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There's a caveat about Joker. Joker will not stand for bigotry *unless he thinks its funny*. Joker doesn't strike me as particularly ableist but he does cripple and mock Barbara Gordon. If he found out one Batman's friends was trans and wanted to hurt his toxic yaoi obsession, he would absolutely torture them in a very brutal and transphobic way, as well as mocking them along the way. He's evil. He definitely isn't principled enough to restrain from tormenting queer people.
I think he also does have standards (not in the moral way where he has some lines he won't cross) but in a professional way. Like he might just see that as a lazy joke and since he thinks super highly of himself he wouldn't perform such low tier comedy
I think he'd be super chill with binary trans people. He'd see it like flipping a coin but with gender. That said, I think nonbinary people would blow his mind so he would try not to think about them.
God I love this stupid ass brainrot humor. My favorite is probably the one where it's him taking "STUPID" pills saying, "I Must Jonkle!" And the thumbnail of this video is peak too.
I love the conclusion of The Riddler being transphobic in the sense that when he says 'I can always tell' he's not saying it to justify excluding anyone from anything, he's saying it because he's just a dick who thinks people with deeper histories are just fun puzzles to solve. He's still okay with you going to whatever bathroom you want, he just wants you to know he had you figured out.
@@mikaroni_and_cheezgetting transgenderized by the riddler and totally not falling for it and being confident in your identity and not seeing him again. but like a decade later you’re going to the pharmacy to pick up your hormones. You haven’t thought about it in years, just an awkward step in your awakening that you never think about, but as you walk away the bag they handed you feels a little heavy so you open it up and there’s a stupid little green question mark. You could stop to consider if he somehow tricked you into this, or if he could just tell all along somehow, but you don’t feel like it so you throw it directly in the trash and continue on with your day.
Two cis guys starting a funny trans video with "you can't be neutral, that's the side of the oppressor" is an amazing way to start. Love it. You just come out swinging. Also, Clayface has a sort of split off of him that's a young girl who was sort of Robin's love interest for one episode. So something between daughter and self, but she is treated as him in the cartoon.
I'm just gonna feed the algorithm here and comment whenever a stray thought crosses my mind: On the subject of queer people on the Suicide Squad: Grant Morrison (the writer) was on the Suicide Squad. They died of writer's block.
Maxie Zeus when he's crazy and thinks he's Zeus, maybe he'd be accepting, but when he's just a rich billionaire he's definitely a JK Rowling. I also don't necessarily think he'd be a mythologically accurate. Like he's not becoming Zeus, he's just thinking he's Zeus. And who he thinks Zeus is would probably be transphobic. Which actually brings up a story from a health care worker training I went to. It was about how you're not there to push back against schizophrenics or anything like that, and how she had a client who thought he was Darth Vader and once said his legs grew out of a silver box, and I'm sitting there thinking "that's not lore accurate!"
Riddler is absolutely transphopic. It's not because he's particularly hateful, it's because he doesn't "get it" and since he considers himself the smartest person in existence, anything he doesn't understand must be stupid and fake. He's definitely leaving reddit comments about how dumb he thinks being trans is.
I mean he's dealt with harder conundrums than gender dysphoria I think he'd be fine with it but mostly be proud that he understands it, like how he'd understand a riddle
Yeah, I can see that. The major irony of Riddler's character is that he himself hates riddles he can't solve. That said, he ALSO hates leaving a riddle unsolved, so I could see him researching the neuroscience behind transness out of a need to understand, and accepting the data he finds. ...and then he'd start explaining the trans experience to trans people.
Fun fact about the F slur btw, it just means a bundle of sticks, because a bundle of sticks is used to light fires, and I assume that in the west a few hundred years ago, if people thought you were gay you got burned. So. I mean. Kindling isn’t too far off?
Pyg would be like 'oh you're a woman, yes you will make a beautiful doll' but in a way where like. He thinks you need to get surgery to be 'really' trans.
upon further consideration: thoughts on a headcanon where Pyg is transfem but in denial? The obsession with creating 'perfect' feminine forms could be argued to be redirected personal desires, and Pyg definitely has plenty of trauma that could lead to that kind of denial, in my non-expert opinion.
I will say in the Harley Quinn TV show Riddler is gay and married to Clock King. He is, however, depicted as an asshole gay, so he could be like an LGB alliance type dude.
@@jonathonriddle9922The Riddler gives me big Bi vibes for some reason. It might just be a case of "I'm bi and I like him" but he just kinda gives me a feeling
@jonathonriddle9922 i know that there's a billion different iterations of these characters but i believe a valentines day comic from 2022 had the riddler be explicitly bi
Killer croc and bane are most trans accepting (bc killer croc has been called a freak, monster, crime against god, and outcast so he relates to the trans community while bane heavily promotes taking testosterone)
Do you thinking baseball players that juiced in the 90s are more trans accepting than a random person? My wild guess would be no. I don't think steroid taking for performance relates to gender changing. Admittedly, I do not know a single baseball players stance on trans, so that is an unscientific estimate of a subset of competitive males form the late 90s.
@@cheeseburger12 i dont think you can compare a 8ft tall 7ft wide man who broke batman’s spine and is one of the strongest non-metahuman people on the planet to a juicing 90s baseball player
@CoolusGuyus I don't think you can compare people using steroids to get stronger and people thst use steroids to change genders. I do think people that take steroids together stronger at sports have more in common with people that take steroids to get stronger for other reasons then changing gender. Unless you think people that use steroids to change gender have more in common with a 7 foot tall super criminal that tries to kill a giant Bat.
@@CoolusGuyus no but the point still stands that he could easily have a "it's cool when i take horomones but not when trans ppl do it" attitude that a lot of gymbros on juice do
9:07 clayface actually has some trans moments in the harley quinn show, initially because they actually needed him to transform into a girl, but then he got too much into the character, there he also says he identify as ''fluid'', so himself is technically genderfluid, and there's also a bunch of queer subtext in his btas incarnation
Also he has a daughter made out of his own body which he initially made to sneak into a private school to get revenge on a play director (until she betrayed him)
Professor Pyg and Hugo Strange wouldn't be transphobic simply because deconstructing humans is their speciality, Professor Pyg would be fascinated by the physical side of transition and Hugo would be fascinated by the psychological side of transition There should be a row of "Accepts Trans people maliciously" For villains who belive in transexuality but that don't mean they're inherently positive towards it
And I don't believe Bane and Deadshot would be in the kills transphobes row simply because they don't care enough about this sort of stuff, But Mad Hatter tho, He should be in JK Rowling row
@@Icedsobaka I'd be willing to argue Mad Hatter doesn't care whether someone is trans or not, dude's just nuts and wants an "Alice" and i don't think he'd be too picky about whether his "Alice" is trans or not
I disagree completely that they'd be accepting just because they view it as a real medical phenomena. Doctors like those tend to view people with disorders as subhuman lab rats and I have no doubt Strange would be the same
12:17 I will forever bring up the comic panel where Poison Ivy says "Why did you kidnap her? What's your problem with black trans women?" and Black Mask answers "I'm an lgbtqia ally! I just needed the money!" Because that perfectly sums up his character. Edit: To everyone who asked, It's from Harley Quinn: The Animated Series: Legion of Bats #6 (2023)
Hugo could go either way. He could go Peterson, or he could go purely clinical, mildly irritated, "No, transexuality is a fully recognised part of medical science. That's just how it works." And then start psychoanalysing transphobes in his standard fucked up way. Not because they're transphobes, mind, he just likes tormenting people psychologically and would see that as an opening.
5:43 i disagree that Gotham itself is more transphobic than your average city, but rather the average criminal is more transphobic and because of the sheer number of them she would need to carry self defense. She's at a higher risk of being attacked because trans people get hate crimed and there's a bunch of terrible criminals in Gotham, and that's why she said what she said
In the comic that panel is from, Alyshia says that "violence against trans people is on the rise" though it's unclear if she's talking about Gotham specifically or just in general.
@@breezeshooter42yeah honestly it could be just a commentary on the country at large, though I wouldn’t be surprised if Gotham - a city usually representing the worst of the capitalist hellscape - would have higher levels of transphobic violence
I was thinking that it's not even that the average criminal is more likely to be transphobic, but moreso that because Gotham has higher levels of criminal activity (which probably means the population has a higher population of criminals) it's more likely that a transphobic person would also be a criminal. So it's because there's more criminals in the population that leads to more possibilities for hate crimes.
Yes he would, but not because he particularly hates transphobes or particularly cares about trans people, but because he knows that would be torturous. He would probably do something just as tortuous to a trans person based on their transness.
I think Joker is in the kills transphobes tier not because he in any way cares about trans people, but just because they're such good targets to mess with. Uptight and stubborn, obsessed with things like appearances, rules, and expectations.
joker looks for chaos, anyone who looks for a reality of sameness is some that he wants to mess with. personally i dont agree with the methods but i understand.
@@MarcyRavenManjiI'm gonna take a leap and say they probably meant it as some weird meta joke on how they couldn't get will Smith back and had to hire a (better) actor who was also black to practically basically play the same character for THE suicide squad
In Arkham Asylum:A serious house on serious earth. It’s explained the Joker wakes up everyday and creates his personality. It’s why he can go from laughing fish to blowing up hospitals. So the Joker would just wake up and figure out if he’s transphobic or not.
@@AlriikLives It works so well with the multiple choice backstory idea. The Joker vaguely knows who he is but hes so physically and mentally damaged hes basically a living John Doe
The Mad Hatter’s view on gender roles is _absolutely_ something that depends on the continuity. Arkham gameverse Jarvis Tetch would think gender is fluid, in so much as he’ll make anyone who fits the physical characteristics “his Alice”, but classic DCAU Jarvis would would *absolutely not accept* any person assigned female he fancies coming out as a man.
The only item I disagree with on this list is poison ivy. Love her, but with how much she despises men, I feel like she could fall into the biological essentialist view point very easily and think like, 'once a man always a man' or some bs like that. I guess it also depends on the version. Poison ivy from the Harley Quinn animated series def would go killing transphones as a fun date with Harley. But other, more villainous versions of her wouldnt care because she hates all of humanity, or actively despsise trans people.
Well if she hates humanity, yes sure. But i think she's smart enough to know that what's between your legs doesn't dictate your gender i.e. what your personality is.
I slightly disagree (though I do see where you're coming from) since modern versions of Poison Ivy are characterized less as hating men and more just hating humanity in general (except for Harley of course), so I don't think Ivy would discriminate against trans men specifically even at her most villainous. IMO, for her, transphobia would be like deciding to discriminate between different genders of ants - i.e., utterly pointless.
@@halfmettlealchemist8076like the op said, depends the version, she can go from killing indiscriminately any person, to just killing men and forgiving women (and all kids I guess) but I feel either way she likely fall into hypocritical territory since I see her as jumping from mindset depending her moods and how much she is connect with nature that day
@@halfmettlealchemist8076 that is fair! I don't really read that many comics so my only exposure to modern versions of her is the Harley Quinn animated series.
The 'kill transphobes' roster is so funny, imagine if that group had to hang out with each other. Half of them have personal beef with the Joker. Also, I will say that the Talia Al Ghoul and Batman conception of Damian is pretty widely considered as a racist retcon that came out of nowhere for Talia's character and is basically character assassination. At no point was she set up to be a character that would do something like that, and it took away all of her complexity to just demonize her. She would probably still fall under "doesn't accept trans people" but more so because of her environment, and I feel she's one of those cases that could change her mind as she grows
Thank you! I was waiting to see someone point this out. Though I don’t think there is any evidence the Al Ghuls are all that bigoted, except against the human race as a whole. Tbh (before Grant Morissons racism) I think the only reason she shouldn’t be ranked at “kills transphobes” is because she doesn’t kill as a principle.
@@KingOfDarknessAndEvil there’s a whole trope about Asian women forcing themselves onto white men, specifically to have their baby. Highly uncomfortable, fetishizing, racist and sexist. Especially since that isn’t how it originally was for Bruce and Talia. Also doesn’t help that they did that A SECOND TIME with Ra’s getting his cousin or something along those lines to nearly r@pe Tim.
As a HUGE Scarecrow fan, I gotta agree with y'all and I wanna provide some more context. This is because Scarecrow, or Jonathan Crane, was bullied as a child for his appearance. In BTAS, he is also shown showing genuine care for Harley, so he and Harley are friends. He's also very educated and is a psychologist. I feel like he'd be like "I don't know anything about trans people, but do tell me what's up with them" and then Harley would explain to him the whole intricacies of being trans and he'd be like "okay, cool," because he doesn't like seeing other people being abused or bullied. It also depends on the continuity, but I think most versions of him wouldn't be transphobic for sure.
The thing is Riddler also reads as kinda autistic coded to me, and autistic people as a demographic are statistically more likely accept trans people. I don't disagree with you guys completely tho, I can totally see him as a bioessentialist "LGB without the T" type, but I also think he can change if given the chance. Like, he'll probably get very defensive and annoying about it if you try to convince him, but if you let him figure out the "gender puzzle" on his own he could end up in the "accepts" tier. Not "kills transphobes" tho, he's too self centered for that.
I could see that. Personally though, I see him as the sort of guy to not "get it" and be hateful because if he doesn't understand something, it must be dumb. Likd he probably wouldn't kill trans people or target them, but he would definitely try to debate them about their identity. Maybe leave some kinda sus reddit comments.
Get him thinking about how certain things are entirely abstract, and then ask him if he thinks gender is abstract, don't bring up the answer immediately because you want him to feel smarter for "figuring it out" so just point him in the direction and then he'll be like "ITS CLEAR! GENDER IS LITERALLY A SOCIALLY APPLIED CONCEPT! I'M A GENIUS!!"
Batman is canonically a registered Democrat and supports trans rights and actually paid for Victoria October (a trans scientist helping him cure Clayface in DC Rebirth) he paid for her gender reassignment surgery and sent her a congratulations card. He also accepted Tim Drake Robin when he came out as bisexual. Like y’all said the Justice League has diverse ppl on it he’s used to working with so Batman is definitely not transphobic
That seems obvious. When Tim came out to him, he told him that he just wants his son to be happy. No big reaction. Just "are you happy with who you are? Yes? Good, b/c that's all I've ever wanted for you"
there's a case to be made with Ras Al Ghul that he would be accepting having come across the numerous queer identities present in the ancient world. modern conservatives want people to think normative "family values" have been consistent throughout history.
This is a good point. Ra's sort of hates humanity as a whole, I don't think he would really target any one group in particular. Living for as long as he has certainly put Ra's into contact with plenty of people from all sorts of backgrounds, orientations, cultures, etc, and he's watched them all change with time, developing his own sense of things over the course of many lifetimes. He's had a long time to come to terms with things. The guy's pretty much seen everything, and living in a world where crazy sh*t happens every other week, I feel like he'd treat the subject as no big thing. Also, considering just how intelligent Ra's is, I think he'd know better.
Ra's out there living for more than half a millennia, training with or fighting all sorts of people. Knowledge of your enemies and allies is your biggest weapon.
Imo Ras Al Ghul would be like a grandpa who is an ally. Like sure he tries to respect you but can sometimes be accidentally transphobic/confusing because he would use older terms from accient greece or someshit when talking about you to someone else.
Idk, 'cause isn't there times where Talia asked "Why can't I just become your successor since I'm obviously your favorite?" and Ra's response was "Cause you're a woman and women can't lead"? Would trans-friendly Ra's change his mind if Talia became Talio and let him become his successor?
I feel like Scarecrow, depending on the version, would be in an odd place he accepts trans people, and while he doesn't kill transphobes he's definitely going to kidnap them and experiment on them. Not because he's enraged at the bigotry, but there's a common theory that a lot of bigotry, including homophobia/transphobia, is rooted in fear that turns into hatred. I can see him wanting to experiment with the idea and understand it. Then in some versions, I remember him being made fun of for his appearance being very thin and like a scarecrow while in school. Then also there's the thing where he in some versions worked at Arkham Asylum as a paychologist and others Gotham University as a professor of psychology. I can imagine the versions of him that works as a professor being leagues more upset at one of his students bullying another student for being trans than a version of him as a psychologist seeing transphobia, solely because of his school years. My rating is "Accepts trans people, weirdly fascinated with the psychology of transphobia". Then again I may be biased as a trans person who is OBSESSED with Scarecrow so-
Yeah Croc would definitely kill transphobes. Waylon is always looking out for the marginalized and underprivileged people of Gotham. He was also Roy Harper’s AA sponsor. I love him so much. I hate when writers just use him as a big guy to be an obstacle for a hero.
The mentioned story of him and Swamp Thing is great also. He doesn't even want to be a criminal most of the time, he's just poor, which is honestly sad.
About Tahlia al Ghul, originally it was consensual but then it was changed in the Morrison run which was wrote her incredibly out of character and was probably just racism. In the New 52 her and Batman had Damian consensually, so the r*pe got retconned. Morrision's Tahlia was portrayed really racist and misogynistically so not great at all. She is a super interesting character so it sucks how her best characterisation is ignored over a retconned version that is literally just a racist stereotype
That's very interesting. The daterape of Batman has always been my point of reference for the character other than her relation to her father and her relationship with Batman. Honestly we should just have disclaimer on Morrison comics that no matter how good they are, the interpretations of the characters are batshit for no reason. See : Magneto in New X-Men. That really bums me that either character got saddled with unnecessary rape, especially Bane since I am attached to that character. But to your point, I think its very telling that I've known about Tallia's rape in Morrison for about a decade while I've just heard about Bane's rape right now
I think a telling problem with this confusion is that neither Talia or Ra's has had any memorable stories to the point that Grant Morisson's oopsie is the only thing people remember about her. When was the last time a story with Ra's was relevant to the casual audience? Batman Begins? Talia's had it worse.
@@leithaziz2716 Yeah true. Like Ra and Tahlia had a few episodes in BTAS but way less than most of Batman's other notable rouges which sucks. They're both really interesting characters too
26:20 Very apt analysis there! There’s a quite prominent comic panel from Whatever Happened to The Caped Crusader where Joker refuses to kill someone because it wouldn’t be funny. (Also, he’s a natural born comedian, picking on trans people is hack comedy) Also 50:22 the idea was that it didn’t really work. They made him decide his every action by drawing from a tarot deck and it lead to him being unable to make a single decision because there were like 60 options at once.
Joker complains about attack helicopter jokes not because he hates that they are transphobic as his care for other people is about zero he just hates how overdone they are. Transphobes use the same cookie cutter jokes with no build up and basically the exact same punchline while wearing different colored gloves and I think that would be the most likely part to actually anger him. I feel like Joker is merely just accepting in the way he is indifferent to most people’s lives and what they identify as, he just ends up hating transphobes because of comedy based spite and it makes him look like a much bigger ally
On a similar note, Joker would hate comedians who complain about how “PC/wokeness is killing comedy” because those people are hacks who can’t come up with anything original. Plus, he knows that political correctness isn’t killing comedians - _he’s_ killing comedians, because he kills everybody lol
@@beywheelzhater8930 I think he would like trans people on principle the same way John Waters does. We are naturally subversive just by being ourselves. We are punks down to the very synapses of our brains. We can make any side of the political spectrum uncomfortable. Joker loves himself some shifting paradigms
@@halfmettlealchemist8076Joker would hate people who make bigoted jokes, not because they're bigoted, but because they're just not that funny. If there was a bigoted commedian who was actually funny, he'd have no issue with them.
I feel you, sis. I'm not trans myself (still figuring out) but the amount of transphobia in the area where I live is absurd. Like, nobody takes trans folks seriously and most people here make them to freaks and if you try and tell them it's wrong they'll call you 'soft or woke' basically. It's a sad world, really, but I agree this video is real good
Personally I don't care about it If someone's transphobic they can say it to my face I'm a femboy at heart and I usually identify as a women, my friends use he/they as my pronouns but I'm completely fine with it because it's confusing when someone just switches pronouns suddenly, I myself suck at remembering people's pronouns But theyre still respectful about my identity Most people I hang around are usually chill about it, I'll tell people that I am trans and if it makes them uncomfortable to call me by my feminine name (I legally got a name change) or calling me a girl then that's fine and all so long as their respectful about it I've seen a few fully transphobic people and really they aren't even transphobic, they're just assholes to everyone in general But the actual "transphobic" people I know more or less just get uncomfortable treating me as a girl but they're still very respectful about it and that I can appreciate Being transphobic isn't necessarily bad as long as you're respectful, if using someone's pronouns makes you uncomfortable then that doesn't make you a bad person as long as you dont go out of your way to harass them or purposely misgender them Personally I don't see any transphobia, I just see respect and disrespect
@@thechargedfoxie456yt2you’re lucky. As a trans person I have people threaten me with violence if I go out in public…existing. So many people view me with straight up disgust and harass me and my friends. In good parts of the world, I believe your story to be true. But there are many people who live like me, in fear. I hope that changes
I think it's worth noting that Hush was a surgeon at one point and has shown to at least have a passing ability to perform cosmetic surgery, so it's entirely possible he performed gender reassignment surgeries on people.
Hush's ability to perform cosmetic surgery isn't just "passing" it's "make someone look EXACTLY LIKE someone else at his whim", comic-logic absurd levels of perfect cosmic surgery. You ABSOLUTELY want him to do your gender reassignment surgery if at all possible, at least the facial feminization/masculization surgery.
yep, the producers confirmed Matt Hagan (BTAS Clayface) was canonically gay, and specifically included a scene of Matt’s boyfriend standing outside a hospital, not allowed to go in to see Matt, as a critique of 80s/90s hospitals who determined gay relationships “weren’t real family” and therefore gay people couldn’t see hurt loved ones due to restricted patient visitation.
Grant Morrison straight up admitted on record that they didn't re-read Talia's OG intro, & completely misremembered that Talia & Bruce were married & had Damien through mutual consent. Like...I'm sorry...how do you mess up so bad?? Agreed, Talia's portrayal is hella racist & misogynist. Also, notice that fans also often use her specifically as a scapegoat too, but they still have respect for villans like Joker, Zsasz, & even R'as al Ghul.
Couple Poison Ivy things: When people tried to claim Ivy as a terf on twit twitter, legendary comic writer Gail Simone as someone who has written Ivy made it clear that not only is Ivy not a terf, she would defend trans women. And in fact, I'm pretty sure she does kill if not just fight off people harassing trans women in a recent comic Ivy also is known to be very "fuck all men" but that's not inherently exclusionary or bioessentialist. When Ivy says she hates men she is including trans women as her sisters, because she correctly views us as women (and identifying trans men as men even if she says fuck em, sorry guys)
@@autismobinch135i wouldnt call excluding trans men from “i hate men” transphobic, queer men in general are usually excluded from that for a lot of people
@@autismobinch135not really if what the writer said is true then trans men would absolutely be on the chopping block and gay men would also be on the chopping block
@@autismobinch135I mean she also canonically makes exceptions for some cis men so I don't think she would blanket exclude all trans men from her hate list but more likely just go in assuming they'd be less complete assholes (which is how she expects most interacts with men to go). It's usually portrayed somewhat nuanced rather than a blanket, kneejerk hatred of men. She's been mistreated and harassed for so long she just can't put up with it anymore and feels detached from most of humanity (just weighted more towards men)
Ivy isnt exactly transphobic just sexist Like say she saw a girl wanting to be a guy She'd say "why though? They suck" But if she saw for example; a femboy or a guy who wants to identify as a woman She'd say "you f*ckin go girl!" Definitely supports trans since she shares many of Harley's beliefs and they've even dated in multiple series, but she just hates men and would try to stop women from identifying as men by telling them that men suck Like she'd support them and say "you don't have to be a guy, you should be comfortable in your own body" but on the opposite end she'd welcome guys becoming female
IIRC the same issue with the “trans flag baseball bat” panel has that same trans woman (Barbara Gordon’s best friend) get into a fight with Killer Moth, but Moth has no actual issue with her being trans and is only fighting her bc she’s in his way when he’s trying to fight Barbara as Batgirl. So I think Moth is in the “uses trans people’s preferred pronouns while he’s mugging them for their wallets” tier
He'd be fine with someone being trans-male or female, but he would deny the existence of non-binary people. I could see him shouting about "Male or Female! The coin only has two sides!" And then in the end, when he gets punched in the face, he drops his coin and it lands in a crack between some tiles so it's on it's edge.
Sure, but that's a bit over-simplistic. Like, that's the most arch version of the character, but any real characterization goes way beyond "I like anything when it's two." Two-Face does struggle with a kind of mental dysphoria (in some versions split personalities like Ventriloquist) in that he feels there are two fragmented sides to himself and he has trouble landing on which one is real or how to synthesize them. In both comics and some shows, he's even developed third personalities. He also struggles with body images issues often. On the basis of saying you think Batman is accepting of trans folks and he generally lends support to politicians whose values he truly believes in, it also suggests Harvey Dent was probably not transphobic (Dent was also very concerned about police corruption and investigating police, woke)
Wasn’t there a minor Greek and/or Roman Diety who is explicitly both male and female? Greek/Roman Gods are more gender nonconforming than most people give them credit for, they weren’t _just_ known for polyamory and being M/M gay relationship accepting (as long as you’re on top, their masculine culture thinks being a bottom is the most shameful thing a man could be).
I'm reminded of a moment on one of the old Sleepycasts where they're making fun of Cory for being a degenerate coomer (justified) and they ask him if he'd bone a donkey, and he immediately asks "I dunno, is it hot?"
Decided to make a Batman Beyond Villain Transphobia Tier List: JK Rowling tier: • Blight • Shreik • Cynthia Doesn’t Accept Trans People Tier: • Spellbinder • Bigtime Accepts Trans People Tier: • Patrick the Rat Boy • Wily Watt (Golem’s Host) • The Terrific Trio • Armory Kills Transphobes Tier: • Inqe • Curare • Mad Stan • Payback
I don’t necessarily disagree, but I am curious, what are your reasons for Shriek being JK Rowling? Because I could definitely see him being transphobic, but idk if he’d care that much. As for Patrick the Rat Boy, he does kinda seem to feel uncomfortable in his body, but he’s also really weird and creepy towards women. I feel like he could end up feeling “tricked” if he kidnapped a trans woman or a trans man, honestly. He maybe wouldn’t mind nonbinary people too much I guess. Finally, allow me to add my thoughts on an unmentioned group of villains. The Royal Flush Gang is transphobic and homophobic, except for Ten, who’s an ally
10:05 in the comics he has canonically (said it in the main universe, and it hasnt been retconned) come out as sapio-sexual (sexually attracted to smart people)
I feel like Joker truly views every person in the world of all walks of life as equally murder-able. Like he doesn’t hate any specific group because he just does not care
Can't believe I'm doing this- but in defense of the Mad Hatter, I think he is *misandrist* and not transphobic. He dislikes men. His best friend (March Harriet) is literally a lesbian who had her lover killed and he helps her get revenge. He never romantically pursues or brainwashes her, they are strictly platonic friends. Most fans also pretty much strongly dislike the "Mad Hatter is a p*do" that was introduced in some of the comics because it's edgy, in-poor-taste nonsense.
Ngl i really feel like mad hatter would be jk rowling teir like even if he would mostly be tranphobic towards transmen i still think that would be MORE than enough to get into jk rowling teir
I think I would go as far to say that batman himself is woke, his main principle is rehabilitation over incarceration and hes ride or die for that principle
Hey, thanks guys. This was a hillarious watch. As a trans person myself I have sometimes mused over what such nerdy topics before. Great fun. Also I distinctly remeber reading a german non licensed batgirl comic i got at my local dingy comic shop. It was bound and printed in an odd way and like 250 pages long. I think it was authored by one of the owners friends. It was wiiiiild. But I really liked it and the protagonist was a teenage boy who would dress up as batgirl and later was turned into a girl and so and so forth. Didnt realized it at the time but that was probably the first trans story i evet read. I hope i have it still somewhere.
@@YuotiKinto he would. But many version of Scarecrow have expressed the feeling of feeling vindicated when he hurt assholes. He also hate hateful religious people so... Trans people is just for regular 'curious' about people's fears while attacking phobes with fear gaz is a 'had it coming moment' for him.
2 face would accept mtf and ftm transgenderism because it fits his binary, potentially even being in favor of it, but nonbinary throws him off and upsets him
I only know a few batman villains, since i'm not that deep in the matter, but if I had to guess, clayface would be an ally, cause he can relate to gender dysphoria, what with what his body has going on, riddler would not care, cause his entire shtick is kinda far away from the whole topic and penguin would be a bigot, just cause he's a complete kook. Looking forward to see how accurate that is lol Also that speech at the beginning is incredibly based. Can't wait for republicans to get exactly what they voted for
The Iceberg Lounge, however, would _totally_ have themed weekends and rotating specials for the entire month of June. The Penguin would use that as a "gotcha" against any accusations of transphobia, but really it's just because he can recognize a potential revenue boost when he sees one. Regardless of his own prejudice, he knows for a fact that they/them dollars spend just as well.
@@lalas181 so basically that means penguin b like any corpo on pride month, claims to support the queers and even sells merch on pride month bc *Mr krabs voice* money but in this case he’s just do something special for that occasion in the lounge (he’d probably sell merch and hire drag queens for entertainment for that one month idk). But once July hits he takes down all the rainbows and goes “back to hell ya go u stupid fruit” and then just waits for pride month to come by again to start his “support” all over again
i can’t believe Batthem and Harley Queer teamed up against The Woker and The LGBeast. it was especially epic when Harley Queer looked over at Pronoun Ivy and said, “i am feeling extra *homosexual* today, do you want to *kiss* ???”
There is a thing where being a victim doesn't automatically make you a good person. There is a comics Maus about that, although it's about a holocaust and it's survivors. I'm mentioning it here because Croc doesn't neceserrily has to be trans supportive just because he has problems with his body.
The nuance of whether the crocodile man chooses to eat people equally or not (fr tho that's a very interesting concept. But like, aren't many Batman villains like this already? Ostracized to the point of having almost no empathy or having empathy limited to only a few people)
Yes. I agree with your analysis. I would put Croc 'kills transphobs' because: he is Roy Harper's (Arsenal) AA sponsor, good friends with Jason Todd (red hood) , lived in a classic old-school circus part of the freaks and geeks, is canonically friends with young children and homeless in Gotham, and the marginalized.
Hush would be the oli london type of transphobe. Ie obssessed with someone(for hush it's bruce wayne for oli it was kpop idols) enough massively change their physical appearance then when they get called out for how weird that is they turn it into a anti trans thing to seem more "normal".
Professor Pyg should be in the "doesn't accept" category, because he doesn't care about people's feelings. The Dollotrons are created from people he perceives to have no physical flaws, who he kidnaps and forcefully removes all feeling, making them "perfect". People *with* physical flaws, however, he murders because they'll never be perfect (that's how he gets caught, he leaves a trail of victims with bone deformities and other physical ailments or uniquities). It should be said that the Dollotrons are genderless, but it's because they have no feelings. Pyg's "perfection" removes all discernable traits.
I would've put Firefly in JK rowling since in Batgirl Year One, the only place I know any real backstory from him, his motivation is literally to see a beautiful woman on fire. His view of women, in that iteration at least, seemed misogynistic. I'll update the comment if i have future thoughts. Edit: nah no more notes.
Nah personally I just think stuff he kind gets interested into he mentally wants to connect it with fire, in other appearances he also set fire to a zoo and an amusement park because is where places he wished to go when he was. A kid, but he doesn't see it as destroying what he couldn't have but more as in mixing the psycho pyro desire with the experience
As another comment said, he usually burns what he likes or wants. He doesn't burn them simply because they are women, but because according to his disorder that is not bad.
Fun fact: there was a trans woman in doom patrol in the 90s, I think. Coagula. She was written by a trans woman who picked up the book immediately after Grant Morrison. Oh, and of course there's Rebis who is...non binary in a complicated way.
This was absolutly pointless and had no greater effect on the wider dc universe. I loved every second of it and honestly every choice made me laugh harder and harder. I just imagine someone trying to cancel one of these guys and gals on twitter. And they just go “…. This is what you have a problem with? Not the murder or terroism or crimes against humanity… but this… huh” then they just thwack them or shoot them. Funnesit shit ever
Joker would get all giddy if someone got mad at him for being trans accepting over the murder specifically because he would find the situation hilarious. He interacts with transphobes specifically for the unintentional comedy, although that joy tends to quickly fade as they begin to once again cycle through the same handful of jokes about attack helicopters and neo pronouns. He doesn’t even really care about trans people that much, he is an ally in the sense that he will shrug and accept these kinds of things without a second thought because it is none of his business, he just ends up having actual strong feelings against transphobes for being bad at comedy I feel like Joker saying “bored now” is something a number of people have heard before dying
I feel like Hush belongs in JK Rowling tier solely cuz of how massively bigoted he canonically is and how he’s generally written to be as reprehensible as possible.
The thing that bothers me is that a trans person, especially a trans woman, would make an amazing supervillain cause she has the basic supervillain backstory and motivation of burning down the society that mistreated her by default. But the format of a superhero comic would just mean she'd be defeated with no meaningful change to the system.
@@GoblinCorn69i honestly love the idea of a trans-person just so enraged they snap one day and do good things with the wrong methods. like red hood with extra steps
Batman : *Punches her into prison* *Does the impossible to make it so she goes in the women's prison with free hrt and therapy* *Exposes the CEO of transphobia as a war criminal* *Goes to publicly and financially support a trans rights association as Bruce Wayne the next day*
I just imagined the following Joker esque scenario: - Joker “AHA Batsy it’s good to see you again” - Batman “Save it Joker, release the hostages” - J “Oooh~ not so fast, that’s really up for YOU to decide” - B (Brooding noises) - J “ON YOUR LEFT you will see a straight white cis man!” - B “What?” - J “AND ON YOUR RIGHT a black lesbian trans woman!” - B “Uhh” - J “AND THEY ARE BOTH SUSPENDED ABOVE A VAT OF ACID *maniacal laughter*” - B “You’ve done this trick before, I just save both.” - J “I haven’t shown you the best part yet! Your actions are on video broadcast to the entirety of Gotham city! I have made sure that this time you CAN only save one, and no matter who you save you’ll make some of Gotham city lose hope in the BATMAN, causing havoc on the streets. -B “Gotham has enough sense to not-“ - J “CHECK THE NEWS LATELY!? People want a reason to go to war with each other, and this might just be the spark to do it!” So the choice is yours! Is Batman WOKE or BASED! Make your choice, and let Gotham burn in the ashes!”
Peter - H-hey boss I just got these new- Jameson - Gimme P- … pictures. J- Parker these suck you’re fired P- Wait wait, uhhh here’s one where he saves a black guy! Shows some divers- J- Peter, you’re unfired I need you to get more of these P- I can’t just- J- I can see it now; is Spider-Man Woke or Based P- What does that- J- Don’t matter don’t care, ship it! P- But- J- Parker get me some coffee and then more pictures of him saving minorities P-… Sure… sir
I imagine this to be a podcast recorded by two gothamites fresh out of, or just about to go in to college. And therefore I will take everything started in this video to be absolutely canon.
I guess you wouldn't be aware of that if you didn't read Midnighter's runs (you should), but Prometheus is is clearly LGBT and wouldn't be transphobe. Dude had sex and got into a relationship with Midnighter to get as close to him as possible in a long-term plan that involved killing him. Aaaand he was on a "sexy rogues" cover for the DC PRIDE #1 comic book, shirtless alongside Savant, Creote, the Brain and Monsieur Mallah, officially confirming that he is LGBT-friendly. Even the Arrowverse version of Prometheus was obsessed by Green Arrow to a disturbing degree... Slade Wilson dedicated most of his life post-Lian Yu to get revenge on Oliver Queen, but the mirakuru was messing with his head, and he had hallucinations egging him on and PTSD... ... but Prometheus didn't have those excuses, he was on another level.
@@randallflagg3700 Fair, but even some members of the community can be transphobic (just personally, I've been on a few dates where guys get Really weirded out by the thought of me transitioning further). Still, my philosophy? If you enjoy a character, then you can justify them being supportive of trans folks, or even trans themselves
I will say Professor Pyg’s whole gimmick is breaking out of the binary. He sees humans as imperfect because we are bogged down by gender and characteristics so seeks to create a race of single sex mannequins. As well as this, his bouts of being schizotypical leads him to cross dress and think of himself as female. You could definitely argue he’s bad representation (I would) in a Buffalo Bill kinda way, but there you go. Also honourable mentions is El Flamingo, flamboyant animal who definitely doesn’t consider himself any gender. Anyways wholesome vidyah, nice to see two cool guys talking bout this:)
Trans woman here - this is fucking class. Not too sure what I was expecting, but was massively surprised and pleased by two extremely based dudes. Mostly agree on the tierlist, although I'm not sure about the Joker, but I would give my left arm to hit the club with Ivy, Harley, Selena and Croc. It'd be a great time, and Croc's Hot To Go moves would be LETHAL.
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About that :P
you guys are the UA-cam equivalent of the Strokes. Quality over Quantity.
You guys are absolutely based, and an ally we all wish we had. Immediately subscribed❤️
Please rank the most racist superheroes/villains
more than Doubled in a month! Interesting idea, had to check it out.
I can imagine Two-face just flipping a coin at the start of the day to decide if he's feeling transphobic today.
Hrm. Trans rights, or Trans wrongs? *Flips coins.* Trans wrongs.
nah he flips the coin to assign your gender, even if you're a cis person he doesnt care, only the coin decides
@@AlriikLives Gosh that ain't supposed to be that funny and yet I'm laughing my ass for 20 minutes straight
@@Simply_Bintangheads. its 20 minutes gay.
Coin: *Miraculously stands exactly on edge*
Riddler being a "transvestigator" just makes sense in my head
I have always thought of him as a weird little incel anyway
“Hmmmm it appears that Robin doesn’t have a prominent Adams Apple!” *gets punched *
@@joshuadk13 Hmmm it appears their shoulderd are wide, but the hips are wider! *SLAPS*
Gender me this❓️
Gender me this batman
ventriloquist accepts trans people, scarface yells slurs
@@sunbirth4795 Scarface is based on the classic monster archetype.
Of course he'd be steeped in toxic masculinity.
Absolutely
@@calemr*mobster?
@@stevenwall2010 Yes, thank you.
@@stevenwall2010 **lobster
powerscaling transphobia is crazy
Truly
Idk man a lotta people like Harry Potter
@@Heavy-TF2 the books are kinda good just way to long
@@ERK_hanna They're not long. The average of each book is like 400 pages. You can easily read them in 5 hours or so.
There's a caveat about Joker. Joker will not stand for bigotry *unless he thinks its funny*. Joker doesn't strike me as particularly ableist but he does cripple and mock Barbara Gordon. If he found out one Batman's friends was trans and wanted to hurt his toxic yaoi obsession, he would absolutely torture them in a very brutal and transphobic way, as well as mocking them along the way.
He's evil. He definitely isn't principled enough to restrain from tormenting queer people.
Joker would despise the attack helicopter jokes not because he's pro-trans but because he thinks it's outplayed and no longer funny
I think he also does have standards (not in the moral way where he has some lines he won't cross) but in a professional way. Like he might just see that as a lazy joke and since he thinks super highly of himself he wouldn't perform such low tier comedy
TLDR, if the joke is low-hanging fruit, he'd hate it out of principle of comedy.
Absolutely, I think he would also be the type to mix and match political ideologies if it means getting someone to help him
Lego Batman Joker is omnigay demiboy 100%.
Two face would be like “if the coin says heads I’ll accept your pronouns” lmfao
More than two genders flipping his cryptocoin: doge, you’re a male… but bitcoin… you’re a female
One of his faces is transphobic
And it’s not the one you’d expect
I think he'd be super chill with binary trans people. He'd see it like flipping a coin but with gender. That said, I think nonbinary people would blow his mind so he would try not to think about them.
@@cartoonishidealism582 which one?
I think he'd flip a coin for NB folks and just be ok with plain trans people
Professor Pyg out here giving me the worst top surgery ever 😭
BUT Would they give the worst top as well
@@june9914
Prof. Pyg would give insane top
“Bruh, look at my surgeon, I’m gon die 💀💀💀”
He is gonna give you even bigger boobs just for asking or leave you with the biggest hole in the chest while keeping you alive
Gets scars that look like an X for some reason
the woker be like: why so queerious
God I love this stupid ass brainrot humor. My favorite is probably the one where it's him taking "STUPID" pills saying, "I Must Jonkle!" And the thumbnail of this video is peak too.
Then proceeds to beatbox.
"You wanna know how I got these pronouns?"
-Woker
J-Lest put a Smile on That Face, Darling 😋
“We love in a Cisiety” - The Woker
I love the conclusion of The Riddler being transphobic in the sense that when he says 'I can always tell' he's not saying it to justify excluding anyone from anything, he's saying it because he's just a dick who thinks people with deeper histories are just fun puzzles to solve.
He's still okay with you going to whatever bathroom you want, he just wants you to know he had you figured out.
Riddler is the type to try and "crack" completely cis people's eggs as a puzzle.
@@mikaroni_and_cheezgetting transgenderized by the riddler and totally not falling for it and being confident in your identity and not seeing him again. but like a decade later you’re going to the pharmacy to pick up your hormones. You haven’t thought about it in years, just an awkward step in your awakening that you never think about, but as you walk away the bag they handed you feels a little heavy so you open it up and there’s a stupid little green question mark. You could stop to consider if he somehow tricked you into this, or if he could just tell all along somehow, but you don’t feel like it so you throw it directly in the trash and continue on with your day.
I kind of hate it because I really like the Ridler but I do agree.
@@mikaroni_and_cheezShit wait I do that
the best villains you love because they’re so easy to hate
Two cis guys starting a funny trans video with "you can't be neutral, that's the side of the oppressor" is an amazing way to start. Love it. You just come out swinging.
Also, Clayface has a sort of split off of him that's a young girl who was sort of Robin's love interest for one episode. So something between daughter and self, but she is treated as him in the cartoon.
I think Mad Hatter is a chaser.
I'm just gonna feed the algorithm here and comment whenever a stray thought crosses my mind: On the subject of queer people on the Suicide Squad: Grant Morrison (the writer) was on the Suicide Squad. They died of writer's block.
I will say that while Anarky is supposed to be an Anarchist, he was mostly written as an Objectivist. So it depends on when he was written and by who.
Maxie Zeus when he's crazy and thinks he's Zeus, maybe he'd be accepting, but when he's just a rich billionaire he's definitely a JK Rowling.
I also don't necessarily think he'd be a mythologically accurate. Like he's not becoming Zeus, he's just thinking he's Zeus. And who he thinks Zeus is would probably be transphobic.
Which actually brings up a story from a health care worker training I went to. It was about how you're not there to push back against schizophrenics or anything like that, and how she had a client who thought he was Darth Vader and once said his legs grew out of a silver box, and I'm sitting there thinking "that's not lore accurate!"
@@AspelShuyin until he eats her
Riddler is absolutely transphopic. It's not because he's particularly hateful, it's because he doesn't "get it" and since he considers himself the smartest person in existence, anything he doesn't understand must be stupid and fake. He's definitely leaving reddit comments about how dumb he thinks being trans is.
I mean he's dealt with harder conundrums than gender dysphoria I think he'd be fine with it but mostly be proud that he understands it, like how he'd understand a riddle
He would consider them delusional and therefore stupid
So smart and yet so slow all the same.
Yeah, I can see that. The major irony of Riddler's character is that he himself hates riddles he can't solve.
That said, he ALSO hates leaving a riddle unsolved, so I could see him researching the neuroscience behind transness out of a need to understand, and accepting the data he finds.
...and then he'd start explaining the trans experience to trans people.
@@PotatoPatatoVonSpudsworth lol he becomes the most annoying ally?
Would this make Joker a TIRM
Trans-Inclusive Radical Misogynist
"Oh, you're a woman now? Cool. Make me a sandwich."
~ A Better Way to Hate🎶
DUDES ROCK
JOIN THE WINNING TEAM
Hilarious interpretation of the Joker, I love it
24:21
Trans person: "I'm trans"
Firefly: "No, you're kindling"
Transphobe: "Ha, I'm right!"
Firefly: "No, you're kindling"
🤣
Fun fact about the F slur btw, it just means a bundle of sticks, because a bundle of sticks is used to light fires, and I assume that in the west a few hundred years ago, if people thought you were gay you got burned.
So. I mean. Kindling isn’t too far off?
@@Vivigreeny25 Another fun fact! Fascist is pretty much just the f-slur in Italian!
@@zachariahmerry2396 so calling nick fuentes a fascist is right in both definitions
@@zachariahmerry2396In a way of what it means or in a way of the reaction it gets when someone says it...?
Pyg would be like 'oh you're a woman, yes you will make a beautiful doll' but in a way where like. He thinks you need to get surgery to be 'really' trans.
upon further consideration: thoughts on a headcanon where Pyg is transfem but in denial? The obsession with creating 'perfect' feminine forms could be argued to be redirected personal desires, and Pyg definitely has plenty of trauma that could lead to that kind of denial, in my non-expert opinion.
@@DaughterOfDrakesoh that's fascinating
Transmedicalist Pyg
TRANSMEDICALIST PYG...
@@ceratiidaedalus3709you do not know what transmedicalism is
I will say in the Harley Quinn TV show Riddler is gay and married to Clock King. He is, however, depicted as an asshole gay, so he could be like an LGB alliance type dude.
Oh so James Somerton.
Ew
Riddler in the show Gotham seemed to be developing a queer romance with Penguin, so maybe he's bisexual?
@@jonathonriddle9922The Riddler gives me big Bi vibes for some reason. It might just be a case of "I'm bi and I like him" but he just kinda gives me a feeling
@jonathonriddle9922 i know that there's a billion different iterations of these characters but i believe a valentines day comic from 2022 had the riddler be explicitly bi
Killer croc and bane are most trans accepting (bc killer croc has been called a freak, monster, crime against god, and outcast so he relates to the trans community while bane heavily promotes taking testosterone)
Do you thinking baseball players that juiced in the 90s are more trans accepting than a random person? My wild guess would be no. I don't think steroid taking for performance relates to gender changing. Admittedly, I do not know a single baseball players stance on trans, so that is an unscientific estimate of a subset of competitive males form the late 90s.
@@cheeseburger12 i dont think you can compare a 8ft tall 7ft wide man who broke batman’s spine and is one of the strongest non-metahuman people on the planet to a juicing 90s baseball player
@CoolusGuyus I don't think you can compare people using steroids to get stronger and people thst use steroids to change genders. I do think people that take steroids together stronger at sports have more in common with people that take steroids to get stronger for other reasons then changing gender. Unless you think people that use steroids to change gender have more in common with a 7 foot tall super criminal that tries to kill a giant Bat.
@@CoolusGuyus no but the point still stands that he could easily have a "it's cool when i take horomones but not when trans ppl do it" attitude that a lot of gymbros on juice do
Riiiight.
9:07 clayface actually has some trans moments in the harley quinn show, initially because they actually needed him to transform into a girl, but then he got too much into the character, there he also says he identify as ''fluid'', so himself is technically genderfluid, and there's also a bunch of queer subtext in his btas incarnation
BTAS is kinda gay as hell and it's weird that doesn't get talked about more. Not just the villains either.
What about the like 4 other Clayface?
Also he has a daughter made out of his own body which he initially made to sneak into a private school to get revenge on a play director (until she betrayed him)
@notsmrt4521 katherine karlo, yeah? or was it the other one? he does this at least 3 times, 2 in the comics and one in btas
hes also fluid bc hes clay and theres water in clay harharharhar
Professor Pyg and Hugo Strange wouldn't be transphobic simply because deconstructing humans is their speciality, Professor Pyg would be fascinated by the physical side of transition and Hugo would be fascinated by the psychological side of transition
There should be a row of "Accepts Trans people maliciously" For villains who belive in transexuality but that don't mean they're inherently positive towards it
And I don't believe Bane and Deadshot would be in the kills transphobes row simply because they don't care enough about this sort of stuff, But Mad Hatter tho, He should be in JK Rowling row
Agreed, Scarecrow too. Man would have a field day with body dysphoria. He’d be on board for every wrong reason imaginable.
@@Icedsobaka I'd be willing to argue Mad Hatter doesn't care whether someone is trans or not, dude's just nuts and wants an "Alice" and i don't think he'd be too picky about whether his "Alice" is trans or not
Nah see Strange would see trans people as sick and treat it as a disease.
I disagree completely that they'd be accepting just because they view it as a real medical phenomena. Doctors like those tend to view people with disorders as subhuman lab rats and I have no doubt Strange would be the same
12:17 I will forever bring up the comic panel where Poison Ivy says "Why did you kidnap her? What's your problem with black trans women?" and Black Mask answers "I'm an lgbtqia ally! I just needed the money!" Because that perfectly sums up his character.
Edit: To everyone who asked, It's from Harley Quinn: The Animated Series: Legion of Bats #6 (2023)
Which comic is that I NEED that
OMG, I find It, Black Mask LGBTQIA Ally is Canon!
I need to see this
found it by googling ‘“black mask” “poison ivy” trans’
Thank you for this, that panel was amazing to see
“Batman! I’ve poisoned the water supply with the chemicals that turn the freaking frogs gay!” - idfk, one of those guys, I don’t read comics
Joker
Idk, Poison Ivy? If anyone would have the knowledge to do that, it'd be her
@@samtinkle9076I second this. Gay poison is a very Poison Ivy thing to do.
Hugo could go either way.
He could go Peterson, or he could go purely clinical, mildly irritated, "No, transexuality is a fully recognised part of medical science. That's just how it works." And then start psychoanalysing transphobes in his standard fucked up way.
Not because they're transphobes, mind, he just likes tormenting people psychologically and would see that as an opening.
As long as he doesn't call us "monster men".
Blanchard option
He wouldn't care.
@@killerqueenisbestmanneko8419Yep, Hugo Strange gives full Ray Blanchard/conversation therapist vibes.
@@ChristyAbbey Deep cut, but goes hard.
5:43 i disagree that Gotham itself is more transphobic than your average city, but rather the average criminal is more transphobic and because of the sheer number of them she would need to carry self defense. She's at a higher risk of being attacked because trans people get hate crimed and there's a bunch of terrible criminals in Gotham, and that's why she said what she said
It might also be about being a trans WOMAN in particular. Alot of villains go out of their way to attack women
In the comic that panel is from, Alyshia says that "violence against trans people is on the rise" though it's unclear if she's talking about Gotham specifically or just in general.
@@breezeshooter42yeah honestly it could be just a commentary on the country at large, though I wouldn’t be surprised if Gotham - a city usually representing the worst of the capitalist hellscape - would have higher levels of transphobic violence
I was thinking that it's not even that the average criminal is more likely to be transphobic, but moreso that because Gotham has higher levels of criminal activity (which probably means the population has a higher population of criminals) it's more likely that a transphobic person would also be a criminal. So it's because there's more criminals in the population that leads to more possibilities for hate crimes.
Isnt like gotham posseses by a omega demon of darkseid
So god of evil makes stuff worse-
Joker would 100% break into a transphobs house, force transition them, and then tape mirrors everywhere and leave just to antagonize them
he should tbh. would be pretty funny
At the same time I could also see him do the opposite to a trans person, he just likes causing pain indiscriminately
No he absolutely would
Yeah, but he MIGHT also do that to a trans person. The target doesn't really matter so long as he thinks it's funny.
Yes he would, but not because he particularly hates transphobes or particularly cares about trans people, but because he knows that would be torturous. He would probably do something just as tortuous to a trans person based on their transness.
For some reason I feel like the riddler ONLY respects neopronouns.
oh my god 😭 you’re onto something
picturing him approaching a cis man who uses only he/him and immediately referring to him using xe/xem pronouns. S tier guy type of guy honestly
I think Joker is in the kills transphobes tier not because he in any way cares about trans people, but just because they're such good targets to mess with. Uptight and stubborn, obsessed with things like appearances, rules, and expectations.
joker looks for chaos, anyone who looks for a reality of sameness is some that he wants to mess with. personally i dont agree with the methods but i understand.
I don't understand the rules part
Who let the bro cook?
That … actually applies to a ton of cis “allies” LMAO
Joker would kidnap and force trans transphobes
This video gives very big "Discord call me and my friends would make at 2 am" vibes and I love it
The Deadshot minset being "transphobia hurts my friends and I have a gun 🤷🏾♂️" is so goddamned funny
Deadshot is such a great character. Particularly Deadshot as played by Idris Elba in The Suicide Squad. He barely even reads as a bad guy to me.
@@hannahfanning9585idk if you're joking but Idris plays Bloodsport in that movie... Will Smith is the one who played Deadshot
@@MarcyRavenManjiI'm gonna take a leap and say they probably meant it as some weird meta joke on how they couldn't get will Smith back and had to hire a (better) actor who was also black to practically basically play the same character for THE suicide squad
@postaldude9779 That's a real 4D chess move...
Bane is very much an ally, he’s close friends with Ragdoll who is non-binary.
In Arkham Asylum:A serious house on serious earth.
It’s explained the Joker wakes up everyday and creates his personality. It’s why he can go from laughing fish to blowing up hospitals.
So the Joker would just wake up and figure out if he’s transphobic or not.
Ah, "Super Sanity". I love that concept. Keeps us from having three Jokers.
@@AlriikLives It works so well with the multiple choice backstory idea. The Joker vaguely knows who he is but hes so physically and mentally damaged hes basically a living John Doe
As a trans woman, I think we may have found the most based cis dudes of all time
True allies
Yeah! :D
Yes! I think we have!
protect them at all costs.
Agreed, I clicked on this expecting trans people of some kind
The Mad Hatter in some versions also kidnaps men to turn them into "his Alice", so I think he might accept trans people.
In the Arkham games tons of moments imply he views Batman. As his Alice
Forcefem Mad Hatter?????
@@mell7249 And it's definitely his hypnosis' fault that I do crossdressing with the Alice in Wonderland theme, just his fault.
The Mad Hatter’s view on gender roles is _absolutely_ something that depends on the continuity. Arkham gameverse Jarvis Tetch would think gender is fluid, in so much as he’ll make anyone who fits the physical characteristics “his Alice”, but classic DCAU Jarvis would would *absolutely not accept* any person assigned female he fancies coming out as a man.
The Mad Hatter is definitely a chaser.
The only item I disagree with on this list is poison ivy. Love her, but with how much she despises men, I feel like she could fall into the biological essentialist view point very easily and think like, 'once a man always a man' or some bs like that.
I guess it also depends on the version. Poison ivy from the Harley Quinn animated series def would go killing transphones as a fun date with Harley. But other, more villainous versions of her wouldnt care because she hates all of humanity, or actively despsise trans people.
Well if she hates humanity, yes sure. But i think she's smart enough to know that what's between your legs doesn't dictate your gender i.e. what your personality is.
I slightly disagree (though I do see where you're coming from) since modern versions of Poison Ivy are characterized less as hating men and more just hating humanity in general (except for Harley of course), so I don't think Ivy would discriminate against trans men specifically even at her most villainous. IMO, for her, transphobia would be like deciding to discriminate between different genders of ants - i.e., utterly pointless.
@@halfmettlealchemist8076like the op said, depends the version, she can go from killing indiscriminately any person, to just killing men and forgiving women (and all kids I guess) but I feel either way she likely fall into hypocritical territory since I see her as jumping from mindset depending her moods and how much she is connect with nature that day
@@halfmettlealchemist8076 that is fair! I don't really read that many comics so my only exposure to modern versions of her is the Harley Quinn animated series.
Uma Therman's Poison Ivy gives big TERF vibes. Modern Poison Ivy like in THQS would be an ally.
“Why so conservative?” - The Woker
It's not often you watch a video that's "two cis guys ranting about politics on the internet" and they're just completely based. It rules
I thought one of them was trans for a lot of the video 😂
The 'kill transphobes' roster is so funny, imagine if that group had to hang out with each other. Half of them have personal beef with the Joker. Also, I will say that the Talia Al Ghoul and Batman conception of Damian is pretty widely considered as a racist retcon that came out of nowhere for Talia's character and is basically character assassination. At no point was she set up to be a character that would do something like that, and it took away all of her complexity to just demonize her. She would probably still fall under "doesn't accept trans people" but more so because of her environment, and I feel she's one of those cases that could change her mind as she grows
@@gaminganimators7000 the first one, as far as I know people don't have as big a problem with the second one
Wait, racist? I'm confused
Thank you! I was waiting to see someone point this out. Though I don’t think there is any evidence the Al Ghuls are all that bigoted, except against the human race as a whole.
Tbh (before Grant Morissons racism) I think the only reason she shouldn’t be ranked at “kills transphobes” is because she doesn’t kill as a principle.
@@KingOfDarknessAndEvil there’s a whole trope about Asian women forcing themselves onto white men, specifically to have their baby. Highly uncomfortable, fetishizing, racist and sexist. Especially since that isn’t how it originally was for Bruce and Talia.
Also doesn’t help that they did that A SECOND TIME with Ra’s getting his cousin or something along those lines to nearly r@pe Tim.
I THINK THE MAD HATTER IS A CHASER LMAO
oh my fucking god you're probably right. I bet he'd literally forcefem people to turn them into his "alices" or whatever.
Lmfaooooo
@@carnivallegf
If I recall correctly, I think he did-
@@purplepedantry In Arkham Knight there's a riddler story where he does that lol.
As a HUGE Scarecrow fan, I gotta agree with y'all and I wanna provide some more context. This is because Scarecrow, or Jonathan Crane, was bullied as a child for his appearance. In BTAS, he is also shown showing genuine care for Harley, so he and Harley are friends. He's also very educated and is a psychologist. I feel like he'd be like "I don't know anything about trans people, but do tell me what's up with them" and then Harley would explain to him the whole intricacies of being trans and he'd be like "okay, cool," because he doesn't like seeing other people being abused or bullied.
It also depends on the continuity, but I think most versions of him wouldn't be transphobic for sure.
I LOVE THIS COMMENT. That's such a cool way to think about thatttttt.
hell yes-Scarecrow is all about disturbing the comfortable (read: bullies)
and, like many horror fans, using camp to enact vengeance
Haha no he would trap me in a dysphoria inducing illusion
He likes fear so He likes making trans people miserable.
The thing is Riddler also reads as kinda autistic coded to me, and autistic people as a demographic are statistically more likely accept trans people.
I don't disagree with you guys completely tho, I can totally see him as a bioessentialist "LGB without the T" type, but I also think he can change if given the chance.
Like, he'll probably get very defensive and annoying about it if you try to convince him, but if you let him figure out the "gender puzzle" on his own he could end up in the "accepts" tier. Not "kills transphobes" tho, he's too self centered for that.
Yeah I could see that. I think we were mostly thinking of Paul Dani's Riddler, who is more than a little Qanon-coded
I could see that. Personally though, I see him as the sort of guy to not "get it" and be hateful because if he doesn't understand something, it must be dumb. Likd he probably wouldn't kill trans people or target them, but he would definitely try to debate them about their identity. Maybe leave some kinda sus reddit comments.
As an autistic person who is hyperfocused on the Riddler, yes, I completely agree
Get him thinking about how certain things are entirely abstract, and then ask him if he thinks gender is abstract, don't bring up the answer immediately because you want him to feel smarter for "figuring it out" so just point him in the direction and then he'll be like "ITS CLEAR! GENDER IS LITERALLY A SOCIALLY APPLIED CONCEPT! I'M A GENIUS!!"
@@mutantmuseum oh yeah, that Riddler is just straight up an incel. He's transphobic for sure
Batman is canonically a registered Democrat and supports trans rights and actually paid for Victoria October (a trans scientist helping him cure Clayface in DC Rebirth) he paid for her gender reassignment surgery and sent her a congratulations card. He also accepted Tim Drake Robin when he came out as bisexual. Like y’all said the Justice League has diverse ppl on it he’s used to working with so Batman is definitely not transphobic
Batman cannot stop getting more based
yippee!!
I feel like Bruce Wayne would donate to the Trevor Project.
As a marvel fan, I need to invest in DC after reading this.
I feel like the Joker has RuPaul energy. He thinks of himself as an ally, but throws around the t-slur
Fun fact Batman canonically not transpobic.
Ofc not, it's Batman. He's like the best ally you could ask for.
I thought that was the assumption...?
He's one of the most selfless guys you could ask for.
Batman is such a good person, one of my favorite characters, I love him
I would have been more surprised if he WASN'T
That seems obvious. When Tim came out to him, he told him that he just wants his son to be happy. No big reaction. Just "are you happy with who you are? Yes? Good, b/c that's all I've ever wanted for you"
there's a case to be made with Ras Al Ghul that he would be accepting having come across the numerous queer identities present in the ancient world. modern conservatives want people to think normative "family values" have been consistent throughout history.
This is a good point. Ra's sort of hates humanity as a whole, I don't think he would really target any one group in particular. Living for as long as he has certainly put Ra's into contact with plenty of people from all sorts of backgrounds, orientations, cultures, etc, and he's watched them all change with time, developing his own sense of things over the course of many lifetimes. He's had a long time to come to terms with things. The guy's pretty much seen everything, and living in a world where crazy sh*t happens every other week, I feel like he'd treat the subject as no big thing. Also, considering just how intelligent Ra's is, I think he'd know better.
Ra's out there living for more than half a millennia, training with or fighting all sorts of people. Knowledge of your enemies and allies is your biggest weapon.
Imo Ras Al Ghul would be like a grandpa who is an ally. Like sure he tries to respect you but can sometimes be accidentally transphobic/confusing because he would use older terms from accient greece or someshit when talking about you to someone else.
This is a very important point.
Idk, 'cause isn't there times where Talia asked "Why can't I just become your successor since I'm obviously your favorite?" and Ra's response was "Cause you're a woman and women can't lead"? Would trans-friendly Ra's change his mind if Talia became Talio and let him become his successor?
Joker is the only one who gets away with "I treat everyone the same"
Men, women, children, everything in between, it doesn’t matter to him, if you live, you’re the perfect toy
I feel like Scarecrow, depending on the version, would be in an odd place he accepts trans people, and while he doesn't kill transphobes he's definitely going to kidnap them and experiment on them. Not because he's enraged at the bigotry, but there's a common theory that a lot of bigotry, including homophobia/transphobia, is rooted in fear that turns into hatred. I can see him wanting to experiment with the idea and understand it.
Then in some versions, I remember him being made fun of for his appearance being very thin and like a scarecrow while in school. Then also there's the thing where he in some versions worked at Arkham Asylum as a paychologist and others Gotham University as a professor of psychology. I can imagine the versions of him that works as a professor being leagues more upset at one of his students bullying another student for being trans than a version of him as a psychologist seeing transphobia, solely because of his school years.
My rating is "Accepts trans people, weirdly fascinated with the psychology of transphobia".
Then again I may be biased as a trans person who is OBSESSED with Scarecrow so-
As a big Scarecrow fan and LG>B
no no ur so right
okay scarecrow targeting homo/trans/queerPHOBES is genius, he makes them hallucinate their kids coming out to them 😂
Yeah Croc would definitely kill transphobes. Waylon is always looking out for the marginalized and underprivileged people of Gotham. He was also Roy Harper’s AA sponsor. I love him so much. I hate when writers just use him as a big guy to be an obstacle for a hero.
YES! Lore-backed analysis, I love it.
He has also had his pairing with Baby Doll, who had her whole story with dysphoria. And cheated on her.
@@DuskyPredator Animated series only tho
The mentioned story of him and Swamp Thing is great also. He doesn't even want to be a criminal most of the time, he's just poor, which is honestly sad.
About Tahlia al Ghul, originally it was consensual but then it was changed in the Morrison run which was wrote her incredibly out of character and was probably just racism. In the New 52 her and Batman had Damian consensually, so the r*pe got retconned. Morrision's Tahlia was portrayed really racist and misogynistically so not great at all. She is a super interesting character so it sucks how her best characterisation is ignored over a retconned version that is literally just a racist stereotype
THANK U. ive been looking for a comment like this. i love talia! batman son of the demon is like my favorite comic ever
UserID checks out
That's very interesting. The daterape of Batman has always been my point of reference for the character other than her relation to her father and her relationship with Batman. Honestly we should just have disclaimer on Morrison comics that no matter how good they are, the interpretations of the characters are batshit for no reason. See : Magneto in New X-Men.
That really bums me that either character got saddled with unnecessary rape, especially Bane since I am attached to that character. But to your point, I think its very telling that I've known about Tallia's rape in Morrison for about a decade while I've just heard about Bane's rape right now
I think a telling problem with this confusion is that neither Talia or Ra's has had any memorable stories to the point that Grant Morisson's oopsie is the only thing people remember about her. When was the last time a story with Ra's was relevant to the casual audience? Batman Begins? Talia's had it worse.
@@leithaziz2716 Yeah true. Like Ra and Tahlia had a few episodes in BTAS but way less than most of Batman's other notable rouges which sucks. They're both really interesting characters too
26:20 Very apt analysis there! There’s a quite prominent comic panel from Whatever Happened to The Caped Crusader where Joker refuses to kill someone because it wouldn’t be funny.
(Also, he’s a natural born comedian, picking on trans people is hack comedy)
Also 50:22 the idea was that it didn’t really work. They made him decide his every action by drawing from a tarot deck and it lead to him being unable to make a single decision because there were like 60 options at once.
Joker complains about attack helicopter jokes not because he hates that they are transphobic as his care for other people is about zero he just hates how overdone they are.
Transphobes use the same cookie cutter jokes with no build up and basically the exact same punchline while wearing different colored gloves and I think that would be the most likely part to actually anger him.
I feel like Joker is merely just accepting in the way he is indifferent to most people’s lives and what they identify as, he just ends up hating transphobes because of comedy based spite and it makes him look like a much bigger ally
On a similar note, Joker would hate comedians who complain about how “PC/wokeness is killing comedy” because those people are hacks who can’t come up with anything original. Plus, he knows that political correctness isn’t killing comedians - _he’s_ killing comedians, because he kills everybody lol
@@beywheelzhater8930 I think he would like trans people on principle the same way John Waters does. We are naturally subversive just by being ourselves. We are punks down to the very synapses of our brains. We can make any side of the political spectrum uncomfortable.
Joker loves himself some shifting paradigms
@@halfmettlealchemist8076Joker would hate people who make bigoted jokes, not because they're bigoted, but because they're just not that funny. If there was a bigoted commedian who was actually funny, he'd have no issue with them.
So I'm a trans woman, and before I inevitably end up ranting about transphobia, I just wanted to say how wonderful this video is
I feel you, sis. I'm not trans myself (still figuring out) but the amount of transphobia in the area where I live is absurd. Like, nobody takes trans folks seriously and most people here make them to freaks and if you try and tell them it's wrong they'll call you 'soft or woke' basically. It's a sad world, really, but I agree this video is real good
Personally I don't care about it
If someone's transphobic they can say it to my face
I'm a femboy at heart and I usually identify as a women, my friends use he/they as my pronouns but I'm completely fine with it because it's confusing when someone just switches pronouns suddenly, I myself suck at remembering people's pronouns
But theyre still respectful about my identity
Most people I hang around are usually chill about it, I'll tell people that I am trans and if it makes them uncomfortable to call me by my feminine name (I legally got a name change) or calling me a girl then that's fine and all so long as their respectful about it
I've seen a few fully transphobic people and really they aren't even transphobic, they're just assholes to everyone in general
But the actual "transphobic" people I know more or less just get uncomfortable treating me as a girl but they're still very respectful about it and that I can appreciate
Being transphobic isn't necessarily bad as long as you're respectful, if using someone's pronouns makes you uncomfortable then that doesn't make you a bad person as long as you dont go out of your way to harass them or purposely misgender them
Personally I don't see any transphobia, I just see respect and disrespect
@@thechargedfoxie456yt2you’re lucky. As a trans person I have people threaten me with violence if I go out in public…existing. So many people view me with straight up disgust and harass me and my friends. In good parts of the world, I believe your story to be true. But there are many people who live like me, in fear. I hope that changes
I think it's worth noting that Hush was a surgeon at one point and has shown to at least have a passing ability to perform cosmetic surgery, so it's entirely possible he performed gender reassignment surgeries on people.
Hush is also massively racist, misogynist, and hates poor people tho so I’m like 95% sure he’d be JK-Rowling levels of transphobic
Hush's ability to perform cosmetic surgery isn't just "passing" it's "make someone look EXACTLY LIKE someone else at his whim", comic-logic absurd levels of perfect cosmic surgery. You ABSOLUTELY want him to do your gender reassignment surgery if at all possible, at least the facial feminization/masculization surgery.
On clayface the BTAS version was written queer (subtextually, f those censors) and was supposed to in a relationship with his friend in the episode
yep, the producers confirmed Matt Hagan (BTAS Clayface) was canonically gay, and specifically included a scene of Matt’s boyfriend standing outside a hospital, not allowed to go in to see Matt, as a critique of 80s/90s hospitals who determined gay relationships “weren’t real family” and therefore gay people couldn’t see hurt loved ones due to restricted patient visitation.
@@tabbingphafner3681that scene was heartbreaking
Fun fact: the first time Jason Todd ever killed someone he pushed a rapist/abuser off a building back when he was Robin
which comic was this?
@vildastensson1189 batman issue 424 "diplomat's son"
Didn’t even realize this video was an hour long because y’all’s conversations kept my attention so well.
REAL QUICK Talia s/a ing bruce is a horrid and racist retcon because grant Morrison didn’t do their homework.
Morrison also wrote Serious House, iirc, which is CONSTANT s/a references
Grant Morrison straight up admitted on record that they didn't re-read Talia's OG intro, & completely misremembered that Talia & Bruce were married & had Damien through mutual consent. Like...I'm sorry...how do you mess up so bad?? Agreed, Talia's portrayal is hella racist & misogynist. Also, notice that fans also often use her specifically as a scapegoat too, but they still have respect for villans like Joker, Zsasz, & even R'as al Ghul.
Couple Poison Ivy things:
When people tried to claim Ivy as a terf on twit twitter, legendary comic writer Gail Simone as someone who has written Ivy made it clear that not only is Ivy not a terf, she would defend trans women. And in fact, I'm pretty sure she does kill if not just fight off people harassing trans women in a recent comic
Ivy also is known to be very "fuck all men" but that's not inherently exclusionary or bioessentialist. When Ivy says she hates men she is including trans women as her sisters, because she correctly views us as women (and identifying trans men as men even if she says fuck em, sorry guys)
Nah Ivy would def exclude trans men from her misandry and prob cis gay guys too
soooooo
positive transphobia?
@@autismobinch135i wouldnt call excluding trans men from “i hate men” transphobic, queer men in general are usually excluded from that for a lot of people
@@autismobinch135not really if what the writer said is true then trans men would absolutely be on the chopping block and gay men would also be on the chopping block
@@autismobinch135I mean she also canonically makes exceptions for some cis men so I don't think she would blanket exclude all trans men from her hate list but more likely just go in assuming they'd be less complete assholes (which is how she expects most interacts with men to go). It's usually portrayed somewhat nuanced rather than a blanket, kneejerk hatred of men. She's been mistreated and harassed for so long she just can't put up with it anymore and feels detached from most of humanity (just weighted more towards men)
Ivy isnt exactly transphobic just sexist
Like say she saw a girl wanting to be a guy
She'd say "why though? They suck"
But if she saw for example; a femboy or a guy who wants to identify as a woman
She'd say "you f*ckin go girl!"
Definitely supports trans since she shares many of Harley's beliefs and they've even dated in multiple series, but she just hates men and would try to stop women from identifying as men by telling them that men suck
Like she'd support them and say "you don't have to be a guy, you should be comfortable in your own body" but on the opposite end she'd welcome guys becoming female
"I don't see batman as that sort of guy." I love how in the 80s run of JL comics, Bruce deadass just decks a guy for being racist
"My pronouns are He/Him but with capital H's." is an incredible line, holy shit.
the fact that killer moth is not on this tier list is a crime
@@A_Shrubbery1901 That’s because the answer would be too easy.
Killer Moth goes in both the JK Rowling and Kills Transphobes tier. Like, he is fabulous, but he hates anyone enjoying life.
IIRC the same issue with the “trans flag baseball bat” panel has that same trans woman (Barbara Gordon’s best friend) get into a fight with Killer Moth, but Moth has no actual issue with her being trans and is only fighting her bc she’s in his way when he’s trying to fight Barbara as Batgirl. So I think Moth is in the “uses trans people’s preferred pronouns while he’s mugging them for their wallets” tier
Classic killer moth W
More like Killer GOAT
I think that Two-Face would definitely be transphobic, since he's obsessed with binaries.
He'd be fine with someone being trans-male or female, but he would deny the existence of non-binary people.
I could see him shouting about "Male or Female! The coin only has two sides!"
And then in the end, when he gets punched in the face, he drops his coin and it lands in a crack between some tiles so it's on it's edge.
its a coin toss really
"Pick a side" type mf
Lmfao two-face would accept binary trans people but his transphobia would be appaling with NBs
Sure, but that's a bit over-simplistic. Like, that's the most arch version of the character, but any real characterization goes way beyond "I like anything when it's two."
Two-Face does struggle with a kind of mental dysphoria (in some versions split personalities like Ventriloquist) in that he feels there are two fragmented sides to himself and he has trouble landing on which one is real or how to synthesize them. In both comics and some shows, he's even developed third personalities. He also struggles with body images issues often.
On the basis of saying you think Batman is accepting of trans folks and he generally lends support to politicians whose values he truly believes in, it also suggests Harvey Dent was probably not transphobic (Dent was also very concerned about police corruption and investigating police, woke)
Poison Ivy also is a botanist, and knows that sex isn't binary, much less gender.
Nah, Maxie Zeus would go: "Can I fuck it?" because he's so much into Zeus RP.
Wasn’t there a minor Greek and/or Roman Diety who is explicitly both male and female? Greek/Roman Gods are more gender nonconforming than most people give them credit for, they weren’t _just_ known for polyamory and being M/M gay relationship accepting (as long as you’re on top, their masculine culture thinks being a bottom is the most shameful thing a man could be).
Maxie, as a Greek roleplayer, is super inclusive. Sad thing is, he's into Pederasty.
I'm reminded of a moment on one of the old Sleepycasts where they're making fun of Cory for being a degenerate coomer (justified) and they ask him if he'd bone a donkey, and he immediately asks "I dunno, is it hot?"
Decided to make a Batman Beyond Villain Transphobia Tier List:
JK Rowling tier:
• Blight
• Shreik
• Cynthia
Doesn’t Accept Trans People Tier:
• Spellbinder
• Bigtime
Accepts Trans People Tier:
• Patrick the Rat Boy
• Wily Watt (Golem’s Host)
• The Terrific Trio
• Armory
Kills Transphobes Tier:
• Inqe
• Curare
• Mad Stan
• Payback
What about Curare?
@ She’s on the list, check again
@@felixmckinney7132 oh, I missed her, and I agree with that she definitely kills transphobes, same with Inque
The Jokerz would be like half accepting half not imo
I don’t necessarily disagree, but I am curious, what are your reasons for Shriek being JK Rowling? Because I could definitely see him being transphobic, but idk if he’d care that much.
As for Patrick the Rat Boy, he does kinda seem to feel uncomfortable in his body, but he’s also really weird and creepy towards women. I feel like he could end up feeling “tricked” if he kidnapped a trans woman or a trans man, honestly. He maybe wouldn’t mind nonbinary people too much I guess.
Finally, allow me to add my thoughts on an unmentioned group of villains. The Royal Flush Gang is transphobic and homophobic, except for Ten, who’s an ally
10:05 in the comics he has canonically (said it in the main universe, and it hasnt been retconned) come out as sapio-sexual (sexually attracted to smart people)
I like how I didn’t even need to check to know who you meant
Riddler regularly browses 4chan and Reddit
Trans woman: I feel like I'm trapped in a man's body
Zsasz: I agree
I feel like Joker truly views every person in the world of all walks of life as equally murder-able. Like he doesn’t hate any specific group because he just does not care
Can't believe I'm doing this- but in defense of the Mad Hatter, I think he is *misandrist* and not transphobic. He dislikes men. His best friend (March Harriet) is literally a lesbian who had her lover killed and he helps her get revenge. He never romantically pursues or brainwashes her, they are strictly platonic friends.
Most fans also pretty much strongly dislike the "Mad Hatter is a p*do" that was introduced in some of the comics because it's edgy, in-poor-taste nonsense.
Ngl i really feel like mad hatter would be jk rowling teir like even if he would mostly be tranphobic towards transmen i still think that would be MORE than enough to get into jk rowling teir
Mad hatter imposter however would be trans accepting
Honestly viewing people as objects is the reason we’re in this mess to begin with so I believe it. Like JKR is also vibing on this wavelength
Joker surrounds himself with what society deems to be "freaks and weirdos" so in a transphobic society, he would 100% accept them.
I think I would go as far to say that batman himself is woke, his main principle is rehabilitation over incarceration and hes ride or die for that principle
I think joker would put estrogen in the water as a joke "haha get hormonal"
Hey, thanks guys.
This was a hillarious watch.
As a trans person myself I have sometimes mused over what such nerdy topics before. Great fun.
Also I distinctly remeber reading a german non licensed batgirl comic i got at my local dingy comic shop.
It was bound and printed in an odd way and like 250 pages long. I think it was authored by one of the owners friends. It was wiiiiild.
But I really liked it and the protagonist was a teenage boy who would dress up as batgirl and later was turned into a girl and so and so forth.
Didnt realized it at the time but that was probably the first trans story i evet read.
I hope i have it still somewhere.
Scarecrow would love scaring transphobes.
BOO! TRANS PEOPLE!!! YOU NOW HAVE THE OPPOSITE GENITALS!!! WASHAHGAHAHAHHAHAH
If Scarecow ever used his fear gas on JK Rowling, she'd see trans people being treated nicely.
He'd scare both probably.
scarephobe
@@YuotiKinto he would. But many version of Scarecrow have expressed the feeling of feeling vindicated when he hurt assholes. He also hate hateful religious people so... Trans people is just for regular 'curious' about people's fears while attacking phobes with fear gaz is a 'had it coming moment' for him.
2 face would accept mtf and ftm transgenderism because it fits his binary, potentially even being in favor of it, but nonbinary throws him off and upsets him
hed flip a coin each time he has to refer to a nb person with pronouns
@@snartboy5000 Heads, you're a he. Tails, you're a she.
OR he might be More OK with non-binary, as he himself is sometimes a 'we' so dealing with they/them
I only know a few batman villains, since i'm not that deep in the matter, but if I had to guess, clayface would be an ally, cause he can relate to gender dysphoria, what with what his body has going on, riddler would not care, cause his entire shtick is kinda far away from the whole topic and penguin would be a bigot, just cause he's a complete kook. Looking forward to see how accurate that is lol
Also that speech at the beginning is incredibly based. Can't wait for republicans to get exactly what they voted for
The Iceberg Lounge, however, would _totally_ have themed weekends and rotating specials for the entire month of June. The Penguin would use that as a "gotcha" against any accusations of transphobia, but really it's just because he can recognize a potential revenue boost when he sees one. Regardless of his own prejudice, he knows for a fact that they/them dollars spend just as well.
@@lalas181 Ah.. So Disney
@@dillydraws you're both so real lmao
@@lalas181 so basically that means penguin b like any corpo on pride month, claims to support the queers and even sells merch on pride month bc *Mr krabs voice* money but in this case he’s just do something special for that occasion in the lounge (he’d probably sell merch and hire drag queens for entertainment for that one month idk). But once July hits he takes down all the rainbows and goes “back to hell ya go u stupid fruit” and then just waits for pride month to come by again to start his “support” all over again
Considering Mad Hatter is a sex pest, I could see him being like a chaser but I don't know where that would fit in this list
He's the one producing those sissy hypno vids
i can’t believe Batthem and Harley Queer teamed up against The Woker and The LGBeast. it was especially epic when Harley Queer looked over at Pronoun Ivy and said, “i am feeling extra *homosexual* today, do you want to *kiss* ???”
this got a chuckle out of me
I want fan art of this interaction
Prometheus hates cops so I feel like he’d hate transphobes
Agreed
Right, but like all of these guys hate cops, lol. I see what you're saying though.
Hey! That’s me! A trans person who knows all these characters! I feel so seen…
There is a thing where being a victim doesn't automatically make you a good person. There is a comics Maus about that, although it's about a holocaust and it's survivors. I'm mentioning it here because Croc doesn't neceserrily has to be trans supportive just because he has problems with his body.
That's too much of a nuanced take for certain people's brains to understand
The nuance of whether the crocodile man chooses to eat people equally or not (fr tho that's a very interesting concept. But like, aren't many Batman villains like this already? Ostracized to the point of having almost no empathy or having empathy limited to only a few people)
True, but I don’t see any reason Croc *would* be transphobic.
He has, however, been shown to be a very accepting person who looks out for the marginalized people of Gotham & was Roy Harper's AA sponsor
Yes. I agree with your analysis.
I would put Croc 'kills transphobs' because: he is Roy Harper's (Arsenal) AA sponsor, good friends with Jason Todd (red hood) , lived in a classic old-school circus part of the freaks and geeks, is canonically friends with young children and homeless in Gotham, and the marginalized.
19:40 bruce is a very progressive man, he uses his money for a lot of social stuff, and works to fight a lot of global issues
Hush would be the oli london type of transphobe. Ie obssessed with someone(for hush it's bruce wayne for oli it was kpop idols) enough massively change their physical appearance then when they get called out for how weird that is they turn it into a anti trans thing to seem more "normal".
I love the unhinged thumbnail
Professor Pyg should be in the "doesn't accept" category, because he doesn't care about people's feelings.
The Dollotrons are created from people he perceives to have no physical flaws, who he kidnaps and forcefully removes all feeling, making them "perfect". People *with* physical flaws, however, he murders because they'll never be perfect (that's how he gets caught, he leaves a trail of victims with bone deformities and other physical ailments or uniquities).
It should be said that the Dollotrons are genderless, but it's because they have no feelings. Pyg's "perfection" removes all discernable traits.
I would've put Firefly in JK rowling since in Batgirl Year One, the only place I know any real backstory from him, his motivation is literally to see a beautiful woman on fire. His view of women, in that iteration at least, seemed misogynistic. I'll update the comment if i have future thoughts.
Edit: nah no more notes.
Nah personally I just think stuff he kind gets interested into he mentally wants to connect it with fire, in other appearances he also set fire to a zoo and an amusement park because is where places he wished to go when he was. A kid, but he doesn't see it as destroying what he couldn't have but more as in mixing the psycho pyro desire with the experience
If Firefly is a misogynist then he should also be trans-accepting.
@@rorschach1848 How??
As another comment said, he usually burns what he likes or wants. He doesn't burn them simply because they are women, but because according to his disorder that is not bad.
Fun fact: there was a trans woman in doom patrol in the 90s, I think. Coagula. She was written by a trans woman who picked up the book immediately after Grant Morrison. Oh, and of course there's Rebis who is...non binary in a complicated way.
Rachel Pollack! I read one of her scifi novels a while ago
30:37 why do I feel like the mad hatter would accept trans women but not trans men simply because that gives him more victims to prey on?
would he be a chaser??
Is he Lou Reed??
canonically hes turned men into women to be his alice so uh yeah he would forcefully transition trans-men AND cis men.
@gintygaz493 100%
@@Mother_of_all_Badussies WDYM did lou reed dont accept transmen or are u straight up just calling him a chaser?
This was absolutly pointless and had no greater effect on the wider dc universe. I loved every second of it and honestly every choice made me laugh harder and harder. I just imagine someone trying to cancel one of these guys and gals on twitter. And they just go “…. This is what you have a problem with? Not the murder or terroism or crimes against humanity… but this… huh” then they just thwack them or shoot them. Funnesit shit ever
Joker would get all giddy if someone got mad at him for being trans accepting over the murder specifically because he would find the situation hilarious. He interacts with transphobes specifically for the unintentional comedy, although that joy tends to quickly fade as they begin to once again cycle through the same handful of jokes about attack helicopters and neo pronouns. He doesn’t even really care about trans people that much, he is an ally in the sense that he will shrug and accept these kinds of things without a second thought because it is none of his business, he just ends up having actual strong feelings against transphobes for being bad at comedy
I feel like Joker saying “bored now” is something a number of people have heard before dying
@@beywheelzhater8930Batman is trans??
Fun fact it’s cannon in the live action dc universe that Harley voted for Bernie
I feel like Hush belongs in JK Rowling tier solely cuz of how massively bigoted he canonically is and how he’s generally written to be as reprehensible as possible.
Also also for similar reasons as the Court being JK Rowling tier
I am shocked that this channel only has 2,200 subscribers. This was entertaining to listen to.
Before this video we had like twenty.
@ Well damn, you made a banger!
The thing that bothers me is that a trans person, especially a trans woman, would make an amazing supervillain cause she has the basic supervillain backstory and motivation of burning down the society that mistreated her by default. But the format of a superhero comic would just mean she'd be defeated with no meaningful change to the system.
antihero
@@GoblinCorn69i honestly love the idea of a trans-person just so enraged they snap one day and do good things with the wrong methods. like red hood with extra steps
Magneto
Batman :
*Punches her into prison*
*Does the impossible to make it so she goes in the women's prison with free hrt and therapy*
*Exposes the CEO of transphobia as a war criminal*
*Goes to publicly and financially support a trans rights association as Bruce Wayne the next day*
The MCU in general
Feel like there should be a chaser tier
Haha who do you think would go in there?
Riddler would definitely go in there
Penguin too
Poison ivy aswell
Two face also because of his obsession with duality
I just imagined the following Joker esque scenario:
- Joker “AHA Batsy it’s good to see you again”
- Batman “Save it Joker, release the hostages”
- J “Oooh~ not so fast, that’s really up for YOU to decide”
- B (Brooding noises)
- J “ON YOUR LEFT you will see a straight white cis man!”
- B “What?”
- J “AND ON YOUR RIGHT a black lesbian trans woman!”
- B “Uhh”
- J “AND THEY ARE BOTH SUSPENDED ABOVE A VAT OF ACID *maniacal laughter*”
- B “You’ve done this trick before, I just save both.”
- J “I haven’t shown you the best part yet! Your actions are on video broadcast to the entirety of Gotham city! I have made sure that this time you CAN only save one, and no matter who you save you’ll make some of Gotham city lose hope in the BATMAN, causing havoc on the streets.
-B “Gotham has enough sense to not-“
- J “CHECK THE NEWS LATELY!? People want a reason to go to war with each other, and this might just be the spark to do it!” So the choice is yours! Is Batman WOKE or BASED! Make your choice, and let Gotham burn in the ashes!”
Is Batman woke or based! sounds like a j jonah jameson article title and the funniest shit ever
Peter - H-hey boss I just got these new-
Jameson - Gimme
P- … pictures.
J- Parker these suck you’re fired
P- Wait wait, uhhh here’s one where he saves a black guy! Shows some divers-
J- Peter, you’re unfired I need you to get more of these
P- I can’t just-
J- I can see it now; is Spider-Man Woke or Based
P- What does that-
J- Don’t matter don’t care, ship it!
P- But-
J- Parker get me some coffee and then more pictures of him saving minorities
P-… Sure… sir
@@nicholaspearce2250 Except JJJ is an ally to all marginalised people (just not Spider-Man)
Fucking. Awesome. 💀
Dude, you rule!
I imagine this to be a podcast recorded by two gothamites fresh out of, or just about to go in to college. And therefore I will take everything started in this video to be absolutely canon.
My take on Two-Face is that he doesn't accept trans people, but he DOES accept two-spirit people
'Neutrality takes the side of the oppressor' BASED TAKE
BASED VIDEO WE LOVE TO SEE IT!!!
17:37 also Jericho’s actor in the Titans show , Chella mann, is a trans guy
That would have been great to know before we made the video lmao
You're telling me Man is a man?
@@BougGroug it was in his destiny, the gender at his birth was just an obstacle
I guess you wouldn't be aware of that if you didn't read Midnighter's runs (you should), but Prometheus is is clearly LGBT and wouldn't be transphobe. Dude had sex and got into a relationship with Midnighter to get as close to him as possible in a long-term plan that involved killing him. Aaaand he was on a "sexy rogues" cover for the DC PRIDE #1 comic book, shirtless alongside Savant, Creote, the Brain and Monsieur Mallah, officially confirming that he is LGBT-friendly.
Even the Arrowverse version of Prometheus was obsessed by Green Arrow to a disturbing degree... Slade Wilson dedicated most of his life post-Lian Yu to get revenge on Oliver Queen, but the mirakuru was messing with his head, and he had hallucinations egging him on and PTSD...
... but Prometheus didn't have those excuses, he was on another level.
Great to know!
@@iwillsaythistho3023 - Cheers, keep up the good work!
@@randallflagg3700 Fair, but even some members of the community can be transphobic (just personally, I've been on a few dates where guys get Really weirded out by the thought of me transitioning further).
Still, my philosophy? If you enjoy a character, then you can justify them being supportive of trans folks, or even trans themselves
@@Miles_Phantasmagoria - Indeed, I guess I got a little carried away because I really, really like Prometheus for some reason ^^' so any time I get an excuse to dump random trivia on this chara, I pounce.
I'm not part of the LGBT community, just trying to be a good ally;
and indeed recently I've seen more and more far-right bigots getting bolder in their sick "I'm gay and even we hate trans! leave our children alone! make 'murica safe again for kids©" rhethoric🤮
(I kinda doubt most of these people are actually gay, they give the same vibe as those "I'm black and even I am sick and tired of these damn n-words!!" accounts)
@@randallflagg3700 i mean they ARE, they're just somehow stupid enough to fall into the same pit that the cishets fall into (literally friendly fire)
I will say Professor Pyg’s whole gimmick is breaking out of the binary. He sees humans as imperfect because we are bogged down by gender and characteristics so seeks to create a race of single sex mannequins. As well as this, his bouts of being schizotypical leads him to cross dress and think of himself as female.
You could definitely argue he’s bad representation (I would) in a Buffalo Bill kinda way, but there you go. Also honourable mentions is El Flamingo, flamboyant animal who definitely doesn’t consider himself any gender. Anyways wholesome vidyah, nice to see two cool guys talking bout this:)
Trans woman here - this is fucking class. Not too sure what I was expecting, but was massively surprised and pleased by two extremely based dudes. Mostly agree on the tierlist, although I'm not sure about the Joker, but I would give my left arm to hit the club with Ivy, Harley, Selena and Croc. It'd be a great time, and Croc's Hot To Go moves would be LETHAL.