“The Ultimate Computer” is one of my all-time favourite TOS episodes ... especially after it was remastered. It’s a brilliant combination of great storytelling, fine acting and action.
The remastered version of The Ultimate Computer and The Doomsday Machine are my favorites of TOS. You really get into the story and feel like you're there. It's like being an observer where you know the outcome but just like Doctor Who, are not allowed to interfere with fixed points in time. Your there as an observer only.
Thank you for doing this one. It’s one of my favourite TOS episodes, and it’s a “bottle show”. The story is even more relevant to today, with Artificial Intelligence actually being developed. This is a story where I absolutely empathise with Kirk throughout. On top, the guest actor who played Daystrum was amazing too. Everyone was on top form in this one. Key memorable moment: The sudden death of the assistant engineer, vapourised right in front of everyone. Perfectly shot.
This is one of those rare episodes that feels more relevant today than it did when it was made. During the 60s & 70s the word 'computer' was thrown around a lot but most people saw them as very large calculators and not much more. The science fiction writers, of the time, had a lot of frustration getting across the idea that a computer could be less than a fully formed intelligence but more than a calculator. This episode is very much how AI is seen today as opposed to when it came out. Oh, as far as naming things after Doctor Daystrom, just look at Howard Hughes as just one example of the naming conventions. Just remembering the breakthroughs and turning a blind eye to the less than palatable aspects. As always, I really enjoyed this Back Trek! Thank you!
Oh I completely agree! AI Advancement is getting crazy, and I do believe we'll be at Enterprise Computer level with in the next 2 decades or so... And that's scary!
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios - Tell me about it! I hear numbers and statistics thrown around a LOT today and have to wonder, how would a computer interpret these numbers in order to carry out a best-case scenario. The idea is chilling.
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios Well, our computers in the normal sense (machines that are calculating stuff with 1 and 0) are reaching the borders of physics. Our latest transistors are just the size of some atoms, so getting smaller (and therefore more computing power in less space while getting more power at the same time) is not possible any more. So we decided to get bigger again. We now design processors with multi-core capability (quadrocore is now standart, hexa- and octacore processors are becoming more common). This means that we are changing our way of writing programs significantly, so that we can use these multi-core processors in a better way. But by just making things bigger you do not make them better, do you? All our recent progress in AI technology is no progress in terms of building computers (although some hardware is optimized for AI) but rather in how we use computers. Our way of programming changed in the last several years quite drastically and enabled us to do more complicated stuff in less time. Maybe, the multitronic computer is just a computer that is highly optimized for AIs while the duotronic is not. In my opinion, Richard Daystrom is not only a marvelous engineer, but also a great programmer.
Thanks for the video I think not just the idea of being replaced by automation but more so just the feeling of no longer being relevant is something most of us can relate to. I would love to see McCoy interact with holodocter though I feel like with spock they woukd eventually warm up to each other.
One of the things this episode does is show how Spock's pragmatism and experience as a line officer were actually more helpful to Kirk than McCoy's purely emotional response. McCoy really couldn't come up with anything concrete to make Kirk feel any better. Spock's "one man" speech did. It's a completely logical take, but is dripping with emotion as well. Prior to the movies, Spock rarely spoke of his friendships directly, but could show it remarkably well while maintaining the air of logic. It's up there with CourtMartial where Spock used his personal knowledge of Kirk to come to a different logical conclusion than anyone else would have.
I don't know if I agree. McCoy's pela for Jim not to destroy the only James Kirk in the universe (paraphrasing here) always struck a strong emotional chord in me.
ah yes, in which the very first opportunity for actual artificial intelligence was ended due to the resulting computer being insane. remember, don't use your own memory engrams in artificial intelligence. in fact, don't try to use it to command a ship capable of scouring a planet's surface at all. nice episode. keep up the content.
I think that this episode is more important than ever since it raises the question if we should handle war by computers. I personally think that this is a very bad idea. Humans should still decide whom they kill. That does not mean that all automation in modern warfare is bad, since humans are unable to do certain things, e.g. they need too much time to react. It's just that machines should not decide who dies and who lives.
For what's worth, modern automation in warfare includes the need for a human person to actually pull the trigger. Computers will scan, target etc., but it'll be a human pulling the trigger - for the very reasons you think they should. Nobody trusts computers that much - yet.
William Marshall was great in this episode. I love his voice. He has a regal presence. Hokey as it was, he was a good Blackula, too. This was one of the good episodes. Not great, but good. The message of the dichotomy of replacing man with machine still holds true. And, perhaps, knowing he was such a great mind, who contributed so much to that exotic future technology, suffered from insanity later in his career, they sought to still honor the man he was and all he contributed, and name an institute after him, even though he was responsible for all those deaths (unintentionally, don't forget). It was, after all, his own guilt and respect for life that ultimately saved them, since it was his own engrams used in the mind of the M-5.
Always enjoyed this one, there's some great Spock vs. McCoy banter but as usual you have to let a few things slide. William Marshall (don't forget his career defining role as "Blacula") is more than a match for Shatner's over-acting "skills" (not a good thing) and most risible is Kirk once again out smarting a computer to the point that it self-destructs (see NoMad and Landru). I've tried that with some of my PCs at work with absolutely no success. Also couldn't the four starships detect the Enterprise powering up phasers at full power and get their shields up and for that matter where was the console code we saw in "Wrath of Khan". That would've taken the now rogue Enterprise out of the game. Finally, why didn't the M5 realize it was killing people which is against the "laws of man and god", it really took Kirk to point that out? This unit must...die.
We are grateful for the level of detail and hard work that goes into the vids man...anyone who complains or can’t see how fortunate we are, well...put bluntly...let Q deal with their ungrateful impatient behinds :)
TriAngulum Audio Studios you’re welcome 🖖🏻 My biggest bit of gratefulness is that especially in your error mistakes series (personally my fave because another perspective can open new trivia points I may have not noticed due to growing up as a kid watching it)...that when points are made, and sometimes debated etc, that there is the maturity and understanding on all fronts so that it remains a civilised debate, never an argument...even though I will concede, at times I know I can get a little fired up in the passion, “fighting” for the midway concession of “I see you point, and it has logical merit, and therefore MIGHT indeed be the writers intention, but since not seen on screen...still not official canon” On that note, combined with a suggestion about beta canon ships, I’d mentioned the array of various factions ships in the late 2200s era based around Star Trek 6 game KLINGON ACADEMY...would you consider the story and cutscenes in that to be a part of canon? As it’s upheld as such due to the actual actors being in it and immediate prequel to the events of undiscovered country...yet being a game as opposed to series of “movie” footage would fall under the heading beta canon...or due to the official verdicts is it on the fence boundary to you? I loved it as soon as it showed how Chang lost his eye to require the patch :)
Love the behind the scenes stuff and your knowledge of Trek! I believe testing of M-5 had progressed to the point of being trialed in surprise wargames. You wouldn't do that with a freighter.
You make excellent observations about Kirk's fear of being replaced and Daystom's fear of becoming irrelevant in his field of study. Yes William Marshall's portrayal of an increasingly unhinged Daystrom was spot on. It also made me wonder if Shatner was a little intimated by Marshall's height? I read that at times Shatner like to chew scenes and steal lines from other cast members not sure if that was completely true though. That said if this was onf of the better episodes from season 2 it makes me wonder what are the best episodes of season three considering that the third season was considered the worse in terms of quality, writing etc.... What is your pick of the best of the worst in season three LOL!
I noticed on how they reused the high back of the Excalibur center seat in "Mirror Mirror" for the ISS Enterprise and the same cue of endangerment music for "The Doomsday Machine." His pyschitc and mental breakdown. Starfleet discontinued the M super computer program.
Another awesome entry TriAngulum. Peace ans long life! I know what you mean about something just slightly off...no...what...ohmygosh...he's a vampire! Prince Mamuwalde!
As a victim of automation about 5 years ago, I totally get this episode now more than I ever did as a kid in the 1970s. And I've since recovered into a new career. So no harm, but going through the process was not fun.
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios Sure, TV Audio operator. I moved into programming / listing coordination = which is a lot of email - and master control. Fortunately I was never laid off, I was able to transition before that due to openings in the other department. But the stress before that was pretty bad. I was watching something I'd help build over 17 years get taken away. Now the news control room is operated by 2 people. It used to have a crew of 8 or more 20 years ago. Progress, I suppose. And to be clear, this wasn't A.I., just computer assist increasing 'efficiency but costing jobs. And it's only going to increase in a lot of areas and jobs as AI improves.
I noticed on how Daystrum was in denial and obsessed by the ide the M5 was perfect. So perfect that he didn't so no empathy it was taking control of the ship's systems, jobs including the captian's, killed a crew member, destroyed a freighter which could had a crew members on it. Attacking the Excalibur
Excellent! And I was wondering how you were going to fit in Captain Dunsel. And yes, they should have use the Miranda class to test it out. Or maybe an Oberth class. Then nobody would have gotten killed.
It was a fantastic episode and the reason it’s so popular is back in the day we fans were so thirsty tinder other Federation ships even if they were just duplicates of the Enterprise...!
Really a very good episode that really liked it was very interested only wish they had at least a couple of shifts at work to say that they had to save money by using the same models
Spock: "The unfortunate lack in current computer programming is that there isn't anything to replace the Starship Surgeon" EMH: "Please state the nature of the medical emergency" Spock: "A starship also runs on loyalty to one man, and nothing could replace it, or him" EMH: "Activate the Emergency Command Hologram" *four pips appear "zzzp zzzp zzzp zzzp"*
"The Ultimate Computer" is a good episode, I always put it if unchecked, the dangers of technology will creep up. oddly enough this Theme will be covered in the Terminator Films. can you do a video about "Tomorrow is Yesterday"??
This inspired me watch the episode again. It is very good. The only issue I have with it is technical. They were in orbit around a planet, then all of a sudden they are a warp speed (maybe I missed a command). Speaking of warp speed, preforming battle maneuvers at warp speed doesn't seem logical or achievable within established canon. The writers should have had them drop to sub-light speed.
Fighting at warp speed was standard during the TOS. It was only later - because of Star Wars, I think - that it became common to only fight at sublight. Which brings me to a question I could never find an answer to: If a ship didn't want to fight, why not just keep going at warp until the other just got tired of it and came home? Unless both ships want to fight, there's no reason for it to happen, at all. Escaping a fight would be simplicity itself, if it couldn't be done in warp speeds.
As a computer person, I have always found the Frankenstein idea that the monster will turn on its maker, rather silly. If it ever were to happen then Skynet from the Terminator series is how it would happen.
highly doubt it, if they do turn on their master it will be like the paper-clip maximiser, doing exactly as it is told, but not as its creators imagined.
@@BartJBols Asimov's "I, Robot" series of stories is the quintessential exploration of that concept. (not the Will Smith film which has almost nothing to do with the original stories.)
Thanks for this. Please do an episode on "Turnabout Intruder." I would like to know what the producers were thinking when making this chauvinistic offering.
First comment yay!!! I do like this episode. I have no linear list of episodes. Just catagories. (Except for omega glory) I do like one aspect of this episode. More star fleet. More ships. I think it's the first time we see more than 2 vessels on screen/in the area at a time
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios odd. On my screen it showed no comments. Must have been a glitch. Will get the boys at the Dastrum institute to look into it. Here is a question for you though. What if they had named the Institute BEFORE the incident with the M-5 and decided to keep the name as the M-5 incident was well known public knowledge?
It might have been M-5's interference? :P And I dont think it matters... I mean they've since renamed Stalin and Leningrad sine the downfall of Communism when the atrocities were revealed...
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios millions killed by a government sanctioned assassination and oppression schemes Vs less than 1000 starfleet officers killed in tragic accident due to a malfunction.... I do agree on your question of why the enterprise. It seemed odd to place it on the best ship in the fleet. However they do want to test it's combat capabilities
Let me put it this way... Suppose you have a man who is always doing charitable work in your city.... So much so, that the city names a city square, a meeting place after that man. Then 20 years later, it was revealed that he was a serial killer who killed 400 people in the surrounding cities and towns... Do you think that square would remain named after the man? Bear in mind, the M5 WAS Daystrom... It was his memory engrams, which means what it did, killing all those people, was exactly what Daystrom was capable of doing!
You mentioned a thought that I had myself -- why would they name one of their key institutions after a man who invented a killing machine, then had a nervous breakdown. I even wondered if it was the same Daystrom.
This was a wonderful review! Thank you. The Ultimate Computer - 1968 is one of my favorite TOS episodes. The music and the emotions expressed were perfectly timed hooking me in as things began to spin out of control( no thanks to M5! ). William Marshall and William Shatner really pulled it off here. A little Star Trek trivia. Apparently, M-5 fought in the Dominion War offscreen? It came to be in the possession of The Immortal Flint and defended a station called Valhalla. Apparently it's mention in a book called Immortal Coil written by Jeffrey Lang released in 2002.
it is possible another daystrom also made a significant enough contribution(s) to computer development. Or perhaps his it was decided to honor his other accomplishments over his failure? If I recall correctly, he did take responsibility for this incident.
No he really didnt... Instead he boasted about how M5 was able to take on all those mighty starships... That's hardly accepting personal responsibility :P
In the 23rd century people get institutions named after themselves warts and all. Further the name doesn't get changed when dirt gets dug up about the namesake.
As to would they name the Daystom institute after him. I'ld assume the development and test of the M5 would be highly classified, and the disaster afterwards, very hushed up. So with Daystom only known for his early ledgend, they still might well do so.
Maybe in Trek Lore, Daystrom finally makes another scientific breakthrough long after his emotional breakdown? One that saves Billions of lives later in his career and created out of guilt for what M5 did? It would be a great Redemption Arc.
Love your videos! If you are taking requests, I would love to see a Mirror Universe episode in which you explore an alternate reality in which the TV series The Lieutenant is a huge hit and runs multiple seasons leading Gene Roddenberry to delay proposing Star Trek as a series until the mid 1970's, proposals which are all declined until Star Wars ushers in the sci-fi craze and Gene's concept suddenly receives Feature Film approval and budgeting. Star Trek the Motion Picture becomes the first "episode" of the franchise. How does this affect the rest of Trek franchise future? On the topic of digital effects added to original TOS... is it possible there is an aggressive alien species similar to the Klingons who have intercepted transmissions of original TOS and being unable to determine how the impressive phaser and photon technology is produced has for many years declined to invade our puny planet only to intercept TOS digitally altered episodes which the alien's own digital technology immediately deciphers as false imagery leading to their realization Earthlings have duped them and they immediately invade and enslave the human race?
hi there T A S, i was wondering if you could do a back to back behind the scenes on the last episode on DS9 what you leave behind, thanx . best regurds roberto.
@@daviddyster4145 M4 vanished without trace,some years ago only to appear briefly recently before disappearing for good. Guess what SF show I'm referring to? :-D
Excellent research, beautiful imagery, exciting delivery. Please consider adding or documenting what went wrong with M5. It is for the Star Trek Business Model Energy Cloud City technology development project at York University, working with MIT and Harvard. I would be pleased to highlight your series at our Oct 21, 2020 Washington DC Quantum Computer Meetup reveal.
I'm still of a mind that Kirk could've overloaded a handfull of phasers and phaser rifles and blew up Engineering. The very least Enterprises phaser array and photon torpedo launcher.
Indeed, I believe there are many things Kirk could have done... BUT M5 does a forcefield protecting it, and that field IS using the power of the Enterprise herself....
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You're telling me Scotty and Spock couldn't have went to the deflector dish and blew it up to stop M5? With all the personal munitions onboard, plus whatever possible scientific equipment, they couldn't have stopped it? Shuttlecraft and spare photon torpedoes used together. When I was younger, this irked me. As a former US Army, this bothered even more. Kirk & Co. should all be dead...or court-martialed for not making the attempt.
Well M5 wasnt a stupid computer... Bear in mind that it was able to fool the 2 while they attempted to circumvent it's control and rerouted control.... Who knows what it would have done had it detected them attempting to do that? Maybe turn off all life support, or open an airlock on the deck they're on? Maybe flood those decks with radiation or gas? Again there are equally as many things the M5 could have done against an attack!
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You're right, it did do that. Control even means it's destruction, though. To be honest, it should've been the first thing on their minds. Plus, none of them should be alive. Most importantly, Kirk for allowing it to get this far. He dealt with far tougher nuts to crack than Windows XP.
I have always been curious why the other ships thought it was The enterprise crew actually doing the attack..... Kirk said you could not run the ship with a crew of 20.... so how could the crew carry out this attack with such precision? Wesley doesn’t even seem to consider that the M5 is responsible for what’s happening..
When you say that DC Fontana "rewrote" the script, does that mean she gutted it and redid it completely, or does it mean she worked with the writer? The fear that machines or AI will take our jobs is even stronger today and much more inevitable. Too bad we never saw Commodore Wesley again. I liked the actor and the character.
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You were so inspired by my comment that you do a sling shot around the sun in a Klingon Bird of Prey and went back in time to create the video that my inspirational comment inspired you to do. You literally broke the laws of Physics to do that video.
12:23 as per other comment, if memory serves, here was dialogue insinuating that the federation wanted to test the outcome of this technology, and due to the looming Cold War with the klingons and romulan, it is conceivable (though not set in the stone of canon), that it was decided to test on the enterprise to expedite testing etc...
I seen or read somewhere that the CGI artist were going to use different classes of Starships for the fleet but decided to use the Enterprise CGI model with rearranged windows instead🖖🏾
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios it might been on the blu ray extras or commentary for that episode ..i will check i remember hearing it from somewhere ..still your research & knowledge of Trek is incredible👍🏾🖖🏾
Before watching, I'm going to say this is the sort of thing that worked better when I was a kid. The idea of a "single inventor" is mostly something long dead, especially for something like a computer system that could run a starship. It's also on of those Start Trek cases of, "This didn't work perfectly the first time out, we should scrap the project that we got all the way to testing on our most advanced and dangerous ship." Also, what was with Wesley's casual insult of Kirk? Didn't he realize he'd be out of a job too?
It's not the best of season 2 but it is above average. I always saw it as regarding Daystrom, a genius who realized himself at a young age, continuing to achieve new heights to prove himself when everyone treated him badly (hence his breakdown scene). Like Icarus and Daedalus but on a bigger scale. Fontana's take on the story is indeed great.
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios d'oh! As a great man once said, "Missed it by that much!" Loving the care and quality you put into your reviews! Very professionals smooth flowing stuff. Thanks!
Just rewatched ST:TMP. WHAT AN ABSOLUTE LOAD OF FILTH! Plot=where is it? Speed = thrusters only! Slower than a sub warp transport. It’s just awful. Worse that ST:TFF. Just woeful. Who approved this repelling story at paramount?
UA-cam is NOT your friend. The hoops you had to jump through to avoid copyright / monetization strikes is obscene. I "own" a legal copy of all ST:TOS as a Netflix subscriber. Yet, you can't show unadulterated scene fragments from this episode. I'm sure you wasted more time "hiding" these clips from UA-cam than actually the commentary on this episode. I'm probably better off just listening to your commentary on this episode, then go back and watch the full episode again on Netflix.
What are you talking about? I didnt jump through any hoops, nor did I try to avoid anything... I show the clips I wish to show, and I own physical copies of ALL The Trek Episodes, so not sure what THAT has to do with anything... These videos fall under fair use and as such are protected.... So I'm not sure what you're going on about, but you're completely WRONG! So just worry about your own channel, I'm doing just fine without you :)
“The Ultimate Computer” is one of my all-time favourite TOS episodes ... especially after it was remastered. It’s a brilliant combination of great storytelling, fine acting and action.
I personally loved the remastering as well :)
My favourites are City on the Edge of Forever, Balance of Terror, and The Doomsday Machine. Many good episodes like this one too, though.
The remastered version of The Ultimate Computer and The Doomsday Machine are my favorites of TOS. You really get into the story and feel like you're there. It's like being an observer where you know the outcome but just like Doctor Who, are not allowed to interfere with fixed points in time. Your there as an observer only.
They did an excellent job with the remasters :)
One of my favorite Trek episodes.
William Marshall had a great voice.
I completely agree!
Thank you for doing this one. It’s one of my favourite TOS episodes, and it’s a “bottle show”. The story is even more relevant to today, with Artificial Intelligence actually being developed. This is a story where I absolutely empathise with Kirk throughout. On top, the guest actor who played Daystrum was amazing too. Everyone was on top form in this one. Key memorable moment: The sudden death of the assistant engineer, vapourised right in front of everyone. Perfectly shot.
Really enjoying these episode specific retrospectives. Please keep 'em coming!
Thank you so much, and no problem there :)
I love all the info about the little cost cutting measures
Glad you like them! :)
It's certainly one of my favorite episodes. And completely agree the remastered scenes in the episode make it better. 🖖
Indeed they do :)
Thank you for the episode. The Ultimate Computer is one of my favorite of TOS.
You are very welcome my friend :)
Great video. Adding to the EMH analogy in 'VOY: Life Line' Dr Zimmerman refers to the EMH as "Doctor Dunzel' as he considers him outmoded
Thanks Djarra
One of my favorite episodes - and I love your Back Trek episodes :D
You are too kind my amazingly accented friend :)
One of my all time faves. When Daystrom goes mad speaking to the M5. - one of the most dramatic moments in all of TOS.
I loved the King of Cartoons.
LOL Me too :)
This is one of those rare episodes that feels more relevant today than it did when it was made. During the 60s & 70s the word 'computer' was thrown around a lot but most people saw them as very large calculators and not much more. The science fiction writers, of the time, had a lot of frustration getting across the idea that a computer could be less than a fully formed intelligence but more than a calculator. This episode is very much how AI is seen today as opposed to when it came out. Oh, as far as naming things after Doctor Daystrom, just look at Howard Hughes as just one example of the naming conventions. Just remembering the breakthroughs and turning a blind eye to the less than palatable aspects.
As always, I really enjoyed this Back Trek! Thank you!
Oh I completely agree! AI Advancement is getting crazy, and I do believe we'll be at Enterprise Computer level with in the next 2 decades or so... And that's scary!
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios - Tell me about it! I hear numbers and statistics thrown around a LOT today and have to wonder, how would a computer interpret these numbers in order to carry out a best-case scenario. The idea is chilling.
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios Well, our computers in the normal sense (machines that are calculating stuff with 1 and 0) are reaching the borders of physics. Our latest transistors are just the size of some atoms, so getting smaller (and therefore more computing power in less space while getting more power at the same time) is not possible any more. So we decided to get bigger again. We now design processors with multi-core capability (quadrocore is now standart, hexa- and octacore processors are becoming more common). This means that we are changing our way of writing programs significantly, so that we can use these multi-core processors in a better way. But by just making things bigger you do not make them better, do you?
All our recent progress in AI technology is no progress in terms of building computers (although some hardware is optimized for AI) but rather in how we use computers.
Our way of programming changed in the last several years quite drastically and enabled us to do more complicated stuff in less time.
Maybe, the multitronic computer is just a computer that is highly optimized for AIs while the duotronic is not. In my opinion, Richard Daystrom is not only a marvelous engineer, but also a great programmer.
Thanks for the video I think not just the idea of being replaced by automation but more so just the feeling of no longer being relevant is something most of us can relate to. I would love to see McCoy interact with holodocter though I feel like with spock they woukd eventually warm up to each other.
You're very welcome Kitty :)
I've always liked this episode and it is among my favorites for TOS. It features other Connies also, which is quite cool.
One of the things this episode does is show how Spock's pragmatism and experience as a line officer were actually more helpful to Kirk than McCoy's purely emotional response. McCoy really couldn't come up with anything concrete to make Kirk feel any better. Spock's "one man" speech did. It's a completely logical take, but is dripping with emotion as well. Prior to the movies, Spock rarely spoke of his friendships directly, but could show it remarkably well while maintaining the air of logic. It's up there with CourtMartial where Spock used his personal knowledge of Kirk to come to a different logical conclusion than anyone else would have.
I don't know if I agree. McCoy's pela for Jim not to destroy the only James Kirk in the universe (paraphrasing here) always struck a strong emotional chord in me.
Ultimate Computer is one of my favorite episodes! It is always great to see the sisters of Enterprise! (29 May 2022)
ah yes, in which the very first opportunity for actual artificial intelligence was ended due to the resulting computer being insane.
remember, don't use your own memory engrams in artificial intelligence. in fact, don't try to use it to command a ship capable of scouring a planet's surface at all.
nice episode. keep up the content.
My memory engrams are AWESOME though :P
We must always be careful when it comes to A.I.
I think that this episode is more important than ever since it raises the question if we should handle war by computers. I personally think that this is a very bad idea. Humans should still decide whom they kill. That does not mean that all automation in modern warfare is bad, since humans are unable to do certain things, e.g. they need too much time to react. It's just that machines should not decide who dies and who lives.
Definitely an interesting perspective you got there :)
For what's worth, modern automation in warfare includes the need for a human person to actually pull the trigger. Computers will scan, target etc., but it'll be a human pulling the trigger - for the very reasons you think they should. Nobody trusts computers that much - yet.
William Marshall was great in this episode. I love his voice. He has a regal presence. Hokey as it was, he was a good Blackula, too.
This was one of the good episodes. Not great, but good. The message of the dichotomy of replacing man with machine still holds true.
And, perhaps, knowing he was such a great mind, who contributed so much to that exotic future technology, suffered from insanity later in his career, they sought to still honor the man he was and all he contributed, and name an institute after him, even though he was responsible for all those deaths (unintentionally, don't forget).
It was, after all, his own guilt and respect for life that ultimately saved them, since it was his own engrams used in the mind of the M-5.
Always enjoyed this one, there's some great Spock vs. McCoy banter but as usual you have to let a few things slide. William Marshall (don't forget his career defining role as "Blacula") is more than a match for Shatner's over-acting "skills" (not a good thing) and most risible is Kirk once again out smarting a computer to the point that it self-destructs (see NoMad and Landru). I've tried that with some of my PCs at work with absolutely no success. Also couldn't the four starships detect the Enterprise powering up phasers at full power and get their shields up and for that matter where was the console code we saw in "Wrath of Khan". That would've taken the now rogue Enterprise out of the game. Finally, why didn't the M5 realize it was killing people which is against the "laws of man and god", it really took Kirk to point that out? This unit must...die.
We are grateful for the level of detail and hard work that goes into the vids man...anyone who complains or can’t see how fortunate we are, well...put bluntly...let Q deal with their ungrateful impatient behinds :)
Well thank you so much :)
TriAngulum Audio Studios you’re welcome 🖖🏻
My biggest bit of gratefulness is that especially in your error mistakes series (personally my fave because another perspective can open new trivia points I may have not noticed due to growing up as a kid watching it)...that when points are made, and sometimes debated etc, that there is the maturity and understanding on all fronts so that it remains a civilised debate, never an argument...even though I will concede, at times I know I can get a little fired up in the passion, “fighting” for the midway concession of “I see you point, and it has logical merit, and therefore MIGHT indeed be the writers intention, but since not seen on screen...still not official canon”
On that note, combined with a suggestion about beta canon ships, I’d mentioned the array of various factions ships in the late 2200s era based around Star Trek 6 game KLINGON ACADEMY...would you consider the story and cutscenes in that to be a part of canon? As it’s upheld as such due to the actual actors being in it and immediate prequel to the events of undiscovered country...yet being a game as opposed to series of “movie” footage would fall under the heading beta canon...or due to the official verdicts is it on the fence boundary to you?
I loved it as soon as it showed how Chang lost his eye to require the patch :)
Love the behind the scenes stuff and your knowledge of Trek! I believe testing of M-5 had progressed to the point of being trialed in surprise wargames. You wouldn't do that with a freighter.
You make excellent observations about Kirk's fear of being replaced and Daystom's fear of becoming irrelevant in his field of study. Yes William Marshall's portrayal of an increasingly unhinged Daystrom was spot on. It also made me wonder if Shatner was a little intimated by Marshall's height? I read that at times Shatner like to chew scenes and steal lines from other cast members not sure if that was completely true though. That said if this was onf of the better episodes from season 2 it makes me wonder what are the best episodes of season three considering that the third season was considered the worse in terms of quality, writing etc.... What is your pick of the best of the worst in season three LOL!
I noticed on how they reused the high back of the Excalibur center seat in "Mirror Mirror" for the ISS Enterprise and the same cue of endangerment music for "The Doomsday Machine." His pyschitc and mental breakdown. Starfleet discontinued the M super computer program.
Another awesome entry TriAngulum. Peace ans long life!
I know what you mean about something just slightly off...no...what...ohmygosh...he's a vampire! Prince Mamuwalde!
That cool star trek is great 👍
As a victim of automation about 5 years ago, I totally get this episode now more than I ever did as a kid in the 1970s. And I've since recovered into a new career. So no harm, but going through the process was not fun.
May I ask what you used to do, and what your new career is?
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios Sure, TV Audio operator. I moved into programming / listing coordination = which is a lot of email - and master control. Fortunately I was never laid off, I was able to transition before that due to openings in the other department. But the stress before that was pretty bad. I was watching something I'd help build over 17 years get taken away. Now the news control room is operated by 2 people. It used to have a crew of 8 or more 20 years ago. Progress, I suppose. And to be clear, this wasn't A.I., just computer assist increasing 'efficiency but costing jobs. And it's only going to increase in a lot of areas and jobs as AI improves.
Many talk about what's the best series of star trek (TNG,VOY or Ds9) but for it always were Vanguard
...yes the novel 😄
Wouldn’t it be fascinating to have a backstory of Dr. Daystrom as a new episode? Strange New Worlds?
Captain Kirk always outsmarts all these trigger happy smart alec machines
The Sickbay doors are VERY polite!
I noticed on how Daystrum was in denial and obsessed by the ide the M5 was perfect. So perfect that he didn't so no empathy it was taking control of the ship's systems, jobs including the captian's, killed a crew member, destroyed a freighter which could had a crew members on it. Attacking the Excalibur
Again, a lot of interesting facts
Thank you :)
TriAngulum Audio Studios you’re welcome
Excellent! And I was wondering how you were going to fit in Captain Dunsel.
And yes, they should have use the Miranda class to test it out. Or maybe an Oberth class. Then nobody would have gotten killed.
It was a fantastic episode and the reason it’s so popular is back in the day we fans were so thirsty tinder other Federation ships even if they were just duplicates of the Enterprise...!
Im always thirsty for ships :)
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios me too! I’m such a sci-fi nerd. It’s ironic but I should have done a UA-cam channel with my knowledge and obsession with Trek
Well it did seem to work out well for me :)
Really a very good episode that really liked it was very interested only wish they had at least a couple of shifts at work to say that they had to save money by using the same models
Spock: "The unfortunate lack in current computer programming is that there isn't anything to replace the Starship Surgeon"
EMH: "Please state the nature of the medical emergency"
Spock: "A starship also runs on loyalty to one man, and nothing could replace it, or him"
EMH: "Activate the Emergency Command Hologram" *four pips appear "zzzp zzzp zzzp zzzp"*
"The Ultimate Computer" is a good episode, I always put it if unchecked, the dangers of technology will creep up. oddly enough this Theme will be covered in the Terminator Films. can you do a video about "Tomorrow is Yesterday"??
I will add it to my to do list :)
This inspired me watch the episode again. It is very good. The only issue I have with it is technical. They were in orbit around a planet, then all of a sudden they are a warp speed (maybe I missed a command). Speaking of warp speed, preforming battle maneuvers at warp speed doesn't seem logical or achievable within established canon. The writers should have had them drop to sub-light speed.
I loving hearing when someone say a video of mine inspired them to do something :) It is so amazing and humbling :)
Fighting at warp speed was standard during the TOS. It was only later - because of Star Wars, I think - that it became common to only fight at sublight.
Which brings me to a question I could never find an answer to: If a ship didn't want to fight, why not just keep going at warp until the other just got tired of it and came home? Unless both ships want to fight, there's no reason for it to happen, at all. Escaping a fight would be simplicity itself, if it couldn't be done in warp speeds.
As a computer person, I have always found the Frankenstein idea that the monster will turn on its maker, rather silly.
If it ever were to happen then Skynet from the Terminator series is how it would happen.
highly doubt it, if they do turn on their master it will be like the paper-clip maximiser, doing exactly as it is told, but not as its creators imagined.
@@BartJBols Asimov's "I, Robot" series of stories is the quintessential exploration of that concept. (not the Will Smith film which has almost nothing to do with the original stories.)
I wonder if there's any link between this episode and 2001: A Space Odyssey in terms of a computer taking over the ship from humans.
If there was, I havent been able to find it!
Thanks for this. Please do an episode on "Turnabout Intruder." I would like to know what the producers were thinking when making this chauvinistic offering.
Your timing on showing the Excalibur class starship yesterday is on point with the showing of this video. Coincidence? 😂
Anyway, nice review.
LOL I do like to make magical coincidences every now and then ;) :P
First comment yay!!!
I do like this episode. I have no linear list of episodes. Just catagories. (Except for omega glory)
I do like one aspect of this episode. More star fleet. More ships.
I think it's the first time we see more than 2 vessels on screen/in the area at a time
Well about 20th actually... But I still appreciate ALL the support my friend :)
And yes, Im always thirsty for more and new starships! :)
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios odd. On my screen it showed no comments. Must have been a glitch. Will get the boys at the Dastrum institute to look into it.
Here is a question for you though.
What if they had named the Institute BEFORE the incident with the M-5 and decided to keep the name as the M-5 incident was well known public knowledge?
It might have been M-5's interference? :P
And I dont think it matters... I mean they've since renamed Stalin and Leningrad sine the downfall of Communism when the atrocities were revealed...
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios millions killed by a government sanctioned assassination and oppression schemes Vs less than 1000 starfleet officers killed in tragic accident due to a malfunction....
I do agree on your question of why the enterprise. It seemed odd to place it on the best ship in the fleet. However they do want to test it's combat capabilities
Let me put it this way... Suppose you have a man who is always doing charitable work in your city.... So much so, that the city names a city square, a meeting place after that man. Then 20 years later, it was revealed that he was a serial killer who killed 400 people in the surrounding cities and towns... Do you think that square would remain named after the man?
Bear in mind, the M5 WAS Daystrom... It was his memory engrams, which means what it did, killing all those people, was exactly what Daystrom was capable of doing!
My favourite TOS season 2 episodes R the Immunity Syndrome Trouble with Tribbles The Doomsday Machine Mirror Mirror & The Ultimate Computer
Good review. Not the best but it is up there.
If you think the season is the best, but cant agree on "which episode" is the best, then that means they are all excelent.
LOL Not at all, since I CAN decide which are the worst :P
You mentioned a thought that I had myself -- why would they name one of their key institutions after a man who invented a killing machine, then had a nervous breakdown.
I even wondered if it was the same Daystrom.
This was a wonderful review! Thank you. The Ultimate Computer - 1968 is one of my favorite TOS episodes. The music and the emotions expressed were perfectly timed hooking me in as things began to spin out of control( no thanks to M5! ). William Marshall and William Shatner really pulled it off here. A little Star Trek trivia. Apparently, M-5 fought in the Dominion War offscreen? It came to be in the possession of The Immortal Flint and defended a station called Valhalla. Apparently it's mention in a book called Immortal Coil written by Jeffrey Lang released in 2002.
it is possible another daystrom also made a significant enough contribution(s) to computer development. Or perhaps his it was decided to honor his other accomplishments over his failure?
If I recall correctly, he did take responsibility for this incident.
No he really didnt... Instead he boasted about how M5 was able to take on all those mighty starships... That's hardly accepting personal responsibility :P
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios
I stand corrected. I couldn't remember for sure it has been awhile 😔. Off to the brig with me
In the 23rd century people get institutions named after themselves warts and all. Further the name doesn't get changed when dirt gets dug up about the namesake.
As to would they name the Daystom institute after him. I'ld assume the development and test of the M5 would be highly classified, and the disaster afterwards, very hushed up. So with Daystom only known for his early ledgend, they still might well do so.
Maybe in Trek Lore, Daystrom finally makes another scientific breakthrough long after his emotional breakdown? One that saves Billions of lives later in his career and created out of guilt for what M5 did? It would be a great Redemption Arc.
Love your videos! If you are taking requests, I would love to see a Mirror Universe episode in which you explore an alternate reality in which the TV series The Lieutenant is a huge hit and runs multiple seasons leading Gene Roddenberry to delay proposing Star Trek as a series until the mid 1970's, proposals which are all declined until Star Wars ushers in the sci-fi craze and Gene's concept suddenly receives Feature Film approval and budgeting. Star Trek the Motion Picture becomes the first "episode" of the franchise. How does this affect the rest of Trek franchise future?
On the topic of digital effects added to original TOS... is it possible there is an aggressive alien species similar to the Klingons who have intercepted transmissions of original TOS and being unable to determine how the impressive phaser and photon technology is produced has for many years declined to invade our puny planet only to intercept TOS digitally altered episodes which the alien's own digital technology immediately deciphers as false imagery leading to their realization Earthlings have duped them and they immediately invade and enslave the human race?
great pointers today
264th like
hi there T A S, i was wondering if you could do a back to back behind the scenes on the last episode on DS9 what you leave behind, thanx .
best regurds roberto.
Sure thing! Cant guarantee when, but Ill add it to my to do list :)
Looking at the episode do you think Control was the M4 computer? It would explain the why the M5 was a failiure.
I doubt it, BUT I DO love that theory :) That would be a great tie in :)
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios Thank you, what is your theory on the preveious M1 to M4 computers?
@@daviddyster4145 M4 vanished without trace,some years ago only to appear briefly recently before disappearing for good. Guess what SF show I'm referring to? :-D
M4 was a butler employed by Flint.
Excellent research, beautiful imagery, exciting delivery. Please consider adding or documenting what went wrong with M5. It is for the Star Trek Business Model Energy Cloud City technology development project at York University, working with MIT and Harvard. I would be pleased to highlight your series at our Oct 21, 2020 Washington DC Quantum Computer Meetup reveal.
HAL 9000 gets a job on the Enterprise !
WHAT ARE YOU DOING, JIM ?
I want to know if parts of the M5 were used as (parts of) the computer for the episode with Gary 7.
Also used in All our Yesterdays. Probably others I don't remember
I'm still of a mind that Kirk could've overloaded a handfull of phasers and phaser rifles and blew up Engineering. The very least Enterprises phaser array and photon torpedo launcher.
Indeed, I believe there are many things Kirk could have done... BUT M5 does a forcefield protecting it, and that field IS using the power of the Enterprise herself....
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You're telling me Scotty and Spock couldn't have went to the deflector dish and blew it up to stop M5? With all the personal munitions onboard, plus whatever possible scientific equipment, they couldn't have stopped it? Shuttlecraft and spare photon torpedoes used together. When I was younger, this irked me. As a former US Army, this bothered even more. Kirk & Co. should all be dead...or court-martialed for not making the attempt.
Well M5 wasnt a stupid computer... Bear in mind that it was able to fool the 2 while they attempted to circumvent it's control and rerouted control.... Who knows what it would have done had it detected them attempting to do that? Maybe turn off all life support, or open an airlock on the deck they're on? Maybe flood those decks with radiation or gas? Again there are equally as many things the M5 could have done against an attack!
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You're right, it did do that. Control even means it's destruction, though. To be honest, it should've been the first thing on their minds. Plus, none of them should be alive. Most importantly, Kirk for allowing it to get this far. He dealt with far tougher nuts to crack than Windows XP.
I have always been curious why the other ships thought it was The enterprise crew actually doing the attack..... Kirk said you could not run the ship with a crew of 20.... so how could the crew carry out this attack with such precision? Wesley doesn’t even seem to consider that the M5 is responsible for what’s happening..
Why wasn't the M-5 brought out of mothballs to deal with the Borg and the Dominion? Slap that thing into a Defiant Class ship and say "Sic'em boy".
When you say that DC Fontana "rewrote" the script, does that mean she gutted it and redid it completely, or does it mean she worked with the writer?
The fear that machines or AI will take our jobs is even stronger today and much more inevitable.
Too bad we never saw Commodore Wesley again. I liked the actor and the character.
Do Balance of Terror, that's one of my favourite episodes. Is that inspiring enough?
Ive already done it :P ua-cam.com/video/mvkB35yFdBk/v-deo.html&t
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios You were so inspired by my comment that you do a sling shot around the sun in a Klingon Bird of Prey and went back in time to create the video that my inspirational comment inspired you to do. You literally broke the laws of Physics to do that video.
12:23 as per other comment, if memory serves, here was dialogue insinuating that the federation wanted to test the outcome of this technology, and due to the looming Cold War with the klingons and romulan, it is conceivable (though not set in the stone of canon), that it was decided to test on the enterprise to expedite testing etc...
Can you make review of the vanguard novel series ?
I will add it to my to do list :)
Comment 🖖😁
Response :) :)
Tangent🖖🤔😉
I seen or read somewhere that the CGI artist were going to use different classes of Starships for the fleet but decided to use the Enterprise CGI model with rearranged windows instead🖖🏾
In my research I didnt come across that at all...
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios it might been on the blu ray extras or commentary for that episode ..i will check i remember hearing it from somewhere ..still your research & knowledge of Trek is incredible👍🏾🖖🏾
First comment? Noice lol 🤣🤣🤣
Well not quite, about 10th! But I still appreciate the support :) Thank you :)
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios haha oh well, still you're welcome 😁
Before watching, I'm going to say this is the sort of thing that worked better when I was a kid. The idea of a "single inventor" is mostly something long dead, especially for something like a computer system that could run a starship. It's also on of those Start Trek cases of, "This didn't work perfectly the first time out, we should scrap the project that we got all the way to testing on our most advanced and dangerous ship."
Also, what was with Wesley's casual insult of Kirk? Didn't he realize he'd be out of a job too?
I'd like to think that Dr. Daystrom got some 23rd century help and went on to create bigger and better things.
Not George
Fiiiiirst! 😁
It's not the best of season 2 but it is above average.
I always saw it as regarding Daystrom, a genius who realized himself at a young age, continuing to achieve new heights to prove himself when everyone treated him badly (hence his breakdown scene). Like Icarus and Daedalus but on a bigger scale. Fontana's take on the story is indeed great.
Almost! Third actually, but I do appreciate the support :)
@@TriAngulumAudioStudios d'oh! As a great man once said, "Missed it by that much!"
Loving the care and quality you put into your reviews! Very professionals smooth flowing stuff. Thanks!
War Games🎮
This seemed very sort of derivative and silly.
Just rewatched ST:TMP. WHAT AN ABSOLUTE LOAD OF FILTH! Plot=where is it? Speed = thrusters only! Slower than a sub warp transport. It’s just awful. Worse that ST:TFF. Just woeful. Who approved this repelling story at paramount?
UA-cam is NOT your friend. The hoops you had to jump through to avoid copyright / monetization strikes is obscene. I "own" a legal copy of all ST:TOS as a Netflix subscriber. Yet, you can't show unadulterated scene fragments from this episode. I'm sure you wasted more time "hiding" these clips from UA-cam than actually the commentary on this episode. I'm probably better off just listening to your commentary on this episode, then go back and watch the full episode again on Netflix.
What are you talking about? I didnt jump through any hoops, nor did I try to avoid anything... I show the clips I wish to show, and I own physical copies of ALL The Trek Episodes, so not sure what THAT has to do with anything... These videos fall under fair use and as such are protected.... So I'm not sure what you're going on about, but you're completely WRONG! So just worry about your own channel, I'm doing just fine without you :)