He is too fair compared to the new abominations Riot is adding lately, passives with more words than an entire old champ kit, resets everywhere, free damage, penetration or true damage for no reason, there is no way an old champ like him can compete.
if i were riot, ill make his q recastable on his e but the second cast has no damage but would still knock up enemies. good for going in and going out easily
It's not an attractive playstyle to dump all your spells and die half of the time, but nothing is more fun than knocking up your enemies on repeat once you get absurd amounts of ability haste.
@@sekira4516 most champs just kill J4 straight up. He doesn't do much damage. If you go tank J4 you are just holding people so your team can wipe them out
I rmember when this champ first came out. Dude had wild mechanics, dashing through walls/ champs followed by a knock up, etc people immediately screamed OP. Oh how times have changed
Fr a skirmisher like Yone gets a bigger shield for hitting multiple people and also does damage with it, Jarvans abilities are simply underpowered right now
I'd say he needs more than that: make his passive reset after a fixed number of hits on the same target (say 4 or so) instead of a flat amount of time, so that way having ATS enhancements matter more to him, make it also have some healing, like Xin Zhao's, give him a better ATS steroid on his Demacian Standard and maybe make his shield actually be worth something in terms of numbers and also make it be able to get blown up by detonating it with a second activation after a small time delay...and do some damage when it pops, like Diana's or Sion's, but only if it's popped at will and not by enemy damage (that way the balance is kept by choosing between the damage and the protection). A trade-off for this would be to move the slow on the detonation, not when the shield is created. He desperately needs more 1 on 1 dueling potential. Right now...Xin Zhao's just better than him in almost every way, because his heavy auto-attack focus makes him more consistent and a good (although not great) duelist and basically allows him to pull double-duty as a skirmisher. It might seem excessive love that can potentially make him overloaded, but I think it's nothing compared to the trend of newer champions and, at worst, it'll just make him a bit overtuned, something that can easily be fixed with number adjustments. Keep in mind that everything Xin has received through his various mini-reworks were additions to his repertoire, while conserving his old passive, "stat-checky" boons by moving them to his other abilities, almost no removals of anything (a fourth damaging ability in the form of a skill-shot, but still keeping his ATS steroid and AA based cooldown reduction, which were taken from his old W and split between his E and his Q, as well as bonus damage on his 3-hit passive instead of just healing, like he had before). And yes, I realize it would make him even more similar to Xin (well, more like a mix between Xin and an AD version of Diana), but...what else can be done with such an old concept for a diver, apart from reworking him from the ground up?
@@madsgrams2069 I dont like the idea of reworking jarven; his Q, E and R are uniquely cool and his W is most the way a good idea but probably some number changes will fix it. His passive is nice that it gives him some form of damage but it can honestly be completely reworked into a cool mechanic that also gives damage and everyone will be happy(hopefully something that scales).
I had been stuck in the silver to gold range since I started playing League around 10 years ago. But just a few seasons ago I managed to hit Plat by exclusively spamming Jarvan, cheese ganking level 2 and then spam ganking for the rest of the game, acting kind of as a second support, even building knights vow second (when it was stronger). Quickly though, the next season I started playing other junglers because Jarvan was just boring and does not have all that high of a skill ceiling. Champions like Graves, Lee Sin, Kindred, Kayn just had more nuances, more stuff to learn, a higher skill ceiling and were more fun. But I still have a special fondness for Jarvan, who was like my gateway to a higher elo and jungle. Tl;dr Jarvan was like the Annie of jungle for me
A midscope update for J4 is what he needs. His flag and drag into cataclysm is so iconic I cannot imagine him without it. Maybe giving him some sort of sustain into his passive or changing his W making it a completely new ability, Imagine if you move the shield into his passive and you give him a new utility or damage spell to work with.
I would make his Golden Aegis stay what it is, a shield, but also make it one of those nifty damaging shields, like Sion and Diana have. It would no longer have a slow radius like it has now, but rather have a damaging and slow radius when detonated with a second button push. This explosion would be absent if the shield goes away by itself or is destroyed by enemies, thus meaning that he'd have to choose between it and the protection that the shield provides, I woiuld also make it have some actual good numbers, like say...a good 15% of his maximum health or soemthing, cuase right now it's...pretty pathetic. But it's not all he needs. His passive should also be made to have a lower cool-down on the same target and an interaction with his Q's armor reduction effect, say...when you hit one of those enemies affected by that, you have just one second delay betweern the hard smacks instead of the usual 3. It should also be made to do 8% maximum health damage again, like it used to (it really wasn't all that OP) and be made to be true dmage while the enemy is over 50% health. He should also get a decent attack speed steroid passive from his Demacian Standard (maybe bring back the doubling it used to have). Right now, it's another unimpressive ability, to say the least. Finally, his Cataclysm needs to be made a lock-on dash and the arena needs to be made harder to escape from, say it can no longer be escaped by dashes that don't normally pass through other terrain, just by jumps or other blink abilities (Riven's E no, Kha'Zix's E, Shyvana's ultimate, Master Yi's Q or flash, yes) and his team-mates don't get stuck in it anymore. He should also get some AD steroid after the arena's up, same way Camille gets extra-damge against her Hextech Ultimatum target, but this way he'll gain it against everyone in the arena, not just the original target.
New Passive : Jarvan IV's first basic attack against a target will grant him a shield lasting for 3 seconds, the shield will scale with both AD and max HP, the target will have immunity against this passive for 5 seconds New W : After a 0.25 second cast time, Jarvan IV will do his battlecry, causing an aura to surround him and his E for 5 seconds, Jarvan IV and his allies that are in the aura will gain bonus attack damage while Jarvan IV will get a buff where his first basic attack against a target will deal 5/6/7/8/9% of target's maximum health damage, a portion of the damage dealt by damage through this buff will heal Jarvan IV
@@vinaayagamkarunagaran3439 A shield like Camille's, but that also refreshes when changing target and absorbing all kinds of damage? That would be incredibly broken... I could get on board with this, but the cooldown would have to be similar to Camille's (10 seconds at the very least) and definitely NOT 0, even if you change the target champion. Your idea for his new W is good, but it should only apply to him. He already has a buff for his team-mates for ATS. One for AD would be too much.
J4's overall damage is fine, fair and balanced compared to other champions. His W is just abysmal. Like, increase the base shield; 100 base to 200 would be better. or increase the max shield per champ hit up to 1.8 or something. Is not like you'll hit everyone with it every time. At most 2-3 people. If you're lucky with R, all of them, but that's kind of rare considering every new champ can dash out (or flash)
@@FranciscoJG Neah...they really have to keep his iconic R and his even more iconic E-Q combo. He wouldn't be Jarvan without them. His pathetic shield and old-school, one sentence long passive are the problem.
Yes, W needs a buff they gutted that ability... And do you remember when the E passive also gave you bonus armor? Also his Q hitbox was wider And the EQ pull combo couldn't be cancelled with any type of cc (like Malph's R) And the R was targeted in such a way that you followed the champion half the map until you landed on them if they tried to scape with dashes or flash (like Vi's R)
The ATS steroid on his E also used to double when the flag was up (he basically received the same buff that his team-mates received from it). They really nerfed the poor prince into the ground, didn;t they?
The funny thing about that last one is its a result of the change of turning his R's DMG from the target only into AoE. Looks like they changed the code from "Jump on, track and damage target, create an arena" to "Jump at target's current location, do damage to everything within AoE and create walls". like Jayce Q
Doesn't help that it's pretty easy to completely dodge the damage from his ult by just timing your dash/flash. I dont know why Camille can lock someone down guaranteed with her ult, but Jarvan cannot.
also, J4 can accidentally obstruct or trap allies with his ability. similar champs like yorick and camille have their allies pass through their respective obstacle
I think it would also be interesting for you to do a why no one plays for xin zhao though he is very similar to j4 so their weaknesses might be very similar
If I had to guess why Xin isn't popular... he has similar strengths and issues as J4 (basically being the straight-forward fighter/bruiser who can solo out a single target for a lot of damage). Since Xin is an older champ, he doesn't have the extra utility/tools in his kit like the newer champs.
@@monirkinder7184 True, he did get a rework, but he still seems to function as he used to play. But I feel like Xin could use another kit touch-up (or an ASU), which would encourage more people to play him.
Xin is supposed to be an early game stomper and he just isn't good enough at that, and when he falls off he falls hard and becomes even more useless that's why noone plays him
I like the QE combo however i can agree it takes a toll to what jarvan is able to cast. So what i would do is remove the attack speed buff you get from being at your flag and give it a form of "thresh lantern" shield so when you q to the flag you get your shield. And then you have room for an extra offensive skill. A wide sweep or so that is a weaker version of darius q (weaker in terms of healing however damage wise somthing thats impactfull enough. But i would preffer a lowish cooldown for sure then damage and if posible a selfheal on top
It just came to my mind but its a "solution" to fix J4 biggest issue: What to do when all your habilities are on cd, well what if riot made that applying his passive reduces cooldown on all basic habilities, like ezreal q for example obviously they would have to reduce some numbers and such but I think it is a pretty cool idea :D. Nice video btw
As someone who has played *thousands* of jarvan games, I can say with certainty what his issue is. Jarvan suffers from stat discordance. His steroid is attack speed. His Q scales off of AD, yet disables his basic attack. His passive does not scale with AS. His E is spell power (Which is mismatched with Q's cooldown). His W hardly scales at all. He requires being tanky to dive, yet has no strong defensive abilities. There are many ways to fix Jarvan. I'm going to focus on the simplest version with the least changes. * Swap the coefficients on Jarvan's W. Make the baseline scale off of % HP, have the bonus from hitting heroes a flat shield bonus. * Remove the attack speed steroid from E. * Added Q functionality, after casting has finished, increase attack speed substantially for 3 seconds. * E changed, cooldown increased, basic attacks now reduce E's cooldown. That's the simplest one in my opinion, though I have others which I think people would enjoy greatly.
@@Keln02 E has and always will have snipe damage for low HP targets. It's also an important scouting tool. E is a vital part of Jarvan's kit. In the end this is still the simplest solution to Jarvan's issues.
I want to see more vids on the four horsewoman of the baron lane: riven, camille, fiora, irelia. There’s this trend of polarizing skirmisher/diver/assasin like champs in the baron lane. I find it so coincidental that they have so much in common: they’re highly skill expressive, they’re all extremely mobile, they all have a high skill floor, they all have consistently high winrates.
All of them can destroy tanks by one means or another, making them hard to build against. All of them can make effective short trades and even more effective sustained combat which makes interacting with them at their range hell, in addition to picks like fiora and irelia having great sustain built into their kits. They literally have everything a top laner wants with the only barrier being that they aren’t that easy to pick up and play.
One thing that could be done, riot could Just give a Second cast to his ult, i mean, as he his now he Just break his own walls, imagine If instead of Just breaking he would do something else with then like causing a massive AOE cc and maybe gain some kind of buff after. He would still play the same but his ult would be Far more threatening.
I would love to see a What Happened To about Fizz, I’m a newer player and I hear horror stories about this champion but I almost never actually see him picked
When he was the newest assassin, he destroyed everyone, with tons of windows when you just couldn't do anything to him. I guess he's still like that, but nerfed / overshadowed by newer releases? I mean, he came out before yasuo
If Riot makes a midscope update for J4 I hope they update his passive and W, where his W gives him a shield for every enemy he CC's and his passive now has a 3 hit proc where he does bonus damage to ene - wait a minute...this sounds familiar.
Two thirds of the problem comes down to clear speed alone. Having bad clears used to be just one of many weaknesses a jungler can have. But now that power farming and full clearing became such a dominant playstyle for so long, being bad at clearing isn't just a weakness, it is practically a death sentence. Skiping camps to make an extra play has never been this punishing for this long. Regarding lane Jarvan, his mana costs are **atrocious**. Not that this is his only problem, mind you. But he would have pretty good poke, waveclear and short trades if he didn't ran out of mana in two rotations. There's the issue that squishy champions aren't exactly squishy anymore, so if you have front loaded damage alone, you'll fail to 100-0 your target and get lifestealed to death and you will never find a target that's not full HP because chunking never sticks. The moment a carry touches a minion wave or a jungle camp they lifesteal back to full.
I remember when J4 was everywhere. He definitely does need a mid scope update. His style of champion died when the previous champion designer resigned and the current one took over.
I was Jarvan otp since like S2 and I feel this a lot. I do not even play that much for last few seasons manily because of this. You feel super weak against most of the jungle champs unless you get ahead a lot and even if you do, you have very small window where you are useful, because he falls behind pretty quickly.
I have a couple ideas cause yeah j4 is fun 1) Grounding, add it to e or r to counter some of the crazy dash champs 2) give his shield a drain to up his durability a bit 3) his ult refunds partial cooldown of basic abilities, increased per enemy caught in it 1 or more of these would make him viablely balanced and a counter to all these new dumb champs (I mean they gave poppy a no dash zone and singed)
One cool thing to do is give his ulti a point click root like lee r and then make his dash half seconds. Make the primary target always take the dmg and others dash our easier
Okay but what about the fun ap j4 support build where you go summon aery, and shurelyas. Your e attack speed buff circle on your flag procs aery onto allies repeatedly in 1 e and gives them movespeed from the shield with shurelyas. You do okay poke damage with your e and its pretty hard to avoid too.
Maybe make his E into a 2 part ability, so that the dash is only tied to E. The E2 could have the same animation as the current E+Q. Then change Q into just a damaging move. It can even still be a stab/thrust. W is useful but kinda unimpressive, so change it. Move the shield to his E also. If E2 knocks up a champion, gain a shield, the shield increases based on how many champions you knock up. Wow, now you can make a new W. Perhaps, a mini version of Xin’s ult? Just swing his spear thing around, roughly the size of Jax’s counterstrike. This briefly knocks back any enemies in the area and does damage. Cataclysm can remain the same, it’s iconic, pretty strong, and is a good engage tool. Basically I just combined all of J4’s basic abilities into his E, made it 2 stage. And gave him 2 damaging tools, one of which has aoe hard cc. I can’t remember his passive, so I’m not even going to address it. My J4 rework plays mostly the same, you want to run in, use standard to dive in, and ult a priority target. Except now you can actually have 2 abilities to use after you’re there. Also, maybe his W and R could interact? W to push people back, if they hit the inside wall of R, they are slowed or stunned. Still very much Jarvan at the end of the day
I’d make his flag ability work a bit like GP’s barrels. He could save up to 3-5 flags and every time he uses that ability or reduces the CD on his Q. Also change his w to drag all flags he has up to him and it knocks up any enemy champion it hits.
How about if he uses the e and q combo and hits a champ reduce the current cd of q and e by half . This will give him more pressure when he ganks and will up his DMG and make him for of a DMG dealer , but if this happens maybe make his Q only knock up the 1st or 2 champs hit or something
I Feel Like Jarvan’s R Arena Could Have Something More About It To Give It Umf. Maybe Make It Explode In All Directions When No Enemies Are Inside And Do Massive AOE Damage Like Nunu Ult Size. This’ll Force People To Stay Inside To Not Hurt Allies By Flashing/Using An Ability To Get Out Of The Arena.
There is one extremely fun niche use for J4: Midlane assasin, honestly if you haven't tried it, it's hilarious. Also it makes his w feel "okay to be useless" since assasins shouldn't be too tanky anyways and its just nice to have a little slow to chase for a potential second Q.
What do you guys think? RIOT gave Amumu's q 2 charges, and that massively helped him. I think if Jarvan got 2 charges with his E, he would be able to dash in and dash out or double knock up since the cd in his q isn't that long. It's also nice because his flag gives vision and can't be destroyed. Or, maybe just reduce the duration of his ult but make it that champs get grounded when ulted? (Probably too broken so idk lol)
A cool concept for reworking J4 if need be, would be to keep his e + q combo engage on one key, Q or something, and have it like - First Tap --> Summon the Flag - Second Tap --> Dash to the Flag - Hold --> Only the Damage in a straight line maybe the ability can hold charges as well, like 2 charges, 2 taps consume 1 charge, hold consumes 1 charge. His shield can change to be a shield that lowers enemy resistances as well, and increasing his own. So like, the more enemies there are, the bigger the shield and he gains more resistances based on what he stole. His E / third ability can be changed to something completely different, now that his flag is a part of his q. We have the damage and engage from his Q, and defensive from his W, I'm not sure what his E / third ability can be, what you guys think... And the ultimate can stay the same as well.
Honestly, Jarvan right now is the definition of "balanced" His kit is not overtuned, it accomplishes the job, he deals damage but not THAT much, he can Tank some hits but he is not unkillable, applies CC, gives utility and yet he is quite simple to play and understand. Even when he was meta, he was not broken at all.
His only sin is that he doesn’t put you at an immediate disadvantage when your forced to fight him. Everyone else has some way to either force you into an un winnable situation or just buff themselves up so it’s unlikely theyd win let alone survive your full combo with ult.
J4 is easily one of my favorite champions who, in my opinion, can play any role beside adc with the right match up or partner in bot. But not someone I often take into ranked because -see video- but I love him all the same when playing with my buds
Jarvan IV spotlight got me to start playing LoL at the end of season 3. My friends tried to turn me onto the game, but i didnt start until I watched the J4 Champ Spotlight and Full AD Jarvan by Uberdanger. His ult was SOOO powerful back in the day before mobility creep. It didnt even do AOE damage! I would argue he was the best jungler in Season 4 outside of LCS. Swagflag forever
Jarvan used to be my favorite champ to play pre-item rework. He was super versatile and could build assassin, bruiser or tank depending on comp and game state. After the item rework he's felt very weak due to no good jungle tank items (rip cinderhulk) and his low damage.
its not just abilities that are overtuned its passives mainly newer champions are built around some crazy passive when you compare people like garen rammus Jarvan Janna they are just neat little buffs compare that to characters like Akshan Viego Senna belveth and they are completely OP by comparison
I main J4 as support (CrowElysium on league). And he's a great counter pick against Morgana and lux, because he can still get away, or engage, when rooted. Paired with Samira, his ult and hers is a great combo. And his q shred armour with is always good for an ADC. That said, his w slowing, it's really good I feel. BUT it really lacks in defensive abilities. If they changed his passive or just his W to have a better shield. Hell, not even a shield, just give his W a movement speed buff like teemo. You can take away the slow to make it fair. It would allow for better escapes especially if you can't slow them with the w, you'd be able to speed yourself up
To be honest i keep forgetting Teemo has a movespeed buff both passive and active as it does not feel like it exists with this speed creep they have. Also it sucks that fair champions fall to become supports as they are shit everywhere else
Back then Champion design seemed to be a lot more balanced. It's crazy to say that but when you think about it, creating champions with one defining trait leaves them more vulnerable to counterplay and thus ensures a healthier gameplay experience. When a champion's problems in the current meta-game boil down to "being too fair", you know Leauge has issues. I kinda wish Riot went back to that design Philosophy instead of releasing another Yone or Yuumi.
There are so many things Riot Games could do for J4. I would give him a re-cast mechanic on his E so that if you re-cast your E J4 automaticly gets to his Flag similar to Lee Sin´s Q. Then the thing with his Flag in general. It needs an AD or HP scaling and a bit more AoE when it hits the ground. And a small QoL change: Make the zone visiable where you get the AS aura buff from his Flag. His W is a extremely weak shield. Yes, it gets better if you hit more champions with Golden Aegis but you rarely hit more than 2 and even with all 5 enemy champions its still not that big. Higher base values or put a passive on the skill like his E has. I am not sure about that one but maybe changing the Q into an Amplified AA that helps with AA resets? Bruiser/Tank J4 does mostly AA`s after his engage so an Q that functions as a AA-reset should do better. His passive should be something entirely different or make it at least max. HP dmg instead of current HP and lower the target immunity from his 6/5/4/3 sec (Based on lv) to continuously 3 seconds.
i played him jg and he is good, people dont see him much and dont know him. if you play mid and theyre range. play safe soo they think that youre bad. and at lvl 2 do E Q combo and free kill or lane prio
13:43 I did something with it,(to keep enemies stuck to him: additional Passive: Jarvan's AAs slowdown(30%) enemies that have been Crushed.) in that stance he still just AAs. So I'll keep it and give his Q the another section after use: Forward March: Jarvan swing his Javelin forward in a cone, crushing the ground dealing physical damage and slowing targets hit. If an enemy has already been slowed, Root them instead. Then he swings in a half circle, dealing physical and additional magic damage. If an enemy champion has either been Rooted, stunned or slowed, it deals additional true damage while healing him for 30 per target. Q cooldown is reduced via Jarven's attacks, 3 for abilities, 1 for AAs.
I used to main J4 and he's very fun to play. And I agree, he needs some adjustments for the uptime. I think cutting down the Q cooldown and increasing the E cooldown in proportion might work (Gives him more damage in a straight up fight but if he wants to engage he has to make it count because if he misfires he's not surviving 10+ seconds for his next flag) Also, I think that changing him into more of a full tank with inside out playstyle would be better than keeping him a diver - move some of the damage into his tankiness. You can't ignore him because of the armor shred and the fact that he just locked your main carry in a cage but if you go for him the rest of the team has open way
I don't agree with your E adjustments, but i do agree changing him into a tank. I play him as a tank support anyway. His kit is great for team fights obviously, but it also really works in bot lane. Gives adc attack speed, plus attack shred. Plus current health DMG to tanks. Plus can counter Morg and Lux cc. Etc etc But his W is def his weakest. I love the slow but hate the shield
@@cgijokerman5787 Yeah, my changes are meant to give him more consistent dmg to the detriment of not having the extreme range engage as often (But with the recent champs I think just lowering the Q cd would be enough). I like the W shield idea, the numbers on it need to be higher though, and quite a bit. I still balance him around being a jungler.
@@galactick3816 I would change his ultimate. Make it more difficult to escape from it because at the moment it feels like every character can escape from it. Add a slow or applying the armour shred, something to make it worth even if the target escapes.
@@galactick3816 would be to good. The radius of the zone is small so no counter play for people in it plus it could entrap a hole team. It would be completely busted in pro play and probably in solo play as well. Look at Camille, one champ only and he can move in a bigger zone so he can still somewhat dodge her attacks even if you are forced to duel her. Still a very brutal ult to get hit by. I think a armour sheared extra debuff would be still effective. I would give the flag mini wall properties not unlike Orn's q.
I think a potential option would be to pull a diana on him and swap something like his ultimate and demacia standard. I know this sounds stupid without elaborating so hear me out; Potentially swapping his ultimate to basic ability that's a-non target point and click that would give him some form of durability buff and only raise a wall around an area for a very short time like yorrick, but then he could also be able to be the only one that could AA it to destroy a small portion of it so he can leave. This can give him area control, more durability without being too insane, still give him a minor amount of mobility and double not just for engage but also disengaging if necessary. It also encourages thoughtful use when engaging and not just using it carelessly... since if you go in you're stuck in a short 1v1 and if you AA to try to get out immediately this leaves you open for a slightly minimized trade due to the durability buff. The durability increase would be just enough to help you duel but not enough that recklessly engaging on someone who absurdly out-damages you doesn't guarantee you'll get away without losing the trade. This being on a basic ability now means that it isn't then end of the world when you don't time it perfectly to maximize its impact against enemy dash and flash cooldowns, and leaves just enough time to combo with large aoe ultimates that I think he'd still see picking in pro play for his now slightly more mild wombo-combo potential while still giving him some cc to work around with for ganks. If the cc from basic ability cataclysm isn't enough the armor shred on q could potentially be traded out for a slow? Moving demacian standard to his ultimate could allow the targeting range and buffs to be much more increased while also increasing his q's ability to reach it; you drop the flag from fog of war and then dash and knock up from twice the distance while getting an insane combat steroid and a small non-stacking shield pulsed to you and your allies (ie flag comes down, it gives your team a 100 health shield, you take damage but the shield wasn't completely destroyed it sets it back to a 100 one second later, not stacking) while it lasts. This in combo with his q can give him a decently long rang "save the day" sort of ultimate like galio where at the cost of his q cooldown he can jump in to save the day like the king's calvary coming in to save the troops, fitting his battle-king like and demacian MO. This could potentially be busted as he could just drop it without having to engage? Which if that is too much of an issue we could just have it forcibly cast his q towards the flag which I don't think is a terrible tradeoff. I like all of this conceptually because it makes him an interesting hybrid of keeping his diver playstyle while also giving him an AD control mage/warden sort of vibe. Alternatively if this all sounds too "200+ years" we could just say fuck it and make the AOE in his ulti now have a no-mobility-grounding effect like cass and poppy.
Jarvin is really strong in aram right now with heartsteel+titanic hydra build. After that can build bruiser or tank depending on enemy comp.but you end up with like 6k health just smacking fools
lethality jarvan is underrated. if the majority of the enemy is squishy, you will one shot with a combo and sometimes just your ult. his ult has %180 AD scaling (insane) so after a few items his ult will do upwards of 1,000 damage. I believe his Q has something like %140 AD scaling too. So one full combo and maybe an auto, you will destroy squishies. it's actually super fun lol.
Was going to make a comment about it myself. Once you get the build up and running you can win an auto fight with most champions as long as they can't run from you (his ult). Maybe it only works in lower elo though.
Make his ult or w cripple enemies, increase w shield, replace e atks buff with mvs burst buff (like 30% for 2 seconds for teammates) but keep his passive atks so he can clear and you got a champ thats still balanced but has a bit more oomph on his engage and can actually be considered as a champ nowadays
I think that this next build can help solve some of his problems: -Phase Rush as main rune can help him engage into more dangerous situations without getting so punished, as well as helping with stickiness during a fight. -Eclipse and Stridebreaker provide good damage as mythic items: Eclipse ads a shield that synergizes with Golden Aegis and Stridebreaker gives more movement speed. -Fimbulwinter makes up to strenghten the Golden Aegis shield while also providing tanky stats. -Black Cleaver provides increased damage thanks to its pasive as well as a good amount of cooldown reduction that allowes him to engage/cc more frequently. -Gargoyle's Stoneplate gives another shield while also providing tank stats that synergizes with Fimbulwinter. -Ionian Lucidity Boots gives us extra cooldown reduction and are quite handy since Jarvan's E-Q combo can buffer/parry a lot of CC abilities (except point-and-clicks) What are your opinions on it?
Same experience here, by second buff on 1st clear i had to kite all over the place so I don't embarrass myself and get executed lol note: never played him before preseason 13
I like it when i face him top lane well not the he fucking hurts as a single target part but when the enemy jungler comes he ults in to make it a 1v1 or accidently lets me escape while trapping his jungler. Norms is a fucking roulette that you can never get Mastery 7 tokens on i swear, hell i can't even play support as that is what people go to to farm Mastery 7 tokens as we all know all a support has to do is get assists and high vision score
It has became my sidequest that whenever Vars uploads a Why No One Plays on a champion, I play that champion rigorously to try and understand Vars' points. As a tip, studying these points and overcoming those said weaknesses can actually help you master the champion.
I feel like J4 needs a new passive since his current one feels misplaced, it's a frontloaded damaging ability that feels wrong on a bruiser/tank. Also he needs like a mini stun or knock up on his ult to allow you to capitalise on it since mobility creep has made it so about 80% of champs either don't care that they're trapped in a box with you or can just leave.
Vars, I think it was the item rework that made tank J4 so bad. In s10 I played a lot of Jarvan in Clash and premades since he brought very good on demand engage. Usually I would build Cinderhulk, Thornmail, Gargoyles. This build made him actually tanky. In s11 J4's jungle clear would be severely hurt compared to other champs if he built tanky, and the tank items weren't as cheap as before. He effectively lost income, effective items and the items had increased cost.
Just put his E-Q combo on his Q alone and make it work like Warwick Q. If he holds it, he travels, if he taps it he just places the flag and stabs but doesn't travel. E only exists to make the Q work anyway. You can even go as far as having him receive his W shield upon traveling the distance. That way he can have 2 full extra abilities to work with.
After this video, I started thinking about xin Zhao. He seems very reliable, and strong yet never seems to be that great despite having a very balanced kit imo. It'd be nice if you spoke about it
Xin is in the same boat right now. I also think he one of the clunkiest melee champs in the game since his rework. So many champs do the job better with more damage escapes or just survivability than Xin or J4. Maybe it is me but reworked Xin feels extremely clunky. His q feels so much worse than the old one.
jarvans kit be LIT for supporting "standard" adcs(physical attack speed ones) tho, % armor pen on q, a slow on w, giving allies attack speed with e, the worst lockdown in the game on ult and a pretty good engage.
I never give up an opportunity to play Jarvan IV on ARAM. In that mode he's an absolute blast, especially considering I don't play Jungle. He's simple but I like that in a champion.
Have you tried Annie and Garen? they too are simple champions but better than J4 as you can actually live while killing a team and with Annie you can just Flash Tibbers stuns the entire enemy team nukes them Hooray Pentakill
@@nephilimdj Dude who gives a fuck about Aram as most of the time you are not going to get Annie even with a Aram only account giving you better odds of getting the champ you want so no fucking point in bringing up Aram. Besides a lot of champions scale badly in Aram otherwise they would be fucking broken as it is a different fucking mode than real league
j4 was one of the best before because of 2 things he was great at.. 1) clash team attackspeed boost and 2) the other item that grant attackspeed for teammates that are near for 5% each(stackable per champion with the same item btw) and players are great at weaving autos back then. nowadays you could rarely see a jinx or varus... etc. do auto attack... players could not see the difference between those kinds of champs and ezreal.
I think they should combine his EQ together to be a damaging knock up engage. Then make his W a auto attack toggle that swaps between a damage and healing version. Then make his E a ranged poke that slows. And make his R an AOE explosion, that gives attack speed and AR. Then make his passive a revive. And there we have it, a fixed jarvan.
If they wanted to make Jarvan relevant. Change his W to also include a damage reduction, and his ult should include a Taunt to those caught inside (very few champions use this mechanic) and he should shine well. He gains the damage reduction that will allow him to really shine in making him fight and his ult will gain the shine that he had in the earlier seasons. That way he gains a very adaptive kit. Q and E are well off providing armor reduction and attack speed. W will allow him to stay in fights longer, and his R will bring an insane threat to the backline since they're forced to fight for a little bit rather than dashing out with a 4 second cd....
Maybe they should add a function to his e+q combo Like when he hits it on enemies and knocks them up, he gets 5% less damage from these enemies. But that is just my opinion
I would actually love to see him shifted into a more support style jungler, kind of like how nidalee used to run Athenes in pro play and play more defensively. I'd love to see his w apply to teammates as well and a little bit higher scaling on it (maybe an AP ratio). AP Harbin support where u go mostly enchanter occasionally becomes meta every once and a while and it's such and amazing Playstyle for him as it fits him really well and his kit is def suited for it. While i don't think he should straight up be worked into a support introducing some small supportive buffs could def lead to him carving out his own niche where u may not want to pick him for his damage, or clear, or gank-ability but for utility and pressure. He can now save your team and be an amazing counter jungler while still being able to set up some picks for him self here and there.
I have come 11 months from the release of this video to say that in season 13 with goredrinker and spear of shojin jarvan is a top tier jungle because he scales so well with ability haste. this champ is able to spam e q more often than my parents give me compliments.
Simple: If you play him bruiser his biggest strength is his early which is compared to other earaly game power houses (Elise, Lee etc.) too weak. He falls off like crazy and Goredrinker is not very beneficial on him (too expensive with too little dmg is brings to the table). Another issue about the bruiser build which in my opionion is still the best out of all options is that you need to run conq. which again doesn't exactly synergize with J4 (not enough attack speed + the rest of his build idk BC, GA etc. none of that boots your attack speed) so it becomes useless in mid you have no self heal in your kid and bruiser build doenst give you enough sustain to stay in fights longer. Its basically still going in with e+q hoping to airborne multiple targets and then kinda jab ansd dap until you see good ult opportunity. The ult deals zero dmg in later stages of the game and with all the dashes and mobility in the game its not even a solid cc option anymore ( no hard cc). I could go on but thats just my experience.
I play him support and get a tank item and boots a couple brusier items then 2 tank items pretty tank good engage and enough dmg you cant ignore. Or full armor spread jungle
Jarvan's ult should be like Legion Commander's from DotA. A 1 vs anyone trapped challenge that gives him stats on victory. Also his cataclysm should be bigger.
i think the one thing they can make him better is to make his ult more useful. they can easily make it as useful as mordekaisers ult , dont know why j4 is getting the short straw
They should make his w a sweep damage move (like gore active) that gives him a shield depending on his max health and people hit. And make his cataclysm have a slight grounding capability.
I remember when his ult was actually useful for trapping people, now everyone and their mother can get out so easily.
There are still loads of priority targets that cant get out of it, and you can force their dashes out beforehand too.
I wish that Jarvan's ult makes enemies unable to dash away
@@etheron1235 so Camille r
@@kaedonx0673 yeah she is a better version of J4
@@adamnagel7436 camille can't deal aoe dmg with her r
You know what he needs? A totally obscure 3 hit passive
Riot already sent you a job letter
What if J4's passive but it works like Kled's W?
How about an infinite stacking passive? Or a reset upon take downs..
Or maybe a bible wall of text?
Also make sure the text explaining that 3 hit passive is more text than other champions have for their entire champion kit and lore.
He is too fair compared to the new abominations Riot is adding lately, passives with more words than an entire old champ kit, resets everywhere, free damage, penetration or true damage for no reason, there is no way an old champ like him can compete.
Passives with more words than Shaco lore
At least let Jarvan throw two flags at the same time.
@@magnusm4 yeah, make his Q or E (attack speed bonus stacks) has 2 charges should help him. Like Amumu's Q
I think that they could just make it that if he dash with q, the q refreshes.
@@gkarak1996 maybe reduce the CD, but not refreshing. Otherwise you can stunlock people and thats cancerous
I can imagine if J4 was released today he'd have his E+Q reset every time he gets a takedown. Oh, and he rushes Duskblade for the invisible dashes.
if i were riot, ill make his q recastable on his e but the second cast has no damage but would still knock up enemies. good for going in and going out easily
and if you hit E with Q, you get automatic 50% cd reduce
It's not an attractive playstyle to dump all your spells and die half of the time, but nothing is more fun than knocking up your enemies on repeat once you get absurd amounts of ability haste.
But he's like malph. His r is "telegraphed".
@@aaronmcconkey1062 abut unlike Malphite, Jarvan can get in your face and press R to win anyway even if you try and kite.
@@aaronmcconkey1062it doesnt matter how telegraphed it is if they cant do anything about it
@@sekira4516 most champs just kill J4 straight up. He doesn't do much damage. If you go tank J4 you are just holding people so your team can wipe them out
@@sekira4516 AP Malphite.
I think he's due for a mid-scope update, like Olaf, Talyah and Swaim.
As a bot lane main i agree
Yes one that would give them an actual passive and W.
Most definitely.
Yea and make him batshit broken like swain for 2 weeks
Olav*
I rmember when this champ first came out. Dude had wild mechanics, dashing through walls/ champs followed by a knock up, etc people immediately screamed OP. Oh how times have changed
Riot can easily make jarven great again by buffing his W's scaling based on how many it hits.
Fr a skirmisher like Yone gets a bigger shield for hitting multiple people and also does damage with it, Jarvans abilities are simply underpowered right now
His W is such an after thought. They had no idea what to do so they added a worthless shield haha.
It does tho, which is the saddest part
I'd say he needs more than that: make his passive reset after a fixed number of hits on the same target (say 4 or so) instead of a flat amount of time, so that way having ATS enhancements matter more to him, make it also have some healing, like Xin Zhao's, give him a better ATS steroid on his Demacian Standard and maybe make his shield actually be worth something in terms of numbers and also make it be able to get blown up by detonating it with a second activation after a small time delay...and do some damage when it pops, like Diana's or Sion's, but only if it's popped at will and not by enemy damage (that way the balance is kept by choosing between the damage and the protection). A trade-off for this would be to move the slow on the detonation, not when the shield is created.
He desperately needs more 1 on 1 dueling potential. Right now...Xin Zhao's just better than him in almost every way, because his heavy auto-attack focus makes him more consistent and a good (although not great) duelist and basically allows him to pull double-duty as a skirmisher. It might seem excessive love that can potentially make him overloaded, but I think it's nothing compared to the trend of newer champions and, at worst, it'll just make him a bit overtuned, something that can easily be fixed with number adjustments. Keep in mind that everything Xin has received through his various mini-reworks were additions to his repertoire, while conserving his old passive, "stat-checky" boons by moving them to his other abilities, almost no removals of anything (a fourth damaging ability in the form of a skill-shot, but still keeping his ATS steroid and AA based cooldown reduction, which were taken from his old W and split between his E and his Q, as well as bonus damage on his 3-hit passive instead of just healing, like he had before). And yes, I realize it would make him even more similar to Xin (well, more like a mix between Xin and an AD version of Diana), but...what else can be done with such an old concept for a diver, apart from reworking him from the ground up?
@@madsgrams2069 I dont like the idea of reworking jarven; his Q, E and R are uniquely cool and his W is most the way a good idea but probably some number changes will fix it.
His passive is nice that it gives him some form of damage but it can honestly be completely reworked into a cool mechanic that also gives damage and everyone will be happy(hopefully something that scales).
I had been stuck in the silver to gold range since I started playing League around 10 years ago. But just a few seasons ago I managed to hit Plat by exclusively spamming Jarvan, cheese ganking level 2 and then spam ganking for the rest of the game, acting kind of as a second support, even building knights vow second (when it was stronger).
Quickly though, the next season I started playing other junglers because Jarvan was just boring and does not have all that high of a skill ceiling. Champions like Graves, Lee Sin, Kindred, Kayn just had more nuances, more stuff to learn, a higher skill ceiling and were more fun. But I still have a special fondness for Jarvan, who was like my gateway to a higher elo and jungle.
Tl;dr Jarvan was like the Annie of jungle for me
This video aged like milk, lol.
A midscope update for J4 is what he needs. His flag and drag into cataclysm is so iconic I cannot imagine him without it. Maybe giving him some sort of sustain into his passive or changing his W making it a completely new ability, Imagine if you move the shield into his passive and you give him a new utility or damage spell to work with.
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I would make his Golden Aegis stay what it is, a shield, but also make it one of those nifty damaging shields, like Sion and Diana have. It would no longer have a slow radius like it has now, but rather have a damaging and slow radius when detonated with a second button push. This explosion would be absent if the shield goes away by itself or is destroyed by enemies, thus meaning that he'd have to choose between it and the protection that the shield provides, I woiuld also make it have some actual good numbers, like say...a good 15% of his maximum health or soemthing, cuase right now it's...pretty pathetic.
But it's not all he needs. His passive should also be made to have a lower cool-down on the same target and an interaction with his Q's armor reduction effect, say...when you hit one of those enemies affected by that, you have just one second delay betweern the hard smacks instead of the usual 3. It should also be made to do 8% maximum health damage again, like it used to (it really wasn't all that OP) and be made to be true dmage while the enemy is over 50% health. He should also get a decent attack speed steroid passive from his Demacian Standard (maybe bring back the doubling it used to have). Right now, it's another unimpressive ability, to say the least.
Finally, his Cataclysm needs to be made a lock-on dash and the arena needs to be made harder to escape from, say it can no longer be escaped by dashes that don't normally pass through other terrain, just by jumps or other blink abilities (Riven's E no, Kha'Zix's E, Shyvana's ultimate, Master Yi's Q or flash, yes) and his team-mates don't get stuck in it anymore. He should also get some AD steroid after the arena's up, same way Camille gets extra-damge against her Hextech Ultimatum target, but this way he'll gain it against everyone in the arena, not just the original target.
New Passive : Jarvan IV's first basic attack against a target will grant him a shield lasting for 3 seconds, the shield will scale with both AD and max HP, the target will have immunity against this passive for 5 seconds
New W : After a 0.25 second cast time, Jarvan IV will do his battlecry, causing an aura to surround him and his E for 5 seconds, Jarvan IV and his allies that are in the aura will gain bonus attack damage while Jarvan IV will get a buff where his first basic attack against a target will deal 5/6/7/8/9% of target's maximum health damage, a portion of the damage dealt by damage through this buff will heal Jarvan IV
@@vinaayagamkarunagaran3439 A shield like Camille's, but that also refreshes when changing target and absorbing all kinds of damage? That would be incredibly broken... I could get on board with this, but the cooldown would have to be similar to Camille's (10 seconds at the very least) and definitely NOT 0, even if you change the target champion. Your idea for his new W is good, but it should only apply to him. He already has a buff for his team-mates for ATS. One for AD would be too much.
@@madsgrams2069 let me stop you there. The shield would break 90% of the time making that change utterly useless for him and make him worse.
J4's overall damage is fine, fair and balanced compared to other champions. His W is just abysmal. Like, increase the base shield; 100 base to 200 would be better. or increase the max shield per champ hit up to 1.8 or something. Is not like you'll hit everyone with it every time. At most 2-3 people. If you're lucky with R, all of them, but that's kind of rare considering every new champ can dash out (or flash)
He needs a midscope update and a godking legendary skin
Ashen Knight meaby? Seems pretty fitting to me. Xin Zhao, K'sante and Garen too I think would fit the skin line.
Oh Azir as well!
He's old enough to get a full VGU tbh
Specially considering the horrendous BR VO
@@nicolaezenoaga9756 pretty sure mordekaiser was the final ashen knight skin of the year, and I don’t think they’ll continue it for a while
@@FranciscoJG Neah...they really have to keep his iconic R and his even more iconic E-Q combo. He wouldn't be Jarvan without them. His pathetic shield and old-school, one sentence long passive are the problem.
Yes, W needs a buff they gutted that ability...
And do you remember when the E passive also gave you bonus armor?
Also his Q hitbox was wider
And the EQ pull combo couldn't be cancelled with any type of cc (like Malph's R)
And the R was targeted in such a way that you followed the champion half the map until you landed on them if they tried to scape with dashes or flash (like Vi's R)
The ATS steroid on his E also used to double when the flag was up (he basically received the same buff that his team-mates received from it). They really nerfed the poor prince into the ground, didn;t they?
The funny thing about that last one is its a result of the change of turning his R's DMG from the target only into AoE. Looks like they changed the code from "Jump on, track and damage target, create an arena" to "Jump at target's current location, do damage to everything within AoE and create walls". like Jayce Q
Doesn't help that it's pretty easy to completely dodge the damage from his ult by just timing your dash/flash.
I dont know why Camille can lock someone down guaranteed with her ult, but Jarvan cannot.
also, J4 can accidentally obstruct or trap allies with his ability. similar champs like yorick and camille have their allies pass through their respective obstacle
@@Underworlder5 that's because the walls are *actual* terrain and are coded like it.
@@sekira4516 Doesn't change the fact that it is a problem that other champions have bypassed.
I think it would also be interesting for you to do a why no one plays for xin zhao though he is very similar to j4 so their weaknesses might be very similar
If I had to guess why Xin isn't popular... he has similar strengths and issues as J4 (basically being the straight-forward fighter/bruiser who can solo out a single target for a lot of damage). Since Xin is an older champ, he doesn't have the extra utility/tools in his kit like the newer champs.
Also, Xin Zhao is a little more popular than Jarvan because of that ultimate, which is very good on tf.
@@namishusband818 xin had a complete rework, so his kit is not older than jarvan's
@@monirkinder7184 True, he did get a rework, but he still seems to function as he used to play. But I feel like Xin could use another kit touch-up (or an ASU), which would encourage more people to play him.
Xin is supposed to be an early game stomper and he just isn't good enough at that, and when he falls off he falls hard and becomes even more useless that's why noone plays him
His w is like half an ability while his q e really feels similar. Gotta make the dash one ability and maybe have a ranged poke slow to replace
So Camille basically?
I like the QE combo however i can agree it takes a toll to what jarvan is able to cast. So what i would do is remove the attack speed buff you get from being at your flag and give it a form of "thresh lantern" shield so when you q to the flag you get your shield. And then you have room for an extra offensive skill. A wide sweep or so that is a weaker version of darius q (weaker in terms of healing however damage wise somthing thats impactfull enough. But i would preffer a lowish cooldown for sure then damage and if posible a selfheal on top
It just came to my mind but its a "solution" to fix J4 biggest issue: What to do when all your habilities are on cd, well what if riot made that applying his passive reduces cooldown on all basic habilities, like ezreal q for example obviously they would have to reduce some numbers and such but I think it is a pretty cool idea :D.
Nice video btw
Once upon a time Jarvan's flag used to grant bonus AS AND ARMOR. Those were the good ol days for J4 mains
As someone who has played *thousands* of jarvan games, I can say with certainty what his issue is.
Jarvan suffers from stat discordance.
His steroid is attack speed.
His Q scales off of AD, yet disables his basic attack.
His passive does not scale with AS.
His E is spell power (Which is mismatched with Q's cooldown).
His W hardly scales at all.
He requires being tanky to dive, yet has no strong defensive abilities.
There are many ways to fix Jarvan. I'm going to focus on the simplest version with the least changes.
* Swap the coefficients on Jarvan's W. Make the baseline scale off of % HP, have the bonus from hitting heroes a flat shield bonus.
* Remove the attack speed steroid from E.
* Added Q functionality, after casting has finished, increase attack speed substantially for 3 seconds.
* E changed, cooldown increased, basic attacks now reduce E's cooldown.
That's the simplest one in my opinion, though I have others which I think people would enjoy greatly.
But then E practically does nothing.
if E grounded enemies it would be a lot more interesting...
@@Keln02
E has and always will have snipe damage for low HP targets. It's also an important scouting tool.
E is a vital part of Jarvan's kit.
In the end this is still the simplest solution to Jarvan's issues.
Oh lord have mercy 1:38
I want to see more vids on the four horsewoman of the baron lane: riven, camille, fiora, irelia. There’s this trend of polarizing skirmisher/diver/assasin like champs in the baron lane. I find it so coincidental that they have so much in common: they’re highly skill expressive, they’re all extremely mobile, they all have a high skill floor, they all have consistently high winrates.
All of them can destroy tanks by one means or another, making them hard to build against. All of them can make effective short trades and even more effective sustained combat which makes interacting with them at their range hell, in addition to picks like fiora and irelia having great sustain built into their kits. They literally have everything a top laner wants with the only barrier being that they aren’t that easy to pick up and play.
One thing that could be done, riot could Just give a Second cast to his ult, i mean, as he his now he Just break his own walls, imagine If instead of Just breaking he would do something else with then like causing a massive AOE cc and maybe gain some kind of buff after.
He would still play the same but his ult would be Far more threatening.
That would be awesome like if he destroys his walls he would make an area wich buff allies and himself
@@custodianguardofthemagyari216 yeah, his ult would feel complete with this.
I would love to see a What Happened To about Fizz, I’m a newer player and I hear horror stories about this champion but I almost never actually see him picked
When he was the newest assassin, he destroyed everyone, with tons of windows when you just couldn't do anything to him. I guess he's still like that, but nerfed / overshadowed by newer releases?
I mean, he came out before yasuo
Just replace his W with Yone W, adjust his numbers, maybe make that people cant dash from his R and his pick rate will skyrocket.
Or just play Camille
If Riot makes a midscope update for J4 I hope they update his passive and W, where his W gives him a shield for every enemy he CC's and his passive now has a 3 hit proc where he does bonus damage to ene - wait a minute...this sounds familiar.
Two thirds of the problem comes down to clear speed alone. Having bad clears used to be just one of many weaknesses a jungler can have. But now that power farming and full clearing became such a dominant playstyle for so long, being bad at clearing isn't just a weakness, it is practically a death sentence. Skiping camps to make an extra play has never been this punishing for this long.
Regarding lane Jarvan, his mana costs are **atrocious**. Not that this is his only problem, mind you. But he would have pretty good poke, waveclear and short trades if he didn't ran out of mana in two rotations.
There's the issue that squishy champions aren't exactly squishy anymore, so if you have front loaded damage alone, you'll fail to 100-0 your target and get lifestealed to death and you will never find a target that's not full HP because chunking never sticks. The moment a carry touches a minion wave or a jungle camp they lifesteal back to full.
3 months after and we discovered the only probled that jarvan had: his w was useless
I remember when J4 was everywhere. He definitely does need a mid scope update. His style of champion died when the previous champion designer resigned and the current one took over.
Was just watching your ganondorf video, this video came out as soon as I finished it
I was Jarvan otp since like S2 and I feel this a lot. I do not even play that much for last few seasons manily because of this. You feel super weak against most of the jungle champs unless you get ahead a lot and even if you do, you have very small window where you are useful, because he falls behind pretty quickly.
I have a couple ideas cause yeah j4 is fun
1) Grounding, add it to e or r to counter some of the crazy dash champs
2) give his shield a drain to up his durability a bit
3) his ult refunds partial cooldown of basic abilities, increased per enemy caught in it
1 or more of these would make him viablely balanced and a counter to all these new dumb champs (I mean they gave poppy a no dash zone and singed)
One cool thing to do is give his ulti a point click root like lee r and then make his dash half seconds. Make the primary target always take the dmg and others dash our easier
Okay but what about the fun ap j4 support build where you go summon aery, and shurelyas. Your e attack speed buff circle on your flag procs aery onto allies repeatedly in 1 e and gives them movespeed from the shield with shurelyas. You do okay poke damage with your e and its pretty hard to avoid too.
Maybe make his E into a 2 part ability, so that the dash is only tied to E. The E2 could have the same animation as the current E+Q. Then change Q into just a damaging move. It can even still be a stab/thrust. W is useful but kinda unimpressive, so change it. Move the shield to his E also. If E2 knocks up a champion, gain a shield, the shield increases based on how many champions you knock up. Wow, now you can make a new W. Perhaps, a mini version of Xin’s ult? Just swing his spear thing around, roughly the size of Jax’s counterstrike. This briefly knocks back any enemies in the area and does damage. Cataclysm can remain the same, it’s iconic, pretty strong, and is a good engage tool. Basically I just combined all of J4’s basic abilities into his E, made it 2 stage. And gave him 2 damaging tools, one of which has aoe hard cc. I can’t remember his passive, so I’m not even going to address it. My J4 rework plays mostly the same, you want to run in, use standard to dive in, and ult a priority target. Except now you can actually have 2 abilities to use after you’re there. Also, maybe his W and R could interact? W to push people back, if they hit the inside wall of R, they are slowed or stunned. Still very much Jarvan at the end of the day
You can design champs better than 90% of the clowns at riot
I’d make his flag ability work a bit like GP’s barrels. He could save up to 3-5 flags and every time he uses that ability or reduces the CD on his Q. Also change his w to drag all flags he has up to him and it knocks up any enemy champion it hits.
How about if he uses the e and q combo and hits a champ reduce the current cd of q and e by half . This will give him more pressure when he ganks and will up his DMG and make him for of a DMG dealer , but if this happens maybe make his Q only knock up the 1st or 2 champs hit or something
I Feel Like Jarvan’s R Arena Could Have Something More About It To Give It Umf. Maybe Make It Explode In All Directions When No Enemies Are Inside And Do Massive AOE Damage Like Nunu Ult Size. This’ll Force People To Stay Inside To Not Hurt Allies By Flashing/Using An Ability To Get Out Of The Arena.
There is one extremely fun niche use for J4: Midlane assasin, honestly if you haven't tried it, it's hilarious.
Also it makes his w feel "okay to be useless" since assasins shouldn't be too tanky anyways and its just nice to have a little slow to chase for a potential second Q.
What do you guys think? RIOT gave Amumu's q 2 charges, and that massively helped him. I think if Jarvan got 2 charges with his E, he would be able to dash in and dash out or double knock up since the cd in his q isn't that long. It's also nice because his flag gives vision and can't be destroyed. Or, maybe just reduce the duration of his ult but make it that champs get grounded when ulted? (Probably too broken so idk lol)
A cool concept for reworking J4 if need be, would be to keep his e + q combo engage on one key, Q or something, and have it like
- First Tap --> Summon the Flag
- Second Tap --> Dash to the Flag
- Hold --> Only the Damage in a straight line
maybe the ability can hold charges as well, like 2 charges, 2 taps consume 1 charge, hold consumes 1 charge.
His shield can change to be a shield that lowers enemy resistances as well, and increasing his own. So like, the more enemies there are, the bigger the shield and he gains more resistances based on what he stole.
His E / third ability can be changed to something completely different, now that his flag is a part of his q. We have the damage and engage from his Q, and defensive from his W, I'm not sure what his E / third ability can be, what you guys think...
And the ultimate can stay the same as well.
jarvan is the most champion ever. not over or undertuned .
I feel like he deserves some attack speed when inside cataclysm not just when standing by the E.
Honestly, Jarvan right now is the definition of "balanced"
His kit is not overtuned, it accomplishes the job, he deals damage but not THAT much, he can Tank some hits but he is not unkillable, applies CC, gives utility and yet he is quite simple to play and understand. Even when he was meta, he was not broken at all.
His only sin is that he doesn’t put you at an immediate disadvantage when your forced to fight him. Everyone else has some way to either force you into an un winnable situation or just buff themselves up so it’s unlikely theyd win let alone survive your full combo with ult.
J4 is easily one of my favorite champions who, in my opinion, can play any role beside adc with the right match up or partner in bot. But not someone I often take into ranked because -see video- but I love him all the same when playing with my buds
Jarvan IV spotlight got me to start playing LoL at the end of season 3. My friends tried to turn me onto the game, but i didnt start until I watched the J4 Champ Spotlight and Full AD Jarvan by Uberdanger. His ult was SOOO powerful back in the day before mobility creep. It didnt even do AOE damage! I would argue he was the best jungler in Season 4 outside of LCS. Swagflag forever
Jarvan used to be my favorite champ to play pre-item rework. He was super versatile and could build assassin, bruiser or tank depending on comp and game state. After the item rework he's felt very weak due to no good jungle tank items (rip cinderhulk) and his low damage.
its not just abilities that are overtuned its passives mainly newer champions are built around some crazy passive when you compare people like garen rammus Jarvan Janna they are just neat little buffs compare that to characters like Akshan Viego Senna belveth and they are completely OP by comparison
I'VE WANTED A VIDEO FROM YOU ABOUT HIM FOR SO LANG THANK YOU
I'VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS VIDEO FOR SO LONG
I main J4 as support (CrowElysium on league). And he's a great counter pick against Morgana and lux, because he can still get away, or engage, when rooted. Paired with Samira, his ult and hers is a great combo. And his q shred armour with is always good for an ADC.
That said, his w slowing, it's really good I feel. BUT it really lacks in defensive abilities. If they changed his passive or just his W to have a better shield. Hell, not even a shield, just give his W a movement speed buff like teemo. You can take away the slow to make it fair.
It would allow for better escapes especially if you can't slow them with the w, you'd be able to speed yourself up
To be honest i keep forgetting Teemo has a movespeed buff both passive and active as it does not feel like it exists with this speed creep they have. Also it sucks that fair champions fall to become supports as they are shit everywhere else
Back then Champion design seemed to be a lot more balanced. It's crazy to say that but when you think about it, creating champions with one defining trait leaves them more vulnerable to counterplay and thus ensures a healthier gameplay experience.
When a champion's problems in the current meta-game boil down to "being too fair", you know Leauge has issues. I kinda wish Riot went back to that design Philosophy instead of releasing another Yone or Yuumi.
Agreed, they should stick to remaking old champs. They are actually very good at it.
@@labranehit7687 agreed. I still want a western dragon style champ
@@ashtonshephard3852 Shyvana
@@nicolaezenoaga9756 shyvana is a wyvern who spends the majority of her time in human form
I'm super happy about this video ! Thank you so much :D
There are so many things Riot Games could do for J4. I would give him a re-cast mechanic on his E so that if you re-cast your E J4 automaticly gets to his Flag similar to Lee Sin´s Q. Then the thing with his Flag in general. It needs an AD or HP scaling and a bit more AoE when it hits the ground. And a small QoL change: Make the zone visiable where you get the AS aura buff from his Flag.
His W is a extremely weak shield. Yes, it gets better if you hit more champions with Golden Aegis but you rarely hit more than 2 and even with all 5 enemy champions its still not that big. Higher base values or put a passive on the skill like his E has.
I am not sure about that one but maybe changing the Q into an Amplified AA that helps with AA resets? Bruiser/Tank J4 does mostly AA`s after his engage so an Q that functions as a AA-reset should do better. His passive should be something entirely different or make it at least max. HP dmg instead of current HP and lower the target immunity from his 6/5/4/3 sec (Based on lv) to continuously 3 seconds.
i played him jg and he is good, people dont see him much and dont know him. if you play mid and theyre range. play safe soo they think that youre bad. and at lvl 2 do E Q combo and free kill or lane prio
13:43 I did something with it,(to keep enemies stuck to him: additional Passive: Jarvan's AAs slowdown(30%) enemies that have been Crushed.) in that stance he still just AAs.
So I'll keep it and give his Q the another section after use:
Forward March: Jarvan swing his Javelin forward in a cone, crushing the ground dealing physical damage and slowing targets hit. If an enemy has already been slowed, Root them instead.
Then he swings in a half circle, dealing physical and additional magic damage. If an enemy champion has either been Rooted, stunned or slowed, it deals additional true damage while healing him for 30 per target.
Q cooldown is reduced via Jarven's attacks, 3 for abilities, 1 for AAs.
I used to main J4 and he's very fun to play. And I agree, he needs some adjustments for the uptime. I think cutting down the Q cooldown and increasing the E cooldown in proportion might work (Gives him more damage in a straight up fight but if he wants to engage he has to make it count because if he misfires he's not surviving 10+ seconds for his next flag)
Also, I think that changing him into more of a full tank with inside out playstyle would be better than keeping him a diver - move some of the damage into his tankiness. You can't ignore him because of the armor shred and the fact that he just locked your main carry in a cage but if you go for him the rest of the team has open way
I don't agree with your E adjustments, but i do agree changing him into a tank. I play him as a tank support anyway. His kit is great for team fights obviously, but it also really works in bot lane. Gives adc attack speed, plus attack shred. Plus current health DMG to tanks. Plus can counter Morg and Lux cc. Etc etc
But his W is def his weakest. I love the slow but hate the shield
@@cgijokerman5787 Yeah, my changes are meant to give him more consistent dmg to the detriment of not having the extreme range engage as often (But with the recent champs I think just lowering the Q cd would be enough). I like the W shield idea, the numbers on it need to be higher though, and quite a bit. I still balance him around being a jungler.
@@galactick3816 I would change his ultimate. Make it more difficult to escape from it because at the moment it feels like every character can escape from it. Add a slow or applying the armour shred, something to make it worth even if the target escapes.
@@labranehit7687 Or just make it interupt dashes, that would work too
@@galactick3816 would be to good. The radius of the zone is small so no counter play for people in it plus it could entrap a hole team. It would be completely busted in pro play and probably in solo play as well. Look at Camille, one champ only and he can move in a bigger zone so he can still somewhat dodge her attacks even if you are forced to duel her. Still a very brutal ult to get hit by. I think a armour sheared extra debuff would be still effective. I would give the flag mini wall properties not unlike Orn's q.
just make his ultimate ground people nearby and inside
I think a potential option would be to pull a diana on him and swap something like his ultimate and demacia standard. I know this sounds stupid without elaborating so hear me out;
Potentially swapping his ultimate to basic ability that's a-non target point and click that would give him some form of durability buff and only raise a wall around an area for a very short time like yorrick, but then he could also be able to be the only one that could AA it to destroy a small portion of it so he can leave. This can give him area control, more durability without being too insane, still give him a minor amount of mobility and double not just for engage but also disengaging if necessary. It also encourages thoughtful use when engaging and not just using it carelessly... since if you go in you're stuck in a short 1v1 and if you AA to try to get out immediately this leaves you open for a slightly minimized trade due to the durability buff. The durability increase would be just enough to help you duel but not enough that recklessly engaging on someone who absurdly out-damages you doesn't guarantee you'll get away without losing the trade. This being on a basic ability now means that it isn't then end of the world when you don't time it perfectly to maximize its impact against enemy dash and flash cooldowns, and leaves just enough time to combo with large aoe ultimates that I think he'd still see picking in pro play for his now slightly more mild wombo-combo potential while still giving him some cc to work around with for ganks. If the cc from basic ability cataclysm isn't enough the armor shred on q could potentially be traded out for a slow?
Moving demacian standard to his ultimate could allow the targeting range and buffs to be much more increased while also increasing his q's ability to reach it; you drop the flag from fog of war and then dash and knock up from twice the distance while getting an insane combat steroid and a small non-stacking shield pulsed to you and your allies (ie flag comes down, it gives your team a 100 health shield, you take damage but the shield wasn't completely destroyed it sets it back to a 100 one second later, not stacking) while it lasts. This in combo with his q can give him a decently long rang "save the day" sort of ultimate like galio where at the cost of his q cooldown he can jump in to save the day like the king's calvary coming in to save the troops, fitting his battle-king like and demacian MO. This could potentially be busted as he could just drop it without having to engage? Which if that is too much of an issue we could just have it forcibly cast his q towards the flag which I don't think is a terrible tradeoff.
I like all of this conceptually because it makes him an interesting hybrid of keeping his diver playstyle while also giving him an AD control mage/warden sort of vibe.
Alternatively if this all sounds too "200+ years" we could just say fuck it and make the AOE in his ulti now have a no-mobility-grounding effect like cass and poppy.
You say that last paragraph but giving him grounding inside the tiny cage ult is more "200 years" than the rest of your comment
Jarvin is really strong in aram right now with heartsteel+titanic hydra build. After that can build bruiser or tank depending on enemy comp.but you end up with like 6k health just smacking fools
lethality jarvan is underrated. if the majority of the enemy is squishy, you will one shot with a combo and sometimes just your ult. his ult has %180 AD scaling (insane) so after a few items his ult will do upwards of 1,000 damage. I believe his Q has something like %140 AD scaling too. So one full combo and maybe an auto, you will destroy squishies. it's actually super fun lol.
Was going to make a comment about it myself. Once you get the build up and running you can win an auto fight with most champions as long as they can't run from you (his ult). Maybe it only works in lower elo though.
No, it isn't. So easy to shut down.
Make his ult or w cripple enemies, increase w shield, replace e atks buff with mvs burst buff (like 30% for 2 seconds for teammates) but keep his passive atks so he can clear and you got a champ thats still balanced but has a bit more oomph on his engage and can actually be considered as a champ nowadays
I think that this next build can help solve some of his problems:
-Phase Rush as main rune can help him engage into more dangerous situations without getting so punished, as well as helping with stickiness during a fight.
-Eclipse and Stridebreaker provide good damage as mythic items: Eclipse ads a shield that synergizes with Golden Aegis and Stridebreaker gives more movement speed.
-Fimbulwinter makes up to strenghten the Golden Aegis shield while also providing tanky stats.
-Black Cleaver provides increased damage thanks to its pasive as well as a good amount of cooldown reduction that allowes him to engage/cc more frequently.
-Gargoyle's Stoneplate gives another shield while also providing tank stats that synergizes with Fimbulwinter.
-Ionian Lucidity Boots gives us extra cooldown reduction and are quite handy since Jarvan's E-Q combo can buffer/parry a lot of CC abilities (except point-and-clicks)
What are your opinions on it?
Jarvan's one of the only junglers I've played who struggles to clear healthily
Same experience here, by second buff on 1st clear i had to kite all over the place so I don't embarrass myself and get executed lol
note: never played him before preseason 13
I like it when i face him top lane well not the he fucking hurts as a single target part but when the enemy jungler comes he ults in to make it a 1v1 or accidently lets me escape while trapping his jungler. Norms is a fucking roulette that you can never get Mastery 7 tokens on i swear, hell i can't even play support as that is what people go to to farm Mastery 7 tokens as we all know all a support has to do is get assists and high vision score
It has became my sidequest that whenever Vars uploads a Why No One Plays on a champion, I play that champion rigorously to try and understand Vars' points. As a tip, studying these points and overcoming those said weaknesses can actually help you master the champion.
I feel like J4 needs a new passive since his current one feels misplaced, it's a frontloaded damaging ability that feels wrong on a bruiser/tank.
Also he needs like a mini stun or knock up on his ult to allow you to capitalise on it since mobility creep has made it so about 80% of champs either don't care that they're trapped in a box with you or can just leave.
"1:38"
Irelia: "what have you done?"
Jarvan: "Scorchead earth"
Vars, I think it was the item rework that made tank J4 so bad. In s10 I played a lot of Jarvan in Clash and premades since he brought very good on demand engage. Usually I would build Cinderhulk, Thornmail, Gargoyles. This build made him actually tanky.
In s11 J4's jungle clear would be severely hurt compared to other champs if he built tanky, and the tank items weren't as cheap as before. He effectively lost income, effective items and the items had increased cost.
Make Jarvan R apply Grounded for .5-1 seconds.
Just put his E-Q combo on his Q alone and make it work like Warwick Q.
If he holds it, he travels, if he taps it he just places the flag and stabs but doesn't travel. E only exists to make the Q work anyway.
You can even go as far as having him receive his W shield upon traveling the distance.
That way he can have 2 full extra abilities to work with.
After this video, I started thinking about xin Zhao. He seems very reliable, and strong yet never seems to be that great despite having a very balanced kit imo. It'd be nice if you spoke about it
Xin is in the same boat right now. I also think he one of the clunkiest melee champs in the game since his rework.
So many champs do the job better with more damage escapes or just survivability than Xin or J4.
Maybe it is me but reworked Xin feels extremely clunky. His q feels so much worse than the old one.
jarvans kit be LIT for supporting "standard" adcs(physical attack speed ones) tho, % armor pen on q, a slow on w, giving allies attack speed with e, the worst lockdown in the game on ult and a pretty good engage.
I never give up an opportunity to play Jarvan IV on ARAM. In that mode he's an absolute blast, especially considering I don't play Jungle. He's simple but I like that in a champion.
Have you tried Annie and Garen? they too are simple champions but better than J4 as you can actually live while killing a team and with Annie you can just Flash Tibbers stuns the entire enemy team nukes them Hooray Pentakill
@@JohnnyYeTaecanUktena Sadly Annie scales badly in ARAM, and Mercury's Treads make the stun last like .5 sec
@@nephilimdj Dude who gives a fuck about Aram as most of the time you are not going to get Annie even with a Aram only account giving you better odds of getting the champ you want so no fucking point in bringing up Aram. Besides a lot of champions scale badly in Aram otherwise they would be fucking broken as it is a different fucking mode than real league
Make his ult larger and ground enemies after used with a q+e combo. Make it actually dangerous.
Tbh this made me want to play support jarvin with a zeri ADC.
Jarvan NEEDS a midscope ASAP. Like, outside of someone like Rell, he's the most deserving because of how much the powercreep got to him.
Almost every champ can get out of his R because everyone has dashes rn. Maybe add grounded effect inside the R?
j4 was one of the best before because of 2 things he was great at.. 1) clash team attackspeed boost and 2) the other item that grant attackspeed for teammates that are near for 5% each(stackable per champion with the same item btw) and players are great at weaving autos back then. nowadays you could rarely see a jinx or varus... etc. do auto attack... players could not see the difference between those kinds of champs and ezreal.
ooh, you're using a track from Dynasty Warriors in this. It sounds like Wei's theme
I think they should combine his EQ together to be a damaging knock up engage. Then make his W a auto attack toggle that swaps between a damage and healing version. Then make his E a ranged poke that slows. And make his R an AOE explosion, that gives attack speed and AR. Then make his passive a revive. And there we have it, a fixed jarvan.
If they wanted to make Jarvan relevant. Change his W to also include a damage reduction, and his ult should include a Taunt to those caught inside (very few champions use this mechanic) and he should shine well. He gains the damage reduction that will allow him to really shine in making him fight and his ult will gain the shine that he had in the earlier seasons. That way he gains a very adaptive kit. Q and E are well off providing armor reduction and attack speed. W will allow him to stay in fights longer, and his R will bring an insane threat to the backline since they're forced to fight for a little bit rather than dashing out with a 4 second cd....
Maybe they should add a function to his e+q combo
Like when he hits it on enemies and knocks them up, he gets 5% less damage from these enemies. But that is just my opinion
I was a j4 main almost an year ago... I miss him so much
I would actually love to see him shifted into a more support style jungler, kind of like how nidalee used to run Athenes in pro play and play more defensively. I'd love to see his w apply to teammates as well and a little bit higher scaling on it (maybe an AP ratio). AP Harbin support where u go mostly enchanter occasionally becomes meta every once and a while and it's such and amazing Playstyle for him as it fits him really well and his kit is def suited for it. While i don't think he should straight up be worked into a support introducing some small supportive buffs could def lead to him carving out his own niche where u may not want to pick him for his damage, or clear, or gank-ability but for utility and pressure. He can now save your team and be an amazing counter jungler while still being able to set up some picks for him self here and there.
Maybe they can combine his q and e so it’s done on recast, giving him a new ability on his q
I have come 11 months from the release of this video to say that in season 13 with goredrinker and spear of shojin jarvan is a top tier jungle because he scales so well with ability haste. this champ is able to spam e q more often than my parents give me compliments.
I wish Jarvan R would allow jarvan and his teammates to escape while trapping enemy and maybe applying a heal debuff.
similar to odin from smite
Simple: If you play him bruiser his biggest strength is his early which is compared to other earaly game power houses (Elise, Lee etc.) too weak. He falls off like crazy and Goredrinker is not very beneficial on him (too expensive with too little dmg is brings to the table). Another issue about the bruiser build which in my opionion is still the best out of all options is that you need to run conq. which again doesn't exactly synergize with J4 (not enough attack speed + the rest of his build idk BC, GA etc. none of that boots your attack speed) so it becomes useless in mid you have no self heal in your kid and bruiser build doenst give you enough sustain to stay in fights longer. Its basically still going in with e+q hoping to airborne multiple targets and then kinda jab ansd dap until you see good ult opportunity. The ult deals zero dmg in later stages of the game and with all the dashes and mobility in the game its not even a solid cc option anymore ( no hard cc). I could go on but thats just my experience.
Buff his shield and reset his passive on targets hit by slow? Maybe leave a flag in the center of cataclysm?
What version of the Jin Overture was used at 3:20ish?
Few things suck more than when you ult an enemy and they flash out, and leave you stuck within the wall you built.
I play him support and get a tank item and boots a couple brusier items then 2 tank items pretty tank good engage and enough dmg you cant ignore. Or full armor spread jungle
Jarvan's ult should be like Legion Commander's from DotA. A 1 vs anyone trapped challenge that gives him stats on victory. Also his cataclysm should be bigger.
'a champion designed to have ONE job, and ONE JOB ONLY'... what a novel concept!
1:37 actually he's king now in the lore
i think the one thing they can make him better is to make his ult more useful. they can easily make it as useful as mordekaisers ult , dont know why j4 is getting the short straw
Delete this. He's back
They should make his w a sweep damage move (like gore active) that gives him a shield depending on his max health and people hit. And make his cataclysm have a slight grounding capability.
My instinct makes me get him every time he's available on ARAM. He and Lucian are the champions i love the most to play... with ap builds.