Bariss was a great foil for Ahsoka. They both thought what the Jedi Order was doing was wrong and both went about leaving it very differently. Bariss is also a great foil for Morgan. They both had a chance to choose the correct path and went about it in opposite ways.
Yes. Bothe stumbled and fell. Morgan stayed down and used her rage to make others suffer as she had. Barris got back up, and and decided to help rather than harm.
@@primecoconut4204 No. What they have in common is compassion for others. Barris sought to heal. Ahsoka seeks to protect. Morgan chose to spread her suffering and pain to others.
Luminara does come across as stern and traditional but something that struck me was that Luminara was able to admit to Ahsoka that she was wrong about Ventress, and at least Barriss was able to look fondly on Luminara in the end
Getting to know Fourth Sister/Lyn a little more was nice. I hope we see her more after this, especially if she manages to save Barriss. I don't expect her to live, though.
I think people just forget that Barris doesn't hate the Jedi. She only saw how corrupt and disillusioned the Jedi had become. She didn't want to end the Jedi. She wanted to reform the order. Her master also literally barely cared about her.
I wonder if she ever got jealous of Ahsoka. She could clearly see how much Anakin cared about her. I wonder if that in part was why she decided to frame Ahsoka vs anyone else.
"Trust is overrated" "I think they (red lightsabers) suit me" Barriss is barely even a character in TCW but she made it pretty clear that she wants to be a dark side user lol
@@dancingvalkyrie And how does this disprove any of my points? Lol. Also she saw the Temple attack in Episode III, she definitely didn't want the Jedi to be wiped out. The reason she bombed the temple is because she saw the disillusionment that had fallen over the order, along with the corruption. She wanted to end the Clone Wars, not start the next Jedi massacre. If she really wanted to end the Jedi she would've just ended Ashoka, she had several chances to do so. But didn't.
I'm actually amazed the Jedi didn't cover up what barriss did and put her in the dawn Temple which was a Jedi Temple located in the unknown regions where they put suspecting dark Jedi some of their own for re-education. Something which grandmaster Yoda knew about. So that sounds very culty so much so that order 66 makes more sense. You're willing to imprison your own Jedi who feel that you are too dogmatic and you're willing to re-educate them into your dogmatic ways that is culty and you deserve to order 66.
@@isimperialist Yeah that scene made zero sense because she bombed the temple and attempted to kill her own friend and then suddenly cares when shes in prison. Her character is the epitome of inconsistent
All the people crying because they wanted to see her go full dark side didnt understand her character and it shows. But her arc was beautiful and she has proven to be worthy of redemption. People especially complained about her death but i loved it, she sacrificed herself to bring her friend back into the light thats the most Jedi thing ever
I made a comment on a different video about how Barriss was able to properly process her emotions due to her master's teaching. Instead of being allowed to voice her frustrations, she was told to just stop feeling it and to stuff it deep down inside her, where it fester until it blew up like a bomb (no, I did not intend for this to sound like a pun, since she literally blew up the jedi temple. I only realized it was a pun when I finished writing this.)
If you wish she had more screentime then that means she hasnt been characterized very well. Barriss turns evil offscreen because the writers didnt want to do any work
@@dancingvalkyrieI think it's a bit different, for me I can only imagine the absolute horrors she saw that turned her from the super kind nice padawon into what she eventually became and it's probably better than what they would come up with if they tried writing it
@@JakeTheStakeNowIn3D5024 Exactly! The jedi were wrong to suppress their emotions. They should have been like qui gon, kanan jarrus, cal kestis and ahsoka to a certain degree. unfortunately more were like windu, adi mundi, yoda (he ignored his revelations), etc.
I agree that Ashoka and Count Dooku were fan favorites… but I love tales as the Empire just as well. So glad there are people like you out there who can feed our hunger for all things Star Wars!
I think part that a lot of people miss is that she literally starts giving her life force away to make up for all the wrong she did whether it be the inquisitorial or everything she did with the Jedi temple. Other words she wasn’t asking for forgiveness, but she was willing to forgive others who wronged her.
To be fair to Luminara, while she's proven wrong about being able to handle Ventress on her own, her instincts that someone like Ahsoka needed to be standing watch on the prisoner while she did so were spot on. When Ahsoka does decide to do after her, she saves Luminara's life, but also allows the prisoner to escape and Ventress to accomplish her mission. So it's not like she was just dissing Ahsoka; there were sound tactical reasons to have Ahsoka stay there that events ultimately justified. She just underestimated Ventress's skill as a combatant.
This was really nice to hear coming off of Star Wars Theory's angry rant about the show. I really enjoyed Tales of the Empire. I hope to get more of these types of shows.
Even more detached than Windu imo, at least he had an unorthodox lightsaber combat style that could use his opponent's dark side against them in combat.
I feel like it's easy to hate Barriss, simply because it was Ahsoka who she chose to frame. I often wonder how things might have gone differently if she had chosen anyone else. Choosing Ahsoka was probably the worst thing she decided to do; everyone in that Temple had to have known how close Anakin and Ahsoka were. They were like a father daughter duo. Framing Ahsoka sealed Barriss' fate before she even knew it herself. Anakin would go to the ends of the Earth for his Padawan...I wonder if that's because he wanted to be the Master to Ahsoka that Obi-Wan just never was to him. Someone who openly cared.
I think it was just chance that she had to frame Ahsoka since she and Anakin were the ones investigating the attack so it was easier to put the connections leading to her. I don't recall there being anything said that she was always intending to set up Ahsoka and it's not like she had any influence on the council to choose them two to investigate.
@@Zakatkpro Well, the people working for the jedi order were not saints were they? Luke killed thousands when he destroyed the death star. (civilians and soldiers). However, what the fourth sister do was plain evil to purge a village full of civilians!
What a fantastic video Alan (Allen? idk). This one really had me engaged and thinking. I feel like Barris in a way always knew exactly what she needed to be and how she needed to use her powers. I like how she basically became a "Witch of the Woods" in a good way. That sort of story isn't often told. Sorry if I am typing a little robotic right now I don't feel well.
Great take, I feel the same way. You carry yourself with the presence of someone who's learned empathy for others the personal experience and strive to teach others so they can learn through wisdom instead, you really are a positive force in the fandom. We've gotta forgive people for the things they're done in the past, otherwise all we will ever do is cut each other down. I was pleasantly surprised they didn't take full blown Inquisitor route for Barris. We will get a inquisition show someday and it will be sweet but now is not that time.
This was a ride of a video, Allen. I really enjoyed the part explaining the misguided anger at Barriss not joining the empire, and comparing it to real world situations such as the atrocities in Gaza currently playing out and how it would only play further into an imperialist view of the world. This kind of nuance is why I truly enjoy your channel and why your one of the few SW creators I still enjoy watching ❤
I've been watching your channel more and more since the Acolyte started. Your incredible in depth reviews is making me want to watch more of the Clone Wars. Thank you for doing wonderful reviews with the "extended spaceship warranty" of course. May force be with you.
i’m so glad she didn’t stick with the empire. the whole reason she “turned to the dark side” in the first place (which she didn’t even really do honestly) was to make a point against the jedi because she thought THEY turned to the dark side and fought for a republic she viewed as evil. so obviously she wasn’t going to wholeheartedly devote her entire life to a regime that publicly embraced the dark side and exemplified everything she hated about the republic. if they’d gone full inquisitor with her they would’ve need to do the leg work in making it look believable (which they wouldn’t have done)
Bombing the Jedi temple, killing dozens of Jedi, Clones and innocent workers and than framed the whole thing on Ahsoka (her best friend) with no remorse is an interesting way of "making a point"
I'm honestly glad as well. It never would've worked. I kinda wish we saw Barriss and Ahsoka talk in this. When she mentioned an old friend you know that's Tano. So clearly they had to have met up at some point. Wonder what that convo would've looked like.
@@JuliaJuanaAlvarez Dude even Ahsoka agreed about what Barris said. She understands the "why". It's the method that is wrong. Barris used fear and death to make a point. ( which Ahsoka was sadeneend by plus she was used). But Bariss even at her lowest point was always against the dark side and the Sith. And in the end, despite her crimes she choose the light side and tried to help Lyn redeem herself.
I'm glad Barris didn't stick with the Empire and left. She never wanted the destruction of the Jedi. She just wanted them to change and no longer fight in wars.
Barris was always too idealistic for the Inquisitors. Her anger was more specific and focused at the Jedi Council's policies regarding the war and politics. It never developed into the kind of hatred for the institution that other Inquisitors harbored, as she was able to separate her attitudes towards the rank and file Jedi, who were being led astray like she was, from the ruling Council who were the ones in charge. Once she learned the Council was gone and the war was over, she had little reason to be angry or to let her anger fester into hatred. In the end, the cruelty of the Inquisitors clashed with her idealism, and having gone through that training, she understood better than most that a lot of the Jedi who joined the Inquisitors purely did so out of fear for their own survival, that whatever hatred they spat out for the Jedi was just a mask to cover up their fear of being cut down by Vader.
I think Barris's story arc was excellent - she rediscovered what it *means* to be a Jedi. It's very hard and painful thing to do, but she pulled it off perfectly. I see some fools online lamenting that we didn't get to see Vader kill Barris - that would been a very cheap plot twist. That would have been bad writing. I'm glad they didn't go that way.
I think Barris was an idealist who went to extreme lengths to achieve an idealised goal. I think she was naive and definitely radicalised during TCW, but after joining The Inquisitors quickly realised they were no better than the the corruption she opposed within the Jedi. I appreciate that her character stayed true to her moral core but showed growth/ development and also atonement for her past actions. Tales of the Empire made me like her character more, seeing it from her perspective and it showed she wasn't an innately bad person... Something Star Wars epitomises.
That’s because theory is the only sw channel except a very few that are sane enough to call of shit Star Wars shows etc which a lot of fans don’t because they refuse to admit that a lot of stuff doesn’t make sense anymore
@@bazanime yeah lol, he's so out of touch. Didn't he complain about bricks. I used to respect him but i believe the best star wars show could be created and he'd still moan about it.
People being upset that Barriss reformed were either upset that she wasn't the Inquisitor in Rebels, or because they don't understand that people CAN reform. But when I first saw the trailer, I knew immediately that Barriss would leave the Empire the first chance she got. And I knew that because of the bombing arc. Her entire motivation was that she feared what the Jedi were becoming. She thought they were failing to live up to their ideals, and wanted to try to force them to get better through an act of terrorism, so that they would be forced to listen. But she failed. And the darkness she sensed was growing not only overtook her, but also the Republic. And when that happened, the Jedi were nearly wiped out. But Barris wasn't a different person because of her darkness. She still cared about people and was a Jedi at heart. Honestly, I'm surprised we didn't get a scene of her sarcastically apologizing to Ahsoka about framing her but still smugly pointing out that she was right. And Ahsoka would have forgiven her. And we know she did, as she herself aludes to in the final episode of Tales of the Empire. Barriss was never a villain. An extremist? Perhaps. But even her extremism failed, which just goes to show how powerful Palpatine was.
So, she decided to fight the Jedi’s violence with more violence? There is no justification for what she did. She’s also undermining her own message by bombing innocent people.
@@Enigma75614 Do you honestly think anything would have changed if she just talked about it? Because I'm gonna be blunt and tell you that it wouldn't have done shit. I know a lot of people are against the idea of violence in the sake of making a message, but sometimes, violence is the ONLY thing that will solve anything or get yourself heard. I mean, objectively speaking you'd have to say the same of the Rebel Alliance as you are to Barriss. Because both are considered terrorists. And while, sure, there's not necessairly justification for the violence they enact, sometimes there doesn't need to be. Sometimes people acknowledge that violence should never have happened but that it still had to happen.
@@DarthTingleBinks Clearly her terrorist attack didn’t make an impact. No one listened to her. They just rightfully called her a terrorist. I bet you support Hamas.
I love your channel The amount of lore and how you break it all down. I have a hard time remembering all of the events and characters….. However I do hate the Disney sequel movies. But I love Filoni’s work on the shows and hope he can unite the divisive fandom. I don’t need my fandom to turn into real life politics
@@vasyeara weakness of the format. We have no idea of the timespan between the episodes, or how many missions she had gone on between joining the Inquisitors and seeing Lyn's true colours. This was also a problem for Morgan's story. The lack of context for episode 2 made the reaction of the townsfolk seem unreasonable. But I will make the point that more time does not automatically equal better.
Thank you GT! That was a deep analysis about Barris arc and agree with you on every word you said. Sometimes I ask myself if SW Theory does his SW homework before he criticizes a complex character like Barris.
Had Disney actually given fans what they wanted and done an animated Ahsoka movie or series about Ahsoka's journey to become the next Daughter, they could have made Barris part of that journey. Totally missed opportunity and yet another example of Disney shooting themselves in the foot.
I appreciate that we're getting more stories of people who turned back from the Dark Side because Vader made it feel so impossible when his story was all we had. I did always want a story where Slick helped her escape during Order 66 somehow, but never had much of a reason why or where they would go. But this does feel in line for her, and that she would be another person who escaped the dogma and indoctrination of the Jedi and chose to use her powers her way for what she viewed as a good life instead of in service to anyone who saw her as a tool or a piece of a machine
I really found her story beautiful. She was a critical spirit, found the flaws in both the Jedi/Republic and the Sith/Empire and she sacrificed herself to make the universe a little bit better.
Show was really nice with rich storytelling and interesting/very enjoyable scenes. I only wish it was longer. It would have been nice to have a full length 10+ episode arc surround barriss and maybe 4 or 5 episodes for Elsbeth
I'm so glad that you gave this take. I'm tired of people who don't like Star Wars anymore because Disney screwed some things up, and don't give the benefit of the doubt. Thank you for being different
I don't think Barriss was misvharacterized in TotE. She was never really into the dark side. I also never hated her. But I do think her story could've been handeled better. Unlike in case of Dooku, Ahsoka or Morgan where we had the whole context, this is literally the first time we ever see anything about Barriss after the Clone Wars. The whole story was kinda skimmed over & therefore underwhelming.
The finniest part about Bariss is that she was right about the Jedi but her actions had major consequences. Most people (like me) have disdain for her because she betrayed Ahsoka and almost caused her to be effectively executed.
It's a good thing I don't follow the general fan base and just enjoy the content. It is a fine set of shorts that flesh out the characters and is very interesting.
You called Master Luminara an asshole.. and thus I am now subscribed to your channel. I feel so validated. Barriss was a healer, she was always a healer, she never should have been put in the Clone Wars, i actually loved Barriss's arc in this, though i honestly wish that it had been longer. I never for one moment pictured Barriss falling to the dark side or becoming an inquisitor, because at the core of herself she wanted to help people, she wanted to protect people, her being a pacifist healer in the end of her arc was perfect for her, it's what she always should have been allowed to be. And for Barriss having Luminara as a master and having it basically programmed into her head what a jedi is supposed to be.. of course when the jedi go against that when she's already struggling with the violence she's going to crack.. And she regretted it, then she was afraid when Ahsoka got involved, then she lashed out, then she regretted it more.. and so on.. Because she was falling, and because the dark side turns a person into a mockery of themselves who basically goes down a path of being everything that they stood against previously.. it's probably because Barriss was such a fundamentally good person that her fall was so viciously dark.. I think her being in prison and having time to reflect and seeing what had become of the galaxy made her inherent desire to help and to protect people rise immediately back to the surface, because the Empire is everything she hated about the Jedi and the Republic taken to its most extreme possible conclusion.. Her storyline is very much appropriate for her, really at the end I feel like she is finally embracing who she is as a person, the one who wanted to help everyone and wanted everyone to be ok, who really just wanted to help people.
I think the basic problem is actually an inherent weakness of combining the triptych method of story telling with episodes that aren't long enough, it can work beautifully when you have all the needed context but it quickly falls apart when you don't. I still haven't watched the Morgan Elsbeth arc, but from my perspective what made the the arcs from the first season superior is all of the work that the clone wars, and rebels in for Asoka, put in for these characters. Seeing the series of moments that led to Duku's fall is natively satisfying because we already knew his fate and have had enough screen time with the man he would become, similarly the episodes dealing with Asoka during and immediately after the clone wars bookends well with all the context we already have for the charterer to tell a complete story and then again seeing her both trying to just disappear and then choosing to become Fulcrum works because of rebels(and might have left a bad taste in everyones mouth if she had not been established as Fulcrum in Rebels). Conversely Barris'es story starts out really strong showing her during order 66, we know this character and we have context, and then we see her start to go through inquisitor training. Then on what I assume is her first mission she tries to take out her overseer and disappears which feels rushed. Then finally we see her going from 20(?) to what looks to be 40 with zero context for anything between points A and B, for how she went from not being able to land a hit on the unarmed grand inquisitor to being able to do the same thing against an opponent who was presumably more skilled at combat than Barris had been when she was being training with the grand inquisitor. In short Barris'es story is a sequel with a strong introduction but that rushes through the first act skips the second and then skips enough time and context to spoil the third act (which as an episode out of context was well written and well passed). If for instance they had taken a little more time with act 1, had her do enough with the inquisition to constitute an act 2 and then finished with her going into hiding to become that healer you would have had a stronger 3 act structure and instead of preaching to Lyn she could have had to learn those things for herself before choosing to leave.
Luminara may have been cold, but she never tried to ruin the life of her best friend by making sure Ahsoka was falsely accused of the terrorist crimes Unduli had herself committed.
I actually quite liked the contrast of Morgan and Barriss path in "Tales of the Empire". Morgan, who embraced the darkness, bitterness and hatred to avenge the loss of her own people; and Barriss, who charted a path through the Dark and overcame it. Barriss wasn't inherently bad - she was a Healer with compassion - but the Clone Wars and being a young soldier messed everyone up. I just wondered WHO "the Friend" was that the family was going to see. Could it have been Ahsoka & that is how Barriss found redemption and peace? If so, it could imply some reconciliation between them. 🤔 [Admittedly, it is some bridge to rebuild]. I hope she survived, but as we have seen, one lightsabre thrust to the chest doesn't have to be fatal any longer! 😜
@@TopGunSGA i doubt its ashoka, she doesn't know that ahsoka is alive and she betrayed her to the point of framing her and would result in her going to prison or worse. Even if she did contact ashoka it would be a massive wtf if ashoka were to forgive her for what she caused her and the shit she made ashoka go through.
@@ElMaestroGordoThe old friend is a woman. "Do starej przyjaciółki. Będzie wiedziała co robić". Check Polish dubbing or other gendered languages of that scene.
12:20 I also think that. Have the Separatists use a droid army so the Jedi will be more willing to fight than they would against organic soldiers, or especially conscripts. But (and here's where the evil comes in), have the clones fight alongside the Jedi, so they're still being bombarded with fear and pain and anger as long as they're on the front lines. Just little bits of darkness, wearing them down over time. Until they finally snap, like Barriss. Or Krell. Or Anakin.
*Spoiler*⚠️ I believe Barriss had the right idea, but the absolutely wrong solution. Her betrayal to Ahsoka was the biggest mistake of her life, especially when she embraced those red lightsabers. I believe she felt and showed remorse when she felt the deaths of the Jedi during Order 66. Especially when one of the Inquisitors she knew (Lyn) just slaughter all those people without hesitation, that was just as shocking as to what Vader did. But when Bariss really showed development when she stopped Lyn from killing her and almost letting that Jedi die that's when her redemption began and then they show her years later that she's a better person now and had become a master, that to me was amazing cause they're saying she came a long way. I love that Barriss saved that family and her apprentices' lives and showed compassion for Lyn, and Lyn's remorse showed when she stabbed Barriss realizing she was the only Jedi she met that showed hope, love, and kindness for her.
Everyone who thinks her character just got ruined should go read her original character in the two Medstar books. Tales of the empire REDEEMED Baris' original arc.
I really do think that people just don't understand Star Wars... This video is a perfect example of a (mild) deconstruction of how Disney SW is actually trying to answer those deep questions that KotOR II asked, albeit with many, many changes with internal company conflict being a major factor.
You’ve give me a new and interesting perspective on Barriss that I hadn’t considered before, I feel that Luminara gets a bad rap though. Though criticisms of her strictness to the Jedi code/general Jedi inflexibility and her lack of attachment is very valid, my take is that she simply doesn’t fear death and allows the force to guide her (there’s no need for physical attachment with the understanding that the physical world isn’t the be all and end all of things) as well as utilising tried and tested procedure, rather necessarily making bad decisions. It’s easy to judge her decisions (and the Jedi in general) in hindsight, but her decisions in regards to fulfilling her duty and what she was presented with were pretty logical. eg. The mission to escort Nute Gunray that you mentioned, she didn’t see Ahsoka being able to hold her own, Ahsoka had been defeated and locked in a prison. Given that they needed to both guard Nute and stop Ventress, that Ahsoka was unsuccessful at stopping Ventress, and that Luminara was the most experienced, it made the most sense to split up rather than leaving one objective unmonitored or risking a recently defeated Padawan in re-engaging a highly trained assassin.
Well with Morgan it was pretty interesting for them to link her to Rebels in the way that they had it that she designed the TIE Defender and that is how she ended up being an ally to Thrawn. Ophee pretty much wasn't entirely evil, but she saw that the Jedi had fallen from being peacekeepers and using the powers of the light to aid in that pursuit. To being directly involved in war with most of them acting in the roles of Generals and Commanders. Which was against the Jedi beliefs. Often choosing direct confrontation and violence over any diplomacy. The only reason she joined the Inquisitors was because she was made to believe that they were actually helping the galaxy by stopping the Jedi and bringing them to justice, as the Fourth Sister pretty much told her. Also, the choice was either to join the ranks of the Inquisitors or be put to death. Once realizing that they had no intention of capturing Jedi to put them on trial she had no intention of staying. Pretty much a common trope with imperial servants that then turn rebel is that they get snapped out of it once they are put in the position of conducting atrocities against innocent people. Iden Versio, Crics Maydeen, Mayweather in the Mandalorian, Sabeen Wren when her weapon was used to kill her own people.
You know what I was perfectly satisfied with it and I'm glad we got to see what happened to her. But a lot of other critics like Star wars theory they just ripped on the series for no good reason That's why I like you man You're honest.
I feel that the frustration with Barriss history comes from feeling how much of a wasted potential it is. Miss goody two shoes, apprentice of the most nun looking jedi in appearences and behavior, having a break down at the hypocrisy of the Jedi Order and the war. There is some gold there, but Clone Wars botched it, barely going beyond the initial thought of the premise. She radicalizes off screen to a point of murdering hundreds and coldly framing her supposed best friend, leaving a lot to the fans to fill the holes. We have no face to face between her and Ahsoka, which sounds like super basic with this premise. No conversation between her and Luminara, an established secundary characters. The pay offs that could give us more, define her history better, characterize her better, never appeared in Clone Wars, and i feel some expected the Tales of the Empire to be a second chance. You are still in time to do all of this. We know Luminara was captured and eventually executed by the Inquisitors. Why dont make Barriss be the one who did that? It sounds like an obvious pay off. We could have had a climatic duel between her and Ahsoka. Instead, as expected from Disney Wars, Barriss plot is quite generic. You could change her with a random Jedi who did something bad during the Clone Wars, invented for the occassion, and it wouldnt be such a great change in the overall plot. Its could fit any Jedi forcefully recruited into the Inquisitors, but to prompt caring for the story, they use a familiar face. Its again a case of wasted potential. Imagine what gold you could dig from Luminara confronting her ex-padawan, a nihilistic and cronically depressed Barriss, uncaring about her awful situation because, from her point of view, the Inquisitorius dont care for her more than the Jedi, both expect her to kill, to die, and will ditch her once her usefulness is over, all in the name of order. That she already tried to stop it, nobody listened, not even her beloved master, andonly achieved succesfully becoming a monster anyway, so she DESERVES the Inquisitorius. Perhaps some flashbacks here and there to boost the story. One where you could show Barriss, before the war, as a healer, showing how much meaning she extracted from nursing people back to health and fighting to protect others. How much meaning she extracted by looking at her master, infallible at her eyes, for guidance and answer. Some flashback of the war, with Barriss trying to share her anguish with Luminara, but she is told to be restrained with her emotion and forget about it. Or trying it with Ahsoka, but she doesnt really think of the war that much, she is having her fights and her banter with Anakin. All of this to show the contrast between her when she felt she had meaning in her life, and her nihilistic and voided Inquisitor self. Show us her frustration towards her master, the fall of a heroe in her eyes due to blind faith in the Order, and her envy towards Ahsoka, with such a close relationship with her master, who seems to be having even fun with the war sometimes, while Barriss is having depression due to it. All for us to reach properly the obvious climax of such a story: that murdering of her once idol, Luminara, or a sad final fight with Ahsoka, where you can either make her die a broken and regretful mess, asking Ahsoka if she remembers when they met, saying she is sorry, for once. Or be defeated, laying down her weapon, breaking down emotionally, confessing how tired she is, lost in a nighmare of blood that never ends, with no one she could really trust to support her, almost wishing that the next Jedi she finds ends her for good. Maybe asking Ahsoka to be the one to do it, as she for sure must hate her. The type of stuff that currently belong to the realm of speculation and fanfiction, the fans filling gaps in their head, as usual. This sounds to me like the type of stuff that should have been showed or at least attempted. It would have made a basic on rails and predictable story that feels like a shoe, interchangeable, into a unique one. Barriss's story. A story and interactions only she could have, that are there, awaiting to be digged, and once again have been squandered, in the minds of some. Maybe they cant verbalize it, but they feel something is missed here. Because they way it stands right know, Barriss story has been be recruited, some dark side training, oh no they are so mean, i leave, im good now. So wasteful. Inquisitors are supposed to be mini Vaders, people so broken they would allow themselves to be used and sacrificed by their superior, their life mean as much as the level of usefullness they have. They did better in Fallen Order, and Barriss had more to work with than Trilla Suduri/Second Sister.
I've been saying this ever since the trial episodes were released. Barriss's goal was the restoration of the Jedi order as she believed it should be; that of mediators, peace keepers, healers, and teachers. Remember that she spent time as a padawan before the outbreak of the clone wars, so she has first hand experience of how they order was before it was took on the role of military commanders. Becoming generals and soldiers was antithetical to everything she believed the Jedi should stand for, and Ahsoka was unfortunately through little fault of her own, the embodiment of everything Barriss despised in the militaristic Jedi order during TCW; a Jedi trained as a soldier, unwittingly perpetuating the influence of the dark side, and who having known nothing but war, would have their teachings of any future padawans skewed by that experience. Certainly in perpetuating the war, she felt that the Jedi had become tools of the Dark Side, and only in withdrawing from the war, and returning to their traditional roles could they resist. Her methods about how to achieve that were reprehensible and outright criminal, even before the betrayal of Ahsoka, but her ultimate goal was a good one. Sadly goals do not excuse methods, but her intentions were not to destroy the order, but to renew and restore it to how it was before it succumbed to the influence of the dark side. I've argued before that based on this view, Barriss would have had little reason to become an inquisitor, and as we saw, she did reject it, and the dark side in the end.
In the end? What was she on the dark side for all of like thirty seconds? And that's if you count killing someone who is openly trying to kill you, a dark side act. She did feel at fist that the remaining Jedi should be neutralized. But her technique for finding them was about as innocuous as it gets. And when she found them she tries to talk them into surrendering so they could be rehabilitated. As an inquisitor Barriss was a better Jedi than many Jedi were during the clone war. Filoni said that Barriss was not meant to be an inquisitor, but people kept clamoring for it. So he showed them just how silly the idea of Barriss as inquisitor actually is. Then he put her on the path he had originally planed for her...working with the hidden path.
After finding her the first thing Anakin does is "hugging" Ahsoka. Luminara is detached. I do not know, little detail I noticed. Beside, given the stories, it is clear who is actually the superior teacher.
also Generations tech Please tell me when do you think you can make more Star Wars? What if alternate scenarios. You once did it, so why not now? Also, do you believe Boba and Omega are gonna cross paths sometime in another live action TV show or animation? Because we all want to see it happen.
I think my main problem with the arc is that it's not really enough time dedicated to justify her redemption. Idc that she's redeemed, I care that she's actually shown to be redeemed. We don't really get a lot of time here, and while we can wager through very short dialogue that she regrets some of her actions, nothing really about her redemption calls back to it. Would've been nice to have a 5-10 full length episode season dedicated to her fall and rise again from that dark place. Rather than what we got. Wishful thinking sure, and I'm still glad we got it, but it's very disjointed on a storytelling standpoint. Or, maybe less disjointed, and more rushed. Either way, still happy to see Barriss again, but there's a lot of issues in her story to me.
Those who say that she'd be redeemed because of her reasoning (the Jedi going down a path of self-destruction) forget about Count Dooku who collaborated with the Sith for the same reason, also killed people and tried to cover the tracks leading to him, and he also regretted his actions afterwards. But the thing is, once you've gone down a dark path you simply would not feel like you deserve to go back (and deep inside you wouldn't want it because of the "power") . Besides, with all the villains turning to the good side, how about we finally have another tragic villain and a dark ending? It's been a long time.
By the time Dooku started covering his tracks by killing his friends, he had long been accustomed to "regretful, but necessary, killing and violence. He had left the order over 10 years before killing Yaddle and Sifo Dyas. Offee doesn't have that experience. She was still uncomfortable with unnecessary violence and killing. That's why she was able to reject the dark side. She was shocked out of it. Unlike Lyn and Anakin, she never got to the point where she reveled in killing. Anakin had the Tuskens and Separatist Council for that. Lyn had the villagers (and that probably wasn't her first massacre either). Barriss simply had not waded deeply enough into the dark side to embrace it when she saw its true fruits. While she had started down a dark path, she hadn't traveled so far down that path that she was trapped on it.
I think Dooku and Barris have super similar story arcs, one in the perspective of a master and one an apprentice disillusioned with the Jedi order but not TRULY hating them. At least, that's sorta how I see it.
I liked your critique that Disney is trying to ensure that it doesn't glorify oppressive regimes. Perfectly fair. What I think more discerning people can appreciate though is seeing what these kinds of organizations are capable of, and why they're enticing in times of cultural crisis. They're vicous, subversive, and they're cruel, but it doesn't happen quickly or all at once. Who would the masses turn to if a malevolent force actually provided work, stability, and safety? That requires a steady hand (at first) and dare I say, competence. Discerning people will understand this is how dictatorship works and can grasp the danger this kind of false hope promises. Seeing the empire constantly portrayed as childish degrades its threat as a credible enemy.
There are two concepts to consider: 1) Predictive Programming--the idea that media entities will put out content that, in some manner helps prepare the people for what is being prepared. Someone told me that in the past 20 years, we have had nearly 30 shows/movies dealing with post-pandemic apocalyptic worlds, where viruses just up and killed off most humans...which has NEVER happened due to natural immunities (while American Indians had large amounts killed from smallpox, it didn't kill off all, or most, and the Europeans had become largely immune). Thus, when the WHO or the CDC starts talking about new virus, we are programmed to respond with fear (even though our personal experiences tell us otherwise), and clamor for a large, expansive, and militaristic central government to take control. Disney can be seen thus showing us what IS COMING as a result of the numerous "crises" that are being sent our way, from forever wars in Eastern Europe and the Middle East, to inflation, to societal meltdowns, etc. Being unstable, we have desire stability, and will follow the Empire when it emerges. Those engaged in large scale evil always broadcast what they are going to do...because they are so proud they believe that even IF we know, they will still pull it off. 2) Projection--It seems that entities like to project onto their opponents what they themselves are doing (or would do). While I LOVE the development of the Empire as an entity, or should never be lost that Lucas was basing the Empire off of what he considered the "conservative" political parties in the US...using visual references to known "bad guys" like the National Socialists and Bolsheviks...who were more politically aligned with liberals in the US at the time (and still are in many respects). Consider what Thrawn says to Morgan Elsbeth: most people who join the Empire do so for personal gain. Look at all major politicians, regardless of party, and regardless of country: nearly ALL will push similar policies (that increase government control and decrease personal opportunities to do good and provide for their own livelihoods) and ultimately THEY are the ones who benefit. However, consider the motives for Disney: they have a HUGE market share. They purchased Lucasfilm not out of love for the IP, but for its profitability (which they still exploit) and its ability to act as a venue for their "message". DEI (actually better named DIE) money will be available to make up for lost revenue, so they are not concerned with revenue...just like the Empire was not concerned with the lives of the people it purported to "protect".
@@rezza_lynsaiieh, Disney is more the Trade Federation than the empire. The aid and abet fascism when it’s financially remunerative, and then the fascists declare them enemies of the state when they’re no longer useful or stop towing the party line, just as Nute Gunray and the other conglomerate figureheads were wiped out by Darth Sidious at the end of the war. Disney actively funded the politicians who have now turned on them. Theyre quick to censor on behalf of China and Russia and various Middle Eastern governments, and those governments still hate Disney.
@@aaronaukema1284the amount of mental gymnastics you need to twist George Lucas’ messages into peddling fascistic rhetoric when George is a staunch progressive leftist and the entire theme of Star Wars is how fascists manipulate common people into giving into their hatred, greed and prejudice so that they cede their rights over to despots is honestly astonishingly impressive. It’s especially ironic that your blind hatred of minorities as lead you to buying into the delusion that Disney pushes a “DEI” message when they are among the most prolific conservative donors in the US, directly financially sponsored legislation that strips human/civil rights away from LGBTI people, and actively censor their own products to cater to socially conservative “anti-woke/anti-DEI” fascists in China, Russia and the Middle East. It would be hilarious if it wasn’t so scary to see just how correct George was, and to see you falling for the very thing his magnum opus was warning against. Fanatical, ideological, obsessive hatred of minorities is used by social conservative despots to strip people of their civil rights. The national socialists did it with Jews and sexual/gender minorities, the Bolsheviks did it with the bourgeoisie (which was just code for Jews and sexual/gender minorities) etc. Also George named villains after Republicans he disliked, in particular he named Nute Gunray after Ronald Reagan and Newt Gingrich.
despite filoni's timeline was kinda disrupted for revenge of the sith movie deleted scene and legends movie comic of barriss was suppose to die during order 66 for some of prequel characters weren't suppose to be in the original trilogy movies
If Anakin with the Youngling Killer 9000 can be redeemed, so can Barriss Offee
😂 true
Bariss was a great foil for Ahsoka. They both thought what the Jedi Order was doing was wrong and both went about leaving it very differently.
Bariss is also a great foil for Morgan. They both had a chance to choose the correct path and went about it in opposite ways.
what Barris and Ahsoka have in common was self-sacrifice
Yes. Bothe stumbled and fell. Morgan stayed down and used her rage to make others suffer as she had. Barris got back up, and and decided to help rather than harm.
@@primecoconut4204 No. What they have in common is compassion for others. Barris sought to heal. Ahsoka seeks to protect.
Morgan chose to spread her suffering and pain to others.
Luminara does come across as stern and traditional but something that struck me was that Luminara was able to admit to Ahsoka that she was wrong about Ventress, and at least Barriss was able to look fondly on Luminara in the end
Getting to know Fourth Sister/Lyn a little more was nice. I hope we see her more after this, especially if she manages to save Barriss. I don't expect her to live, though.
I think people just forget that Barris doesn't hate the Jedi. She only saw how corrupt and disillusioned the Jedi had become. She didn't want to end the Jedi. She wanted to reform the order. Her master also literally barely cared about her.
I wonder if she ever got jealous of Ahsoka. She could clearly see how much Anakin cared about her. I wonder if that in part was why she decided to frame Ahsoka vs anyone else.
"Trust is overrated"
"I think they (red lightsabers) suit me"
Barriss is barely even a character in TCW but she made it pretty clear that she wants to be a dark side user lol
@@dancingvalkyrie And how does this disprove any of my points? Lol. Also she saw the Temple attack in Episode III, she definitely didn't want the Jedi to be wiped out. The reason she bombed the temple is because she saw the disillusionment that had fallen over the order, along with the corruption. She wanted to end the Clone Wars, not start the next Jedi massacre. If she really wanted to end the Jedi she would've just ended Ashoka, she had several chances to do so. But didn't.
I'm actually amazed the Jedi didn't cover up what barriss did and put her in the dawn Temple which was a Jedi Temple located in the unknown regions where they put suspecting dark Jedi some of their own for re-education. Something which grandmaster Yoda knew about. So that sounds very culty so much so that order 66 makes more sense. You're willing to imprison your own Jedi who feel that you are too dogmatic and you're willing to re-educate them into your dogmatic ways that is culty and you deserve to order 66.
@@isimperialist Yeah that scene made zero sense because she bombed the temple and attempted to kill her own friend and then suddenly cares when shes in prison. Her character is the epitome of inconsistent
All the people crying because they wanted to see her go full dark side didnt understand her character and it shows. But her arc was beautiful and she has proven to be worthy of redemption. People especially complained about her death but i loved it, she sacrificed herself to bring her friend back into the light thats the most Jedi thing ever
Couldn't agree more. Barriss was characterized so well in TCW, just wish she had more screen time honestly
I made a comment on a different video about how Barriss was able to properly process her emotions due to her master's teaching. Instead of being allowed to voice her frustrations, she was told to just stop feeling it and to stuff it deep down inside her, where it fester until it blew up like a bomb (no, I did not intend for this to sound like a pun, since she literally blew up the jedi temple. I only realized it was a pun when I finished writing this.)
If you wish she had more screentime then that means she hasnt been characterized very well. Barriss turns evil offscreen because the writers didnt want to do any work
@@dancingvalkyrieI think it's a bit different, for me I can only imagine the absolute horrors she saw that turned her from the super kind nice padawon into what she eventually became and it's probably better than what they would come up with if they tried writing it
@@dancingvalkyrie General krell, quilan vos and others turned off screen...
@@JakeTheStakeNowIn3D5024 Exactly! The jedi were wrong to suppress their emotions. They should have been like qui gon, kanan jarrus, cal kestis and ahsoka to a certain degree. unfortunately more were like windu, adi mundi, yoda (he ignored his revelations), etc.
I agree that Ashoka and Count Dooku were fan favorites… but I love tales as the Empire just as well. So glad there are people like you out there who can feed our hunger for all things Star Wars!
I think part that a lot of people miss is that she literally starts giving her life force away to make up for all the wrong she did whether it be the inquisitorial or everything she did with the Jedi temple. Other words she wasn’t asking for forgiveness, but she was willing to forgive others who wronged her.
She literally did the most wrong, so she has no place to be "forgiving others" who wronged her. Grow up.
@@PoinDexter47wtf are you talking about
@@PoinDexter47no, you grow up 😂
Tech has been drinking the same beer for 24 hours straight.
To be fair to Luminara, while she's proven wrong about being able to handle Ventress on her own, her instincts that someone like Ahsoka needed to be standing watch on the prisoner while she did so were spot on. When Ahsoka does decide to do after her, she saves Luminara's life, but also allows the prisoner to escape and Ventress to accomplish her mission. So it's not like she was just dissing Ahsoka; there were sound tactical reasons to have Ahsoka stay there that events ultimately justified. She just underestimated Ventress's skill as a combatant.
This was really nice to hear coming off of Star Wars Theory's angry rant about the show. I really enjoyed Tales of the Empire. I hope to get more of these types of shows.
Allen thank you for doing what you do idk what i would do sometimes with out these videos my homelife is rough and it helps me escape
Luminara is just like Mace Windu. Great, but very detached.
Even more detached than Windu imo, at least he had an unorthodox lightsaber combat style that could use his opponent's dark side against them in combat.
Lyn was an interesting character as an inquisitor. Actually a back story to the inquisitor’s background would give the empire an interesting backdrop.
Could you please make a video on the ecosystem of Dathomir
that's not a bad idea i think ill put it down on the list
@@GenerationTech Space Austrailia with dark magic.
@@GenerationTech 😁
@@steelresilience Need me some outer rim drop bears!
Was my favorite planet in Star Wars Galaxies!
I feel like it's easy to hate Barriss, simply because it was Ahsoka who she chose to frame. I often wonder how things might have gone differently if she had chosen anyone else. Choosing Ahsoka was probably the worst thing she decided to do; everyone in that Temple had to have known how close Anakin and Ahsoka were. They were like a father daughter duo.
Framing Ahsoka sealed Barriss' fate before she even knew it herself. Anakin would go to the ends of the Earth for his Padawan...I wonder if that's because he wanted to be the Master to Ahsoka that Obi-Wan just never was to him.
Someone who openly cared.
Its easy to hate Barriss because she's barely even a character. Her arc is never explored to begin with
Yeah she probably would've been seen as a lot more heroic from the start if she framed someone like Pong Krell instead
I don't buy that she all of a suddenly cares about innocents when she so easily put a bomb in the Jedi Temple
I think it was just chance that she had to frame Ahsoka since she and Anakin were the ones investigating the attack so it was easier to put the connections leading to her. I don't recall there being anything said that she was always intending to set up Ahsoka and it's not like she had any influence on the council to choose them two to investigate.
@@Zakatkpro Well, the people working for the jedi order were not saints were they? Luke killed thousands when he destroyed the death star. (civilians and soldiers). However, what the fourth sister do was plain evil to purge a village full of civilians!
When you casually called Luminara an A-Hole I had to rewind because I thought I misheard 🤣🤣 I couldn’t agree more! That was gold
What a fantastic video Alan (Allen? idk). This one really had me engaged and thinking. I feel like Barris in a way always knew exactly what she needed to be and how she needed to use her powers. I like how she basically became a "Witch of the Woods" in a good way. That sort of story isn't often told. Sorry if I am typing a little robotic right now I don't feel well.
Great take, I feel the same way. You carry yourself with the presence of someone who's learned empathy for others the personal experience and strive to teach others so they can learn through wisdom instead, you really are a positive force in the fandom. We've gotta forgive people for the things they're done in the past, otherwise all we will ever do is cut each other down. I was pleasantly surprised they didn't take full blown Inquisitor route for Barris. We will get a inquisition show someday and it will be sweet but now is not that time.
4:44 "Who's an asshole." Damn dude didn't hesitate there.
This was a ride of a video, Allen. I really enjoyed the part explaining the misguided anger at Barriss not joining the empire, and comparing it to real world situations such as the atrocities in Gaza currently playing out and how it would only play further into an imperialist view of the world. This kind of nuance is why I truly enjoy your channel and why your one of the few SW creators I still enjoy watching ❤
This is why your my favorite star wars channel. You in depth explain characters, the lore, and not sound like whinny child.
I get the feeling this is a comment slightly targeted towards someone… 😂😂
facts
Who is ?@@Squiddy-go1du
@@Squiddy-go1du I get that feeling too lol but so true
@@Master_Ordol indeed
I loved this story of Barriss. I love your new setup! Always so thoughtful and helpful voice in this community! ❤
You provide a powerful interpretation that most people overlook. Thank you.
I've been watching your channel more and more since the Acolyte started. Your incredible in depth reviews is making me want to watch more of the Clone Wars. Thank you for doing wonderful reviews with the "extended spaceship warranty" of course. May force be with you.
i’m so glad she didn’t stick with the empire. the whole reason she “turned to the dark side” in the first place (which she didn’t even really do honestly) was to make a point against the jedi because she thought THEY turned to the dark side and fought for a republic she viewed as evil. so obviously she wasn’t going to wholeheartedly devote her entire life to a regime that publicly embraced the dark side and exemplified everything she hated about the republic. if they’d gone full inquisitor with her they would’ve need to do the leg work in making it look believable (which they wouldn’t have done)
my point exactly. barris still had morals, so all these comppaints are stupid
Bombing the Jedi temple, killing dozens of Jedi, Clones and innocent workers and than framed the whole thing on Ahsoka (her best friend) with no remorse is an interesting way of "making a point"
I'm honestly glad as well. It never would've worked. I kinda wish we saw Barriss and Ahsoka talk in this. When she mentioned an old friend you know that's Tano. So clearly they had to have met up at some point. Wonder what that convo would've looked like.
@@JuliaJuanaAlvarez Dude even Ahsoka agreed about what Barris said. She understands the "why". It's the method that is wrong. Barris used fear and death to make a point. ( which Ahsoka was sadeneend by plus she was used). But Bariss even at her lowest point was always against the dark side and the Sith. And in the end, despite her crimes she choose the light side and tried to help Lyn redeem herself.
@@JuliaJuanaAlvarez ps: which is something even Anakin did not manage to do for a Loong time.
I'm glad Barris didn't stick with the Empire and left. She never wanted the destruction of the Jedi. She just wanted them to change and no longer fight in wars.
Agreed.
Barris was always too idealistic for the Inquisitors. Her anger was more specific and focused at the Jedi Council's policies regarding the war and politics. It never developed into the kind of hatred for the institution that other Inquisitors harbored, as she was able to separate her attitudes towards the rank and file Jedi, who were being led astray like she was, from the ruling Council who were the ones in charge. Once she learned the Council was gone and the war was over, she had little reason to be angry or to let her anger fester into hatred. In the end, the cruelty of the Inquisitors clashed with her idealism, and having gone through that training, she understood better than most that a lot of the Jedi who joined the Inquisitors purely did so out of fear for their own survival, that whatever hatred they spat out for the Jedi was just a mask to cover up their fear of being cut down by Vader.
I don’t think luminara was a council member
I think Barris's story arc was excellent - she rediscovered what it *means* to be a Jedi. It's very hard and painful thing to do, but she pulled it off perfectly. I see some fools online lamenting that we didn't get to see Vader kill Barris - that would been a very cheap plot twist. That would have been bad writing. I'm glad they didn't go that way.
I think Barris was an idealist who went to extreme lengths to achieve an idealised goal. I think she was naive and definitely radicalised during TCW, but after joining The Inquisitors quickly realised they were no better than the the corruption she opposed within the Jedi. I appreciate that her character stayed true to her moral core but showed growth/ development and also atonement for her past actions. Tales of the Empire made me like her character more, seeing it from her perspective and it showed she wasn't an innately bad person... Something Star Wars epitomises.
I remember people saying she was the Seventh Sister shown in Rebels because both are Mirialan, but they look nothing alike.
Exactly, different facial markings and slightly different skin tone
What you're doing here with your channel is a very good thing. The world is a little better for having your perspective added to it.
Barris has had time to meditate on her actions I felt she genuinely felt remorse for what she did. I think even Ashoka has forgiven her.
If Darth Vader could be redeemed then so could Bariss.
A lot of loved characters have done far worse
Dude u are so so so so so good at making videos, thankful for u man
Great video GenTech, I'm glad Barriss got more to her story. I just wish Luminara was seen somewhere.
She got a raw deal having Luminara as a master. Hope we get more from her
Thank you for this, cause Star Wars theory went on a crash out just cause he didn’t get what he wanted
he’s such an embarrassment
Stopped watching that person years ago and have since been at peace with the force.
That’s because theory is the only sw channel except a very few that are sane enough to call of shit Star Wars shows etc which a lot of fans don’t because they refuse to admit that a lot of stuff doesn’t make sense anymore
Thats because unlike the rest if u hes starting to wake up and wont juss consume any and everything star wars
@@bazanime yeah lol, he's so out of touch. Didn't he complain about bricks. I used to respect him but i believe the best star wars show could be created and he'd still moan about it.
People being upset that Barriss reformed were either upset that she wasn't the Inquisitor in Rebels, or because they don't understand that people CAN reform.
But when I first saw the trailer, I knew immediately that Barriss would leave the Empire the first chance she got. And I knew that because of the bombing arc. Her entire motivation was that she feared what the Jedi were becoming. She thought they were failing to live up to their ideals, and wanted to try to force them to get better through an act of terrorism, so that they would be forced to listen. But she failed. And the darkness she sensed was growing not only overtook her, but also the Republic. And when that happened, the Jedi were nearly wiped out. But Barris wasn't a different person because of her darkness. She still cared about people and was a Jedi at heart.
Honestly, I'm surprised we didn't get a scene of her sarcastically apologizing to Ahsoka about framing her but still smugly pointing out that she was right. And Ahsoka would have forgiven her. And we know she did, as she herself aludes to in the final episode of Tales of the Empire.
Barriss was never a villain. An extremist? Perhaps. But even her extremism failed, which just goes to show how powerful Palpatine was.
So, she decided to fight the Jedi’s violence with more violence? There is no justification for what she did. She’s also undermining her own message by bombing innocent people.
@@Enigma75614 Do you honestly think anything would have changed if she just talked about it? Because I'm gonna be blunt and tell you that it wouldn't have done shit. I know a lot of people are against the idea of violence in the sake of making a message, but sometimes, violence is the ONLY thing that will solve anything or get yourself heard.
I mean, objectively speaking you'd have to say the same of the Rebel Alliance as you are to Barriss. Because both are considered terrorists. And while, sure, there's not necessairly justification for the violence they enact, sometimes there doesn't need to be. Sometimes people acknowledge that violence should never have happened but that it still had to happen.
@@DarthTingleBinksmate why make her into an inquisitor for a week or 2 and then all of a sudden feels like what she’s doing is wrong 😂😂😂
@@darwinodriscoll7750 We don't know how long she was an Inquisitor for, so that's a stupid question.
@@DarthTingleBinks Clearly her terrorist attack didn’t make an impact. No one listened to her. They just rightfully called her a terrorist. I bet you support Hamas.
I love your channel
The amount of lore and how you break it all down. I have a hard time remembering all of the events and characters…..
However I do hate the Disney sequel movies. But I love Filoni’s work on the shows and hope he can unite the divisive fandom. I don’t need my fandom to turn into real life politics
People expecting barriss to run fully evil never understood her nor her reasoning for what she did
I did understand her but it should've taken more than 1
25 episodes to redem her
Maybe because her childlike reasoning is full of holes, and is by no means grounds for a terroristic bombing. Get your head out of your ass.
@@vasyeara weakness of the format. We have no idea of the timespan between the episodes, or how many missions she had gone on between joining the Inquisitors and seeing Lyn's true colours. This was also a problem for Morgan's story. The lack of context for episode 2 made the reaction of the townsfolk seem unreasonable.
But I will make the point that more time does not automatically equal better.
@@intergalactic92 I was thinking of more time as an inquisitor would be great
Thank you GT! That was a deep analysis about Barris arc and agree with you on every word you said. Sometimes I ask myself if SW Theory does his SW homework before he criticizes a complex character like Barris.
Had Disney actually given fans what they wanted and done an animated Ahsoka movie or series about Ahsoka's journey to become the next Daughter, they could have made Barris part of that journey. Totally missed opportunity and yet another example of Disney shooting themselves in the foot.
I love the Ender Wiggin refference. So much wisdom in this quote.
Ahsoka forcepushing Ventress into a tube was surprisingly funny
mic fixed thank god
I appreciate that we're getting more stories of people who turned back from the Dark Side because Vader made it feel so impossible when his story was all we had. I did always want a story where Slick helped her escape during Order 66 somehow, but never had much of a reason why or where they would go. But this does feel in line for her, and that she would be another person who escaped the dogma and indoctrination of the Jedi and chose to use her powers her way for what she viewed as a good life instead of in service to anyone who saw her as a tool or a piece of a machine
I really found her story beautiful. She was a critical spirit, found the flaws in both the Jedi/Republic and the Sith/Empire and she sacrificed herself to make the universe a little bit better.
10:02 dude, I’d want to be in the explorer corps. That’s basically Starfleet where you go and push back the map.
i really hope all the tales continue jedi and empire and continue to give us an interesting view of things behind the scenes
Show was really nice with rich storytelling and interesting/very enjoyable scenes. I only wish it was longer. It would have been nice to have a full length 10+ episode arc surround barriss and maybe 4 or 5 episodes for Elsbeth
I'm so glad that you gave this take. I'm tired of people who don't like Star Wars anymore because Disney screwed some things up, and don't give the benefit of the doubt. Thank you for being different
I don't think Barriss was misvharacterized in TotE. She was never really into the dark side. I also never hated her.
But I do think her story could've been handeled better. Unlike in case of Dooku, Ahsoka or Morgan where we had the whole context, this is literally the first time we ever see anything about Barriss after the Clone Wars. The whole story was kinda skimmed over & therefore underwhelming.
I read her books Jedi healers and it explains her stance
The finniest part about Bariss is that she was right about the Jedi but her actions had major consequences. Most people (like me) have disdain for her because she betrayed Ahsoka and almost caused her to be effectively executed.
It's a good thing I don't follow the general fan base and just enjoy the content.
It is a fine set of shorts that flesh out the characters and is very interesting.
You called Master Luminara an asshole.. and thus I am now subscribed to your channel.
I feel so validated.
Barriss was a healer, she was always a healer, she never should have been put in the Clone Wars, i actually loved Barriss's arc in this, though i honestly wish that it had been longer.
I never for one moment pictured Barriss falling to the dark side or becoming an inquisitor, because at the core of herself she wanted to help people, she wanted to protect people, her being a pacifist healer in the end of her arc was perfect for her, it's what she always should have been allowed to be.
And for Barriss having Luminara as a master and having it basically programmed into her head what a jedi is supposed to be.. of course when the jedi go against that when she's already struggling with the violence she's going to crack..
And she regretted it, then she was afraid when Ahsoka got involved, then she lashed out, then she regretted it more.. and so on..
Because she was falling, and because the dark side turns a person into a mockery of themselves who basically goes down a path of being everything that they stood against previously.. it's probably because Barriss was such a fundamentally good person that her fall was so viciously dark..
I think her being in prison and having time to reflect and seeing what had become of the galaxy made her inherent desire to help and to protect people rise immediately back to the surface, because the Empire is everything she hated about the Jedi and the Republic taken to its most extreme possible conclusion..
Her storyline is very much appropriate for her, really at the end I feel like she is finally embracing who she is as a person, the one who wanted to help everyone and wanted everyone to be ok, who really just wanted to help people.
Thanks for this video Allen, it helped me understand Barris more and like the mini series better as a result
I think the basic problem is actually an inherent weakness of combining the triptych method of story telling with episodes that aren't long enough, it can work beautifully when you have all the needed context but it quickly falls apart when you don't.
I still haven't watched the Morgan Elsbeth arc, but from my perspective what made the the arcs from the first season superior is all of the work that the clone wars, and rebels in for Asoka, put in for these characters. Seeing the series of moments that led to Duku's fall is natively satisfying because we already knew his fate and have had enough screen time with the man he would become, similarly the episodes dealing with Asoka during and immediately after the clone wars bookends well with all the context we already have for the charterer to tell a complete story and then again seeing her both trying to just disappear and then choosing to become Fulcrum works because of rebels(and might have left a bad taste in everyones mouth if she had not been established as Fulcrum in Rebels). Conversely Barris'es story starts out really strong showing her during order 66, we know this character and we have context, and then we see her start to go through inquisitor training. Then on what I assume is her first mission she tries to take out her overseer and disappears which feels rushed. Then finally we see her going from 20(?) to what looks to be 40 with zero context for anything between points A and B, for how she went from not being able to land a hit on the unarmed grand inquisitor to being able to do the same thing against an opponent who was presumably more skilled at combat than Barris had been when she was being training with the grand inquisitor. In short Barris'es story is a sequel with a strong introduction but that rushes through the first act skips the second and then skips enough time and context to spoil the third act (which as an episode out of context was well written and well passed). If for instance they had taken a little more time with act 1, had her do enough with the inquisition to constitute an act 2 and then finished with her going into hiding to become that healer you would have had a stronger 3 act structure and instead of preaching to Lyn she could have had to learn those things for herself before choosing to leave.
Luminara may have been cold, but she never tried to ruin the life of her best friend by making sure Ahsoka was falsely accused of the terrorist crimes Unduli had herself committed.
A good act does not wash out the bad, nor a bad act the good. Each should have its own reward.
Thanks Stannis.
I actually quite liked the contrast of Morgan and Barriss path in "Tales of the Empire".
Morgan, who embraced the darkness, bitterness and hatred to avenge the loss of her own people; and Barriss, who charted a path through the Dark and overcame it. Barriss wasn't inherently bad - she was a Healer with compassion - but the Clone Wars and being a young soldier messed everyone up.
I just wondered WHO "the Friend" was that the family was going to see. Could it have been Ahsoka & that is how Barriss found redemption and peace? If so, it could imply some reconciliation between them. 🤔 [Admittedly, it is some bridge to rebuild].
I hope she survived, but as we have seen, one lightsabre thrust to the chest doesn't have to be fatal any longer! 😜
I did think that it could be Ahsoka who Barriss was referring to, it's a popular belief
@@TopGunSGA - With Dave Filoni, it is a distinct probability.
@@TopGunSGA i doubt its ashoka, she doesn't know that ahsoka is alive and she betrayed her to the point of framing her and would result in her going to prison or worse.
Even if she did contact ashoka it would be a massive wtf if ashoka were to forgive her for what she caused her and the shit she made ashoka go through.
@@MNM-lq9te we'll have to wait and see
@@ElMaestroGordoThe old friend is a woman. "Do starej przyjaciółki. Będzie wiedziała co robić". Check Polish dubbing or other gendered languages of that scene.
12:20 I also think that. Have the Separatists use a droid army so the Jedi will be more willing to fight than they would against organic soldiers, or especially conscripts. But (and here's where the evil comes in), have the clones fight alongside the Jedi, so they're still being bombarded with fear and pain and anger as long as they're on the front lines. Just little bits of darkness, wearing them down over time. Until they finally snap, like Barriss. Or Krell. Or Anakin.
*Spoiler*⚠️
I believe Barriss had the right idea, but the absolutely wrong solution. Her betrayal to Ahsoka was the biggest mistake of her life, especially when she embraced those red lightsabers.
I believe she felt and showed remorse when she felt the deaths of the Jedi during Order 66. Especially when one of the Inquisitors she knew (Lyn) just slaughter all those people without hesitation, that was just as shocking as to what Vader did.
But when Bariss really showed development when she stopped Lyn from killing her and almost letting that Jedi die that's when her redemption began and then they show her years later that she's a better person now and had become a master, that to me was amazing cause they're saying she came a long way.
I love that Barriss saved that family and her apprentices' lives and showed compassion for Lyn, and Lyn's remorse showed when she stabbed Barriss realizing she was the only Jedi she met that showed hope, love, and kindness for her.
I feel like Tales of the Empire was Morgan Elsbeth's prologue and Bariss Offee's epilogue.
Hoping to see Baris in Ashoka season 2
I think the episodes should have been about all you have talked about and not what we got. A Doku style arc would help so much to understand her
Such an amazing summary! Keep up the great work! Love your channel!
Was really hoping it was Vader coming over the rim coming for Bariss. He wouldn't want anyone taking any of the redemption credits he was saving! ;)
Everyone who thinks her character just got ruined should go read her original character in the two Medstar books. Tales of the empire REDEEMED Baris' original arc.
Love how you keep that love energy of Star Wars alive 🙏
I really do think that people just don't understand Star Wars... This video is a perfect example of a (mild) deconstruction of how Disney SW is actually trying to answer those deep questions that KotOR II asked, albeit with many, many changes with internal company conflict being a major factor.
You’ve give me a new and interesting perspective on Barriss that I hadn’t considered before, I feel that Luminara gets a bad rap though.
Though criticisms of her strictness to the Jedi code/general Jedi inflexibility and her lack of attachment is very valid, my take is that she simply doesn’t fear death and allows the force to guide her (there’s no need for physical attachment with the understanding that the physical world isn’t the be all and end all of things) as well as utilising tried and tested procedure, rather necessarily making bad decisions. It’s easy to judge her decisions (and the Jedi in general) in hindsight, but her decisions in regards to fulfilling her duty and what she was presented with were pretty logical. eg. The mission to escort Nute Gunray that you mentioned, she didn’t see Ahsoka being able to hold her own, Ahsoka had been defeated and locked in a prison. Given that they needed to both guard Nute and stop Ventress, that Ahsoka was unsuccessful at stopping Ventress, and that Luminara was the most experienced, it made the most sense to split up rather than leaving one objective unmonitored or risking a recently defeated Padawan in re-engaging a highly trained assassin.
There was a story to be told about Barriss Offee
Yeah you know what this changed my view on the Barriss episodes I actually see what your talking about and see myself agreeing with it
Fans had different expectations , and I do still love her character and am excited for this.
Well with Morgan it was pretty interesting for them to link her to Rebels in the way that they had it that she designed the TIE Defender and that is how she ended up being an ally to Thrawn. Ophee pretty much wasn't entirely evil, but she saw that the Jedi had fallen from being peacekeepers and using the powers of the light to aid in that pursuit. To being directly involved in war with most of them acting in the roles of Generals and Commanders. Which was against the Jedi beliefs. Often choosing direct confrontation and violence over any diplomacy. The only reason she joined the Inquisitors was because she was made to believe that they were actually helping the galaxy by stopping the Jedi and bringing them to justice, as the Fourth Sister pretty much told her. Also, the choice was either to join the ranks of the Inquisitors or be put to death. Once realizing that they had no intention of capturing Jedi to put them on trial she had no intention of staying. Pretty much a common trope with imperial servants that then turn rebel is that they get snapped out of it once they are put in the position of conducting atrocities against innocent people. Iden Versio, Crics Maydeen, Mayweather in the Mandalorian, Sabeen Wren when her weapon was used to kill her own people.
You know what I was perfectly satisfied with it and I'm glad we got to see what happened to her. But a lot of other critics like Star wars theory they just ripped on the series for no good reason That's why I like you man You're honest.
10:28 Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm like 99% sure that Luminara Unduli was never a council member.
Literally tho like I don’t remember she was a member nor a part of the Jedi Council
Hey you fixed the mic issue from the last video 👍🏽
I feel that the frustration with Barriss history comes from feeling how much of a wasted potential it is. Miss goody two shoes, apprentice of the most nun looking jedi in appearences and behavior, having a break down at the hypocrisy of the Jedi Order and the war. There is some gold there, but Clone Wars botched it, barely going beyond the initial thought of the premise. She radicalizes off screen to a point of murdering hundreds and coldly framing her supposed best friend, leaving a lot to the fans to fill the holes. We have no face to face between her and Ahsoka, which sounds like super basic with this premise. No conversation between her and Luminara, an established secundary characters. The pay offs that could give us more, define her history better, characterize her better, never appeared in Clone Wars, and i feel some expected the Tales of the Empire to be a second chance. You are still in time to do all of this. We know Luminara was captured and eventually executed by the Inquisitors. Why dont make Barriss be the one who did that? It sounds like an obvious pay off. We could have had a climatic duel between her and Ahsoka. Instead, as expected from Disney Wars, Barriss plot is quite generic. You could change her with a random Jedi who did something bad during the Clone Wars, invented for the occassion, and it wouldnt be such a great change in the overall plot. Its could fit any Jedi forcefully recruited into the Inquisitors, but to prompt caring for the story, they use a familiar face. Its again a case of wasted potential. Imagine what gold you could dig from Luminara confronting her ex-padawan, a nihilistic and cronically depressed Barriss, uncaring about her awful situation because, from her point of view, the Inquisitorius dont care for her more than the Jedi, both expect her to kill, to die, and will ditch her once her usefulness is over, all in the name of order. That she already tried to stop it, nobody listened, not even her beloved master, andonly achieved succesfully becoming a monster anyway, so she DESERVES the Inquisitorius. Perhaps some flashbacks here and there to boost the story. One where you could show Barriss, before the war, as a healer, showing how much meaning she extracted from nursing people back to health and fighting to protect others. How much meaning she extracted by looking at her master, infallible at her eyes, for guidance and answer. Some flashback of the war, with Barriss trying to share her anguish with Luminara, but she is told to be restrained with her emotion and forget about it. Or trying it with Ahsoka, but she doesnt really think of the war that much, she is having her fights and her banter with Anakin. All of this to show the contrast between her when she felt she had meaning in her life, and her nihilistic and voided Inquisitor self. Show us her frustration towards her master, the fall of a heroe in her eyes due to blind faith in the Order, and her envy towards Ahsoka, with such a close relationship with her master, who seems to be having even fun with the war sometimes, while Barriss is having depression due to it. All for us to reach properly the obvious climax of such a story: that murdering of her once idol, Luminara, or a sad final fight with Ahsoka, where you can either make her die a broken and regretful mess, asking Ahsoka if she remembers when they met, saying she is sorry, for once. Or be defeated, laying down her weapon, breaking down emotionally, confessing how tired she is, lost in a nighmare of blood that never ends, with no one she could really trust to support her, almost wishing that the next Jedi she finds ends her for good. Maybe asking Ahsoka to be the one to do it, as she for sure must hate her. The type of stuff that currently belong to the realm of speculation and fanfiction, the fans filling gaps in their head, as usual. This sounds to me like the type of stuff that should have been showed or at least attempted. It would have made a basic on rails and predictable story that feels like a shoe, interchangeable, into a unique one. Barriss's story. A story and interactions only she could have, that are there, awaiting to be digged, and once again have been squandered, in the minds of some. Maybe they cant verbalize it, but they feel something is missed here.
Because they way it stands right know, Barriss story has been be recruited, some dark side training, oh no they are so mean, i leave, im good now. So wasteful. Inquisitors are supposed to be mini Vaders, people so broken they would allow themselves to be used and sacrificed by their superior, their life mean as much as the level of usefullness they have. They did better in Fallen Order, and Barriss had more to work with than Trilla Suduri/Second Sister.
I've been saying this ever since the trial episodes were released.
Barriss's goal was the restoration of the Jedi order as she believed it should be; that of mediators, peace keepers, healers, and teachers. Remember that she spent time as a padawan before the outbreak of the clone wars, so she has first hand experience of how they order was before it was took on the role of military commanders. Becoming generals and soldiers was antithetical to everything she believed the Jedi should stand for, and Ahsoka was unfortunately through little fault of her own, the embodiment of everything Barriss despised in the militaristic Jedi order during TCW; a Jedi trained as a soldier, unwittingly perpetuating the influence of the dark side, and who having known nothing but war, would have their teachings of any future padawans skewed by that experience. Certainly in perpetuating the war, she felt that the Jedi had become tools of the Dark Side, and only in withdrawing from the war, and returning to their traditional roles could they resist.
Her methods about how to achieve that were reprehensible and outright criminal, even before the betrayal of Ahsoka, but her ultimate goal was a good one. Sadly goals do not excuse methods, but her intentions were not to destroy the order, but to renew and restore it to how it was before it succumbed to the influence of the dark side.
I've argued before that based on this view, Barriss would have had little reason to become an inquisitor, and as we saw, she did reject it, and the dark side in the end.
In the end? What was she on the dark side for all of like thirty seconds? And that's if you count killing someone who is openly trying to kill you, a dark side act. She did feel at fist that the remaining Jedi should be neutralized. But her technique for finding them was about as innocuous as it gets. And when she found them she tries to talk them into surrendering so they could be rehabilitated. As an inquisitor Barriss was a better Jedi than many Jedi were during the clone war.
Filoni said that Barriss was not meant to be an inquisitor, but people kept clamoring for it. So he showed them just how silly the idea of Barriss as inquisitor actually is. Then he put her on the path he had originally planed for her...working with the hidden path.
After finding her the first thing Anakin does is "hugging" Ahsoka.
Luminara is detached. I do not know, little detail I noticed.
Beside, given the stories, it is clear who is actually the superior teacher.
Hawkey Pierce in Mash also went insane, because of war.
1:51 yay im not the only one who read that book
Bariss isn't evil, just complex.
Alan, would you ever feel like doing a video where you talk about star wars books? I'm looking for recommendations.
also Generations tech Please tell me when do you think you can make more Star Wars? What if alternate scenarios. You once did it, so why not now? Also, do you believe Boba and Omega are gonna cross paths sometime in another live action TV show or animation? Because we all want to see it happen.
Tldr, she hates the systemic issues of the jedi, not the symbolic nature of the jedi.
I think my main problem with the arc is that it's not really enough time dedicated to justify her redemption. Idc that she's redeemed, I care that she's actually shown to be redeemed. We don't really get a lot of time here, and while we can wager through very short dialogue that she regrets some of her actions, nothing really about her redemption calls back to it.
Would've been nice to have a 5-10 full length episode season dedicated to her fall and rise again from that dark place. Rather than what we got.
Wishful thinking sure, and I'm still glad we got it, but it's very disjointed on a storytelling standpoint. Or, maybe less disjointed, and more rushed. Either way, still happy to see Barriss again, but there's a lot of issues in her story to me.
Those who say that she'd be redeemed because of her reasoning (the Jedi going down a path of self-destruction) forget about Count Dooku who collaborated with the Sith for the same reason, also killed people and tried to cover the tracks leading to him, and he also regretted his actions afterwards. But the thing is, once you've gone down a dark path you simply would not feel like you deserve to go back (and deep inside you wouldn't want it because of the "power") .
Besides, with all the villains turning to the good side, how about we finally have another tragic villain and a dark ending? It's been a long time.
By the time Dooku started covering his tracks by killing his friends, he had long been accustomed to "regretful, but necessary, killing and violence. He had left the order over 10 years before killing Yaddle and Sifo Dyas. Offee doesn't have that experience. She was still uncomfortable with unnecessary violence and killing. That's why she was able to reject the dark side. She was shocked out of it. Unlike Lyn and Anakin, she never got to the point where she reveled in killing. Anakin had the Tuskens and Separatist Council for that. Lyn had the villagers (and that probably wasn't her first massacre either). Barriss simply had not waded deeply enough into the dark side to embrace it when she saw its true fruits. While she had started down a dark path, she hadn't traveled so far down that path that she was trapped on it.
I love your videos
Can you tell me more about these extended warranties?
I think Dooku and Barris have super similar story arcs, one in the perspective of a master and one an apprentice disillusioned with the Jedi order but not TRULY hating them. At least, that's sorta how I see it.
I liked your critique that Disney is trying to ensure that it doesn't glorify oppressive regimes. Perfectly fair. What I think more discerning people can appreciate though is seeing what these kinds of organizations are capable of, and why they're enticing in times of cultural crisis. They're vicous, subversive, and they're cruel, but it doesn't happen quickly or all at once. Who would the masses turn to if a malevolent force actually provided work, stability, and safety? That requires a steady hand (at first) and dare I say, competence. Discerning people will understand this is how dictatorship works and can grasp the danger this kind of false hope promises. Seeing the empire constantly portrayed as childish degrades its threat as a credible enemy.
But see that’s the thing Disney is the Empire
But Disney don't mind bowing down to China and kissing the kings ring
There are two concepts to consider:
1) Predictive Programming--the idea that media entities will put out content that, in some manner helps prepare the people for what is being prepared. Someone told me that in the past 20 years, we have had nearly 30 shows/movies dealing with post-pandemic apocalyptic worlds, where viruses just up and killed off most humans...which has NEVER happened due to natural immunities (while American Indians had large amounts killed from smallpox, it didn't kill off all, or most, and the Europeans had become largely immune). Thus, when the WHO or the CDC starts talking about new virus, we are programmed to respond with fear (even though our personal experiences tell us otherwise), and clamor for a large, expansive, and militaristic central government to take control. Disney can be seen thus showing us what IS COMING as a result of the numerous "crises" that are being sent our way, from forever wars in Eastern Europe and the Middle East, to inflation, to societal meltdowns, etc. Being unstable, we have desire stability, and will follow the Empire when it emerges. Those engaged in large scale evil always broadcast what they are going to do...because they are so proud they believe that even IF we know, they will still pull it off.
2) Projection--It seems that entities like to project onto their opponents what they themselves are doing (or would do). While I LOVE the development of the Empire as an entity, or should never be lost that Lucas was basing the Empire off of what he considered the "conservative" political parties in the US...using visual references to known "bad guys" like the National Socialists and Bolsheviks...who were more politically aligned with liberals in the US at the time (and still are in many respects). Consider what Thrawn says to Morgan Elsbeth: most people who join the Empire do so for personal gain. Look at all major politicians, regardless of party, and regardless of country: nearly ALL will push similar policies (that increase government control and decrease personal opportunities to do good and provide for their own livelihoods) and ultimately THEY are the ones who benefit. However, consider the motives for Disney: they have a HUGE market share. They purchased Lucasfilm not out of love for the IP, but for its profitability (which they still exploit) and its ability to act as a venue for their "message". DEI (actually better named DIE) money will be available to make up for lost revenue, so they are not concerned with revenue...just like the Empire was not concerned with the lives of the people it purported to "protect".
@@rezza_lynsaiieh, Disney is more the Trade Federation than the empire. The aid and abet fascism when it’s financially remunerative, and then the fascists declare them enemies of the state when they’re no longer useful or stop towing the party line, just as Nute Gunray and the other conglomerate figureheads were wiped out by Darth Sidious at the end of the war. Disney actively funded the politicians who have now turned on them. Theyre quick to censor on behalf of China and Russia and various Middle Eastern governments, and those governments still hate Disney.
@@aaronaukema1284the amount of mental gymnastics you need to twist George Lucas’ messages into peddling fascistic rhetoric when George is a staunch progressive leftist and the entire theme of Star Wars is how fascists manipulate common people into giving into their hatred, greed and prejudice so that they cede their rights over to despots is honestly astonishingly impressive.
It’s especially ironic that your blind hatred of minorities as lead you to buying into the delusion that Disney pushes a “DEI” message when they are among the most prolific conservative donors in the US, directly financially sponsored legislation that strips human/civil rights away from LGBTI people, and actively censor their own products to cater to socially conservative “anti-woke/anti-DEI” fascists in China, Russia and the Middle East. It would be hilarious if it wasn’t so scary to see just how correct George was, and to see you falling for the very thing his magnum opus was warning against. Fanatical, ideological, obsessive hatred of minorities is used by social conservative despots to strip people of their civil rights. The national socialists did it with Jews and sexual/gender minorities, the Bolsheviks did it with the bourgeoisie (which was just code for Jews and sexual/gender minorities) etc.
Also George named villains after Republicans he disliked, in particular he named Nute Gunray after Ronald Reagan and Newt Gingrich.
0:07 yeah same here man
you do make a good point
despite filoni's timeline was kinda disrupted for revenge of the sith movie deleted scene and legends movie comic of barriss was suppose to die during order 66 for some of prequel characters weren't suppose to be in the original trilogy movies