People always cite "Hounds of Love" as being her best.I think it's "The Dreaming".It's the bravest album a female songwriter has ever produced-literally! This album keeps on giving the more you listen to it.She calls it her aggressive "city" album;it reflects her response to her critics,the industry,the Falklands War,etc....If she wanted her music to "intrude"....well...it certainly had.I believe it's her pointed response to being a sex symbol.pop star,industry commodity,etc.....Love the album and the experimentation.
The Dreaming is unquestionably the superior of the two! Aside from the singles, I can't even remember any of the songs on Hounds. I thought it was boring, monotonous, uninspired, phoned-in. I'm the odd one out, I guess.
It's definitely up there as one of her best. I am obsessed by her music. So much to admire and discover. She's one of a kind for sure. But the waiting between albums is so hard.....
I agree. Even though I think 'Hounds Of Love' is flawless, something about 'The Dreaming' is more compelling to me. It's just bizarre, experimental and creative in a way few albums can manage to do. Kate is a genius.
I agree but a think The Ninthwave may be her greatest work but as an album a think a just prefer The Dreaming that might be because The Big Sky is on HOL if that was replaced by Under The Ivy then it would be a tie for me 2 Masterpieces
I find it strange that people regard The Dreaming as an album that is steeped in synth pop. Almost every song with maybe two exceptions has piano, bass and drums as it'foundation. The fairlight is used as a distinct instrument, but the overall quality of the album is still very organic to me. The choices were intentionally extreme which always suits the themes very well. As for the 'strangness' of it, I am never comfortable with that term in creative criticism, because art IS strange, music IS strange, poetry IS strange, and all real pioneers ought to be foraging into strange, new realms. So The Dreaming is actually what recorded music OUGHT to be doing.
The word 'genius' is thrown around too often, but Kate Bush objectively fits the criteria. Mostly self-taught as a young musician; writing outstanding work at a very young age [e.g. Man with the Child in His Eyes]; writing hugely successful work at a very young age; among the first, if not the first, female singer also to write a number 1 hit [in her teens]; taking over production when very few female artists did; extremely original and a unique sound etc. Even if you don't like her work, she meets the criteria of genius. I doubt she'd like that label though!
She wouldn't like the label at all infact she'd probably laugh and don't be so ridiculous she's so disarmingly self deprecating with a total absence of egotricity
If any other artist had released a song like "Wuthering Heights", it would have been the pinnacle of their career. But for Kate, it was only just the start - literally! Her artistic progression from '78 - '82 was nothing short of breathtaking.
I love the album, it's transitional, her most experimental. My favorite track which wasn't even touched on here is 'Night of the Swallow'. There's an anxiousness that pulls me in, some emotional singing too.
"Suspended in Gaffa" and "Houdini" are also worth talking about - moving and magical! "Get out of my House" was inspired by Kubrick's "The Shining", if I remember correctly. So scary, certainly!
As a complete album, I think The Dreaming is probably her best album. It is like her Revolver, as good as the next album, but overshadowed by its hype.
Most artists: "How do I make my voice sound good?" Kate Bush: "What can I do with this crazy-cool instrument I was born with?" Her lack of concern for current musical "trends" is why Aerial is my most listened to album of all time - it's ageless, timeless, and immortal, and a joy every time.
The Dreaming for me is Kate's unorthodox masterpiece. Steven is right in saying this album is the one where she explores every aspect of her voice in a way that she never did again.
Great to hear an interviewer who really knows their subject and more importantly allows the interviewee to talk at length without constant interruptions. I love this album and the videos that were made for at least 4 of the tracks. I just wish Kate would release a DVD compilation of ALL of her videos!
Glad to see this masterpiece receiving the appreciation it deserves. When I first heard it around 14 years ago, I couldn't believe how experimental and weird and beautiful the music was - and that it was an album from 1982! So unique and - to use a cliché - ahead of its (and, for that matter, our) time.
I've often thought The Dreaming is on par with Hounds Of Love. It's just that former is the unorthodox bizarre creation that sometimes gets overshadowed by the masterful art-pop successor. Glad to see more people are giving this album the attention it deserves.
@@Missjunebugfreak Yes.I totally agree, both albums are amazing, I couldn't say which one I prefer. They are very different form each other, yet the same level of genius imo.
According to Kate biographer Graeme Thompson, EMI came very close to not releasing it at all. By the way, his book Under the Ivy, is the only book about Kate Bush you need to read.
Kate Bush is one of my all-time favourite artists, and I suddenly realise that it's been a while since I've listened to The Dreaming. Thanks for such a great overview of this album... I'm off to relisten 😍
What a wonderful conversation! And of course Steven Wilson would adore this album!!! I discovered him through his remixes of Gentle Giant, and I really believe this album of Kate Bush’s, as well as her previous and following releases, could arguably fit into the label of prog rock. It always feels so incongruous to hear this album being referred to as “a pop album.” Pop? Not really even Prog Rock! A better word would just be art. I believe the first side of Hounds of Love could be categorized as Pop, just because there are a handful of songs which certainly have a more even shape and sound, less esoteric, easier to put into context. The Dreaming is an escape into the world of imagination. This album is, in my opinion, live it or hate it, Kate Bush’s most pure and authentic creation, in my opinion, and an absolute masterpiece.
Huge fan of both Kate (since I first heard the Dreaming) and Steven (since the PT days) ... this interview was a real treat! FYI - my twin sons were students of Adam Holzman, the keyboardist in SWs solo touring band. The Twins and I have met and chatted with Steven on numerous occasions - he is quite an interesting Dude!
This is total sweet spot intersection for me. I have been big Kate fan since Wuthering Heights* AND The Dreaming is my favourite album by her AND Porcupine Tree / SW is my biggest music discovery as an adult. Thank You both! *Still remember when I heard it on small mono radio for the very first time. I believe I was 13 years old. So, it made lasting impression. Years leater, while in university, a friend hacked my Unix password; it was way too easy to guess: katebush
Now I got to hear "Sat In Your Lap" for the first time, after (like Steven) first being introduced to Kate with "Wurthering Heights". Fantastic stuff, Kate Bush is totally unique, her voice is so intriguing.
Yep. I heard that comment too. The Fairlight was all over that album. I think Never Forever was really her transitional record. From Dreaming on the sound never changed. Never Forever was an odd one. Of her four good albums, it's the patchiest. A definite step away from the chamber pop sound of her first two, but lacking the consistency of all the following albums.
"The Dreaming" isn't my favorite Kate Bush album, but my very favorites ("Hounds," "Aerial", "Sensual World") would never have emerged into the greatness they are without it. This was an insightful, great conversation of a record that deserves deep discussion and explication. Love Steven Wilson's own body of work, and his perspectives on this record are interesting and unsurprisingly sagacious. I, too, would love to hear him do her records in 5.1.
I agree, i always thought that too.. Tbh, I never liked 'The Dreaming' at first, but after Hounds of Love, I kind of realised what Kate was thinking.. And Kate Bush is formost a thinking or a contemplative artist..
"Watching you Without Me", "Mother Stands for Comfort" and maybe "Waking the Witch" could all have come out of TD they're maybe tighter and more streamlined but they're clearly its children
Wow, thanks Steven for your frank & intelligent analysis of that album. Love Kate Bush but I think I’m actually going to listen to more of SW now, seems like the guy in the pub/ bar you can talk forever to about music. Brilliant.
The first time she used the Fairlight was on Never for Ever and not The Dreaming. The breaking glass sound on Babooshka is a Fairlight use for instance.
Kate got the Fairlight very late in the production of Never For Ever, and it wasn't a principal compositional tool like it was with The Dreaming. A good example of that is when she performed Babooshka on the Dr Hook special and it was missing the glass smashes, that were added on the final mix.
@@midwestconcertvideo She confirmed herself in an interview she used it first time for Never For Ever, she even corrected the interviewer who made the same mistake.
Was always made fun of for liking Kate Bush/Roxy Music growing up in Canada, and this album would have had my friends put me in the nut house had I played it for them....always loved the Dreaming, especially Suspended in Gaffa...not my favourite KB LP, but its up there. Thanks for the discussion. Love your music Steve, you are so unique from all the crap we hear on the radio...thanks for not selling out.
This is one of my all time favourites albums when I first got it I didn't know if I liked it but I couldn't stop playing it that was 1982 and I haven't stopped playing it since a true masterpiece
"The Dreaming" is the only album of Kate Bush that didn't go Gold. (only Silver) . Creative, but not commercial. I'm a fan of the combination. Also of Steve Wilson's 5.1 mixes. He's a gift to the music world on several dimensions.
Kate Bush was the soundtrack to my childhood as my dad was a huge fan. For me , it was Never Forever. As a kid that album gave me nightmares. So many strange and evocative songs plus the creepy album artwork (sadly the connection between the music and the artwork is a dying experience, although great to see the re-emergence of vinyl!). I also think she set me on a path to my preference towards alternative music. She deserves all the plaudits she gets.
On a completely random note my neighbour was in the garden with the headphones on singing yesterday and I realised he was listening to Suspended in Gaffa. My favourite tracks are There Goes a Tenner, Suspended in Gaffa and The Dreaming.
Not Percy Thrower, Steve! He lived near me, BBC Gardener& fuchsia expert from Shrewsbury. I do own 'The Dreaming' - bought it the week it came out - agree about the vocals + drums mix - Loved the cartoon-type drawings on 'Forever' Album and was a regular at Peter Gabriel concerts at the time. Cheers H
Hi guys. Thank you for a very interesting video. Actually The Dreaming is my favourite Kate Bush album too. I never get tired of it. I love all the songs, but my favourites are Leave It Open and All The Love. Thanks to this review, I found your music too Steven! I have downloaded Hand.Cannot.Erase on Spotify today and it's stunning! I will be playing this record for years, and I will also check out the rest of your catalogue. Thank you! Best regards from Ståle in Oslo.
My first exposure to Kate Bush was when she did that great duet with Peter Gabriel in the song"Don't Give Up!"I was amazed by her bizarre style that no one has or will ever duplicate! I have three of her albums .she was very different in pitch and presentation,dynamic range,and just great!
I forgot that when Yeats ago I heard this album , I loved it but for the longest time after my first listening I wculd listen up to "Houdini" because " Get Out Of My House" scared me so much. I was 19 years old and over it now lol :)
funnily enough I had to listen to Steven WIlson's solo stuff and PT stuff several times before they really clicked too :). But it's worth it! The Dreaming is fantastic, I think it's so under-rated. The Night of the Swallow is my favourite but they're all great songs and so unique!
She already used her (own?) Fairlight CMI on her third Album "Never for Ever", see "Babooshka" as an example, after working with Peter Gabriel on "Melt". On "The Dreaming", she had some more experience with it, bringing it to perfection on "Hounds of Love"...
It’s the only album from the remastered 1 box set that I have yet to listen to so you’ve piqued my curiosity. I remember when it came out and reading a fairly scathing review of it in one of the pop mags so I always knew it was a different kettle of fish to the first 3. If only today’s artists were allowed to be as experimental and fearless.
I love Kate's album The Dreaming and Steven Wilson's album Hand Cannot Erase. The Dreaming is Kate's Prog album and it makes sense that the Prog master Steven Wilson would be inspired from it.
I'd only heard Kate Bush on a "Saturday Night Live" performance. I bought "The Dreaming" sight unheard and loved everything about it immediately. So much so that her back catalog disappointed me.Skip to the present...Nothing she has done since matches it in strength and genius. "Hounds", "Aerial" and "Snow" are great albums no one else could have made but "The Dreaming" stands above and beyond any of those.
I respect the intensity so much. You're right she never got there again, but Hounds of Love benefited greatly from the frontiers she found on The Dreaming. Its my favourite album hands down.
Wonderful, always a treat to hear Steven talk about music. Great interview, hope Kate watches this one too! This may be my favourite Kate Bush album as well, so daring and enchanting! Fascinating that many people seem to feel there's a "haunted" quality to the album. It sure takes you to weird places. There are also those who experience eerie moments of "synchronicity", while listening to the album and then something random happens, it becomes this "epic" moment :D
Yes, the narrative that they offer here won't bear close scrutiny. “Houdini” & “Night of the Swallow” have more a sumptuous sound with chamber strings and piano respectively: I think that they barely mention either. “All The Love” is a very pure ballad. Then they say that Hounds of Love drops the ventriloquising, while forgetting the dog barking in the title track or the multiple voices in “Waking The Witch”. Still, it's difficult to handle an album as diverse as The Dreaming even in a podcast of this length.
@@sordel5866 I guess the Dreaming is an album that when it REALLY hits you, it resonates on a personal note for every listener and becomes something truly unforgettable and unique. It works very well as a whole for me, possibly better than any of her other albums. It will always be too weird for some people but that's OK, not everybody has to love or even like it.
@@OperationPhantom I wish that SW hadn't focused so much on having to force himself to like it, though: while it's admittedly a divisive album I don't remember struggling with it as much as he did. The three albums that preceded it rather boiled a frog when it came to weirdness & eccentricity.
@@sordel5866 Yeah, well that's HIS take on it. Kinda surprised myself I guess, as I only remember being intrigued, a bit confused but quickly smitten with the album. There Goes a Tenner is like a perfect POP song to me :) Maybe as a musician he's all like "whoa, wait a minute... that's not how it's normally done..."
@@JonPickles I forgot that. I should have said not a very good surround mixer then. Would be a disaster if SW doesn’t do KB. Like the mess of Rush. Just did enough to demonstrate why he should have done it all.
I love everything Kate Bush has ever done. It's been a long while since I listened to the Dreaming. I was curious if Steven had ever actually met Kate.
I agree with Steven at 6.10 her first three albums are conventional and while they show an undoubted brilliance its muted and fenced in by conventional standards of the day i.e. a producer that was assigned to her and clearly there other people pulling the strings behind the scenes, they're interesting but not on the whole terribly exciting for me. With The Dreaming all that changed all those conventions and frankly people were thrown out and from then on Kate is in charge of her own destiny her own direction and honestly does what she wants and while in most artists that would likely be a recipe for disaster for Kate it totally freed her creativity and TD is simply an explosion of innovation and sheer naked creativity and while it sometimes doesn't always work enough does to make it an extraordinary album that I return to again and again as one of my favourites. Who else would or could dare to be as brave as Kate Bush?
No mention of the most moving song on the album, the hauntingly beautiful Houdini. It has all the hallmarks of the album, experimental, storytelling, drama, at once old and new, but notably doesn’t have the heavy reliance on percussion and harkens back to earlier Kate Bush songs with a simple gorgeous melody, lush string arrangement, and romance tinged with regret.
The flipside of the vinyl album sheet tells you explicitly what the code is in the song, Houdini always escapes, just as in NF she was partly free of inluence which she also used to become a producer in her own right for her own songs. She went on to over-produce in all albums after Hounds of Love.
My favorites are "There Goes A Tenner ", Pulling Out The Pin", Night Of The Swallow" "All The Love",' "Houdini ", and "Get Out Of My House".This is a great album, edgy and disturbing, and not for the fans who like the Kate Bush "Weathering Heights" style of music. This is dramatically different stuff!
I adore The Dreaming and I adore The Kick Inside. Two very different sounds, but Kate made them work in unbelievably well done ways. So I think The Dreaming can be for fans of Wuthering Heights.
It's different, but Wuthering Heights was just as extraordinary when it was first released. The Dreaming is taking the boldness and originality of the songwriting and vocal performance in Wuthering Heights and building on it. I imaging that most of the people who liked Wuthering Heights and followed Kate also love The Dreaming.
There's no one like Kate.There are those who would imitate;some blatantly so,but for me they don't have the song writing skill that Kate has,to write something like Wuthering Heights at 17 or 18 is incredible.I ask myself why can't artist out today who are perhaps the same age that Kate was when she started,be as good.The Dreaming is also my favourite album Get out of my house being my favourite track,that scream of anger in her saying "get out of my house".
Hounds of Love is 2 albums really, the A side, which is the "commercial" bangers. And then you turn the record and you're listening to her NInth Wave suite, a journey through the bardo between living and dying, told in the mode of a rescue at sea film. I also think Never Forever was the pivot. In The Dreaming she also allows herself to sound "ugly", even using double voice quite a lot.
Not to forget "All the love" with Eberhard Weber. For many years that was my favourite on this album. - I think every single song on this album deserves a talk not just the album as a whole. It's THAT deep! The only thing I would like to do with some parts is to give it more clarity in some of the EQ. - I think it could have been great if Steve Nye had come in at the end to do a bit of mopping up EQ-wise. ...
Is it just me or has Steven's public profile really increased recently? I remember back over a decade ago when Porcupine Tree was still a thing and he rarely if ever talked or gave interviews. He seems a lot more open and personable now.
"Leave It Open" is my favorite track on the album so I disagree with SW on this. Interesting, sticking with the difficult songs until we like them, I've done that myself plenty (including elsewhere on this album), do people still do this or is it something we are losing with cheap or free access to enormous quantities of music and the technology allowing us to cherry-pick at ease? It's such a powerful album, uncompromising, raw, effervescent, scolding hot, mind-bending, romantic, tragic... I came to it after falling in love with Hounds Of Love and The Sensual World, so probably around 1990, not when it was fresh out of the oven, but it still stood out a mile. I'd be interested to hear whether modern 20-somethings on hearing it find it unusual or outstanding or wonder what the fuss is about. I still only have this album on cassette, I've been meaning to upgrade but you know...
Get out of my house...Houdini....Suspended in gaffa............what can one say.......Emi were disappointed...the album had no hits and it didnt sell......Kate bush was Finally 'kate bush'......the album was beyond its time...and 40 years later IT STILL IS....The World in general will always play catch-uo with Kate.....only her true fans will KNOW
Night of the Swallow is possibly my favourite song of all time. In an album of utter genius, where every song is masterful, it soars.
it's in my top five.
People always cite "Hounds of Love" as being her best.I think it's "The Dreaming".It's the bravest album a female songwriter has ever produced-literally! This album keeps on giving the more you listen to it.She calls it her aggressive "city" album;it reflects her response to her critics,the industry,the Falklands War,etc....If she wanted her music to "intrude"....well...it certainly had.I believe it's her pointed response to being a sex symbol.pop star,industry commodity,etc.....Love the album and the experimentation.
YES
The Dreaming is unquestionably the superior of the two! Aside from the singles, I can't even remember any of the songs on Hounds. I thought it was boring, monotonous, uninspired, phoned-in. I'm the odd one out, I guess.
As a massive fan of Kate, "The Dreaming" is the masterpiece for me. "Leave it Open" and "Get out of my House" are the standouts.
It's definitely up there as one of her best. I am obsessed by her music. So much to admire and discover. She's one of a kind for sure. But the waiting between albums is so hard.....
I agree. Even though I think 'Hounds Of Love' is flawless, something about 'The Dreaming' is more compelling to me. It's just bizarre, experimental and creative in a way few albums can manage to do. Kate is a genius.
Each track on the album is better than every other track.
Weee let the weirdness innn..! ;-)
I agree but a think The Ninthwave may be her greatest work but as an album a think a just prefer The Dreaming that might be because The Big Sky is on HOL if that was replaced by Under The Ivy then it would be a tie for me 2 Masterpieces
I find it strange that people regard The Dreaming as an album that is steeped in synth pop. Almost every song with maybe two exceptions has piano, bass and drums as it'foundation. The fairlight is used as a distinct instrument, but the overall quality of the album is still very organic to me. The choices were intentionally extreme which always suits the themes very well. As for the 'strangness' of it, I am never comfortable with that term in creative criticism, because art IS strange, music IS strange, poetry IS strange, and all real pioneers ought to be foraging into strange, new realms. So The Dreaming is actually what recorded music OUGHT to be doing.
Well said!
The word 'genius' is thrown around too often, but Kate Bush objectively fits the criteria. Mostly self-taught as a young musician; writing outstanding work at a very young age [e.g. Man with the Child in His Eyes]; writing hugely successful work at a very young age; among the first, if not the first, female singer also to write a number 1 hit [in her teens]; taking over production when very few female artists did; extremely original and a unique sound etc. Even if you don't like her work, she meets the criteria of genius. I doubt she'd like that label though!
Completely agree.
Apparently Bjork says that Kate Bush is one of her biggest influences. I would say she fits most of that criteria too!
Eivor gives me the Kate vibes now plus some...
So does Steven Wilson
She wouldn't like the label at all infact she'd probably laugh and don't be so ridiculous she's so disarmingly self deprecating with a total absence of egotricity
This is my favourite album of all time an absolute MASTERPIECE
The Dreaming for me is her best work💜
If any other artist had released a song like "Wuthering Heights", it would have been the pinnacle of their career. But for Kate, it was only just the start - literally! Her artistic progression from '78 - '82 was nothing short of breathtaking.
I love the album, it's transitional, her most experimental. My favorite track which wasn't even touched on here is 'Night of the Swallow'. There's an anxiousness that pulls me in, some emotional singing too.
Yep. Night of the swallow is my favourite. I played it to the youngsters I work with and the look on their face was priceless.
one of mine too.
"Suspended in Gaffa" and "Houdini" are also worth talking about - moving and magical! "Get out of my House" was inspired by Kubrick's "The Shining", if I remember correctly. So scary, certainly!
I used to always assume that "Get Out of My House" was a metaphor song for rape. It still works on that level, and is still as scary/powerful.
@@fishdrew1111 it works on a lot of levels....
As a complete album, I think The Dreaming is probably her best album. It is like her Revolver, as good as the next album, but overshadowed by its hype.
Thank you. A truly extraordinary album, knocks my head in all directions every time I hear it.
Pull Out The Pin is a ridiculously underrated track.
For me Hounds of Love is her masterpiece, The ninth wave her concept piece is amazing.
Sat in you Lap was my first Kate Bush 7” as a 13 year old..... incredible song 💜
Most artists: "How do I make my voice sound good?"
Kate Bush: "What can I do with this crazy-cool instrument I was born with?"
Her lack of concern for current musical "trends" is why Aerial is my most listened to album of all time - it's ageless, timeless, and immortal, and a joy every time.
i feel the same,it's taken years but Aerial is now my favourite Kate album
@@browny44 Same here!
The Dreaming for me is Kate's unorthodox masterpiece. Steven is right in saying this album is the one where she explores every aspect of her voice in a way that she never did again.
Great to hear an interviewer who really knows their subject and more importantly allows the interviewee to talk at length without constant interruptions. I love this album and the videos that were made for at least 4 of the tracks. I just wish Kate would release a DVD compilation of ALL of her videos!
Glad to see this masterpiece receiving the appreciation it deserves. When I first heard it around 14 years ago, I couldn't believe how experimental and weird and beautiful the music was - and that it was an album from 1982! So unique and - to use a cliché - ahead of its (and, for that matter, our) time.
I've often thought The Dreaming is on par with Hounds Of Love. It's just that former is the unorthodox bizarre creation that sometimes gets overshadowed by the masterful art-pop successor.
Glad to see more people are giving this album the attention it deserves.
@@Missjunebugfreak Yes.I totally agree, both albums are amazing, I couldn't say which one I prefer. They are very different form each other, yet the same level of genius imo.
@@Missjunebugfreak I like it better.
The Dreaming is my favorite Kate Bush album - so creative and out there - 'We let the weirdness in"
This is my favourite Kate Bush album. As a composer, myself, I dig the experimentalism
I remember lots of people hating the album when it came out. I loved it. It was so fresh and adventurous. Over time I feel I have been vindicated.
According to Kate biographer Graeme Thompson, EMI came very close to not releasing it at all.
By the way, his book Under the Ivy, is the only book about Kate Bush you need to read.
Kate Bush is one of my all-time favourite artists, and I suddenly realise that it's been a while since I've listened to The Dreaming. Thanks for such a great overview of this album... I'm off to relisten 😍
This is my favourite Kate Bush album. A focus on percussion and unusual rhythms is right up my street.
The first use of Fairlight CMI was on Never for Ever
What a wonderful conversation! And of course Steven Wilson would adore this album!!! I discovered him through his remixes of Gentle Giant, and I really believe this album of Kate Bush’s, as well as her previous and following releases, could arguably fit into the label of prog rock. It always feels so incongruous to hear this album being referred to as “a pop album.” Pop? Not really even Prog Rock! A better word would just be art. I believe the first side of Hounds of Love could be categorized as Pop, just because there are a handful of songs which certainly have a more even shape and sound, less esoteric, easier to put into context. The Dreaming is an escape into the world of imagination. This album is, in my opinion, live it or hate it, Kate Bush’s most pure and authentic creation, in my opinion, and an absolute masterpiece.
Huge fan of both Kate (since I first heard the Dreaming) and Steven (since the PT days) ... this interview was a real treat! FYI - my twin sons were students of Adam Holzman, the keyboardist in SWs solo touring band. The Twins and I have met and chatted with Steven on numerous occasions - he is quite an interesting Dude!
SW introduced me to Kate Bush, been obsessed ever since.
This is total sweet spot intersection for me. I have been big Kate fan since Wuthering Heights* AND The Dreaming is my favourite album by her AND Porcupine Tree / SW is my biggest music discovery as an adult. Thank You both!
*Still remember when I heard it on small mono radio for the very first time. I believe I was 13 years old. So, it made lasting impression. Years leater, while in university, a friend hacked my Unix password; it was way too easy to guess: katebush
Now I got to hear "Sat In Your Lap" for the first time, after (like Steven) first being introduced to Kate with "Wurthering Heights". Fantastic stuff, Kate Bush is totally unique, her voice is so intriguing.
It's the best seeing other people geeking out about your favorite Artist
One thing they got wrong - Kate actually used the Fairlight CMI quite a bit on her previous album, Never Forever. Peter Gabriel introduced her to it.
Thanks to Peter Gabriel for opening the doors
Just what I was thinking.
Yep. I heard that comment too. The Fairlight was all over that album. I think Never Forever was really her transitional record. From Dreaming on the sound never changed. Never Forever was an odd one. Of her four good albums, it's the patchiest. A definite step away from the chamber pop sound of her first two, but lacking the consistency of all the following albums.
"The Dreaming" isn't my favorite Kate Bush album, but my very favorites ("Hounds," "Aerial", "Sensual World") would never have emerged into the greatness they are without it. This was an insightful, great conversation of a record that deserves deep discussion and explication. Love Steven Wilson's own body of work, and his perspectives on this record are interesting and unsurprisingly sagacious. I, too, would love to hear him do her records in 5.1.
Without "The dreaming" There is no "Hounds of love"
I agree, i always thought that too.. Tbh, I never liked 'The Dreaming' at first, but after Hounds of Love, I kind of realised what Kate was thinking.. And Kate Bush is formost a thinking or a contemplative artist..
Woah!
It certainly was the primer. Although it’s hard to not see Hounds as a pinnacle.
"Watching you Without Me", "Mother Stands for Comfort" and maybe "Waking the Witch" could all have come out of TD they're maybe tighter and more streamlined but they're clearly its children
I enjoy listening to Steve speak.
A very interesting conversation about a special album. Inspires me to listen to the album again. Thank you very much for this post.
Marvelous discussion. I've never heard somebody analysing a record in a so deep way as in this video.
Thank you!
Wow, thanks Steven for your frank & intelligent analysis of that album. Love Kate Bush but I think I’m actually going to listen to more of SW now, seems like the guy in the pub/ bar you can talk forever to about music. Brilliant.
The first time she used the Fairlight was on Never for Ever and not The Dreaming. The breaking glass sound on Babooshka is a Fairlight use for instance.
Kate got the Fairlight very late in the production of Never For Ever, and it wasn't a principal compositional tool like it was with The Dreaming. A good example of that is when she performed Babooshka on the Dr Hook special and it was missing the glass smashes, that were added on the final mix.
@@midwestconcertvideo She confirmed herself in an interview she used it first time for Never For Ever, she even corrected the interviewer who made the same mistake.
What a great discussion , so many insights from both of you. An incredible album in the strictest sense of the word
Percy Thrower was the gardening chap and Percy Edwards was the bird impersonator.
Ah Blue Peter!
Yup, and let's all agree to skip over Rolf Harris who came in later.
Deep Esoteric knowledge here!
Was always made fun of for liking Kate Bush/Roxy Music growing up in Canada, and this album would have had my friends put me in the nut house had I played it for them....always loved the Dreaming, especially Suspended in Gaffa...not my favourite KB LP, but its up there. Thanks for the discussion. Love your music Steve, you are so unique from all the crap we hear on the radio...thanks for not selling out.
Who would make fun of you for listening to excellent artists like Kate Bush and Roxy Music?
This is one of my all time favourites albums when I first got it I didn't know if I liked it but I couldn't stop playing it that was 1982 and I haven't stopped playing it since a true masterpiece
Get Out of My House is my all time favorite!! Love Kate!!
"The Dreaming" is the only album of Kate Bush that didn't go Gold. (only Silver) .
Creative, but not commercial. I'm a fan of the combination.
Also of Steve Wilson's 5.1 mixes. He's a gift to the music world on several dimensions.
Absolutely essential. And I share Steven's obsession with Kate Bush of course😊
Kate Bush was the soundtrack to my childhood as my dad was a huge fan. For me , it was Never Forever. As a kid that album gave me nightmares. So many strange and evocative songs plus the creepy album artwork (sadly the connection between the music and the artwork is a dying experience, although great to see the re-emergence of vinyl!). I also think she set me on a path to my preference towards alternative music. She deserves all the plaudits she gets.
Kate Bush... Steven Wilson... We are on Mount Olympus ... observing two gods...
On a completely random note my neighbour was in the garden with the headphones on singing yesterday and I realised he was listening to Suspended in Gaffa. My favourite tracks are There Goes a Tenner, Suspended in Gaffa and The Dreaming.
Not Percy Thrower, Steve! He lived near me, BBC Gardener& fuchsia expert from Shrewsbury. I do own 'The Dreaming' - bought it the week it came out - agree about the vocals + drums mix - Loved the cartoon-type drawings on 'Forever' Album and was a regular at Peter Gabriel concerts at the time. Cheers H
Just been getting into Kate Bush. Some absolutely incredible albums. Cool to hear Steven talk about it as well.
Hi guys. Thank you for a very interesting video. Actually The Dreaming is my favourite Kate Bush album too. I never get tired of it. I love all the songs, but my favourites are Leave It Open and All The Love. Thanks to this review, I found your music too Steven! I have downloaded Hand.Cannot.Erase on Spotify today and it's stunning! I will be playing this record for years, and I will also check out the rest of your catalogue.
Thank you! Best regards from Ståle in Oslo.
My first exposure to Kate Bush was when she did that great duet with Peter Gabriel in the song"Don't Give Up!"I was amazed by her bizarre style that no one has or will ever duplicate! I have three of her albums .she was very different in pitch and presentation,dynamic range,and just great!
Now at 42 Years old. I wondered,…how the darn didnt I heard this album before??…..So fast it became one of my loved ones.
And the drums on Sat in your lap! A 6/8 with drums as a melody bit like Japan on Tin Drum which came out at around the same time...
Very nice discussion!
I forgot that when Yeats ago I heard this album , I loved it but for the longest time after my first listening I wculd listen up to "Houdini" because " Get Out Of My House" scared me so much. I was 19 years old and over it now lol :)
My favorite track off The Dreaming is All the Love. 😍
Pull Out The Pin is one of my favourite songs of all time
Great vid, I love The Dreaming, it’s so multilayered and fantastic production
funnily enough I had to listen to Steven WIlson's solo stuff and PT stuff several times before they really clicked too :). But it's worth it!
The Dreaming is fantastic, I think it's so under-rated. The Night of the Swallow is my favourite but they're all great songs and so unique!
It was such a leap from Never For Ever to The Dreaming. I’ve loved it since I was 15 and I am 50 now.
@17:45 except the notably sick guitar on Pull out the Pin.
Such a great album.
She already used her (own?) Fairlight CMI on her third Album "Never for Ever", see "Babooshka" as an example, after working with Peter Gabriel on "Melt". On "The Dreaming", she had some more experience with it, bringing it to perfection on "Hounds of Love"...
It’s the only album from the remastered 1 box set that I have yet to listen to so you’ve piqued my curiosity. I remember when it came out and reading a fairly scathing review of it in one of the pop mags so I always knew it was a different kettle of fish to the first 3. If only today’s artists were allowed to be as experimental and fearless.
I love Kate's album The Dreaming and Steven Wilson's album Hand Cannot Erase. The Dreaming is Kate's Prog album and it makes sense that the Prog master Steven Wilson would be inspired from it.
Wonderful interview on a fantastic record.
I'd only heard Kate Bush on a "Saturday Night Live" performance. I bought "The Dreaming" sight unheard and loved everything about it immediately. So much so that her back catalog disappointed me.Skip to the present...Nothing she has done since matches it in strength and genius. "Hounds", "Aerial" and "Snow" are great albums no one else could have made but "The Dreaming" stands above and beyond any of those.
Aerial and Before the Dawn are two of my favourites
I respect the intensity so much. You're right she never got there again, but Hounds of Love benefited greatly from the frontiers she found on The Dreaming. Its my favourite album hands down.
it was my first exposure to her, given to me on a cassette by a friend. Loved it immediately and yes, the rest are not as good. :-)
'Drums and her voice' what an amazing definition of her artistry at her peak.
Wonderful, always a treat to hear Steven talk about music. Great interview, hope Kate watches this one too!
This may be my favourite Kate Bush album as well, so daring and enchanting! Fascinating that many people seem to feel there's a "haunted" quality to the album. It sure takes you to weird places. There are also those who experience eerie moments of "synchronicity", while listening to the album and then something random happens, it becomes this "epic" moment :D
Yes, the narrative that they offer here won't bear close scrutiny. “Houdini” & “Night of the Swallow” have more a sumptuous sound with chamber strings and piano respectively: I think that they barely mention either. “All The Love” is a very pure ballad. Then they say that Hounds of Love drops the ventriloquising, while forgetting the dog barking in the title track or the multiple voices in “Waking The Witch”. Still, it's difficult to handle an album as diverse as The Dreaming even in a podcast of this length.
@@sordel5866 I guess the Dreaming is an album that when it REALLY hits you, it resonates on a personal note for every listener and becomes something truly unforgettable and unique. It works very well as a whole for me, possibly better than any of her other albums. It will always be too weird for some people but that's OK, not everybody has to love or even like it.
@@OperationPhantom I wish that SW hadn't focused so much on having to force himself to like it, though: while it's admittedly a divisive album I don't remember struggling with it as much as he did. The three albums that preceded it rather boiled a frog when it came to weirdness & eccentricity.
@@sordel5866 Yeah, well that's HIS take on it. Kinda surprised myself I guess, as I only remember being intrigued, a bit confused but quickly smitten with the album. There Goes a Tenner is like a perfect POP song to me :) Maybe as a musician he's all like "whoa, wait a minute... that's not how it's normally done..."
Superb really enjoyed this, one.
Night of the swallow reminds me of walking through piles of crispy leaves, has an Irish flavour to it.
"I don't know if I like it, but I think it's amazing" pretty much sums it up. :)
Why won’t Kate Bush get SW to do Surround Sound Mix of her back catalogue. HOL in 5.1? Sweet!
He wants to. Couldn’t get her interested I believe. This may change.
She has Stephen W Tayler to do the remixes. He did her live show and 50 words for Snow.
@@JonPickles Not a surround mixer though
@@TheCleasby he is and he’s done all the Be Bop Deluxe and many more
@@JonPickles I forgot that. I should have said not a very good surround mixer then. Would be a disaster if SW doesn’t do KB. Like the mess of Rush. Just did enough to demonstrate why he should have done it all.
The dreaming is a masterpiece. The soundtrack of my adolescence 😜
Yep, for me as a musician and composer ... It's brilliant
The Dreaming (the track) is awesome.
Say what you will about Steven, he often has great taste in albums.
He listen to everything that isn't popular and well known.
I love everything Kate Bush has ever done. It's been a long while since I listened to the Dreaming. I was curious if Steven had ever actually met Kate.
Hounds was the first album I heard, so it's hard to warm up to others being better. I like The Dreaming, so I'll try to listen to it more.
Steven has also noted the song “All The Love”, in particular the section with the choir boy, as having inspired him when making Hand Cannot Erase.
I agree with Steven at 6.10 her first three albums are conventional and while they show an undoubted brilliance its muted and fenced in by conventional standards of the day i.e. a producer that was assigned to her and clearly there other people pulling the strings behind the scenes, they're interesting but not on the whole terribly exciting for me. With The Dreaming all that changed all those conventions and frankly people were thrown out and from then on Kate is in charge of her own destiny her own direction and honestly does what she wants and while in most artists that would likely be a recipe for disaster for Kate it totally freed her creativity and TD is simply an explosion of innovation and sheer naked creativity and while it sometimes doesn't always work enough does to make it an extraordinary album that I return to again and again as one of my favourites. Who else would or could dare to be as brave as Kate Bush?
The Dreaming is just one of those abums where pop succesfully becomes art... (just like Japan's Tin Drum but with more diverse colour...)
The title track: a big BANG of experimentation!
That album isn't easy to digest at first. Isn't accessible at all. You have to listen to it at least 5 times. Then you will love it.
The 'chorus' on There goes a Tenner.....All the Love, etc. Atmospheric masterpiece.
No mention of the most moving song on the album, the hauntingly beautiful Houdini. It has all the hallmarks of the album, experimental, storytelling, drama, at once old and new, but notably doesn’t have the heavy reliance on percussion and harkens back to earlier Kate Bush songs with a simple gorgeous melody, lush string arrangement, and romance tinged with regret.
The flipside of the vinyl album sheet tells you explicitly what the code is in the song, Houdini always escapes, just as in NF she was partly free of inluence which she also used to become a producer in her own right for her own songs. She went on to over-produce in all albums after Hounds of Love.
Leave it Open is my fav from this album, but I love the thing tbh.
My favorites are "There Goes A Tenner ", Pulling Out The Pin", Night Of The Swallow" "All The Love",' "Houdini ", and "Get Out Of My House".This is a great album, edgy and disturbing, and not for the fans who like the Kate Bush "Weathering Heights" style of music. This is dramatically different stuff!
I agree. The dreaming is brilliant but is not for all the kind of ears.
I adore The Dreaming and I adore The Kick Inside. Two very different sounds, but Kate made them work in unbelievably well done ways. So I think The Dreaming can be for fans of Wuthering Heights.
@@ashtabet3450 I think you' re right
It's different, but Wuthering Heights was just as extraordinary when it was first released. The Dreaming is taking the boldness and originality of the songwriting and vocal performance in Wuthering Heights and building on it. I imaging that most of the people who liked Wuthering Heights and followed Kate also love The Dreaming.
There's no one like Kate.There are those who would imitate;some blatantly so,but for me they don't have the song writing skill that Kate has,to write something like Wuthering Heights at 17 or 18 is incredible.I ask myself why can't artist out today who are perhaps the same age that Kate was when she started,be as good.The Dreaming is also my favourite album Get out of my house being my favourite track,that scream of anger in her saying "get out of my house".
Pull Out the Pin and Houdini are my favorites
Aerial or Before the Dawn for me the peak of this extraordinary artist.
Please Steven;do a remaster of "The Dreaming".
Hounds of Love is 2 albums really, the A side, which is the "commercial" bangers. And then you turn the record and you're listening to her NInth Wave suite, a journey through the bardo between living and dying, told in the mode of a rescue at sea film. I also think Never Forever was the pivot. In The Dreaming she also allows herself to sound "ugly", even using double voice quite a lot.
Not to forget "All the love" with Eberhard Weber. For many years that was my favourite on this album. - I think every single song on this album deserves a talk not just the album as a whole. It's THAT deep!
The only thing I would like to do with some parts is to give it more clarity in some of the EQ. - I think it could have been great if Steve Nye had come in at the end to do a bit of mopping up EQ-wise. ...
Is it just me or has Steven's public profile really increased recently? I remember back over a decade ago when Porcupine Tree was still a thing and he rarely if ever talked or gave interviews. He seems a lot more open and personable now.
Ya no kidding, maybe since marriage he's become more social?
Just listening to her albums makes me feel smarter.
Love it :)
@7:40 “I don’t need musicians anymore...” except the best bassists I can find!!
She said I don’t need....
"Leave It Open" is my favorite track on the album so I disagree with SW on this. Interesting, sticking with the difficult songs until we like them, I've done that myself plenty (including elsewhere on this album), do people still do this or is it something we are losing with cheap or free access to enormous quantities of music and the technology allowing us to cherry-pick at ease? It's such a powerful album, uncompromising, raw, effervescent, scolding hot, mind-bending, romantic, tragic... I came to it after falling in love with Hounds Of Love and The Sensual World, so probably around 1990, not when it was fresh out of the oven, but it still stood out a mile. I'd be interested to hear whether modern 20-somethings on hearing it find it unusual or outstanding or wonder what the fuss is about. I still only have this album on cassette, I've been meaning to upgrade but you know...
Get out of my house...Houdini....Suspended in gaffa............what can one say.......Emi were disappointed...the album had no hits and it didnt sell......Kate bush was Finally 'kate bush'......the album was beyond its time...and 40 years later IT STILL IS....The World in general will always play catch-uo with Kate.....only her true fans will KNOW