imo part of the problem is as you say power creep, i think also the transition from 6v6 to 5v5 has made tank be put in an interesting spot, where tank used to check other tanks and due to two of them existing it gave more breathing room to do "fun" pushes, now as tank you either have to play turtle hoping your dps blows up the enemy tank first or basically half forget working together and play doom/jk doing anything in the middle usually ends up you blowing up first
I agree, especially with the 5v5. The game lost a lot with only having 1 tank on each team. Theres no longer any tank synergies (rip zarya & rein). But also just 1 buffed tank has way less presence than 2 slightly weaker tanks, the 2 tanks simply had twice as much abilities being used, as well as significantly more stats to throw around. Theres no other tank to fall back on if your tank is bad, and tanks cant rely on each other either.
@@milkevgaming you can't fall back on 1 tank in 6v6 if one of your tanks were bad unless the enemy team was also bad combining tank abilities together was really exponentially stronger, so if your team had a bad tank duo like zarya + dva with no synergy and the enemy team had good synergy you would get rolled and be stuck at choke points also, i disagree that tanks were weaker, on launch rien used to have 2k shield hp (changed to 1.6k towards the end of the game's lifespan) and he used to insta kill on pin, dva's matrix used to last longer and she didn't have a cooldown on it, hog used to one shot combo so easily, zarya's beam hitbox used to grow with energy, orisa had a mini zarya ult on cooldown and a shield and they nerfed fortify recently, oh and sig's rock used to stun for longer and he could one shot you with a rock + sphere combo
For me, the problem isn’t even the game. It’s the other players. If you’re playing tank on the losing team, you’re getting blamed for it, you’re getting flamed for not switching heroes, and the enemy tank player is stroking his ego all over you in text chat. God help you if you ACTUALLY got diffed that round. Oh and if you talk shit back to them you get chat banned for 14 days
This. Nobody wants to talk about every single new character getting a get-out-of-jail-free button to go with the old characters that already had one. We can look at Ana as the perfect counter example to this. She has a skill shot where if she lands it she gets away, if she misses it or is outplayed, she dies. Contrast that with Kiri who presses one button and is instantly halfway across the map with no option for counterplay
Agreed, even though anti can feel really powerful against tanks like hog/mauga, it still feels like there's room to outplay her since she has a weakness of no mobility. Most supports don't have significant weaknesses, or the ones they have can be reduced by the other support's cooldowns. This makes it really frustrating, since it makes the optimal play as tank to force/block cooldowns, instead of making space through kill potential. Unless you're a flavor of the month tank I guess.
As a tracer player if they are gonna buff tracer I would much prefer a spread buff than a damage buff because she already kills fast at close range she doesn’t need to kill faster there it would be better to be able to poke a little bit.
What killed playing the role for me is that every time I found something fun or rewarding about a tank they without fail would ruin it in some way and I've honestly just gotten tired of it. Forget other heroes making my life miserable I'm not even enjoying the tanks in a vacuum anymore.
No one talks about this but fundamentally the reason why tank feels like shit and probably always be the lack of being able to push something. In overwatch 1 2 tanks had amazing cooldown synergy even if it was only for 2 seconds to go in and fight. If there was an off angle your d.va would take care of it, or your sigma would fight it and give some much needed coverage. Now it's all about 1v1's on dps. In theory that's better for dps being able to 1v1. BUT much of the map design has chokes, highground, or off angles that are incredibly hard to contest. As a tank you cant fight it all and even as dps walking into the enemy teams advantage can be daunting and scary. I wanna off angle as soldier on Meka Base oops hanzo has the angle locked down on bridge. Oh i guess i'll go main oop there's too much spam damage and my tank can't go in. Let's go low ground whoops in a kill box Tanks like D.va and zarya feel amazing when your the one taking care of of angles flankers etc. But now you also have to fight main like a main tank. Contain the enemy tank. Contest high ground. All with honestly not that great of a cooldown to do so. Rein get's off angled easily, winston get's blown up, by dps and lacks many ways of staying in if he has to commit jump onto high ground. No matter how many good cooldowns 1 tank has it will never truly be able to block the space that 2 tanks did. Map control is incredibly hard as 1 tank. I think if 5v5 continues there needs to be a lot of reworks to maps to make them feel like you can actually contest the angles I think samoa is a good maps for 5v5. Smaller, each choke has a lot of different angles but are short enough to rush and push people out. Highground is good but it's not oppressive like Havana, or numbani. While I was playing open que with friends we did 2 tanks 1 dps and 2 supports and its wild how much better most of the maps felt when you had a tank protecting an angle and how much more dynamic team fights got. Being able to actually have map control or true pushes with cooldowns back and forth brought me back to why I loved overwatch 1. But we aren't getting that back so I think one of the easier ways is to look at map design and see how each map could be improved now that there's more limited cooldowns on both sides I would say most of the orignal maps could have slightly lower highground or less empty space to facilitate brawl and dive more effectively. But i'm not sure what everyone else would think about that
regarding the tracer buff we've already buffed her like that before, and she became gigabroken and had to get nerfed to 5.5 where she is now and now we're putting it back to 6? like?
As a super mega bronze master, which doesn't say or mean much, I still have a blast playing Winton, but I've had to make a whole new playstyle to work with it. But when getting a Kiriko, Moira, or Genji, someone who excels at cleaning up low HP kills, really enables the dive and they can help clean up the under powered Tesla Cannon. The changes look good on paper, but Mauga and Bastion are still hard to play against, and swapping off Monke King is better overall, even if I can isolate targets that holding better positions.
Out of touch devs killed tanks. Again FInnaly someone who says dpses are the problem. Word. dpses make you absolutely miserable. Not that supports are not busted but there is more tankbusters now than tanks. Heck even soljorn can delete you so hard and there is absolutely nothing you can do about it except stand and hold shield
I’m not high rank, mostly gold, but honestly i love playing tank, and it’s all about taking space. If you don’t have space in any circumstance and go 1v5, then you’re throwing the game
i think they needed to rework EVERY hero. It's a whole new format, and we're now seeing the consequences of switching to 5v5 and doing some half-assed changes. 100 extra health for a tank is not going to make up for the loss of a matrix, an extra shield, or a bubble.
To throw my two cents in on why tank is having so many issues right now is that Tank is not allowed to make big plays anymore. If you look at the tanks that are good, its the tanks that just ware down the enemy resources until nothing is left. Orisa does that by simply being unkillable, sigma does that by absorbing so much damage for his team, I would also through Rammatra into this as that is how he is played from what I have seen. Rein kinda does this through being a shield bot as mentioned in the video. Try and play Rein normally and you instantly get shut down by supports being supports, damage going to counter you if you had too much fun and the dreaded horse making life hell. Winton hasn't had much time to shine outside of top level organized play as he is fundamentally a play making tank, Winston cant poke out the enemy and grind them down, he doesn't have the sustain to do that, same can be said about ball to an extent. Without an offtank to help take some of the pressure off, this wear down the enemy style will probably be the only style of tank that is allowed to exist unless something breaks and can overpower everything else.
the 5v5 change killed every off tank. no off tank was designed to be the ONLY tank on the team and forcing them into that completely guts their playstyle (zarya, dva, hog, ball). now as a tank you're just so lonely out there. theres no pressure release valve by ur side so half the time you spend as tank is just holding a corner. doesnt help that every character now is movement crept out the fucking ass. they've boiled tank down to do 1 thing only and that's make space. that's the value tank brings and practically nothing else.
shout out to overwatch team taking a year to "rework" hog to only give him an aoe 150damage junk rat trap all because they refuse to nerf ana nade from cutting off 100% healing to something like 50-75%
Its kinda like the people that threw up red flags about the 6v6 to 5v5 switch were right and never stop being vindicated (despite all the hate we got at the time), but thats none of my business
Im a onetrick hog i slso dont like the meta is has been the same since season 6 its the same dps and support with both having broken abilities and tanks need to pick high sustain tanks because if not you just explote so i hope they nerf the abilities like soujorn rail gun ana nades brig in general support passive hack on tanks bastion turret form lifegrip is just not fun to play against and onestly even with the abilities it just feels like tanks and some dps are just playing against a overpawerd version of dobleshield without shild intead healing and inmortality abilities that protect inmense amount of high damage heroes
i dont get why you think rineheart is just standing there likei play him in mid plat and i play with him in mid dia but i see plenty movement and denial space and having plenty fun
how you shatter so fast after charging? i think at some point short or vid flats was mentioning some key switching to make getting out of charge with sheild faster? or its just me?
How did you go through this whole video without mentioning Dva? She's the perfect in between of being a protector for her team (defense matrixing teammate pharah or reaper ults, peeling for the backline to dm/bully the enemy diving your Zen/Ana/etc.) And being a 3rd dps having a good burst dmg combo that can delete squishy's and put some serious pressure on other tanks bar for like zarya and a fortified orisa. The way she's designed is perfect for 5v5 having the mobility to be anywhere on the map she wants every few seconds, free use basically no cd shield similar rein and sig to protect allies and deny the enemy team value and respectable but not busted dps output so she can confirm picks herself. Also now that 6v6 is no more her ult is more useful too because there aren't 3+ shields every game blocking it and can guarantee at least one free kill as long as you know how to use it. All of this sounds broken on paper but it's balanced due to her having the largest and a center mass critbox and being hard countered by beam heroes except Moira and Winston
hmmmm i personally feel like dva's damage output is not that great, and you can't just dive like a winston with bubble. Dva would need to rely on another cooldown like lifegrip to get you out. She's more of a straight up bodyguard to flankers but doesn't have much threatening presence to push the enemy team (or their tank) away.
@RexelBartolome agreed. As soon as I see an enemy D.va I know it's a free win. You just press W on her and she evaporates or she runs and you delete her squishies. D.va is in a much worse spot than Ow1 and it's not close
@@ieatsand9259that was an issue with the devs abandoning the game. Complaining about double shield is a meme. Double shield because strong after the final orisa change and then they left the game alone for 2 years to "work" on ow2. Orisa's fortify buff at the tail end of ow1 invalidated dive, otherwise double shield was easily counterable by just playing a comp that goes around the sheilds like Winston diva, but then fortify made orisa unkillable therefore undivable. It was a balance issue, not a format issue. They changed to 5v5 solely to improve queue times, which directly helps their bottom lines because casuals aren't going to wait 5+ minutes to queue
So Zarya is trash, in your opinion, despite high damage giving her high charge and therefore her own high damage, if you are smart (by bubbling team mates first, before you commit).
The OW2 tank reworks have been horrible in my opinion. Doomfist, Orisa, Roadhog, & Wrecking Ball need reworked, even more so in 5v5. Tanks focused only on damage, self-sustain, and CC are not fun to play alongside or against, no matter what role you're on. Every tank should have some form of team protection ability; like even though Junker Queen is overly stated in self-sustain and kill potential and so I'd like her re-balanced, she does still have Commanding Shout to help her team. Below is the direction I'd like them to take the 4 tanks I mentioned: *Doomfist* * Moved from Tank to Damage Role * Base health reduced from 450 to 250 Power Block * Ability Removed Rising Uppercut * OW1 Rising Uppercut Added * Reduce upwards travel and knock-up of Uppercut Seismic Slam * Now also allows for targeting the ground mid-air to travel downward (damage ramping from OW1 would stay gone, and Doomfist keeps the OW2 verticality to his Slam) Rocket Punch * No longer stuns * Wall impact damage removed * Knock-back reduced * Impact damage buffed (would do less than 200 impact damage) * Charge up time buffed Meteor Strike * Slow on enemies removed * Outer-ring damage buffed *Orisa* * Reworked back to OW1 Orisa's abilities * Barrier balanced around having an 8 second cooldown so she can reposition more * Possibly make Orisa's barrier a little bit more of a tunnel, that way enemies can't out-maneuver it quite as easily * Fortify nerfed so Orisa is weaker up close *Roadhog* * Take a Breather forms gas (healing and damage reduction field) around Roadhog to support allies like it did during the Feb 2020 1-3-2 experimental card. The difference is that TaB would be a resource meter like it currently is on live servers, and the gas would not be a field that instantly is at its max size, instead, the gas would keep coming out of TaB as long as Roadhog is using it, and would accumulate into a bigger cloud if gas is already near Roadhog. Roadhog can walk in a line using TaB, and a trail of gas would be left behind for allies to be sustained by, or Roadhog can stay in the same area while using TaB, and the gas forms into a bigger circular area to sustain himself and his team. * Pig Pen damage reduced, and slow effect weakened. * Roadhog would be balanced around having a 7 second Hook cooldown (1 second higher cooldown). * Whole Hog re-balanced to knock back enemies less and deal less damage because it knocks enemies back less. *Wrecking Ball* * Adaptive Shields reworked into an ability that reduces the amount of damage enemies deal for a set duration (so Wrecking Ball can reduce damage done to his team). * Reduce Wrecking Ball's knock-back. * Slightly reduce Pile Driver's knock-up distance. * Reduce max duration of Mine Field (20 seconds is too long).
Roadhog was never balanced around his hook to begin with. It was his ability to dump on squishy damage characters that people complained about the most. Plus hook only takes off 5 HP now, so the nerf to the cool down is unwarranted. Also the nerf to whole Hog is pointless as well because half the time the push force works against you. You can only get kills with it by either forcing someone against a wall to take advantage of the damage or throw them off a cliff; you can hook them back into range but it's only just one person while others will use the knockback to escape.
ughhhhhhh like all of this is true but its just that at the end of the day... you need a second tank... like lmao i know this talking point has been talked to death but the reason those "hyper mobile, borderline dps tanks" are good is because they can lowkey be everywhere at once like doom who can slam high ground to contest soldier, fall off, punch the ram or rein INTO your team to put pressure on him, farm for empowered punch then wait for slam again and now empower punch the zen in the background which is a borderline guaranteed kill even someone else even sneezes on him. meanwhile all the enemy rein can do in that situation is like you said... hold shield and pray that you dont get bursted down and that your dps pop off since you holding shield lets them stand in the open a bit more.
imo part of the problem is as you say power creep, i think also the transition from 6v6 to 5v5 has made tank be put in an interesting spot, where tank used to check other tanks and due to two of them existing it gave more breathing room to do "fun" pushes, now as tank you either have to play turtle hoping your dps blows up the enemy tank first or basically half forget working together and play doom/jk doing anything in the middle usually ends up you blowing up first
I agree, especially with the 5v5. The game lost a lot with only having 1 tank on each team. Theres no longer any tank synergies (rip zarya & rein). But also just 1 buffed tank has way less presence than 2 slightly weaker tanks, the 2 tanks simply had twice as much abilities being used, as well as significantly more stats to throw around. Theres no other tank to fall back on if your tank is bad, and tanks cant rely on each other either.
@@milkevgaming you can't fall back on 1 tank in 6v6 if one of your tanks were bad unless the enemy team was also bad
combining tank abilities together was really exponentially stronger, so if your team had a bad tank duo like zarya + dva with no synergy and the enemy team had good synergy you would get rolled and be stuck at choke points
also, i disagree that tanks were weaker, on launch rien used to have 2k shield hp (changed to 1.6k towards the end of the game's lifespan) and he used to insta kill on pin, dva's matrix used to last longer and she didn't have a cooldown on it, hog used to one shot combo so easily, zarya's beam hitbox used to grow with energy, orisa had a mini zarya ult on cooldown and a shield and they nerfed fortify recently, oh and sig's rock used to stun for longer and he could one shot you with a rock + sphere combo
For me, the problem isn’t even the game. It’s the other players. If you’re playing tank on the losing team, you’re getting blamed for it, you’re getting flamed for not switching heroes, and the enemy tank player is stroking his ego all over you in text chat. God help you if you ACTUALLY got diffed that round.
Oh and if you talk shit back to them you get chat banned for 14 days
And if you even dare to point out your underperforming dps you instantly get mass reported and banned. It's just a sign of incompetent devs
Hot take: if mobility creep was dealt with we would have never needed to buff support or tank.
This. Nobody wants to talk about every single new character getting a get-out-of-jail-free button to go with the old characters that already had one. We can look at Ana as the perfect counter example to this. She has a skill shot where if she lands it she gets away, if she misses it or is outplayed, she dies. Contrast that with Kiri who presses one button and is instantly halfway across the map with no option for counterplay
Agreed, even though anti can feel really powerful against tanks like hog/mauga, it still feels like there's room to outplay her since she has a weakness of no mobility. Most supports don't have significant weaknesses, or the ones they have can be reduced by the other support's cooldowns. This makes it really frustrating, since it makes the optimal play as tank to force/block cooldowns, instead of making space through kill potential. Unless you're a flavor of the month tank I guess.
As a tracer player if they are gonna buff tracer I would much prefer a spread buff than a damage buff because she already kills fast at close range she doesn’t need to kill faster there it would be better to be able to poke a little bit.
What killed playing the role for me is that every time I found something fun or rewarding about a tank they without fail would ruin it in some way and I've honestly just gotten tired of it. Forget other heroes making my life miserable I'm not even enjoying the tanks in a vacuum anymore.
Hammon actually got out of his mech to t-bag Winston himself.
Correction doomfist is the I was a DPS tank
No one talks about this but fundamentally the reason why tank feels like shit and probably always be the lack of being able to push something. In overwatch 1 2 tanks had amazing cooldown synergy even if it was only for 2 seconds to go in and fight. If there was an off angle your d.va would take care of it, or your sigma would fight it and give some much needed coverage. Now it's all about 1v1's on dps. In theory that's better for dps being able to 1v1.
BUT much of the map design has chokes, highground, or off angles that are incredibly hard to contest. As a tank you cant fight it all and even as dps walking into the enemy teams advantage can be daunting and scary. I wanna off angle as soldier on Meka Base oops hanzo has the angle locked down on bridge. Oh i guess i'll go main oop there's too much spam damage and my tank can't go in. Let's go low ground whoops in a kill box
Tanks like D.va and zarya feel amazing when your the one taking care of of angles flankers etc. But now you also have to fight main like a main tank. Contain the enemy tank. Contest high ground. All with honestly not that great of a cooldown to do so.
Rein get's off angled easily, winston get's blown up, by dps and lacks many ways of staying in if he has to commit jump onto high ground.
No matter how many good cooldowns 1 tank has it will never truly be able to block the space that 2 tanks did. Map control is incredibly hard as 1 tank.
I think if 5v5 continues there needs to be a lot of reworks to maps to make them feel like you can actually contest the angles I think samoa is a good maps for 5v5. Smaller, each choke has a lot of different angles but are short enough to rush and push people out. Highground is good but it's not oppressive like Havana, or numbani.
While I was playing open que with friends we did 2 tanks 1 dps and 2 supports and its wild how much better most of the maps felt when you had a tank protecting an angle and how much more dynamic team fights got. Being able to actually have map control or true pushes with cooldowns back and forth brought me back to why I loved overwatch 1.
But we aren't getting that back so I think one of the easier ways is to look at map design and see how each map could be improved now that there's more limited cooldowns on both sides I would say most of the orignal maps could have slightly lower highground or less empty space to facilitate brawl and dive more effectively. But i'm not sure what everyone else would think about that
"Hey, can I offer you a small tip? Try not to jump as much when playing support and DPS. It makes you easier to hit and you
becomes more predictable."
regarding the tracer buff
we've already buffed her like that before, and she became gigabroken and had to get nerfed to 5.5 where she is now
and now we're putting it back to 6? like?
Her damage and spread have been nerfed since the last time she did 6 damage. That’s why they’re giving her the damage back
Initially it was because of a bug with her damage falloff, which they supposedly fixed by now. Whether or not that's true remains to be seen.
As a super mega bronze master, which doesn't say or mean much, I still have a blast playing Winton, but I've had to make a whole new playstyle to work with it. But when getting a Kiriko, Moira, or Genji, someone who excels at cleaning up low HP kills, really enables the dive and they can help clean up the under powered Tesla Cannon. The changes look good on paper, but Mauga and Bastion are still hard to play against, and swapping off Monke King is better overall, even if I can isolate targets that holding better positions.
Out of touch devs killed tanks. Again
FInnaly someone who says dpses are the problem. Word. dpses make you absolutely miserable. Not that supports are not busted but there is more tankbusters now than tanks. Heck even soljorn can delete you so hard and there is absolutely nothing you can do about it except stand and hold shield
I’m not high rank, mostly gold, but honestly i love playing tank, and it’s all about taking space. If you don’t have space in any circumstance and go 1v5, then you’re throwing the game
Getting rid of the other one and not balancing the game correctly, it’s actually that simple
I feel you bro tank feels miserable. I only play Doom though so at least I get to die in style
Winton overwatch, more like loseton overated amirite
:)
-Me
I think the thing that pushed me from tank is the lack of control. If my team is worse we lose, i dont feel too in control of the game
I think they need to give tanks more tools. We need a road hog like rework for the other tanks. Give them more flexibility
Reinhart just needs a personal bubble sheild with 2k health
i think they needed to rework EVERY hero. It's a whole new format, and we're now seeing the consequences of switching to 5v5 and doing some half-assed changes. 100 extra health for a tank is not going to make up for the loss of a matrix, an extra shield, or a bubble.
To throw my two cents in on why tank is having so many issues right now is that Tank is not allowed to make big plays anymore. If you look at the tanks that are good, its the tanks that just ware down the enemy resources until nothing is left. Orisa does that by simply being unkillable, sigma does that by absorbing so much damage for his team, I would also through Rammatra into this as that is how he is played from what I have seen. Rein kinda does this through being a shield bot as mentioned in the video. Try and play Rein normally and you instantly get shut down by supports being supports, damage going to counter you if you had too much fun and the dreaded horse making life hell. Winton hasn't had much time to shine outside of top level organized play as he is fundamentally a play making tank, Winston cant poke out the enemy and grind them down, he doesn't have the sustain to do that, same can be said about ball to an extent. Without an offtank to help take some of the pressure off, this wear down the enemy style will probably be the only style of tank that is allowed to exist unless something breaks and can overpower everything else.
I just wanna play hog without getting anti naded, discorded, or hacked for what seems like every 10 seconds.
This is another major problem. Imo it should double your cooldown if you use a CC on a tank
to be fair whenever hog is good it’s probably hell for everyone else
I play tank I have fun still it’s something your sort of come back to
7:15 bro that shuter...
the 5v5 change killed every off tank. no off tank was designed to be the ONLY tank on the team and forcing them into that completely guts their playstyle (zarya, dva, hog, ball). now as a tank you're just so lonely out there. theres no pressure release valve by ur side so half the time you spend as tank is just holding a corner. doesnt help that every character now is movement crept out the fucking ass. they've boiled tank down to do 1 thing only and that's make space. that's the value tank brings and practically nothing else.
OW2 try to play Dva without the enemy tank instantly switching to Zarya challenge instant fail
5v5 just is never going to work. its best to keep tank as the worst role because you need the least players playing that role.
shout out to overwatch team taking a year to "rework" hog to only give him an aoe 150damage junk rat trap all because they refuse to nerf ana nade from cutting off 100% healing to something like 50-75%
Its kinda like the people that threw up red flags about the 6v6 to 5v5 switch were right and never stop being vindicated (despite all the hate we got at the time), but thats none of my business
Im a onetrick hog i slso dont like the meta is has been the same since season 6 its the same dps and support with both having broken abilities and tanks need to pick high sustain tanks because if not you just explote so i hope they nerf the abilities like soujorn rail gun ana nades brig in general support passive hack on tanks bastion turret form lifegrip is just not fun to play against and onestly even with the abilities it just feels like tanks and some dps are just playing against a overpawerd version of dobleshield without shild intead healing and inmortality abilities that protect inmense amount of high damage heroes
It sounds like its time to give Rhinehardt more armor. He can be a slow juggernaut instead of a mobile barrier.
i dont get why you think rineheart is just standing there likei play him in mid plat and i play with him in mid dia but i see plenty movement and denial space and having plenty fun
You lost me at afk rein shield bot
If you play Winston the enemy team is just going to swap to reaper-bastion. Especially since ow2 and the loss of 2nd tank.
That literally never happens you're just paranoid.
Me when I gaslight on the internet
They should just bring back 6v6.
how you shatter so fast after charging? i think at some point short or vid flats was mentioning some key switching to make getting out of charge with sheild faster? or its just me?
Id say ana could be a big culprit. The nerfs to her nade were nice and all but full restrictions to healing on tanks does not seem good for anyone
I hate swapping just cuz the enemy counters me then I have to continue to swap and get no ult charge
2:10 I laughed out loud so hard
How did you go through this whole video without mentioning Dva? She's the perfect in between of being a protector for her team (defense matrixing teammate pharah or reaper ults, peeling for the backline to dm/bully the enemy diving your Zen/Ana/etc.) And being a 3rd dps having a good burst dmg combo that can delete squishy's and put some serious pressure on other tanks bar for like zarya and a fortified orisa. The way she's designed is perfect for 5v5 having the mobility to be anywhere on the map she wants every few seconds, free use basically no cd shield similar rein and sig to protect allies and deny the enemy team value and respectable but not busted dps output so she can confirm picks herself. Also now that 6v6 is no more her ult is more useful too because there aren't 3+ shields every game blocking it and can guarantee at least one free kill as long as you know how to use it. All of this sounds broken on paper but it's balanced due to her having the largest and a center mass critbox and being hard countered by beam heroes except Moira and Winston
hmmmm i personally feel like dva's damage output is not that great, and you can't just dive like a winston with bubble. Dva would need to rely on another cooldown like lifegrip to get you out. She's more of a straight up bodyguard to flankers but doesn't have much threatening presence to push the enemy team (or their tank) away.
@RexelBartolome agreed. As soon as I see an enemy D.va I know it's a free win. You just press W on her and she evaporates or she runs and you delete her squishies. D.va is in a much worse spot than Ow1 and it's not close
God I miss Season 5
Dude rein is way better at brawl than junker queen you pick rein if there is a jq so you can be funny and kill the jq in every duel
Winton :)
Op :/
TANK VIDEOOOOO
Its almost of 6v6 was better
Ehhhh I don't know. What we have right now is messy but I'll take it over Orisa/Sigma every other game
@@ieatsand9259that was an issue with the devs abandoning the game. Complaining about double shield is a meme. Double shield because strong after the final orisa change and then they left the game alone for 2 years to "work" on ow2. Orisa's fortify buff at the tail end of ow1 invalidated dive, otherwise double shield was easily counterable by just playing a comp that goes around the sheilds like Winston diva, but then fortify made orisa unkillable therefore undivable. It was a balance issue, not a format issue. They changed to 5v5 solely to improve queue times, which directly helps their bottom lines because casuals aren't going to wait 5+ minutes to queue
So Zarya is trash, in your opinion, despite high damage giving her high charge and therefore her own high damage, if you are smart (by bubbling team mates first, before you commit).
Evidently 5 v 5. They obly changed to this because they couldn't balance the Tank role anyway.
The OW2 tank reworks have been horrible in my opinion. Doomfist, Orisa, Roadhog, & Wrecking Ball need reworked, even more so in 5v5. Tanks focused only on damage, self-sustain, and CC are not fun to play alongside or against, no matter what role you're on. Every tank should have some form of team protection ability; like even though Junker Queen is overly stated in self-sustain and kill potential and so I'd like her re-balanced, she does still have Commanding Shout to help her team. Below is the direction I'd like them to take the 4 tanks I mentioned:
*Doomfist*
* Moved from Tank to Damage Role
* Base health reduced from 450 to 250
Power Block
* Ability Removed
Rising Uppercut
* OW1 Rising Uppercut Added
* Reduce upwards travel and knock-up of Uppercut
Seismic Slam
* Now also allows for targeting the ground mid-air to travel downward (damage ramping from OW1 would stay gone, and Doomfist keeps the OW2 verticality to his Slam)
Rocket Punch
* No longer stuns
* Wall impact damage removed
* Knock-back reduced
* Impact damage buffed (would do less than 200 impact damage)
* Charge up time buffed
Meteor Strike
* Slow on enemies removed
* Outer-ring damage buffed
*Orisa*
* Reworked back to OW1 Orisa's abilities
* Barrier balanced around having an 8 second cooldown so she can reposition more
* Possibly make Orisa's barrier a little bit more of a tunnel, that way enemies can't out-maneuver it quite as easily
* Fortify nerfed so Orisa is weaker up close
*Roadhog*
* Take a Breather forms gas (healing and damage reduction field) around Roadhog to support allies like it did during the Feb 2020 1-3-2 experimental card. The difference is that TaB would be a resource meter like it currently is on live servers, and the gas would not be a field that instantly is at its max size, instead, the gas would keep coming out of TaB as long as Roadhog is using it, and would accumulate into a bigger cloud if gas is already near Roadhog. Roadhog can walk in a line using TaB, and a trail of gas would be left behind for allies to be sustained by, or Roadhog can stay in the same area while using TaB, and the gas forms into a bigger circular area to sustain himself and his team.
* Pig Pen damage reduced, and slow effect weakened.
* Roadhog would be balanced around having a 7 second Hook cooldown (1 second higher cooldown).
* Whole Hog re-balanced to knock back enemies less and deal less damage because it knocks enemies back less.
*Wrecking Ball*
* Adaptive Shields reworked into an ability that reduces the amount of damage enemies deal for a set duration (so Wrecking Ball can reduce damage done to his team).
* Reduce Wrecking Ball's knock-back.
* Slightly reduce Pile Driver's knock-up distance.
* Reduce max duration of Mine Field (20 seconds is too long).
Roadhog was never balanced around his hook to begin with. It was his ability to dump on squishy damage characters that people complained about the most. Plus hook only takes off 5 HP now, so the nerf to the cool down is unwarranted.
Also the nerf to whole Hog is pointless as well because half the time the push force works against you. You can only get kills with it by either forcing someone against a wall to take advantage of the damage or throw them off a cliff; you can hook them back into range but it's only just one person while others will use the knockback to escape.
ughhhhhhh like all of this is true but its just that at the end of the day... you need a second tank... like lmao i know this talking point has been talked to death but the reason those "hyper mobile, borderline dps tanks" are good is because they can lowkey be everywhere at once like doom who can slam high ground to contest soldier, fall off, punch the ram or rein INTO your team to put pressure on him, farm for empowered punch then wait for slam again and now empower punch the zen in the background which is a borderline guaranteed kill even someone else even sneezes on him. meanwhile all the enemy rein can do in that situation is like you said... hold shield and pray that you dont get bursted down and that your dps pop off since you holding shield lets them stand in the open a bit more.
Maybe I’m a masochist but I started enjoying tank more when ow 2 came out