Well done! I think I’m liking the new vane shape. And I’m impressed with the “ bouncing?” the shaft on the work bench edge to find the dead? spot. Would have never thought about that concept. I can see exactly the idea behind that. I need to build some new arrows for 3-d and I’m going to try this out. Pretty cool video. 👍👍
Always enjoy your videos Matt!! Do you prefer to do the bend test on your workbench or vertically? I recall in one of your earlier videos that bend testing the arrows vertically would eliminate pressure/gravity. Does either method matter when bend testing?
Great video, they look great and hope those 25's can bring your averages up into the mid-high 290's! I am getting the V-Tac 23's dialed in to see if they help my scores as well and so far they are flying great. A few things with Victory; the spine align is the stiff "axis" of the arrow and your bend test reveals the weak axis of the arrow. Both ways give you consistency out of the bow, the stiff axis will just give you less flex. They say in their testing, the stiff axis up gave them the best consistency and accuracy. As for the straightness, I have went through several dozens of different kinds of Victory arrows and on average 10/12 spin like "glass". So when you do get one with any kind of wobble, even one that is at the top of that .001 tolerance, it makes it look bad. I benefit from cutting arrows down quite a bit, so I have no trouble getting all 12 spinning true, but longer draw archers will have to be picky. For the arrow node testing, I have always shot with more point weight, so the node was always up within .5" of the insert or edge of carbon, so I just default to 1/2"-1" in front of the launcher with every setup, depending on insert/collar or point. I am not good enough of a shooter to really tell the difference, but it's easy to do, so why not.
Your videos are fantastic, Mat! What do you think about this method: 1) Bend test each arrow as a starting point. 2) Bare-shaft nock tune each arrow to confirm. I tried this method and found about 25% of the arrows liked a different alignment to shoot consistent paper tears (than the bend test suggested). Once I got the arrows shooting the same paper tear, I then tuned the bow using one bareshaft and fletch the rest. Then start fine tuning the bow. I asked my local shop about the difference between bend testing and nock tuning and he mentioned it was static spine vs. dynamic spine. Apparently, these can be different. Love to hear your thoughts.
I see now that you followed up with a video about bare shaft tuning. I feel like our arrow and bow tuning methods are now very similar. Thanks for the great videos.
Don’t know what it is about the Victory arrows, but even without doing bend testing on them, they fly a lot more consistently than cheaper ones I tested before. I‘d say they are worth their money. I‘m still not sure what to think about the blue hot-melt. That one already cost me a point on my V-TAC 23s and I consider switching to the translucent stuff you find at the hardware store.
It’s your junk 3d printed mod saw. Not one arrow did you turn over and spin and coincidence that all the wobble is in one side of the shaft I think not. I shoot a lot of victory arrows and never had more than two that had a tiny wobble on the point side of the shaft and victory puts the spine alignment for a reason in their shafts because it’s the over lap and high spot in the shaft and spine aligning them then shooting through paper will show you that that mark they out in their shaft is there for a reason.
So I grabbed three fully fetched arrows, and then compared them to the original arrow I used for the node test. It’s exactly the same spot. Nothing changed.
@@mat_in_texas that's strange, since the node location should be dependend on the arrow length in my opinion. But since it's hard to locate the exact location (this test will rather give a location range as you pointed out), the node might not have moved much by cutting off those few inches and the pluck test doesn't show it.
Hi Mat! Your videos are awesome! I have one question. What are your specs, draw length, poundage, arrow length. I'm struggle to find appropriate arrow spine for my setup, 30 draw length, 54# arrow length 28,5". Regards bend-test, on avance arrows they show weak spot or direction in which they bend. On only one i could not find bend, every time it was different location.
I think my bow is at 29 1/4” draw, 55 lbs. arrows are cut at 29” C to C with 100 grain points. I’ve found that too stiff is better than even slightly weak.
What holt melt do you use. I’m going to use it for the first time but the summers in Texas can get pretty hot and afraid it’s going to soften the hot melt
@@georgemyers6518 All things being equal, you would see a tail left tear on a weak arrow. But a lot of other things can play a role is what you’re seeing in a paper tear.
The bend test is THE way. To me it is irrelevant spine testing on a tester to find the stiff spine because in most cases the weak spine is not 180 degrees (opposite it). eg MFJJ did a vid years ago where he found that the victory spine line was mostly the weak spine (not stiff) and the stiff spine was sometimes 90 degrees to it! I can also attest to Eastons claim that their acc carbon weave manufacturing process makes their arrows spineless as being untrue. Sonic 6.0mm match grades absolutely repeatedly bend to a consistent weak line in a bend test. I'd like to see if Altras spineless claim holds up but I doubt that too. If the arrow will always flex into the weak axis, why would we care where the stiff spine is. Since I've been ignoring the stiff spine and just finding the weak spine your way and setting the cock vane the same way too (on the top side of the concave), bow tuning after string changes, arrow changes, broadhead tuning etc has been a significantly simpler task than ever before. I too did the node test for the first time with my Sonic build. Its tricky because as you cut the arrow, the node moves. So if you find the node and then take 2 inches off the nock end, the node will have shifted. Not usually by much though and a small rest fore/aft adjustment would account for that if it didn't mess up your rests torque tune position if you in fact do that with your rest. In future i'll cut an arrow close in length, do the node test and then cut the final bit to your exact length which won't actually move it much. If you get caught out you can manipulate your point weight which also dictates the node location. Although with a drop away like a QAD I doubt it makes any difference but perhaps with a slower to drop limb driven.
The bend test has absolutely made set up and tuning a breeze. This node thing might have a learning curve. I’m definitely gonna play with it a bit. What are you currently shooting?
@@mat_in_texas My whole setup is for hunting but I obviously 'train' at the range. I shoot easton sonic 6.0 basically because they are the smallest arrow around that still has an insert system like a .246 where the insert is still footed yet goes entirely inside the arrow. and the shaft can still take an impact collar. The 300 spines I shoot actually take the easton #6 match grade HIT impact collars from the thickest spine FMJ/axis 5mm arrows. So I can have a 15gr collar and then slide 50-75gr of brass through that. Just an insert strength choice really. I bought .003's and after cutting off whichever end required it, I only had one reject out of twelve. With your bend test method and cutting them to length considering the node test (which had them a tad longer than I'd normally have them), they are grouping field points and single bev broadheads at 50m better than I've had on any setup before. I shoot a Bowtech Solution SS. Top vids mate!
What’s your go-to Target Arrow?
Victory V-TAC 23
@@AkiDarkWolfTeam Victory!
Well done! I think I’m liking the new vane shape. And I’m impressed with the “ bouncing?” the shaft on the work bench edge to find the dead? spot. Would have never thought about that concept. I can see exactly the idea behind that. I need to build some new arrows for 3-d and I’m going to try this out. Pretty cool video. 👍👍
@@timbow50 I was taken back when I saw George Ryles demonstrate it and then tried it on my own arrows. I knew I had to implement it into these arrows.
Always enjoy your videos Matt!! Do you prefer to do the bend test on your workbench or vertically? I recall in one of your earlier videos that bend testing the arrows vertically would eliminate pressure/gravity. Does either method matter when bend testing?
Adjust your rollers so they're not on the decals. That might explain some of the wobble.
That could help, but that one was pretty wobbly regardless
Great video, they look great and hope those 25's can bring your averages up into the mid-high 290's! I am getting the V-Tac 23's dialed in to see if they help my scores as well and so far they are flying great.
A few things with Victory; the spine align is the stiff "axis" of the arrow and your bend test reveals the weak axis of the arrow. Both ways give you consistency out of the bow, the stiff axis will just give you less flex. They say in their testing, the stiff axis up gave them the best consistency and accuracy.
As for the straightness, I have went through several dozens of different kinds of Victory arrows and on average 10/12 spin like "glass". So when you do get one with any kind of wobble, even one that is at the top of that .001 tolerance, it makes it look bad. I benefit from cutting arrows down quite a bit, so I have no trouble getting all 12 spinning true, but longer draw archers will have to be picky.
For the arrow node testing, I have always shot with more point weight, so the node was always up within .5" of the insert or edge of carbon, so I just default to 1/2"-1" in front of the launcher with every setup, depending on insert/collar or point. I am not good enough of a shooter to really tell the difference, but it's easy to do, so why not.
I’m gonna play with them a little bit more, adding a little point weight just to see if that makes a difference
Great video!
@@ryanspaeth2400 Thank you!
Your videos are fantastic, Mat! What do you think about this method: 1) Bend test each arrow as a starting point. 2) Bare-shaft nock tune each arrow to confirm. I tried this method and found about 25% of the arrows liked a different alignment to shoot consistent paper tears (than the bend test suggested). Once I got the arrows shooting the same paper tear, I then tuned the bow using one bareshaft and fletch the rest. Then start fine tuning the bow. I asked my local shop about the difference between bend testing and nock tuning and he mentioned it was static spine vs. dynamic spine. Apparently, these can be different. Love to hear your thoughts.
I see now that you followed up with a video about bare shaft tuning. I feel like our arrow and bow tuning methods are now very similar. Thanks for the great videos.
Put bow string wax on end of nock and they will go right in If you press the in you could bend nock
🤯
Don’t know what it is about the Victory arrows, but even without doing bend testing on them, they fly a lot more consistently than cheaper ones I tested before. I‘d say they are worth their money. I‘m still not sure what to think about the blue hot-melt. That one already cost me a point on my V-TAC 23s and I consider switching to the translucent stuff you find at the hardware store.
That’s a lie. That’s probably the same excuse I would use if I bought cheap crap arrows
It’s your junk 3d printed mod saw. Not one arrow did you turn over and spin and coincidence that all the wobble is in one side of the shaft I think not. I shoot a lot of victory arrows and never had more than two that had a tiny wobble on the point side of the shaft and victory puts the spine alignment for a reason in their shafts because it’s the over lap and high spot in the shaft and spine aligning them then shooting through paper will show you that that mark they out in their shaft is there for a reason.
I’ve used that saw to build about 5 dozen arrows, it’s definitely not the saw. 😂
Great video. Have you 21:09 repeated the test for the node testing After cutting the arrow? Would be interesting to see where the node has moved.
Let me go check, I’ll be right back.
So I grabbed three fully fetched arrows, and then compared them to the original arrow I used for the node test. It’s exactly the same spot. Nothing changed.
@@mat_in_texas that's strange, since the node location should be dependend on the arrow length in my opinion. But since it's hard to locate the exact location (this test will rather give a location range as you pointed out), the node might not have moved much by cutting off those few inches and the pluck test doesn't show it.
Hi Mat! Your videos are awesome! I have one question. What are your specs, draw length, poundage, arrow length.
I'm struggle to find appropriate arrow spine for my setup, 30 draw length, 54# arrow length 28,5".
Regards bend-test, on avance arrows they show weak spot or direction in which they bend. On only one i could not find bend, every time it was different location.
I think my bow is at 29 1/4” draw, 55 lbs. arrows are cut at 29” C to C with 100 grain points. I’ve found that too stiff is better than even slightly weak.
@mat_in_texas thanx for input. I've noticed that little stiffer on spine is better.
What holt melt do you use. I’m going to use it for the first time but the summers in Texas can get pretty hot and afraid it’s going to soften the hot melt
@@m-1608 I’ve been using the blue Bohning glue and haven’t had an issue with points or inserts pulling out, even when I was out shooting in 95° temps.
@ sorry, I had this playing in back ground while was shooting and just heard that you mentioned it in the freaking video
@ 😂 no worries
Would arrows with a slightly weak spine go left or right with a right handed shooter ?
@@georgemyers6518 All things being equal, you would see a tail left tear on a weak arrow. But a lot of other things can play a role is what you’re seeing in a paper tear.
what is this device you use to do the spine alignement?
@@michaelhenschel4356 it’s just a bar clamp. You can pick them up at any hardware store
The bend test is THE way. To me it is irrelevant spine testing on a tester to find the stiff spine because in most cases the weak spine is not 180 degrees (opposite it). eg MFJJ did a vid years ago where he found that the victory spine line was mostly the weak spine (not stiff) and the stiff spine was sometimes 90 degrees to it! I can also attest to Eastons claim that their acc carbon weave manufacturing process makes their arrows spineless as being untrue. Sonic 6.0mm match grades absolutely repeatedly bend to a consistent weak line in a bend test. I'd like to see if Altras spineless claim holds up but I doubt that too. If the arrow will always flex into the weak axis, why would we care where the stiff spine is. Since I've been ignoring the stiff spine and just finding the weak spine your way and setting the cock vane the same way too (on the top side of the concave), bow tuning after string changes, arrow changes, broadhead tuning etc has been a significantly simpler task than ever before.
I too did the node test for the first time with my Sonic build. Its tricky because as you cut the arrow, the node moves. So if you find the node and then take 2 inches off the nock end, the node will have shifted. Not usually by much though and a small rest fore/aft adjustment would account for that if it didn't mess up your rests torque tune position if you in fact do that with your rest. In future i'll cut an arrow close in length, do the node test and then cut the final bit to your exact length which won't actually move it much. If you get caught out you can manipulate your point weight which also dictates the node location. Although with a drop away like a QAD I doubt it makes any difference but perhaps with a slower to drop limb driven.
The bend test has absolutely made set up and tuning a breeze.
This node thing might have a learning curve. I’m definitely gonna play with it a bit. What are you currently shooting?
Also, I’m very interested in the new Easton 5.0 arrow. Lots of hype around that arrow.
@@mat_in_texas My whole setup is for hunting but I obviously 'train' at the range. I shoot easton sonic 6.0 basically because they are the smallest arrow around that still has an insert system like a .246 where the insert is still footed yet goes entirely inside the arrow. and the shaft can still take an impact collar. The 300 spines I shoot actually take the easton #6 match grade HIT impact collars from the thickest spine FMJ/axis 5mm arrows. So I can have a 15gr collar and then slide 50-75gr of brass through that. Just an insert strength choice really. I bought .003's and after cutting off whichever end required it, I only had one reject out of twelve. With your bend test method and cutting them to length considering the node test (which had them a tad longer than I'd normally have them), they are grouping field points and single bev broadheads at 50m better than I've had on any setup before. I shoot a Bowtech Solution SS. Top vids mate!
That’s a really good point. Maybe I should look into the Sonics too.