they're blaming their engine partner not being ready until 2028 (when they're invited to re-apply). Honda are their partner in the US and they're coming to F1 in 2026. Very short-sighted if they're prepared to put up the $200m bond
A question I have is why would GM spend the money to develop a PU only to be rejected once again by F1. GM has said they are only interested in developing a unit for Andretti. They will tell F1 to shove it up their…
@@lankyboy90 I was speaking to the 2028 entry that F1 is dangling in front of Andretti like a carrot but for sure you have me a great point. I wouldn’t believe those guys as far as I can throw them.
@@sportkiteflyer To me, it applies equally to both. I certainly wouldn't be pouring money and effort in to a PU project without the prospect of it being useful at the end.
Its totally different how long have them teams been in and helping build it to what it is today? Antretti just want to come in because its become popular
@@AaronMartin7193 we currently have at least 3 moving billboards in F1. Andretti has history, money and ability to compete. I would argue Andretti wants to fulfil his dream of winning in F1 even if as a team rather than a driver.
@@AaronMartin7193 haas has been a back marker since it started in 2016 and has had no ambition to be anything else, alpha Tauri would never be allowed to compete with redbull it’s a second team all they’ll ever be are redbull test drivers how is that value or competitive ?
Been a fan for over 25 years. This is the most disappointed I've ever been. F1 isn't the "Pinnacle of motorsport" anymore it's just club racing at this point. What a joke.
The "Pinnacle of motorsport" is fast becoming WEC and IMSA. F1 has become a filthy super rich man's caricature of what F1 used to be. Additionally, dropping classic road tracks for fake looking things in deserts or for silly street races makes F1 less and less appealing. The cars look like flattened SUVs. Martin B talks about the commercial rights. Like other things in the sporting world (the NFL for example), F1 has become over commercialized. F1 is rapidly losing its soul.
I feel the same way, almost makes me want to quit watching F1. WEC and IMSA are hosting really good racing, and Ferrari winning outside of F1 could really divert some longtime US fans away from F1.
I am so sorry F1 is letting down your country. The world's largest consumer economy and they're claiming "Andretti won't bring commercial value". A ********* joke. Please boycott
Nah. I just never really knew who Gene Haas was before F1, even though he has a partnership in a Nascar team. I remember seeing Mario and Michael on tv growing up. I've been a fan of the Andretti's for a longer time than Haas has been on the grid. I get that Haas is a US based team, but I never felt a connection to them in F1. @@bennylloyd-willner9667
The IMSA Caddys are absolute monsters. GM has the know how and resources to get the job done.I hope Andretti shows up in 2028 all USA with a Cadillac and spanks everyone in their first season. That thought is just to scary for the prima donna F1 culture? I smell fear.
@@maxluces2479😂😂😂 nobody is scared, all teams know Andretti would be the backmarker for several seasons. There is no series as technical as F1…. See how even Merc has been struggling these last 2 years. You overestimate Andretti immensly
If Andretti can’t get into F1 with the backing of one the biggest auto manufacturers in the world. Then basically no one can get in, but they are ok with HAAS drowning in the backfield.
They may have some financial backing from GM, but using Renault engines! It's clear that F1 sees more benefit or Andretti than to F1 as a whole. If GM had come forward with an actual GM engine then I reckon Andretti would have been given a slot on the grid. Plus the current 10 teams are selfish and would vote against it if given the chance anyway.
@@gillie-monger3394only up to 2028 when GM already pledged to be a engine supplier. They easily could’ve put stipulations for this move to have to happen for Renault be a temp supplier while GM gets its engine down.
@@gillie-monger3394 building engines takes time. They are bringing one in 2028 for the new regs, after the engine freeze. Andretti would also benefit f1 a hell of a lot more than haas, rb, or stake are - especially for building hype when NOTHING IS HAPPENING in the championship.
I used to wake up in the middle of the night to watch races. Hell I'd watch free practise for the comms even though most of the time nothing was happening on track. These days, I barely catch highlights and haven't been to a race in a few years. To do something like this to Andretti and yet allow "Visa Cash App RB" to be one of the teams on the grid and Haas to stink up the gaff. Yes F1 and Liberty - congrats on growing the sport. What you don't realise is you've lost the ones who have been here for decades along the way. Congrats and all!
I agree, I've been watching F1 since 1966 when it was highlights on CBS Sports at midnight on Sundays, been to races all over the world, and F1's simply fallen apart in the last few years. It's no better than going to an old-fashioned circus now.
And once the netflix hype dies off (which I think is already beginning), who will be left? And with Liberty working so hard to expand into the USA market, how can they possibly justify turning away a prolific american race team with pedigree. And one that actually wants to compete instead of clog up the rear. You would think they would be incentivizing such a team to get onboard if anything. Now is the time for them to be capitalizing on their investment into the north american market, and this is them throwing away their opportunity.
@@Mandykiss4500 while true Indycar now knows there is a deep interest in racing still in this country, I have watched Indycar since the CART days would be glad to have them come back. All they have to do is take advantage of the finger F1 just gave to the American fans they so desperately want.
How could they know they won't be competitive? What the hell is that? We've had Marussia's, Lotus, Haas, in the last decade with no competitive cars, what about Alfa Romeo last season?
@@anonymouse618 I agree about anyone taking middle east money, or driving on their gasoline for that matter. Remove 'proper' tracks? Examples? The US street circuits are shite we know that, but so is Indy for F1. Not because of the track, because of the owner and the fan base.
@@jameshisself9324 He means classic F1 venues like Monza, Spa, Silverstone etc which are all under threat because they can't compete with the U.S. and the Middle East throwing money at the money men.
The Concorde agreement that they all adhere to says there should be 12 teams. All the teams have signed the Concorde agreement. Greed in the teams not willing to share the winnings has stopped this, and Liberty Media should have upped the total fund to compensate.
Well... you never know. If the ratings continue to fall, maybe Andretti could get an even better deal in a few more years. When team values take a dive and they're desperate for some positive hype. Hell, part of me hopes Andretti and GM just issue a statement writing off F1 completely. Why would true competitors want to race in an anti-competitive sport?
This imo is borderline criminal, how many millions has Andretti spent, he already has 120 employees and GM had 50 employees working . GM has already said they would supply the engines after the new engine rules were introduced.
How would you feel having spent years building, perfecting and cleaning your house, you gonna rent a room to a dirty and homeless person? Now add to this you know this person will never sort themselves or clean up as you've seen it before (Haas). You have also a long history of slow cars and even slower drivers. Look what happened when Nigel landed in USA.
Get your facts straight 😂 GM pulled out of the Andretti deal… that meant they had no engine anymore. GM doesn’t want to supply any engine until 2028. That was why they were denied. Read the full FOM statement, not only what Slater reads…. and Andretti did let the agreement for potentionaly using Renault engine pass by…. The date of that agreement expired!! So they didn’t even have an engine.
Another crazy point is that they made it more difficult for a new team to join a few years ago, Andretti proved they could pay the fee, F1 moved the goalposts for whatever bizarre reason and Andretti were still able to pay up...
Would like to see Andretti take this one to court. They put together a highly credible and serious bid, and are clearly in a position to be more competitive than a number of existing teams.
Yep, they should talk with the FIA get their backing to take the FOM to the sporting tribunal for Anti-competitive behaviour. Andretti have shown they make enough money to be self sufficient, they have developed their own prototype car, they signed a whole new engine supplier, they have been hiring people from the big 4 teams already established and if you look at their portfolio in Motorsports, they have a successful Indycar team, they have partnerships with McLaren, they have their Formula E program and their recent endurance cars program which was quite successful. Andretti must be taken seriously.
@@leucadendron007 The FIA didn't reject the Andretti bid, in fact the FIA wanted the bid to succeed. It was F1 that rejected it. Liberty Media owns F1, and they are the ones that essentially said no. So an American media company rejected a bid from an American team.
Liberty: We need to make F1 bigger in America Andretti: American team with a strong racing history in respective other series Liberty: Eh, you lot aren’t competitive enough How on earth is that not a golden opportunity? What a joke
Guess you didn't listen closely enough. F1 said they aren't competitive enough and not Liberty Media. Even FIA said they should be there. Only F1 and the other teams are keeping Andretti out of F1. I think many of the teams are scared of how much money GM is willing to invest. Even Haas is afraid to invest in his team, hence why they sent Guenther with his walking papers.
@@dennis8223 it won't hurt the other teams bonuses because Andretti/GM would have to put up 250 million for this reason. Did you even listen to what was said? If so I wouldn't have to spell it out for you.
FIA only checked the criteria. They didn’t let Andretti in. That decision is not for FIA. They only check if the proposal was according the requirements. At that time GM still was in the deal, but they pulled out before FOM made their decision.
Been an F1 fan for 30+ years and used to stay up at all ours at night here in Australia to watch GPs. It's not worth doing anymore, the racing is horrible, the series based around a Netflix audience and Andretti was a possibility to bring grid numbers back up. Indycar is the best racing in the world now, reminds me of what F1 used to be.
Ive read that rejection list and it sufficiently removes every single team in F1 currently based on the points and standards. It it definitely hypocrisy and shows that its all about the short term money and not about the growth of the sport.
I notice that one of F1 Management's gripes was that the inclusion of an eleventh team would impose a logistical strain on the circuits. How is it possible that Brad Pitt's movie team was accommodated with a couple of pit garages yet Andretti are rejected? Wallywood obviously has deeper pockets? Then again, the FiA could only sanction a race unless an eleventh or twelfth team is included according to their own rules and sue any team, organiser or management who tried to hold an event using the name "F1" in it's description!
Also why invite bids in the first place. The lack of 11 garages thing is so silly, even Monaco had 30 cars in the past. They're going to be taken to court.
@@ab8jeh30 tiny cars…. Back then. Now they are huge and all parts and team are much MUCH BIGGER. There simply is no room now for more teams in the pitlane of many tracks
Although alpine/Renault have huge history in F1, in the turbo hybrid era they are a shame. Even come to its CEO saying that he doesn’t care about f1 and is there only berths marketing team said so.
They have to buy in plain and simple. and they know this, they have been told this for years. Instead they cry and moan and of course F1 are going to protect themselves. People don't get the straight up business facts. This isn't good for the other 10 teams to add an 11th. End of story
This sport has been in the gutter for years now. - Liberty media - DRS - V6 engines and oversized cars - Drive to survive - Too many street races - Too many races in America - FIA constantly making poor decisions - Spa 2021 - Abu Dhabi 2021 - Regulation change for closer racing yet there is only one team that can win races and nobody else can catch them now with the cost cap and engine freeze - Andretti rejected It’s a struggle to even consider it a professional sport and not a soap opera at this stage.
@@ab8jeh It didn't start with DRS. DRS was a bandaid solution for the terrible middle eastern circuits that you literally couldn't overtake on. It started with Arab oil money.
The teams only care about money. Period. The sport is absolutely secondary. There is no possible way F1 can know how competitive Andretti would be if they entered. Pretty disgusting.
The teams are the ones who have made it incredibly expensive. Marketing purposes and profit are more important rather than the sport. I stand by my statement.@@odeode4338
@@odeode4338they’ve met the financial requirements already. They’ve stated they have the financial backing AND the support of a full factory GM effort. I don’t know what you’re smoking but lay off it.
@@odeode4338Good to know you think you know how Andretti financially are somehow not able to shoulder themselves. I mean they even have the backing of GM for the power unit, which means everything else is up to them, just like a bunch of other teams who don't build their own PU on the grid, which is the bulk of them. So tell us, just how expensive is F1 for Andretti to not be fit in your eyes. So you must have data and not just the PR nonsense given by F1!
It's a bloody joke. "You need to pay every team $20 mln to join our little club" -> "Ok, not a problem". "Right, but you don't have a backing of major automotive brand" -> "Ok, here you go - we're bringing in GM". "Ok but now you need to be manufacturing your own power unit" -> "Weird, other teams don't have to do that, but sure, ok". "Yeah... you know what? Nah, we're good but good luck elsewhere Andretti". All these teams care about is money and don't try to BS people that it's otherwise. "Competitive participant", jeez... then why didn't you kick Williams the hell out of f1 in 2019 when they were 2-3 seconds off the pace, huh? Andretti has all the resources and facilities to manufacture a competitive race car, they have an outstanding reputation in the world of motorspors and Michael is the son of 1978s f1 world champion Mario Andretti for Christ's sake. You have space for 12 teams in the championship regulations, so use them. More teams = more seats = more competition = better show.
@@jivewig Williams only peak since 2004 was when they had the Mercedes PU advantage. They have been at the bottom or close to it otherwise. Remember all their pay drivers
Yet they have the right to stay in F1 and choose who to sell to because they joined before the 2021 Concorde agreement. Williams was acquired in 2020. Aston in 2018. Even Audi only got their spot by buying out Sauber. Andretti should have bought in earlier and not just half assed their current F1 bid.
@@srfnsurfer Each team has a racing license/F1 entry, which is what Andretti is applying for, so they can stay however long they want/can. That's what gives them the 'right' to be there. Doesn't matter if the fans think their performance is shitty.
@@tijgertjekonijnwordopgegeten did you poll them? Maybe you‘re just in a bubble that likes that. I know more fans that are against it. But I would not dare to say most fans don‘t want it. There‘s a bit of a too large number of fans to make such a statement. 🖖
To the F1 fans in America, I would like to apologise for this insult. I think you need to protest in some way and probably the best way to do that would be to ignore F1. Empty grandstands at Miami, Vegas and COTA would be a major embarrassment for F1. Or alternatively turn up to those events wearing Andretti Cadillac merchandise instead of Ferrari, Red Bull, Mercedes etc. As an, Australian fan I know what it's like to be ignored by those managing F1 but unfortunately for me the Australian market is too small to matter. The US market on the other hand is huge, they can't ignore you.
American here, who has watched every race and practice session since 2010. I've been falling asleep during most races for the past two years, and this is the final straw. I am done, what a farce.
Exactly Martin... Everyone is pointing to the fact that HAAS is not a competitive team either, but the reality is if they were applying now they'd get rejected too. Plus, just because we already have an uncompetitive US team in F1, doesn't mean we should just accept another, possibly, uncompetitive team. Sure, Andretti might come in and be successful, but just because he's had success in other categories, and his name is Andretti is not a guarantee of success in F1. We've seen many attempts by US-based teams to break into F1, but they've all failed to produce good enough results. The same applies to GM. Everyone points out how big GM is, and I say, so what??? So they are big, and???? FYI - Toyota is big too, and their attempt at F1 can only be described as a failure, yet the smaller Honda company has had a significant amount of success over multiple decades now. In other words, the size of the manufacturer has no bearing on how successful they'll be. GM might build a great engine and be up the front in their first season, but they are also producing their very first F1 engine and it could turn out to be a complete failure because again size doesn't equal success in F1. Another perfect example is Ford. Sure, once upon a time, many decades ago, Ford had success, but it has been a very long time since Ford managed to produce a competitive F1 engine. Ford is big, yet their results in F1 are mediocre at best.
How does it not provide Value to the sport? If you want more of the US market. I think Andretti is a good brand to bring into F1 and it helps the grow the US market.
Value is a very broad term from your side, Remember there are teams here as well, prize pools etc, i was reading articles since early last year, most teams on the grid don't want them and remember Ferrari has Veto rights. It's just the usual politics.
F1’s downfall has already started. Fan attendance, viewership and engagement are already on the decline. It’s the hangover from DTS and F1 not delivering an exciting product to the regular fan.
At the end of the day they only want GM, in that statement they put out, it said they would consider a team if GM were the ones in charge and fully running it as a GM works team and or at least a GM customer team. They don't care for Andretti, they just want the GM money.
@@haydengoodall6767no it wasn’t. Their proposal wasn’t okay by FIA. They didn’t comply with the necessary criteria. And they pushed that they would put 1 woman and 1 man in the car as mandatory. That was a big no cos each F1 driver needs a certain amount of license points to get into F1…and no woman is anywhere near earning those points. That seat would then be empty…
@@Redlingstein Apparently they did/do comply but it is the F1 teams association cockblocking any future potential competitors. Weird considering NZ has a long and strong history with F1 even over some current day competitors despite never having a FIA graded F1 circuit. But hey maybe we should focus upon North America and Indycar as that is where the future is.. F1 is dying and will die through its own greed and contempt for competition. 🙃
I don't get it.....saying they'll be uncompetitive? 🤔 I get the regulations change in 2 years but saying Andretti will be uncompetitive is simply crap!!!
ONE corporation One team Tomatoes Tomatoes. they can move drivers around the 4 cars if they like. that makes it one team true or false? @@arkangelgaming35
@@arkangelgaming35you think the junior team doesn’t do what the senior team tells them? That makes them a four car team. There’s ZERO chance either junior Red Bull car ever comes close to beating the factory team.
Not true. Its two teams. I see your logic but its not one team. Andretti should be able to compete. How do you say someone is not competitive if you don't even let them compete
FOM has been threatening to breakaway from the FIA for sometime now. Bernie Ecclestone is a populist figure among fans, he would bring up wild ideas such as "bring back V10s" in order to seduce F1 fans into supporting such. However, F1 separating from FIA would be detrimental to the latter's financial stability
imagine the championship standing coming from the FIA and F1 being different, but technically though, you are right that they can show up to the races but FOM will just be blurring them in every shot
FOM is a much more powerful entity than the FIA today, because they hold the money. FOM almost strong-armed FIA into firing Ben-Sulayem just the last month
I would argue that the reason is the exact opposite of what is being reported. The top teams are VERY worried that Andretti would show up and be a top end team right out of the box and taking that top money away. If they were gonna run in the back with Haas Merc, Ferrari and the rest would not care. Black eye on the face of F1 and Liberty media.
Andretti is a global Powerhouse in all forms of Motorsports they don't show up to run at the back of the pack in mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari all know that and now that they can't spend their way to the front they realize a team like Andretti could be a serious problem
@@SaabJitsu It's literally not good for their business having someone else challenging for wins and causing the prize money to be divided into more parts
Agree, but there is the fact that Liberty Media reported 12 BILLION in earnings for 2023 shows to me anyway that the prize money thing could be sorted pretty quickly. Someone call Eddie Jordan and get a deal done lol
USA is a huge market,it has 3 races, this is the ruling body being very very short sighted. There are already uncompetitive teams in F1, and while GM may have a poor first year while getting their feet wet, you can bet by year 3 they would consistently be running in the top half of teams.This ruling makes no sense to me.
I wonder how the US market for F1 will be effected, given that people in the US were so hyped about seeing the Andretti name on a Formula One grid again. I will be very interested in the viewership numbers in the US for F1, Netflix "Drive To Survive", and attendance at the United States F1 circuits.
Boycott the races, also The State Department should block entry of the F1 officials as punishment. F1 wants our money without giving us a chance to compete. This decision is also a violation of The Concord Agreement, F1 is supposed to have 12 teams on the grid.
We Americans care about the Andretti name, but we want to see an American manufacturer more than the Andretti name. We want a true American team like the Germans (Mercedes), French (Alpine), British Aston Martin & McClaren), and Italians (Ferrari) have.
How can F1 call itself a world championship if no one new, possibly better, is allowed to compete? It is just a group of individuals running a so called championship in an isolated environment.
@bm8725 what? there were always new teams in f1. Historically there were 13 or more teams. To have some cap at 10 is just ludicrous. Ask yourself why every other racing series welcomes new teams and competition.
@bm8725 right.. im just saying it's better to have more. What if a team folds or engine supplier like alpine leave? F1 will then go begging for more... and want Andretti, but deny them now. Its not good foresight or planning foe future.
@bm8725 you realize alot of American fans that F1 worked so hard to get are now completely gone, or boycotting. From US perspective it looks like F1 wanted American money, tracks, sponsors but only for themselves. Really stupid decision.
Not having space for a 11th team in the pit lane isn't Andretti's problem. That's F1's problem. The regulations allow for up to 12 teams. If we can't create space in the pit lane for an extra team then we would never be able to go beyond 10th teams.
Because its simply an outright lie, the the pieces of pie shared between the teams would get smaller for each team and thats it. If it was about competition they could just pay the last team 0 price money and then we would see who is actually worth being in F1
This decision will be fought by andretti this entire year and will bring in to question the commercial viability (or lack there of) of Haas. sorry, Andretti in their first season brings magnitudes more commercial viability than Haas ever will
@@Harvick29ism not blaming haas. im pointing out the obvious hypocrisy of the reason they rejected Andretti. How are you going to reject Andretti for not being commercially viable, when haas literally struggles to get any sponsors every single year. its blatent hypocrisy. the fact is F1 doesnt want a serious US team in their ranks because it will put their european monopoly in danger.
This is purely financial…the concern is dilution of team monies versus the added gross revenue. A privateer team with OEM engines does little. A new manufacturer team (GM) does have a lot more potential
I've followed Formula 1 religiously since I was a 16 year-old growing up in Alabama in the 70's. I've probably watched 95% of the races that were aired where I could receive them over the past 45 years. Formula 1, ESPN, and Sky Sports F1 has lost this dedicated American Formula 1 fan. I am done.
@@jacksteven781 F1 is all about dirty politics but I'll be honest in that I'm so tired of it. For those that have joined watching F1 recently, I kinda pity because while they might love the racing, they'll quickly tire of the polittics unless they're gluttons for punishment. All of which is to say I empathise greatly with people who are done with F1. I'm pretty much there myself.
@@heliumtrophy I only started watching 2 seasons ago with the rule change. I thought it would be different because of Liberty, it *was* in the name. Eh, I guess I can finally start going back to gym for 6 hours a week and save money on my Sky subscription. IDK why but this really really rubbed me the wrong way.
@@kevingraham3161 I used to think that but I've watched less now and genuinely couldn't care less if I miss a race. 10 years ago I would've been kicking myself if I missed one - now, I'll read about who wins but I don't care one way or the other.
If I was Andretti I'd say fine and take advantage of every minute for testing since they are denied, research and development time is fair game As a fan I welcome Andretti and am embarrassed for F1 and fia for being so afraid and in fact against the definition of Sport.
F1's success is solely due to the production team on Drive to Survive. The teams and rights holders are owed nothing and should simply be greatful the show was so well done. This decision to deny Andretti is greed and nothing else
@@Mandykiss4500This isn't China, just because a business is owned by an American outfit or headed by one, it doesn't mean it can't hold ideals that aren't even remotely tied to the nation of origin. In fact American companies are usually ready to sell something if the price is right, money is King and they can care less about if their company originated in good ol US of A. In fact there'sa list of American companies owned by foreign owners across the nation. So Liberty being American don't meana damn thing in business really. No one has asked them to sell for the right price yet.
I'm really sad, man. My family pulled together a Christmas present for me - ticket to the Canadian GP. It's not in the US, so it wouldn't be in a boycott zone, but I just feel... dirty... wanting to go now.
they might F1 is an open world championship Andretti clearly have met all the requirements argument that FOM does not believe they would be competitive in their first year is utterly ludicrous - nobody was competitive in their first years...
@@mikez2779They just threw everything they could think of against the wall thinking some of us would t see right through their BS. It’d have been easier to just say “We really don’t like you, Michael.”
I was at the Toronto INDY in 1993 and went on the Grid Walk. I spoke to Mario and he was a verey nice laid back person. He goes to many F1 races and i would like the growth of America in F1 with many new tracks in the USA. And a competitive American driver as we try to compete with INDYCAR and NASCAR in America. It is all about money and Andretti will be villains of the padlock espeshaly if they become competitive. But what is good for the image of the Sport is not good enough financially. We don't want teams going broke and bankrupt because a new team brought them out.
Andretti would not have the expertise, infrastructure or experience these teams have in the context of F1 and would be three years behind in development. A big budget would compensate to some degree but it would be hard to envisage Andretti being as competitive as any of these teams for many years
Haas has said repeatedly he will not sell. He achieves his business goals riding around at the back, one of the very reasons they’ve rejected Andretti. Benefiting the team owner more than F1. You couldn’t make up the irony. 🤦♂️
F1 is a joke. They moved the goalposts constantly on Andretti and each time Andretti would check the boxes. Now they're finally done trying to find a way to say they can't do it and say "they wouldn't be competitive."
So F1 say they don’t bring enough value and won’t be competitive and this is the reasoning behind not allowing Andretti to compete, but then you have teams saying they don’t want to share the winnings and this is partially why they can’t join. What is it really? If it’s the latter, then we should just assume F1 is only 10 teams going forward and be honest about it. If the US team doesn’t bring enough value, then then Americans should show their disapproval with their wallets and boycot F1 They want the audience and money but not the teams
F 1 is scared of Andretti they are coming with a lot of backing and are worried they would be a lot better than what they would invision. With three gps in the us I can’t see how this wouldn’t be a positive for formula 1
Don’t count your chickens before they hatch, that’s assuming the US market keeps growing. Decisions like this may up just stall your popularity in the U.S,
I don't know if Domenicali is actually leading the decision making. If he does, this is a bigger mistake that the one that he made in 2008 when he steered the development of the car towards Massa instead of Raikkonen at Ferrari
Ive been a fan my whole life havent missed watching a race in years. But this is seriously making me rethink being a fan if it was truly about the sport Andretti would be let in but its more about politics and the commercial rights then the actual sport.
Brundle's point that these F1 teams have poured billions into building F1 to this level is utter nonsense! They have poured billions into participating in F1, but have contributed little to nothing to build the sport's popularity. Making such a nonsensical statement is the equivalent of saying the Cleveland Browns (a team with a 0.340 winning percentage since 1990) had anything to do with making the NFL one of the most popular sports leagues in the world.
Also will Caddy want the rules changed so they can use Bodecia's cart suspension and camshafts in the crankcase? I say as you lot only just give them up in performance road cars recently? F1 should always reflect road car tech, has done for years.
“We care about the fans!” -adds more street races to the calendar, refuses an entry from a well known racing team, tells fans that payed money and traveled across the country to see a practice session that lasted 7 minutes “lmao stuff happens, no refunds, bring your money next year k thx”
A valid point... especially as this past year NO OTHER TEAM actually fought for the championship; Red Bull was so far out ahead that effectively, there wasn't a competition. Despite not even fielding a car, Andretti was only marginally less competitive than William, Alphatauri, Alfa Romeo, or Haas
Let's face it, F1 didn't reject Andretti-Cadillac because they WON'T be competitive. Rather, the current teams fear that the team WOULD give them even more real competition. It should be clear by now that F1 is not a zero-sum enterprise -- the pie can grow.
4 years ago, half the field was going bankrupt, pandemic DTS bump is already receding, Car sales are down because of unaffordability, when these OEM'S need to cut costs first thng getting cut is racing money. A team with a business of racing will stick around before OEM's. Plus ticket prices to high for what you get. Las Vegas was crazy expensive..
One thing I haven't heard mentioned is that the Concorde Agreement is up for renewal in 2026. One could see the FIA demanding entry of any teams they approve as part of the new deal.
The new Concorde Agreement is going to make MUCH more expensive for a new team to get in. Right now the entry fee is $200 million. Existing teams want that to be a lot higher. Think $500 million plus, if not $1 Billion if they are that delusional
As an American, this Andretti decision does it for me and F1, I’m done. The politics in this sport are unlike any I’ve ever witnessed. The racing takes a backseat to everything else.
What does competitive mean? Is anyone behind Alpine in the championship considered competitive?
is anyone behind RB competitive at the moment?
exactly!
Can't believe a race series that just had one team win all but a couple races claim to be concerned about competitiveness
@@srfnsurferlol absolutely this ….. also when F1 is more entertainment than a sport who really cares
It's nothing to do with competitiveness. The other teams don't want them in.
3 races in the USA and rejecting Andretti...doesn't look very serious to me
Maybe four US races.
4 races actually, there is some rumours about adding Chicago GP to F1............
They want Andretti to buy Haas. But Haas don t want to sell.
If I were Biden I'd cancel their Visas and send them packing.
They want America's money. They DO NOT want America's contention.
I'm convinced F1 just hates itself at this point.
You can't convince me there is any valid reason to turn Andretti away.
they're blaming their engine partner not being ready until 2028 (when they're invited to re-apply). Honda are their partner in the US and they're coming to F1 in 2026. Very short-sighted if they're prepared to put up the $200m bond
Money.
@@kwanlinus6999 yeah, there are some greedy people on the board. or so it seems
@@omarmohammd5276 not some, everyone. Ecclestone, Domenicalli, all the team owners etc
Because they want to use a Renault engine 😂😂😂 10hp down on anyone else.
F1 has shown us that everything they said about wanting more manufacturers and a larger USA representation in the sport was a boldfaced lie.
A question I have is why would GM spend the money to develop a PU only to be rejected once again by F1. GM has said they are only interested in developing a unit for Andretti. They will tell F1 to shove it up their…
This is exactly the point I've been making! Why would GM pour millions into a PU project for a 2026 entry, when said entry is not guaranteed?
@@lankyboy90 I was speaking to the 2028 entry that F1 is dangling in front of Andretti like a carrot but for sure you have me a great point. I wouldn’t believe those guys as far as I can throw them.
@@sportkiteflyer To me, it applies equally to both. I certainly wouldn't be pouring money and effort in to a PU project without the prospect of it being useful at the end.
"their"
@@JeffKopis Ah crap! Got me! 🤦♂️😂
They are not fit commercially?? I suppose Haas and RB2 are golden examples of commercial fitness.
Its totally different how long have them teams been in and helping build it to what it is today? Antretti just want to come in because its become popular
There have been so many back runners in F1 why deny Andretti. Its money and nothing else.
@@AaronMartin7193 we currently have at least 3 moving billboards in F1. Andretti has history, money and ability to compete. I would argue Andretti wants to fulfil his dream of winning in F1 even if as a team rather than a driver.
@@AaronMartin7193 haas has been a back marker since it started in 2016 and has had no ambition to be anything else, alpha Tauri would never be allowed to compete with redbull it’s a second team all they’ll ever be are redbull test drivers how is that value or competitive ?
Love "RB2"
Been a fan for over 25 years. This is the most disappointed I've ever been. F1 isn't the "Pinnacle of motorsport" anymore it's just club racing at this point. What a joke.
The "Pinnacle of motorsport" is fast becoming WEC and IMSA. F1 has become a filthy super rich man's caricature of what F1 used to be. Additionally, dropping classic road tracks for fake looking things in deserts or for silly street races makes F1 less and less appealing. The cars look like flattened SUVs. Martin B talks about the commercial rights. Like other things in the sporting world (the NFL for example), F1 has become over commercialized. F1 is rapidly losing its soul.
An exclusive club. Fan since ‘68 and I too am massively disappointed.
I feel the same way, almost makes me want to quit watching F1. WEC and IMSA are hosting really good racing, and Ferrari winning outside of F1 could really divert some longtime US fans away from F1.
FORMULA! 1! NEEDS! MICHAEL! ANDRETTI! THE! MOTORSPORT! (LEGEND)! HA! HA! HA!
Cadillac chased Porsche to the line in Daytona yesterday, but yeah sure they won't be competitive 😂😂😂😂
As a US fan, I am disappointed in this news. I’ve never been a big fan of Haas, but I was eager to cheer on Andretti.
I am so sorry F1 is letting down your country. The world's largest consumer economy and they're claiming "Andretti won't bring commercial value". A ********* joke. Please boycott
Same here this is bullshit
Nah. I just never really knew who Gene Haas was before F1, even though he has a partnership in a Nascar team. I remember seeing Mario and Michael on tv growing up. I've been a fan of the Andretti's for a longer time than Haas has been on the grid. I get that Haas is a US based team, but I never felt a connection to them in F1. @@bennylloyd-willner9667
Are you going to be a true US fan and boycott F1? 😂
@@PavanDhariwalhonestly thinking about it.
Cadillac: creates a hypercar that wins IMSA championship in its inaugural season
F1: they won't be competitive enough
The IMSA Caddys are absolute monsters. GM has the know how and resources to get the job done.I hope Andretti shows up in 2028 all USA with a Cadillac and spanks everyone in their first season. That thought is just to scary for the prima donna F1 culture? I smell fear.
Imsa is not F1 cars….. get back to reality
@@maxluces2479😂😂😂 nobody is scared, all teams know Andretti would be the backmarker for several seasons. There is no series as technical as F1…. See how even Merc has been struggling these last 2 years. You overestimate Andretti immensly
@@Redlingstein Who knows maybe if they allowed Andretti/Cadillac to enter f1 then maybe they can prove that they can also compete with the big teams.
F1 will allow Visa Cash App RB, Stake and Haas to be on the grid but not Andretti. What a farcical joke.
Yet, they claim it's a sport. It's not a sport
@@mbukukanyau it’s all about politics and money that’s all it is
The current teams are already on the grid. Huge difference. Stop comparing. Its irrelevant
"Sportsmanship? What sportsmanship? We race as money, lads." Signed, FOM and Liberty.
"I am entitled to some of your money"
Andretti
If they had any sportsmanship they would respect rules 😂
If Andretti can’t get into F1 with the backing of one the biggest auto manufacturers in the world. Then basically no one can get in, but they are ok with HAAS drowning in the backfield.
Yeah it looks that way.. we are going to be stuck with just 10. I was really hoping we could get back to 12 soon.
spot on, spot on!
They may have some financial backing from GM, but using Renault engines! It's clear that F1 sees more benefit or Andretti than to F1 as a whole. If GM had come forward with an actual GM engine then I reckon Andretti would have been given a slot on the grid. Plus the current 10 teams are selfish and would vote against it if given the chance anyway.
@@gillie-monger3394only up to 2028 when GM already pledged to be a engine supplier. They easily could’ve put stipulations for this move to have to happen for Renault be a temp supplier while GM gets its engine down.
@@gillie-monger3394 building engines takes time. They are bringing one in 2028 for the new regs, after the engine freeze. Andretti would also benefit f1 a hell of a lot more than haas, rb, or stake are - especially for building hype when NOTHING IS HAPPENING in the championship.
I used to wake up in the middle of the night to watch races. Hell I'd watch free practise for the comms even though most of the time nothing was happening on track. These days, I barely catch highlights and haven't been to a race in a few years. To do something like this to Andretti and yet allow "Visa Cash App RB" to be one of the teams on the grid and Haas to stink up the gaff. Yes F1 and Liberty - congrats on growing the sport. What you don't realise is you've lost the ones who have been here for decades along the way. Congrats and all!
I agree, I've been watching F1 since 1966 when it was highlights on CBS Sports at midnight on Sundays, been to races all over the world, and F1's simply fallen apart in the last few years. It's no better than going to an old-fashioned circus now.
All the teams were fine with the 2010 teams not being competitive.
And once the netflix hype dies off (which I think is already beginning), who will be left? And with Liberty working so hard to expand into the USA market, how can they possibly justify turning away a prolific american race team with pedigree. And one that actually wants to compete instead of clog up the rear. You would think they would be incentivizing such a team to get onboard if anything. Now is the time for them to be capitalizing on their investment into the north american market, and this is them throwing away their opportunity.
100%
@@LASkB 2021 was a classic season. You missed out.
Indycar and Nascar are jumping for joy right now. I can only imagine the marketing they will put out about this. F1 gave them a goldmine.
Indycar needs ALL the Marketing they can get…it’s actually amazing how little interest Indycar gets in USA except for the 500…
@@Mandykiss4500 while true Indycar now knows there is a deep interest in racing still in this country, I have watched Indycar since the CART days would be glad to have them come back. All they have to do is take advantage of the finger F1 just gave to the American fans they so desperately want.
I do miss the cart days Michael and Mario, Alex Zanardi my favorites.
😂😂😂😂
😂😂😂 hilarious. Indycar is doing badly….
How could they know they won't be competitive? What the hell is that? We've had Marussia's, Lotus, Haas, in the last decade with no competitive cars, what about Alfa Romeo last season?
F1 has a glass ceiling and is denying more drivers a chance. Greed, fear of competition
Greed? It's a business designed for profit and succeeds at it. You think it is some charitable state sponsored fair play Special Olympics? Daft.
@@jameshisself9324 yepp thats why they take all that middle east money and remove proper tracks for street circuits :)
@@anonymouse618 I agree about anyone taking middle east money, or driving on their gasoline for that matter. Remove 'proper' tracks? Examples? The US street circuits are shite we know that, but so is Indy for F1. Not because of the track, because of the owner and the fan base.
@@jameshisself9324 He means classic F1 venues like Monza, Spa, Silverstone etc which are all under threat because they can't compete with the U.S. and the Middle East throwing money at the money men.
They better not remove Spa, Monza and Silverstone from the F1 calender. They should rather remove that hideous circuit in Texas.
The Concorde agreement that they all adhere to says there should be 12 teams. All the teams have signed the Concorde agreement. Greed in the teams not willing to share the winnings has stopped this, and Liberty Media should have upped the total fund to compensate.
4 years to wait until the goal posts get moved again...
Exactly this. Andretti can jump through all the hoops, ace every new test, and it won’t matter.
Well... you never know. If the ratings continue to fall, maybe Andretti could get an even better deal in a few more years. When team values take a dive and they're desperate for some positive hype. Hell, part of me hopes Andretti and GM just issue a statement writing off F1 completely. Why would true competitors want to race in an anti-competitive sport?
@@BigPapiChi Lol.
This imo is borderline criminal, how many millions has Andretti spent, he already has 120 employees and GM had 50 employees working . GM has already said they would supply the engines after the new engine rules were introduced.
How would you feel having spent years building, perfecting and cleaning your house, you gonna rent a room to a dirty and homeless person? Now add to this you know this person will never sort themselves or clean up as you've seen it before (Haas). You have also a long history of slow cars and even slower drivers. Look what happened when Nigel landed in USA.
@@markcripps2384 are you comparing Andretti to a homeless person?
Get your facts straight 😂 GM pulled out of the Andretti deal… that meant they had no engine anymore. GM doesn’t want to supply any engine until 2028. That was why they were denied. Read the full FOM statement, not only what Slater reads…. and Andretti did let the agreement for potentionaly using Renault engine pass by…. The date of that agreement expired!! So they didn’t even have an engine.
@@Redlingstein sounds to me like your full of 💩
Another crazy point is that they made it more difficult for a new team to join a few years ago, Andretti proved they could pay the fee, F1 moved the goalposts for whatever bizarre reason and Andretti were still able to pay up...
Would like to see Andretti take this one to court. They put together a highly credible and serious bid, and are clearly in a position to be more competitive than a number of existing teams.
Yep, they should talk with the FIA get their backing to take the FOM to the sporting tribunal for Anti-competitive behaviour.
Andretti have shown they make enough money to be self sufficient, they have developed their own prototype car, they signed a whole new engine supplier, they have been hiring people from the big 4 teams already established and if you look at their portfolio in Motorsports, they have a successful Indycar team, they have partnerships with McLaren, they have their Formula E program and their recent endurance cars program which was quite successful.
Andretti must be taken seriously.
That's why they are afraid. Instant success of sorts
Yeah, F1 is a cartel.
@@arkangelgaming35 I might have misheard but didnt brundle say the FIA made the decision and not the teams (FOM)
@@leucadendron007 The FIA didn't reject the Andretti bid, in fact the FIA wanted the bid to succeed. It was F1 that rejected it. Liberty Media owns F1, and they are the ones that essentially said no. So an American media company rejected a bid from an American team.
Liberty: We need to make F1 bigger in America
Andretti: American team with a strong racing history in respective other series
Liberty: Eh, you lot aren’t competitive enough
How on earth is that not a golden opportunity? What a joke
Guess you didn't listen closely enough. F1 said they aren't competitive enough and not Liberty Media. Even FIA said they should be there. Only F1 and the other teams are keeping Andretti out of F1. I think many of the teams are scared of how much money GM is willing to invest. Even Haas is afraid to invest in his team, hence why they sent Guenther with his walking papers.
Speaking of dropping the golden goose for racing in America
Liberty meant more street circuits in America, not a potentially competitive American team that may harm other teams' bonus. we race as money
@@dennis8223 it won't hurt the other teams bonuses because Andretti/GM would have to put up 250 million for this reason. Did you even listen to what was said? If so I wouldn't have to spell it out for you.
@@Schizz_PopinovFOM and F1 made the decision therefore they both basically are saying the same thing
Absolutely criminal and crooked.
Oh hello, you must be new to F1
@@BongoBaggins no unfortunately not. Likely been a hardcore fan since before most of those commenting were born! Same old same old.
Yup that's fatdretti 😊
@@abel4776 burgers and pizza 🍕
Its not about the money, its about their egos.
F1 and the teams are greedy.
The FIA was right on letting Andretti in.
FIA only checked the criteria. They didn’t let Andretti in. That decision is not for FIA. They only check if the proposal was according the requirements. At that time GM still was in the deal, but they pulled out before FOM made their decision.
Been an F1 fan for 30+ years and used to stay up at all ours at night here in Australia to watch GPs. It's not worth doing anymore, the racing is horrible, the series based around a Netflix audience and Andretti was a possibility to bring grid numbers back up. Indycar is the best racing in the world now, reminds me of what F1 used to be.
Indycar is amazing!!!! So much better than F1!!
Ive read that rejection list and it sufficiently removes every single team in F1 currently based on the points and standards. It it definitely hypocrisy and shows that its all about the short term money and not about the growth of the sport.
'The presence of more CITY STREET TRACKS or DESERT TRACKS, on its own, will not add value to the championship except our own pockets'
Too true
Replace Haas with Andretti.
😂😂
No, have both.
@@pher38 no remove HAAS useless
I think Andretti will buy HAAs
Not while Gene Haas has air in his lungs it won’t.
I notice that one of F1 Management's gripes was that the inclusion of an eleventh team would impose a logistical strain on the circuits. How is it possible that Brad Pitt's movie team was accommodated with a couple of pit garages yet Andretti are rejected? Wallywood obviously has deeper pockets?
Then again, the FiA could only sanction a race unless an eleventh or twelfth team is included according to their own rules and sue any team, organiser or management who tried to hold an event using the name "F1" in it's description!
Also why invite bids in the first place. The lack of 11 garages thing is so silly, even Monaco had 30 cars in the past. They're going to be taken to court.
Brad Pitt was only at 2 race tracks where there is enough room like Silverstone. Brad wasn’t at all tracks, just 2. So stop compairing
@@ab8jeh30 tiny cars…. Back then. Now they are huge and all parts and team are much MUCH BIGGER. There simply is no room now for more teams in the pitlane of many tracks
Antitrust lawsuit time! Let's go!
What a bunch of f&#@ng bull. How can F1 look us all in the eye and tell us that Sauber and Haas bring more value than Andretti? Shame on you, F1
Sauber are going to be Audi and they have history in the sport. But Haas red bull 2 and probably even alpine offer less
Its completely different them teams you mention have been there helping build the sport, Andretti just want to join because its become popular 😂
@@charliechuck1341 Alpine/ Renault have huge history in F1. and FIA
Couldn’t agree more
Although alpine/Renault have huge history in F1, in the turbo hybrid era they are a shame. Even come to its CEO saying that he doesn’t care about f1 and is there only berths marketing team said so.
I want 30 cars on the grid. Like the old days
I want more questionable characters, rouges and gentlemen drivers
I want the grid girls back wearing less than bikinis
@@randomcamerajunk6977 You have questionable characters now - in the management part.
Bring back pre-qualifying!
Never get 30 cars on the grid again.
Would have been good to have them in F1.
it'd been TOO good, we're not allowed to that much
They have to buy in plain and simple. and they know this, they have been told this for years. Instead they cry and moan and of course F1 are going to protect themselves. People don't get the straight up business facts. This isn't good for the other 10 teams to add an 11th. End of story
@@DAGATHireI hope he’s even more annoying.
I bet F1 would accept them if they buy existing teams.
It looks like f1 don’t respect the andretti name like they say they do. 🙃
This sport has been in the gutter for years now.
- Liberty media
- DRS
- V6 engines and oversized cars
- Drive to survive
- Too many street races
- Too many races in America
- FIA constantly making poor decisions
- Spa 2021
- Abu Dhabi 2021
- Regulation change for closer racing yet there is only one team that can win races and nobody else can catch them now with the cost cap and engine freeze
- Andretti rejected
It’s a struggle to even consider it a professional sport and not a soap opera at this stage.
100%. It all started with DRS and been downhill since then.
@@ab8jeh It didn't start with DRS. DRS was a bandaid solution for the terrible middle eastern circuits that you literally couldn't overtake on.
It started with Arab oil money.
no fueling killed the racing strategy went out the window
How do you become competitive, if you don't get a chance??
"We race as MONEY"
The teams only care about money. Period. The sport is absolutely secondary. There is no possible way F1 can know how competitive Andretti would be if they entered. Pretty disgusting.
No. The sport is incredibly expensive. Hence the focus on money is needed for competitive advantage. So it is actually not a secondary aspect.
THANK YOU!!!!!
The teams are the ones who have made it incredibly expensive. Marketing purposes and profit are more important rather than the sport. I stand by my statement.@@odeode4338
@@odeode4338they’ve met the financial requirements already. They’ve stated they have the financial backing AND the support of a full factory GM effort. I don’t know what you’re smoking but lay off it.
@@odeode4338Good to know you think you know how Andretti financially are somehow not able to shoulder themselves. I mean they even have the backing of GM for the power unit, which means everything else is up to them, just like a bunch of other teams who don't build their own PU on the grid, which is the bulk of them. So tell us, just how expensive is F1 for Andretti to not be fit in your eyes.
So you must have data and not just the PR nonsense given by F1!
Whoever conducted said “research” need to be sacked. Look at what Andretti has done in VARIOUS motorsport. Not just Indycar
It's a bloody joke. "You need to pay every team $20 mln to join our little club" -> "Ok, not a problem". "Right, but you don't have a backing of major automotive brand" -> "Ok, here you go - we're bringing in GM". "Ok but now you need to be manufacturing your own power unit" -> "Weird, other teams don't have to do that, but sure, ok". "Yeah... you know what? Nah, we're good but good luck elsewhere Andretti". All these teams care about is money and don't try to BS people that it's otherwise. "Competitive participant", jeez... then why didn't you kick Williams the hell out of f1 in 2019 when they were 2-3 seconds off the pace, huh? Andretti has all the resources and facilities to manufacture a competitive race car, they have an outstanding reputation in the world of motorspors and Michael is the son of 1978s f1 world champion Mario Andretti for Christ's sake. You have space for 12 teams in the championship regulations, so use them. More teams = more seats = more competition = better show.
Sauber and Williams spent most of the last 20 years not competing for podiums. This is bold by F1 when one team dominated the whole season
Williams did compete quite well except 2013 and 2018-23
@@jivewig Williams only peak since 2004 was when they had the Mercedes PU advantage. They have been at the bottom or close to it otherwise. Remember all their pay drivers
Yet they have the right to stay in F1 and choose who to sell to because they joined before the 2021 Concorde agreement. Williams was acquired in 2020. Aston in 2018. Even Audi only got their spot by buying out Sauber. Andretti should have bought in earlier and not just half assed their current F1 bid.
@@chris01981 The explanation said nothing about "rights". All the teams could fold and Liberty doesn't own them anything
@@srfnsurfer Each team has a racing license/F1 entry, which is what Andretti is applying for, so they can stay however long they want/can. That's what gives them the 'right' to be there. Doesn't matter if the fans think their performance is shitty.
how are they calling them not competitive when we have several teams on the grid who’s car barely moves fast enough lol
F1 cares more about money than the fans wanting to see a 11th team which could have more action which will get more people watching
Why would there be more action? I‘m a fan and don‘t want an Andretti team.
we need to boycott
@@odeode4338You're the exception from what I can gather. Most fans want Andretti in F1.
And if more people watch, F1 generates more revenue.
@@tijgertjekonijnwordopgegeten did you poll them? Maybe you‘re just in a bubble that likes that. I know more fans that are against it. But I would not dare to say most fans don‘t want it. There‘s a bit of a too large number of fans to make such a statement. 🖖
To the F1 fans in America, I would like to apologise for this insult. I think you need to protest in some way and probably the best way to do that would be to ignore F1. Empty grandstands at Miami, Vegas and COTA would be a major embarrassment for F1. Or alternatively turn up to those events wearing Andretti Cadillac merchandise instead of Ferrari, Red Bull, Mercedes etc. As an, Australian fan I know what it's like to be ignored by those managing F1 but unfortunately for me the Australian market is too small to matter. The US market on the other hand is huge, they can't ignore you.
American here, who has watched every race and practice session since 2010. I've been falling asleep during most races for the past two years, and this is the final straw. I am done, what a farce.
Exactly Martin... Everyone is pointing to the fact that HAAS is not a competitive team either, but the reality is if they were applying now they'd get rejected too. Plus, just because we already have an uncompetitive US team in F1, doesn't mean we should just accept another, possibly, uncompetitive team. Sure, Andretti might come in and be successful, but just because he's had success in other categories, and his name is Andretti is not a guarantee of success in F1. We've seen many attempts by US-based teams to break into F1, but they've all failed to produce good enough results.
The same applies to GM. Everyone points out how big GM is, and I say, so what??? So they are big, and????
FYI - Toyota is big too, and their attempt at F1 can only be described as a failure, yet the smaller Honda company has had a significant amount of success over multiple decades now. In other words, the size of the manufacturer has no bearing on how successful they'll be. GM might build a great engine and be up the front in their first season, but they are also producing their very first F1 engine and it could turn out to be a complete failure because again size doesn't equal success in F1.
Another perfect example is Ford. Sure, once upon a time, many decades ago, Ford had success, but it has been a very long time since Ford managed to produce a competitive F1 engine. Ford is big, yet their results in F1 are mediocre at best.
How does it not provide Value to the sport? If you want more of the US market. I think Andretti is a good brand to bring into F1 and it helps the grow the US market.
This is dirty politics. This isn't logic anymore. They're making a sport into corrupt politics like FIFA
Value is a very broad term from your side, Remember there are teams here as well, prize pools etc, i was reading articles since early last year, most teams on the grid don't want them and remember Ferrari has Veto rights. It's just the usual politics.
@@NightElveee they all act like the prize pool can't be increased to support a new team. A completely artificial reason.
This will be the day we look back upon as the beginning of F1's downfall
F1’s downfall has already started. Fan attendance, viewership and engagement are already on the decline. It’s the hangover from DTS and F1 not delivering an exciting product to the regular fan.
@@sportkiteflyer not true unfortunately. Attendance and ticket prices are at an all time high
The day was the start of the 2021 season. Ever since then the decisions that have been made have been wildly out of touch and driven by money
They need North America more than we need them. Send them back home, close our wallets, no fans no sponsorship.
The downfall has been in full swing for years.
This was a massive own goal for F1. Would have been great to have Andretti and GM on the grid.
At the end of the day they only want GM, in that statement they put out, it said they would consider a team if GM were the ones in charge and fully running it as a GM works team and or at least a GM customer team.
They don't care for Andretti, they just want the GM money.
Own goal? no, this isn't an own goal. This is a 3-0 forfeit. I am now tired of F1
i'm sure i'm speaking for so many fans here but i think we'd love 2 more teams and 24 drivers on the grid..
New Zealands 'Rodin race cars' had also applied a bid in the same process as Andretti that was everybit as compelling as Mario's.
No we don’t need that.
@@haydengoodall6767no it wasn’t. Their proposal wasn’t okay by FIA. They didn’t comply with the necessary criteria. And they pushed that they would put 1 woman and 1 man in the car as mandatory. That was a big no cos each F1 driver needs a certain amount of license points to get into F1…and no woman is anywhere near earning those points. That seat would then be empty…
@@Redlingstein Apparently they did/do comply but it is the F1 teams association cockblocking any future potential competitors. Weird considering NZ has a long and strong history with F1 even over some current day competitors despite never having a FIA graded F1 circuit. But hey maybe we should focus upon North America and Indycar as that is where the future is.. F1 is dying and will die through its own greed and contempt for competition. 🙃
I don't get it.....saying they'll be uncompetitive? 🤔 I get the regulations change in 2 years but saying Andretti will be uncompetitive is simply crap!!!
But yet one team has 4 cars on the grid
No.
Two teams owned by one corporation. Not the same thing
ONE corporation One team Tomatoes Tomatoes. they can move drivers around the 4 cars if they like. that makes it one team true or false? @@arkangelgaming35
@@arkangelgaming35you think the junior team doesn’t do what the senior team tells them? That makes them a four car team. There’s ZERO chance either junior Red Bull car ever comes close to beating the factory team.
Not true. Its two teams. I see your logic but its not one team. Andretti should be able to compete. How do you say someone is not competitive if you don't even let them compete
If they have FIA approval, cant they just show up anyway? Would be up to Liberty to not broadcast their cars.
😂🤣
FOM has been threatening to breakaway from the FIA for sometime now. Bernie Ecclestone is a populist figure among fans, he would bring up wild ideas such as "bring back V10s" in order to seduce F1 fans into supporting such.
However, F1 separating from FIA would be detrimental to the latter's financial stability
imagine the championship standing coming from the FIA and F1 being different, but technically though, you are right that they can show up to the races but FOM will just be blurring them in every shot
FOM is a much more powerful entity than the FIA today, because they hold the money. FOM almost strong-armed FIA into firing Ben-Sulayem just the last month
I think they can go to other fia series like WEC and WRC.
I would argue that the reason is the exact opposite of what is being reported. The top teams are VERY worried that Andretti would show up and be a top end team right out of the box and taking that top money away. If they were gonna run in the back with Haas Merc, Ferrari and the rest would not care.
Black eye on the face of F1 and Liberty media.
That's literally what it is mate, they're just scared by the fact that Andretti has a proper racing heritage and could give them a run for their money
Andretti is a global Powerhouse in all forms of Motorsports they don't show up to run at the back of the pack in mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari all know that and now that they can't spend their way to the front they realize a team like Andretti could be a serious problem
@@SaabJitsu It's literally not good for their business having someone else challenging for wins and causing the prize money to be divided into more parts
Agree, but there is the fact that Liberty Media reported 12 BILLION in earnings for 2023 shows to me anyway that the prize money thing could be sorted pretty quickly.
Someone call Eddie Jordan and get a deal done lol
@jaybecker9073 you really dont understand what it takes to be competitive in F1 They would be at the back behind Haas.
Shame on FOM and Liberty. Shame on them all.
This was a slam dunk and they decide to fumble it.
I'm so angry.
I hope they keep building the car and at least put it on track with Herta to prove they can be competitive
USA is a huge market,it has 3 races, this is the ruling body being very very short sighted. There are already uncompetitive teams in F1, and while GM may have a poor first year while getting their feet wet, you can bet by year 3 they would consistently be running in the top half of teams.This ruling makes no sense to me.
And they are still wanting a race in NYC
Just a clarification that the ruling body approved them. The FIA gave them approval, the commercial rights holders, Liberty Media did not.
I wonder how the US market for F1 will be effected, given that people in the US were so hyped about seeing the Andretti name on a Formula One grid again. I will be very interested in the viewership numbers in the US for F1, Netflix "Drive To Survive", and attendance at the United States F1 circuits.
It’s horrible news for us Americans! Makes no sense. 3 grand prix’s here, that are so unaffordable these days, we were routing for an American team.
Boycott the races, also The State Department should block entry of the F1 officials as punishment. F1 wants our money without giving us a chance to compete. This decision is also a violation of The Concord Agreement, F1 is supposed to have 12 teams on the grid.
We Americans care about the Andretti name, but we want to see an American manufacturer more than the Andretti name. We want a true American team like the Germans (Mercedes), French (Alpine), British Aston Martin & McClaren), and Italians (Ferrari) have.
Real fans will boycott the races. the drive to survive fans will still go tho
How can F1 call itself a world championship if no one new, possibly better, is allowed to compete? It is just a group of individuals running a so called championship in an isolated environment.
Cadillac chased Porsche across the line in Daytona yesterday - but hey they wouldn't be competitive 😂😂😂
@bm8725 what? there were always new teams in f1. Historically there were 13 or more teams. To have some cap at 10 is just ludicrous.
Ask yourself why every other racing series welcomes new teams and competition.
@bm8725 right.. im just saying it's better to have more. What if a team folds or engine supplier like alpine leave? F1 will then go begging for more... and want Andretti, but deny them now. Its not good foresight or planning foe future.
@bm8725 you realize alot of American fans that F1 worked so hard to get are now completely gone, or boycotting. From US perspective it looks like F1 wanted American money, tracks, sponsors but only for themselves. Really stupid decision.
Not having space for a 11th team in the pit lane isn't Andretti's problem. That's F1's problem. The regulations allow for up to 12 teams. If we can't create space in the pit lane for an extra team then we would never be able to go beyond 10th teams.
Every major sport adds teams. The whole gets better by addition. This is a ridiculous decision
Why not? I don’t think Andretti would be any LESS competitive than Hass.
Because its simply an outright lie, the the pieces of pie shared between the teams would get smaller for each team and thats it. If it was about competition they could just pay the last team 0 price money and then we would see who is actually worth being in F1
Also they have or had the backing of GM as a engine supplier for the future.
This decision will be fought by andretti this entire year and will bring in to question the commercial viability (or lack there of) of Haas. sorry, Andretti in their first season brings magnitudes more commercial viability than Haas ever will
How about you stop blaming Haas for the stupid decision by F1?
@@Harvick29ism not blaming haas. im pointing out the obvious hypocrisy of the reason they rejected Andretti. How are you going to reject Andretti for not being commercially viable, when haas literally struggles to get any sponsors every single year. its blatent hypocrisy. the fact is F1 doesnt want a serious US team in their ranks because it will put their european monopoly in danger.
Therefore, Haas adds nothing to the sport
I mean, Guenther was a star on DTS, but now that he's gone, they don't.
Keeps the marshals employed
@@connorappleton1945 facts
@@connorappleton1945 The marshals are volunteers and not paid, so it doesn't even do that!
@@WizzkidwasYou know what I mean
This is purely financial…the concern is dilution of team monies versus the added gross revenue. A privateer team with OEM engines does little. A new manufacturer team (GM) does have a lot more potential
Martin brundle is like a US politician, everyone hates him but the establishment just adores him.
I've followed Formula 1 religiously since I was a 16 year-old growing up in Alabama in the 70's. I've probably watched 95% of the races that were aired where I could receive them over the past 45 years. Formula 1, ESPN, and Sky Sports F1 has lost this dedicated American Formula 1 fan. I am done.
Same. Exactly same. I'm a brit and I am done. This is dirty politics. I am done.
@@jacksteven781 F1 is all about dirty politics but I'll be honest in that I'm so tired of it. For those that have joined watching F1 recently, I kinda pity because while they might love the racing, they'll quickly tire of the polittics unless they're gluttons for punishment.
All of which is to say I empathise greatly with people who are done with F1. I'm pretty much there myself.
@@heliumtrophy I only started watching 2 seasons ago with the rule change. I thought it would be different because of Liberty, it *was* in the name. Eh, I guess I can finally start going back to gym for 6 hours a week and save money on my Sky subscription. IDK why but this really really rubbed me the wrong way.
You will carry on watching
@@kevingraham3161 I used to think that but I've watched less now and genuinely couldn't care less if I miss a race. 10 years ago I would've been kicking myself if I missed one - now, I'll read about who wins but I don't care one way or the other.
Unbelievable..... just wow
Andretti just could not bring the value that a strong, competitive, independent team like the great Visa CashApp Racing Bulls can… 🤦♂️
If I was Andretti I'd say fine and take advantage of every minute for testing since they are denied, research and development time is fair game
As a fan I welcome Andretti and am embarrassed for F1 and fia for being so afraid and in fact against the definition of Sport.
F1's success is solely due to the production team on Drive to Survive. The teams and rights holders are owed nothing and should simply be greatful the show was so well done. This decision to deny Andretti is greed and nothing else
They don't want American teams they just the American dollar
Liberty Media IS American! They are F1!
@@Mandykiss4500 IK, but that doesn't change the fact that they don't want American teams they just want the American dollar.
Exactly!
@@Mandykiss4500This isn't China, just because a business is owned by an American outfit or headed by one, it doesn't mean it can't hold ideals that aren't even remotely tied to the nation of origin. In fact American companies are usually ready to sell something if the price is right, money is King and they can care less about if their company originated in good ol US of A. In fact there'sa list of American companies owned by foreign owners across the nation. So Liberty being American don't meana damn thing in business really. No one has asked them to sell for the right price yet.
Would suck if fans for the US races started to boycott... but I am sure they considered the risk...
Probably not well enough
They won't get one penny from me anymore. And my viewership will be on the high seas.
Already dumped their phone app, cancelled F1 related subs…won’t be watching or attending races.
It would be a strong statement if Circuit of America shut out F1 at their track. We here is the USA don't really need F1 to be a racing fan.
I'm really sad, man. My family pulled together a Christmas present for me - ticket to the Canadian GP. It's not in the US, so it wouldn't be in a boycott zone, but I just feel... dirty... wanting to go now.
Hope they get sued in EU court.
They can sue them in the US for Antitrust for sure.
they might
F1 is an open world championship
Andretti clearly have met all the requirements
argument that FOM does not believe they would be competitive in their first year is utterly ludicrous - nobody was competitive in their first years...
@@mikez2779They just threw everything they could think of against the wall thinking some of us would t see right through their BS. It’d have been easier to just say “We really don’t like you, Michael.”
He said the teams and fans would be split. Which shows its about the teams an not the fans anymore.
I was at the Toronto INDY in 1993 and went on the Grid Walk. I spoke to Mario and he was a verey nice laid back person. He goes to many F1 races and i would like the growth of America in F1 with many new tracks in the USA. And a competitive American driver as we try to compete with INDYCAR and NASCAR in America. It is all about money and Andretti will be villains of the padlock espeshaly if they become competitive. But what is good for the image of the Sport is not good enough financially. We don't want teams going broke and bankrupt because a new team brought them out.
They don't want another team, another team means the money they make would be divided by 11 teams not 10.
But another team would also bring in more money. Ultimately making the pot that gets divided even bigger.
@@TerryWillard you’re right, but that’s way too logical for FOM
'We do not believe the applicant would be be competitive" when they have teams like Haas, Alpine and Toro Rosso with no ambition is laughable
Andretti would not have the expertise, infrastructure or experience these teams have in the context of F1 and would be three years behind in development. A big budget would compensate to some degree but it would be hard to envisage Andretti being as competitive as any of these teams for many years
@@pikey740 Andretti have won more championships than these teams could ever hope to win
@@Lastname6955not in the F1 Constructors Worldchampionship ……
With Gunther gone, HAAS is no where now. Let Andretti buy HASS, instead of having 11th team.
They were no where with him
Haas is nowhere as long as Gene keeps calling the shots
Haas has said repeatedly he will not sell. He achieves his business goals riding around at the back, one of the very reasons they’ve rejected Andretti. Benefiting the team owner more than F1. You couldn’t make up the irony. 🤦♂️
That’s a slap in the face to the Andretti line and all the fans who want to see the worlds best compete.
The F1 statement contradicts F1
F1 is a joke. They moved the goalposts constantly on Andretti and each time Andretti would check the boxes. Now they're finally done trying to find a way to say they can't do it and say "they wouldn't be competitive."
Any sport that doesn't allow new competitors has no right to call themselves a sport
I bet they could beat 2 teams in their 1st year, right out of the gate.
😂😂😂 stop fooling yourself. This lunacy is 😂😂 F1 and all teams know that ANY NEW TEAM would be THE backmarker for several years….
Completely self-defeating. I wouldn't be surprised if Liberty run F1 into the ground or a breakaway championship is formed.
They do.... It's called Indycar!. Plus the actual action is more competitive.
So F1 say they don’t bring enough value and won’t be competitive and this is the reasoning behind not allowing Andretti to compete, but then you have teams saying they don’t want to share the winnings and this is partially why they can’t join.
What is it really? If it’s the latter, then we should just assume F1 is only 10 teams going forward and be honest about it.
If the US team doesn’t bring enough value, then then Americans should show their disapproval with their wallets and boycot F1
They want the audience and money but not the teams
F 1 is scared of Andretti they are coming with a lot of backing and are worried they would be a lot better than what they would invision. With three gps in the us I can’t see how this wouldn’t be a positive for formula 1
Don’t count your chickens before they hatch, that’s assuming the US market keeps growing. Decisions like this may up just stall your popularity in the U.S,
I don't know if Domenicali is actually leading the decision making.
If he does, this is a bigger mistake that the one that he made in 2008 when he steered the development of the car towards Massa instead of Raikkonen at Ferrari
He did my boy Kimi dirty.
Ive been a fan my whole life havent missed watching a race in years. But this is seriously making me rethink being a fan if it was truly about the sport Andretti would be let in but its more about politics and the commercial rights then the actual sport.
Brundle's point that these F1 teams have poured billions into building F1 to this level is utter nonsense! They have poured billions into participating in F1, but have contributed little to nothing to build the sport's popularity. Making such a nonsensical statement is the equivalent of saying the Cleveland Browns (a team with a 0.340 winning percentage since 1990) had anything to do with making the NFL one of the most popular sports leagues in the world.
Also will Caddy want the rules changed so they can use Bodecia's cart suspension and camshafts in the crankcase? I say as you lot only just give them up in performance road cars recently? F1 should always reflect road car tech, has done for years.
“We care about the fans!” -adds more street races to the calendar, refuses an entry from a well known racing team, tells fans that payed money and traveled across the country to see a practice session that lasted 7 minutes “lmao stuff happens, no refunds, bring your money next year k thx”
Andretti is not a well known team worldwide….. only in US.
Claim money at F1 for those tickets… their Vegas organizing teams fault.
I can forsee the DECLINE of F1's popularity from now on....
2022 season was very boring aswell
So they expect a new team to immediately fight for championships?
A valid point... especially as this past year NO OTHER TEAM actually fought for the championship; Red Bull was so far out ahead that effectively, there wasn't a competition. Despite not even fielding a car, Andretti was only marginally less competitive than William, Alphatauri, Alfa Romeo, or Haas
Let's face it, F1 didn't reject Andretti-Cadillac because they WON'T be competitive. Rather, the current teams fear that the team WOULD give them even more real competition. It should be clear by now that F1 is not a zero-sum enterprise -- the pie can grow.
4 years ago, half the field was going bankrupt, pandemic DTS bump is already receding, Car sales are down because of unaffordability, when these OEM'S need to cut costs first thng getting cut is racing money. A team with a business of racing will stick around before OEM's. Plus ticket prices to high for what you get. Las Vegas was crazy expensive..
I'm convinced it is basically Gene Haas (who has a personal rivalry with Michael Andretti) who is vetoeing everything
Never forget that Gene Haas was breaking sanctions by supplying Russia with CNC machines.
@@vapeymcvape5000 Gene Haas' character was also shady, like most F1 characters. He was convicted of fraud once
Naw it's toto. I'm sure haas is part of it too though.
you also need to remember that nikita mazepin was a trainee KGB officer, he admitted to this in an episode of beyond the grid.
Thank you Sky Sports - for reacting in minutes with live experts.
And how is Hass more commercially competitive than Andretti Cadillac?
One thing I haven't heard mentioned is that the Concorde Agreement is up for renewal in 2026. One could see the FIA demanding entry of any teams they approve as part of the new deal.
Or the opposite. F1 demanding that the 10 team structure is enshrined in the agreement to prevent this and effectively seal the franchise model in law
The new Concorde Agreement is going to make MUCH more expensive for a new team to get in. Right now the entry fee is $200 million. Existing teams want that to be a lot higher. Think $500 million plus, if not $1 Billion if they are that delusional
As an American, this Andretti decision does it for me and F1, I’m done. The politics in this sport are unlike any I’ve ever witnessed. The racing takes a backseat to everything else.