The passenger window going up slower is actually a design feature. If you're doing 85mph on the HWY, and you roll all the windows up at the same time it creates a vacuum inside the car and it's pretty hard on your ears. So when one window goes up slower than the rest it allows the pressure to escape!
Interesting, if I pull up on both in my 2010 FXT the passenger side is slower until I let go of the driver switch. But in the old Legacy I had they'd roll up evenly
Really nice to see that race at the beginning, seeing the difference between an STi and Aventador, uncut and unedited, and see how it pulls. It really puts supercars into perspective how fast they really are.
Just puts in perspective how fast supercars really are. The sti is no slouch compared to what most consumers are used to, but the aventador made it look like a sloth.
I needed AWD to drive to the hospital in the snow, and wanted something fun for around $40k. My options were down to the Golf R and STi. I just got rid of a 2011 GTI and that car was pretty unreliable. So I decided to give subaru a shot this time around. Even Stage 1 with the Cobb Accessport does the STi a favor. I feel like the car is quick, not fast, which is fine. If I wanted a fast sports car I'd buy a Porsche, but for a DD in the northeast the STi is a good option. The STi is very rewarding to drive since you really feel connected to the car. Steering is heavy, shifter is good, sure it may not be super powerful, but it is a lot of fun IMO.
***** as true as that may be, it doesn't apply to people in the U.S.(me). To be honest I couldn't really care less what another country gets in a vehicle, there's really no point. Other than to gripe and bitch about what they're getting vs. us. If you want your needs met, make the manufacturers lose money until we get what we want. That's the patriotic way.
I don't care if it's still the original engine since that thing is capable. the part I don't get is: >subaru was built with 280hp because regulations restricted them from more >at least every 2nd subaru in asia is modded and most of them get 400hp with bolt-ons without destroying the reliability. >the regulations are gone yet they stick to producing only 280hp with it?
Daniel Kerkotchian nono I mean the japanese law. they prohibited cars from having more than 280hp. that's why the NSX, R34, Subarus, Evos weren't built faster than BMWs and other competitors. but they were built so strong that you could make insane performance with just bolt ons. nissan really showed what they can do without regulations. now subaru, mitsub and acura should follow with a deregulated subby, evo and NSX. sadly they apparently don't.
Had a 2016 WRX, loved it. No mods done just learned to drive it bone stock and it's plenty fast. I now have a 2017 STI and it's night and day difference. Steering and handling are different for sure. The ability to adjust the throttle response and differential power is a plus. Learning how to adjust the modes and differential for the type of driving and roads one drives took a bit of research and learning. Too many times people with an STI rush to tune it up and fail to learn the car first. Result is blown engines and fatal accidents. Stay safe out there and enjoy the ride !
People seem to focus on horsepower so much but I feel like this car is one of the few available that is the whole package. It's not a one trick pony, it's very good at everything. The only down side to this car is just the mpg.
Good job Matt, nice review of the 2015 STI. I bought one in January and really enjoy it. Sure, it would be even more fun to have more than 305 HP (more power is always more fun), but the car doesn't actually need more power to be fun. Keep your foot down through the gears, and suddenly you're going 110 mph on a winding back road and the guy you just passed, and who tried to chase you, has been dropped so hard he gives up - every time. The car has so much grip and the long-travel suspension soaks up bumpy back roads so much better than other cars, that you can stay on the power all the time. After a two curves, at speed, no one else is keeping pace. Such a fun car!
I own a daily driven 2015 sti and I agree with many of the points Matt has, but all I have to say about people saying there isn't enough power is that as soon as you hop in the car and drive it, it will put a smile on your face instantly. Just like a Mazda Miata, it barely has any power for a" sports" car, but it's sooooo fun to drive. I agree it is an old engine and it does need an upgrade, but it is still an incredibly fun and nimble car with great steering and suspension. Great, honest review Matt.
As an owner of one of these, you absolutely are doing the car a disservice driving it in Sport versus Sport Sharp, and take the thing out of Auto on the diff for god sakes, and put the power to the back tires - it transforms the driving experience.
Steven D Very true... it's kind of good that there is a healthy aftermarket for that motor but people buying a $40,000 sporty car like an STI shouldn't have to go there just to feel modern.
Derek Butler again, a number impressive in 2004. Not so much today. I just don't get Subaru's thinking on this. "Let's make this a perfectly capable and modern chassis and stick a motor designed close to a decade and a half ago! Yeah!"
Steven D You must have missed the part where this car walked the CLA45 AMG on the track at Willow Springs when that car has 355 Hp and does 0-60 in 4.2 and a 1/4 mile under 13. This car doesn't need HP to be enjoyable, and it certainly isn't hard to add HP to it either with the aftermarket--this is why the engine was left the same.
John Driscoll yes, it handles well. But justify how slow it is all you want. Name one other performance car with an engine as old as this one's. This is a great chassis with an ancient motor. Plain and simple.
Dude, I love your choice of words sometimes: "...at low speeds the engine sounds a bit..._agricultural_" Haha, that's such a polite way to put it. I've always thought Porsches sounded like that, but used the word "tractor". I love 'em, but I guess it's the boxer engine that inherently has that sound.
Yes it's an oldschool engine and that's why I love it. That and the sound...mine has been bulletproof so far at 110k miles. If it wasn't a good engine they wouldn't have kept using it for all these years
So much fast in your life you seem a little Jaded Matt. Nothing a few little "mods" cant fix.. I rode shotgun in the new Sti last week and it felt quick. Having lived with a number of WRX's and an 09 Sti i kinda feel they've always been a little underwhelming stock (engine wise) because i think Subaru kinda expects that its a blank canvas of sorts and people are gonna do what they do with them. All be it a blank canvas with a fancy frame when we're talking about the Sti.
"beigemobiles" lol... so underhanded.. That'd be the majority of factory cars in this price bracket pre mod im assuming. The Sti bit of the whole Subaru thing used to be something real special though. Back when things weren't so bloated.
Russell Tyrone Jones When the STI came out in 2004 it had 300 HP and the Mustang GT had 260. Now the STI has 300 HP and the Mustang GT has 435. Feel me?
TheSmokingTire Yeah I get what your saying 100% as a factory car in today's environment it hasn't kept up with the HP times, basically. That little 4 up front of any WRX/Sti is still a nice little lump just waiting to be molded into a fire spitting beast tho.. Especially the 2.0 liter.. Man if i could just get you behind the wheel of my boys Forester.. Gzus! And still compared to a stock Stang or Camaro 0-100 (0-60) is still coming just as fast or faster depending on your skills and rubber of course. Personally I'd rather go back and buy the 04 Sti and make some gains than buy this car simply based on its looks. That's where I think Subaru fell off the most, hasn't been a good looking Wrex since 2005.
TheSmokingTire I think it's a crime they didn't give the STI a tuned version of the WRX's 2.0L direct injection motor, it's so much better than the old one even if it is smaller.
Japanese sports cars make more sense if you drive them in Japan. The average Japanese Kei car has 40-60 horsepower and is slower than a sunrise. Anything with over 200hp is going to be plenty on a nice twisty mountain road or cutting through traffic in downtown rush hour. The EJ257 is an excellent tuner platform and can easily produce 350-370hp or more before major upgrades are needed (forged pistons, etc).
downpipe, tune and intake 70-80ft lbs at the wheels and 50+hp....the standard $3k stage 2 . they go from 13.5 to 12.5 1/4 miles and power issue is not an issue and car is done for 50-70% of owners. Its expected by the people that buy them and not an issue having an 'old' motor. my stock '15 can do things better than my 275/35/18 shod Evo RS on big swaybars couldnt. New STI does NOT understeer at all. Its insane how far it will go before letting go - stock. If your not poor I highly recommend it.
But Subaru is in Rally. I'm so confused as to why people are saying Subaru isn't in rally anymore. They compete in WRC and Rally X still. And the new STi was just recently converted to rally spec.
they suck stock..I added Cobb AP 4-5 weeks after i got it. It was AMAZING going to a new map....then Downpipe+new map...x2 amazing. Im at stage 2(maxxed out 590cc injectors same as '04 cars) got my 1000's and fuel regulator kit and intake waiting on dyno sesh appt. These EJ25s are same inside, but BIGGER turbo and BETTER ecu logic. The '15+ has 5 wire O2 that will trim maps at WOT unlike the previous EJ's...why allll the internet reviewers talk about the big end feeling so good on new cars....once you UNCORK the fueling limitations and airflow they are amazing. The 4G63 is an ancient motor - so what it makes power...so does the EJ. Yoy get a blank canvas from factory to build what you want. Subaru has the EJ25 EPA certified on a lean map w small injectors why ita down on power OEM. Once you get past the garbage USDM tune shes a beast. You get an awesome chassis and a corked motor that just needs to be popped w $$. STIs are NOT 40K! they are 33-34k base. Spend 4-5k on E85 stage 3 and you have a safely tuned 380-400hp Sti for 40k
all this car needs from the factory is El headers, large twin scroll turbo, stronger Pistons and rods, and a little more boost. nothing wrong with the EJ motor they just need to improve it.
i would be fucking furious if my new car was grinding like that. My old 03 Mach 1 Mustang with almost 70k miles still shifts smooth. Ive had that car since 07 and it had 12k miles, I have beaten the hell out of the trans, power shifted (flat foot shift) that car at least 100 times and now has 500 hp (and irs, matt im sure youd appreciate that, let me know when you come to the east coast to come drive it, fun car for sure).
Good review man. I love these one takes, even when they are press cars. I will say that I am one of those who were considering getting the new model but then they said no hatchback and that turned me away quick. So I guess I'll wait to see if they change their mind.
Had a 2011 STI and Matt nailed it from the start..."Its just not that fast" Fun car, but after wanting one for years and finally buying it I was disappointed with the performance...
I have an Evo X MR, I bought it in 2013, and I was not happy with the power, so I spent a bit on boltons, now it has 100 more, and now the car rocks, I have no downsides, and the car feels like it should be from the factory, I have a downpipe, exhaust, intercooler and turbo inlet, 3 port, drop in filter, the car is just like stock with more torque and power, I would say I would not trade my evo for any new hatchback or sti.
Yeah seeing on the forums that the STI's transmission has got "glass" synchros in it. There is a ton of peeps complaining about gear grind in the 3 / 4 shift.
New exhaust, chip it, up the boost, bigger injectors, dyno. She'll make nice usable figures. Love the look of the 015 scoobies. Glad theyve gone back to the boot/trunk version, Was never a fan of the hatchback.
Lol "full grind" ..nice review, I liked how you called out the bigger differences between it and the WRX, learned a few things about the steering rack & transmission. Looking forward to see how the R competes
Thanks for giving an honest review Matt. I have contemplated getting another STI, but to be honest, I am not really wanting to spend 40k, and then X amount to get it to 400 + hp. For the money you would need to spend to get the power where it needs to be you could have just went out and bought a fully loaded Scatpack Challenger. Which has a superior interior, electronics, women like the Challanger a lot more, etc. You won't have the baller AWD system, but you would have a sports car. Thanks again for that review.
"Sounds agricultural" is nicely saying "it sounds like a lawn tractor" which I do agree with. Needs some EL headers, bigger downpipe and a good tune, increases power and reliability.
***** One hopes that the factory maintains reliability, also, a car doesn't have to be loud to be fast. Factory catbacks are not very restrictive anymore and there are quiet aftermarket systems like the Invidia Q300 which are high flow.
I literally live 30 seconds away from this canyon in Sunland, CA, and I take my 15 wrx out there at least a couple times a week. However, lately, I've been noticing a lot more cops on this trail, so take a radar and keep an eye out if you're thinking about going on this run.
I have to agree, the seats are nothing special. They aren't bad, but they could be better. I never got to test drive the STI, but does the power kind of die off after 5k rpm kind of like the WRX? Or does it pull all the way through the power band?
MrGovenator1 It pulls better than the WRX up top, but an aftermarket tune from someone like COBB will really wake the engine up. The stock tune is very conservative.
TheSmokingTire I remember watching your original video on the 2015 and you mentioned it died at the top end. Didn't really make any sense to how that worked at the time, but after owning one now, I completely understand what you were saying about that. I would like to get a COBB tune, but don't want to infringe on the warranty either. Its not that big of a deal to me any ways, its punchy where I need it.
MrGovenator1 So the turbo spools quickly and then dies off like the Ecoboost turbos? I remember it being said that the power band was very linear and the turbo doesn't sneak up on you like it did in the older WRX.
maximus9401 Yeah, you can feel it start to spool around 2k, but power starts to die around 5k. It does feel pretty linear, but its still not like a N/A engine.
I had purchased a '15 STi LE last spring. Instead sticking it out with modding the same ol "formula" and risking the cars reliability. I got rid of it and purchased ZL1 instead. MUCH happier!
They totally dropped the ball on this one. I don't understand why they didn't put a high strung FA, like an upgraded WRX motor. Compared to the EJ motors I think they have better flowing heads and direct injection. I saw a video about a Crawford Performance boosted BRZ(which is an FA motor), and Mr Crawford was saying that the new motor "loves to make power" I also like the idea of the Sti having a 2.0 liter motor. The jdm ones always had the ej20 and it was a bad ass, higher revving, harder boosted, version of the WRX motor. I've heard the 2.5 doesn't feel as responsive, and definitely doesn't Rev the same as the 2.0. Now the Sti has the old motor that is the weak spot of the car, it seems like the chassis could handle so much more. All the while the wrx has newer motor, seems backwards. A 350hp FA20 that pulled harder and harder up to 7500rpm in the new Sti chassis is what should have been. Do they offer a factory wing delete, I always thought the little "duck bill" spoilers looked way cleaner.
I do, agree with you on the cars engine being outdated, that being said I don't think I know a single person with an STi that has not been tuned, I wonder how you'd feel about a cobb stage 2 car.
My WRX does the same thing with rolling the windows down. Not sure why. Looking forward to what Subaru can do with the FB motor in an STi. Also hope they increase the performance differential between the WRX and the STi as it's got closer and closer over the last 11 years.
The EJ257 was a spectacular motor in 2004. It's been over ten years since then, and it's now officially irrelevant. It is absolutely mind boggling that Subaru has decided to retain that motor. It's almost an offensively blatant marketing/economics decision. And I think it goes to show who the STI caters to these days. A real enthusiast would be scratching their head a bit that this brutal lack of progress has been allowed to continue.
jagerx I agree. Even though it makes (roughly) the same power, the new Golf R (previously R32) has been through FOUR different drivetrains since the EJ25 was put in the STI. At least VW is developing something new....
TheSmokingTire Exactly. Whether you believe it needs more power or not, there's something to be said for progress. Competitor motors are getting more powerful while also getting better fuel economy. It's baffling that Subaru wouldn't innovate in such a manner--perhaps at least dropping a tuned FA into the STI. But they are focused on selling cars, which is exactly why we never saw the proposed bespoke standalone WRX/STI models and instead got a hotter Impreza as usual. Either way great review and commentary as usual, Matt.
TheSmokingTire the engine block is mostly the same, it has improved technology and tweaks. Also it is a haldex. The r has upgraded heads, valve spring, its said that it can support 500 bhp
jagerx the ej257 was never spectacular. subaru kept the good engines in japan since the gc8. the japan spec version have only 2l, but rev to 8000rpm and have a twinscroll turbocharger. they have better driveablity.
amduser86 You know, back in 04 the STI was one heck of a proposition. 300hp, AWD, and a price lower than its competitors. Now, it's nothing special. The world has passed the STI by. I won't disagree with you on the Japanese motors though. They are better overall. I noticed they used higher quality head gaskets and other wear-and-tear parts that seem to die quickly in the EJ series.
Matt, you seemed very excited in the 89 Honda Civic. That only had 100hp. Are we maybe to picky with the STI? (journalists and enthusiasts in general, not specifically you)
Considering Subaru knows what it is this car is capable of and what it is they know people do with them I don't see why 375hp out the factory isn't an option. I'm not really big on tuner cars or imports but I absolutely love the STi. Little boxer engine has great performance. I love the way they look and how they sound amd how they perform. Very impressive and probably one of if not the best bang for your buck import for performance. Just my opinion though.
I kind of like the idea of it having less power. If someone asked me what car they should consider as their first tuner car I would point them toward the STi. It has a responsible composure and good breaks and lots of room to grow if they choose to modify it. I think they would be safer in this car because it isn't more power than what I think most people can handle. Plus, that all wheel drive is a great thing to have.
In many reviews I've seen of this new STI, every driver seems to crunch synchros when shifting it's new short throw shifter. In all of Matts one-takes, he seems smooth and confident w/shifting, so now I can't help but wonder maybe it posses flawed build quality or if it is simply that difficult of a gearbox to use. I recall journalists struggled when shifting 2014 Mustang GT500 gearbox as well. Anyone have any credible thoughts on this matter??
I just hope Subaru don't fall asleep now that it's main competitor (EVO) is pretty much gone. If Mitsubishi had made an EVO XI I feel like Subaru would probably have dropped the 2.5 instead of waiting for the next generation to switch to the 2.0. Competition is always a good thing so I hope the Focus RS and Civic Type R can keep that going.
I hope you say the STI is better, cause otherwise you'll be flamed by the fanboys for thinking there could be anything better.. God forbid the STI isn't what it used to be
zed4me what do you mean what it used to be? The engine is still the EJ257...and the suspension is overhauled...it's better than it used to be, just the same power out put.
people hate old engines but I love them, 5+ year old engines are the most reliable but to be fair the 300hp is not big but the car can do 0-62 in 5 seconds the same as a GOLF R and no one says that car has low power just because its a hatchback, also if you paid 40k or how much ever this costs and you expect track times out of it it doesnt matter if it does well on track or not the fact is this is a rally car, if this was a track car it would have a bit lowered look to it and have 20 inch wheels and also it wouldn't be so noisy to drive, the reason its also very noisy when driving compared to a golf or other cars is that what this car is meant for which is rally this cars suspension,dampers and chassis is not going to have a good time so there is no space for soft stuff in this car.
TheSmokingTire Can you compare the Recaro seats from this car to the Recaros in the Camaro? I know you recently just did a one take in a 1LE optioned with them. Could you go a step further and comment on the Camaro's Recaros vs competitors (Ford, Volkswagen) as well? Thanks! Keep up the hard work. Love watching this channel!!
William Dey The Camaro's actual seats are more comfortable than these, but the low roofline of the camaro makes my back hurt from hunching down. the Recaro's Ford uses in the Mustang are my favorite, the ones in the VW are "softer" like more normal seats but offer great support too.
BRaskin1982 Yes, I was in Sport # with the Auto diff set to + . It's not slow in a vacuum, but if you're used to driving cars that are actually, legitimately fast by comparison, then yes its slow.
The STI really needs another 100 horses and torques with how big it's gotten. My mildly built 2.5RS will pace a WRX on roads like that canyon. My friends SR20 240 has destroyed 2015 STIs. But the older, 06-09 STi still rips. More liters, more boost, less ugly will give us a better STi.
I know my 1998 Legacy wagon is just a low end car. But he is right about having the engine at higher rpm. Thankful I have a 5 speed. I added a Thrush muffer to it, and it sounds nice. I want to do so much to the car, nothing crazy. Just make it a little faster, handle and stop way better.
I drove my 2007 STI to florida from maryland, 1000 miles. I have back spasms and guess what? I felt good. You know what car hurts my back? Toyota Camry LE. Those buckets seats are terrible. sti seats fit my broad shoulders, brz, srt4, Evo seats are for small people
this new STi is underrated. it is 330HP from the factory with the new ecu it received from Subaru. but with the 4 diffs, 3 being mechanical, there is quite a bit of drivetrain parasitic losses. my point is that it is a bit faster than the previous generations.
A13U53D they are trapping 104mph+. check out my videos. I also rated net HP of the car with accelerometer in 2nd gear and compared it to a 2011 Carrera 4S (accelerometer done to that car on same road and conditions in 2nd, as well). 299HP for the Carrera and 249hp for the STi. exactly the 50hp difference as would be expected from the cars. Carrera rated at 385 HP.
And no videos of the comparing? Nope just a 2015 sti... like I said best sti's are from 03-06 after that issues pulled up. Factory spec vs factory spec the new ones just can't compare. Even equally modded the new ones can't compare. I've witnessed it many times first hand. Till there is hard factual evidence my opinion won't sway.
Matt, you kept mentioning how the STI "just isn't that fast." Do you think the new Golf R has the same problem? And does it concern you that the Focus RS is estimated to be higher but not that much higher? Or is it something specific about how the STI delivers its power with the older 2.5 setup? Maybe the answer will come in the Golf R vid.
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The passenger window going up slower is actually a design feature. If you're doing 85mph on the HWY, and you roll all the windows up at the same time it creates a vacuum inside the car and it's pretty hard on your ears. So when one window goes up slower than the rest it allows the pressure to escape!
Chance Kristo that's interesting. good call.
Interesting, if I pull up on both in my 2010 FXT the passenger side is slower until I let go of the driver switch. But in the old Legacy I had they'd roll up evenly
Really nice to see that race at the beginning, seeing the difference between an STi and Aventador, uncut and unedited, and see how it pulls. It really puts supercars into perspective how fast they really are.
Just puts in perspective how fast supercars really are. The sti is no slouch compared to what most consumers are used to, but the aventador made it look like a sloth.
Aventador is a street legal Formula 1 race car. STI is a street legal rally car. It is like comparing apples to oranges.
I needed AWD to drive to the hospital in the snow, and wanted something fun for around $40k. My options were down to the Golf R and STi. I just got rid of a 2011 GTI and that car was pretty unreliable. So I decided to give subaru a shot this time around. Even Stage 1 with the Cobb Accessport does the STi a favor. I feel like the car is quick, not fast, which is fine. If I wanted a fast sports car I'd buy a Porsche, but for a DD in the northeast the STi is a good option. The STi is very rewarding to drive since you really feel connected to the car. Steering is heavy, shifter is good, sure it may not be super powerful, but it is a lot of fun IMO.
The lambo scared the syncro out of 4th lol
Lol
"Why hasn't the engine changed in a decade you ask?" well because people still buy it. Brand loyalty is a bitch.
***** as true as that may be, it doesn't apply to people in the U.S.(me). To be honest I couldn't really care less what another country gets in a vehicle, there's really no point. Other than to gripe and bitch about what they're getting vs. us. If you want your needs met, make the manufacturers lose money until we get what we want. That's the patriotic way.
I don't care if it's still the original engine since that thing is capable. the part I don't get is:
>subaru was built with 280hp because regulations restricted them from more
>at least every 2nd subaru in asia is modded and most of them get 400hp with bolt-ons without destroying the reliability.
>the regulations are gone yet they stick to producing only 280hp with it?
ye ye what regulations are gone? the hippies and the EPA are preventing JDM engines from coming here.
Daniel Kerkotchian nono I mean the japanese law. they prohibited cars from having more than 280hp. that's why the NSX, R34, Subarus, Evos weren't built faster than BMWs and other competitors. but they were built so strong that you could make insane performance with just bolt ons. nissan really showed what they can do without regulations. now subaru, mitsub and acura should follow with a deregulated subby, evo and NSX. sadly they apparently don't.
ye ye A darn shame that the Evo is now discontinued
The grinding in 4th gear sounds like a e-brake haha!!
The Lambo was in the horizon in a matter of seconds, lol.. that was awesome. At least you had a hot passenger. You have a fun job Matt!
Had a 2016 WRX, loved it. No mods done just learned to drive it bone stock and it's plenty fast. I now have a 2017 STI and it's night and day difference. Steering and handling are different for sure. The ability to adjust the throttle response and differential power is a plus. Learning how to adjust the modes and differential for the type of driving and roads one drives took a bit of research and learning. Too many times people with an STI rush to tune it up and fail to learn the car first. Result is blown engines and fatal accidents. Stay safe out there and enjoy the ride !
STI is a rally car. I could care less about it not being able to compete with cars it was never meant to compete with. I love it.
People seem to focus on horsepower so much but I feel like this car is one of the few available that is the whole package. It's not a one trick pony, it's very good at everything. The only down side to this car is just the mpg.
Good job Matt, nice review of the 2015 STI. I bought one in January and really enjoy it. Sure, it would be even more fun to have more than 305 HP (more power is always more fun), but the car doesn't actually need more power to be fun. Keep your foot down through the gears, and suddenly you're going 110 mph on a winding back road and the guy you just passed, and who tried to chase you, has been dropped so hard he gives up - every time. The car has so much grip and the long-travel suspension soaks up bumpy back roads so much better than other cars, that you can stay on the power all the time. After a two curves, at speed, no one else is keeping pace. Such a fun car!
I own a daily driven 2015 sti and I agree with many of the points Matt has, but all I have to say about people saying there isn't enough power is that as soon as you hop in the car and drive it, it will put a smile on your face instantly. Just like a Mazda Miata, it barely has any power for a" sports" car, but it's sooooo fun to drive. I agree it is an old engine and it does need an upgrade, but it is still an incredibly fun and nimble car with great steering and suspension. Great, honest review Matt.
So if I pay $40,000 for the new STi.... do I get the girl too?
***** Yeah you can totally buy women like they're objects
durkley only if you win street races!!! NOOOOOOOO MONICA!!!!
durkley You must be a feminist. "Yeah! Women's rights!"
***** Yep, I am a feminist, you 14-year-old unoriginal dweeb.
durkley I like that you think I'm 14. Lawl.
Without the passenger you might have taken the Aventador.
Michael Cohen agreed, or maybe folding the mirrors in for better aerodynamics would of been enough.
George Washingturnt No I think he would need to add a bumper sticker to give him +50 horsepower
This sticker adds +50 VTEC
Hey, lets be grateful he had the spoiler! Without it, the race would have been a lot worse...
Michael Cohen I really should have taped up all the seams of the car. That would have made a difference.
As an owner of one of these, you absolutely are doing the car a disservice driving it in Sport versus Sport Sharp, and take the thing out of Auto on the diff for god sakes, and put the power to the back tires - it transforms the driving experience.
Yes, the window thing also happens in my 13 year old Corolla.
Does that mean we have the same car?
I had an identical 2015 Launch Edition. This video really makes my miss it.
300HP was impressive in 2004. Now its extremely plebeian (for a performance car), and its a crime its virtually the same motor for more than a decade.
Steven D Very true... it's kind of good that there is a healthy aftermarket for that motor but people buying a $40,000 sporty car like an STI shouldn't have to go there just to feel modern.
Steven D It's not all about hp. The STi still makes almost 300lb ft of torque. And on racetracks it's proven itself quite well.
Derek Butler again, a number impressive in 2004. Not so much today. I just don't get Subaru's thinking on this. "Let's make this a perfectly capable and modern chassis and stick a motor designed close to a decade and a half ago! Yeah!"
Steven D You must have missed the part where this car walked the CLA45 AMG on the track at Willow Springs when that car has 355 Hp and does 0-60 in 4.2 and a 1/4 mile under 13. This car doesn't need HP to be enjoyable, and it certainly isn't hard to add HP to it either with the aftermarket--this is why the engine was left the same.
John Driscoll yes, it handles well. But justify how slow it is all you want. Name one other performance car with an engine as old as this one's. This is a great chassis with an ancient motor. Plain and simple.
Do you still prefer the 10th generation Evolution over the STI?
SoCalSupercars would love to know as well
LaZiiiDaN mhm
Dude, I love your choice of words sometimes: "...at low speeds the engine sounds a bit..._agricultural_"
Haha, that's such a polite way to put it. I've always thought Porsches sounded like that, but used the word "tractor". I love 'em, but I guess it's the boxer engine that inherently has that sound.
illitero I think porsches sound like shit at low RPM too. But they pick up a crazy wail when you wind them out.
This is probably the best canyon scenery you've had for the one takes so far.
everyone lets matt farah pass them in the canyons, its like you have some superpower
Yes it's an oldschool engine and that's why I love it. That and the sound...mine has been bulletproof so far at 110k miles. If it wasn't a good engine they wouldn't have kept using it for all these years
So much fast in your life you seem a little Jaded Matt. Nothing a few little "mods" cant fix.. I rode shotgun in the new Sti last week and it felt quick. Having lived with a number of WRX's and an 09 Sti i kinda feel they've always been a little underwhelming stock (engine wise) because i think Subaru kinda expects that its a blank canvas of sorts and people are gonna do what they do with them. All be it a blank canvas with a fancy frame when we're talking about the Sti.
DirtMcGirt BBJ yeah, the STI is fast if you're used to beigemobiles. If you drive or are around a lot of fast cars, it's really underwhelming.
"beigemobiles" lol... so underhanded.. That'd be the majority of factory cars in this price bracket pre mod im assuming. The Sti bit of the whole Subaru thing used to be something real special though. Back when things weren't so bloated.
Russell Tyrone Jones When the STI came out in 2004 it had 300 HP and the Mustang GT had 260. Now the STI has 300 HP and the Mustang GT has 435. Feel me?
TheSmokingTire Yeah I get what your saying 100% as a factory car in today's environment it hasn't kept up with the HP times, basically. That little 4 up front of any WRX/Sti is still a nice little lump just waiting to be molded into a fire spitting beast tho.. Especially the 2.0 liter.. Man if i could just get you behind the wheel of my boys Forester.. Gzus!
And still compared to a stock Stang or Camaro 0-100 (0-60) is still coming just as fast or faster depending on your skills and rubber of course. Personally I'd rather go back and buy the 04 Sti and make some gains than buy this car simply based on its looks. That's where I think Subaru fell off the most, hasn't been a good looking Wrex since 2005.
TheSmokingTire I think it's a crime they didn't give the STI a tuned version of the WRX's 2.0L direct injection motor, it's so much better than the old one even if it is smaller.
Hey Matt, time to get your hands on a couple of Evo's since you pulled out the STI.
Japanese sports cars make more sense if you drive them in Japan. The average Japanese Kei car has 40-60 horsepower and is slower than a sunrise. Anything with over 200hp is going to be plenty on a nice twisty mountain road or cutting through traffic in downtown rush hour. The EJ257 is an excellent tuner platform and can easily produce 350-370hp or more before major upgrades are needed (forged pistons, etc).
downpipe, tune and intake 70-80ft lbs at the wheels and 50+hp....the standard $3k stage 2 . they go from 13.5 to 12.5 1/4 miles and power issue is not an issue and car is done for 50-70% of owners. Its expected by the people that buy them and not an issue having an 'old' motor. my stock '15 can do things better than my 275/35/18 shod Evo RS on big swaybars couldnt. New STI does NOT understeer at all. Its insane how far it will go before letting go - stock. If your not poor I highly recommend it.
All i here is grind ..... grind.... why you grinding in 4th?
Another awesome video Matt. Keep up the good work man.
I love the 60fps video, I hope they're all like that from now on.
But Subaru is in Rally. I'm so confused as to why people are saying Subaru isn't in rally anymore. They compete in WRC and Rally X still. And the new STi was just recently converted to rally spec.
Not sure I can get used to the missing Subaru rumble ;)
Good test. That thing can certainly carve corners!
they suck stock..I added Cobb AP 4-5 weeks after i got it. It was AMAZING going to a new map....then Downpipe+new map...x2 amazing. Im at stage 2(maxxed out 590cc injectors same as '04 cars) got my 1000's and fuel regulator kit and intake waiting on dyno sesh appt. These EJ25s are same inside, but BIGGER turbo and BETTER ecu logic. The '15+ has 5 wire O2 that will trim maps at WOT unlike the previous EJ's...why allll the internet reviewers talk about the big end feeling so good on new cars....once you UNCORK the fueling limitations and airflow they are amazing. The 4G63 is an ancient motor - so what it makes power...so does the EJ. Yoy get a blank canvas from factory to build what you want. Subaru has the EJ25 EPA certified on a lean map w small injectors why ita down on power OEM. Once you get past the garbage USDM tune shes a beast. You get an awesome chassis and a corked motor that just needs to be popped w $$. STIs are NOT 40K! they are 33-34k base. Spend 4-5k on E85 stage 3 and you have a safely tuned 380-400hp Sti for 40k
+05EVORS Yeah i bought COBB SF intake without the AP, waited 2 months than bought COBB AP.
the AcessPort really wakes up the 2015~2016 STi
Aaaaand there goes you warranty...
+MagicGuy669 modify after warranty. :)
05EVORS I'd like to know where you found a new STI(a year ago) for $34,000. they haven't been 34k for 4+ years. A limited WRX is 32k.
all this car needs from the factory is El headers, large twin scroll turbo, stronger Pistons and rods, and a little more boost. nothing wrong with the EJ motor they just need to improve it.
i have a 2015 WRX (I know its an STI video) but for a working class guy like myself I love the power and handling i get out of my car
Man this road is so great, nice view around. I would love to drive on this road listening good music.
i would be fucking furious if my new car was grinding like that. My old 03 Mach 1 Mustang with almost 70k miles still shifts smooth. Ive had that car since 07 and it had 12k miles, I have beaten the hell out of the trans, power shifted (flat foot shift) that car at least 100 times and now has 500 hp (and irs, matt im sure youd appreciate that, let me know when you come to the east coast to come drive it, fun car for sure).
this is a good video to show all those people that think their stock subaru is a supercar.
Can't wait to see what you have to say when comparing the golf r
Good review man. I love these one takes, even when they are press cars. I will say that I am one of those who were considering getting the new model but then they said no hatchback and that turned me away quick. So I guess I'll wait to see if they change their mind.
Had a 2011 STI and Matt nailed it from the start..."Its just not that fast" Fun car, but after wanting one for years and finally buying it I was disappointed with the performance...
That grind made it like the scene in Boogie Nights with the Chinese twink and the firecrackers.
I have an Evo X MR, I bought it in 2013, and I was not happy with the power, so I spent a bit on boltons, now it has 100 more, and now the car rocks, I have no downsides, and the car feels like it should be from the factory, I have a downpipe, exhaust, intercooler and turbo inlet, 3 port, drop in filter, the car is just like stock with more torque and power, I would say I would not trade my evo for any new hatchback or sti.
Yeah seeing on the forums that the STI's transmission has got "glass" synchros in it. There is a ton of peeps complaining about gear grind in the 3 / 4 shift.
New exhaust, chip it, up the boost, bigger injectors, dyno.
She'll make nice usable figures.
Love the look of the 015 scoobies.
Glad theyve gone back to the boot/trunk version,
Was never a fan of the hatchback.
Lol "full grind" ..nice review, I liked how you called out the bigger differences between it and the WRX, learned a few things about the steering rack & transmission. Looking forward to see how the R competes
Thanks for giving an honest review Matt. I have contemplated getting another STI, but to be honest, I am not really wanting to spend 40k, and then X amount to get it to 400 + hp. For the money you would need to spend to get the power where it needs to be you could have just went out and bought a fully loaded Scatpack Challenger. Which has a superior interior, electronics, women like the Challanger a lot more, etc. You won't have the baller AWD system, but you would have a sports car.
Thanks again for that review.
Twin turbo STI would be insane. Highly unlikely that subaru would do it but its becoming more and more common for track teams do it from an H6 engine
"Sounds agricultural" is nicely saying "it sounds like a lawn tractor" which I do agree with. Needs some EL headers, bigger downpipe and a good tune, increases power and reliability.
you know what really grinds my gears... I couldn't take it seriously anymore, cracked me up.
So how much power do you reckon the STI should have from the factory? 350? 375? 400? (BHP)
***** 300
Noah Ferrari Evidently not.
***** I think that, given what we know that engine is capable of, 350-375 isn't unreasonable from the factory.
***** Depends on how reliable you want it to be and how loud you want it to be...
***** One hopes that the factory maintains reliability, also, a car doesn't have to be loud to be fast. Factory catbacks are not very restrictive anymore and there are quiet aftermarket systems like the Invidia Q300 which are high flow.
I literally live 30 seconds away from this canyon in Sunland, CA, and I take my 15 wrx out there at least a couple times a week. However, lately, I've been noticing a lot more cops on this trail, so take a radar and keep an eye out if you're thinking about going on this run.
It's most likely the gear syncros from 3rd to 4th. That grinding noise when he shifts.
The slower passenger side window is supposed to be a safety feature (if someone has their hand there) my Suzuki Kizashi has it too.
300 hp 4 banger stock from the factory slow?!! Wow! Wasn't long ago our Mustangs and Camaros had 300 hp V8's and we were happy!
My 2012 STI does that same "grind" into 4th gear (only) sometimes too. I've never figured out why.
it does not like being shifted so fast just the way they are
I have to agree, the seats are nothing special. They aren't bad, but they could be better. I never got to test drive the STI, but does the power kind of die off after 5k rpm kind of like the WRX? Or does it pull all the way through the power band?
MrGovenator1 It pulls better than the WRX up top, but an aftermarket tune from someone like COBB will really wake the engine up. The stock tune is very conservative.
TheSmokingTire I remember watching your original video on the 2015 and you mentioned it died at the top end. Didn't really make any sense to how that worked at the time, but after owning one now, I completely understand what you were saying about that. I would like to get a COBB tune, but don't want to infringe on the warranty either. Its not that big of a deal to me any ways, its punchy where I need it.
MrGovenator1 So the turbo spools quickly and then dies off like the Ecoboost turbos? I remember it being said that the power band was very linear and the turbo doesn't sneak up on you like it did in the older WRX.
maximus9401 Yeah, you can feel it start to spool around 2k, but power starts to die around 5k. It does feel pretty linear, but its still not like a N/A engine.
MrGovenator1 hmm :/
Sounds like a proper tune is in order!
This is a road I could only dream about taking my STi on
Press cars must have short, horrible lives.
Trickybear211 Some of them, yeah.
“That’s another gentleman of the canyon. They’re out there, you just gotta find them”
Can we all just focus on how much we love cars!! that is the reason y'all watched this video right? no more bigotry or complaining just CARS!!
I had purchased a '15 STi LE last spring. Instead sticking it out with modding the same ol "formula" and risking the cars reliability. I got rid of it and purchased ZL1 instead. MUCH happier!
They totally dropped the ball on this one. I don't understand why they didn't put a high strung FA, like an upgraded WRX motor. Compared to the EJ motors I think they have better flowing heads and direct injection.
I saw a video about a Crawford Performance boosted BRZ(which is an FA motor), and Mr Crawford was saying that the new motor "loves to make power"
I also like the idea of the Sti having a 2.0 liter motor. The jdm ones always had the ej20 and it was a bad ass, higher revving, harder boosted, version of the WRX motor. I've heard the 2.5 doesn't feel as responsive, and definitely doesn't Rev the same as the 2.0.
Now the Sti has the old motor that is the weak spot of the car, it seems like the chassis could handle so much more. All the while the wrx has newer motor, seems backwards.
A 350hp FA20 that pulled harder and harder up to 7500rpm in the new Sti chassis is what should have been.
Do they offer a factory wing delete, I always thought the little "duck bill" spoilers looked way cleaner.
I do, agree with you on the cars engine being outdated, that being said I don't think I know a single person with an STi that has not been tuned, I wonder how you'd feel about a cobb stage 2 car.
My WRX does the same thing with rolling the windows down. Not sure why. Looking forward to what Subaru can do with the FB motor in an STi. Also hope they increase the performance differential between the WRX and the STi as it's got closer and closer over the last 11 years.
"Why are you grinding?!"
-My life as a WRX owner
Xd
The grinding in 4th gear is actually very common for the cars. The last gen does the same thing.
I hope you let the Golf R cool down before driving it :)
The EJ257 was a spectacular motor in 2004. It's been over ten years since then, and it's now officially irrelevant. It is absolutely mind boggling that Subaru has decided to retain that motor. It's almost an offensively blatant marketing/economics decision. And I think it goes to show who the STI caters to these days. A real enthusiast would be scratching their head a bit that this brutal lack of progress has been allowed to continue.
jagerx I agree. Even though it makes (roughly) the same power, the new Golf R (previously R32) has been through FOUR different drivetrains since the EJ25 was put in the STI. At least VW is developing something new....
TheSmokingTire Exactly. Whether you believe it needs more power or not, there's something to be said for progress. Competitor motors are getting more powerful while also getting better fuel economy. It's baffling that Subaru wouldn't innovate in such a manner--perhaps at least dropping a tuned FA into the STI. But they are focused on selling cars, which is exactly why we never saw the proposed bespoke standalone WRX/STI models and instead got a hotter Impreza as usual.
Either way great review and commentary as usual, Matt.
TheSmokingTire the engine block is mostly the same, it has improved technology and tweaks.
Also it is a haldex.
The r has upgraded heads, valve spring, its said that it can support 500 bhp
jagerx
the ej257 was never spectacular. subaru kept the good engines in japan since the gc8. the japan spec version have only 2l, but rev to 8000rpm and have a twinscroll turbocharger. they have better driveablity.
amduser86 You know, back in 04 the STI was one heck of a proposition. 300hp, AWD, and a price lower than its competitors. Now, it's nothing special. The world has passed the STI by. I won't disagree with you on the Japanese motors though. They are better overall. I noticed they used higher quality head gaskets and other wear-and-tear parts that seem to die quickly in the EJ series.
On my 2013 wrx the passenger window takes about 4-5 seconds longer than the drivers window when all four windows are being rolled up at the same time.
Matt, you seemed very excited in the 89 Honda Civic. That only had 100hp. Are we maybe to picky with the STI? (journalists and enthusiasts in general, not specifically you)
Stefan Gossler No, that 89 honda was WAY more fun.
Liez...this was two takes.
Also sounds like the 4th gear synchronizer is stripped.
Considering Subaru knows what it is this car is capable of and what it is they know people do with them I don't see why 375hp out the factory isn't an option. I'm not really big on tuner cars or imports but I absolutely love the STi. Little boxer engine has great performance. I love the way they look and how they sound amd how they perform. Very impressive and probably one of if not the best bang for your buck import for performance. Just my opinion though.
I know the 2015 wrx sti will haul, I've had mine up to 160 and it's a base model wrx stick shift
I kind of like the idea of it having less power. If someone asked me what car they should consider as their first tuner car I would point them toward the STi. It has a responsible composure and good breaks and lots of room to grow if they choose to modify it. I think they would be safer in this car because it isn't more power than what I think most people can handle. Plus, that all wheel drive is a great thing to have.
40 thousand dollar tuner car? Dumb comment .
No need to be rude. Sorry you're poor bro.
You should do a review of this car on some dirt and see how it does from the factory. That would be an interesting One Take.
Leslom I'd love to, but Subaru forbids journalists from taking STI's on dirt.
Why is it grinding? Cause Subaru quality !
In many reviews I've seen of this new STI, every driver seems to crunch synchros when shifting it's new short throw shifter. In all of Matts one-takes, he seems smooth and confident w/shifting, so now I can't help but wonder maybe it posses flawed build quality or if it is simply that difficult of a gearbox to use. I recall journalists struggled when shifting 2014 Mustang GT500 gearbox as well. Anyone have any credible thoughts on this matter??
Love what this guy does, but if I'm sitting in a car seat huffing and puffing out of breath I'm seriously having a think about my life.
You lost me at... "Drop the pretty lady at the tent"... lol
The power windows on my '94 Mustang are like that.
"It's not a bug, it's a feature!" Hahaha.
Also noticed your audio is better, I'm guessing you're using the GoPro Hero 4 now?
Good driving too btw!
My Stoner Mind nope, same cameras. Just ditched the wired lav. The internal mic sounds better.
I just hope Subaru don't fall asleep now that it's main competitor (EVO) is pretty much gone. If Mitsubishi had made an EVO XI I feel like Subaru would probably have dropped the 2.5 instead of waiting for the next generation to switch to the 2.0. Competition is always a good thing so I hope the Focus RS and Civic Type R can keep that going.
would be cool to see wat u think of a tuned version. maybe someone will come with one for u to try
Makes really pleasant sounds.
I hope you say the STI is better, cause otherwise you'll be flamed by the fanboys for thinking there could be anything better.. God forbid the STI isn't what it used to be
zed4me what do you mean what it used to be? The engine is still the EJ257...and the suspension is overhauled...it's better than it used to be, just the same power out put.
people hate old engines but I love them, 5+ year old engines are the most reliable but to be fair the 300hp is not big but the car can do 0-62 in 5 seconds the same as a GOLF R and no one says that car has low power just because its a hatchback, also if you paid 40k or how much ever this costs and you expect track times out of it it doesnt matter if it does well on track or not the fact is this is a rally car, if this was a track car it would have a bit lowered look to it and have 20 inch wheels and also it wouldn't be so noisy to drive, the reason its also very noisy when driving compared to a golf or other cars is that what this car is meant for which is rally this cars suspension,dampers and chassis is not going to have a good time so there is no space for soft stuff in this car.
Sounds like the fourth gear synchro is on it's way out man.
TheSmokingTire Can you compare the Recaro seats from this car to the Recaros in the Camaro? I know you recently just did a one take in a 1LE optioned with them.
Could you go a step further and comment on the Camaro's Recaros vs competitors (Ford, Volkswagen) as well?
Thanks! Keep up the hard work. Love watching this channel!!
William Dey The Camaro's actual seats are more comfortable than these, but the low roofline of the camaro makes my back hurt from hunching down. the Recaro's Ford uses in the Mustang are my favorite, the ones in the VW are "softer" like more normal seats but offer great support too.
I hope you were in S#.. although i'm modified now, I didn't think the car felt slow..even in stock form
BRaskin1982 Yes, I was in Sport # with the Auto diff set to + . It's not slow in a vacuum, but if you're used to driving cars that are actually, legitimately fast by comparison, then yes its slow.
The STI really needs another 100 horses and torques with how big it's gotten. My mildly built 2.5RS will pace a WRX on roads like that canyon. My friends SR20 240 has destroyed 2015 STIs. But the older, 06-09 STi still rips. More liters, more boost, less ugly will give us a better STi.
It has a unique gear grind sound. Maybe it's the audio.
I know my 1998 Legacy wagon is just a low end car. But he is right about having the engine at higher rpm. Thankful I have a 5 speed. I added a Thrush muffer to it, and it sounds nice. I want to do so much to the car, nothing crazy. Just make it a little faster, handle and stop way better.
That is why I want to do some shocks
I drove my 2007 STI to florida from maryland, 1000 miles. I have back spasms and guess what? I felt good. You know what car hurts my back? Toyota Camry LE. Those buckets seats are terrible. sti seats fit my broad shoulders, brz, srt4, Evo seats are for small people
Dude II almost had you.
Clever
I had the same 4th grind issue on the 2008, but it wasn't as bad as in this video.
this new STi is underrated. it is 330HP from the factory with the new ecu it received from Subaru. but with the 4 diffs, 3 being mechanical, there is quite a bit of drivetrain parasitic losses. my point is that it is a bit faster than the previous generations.
You are wrong my good sir. Research even factory ratings will tell you. I for one own a 2005 sti and rape all the new sti's, and mine is factory spec
A13U53D they are trapping 104mph+. check out my videos. I also rated net HP of the car with accelerometer in 2nd gear and compared it to a 2011 Carrera 4S (accelerometer done to that car on same road and conditions in 2nd, as well).
299HP for the Carrera and 249hp for the STi. exactly the 50hp difference as would be expected from the cars. Carrera rated at 385 HP.
And no videos of the comparing? Nope just a 2015 sti... like I said best sti's are from 03-06 after that issues pulled up. Factory spec vs factory spec the new ones just can't compare. Even equally modded the new ones can't compare. I've witnessed it many times first hand. Till there is hard factual evidence my opinion won't sway.
Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't WRC rules state that the power output of these engines should be limited to 300 hp?
Looking forward to the Golf R review
Matt, you kept mentioning how the STI "just isn't that fast." Do you think the new Golf R has the same problem? And does it concern you that the Focus RS is estimated to be higher but not that much higher? Or is it something specific about how the STI delivers its power with the older 2.5 setup? Maybe the answer will come in the Golf R vid.
GnosticDevice The Golf R is faster than the STI and feels it.