not defending either of them but fantano's review is being hugely misinterpreted. When he brought up the "main character syndrome" thing it was not when speaking about the whole album but a specific song in which the lyrics were genuinely just that. Also fantano rates albums based on music quality and when he was summarising the album he was only talking about the sound of it. Edit: As I stand corrected and mistaken, he was indeed talking about the entire album. I still think his review being misinterpreted though, feel free to debate.
@@shaungovind8698 i want you to actually read your comment.. like bro fantano calls albums, records.. now he's referring to a song?? What's next? He's actually talking about Donald trump on his review about Halsey's new album!!! Totally believable!!
I feel like these days, people throw around "playing the victim" or "victim mentality" too much. They just say it any time they want to silence victims because hearing them talking about their trauma makes them uncomfortable.
It's also pretty funny in an ironic kind of way, because Halsey IS LITERALLY calling themselves "a baby" in "Ego" (lyrics: "I'm acting like a fucking baby"), but these ignorant people somehow missed that (conveniently so).
@@nofanealbni well he literally said her album sounded like it was made by an angsty teenager so yeah it sounds like he was calling her kind of childish or at least her art kind of childish
EXACTLY. If it was someone like Celine Dion writing about her illness, or Gaga, people would celebrate it. I hate that people dunk on Halsey for the sake of it. She’s not my vibe but she deserves mercy
@@saranoelle3927Fantano’s review is garbage? Why? I think that dude sucks but you guys, they’re there to review the MUSIC. not the story that inspired the music. Wtf?? The music just isn’t very good. D’Angelo himself says that!
What if Fantano had simply said he thought the music itself was bad and the lyrics were garbage? Like what if he had said he sympathizes with her struggles, but just doesn’t think she possesses the artistry or the vision to pull it off? I’ve listened. I do sympathize with her struggles, but I personally feel the music and lyrical content itself is garbage. She didn’t stick the landing. You can stan a story and a struggle all you want, but if the craftsmanship behind it is garbage, then what’s the point?
@@dcat65 it's fine to simply not like the song, but that is not what the video was criticising.. he literally said that lmao, and there is a point EVEN if it is lyically/musically bad, you can critisize it on that merit. the criticism was that she is overdramatic and self centred for making a song about being diagnosed with cancer and thinking she was gonna die? like you clearly have not watched the video
I feel like “main character syndrome” and “trauma dumping” have been so over used to the point that we aren’t allowed to talk about ourselves with friends and family any more. When did needing support become cringe?
Best comment. Literally, this is how people feel isolated and depressed when they feel they cant share their feelings. And being an artist she wrote about what she was experiencing… thats it? Idc if people think im being too defensive but albums like great impersonator and even tortured poets are critisized for playing the victim but if a man’s, any man’s name was on those songs and lyrics it would be taken a bit more seriously.
@@margielaaa Trauma dumping is very much a real thing and can be hurtful but a lot of people on the internet use it (whether wittingly or not) as an excuse to villainize people for being vulnerable because they're not comfortable with it. Either that, or they were mislead by the former group of ppl into thinking any vulnerability is trauma dumping.
Halsey: People acted like I was being dramatic when I was fearing for my health. People: You're being dramatic. It's almost comical how badly they missed the point.
Let me start by saying that these reviews absolutely missed the mark and were way too harsh. But I think, without attacking Halsey as a person, you can definitely make some legitimate criticisms of the writing being dramatic at parts. One of the lyrics was "I always knew I was a martyr and Jesus was one too," and I personally think it's fair to find writing like that a bit dramatic. But again, I think you can frame those criticisms in a way that doesn't invalidate her feelings, and that neither of those reviews attempted to do that.
@@JustForTheTuneswomen are martyrs in culture, for as long as the patriarchy exists this statement will remain true. it isnt dramatic because it can very seriously be compared directly to reality.
@@JustForTheTunes Why are you so stuck on this lyric that you are replying to multiple people with the same example? Look, I think criticizing the lyric is fine but part of music and art is that it is often irrational. Part of being in traumatic situations is that it seems like the end of the world even if it's just something really bad that's happening to you in particular. When I listen to that lyric, I relate to it heavily right until the end of the song, then I drop the dramatics, because I'm done being in my feelings. And just to be clear, you personally can think the lyric is silly, that's your opinion, but other people can think your opinion is shallow and not well thought out, which is just another layer of opinions. But also, let's not pretend like most music isn't dramatic af for wayyyyy less serious reasons and people don't get told they are being "dramatic". The reality is a lot of people are uncomfortable with the idea of dying and their own "dramatic" emotions and get upset with other people for being open about when they feel like a Jesus-like martyr. It's dumb but it's how most people feel at some points of their life, even if they realize at the time that's it dumb.
@@maimee1but is "you're dramatic" a legitimate criticism even? Why does nobody ever complain about the love songs and the breakup songs being dramatic, even though like 90% of the time they are?
Using Tyler the Creator as an example was spot on - No one hates Tyler for talking about his life, his views, his mental health, his pain. And he does it in the most extra ways possible. When a woman does it? She is dramatic, she is complaining, she thinks she is more important than everyone. So basically the pain women go through isn’t considered anywhere; not in a doctor’s office and certainly not on the album people chose to listen to.
Because when Tyler does it, he does it with good music. And if he say his song is dedicated/inspired by Dr Dre, Guess what? It’s going to actually song like a Dre song.
Women's health and pain is treated like a joke from beginning to end. Every single woman I know has been dismissed by doctors or treated like an idiot.
Yes, I was going to say the same thing. On various occasions, doctors tried to tell me that I did not have (separate!) medical conditions I knew I had, and later got properly assessed for, diagnosed with, and treated with. In one case, the treatment required and resulted in surgery, which I wouldn't have gotten had I listened to the first doctor. Makes me want to exit my body when I think about it too much.
I had a surgeon tell me to “stop being a fragile little girl and man up” when I was 13 because I had chronic pain from a botched surgery he did. It happened 3 times for 3 different reasons but I proved 3 surgeons my pain was real once they cut me open. But my white privilege is the only reason i eventually got proper care. My non white cousin is dead because they gaslit her when she kept telling them she had chest pain. She was 18 and died from medical neglect after giving birth she went into heart failure. They had a full day to catch it, to believe her, but they let her suffer and die instead.
I’m so sorry about your cousin and your experience. I also lost a cousin recently she told them something was wrong before giving birth to her child. They both didn’t make it. I wish doctors would listen. 😭
Also there’s a theory about this ( why the divorce rates are high in these instances) may be because of insurance and financial purposes. In the us especially when these studies were done, men were more likely to be the bread winners and therefore the insurance carriers- so if the spouse became ill, they might legally divorce to receive better state benefits overall. Or sadly, because medical debt might affect financial status and abilities for current or future rent/mortgages/loans/leases- they might divorce to have one fiscally safe individual who will be able to take out credit/loans in future. It’s the sad reality of the US and those going through medical treatments. But just a reminder of why findings shouldn’t be taken at face value. This doesnt explain Halseys case though to be clear, just wanted to clarify on the 20%
@@kodabuck225 ". A 2009 study published in the journal Cancer found that a married woman diagnosed with a serious disease is six times more likely to be divorced or separated than a man with a similar diagnosis. Among study participants, the divorce rate was 21 percent for seriously ill women and 3 percent for seriously ill men. "
8:00 The reviewer is not realizing that "The Great Impersonator" is a term for lupus, the autoimmune disease that Halsey was diagnosed with. That's why the album is called that. The disease and how hard it is to diagnose is the inspiration for the album not a random impulse to imitate the styles of various artists.
Thank you for explaining that. I am not into Halsey's career lore, I am more of a casual listener so I didn't know too much about the deeper meaning of the new concept. But it makes so much more sense now❤
Lupus is already a difficult disease to diagnose (bc its symptoms may point to many other conditions, therefore it being an "impersonator") but it is tragically comical to me that my mom first got diagnosed with Lupus when she actually has an even rarer autoimmune disease. Listening to Halsey's music helped me understand a bit more how my mom feels but doesn't know how to express. It's a great album
I have listened to this album 5 times without realizing this. Thank you. Thank you. Now I have to listen another five times with new perspective. I'm sure I'll love it even more.
This is why I roll my eyes at men who say that women aren't punished for crying or being emotional. People write off women as dramatic or hysterical for expressing fear, anger, pain, or sadness all the time, to the point where it negatively affects their quality of care at a doctor's office. Doubly so if said woman is a woman of color.
What's crazy too is how men experience that in a similar, though less directly cruel, way. Men have been told not to cry, that anger is more acceptable and even then that too much emotion is "feminine", that being anything associated with women is a bad thing, no matter how irrational. I may not necessarily be a trans man, but the horror stories I've heard from them about how they start being perceived differently, how men start seeing them as "one of their own" and just spew the most cruel shit without batting an eye...not to mention the hypocrisy when women advocate for feminism and men interrupt them with "but what about men?" as if any of those insecure losers would genuinely comfort a male friend of theirs. Women have done significantly more for men than men have, both due to socialization of the genders and because of the acknowledgement of how patriarchy and misogyny literally kills all of us. I have never in my life seen a man advocate for men genuinely beyond "I want pu$$y". You suffer as well, maybe not to the same cruel degree but it is a cruel fate nonetheless. How could any of them then look at women...and have the audacity to say that? Realistically, everybody is shamed for human emotions, regardless of gender-i genuinely don't understand how the vast majority of men can suffer under misogyny and not feel for those that aren't men, dealing with conscious misogyny rather than subconscious misogyny.
Anger is similar but in reverse. When men are angry or complain about ways in which they are marginalised they are dismissed whereas women have a whole movement to support them for any real or perceived inequality.
@@Anonymityfanthe reason for that movement was to let women have the freedom to vote, have jobs, study in school, be equal, whereas men don't have one because.. guess what? They already have the things women began that movement for :p
@@Anonymityfan I've seen the complete opposite...? Whenever women complain about being marginalized, they get belittled, meanwhile so many feminists talk about mens' issues nowadays and the comments are always completely supportive. Whenever I see a big headline about a woman talking about misogyny, the comments are the likes of "Ugh can women do anything besides playing victim?", whenever there's a headline criticizing feminism or talking about mens' issues, all the comments are the likes of "Finally somebody said it!!" The comments here kindly point out the double standards of how mens' angsty music albums about their addiction problems are iconic, while womens' albums about their personal experiences are torn apart because "they're just playing victim". Also, yes, women have a whole movement to support them because they used to have NO RIGHTS. Men never NEEDED a whole movement to themselves. I can tell you, I used to be a huge anti feminist who got incredibly upset whenever people would focus on women while men got treated unfairly. Now I'm a lot more focused on unfair treatment against women. Why am I telling you this? Because it was so much easier to be an anti feminist than to be a feminist. I was hardly ever mad as an anti feminist because I saw men get so much support and attention, especially from feminists themselves, plus, anti feminism was and still is on a rise, more so than feminism is, and that made me happy. The only times I was truly mad was when there was healthy conversations about womens' issues. I was one of those "BUT MEN TOO!!"-people. Now as a feminist, I get upset about truly unfair treatment and actual hatred against the gender I'm focussing on (women) much more often and I see way less support.
@@DwynTwo In real life the opposite is usually the case, whenever women complain they are met with sympathy or at worst ignored whereas men are often laughed at. Think about how complaints about misandry go vs misogyny or how male cheating victims like Will Smith were mocked in a way no female cheating victims were or the same for domestic violence and SA. In terms of music I will take your word for it because I am not a big music listener. Men defnitely are more in need of a movement advocating for their rights in the west than women. Look at everything from homelessness, to getting to longer prison sentences for the same crimes to earning less in their 20's, to doing worse in school, to being less likely to get into university, to prostate cancer being less funded despite being more lethal to how violence against men is treated vs violence against women, to homicide to all the other stuff I mentioned earlier and the list goes on. Women have their own issues for sure but what can you really mention that makes you think being a woman is anywhere near as difficult as being a man?
Gotta love how people validate a male celebrity like Shia labouf using his mental illness and substance issues to justify abusing women and being cruel for his "art", but Halsey using her personal struggles with her diagnosed illness' as an outlet to express her pain has people personally offended and calling her dramatic.
Being terrified of dying as a single mother and shouldering the weight of saying goodbye to the child you fought so hard to have… such childish angst am I right fellas? GOD Fantano’s review pissed me the fuck off. I’ve also been seeing (very few) comments defending him for “not having all the context die-hard fans have”. It’s in the lyrics though?? Huh? Is this just another “media literacy is dead” thing?
Fr, the line about shaving her head cause she's sick should've clued him in. Also, talking about her treatment starting in The End and being sick every couple of years would also be a big hint
@gothic_nix that and basically the entirety of life of the spider, + other lyrics about having to leave behind her child. You'd have to be completely not paying attention to the lyrics & ignored the entire album rollout to miss the context. And I know fantano listened to the lyrics enough to whine about them being "childish" (really childish to write lyrics about starting medical treatment while you're dying amiright), so I truly do not understand how he was able to justify his position to himself
Fantano seems to be one of those insincere guys who relies on being cynical to keep up his popularity, I can't help thinking this is an obvious attention grab for him. I do not follow Halsey at all, only knew about some health struggles she had but the theme of the album was very obvious to me on first listen. The fact he didn't get any sense of emotion from the songs to stop himself making a tired snarky jab at Halsey, even if he doesn't like the music, tells me all I need to know about what type of person he is.
Fantano, the UA-camr? which video did he review this album in? his video titles are... not always very descriptive. EDIT: OH. ohhhhhh. wild that I know him more for his second channel than his first. Oo I still wonder if the "missing the point" video he posted with FD covers this. nope. it was about right wingers failing to grasp the meaning of things. good lord.... someone get Anthony a mirror, stat.
I'm not a Halsey fan, but this made me real curious, so I went and listened to the whole album and damn... it's so fucking beautiful. You would not believe it's what those assholes are talking shit about. Misogyny so bad, they're hating on songs that sound like an angels lulling you to sleep. Edit: I'm gonna be listening to The End on repeat for next few hours. That shit's beautiful.
@Tocaraca that song alone could've made it a good album even if all the other songs where shit. Which they weren't. I simply do not understand how it got so much hate. Misogyny is crazy.
@@chiedzawith2ds Maybe I'm in an echo chamber, but I haven't seen much hate luckily. Fantano's own comment section was full of people defending the album and shitting on Fantano which was beautiful to see. The End, Hurt Feelings, and Letter to God (1998) are the songs I'm going back to the most ^^
Idk maybe she could get a vocal coach and start writing good songs. There’s a reason why 5/6 of her most streamed songs, are features. She’s not a good songwriter.
@BigOwl51 damn you must be her biggest fan, I've seen you commenting hate on multiple videos talking about this album. For someone who seemingly doesn't like her, you sure are helping her promote like craaaazy 😂
@@charmedblondie4good! Maybe the great impersonator won’t be as much of a miserable failure as her “rock” album! Happy to help a struggling, washed up pop singer!
The album is called "The Great Impersonator" not just because Halsey was impersonating all those artists in the album rollout, but because "The Great Imitator/Masquerader" is a medical term used to classify conditions that can easily be mistaken for other conditions. One of these "Great Imitators" is Lupus. The album is entirely about Halsey's struggle with Lupus and other health concerns, and even the title is in reference to that, so it astonishes me how those two music review outlets can miss the point so much when it's standing right in front of them.
Fantano does this with women a lot. almost his entire "eternal sunshine" ariana grande review was talking about the alleged homewrecker scandal and scandals she's faced in the past and barely was about the music itself.
*SHE IS* the main character of her own story which is what shes talking about, the audacity people have to tell someone how and what to tell about their struggles….. specially when it comes to health, my blood boils….
A friend of mine went to the hospital because she was sure she had a lump in her breast and she hadn’t felt well in a long time. The doctors kept telling her that there was nothing wrong, she’s too young for breast cancer, blah blah. 8 months later her pain was so bad she couldn’t walk. She went back to the hospital and they finally listened. Turns out it WAS breast cancer, and it had spread to her bones. She died less than a year later. Take women seriously in medicine ffs. I don’t listen to her music, but I’m glad Halsey is still here
I'm sorry about your friend. I'm also sorry that she's far from the only young woman that has been told the exact same thing even though women are getting breast cancer younger now. I had a little lump in my armpit and when I asked my female gyno about it she seemed really irritated that I didn't know that it was just a cyst. How would I know?? You would think female doctors would be less dismissive than male doctors but even that is sometimes too much to ask.
@@ANYHOO0 It's disappointing how many women that act misogynistic to other women exist. You'd think they understand, but no, they won't because they don't even take themselves seriously.
I study medicine and I absolutely don't get how she wasn't examined right away physically and by usg? She did everything right to find the lump and go to her doctor... And breast cancer is usually pretty treatable I feel so sorry for her :(
@@depressedcockroach4045 I'm an untransitioned trans man dealing with pre-cancerous endometrial hyperplasia. between complications with my connective tissue disorder plus getting the, ahem, panda mic in 2022, the endo also contributed to massive, life-threatening digestive and subsequent malnutrition issues. the first major episode of the endo symptoms occurred almost exactly three years ago. I've been unable to work for two years. I only got a correct diagnosis this year, and I myself had to identify what it was first before I could get a doctor to confirm. I've been trying to get surgery this whole year. I was in fact just informed today that my surgery is being delayed for the FOURTH time, under the SECOND surgeon. yeah, this.... this kind of thing happens all the time.
As soon as you mentioned Anthony Fantano I immediately rolled my eyes. I don’t remember the last time he had a good take about a woman artist, if he’s ever even had one.
Well he’s given a plethora of women very positive reviews as well as a plethora of men very terrible reviews. Fantanos take on this album was very much in poor taste, I doubt it stems from a point of misogyny more so than him just being a little elitist and cold though. That’s just me however.
@@lobstertown1826it is just you lol he’s had so many absolutely rancid takes that prove his inability to look at any semblance of situation behind a piece of music… usually when it’s a woman.
He's done less reviews on female artists. The one he did with Billie eilish was so bad, it feels like he's not even listening. Just straight up saying it's good but then that's it. No full commentary. Most of the reviews are cut short.
As someone with chronic illness, THANK YOU for discussing medical gaslighting. It took me 2.5 years to get a diagnosis because I was repeatedly dismissed as "anxious." The legacy of systemic discrimination in medicine is very real and still being felt by these communities daily. EDIT: To everyone struggling with this in the replies, I wish you all of the healing, love, and support. We are in this together
100% I was misdiagnosed with anxiety when I actually had schizoaffective disorder. Took me figuring it out myself through watching interviews to go back and insist for a new diagnosis. Additionally, they also missed my crohn's disease and said it was in my head. I now have a permanent-end ileostomy for that misdiagnosis.
@@Qb3nsis I am so sorry you went through that. I am right there with you. I was dismissed as anxious and later discovered I have a rare lymphoproliferative disease (similar to Halsey) as well as other autoimmune conditions. And yep, the complications that stem from this delay in care are so real. There is nothing that inspires disappointment in the system quite like these kinds of experiences. Sending hugs.
me too good lord i had a heart attack but it was brushed off as anxiety lmfao i had to literally beg for the proper tests for them to bother finding out what was wrong with me and at first they just treated me like i was hysterical and over dramatic
@@banquetoftheleviathan1404 I am not dismissing anxiety as not needing treatment. I am saying my symptoms were reduced to anxiety alone when that wasn't the full story.
Also, like.....I dunno, Fantano's review feels especially callous when you consider one of the most consistent through-lines in the album is Halsey fearing they'd die AND LEAVE THEIR SON BEHIND, so to say she's just being "edgy" and "laundering in childish angst" with THAT context too is like "oh, are you just mad it didn't meet YOUR specific expectations??" Just weird all around, like you said.
i remember him totally misunderstanding and writing off one of FKA Twigs songs from magdalene and that told me what i needed to know about his lack of ability to engage with women’s art. he’s really never beating the misogyny allegations lmao
As someone whose dad recently passed away from cancer I am honestly livid at this whole ordeal. It reeks of misogyny and a severe lack of empathy. Men seriously need to do better.
They need to but they won't, especially not with the culture the way it is. The trick is to ignore them, you can't teach them to see women as humans like them. I am sorry and wish you safe healing.
Weird that *men's* angst is so rarely considered childish. Genuinely wonder what that reviewer's opinion is on the Smiths, the Cure, Pulp, Nirvana, Radiohead, Daniel Johnston, Joy Division, REM...c'mon man. Some of the best albums of all time are angstfests.
There is a definite trend of thinking that men's angst is profound and speaks to the human condition, while anyone else's angst is just frivolous whining.
this is so true. these men will punch holes on the wall like a toddler throwing a tantrum but everyone considers it something so profound and deep and it's just an adult toddler throwing a tantrum
Trust if Tyler made an album about his confrontation with death and his own mortality it would go number 1- not sayin Halsey deserves to go platinum just saying angst pulls a lot of weight for these male artists
Fantano has a record like this for guys too, he trashed Frightened Rabbit’s albums about suicidal thoughts as being melodramatic even though the singer ended up killing himself
As a woman with chronic headaches, the mockery from doctors is insaneee. I've seen dozens of medical professionals over the course of a decade and you just get 'it's just stress and hormones' and 'you just need to push through it' without doing any brainscans or anything. Like, thanks doc, I didn't know it was normal to be in excruciating pain after talking to someone for an hour. Or laughing for ten minutes. Or listening to music with a higher pitched singer for just a minute. Great. Thanks.
10:50 smh they say halsey didn't sound enough like the artists that inspired them, but if she went the other direction and sounded a lot like the other artists, you can bet the critics would just say she copied them and she's unoriginal/uninspired or some bs
as a cancer survivor, i cannot even begin to convey the rage and internal anger that you feel against your body that has decided to attack itself. and on top of that people tell her she is being main character energy edgy vibes. it’s MUSIC!! god forbid she expresses her experiences and emotions 🙄🙄🙄🙄
The needledrop, “Halsey wants everyone to know how tortured she feels.” Considering the album is about a CANCER DIAGNOSIS that makes total sense. Have these reviewers lost their minds?
Fantano saying she suffers from “Main Character Syndrome” and then relating her Taylor Swift reminds me of Taylor’s iconic quote “I’m sorry. Was I being too loud? In the house I bought? With the money I made? From the songs I wrote? About my own life?” What artist doesn’t write about themselves?
his Halsey review reminded me a lot of Taylor actually specifically his review on TTPD, he like writes off one of the songs as "no one's scared of Taylor" and it felt like such an overlook of what the song was saying about how ppl view her as this vastly evil woman while also being like "well who could be scared of her if we beat her down?" I can absolutely understand not enjoying the album frankly it's not my favorite but he's very dismissive of concepts that are usually unique to women and how they navigate sexism and overall anticipation of their downfalls (and this goes beyond Taylor obviously) and it boils down to him either not understanding or being stubborn and refusing to see the point because he's already made up his mind about the art. Also YEAH Halsey notoriously writes about her experiences, idk any hits of her's that aren't pulled from her life, for Anthony to just now be like "maybe you're centering yourself too much" FIVE ALBUMS into her career is a bizarre choice and idk if he just lacked research to see that or what but it comes off even worse.
Before this review I used to give fantano the benefit of the doubt but now I loathe him. He can't stomach a woman singing about *actual* trauma but will give s3xy red a 8/10 and Brat (a good album but doesn't dive into dark subject matter like Halsey and TTPD) a 10.
yeahh exactly like you can't tell someone their own experiences aren't valid just cause you can't relate to them personally. if you think the song is corny, say that. don't try to make it seem like the artist is 'victimizing' themselves. i feel like that word has become a convenient substitute for singers simply expressing their emotions nowadays. we're making music soulless. like if you dare to say you're not happy, you must be taking yourself too seriously or fishing for sympathy. idk man, everyone has problems and just because you're not aware of them doesn't equate to a character flaw on the artist's part. when it comes to albums he doesn't like, fantano doesn't bother to do any introspection and always assumes the worst.
@@junainahrahman4156 giving Brat a 10 is fine, and same for Sexy Red, but his ignorance for what the subject matter and that being why the albums get scored low is a problem
i think people also aren't taking into account that Lupus is called The Great Imitator which is probably a big reason as to why she did the impersonations. but people think that THAT's the concept of the album, when it's really not
How can people listen to an album about an artist dealing with her own mortality and then hate on her for it? Feeling guilty for being suicidal as a teenager and that her diagnosis was a delayed prayer being answered. Leaving your child to become an orphan. Contemplating what people will think of your career and your legacy when you are done. How does that not affect you in any way shape or form? I truly think that if these 'music reviewers' are going to have their job, they need to take all elements into account when judging: the context and meaning behind the piece, the lyrics, the sound, the inspirations, the album roll out, the theming. How can you judge music without taking it all into account and instead make it about your personal opinion of the artist and not about the music itself? I may be biased being a Halsey fan but I don't think it takes a fan to have empathy towards her situation. Thank you for making an elaborate and empathetic video about this situation. Halsey can never catch a break, I swear.
i find it interesting how the internet has been in an era of critiquing female artists for doing too little (some people disliking brat for the simple green cover etc etc) but then god forbid someone does something interesting the internet thinks it’s too much!
how come during the kendrick vs drake deal everyone read behind the lines and did deepdives on specific words, cadences, even song names to connect them, but when halsey makes a pretty clear reference to her well know health issues, everybody is confused?
misogny, all of it..they subconsioucly think women can't be deep so no point in diving under the lines for them.our pain and the results of it are treated like a child with a lost toy, always secondary and to be forgotten in the long run.
I mean I agree with parts of this and all of DeAngelo's video but saying "everyone" like music genres don't have different groups of people listening I agree 100% if it's with music reviewers like fantano but saying that everyone is against Halsey is misrepresenting the situation. Although I could have misinterpreted what you meant so correct me if I'm wrong
They're not confused, they're ignorant. They don't bother to read the lyrics that are there, instead they generalize the whole song and brush it off as "edgy" ramblings of a self-obsessed person, when that isn't the case at all.
Dudes think that shit is cool (despite so many songs having the cringiest lyrics imaginable) and put those male artists on a pedestal because they desire and support that type of fame, money, and power while putting on a persona of being badass, rich, getting women etc. Then, as soon as a woman writes a song, every line of lyrics gets nitpicked to dismiss her as being cringe and unworthy of praise. There is also something to be noticed that men making art are labeled so often as "geniuses" while women of the same caliber rarely get revered in such a respectful way.
I know that you probably get thousands of comments like this, but I really appreciate what you bring to the dialogue. You tend to have a nuanced take on almost every subject you cover, and it really does expand my understanding in a way that I think makes me a better person.
"Does she have more music like that?" Begging you to check out her entire 'If I Can't Have Love I Want Power' album, it was produced by Nine Inch Nails, changed my brain chemistry, and carried me through my last semester of college (along with The Amazing Devil's album Ruin which also came out that fall). Any time Halsey does rock I am there in a heartbeat 🙌
It's also one of her least successful albums and it drives me CRAZY because it's so unbelievably absurdly good. She also did a rock remix of Gasoline, which was one of my favorites from her debut album (which was my favorite release by her until IICHLIWP came out). Seriously, everyone who hasn't listened to it needs to asap.
But yeah Lonely is the Muse is also my favorite of hers from this album, I've listened to it basically non-stop since it's came out! (And I've been revisiting it a lot since I got into Interview With the Vampire, since it fits Armand's character to a t. And if anyone is into Batman, Easier Than Lying is the most Jason Todd song to ever exist and it drives me crazy because no one ever talks about it 😭)
The only reason people interpreted her as "playing a victim" is because she's a woman. I think she'd be viewed as a victim if she were a man. Let's be real, if a man dropped an album abt being really ill while navigating an unfair life, people would be like YASSS LIFE IS SO HARDDDD YESSS I AGREEEEEE PREACHHHH. People are unable to have sympathy for women because they're always gonna be perceived as dramatic, attention seeking, and performative. "She has Main character syndrome", no, you're just unable to view a woman as a main character. Shoutout katara from ATLA 💀
Let's be real here, by people we mean males. Some males just hate women, and they use every excuse to disguise their resentment. There is no actual standard or reason, because only their hate toward her is real.
So shat kind of man would drop an album like that? And in what genre? Rap? Probably not, not before Drake. Pop, ok, that exists, a lot, in a similar vein to women singing about their relationships, men also do it, not to extra praise or dismissal, at least within this genre. For some real edgy my life so bad this my trauma shit, I don't think that gets, like, extra praise? With suicide in the climate where that was rarely discussed and any mention of it was like ground breaking, it is, or was, discussed, but I don't think that had a gender bias? Don't get me wrong, some, men, who love to talk about how Feminism has oppressed them, would probably react like that if such a thing came out, but that sure doesn't look like general "people". Sounds to me like you are deriving a conclusion without basis, using valid but unrelated facts, due to your desire to see a certain narrative in everything, when it might be more complex than that.
@@maimee1 You don't get recognition for the pain you've gone through because you don't have a deadly chronic illness nor are you in the public eye. If you told people around you about the trauma you've been through, they would probably have sympathy for you. If you want to bare your soul to the public by transforming it into art, go right ahead. No one will shame you for that. Secondly, Green Day, Freddie Mercury, Justin Bieber, The Neighborhood, Eminem, The Crow, Nine Inch Nails, and countless other male artists have made soul barring songs about what they've been through. They never been told that they're "overdramatic," are "playing the victim," or "have main character syndrome." That music critic was simply being misogynistic and didn't do enough research about what the album was about.
@maimee1 You said a whole lot without saying much. You're not even right about what my comment was communicating. To answer your initial questions, the first artist who comes to mind is Freddie Mercury, who had HIV/AIDS and wrote about dying and being sick. He's widely loved, and many people say he's a musical genius. I also think of Vincent Van Gogh. Though he's not a musician, he is known as one of the greatest artists of all time, as you can see his mental state decline throughout his work. He made art about the madness in his mind. I also think of classic grunge/alt bands and artists: Radiohead, Tool, Slipknot, Deftones, blink 182... their music is all what I'd classify as angsty. Yet, I've never heard criticism about their music being too emotional. My point still stands; if Halsey were a man, nobody would be insinuating that she's attention seeking. They'd simply say the music is bad and move on instead of trying to debate whether or not she has a right to be angsty or viewed as a victim. Nobody said Van Gogh or Freddie were just trying to be the main character, right? I don't think Halsey deserves extra praise, nor did I or D'Angelo say that she did. My conclusion is that nobody would be calling her attention seeking or a main character wannabe if she were a man. Hell, even Eminem is widely known to be bold. Most of his songs are him complaining about his upbringing or insulting people. Still, I don't see anybody reviewing his music and saying "he just wants attention". If all that yapping still reads as an unrelated conclusion without a basis, how about the fact that she literally wrote about medical professionals not taking her illness seriously. There are actual facts on that, I can cite them if you like. Women are way more likely to be misdiagnosed. Why is this? Oh, right, because as a society, we view women as dramatic and attention seeking. Her complaints get proven by the people claiming she isn't *victim* enough to be angsty, and she's just trying to be a main character.
When I've gone to the doctor as a woman with endometriosis describing excruciating pain on my periods, and 21-30 day periods that would happen anywhere from 3 days apart to 6 months apart, I NEVER had a gynecologist do anything to investigate the pain for 29 years. I was told "you should wait until you give birth, then you'll really know pain" or the same comment but that I'd know pain when I turn 30. Then when doing a different, unrelated surgery they happened to find a bunch of endometriosis, my ovaries had giant cysts and one was adhered to another part of my body. I basically got diagnosed by luck, not a doctor doing their job. If endometriosis affected men on the same scale it affects women (cis men and AMAB people can get it, but it is extremely rare) it would be taken so much more seriously.
way too many people have had this kind of experience. and way too many cis dudes are totally ignorant of it. largely because.... no one with a uterus trusts them enough to talk to them about these things. I'm a 45 yr old untransitioned trans man dealing with endometrial hyperplasia. and yeah, even after two years of extreme symptoms including bleeding for two straight months, I still had to diagnose *myself* before the doctors would see what was going on. we see what's really going on, though.
i’ll never be more confused why being concerned over not being “the main character” in YOUR life was ever a thing. like regardless you ARE the main character of your own life
right? there's a difference between thinking the world revolves around you, and centring (from the uk, in case the spelling confused anyone) your own world around yourself. the former is being self absorbed, meanwhile the latter is just being confident and having enough self respect to put yourself first in your own life. writing an album about your own, personal struggles is - not only - *not* an example of thinking youre the "main character"... but also is literally one of the fundamentals of creating art. you'd think a music critic would understand this, but apparently not if he cant personally relate to the subject matters being discussed. ironically, writing off a piece of media because it touches on subjects that you *personally* cannot relate to is one of the most self absorbed things a person could do, imho. of course there's nothing wrong with not enjoying a piece of media for this reason, but to completely dismiss it? it's literally fantano's *JOB* to try and understand the work he's critiquing. not being funny, but it's genuinely baffling that there are really people who go to fantano for media analysis and to determine something's quality. he's more of an entertainer than anything else, atp at least
@@zaddyfaye6880honestly people seem so afraid to care about themselves, but we also live in very contradictory times where self sacrifice for the sake of others is mocked meanwhile self sacrifice for yourself in the future is praised (say for example, not going to starbucks or mcdonalds because they are in support of a whole ass jenna-slide, and not going to either because it's unhealthy). You're cringe for having a personality, wanting to be unique, but you're also lame and annoying and basic if you happen to like what's popular/trendy. You're vain and arrogant if you go to the gym, but disgusting and undeserving of love if you don't develop an eating disorder (from too much focus on your body). Everybody "wants to be the main character", supposedly, but they mock random people on the street and online for being "NPCs". Which is it? Why is the response to a mindless hivemind hyperindividualism and vice versa?? Is this not horribly self destructive, not just of individuals but of communities and interpersonal relationships, why is everybody so aggressively antisocial???
No cuz lucky is always such a low bar for us bc if men were treated by “lucky” doctors the way we are treated it would be considered medical negligence. 😭
I’d love to hear Fantano say this to Halsey in person, call her “childish” for being afraid of dying and orphaning her kid, in person, to her face. Oh wait, he’d never do that because like every other online critic, once he has to come out from behind the shield of his phone screen suddenly he’s all about keeping things civil.
Song: "creep" = playing the victim and drowning in self pity. Also a hit, a classic, a great song. If none of you know it it's time for me to dig my own grave because I'm just that old. Talking of self pity:. Lyrics:" I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo, what the hell am I doing here, I don't belong here..."
thank you so much dude. I feel like so many well respected male artists have whole albums worth of introspective miserable navel-gazing and that's fine! It's actually good! Sometimes we all feel like that!
i think there's a bigger problem of introspection and being in a really bad place being seen as lame. just in general, seems to be a problem, especially since memes have now convinced real people that radiohead somehow corny and for incels
What sucks is I think there are legitimate criticisms of the framing if these reviews weren't so harsh. Like one of the lyrics was "I always knew I was a martyr and Jesus was one too," and idk, I think finding lines like that a bit too self indulgent is absolutely a fair criticism. There's a bit more going on that just that one artist was male and one was female, but that the writing is also fundamentally different. But criticisms like that need to be leveled at the writing, not the character of the artist imo
I don't think Halsey or Radiohead's "Creep" are examples of playing the victim, truly. To feel like you aren't enough isn't "playing the victim", IMO, nor even the Jesus line mentioned in this thread. Playing the victim requires being either someone doing harm or a random bystander, IMO. Or like, if someone has a relative with a mobility disorder, and the person starts making it about how it's SOOO HARRRD to accomodate them, and how you should throw your sympathy to THEM and how they have to DEAL WITH THAT. Especially if they say that they're a good person for "putting up with" the poor person they're complaining about.
Simply recreating an Aaliyah picture isnt Blackfishing. Blackfishing is deeper than just dressing up as a Black celebrity. It's an attempt at actually looking Black/Black-adjacent to the point of confusing the audience.
Halsey is biracial. I'm not sure a lot of people know what that is. Not surprised since the entire creation of this topic was spun by illiterate Euromen.
to answer your question about Lonely is the Muse: yes. she has almost an entire album that sounds like it. If I Can't Have Love, I Want Power. produced by Nine-Inch Nails (Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross) and Lindsey Buckingham of Fleetwood Mac. released in 2021. about the "joys and tragedies of pregnancy and childbirth" giftwrapped in a recreation of the "Madonna + Wh**e" Complex. its a fantastic record and was one of the most acclaimed of 2021. none of this happened with that record, funny enough.
Its also so ironic that fantano made a video recently talking about Ethel Cain's comments about no one taking anything seriously and then posts this review
As someone who has chronic illnesses, it really does feel like you just have to impersonate the person you were before. Or just a person who functions.
imagine being sick and almost dying and putting all of that pain and heartache into your art just for a random ‘music critic’ on the internet to be like “ok but ur being dramatic asf rn” edit: should’ve worded “random ‘music critic’” better, i’m aware that fantano has a big following, regardless of if i regularly keep up with him or not. i found his review incredibly inhumane and disgustingly dismissive in the face of very serious topics and halsey’s/ashley’s personal stories and experiences. i think it’s important to hold fantano accountable for his very PUBLIC mistreatment of such a vulnerable body of work 🫶
I’ve been a Fantano follower for years. I’ve gotten a lot of great music recommendations from him. But God, this review is genuinely not it at all. It’s one thing to give a low score to a beloved album, it’s another to clearly not do an ounce of research into an album and completely miss the point of it.
As a woman who has been anemic for most of her life and was just exhausted all the time with no energy, I cannot express my frustration enough with the way I struggled so hard not to fall asleep during class, after coming home from school and having to do my homework and study, while constantly being called lazy and that "I would rather sleep than study". Having a heavy flow during my cycle made all the iron supplement treatment I would take for months just regress after 2-3 months after my cycle, having to take more iron supplements while having the worst digestion ever due to the supplements. And then moving onto birth control to combat my heavy flow, but then having migraines as a side effect up to the point I would feel like throwing up and being able to see was painful because my migraines would make dim lighting look super bright. I remember going to watch the Avatar 2 in theaters with my sister and having another migraine just 30 minutes before the end of the movie and I couldn't wait to come back home and take an ibuprofen, but my sister thought I was just cranky and said I ruined her night with my negativity, and I was too unwell to explain to her that I felt like I was getting a stroke or something. To an outsider, people like us seem overly dramatic or cranky or lazy, but we are just trying to live our everyday life and not feel sick and like a burden to everyone around us, so being called a "main character" is more insulting than you realize
You know, I wasn't expecting Anthony's comments to trigger me, but hearing them, I was suddenly back to being on the phone with a neurology department asking when they'd be offering me an appointment because I was experiencing bouts of paralysis that were becoming more frequent just to be told that my case was flagged as non-serious and that I'd have to talk to my GP about it again. And then I was on the phone to the hospital asking for updates on my lumbar puncture because something was wrong in my occipital lobes and I was terrified I was going blind. And then I was in the operating theatre for the third lumbar puncture of the day and the doctors weren't listening to me when I was trying to tell them that the local anaesthesia wasn't going to work and I was about to feel the pain of a lumbar puncture for the third time that day. And then I was near tears trying to explain to my GP that I was experiencing such bad nerve pain when walking that it was causing me to pass out and the GP was writing my concerns off and telling me to lose weight and to try to go for a walk every evening. Like I love Halsey's stuff and their most recent album is so relatable to me as someone who has gone through that pain and terror, where you are genuinely thinking I am going to die because people will not listen to me when I am telling them that there is something wrong with my body. And hearing him talk about Halsey as if they want to be some martyr and as if she's trying to make herself the victim is so bleakly relatable in itself. And god it's so ironic to describe chronic illness as some kind of symptom main character syndrome as if we aren't some of the most voiceless people in society.
big hug from a fellow chronic pain girly 🫂🫂 I have horrible nerve pain as well (severe pudendal neuralgia where I can’t walk) and it’s taken all of my teenage years away from me living in fear until I finally got diagnosed. Doctors didn’t know wtf to do with me and I felt like I was going insane so seeing this dismissal of medical trauma has hit home 💔
Doctors told my energetic 8 year old suddenly stopped walking because she was being dramatic. It was 9 months before a doctor would listen. She could barely eat ("Kids fake tummy aches") or sleep or live. She's better now after months of meds and a transfusion, but she lost two years of her childhood.
Fellow chronic pain girlie and Fanatano's statements about being dramatic and edgey mirror things my family has said about me. It made me sick and it's so disappointing.
@@spacegalaxy19chronic illness took my teen years away too. it’s very hard to watch your peers enjoy their youth while you’re bedridden. it’s taken a massive toll on me. I’m glad that you’re still here and that your life has improved after getting a diagnosis
Sending more love from another chronic pain girly. I am so triggered by doctors,when you've been dismissed so many times it's hard not to be beside yourself with worry that you're being misunderstood or blatantly ignored. Sending you lots of love. ❤️
I'm chronically ill with an invisible disability and while my life is not at risk, i see myself in what halsey is saying so deeply. as a woman, a teenage girl at the time, no one listened to anything i said. i was either being dramatic or straight up lying. I spent years in pain and bedridden before anyone even gave me a second look. i hate to be parasocial, im not even a halsey fan, but her speaking out about this means the world to me and i want to hug her for it.
Yeah i was in a similar situation for a few years, I thought I would spend the rest of my life living with my parents because I was in too much pain to do much of anything. I’m not a Halsey fan but when D’Angelo said what the album is about I made a mental note to check it out because it sounds really interesting.
Yes!! Everything she was expressing here resonates so deeply with me that I know I can't listen to the album because it'll trigger my medical PTSD. This kind of stuff needs to be expressed and put out into the world, because it's expressing a deep truth.
Me too. I have fibromyalgia and endometriosis, and it took years to be taken seriously and get diagnosed. Much love to you - we're all in this together
exactly my experience ❤️ mine started when I was 10 and only got diagnosed last year when I was 16 because doctors didn’t know wtf to do with me even when I was bed-bound sobbing in pain 😢 wasn’t a halsey fan but some of these songs made me tear up
I just left a very toxic marriage shortly after going through endometriosis surgery (which Halsey also suffers from). I deeply also felt like my illness was an inconvenience to my partner. This album resonated very strongly with me and seeing these men be so dismissive of the circumstances she was under as she created this is honestly infuriating.
9:15 I LOVE halsey and she is absolutely relatable. A lot of her songs are about abuse, being cheated on, relationships, losing her child, etc. All of her songs show exactly who she is.
Her songs that touch on her mental health are relatable to me in ways very few other artists quite get. The ups and downs of it. She's very relatable. Fantano is just being sexist whether he realizes it or not. That or he lacks the ability to understand the concept of empathy in any form and can only see something being relatable if it is relatable to himself.
I promise this album will be SUPER relatable and comforting to most of the women that listen to it. I spent 6 years complaining about feeling like there was something in my abdomen. Went to 8 different doctors, spent thousands, they all told me it was “in my head” and I was ‘too small and thin’ for anything to be there without it being observable… the last doctor I went to gave me two weeks to get “final arrangements” in order to prepare for an emergency surgery. It was a fibroid the size of a cantaloupe. Luckily, it was benign but because it got so large the surgery was complicated, I had to spend two months in bed, and will have health complications as a result until my dying day. My experience is minor in comparison to many other women’s experiences. I can imagine this being a very validating and healing experience to listen to a woman, with as many resources as Halsey- experiencing the same. Disappointing that Ant has that take but I’m glad his audience tore him a new one!
The one irony that you pointed out about Halsey acknowledging how men don't take her seriously is one thing...but then there is another song called 'Ego' from the same album where she actively acknowledges that she is NOT the main character and that she should 'kill her ego' and her self-obsession before it bites her back (this is my interpretation of the song). So not only does the image of this album convey more than just 'main character syndrome', it also actively admits to how pretending that you're the main character is actually self-destructive (cause if i don't my ego might kill me)
She also had other lyrics on the album like in The End, where she says she knows her illness isn't the end of the world but could be the end of her world. She also has a line where she says she knows she's not special or chosen and that the world goes on without her in the literal first track of the album.
The medical gaslighting that women face is very real, and the majority of the time, it is male doctors telling us, 'We're being dramatic' - I didn't miss the irony that the two critics who missed her point were ALSO men. I thank you for pointing out you can not care for the music and still absorb its point on its own merit. That is critical thinking done right. I almost lost my life to medical professionals not believing me, too, and it is terrifying. It makes you doubt your own sanity, and she had so much else going on at the SAME time, and yes musics put their lives into art.
Why would we as a society entrust our health with males when they are the gender that walk out when their wife or children fall ill? That is some age old bs that we need to get rid of.
I disagree it’s more that Halsey can at times come off as cringy and fake deep. There are plenty of artists that can be deep and people take what they say seriously
Halsey is not deep at all…and I love her music. But she’s very “14 year old on tumblr in 2015” type of “deep.” Which there’s nothing wrong with that, I like that vibe, but I’m not delusional enough to pretend like it’s deep.
@@witchykittyy listen to I believe in magic in her new album and tell me she's “14 year old on tumblr in 2015 type deep.” Literally listen to her previous album. She's an adult woman, and her music reflects that
I'm not a "critics are bad" person. I think art criticism is really valuable. But these people simply do not understand the concept of making personal art. Maybe this doesn't relate to you BECAUSE IT'S ABOUT A VERY SPECIFIC TOPIC!
I was thinking something similar. I don't usually listen to critics because usually what they're criticizing is so subjective, and there are tons of examples of music, movies, books, etc that were absolutely panned by critics but are super holy god popular. But also more along this video's topic, sometimes critics get...cruel? Like they took the art as a personal offense or something, so their criticism gets personal. I'm all for criticism if it's productive and fair, but there are times when, idk if the critic is having a bad day or what's going on, but they just go all in on something and it's like, dude why? It doesn't have to be like this.
Unfortunately a lot of so called critics - who in reality are just a bunch of pop magazine writers - have no idea what integrity and good criticism and media analysis is. If they did, we wouldn't be getting degenerate braindead opinions year after year after year. Not to mention that there's a whole subset of media reviewers like Fantano and Pitchfork whose entire business model is built around rage bait and contrarianism VS actual good faith critique.
I feel like being able to understand creative expression needs to be a prerequisite for being a critic. Like, what’s the purpose of critiquing something you don’t even understand? You’re supposed to have an EXPERT OPINION.
the “profoundly unrelatable” line really bothered me too bc even just from the brief screenshot you shared from the lupus subreddit, it’s abundantly clear that this album is likely deeply relatable for people with lupus or cancer or chronic illness in general!!
I wonder if Halsey had died from her cancer if these reviews would be so rude. This album was literally made at a time when they had no clue if they would make it out alive. This is just her trying to have a little fun experimenting with different genres because they didn't know if they'd have that opportunity again.
Shout Out to fantano's review of mac miller's swimming which he suddenly changed from a 3 to an 8 after Mac Miller died. fantano is so obviously biased against Artist he doesn't like in general, that any comment from him on music should be ignored. He is incapeable to review a Project just based on it's quality and will always Interpret something the worst way possible when he dislikes the Artist.
And the way we INTERNALIZE IT. Like the amount of second guessing I do on a daily basis no matter how fucked up the thing done to me is???? The way I’ve had to fight tooth and nail to unlearn putting myself down because I was treated like this my whole life by family and strangers alike
Bullies do that all the time, unfortunately. They come at you for something you did on your own that they didn't like, and then twist it around and blame you for "provoking" them just by living your life. Bully checklist top ten.
The craziest part about their recent response to the pitchfork review is that some people called her out for it and if you go to their accounts you see that they’re all music journalists or at least pretending to be out of their New York apartments lmaooo. The jokes write themselves
@@cinemachronicI think the worst part is them all being obtuse on purpose to further justify their “big bad millionaire pop star has a meltdown online bc someone doesn’t like her music/and is sending their parasocial fanbase after poor journalists who make 24k a year” narrative they’re all parroting. The extreme gaslighting is insane
I relate to Halsey way too much. I couldn’t imagine publicizing my health issue just to see men pick it apart on the internet. She’s so courageous for that. I respect that even if people don’t like the album that much.
Calling it "profoundly unrelatable' just seems so wrong. I've dealt with chronic illness, I have friends that have. We can all find bits of shared experience in their work. Wild that the Pitchfork author had such a chip on their shoulder, and it comes off as so unprofessional.
I think many male critics have HUGR blind spots when examining media that is exploring life experiences they can’t relate to. Rather than being humble and recognizing this as their own limitation by exercising empathy to extend their analysis, they penalize the film/song/book itself for being too ‘insert veiled misogynistic critic” here. It reminds me of when a male reviewer called “Turning Red” not relatable. If my memory serves me correct, he was making specific reference to the scene about Mei’s mom thinking she got her period. An experience very relatable to women but we don’t actually see in media often despite being a common coming of age experience for girls.
i don't usually comment on these videos but thank you for sharing this, d'angelo. i lost my cousin to lupus when she was 26 years old last year and she was like my sister. people refused to take her seriously and take her pain seriously so she died. this stuff has REAL EFFECTS on REAL PEOPLE. its so much deeper than what fantano makes it out to be.
I discovered Anthony Fantano years ago, way before he became super popular. I stopped watching him once I realized that sometimes he doesn't actually review the music, he just hates on the artist/music without any constructive criticism or support for his feelings/thoughts. Being "a hater" is not the same as being a "real, valid critic." And he has hated on Halsey for years. I haven't taken him seriously since I realized that, and I was surprised when he suddenly became popular. I think you can hate/dislike an artist but acknowledge that their work is good or vice versa. But hating just to hate isn't actually good, valid critiquing.
That last sentence hits the nail bc its essay writing 101. Its how professionals handle shit and he is definitely not a professional. I have never heard of this man before but this has definitely turned me away from watching his content if its ever recommended to me
I’m very puzzled on how there some people who defend Fantano. Then again he was one of the few who started a music critic channel on UA-cam. So, maybe that is why he got so big? Because at that time there was no else. At least from what I can remember that did reviews on music albums. Anyways, his criticism are laughably bad. Honestly, I can’t take him seriously, not since he had reviewed one of Lana Del Rey albums.
i feel like everyone forgot that she also literally had a miscarriage on stage. she was about to go on, started miscarrying, and her manager gave her an adult diaper and sent her out to perform. and ppl still act like she's some overdramatic entitled popstar
Ok no no no. She as a grown adult made that decision for herself & her fans. She has spoken on it. She was NOT FORCED to do ANYTHING. They encouraged her, & she was in shock. But that’s it. No one forced her to use her own two feet & walk on that stage that night. Possible coercion, maybe. But Free Will put her on the stage. It is so exhausting seeing people try to use language, & use it incorrectly. She is not a Britney Spears case. She loves Brit & can probably relate in some instances. However, don’t say anyone was forced to do something - unless you can prove it. The opposite proof is out there. She tries to “credit herself to her fans” for pushing through the performance. A damn joke. No one respects you more for performing through a miscarriage, girl. Get to a damn doctor & don’t risk your Health for fame/money. Dumb to Me.
@AS-rr9km "grown ass adult" is a big stretch for her being 20 at the time. she said herself in an interview that the show was a big deal not just because of the number of people there but also corporate and media sponsors attached to it. sure, nobody put a gün to her head and made her go out there, but it might not have felt like she had much of a choice at all. i don't know why you're making it out like i said he physically dragged her on stage. it has literally nothing to do w britney or any type of conservatorship or anything of that nature at all and i never even implied that so i have no idea why you're putting so many words in my mouth LMAO
i was diagnosed with leukemia in 2022 and stopped this video to listen to the album and “the end” made me start crying within 30 seconds. the only other thing that has capture a cancer diagnosis as well was the album Hospice by the Antlers
THANK GOD SOMEONES COVERING THIS!!!! People like fantano haven't gone through or experienced the LACK OF CONTROL in your own life that comes with chronic health issues yet still feel like they can confidently address and criticize music about it as if they know anything on that topic and how the words cut as deep as they do. As someone with BPD, Endometriosis, Ehlers Danlos Syndrome and WAAAAAAY more that i'd like not to share to the world, this album finally gave me a way to express how destroyed and cruel life with health issues is. I've shared this album to legit every person i know, explaining if they care and if they want to know more about me, this album gives an amazing insight into life with chronic illnesses and every person i've showed has nothing but high praise and love because they can relate it to my experience and see the daily struggles. Truly just because baldtano just has no one in his life that has experienced this personally and opened up to him about it. Stupid take from stupid baldthany bakatano.
@@BigOwl51 they legit said they are suffering in similar ways to what is expressed in the album. How is suffering privileged??? Plus most music that is super popular is popular because people can relate to it.
@@SoManyRandomRamblingsmakes sense, which is why the great impersonator is a commercial failure. The most streamed song on that album only has 20 million streams on Spotify. For comparison, without me has 2 BILLION streams. So I guess you’re right. Popular music is relatable, and this album isn’t popular, because it’s not relatable.
I was disappointed in Fantano because he can be crass or sarcastic with his jokes or musical criticism all he wants , but usually he doesn't attack the artists personal character unless they are being racist or bigoted... And although halsey's music is a hit or miss for me, she has always shown a lot of empathy and raised awareness about many important issues... I find very sad how there's always someone projecting onto her, misunderstanding her in bad faith or being cruel to her, when she clearly makes an effort to be considerate with others. I heard this album and I actually really liked it, musically and lyrically, but I get how some people may not like her singing style or how the mood of this project is 90% depressing... However, as you pointed out, the themes of this album are fairly clear: she sings about childhood neglect, being an unwanted daughter, the memory of her teenage friend dying due to an overdose, her doctor not believing her statements, misdiagnosis, getting sick, her contemplating her mortality, her strained relationship with both her parents, how the body retains memories of stress towards certain triggers eve years later, abandonement issues and distrust of men, her partner leaving her when she got sick, being a people's pleaser as a coping mechanism, fearing for the future of her toddler if she can't be there, being objectified and alienated by the masses due to being a star, her desperation to feel loved related to her feeling repeatedly rejected, struggling with her faith in the face of death... The entire story is very coherent and heavy. You can see how people's childhood problems affect their perception of themselves and how they deal with relationships... These are real experiences that A LOT of people suffer. It's not just about her. And I can see how this could resonate with people who need someone to tell them that their fear, their pain, their anger, their sadness is valid and allowed to be expressed.
He definitely showed his true colors there. Halsey is more vulnerable: she's bipolar, a biracial woman who appears white, portrays herself as extremely 'quirky' etc. In other words, she's an easy target for misogynists who want to exercise their misogyny in a way that will be more socially "accepted." Tbh, to me, he looks exactly like what he is, inside out. I am profoundly unsurprised.
@@meemzingshe isn't biracial! Lol y'all kill me by adding everything to this girl's personal victim resume, wondering why people don't like her and thinks she's self centered. Her father is biracial and her mother is white, making her white. Period, everyone goes through things but that doesn't mean people have to like her music.
@@whatreallymatters571 No lol, Halsey is biracial. Her dad is not biracial he is a light skinned AA. The point (that clearly went way over your head) is she is biracial and APPEARS white, so if anyone wanted to target her for her belonging (or lack thereof) it would be simpler.
@@whatreallymatters571 Halsey is biracial. Her dad is not biracial, he is a light skinned AA. The point (that clearly went way over your head) is she is biracial and APPEARS white, so if anyone wanted to target her for her belonging (or lack thereof) it would be simpler.
“the great impersonator does feel like it is designed to position halsey as a tortured singular artist” like okay? and what was the reaction to the tortured poets department or wtv by taylor swift? like this isn’t a new trope be serious
To be fair they also called Taylor dramatic BUT she and Halseys struggles (the ones on their albums at least) are not even on the same plane of existence so I don't know why are they even using the same language. Thats just goes to show you how out of their way they had to go to be able to critique Halsey.
@@riahlexingtonshe was criticized too, but if people actually listened tot he album, she explicitly states she isn’t a tortured artist, and she was being overdramatic. The prologue mentions how she was manic (temporary insanity) when writing some of the songs, and she writes often about the symptoms of bpd (mania, depression, intense but unstable relationships, emotional instability, impulsive behavior). While not saying directly that she suffers from a specific mental illness besides an ed, she very much has alluded to it throughout her entire discography (the earliest I can think of is fearless “screaming and crying and kissing in the rain…. Roller coaster kinda rushed..That’s the way I loved”you”.
@@riahlexington not to shift the focus from Halsey but Taylor is constantly shat on by music critics & general audiences, especially online. the only folks that like her are her fans afaik. anyway, however you look at it, there are certain female artists that people simply dislike and will think that all of their art is shit. unfortunately, Halsey can frequently be in that category when she never deserved it imo
Halsey: I have a fear of leaving my child without a mother, nobody takes my symptoms seriously, the people that i thought i loved have left me, i was on a brink of death Men: Lol move on, so dramatic Shia Lebouf: I Abused my ex girlfriend, almost killed my wife and very likely i'll do it again Men: omg we love you vulnerable king
Zoe Seldana wore "Brown" makeup to play Nina Simone. Identity isnt always a "shield" to protect a Black, or biracial person from being called out for problematic behaviour. The picture isnt Blackfishing bec. she isnt trying to look or pass as a Black woman, she was simply recreating the pose, clothes and hairstyle.
Ooooh the pitchfork response so clever tbf. Let's be honest, if she sounded more like these artists she was inspired by - you can GUARANTEE that music reviewers would drag her for not sounding unique enough. Truly damned if you do, damned if you don't. I personally enjoyed the album, due to the variety, I certainly have favourites (including LITM), but the overall narrarive of the story (something that was clearly missed by some 😅) Thank you for making this vid!
they DID get dragged for Lucky. people were non-stop accusing her of stealing for britney despite the fact that halsey sampled the song with permission. its insane how fast people are willing to forget. Lucky is my least favorite song on the album but holy shit people come at it for the worst reasons
Right? If she does sound like the original artists, she's unoriginal. If she doesn't, she's not doing a good enough job impersonating. Women and afab people can never win
5:49 did people forget halsey is also literally biracial 😭 extremely white passing yes, but they've talked about it extensively and it has in fact been the basis of other stupid controversies stirred up around them 6:55 also the answer is kind of yes, her last album If I Can't Have Love I Want Power was produced by nine inch nails and nothing on it sounds exactly like lonely is the muse but it's much more in that gritty alt rock lane, you might enjoy it more
@@RogueVideoRavenif anything that would just make her uber mixed, right? Even if she is more white than black, genetics aren't ever as simple as perfect halves or thirds, though to be fair I did just relearn that recently. Maybe if they were "overcompensating" with a blaccent and surgeries and whatnot there might be room for discussion, but if she's just existing...then you can't call that blackfishing. Some black people really piss me off as a ambiguously "mixed" person (as in I could be majority black, afro-latino, black with indigenous ancestry and recent latino lineage, etc etc) with their who's not black nonsense. Not even just those black people, but all people when it comes to people of two or more ethnicities/races. If, in the eyes of racism, they are someone that would've been considered a "halfblood" or a "halfbreed"... they're a poc. It's unfortunate, but it's equally upsetting to try and say any mixed person is just one identity, either to exclude or to gatekeep.
Fantano had this weird take a while back about Sabrina Carpenter’s Taste where he kinda knocked it for being toxic (I’m being a bit reductive for the sake of brevity) - and yeah, that’s the point?? Sometimes you’re gonna have toxic feelings about your ex. The tongue in cheek homoeroticism in the song wasn’t brought up either. I feel like this is kinda similar to that situation in the sense that he just writes off things he can’t personally relate to at times in a really unfortunate way. Edit for clarification: I don’t want to bash the guy or prescribe any opinions to him, because that’s not helpful to anyone. I just thought it was kind of emblematic of how this type of discourse tends to go. Calling out toxicity where you see it is fine of course, but the bar for what’s considered "problematic" for women is so unbelievably low compared to what guys get away with. It’s okay to not relate to a piece of art or thinking it’s cringe or whatever, but there’s something to be said for having the grace to realise that the reason you’re having those feelings might not always be the artists fault. Culturally ingrained misogyny is a powerful drug. No one *has* to like Halsey’s album or praise it but saying she’s expecting us to marvel at her childish angst is just cold. Maybe in the eyes of some she failed at conveying what she went through in an artistically pleasing way, but that does not warrant cruelty.
Yeah literally I remember in that review Fantano was talking about how Sabrina's describes her love interests in sharpest tool, good graces, don't smile, etc as idiots and she wants them to miss her or something. But clearly if you listen to the songs she clearly referring to herself- for don’t smile she’s keeping on telling herself she want the person to miss her even they moved on bc she’s misses them; good graces she’s doesn’t want anyone else but if they do something suspect she has to leave them; for sharpest tool, she’s talking about miscommunication and how the love interest as more than a situationship bc it’s not seriously to him. Like some of his takes are fine but it feels like fantano isn't giving these albums a good listen or he’s just bias on certain pop music and undermines the artists (he did that for ethal cain's album, beabadoobee, etc.)
tons of men have songs about wanting to beat/kill their ex or her new boyfriend. it's okay for them to be honest about their feelings but women have to be a perfect cool girl's girl 💀 i swear to god these people will pick up a diary and expect it to be full of compliments
he was so mad about Sabrina calling men dumb/stupid 💀 He's honestly not the best at analyzing lyrics. He takes it too literally and doesn't care to think about it even for half a second more, it's frustrating watching him review a song and miss the entire point even when the point is as blantant as it was on Sabrina's songs. Don't smile is so simple and he was like 'toxic' that's it. Apparently it's illegal to wish for your ex to miss you because it hurts that they moved on too fast and it makes you feel like they never cared at all 🙃
@@theclairewhy literally tyler the creator, as mentioned in the video, has said insanely v!0lent things towards women just while speaking and in his music and clearly he loves that.
misogynistic ableism is the theme of the album. emphasis on ableism. its absolutely wild how they missed the point. As someone who has been following halsey since room 913, i appreciate you bringing up Halsey's work. Halsey has consistently been clowned as someone to not take serious since their fruition in the industry. they've always been very open about their creative process, their health issues, mental health, multiple miscarriages, and they constantly are pegged as being an attention seeker rather than an advocate. she's been VERY transparent about the album and almost dying. The lyrics are very obvious about their baby daddy treated them during this period which was extremely abusive. i love this album even though its a tough listen. halsey's music is some of the most relatable even though the situations are things i cannot relate to. she also is very open about their artistic endeavors are doing whatever they want and being dynamic. i love that they always change. thats literally a threaded theme throughout their work. Halsey almost died. Halsey has 2 life threatening chronic illnesses that they have to hope wont interfere with their livelihood. I've never heard such an obviously intended album, even if the music itself doesn't hit for people, be completely missed. having to sort through trauma and mortality and being left to die with no support system and praying you can live for the child you worked so hard to conceive is a LOT. and its wild how misogynistic and ableist it is. halsey did say that this album was like badlands and manic, badlands which is a little edgy and dramatic but also erratic and going through deep emotions. and who cares if halsey is feeling dramatic? off topic: lonely is the muse is my fave song on the album as well!! their last album was produced by NIN and has a couple great rock songs on it. also lonely is the muse to me feels like its a realization that if she dies she'll die as only being an inspirational tool for the lovers in her life and her accomplishments are not as valid because she's a woman . very tongue in cheek. "ive done all these things and yet im reduced to someone you sleep with". thanks for the video, glad someone with a platform has common sense!
Great comment, I follow her since Badlands and absolutely LOVED " If I can't have love, I want power" Which is one of my favorite albums of all time 🤩 You bring up good points too 👍🏽
I haven't listened to Halseys album yet but I do have a few chronic illnesses. One thing I learned really early on is that I cannot talk about my illness "too much" (if at all) because others don't appreciate it even if they love you. I've almost completely isolated myself now because my life is so encompassed by my illnesses that I can't work or do anything except occasionally play videogames (if I have enough energy/ my pain isn't too bad) or watch UA-cam/ my favourite shows. So I can't talk about my struggles but if I don't, it just sounds like my life is a paradise of being able to be lazy and doing fun things for people who have a normal life and are working. I can't get out of this hole as my doctors have dismissed me so much that I doubt they'll help at all and my health has become bad enough that I can't do anything myself to change it. All that to say, chronic illness is a struggle and I hope that people's attitudes will change. But for now, all I can do is focus on the positives no matter how tiny or infrequent they are so I can at least maintain some sanity.
Oh my goodness, I hope you listen to the album soon cause they do have a song that perfectly encapsulates what you just talked about!! I love halsey so so much, I am very proud and glad she spoke up about this and I am also sending you lots of courage and love
Oof. This is very relatable 😢 hang in there, fellow internetter. I don't even know how to be more hopeful than that, I had to double check that I didn't somehow type this in a fugue state. I get frustrated that this is what my life is limited to-- it isn't a paradise or an orgy of slothful behavior. It's a shrine to how heavy the price of survival is. People always think I'm faking it until they see me fall after pushing me to ignore the signs that exactly that is about to happen, and since they don't listen, they get surprised and mad I didn't scream dramatically for help so they... wouldn't look bad walking away or not noticing immediately. Not so they could actually help, so they could pretend to and get the right faces on for bystanders. I've tried asking people who think this is a paradise, who say they want my life, what they'd do if it meant they couldn't have sex anymore. not in any way they recognize now, and definitely not in their preferred ways. Suddenly nobody wants this "paradise" and it's ONLY sex I removed from the hypothetical equation. Friends, work, hobbies, opportunities, real money, fun experiences, intimate relationships or highly engaged friendships, a lot of school... all of that falls away, too. It takes a long time to recover, or even get to a point that we can go "yup this is my life now." Sorry, this is a novel. I believe you, I know this ain't some gd cake walk or extended vacation. 💐 it's life.
I almost died from medical gaslighting as an AFAB person with a nueroimmune disease. Fame and money can’t get them to take you seriously, nothing can. It took my mom 30 years and me 16; to learn we had a crippling genetic mutation. My life will likely end prematurely as a consequence of medical gaslighting and maltreatment. This is honestly not dramatic enough. If I had her money and power I’d make every person who let me decay suffer the way they made me.
THANK YOU. I was waiting on youtubers to talk about this. Being “the main character” in your art & music isn't a valid criticism. no DUH bc you're the artist. you don't have to like the music but calling her a "performative victim" deeply insensitive & cruel. what man has been criticized like this???
to take all of this, we can now (as of an hour ago) add "her mother ALSO battling cancer while the record was being finished" to the laundry list of things that they were going through during the past two years.
“designed to position halsey as a tortured singular artist” y’all make me SICKKKK. y’all hate it when women in the industry stick to an aspirational level of glamour & polish & mystique but then also hate when they open up about their health, personal lives, thoughts on the world etc. WOMEN CANT WIN!!!!!
Pov a woman writes about medical misogyny and a bunch of men tell her she doesn't know what shes talking about
not defending either of them but fantano's review is being hugely misinterpreted. When he brought up the "main character syndrome" thing it was not when speaking about the whole album but a specific song in which the lyrics were genuinely just that. Also fantano rates albums based on music quality and when he was summarising the album he was only talking about the sound of it.
Edit: As I stand corrected and mistaken, he was indeed talking about the entire album. I still think his review being misinterpreted though, feel free to debate.
@@shaungovind8698He literally said the whole album has ‘the worst case of main character syndrome’
@@str4wberrystarburst he said "record" not album... go back and watch the review he was talking about a song which can also be referred to as a record
I hate that those people are the same gender as me!
@@shaungovind8698 i want you to actually read your comment.. like bro fantano calls albums, records.. now he's referring to a song?? What's next? He's actually talking about Donald trump on his review about Halsey's new album!!! Totally believable!!
"playing the victim" in response to her having literal cancer is Wild. How deranged does someone have to be to write that???
fr
A man is allowed to react, a woman can only overreact
I feel like these days, people throw around "playing the victim" or "victim mentality" too much. They just say it any time they want to silence victims because hearing them talking about their trauma makes them uncomfortable.
@@mynameisreallycool1 THIS!
@@mynameisreallycool1 Big "no excuses" vibes. Like why does the word even exist then? lol
calling a grown woman "childish" for nearly dying of cancer is a fucking insane level of misogyny
It's also pretty funny in an ironic kind of way, because Halsey IS LITERALLY calling themselves "a baby" in "Ego" (lyrics: "I'm acting like a fucking baby"), but these ignorant people somehow missed that (conveniently so).
it's men like this that hold us back🤮
Oh please calling this misogyny is insane victim complex. Fantano is just an asshole and does this shit to male artists too
no one said that
@@nofanealbni well he literally said her album sounded like it was made by an angsty teenager so yeah it sounds like he was calling her kind of childish or at least her art kind of childish
“She’s making herself a victim” okay cuz she IS???? Of her own body??? WHAT
These people are insane istg
EXACTLY. If it was someone like Celine Dion writing about her illness, or Gaga, people would celebrate it. I hate that people dunk on Halsey for the sake of it. She’s not my vibe but she deserves mercy
I hate when people say someone is playing a victim, because most of the time, they are actually a victim. 🙄🙄🙄
like she literally couldve died???????? while going thru a divorce????
Victim of her own body the dumbest shit I’ve ever heard😭
people reacting about an album about medical misogyny almost killing her and people missing the point and responding with misogyny, the irony
Please go put this on Fantano’s garbage review ❤
There’s literally no misogyny in the Pitchfork review
@@saranoelle3927Fantano’s review is garbage? Why? I think that dude sucks but you guys, they’re there to review the MUSIC. not the story that inspired the music. Wtf??
The music just isn’t very good. D’Angelo himself says that!
What if Fantano had simply said he thought the music itself was bad and the lyrics were garbage? Like what if he had said he sympathizes with her struggles, but just doesn’t think she possesses the artistry or the vision to pull it off? I’ve listened. I do sympathize with her struggles, but I personally feel the music and lyrical content itself is garbage. She didn’t stick the landing. You can stan a story and a struggle all you want, but if the craftsmanship behind it is garbage, then what’s the point?
@@dcat65 it's fine to simply not like the song, but that is not what the video was criticising.. he literally said that lmao, and there is a point EVEN if it is lyically/musically bad, you can critisize it on that merit. the criticism was that she is overdramatic and self centred for making a song about being diagnosed with cancer and thinking she was gonna die? like you clearly have not watched the video
I feel like “main character syndrome” and “trauma dumping” have been so over used to the point that we aren’t allowed to talk about ourselves with friends and family any more. When did needing support become cringe?
Heavily agree
They really have. At this point, when people talk about “trauma dumping,” I just assume they’re a bad friend and keep it pushing.
@@Julie-ik9cr are people confused by the definition of trauma dumping? its a very real thing 😭
Best comment. Literally, this is how people feel isolated and depressed when they feel they cant share their feelings. And being an artist she wrote about what she was experiencing… thats it? Idc if people think im being too defensive but albums like great impersonator and even tortured poets are critisized for playing the victim but if a man’s, any man’s name was on those songs and lyrics it would be taken a bit more seriously.
@@margielaaa Trauma dumping is very much a real thing and can be hurtful but a lot of people on the internet use it (whether wittingly or not) as an excuse to villainize people for being vulnerable because they're not comfortable with it. Either that, or they were mislead by the former group of ppl into thinking any vulnerability is trauma dumping.
Halsey: People acted like I was being dramatic when I was fearing for my health.
People: You're being dramatic.
It's almost comical how badly they missed the point.
Let me start by saying that these reviews absolutely missed the mark and were way too harsh. But I think, without attacking Halsey as a person, you can definitely make some legitimate criticisms of the writing being dramatic at parts. One of the lyrics was "I always knew I was a martyr and Jesus was one too," and I personally think it's fair to find writing like that a bit dramatic. But again, I think you can frame those criticisms in a way that doesn't invalidate her feelings, and that neither of those reviews attempted to do that.
@@JustForTheTuneswomen are martyrs in culture, for as long as the patriarchy exists this statement will remain true. it isnt dramatic because it can very seriously be compared directly to reality.
@@JustForTheTunes Why are you so stuck on this lyric that you are replying to multiple people with the same example? Look, I think criticizing the lyric is fine but part of music and art is that it is often irrational. Part of being in traumatic situations is that it seems like the end of the world even if it's just something really bad that's happening to you in particular. When I listen to that lyric, I relate to it heavily right until the end of the song, then I drop the dramatics, because I'm done being in my feelings. And just to be clear, you personally can think the lyric is silly, that's your opinion, but other people can think your opinion is shallow and not well thought out, which is just another layer of opinions.
But also, let's not pretend like most music isn't dramatic af for wayyyyy less serious reasons and people don't get told they are being "dramatic". The reality is a lot of people are uncomfortable with the idea of dying and their own "dramatic" emotions and get upset with other people for being open about when they feel like a Jesus-like martyr. It's dumb but it's how most people feel at some points of their life, even if they realize at the time that's it dumb.
@@DaniFromNowOnso basically you agree with the other comment that it's dramatic?
@@maimee1but is "you're dramatic" a legitimate criticism even? Why does nobody ever complain about the love songs and the breakup songs being dramatic, even though like 90% of the time they are?
Using Tyler the Creator as an example was spot on - No one hates Tyler for talking about his life, his views, his mental health, his pain. And he does it in the most extra ways possible. When a woman does it? She is dramatic, she is complaining, she thinks she is more important than everyone.
So basically the pain women go through isn’t considered anywhere; not in a doctor’s office and certainly not on the album people chose to listen to.
@ 👀 I’m looking for the part where I said he did…
@@elstovonHow about you stop spreading misinformation? Or.. get better reading comprehension 🤷♂️
@@elstovon 😂 bud, they're talking about D'Angelo bringing it up in the video you're commenting on 🥴 whoosh
Because when Tyler does it, he does it with good music. And if he say his song is dedicated/inspired by Dr Dre, Guess what? It’s going to actually song like a Dre song.
The irony of the fact that the album literally talks about her struggle with doctors & not being listened to/heard.
It’s so funny how fantano gave brat a 10 when everything about it is "main character" and even starts with "I’m everywhere I’m so Julia"
i was thinking the same thing like omg what
Don't get me wrong. I am happy for Charli XCX getting her freaking flowers, but the fact that was a 10 and this is below a 5 is ridiculous
The difference is Charli made a good album.
lmaoo ragebait^
@@veyane its objectively a better album and i think most people would agree🤷♂️
Women's health and pain is treated like a joke from beginning to end. Every single woman I know has been dismissed by doctors or treated like an idiot.
same here
Yes, I was going to say the same thing. On various occasions, doctors tried to tell me that I did not have (separate!) medical conditions I knew I had, and later got properly assessed for, diagnosed with, and treated with. In one case, the treatment required and resulted in surgery, which I wouldn't have gotten had I listened to the first doctor. Makes me want to exit my body when I think about it too much.
For fucking real…
"it's just endometriosis it's not that bad" ok dude one of my kidneys is now at risk but keep telling me how it's not that bad
Yes! I have not met a single woman who hasn’t experienced this.
I had a surgeon tell me to “stop being a fragile little girl and man up” when I was 13 because I had chronic pain from a botched surgery he did. It happened 3 times for 3 different reasons but I proved 3 surgeons my pain was real once they cut me open. But my white privilege is the only reason i eventually got proper care. My non white cousin is dead because they gaslit her when she kept telling them she had chest pain. She was 18 and died from medical neglect after giving birth she went into heart failure. They had a full day to catch it, to believe her, but they let her suffer and die instead.
😢
I’m so sorry about your cousin and your experience. I also lost a cousin recently she told them something was wrong before giving birth to her child. They both didn’t make it. I wish doctors would listen. 😭
That is sickening. I wish there wasn’t such evil in the medical industry.
I am angry for your cousin.
I’m so sorry about your cousin
:( medical misogyny is such a big problem and really needs to stop
HER HUSBAND LEAVING HER
YALL KNOW THAT 60% MEN LEAVE THEIR SICK PARTNERS
Most divorce initiators are women, and?
20%
Also there’s a theory about this ( why the divorce rates are high in these instances) may be because of insurance and financial purposes. In the us especially when these studies were done, men were more likely to be the bread winners and therefore the insurance carriers- so if the spouse became ill, they might legally divorce to receive better state benefits overall. Or sadly, because medical debt might affect financial status and abilities for current or future rent/mortgages/loans/leases- they might divorce to have one fiscally safe individual who will be able to take out credit/loans in future. It’s the sad reality of the US and those going through medical treatments. But just a reminder of why findings shouldn’t be taken at face value. This doesnt explain Halseys case though to be clear, just wanted to clarify on the 20%
@@BlackBullNDN no 60% is pretty close, lowest stat I've ever seen on this was 48% highest was 62%, so eh, just depends on what you're reading
@@kodabuck225 ". A 2009 study published in the journal Cancer found that a married woman diagnosed with a serious disease is six times more likely to be divorced or separated than a man with a similar diagnosis. Among study participants, the divorce rate was 21 percent for seriously ill women and 3 percent for seriously ill men. "
8:00 The reviewer is not realizing that "The Great Impersonator" is a term for lupus, the autoimmune disease that Halsey was diagnosed with. That's why the album is called that. The disease and how hard it is to diagnose is the inspiration for the album not a random impulse to imitate the styles of various artists.
Lmao not him not even doing his research
Thank you for explaining that. I am not into Halsey's career lore, I am more of a casual listener so I didn't know too much about the deeper meaning of the new concept. But it makes so much more sense now❤
Lupus is already a difficult disease to diagnose (bc its symptoms may point to many other conditions, therefore it being an "impersonator") but it is tragically comical to me that my mom first got diagnosed with Lupus when she actually has an even rarer autoimmune disease. Listening to Halsey's music helped me understand a bit more how my mom feels but doesn't know how to express. It's a great album
I have listened to this album 5 times without realizing this. Thank you. Thank you. Now I have to listen another five times with new perspective. I'm sure I'll love it even more.
Ok that’s makes it such a killer album name
This is why I roll my eyes at men who say that women aren't punished for crying or being emotional. People write off women as dramatic or hysterical for expressing fear, anger, pain, or sadness all the time, to the point where it negatively affects their quality of care at a doctor's office. Doubly so if said woman is a woman of color.
What's crazy too is how men experience that in a similar, though less directly cruel, way. Men have been told not to cry, that anger is more acceptable and even then that too much emotion is "feminine", that being anything associated with women is a bad thing, no matter how irrational.
I may not necessarily be a trans man, but the horror stories I've heard from them about how they start being perceived differently, how men start seeing them as "one of their own" and just spew the most cruel shit without batting an eye...not to mention the hypocrisy when women advocate for feminism and men interrupt them with "but what about men?" as if any of those insecure losers would genuinely comfort a male friend of theirs. Women have done significantly more for men than men have, both due to socialization of the genders and because of the acknowledgement of how patriarchy and misogyny literally kills all of us. I have never in my life seen a man advocate for men genuinely beyond "I want pu$$y".
You suffer as well, maybe not to the same cruel degree but it is a cruel fate nonetheless. How could any of them then look at women...and have the audacity to say that? Realistically, everybody is shamed for human emotions, regardless of gender-i genuinely don't understand how the vast majority of men can suffer under misogyny and not feel for those that aren't men, dealing with conscious misogyny rather than subconscious misogyny.
Anger is similar but in reverse. When men are angry or complain about ways in which they are marginalised they are dismissed whereas women have a whole movement to support them for any real or perceived inequality.
@@Anonymityfanthe reason for that movement was to let women have the freedom to vote, have jobs, study in school, be equal, whereas men don't have one because.. guess what? They already have the things women began that movement for :p
@@Anonymityfan I've seen the complete opposite...? Whenever women complain about being marginalized, they get belittled, meanwhile so many feminists talk about mens' issues nowadays and the comments are always completely supportive. Whenever I see a big headline about a woman talking about misogyny, the comments are the likes of "Ugh can women do anything besides playing victim?", whenever there's a headline criticizing feminism or talking about mens' issues, all the comments are the likes of "Finally somebody said it!!"
The comments here kindly point out the double standards of how mens' angsty music albums about their addiction problems are iconic, while womens' albums about their personal experiences are torn apart because "they're just playing victim".
Also, yes, women have a whole movement to support them because they used to have NO RIGHTS. Men never NEEDED a whole movement to themselves.
I can tell you, I used to be a huge anti feminist who got incredibly upset whenever people would focus on women while men got treated unfairly. Now I'm a lot more focused on unfair treatment against women. Why am I telling you this? Because it was so much easier to be an anti feminist than to be a feminist. I was hardly ever mad as an anti feminist because I saw men get so much support and attention, especially from feminists themselves, plus, anti feminism was and still is on a rise, more so than feminism is, and that made me happy. The only times I was truly mad was when there was healthy conversations about womens' issues. I was one of those "BUT MEN TOO!!"-people. Now as a feminist, I get upset about truly unfair treatment and actual hatred against the gender I'm focussing on (women) much more often and I see way less support.
@@DwynTwo In real life the opposite is usually the case, whenever women complain they are met with sympathy or at worst ignored whereas men are often laughed at. Think about how complaints about misandry go vs misogyny or how male cheating victims like Will Smith were mocked in a way no female cheating victims were or the same for domestic violence and SA. In terms of music I will take your word for it because I am not a big music listener. Men defnitely are more in need of a movement advocating for their rights in the west than women. Look at everything from homelessness, to getting to longer prison sentences for the same crimes to earning less in their 20's, to doing worse in school, to being less likely to get into university, to prostate cancer being less funded despite being more lethal to how violence against men is treated vs violence against women, to homicide to all the other stuff I mentioned earlier and the list goes on. Women have their own issues for sure but what can you really mention that makes you think being a woman is anywhere near as difficult as being a man?
I keep hearing that Fantano proves with every review why his wife left him and I can’t help but agree, especially after this review, holy shit.
Gotta love how people validate a male celebrity like Shia labouf using his mental illness and substance issues to justify abusing women and being cruel for his "art", but Halsey using her personal struggles with her diagnosed illness' as an outlet to express her pain has people personally offended and calling her dramatic.
EXACTLY 😡
OH MAMA say it louder for the ppl in the back 👏🏻👏🏻
Gotta love mysoginy!!!
YUPPPPP
I thought ppl just clowned on Shia labouf
Being terrified of dying as a single mother and shouldering the weight of saying goodbye to the child you fought so hard to have… such childish angst am I right fellas? GOD Fantano’s review pissed me the fuck off.
I’ve also been seeing (very few) comments defending him for “not having all the context die-hard fans have”. It’s in the lyrics though?? Huh? Is this just another “media literacy is dead” thing?
Fr, the line about shaving her head cause she's sick should've clued him in. Also, talking about her treatment starting in The End and being sick every couple of years would also be a big hint
@gothic_nix that and basically the entirety of life of the spider, + other lyrics about having to leave behind her child. You'd have to be completely not paying attention to the lyrics & ignored the entire album rollout to miss the context. And I know fantano listened to the lyrics enough to whine about them being "childish" (really childish to write lyrics about starting medical treatment while you're dying amiright), so I truly do not understand how he was able to justify his position to himself
Fantano seems to be one of those insincere guys who relies on being cynical to keep up his popularity, I can't help thinking this is an obvious attention grab for him. I do not follow Halsey at all, only knew about some health struggles she had but the theme of the album was very obvious to me on first listen. The fact he didn't get any sense of emotion from the songs to stop himself making a tired snarky jab at Halsey, even if he doesn't like the music, tells me all I need to know about what type of person he is.
@@shoobamocha Couldn't have put it better myself
Fantano, the UA-camr? which video did he review this album in? his video titles are... not always very descriptive.
EDIT: OH. ohhhhhh. wild that I know him more for his second channel than his first. Oo I still wonder if the "missing the point" video he posted with FD covers this. nope. it was about right wingers failing to grasp the meaning of things. good lord.... someone get Anthony a mirror, stat.
I'm not a Halsey fan, but this made me real curious, so I went and listened to the whole album and damn... it's so fucking beautiful. You would not believe it's what those assholes are talking shit about.
Misogyny so bad, they're hating on songs that sound like an angels lulling you to sleep.
Edit: I'm gonna be listening to The End on repeat for next few hours. That shit's beautiful.
The End is one of the best ones on the album for sure
@Tocaraca that song alone could've made it a good album even if all the other songs where shit. Which they weren't. I simply do not understand how it got so much hate. Misogyny is crazy.
@@chiedzawith2ds Maybe I'm in an echo chamber, but I haven't seen much hate luckily. Fantano's own comment section was full of people defending the album and shitting on Fantano which was beautiful to see.
The End, Hurt Feelings, and Letter to God (1998) are the songs I'm going back to the most ^^
@@TocaracaI'm talking about Fantano and that article
@@Tocaracaall the Letter to God songs are fucking amazing
It's literally her career to write and create and perform art!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What do people WANT from her???
Idk maybe she could get a vocal coach and start writing good songs. There’s a reason why 5/6 of her most streamed songs, are features. She’s not a good songwriter.
@BigOwl51 damn you must be her biggest fan, I've seen you commenting hate on multiple videos talking about this album. For someone who seemingly doesn't like her, you sure are helping her promote like craaaazy 😂
@@charmedblondie4good! Maybe the great impersonator won’t be as much of a miserable failure as her “rock” album! Happy to help a struggling, washed up pop singer!
@@charmedblondie4good! Always happy to help a washed up pop singer! Maybe this new album won’t flop as hard as her last one!
@@BigOwl51 Porter Robinson would be ashamed of you
The album is called "The Great Impersonator" not just because Halsey was impersonating all those artists in the album rollout, but because "The Great Imitator/Masquerader" is a medical term used to classify conditions that can easily be mistaken for other conditions. One of these "Great Imitators" is Lupus. The album is entirely about Halsey's struggle with Lupus and other health concerns, and even the title is in reference to that, so it astonishes me how those two music review outlets can miss the point so much when it's standing right in front of them.
Also idk if any of the other songs have it, but lucky is definitely a spin on Britney Spears’ lucky…. Hence the album title even further 🎉
THIIIIIS. THANK YOU
omg 🤯 that's brilliant
Thank you for explaining that. I never would have understood that side of the title!
It's because they never had to consider that. People hate disabled people and never talk to us and stuff like that makes it plainly clear.
Fantano does this with women a lot. almost his entire "eternal sunshine" ariana grande review was talking about the alleged homewrecker scandal and scandals she's faced in the past and barely was about the music itself.
@@VividTea I thought Eternal was mid but I don’t really care about her personal life. It sounds like he is obsessive or maybe self-projecting.
*SHE IS* the main character of her own story which is what shes talking about, the audacity people have to tell someone how and what to tell about their struggles….. specially when it comes to health, my blood boils….
Fr like why is it bad that she's writing about her own experience?
Right everyone is the main character in their own lives
@@ESJ_27 weird to make guarantees on behalf of someone we can only assume you don't know
people jus throwing around that to whatever woman does something they don't like
Don’t let these people find out about autobiographies they might combust!!
A friend of mine went to the hospital because she was sure she had a lump in her breast and she hadn’t felt well in a long time. The doctors kept telling her that there was nothing wrong, she’s too young for breast cancer, blah blah.
8 months later her pain was so bad she couldn’t walk. She went back to the hospital and they finally listened. Turns out it WAS breast cancer, and it had spread to her bones.
She died less than a year later.
Take women seriously in medicine ffs. I don’t listen to her music, but I’m glad Halsey is still here
I'm sorry about your friend. I'm also sorry that she's far from the only young woman that has been told the exact same thing even though women are getting breast cancer younger now. I had a little lump in my armpit and when I asked my female gyno about it she seemed really irritated that I didn't know that it was just a cyst. How would I know?? You would think female doctors would be less dismissive than male doctors but even that is sometimes too much to ask.
@@ANYHOO0 It's disappointing how many women that act misogynistic to other women exist. You'd think they understand, but no, they won't because they don't even take themselves seriously.
I study medicine and I absolutely don't get how she wasn't examined right away physically and by usg? She did everything right to find the lump and go to her doctor... And breast cancer is usually pretty treatable I feel so sorry for her :(
@@depressedcockroach4045 I'm an untransitioned trans man dealing with pre-cancerous endometrial hyperplasia. between complications with my connective tissue disorder plus getting the, ahem, panda mic in 2022, the endo also contributed to massive, life-threatening digestive and subsequent malnutrition issues. the first major episode of the endo symptoms occurred almost exactly three years ago. I've been unable to work for two years. I only got a correct diagnosis this year, and I myself had to identify what it was first before I could get a doctor to confirm. I've been trying to get surgery this whole year. I was in fact just informed today that my surgery is being delayed for the FOURTH time, under the SECOND surgeon.
yeah, this.... this kind of thing happens all the time.
As soon as you mentioned Anthony Fantano I immediately rolled my eyes. I don’t remember the last time he had a good take about a woman artist, if he’s ever even had one.
But his fans insist he's a "feminist" URGHHHHHH
@@whatzittooyah9182 Only Brat tbh
Well he’s given a plethora of women very positive reviews as well as a plethora of men very terrible reviews. Fantanos take on this album was very much in poor taste, I doubt it stems from a point of misogyny more so than him just being a little elitist and cold though. That’s just me however.
@@lobstertown1826it is just you lol he’s had so many absolutely rancid takes that prove his inability to look at any semblance of situation behind a piece of music… usually when it’s a woman.
He's done less reviews on female artists. The one he did with Billie eilish was so bad, it feels like he's not even listening. Just straight up saying it's good but then that's it. No full commentary. Most of the reviews are cut short.
As someone with chronic illness, THANK YOU for discussing medical gaslighting. It took me 2.5 years to get a diagnosis because I was repeatedly dismissed as "anxious." The legacy of systemic discrimination in medicine is very real and still being felt by these communities daily.
EDIT: To everyone struggling with this in the replies, I wish you all of the healing, love, and support. We are in this together
100% I was misdiagnosed with anxiety when I actually had schizoaffective disorder. Took me figuring it out myself through watching interviews to go back and insist for a new diagnosis.
Additionally, they also missed my crohn's disease and said it was in my head. I now have a permanent-end ileostomy for that misdiagnosis.
@@Qb3nsis I am so sorry you went through that. I am right there with you. I was dismissed as anxious and later discovered I have a rare lymphoproliferative disease (similar to Halsey) as well as other autoimmune conditions. And yep, the complications that stem from this delay in care are so real. There is nothing that inspires disappointment in the system quite like these kinds of experiences. Sending hugs.
That's funny cuz even being anxious is deserving of treatment.
me too good lord
i had a heart attack but it was brushed off as anxiety lmfao i had to literally beg for the proper tests for them to bother finding out what was wrong with me and at first they just treated me like i was hysterical and over dramatic
@@banquetoftheleviathan1404 I am not dismissing anxiety as not needing treatment. I am saying my symptoms were reduced to anxiety alone when that wasn't the full story.
Also, like.....I dunno, Fantano's review feels especially callous when you consider one of the most consistent through-lines in the album is Halsey fearing they'd die AND LEAVE THEIR SON BEHIND, so to say she's just being "edgy" and "laundering in childish angst" with THAT context too is like "oh, are you just mad it didn't meet YOUR specific expectations??" Just weird all around, like you said.
i remember him totally misunderstanding and writing off one of FKA Twigs songs from magdalene and that told me what i needed to know about his lack of ability to engage with women’s art. he’s really never beating the misogyny allegations lmao
@@plasticjesus444 sheesh 🥴🥴🥴 to misunderstand TWIGS especially…yeah fantano, might be time to wrap it up or get gooder, dude!!!!
@@toyosibee.mp3 he also said fiona apple lacks a filter for using the word rape in a song about being raped
It’s his opinion so yes if it didn’t meet his specific expectations it would make sense for him to give it a low score
she has 2 whole tracks with her sons voice in it. it's fucking heart wrenching
As someone whose dad recently passed away from cancer I am honestly livid at this whole ordeal. It reeks of misogyny and a severe lack of empathy. Men seriously need to do better.
So sorry for you loss.
They need to but they won't, especially not with the culture the way it is. The trick is to ignore them, you can't teach them to see women as humans like them. I am sorry and wish you safe healing.
Weird that *men's* angst is so rarely considered childish. Genuinely wonder what that reviewer's opinion is on the Smiths, the Cure, Pulp, Nirvana, Radiohead, Daniel Johnston, Joy Division, REM...c'mon man. Some of the best albums of all time are angstfests.
There is a definite trend of thinking that men's angst is profound and speaks to the human condition, while anyone else's angst is just frivolous whining.
this is so true. these men will punch holes on the wall like a toddler throwing a tantrum but everyone considers it something so profound and deep and it's just an adult toddler throwing a tantrum
Trust if Tyler made an album about his confrontation with death and his own mortality it would go number 1- not sayin Halsey deserves to go platinum just saying angst pulls a lot of weight for these male artists
Fantano has a record like this for guys too, he trashed Frightened Rabbit’s albums about suicidal thoughts as being melodramatic even though the singer ended up killing himself
THIS.
Never did I think I’d see someone get victim blamed for talking about FUCKING CANCER
As a woman with chronic headaches, the mockery from doctors is insaneee. I've seen dozens of medical professionals over the course of a decade and you just get 'it's just stress and hormones' and 'you just need to push through it' without doing any brainscans or anything. Like, thanks doc, I didn't know it was normal to be in excruciating pain after talking to someone for an hour. Or laughing for ten minutes. Or listening to music with a higher pitched singer for just a minute. Great. Thanks.
10:50 smh they say halsey didn't sound enough like the artists that inspired them, but if she went the other direction and sounded a lot like the other artists, you can bet the critics would just say she copied them and she's unoriginal/uninspired or some bs
EXACTLY THANK YOUUU
Exactly
That’s exactly what I thought.
YES! i said this too!!
exacty!! the point was to get inspired by them and not plagiarising their songs
as a cancer survivor, i cannot even begin to convey the rage and internal anger that you feel against your body that has decided to attack itself. and on top of that people tell her she is being main character energy edgy vibes. it’s MUSIC!! god forbid she expresses her experiences and emotions 🙄🙄🙄🙄
The needledrop, “Halsey wants everyone to know how tortured she feels.” Considering the album is about a CANCER DIAGNOSIS that makes total sense. Have these reviewers lost their minds?
It’s not cancer but ok
@ it’s lupus and luekemia, luekemia is a form of cancer
@@guavagal ?
Fantano saying she suffers from “Main Character Syndrome” and then relating her Taylor Swift reminds me of Taylor’s iconic quote “I’m sorry. Was I being too loud? In the house I bought? With the money I made? From the songs I wrote? About my own life?” What artist doesn’t write about themselves?
his Halsey review reminded me a lot of Taylor actually specifically his review on TTPD, he like writes off one of the songs as "no one's scared of Taylor" and it felt like such an overlook of what the song was saying about how ppl view her as this vastly evil woman while also being like "well who could be scared of her if we beat her down?" I can absolutely understand not enjoying the album frankly it's not my favorite but he's very dismissive of concepts that are usually unique to women and how they navigate sexism and overall anticipation of their downfalls (and this goes beyond Taylor obviously) and it boils down to him either not understanding or being stubborn and refusing to see the point because he's already made up his mind about the art.
Also YEAH Halsey notoriously writes about her experiences, idk any hits of her's that aren't pulled from her life, for Anthony to just now be like "maybe you're centering yourself too much" FIVE ALBUMS into her career is a bizarre choice and idk if he just lacked research to see that or what but it comes off even worse.
Before this review I used to give fantano the benefit of the doubt but now I loathe him.
He can't stomach a woman singing about *actual* trauma but will give s3xy red a 8/10 and Brat (a good album but doesn't dive into dark subject matter like Halsey and TTPD) a 10.
@@junainahrahman4156 back off on brat
yeahh exactly like you can't tell someone their own experiences aren't valid just cause you can't relate to them personally. if you think the song is corny, say that. don't try to make it seem like the artist is 'victimizing' themselves. i feel like that word has become a convenient substitute for singers simply expressing their emotions nowadays. we're making music soulless. like if you dare to say you're not happy, you must be taking yourself too seriously or fishing for sympathy. idk man, everyone has problems and just because you're not aware of them doesn't equate to a character flaw on the artist's part. when it comes to albums he doesn't like, fantano doesn't bother to do any introspection and always assumes the worst.
@@junainahrahman4156 giving Brat a 10 is fine, and same for Sexy Red, but his ignorance for what the subject matter and that being why the albums get scored low is a problem
i think people also aren't taking into account that Lupus is called The Great Imitator which is probably a big reason as to why she did the impersonations. but people think that THAT's the concept of the album, when it's really not
This is a brilliant piece of context that should be highlighted more
holy shit i didnt know this thats soooo cool
It's crazy that it's only been 4 months since the Kendrick/Drake beef and people have already forgotten what a double entendre is
How can people listen to an album about an artist dealing with her own mortality and then hate on her for it? Feeling guilty for being suicidal as a teenager and that her diagnosis was a delayed prayer being answered. Leaving your child to become an orphan. Contemplating what people will think of your career and your legacy when you are done. How does that not affect you in any way shape or form?
I truly think that if these 'music reviewers' are going to have their job, they need to take all elements into account when judging: the context and meaning behind the piece, the lyrics, the sound, the inspirations, the album roll out, the theming. How can you judge music without taking it all into account and instead make it about your personal opinion of the artist and not about the music itself? I may be biased being a Halsey fan but I don't think it takes a fan to have empathy towards her situation.
Thank you for making an elaborate and empathetic video about this situation. Halsey can never catch a break, I swear.
i find it interesting how the internet has been in an era of critiquing female artists for doing too little (some people disliking brat for the simple green cover etc etc) but then god forbid someone does something interesting the internet thinks it’s too much!
Is artists as a whole, or only the feminine ones?
They just do it to women sweetheart
@@NotHere4ThisShipwomen can never win unfortunately
Literally no winning for female artists. Either doing too little or too much.
Right?!
how come during the kendrick vs drake deal everyone read behind the lines and did deepdives on specific words, cadences, even song names to connect them, but when halsey makes a pretty clear reference to her well know health issues, everybody is confused?
misogny, all of it..they subconsioucly think women can't be deep so no point in diving under the lines for them.our pain and the results of it are treated like a child with a lost toy, always secondary and to be forgotten in the long run.
I mean I agree with parts of this and all of DeAngelo's video but saying "everyone" like music genres don't have different groups of people listening I agree 100% if it's with music reviewers like fantano but saying that everyone is against Halsey is misrepresenting the situation.
Although I could have misinterpreted what you meant so correct me if I'm wrong
They're not confused, they're ignorant. They don't bother to read the lyrics that are there, instead they generalize the whole song and brush it off as "edgy" ramblings of a self-obsessed person, when that isn't the case at all.
Dudes think that shit is cool (despite so many songs having the cringiest lyrics imaginable) and put those male artists on a pedestal because they desire and support that type of fame, money, and power while putting on a persona of being badass, rich, getting women etc.
Then, as soon as a woman writes a song, every line of lyrics gets nitpicked to dismiss her as being cringe and unworthy of praise. There is also something to be noticed that men making art are labeled so often as "geniuses" while women of the same caliber rarely get revered in such a respectful way.
Dudes being fucking stupid. They get hyped about their idols, and dismissive of anyone else, especially women.
I know that you probably get thousands of comments like this, but I really appreciate what you bring to the dialogue. You tend to have a nuanced take on almost every subject you cover, and it really does expand my understanding in a way that I think makes me a better person.
"Does she have more music like that?" Begging you to check out her entire 'If I Can't Have Love I Want Power' album, it was produced by Nine Inch Nails, changed my brain chemistry, and carried me through my last semester of college (along with The Amazing Devil's album Ruin which also came out that fall). Any time Halsey does rock I am there in a heartbeat 🙌
It's also one of her least successful albums and it drives me CRAZY because it's so unbelievably absurdly good. She also did a rock remix of Gasoline, which was one of my favorites from her debut album (which was my favorite release by her until IICHLIWP came out). Seriously, everyone who hasn't listened to it needs to asap.
But yeah Lonely is the Muse is also my favorite of hers from this album, I've listened to it basically non-stop since it's came out! (And I've been revisiting it a lot since I got into Interview With the Vampire, since it fits Armand's character to a t. And if anyone is into Batman, Easier Than Lying is the most Jason Todd song to ever exist and it drives me crazy because no one ever talks about it 😭)
Legit came here to say this tht album changed my lifeee
YES!!! That album fucking RIPS. I’m overdue for another listen!
it's honestly criminal how underrated IICHLIWP is
The only reason people interpreted her as "playing a victim" is because she's a woman. I think she'd be viewed as a victim if she were a man. Let's be real, if a man dropped an album abt being really ill while navigating an unfair life, people would be like YASSS LIFE IS SO HARDDDD YESSS I AGREEEEEE PREACHHHH. People are unable to have sympathy for women because they're always gonna be perceived as dramatic, attention seeking, and performative. "She has Main character syndrome", no, you're just unable to view a woman as a main character. Shoutout katara from ATLA 💀
It really sucks for women to be culturally cast in the role of "caretaker," but then when they need care themselves, to be abandoned and shamed 💔
Let's be real here, by people we mean males. Some males just hate women, and they use every excuse to disguise their resentment. There is no actual standard or reason, because only their hate toward her is real.
So shat kind of man would drop an album like that? And in what genre? Rap? Probably not, not before Drake. Pop, ok, that exists, a lot, in a similar vein to women singing about their relationships, men also do it, not to extra praise or dismissal, at least within this genre.
For some real edgy my life so bad this my trauma shit, I don't think that gets, like, extra praise?
With suicide in the climate where that was rarely discussed and any mention of it was like ground breaking, it is, or was, discussed, but I don't think that had a gender bias?
Don't get me wrong, some, men, who love to talk about how Feminism has oppressed them, would probably react like that if such a thing came out, but that sure doesn't look like general "people".
Sounds to me like you are deriving a conclusion without basis, using valid but unrelated facts, due to your desire to see a certain narrative in everything, when it might be more complex than that.
@@maimee1 You don't get recognition for the pain you've gone through because you don't have a deadly chronic illness nor are you in the public eye. If you told people around you about the trauma you've been through, they would probably have sympathy for you. If you want to bare your soul to the public by transforming it into art, go right ahead. No one will shame you for that.
Secondly, Green Day, Freddie Mercury, Justin Bieber, The Neighborhood, Eminem, The Crow, Nine Inch Nails, and countless other male artists have made soul barring songs about what they've been through. They never been told that they're "overdramatic," are "playing the victim," or "have main character syndrome."
That music critic was simply being misogynistic and didn't do enough research about what the album was about.
@maimee1 You said a whole lot without saying much. You're not even right about what my comment was communicating. To answer your initial questions, the first artist who comes to mind is Freddie Mercury, who had HIV/AIDS and wrote about dying and being sick. He's widely loved, and many people say he's a musical genius.
I also think of Vincent Van Gogh. Though he's not a musician, he is known as one of the greatest artists of all time, as you can see his mental state decline throughout his work. He made art about the madness in his mind.
I also think of classic grunge/alt bands and artists: Radiohead, Tool, Slipknot, Deftones, blink 182... their music is all what I'd classify as angsty. Yet, I've never heard criticism about their music being too emotional.
My point still stands; if Halsey were a man, nobody would be insinuating that she's attention seeking. They'd simply say the music is bad and move on instead of trying to debate whether or not she has a right to be angsty or viewed as a victim. Nobody said Van Gogh or Freddie were just trying to be the main character, right?
I don't think Halsey deserves extra praise, nor did I or D'Angelo say that she did. My conclusion is that nobody would be calling her attention seeking or a main character wannabe if she were a man.
Hell, even Eminem is widely known to be bold. Most of his songs are him complaining about his upbringing or insulting people. Still, I don't see anybody reviewing his music and saying "he just wants attention".
If all that yapping still reads as an unrelated conclusion without a basis, how about the fact that she literally wrote about medical professionals not taking her illness seriously. There are actual facts on that, I can cite them if you like. Women are way more likely to be misdiagnosed. Why is this? Oh, right, because as a society, we view women as dramatic and attention seeking. Her complaints get proven by the people claiming she isn't *victim* enough to be angsty, and she's just trying to be a main character.
When I've gone to the doctor as a woman with endometriosis describing excruciating pain on my periods, and 21-30 day periods that would happen anywhere from 3 days apart to 6 months apart, I NEVER had a gynecologist do anything to investigate the pain for 29 years. I was told "you should wait until you give birth, then you'll really know pain" or the same comment but that I'd know pain when I turn 30.
Then when doing a different, unrelated surgery they happened to find a bunch of endometriosis, my ovaries had giant cysts and one was adhered to another part of my body. I basically got diagnosed by luck, not a doctor doing their job. If endometriosis affected men on the same scale it affects women (cis men and AMAB people can get it, but it is extremely rare) it would be taken so much more seriously.
way too many people have had this kind of experience. and way too many cis dudes are totally ignorant of it. largely because.... no one with a uterus trusts them enough to talk to them about these things. I'm a 45 yr old untransitioned trans man dealing with endometrial hyperplasia. and yeah, even after two years of extreme symptoms including bleeding for two straight months, I still had to diagnose *myself* before the doctors would see what was going on.
we see what's really going on, though.
i’ll never be more confused why being concerned over not being “the main character” in YOUR life was ever a thing. like regardless you ARE the main character of your own life
Fantano never criticizes male artists for it either so... Lol.
right? there's a difference between thinking the world revolves around you, and centring (from the uk, in case the spelling confused anyone) your own world around yourself. the former is being self absorbed, meanwhile the latter is just being confident and having enough self respect to put yourself first in your own life.
writing an album about your own, personal struggles is - not only - *not* an example of thinking youre the "main character"... but also is literally one of the fundamentals of creating art. you'd think a music critic would understand this, but apparently not if he cant personally relate to the subject matters being discussed.
ironically, writing off a piece of media because it touches on subjects that you *personally* cannot relate to is one of the most self absorbed things a person could do, imho. of course there's nothing wrong with not enjoying a piece of media for this reason, but to completely dismiss it? it's literally fantano's *JOB* to try and understand the work he's critiquing.
not being funny, but it's genuinely baffling that there are really people who go to fantano for media analysis and to determine something's quality. he's more of an entertainer than anything else, atp at least
@@zaddyfaye6880honestly people seem so afraid to care about themselves, but we also live in very contradictory times where self sacrifice for the sake of others is mocked meanwhile self sacrifice for yourself in the future is praised (say for example, not going to starbucks or mcdonalds because they are in support of a whole ass jenna-slide, and not going to either because it's unhealthy).
You're cringe for having a personality, wanting to be unique, but you're also lame and annoying and basic if you happen to like what's popular/trendy. You're vain and arrogant if you go to the gym, but disgusting and undeserving of love if you don't develop an eating disorder (from too much focus on your body). Everybody "wants to be the main character", supposedly, but they mock random people on the street and online for being "NPCs". Which is it? Why is the response to a mindless hivemind hyperindividualism and vice versa?? Is this not horribly self destructive, not just of individuals but of communities and interpersonal relationships, why is everybody so aggressively antisocial???
I literally cried when I got a doctor that believed me when I told them about issues I was facing immediately. And I've been LUCKY with doctors
No cuz lucky is always such a low bar for us bc if men were treated by “lucky” doctors the way we are treated it would be considered medical negligence. 😭
I’d love to hear Fantano say this to Halsey in person, call her “childish” for being afraid of dying and orphaning her kid, in person, to her face. Oh wait, he’d never do that because like every other online critic, once he has to come out from behind the shield of his phone screen suddenly he’s all about keeping things civil.
How do you think Halsey would react if he said that to her in person
Song: "creep" = playing the victim and drowning in self pity. Also a hit, a classic, a great song. If none of you know it it's time for me to dig my own grave because I'm just that old. Talking of self pity:. Lyrics:" I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo, what the hell am I doing here, I don't belong here..."
thank you so much dude. I feel like so many well respected male artists have whole albums worth of introspective miserable navel-gazing and that's fine! It's actually good! Sometimes we all feel like that!
i think there's a bigger problem of introspection and being in a really bad place being seen as lame. just in general, seems to be a problem, especially since memes have now convinced real people that radiohead somehow corny and for incels
There are so many female emo fans. Women can be miserable too.
What sucks is I think there are legitimate criticisms of the framing if these reviews weren't so harsh. Like one of the lyrics was "I always knew I was a martyr and Jesus was one too," and idk, I think finding lines like that a bit too self indulgent is absolutely a fair criticism. There's a bit more going on that just that one artist was male and one was female, but that the writing is also fundamentally different. But criticisms like that need to be leveled at the writing, not the character of the artist imo
I don't think Halsey or Radiohead's "Creep" are examples of playing the victim, truly. To feel like you aren't enough isn't "playing the victim", IMO, nor even the Jesus line mentioned in this thread. Playing the victim requires being either someone doing harm or a random bystander, IMO. Or like, if someone has a relative with a mobility disorder, and the person starts making it about how it's SOOO HARRRD to accomodate them, and how you should throw your sympathy to THEM and how they have to DEAL WITH THAT. Especially if they say that they're a good person for "putting up with" the poor person they're complaining about.
Simply recreating an Aaliyah picture isnt Blackfishing. Blackfishing is deeper than just dressing up as a Black celebrity. It's an attempt at actually looking Black/Black-adjacent to the point of confusing the audience.
Thank you so much for this explanation! 😊
Halsey’s father is black.
Halsey is biracial. I'm not sure a lot of people know what that is. Not surprised since the entire creation of this topic was spun by illiterate Euromen.
@@chrishealton3830I was gonna say lmao, like I know they’re white passing and that they themself recognize that, but also like… she IS half black 😭
@@chrishealton3830 And so is Candace Owen. Being Black has never prevented anybody from engaging in anti-Blackness.
the sky could fall on a woman and men would still say "you're overreacting"
to answer your question about Lonely is the Muse: yes. she has almost an entire album that sounds like it. If I Can't Have Love, I Want Power. produced by Nine-Inch Nails (Trent Reznor and Atticus Ross) and Lindsey Buckingham of Fleetwood Mac. released in 2021. about the "joys and tragedies of pregnancy and childbirth" giftwrapped in a recreation of the "Madonna + Wh**e" Complex. its a fantastic record and was one of the most acclaimed of 2021. none of this happened with that record, funny enough.
Nightmare and Experiment on Me are also similar
Thank you I haven't heard that one
this being one of the best albums ever released too like Easier Than Lying, Honey, Bells in Sante Fe, 1121, THE ENTIRE THING IS JUST HIT AFTER HIT
thanks, i immediately listened to lonely is the muse and i need more
@@alexisbruce4586 you'll like the lighthouse, easier than lying, and you asked for this, and nightmare (reprise)
Its also so ironic that fantano made a video recently talking about Ethel Cain's comments about no one taking anything seriously and then posts this review
He just proved that he should not be taken seriously
I mean he even complains about his own comments in that video... But like. There's a reason the comments are like that.
right?? like come on dude, check your reflection
As someone who has chronic illnesses, it really does feel like you just have to impersonate the person you were before. Or just a person who functions.
it's like you knew i started crocheting
Retweet
That's exactly what i was doing lol
Best UA-cam to crochet too!
Me crocheting when I read this comment 😭
D’Angelo has the best videos to crochet to!!
imagine being sick and almost dying and putting all of that pain and heartache into your art just for a random ‘music critic’ on the internet to be like “ok but ur being dramatic asf rn”
edit: should’ve worded “random ‘music critic’” better, i’m aware that fantano has a big following, regardless of if i regularly keep up with him or not.
i found his review incredibly inhumane and disgustingly dismissive in the face of very serious topics and halsey’s/ashley’s personal stories and experiences. i think it’s important to hold fantano accountable for his very PUBLIC mistreatment of such a vulnerable body of work 🫶
Yeah like wtf! 🤷🏾♀️
frrrrrrrr
Media literacy is dead.
He's not a 'random music critic'. He's one of the loudest voices online, don't minimize the damage he can do.
I’ve been a Fantano follower for years. I’ve gotten a lot of great music recommendations from him. But God, this review is genuinely not it at all. It’s one thing to give a low score to a beloved album, it’s another to clearly not do an ounce of research into an album and completely miss the point of it.
As a woman who has been anemic for most of her life and was just exhausted all the time with no energy, I cannot express my frustration enough with the way I struggled so hard not to fall asleep during class, after coming home from school and having to do my homework and study, while constantly being called lazy and that "I would rather sleep than study". Having a heavy flow during my cycle made all the iron supplement treatment I would take for months just regress after 2-3 months after my cycle, having to take more iron supplements while having the worst digestion ever due to the supplements. And then moving onto birth control to combat my heavy flow, but then having migraines as a side effect up to the point I would feel like throwing up and being able to see was painful because my migraines would make dim lighting look super bright. I remember going to watch the Avatar 2 in theaters with my sister and having another migraine just 30 minutes before the end of the movie and I couldn't wait to come back home and take an ibuprofen, but my sister thought I was just cranky and said I ruined her night with my negativity, and I was too unwell to explain to her that I felt like I was getting a stroke or something. To an outsider, people like us seem overly dramatic or cranky or lazy, but we are just trying to live our everyday life and not feel sick and like a burden to everyone around us, so being called a "main character" is more insulting than you realize
You know, I wasn't expecting Anthony's comments to trigger me, but hearing them, I was suddenly back to being on the phone with a neurology department asking when they'd be offering me an appointment because I was experiencing bouts of paralysis that were becoming more frequent just to be told that my case was flagged as non-serious and that I'd have to talk to my GP about it again.
And then I was on the phone to the hospital asking for updates on my lumbar puncture because something was wrong in my occipital lobes and I was terrified I was going blind.
And then I was in the operating theatre for the third lumbar puncture of the day and the doctors weren't listening to me when I was trying to tell them that the local anaesthesia wasn't going to work and I was about to feel the pain of a lumbar puncture for the third time that day.
And then I was near tears trying to explain to my GP that I was experiencing such bad nerve pain when walking that it was causing me to pass out and the GP was writing my concerns off and telling me to lose weight and to try to go for a walk every evening.
Like I love Halsey's stuff and their most recent album is so relatable to me as someone who has gone through that pain and terror, where you are genuinely thinking I am going to die because people will not listen to me when I am telling them that there is something wrong with my body. And hearing him talk about Halsey as if they want to be some martyr and as if she's trying to make herself the victim is so bleakly relatable in itself.
And god it's so ironic to describe chronic illness as some kind of symptom main character syndrome as if we aren't some of the most voiceless people in society.
big hug from a fellow chronic pain girly 🫂🫂 I have horrible nerve pain as well (severe pudendal neuralgia where I can’t walk) and it’s taken all of my teenage years away from me living in fear until I finally got diagnosed. Doctors didn’t know wtf to do with me and I felt like I was going insane so seeing this dismissal of medical trauma has hit home 💔
Doctors told my energetic 8 year old suddenly stopped walking because she was being dramatic. It was 9 months before a doctor would listen. She could barely eat ("Kids fake tummy aches") or sleep or live. She's better now after months of meds and a transfusion, but she lost two years of her childhood.
Fellow chronic pain girlie and Fanatano's statements about being dramatic and edgey mirror things my family has said about me. It made me sick and it's so disappointing.
@@spacegalaxy19chronic illness took my teen years away too. it’s very hard to watch your peers enjoy their youth while you’re bedridden. it’s taken a massive toll on me. I’m glad that you’re still here and that your life has improved after getting a diagnosis
Sending more love from another chronic pain girly. I am so triggered by doctors,when you've been dismissed so many times it's hard not to be beside yourself with worry that you're being misunderstood or blatantly ignored. Sending you lots of love. ❤️
I'm chronically ill with an invisible disability and while my life is not at risk, i see myself in what halsey is saying so deeply. as a woman, a teenage girl at the time, no one listened to anything i said. i was either being dramatic or straight up lying. I spent years in pain and bedridden before anyone even gave me a second look. i hate to be parasocial, im not even a halsey fan, but her speaking out about this means the world to me and i want to hug her for it.
Yeah i was in a similar situation for a few years, I thought I would spend the rest of my life living with my parents because I was in too much pain to do much of anything. I’m not a Halsey fan but when D’Angelo said what the album is about I made a mental note to check it out because it sounds really interesting.
Yes!! Everything she was expressing here resonates so deeply with me that I know I can't listen to the album because it'll trigger my medical PTSD. This kind of stuff needs to be expressed and put out into the world, because it's expressing a deep truth.
Me too. I have fibromyalgia and endometriosis, and it took years to be taken seriously and get diagnosed. Much love to you - we're all in this together
exactly my experience ❤️ mine started when I was 10 and only got diagnosed last year when I was 16 because doctors didn’t know wtf to do with me even when I was bed-bound sobbing in pain 😢 wasn’t a halsey fan but some of these songs made me tear up
Not only can I relate, my sisters and my mother can too. And my friends. Her album is relatable to so many…
I just left a very toxic marriage shortly after going through endometriosis surgery (which Halsey also suffers from). I deeply also felt like my illness was an inconvenience to my partner. This album resonated very strongly with me and seeing these men be so dismissive of the circumstances she was under as she created this is honestly infuriating.
ugh thank you for this!
9:15 I LOVE halsey and she is absolutely relatable. A lot of her songs are about abuse, being cheated on, relationships, losing her child, etc. All of her songs show exactly who she is.
Her songs that touch on her mental health are relatable to me in ways very few other artists quite get. The ups and downs of it. She's very relatable. Fantano is just being sexist whether he realizes it or not. That or he lacks the ability to understand the concept of empathy in any form and can only see something being relatable if it is relatable to himself.
I promise this album will be SUPER relatable and comforting to most of the women that listen to it.
I spent 6 years complaining about feeling like there was something in my abdomen. Went to 8 different doctors, spent thousands, they all told me it was “in my head” and I was ‘too small and thin’ for anything to be there without it being observable… the last doctor I went to gave me two weeks to get “final arrangements” in order to prepare for an emergency surgery. It was a fibroid the size of a cantaloupe. Luckily, it was benign but because it got so large the surgery was complicated, I had to spend two months in bed, and will have health complications as a result until my dying day. My experience is minor in comparison to many other women’s experiences. I can imagine this being a very validating and healing experience to listen to a woman, with as many resources as Halsey- experiencing the same.
Disappointing that Ant has that take but I’m glad his audience tore him a new one!
The one irony that you pointed out about Halsey acknowledging how men don't take her seriously is one thing...but then there is another song called 'Ego' from the same album where she actively acknowledges that she is NOT the main character and that she should 'kill her ego' and her self-obsession before it bites her back (this is my interpretation of the song). So not only does the image of this album convey more than just 'main character syndrome', it also actively admits to how pretending that you're the main character is actually self-destructive (cause if i don't my ego might kill me)
Oof this just makes me mad at Fantano’s downright lazy review all over again.
She also had other lyrics on the album like in The End, where she says she knows her illness isn't the end of the world but could be the end of her world. She also has a line where she says she knows she's not special or chosen and that the world goes on without her in the literal first track of the album.
The medical gaslighting that women face is very real, and the majority of the time, it is male doctors telling us, 'We're being dramatic' - I didn't miss the irony that the two critics who missed her point were ALSO men. I thank you for pointing out you can not care for the music and still absorb its point on its own merit. That is critical thinking done right. I almost lost my life to medical professionals not believing me, too, and it is terrifying. It makes you doubt your own sanity, and she had so much else going on at the SAME time, and yes musics put their lives into art.
Why would we as a society entrust our health with males when they are the gender that walk out when their wife or children fall ill? That is some age old bs that we need to get rid of.
4:37 ugh started tearing over the lines "they couldn't save her, they couldn't save her"
People hate Halsey because we live in a "it's not that deep" culture and she's an artist who consistently tries to prove that wrong
I disagree it’s more that Halsey can at times come off as cringy and fake deep. There are plenty of artists that can be deep and people take what they say seriously
it's hilarious bc fantano just made a video critiquing that culture. clearly he needs to take notes from.......himself.
Halsey is not deep at all…and I love her music. But she’s very “14 year old on tumblr in 2015” type of “deep.” Which there’s nothing wrong with that, I like that vibe, but I’m not delusional enough to pretend like it’s deep.
@@witchykittyy listen to I believe in magic in her new album and tell me she's “14 year old on tumblr in 2015 type deep.” Literally listen to her previous album. She's an adult woman, and her music reflects that
@@vins2610I assume those artists you're talking about are male artists, because all female artists, no matter the success, don't get taken seriously
I'm not a "critics are bad" person. I think art criticism is really valuable. But these people simply do not understand the concept of making personal art. Maybe this doesn't relate to you BECAUSE IT'S ABOUT A VERY SPECIFIC TOPIC!
Off topic but I love your profile picture!
@@Rollypoly666 thank you!! NITW is my favorite game :)
I was thinking something similar. I don't usually listen to critics because usually what they're criticizing is so subjective, and there are tons of examples of music, movies, books, etc that were absolutely panned by critics but are super holy god popular.
But also more along this video's topic, sometimes critics get...cruel? Like they took the art as a personal offense or something, so their criticism gets personal. I'm all for criticism if it's productive and fair, but there are times when, idk if the critic is having a bad day or what's going on, but they just go all in on something and it's like, dude why? It doesn't have to be like this.
Unfortunately a lot of so called critics - who in reality are just a bunch of pop magazine writers - have no idea what integrity and good criticism and media analysis is. If they did, we wouldn't be getting degenerate braindead opinions year after year after year. Not to mention that there's a whole subset of media reviewers like Fantano and Pitchfork whose entire business model is built around rage bait and contrarianism VS actual good faith critique.
I feel like being able to understand creative expression needs to be a prerequisite for being a critic. Like, what’s the purpose of critiquing something you don’t even understand? You’re supposed to have an EXPERT OPINION.
the “profoundly unrelatable” line really bothered me too bc even just from the brief screenshot you shared from the lupus subreddit, it’s abundantly clear that this album is likely deeply relatable for people with lupus or cancer or chronic illness in general!!
I wonder if Halsey had died from her cancer if these reviews would be so rude. This album was literally made at a time when they had no clue if they would make it out alive. This is just her trying to have a little fun experimenting with different genres because they didn't know if they'd have that opportunity again.
Shout Out to fantano's review of mac miller's swimming which he suddenly changed from a 3 to an 8 after Mac Miller died.
fantano is so obviously biased against Artist he doesn't like in general, that any comment from him on music should be ignored.
He is incapeable to review a Project just based on it's quality and will always Interpret something the worst way possible when he dislikes the Artist.
@@stephantrezgue6281 this is what happens when you give a dude with opinions too much power tbh
i hate how just speaking about your problems means you’re “playing the victim” 😭
And the way we INTERNALIZE IT. Like the amount of second guessing I do on a daily basis no matter how fucked up the thing done to me is???? The way I’ve had to fight tooth and nail to unlearn putting myself down because I was treated like this my whole life by family and strangers alike
No one rushes to point and silence the victim faster than the perpetrator. He benefits from the suffer of her or someone like her.
Or you have "main character syndrome". lol
@@Aros4 THISSSSSS!!!!!!!!
Bullies do that all the time, unfortunately. They come at you for something you did on your own that they didn't like, and then twist it around and blame you for "provoking" them just by living your life. Bully checklist top ten.
The craziest part about their recent response to the pitchfork review is that some people called her out for it and if you go to their accounts you see that they’re all music journalists or at least pretending to be out of their New York apartments lmaooo. The jokes write themselves
When critics can't take criticism it's very sad
@@cinemachronicI think the worst part is them all being obtuse on purpose to further justify their “big bad millionaire pop star has a meltdown online bc someone doesn’t like her music/and is sending their parasocial fanbase after poor journalists who make 24k a year” narrative they’re all parroting. The extreme gaslighting is insane
I relate to Halsey way too much. I couldn’t imagine publicizing my health issue just to see men pick it apart on the internet. She’s so courageous for that. I respect that even if people don’t like the album that much.
Calling it "profoundly unrelatable' just seems so wrong. I've dealt with chronic illness, I have friends that have. We can all find bits of shared experience in their work. Wild that the Pitchfork author had such a chip on their shoulder, and it comes off as so unprofessional.
First song had me in tears and I've always been a casual fan, if you get it, you get it
I have a chronic illness and I found it deeply relatable and so glad to have an album about something like this
I think many male critics have HUGR blind spots when examining media that is exploring life experiences they can’t relate to. Rather than being humble and recognizing this as their own limitation by exercising empathy to extend their analysis, they penalize the film/song/book itself for being too ‘insert veiled misogynistic critic” here.
It reminds me of when a male reviewer called “Turning Red” not relatable. If my memory serves me correct, he was making specific reference to the scene about Mei’s mom thinking she got her period. An experience very relatable to women but we don’t actually see in media often despite being a common coming of age experience for girls.
i don't usually comment on these videos but thank you for sharing this, d'angelo. i lost my cousin to lupus when she was 26 years old last year and she was like my sister. people refused to take her seriously and take her pain seriously so she died. this stuff has REAL EFFECTS on REAL PEOPLE. its so much deeper than what fantano makes it out to be.
I discovered Anthony Fantano years ago, way before he became super popular. I stopped watching him once I realized that sometimes he doesn't actually review the music, he just hates on the artist/music without any constructive criticism or support for his feelings/thoughts. Being "a hater" is not the same as being a "real, valid critic." And he has hated on Halsey for years. I haven't taken him seriously since I realized that, and I was surprised when he suddenly became popular. I think you can hate/dislike an artist but acknowledge that their work is good or vice versa. But hating just to hate isn't actually good, valid critiquing.
That last sentence hits the nail bc its essay writing 101. Its how professionals handle shit and he is definitely not a professional. I have never heard of this man before but this has definitely turned me away from watching his content if its ever recommended to me
I’m very puzzled on how there some people who defend Fantano. Then again he was one of the few who started a music critic channel on UA-cam. So, maybe that is why he got so big? Because at that time there was no else. At least from what I can remember that did reviews on music albums. Anyways, his criticism are laughably bad. Honestly, I can’t take him seriously, not since he had reviewed one of Lana Del Rey albums.
i feel like everyone forgot that she also literally had a miscarriage on stage. she was about to go on, started miscarrying, and her manager gave her an adult diaper and sent her out to perform. and ppl still act like she's some overdramatic entitled popstar
Ok no no no. She as a grown adult made that decision for herself & her fans. She has spoken on it. She was NOT FORCED to do ANYTHING. They encouraged her, & she was in shock. But that’s it. No one forced her to use her own two feet & walk on that stage that night. Possible coercion, maybe. But Free Will put her on the stage. It is so exhausting seeing people try to use language, & use it incorrectly. She is not a Britney Spears case. She loves Brit & can probably relate in some instances. However, don’t say anyone was forced to do something - unless you can prove it. The opposite proof is out there. She tries to “credit herself to her fans” for pushing through the performance. A damn joke. No one respects you more for performing through a miscarriage, girl. Get to a damn doctor & don’t risk your Health for fame/money. Dumb to Me.
@AS-rr9km "grown ass adult" is a big stretch for her being 20 at the time. she said herself in an interview that the show was a big deal not just because of the number of people there but also corporate and media sponsors attached to it. sure, nobody put a gün to her head and made her go out there, but it might not have felt like she had much of a choice at all. i don't know why you're making it out like i said he physically dragged her on stage. it has literally nothing to do w britney or any type of conservatorship or anything of that nature at all and i never even implied that so i have no idea why you're putting so many words in my mouth LMAO
i was diagnosed with leukemia in 2022 and stopped this video to listen to the album and “the end” made me start crying within 30 seconds. the only other thing that has capture a cancer diagnosis as well was the album Hospice by the Antlers
I wish you all the better days you could ever need. Bless.
THANK GOD SOMEONES COVERING THIS!!!! People like fantano haven't gone through or experienced the LACK OF CONTROL in your own life that comes with chronic health issues yet still feel like they can confidently address and criticize music about it as if they know anything on that topic and how the words cut as deep as they do. As someone with BPD, Endometriosis, Ehlers Danlos Syndrome and WAAAAAAY more that i'd like not to share to the world, this album finally gave me a way to express how destroyed and cruel life with health issues is. I've shared this album to legit every person i know, explaining if they care and if they want to know more about me, this album gives an amazing insight into life with chronic illnesses and every person i've showed has nothing but high praise and love because they can relate it to my experience and see the daily struggles. Truly just because baldtano just has no one in his life that has experienced this personally and opened up to him about it. Stupid take from stupid baldthany bakatano.
I can’t imagine caring this much about a Fantano album review. You must have an extremely privileged life if you actually care about this. Go outside.
You have an extremely privileged life if you unironically care this much about a music review.
@@BigOwl51 they legit said they are suffering in similar ways to what is expressed in the album. How is suffering privileged??? Plus most music that is super popular is popular because people can relate to it.
@@SoManyRandomRamblingsmakes sense, which is why the great impersonator is a commercial failure. The most streamed song on that album only has 20 million streams on Spotify. For comparison, without me has 2 BILLION streams. So I guess you’re right. Popular music is relatable, and this album isn’t popular, because it’s not relatable.
@@BigOwl51 it wasn’t made for you and that’s ok
Deangelo, you always serve but made my day talking about Halsey. She deserves her flowers thank you for saying it so beautifully fair
I was disappointed in Fantano because he can be crass or sarcastic with his jokes or musical criticism all he wants , but usually he doesn't attack the artists personal character unless they are being racist or bigoted... And although halsey's music is a hit or miss for me, she has always shown a lot of empathy and raised awareness about many important issues... I find very sad how there's always someone projecting onto her, misunderstanding her in bad faith or being cruel to her, when she clearly makes an effort to be considerate with others. I heard this album and I actually really liked it, musically and lyrically, but I get how some people may not like her singing style or how the mood of this project is 90% depressing... However, as you pointed out, the themes of this album are fairly clear: she sings about childhood neglect, being an unwanted daughter, the memory of her teenage friend dying due to an overdose, her doctor not believing her statements, misdiagnosis, getting sick, her contemplating her mortality, her strained relationship with both her parents, how the body retains memories of stress towards certain triggers eve years later, abandonement issues and distrust of men, her partner leaving her when she got sick, being a people's pleaser as a coping mechanism, fearing for the future of her toddler if she can't be there, being objectified and alienated by the masses due to being a star, her desperation to feel loved related to her feeling repeatedly rejected, struggling with her faith in the face of death... The entire story is very coherent and heavy. You can see how people's childhood problems affect their perception of themselves and how they deal with relationships... These are real experiences that A LOT of people suffer. It's not just about her. And I can see how this could resonate with people who need someone to tell them that their fear, their pain, their anger, their sadness is valid and allowed to be expressed.
He definitely showed his true colors there. Halsey is more vulnerable: she's bipolar, a biracial woman who appears white, portrays herself as extremely 'quirky' etc. In other words, she's an easy target for misogynists who want to exercise their misogyny in a way that will be more socially "accepted." Tbh, to me, he looks exactly like what he is, inside out. I am profoundly unsurprised.
@@meemzing she's not a "biracial woman who appears white" she IS a white woman who is PART black.
@@meemzingshe isn't biracial! Lol y'all kill me by adding everything to this girl's personal victim resume, wondering why people don't like her and thinks she's self centered. Her father is biracial and her mother is white, making her white. Period, everyone goes through things but that doesn't mean people have to like her music.
@@whatreallymatters571 No lol, Halsey is biracial. Her dad is not biracial he is a light skinned AA. The point (that clearly went way over your head) is she is biracial and APPEARS white, so if anyone wanted to target her for her belonging (or lack thereof) it would be simpler.
@@whatreallymatters571 Halsey is biracial. Her dad is not biracial, he is a light skinned AA. The point (that clearly went way over your head) is she is biracial and APPEARS white, so if anyone wanted to target her for her belonging (or lack thereof) it would be simpler.
“the great impersonator does feel like it is designed to position halsey as a tortured singular artist” like okay? and what was the reaction to the tortured poets department or wtv by taylor swift? like this isn’t a new trope be serious
Yeah exactly
To be fair they also called Taylor dramatic BUT she and Halseys struggles (the ones on their albums at least) are not even on the same plane of existence so I don't know why are they even using the same language. Thats just goes to show you how out of their way they had to go to be able to critique Halsey.
@@dianaandherbooks yeah like I’m sick of Taylor getting a pass because she’s so famous and rich
@@riahlexingtonshe was criticized too, but if people actually listened tot he album, she explicitly states she isn’t a tortured artist, and she was being overdramatic. The prologue mentions how she was manic (temporary insanity) when writing some of the songs, and she writes often about the symptoms of bpd (mania, depression, intense but unstable relationships, emotional instability, impulsive behavior). While not saying directly that she suffers from a specific mental illness besides an ed, she very much has alluded to it throughout her entire discography (the earliest I can think of is fearless “screaming and crying and kissing in the rain…. Roller coaster kinda rushed..That’s the way I loved”you”.
@@riahlexington not to shift the focus from Halsey but Taylor is constantly shat on by music critics & general audiences, especially online. the only folks that like her are her fans afaik.
anyway, however you look at it, there are certain female artists that people simply dislike and will think that all of their art is shit. unfortunately, Halsey can frequently be in that category when she never deserved it imo
Halsey: I have a fear of leaving my child without a mother, nobody takes my symptoms seriously, the people that i thought i loved have left me, i was on a brink of death
Men: Lol move on, so dramatic
Shia Lebouf: I Abused my ex girlfriend, almost killed my wife and very likely i'll do it again
Men: omg we love you vulnerable king
Not people crying black fishing while her dad’s black 😭… like y’all can google real quick
Exactly! People can just call her out for making trash pop music and being cringe. No need to make stuff up
Zoe Seldana wore "Brown" makeup to play Nina Simone. Identity isnt always a "shield" to protect a Black, or biracial person from being called out for problematic behaviour. The picture isnt Blackfishing bec. she isnt trying to look or pass as a Black woman, she was simply recreating the pose, clothes and hairstyle.
Unfortunatly biracial people are not considered black enough these days especially if they pass as white
That one killed me 😭
Those reactions just proved that media literacy is an all time low
Ooooh the pitchfork response so clever tbf.
Let's be honest, if she sounded more like these artists she was inspired by - you can GUARANTEE that music reviewers would drag her for not sounding unique enough.
Truly damned if you do, damned if you don't. I personally enjoyed the album, due to the variety, I certainly have favourites (including LITM), but the overall narrarive of the story (something that was clearly missed by some 😅)
Thank you for making this vid!
they DID get dragged for Lucky. people were non-stop accusing her of stealing for britney despite the fact that halsey sampled the song with permission. its insane how fast people are willing to forget.
Lucky is my least favorite song on the album but holy shit people come at it for the worst reasons
Right? If she does sound like the original artists, she's unoriginal. If she doesn't, she's not doing a good enough job impersonating. Women and afab people can never win
I think Anthony is just upset because he looks like if Ned Flanders had cancer
5:49 did people forget halsey is also literally biracial 😭 extremely white passing yes, but they've talked about it extensively and it has in fact been the basis of other stupid controversies stirred up around them
6:55 also the answer is kind of yes, her last album If I Can't Have Love I Want Power was produced by nine inch nails and nothing on it sounds exactly like lonely is the muse but it's much more in that gritty alt rock lane, you might enjoy it more
Yeah, I'm pretty sure her natural hair is black and curly. She was trying to grow it out before she got sick.
God people were pulling up pictures of her dad’s mother (who is white) and it was getting weird.
@@RogueVideoRavenif anything that would just make her uber mixed, right? Even if she is more white than black, genetics aren't ever as simple as perfect halves or thirds, though to be fair I did just relearn that recently.
Maybe if they were "overcompensating" with a blaccent and surgeries and whatnot there might be room for discussion, but if she's just existing...then you can't call that blackfishing.
Some black people really piss me off as a ambiguously "mixed" person (as in I could be majority black, afro-latino, black with indigenous ancestry and recent latino lineage, etc etc) with their who's not black nonsense. Not even just those black people, but all people when it comes to people of two or more ethnicities/races. If, in the eyes of racism, they are someone that would've been considered a "halfblood" or a "halfbreed"... they're a poc. It's unfortunate, but it's equally upsetting to try and say any mixed person is just one identity, either to exclude or to gatekeep.
I’m Also Biracial & Multiracial And Extremely White & Latinx Passing
Fantano had this weird take a while back about Sabrina Carpenter’s Taste where he kinda knocked it for being toxic (I’m being a bit reductive for the sake of brevity) - and yeah, that’s the point?? Sometimes you’re gonna have toxic feelings about your ex. The tongue in cheek homoeroticism in the song wasn’t brought up either. I feel like this is kinda similar to that situation in the sense that he just writes off things he can’t personally relate to at times in a really unfortunate way.
Edit for clarification: I don’t want to bash the guy or prescribe any opinions to him, because that’s not helpful to anyone. I just thought it was kind of emblematic of how this type of discourse tends to go. Calling out toxicity where you see it is fine of course, but the bar for what’s considered "problematic" for women is so unbelievably low compared to what guys get away with. It’s okay to not relate to a piece of art or thinking it’s cringe or whatever, but there’s something to be said for having the grace to realise that the reason you’re having those feelings might not always be the artists fault. Culturally ingrained misogyny is a powerful drug.
No one *has* to like Halsey’s album or praise it but saying she’s expecting us to marvel at her childish angst is just cold. Maybe in the eyes of some she failed at conveying what she went through in an artistically pleasing way, but that does not warrant cruelty.
Yeah literally I remember in that review Fantano was talking about how Sabrina's describes her love interests in sharpest tool, good graces, don't smile, etc as idiots and she wants them to miss her or something. But clearly if you listen to the songs she clearly referring to herself- for don’t smile she’s keeping on telling herself she want the person to miss her even they moved on bc she’s misses them; good graces she’s doesn’t want anyone else but if they do something suspect she has to leave them; for sharpest tool, she’s talking about miscommunication and how the love interest as more than a situationship bc it’s not seriously to him. Like some of his takes are fine but it feels like fantano isn't giving these albums a good listen or he’s just bias on certain pop music and undermines the artists (he did that for ethal cain's album, beabadoobee, etc.)
tons of men have songs about wanting to beat/kill their ex or her new boyfriend. it's okay for them to be honest about their feelings but women have to be a perfect cool girl's girl 💀 i swear to god these people will pick up a diary and expect it to be full of compliments
he was so mad about Sabrina calling men dumb/stupid 💀
He's honestly not the best at analyzing lyrics. He takes it too literally and doesn't care to think about it even for half a second more, it's frustrating watching him review a song and miss the entire point even when the point is as blantant as it was on Sabrina's songs.
Don't smile is so simple and he was like 'toxic' that's it. Apparently it's illegal to wish for your ex to miss you because it hurts that they moved on too fast and it makes you feel like they never cared at all 🙃
@@theclairewhy literally tyler the creator, as mentioned in the video, has said insanely v!0lent things towards women just while speaking and in his music and clearly he loves that.
@@hadesisbaby hm not really, Tyler's first albums have the worst scores Fantano ever gave him.
I hope she goes on to make a classic record in the style of Avril and Taylor with a subtle Tony Fantano diss sprinkled in.
misogynistic ableism is the theme of the album. emphasis on ableism. its absolutely wild how they missed the point.
As someone who has been following halsey since room 913, i appreciate you bringing up Halsey's work. Halsey has consistently been clowned as someone to not take serious since their fruition in the industry. they've always been very open about their creative process, their health issues, mental health, multiple miscarriages, and they constantly are pegged as being an attention seeker rather than an advocate. she's been VERY transparent about the album and almost dying. The lyrics are very obvious about their baby daddy treated them during this period which was extremely abusive. i love this album even though its a tough listen. halsey's music is some of the most relatable even though the situations are things i cannot relate to. she also is very open about their artistic endeavors are doing whatever they want and being dynamic. i love that they always change. thats literally a threaded theme throughout their work.
Halsey almost died. Halsey has 2 life threatening chronic illnesses that they have to hope wont interfere with their livelihood. I've never heard such an obviously intended album, even if the music itself doesn't hit for people, be completely missed. having to sort through trauma and mortality and being left to die with no support system and praying you can live for the child you worked so hard to conceive is a LOT. and its wild how misogynistic and ableist it is.
halsey did say that this album was like badlands and manic, badlands which is a little edgy and dramatic but also erratic and going through deep emotions. and who cares if halsey is feeling dramatic?
off topic: lonely is the muse is my fave song on the album as well!! their last album was produced by NIN and has a couple great rock songs on it.
also lonely is the muse to me feels like its a realization that if she dies she'll die as only being an inspirational tool for the lovers in her life and her accomplishments are not as valid because she's a woman . very tongue in cheek. "ive done all these things and yet im reduced to someone you sleep with".
thanks for the video, glad someone with a platform has common sense!
Great comment, I follow her since Badlands and absolutely LOVED " If I can't have love, I want power" Which is one of my favorite albums of all time 🤩 You bring up good points too 👍🏽
very well-said!
I haven't listened to Halseys album yet but I do have a few chronic illnesses. One thing I learned really early on is that I cannot talk about my illness "too much" (if at all) because others don't appreciate it even if they love you. I've almost completely isolated myself now because my life is so encompassed by my illnesses that I can't work or do anything except occasionally play videogames (if I have enough energy/ my pain isn't too bad) or watch UA-cam/ my favourite shows. So I can't talk about my struggles but if I don't, it just sounds like my life is a paradise of being able to be lazy and doing fun things for people who have a normal life and are working. I can't get out of this hole as my doctors have dismissed me so much that I doubt they'll help at all and my health has become bad enough that I can't do anything myself to change it. All that to say, chronic illness is a struggle and I hope that people's attitudes will change. But for now, all I can do is focus on the positives no matter how tiny or infrequent they are so I can at least maintain some sanity.
There are too many of us living like this. Wishing you all the best. Hopefully we get doctors to start actually caring and listening to us.
I’m also sitting here with my deteriorating health. Would you want to share socials? I know how lonely this experience can be
Oh my goodness, I hope you listen to the album soon cause they do have a song that perfectly encapsulates what you just talked about!! I love halsey so so much, I am very proud and glad she spoke up about this and I am also sending you lots of courage and love
This album will definitely hit for you cause it does talk about these things (pretending to be okay and then also feeling like a burden)
Oof. This is very relatable 😢 hang in there, fellow internetter. I don't even know how to be more hopeful than that, I had to double check that I didn't somehow type this in a fugue state. I get frustrated that this is what my life is limited to-- it isn't a paradise or an orgy of slothful behavior. It's a shrine to how heavy the price of survival is. People always think I'm faking it until they see me fall after pushing me to ignore the signs that exactly that is about to happen, and since they don't listen, they get surprised and mad I didn't scream dramatically for help so they... wouldn't look bad walking away or not noticing immediately. Not so they could actually help, so they could pretend to and get the right faces on for bystanders.
I've tried asking people who think this is a paradise, who say they want my life, what they'd do if it meant they couldn't have sex anymore. not in any way they recognize now, and definitely not in their preferred ways. Suddenly nobody wants this "paradise" and it's ONLY sex I removed from the hypothetical equation. Friends, work, hobbies, opportunities, real money, fun experiences, intimate relationships or highly engaged friendships, a lot of school... all of that falls away, too. It takes a long time to recover, or even get to a point that we can go "yup this is my life now."
Sorry, this is a novel. I believe you, I know this ain't some gd cake walk or extended vacation. 💐 it's life.
My mom had to fight leukemia, and if I heard anyone trying to accuse her of "acting like a victim," I would be at their head so quickly...
I almost died from medical gaslighting as an AFAB person with a nueroimmune disease. Fame and money can’t get them to take you seriously, nothing can. It took my mom 30 years and me 16; to learn we had a crippling genetic mutation. My life will likely end prematurely as a consequence of medical gaslighting and maltreatment. This is honestly not dramatic enough. If I had her money and power I’d make every person who let me decay suffer the way they made me.
THANK YOU. I was waiting on youtubers to talk about this. Being “the main character” in your art & music isn't a valid criticism. no DUH bc you're the artist. you don't have to like the music but calling her a "performative victim" deeply insensitive & cruel. what man has been criticized like this???
Right like isn’t a huge purpose of art to express your feelings and experiences?
Kanye.
@@SilverlineXZero kanye the n*zi? not even comparable.
@@SilverlineXZero kanye the n*zi?
@@zoc.6922 Kanye West. Trump. Elon.
Dude I'm promosed you man are criticized sometimes.
I know that's incomprensible to you but I promise it happens.
My best friend recently passed from Leukaemia, and seeing Halsey's music pertaining to the same condition feels oddly comforting
sorry for your loss ❤
Calling health scares like that "a predicament" is so condescending
to take all of this, we can now (as of an hour ago) add "her mother ALSO battling cancer while the record was being finished" to the laundry list of things that they were going through during the past two years.
what?!? where did she say this
God forbid a woman writes about,,,, herself,,,, and her struggles,,, in HER ALBUM?? Playing the victim? ? YES SHE IS ONE? she almost died dude 😭
“designed to position halsey as a tortured singular artist” y’all make me SICKKKK. y’all hate it when women in the industry stick to an aspirational level of glamour & polish & mystique but then also hate when they open up about their health, personal lives, thoughts on the world etc. WOMEN CANT WIN!!!!!
I am so delighted you’re covering this
Thanks for promoting Lonely is the Muse it's currently my fave song 😂
19:08 Dave is truly the fairest reviewer of them all. One of the only people in the video that didnt call Halsey dramatic
I have one of the top comments on that Fantano review and the amount of vitriol I've received by his acolytes in the replies is disturbing.