Would These Indie Heroes Survive the Cult of the Lamb? Part 2
Вставка
- Опубліковано 24 лип 2024
- @rougarabid
#cultofthelamb #hollowknight #castlecrashers #monsterboy #skultheheroslayer #shovelknight #cuphead #thebindingofisaac
Intro - 00:00
Final Hollow Knight Arguments - 00:58
Don't Stave - 7:05
Dead Cells - 13:04
Hades - 21:54
Skulls of the Shogun - 31:39 - Ігри
Part 2 is here you sexy bitches! Enjoy pure unadulterated violence without all those pesky consequences. Fuck that shit.
Can you do souls like main character vs elden ring bosses
If we get a part 3 I think plague knight would be decent to get in this series
I would like to see penitent one in part3
You Drastically underestimated the Castle Crashers, they are actually stupidly overpowered. They can Peirce multi-inch thick steel plate armor with JUST a carboard tube, have basically infinite arrows and fire them at very fast rate, Shrug off hits from LIGHTSABERS and point blank explosions, swim AGAINST rapid river currents in heavy armor, defeated the evil wizard who stole the giant magical crystal (which even don't know that much about) which likely contains a ridiculously high amount of magic power, Go faster than calvary, and have you even heard about INSANE MODE. Case closed the Castle Crashers win.
Also, In Castle Crasher you can play as almost any non-boss character (although you can also play as the necromancer) including regular knights and peasants. So basically, everyone is that strong.
Tbh just the idea of the Lamb and the Knight/Shadelord fighting it out constantly on the island and all of the Lamb’s followers routinely being massacred and revived is metal as hell so a stalemate would still go hard
5:33
The Awoken Dream Nail
"The Dream Nail is upgraded. It can break into even the most protected mind."
Tbh Zag would die almost instantly due to the nature of his curse binding him to the underworld. He can’t survive long outside of the underworld, as his soul is bound there (he’ll die of “natural causes” shortly after, no matter where he is.) So, if the area of the cult of the lamb that he finds himself in is not the specific underworld which he is bound to, simply put, he will die within minutes. Though, that’s a less entertaining answer lmao
I mean, in Hades 2 melinoe was able to surpass this curse with a simple pot and herbs, if she could he deffinitely can.
@@Alex-ko897 yeah but she’s a witch given a spell to lessen the curse on herself and Zag isn’t
@@simonegesualdo6636 im saying that if it was possible for her, maybe it isn't that far fetched that Zagreus could also get rid of it
Same for Hades himself if I understood correctly.
@@leurunner4764No Hades doesnt have that restriction but hes is way to busy to go up there and has no reason to.
The knight would win because he has the pre-patch fluke charm that only costs 2 charm notches
Nahhh this is just cruel 😭
Don’t forget quick slash
Wayward Compass solos
Hey, we want a fight to be some what fair@@XpathTheChojiro
@@XpathTheChojiro not sure why he didn't mention wayward compass smh
something that Webber has going for him is the fact that in the game all spiders peaceful to him until he attacks so he could probably live in the silk cradle for some time.
Also he can join the lambs cult which will help him survive
Just hope he.doesnt fet sacrificed
Still needs to be careful of scorpions, swordsman, followers of the old faith if he doesn't make friends with Shamura.
@@OvalSpirit true
@@nobody..--. He did. Webber is canonically in the Cult of the Lamb
@@rougarabidthere was a collab?
"only 4 characters for this one"
somehow longer than last time
yooooo
Hey, hey, hey…it’s 4 minutes shorter.
@@rougarabid and yet it had twice the characters
quality over quantity
I know he isn't indie, but Wario could probably endlessly stalemate, because for whatever reason, it's stated in one of the warioland games I think that he can't die unless he wants to. Which is hilarious to imagine lamb stabbing him and screaming about why he isnt dying.
And transmog likely won’t even work against him, since transformation is a large part of the Warioland games.
All he probably has to do once transformed is to get set on fire, thus changing him into Flaming Wario, which he can recover from.
the only problem might be Mindcontroll, but propably Warios Ego just cancels that out to
@@Silver_Sonic_23 if the lamb tried then Wario could just say, "no"
Wario will be transformed and then just... turn back I mean it's not like he's never done that before
Yeah, truth be told Wario is a complicated character to assess overall.
Having him be added into the cult via suggestion is already a no-go considering his greed is too great to overcome in any realistic way. Best chance would be telling him he can have ALL the treasure he'd ever want if he joins, but that runs the risk of immediately making him want the cash outta em instead.
12:51 since Lamb is the only one who can build (in his cult), I think he will appreciate Wilson, because he is a scientist who has many opportunities to help a cult
Lamb isn’t the only one who can build. He decides what gets built and can build things but his Followers can build everything he can. I don’t doubt Wilson might be able to build things they can’t though.
@@rougarabid
I mean, only Lamb can create something completely new(Divine Inspiration), but Wilson in his peak know how to make all buildings from Constant (if he have resources) and it includes how to grow giant plants, powerful weapon and armor (for followers), after all, refrigerators, for food not to become rotten after 3 days
@@mrundercrow not exactly countering your point
but I don't think food goes bad in Cult of the Lamb? the closest to that would be a burnt meal that's inedible and you have to clean up
arguably that could be said to just be a gameplay thing but I'm not gonna argue either side of that
It is also debatable that Webber only got instantly indoctrinated due to a combination of just being resurrected, and being a literal child, two things that would make one very influenceable.
Fair but literally no one in the game can resist the indoctrination not even gods so it’s unlikely Wilson will.
@@rougarabidIndoctrination has nothing on my ability to burn myself to a crisp and wake up in bed after 5 seconds
Or I could invite him to my town, give him some food.
@@rougarabid not that i disagree that Wilson would probably be indoctrinated, but didn't the gods only give in after being weakened? please correct me if I'm wrong I haven't touched cult of the lamb too much
he is canonically an adult in COTL, something that was decided by devs of both games since you can marry and sacrifice him. they did decide to leave out mating him though for anyone that doesnt know so they arent weirded out
I think you’re making the beheaded seem way too hero-like, he doesn’t usually act like that. Specially once he recover his memories we see he’s actually incredibly selfish
Also the corruption in his world is not like the cult of the lamb. In his world the corruption isn’t just people being depraved the corruption is an actual infection that spreads itself quickly and unstoppably.
He mostly just wants to save himself
For Hades, there are a few things.
1. Gods can take physical forms, even the gods that are just places and concepts, as seen with Uranos as he needs a physical form to be able to be castrated, or Styx, yes as in the river.
2. Gods have shown they can destroy locations if they want to, such as with Atlantis. And while Atlantis was a large island, that still doesn't change that the idea of Demeter covering the entire world in snow isn't possible.
3. None of the main Olympians play a role in the creation of earth. They may rule over it or help with civilization or invent things for human civilization and culture, but they don't tend to create landmarks or locations for the most part. That would be the Primordials who we know exist in Hades because Nyx and Chaos are right there.
4. The columns not breaking could be for game mechanics. Keep in mind in his second phase, Hades fires blasts from his Bident that follow the player. And while there are various ways to avoid them, the main way is by hiding behind the pillars.
5. Zagreus isn't a demigod. While Persephone was half godess, she's still considered a full one by time she has Zagreus and leaves the Underworld. Zag bleeding red is really his only connection to being a demigod.
6. Zag's weapons would actually make him the most suited for killing the bishops, as his weapons were used to maim the Titans; who are just older gods with different abilities and a different title because Chronos chopped off Uranos' balls. Not to mention the fact that gods in Hades can't die, as Chronos was dismembered and survived but needed to put himself back together with outside help.
7. Zag would probably resist transmogrification as while the Gorgon heads and Megagorgon can turn him to stone, he can break out of it.
Though I agree Zag ultimately loses because he can't live on the surface. At most Hecate hypothesized he could survive a day but once that's over he'll be claimed by the river Styx.
One thing to add to this is that Zagreus’s goal is to escape Hades and it would probably be the same here too. It would probably be in his character to allow himself to die and go back to the river of blood that he spawns from since he’s specifically tied to it.
The only exception to this, I think, would be if Zag isn’t able to go back to Hades by dying and he knows it, but his goal would still be trying to escape rather than survive or stop what’s going on.
Your knight vs lamb argument just made me imaging the lamb looking really confused while the knight dashes and jumps and button mashes around in like 1 spot
Sounds like a normal battle against Starfox in Smash.
The lamb walking into the background to avoid getting hit
I think we need Peppino to be mentioned here too, he is a indie protagonist after all and he is quite strong
lamb will not be able to kill Peppino because funny
Im not gonna sugar coat it...
I am not gonna sugarcoat It.
*Parry, parry parry parry Super parry*
Lamb: *Turns Peppino into a bug.
Peppino: *stings/bites the lamb.
Lamb: *Slaps Bug Peppino.
Peppino: *Turns back to normal and takes knockback.
Lamb: "NANI!?"
What I did notice about majority of people bringing up about Hollow Knight is they focus too directly on the Knight's direct feats instead of other elements in result of how he would obtain it.
What to focus actually, if the Knight ever hopes to defeat the lamb, is looking at the Void during the endgame boss fight.
For what I understand how the void start to emerge into a realm such as the dream realm is through hindering the strongest enemy's influence over the realm as the Knight itself gain more foothold. And the void fully cosumes the realm excluding the strongest foe when the Hollow Knight is at the position to turn into the Shade Lord. Another way the Knight gained power is through the slaughter of enemies and gaining some.sort of power up else where in the realm, similarly to the lamb's path but without gaining members to uphold your own power.
Just excluding the Knight for now and focus on the Void near the end of the game, the way the void interact with the realm is unique compared to the gods of Cult of the Lamb that had limited influence in an area. For the void, it is all over and present within the Void is an undetermined amount of shades/souls that could interact with the physical plane, giving how they aid the Knight by ripping a weakness open on the boss. Not sure what possibilities the entities could do in the void.
The Void may actually cover up part of the weaknesses that the Knight itself could handle by himself. Given an uncertain number of entities and how the void arrives, getting rid of the Lamb's members for him and preventing an easy resurrection more plausible if the void start to take over the island. And with countless aiding on the Knight's side and with it not like other cultists the Lamb faced, this could represent a harrowing challenge for the Lamb. By taking over the island I mean by how effective the Void could take over, being shown ingame how they swallow the dream realm whole. This could possibly go either for the physical realm or within the Lamb's mind.
Again, the main problem I'm seeing regarding of supporting the Knight is they are too focus on direct feats of the Knight without considering other elements that aid him, the Void being one of them. And if the Lamb thinks he could simply respawn, the Knight may not let the Lamb die right there, but let the Void consume them instead in the same fashion as the final boss of Hollow Knight.
The addition of the Void may seem to be a very unfair advantage for the Knight over the Lamb that look easier to kill the god of death. Not everything that the Knight could able to defeat on his own, but with aid such as this he could possibly succeed.
Actually, did you consider of power ups on the island that other indie heroes could use if in-game mechanics or lore from their respective games line up similarly in Cult of the Lamb?
I don't think bosses could one-shot the beheaded, considering they deal the same damage as a regular cultist
Everyone in the whole game deal the same damage as far as health goes. Should I scale the cultists up to TOWW in terms of attack power? This is a game mechanic.
@@rougarabid one quick note, unless you already heard it, but the Beheaded is capable of changing bodies inside the same run (a Cultist in Fractured Shrines, or the Spoiler change near the end of the game), and he keeps all of his mutations. He loses them because of the time loop made by the Time Keeper.
He still ain't beating Bishops or the Lamb, but at least he eventually beats all the minor bosses.
Also, his goal isn't necessarily getting rid of the "corruption" of the kingdom. Malaise is a nearly incurable disease. Beheaded's goals vary based on endings. But it all boils down to one thing: he wants to survive. The Spoiler ending and the Queen and the Sea ending both have him do what he does in them for him to just survive (escaping the Island, or doing what he's doing in the Spoiler endings). He's really selfish if you take into account everyrhing we know about him, so I doubt he would go out of his way to just rid this Island of the cults. If the cults were some biological disease, then maybe he would try something, but mostly because he wants to save himself.
12:47 I feel like if he could use his inventions or research to help aid the lamb like adding upgrades to weapons or existing structures, or add additional boosts then the lamb would be discouraged from sacrificing him as he'd be more useful alive then dead. Heck, if he proves his worth, the lamb might even gift him the golden skull necklace which grants the wearer the immortality trait
Yeah the whole “He might sacrifice him” point was mostly a joke.
Knowing that The Knight could THEORETICALLY kill The Lamb is all I needed to know to put this argument to rest
Lamb is a God of Death who comes back stronger every time he dies and even straight up just choose not to. So no theoretically The Knight can’t.
@@rougarabidyou're assuming the knight is just gonna stand there and watch while the Lamb preforms the ritual and revives a dead cultist? That's as stupid as an anime villain letting the hero do their full transformation and power activation sequence. It's the logic of guns doing literal pixels of damage to a health bar but being a one-shot in the very next cutscene.
@@Arcana_zero_studios The ritual to revive a dead cultist takes seconds and he has 3 days to do it. As I’ve said The Knight can’t kill him so not sure why you think Lamb won’t be able to preform it
@@rougarabid because the lamb is constantly fighting the knight? seems pretty obvious to me that if the lamb could just do the ritual Wherever he wouldn't have any problems. HOWEVER their busy fighting the knight. 3 seconds is more then enough for the knight to just attack and break the lambs concentration or just shade soul them from a distance
@@rougarabidalso consider the charms summoning creatures, the knight could send down volleys of primal aspids, which we all know the Lamb would commit some sort of hyper death suicide rather then facing those freaks
Skulls of the shougun turns the island into a 40k scenario. Random war general causes a forever war where both sides are in an everlasting stalemate and the only win condition disappeared when they killed the war general
Man the idea of Akamoto and The Lamb teaming up is scary
Oh wow! My suggestion not only made it into the video but was also the first thing mentioned! I'm honored!
I also quite like the wilson argument. I don't think he'd actually join the lamb or any of the other cults, but I can definitely see him interacting with them. Something akin to Helob.
This also isnt anything concrete, but I would believe wilson would be particularly difficult to control and indoctrinate not because of some immunity like the knight but because he has pretty much constantly been aftected by darkness, corruption, hypnotism and insanity thanks to the shadows and moonlight of the constant. I'm led to believe he's got a pretty good handle on his mind.
I can definitely see him trading some knowledge for food and even swing by to say hello to webber, maybe bring the boy some ice cream since its his favorite. (And lamb doesnt know how to make it)
Funny thing, Hades 2's protagonist actually has a better chance than Zagreus. Clear upscaling from the gods, Poseidon outright sinks an island iirc, and unlike Zagreus, they can actually survive on the surface, so they won't have the Zag problem of just collapsing when he gets there
One detail with Zagrius we have to ignore for this premise to work is that...He cannot survive very long outside the Underworld. If he is not in Hades/The Underworld, his body will eventually but rapidly, die and will be sent back to the Underworld. So for this to work, we kinda have to ignore the fact that if he's in some form of Mortal Plane, he'll die before the day is up
To put an end to the hollow knight thing, it’s an infinite battle. The transmog ability you bring up would affect the shell and not the shade, which the shell is technically its own being. Neither one can reasonably kill the other.
he-
he literally brought up the argument about the Transmog affecting the Shade in the previous video (not part one, a 'responding to comments' video)
the best argument against transmog that I saw is that Knight could be considered divine and transmog doesn't work on divine beings (bosses)
@@rydergolde3169 but does it work on non-biological beings?
@@fallen9997 this answer feels like a trap and I'll explain why:
Cult of the Lamb, to my knowledge, does not included non-biological *enemies* that you can fight
there is no canon proof to answer the question "yes" and there's no canon that answers "no"
so therefore I feel safe in saying that this question just does not matter, as there's no substance to answer it without heaps of speculation
@@rydergolde3169 It's still safer to ssume transmog wouldn't work on Knight. As we all know, it ain't working on bosses, and the creator of the video estabilished that Knight would beat them and Bishops. And he also used the logic of "if X item isn't working on bosses from X game, it will not work on X character" with Eraser from TBoI, which he assumed wouldn't work on the Lamb.
@@fallen9997 funny you mention this now, because Transmog was actually covered in the latest 'responding to comments' video on this topic
You could put a phantom in front of Wilson and he would ignore it as a "misunderstood phenomena" so I think he would be like the other neutral npcs that you can't control rather than a special follower
I do have one important thing to note about Hollow Knight, it is a correction, but probably doesn't change the outcome. By the end of Hollow Knight, the knight obtains the power to successfully use the dream nail on even greatly shielded minds, such has that of the seer and The Hollow Knight. I believe that the lamb could possibly shield their mind from the normal dream nail, but not the true dream nail, which the knight would have due to the equipment stipulation.
I didn’t argue that he could shield himself from it but that once the Knight entered The Lamb would be incredibly powerful there.
@@rougarabid iirc, you said something about The Lamb potentially being shielded from The Knight's dream nail due to being a powerful psychic, but yes, The Knight getting into The Lamb's head is nowhere close to guaranteed victory for The Knight.
@rougarabid to be fair, the lamb being powerful their doesnt mean much when youve killed a dream god in her own realm.
5:53 the lamb has a strong mind, that didn’t stop the knight from slaying the dreamers, who were essentially the strongest mind of Hallownest and absorbing them!
See this is how we can’t even compare them. The Dreamers could be either much weaker in mind or much stronger but we have no idea because it isn’t quantifiable
The knight kills a Goddess of dreams . . . In her own domain.
technically as far as I know, the Dreamers were simply individuals who had to sleep eternally to act as Living Seals to contain THK
calling them "the strongest minds" feels wrong considering... they put up absolutely zero fight once you're in their minds
even Lurien, the one who is entirely against unsealing the Temple of the Black Egg, puts up zero fight to being killed and unsealed
They died willingly but knight still stomps
The malaise from dead cells proceeds to kill everybody*
In dead cells, you say that he would lose all of his mutations in a new body, but in the game we can take over a body to go to a new location and not lose out on our mutations, and for hollow knight, can you use the animal transmutation spell on the bishops? Or the one who waits? No, and the shade Lord has the power to put down a God of light, so he would be up there with the bishops, and the spell probably wouldn't work on him
Edit: also, with the knight, even if the lamb is more powerful in the dream world, the knight can't die in the dream world and he can try again and again until he kills the lamb
Plus he has a surplus of headless bodies of dissenters...
its a sans fight cenario XD, one is very powerfull and the other can just retry everythime he fails
well i guess fire breathing, immortality and a talisman with glowing energy flowing out of it is science
I said the mutations are science which we know by them being called mutations. I know there’s magic but very few of his hax are actually based in magic
@@rougarabid does this list also consider the pancea, (he only gets access to it for a short time, i understand) and while i get you might consider it science, it turned a little scholar man into a semi-magic super soldier, and if said science is able to give magic, would that not make it magic itself
Sure. Doesn’t change what I said though. Most of his HAX are magic. That’s not hax.
"Sufficiently analyzed magic is no different from science!"
-Agatha Hetrodyne
I think the only 2 things to be mentioned with Wilson is that he does resist mind control as we see in game and that he can locally produce Nightmare fuel through his hallucinations, which might see the Lamb favoring him within his cult and not sacrificing him.
the Shadows in Don't Starve are exclusive to The Constant (and Maxwell's personal magics)
the only times they appear outside of The Constant are directly tied to Maxwell or The Constant itself... except the Terrorbeak that gave notes to Willow-
point being, Shadows of all sorts appear as a result of insanity, and killing them just restores one's sanity (but yes, it does yield Nightmare Fuel)
I wouldn't call beating a shadow to death to heal your mind 'resisting mind control'
@@rydergolde3169 I'm talking about during the fuelweaver fight in DST; it has a mind control attack where if your sanity is low enough it will "control you" (stun you for a few seconds cause gameplay) however this attack can be resisted by having your sanity high enough
@@stickman207 if it's just a stun then it's arguably more of a mental attack like Psychic Damage in DND rather than full control
but that does give precedent to Wilson (and by extension the other survivors) resisting mental attacks if their sanity is high enough
@@rydergolde3169 It's reffered to as a mind control attack, it's only a stun for gameplay purposes
@@stickman207 I see, then yea that is precedent enough imho
Frisk from UNDERTALE, Has a shot.
Ye techicaly frisk will beat the whole island because saving and loading and resetting are cannon, and through determination frisk will win. If this is genocide frisk even more so because they can literally erase the whole effing world. Also if this is pacifist, she'll likely have sans, asgore, Toriel, undyne, and alphys. Who have either insane iq or insane magic.
So looks like knight vs lamb is back to an infinite stalemate?
Not according to logic or fundamental truth.
@@rougarabidThere both immortal gods(the knight might be half god considering there entire void thing)so how one supposed to kill the other?
@@rougarabidthere is no fundamental truth with this. They are from two separate universes and we can’t really compare them. For all we know the lamb has a severe peanut allergy that could kill him even if he has followers and the knight is 0.1mm in our measurements.
@@rougarabidi saw some people saying that the knight charm Shape Of Unn might stop lamb win con (transforming ability)
What do you think about that?
Are they right ot wrong?
@@ranmoses2553 that doesnt explain anything jsut becouse the knight can transform doesnt mean they can stop someone else form transforming them
I would like to see the main Hero of Terraria be put into Cult of the Lamb with their end game stuff
Man that would be a real infinite stalemate, the Terrarian far exceeds the Lamb in power and skill, but they have no way of permakill unless they get all the followers. I say this because the Terrarian also has canon revives, as evidenced by the nurse telling you how many times you’ve died, and being able to view your own gravestones.
@@Thing-ho1bw Counter-Argument: Celebration MKII with honestly any rocket that breaks blocks. The entire island would be obliterated within days.
Also the fact that Wilson has Canonically died multiple times in the don't starve universe just proves that he'll survive longer through his mistakes
You are forgetting 2 things about the knight, first off, if the eraser from Isaac wouldn't work on the lamb, why would the lambs transmogrify work on the knight. Also that if the knight is currently fighting the lamb it can't gain followers because it would be to busy. And the knight has ranged AOE damage that coul slowly kill the cult members and then after they are all dead the knight could fight the lamb untill 3 days have passed and win.
Unless Zag gets the same spell treatment his sister does in 2 he wouldn’t even survive for a few hours in lands
So what you are saying about Lamb being more powerful psychic than anything Knight has ever encountered is that the Radiance didn’t dominate the minds(that are not completely obsessed with something) of the entire Hallownest.
Interesting point ngl.
Radiance didn’t dominate their minds. She spread an infection that drove them mad. Not the same thing. The Lamb actually dominates people’s minds. Like literally. Not an infection or passive madness manipulation. He actually rewrites who they are as people and even does it to other gods. Yes that is superior to Radiance.
I don’t know about that
Myla is a prime example if you need one
My point is that Radiance didn’t “drive them mad” she made their entire existence dreaming about her
They attack the knight only because it is made of void(ancient enemy) and Pale King(the person who took everything from her)
Normal bugs, who were sentient do not attack anyone except the knight without a proper reason
And Radiance gives them the proper reason
They follow her commands and think that it is them who makes the decisions
Husks in the city for example
@@rougarabid if you find my comment on the last video you'll see that the infection is actually on a greater level than physical.
As for how well the knight does in a mental fight, well literally all the gods are based in the dreams/minds of others. Quick learning also doesn't matter much in this case when you just compare the speed at which the knight learns and evolves his abilities.
All these together just give the knight a better chance at winning, you even noted how transmutation is the main won con and speed is heavily in the knight's favor
@@rougarabidI think that if the radiance were to actually come to the island, they would easily overpower the people there. Maybe not the bishops, but assuming they have the same reliance on followers, they’d be dead mighty fast. While the Lamb is easily a better user of magic, the Radiance far outclasses them in their hold over everyone. While the Lamb can’t recruit random followers, the Radiance certainly can, and judging by how the infection is biological, it could very well follow to the afterlife and render the Lamb completely out of options. I know this video isn’t about the radiance, just thought it was a bit of a lowball on the powers the Radiance has.
Alright guys hear me out
John Ward from faith the unholy trinity has a power level so high it’s incomprehensible. When this man loses control, the universe shudders in horror. He oneshots everything if he plays his cards right (or horribly wrong)
SKULLS OF THE SHOGUN MENTIONED 🗣🗣🗣🔥🔥🔥🦴🦴🦴
The terrarian from terraria has a big chance he killed the moon lord who is basically Cthulhu but his lower half is missing and has cybernetic parts being his eyes eyes skull the terrarian does have items that help prevent some things like he can transform him self to prevent the lamb from transforming him he has a shield that prevent confusion so that prevents becoming a mindless slave and the terrarian isn’t all good he sacrifices a person to kill a demonic creature made entirely made of human flesh if anything the terrarian can thrive because he has the power to rival a god and has dealt with curses before like cursed flames and also the terrarian can spread the hollow or corruption and plague the land killing everyone by bringing a foreign disease killing all but the lamb
Moonlord is confirmed to just be Cthulhu after the dryads ripped him up.
Please do “could these indi hero’s climb the tower in enter the gungeoun” I think this would be a fun video for power scaling but also seeing if they could beat their own version of their past
Welp, Isaac succeeds. Probably Peppino as well.
@@charleswillhite5375 I would think this video would be for the weakest characters like castle crashers
Since the knight is the child of a pale being and a higher being wouldn’t that make him a higher being at least. And using lore tablets we know that higher beings are of a higher elevation to regular creatures… so shouldn’t the knight have the same resistance to the curse that the mini bosses do? If I am way off then I am sorry
You are right
One of reasons why beheaded respawns isn't only ability to change bodies but also because the island is stuck in time loop
So i guess this is where comes that thing with losing mutations
And my theory is most likely true because in game you can change body, without losing mutations, but once you die the loop restarts and you lose mutations
Saint from rain world or any other scug tbh
enot, saint, gourmand, ect
Not sure if riv being able to summon that thing should count tho-
Saint might have the best chance with the ability to instantly ascend anything. While it does function like death it doesn't appear to be the same. I'm unsure if it would work.
The lamb has a stop time on crusade option so that makes it even harder for people in this vid, since the lamb only allows things to happen in his cult when he isn’t busy.
So about the knight.
You said that all characters will be their strongest form at the end of the game, having its peak ability and such.
The true ending of hollowknight is that he becomes a massive void creature of infinite power and can destroy heaven itself.
Therefore, there is a good chance that he can destroy every living entity on the COTL island.
Hey Rouga Rabid hear me out, you said that if the knight kills all of the Lamb's followers the Lamb has 3 days to live. If the knight dreamnails him and enters his mind, he cannot die this is showed in game if the knight dies in the dreamworld he wakes up in the realworld. And the dreamnail has no cooldown, so if the knight dreamnails the Lamb for 3 days he could win.
(I know that you said you wouldn't talk about this, but this could be possible)
Basically a form of psychic stun lock. Interesting theory. Unlikely it’ll happen though. I said The Knight could figure out he’ll die without followers but he has no way of knowing it takes 3 days. The Knight wouldn’t know to do that. In the Knight’s mind what is he holding him for? There’s also a possibility that the Lamb could just leave since he’s shown having no issues leaving prison dimensions. Definitely an interesting idea but it seems unlikely.
@@rougarabid i have another (extremly unlikely) addition to this scenario. The Knight wouldn't have to kill all followers and then trap the lamb in a stalemate situation. If the fight goes on even longer the followers could possibly die of starvation.
@@rougarabid okay, okay, hear me out, the knight could very well know this for the same reason he knows the weakness in the first place; reading minds. Forgive me if I am wrong but I'm pretty sure the lamb knows how much time he has, even if it isn't explicitly said
I think the shogun might actually be able to kill the lamb through starvation, with such a large army he could wait untill the lamb leaves to go on an expedition and then massacare the cult and ravage the site, after that it would be a matter of keeping the lamb busy for three days which should be doable with a large enough army so he can’t indoctrinate more followers
This is a decent theory. I’ll bring it up in the response video.
about wilson, he has actually died several times in the lore of dont starve. in fact, every character has. the different worlds you create in dont starve are basically just new attempts of the survivors surviving and maybe finding a way to escape the constant, since death would just start the cycle over and over again.
but this isnt the constant, so he could potentially die for good if he runs out of amulets or meat effiges.
but this is where my theory comes in.
the lamb doesnt always try to indoctrinate _everyone_.
plimbo for example is just a guy selling him stuff. even after he bought everything, he still accepts him not being a cult member. same with most other shopkeeps or just generally people of interest.
so i think that if the lamb were to meet wilson, he would likely just help him stay alive by reviving him if necessary, in exchange for like science stuff or just wilsons general craftiness and his capability to create some handy gadgets or even some magic components for the lamb to use.
like for example telling the lamb about touchstones or life giving amulets for the lambs followers, or teaching followers how to survive more effectively while the lamb is on crusades.
all in all, i agree with most of the things you say, with just some disagreements or different views.
it could be interesting if you could include charlie from dont starve in the next video too though. :D
i have a question, Didn't Beheaded defeat Dracula in a crossover with Castelvania?, does that count as canon for dead cells?, because i hear dracula is pretty strong in the games.
True if we say the castlevania crossover is canon the beheaded has not only beaten death itself but olso its boss dracula both of whom are really powerfull and the beheaded servived a reality cutting slash from the queen so if we see the castlevania dlc canon. The beheaded has actually a great chance to not only survive but beat the most powerful beings in colt of the lamb because dracula from castlevania is op but if not then not so much.
With Wilson, I think he would just get turned into a permanent missionary just can’t die from failure
Is transmog the only thing that we can use?
It doesn't work against bosses or even demons at that point which are the many bosses Reason my holiday was brought up so much when it comes to him. Being a higher being, it means that the item wouldn't work against it. Meanwhile, the only way the lamb can use that ability is from relics. The Crown itself can't just transform Anyone on the fly? It's shown even in the trailer that he has to find these items to learn how to use their power. That's the whole trailer for relics of the old faith.
And even then there's a bigger issue if these people trying to kill the lamb like the headless from dead. Tell going into the cult. It's shown in the newest trailer that's that's leading up to the new update. The other crowns of power seem to have similar abilities to the lamb. When it comes to weaponry and cuas shown in the goat, having The Crown of war and being able to match the lamb Although they are working with the land it still brings into question. What if one of these individuals trying to kill the lamb? Gotta hold of The Crown of war. The lamb is cocky enough to leave the crowns as decorations and their followers are so loyal that they don't touch them.
But headless?! Headless is shown to be a Dick in dead cell and gladly takes weapons To give himself an advantage so if he dies he's not out of the fight. He just needs to fool the lamb enough to get to the crowns. And there is a bunch of Magic on the island of dead cell, including necromancy, where it's a world where science and Magic start to meet.
Using the same excuse over and over again isn't gonna work. When in-lore it's shown that it does not work on these higher beings.
Also I wasn't gonna mention this part. Because I thought someone else would. But the only reason why the other bishops come back is because we defeated the person that's supposed to be in charge of their souls. Then lamb wasn't good, didn't do anything about their came back. The whole part of the new game plus is because we defeated Nari they came back to their bodies. And the lamb, the whole thing that they did instead of you know, bring them to the land of the dead is stealing their power since they didn't have their crowns anymore and forcing them into the cult, which is his version of purgatory at that point since no one really dies because. He'll just do a ritual to revive then that he needs his followers full. He can't resurrect people fully without the The rituals and you could argue that 1 of the relics do the same thing. But it doesn't it revives people and turns them into skeletons? Skeletons that can only be used for warfare only used as soldiers. And you can't bring them back into the Colt, it doesn't allow you.
So if the bishops do get killed, then Only someone who is a God of death can actually deal with their souls. The person that was supposed to be in charge of that, the one who was fought before he can put them in their permanent punishment.
I think we need a deep dive of the transmog spell to see definitively what it can and can't do
Would these indie characters survive the transmogrification spell from cult of the lamb
Akamoto's ending is probably my favorite so far.
a possible team-up that just fucks everyone else over, outside of him and The Lamb.
Maybe one day someone will actually win, but for now this is the closest we have to a victory.
The wizard guy from Noita would absolutely stand a chance against everyone. Its going to be hard to determine his absolute best due to his wand building, but I'm sure that the right wand build could destroy the entire island with a single shot. The best of all, he can defend against transmog.
Everybody gangsta until the master of polymorph shows up. Or I guess in this case everyone gangsta when it shows up cause then you gain immunity?
Since the Knight has been a constant presence in this series, how about a character that people often put against the Knight? Ori from the Ori series, i don't think he can beat the Lamb but i am specificaly curius what you think the tree of life version of Ori appearing on the island would be like, i just think the thought of this massive fucking tree that's actualy really powerful and stupidly bright appearing in the middle of the island and everyone is like "huh???"
But could the MTG planeswalkers survive the island? (Wink wink nudge nudge)
If the Beheaded took the body of a bishop after the lamb killed one...
Bro might be my new favorite UA-camr fr
It’s so interesting seeing people argue that feats need to showcase destructive capabilities in order to be viable. Cause that’s just… so not the case
It’s the same way a character can scale to a feat without showing that same level of destructive capability themselves. A character can have high attack potency without showcasing high destructive capability
By that note, creating enough light to illuminate an entire planet or creating a planet wide snowstorm requires a ton of energy, which would mean a high attack potency with a minimal destructive capability (even though minimal is being generous since Demeter still froze the entire oceans). Given Demeter weaponizes her storm abilities, there’s little reason for it to not be a viable feat and for Zagreus to not compare
Yeah, but he doesn't want the lamb to lose. Could we throw the sun scaling out? Yeah, probably. But even then he still at minimum scales continental due to scaling to the Olympians via scaling to Hades even boonless at EM4. And even more so, he also resists transmog, as he can be turned to stone by the Medusas in the game and break out of it very quickly.
Sure, he's not very durable compared to his attack potency, but he definitely has a way better chance than explained here.
He also forgot that instead of regular death defiances Zag can also have *Stubborn* defiance, which comes back after every room, so he could simply escape with his greater speed to recover it and fight again.
The one big problem is him dying on the surface, which can be dealt with two ways that might change outcomes.
1 - The Fates have no authority over the land of the old faith, and therefore he doesn't die there. Still allows him to respawn back in the house of hades, but not on the island, and therefore he only has the one shot to do it. Also the same as his curse being broken like with Melinoë.
2 - His respawn point is set on the island, and it counts as the "underworld". This effectively guarantees his victory, but seems a bit unfair... though with the Lamb also respawning, maybe not, since he is giving the lamb that advantage.
@@AliceIsSleepy Doesn’t help that the shot of the One That Waits being giant is very clearly not meant to be taken literally, so already the lamb’s using inflated stats
@@Robot_972 Yeah, he's going with the Highest absurd highball for the lamb then downplaying others so that the lamb isn't butchered.
@@AliceIsSleepy Hell, Zagreus could just summon Thanatos to one-shot the Lamb’s body and soul regardless of stats
i hope you cover my skul arguments (briefly) in your next video (also great job with the theories, this is the most fun ive had theorizing things all week)
It would be fun to see how the characters of various indie games would survive in the City from the Project Moon games
Genuinely praying you make a feature length video for this series 🙏📿
If the knight dies in the lambs mind, he still lives. Plus if the shade lords void touches him he dies; the whole point of the void is erasing everything it touches.
Video is up for less than one hour and comments are flooded with counter-arguments on the Knight for the third time. I'm munching my popcorn on the fight between comments and RR at this point. I cheer for both.
I cheer for neither. They are just uncomparable. I guess I’m more on the knight’s side just because void is really strong but we have no idea how they would scale against each other because we don’t even know the scale of their games. Maybe the knight is as tall as Godzilla and the lamb is a small as a bug. For all we know that’s what their size would be.
YEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH, more of htis i do love this!!111!!
I hope you expand a bit with this lil series you have created, the WTIHS (Would These Indie Heroes Survive) Could bring you a LOT more attention if you keep it up!
Honestly you picked some unique characters that I wouldn’t have thought of. Good video 🎉
Nice video, I left a suggestion on the first part if you didn't see it, i came kinda late so i saw your first vid on the topic yesterday, but i like how logical and metodical you explain your reasons of being each contender and the fact that it shows that you actually do your research and don't let yourself be swayed from the general consensus is pretty nice when pinning out the flaws of the reasonings
Hey wayward compass allows knight to instantly absolutely destroy the lamb in seconds.
As a Hollow Knight player, I will stop coming up with reasons that the Knight would win or tie. However, might I propose the reverse of this argument, could the Lamb (and other indie characters) survive Hallownest? And to push it further, could they defeat the Hollow Knight or Radiance? (The latter might only be possible for the lamb, I’m not really sure)
Edit: Also, great video so far
Yes obviously the lamb can
If he solos shade lord he solos the verse
Nah knight beats lamb by courting him
@@djmewtwo6981
The reason I feel this would be interesting the lamb is because it would have to get a cult in Hallownest in order to not die in three days, and would also have to find a way to get into the dream world to fight the radiance. Also, being able to turn creatures into bugs might not be too helpful when every creature is already a bug, not sure.
@@legendofdymin I don’t know why the video author didn’t say that but the 3 days sentence is game mechanics the crowns are empowered by devotion not fueled by it.
Also he could just heal someone of the infection and then indoctrinate them
@@legendofdymin there’s a chance he might even instantly indoctrinate the godseekers which will be terrible bcs by default they have the power to turn any champion into a godlike being and they turned wall level knight into at least city buster shade lord.
Imagine what they’d do to the lamb if he got them in
Quite the enjoyable video. I mostly agree with your reasoning and it’s an interesting discussion to have for things like this. I’m excited to see where this type of content might go.
Imagine how 4 dwarves land on an island and start digging into the planet.
Rock and stone
It's unlikely they could beat the strongest of foes, and yeah they aren't immune to being transformed since they do it to themselves. However, they would probably be very likely to survive. They have no reason to fight the lamb due to it not having more legs than 2, but they would definitely fight the bishops. While the bishops are strong, I feel like nukes are generally quite an effective way to defeat them. They could even start their own sort of underground following as they appear to for some reason have the ability to mind control or instantly kill weaker bugs. Due to them living underground they would likely be quite safe.
For part 3 could you use V1 ultrakill not sure if he counts as indie but if he went to the lands of the old faith it would be interesting
I love the idea of Wilson joining the cult without indoctrination, he would absolutely do it as soon as he learns that they have resources. Also he would be absolutely fine with cannibalism as in ea or beta for DST you could cook "long meat" that dropped from a player after death. And if you don't want to count this since it's a removed feature, you also still can make a soup from bones that drop from a player skelleton
The shade Lord, which is the strongest version of the knight is completely invincible because void is completely invincible you can’t destroy void that’s why just see globs of it in the white palace because the sheles that used the void to operate were destroyed but the void just stayed there also if the shade lord kills ever the possible island cultist by consuming them then they can’t be resurrected.
There is a few things you are forgetting about Zagreus.
1). The Transmogricon has been shown NOT to work against sufficiently powerful beings (like the bosses of Cult of the Lamb.) This shows that certain beings have an immunity to The Transmogricon. The most reasonable conclusion for what causes this resistance is either being a god or having been gifted significant power by a god. Zagreus meets not one, but both of these criteria and thus would be immune to The Transmogricon. (Zagreus is the child of Hades and Persephone, who are both gods, and is thus a full-blooded god. He also receives boons, which could be considered significant power granted by a god.)
2). Zagreus's attacks are very clearly within an order of magnitude of The Lamb's, and he has the power to actually harm gods, as seen in the Hades fight. As a result, Zagreus could probably best the bishops of the old faith in combat, if not The Lamb themself. While The Lamb can resurrect due to being a death god, Zagreus does have a chance to figure out The Lamb's weakness, and possibly might be desperate enough to try and actually kill The Lamb's cult. Or possibly try to steal The Red Crown, as it might favor Zagreus due to him already being a god of the dead.
3). Zagreus could run stubborn defiance instead of death defiance, meaning he can resurrect once per room, (meaning he just has to move to another location to recharge it) instead of three times ever.
4). Being outside of the underworld kills him rather quickly, so even with all of the above, Zagreus would die pretty much instantly. However, this restriction is due to the will of the fates, and there is a possibility the fates of Hades have no influence over the lands of the old faith so he would be perfectly fine. Or perhaps the fates would consider the lands of the old faith to be part of the underworld, somehow.
i honestly believe Wilson would become a special character like Midas, who would introduced liked technology to the cultists
Edit: if Wilson Joins the Lamb, then it would be argued that he's worth more alive than sacrificed
I agree. I that last bit about sacrificing him was mostly a joke.
If we use Greek mythology and scale him to zues, zues has picked up a mountain and thrown it on someone before so there's that.
Nike would beat the Lamb and Goku
I covered this in the video.
@@rougarabid the second part as well?
With Zagreus it is stated that the fates will weaken him to the point of killing him while the surface which is the reason he dies after reaching the surface at the end of each run. Granted one can argue that the absences of the fates mean there might not be a curse but with the curse he will die within minutes.
"The bosses would one-shot the beheaded"
Bro did you forget how he can parry and survive hits from the 100 ft tall Giant and Mama Tick?
The beheaded is not heroic in anyway if you’ve actually beaten the game, he is a complete and utter a hole he would never go out of his way to help other people.
Zagreb’s isn’t a demigod, he’s a full “minor” god
If this wasn’t brought up before, What about the Gungeoneers from Enter/Exit the Gungeon? Or Death from Have a Nice Death? Or what about Bunk Bed Junction from NSR? I’m trying to suggest ideas for a Part 3 of this!
It has been and he’s on the list
@@rougarabid ok, who was on the list?
I’m starting to think that Lamb will take the crown of strongest indie protagonist
I doubt it. There are a lot of Universe busters that would likely wreck him. Lamb is pretty low tier he just has a ton of good hax and is difficult to kill. Makes him tricky but not impossible.
@@rougarabid universe busters on indie? I don’t think so, and if they do probably not enough hax resistance for the huge variety of stuff cult of the lamb has
@@djmewtwo6981
5 words :
isaac
eraser
pause active item
@@thewitchidolsachika6682 he already discussed the eraser. Even in game it doesn’t work on enemies that are too powerful (bosses), and the pause item is just like the seal of bishops or the pause time accessibility
I mean I think Frisk or the dude from Terraria could take him down maybe or weirdly enough Leshy from inscription possibly because he has full control of the game he was created in and dictates everything the player is even able to do in the game except get a hold of his camera , P03 is just very over confident for not puttting down the other Scribes. Also The Batter might be a problem, he's from a game called OFF
21:27 no. Beheaded is exactly that type of person to leave everything as it is. The promise of the game is that he tries to leave the island, not caring about all the insanity that happens
Although Zag wouldn't make it outside of the underworld, period... He does have one thing that would save him from the transmog. I forgot who gives it to him, but he does have a shield of attack immunity that not only negates all damage, but all effects for one attack - and it regenerates once a minute.
*Zagreus approaches the Lamb*
Lamb: *goes to attack*
Zagreus: Let me stop you right there, sheep. As a Hades-born being, i can't exactly stay for very long, so-- *dies without the Lamb attacking him*
Lamb:... well, shit...
A video on different Cryptids and Creepypastas (Skinwalkers and Slenderman for example) on the Cult of the Lamb Island could be interesting.
wilson would become of use to the lamb by sharing his technology with the cult and in exchange receiving forbidden knowledge from the lamb i think.
Just realized that you could legitimately make an episode of “can the DST characters survive x”
general akamato’s force only ends when he pisses off the lamb
Dead Cell's Beheaded has the Ferryman's Lantern though if he has ALL of his weapons. He can collect the souls of every cultist he kills and use them as a weapon against the cults.
Ok, what if... Every character (including the knight) in this video teamed up to try and take on the island.
In the next part of this, you should talk any the Enter The Gungeon characters.
One thing about Wilson is that unless the island is a part of the constant just a normal guy no one imortality
SHADE LORD IN THE LAMB'S MIND HE'S COOKED
He fought the radiance and the radiance has mind controlled many many more followers than you can in cult of the lamb
Here’s my two cents: Wilson can kill the Bishops. His weaponry is insane, and Kallamar doesn’t stand a chance due to Wilson having a Morning Star, a weapon that does more damage based on how wet someone is. He has the thulecite club, the Lunar armor, plus he could stalemate the lamb
Forgot a suggestion for one of these: helltaker. Dude is roughly lightspeed in reactions ( maybe slightly slower, but not by a large amount), storms through hell whilst his soul is under attack ( as shown by the moves remaining thing) and can kick around boulders which are about as large as he himself is ( not too clear if they're slightly bigger or smaller or what, but seemingly about the same size, and hes pretty big himself)