Reasons I Dislike My Pan America
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- Опубліковано 3 лис 2022
- Top reasons I dislike my Harley Davidson Pan America. Today, I discuss the things on this motorcycle that I'm not a fan of. Overall, this adventure motorcycle is solid, but it has some things that need to be addressed. Join me as I walk around the bike and show you things that Harley Davidson needs to address, and what I'm hearing on the Pan America forums.
Reasons I Love This Pan America: • Top Reasons I Love My ...
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• 2017 Harley-Davidson Street Glide Special
• 2021 Harley-Davidson Pan America Special
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#harleydavidson #broncoride #panamerica #harley #streetglide #panamericaspecial #adventurebike #problems #adventure #dislikes @Broncoride
What I love about Harleys is that you can generally find spare parts for them alongside the highways.
And no rust because the parts are usually coated with oil....
Harley humor. Good one
Meh. My dad's been down on his wide glide 3 times and each and every time she was able to come home with minor issues. My dad on the other hand broke his shoulder and needed surgery. I would put my life on a Harleys bars
He needs riding lessons
I've got a 2014 Suzuki V-Strom 1000 with 60k miles on it. Dropped it a few more times than I care to admit. Other than a couple of broken levers, all I have ever needed to do is change the oil and adjust the valves once. While it is only listed at 100 HP, I seem to be able to leave Dukes and GS's in the dust. I have gone on many rides while my friend's expensive BMWs and Ducatis were in the shop. Now I read about all these issues with an expensive Harley. I guess quality and price may be inversely proportional.
Accurate assessment Kurt. The V-Strom is a good ride.
Owner of the first vstrom 1000 2003 model I can assure you that it's a great bike and has made a lot of gs cry. 93 hp on dyno 20 years old bike still surprises 2022 bikes.
That V-Strom isn’t leaving either of those bikes in the dust, it may leave less than capable riders…
👍 Japanese are great at cutting the crap on vanity and focus 200% in quality, performance and practically. But like when you chose the love of your life , who do you pick? A stable and reliable IT guy or an unpredictable, all season drama or Rock Super Star?
What’s the point of buying a high end price Motorcycle when all the peripherals are so tacky and cheap? It cost like another bike just to replace components. I don’t get it. Triumph is, in my opinion, like the RR of Motorcycles when it comes to style, luxury feel and quality. Performance might need to tune up a bit but maybe these two (rather different) brothers HD & T should join forces to become the RR like Motorcycle.
HD is late to the game when it comes to adventure bikes. Nobody beats the Japanese, German and British manufacturers in this realm.
If I were to buy an adventure bike, I’d go to the folks who have perfected it for many years rather than the new overly priced upstart named Harley Davidson.
Same here I love my 2021, did not buy it new. It had 1800 miles on it and about 3k of upgrades. No issues. I also have a 2016 Fat Bob that is really turned up. My Pan America is more fun to ride. I agree on the lacking of red lights on the rear. Kuryakyn makes a box that ties the turn signals into the brake light to all operate at the same time. I have that on my Fat Bob. This type of riding has made me get out to the gym. You drop this beast a few times you feel it.
I didn’t realize how out-of-shape I was until I took this off-road. I was using muscles I haven’t in years. I didn’t know about that kit. I’m very happy with the Denali ones. Huge difference with those. I will agree that this bike is extremely fun to ride.
This is a man who has never visited a Buc-ee's...
Went for the first time last week. Absolutely blown away.
Spot on Colon, I pretty much have the same issues. All in all, the bike is solid. I did change the fuel filter after 11K; well, I should say changing the filter as it was on back order. Will be putting it back together today. The clutch issue has been resolved and a new header was put on because the heat shield broke. Looking forward to riding with ya again sometime.
Glad to hear about the clutch. I agree that overall, it’s solid. Electronic glitches seem to be main issue with several. Definitely on riding again.
Glad you are hanging in there getting the bike sorted out. I bailed on mine last Spring because I was afraid to take it anywhere because it might not start if I turned it off. 😅 If they get these as reliable as the big twins they are going to be fantastic.
I bought one of those NOCO battery boosts just in case that ever happens. Hasn’t happened yet, but just want to be safe in case it does.
@@Broncoride If you ride it constantly and put it on a tender you should be OK. I found that the bike does not charge unless it has some RPMs above idle as well. I'm sometimes away from home for a couple of weeks at a time on my Ultra Classic and would return to the PA not starting but when I took the PA on those outings and didn't let it sit then the battery issues went away.
Senior P, I was ready to bail on mine as well. I've had it since they came out with a little over 10K on it. There have been some trying issues and missed rides but I think I've got mine sorted out now.
Fingers crossed, knocking on wood, throwing salt over my shoulder...
@@Broncoride Which NOCO Battery Booster did you purchase? That is a great idea for those off the grid rides.
edit; ( I think I see that you put up a video. I'll check it out.)
Really do appreciate the honesty man... I was stoked to hear that despite all of the annoying setbacks you still are very happy with the overall performance of the bike. I'm hoping to get one this summer. Great job 👍
Still enjoying mine and I hope you like yours once you pick it up.
@Peter Angles it's a bummer to hear that. I thought they have.worked out most problems of the first two years. If I don't get the Pan America S, I'll most likely get the Road King Special. Thank for the heads up.👍
Just got rid of my 22 PA, fun when it would run, but unreliable as all hell, HD dealers don't give a rats ass about helping you with this things either, no suprise they are one of the most traded in bikes of 22/23
@@dmac5497mine is on day 15 in the shop with 733 miles, no solutions.
I pretty much have the same list. Most hated thing for me is the iffy stand.
Infuriating isn’t it?
Radiator hose is probably my biggest gripe with the bike, own a 22 PAS. The radiator shield doesn't come standard nor does the heftier skid plate. The ARH on my bike is hit or miss, seen on the forums myself that there is a connector supposedly wired in backwards. My other big complaint is that the wiring on the front end it's almost like the harness needs and extra 1/2 inch of cable to make everything sit just right.
You are completely right on the wiring on the front end. Great call out.
Man love the look of your PA!...I'm 5'9" and when I first test rode the PA...one of the first things I thought was...I would need bar risers!...I see Harley installes the "heart attack" stand on all their bikes!...the jefy stand on my Ultra has made me pee my pants a few times now!!🤣🤣👍...great video...stay safe...ride safe!!😎👍🤙👍🤙🇨🇦
One of my best mods is the A1 Risers. They are perfect for me. Makes it so much more comfortable.
I bought a used 22 pa, that already had 2K miles. I've enjoyed it and put 3500 miles on so far. I bought mine for a commuter bike for work, and my first streetbike. There's a couple things I don't like about the navigation/Bluetooth stuff,but I don't really mess with it either. Just start it and ride it.Closest thing to a problem I had was a triangle light and check engine it was about 30°F and my motorcycle is outside and not plugged in., But I still made it where I was going and the light went off once the bike warmed up.
The Bluetooth hasn’t been an issue. I just use it to link up with my Sena. I don’t use the GPS they have on the bike. I’d rather use Waze or use my Garmin. I had the triangle once. Just pulled over at next stop and turned it off and back on, and good to go. Never had any code that prevented the bike from running. Just annoying.
@@Broncoride I've had codes prevent me from riding twice. There is a large fuse up front, remove it for a minute, put it back in and it'll reset the system.
I haven't had to do that one in months. A flash might have fixed it for my PA.
@@pinkiewerewolf didn’t think about the fuse. Good tip.
Where it that fuse?
Under headlight area
There is always things that need to be improved upon from the factory. At times its frustrating but then what would we do with our time if we weren't upgrading. Ride safe and enjoy.
Completely true my friend. Just pointing out some things, but overall love this bike. Hope you’re doing well.
My right front brake calliper was barely hanging on with one bolt on during one of my rides. Whole front end was rattling like crazy. Lesson learned. Got new bolts and used loctite on all of them and regularly check them. And carry spare bolts in my tool kit.
I ended up using Loctite on most of the existing ones. Shouldn’t have to do that.
I have a’21 and I read on the Pan America online forum that the side stand bolts can work loose. I checked mine and one bolt was backed out halfway and no thread locker on it. The worst bike I have ever owned
Nice video! I had the Anakee Wilds on my Scrambler, but I was going through rear tires quick, less than 3k miles on 2 of them, so I'm backing off a bit and trying the Pirelli Scorpions. And, we have Weigels in Tennessee...probably the closest thing to a Wawa.
I’ll miss my WaWa. Damn. Yes, the tires are short lived but they make a huge difference.
I had anakee wilds on my xr650l. Did a cross country trip didn't even make 3k on them. Have MOTOZ on now
Nice review and your right there can always be something wrong but overall it’s a great bike. Get a Honda trickle charger it works the battery even when your not riding. Ride Safe
Yes, I keep it on a trickle charge. They need a stronger battery on this.
Colon, like you said all bikes have issues. My KTM 1290 SA has similar items like yours Stock tires only good for street. I went with Motoz GPS tractionator. My skid plate was plastic , side stand same thing does not feel secure. and a few more items. I have never had or found the perfect bike. That is why i have a few (5) right now.
Good video, missed you at the 2 Wheeled ADV event in Oct weather and roads where perfect little cold in the AM but turned out nice. maybe see you next year
You’ll see me next year for sure. Every bike has issues. Just wanted to put this info out there since it’s a new bike. Still love it.
Agreed ! My Ducati Multi Strada had a lot of these exact issues ! ..lol.....
I have similar dislikes on my Pan America. I had never gotten a code on mine until just recently with the cooler weather. I believe the lower battery voltage causes it, or at least contributes to it. Great video.
Completely agree. The battery can’t handle all this stuff, plus the processor needs to be upgraded. Still enjoying it though. High tech is new to HD and it shows.
I have a '22 PAS with 15K miles on it. I agreed with every one of the complaints you showed in the video. I love my bike, but I don't like those persistent problems.
Overall, this bike is a blast to ride and checks many boxes. They just need to get all the gremlins worked out with the electronics.
My 22 PAS had 15,000 when the fuel pump went out. Now at 30,000 it started screaming so took it in and dealer change fuel pump again. At 31,693 and loving it!!!
Great video mate, I have a question what brand are your hiway pegs?
Aeedea pegs
I had those same issues along with the fuel pump squeal and ARH issues where it wouldn't always work. Also had an instance where I picked it up from the 10K service and it wouldn't start right in front of the service write, service. mgr, and tech. The bike kept rebooting. Also had an instance where it died going down the highway with a fuel tank of fuel, no I did not kill switch myself. At the end of ownership I would turn the bike on and try to start it and it would reboot but typically start the second time. That was enough for me to trade for a 21 RKS. Up to 5K miles it was the greatest bike I ever owned, after that it just kept going downhill and after the 10K service completely unreliable. I hope you don't see the problems I was having.
The dealership gave me a really good trade value towards the RKS.
Sorry to hear that. I hope I don’t have those issues either. It’s crazy that some people are having those large issues. I haven’t with mine. Gotta love the RKS.
I grew up 15 miles from Wawa, PA, and was at their HQ a couple times for a job, circa 1984.
Lots of bugs in the first year PA. Is the moco providing fixes for those codes?
Yes, through all the software updates. Think I’ve done 4 or 5 since I’ve had it. Usually just small fixes, but this bike throws a code if you sit on it wrong. Lol. Still runs fine, just annoying. The updates fix some of those codes.
WaWa totally for the win! I like your jacket! The forums and FB have been bad, but the negativity seems to be on the decline. The best things about the forms though has been what to watch for, what bolts come loose. No real codes for me, and If the bike is sitting more than a couple days I just put it on the tender. The hand guards work great for wind but that's about it. The windshield is sketchy. The foot pegs were a pain point and I had to replace them. 30+ years of riding and I've never had to do that.. The seat is bad, but I am a big guy. I sucked it up this year just to give in a chance. New one is in my future. Ride safe!
I’ve learned a ton from the forums. Yes, people can get negative, but I look at it as they are trying to share info. There are a ton of positive posts too.
Finnish Magazine made a 60000km throughout test which lasted a year with Pan America.
Conclusion:
Clutch is not made for this kind of bike. They changed it twice. They said it broke when doing third 0-60mph run. They do 5, so they didn't get the result done, because the clutch doesn't last 5 times 0 to 60mph acceleration. Harley knows it, but haven't done nothing. This is the most powerful bike they have ever made, so they didn't have the know-how how to make proper clutch. So, to be sure, carrying a clutch-pack with you all the time, is wise.
Second big problem which make this not ready for cross-continent travels is it's electronics. They are catastrophically bad. There were even a problem, when the bike stopped, because it thinks it have a major issue. It will stop you riding.
Third problem is really a life-threatening issue, but thankfully so far, nobody has died yet. QUICKSHIFTER is behaving so badly, it actually doesn't respond anything, but sometimes speeds-up after many seconds after you let off the gas. It doesn't respond anything, not even pressing clutch down (insane, but true). The problem is somewhere in slipper clutch/quickshifter. Because the bike is heavy, you have to press brakes very hard against it, when it's speeding up. Testdrivers were in Alps, and many times, they would have drop off the cliffs (hundreds of feet drop), if they have not known the issue and brake hard when the bike just accelerates like crazy. So, do NOT use the quick shifter in curvy roads or in traffic. You will eventually die.
What always comes in mind.... Is there some kind of competition going on between HD, Ducati, KTM and Triumph? Who can manufacture the bike with most problems. Second thought is, how much they use to practically bribing the journalists and various UA-cam reviewers etc.? World is weird place.... You can't trust basically any reviewers, but those from countries with lessm corruption. Also those countries, which doesn't have domestic product to compete are ones you can trust, maybe. Pan American is maybe the shittiest western made adv, but I haven't found an American reviewer who dare to say it. It is like that fairy tale, where no one said, the emperor didn't have clothes. It was too risky.
Thank you for the information. Haven’t heard about the quick shifter issues.
I've had 4 batteries now, alternator rotor, cam chain noise, heated grips fail, radiator hose burnt, towed back to dealer 4 times, been at the dealer over 3months in first year, now there for one more month, fuel pump replaced, adaptive ride height fail, rear tire sensor fail, and more.
Holy crap! That’s just insane the amount you’ve had. I hope your dealer is trying to make it right at least.
Bummer...I have a PAS 23..For 5months 3.5k miles..95%or more of it on city streets..with many start and stop cycles..no problems so far..when not in use..it's on a 1amp tender..inside a garage..
My issues: Sometimes it will not downshift. It was so bad, I thought I had mud in the linkage during my Dalton Highway ride in the slop. It has done it a few times after I had cleaned it. It seems to be ok after you stop and shift up, then try down, repeat a few times and it goes away for weeks.
Key FOB. I changed to battery twice and since then out of 30 tries, it only powered up once. I have to manually put the code in each time.
Fuel pump whine after I hit around 6k miles. It's bad. The only good news about that is that when I manually put the start code in, there is no whine, and it sounds normal. I think its software related and the actual power switch maybe going bad. It seems to help if you cuss it and wiggle it some.
Back order of brake handle. A year is ridiculous. I think it was a great idea to have that break point in it but that kind of defeats the purpose if you can't get a damn replacement.
I only wish that these issues were nonexistent because I love to ride this bike. The suspension is great. I find it much easier to ride this bike in the rough stuff than I did on a KLR.
Rant over.
Good rant. I had the same FOB issue. Found out it was the fob antenna under tank. They replaced that and good to go. Heard several had fuel pump issues too. 90% of issues are software related. Still love the ride, but the software needs a major overhaul.
I've got a 22 enthusiast edition....the forums drive me nuts lol I went ahead and purchased the bike and I'm glad I did, but I'm glad I knew it had some quirks going into it, the only thing it's really done is my screen has went black once but I still rode it and one other time it failed to start all it did was turn over, after shutting the bike on and off three times it finally started...... I personally think it has a lot to do with the processor that controls everything.... I just don't think you can think fast enough..... but with that being said I love riding this thing it is nothing but fun
Really like the look of the Enthusiast edition. I agree with you on the processor. So much info at one time. It just throws codes, but still rides fine. I have a feeling they will be doing an upgrade on that for new models.
@@Broncoride it woould be nice if they do it so the 21/22 models get a better ECM or whatever...and then do a recall for the upgrade
Hey Colin, which bike did you use the most this year? Good review and upgrades, Cheers Dave
Spent more on the PA. I did long trips on both, but more on the PA. Hope you’re doing well Dave.
@@Broncoride Thanks Colin, was down with COVID recently for a couple of weeks but I'm over it now. Happy to be going out riding tomorrow so things are good. cheers
My 2021 pan America been really good except those codes and fuel pump can be very noisey could do with a a stronger battery in saying that I found riding the bike often helps with those battery issues and I also found changing the fod battery helps over all great bike
The battery is definitely an issue. Agree on once riding, battery issues go away.
It seams to me you either get a good PA or a lemon.
Glad to hear and see that you have a good one. !!
Mine was a lemon. Dealer couldn’t fix a couple reoccurring issues. Could t trust the bike. Sold it by 11,000 kms (7000 miles)
Hope you have many more enjoyable hours !!
Cheers
Bought my 2022 PA Special this past July 30. Currently have 8700 miles on it. All pavement miles. More than half of those miles twist mountain roads. A trip To Fla from my home state of Pa. I have done several 12 hour plus stints. I must say that I absolutely love this bike. At times when I am out in the mountains digging a twisty road I have to look down at the Harley Davidson logo to remind myself that they made this thing . Collin I absolutely watch every video you put out on this bike. Your view point is intelligent, infornative and mature . I don't really mind some of the less refined aspects of this bike. I suppose its vecause my other ride is a bare bones stripped down slammed sportster 1200. Thankfully I havent experienced any of the issues some folks have. When parked I keep a Battery Tender smart charger plugged in all times. Keep up the great work. I pay close attention to your opinion on what works and what doesnt in regard to acessories etc. I see that you have the awesome AEE DEA highway pegs. I found out about them from Snowbird and immediately got them. To all you PA owners they are the best for this bike. Keep up the good work Collin. WaWa. You must be a Pennsylvanian as I. They are the Best. Big Fan Paul Wojnar
I still say a majority have been fine. Hate hearing about the people in forums that have had major issues. Good to hear from you my friend.
Thank you for the kind words Paul. I just tell it like it is. Overall, I’m still very pleased but wanted to put out there what some people are seeing as negative too. I live in Maryland, only a couple hours from PA. I’m addicted to their subs at WaWa.
Sounds like poor quality control on assembly. Maybe sleepy untrained staff.
In 2018 I bought brand new Super Tenere ES, on the road for $16k ($1 less actually). Spent another $700 for engine guard and luggage racks (share boxes with another bike). There was one brake recall that took about an hour to fix. Changed tires between 11-12k miles. Changed oil and shaft drive fluid as needed. Last Fall, I rode from Austin, TX to Branson, MO and back. 300 miles through rain sucked but, everything seemed to work.
That’s a good bike right there.
I prefer shaft drive for touring, 584 pounds without luggage installed is too heavy for off-road adventures unless you are very skilled and strong.
It is a good touring bike though.
@@Dave-sw2dm All these bikes are officially in Touring ADV bike category. Touring is their first purpose. For some reason, and I see it all the time when talking to people at demo rides, that they expect these bikes to be dirt bikes. I rode my Sup Ten on some crummy dirt roads and I was surprised how well it worked. Even couple times on real rough terrain it was surprisingly good. But, it comes with road tires and I see no reason to take it off road. Too big, too expensive and to heavy. But, it has everything for long distance. UBS, ABS, TC, cruise control, grip warmers, shaft drive, electronically controlled suspension. The weight saved me in couple heavy storms with relentless wind and rain. Pan Am is surprisingly good bike. I really liked it at demo ride but, I don't wanna mess with chain at that price. Realistically, I don't need 150HP and 500lbs sucks off road just as much as 600lbs.
@@oknevals , I checked them all out and ended up buying the Moto Guzzi V85TT. I call it my sport touring bike. It was the lightest shaft drive and came with everything for a much better price point than the other shaft drive offerings.
@@Dave-sw2dm That's a great bike. I took it for test ride unintentionally once because sales guy persuaded me to try it 🙂. Such a cool guy. I actually went to try Zero bikes. I wasn't initially that crazy about it especially with that front bird look but later on, I kept thinking about it. There is nothing like it and it has everything it needs. Air cooled, good engine size, shaft drive, electronic controls, very stable, comfortable, just looks like art piece. Some vibrations at stops but, very pleasant to ride. My biggest worry would be city traffic in Texas heat but, I could see myself riding it if I was going for owning one bike only. Although, of 60ish bikes I tried, my heart is set on Kawasaki Versys 650. Just fits me so well but, it doesn't make sense at this time. I have four now (sold one recently 🙂).
Wow. I cant believe that Harley put these things on the market without fixing them first. This isnt the first review that I have seen, that have had these problems and more. This is a very kind and forgiving review of the bike though lol..I think if I spent 20k or more on it, I would have a very different tone.
Most of the issues have been fixed with software updates, but I’d still want to ask the engineers what they were smoking when they designed the kickstand.
Thanks for the info!
No worries John.
My BSA 441 Victor is marvelous in the dirt. Lightweight flickable maneuverable iJoy to ride off-road. Simple reliable dependable and very frugal with fuel even flat-out on a dirt trail. Light enough for me to pick it up set it on a milk crate when I have to adjust the chain. Try to use your hundred and something horsepower off road and I will wave at the ambulance crew that is peeling you off a tree😂
I moved to SD back in 2012. You are correct, WAWA is fantastic and I miss it.
It’s the best
I don't have a issue with the side stand. The reason it is longer is the ARH. You should get the bigger battery, especially with your accessories you have.
I like your extra brake/tail lights, what is that set up? Good video, I have a 22, I have only had 1 code, at 10k plus feet. It cleared at 9k feet. The electronics on this bike has to have steady voltage in a parameter, any above or below, it will code. That is another reason you should change your battery. Lithium is a good way to go, a lot of people with 21s have done this with good results.
I will definitely look at lithium batteries. As for lights, they are from Denali. Huge difference in front and rear.
Mine is a 2022. Agree about the kick stand, it can be difficult. I have codes popping up which I've been able to clear and the codes have not affected drivabilty. Overall it's the best bike I've ever ridden and I've been riding for about 50+ years.
Awesome. I’m still enjoying mine. No issues since getting updates.
I share your opinion on all these minor complaints. I have experienced some of the electrical gremlins on my '22 PA Special. The bike throws a Check Engine almost every time you take it over 9,000 ft in altitude. The dealership actually replaced my intake manifold gaskets the first time it happened. Now we know it is a sensor issue. I also had a VVT Check Engine code that would throw the bike into Limp Mode. Dealership found the cause to be loose wires to the VVT sensor. I have almost 7,000 miles on it now and love taking it on trips and off-road. I've taken it to a few places where many would say that big bikes and stock tires aren't meant to go.
I’ve heard that about the wires. Seems like if they get pinched, then life becomes bad. I definitely like touring on mine. It’s a great bike overall.
Wonder if that elevation tripped the 02 sensor...just a thought.great presentation
@PeterAngles-ks9fp if you hate harley so much, why do you keep going to dealerships? Do you own a harley?
I think I’ll stick with my 2007 Triumph T 100.
Couple of my friends have Triumph bikes and love them.
All legitimate complaints. I haven't had a lot of the same issues though I did upgrade the bike somewhat comparable to yours. I do have the occasional codes but I clear them out and no problem. Haven't taken it off road yet but I'll probably get some knobby tires when the stocks wear out. So far my only issue is my D7 Denali lights like to flicker violently when it is cold out lol.
Haven’t had that issue with the Denali lights. I’ll be sure to keep an eye on it. Even with the codes, bike runs really well.
Nice video. I do have a question though. If you're 6'4" how can you be comfortable on this bike? I'm 6'4" also and demo'd one of these, while I loved the engine this is the most cramped adv bike out there. There is no way I can keep my knees bent at that sharp of an angle for any length of time. Even though you can add risers, a taller seat, and lower pegs, you can also do all those things to all the other adv bikes in this class that start out with more room. Not trying to rag on HD but I'm really curious as to your inseam and whether or not you did lowered pegs.
Thank you. I have a 34” inseam. I added the highway pegs but seat is stock. Honestly, I find it comfortable. I haven’t had any issues except for long rides with the seat(over 300 miles). While I can stretch out more on my SGS, I’m good with this one too.
Just got my PanAm a week ago, and I have the same issues with the side stand. Added the plate too, but I feel like that makes me have to lean it to the right even further to put the stand down 😅
You do, but anything is better than that stock debacle. Side note, pull kickstand bolts off and put Loctite on. You will thank me later. 😎
Curious - how’s the wind protection at say 75 mph or so compared to your street glide?
I get buffeting about halfway on my forehead. I need to get a taller one. The SG is much better, but I also sit much lower on that bike. I’ve been told Madstad makes a good aftermarket one.
My 21’ PA has been a reliability nightmare. Bike is great when it’s running properly though.
Hate to hear that. Mine has had some minor stuff, but reliability on this has been hit or miss.
Will you link in the rear and front light upgrades? Thanks
Custom Dynamics Install Videos
ua-cam.com/play/PLGeFtYNyIdrfqGnZY4G7PsSK_hWecXHX6.html
I owned one for two years. Ended up HATING it. The biggest problem was the starter clutch gear issue that a lot of '21 models had. As that tore up my batteries I found myself stranded far from hoe too many times. It was eventually fixed but waiting for the fix was unacceptable. The starting problem disappeared after the fix but by then the damage had been done. At this point, everything else started bothering me. I traded it in this past June for a Low Rider ST (my 8th HD since 1989) and Amy so F-ing happy I got rid of the POS PAS
The LR ST is amazing. Sorry you had so many issues. Reliability needs to be much better on the PA. Awesome bike when it works.
@@Broncoride "When it works" pretty much sums it up. I DID learn a thing or two about error codes as this bike was a two-wheeled code generator. The intense load on the battery/electrical system due to the starter clutch gear generated a wide array of random and meaningless codes. I learned to ignore them.
The ride modes thing was awesome as was the display. I liked the factory heated grips and the horn button (the standard HD horn button is idiotic and impossible to find in an emergency.).
Sorry for the tortured spelling & grammar in my initial comment. I forgot to proofread.
I’m impressed you got 5500 miles with no problems. I hit 733 miles and haven’t seen it in 15 days.
That sucks man. Shouldn’t be that way.
ordered the 21, did 16000 km in 6 months. 3 batteries, oil in coolant, BCM Replaced, Clutch worn numerous codes, black screen, ARH not working, just shutting off will riding etc. Got a 22, first kms it got me stranded.... I brought it back and bought a 2012 oil cooled beemer. I keep my panheads and shovelhead tough.
Way too many issues. Hope you’re enjoying the BMW.
I was watching the youtube channel Throtle Blip. He said that Harley accidently listed some parts for a smaller engine Pan America due to come out next year and Harley has filed for the the paten name Bronx Street Fighter that will also come out in 2023. You can probably find the video he did. Good video to watch.
Heard that too. They are looking at a mid-size ADV bike. We shall see.
@@Broncoride Hope so that would be great. I really like the Street Fighter also. That will bring the crotch rocket people into the Harley family.
Much appreciated.
Of course.
Some of the same complaints I have heard from some owners here I know. It is crazy the amount of codes the PA throws.
It is a code-happy bike for sure. As long as it still runs, I’m good.
@@Broncoride That’s exactly what matters!!! So happy you are enjoying that ride!!
Colin. Question. Have you been in the air box on your bike yet. Have seen some complaints online in regard to water collecting in the airbox. Any info on this?
Yes, and no issues with mine. No water at all.
AEE DEA makes a lower fender for the front wheel to prevent road dirt and debris from getting into the radiator and also the voltage regulator fins. Affordably priced for a very good functional accessory.
Thank you for the rapid response. Good to know as I have been thru some steady rains on some of my forays. You are the best. Thank you!!!
Sir I test rode that 2021 before getting another ATV bike and this iteration is solid but a long way behind the leaders in ADVs
I agree
Yeah.... I dropped my PAS in the driveway cause of that crappy side stand, till I got on how it worked. It's not like 90% of the other bikes out there, you have to make sure it's in the notch before you dismount. Bad design! Otherwise riding it really puts a smile on my face!
Something so simple seems to drive us crazy. I forgot to mention when you have luggage or another person on, it really becomes annoying to get it down easily.
@@Broncoride Hopefully the after-market will some up with something better, as soon as it does,the factory side stand is gone!
The ARH is what's messing with your side stand deployment. Still, the location of the side stand isn't optimal.
I have the Special W/O the ARH but my bike would sometimes lower... (Insert crickets chirping) and thats how I figured it out. After the umpteenth flash it hasn't been lowering. Which I prefer, even though I'm only 5'8" 31" inseam.
I've missed some rides because of the PA not starting. The latest, come to find out was just a bad battery in the fob. Still, when you're ready to roll and trying to diagnose this stuff on a time limit, no bueno.
As of today I have a second fob.
That one didn't work initially either.
Luckily I bought two new batteries for the older fob so we used that one. I need to grab two more batteries and keep them with the bike.
The other issue I've had has been the fuse under the cover, right side, under the frame/triple tree. It has had to come out to reset the system a couple of times. Always remember that one.
I was so PO'd at the bike that I wanted Harley to buy it back but I think I have most of the issues figured out so that it won't strand me in the middle of BFE. I hope.
I saw your other post on getting a good price for it. I apologize I originally missed this comment.
@@Broncoride No worries Brother.👍
Sounds like the same problems I had on my Ducati Multi - Strada !
I have had a few glitches but not even as much as your seeing. Over all I’m really happy. Just sometimes I have to restart the bike.
The bike always runs even with all the codes. Bike is a tad sensitive. 😎
@@Broncoride lol sensitive is a good description
Test rode the Pan America and loved it! Stumbled on to a 2018 Super Tenere ES with 1200 miles and all the best aftermarket bits money could buy for $14K. the big Yamaha is amazing even though it never gets any media love it’s stone reliable 😎👍
That’s a great bike!
Way to top heavy the technology is ancient in the adventure bike world
It’s just sad that Harley released this bike with so many problems. Honda wouldn’t have.
Have you had any heat issues with your right leg being so close to the exhaust? It looks like there is just a thin heat shield between the pipe and the rider's leg.
It gets warm, but nothing unbearable.
It does get unbearable after 10-15 of riding at 30 mph and below wearing jeans
I'm not a Harley guy and had to go sit on one at a dealer and I was impressed and would love to try one. I can only say one thing would deter me from buying one is that it's not shaft drive.
The chain isn’t bad. I take care of the chain every 500 miles or so.
@@Broncoride I had a KLR 650 that when loading with luggage would cause issues having to keep checking the chain, wonder if the hydraulic height adjustment eliminates that?
Haven’t had any issues so far with luggage on it.
Thanks god bless
You’re welcome
Brother, as long as you enjoy the bike...god bless.
IMO, pushing a bike to market with that many "quirks" is really unacceptable. Especially for a bike company that justifies their prices by pushing the narrative that their selling a premium product.
I’m still enjoying it. Seems like most software updates have fixed a majority of the electronic issues.
On my third PAS and my 21 was junk😡
Issues was fixed on the 22’s after May build date.
Love my current 22 GI Edition.
I put 30K on the 21 and 36K on the blue 22 and this GI I just picked up so it only has 1K on it.
Been lucky with mine. I have a 21 and not many issues. Since last update, it’s been running perfect.
Loose caliper mounting bolt is no fun at all! I had one come off from the rear caliper of my Bonnie, but that was my own fault, I apparently forget to torque them when I changed the tire. Thought at first it was worn pads making the noise I started hearing on the way home from PA, then found only one bolt holding the caliper on after I got home! As for the convenience store issue, I haven't seen a WaWa south of the one where we met up a few months ago, nor north of the MD-PA border. Plenty of Sheetz down through VA and into NC and up into PA, but up around north-central PA you get Dandy Marts and Rutters instead. I do think WaWA has better coffee, haven't tried their sandwiches.
Wanted to make sure with these because I feel the off-road riding will be hard on them. Loctite is my friend. Bought the family size bottle. Lol.
Yep, those would definitely be pet peeves.
I still love the bike. This thing is fast and incredibly in the twisties. Lot of tech on this, so it can create problems for sure.
Which bike do you like riding better the Pan Am or Street Glide?
PA. Much more versatile. Both have pros and cons, but the PA is much more fun to ride. Still love the SGS though.
What handlebar sliders are those ?
HVMP
I think my expectations were simply too high. I came from the GS world, gave the Pan America a 6 month try-out, but it was all the small things that just bugged me to the point I went back to the GS. Seat rocking all the time, side stand (not just how flimsy it is, but try to put the bike on the center stand and then put the kickstand down, or up if it was down prior to the centerstand). I know they have addressed a few things already like font size, but that original screen was bad. Nav system is terrible, then you have the audio cluster. I get it's a Harley, but all those ride modes and important things, they belong in a location you can actually reach them, like where the audio controls are now. Those should have been flipped. Put the audio controls on top, ride modes on the side. And in a nutshell that's what drove me crazy, not big things but attention to detail that just wasn't there.
There are some things like you mentioned that bother me too. The kickstand…unreal design.
Good grief, I’d never leave a GS for a Harley. Why anyone would turn to the recent upstart and leave behind the GS with it’s reliability and high quality is beyond me. I’m a Harley guy when it comes to cruisers and baggers, but NOT when it comes to Adventure bikes.
👍
For a second there I thought you were at a Sheetz 🤔
I never did drink the Kool-Aide, in fact I've bought nothing. I will be getting a new bike sooner or later, whether its one to replace the Victory or the Husky or as a 3rd bike, is yet to be determined... Whatever it is, the new bike will not be a 1st or 2nd year model of any brand.
On the PA the error codes would make me nuts, it might be "software" but I'd always be wondering if one is a "real deal" code
Long live your Victory. Love that bike and it’s fast as hell.
@@Broncoride ... Its a big lumbering land yacht 🤣
I got a 2022 Friday 07/21/23 and on Saturday 07/22/23 I got stranded on the side of the hwy because the bike just stopped working. I am still waiting on the dealershit to tell me what the problem is
Hate hearing stories like this. Completely unacceptable this happened.
@@Broncoride It really is unacceptable. I know it's a newish model but damn dude, it's a motorcycle and HD has been doing motorcycles for 120 years c'mon. I am still waiting to hear from them about what the problem is
I just picked up a 2023 Kawasaki KLR . It takes me places my RoadGlide Limited won’t lol
KLR is a great bike. Congrats
When I was still riding adventure bikes I looked at the BMW, Triumph and the Pan America. None of them in my opinion were good enough to justify the cost over my bullet proof Super Tenere 1200. As an added bonus the Super Tenere is shaft drive so I had no messing around with chains. I owned two of them and did not have a single issue with either one. The design is getting long in the tooth as Yamaha hasn't changed it since it came out around 2011. I decided to get rid of it though as I had it set up like yours for touring and they are too heavy in my opinion to really have fun off road. So in essence I had two touring bikes with my other bike being a Street Glide. So this year I really shook things up and traded my Street Glide for a 22 Goldwing Tour and I also bought a '23 Suzuki DR650 dual sport that I have been having a blast on. I am out exploring and finding things around my local area that I didn't even know existed. Any long distance rides I will take the Wing. The 650 is not bad on the highway though. I could cruise all day on it at 70 mph, my longest trip since buying it in Sept was a little over 200 miles. Oh the small foot on the side stand is common with all of the adventure bikes. I had to add a foot to mine also.
I bet you’re having a blast on the Suzuki. I rode a DRZ couple years back. It was great off-road.
@@Broncoride Yup having fun for sure, nothing I will ever go on a trip with but great around town and exploring back roads and trails.
So everybody else is completely wrong and you have the world's best adventure bike. There is a reason the super tenore doesn't sell as good as the rest of the adventure bike do. Yamaha builds great machines
I own one... and it sucks. It is a problem, software, motor,app...HD should never release a bike with so many issues. It's a client killer.
It has caused some issues with trust with many folks.
I suspect newer AI will rewrite these systems for both cars & bikes to not include acronyms & codes ., which mean nothing in any language, & must be set to memory or "learned " .Each time there is a update you are basically comitting to memory something thats useless, because it will never be standardized , & never stop changing.No one wants codes or acronyms (except maybe the website created to translate them into actual language). Manufactures continue to make this mistake based on the past, because no one is telling them, (yet) otherwise . Their own paper trail for customer satisfaction is being filled out by who ever is handy just so they can prove it was done .Thats why defects go unreported untill a crisis hits , & styling is akward on the most reliable vehicles while makers of such think they have a hit!
I would like to make a valid change to this video: Kwik Trip (not Wawa) is the best ;)
You have no idea what you’re talking about. Lol.
How is it on say a 150 mile trip ? Comfortable?
Yes, I don’t have any issues with that distance. It hits me after 250-300, then my back starts acting up. I have back issues though.
The fit and finish on this bike I think is very substandard for Harley.
They tried to keep the weight down it seems with more plastic.
For $20k, you'd think they could torque the screws, nuts, and bolts to spec. Do they have any torque specs? All the Harleys in my garage have the same issue. Still fun to ride though! Be safe everyone.
Yes they do have specs on most. I picked up the service manual which was very helpful.
Poor finishing. They rust front hub area. Starting issues. Guy I know has one. They replaced the battery.... Still no good. The dealer gave him a jump pack.
And at the high price on these, would buy something else better
My 2022 pan am has been in the service department 3 times for CEL for various reasons and the dealership refuses to unwind the deal. That's my least favorite part of my pan am. I've only made ONE monthly payment so far. Absolutely ridiculous.
PS: TOMORROW going to check all fasteners
Haha, I’ve put loctite on many of the existing ones just to feel better. I figured with an adventure bike, I would have seen more, but maybe that’s not the norm.
I almost bought a PAS in green in 2021 as my first motorcycle. Reviews scared me off. I went with a 2022 BMW 1250 GSA instead. Longer warranty and a history. Steep learning curve but no issues that I didn't initiate. The PAS in Green doesn't appear to exist as an option anymore. Trying to get my kids to ride and would like to get a HD as a second bike.
I know the still have the Essentials Green but they are hard to find.
What you expect from Harley?
My favorite design is spark plugs wires right on your knee, and first to be ripped apart with some brush or when bike falls over.
It's NOT an adventure bike, adventure as competition bikes on that class...
Agree on the plugs
Harley must have used the KLR650 as a design footprint.
Some of those issues are the same as the klr’s.
Fuel pumps, cam chain tensioner, piss poor kickstand design ect…….
That kickstand is so bad.
I stopped at a Wawa in Florida last week to get marshmallows and they didn’t have any.😢
Supply chain issues for marshmallows again. Will it ever end?
I had to turn off after 10 seconds because of that stupid gas station #sheetzrules
I understand your frustration with being second best.
🤣This man thinks that tiny little gas stop is the ultimate convenience store/gas station. He has obviously never been to a Bucc-ees or a FuelCity.😂
I just saw my first Bucc-ees. All I can say is Wow.
My F750 bmw I have had no problems and only one screw had to be fixed over three years. I have to say bmw Is outstanding and trouble free
They have the ADV market down.
Buc-ee’s over Wa-Wa any day!
One is opening by me in about a month. I’ve never been to one.
@@Broncoride I think Wa-Wa’s are expanding into Alabama now.
@@Broncoride what brand phone holder is that you have on your bike? Thanks!
🌞👍👍👍🌞
No codes on my KLR.
KLR is a great ride.
You kind of skipped by the risers.. Why are they junk?
I should have clarified. I meant the stock bars without risers. The A1 ones go up 2” and back 1”. Think Harley risers are just 2” up. The A1 risers made a huge difference. Might not be as big of an issue if you’re under 6’. Strongly recommend the risers and they are one of my favorite mods.
Cam tensioner issues...? Sounds like people are attaching old Twin Cam issues to the PA to try and create more bad buzz. Lol!
Only read a handful of people that have had that issue. Seems rare.
The stock tires are far from junk. They are 80/20 tires, they are excellent for their intended use. They are not a good off road tire, that is far from junk. The fasteners are a good point, although i have not found any loose. The codes are due to voltage drops on start up. Get a better battery, more amps, like it should have, will fix that. And the locking side stand i find to be no problem outside of it being attached to the engine. Most everyone that is reviewing the bike says exactly the same thing, about annoyances, very few have had failures. Even the fuel pump, the most common failure, gives ample warning its failing. My point here, the bike is a pretty darn reliable bike. People that say they are afraid to take it some where remote, or fear impending failure are feeding into all the doom that is pumped out there for content and likes. And most of the negative comments come from people that hate HD and would never buy on reguardless. I dont read BMW, Honda, or KTM forms, but a lot of them seem very interested in reading and watching utube on this HD. Funny how that works.
Also did a vid on why I love it. At the end of this, I talk about why I still enjoy. Since I got the last update, I haven’t had any issues. Solid ride and so much fun.
@@Broncoride I watched the whole video.
There is one guy that has 35 k on his, treats it rough. Says it's the best bike he's ever had.
Another guy and his wife on Facebook, traveled all over North South and Central America. And covered all the things they replaced on the way. The Harley Haters are in full attack on this machine, mostly for no reason and videos of why someone hates it, for views, draws them like flies. For years the hater group complained that hds were slow antiquated, so this machine comes out, out preforms every single one of them except the Ducati, in the first year, and it absolutely drove them nuts.
My biggest complaint is not about the bike, it was about a dealer network that was ill equipped and sometimes unwilling to learn the bike. Most have came around, the ones that refused have suffered. This engine is here to stay, it will continue to get better. The US manufacturing of this bike was not as good as the overseas was. This too has been fixed. All things said, this is a great motorcycle. The one bug is the kickstand, because of the lowering of the bike and it connected to the engine.
We could go on all day on HD! They are at a point of arrogance which brings on, i don't care. I have mostly owned HDs. Not in the future, as I will either go Honda or just be done riding altogether.
Never give up riding my friend. Just my two cents.
The thing that I notice most often in the owner reviews is how many miles are being put on these bikes. People seem to love riding them and clocking miles. Seems to be very few outright failures being discovered in the wild.
Agree, this bike does eat up the miles for sure.
Have any of you people had a problem Harley tech's overfilling Your oil on the engine, when I bought it was over full, from the Factory, it was pouring oil all over the left front cylinder, I. E. breather tube, then at the 1000 mi service they did it again, seems the tech filled it on the center stand, using the strait up marks on the dip stick, if they do that the oil is 1/2 a quart over full, it seems that if you use the side stand marks like You supposed to, then stand it up strait an check it again the oil is barely touching the end of the stick, so the two marks don't read the same, at least on My bike, The person who designed that dip stick should be fired, well the owner's manual and the service manual both state to check the oil on the jiffy stand, the dealer who did the work got an earful from Me, oh I also agree with you about that side stand, very poor design, You got to love them150 horses, it's a hoot to blast up on ramps with.
Didn’t have an issue with mine. I did notice that the coolant was low, and that got fixed.
No Loctite by Harley? I've been wrenching on Harleys for over 30 years and that is absolutely not the case. Most folks that work on them would agree that Harley uses Loctite on everything even when it's not needed. Maybe they're doing something different on the Pan Am, but that's sure not been my experience or anyone I know who wrenches on these bikes regularly.
Agree on your statement about Harley in general. The PA only had it on a couple of screws. I checked about 20 or so, and none had it. Couple of other friends that have them have said same thing. Maybe they ran out that week. Lol. My SGS has them on most.
But wait!! The PAS now comes with a four year warranty!!! If you live in Europe!!! Just how much longer will Americans allow HD to flip them the bird before they tell them to F.O???
I don’t disagree