished fighting a ton of guys and beating Darth Vader, he obviously wasn't at 100% and he still almost defeated him. He could definitely defeat him 1v1.
While I agree with your assessment of their lightsaber skills, I do believe that Marek wins in force abilities. Dooku has always needed a break from combat to properly use his powers while Marek does not. At the same time, marek's ability to channel telekinetic surges into the ground would probably catch Dooku off-guard (given that it broke through the defences of Vader as seen in the game) and one second is all Marek needs to win (again shown against Vader)
Alexzander1989 As much as I'd love to see that, I think Dooku takes that one. At least if we're talking a saber-to-saber duel and not a contest of Force powers. The Count has honed Makashi to such a level that he made Grievous look basic (and that was not the dumbed down Grievous of TCW). Kun's fancy saberstaff and changes in form aren't going to throw Dooku off much and Kun tends to be prone to the kind of defensive lapses that Dooku can easily recognize and take advantage of. Old age and treachery wins out in the end.
wristofkings I think the thing that makes a match between these two interesting to me, is that both are high calibur duelists who's entire MO is to avoid predictability. Both have specialized weapons that bolster their fighting techniques. Both are powerful Force users, yet they go down different paths. Kun being a sorcerer, and Dooku is more of a focused powerhouse. Kun's saberstaff is very much unique to him, and I would be interested to see how Dooku combats it. Dooku is older, but Exar Kun is very much a glass cannon. And I am interested to see how Dooku's and Kun's force powers stack up against each other and in terms of penetrating the others defenses. Aaaaand how Dooku contends with Kun's sith amulets and blasts of dark side energy I do think Dooku is the more skilled overall swordsman, but I don't think he's contended with something like Kun's saberstaff or his tendencies of changing his blade length and power settings in the midst of combat. I do think Dooku has a good chance of winning, but I still want to see this fight play out
All great points. I'm on Team Dooku, but all the same Jensaarai, Evan, Antoine etc. would have plenty to analyze in this contest. I'll add that if it came down to the Force powers, Kun walks all over Dooku but I've noticed that he's very selective in when and how he applies them (kind of odd for a Niman specialist); while Dooku has managed to integrate lightning and TK into his fighting style with relative ease. I'm not sure how good Kun is at defending against users of Dooku's caliber, though killing Odan Urr (or however you spell it) almost casually after tanking his Force shove is an impressive feat regardless.
wristofkings I think it would be a fair and interesting contest and one I am most interested in seeing, especially after Jensaarai's last two versus matches
Yeah, I think people judge him over the game and possibly the comic, without even touching the novel, which is the canon version of events. Galen is very powerfull, but he was trained purely as a blind weapon for Vader, his skill with the dark side was far limited compared to the Sith Lords. He'd put up a good fight against Dooku, but it would inevitably lead to his demise, no matter how hard he'd push.
Obviously Dooku. The Force and Saruman's spells are both basically magic. I'm pretty sure Saruman would avoid close contact with Dooku since he has a lightsaber. So it would come to between who is more powerful, Dooku in the force. Or Saruman in magic? For me I'd say Dooku.
THANK you on the realist analysis of Galen Marek…. The ONLY reason Starkiller was “so powerful” is because he was a VIDEOGAME character in a skill tree style game. And you had to be ABLE to BEAT the game on hard. That’s it…. I cannot stand when people try to use the “but he ripped a star destroyer out of the sky!” argument.. He did not.. ALL he did was redirect a star destroyer that was literally already on fire and crashing down towards the surface; all he did was redirect its course..... Which, was basically the SAME thing Anakin did when he landed the Invisible Hand (which was also moving infinitely faster).. We’d already seen that done; and Anakin was actually IN the ship, and had to basically lift it back up by the nose as it was streamlining toward the planet fast as shit before setting it back down “softly” to cushion their landing. Skywalker’s feat was more impressive. Like I said, Galen Marek is insanely overrated. Possibly the most overrated character in Star Wars.
Read the Novelization. Dude can grab flying Tie Figthers out of the sky and chuck them at people. Count Dooku crumbles when between a rock and a hard place; Galen is that rock.
Please do more narrative verdicts. It's great to hear how it would go down and not just who would win. Putting it in an actual scenario but changing out one opponent was also a cool concept. I'd suggest sometime in the future getting a good artist to illustrate parts of it, as while I got most of the moves, it would be very interesting to see them illustrated.
***** both marek and dooku are top teir. but this guy has made it clear he hates the EU and more than that he has said repeatedly he hates star killer most of all
a great video, but i really feel like you really didnt give enough credit to star killer. i mean, he brought down a god damn battle cruiser! dooku never did that.
+Matthew Zumbo Bring down? No. The ship was coming down. He was able to use the force to redirect it, though. Still a good feat, but not as good as the one you've implied here.
You do truly great analysis. That's why it's so obvious when you're doing a slanted analysis. When you think someone is overrated you spend your entire analysis exploiting their weaknesses and overstating the strengths of their opponent. Shame because I would love to see an unbiased analysis of this duel.
People really over-estimate Galen Marek, mainly because of how Vader and Palpy talk about his potential. But he’s not really a top tier fighter. He’s a threat to any top tier fighter he meets, but not overtly superior. But you have to remember, Marek was powerful and advanced enough to be a credible threat to Dooku before he was 20. Dooku has been a master for as long as Galen has been alive, which is part of why Dooku wins the fight. But it’s a credit to just how talented Marek was. At his theoretical max potential, Marek would probably end up an equal to the likes of Kyo Durron. But he never lived to see that potential realized.
@@kingofthings7929 Overestimating the dude that defeated multiple Jedi Masters, each with their own different specialties and tactics, defeated Vader twice, and fought the Emeror to a standstill?......against an old man who only uses one lightsaber form and got his ass handed to him by a group of (dumb) pirates? K.
I agree with the verdict. A talented amateur versus a true master of the force. Dooku is clearly better than Galen in every aspect other than physical strength. Galen's victory over Vader was no justification to his skill. Vader was far from his prime and took the fight far too lightly, vastly expending his reserves unnecessarily. If Vader was fully focused, it wouldn't even be a fight.
Calm Down Vader intended to finish the duel quickly and thats why he opened the duel with power blows that failed to overwhelm Galen. Vader appeared disinterested and underestimated Galen in their fight. Trying your best means nothing if your mind and focus is not there in the fight.
It's crazy to say that he can't break the force wall of other force adepts when he does in every boss battle after he has wounded and tired out his opponent. Even the count needed to open up his opponents before he broke their force wall.
Game mechanics =/= novelization And actually no, play the game again, you can't attack directly either Kota or the Shadow Guard without throwing stuff at them first.
They feel that they were betrayed to some degree. I was upset at first too until I realized that the EU was ultimately flawed via the tier system. To me it seems like Disney is actually going to attempt to make Star Wars a cohesive universe rather than what we saw with the EU. Most of the people who are opposed to the complete retcon will be over it in a year or two.
VSX0021OmegaGundam From what I remember, Disney decided to look through all of the EU to see what should and should not be considered canon. However even then there's no guarantees that all things EU will disappear or be retconned. Even when it comes to the more ridiculous stuff like the space rabbit from the Marvel Star Wars comics, even that got a little skeleton of the same species appearing in an episode of the CG Clone Wars cartoon. In the end though I would myself argue that the majority of it that can fit into canon probably can be accepted. I was always a little iffy on how large a scale the whole Yuuzhan Vong war went...
This guy just hates marek. Just because the book doesn't say he did certain powers he used in the games means nothing. The book isn't default superior to a game. Lightsaber combat wise I'd agree Dooku would win. Force powers wise I think Galen would just overwhelm Dooku.
The game makes people think that Galen is capable of crazy shit when in truth Galen had raw power with the force he did not live up to his full potential
Yes the book is canon over the game. The games were secondary canon and the books were above that. And remember video game depictions of characters re not canon. With the games the story, events and characters didn't happen in the way it was played.
+Ben engledow Of the multiple Star Wars versus series creators on UA-cam, Jensaarai is one of the few that sing The Force Unleashed's praises and advocate for Marek as a character.
How can Dooku beat Galen when he defeated darth Vader when he was injured and Anakin defeated Dooku in episode 3 and darth Vader is far stronger than Dooku and also Galen defeated the emperor and Dooku is nowhere near powerful as the emperor and Galen could of killed him but spared him instead.
Well here's the thing. Styles make fights. Let's say this, okay? Say boxer A loses a fight to boxer B, and boxer B loses to boxer C. This doesn't mean boxer A doesn't stand a chance of beating boxer C, because you need to take into account how one beat the other, how ones style counters another, how ones advantages play into the other's disadvantages. While I agree Marek would win, the "he'd lose cuz he lost to a guy who he beat" argument is idiotic.
that was an obvious outcome because marek was more trained to battle whole armies, killing many people in a small time. while dooku was clearly the duellist, so comparing them in a duell is actually pointless
Ummmmm… Starkiller literally could put out waves of telekinesis that disintegrated enemies (as shown in the SWFU I trailer). You call his force powers weak, but he could also do things like catch Tie fighters mid flight. His power was explosive, described in the novelizations as threatening to tear his body apart as he would charge up certain abilities. Your basis of “unable to deal with even basic force defense” is flawed, as most video games with force users employ a similar mode of defense, so as to keep players from 1 hit KOing bosses. He pulled a massive ship out of orbit an then kept it from smashing him to bits as it crash landed! He’s was literally denied being made canon because he was too over powered! You do him a great disservice in the force powers section.
The games were confirmed to be exagerrated and only partly canon. Just like with SWOTOR, the TFU novel is in Legends the canon verion of events. And there Starkiller's feats are much more grounded. But he is still very powerfull. Not as skilled as Dooku though, Tyranus has a narrow win mkre often than not imo.
+Romeo Campo Because there were several outside factors that let Anakin win against Dooku... Besides the lightsaber tactics used by vader, starkiller and dooku are similar but not the same.. I prefer Galen more for the win too but only cause I feel like his powers were never truly measured.. I would assume that if the guy whom almost killed Palpatine alone.. Well he would most likely be able to defeat Dooku.. But complete honesty and truth.. It could go either way..
+Romeo Campo Galen barely bested Vader in the book which was the actual canon until they threw out the EU. Galen won because 1 he understood how Vader would attack as Vader had trained him. 2 Vader's cybernetics were weak to lightning. None of which Galen has against Dooku. Dooku would best Galen rather easily.
+Josh Campbell I don't agree to that.. Darth Sidious had a tough time to take him down.. Yeah granted he weakened Vaders cybernetics or mech with lightning.. He couldn't do that against Dooku but considering his age.. He is young and fast.. He might get a shot in at any moment.. Dooku would possibly win but never easily..
Leotrim Krenzi Read the book. Galen threw some debris at him and he fell down playing possum. All he wanted was for Galen to turn to the darkside. Marek had the potential to surpass Vader but that wasn't tapped yet.
Here's how I think it would go down. I'll make a few things clear first, though: Just because Galen uses three forms instead of one, does NOT mean he is a jack of all trades. He seems to have put extra time into Shien and Juyo, a form which you need to be good at at least one other style to properly utilize, probably Ataru for Galen based on the acrobatics he sometimes pulls off. Second, Galen has technically fought Dooku(and defeated) before thanks to PROXY. So he can defeat a duelist of significant Makashi skill, though PROXY can't replicate Dooku's skill 100% accurately. Third, Galen has proven himself capable of defeating opponents that by this logic should have killed him in minutes. Fourth, Dooku is arrogant, and that's a weakness. Fifth, Galen has some degree of unarmed combat skill. The fight would open like you said, cautiously, but that's where it ends. Galen would strike first, of course. Dooku would defect or dodge his Juyo assault, however, Galen is moving fast enough that he would have a degree of difficulty getting an opening to strike back. He would eventually throw a container at Galen's back, getting himself some breathing room to counterattack. Galen would fall back on Soresu, but would resort to a Force push. Dooku's barrier holds up well, though he is staggered a touch. Galen takes the momentary break and retreats, throwing a container at Dooku which the older man catches and returns to Marek. Galen slices it in half. He then attacks with a bit of lightning. Dooku blocks it with his hand, and sends it back at Galen. Galen stops the worst of it, but he is forced backwards onto the ground. Dooku moves in for the kill. He's about to kill Galen with a thrust, but then Marek uses a Force repulse. Caught off guard by the powerful and rarely seen technique, Dooku is sent flying. He maneuvers in the air to land on his feet, and says he's suprised Galen has lasted this long. Galen sees the large pillar which originally was used by Dooku to distract Yoda while he escaped. He grabs it with the Force, and ripping it from its place, has it fly at Dooku like a giant club. Dooku stops it, and Galen is using the window to charge. Dooku brings up his weapon and gracefully deflects the attack, dropping the pillar and engaging saber to saber once more. Eventually, he cuts the emitter off of Galen's saber, and scores two glancing blows while he's at it. Rather than halting in pain as Tyranus expected, Galen outright punches the Count in the gut, winding him. Starkiller grabs Dooku's saber hand, and breaks his wrist. Tyranus' hand reflexively drops his weapon, which Galen grabs. One swipe later, it's over.
Jen this why I like you. Many people hate on Masters like Dooku. But He was a true master of his time. Misguided perhaps but a Master none other You do a great service in explaining The Count and his admirable merits.
Wow really well done man. I rarely watch a 40 minute video that’s just a slideshow and a guy talking. Great job and I completely agree with your analysis
He didn't. Not at all. You propably mean his supposed victory in the game. The game is Secondary Canon. The novel is the true canon (and the comic book) And there it's clear Palpatine faked it. He was impressed by Galen's power, saw the only other chance of creating what Vader was meant to be, so he wanted to turn him at all cost, even if it came to striking him down. Shaak Ti partly let Galen win as well. Vader lost only cause Starkiller knew his Master's tactics and techniqe. Overall, Starkiller has unimaginable raw power, he was more powerfull than Dooku but he was also much less skilled, even with the additional abilities Vader taught him to use. He really isn't that impressive, he was just meant to be a powerfull weapon against Palpatine which he never even became. Vader didn't even train him as a Sith apprentice. Dooku wins.
Count Dooku, a true interdependence - is the mutual reliance between two or more groups. In relationships, interdependence is the degree to which members of the group are "mutually, not forced" in relationship.
Rest in peace Christopher. We will never forget you. :')
@@dragonballtalk8527 Rip mace windu, he was thrown 50 feet
@@generalgrievous4722 rip Snoke, he died like a little bitch.
Yes chrstophee will be removed as ,legend
Absolutely, Christopher was a class act
R.I.P. Sir Christopher Lee (1922-2015)
You take the Legends as Canon and Disney's work as merely 'a certain point of view'. I applaud you sir!
And may Christopher Lee rest in peace
Legends is old canon. Disney labeled the EU books that are considered old canon as Legends. And dubbed them the Legends canon. So yeah it's canon but a separate canon. Disney is simply rebooting the franchise with a new canon which TCW and Rebels are apart of. But Legends is an old canon meaning the original canon. Any book marked Legends are books that don't contradict the movies and were already deemed canon. So Disney called it the Legends canon. So Star Wars has two canons. One old and the other one being a new reboot. The Legends canon and New canon.
John Reeves As so many have shown, older is better. But I won't whine needlessly. Can't undo what has been done
NeidalRuekk Well either way the Legends continuity is the original continuity. Which is why Disney called it old canon. So the name Legends canon.
+John Reeves I wish sometime in the future they keep writing for the Legends canon, that's the main reason people were pissed about the New continuity.
kartrix1 Had the Thrawn trilogy never been written, or the 90s games not been made, it's possible there would have been no drive to make the prequels
"Considering what it took to finally kill the bastard."
That line never fails to make me smile.
Dooku is so under appreciated as both a character and in terms of power
Agreed.
I also agree
When you pick and mix your own complementary style and raise it to a high degree like Marek rather than focus on a single style like Duku that does not necessarily mean you are a jack of all trades and not a master of one. No it could also mean you are a master of your own personal style that simply draws inspiration and elements from existing schools.
Anony Mash As Bruce Lee once put it: “Absorb what is useful, Discard what is not, Add what is uniquely your own..." I think this perfectly describes how a TRUE Battlemaster should approach combat.
While Galen is no Battlemaster, I think he took this principle to heart and made something out of it.
However, interesting point to bring up might be the Makashi doctrine of practical efficiency- Form II emphasizes discarding the ineffective elements and specializing the technique to fit the practitioner. So it could be said that Dooku was no less versatile than a Battlemaster, he simply personalized his single method rather than trying to learn several forms.
Or one could say that form two is not a true form in and of itself but a school of combat that requires the student to personalize their own form; much like form seven in that respect.
I can see what you are saying but I would say that he was not as versatile as Qui gon jin for example not because of a limitation of the form but because he refused to go beyond his own comfort zone.
Anony Mash I never thought to compare it to Form 7, interesting! It's ironic that Dooku championed the practice of a single form, but chose a form that emphasized customization. In terms of versatility, I'll qualify by saying that it's impossible to make a blanket statement about specialists vs hybrids, this is more my personal observations.
I regard Dooku's swordmanship as far superior to that of Qui-Gon or Marek. Prior to his defection, Dooku's only equals were Mace Windu and Yoda- both specialists who employed forms 7 and 4. Throughout the war, Dooku quite handily defeated scores of Jedi, and was only brought down by a combination of Anakin's application of Djem So and Darth Sidious's interference. To me, this is an indicator that Dooku *does* possess a large degree of versatility, as his only equals were individuals of equal or greater power who specialized in a single lightsaber form.
I don't mean to diminish hybrid styles at all- they have been proven to be quite effective, I just have yet to see an application that can compete with top-tier specialists. Perhaps an argument could be made for Kyle Katarn or Darth Vader?
I rather suspect that the series uses top tier duelists to showcase or introduce the forms. I also suspect that is one of the ways they visually inform us about the character; a narative tool if you will.
I do want to see more variety in the new cannon.
One thought though; an additional vulnerability of miashi:
Light pikes. The two handed spear or glaive stance gets you almost overwhelming reach, a massive advantage in terms of leverage and the ability to launch rapid fire stabbing attacks from head to toe. You also have a huge amount of surface area to parry with.
A guy with a saber against a guy with a pike will always be at a disadvantage except in extreme close quarters and enclosed spaces. This isn't helped by the fact that the spear is inherently a much more user frendly weapon to learn with, perhaps the very easiest weapon to begin with. When you are still learning how not to cut yourselft in half with you sabre the guy with the pike is already battle ready and mastering more complex forms. Less than a week compared to over a year to get the basics down.
Mikashi is particularly screwed because it struggles against blast deflection (and it will feel like you are going against an automatic blaster if the spearman has his way) and it depends on darting footwork against a longer reach. Also the amount of mass and leverage you are going up against will make the usual parries extremely difficult to pull off.
Now on the other hand a Wookie Mikashi master with a light pike would be a terrifying opponent for pretty much anyone to face. IT amps up the strength of the style and mitigates its weaknesses; just don't depend on it for blast deflection and you will be fine.
Great great great matchup man. I've waited a long time to see this video and you did not disappoint!
EvanNova95 I'm kind of curious as to when we'll see more great work out of you. You do such great vs series videos. I've been wondering what kind of matchups you can create, since there's so many options left.
James Ellison I plan to start Versus Series Season 5 by the end of this month.
EvanNova95 Alright thanks. Just an idea for a matchup: Githany vs Lumiya. It occured to me after I originally commented that this has yet to be done, as far as I know.
Here's hoping to see Jerec and/or his Seven Dark Jedi make an appearance. Or even Mother Talzin.
EvanNova95 can you do darth maul vs darth malgus, i know someone that said maul would win but i think malgus would win.
Darth Krayt vs Exar Kun......the Radical and the Unorthodox
That would be a fucking exceptional match-up
Krayt smashes him
@@thordgensec Yes. Reborn Krayt wrecks Kun. So does FOTJ Krayt. Vector Krayt loses.
@@thordgensec Vector Krayt lost to Karness Muur who was same level as Kun
@@thordgensec Krayt didn't do anything against Muur
static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/12/124590/4589293-muurdrainskrayt.jpg
Not sure I would consider Marek the 'inferior' swordsman. His use of Juyo may be more controlled, but given the style's proclivities, that is an accomplishment in and of itself, and also makes him similarly unpredictable to the Count. I also suspect it may be a contradictory notion to say the Count would try to press in closer in lightsaber combat: faster, stronger, and more skilled opponents have tried to do this to Marek and failed.
I also personally feel one of the Count's most significant weaknesses, the one that truly killed him, is being overlooked: his staggering arrogance.
I'm sorry but if Galen can kick Vader's ass, a swordsman and force user much better than Dooku, there's no way he would lose to Dooku.
Note Anakin had help from Obi Wan from the beginning of the fight so it was not like Anakin fought Dooku one on one from the beginning yeah.
@@matthewmann8969 no but honestly he may as well have. Dooku removes Obi-wan from the fight by himself seemingly with no problem at all and in the novelization Palpatine specifically tells Dooku to hold back against Anakin and turn him to the dark side but also to kill Obi-wan.
This means Dooku likely could have killed Obi-wan anytime he wanted and only Anakin gave him a challenge, and eventually overcame him.
@@MrEffectfilmsIf there fight started out one on one from the start, start up, or starting then I would say Anakins winning over Dooku was legitametely his and his alone just like how Windu fought Sidious with three other Jedi Masters with him not by himself from the very forefront yeah.
I’m just pointing out that Marek’s first style was probably Form 5: Shien, hence the reverse grip as his main opening
It was that’s why he uses the grip it’s what he’s most comfortable with
@@WolvyBlk it’s a solid opening style, blaster redirection till he can get in close
Dooku is and always will be one of my favorite Sith Lords of all time along with Malak, Sion, Malgus, Vader, and Marka Ragnos. I will always root for Dooku win or lose!
Long live the Sith
His form 2 makashi is so clean the opening part of the obi/ani vs dooku where he is spinning around deflecting every attack swiftly and wasting no movement
Count Dooku, I argue is probably one of the most underrated Sith/characters within Star Wars. To be fair, I can understand why. Despite Christopher Lee portraying the role, Lucas made Dooku(and the rest of the cast) seem incredibly stupid/ dull. Yet, in Legends I found myself liking Dooku, especially during Yoda Dark Rendezvous and the ROTS novelization.
I'd honestly love to, if I ever had a chance to write a book, decide to write a book about Dooku. Specifically, about his younger years when he joined the Jedi order. I'd love to explore his relationship between him and Yoda, along with Qi-Gon. And also how Dooku became such a gifted swordsman.
Some could argue this seems fruitless as we'll already know Dooku's conclusion, but if the Han Solo Trilogy by A.C Crispin taught me anything, it is that you can tell compelling stories even if they have a predestined conclusion. And that's something as I'm not the biggest Han Solo fan.
Dooku is underrated by some, but not all. Most fans know Sidious is the reason Dooku lost to Anakin, but Dooku was not a character Lucas up-played and so he never got a strong fanbase. He is interesting, and I think a novel about him would serve SW fans well. I also think Windu is the same type of character...many believe him overrated, but I disagree.
Dooku is more overrated than underrated to be fair.
Sidious: I've got bad news, dooku. It seems my sith apprentice killed your apprentice. =( Those damn Sith!! Wanna be my new sith apprentice? =D
Yeah, why not? :D
Yo dawg I heard my apprentice killed your apprentice but your apprentice's apprentice killed my apprentice so you wanna be my new apprentice?
This literally proved my point that if dooku had the intention of killing anakin and wasn’t tired he would’ve defeated anakin in 3
Nope
He has fatigued from 1v2 him and kenobi and had to lavishly spend his reserves to remove him from the fight , fatigued taunting and not trying to kill anakin , and the fact the anakin was form 5 specialist added to his defeat. In fact it was stated in the novels that he managed to meet all of anakins strikes while all of this was happening so if he had the intention to kill he could have.
@@Mr.MacMan yes, we’ve seen him do the same thing with ease in the clone wars season 6 a week before the movie takes place
Nah I don't see how Galen would lose to Dooku since he had practiced all forms since he was training as a child and knows all the weaknesses of each form. Dooku only uses one most of the time. Not only that but he was a prodigy when it came to using the force in different applications.
Dooku is also trained in and knows all forms since a child and knowing more styles does not make you a better fighter. And Galen is no amazing master with the saber who knows how to beat anyone, Dooku is a far more skilled and experienced fighter. Galen has not used any force ability that Dooku either hasn't used or seen.
dooku got his force shield broken by savage oppress and force choked to death along with ventress. And not to mention that starkiller was able to pull a star destroyer out of the sky. Was dooku able to do that I don't think so.
xXDeathMetalThrasherXx he redirected it. Still though, just gripping a star destroyer and pulling it down is a feat that is incredibly impressive and cannot be overlooked at all.
I like your videos and i'm not saying anything about the outcome of this versus but i still think you underestimated Starkiller a little bit. How come his force repulse wasn't even mentioned while discussing force powers. Dude could turn multiple targets in ashes..literally. Can't remember Dooku doing that.
***** Galen Marek's telekinetic attacks would at least stagger the Count, which would be enough for Marek to gain a tactical advantage. Galen would exploit this advantage as he is no reckless fighter.
Dooku is more tactical than Galen and has way more experience. Also based on what you said why wouldn't/couldn't Dooku do the same as he more honed abilities than Galen.
***** Well, it is Starkiller's ability fair enough. But i can't agree that Dooku would've blocked his repulse so easily. Honestly if hit i doubt he would be able to block it at all. This is about Starkiller not Galen Marek so i don't have anything against the outcome of the video.
***** Yeah I was kind of thinking of the outcome and saying to my self that it was correct but if starkiller from TFU2 replaced Galen then this would have been alot closer.
***** So there are the versatile but weak versus the strong and inflexible? That's it, there is no one that breaks that stupid convention!
Hm... First the _real_ Darth Maul beats Galen, now it's Lord Tyranus' turn. Not bad.
I wonder why PROXY wasn't given a Tyranus training module. Would've been nice to see him use it against Galen.
DarthWill3 There are two possible reasons why Vader considered it unnecessary.
1. Perhaps he actually believed he did defeat Dooku, and thought that if he could do it in his young foolish days, it would be no problem for Galen.
2. Maybe he didn't believe Training against a Makashi Master wasn't needed, since it was such a Rare Form to see.
josiah jenks And let's not forget Asajj Ventress. She would've made such an awesome training module. Two curved-hilt lightsabers that can be made into a double-bladed one... I mean, that would've been so unpredictable!
DarthWill3 It's Assajj Ventress. She has a good Theory on Fighting. She just doesn't have a Good Grip on Battling. While she was a Challenge for Mace ONCE, she still got Crushed by Anakin, Humiliated by Obi Wan, was equally matched with Wimpy Disney Canon Grevious, failed to Defend against Ahsoka's Offense, and Lost to Plo Koon when He had a BROKEN ARM.
*Though I will give her credit for obliterating Luminara Unduli.*
josiah jenks
No, I spelled it right.
Come on, she wasn't that bad.
DarthWill3 I know you spelled it right. I was saying it like Yeah, it's Ventress, no one really powerful.
And yes, she wasn't too bad. But these shortcomings and failures force me to see her in a Bad Light.
*Though I was somewhat kind to her by not mentioning the time she lost to Dooku when he was only partially awake, under a Drug that dulled his senses, and she had two other Nightsisters with her.*
Disagree with the verdict. You made it seem like Marek couldn't break Dooku's Force shield, which he already did against Vader. Starkiller not being able to penetrate the Sith Acolytes is a game mechanic...
I don't think a passive Force shield would defend against Marek's considerable power.
Wollf Myth if you're bringing Dooku's ability to bring down a bridge and small ship into this, then you should also consider Starkiller's ability to bring down an entire Star Destroyer. Just sayin'.
It's still an incredible feat though. imagine how much kinetic force was behind that Destroyer
Galen was powerful, but not top-tier. Sidious was top-tier.
***** You mean Suited Vader was a shadow of Pre suited Vader at the time. Anakin and Vader even the Pre suited ones where different Identities sure they where both arrogant but Anakin was much more focused then Vader was and I am referring to both the Pre suit Anakin and Pre suit Vader. And yes Sidious was toying with both Marek and Maul and Savage the part in the deleted scene where Maul broke through Sidiouses force shield was just ridiculous unless Sidious let it happen the same way he allowed Windu to kick him in the face.
Those Mask of Zorro tracks fit Dooku perfectly.
Man I like how he uses EU like its canom again. Great job Man U get a like and sub for making my day.
*Canon* stupid auto correct.
@@MindedJewel canon will always be worse
@@generalgrievous4722Canon BAD!!!!! EU GOOD!!!!! Upvotes to the left!!!!!
Galen Marek really has an extremely polarized fanbase.
Kinda like Darth Bane.
Very true.
marinus18 Yeah, they tend to overpower and overrate/hype him SO much. I seriously know people who legitimately think Galen/Starkiller is the most powerful Jedi/Sith/Force User EVER in existence...lmfao at that.
Justin Yatsko
He fought against 2 jedi knights and 1 jedi master and struggled against all 3. Darth Vader even specifically says that Kazden Paratus is stronger in the force than Galen is. Also it's heavily hinted that Ramn Kota is a superior duelist and that Shaak Ti is superior in both.
Rahm Kota was a master actually and a Jedi general. Kazdan was considered more powerful then Galen at the time but Galen was confirmed to have grown in power throughout the events of TFU. Shaak was a Council member. Rahm and Galen stalemated and Shaak only did as well as she did because of numerous circumstances in her favor.
Finally, some justice for Dooku! It's nice to see a level-headed appraisal of Starkiller's abilities.
His abilities were that great. Only second to the emperor...A reason the emperor wanted him as his new apprentice to replace Vader. But he sacrificed himself...even Yoda didn't do that.
@@schwiftycats No, not even close. Galen Marek was not as skilled a lightsaber master as Vader, his Force abilities were less varied and developed than Vader's, and he was no genius strategist or tactician. He was about on par with the likes of Darth Maul at worst, or Anakin Skywalker at best. He was good, and possessed potential. He never achieved it. The only reason he bested Vader was because he was intimately familiar with Vader's weaknesses, and spammed them. The only way he blocked Palpatine's Lightning was due to a partial Oneness with the Force. He was skilled, and had potential, but he punched above his weight-class several times. Shaak Ti gave him his victory out of pity, Vader wasn't at his best, and Sidious was playing with his food, and was only surprised that he deflected his lightning. Galen Marek was skilled, but he wasn't that skilled.
@@austinkersey2445 Here is a video from a popular UA-camr known as Seth the programmer who has been known for being quite knowledgeable in putting up fights against fictional characters such as Star Wars. m.ua-cam.com/video/5J0cCy7H5WE/v-deo.html
He puts Galen Marak on top of dooku in terms of tiers and I think he does justice in proving it right. The time stamp for dooku’s tier is 15:15
The time stamp for Galen marak tier is 17:33
@@MemesCreed I know. I disagree with it immensely, even though he makes a good enough case. Galen is just not as developed as Dooku, he is not as skilled, and his power does not make enough of a difference to even it out. He would be a threat to Dooku, but he would not overcome him. His telekinesis is less refined, his telepathy is virtually nil, and his lightning is his only real surprise when he runs it along his blade. He isn't bringing anything to the table that the good Count can't counter. Marek is capable, for instance, I would say he could beat Legends Ventress or Kit Fisto. That's about where he caps out in my opinion. He could have been more had he lived longer, but he didn't.
@@austinkersey2445 okay I’ll try to go too all your points. While you are correct that dooku is more experienced this also came with age and so kinda slowed down the count needing to exert more force power to contend with the likes of obi wan and anakin at the same time which was stated that the reason he lost was because, anakin used form 5 combat (which Galen also uses) but also he was just to tired to compete. Also to say Galen marak isn’t at least close to skilled is dooku is a bit of a downplay this is the person who was trained by Vader the second most powerful person in the galaxy only below plapatine his entire life who even you can not doubt can destroy dooku. Now as for his force abilities not being strong again even at a young age when Vader was going to kill Galen’s father he said and I quote “where is your master?” Because he sensed someone much stronger than the father(which was Galen). Also on top of that his fight with Vader should prove his force powers can contend with Vader as am pretty sure I saw a scene in the fight where he ragdolled Vader into a wall. Also he was considered a revolutionary force user because not only did he have the lighting blade but a another force ability no one not even luke had access which was the giant ball of electricity he lets out in his ultimate which you can see in his trailer even I don’t know how dooku could counter that. Let’s not even mention the fact that another reason he won the Vader fight was because, he was much faster than him also that the Vader he fought was comparable to yoda which if I remember correctly forced dooku to run retreat.
I like how Jensaarai doesn't underestimate Dooku and knows that Sidious ordered Dooku to lose against Anakin
He was ordered to take it easy and surrender which he did take it easy at 1st but he tried towards the end once anakin started using the darkside but that overwhelmed him. Dooku is one of the best duelist and very powerful but anakin kept getting closer to beating him through the war and the darkside gave him a boost in power. In the novel for ROTS dooku even said anakin was the best form 5 duelist he’d ever seen
As a heavy fan of both Dooku and anakin/vader I got to say you have it 100% right. At the beginning Dooku was supposed to pick on and Bully Anakin into joining the sith. But once Dooku who saw, that that boy's good, he had to go all out even drawing on the dark side to keep up. By the end he was just straight up defeated. It was a good scrap
Ye, if there was no intervention Dooku may have earned a quick victory over Skywalker.
Disney continuity.... Like there is such a thing with them xD cant follow a straight road without falling backwards
They can't even make up their mind about their trash continuity lol
25:04 I'm convinced that cursing makes Versus Videos better.
the real count dooku is dead.. RIP CHRISTOPHER LEE. thanks for entertaining us
I can't get behind the man that beat Vader losing to the man that lost to Anikin Skywalker.
in honor to a great man as christopher lee, i am loving this video due to how truly in depth you are getting into the specifics of both combatant. which is why i continue to come back. and this is so far the best versus video yet that i have seen
By the Dark Lords of the Sith, thank you for outright rejecting Disney.
This made my day; I feel that Galen Marek is such a Gary Sue, so overwhelming and strong and noble that the Force Unleashed series basically tried to make him the new, better Luke Skywalker. I'm glad to see you think that Dooku would still be able to handle him, despite the OPness to his character. :)
Read the novel which was considered the real canon depiction of the force unleashed story. He isn't that powerful in the novel. Starkiller is honestly overrated. His feats are also downplayed in the novel.
Dooku was a boss, one of my favorite Star Wars characters, easily my favorite Sith. Christopher Lee will always be a legend.
He looked sad as his hands were cut off before his head was cut off what a boss
Dark Rendezvous is canon. It's the origin story of Dooku. Disney said only the novels after the original trilogy are non-canon. Darth Bane and Pleagus are canon. They confirmed that. Meaning Path to Power and Darth Pleagus novel are canon. All the novels about them are canon. Plus Force Unleashed 1 is said to be canon. Not 2. Lucas said they are canon. And Disney can't just make them non- canon or the story would not make sense. The old republic is canon too. That is important to the story. Same with Bane and Pleagus. And the Darth Vader novels are canon because they take place during the great Jedi Purge. So that has to be canon. Disney again said only the EU after the Return of the Jedi are non-canon. Not the ones before it.
John Reeves Everything outside of the CW TV show, the films, and these recent books, are regarded as Legends.
LucasFilm, I believe, released a list of the chronology a few months ago, stating that the films, the Clone Wars and Rebels series, as well as the new novels this year, are the only things that are canon. Everything else was rebranded as Legends.
Disney who owns Star Wars has said only the CW TV show, Rebels, Films and all the newer Star Wars novels/comics are canon
Bluebird34 holo This is stuff is nothing. This happened about 2 years ago. The EU before was so convoluted.
Yep. The only changes that I REALLY disagree with were taking out the EU stuff that happened between the films, as well as stuff that happened just before Episode I. To be honest, I always felt that the Pre-Episode I stuff and the Post-Episode VI stuff did not resonate very well with the saga that George Lucas created. Granted, those two eras added an interesting element to the story, but it just didn't feel right. That's why I'm thankful that those two eras are no longer canon, and just Legends, especially Star Wars: Legacy. I know that I might get some flack for these statements, but I'm just putting my personal truth and opinions out there with the hope that they are treated with the respect that I treat everyone else's opinions about what is, in my opinion, the best fictional universe EVER.
R.I.P Count Dooku, Definitely one of my favourite Sith.
This was a match xD Count dooku is one of my favorite sith and you did him justice. Really great video and I agree with the outcome.
It's almost ironic how the description of Dooku's height went, considering that he was played by Christopher Lee who was the tallest professional actor alive (even more ironic is who took his place at his death, Liam Neeson).
R.I.P. Christopher Lee
Excellent. A focus on highly advanced and speculative levels on both the techical and tactical aspects of the characters, combined with excellently fitting background-music that easily blends into the video itself (especially the Microseries-clip with Dooku and Grievous).
I think this was one of your best videos. Great match up, great analysis, and despite your unfamiliarity with narrative endings, great ending!!
wait a second.... Vader>dooku, marvel>Vader, but dooku>marek?
+Mattae Weavs you said marvel and thats only because marek knew what darth vaders fighting styles and tactics were thats why marek won against vader if marek and vader had a duel of the fates and knew nothing about eachother vader would win
+burning ninja06 but also remember he took on palpatine right after whos was well above vader in my opinion showing how physically im shape he is fighting 2 sith lords in a row where as dooku was clearly winded after dualing obi wan and anakin in AOTC
but you have to remember palpatine's not physically in shape in terms of physical abilities but it is a good feat I would agree but he wasn't fighting palpatine it was more of a force battle plus he had 'died' anyways so
Tyler Knard and plus I think dooku was just toying with obi wan and anikan but in that battle in aotc I felt like dooku was one of those kids you tried to saber battle when you were 7 and all they did is try to stab you #cheapdooku #iforgottherewerehashtags
burning ninja06 he was clearly toying with obi wan no doubt but he clearly had a much harder time fighting anakin as he pushed a fast paced fight and sidious fought mace, maul and yoda not that long before the force unleashed, it would only be a few year difference, even if it was a force battle he clearly got the better of sid slamming him to the ground, he COULD have killed him but didn't so i still starkiller takes the fight
The videos are only getting better and better. Very well done especially the part about light-saber combat and technique.
Excellent matchup though not a hugely surprising outcome. Galen was an unpredictable Force-powered wrecking ball but I don't see him as having the level of finesse and experience to deal with one of the greatest combative duos in Jedi history (Obi Wan/Anakin), while Dooku routinely handled them with ease. It took masters on the tier of Yoda or Windu to really make the Count sweat (without outside interference or plot convenient stupidity of course). Well researched and enlightening as usual Jensaarai, I look forward to more.
If I may ask, based on Evannova's recent Vader v. Caedus showdown (personally don't entirely agree with Evan on his evaluation of Caedus but the final outcome was fair)--how well do you see the Count faring against the Solo turned Sith? My personal opinion is that Dooku would hand the young upstart a defeat, though not easily. Just curious on where you'd stand.
Dooku would crush him. Starkiller has more raw power but Dooku is more experienced, more skilled, more agile and probably better force user. Starkiller is probably the most overrated Star Wars character.
I agree on Starkiller. i like Galen but people overhype him just because of gameplay footage and mechanics.
Yah plus dooku is not stupid
Honestly, Dooku would probably take Marek as his apprentice. And to be fair, under Dooku's mentorship, they would probably beat Palpatine.
Given Dooku's approach to the dark side, I'm not sure if he would be able to wake the power within Galen to the point that Vader did. Dooku as you remember preffered a much more loose connection to the dark side and rellied more on his intelligence and lightsaber skills rather than raw power.
why dose everyone say Marek losses? he beat Darth Freaking Vader and stood up to the Emperor. I can see Star Killer not beating Doocu because his training wasn't to make him the best but I think Marek would have a better shot then that.
Read the novel he didn't really beat Palpatine at all. Don't use ABC logic.
@@ironinquisitor3656 he didnt say he beat him he stood up to him he held off his lightning something only Yoda has been seen doing
@@project_ronin4789 Yeah true. He stood for a few seconds but then got overwhelmed.
@@ironinquisitor3656 dookus lightning isnt half as strong and Vader also wasnt just a djem so specialist he added alot of mikashi and the hours of training marathons he did with vader I'm sure he would have picked up on mikashi plenty
@@project_ronin4789Darth vader also took elements from all forms into his Djem So style I believe.
Dooku and Galen are 2 characters ive always found interesting it's great to see someone use them both in a vs battle
we need a animation of the fight in the style of either tcw or tfu2 cut sences
While I'll contend that there are some truly staggering deficiencies with Marek's abilities, I think his inability to penetrate force shields, and likewise make one, was a game mechanic to prevent the player from rag dolling the bosses. But that's just my opinion.
Defeats his master. Stands toe to toe with his masters master. Manages to pull down star destroyer. Then after all these amazing feats he gets defeated by an eighty year old. What the actual fuck?
Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra
Well said.
I like Dooku a lot but I don’t think he would come out on top against Galen- but I think it would be a very fun match.
so starkiller losses because he's too versatile?? Seems legit.
+Kevin Wilson But if you watch his other vs videos, he'll say that somebody like yoda loses to vader because he's too much of a one trick pony with his ataru..SMH...
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra Your statement doesn't make any sense whatsoever. Yoda and Sidious were masters of each lightsaber style and were pretty much untouchable except for someone on their level which would only end as a stalemate. Would you say they were too wide spread as well. I highly doubt it. Having more tools to choose from in a toolbox is a whole lot better than having only a philips screwdriver no matter how good that screwdriver is.
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra I STILL think that knowing more than one style can trump just the one. If you were to pit a ufc fighter against a pure boxer, more times than not the ufc will win because they have more to draw on such as judo, jujitsu, grappling etc. Now if said ufc fighter chooses to fight and use only boxing as a technique, then the odds are in the boxer's favor. Can you see where im coming from? sorry if i sounded aggressive in my last statement.
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra not really since if the jack of all trade guy has the other guys weakness style than he will win
+Kyle messenger of pain/Darth Umbra taekwondo is weak with a style that target's the leg so..
..
I love your choice of Zorro's soundtrack in this video, it gave me goosebumps as you described Dooku's fighting style.
loved when you said that if you follow the disney continuity "you had best be on your way." -Golden man!
This is a focused, sourced, legitimate breakdown. Very impressive because it does not sugar coat either Character. Really excellent job for the community.
Dooku was not in his prime when he faced Anakin and he was disrupted by Palpatine...
A younger Dooku would I think may even have beaten Yoda! Of course he was a Jedi then...
I liked the Martial Breakdown of Makashi and Form 5 .... The best technically I have seen on UA-cam.
Jensaarai1 is turning into the acknowledged expert on the 7 Forms. A Martial Theorist that martial artists can learn from.
My main take-away question is:
You said that Dooku had studied how to beat the different Forms:
What is your technical ways he broke down each style?
How does each Form get overcome by Makashi?
I definitely have new respect for the deadliness of Dooku and Makashi and now want a Dooku movie! An old man rampage!!!!
I really don't understand when people just throw the "not in their prime" argument out there. Dooku became MORE deadly as he got older, not less. His age was a serious hurdle for him, but his skill increase massively overshadowed his body's decline.
@@unbelievablytrash9458 Yeah, I don't get this argument either. Dooku did lose physical attributes due to age, but his greater skill gained through consistent study, practice, and practical application made him all the more dangerous for it. He is even stated to be in great physical shape for his age, and is still more than capable as a hand-to-hand combatant. It's just that strength was never his style, as he used a dexterity-based form and thus focused on that attribute. He probably also put some time into honing his stamina and agility, as he does avoid or sidestep attacks rather than tank them, and he has some impressive staying power for a man in his mid-eighties by the time of his death. Point is, he was still plenty capable in the more physical aspects of combat, but he was never about direct confrontation. His lightsaber skill, immense power and skill in the Force, and ingenius strategic and tactical mind grant him an insane skill advantage against 99.99% of the Star Wars universe. Quite honestly, the only people who are definitively beating Dooku are the top ten Jedi of all time and the top five Sith. Even then, I think he can defeat at least members on either list.
My opinion on who those are is as follows:
Jedi:
1. Grandmaster Luke Skywalker
2. Yoda
3. Kyp Durron
4. Kyle Katarn
5. Jaina Solo Fel
6. Corran Horn
7. Mace Windu
8. Satele Shan
9. Cade Skywalker
10. Mara Jade Skywalker
Honorable Mentions: Nomi Sunrider, Revan, Kol Skywalker (he was a monster, but we don't have many feats besides the admittedly impressive few we have), An'ya Kuro, Shaak Ti, Plo Koon, Obi-Wan Kenobi, and Jaden Korr (potentially, especially if we got some more material with him)
Sith:
1. Darth Sidious
2. Darth Krayt
3. Darth Vitiate
4. Darth Malgus
5. Darth Bane/Darth Vader (I flip-flop on this all the time)
Honorable Mentions: Dooku/Darth Tyranus, Darth Revan, Darth Malak, Darth Plagueis, and Darth Traya
i disegre (spelling). starkiller is far more powerful then dooku
starkiller is SO overrated. In the novel of TFU which is canon over the game, he isn't that powerful and his feats are downplayed.
KING CODGAMING the fact that Niman doesn’t usually include Makashi, 1,3,4,5 but I don’t know if Marek’s training taught him proper defense against Makashi
Dooku. While Galen is stronger in the force, Dooku is smarter, more experienced, more masterful and more skilled.
I just wanted to say that you are my absolute favorite. I love all you videos, and the way you present the information has been a big help to me. I've been trying to learn as much as I can about star wars lately. you, grey jedi, and Evan nova have helped a lot .
Excellently done and I loved the use of Zorro's soundtrack. It embody's Dooku's fighting style and even his idealistic personality (Zorro having been an idealistic outlaw). Absolutely perfect description for a largely underrated character. I don't fully agree with the part about Anakin only winning because of Sidious' anger coaching on the side, as it only influenced Anakin's decision to kill Dooku, but everything else was bang on!
Good match, been a while since I saw a video from you, and I like your attempt at a narrative-style verdict like Antoine's videos. Here's a few matches that might be of interest to you:
1. Anakin Skywalker vs Darth Maul
2. Count Dooku vs Darth Bane
A couple of team battles that might be interesting below.. I know these take more time, but some inspiration for down the road perhaps:
1. Anakin Skywalker + Ahsoka Tano vs Count Dooku + Asajj Ventress (prior to betrayal), two master/student pairs that had an unfortunate end
2. Obi-Wan Kenobi + Anakin Skywalker vs Darth Bane + Darth Zannah, two powerful duos from their respective time periods
I like how no one will tell me how the hell!! Sidious convinced Count Dooku to join his side when his Apprentice killed Qui-Gon Jinn.
It's actually explained in the novel Labyrinth of Evil: Dooku didn't blame the Sith for killing Qui-Gon, he blamed the Jedi for getting him killed. And when Sidious "explained" himself to Dooku, Dooku believed had found a like mind who shared his views, and came to regard Qui-Gon's death as a necessary evil.
@@Jensaarai1 Think you. Never once has someone explained it to me till now
I don't know why I was worried that Marek would win. You always approach these duels so well. I liked The Force Unleashed, but God I hate Starkiller fanboys. Dooku was a master duelist, a proficient user of Dun Moch, a precise and powerful force user. The Force Unleashed novel, which since game mechanics should NEVER BE CONSIDERED CANON has the more accurate depiction of Marek's abilities, shows a potentially powerful, but ultimately amateur Force User. Having powerful AOE attacks does not make you a Force God -.-" I just.. I've grown to hate this character, and it really is not the fault of the writers. Granted he was pretty bland when you get down to it, but not hateable. Darth Tyranus stomps the young upstart
Marek beats Vader but can't beat Dooku whom vader beat before even reaching his max potential. You can't say "Marek looses because I don't like him". Thats as much of a joke as this videos results.
+Hikou72 You're using ABC logic. That is a flawed method. One fight does not determine skill set. Look at Dooku's skill set, you'll see that he emerges as a clear victor. The Force Unleashed... Was a mess of a game. Fun, but misleading. Pre-prime Vader is not necessarily stronger than Anakin Skywalker pre-cybernetics. Listen, I didn't dislike The Force Unleashed, it just wasn't very representative of the various skill sets of Force users. Mainly because Lucas had a heavy hand in it, and he likes to ignore the EU.
Didact13 I agree that the force unleashed was pretty ridiculous and its good for it to be non canon. I'm just stating thst if there was a guy who could pull a stsr destroyer out of the sky, beat Vader, and fight Sidious he would have beaten someone like Dooku. But yeah I still loved The Force Unleashed although ridiculous. It was just good fun to be super powerful.
Hikou72 Did not pull a Star Destroyer out of the sky, he redirected it. Sidious was toying with him, it was pre-prime Vader so it wasn't that impressive. I enjoyed the game. I have the Ultimate Sith Edition steelbook, snagged it for 15 bucks.
If you played the game, Starkiller did more damage to Vader than Luke could've ever done to him. And no Sidious did not toy with him. You can clearly see he protects himself and orders guards to help him.
This battle should've been over before it started. Galen defeated Vader AND the Emperor while injured and fighting off a bunch of assohles before inbetween and sometimes during both fights. Galen is the clear winner.
yeah well dooku is on par with yoda and mace windu. Galen could never keep up with them...dooku would slay him down
kylo ren Galen couldn't keep up with them? Says who? He never fought Yoda or Windu. As I said before he defeated the two most powerful Sith single handed along with a ton of minor force users and soldiers. Dooku wouldn't stand a chance.
Galen only beat Vader not sidious, and if Galen ever did fight yoda or windu, he would surely be beaten. dooku is also par with Darth sidious in lightsaber combat
kylo ren He just finished fighting a ton of guys and beating Darth Vader, he obviously wasn't at 100% and he still almost defeated him. He could definitely defeat him 1v1.
+Philip Paul and dooku fought obi wan and Anakin. and then fought yoda. if he is par with yoda then he can definitely take Galen with ease.
While I agree with your assessment of their lightsaber skills, I do believe that Marek wins in force abilities. Dooku has always needed a break from combat to properly use his powers while Marek does not. At the same time, marek's ability to channel telekinetic surges into the ground would probably catch Dooku off-guard (given that it broke through the defences of Vader as seen in the game) and one second is all Marek needs to win (again shown against Vader)
Seriously, Galen would lose just because the poor fool doesn't even know which way to hold a lightsaber.
28:02 grievously injured lol…i see what you did there.
I've got it. Count Dooku vs Exar Kun.
Alexzander1989 As much as I'd love to see that, I think Dooku takes that one. At least if we're talking a saber-to-saber duel and not a contest of Force powers. The Count has honed Makashi to such a level that he made Grievous look basic (and that was not the dumbed down Grievous of TCW). Kun's fancy saberstaff and changes in form aren't going to throw Dooku off much and Kun tends to be prone to the kind of defensive lapses that Dooku can easily recognize and take advantage of. Old age and treachery wins out in the end.
wristofkings
I think the thing that makes a match between these two interesting to me, is that both are high calibur duelists who's entire MO is to avoid predictability. Both have specialized weapons that bolster their fighting techniques. Both are powerful Force users, yet they go down different paths.
Kun being a sorcerer, and Dooku is more of a focused powerhouse. Kun's saberstaff is very much unique to him, and I would be interested to see how Dooku combats it. Dooku is older, but Exar Kun is very much a glass cannon. And I am interested to see how Dooku's and Kun's force powers stack up against each other and in terms of penetrating the others defenses. Aaaaand how Dooku contends with Kun's sith amulets and blasts of dark side energy
I do think Dooku is the more skilled overall swordsman, but I don't think he's contended with something like Kun's saberstaff or his tendencies of changing his blade length and power settings in the midst of combat.
I do think Dooku has a good chance of winning, but I still want to see this fight play out
All great points. I'm on Team Dooku, but all the same Jensaarai, Evan, Antoine etc. would have plenty to analyze in this contest.
I'll add that if it came down to the Force powers, Kun walks all over Dooku but I've noticed that he's very selective in when and how he applies them (kind of odd for a Niman specialist); while Dooku has managed to integrate lightning and TK into his fighting style with relative ease. I'm not sure how good Kun is at defending against users of Dooku's caliber, though killing Odan Urr (or however you spell it) almost casually after tanking his Force shove is an impressive feat regardless.
wristofkings
I think it would be a fair and interesting contest and one I am most interested in seeing, especially after Jensaarai's last two versus matches
That's appearently an upcoming collaboration.......
What a great vid! Finally someone understood starkiller isn't unbeatable and can be beaten by skill and experience
Yeah, I think people judge him over the game and possibly the comic, without even touching the novel, which is the canon version of events. Galen is very powerfull, but he was trained purely as a blind weapon for Vader, his skill with the dark side was far limited compared to the Sith Lords.
He'd put up a good fight against Dooku, but it would inevitably lead to his demise, no matter how hard he'd push.
OMG, when the music from Zorro starts playing while discussing Dooku's swordsmanship. :'D
How about Count Dooku vs Saruman?
bruh
Obviously Dooku. The Force and Saruman's spells are both basically magic. I'm pretty sure Saruman would avoid close contact with Dooku since he has a lightsaber. So it would come to between who is more powerful, Dooku in the force. Or Saruman in magic? For me I'd say Dooku.
+swarceproducions they are the same person
Yeah for the actor. But I mean in their character.
+swarceproducions well which one died the earliest?
6:59 "I have something to show you. It's called death."
Good job.Thanks for sharing this :)
Rest in peace Christopher Lee, acting was your passion and you did it until your last breath
I think Dooku is underated and a real interesting character, shame he was crowbarred into Attack of the Clones by Lucas.
He's the 2nd or 3rd strongest Sith.
Dodo Productions um no. I like Dooku but the 2nd spot goes to valkorion and the 3rd spot goes to caedus.
In Legends Dooku is the seventh most powerful sith of all time
THANK you on the realist analysis of Galen Marek…. The ONLY reason Starkiller was “so powerful” is because he was a VIDEOGAME character in a skill tree style game. And you had to be ABLE to BEAT the game on hard. That’s it….
I cannot stand when people try to use the “but he ripped a star destroyer out of the sky!” argument.. He did not.. ALL he did was redirect a star destroyer that was literally already on fire and crashing down towards the surface; all he did was redirect its course..... Which, was basically the SAME thing Anakin did when he landed the Invisible Hand (which was also moving infinitely faster).. We’d already seen that done; and Anakin was actually IN the ship, and had to basically lift it back up by the nose as it was streamlining toward the planet fast as shit before setting it back down “softly” to cushion their landing. Skywalker’s feat was more impressive. Like I said, Galen Marek is insanely overrated. Possibly the most overrated character in Star Wars.
Exactly I agree with everything you said! I'm going to do a video at some point debunking the myth that Starkiller is "overpowered."
Read the Novelization. Dude can grab flying Tie Figthers out of the sky and chuck them at people. Count Dooku crumbles when between a rock and a hard place; Galen is that rock.
Please do more narrative verdicts. It's great to hear how it would go down and not just who would win. Putting it in an actual scenario but changing out one opponent was also a cool concept. I'd suggest sometime in the future getting a good artist to illustrate parts of it, as while I got most of the moves, it would be very interesting to see them illustrated.
I find that Dooku would beat Galen Marek to be absurd.
This guy is clearly bias twords the FU and the Ne continuity he low balls starkiller to the extrem and star killer was no novice duelist either
Thank you for being one of the only people who speak logicaly
+Don media films yeah, he nerfed Marek to the extreme
It really is a joke to put a character as OP as Starkiller on the losing side unless his enemy is REALLY top tier
***** both marek and dooku are top teir. but this guy has made it clear he hates the EU and more than that he has said repeatedly he hates star killer most of all
Troll God Yes, he hates Starkiller, but he never once said, "I hate the EU." Never once.
a great video, but i really feel like you really didnt give enough credit to star killer. i mean, he brought down a god damn battle cruiser! dooku never did that.
and you suck with insults pansy lol
+Matthew Zumbo Why would Dooku ever fucking do that in the fist place lmao?
+Matthew Zumbo Bring down? No. The ship was coming down. He was able to use the force to redirect it, though. Still a good feat, but not as good as the one you've implied here.
@@iJakexD123 the ship wasn’t coming down it was flying in the air when Galen marek pulled it down using the force
@@iJakexD123 the ship wasn’t coming down it was flying in the air when Galen marek pulled it down using the force
Though I had hoped Marek would win, I loved this one! Keep up the great work!
Love the new narrative style verdicts, keep it up!
During the force ability section why was Galen being able to match darth sidious's lightning not mentioned?
He was only able to contain it for a few seconds and NOT direct it back.
@@ironinquisitor3656 im late but remember. SIDOUS WAS THE MOST POWERFUL DARKSIDER
Very true. He was the most powerful Sith.
@@ironinquisitor3656 don't forget, battle of plot armor
@@ironinquisitor3656 i think dooku was lacking in lighting, he only manage disable pawdawan Anakin Skywalker
You do truly great analysis. That's why it's so obvious when you're doing a slanted analysis. When you think someone is overrated you spend your entire analysis exploiting their weaknesses and overstating the strengths of their opponent. Shame because I would love to see an unbiased analysis of this duel.
People really over-estimate Galen Marek, mainly because of how Vader and Palpy talk about his potential. But he’s not really a top tier fighter. He’s a threat to any top tier fighter he meets, but not overtly superior. But you have to remember, Marek was powerful and advanced enough to be a credible threat to Dooku before he was 20. Dooku has been a master for as long as Galen has been alive, which is part of why Dooku wins the fight. But it’s a credit to just how talented Marek was. At his theoretical max potential, Marek would probably end up an equal to the likes of Kyo Durron. But he never lived to see that potential realized.
@@kingofthings7929 completely understand where you're coming from. Appreciate you sharing your thoughts. 🤝
@@kingofthings7929 Overestimating the dude that defeated multiple Jedi Masters, each with their own different specialties and tactics, defeated Vader twice, and fought the Emeror to a standstill?......against an old man who only uses one lightsaber form and got his ass handed to him by a group of (dumb) pirates?
K.
I agree with the verdict. A talented amateur versus a true master of the force. Dooku is clearly better than Galen in every aspect other than physical strength.
Galen's victory over Vader was no justification to his skill. Vader was far from his prime and took the fight far too lightly, vastly expending his reserves unnecessarily. If Vader was fully focused, it wouldn't even be a fight.
Calm Down Vader intended to finish the duel quickly and thats why he opened the duel with power blows that failed to overwhelm Galen. Vader appeared disinterested and underestimated Galen in their fight. Trying your best means nothing if your mind and focus is not there in the fight.
It's crazy to say that he can't break the force wall of other force adepts when he does in every boss battle after he has wounded and tired out his opponent. Even the count needed to open up his opponents before he broke their force wall.
Game mechanics =/= novelization
And actually no, play the game again, you can't attack directly either Kota or the Shadow Guard without throwing stuff at them first.
What is it with people and hatred of the Disney continuity?
They feel that they were betrayed to some degree. I was upset at first too until I realized that the EU was ultimately flawed via the tier system. To me it seems like Disney is actually going to attempt to make Star Wars a cohesive universe rather than what we saw with the EU. Most of the people who are opposed to the complete retcon will be over it in a year or two.
VSX0021OmegaGundam From what I remember, Disney decided to look through all of the EU to see what should and should not be considered canon.
However even then there's no guarantees that all things EU will disappear or be retconned. Even when it comes to the more ridiculous stuff like the space rabbit from the Marvel Star Wars comics, even that got a little skeleton of the same species appearing in an episode of the CG Clone Wars cartoon.
In the end though I would myself argue that the majority of it that can fit into canon probably can be accepted. I was always a little iffy on how large a scale the whole Yuuzhan Vong war went...
This guy just hates marek. Just because the book doesn't say he did certain powers he used in the games means nothing. The book isn't default superior to a game. Lightsaber combat wise I'd agree Dooku would win. Force powers wise I think Galen would just overwhelm Dooku.
The game makes people think that Galen is capable of crazy shit when in truth Galen had raw power with the force he did not live up to his full potential
Yes the book is canon over the game. The games were secondary canon and the books were above that. And remember video game depictions of characters re not canon. With the games the story, events and characters didn't happen in the way it was played.
+Ben engledow
Of the multiple Star Wars versus series creators on UA-cam, Jensaarai is one of the few that sing The Force Unleashed's praises and advocate for Marek as a character.
“I have become more powerful than any Jedi even you Galen Marek”
It is obvious that this contest cannot be decided by their knowledge of the force but by their skill of with a lightsaber
How can Dooku beat Galen when he defeated darth Vader when he was injured and Anakin defeated Dooku in episode 3 and darth Vader is far stronger than Dooku and also Galen defeated the emperor and Dooku is nowhere near powerful as the emperor and Galen could of killed him but spared him instead.
No he would not have annihilated the emperor that's incorrect
Well here's the thing. Styles make fights. Let's say this, okay? Say boxer A loses a fight to boxer B, and boxer B loses to boxer C. This doesn't mean boxer A doesn't stand a chance of beating boxer C, because you need to take into account how one beat the other, how ones style counters another, how ones advantages play into the other's disadvantages. While I agree Marek would win, the "he'd lose cuz he lost to a guy who he beat" argument is idiotic.
I disagree. Mostly because Marek has defeated Vader and Palpatine. Not to mention one ability you forgot to mention. Force Repulse.
***** They were fighting as equals, so it's likely that Vader wanted to kill Galen. But he was fooled around by Palpatine.
Even so... but we can all agree he had no chance against Sidious. The only one at the time who had was... yea.
Exactly.
***** did the force priestesses ever actually show combat effectiveness?
***** They could be strongest in another sense though, like foresight and understanding for instance, although I do think you're probably right.
that was an obvious outcome because marek was more trained to battle whole armies, killing many people in a small time. while dooku was clearly the duellist, so comparing them in a duell is actually pointless
its like comparing the death star and an x-wing: x-wing takes down deathstar, but death star more efficient in destroying a planet.
Ummmmm… Starkiller literally could put out waves of telekinesis that disintegrated enemies (as shown in the SWFU I trailer). You call his force powers weak, but he could also do things like catch Tie fighters mid flight. His power was explosive, described in the novelizations as threatening to tear his body apart as he would charge up certain abilities. Your basis of “unable to deal with even basic force defense” is flawed, as most video games with force users employ a similar mode of defense, so as to keep players from 1 hit KOing bosses. He pulled a massive ship out of orbit an then kept it from smashing him to bits as it crash landed! He’s was literally denied being made canon because he was too over powered! You do him a great disservice in the force powers section.
The games were confirmed to be exagerrated and only partly canon. Just like with SWOTOR, the TFU novel is in Legends the canon verion of events. And there Starkiller's feats are much more grounded. But he is still very powerfull. Not as skilled as Dooku though, Tyranus has a narrow win mkre often than not imo.
Galen would win because if Anakin (Darth Vader) killed Dooku, than how would Galen lose to count if he nearly killed Vader himself?
+Romeo Campo Because there were several outside factors that let Anakin win against Dooku... Besides the lightsaber tactics used by vader, starkiller and dooku are similar but not the same.. I prefer Galen more for the win too but only cause I feel like his powers were never truly measured.. I would assume that if the guy whom almost killed Palpatine alone.. Well he would most likely be able to defeat Dooku.. But complete honesty and truth.. It could go either way..
Possibly.
+Romeo Campo Galen barely bested Vader in the book which was the actual canon until they threw out the EU. Galen won because 1 he understood how Vader would attack as Vader had trained him. 2 Vader's cybernetics were weak to lightning. None of which Galen has against Dooku. Dooku would best Galen rather easily.
+Josh Campbell I don't agree to that.. Darth Sidious had a tough time to take him down.. Yeah granted he weakened Vaders cybernetics or mech with lightning.. He couldn't do that against Dooku but considering his age.. He is young and fast.. He might get a shot in at any moment.. Dooku would possibly win but never easily..
Leotrim Krenzi Read the book. Galen threw some debris at him and he fell down playing possum. All he wanted was for Galen to turn to the darkside. Marek had the potential to surpass Vader but that wasn't tapped yet.
Batman wins this fight 9 times out of 10
Batman would get slapped by either of these fighters lol
@@cobracommander3634 r/wooosh
Here's how I think it would go down. I'll make a few things clear first, though: Just because Galen uses three forms instead of one, does NOT mean he is a jack of all trades. He seems to have put extra time into Shien and Juyo, a form which you need to be good at at least one other style to properly utilize, probably Ataru for Galen based on the acrobatics he sometimes pulls off. Second, Galen has technically fought Dooku(and defeated) before thanks to PROXY. So he can defeat a duelist of significant Makashi skill, though PROXY can't replicate Dooku's skill 100% accurately. Third, Galen has proven himself capable of defeating opponents that by this logic should have killed him in minutes. Fourth, Dooku is arrogant, and that's a weakness. Fifth, Galen has some degree of unarmed combat skill. The fight would open like you said, cautiously, but that's where it ends. Galen would strike first, of course. Dooku would defect or dodge his Juyo assault, however, Galen is moving fast enough that he would have a degree of difficulty getting an opening to strike back. He would eventually throw a container at Galen's back, getting himself some breathing room to counterattack. Galen would fall back on Soresu, but would resort to a Force push. Dooku's barrier holds up well, though he is staggered a touch. Galen takes the momentary break and retreats, throwing a container at Dooku which the older man catches and returns to Marek. Galen slices it in half. He then attacks with a bit of lightning. Dooku blocks it with his hand, and sends it back at Galen. Galen stops the worst of it, but he is forced backwards onto the ground. Dooku moves in for the kill. He's about to kill Galen with a thrust, but then Marek uses a Force repulse. Caught off guard by the powerful and rarely seen technique, Dooku is sent flying. He maneuvers in the air to land on his feet, and says he's suprised Galen has lasted this long. Galen sees the large pillar which originally was used by Dooku to distract Yoda while he escaped. He grabs it with the Force, and ripping it from its place, has it fly at Dooku like a giant club. Dooku stops it, and Galen is using the window to charge. Dooku brings up his weapon and gracefully deflects the attack, dropping the pillar and engaging saber to saber once more. Eventually, he cuts the emitter off of Galen's saber, and scores two glancing blows while he's at it. Rather than halting in pain as Tyranus expected, Galen outright punches the Count in the gut, winding him. Starkiller grabs Dooku's saber hand, and breaks his wrist. Tyranus' hand reflexively drops his weapon, which Galen grabs. One swipe later, it's over.
Jen this why I like you. Many people hate on Masters like Dooku. But He was a true master of his time. Misguided perhaps but a Master none other You do a great service in explaining The Count and his admirable merits.
Wow really well done man. I rarely watch a 40 minute video that’s just a slideshow and a guy talking. Great job and I completely agree with your analysis
Glad to get you interested, and glad that your 1st was one of my better ones.
Marek can't lose this.. technically he beat sidious
He didn't. Not at all. You propably mean his supposed victory in the game. The game is Secondary Canon. The novel is the true canon (and the comic book) And there it's clear Palpatine faked it. He was impressed by Galen's power, saw the only other chance of creating what Vader was meant to be, so he wanted to turn him at all cost, even if it came to striking him down. Shaak Ti partly let Galen win as well. Vader lost only cause Starkiller knew his Master's tactics and techniqe.
Overall, Starkiller has unimaginable raw power, he was more powerfull than Dooku but he was also much less skilled, even with the additional abilities Vader taught him to use.
He really isn't that impressive, he was just meant to be a powerfull weapon against Palpatine which he never even became. Vader didn't even train him as a Sith apprentice.
Dooku wins.
Count Dooku, a true interdependence - is the mutual reliance between two or more groups. In relationships, interdependence is the degree to which members of the group are "mutually, not forced" in relationship.
Love your choice of music!
This is a hell of a video and beautifully explained! Just like the counts style.