It’s not done for, it’s just not the same as it was. You have to have some disposable income to buy milsurp rifles. The current economy makes it hard for many. Gun show prices are insane.
I agree, there is still a market, I still keep a finger on the pulse. But I'm more inclined to be an opportunist. Though not actively seeking, just "if" something falls in my lap as it were. I have thinned my duplicates in 3 cases, taking advantage of the seller's market oy 23-24. The current crop of rough Ethiopian imports is not of any interest to me.
Sellers are out of their mind with their listed prices. Bid on penny auctions. Look for guns that you suspect to be better than what the photos suggest. Come up with a max price you're willing to pay and stick with it. Be disciplined - follow multiple items. Be willing to give in if conditions arent favorable. In the past 3 months I've acquired thru gunbroker auctions: Type 46/66 Siamese Mauser with Bayonet - $270 Remington M1903A3 w/ sling - $620 French MAS 36 - $455 All in good condition with mint bores
This. Exactly this. I see those poor suckers on royal tiger imports wanting enfields what ever where for the same exact price you can get a 2x better condition on gunbroker. Likewise, make friends guys. People are interested in trades all the time.
@alexace5584 I am astonished guys buy those wall hangers from RTI and being happy. It doesn't cost that much more to buy a really nice rifle, with excellent bore, at auction.
@@donwyoming1936 that was 15 years ago bud. much different market now. market price for a refurb is $600-700 nowadays. Mine is a WW2 production UNrefurbished which typically will command an even higher price. we can recognize that the market has changed while also calling out the scammers and price gougers
As an 01 FFL, you don't see the minimum wage workers and low ranking enlisted buying up surplus rifles, SKSs, and AKs like you did in the 90s. They buy budget ARs now. The guys coming in buying surplus have good jobs, typically over 29 (ie 45), and they buy one or two a year. I miss the days when enlisted guys would buy a surplus rifle once a month with a case of ammo.
that's not necessarily true. I make very little but always go into my local pawn shop to buy milsurp and cheaper guns. I acquired a type 53 in somewhat bad condition for $250, they know I'm poorer and also like to fix up guns so they give me deals always.
When I first started buying guns in the 90s, an Enfield was $40 and a Remington or Winchester bolt action was $400. Sks's were about $100 and a Colt H-bar AR was $700 to $800. Now the bolt gun prices have reversed and The budget AR and SKS prices are almost even.
Im just glad as a 24 year old ive managed to get almost every surplus gun i want. The only ones im missing are either way too expensive for what they are or too expensive to shoot/ too similar to something i have. Ive been getting into big bore now.
You have some valuable insights. Sadly, the only game in town now (practically) is Royal Tiger Imports. The rest are hit-and-miss at best. Gun shows have become price-gouging centers and opportunities for people to hock taffy, jerky, and roasted nuts. Plus, simple supply and demand impacted prices as well. I fear the golden age of the gun show has come and gone. I wish it was not the case.
The value of a gun show is what walks in the door. If you're a regular joe without a table you already missed the swapping going on during the Friday setup. The dealers will have little if anything fairly priced, they're there to trade with their buddies, watch what comes down the aisle, and most importantly get away from their wives for the weekend.
The Glory Days of Milsurp collecting are over. In the 1980s, you could buy a virtually brand new Swedish Mauser for $100. A new Russian made SKS was $125. There were all kinds of good stuff around and it was all cheap. Even in the early 2000s, I got an unfired Mosin Nagant for $79.95 plus tax.
Luckily I picked up the mil-surps I wanted back in the 80's & 90's.... now it's just trying to stay stacked up on ammo for them, and that's bad enough.
A lot of guns have gone up...Marlins I bought just 10 years ago are going for more than double what I paid, so now I can't justify buying more of them. I decided not to get into milsurp because of prices at this point and have gone with buying replicas of Old West firearms, which are primarily foreign made.
Done? No. It's a collectors market now clearly though, rich mans game if you will. However you either need substantial disposable income or need to be dead set focused on a particular milsurp you want. I'd imagine you won't go in somewhere and just casually pick one up or not.
Its called Capitalism, no ones being forced to purchased these milsurp's. We aren’t talking about gasoline prices after a hurricane. Or the price of toilet paper in 2020 during COVID. You need to sit wait and watch for the right seller.
@@inspectorkemp7439Not its not. There are the same amount of milsurps back then as there are now. Old bommer fudds just want money and price gouge mil-surps to death. "I remember when you could get ten of these for a nickle! Ha! Anyway son, that there M1 will be two grand." Then bommers wonder why young people don't get into the hobby. They HATE losing investments on ANYthing, even something as asinine as mil surps. I'm a staunch pro-capitalist, anti-commie who hates what the boomers did to the milsurp hobby by turning it into an investment oppertunity.
Part of it is definitely greed. But I do think milsurps are viewed differently than they used to be. Some people definitely saw historic value in them back when they were cheap, but I would say a lot less buyers cared about the history or the designs and just wanted an affordable, reliable gun. Nowadays, the current production budget guns have gotten pretty good. A PSA AR can be had for under $350 many bolt actions in that price range too. It would be hard to recommend someone get an SKS or Mosin over those at any price point, if they just want something shoot groundhogs, take to the range twice a year, keep on hand “just in case” etc.
I got over it and sold my entire collection of Enfields and other milsurps. The main reason was they sat in a safe 90% of the time and I can't shoot them cause the ammo is not available or too expensive. Got a really good payout and put the money into my buying a house fund.
I'm still buying, but very selective anymore, mainly parts grade stuff really. Only good stuff I buy, is when I come across things I didn't have, or holes in the collection. The Ethiopian stuff, has actually been the models I wanted, but never see, like Vetterlis, Mannlichers, etc.
I think a strong depressant on the market is the expense for ammo for a lot of these nonstandard calibers. Prices just aren't what they once were and new manufactured stuff costs as much or more than sporting calibers, if it's available at all. Another problem associated with rising costs is lack of range spaces for rifles. I didn't mind having a safe queen when it only cost me a C note, but if it's gonna run me five bills or more I better have the drive to shoot it somewhat often and not have that wreck my pocketbook in the process. Genuinely, though, I'm curious if what we grew up seeing as the norm was actually the anomaly and the current status quo is back to being more normal. The era of the end of the Cold War is a market force we won't ever see again, I'd reckon. I've definitely had to pare down; I used to have a goal to have one of each manufacturer of 1917 and P14, almost did too, just an elusive Remington P14 never made it to me (and I ended up with a duplicate Eddystone thanks to RIA mislabeling a lot and me not being careful of their photos). Now I'm down to a good museum grade example and a shooter of each, and I don't plan to change that. I think I'm done chasing surplus for a while, I'm tired of surprises in stuff online through either ignorance or deceit, and I never catch stuff at shops locally. My new interest is cheap old revolvers and old .22s--the parts are still out there, they're really easy to fix, and .22 will be around forever, plus I can actually shoot them at my local range. Basically all I shoot anymore are .22s because centerfire hurt the wallet so much for the last few years. I can definitely see new collectors making small collections to care about rather than going more general, it's the only way to keep things economical
Interesting information and strategy. I do know of people seeking older 22 rifles, pistols and revolvers. I know of a few Remington Nylon collectors. I do buy online every so often… and yea, deceit and/or misinformation can be upsetting but there’s always a chance that a misinformed seller can present a good deal. I tend to look for stuff locally or while out of town. Never know what you might find. Estate sales and private sellers also present good deals.
I feel like the market in general has stabilized but gun shows largely have not. Still way too many boomers who "know what they got" and are charging $800 for Yugo M48s in mediocre condition. Some milsurps probably won't recover from the 2016-2022 price boom. The perfect storm of high-profile video games like Battlefield 1 and V, PUBG, etc might have permanently borked German Mauser and even Mosin prices and then COVID activated everyone's reptile brain for panic buying and people started rushing to buy milsurps for fear they wouldn't be able to for a while. UA-cam content creators also didn't help. Forgotten Weapons is probably single-handedly responsible for the insane spike in the cost of French guns and the thousands upon thousands of UA-cam videos and now Shorts of internet randos shooting off old guns have kept interest in milsurps permanently ignited. I'm not one to talk, I've raked in a few million views from this stuff too over the past couple of years. But overall, prices have definitely stabilized for most milsurps and have gone down for many as well. Lee-Enfields have barely moved up in price and most Mauser variants can be found at similar prices to what was seen in 2019. The best milsurp market right now is for pistols, and honestly unlike bolt guns left over from WWII this flow isn't going to slow down anytime soon. And we'll still likely see sporadic caches of old rifles from neutral countries being imported for the next decade, you just have to pay attention. One market that is forever doomed is the surplus market for anything German. Another perfect storm of arrogant gun show boomers, serial fraudsters creating fake N*zi markings, and clueless gamer wehraboos paying top dollar for beater Luger and P38s mean this crap will never be affordable again. You'll see some postwar P38s and P1s show up and maybe if we get lucky more drops like those Portuguese Kar98ks but overall the market for affordable German milsurps is dead.
Great write up and I do say that the majority of shows I’ve been to this year were not worth going to. Over the years, I was actually surprised to see overall auction prices and blue book values rise. The sentiment for these old rifles just grew so much but on a sophisticated collector level it seems, like fine art.
Yeah it’s done, if you didn’t start buying stuff in the late 90’s or early 2000’s you are too late, once saving private Ryan came out that ruined it for 95% of people
Shoulda seen what was around pre-'68. And I'm talking at Gibson's and K-Mart. Of course wages were way lower then, but the variety of available guns was amazing. I remember seeing racks of South American Mausers for sale at K-Mart for under $30. Still, all wells run dry eventually.
Biggest advice for a new collectors, unless you hand load or want closet queens. If you plan to shoot your piece research ammo costs before you buy the milsurp. Carcano carbine at $225 are great but, ammo is $1.30 a round how much shooting time will you get in? 7.5 swiss = $1.75 per round 30-06 = $1.20, MAS 7.5 = $1.40. Lately been shooting more 8mm mauser, 54r and 7.62x 39. this surplus is still around with an all in cost (taxes and shipping) of around 50-60 cents a round
30-06 can be bought for around 60 to 70cpr if you stay below 180 so it's garand safe and easier for the bolts. I plan on getting a 1903 at some point with a budget of 700 or less and gun shows are a little easier on ammo, people sell ammo more than the guns themselves so the price is usually negotiable especially if they have a mismatch of stuff on the table they are usually trying to just get rid of it not make a profit.
A gun show with 2,000 people attending is a joke. Gun shows are as dead as Blockbuster Video. The surplus/C&R market used to be interesting because the stuff was really cheap and the ammo was cheap. I'm not a historian opening my own museum. I had a C&R license and never found anything worth buying. It's all been picked over.
No one ever mentions the time sink required to MAINTAIN the things. Once I realized I was tired of attempting to keep old rifles that I rarely shot in museum-quality states I took stock of what I had, decided which shooters were both fun and had a reasonably available ammo supply, and dumped the rest. Some collect to collect, I collect to shoot. But that's just me. And yeah sadly many of the cartridges are just not as available as they once were. But I wouldn't be surprised if enthusiasm comes around again as newer generations enter the fun market. Just remember that time sink. If you actually take care of your guns, it adds up quickly.
One thing many people don't seem to take into consideration is that genuine military surplus is a finite resource that will eventually be completely depleted. When Swiss Alpenflage first came on the market, it was so abundant that people could buy 3 field shirts and a parka for $10, maybe even less. Even UCP surplus, while still dirt cheap, will raise in price as more of it is bought up, increasing the demand.
A few years ago I made a purchase of four rifles for $500. Savage lend lease Enfield , 1937 K98k with the particular eagle holding a certain symbol in its claws all over it, a Chilean Mauser in 308 and a Spanish Mauser in 7mm. $125 each. I do believe those days are gone. But what a score!
It is at gun shows but you can still find reasonable surplus a local gun shops on rare occasions and online. Online is the new gun show. Most thier are barely any gun sales a gun shows it mostly vender selling nick nacks and beef jurkey. Then thier basically peoples private collections that they are selling and know what they have and think it all gold. They days of 79$ rifles in barrels is over. Yhe good new is that you can still get deals online from rti classic and retailers liķe that. And the thier is gunbroker to.
Im not big into military surpluse but i do collect remington marlin and some brownings and im thankful for what i have i cant justify paying these prices for example standard 870 wingmaster beat too death selling for 6 plus just dont get it but thats the way it is and why i dont even mess with looking for stuff anymore
I know what you mean. I’ve been trying to find a Marlin 336 for my dad and even the absolutely best to crap to the point they’ll need replacement parts examples I could find are still asking for $600. It’s infuriating.
They’re definitely getting harder to find and the prices are not what they used to be. But there’s still very much a demand for them. Gun shops near me can’t keep them in stock. You buy them when you see them or miss out quick.
In my view, as a Millennial in their mid 30s, I missed the early window for getting into Milsurp, but this year I set a goal and I set money aside and purchased my first two Milsurp weapons. Regarding housing, I missed the window on that well, so by the time I did get my finances in order, they were out of my price range. I have a couple of gun shops that I do like to go to for Milsurp, but one store has "the good" stuff, while the other one has better deals typically. I don't see any real changes occurring for Milsurp collecting in the near future, so I'm pacing myself and looking to pickup at least a couple of Milsurps per year until I have my collection where I want it.
About 20 years ago, I picked up a Moson Nagant M91/30 for like 99 bux (refurbished at the Izhevsk Aresnal in 1941 & still packed in Cosmoline when I bought it), and bought some commercially available ammo here & there. A year or so later, I found a couple guys that had ammo for it locally (priced cheap), and now have over 3K rounds of Mil-Surp ammo on hand, for less than 800 bux total for the rifle & ammo.......
I drove 2 hours to go to a gun show last weekend. 50% was the same dealers I see everywhere else selling full msrp, and 50% random unrelated things. Not a single private seller in the whole damn place. It's not even a gun show at that point, what a joke and a scam! I hate being born in the 2000s.
Thanks for sharing your experience. The gunshow I went to a few weeks before the Greenville show was a wash as well as the one I went to this past weekend. It definitely appears that not all gunshows are the same.
It's the same here in the UK prices are crazy but if you want one then you have to pay the price. A couple of dealers have cornered the market. Thirty years ago, a long time I know but you could buy a number4 Lee Enfield still in it's mummy wrap for a hundred pounds. Now that same rifle would be close to two thousand pounds.
The surplus rifles are still in circulation, they are just now in the hands of individuals not being sold in large caches by importers. People have just become so focused buying on gunbroker or websites at the push of a button. That convenience and nationwide exposure is driving up prices. I am still finding much lower prices for in-person sales.
8:04 for me personally that's a good thing as a collector. While it makes my collections value go down some there's still lots id like to get that I still don't have. I welcome some mil-surp prices tanking a bit 😁
There will always be caches amd collections sold off. Gunbroker continually has good stuff, yet the prices are a lot higher but stuff is still out there.
Just grabbed a good shaped Carcano at the Monroeville gun show for $110 😮, I know the guy and we’ve traded and bought and sold to each other for over a decade but I’m happy with the M91 WW1 long rifle. I’ve been picking up old WW1 to 1950’s rifles. 😅 I remember getting my 91/30 matching number Mosin for $100 back in 2010. Also got a few M24/46 and M24/47’s for $250 back in 2014 😅 if it has been turned into a hunting rifle I will gladly buy it from you. 😮 I live my KAR98 1938 with a 7.62 NATO/308 Israeli barrel. I found in my cousin’s basement his grandfather’s M95 Steyr Karbine 1899 W-n 99 stamped still in 8x50r unchanged since his grandfather brought it back from the Austro Hungarian army. His and my relatives fought in WW1 for Austro Hungary 🇭🇺. I asked my grandma which division was her father in and which front did he fight against and it looks like my relatives were on the southern front against Serbia and or Italy but I can’t find any info 😮
I decided to get out of milsurp collecting officially this year. I still collect vintage firearms, but anything with a military lineage I stay away from unless it's a killer deal. Pulled off an absolute hat-trick recently on an unshaven, non import-marked 1917 Webley Mark VI with 550 rounds of .455 ammunition for under a grand. I'll probably never get that lucky again.
It's not the same and honestly. I am having more fun getting stuff from the 50s-70s with my C&R lots of police trade ins. Police trade ins isn't the same, but it fills the void
I tell allot of younger guys to start collecting police guns from the 70's-90's. You can get allot of that stuff dirt cheap right now because allot of forces are getting rid of old inventories and militaries typically don't want them. Most of the time they're in much better condition than any of the military stuff, a little holster wear and that's about it. People already get big eyes when I tell them I have a slamfire Ithaca 37 or a gen 1 Glock with the recalled case. While police guns aren't exactly military surplus, it's an adjacent hobby and allot of them have crossover with military history. BTW, Great seeing you at the Greenville gun show. Haven't been able to do a deep dive on that Last Ditch I bought.
I am 61 and started collecting when I was 10. The other thing to look for is quality rather than quantity. Books, research, save for nice stuff. To each their own, but my first was a K98 all matching for $150. No, I don't buy 20K Lugers, but really nice collectable stuff under $2500. But I buy less now and don't sell much, and yes some deals.
In todays money factoring inflation $150 in 1973 (51 years ago) is worth $1,060 today. How much are K98 going for today. 1,000 - 1,500? So they have increased arguably 0%-45% over the past half century. I’m sure there are exotic K98 for more $2,500
Add into that mix that milsurp collecting is also becoming very popular in Europe also and the prices here have remained mostly unchanged but I can't see that staying the case as the demand increases and there is a finite amount of these things.
@BattlefieldCurator not anymore. The EU changed it's deactivation requirements back around 2012 so now collectors like me are collecting live firearms. I'll attach my video on the matter. ua-cam.com/video/kszspan3J7A/v-deo.htmlsi=Z6W0j-0dhziRr0HX
@@BattlefieldCuratorI’m sure a lot are, I know a significant portion of those Thompsons found in the ocean are earmarked for being made into dewats, but manual actions arms also tend to be less regulated in Europe.
@@fortheloveofnoisenone that have large stocks of surplus to sell or that are on good terms with the US. On the one hand I wish we could import from China and Russia but on the other I’m not to fond of their governments and understand the embargoes.
ive dropped from 6-7 rifles a year to 1-2. no more impulse buying for the most part, just targeted acquisitions which i end up enjoying more and stay in my collection longer.
I was out 10 years ago, sold the lot when 8mm Romanian and Mosin Spam cans went over $70.00 a pop. I have zero locker queens, everything I own will be fired when I want to. So ammo has to be affordable and plentiful.
I've been trading for my milsurp no cash kind of trade. Albeit my last one was a sporterized M-1917 Eddy Stone Edition so not as valuable but I don't trade for value.
They have a Venezuelan FN-49 “Sniper” for 2000 dollars. I’m gonna pass because I see no research on a sniper variant in that contract. But I want it! But that’s a lot of money for a FN from venezuala. So my emotions are involved. Haha This rifle was bought in 60s by an old man today, he is in his 90s and still collecting surplus. He never fired it, and it shows. It has a scope mount, and a wooden cheek rest. But what if Venezuela had 20 sniper variants made? The old saying can help you make a decision. If it’s too good to be true, it probably is!
As far as ammo, think of purchasing ammo like purchasing toilet paper. You need to purchase it in large quantities to obtain a decent price. Do not buy a box or two at a time unless you want to pay unreasonable prices; especially for rifle ammo.
If anyone was to look at ads in pre-1968 GCA magazines like the American Rifleman or Guns and Ammo, they would be sick to see what they missed out on if they were too young to buy or not yet born. A 1903 Springfield would typically sell for $40 and 1917 Enfield for $5 less. The late 80s and 90s were the second " golden age" of surplus weapons.
I bought an m1917 enfield that was sporterized for 600, and it's one of my favorite deer rifles alongside my father's, with the bonus that that is one of the cheapest rifles in my area
I am still 29 and that is basically the last age for Millennials to be. After that is zoomers. Regarding to houses, I doubt a bunch of us were able to afford a home because how things went the previous years and still living with our parents or have to work 2x jobs. But yeah, I do collect military surplus firearms when given the right price or free money to throw around.
@BattlefieldCurator I collect guns instead of buy new cars and stiff like that. I daily a 98 5 speed manual Sentra that I painted myself with tractor paint
I still collect, but I have specific interests. Ex: Finnish Nagants, and military rifles/pistols from the 1870-1940 era. If you're picky the price doesn't seem that out of whack.
Why spend 1k on a milsurp when I can spend it on an fn 15 or wasr 10. I understand the wasr 10 is probably considered "milsurp" but milsurp is dead because of the greedy prices. If you fools would chill out and stop buying for 1 measly year we could drive the prices back down.
Dont shop gunshows.Look at local mom and pop stores to get nice ones and better prices.Just got a mint 91 30 from my small town shop.Sweetest 1943 rifle Ive ever seen.Glad to give my money to my neighbors.
There aren’t any deals at gun shows anymore. Used gun cost as much as new ones. Military surplus is way overpriced most of the time. The supply has pretty much dried up.
Whoever is still in the Milsurplus collecting hobby, has to have deep pockets, that I don't have or settle four crap condition stuff that seems to be out there now. 😮
Got most of my collection on GB, after hours and hours of careful searching. Weekday ending auctions, sellers who only take money orders, sellers who don’t sell to blue states, low feedback sellers, etc. Deals are out there but it takes lots and lots of time to spot the market inefficiencies and have the money to act quick
Don’t forget about the sporterized guns, sometimes you can get them cheaper. IF you want to put the time and money into and turn them back to milsurp spec or leave as is and enjoy it.
Right now, I'm focused on increasing my stocks of magazines and some guns that may be soon at risk. With regard to milsurp collecting, I keep my eyes open and my wallet securely held. If I see something that strikes my fancy, I'll go for it, but I try never to be in a rush with that part of my armory. Milsurp collecting is an interest, not a need--need in the sense of something for which I have a practical use--and I can wait. There will be another wave of interesting surplus soon.
I’ve just become more patient. I frequent the local shops in my area and once in awhile I’ll find a steal on consignment. It is definitely harder to justify the hobby when I could spend my disposable income on better gear, optics, or modern firearms. With the younger generation I think they are enthusiastic with milsurps but will prioritize modern firearms especially with the uncertain political climate. As always thank you for the video and keep the content coming!
Yeah, when you've only just hit legal adulthood and you're trying to look for something that costs less than $500 because you don't have a job and nobody is hiring, you're not going to spend it all on Elmer Fudd's beat-to-shit Mosin with rifling so worn out you'd swear it was a smooth bore. 99% of the new Gen Z firearms enthusiasts will absolutely foam at the mouth over historical firearms, but will likely never actually own them, instead using a Palmetto AR-15 and a simple no-frills Glock for all their shooting needs since the older stuff just isn't very affordable considering how little you get out of it compared to modern weapons. That, and people like me living in places like New Mexico who've recently turned 18 having to now wait until 21 to own firearms will probably kill off any interest in the hobby.
The show in Greenville, SC is put on by the SC arms collectors association and prices have always been high there. I saw a few people buying firearms but attendance, too me, seemed a little down compared to past shows over the years. By the way, it was great meeting you there and thanks for the M1 carbine mag.
Well i just recently found a Remington built Mosin 91/30 and it was only 500.00 bucks. I know they use to be a bit cheaper but these days 500bucks aint much! lol same with a 1943 built Enfield i bought for 500bucks as well. The Czech VZ24 i have my grandfather took off a German Conscript during the war and i purchased an Italian stored Carcano. Not the one with the huge bayonet on it! A TS! LOL that i got for 350 and all are in great shape! The other two mil-surps i want are an M1Garand and a Japanese Arisaka. Then for now my WWII collection will be done. Although i did spend 1800 bucks on two SKS's lol one a Chinese Corinco
You fools always blame the seller. It is the buyer who is at fault for high prices. If people stop paying ridiculous prices for these guns, the prices will go down. The problem is the younger generation puts everything on a credit card so they will spend the extra money because they can instantly buy it. But if any of you think these rifles will go down in price, you are crazy. There is only so many military surplus rifles out there.
I’ve referenced this in depth analysis in another video. I mentioned that I saw $1k Mosin m91/30 sell from some of the local shops, so buyer didn’t do the research! But that was mainly during the pandemic
it's not over yet, but a scary concept i've been thinking about lately is that the entire idea of buying military surplus rifles will eventually just be over completely unless the laws change in the future. it's a long ways off, but one day the only rifles in actual surplus will be fully automatic, and future generations of gun collectors won't get to experience this type of collecting unless the FOPA is overturned.
That’s not the point of collecting. Even a minty Finn Mosin isn’t going to be that accurate anyway. If you are looking for top notch accuracy, milsurp is not, nor was it ever, where that’s at.
Shot out military surplus, I usually pass. They don’t make these rifles like this and the few that they do cost a lot to produce. Also, people collect them for the history, the range experience, the aesthetics and many more reasons.
I went to a gunshow a few weeks ago. Dealer wanted 950 for a yugo sks. 700 for chinese type 53, and over 1000 for an Enfield mk3 clearly from the Ethiopian lot. He also complained that he wasnt selling anything.
lol 😂 wow yea I wonder why he not selling anything. I also had to say that I did see some ok deals at this gunshow and I’m sure some savvy folks snagged some good priced milsurps
the Carcanos and the M95s have become the new Mosins price wise, I got quite a few now cause of the reliability and how cheap they are now at least from RTI I remember when they first started importing them in 2020 the M95 long was 399 now as low as 150
One thing I really like about RTI is that guns that were almost impossible to find previously can now be had at reasonable prices. Some good examples are the Mannlicher 1888/90, Vetterli M1870/87, and the Berdan rifles. I should also mention that a Steyr M95 in 8x50R was as rare as hen's teeth before RTI started importing them.
@@TreeWizard648 oh yeah especially all the different variants like the Vetterli TS, M1888/95, the Gras rifles ect. And though some people may complain RTI rifles are junk I still find it great we are getting something brought in that isn’t $500 plus like Chinese SKS or Mosin
@@TreeWizard648 I have bought Mannlicher 1888/90s, 1890 carbine, Gras rifles, Berdan II, and Vetterlis from RTI. You can't really expect to see these things pop up at a gun store or a show unless it comes from the same source. And there been some good deals from RTI like their warehouse clearance sales for their Enfield rifles (both no1 and no4) for $150. The prices for the Mannlicher are bad for the clearance price. If they put it out as 100$, then people will be clearing them out obviously.
@@tomc6255 I have saw many of these RTI guns show up at gun shows, especially the Steyr M95s. Back in the day, an M95 you see at a gun show would be almost certainly an 8x56R gun. Nowadays, you have to look for the presence of an S to determine the caliber. Usually they are going to try to sell those guns for a way higher price than RTI, especially if it was a nice one.
@@tomc6255 I bought a B-Grade Mannlicher 1888/90 from RTI for 200 bucks, and I received a really nice and accurate rifle. I guess I got lucky with that one.
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It’s not done for, it’s just not the same as it was. You have to have some disposable income to buy milsurp rifles. The current economy makes it hard for many. Gun show prices are insane.
Agreed
It’s a rich man’s game now.
I agree, there is still a market, I still keep a finger on the pulse. But I'm more inclined to be an opportunist.
Though not actively seeking, just "if" something falls in my lap as it were.
I have thinned my duplicates in 3 cases, taking advantage of the seller's market oy 23-24.
The current crop of rough Ethiopian imports is not of any interest to me.
Just bought a Danish garand for $700 is that good
@@WalterWild2 yes that is good. Where did you get it?
Sellers are out of their mind with their listed prices. Bid on penny auctions. Look for guns that you suspect to be better than what the photos suggest. Come up with a max price you're willing to pay and stick with it. Be disciplined - follow multiple items. Be willing to give in if conditions arent favorable. In the past 3 months I've acquired thru gunbroker auctions:
Type 46/66 Siamese Mauser with Bayonet - $270
Remington M1903A3 w/ sling - $620
French MAS 36 - $455
All in good condition with mint bores
This. Exactly this.
I see those poor suckers on royal tiger imports wanting enfields what ever where for the same exact price you can get a 2x better condition on gunbroker.
Likewise, make friends guys. People are interested in trades all the time.
I bought a 1972 Refurbished MAS-36 like new, for $135 just 15 years ago. A $450 MAS is not a flex.
@alexace5584 I am astonished guys buy those wall hangers from RTI and being happy. It doesn't cost that much more to buy a really nice rifle, with excellent bore, at auction.
@@donwyoming1936 that was 15 years ago bud. much different market now. market price for a refurb is $600-700 nowadays. Mine is a WW2 production UNrefurbished which typically will command an even higher price. we can recognize that the market has changed while also calling out the scammers and price gougers
@@donwyoming1936
15 years ago is not today!😂
As an 01 FFL, you don't see the minimum wage workers and low ranking enlisted buying up surplus rifles, SKSs, and AKs like you did in the 90s. They buy budget ARs now.
The guys coming in buying surplus have good jobs, typically over 29 (ie 45), and they buy one or two a year.
I miss the days when enlisted guys would buy a surplus rifle once a month with a case of ammo.
that's not necessarily true. I make very little but always go into my local pawn shop to buy milsurp and cheaper guns. I acquired a type 53 in somewhat bad condition for $250, they know I'm poorer and also like to fix up guns so they give me deals always.
When I first started buying guns in the 90s, an Enfield was $40 and a Remington or Winchester bolt action was $400. Sks's were about $100 and a Colt H-bar AR was $700 to $800. Now the bolt gun prices have reversed and The budget AR and SKS prices are almost even.
@@henryturnerjr3857What SKS's have you been looking at? The ones I see are about mid-tier AR range.
@@georgewhitworth9742 I've seen some in pretty rough shape that they were asking $700 for!
I drive a sheedi 1998 5 speed manual Nissan Sentra so I can spend more on old guns...i am in my 20s
I'm going to concentrate on buying ammo for my milsurps this year.
Reloading for MilSurp is Best
My milsurp rifles are hand load only. I have even formed 8X57 cases from 30 06 brass.
I sold my collection when 8mm Romanian and Spam cans went over $70.00 per can.
The shift to select-fire rifles marked a big turn in the milsurp supply.
That and the bush era ban on importation of semi auto mil surps.
Im just glad as a 24 year old ive managed to get almost every surplus gun i want. The only ones im missing are either way too expensive for what they are or too expensive to shoot/ too similar to something i have. Ive been getting into big bore now.
You have some valuable insights. Sadly, the only game in town now (practically) is Royal Tiger Imports. The rest are hit-and-miss at best. Gun shows have become price-gouging centers and opportunities for people to hock taffy, jerky, and roasted nuts. Plus, simple supply and demand impacted prices as well.
I fear the golden age of the gun show has come and gone. I wish it was not the case.
I still find good deals, especially at the smaller gun shows. Usually, I get the best deals from old guys who want to get rid of something.
@@TreeWizard648 I hear you. I concede your point. I believe that does happen..but not nearly as much as it used to.
The value of a gun show is what walks in the door. If you're a regular joe without a table you already missed the swapping going on during the Friday setup. The dealers will have little if anything fairly priced, they're there to trade with their buddies, watch what comes down the aisle, and most importantly get away from their wives for the weekend.
Depends if what you’re looking for is ONLY at Gun shows, then the question is how bad do you want it.
@@ronin6737 There is nothing I want so bad that I would buy it at a gun show at gun show prices.
The Glory Days of Milsurp collecting are over. In the 1980s, you could buy a virtually brand new Swedish Mauser for $100. A new Russian made SKS was $125. There were all kinds of good stuff around and it was all cheap. Even in the early 2000s, I got an unfired Mosin Nagant for $79.95 plus tax.
Luckily I picked up the mil-surps I wanted back in the 80's & 90's.... now it's just trying to stay stacked up on ammo for them, and that's bad enough.
i was born in the mid 90s...no such luck for me
@fortheloveofnoise same. Born too late to collect
A lot of guns have gone up...Marlins I bought just 10 years ago are going for more than double what I paid, so now I can't justify buying more of them. I decided not to get into milsurp because of prices at this point and have gone with buying replicas of Old West firearms, which are primarily foreign made.
Nah, hardly dead. Vendors are just trying to over charge.
Done? No. It's a collectors market now clearly though, rich mans game if you will. However you either need substantial disposable income or need to be dead set focused on a particular milsurp you want. I'd imagine you won't go in somewhere and just casually pick one up or not.
Very much a collectors niche right now, not many people really buying them specifically for a cheap deer rifle
I blame greed.
Its called Capitalism, no ones being forced to purchased these milsurp's. We aren’t talking about gasoline prices after a hurricane. Or the price of toilet paper in 2020 during COVID. You need to sit wait and watch for the right seller.
@@inspectorkemp7439Not its not. There are the same amount of milsurps back then as there are now. Old bommer fudds just want money and price gouge mil-surps to death.
"I remember when you could get ten of these for a nickle! Ha! Anyway son, that there M1 will be two grand."
Then bommers wonder why young people don't get into the hobby. They HATE losing investments on ANYthing, even something as asinine as mil surps.
I'm a staunch pro-capitalist, anti-commie who hates what the boomers did to the milsurp hobby by turning it into an investment oppertunity.
Part of it is definitely greed.
But I do think milsurps are viewed differently than they used to be. Some people definitely saw historic value in them back when they were cheap, but I would say a lot less buyers cared about the history or the designs and just wanted an affordable, reliable gun. Nowadays, the current production budget guns have gotten pretty good. A PSA AR can be had for under $350 many bolt actions in that price range too. It would be hard to recommend someone get an SKS or Mosin over those at any price point, if they just want something shoot groundhogs, take to the range twice a year, keep on hand “just in case” etc.
Is that his first or last name?
🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Demand vs Supply
I got over it and sold my entire collection of Enfields and other milsurps. The main reason was they sat in a safe 90% of the time and I can't shoot them cause the ammo is not available or too expensive. Got a really good payout and put the money into my buying a house fund.
That’s a smart thing to do.
I'm still buying, but very selective anymore, mainly parts grade stuff really. Only good stuff I buy, is when I come across things I didn't have, or holes in the collection. The Ethiopian stuff, has actually been the models I wanted, but never see, like Vetterlis, Mannlichers, etc.
Yea I’m thinking about a Gras from them
The budget AR has pretty much replaced the milsurp as far as inexpensive range toys go.
Yes I’d definitely say so.
I think a strong depressant on the market is the expense for ammo for a lot of these nonstandard calibers. Prices just aren't what they once were and new manufactured stuff costs as much or more than sporting calibers, if it's available at all. Another problem associated with rising costs is lack of range spaces for rifles. I didn't mind having a safe queen when it only cost me a C note, but if it's gonna run me five bills or more I better have the drive to shoot it somewhat often and not have that wreck my pocketbook in the process.
Genuinely, though, I'm curious if what we grew up seeing as the norm was actually the anomaly and the current status quo is back to being more normal. The era of the end of the Cold War is a market force we won't ever see again, I'd reckon.
I've definitely had to pare down; I used to have a goal to have one of each manufacturer of 1917 and P14, almost did too, just an elusive Remington P14 never made it to me (and I ended up with a duplicate Eddystone thanks to RIA mislabeling a lot and me not being careful of their photos). Now I'm down to a good museum grade example and a shooter of each, and I don't plan to change that. I think I'm done chasing surplus for a while, I'm tired of surprises in stuff online through either ignorance or deceit, and I never catch stuff at shops locally. My new interest is cheap old revolvers and old .22s--the parts are still out there, they're really easy to fix, and .22 will be around forever, plus I can actually shoot them at my local range. Basically all I shoot anymore are .22s because centerfire hurt the wallet so much for the last few years. I can definitely see new collectors making small collections to care about rather than going more general, it's the only way to keep things economical
Interesting information and strategy. I do know of people seeking older 22 rifles, pistols and revolvers. I know of a few Remington Nylon collectors.
I do buy online every so often… and yea, deceit and/or misinformation can be upsetting but there’s always a chance that a misinformed seller can present a good deal. I tend to look for stuff locally or while out of town. Never know what you might find. Estate sales and private sellers also present good deals.
trick isn't going to gun shows, those guys are fishing for the sucker. antique swap meets and yard sales is were to find deals.
I feel like the market in general has stabilized but gun shows largely have not. Still way too many boomers who "know what they got" and are charging $800 for Yugo M48s in mediocre condition.
Some milsurps probably won't recover from the 2016-2022 price boom. The perfect storm of high-profile video games like Battlefield 1 and V, PUBG, etc might have permanently borked German Mauser and even Mosin prices and then COVID activated everyone's reptile brain for panic buying and people started rushing to buy milsurps for fear they wouldn't be able to for a while.
UA-cam content creators also didn't help. Forgotten Weapons is probably single-handedly responsible for the insane spike in the cost of French guns and the thousands upon thousands of UA-cam videos and now Shorts of internet randos shooting off old guns have kept interest in milsurps permanently ignited. I'm not one to talk, I've raked in a few million views from this stuff too over the past couple of years.
But overall, prices have definitely stabilized for most milsurps and have gone down for many as well. Lee-Enfields have barely moved up in price and most Mauser variants can be found at similar prices to what was seen in 2019.
The best milsurp market right now is for pistols, and honestly unlike bolt guns left over from WWII this flow isn't going to slow down anytime soon. And we'll still likely see sporadic caches of old rifles from neutral countries being imported for the next decade, you just have to pay attention.
One market that is forever doomed is the surplus market for anything German. Another perfect storm of arrogant gun show boomers, serial fraudsters creating fake N*zi markings, and clueless gamer wehraboos paying top dollar for beater Luger and P38s mean this crap will never be affordable again. You'll see some postwar P38s and P1s show up and maybe if we get lucky more drops like those Portuguese Kar98ks but overall the market for affordable German milsurps is dead.
Great write up and I do say that the majority of shows I’ve been to this year were not worth going to. Over the years, I was actually surprised to see overall auction prices and blue book values rise. The sentiment for these old rifles just grew so much but on a sophisticated collector level it seems, like fine art.
Tbf German and American surplus has always been more expensive.
Just start hitting up every garage sale or estate sale you can get to. The reasonably priced milsurps are there.
Yep, I’ve been to a few and seen some good ones.
Yeah it’s done, if you didn’t start buying stuff in the late 90’s or early 2000’s you are too late, once saving private Ryan came out that ruined it for 95% of people
Shoulda seen what was around pre-'68. And I'm talking at Gibson's and K-Mart.
Of course wages were way lower then, but the variety of available guns was amazing. I remember seeing racks of South American Mausers for sale at K-Mart for under $30. Still, all wells run dry eventually.
During the 90s I was too busy not existing yet, my fault.
@@MagicalTroutI was too busy being in kindergarten 😂
Damn, should’ve been buying surplus guns instead of not existing.
@@MagicalTrout Still forever regretting not buying a house when I was in 6th grade 😔
Biggest advice for a new collectors, unless you hand load or want closet queens. If you plan to shoot your piece research ammo costs before you buy the milsurp. Carcano carbine at $225 are great but, ammo is $1.30 a round how much shooting time will you get in? 7.5 swiss = $1.75 per round 30-06 = $1.20, MAS 7.5 = $1.40. Lately been shooting more 8mm mauser, 54r and 7.62x 39. this surplus is still around with an all in cost (taxes and shipping) of around 50-60 cents a round
30-06 can be bought for around 60 to 70cpr if you stay below 180 so it's garand safe and easier for the bolts. I plan on getting a 1903 at some point with a budget of 700 or less and gun shows are a little easier on ammo, people sell ammo more than the guns themselves so the price is usually negotiable especially if they have a mismatch of stuff on the table they are usually trying to just get rid of it not make a profit.
I wanna open a factory making Carcano ammo 😂
A gun show with 2,000 people attending is a joke. Gun shows are as dead as Blockbuster Video. The surplus/C&R market used to be interesting because the stuff was really cheap and the ammo was cheap. I'm not a historian opening my own museum. I had a C&R license and never found anything worth buying. It's all been picked over.
No one ever mentions the time sink required to MAINTAIN the things. Once I realized I was tired of attempting to keep old rifles that I rarely shot in museum-quality states I took stock of what I had, decided which shooters were both fun and had a reasonably available ammo supply, and dumped the rest.
Some collect to collect, I collect to shoot. But that's just me. And yeah sadly many of the cartridges are just not as available as they once were. But I wouldn't be surprised if enthusiasm comes around again as newer generations enter the fun market.
Just remember that time sink. If you actually take care of your guns, it adds up quickly.
One thing many people don't seem to take into consideration is that genuine military surplus is a finite resource that will eventually be completely depleted. When Swiss Alpenflage first came on the market, it was so abundant that people could buy 3 field shirts and a parka for $10, maybe even less. Even UCP surplus, while still dirt cheap, will raise in price as more of it is bought up, increasing the demand.
A few years ago I made a purchase of four rifles for $500. Savage lend lease Enfield , 1937 K98k with the particular eagle holding a certain symbol in its claws all over it, a Chilean Mauser in 308 and a Spanish Mauser in 7mm. $125 each. I do believe those days are gone. But what a score!
Nice!
It is at gun shows but you can still find reasonable surplus a local gun shops on rare occasions and online. Online is the new gun show. Most thier are barely any gun sales a gun shows it mostly vender selling nick nacks and beef jurkey. Then thier basically peoples private collections that they are selling and know what they have and think it all gold. They days of 79$ rifles in barrels is over. Yhe good new is that you can still get deals online from rti classic and retailers liķe that. And the thier is gunbroker to.
Im not big into military surpluse but i do collect remington marlin and some brownings and im thankful for what i have i cant justify paying these prices for example standard 870 wingmaster beat too death selling for 6 plus just dont get it but thats the way it is and why i dont even mess with looking for stuff anymore
Wow! I had a chance to get a nice wingmaster this year but someone else got it when I went back to get it
I know what you mean. I’ve been trying to find a Marlin 336 for my dad and even the absolutely best to crap to the point they’ll need replacement parts examples I could find are still asking for $600. It’s infuriating.
They’re definitely getting harder to find and the prices are not what they used to be. But there’s still very much a demand for them. Gun shops near me can’t keep them in stock. You buy them when you see them or miss out quick.
Since turning 70, I have been selling my milsurp stuff off. Most of it going for many, many times what I paid for it. Just saving a couple for my son.
I am 29, my grandfather is older than you and scared of guns, I have been helping him get over that and to go to the range.
God damn you battlefield 1!!!
Lol
In my view, as a Millennial in their mid 30s, I missed the early window for getting into Milsurp, but this year I set a goal and I set money aside and purchased my first two Milsurp weapons. Regarding housing, I missed the window on that well, so by the time I did get my finances in order, they were out of my price range. I have a couple of gun shops that I do like to go to for Milsurp, but one store has "the good" stuff, while the other one has better deals typically. I don't see any real changes occurring for Milsurp collecting in the near future, so I'm pacing myself and looking to pickup at least a couple of Milsurps per year until I have my collection where I want it.
Thanks for sharing, it’s a pretty good strategy. I think that collectors a a lot more cautious these days
move out of the u.s., or move to a rural area and build your own home...those are your two options now sadly
@@fortheloveofnoise my plan is to either buy out my parents house or buy some land and build my own home in a more rural area.
@@fortheloveofnoiseyah that’s only a good idea if you have a well enough paying job lined up.
About 20 years ago, I picked up a Moson Nagant M91/30 for like 99 bux (refurbished at the Izhevsk Aresnal in 1941 & still packed in Cosmoline when I bought it), and bought some commercially available ammo here & there. A year or so later, I found a couple guys that had ammo for it locally (priced cheap), and now have over 3K rounds of Mil-Surp ammo on hand, for less than 800 bux total for the rifle & ammo.......
I drove 2 hours to go to a gun show last weekend. 50% was the same dealers I see everywhere else selling full msrp, and 50% random unrelated things. Not a single private seller in the whole damn place. It's not even a gun show at that point, what a joke and a scam! I hate being born in the 2000s.
Thanks for sharing your experience. The gunshow I went to a few weeks before the Greenville show was a wash as well as the one I went to this past weekend. It definitely appears that not all gunshows are the same.
It's the same here in the UK prices are crazy but if you want one then you have to pay the price. A couple of dealers have cornered the market. Thirty years ago, a long time I know but you could buy a number4 Lee Enfield still in it's mummy wrap for a hundred pounds. Now that same rifle would be close to two thousand pounds.
Two thousand? Here in America Enfields are still well below a grand and we didn’t even use them.
@@baneofbanes A nice Lee Enfield with a minty bore is about the same money over here, but an unused rifle is ridiculously overpriced.
The surplus rifles are still in circulation, they are just now in the hands of individuals not being sold in large caches by importers. People have just become so focused buying on gunbroker or websites at the push of a button. That convenience and nationwide exposure is driving up prices. I am still finding much lower prices for in-person sales.
8:04 for me personally that's a good thing as a collector. While it makes my collections value go down some there's still lots id like to get that I still don't have. I welcome some mil-surp prices tanking a bit 😁
Yep 😁
There will always be caches amd collections sold off. Gunbroker continually has good stuff, yet the prices are a lot higher but stuff is still out there.
Looking forward to seeing what else is out there but won’t be too fond of the prices
I'm actually going to be dumping the bulk of my milsurps, later this year. Get your checkbooks out!
Lol
Just grabbed a good shaped Carcano at the Monroeville gun show for $110 😮, I know the guy and we’ve traded and bought and sold to each other for over a decade but I’m happy with the M91 WW1 long rifle. I’ve been picking up old WW1 to 1950’s rifles. 😅 I remember getting my 91/30 matching number Mosin for $100 back in 2010. Also got a few M24/46 and M24/47’s for $250 back in 2014 😅 if it has been turned into a hunting rifle I will gladly buy it from you. 😮 I live my KAR98 1938 with a 7.62 NATO/308 Israeli barrel. I found in my cousin’s basement his grandfather’s M95 Steyr Karbine 1899 W-n 99 stamped still in 8x50r unchanged since his grandfather brought it back from the Austro Hungarian army. His and my relatives fought in WW1 for Austro Hungary 🇭🇺. I asked my grandma which division was her father in and which front did he fight against and it looks like my relatives were on the southern front against Serbia and or Italy but I can’t find any info 😮
What a great amount of history you’ve got there! Glad you can share it with us and great deal on the M91 🔥
I decided to get out of milsurp collecting officially this year. I still collect vintage firearms, but anything with a military lineage I stay away from unless it's a killer deal. Pulled off an absolute hat-trick recently on an unshaven, non import-marked 1917 Webley Mark VI with 550 rounds of .455 ammunition for under a grand. I'll probably never get that lucky again.
Very nice!
It's not the same and honestly. I am having more fun getting stuff from the 50s-70s with my C&R lots of police trade ins. Police trade ins isn't the same, but it fills the void
Yea I can see that… I got a police trade in Gen2 G17 earlier this year, pretty cool
Some of the GB listings I've been seeing lately on milsurps must've been the "gold-plated runs!" 😂
I tell allot of younger guys to start collecting police guns from the 70's-90's. You can get allot of that stuff dirt cheap right now because allot of forces are getting rid of old inventories and militaries typically don't want them. Most of the time they're in much better condition than any of the military stuff, a little holster wear and that's about it. People already get big eyes when I tell them I have a slamfire Ithaca 37 or a gen 1 Glock with the recalled case. While police guns aren't exactly military surplus, it's an adjacent hobby and allot of them have crossover with military history. BTW, Great seeing you at the Greenville gun show. Haven't been able to do a deep dive on that Last Ditch I bought.
I got a Gen 2 Police trade in Glock recently, it’s pretty awesome, I did a full video on it. Great seeing you there as well!
i dont see them that much cheaper
I bought a nice Krag 1898 this year for a really good price. The good deals are still pout there, just harder to find.
Yes, good deals but just harder to find
I have not been to a gun show in years, the prices were just sky high, 20% of the tables weren’t even gun related.😢
I am 61 and started collecting when I was 10. The other thing to look for is quality rather than quantity. Books, research, save for nice stuff. To each their own, but my first was a K98 all matching for $150. No, I don't buy 20K Lugers, but really nice collectable stuff under $2500. But I buy less now and don't sell much, and yes some deals.
In todays money factoring inflation $150 in 1973 (51 years ago) is worth $1,060 today. How much are K98 going for today. 1,000 - 1,500? So they have increased arguably 0%-45% over the past half century. I’m sure there are exotic K98 for more $2,500
This is true-get the research down so people aren’t doing stupid stuff like paying out the nose for common or humped rifles.
Prices are bullshit. The dealers are idiots and will be sitting on scrap rifles
Every 20years or so a new batch of firearms will show up and it starts all over again.
lol I was just thinking that with all the NATO aligned countries in Europe currently.
Add into that mix that milsurp collecting is also becoming very popular in Europe also and the prices here have remained mostly unchanged but I can't see that staying the case as the demand increases and there is a finite amount of these things.
A lot of them are deactivated too right? Well I would guess depends on the country
@BattlefieldCurator not anymore. The EU changed it's deactivation requirements back around 2012 so now collectors like me are collecting live firearms. I'll attach my video on the matter.
ua-cam.com/video/kszspan3J7A/v-deo.htmlsi=Z6W0j-0dhziRr0HX
@@BattlefieldCuratorI’m sure a lot are, I know a significant portion of those Thompsons found in the ocean are earmarked for being made into dewats, but manual actions arms also tend to be less regulated in Europe.
There is milsurp out there but we can’t get it because it’s in countries we cannot import from
Yep that is also true. I think there is a rule that the country has to remain neutral for 20 years before they can sell weapons to US Importers.
@BattlefieldCurator any country close to that 20 year mark yet?
@@fortheloveofnoisenone that have large stocks of surplus to sell or that are on good terms with the US.
On the one hand I wish we could import from China and Russia but on the other I’m not to fond of their governments and understand the embargoes.
Countries that have tons but are on our countries crap list would be: Vietnam, Cuba, Iran, Venezuela
And North Korea
ive dropped from 6-7 rifles a year to 1-2. no more impulse buying for the most part, just targeted acquisitions which i end up enjoying more and stay in my collection longer.
I was out 10 years ago, sold the lot when 8mm Romanian and Mosin Spam cans went over $70.00 a pop.
I have zero locker queens, everything I own will be fired when I want to. So ammo has to be affordable and plentiful.
I've been trading for my milsurp no cash kind of trade. Albeit my last one was a sporterized M-1917 Eddy Stone Edition so not as valuable but I don't trade for value.
Well said! been to the Greenville show a handful of times. Maybe I'll catch you at the next one?
Yep, it’s in October so most likely so
They have a Venezuelan FN-49 “Sniper” for 2000 dollars. I’m gonna pass because I see no research on a sniper variant in that contract.
But I want it! But that’s a lot of money for a FN from venezuala. So my emotions are involved. Haha
This rifle was bought in 60s by an old man today, he is in his 90s and still collecting surplus. He never fired it, and it shows.
It has a scope mount, and a wooden cheek rest. But what if Venezuela had 20 sniper variants made? The old saying can help you make a decision.
If it’s too good to be true, it probably is!
Bruh I knew I should have gone to that show 😭
Ahh man… there is one in October
As far as ammo, think of purchasing ammo like purchasing toilet paper. You need to purchase it in large quantities to obtain a decent price. Do not buy a box or two at a time unless you want to pay unreasonable prices; especially for rifle ammo.
If anyone was to look at ads in pre-1968 GCA magazines like the American Rifleman or Guns and Ammo, they would be sick to see what they missed out on if they were too young to buy or not yet born. A 1903 Springfield would typically sell for $40 and 1917 Enfield for $5 less. The late 80s and 90s were the second " golden age" of surplus weapons.
Bought my Lee Enfield no.1 mkiii*in the 90s for $99, still wrapped in wax paper. Those WERE the days.
I bought an m1917 enfield that was sporterized for 600, and it's one of my favorite deer rifles alongside my father's, with the bonus that that is one of the cheapest rifles in my area
I am still 29 and that is basically the last age for Millennials to be. After that is zoomers. Regarding to houses, I doubt a bunch of us were able to afford a home because how things went the previous years and still living with our parents or have to work 2x jobs. But yeah, I do collect military surplus firearms when given the right price or free money to throw around.
Yep interesting to note.
29 year old millenial here as well...the class 1 year younger than use were veru different than us in school
@BattlefieldCurator I collect guns instead of buy new cars and stiff like that. I daily a 98 5 speed manual Sentra that I painted myself with tractor paint
I still collect, but I have specific interests. Ex: Finnish Nagants, and military rifles/pistols from the 1870-1940 era. If you're picky the price doesn't seem that out of whack.
Do you want to know why it is dead? Because the old 50s and older rifles are made better than the brand new ones!
The prices will come down once the zarr freezes prices and we will just love the economy.....sorry...i just couldn't resist it
Why spend 1k on a milsurp when I can spend it on an fn 15 or wasr 10. I understand the wasr 10 is probably considered "milsurp" but milsurp is dead because of the greedy prices. If you fools would chill out and stop buying for 1 measly year we could drive the prices back down.
Dont shop gunshows.Look at local mom and pop stores to get nice ones and better prices.Just got a mint 91 30 from my small town shop.Sweetest 1943 rifle Ive ever seen.Glad to give my money to my neighbors.
Yes, so many other places to go shop other than gunshows.
There aren’t any deals at gun shows anymore. Used gun cost as much as new ones. Military surplus is way overpriced most of the time. The supply has pretty much dried up.
Whoever is still in the Milsurplus collecting hobby, has to have deep pockets, that I don't have or settle four crap condition stuff that seems to be out there now. 😮
Back in 1992 I bought a Swedish Mauser 1896 for $79.00. I recently saw two at a gun show. One for $850.00 and one for $1,899.00.
Wow
Got most of my collection on GB, after hours and hours of careful searching. Weekday ending auctions, sellers who only take money orders, sellers who don’t sell to blue states, low feedback sellers, etc. Deals are out there but it takes lots and lots of time to spot the market inefficiencies and have the money to act quick
Wow… yea I tend to stay away from GB but I do know people that take the time to find deals on there
Almost like we should start reproducing these firearms for the market if these types of guns are disappearing
Prices are down for the majority of milsurps. As are the prices for most collectible. Currently a correction is taking place.
I’d agree
Don’t forget about the sporterized guns, sometimes you can get them cheaper.
IF you want to put the time and money into and turn them back to milsurp spec or leave as is and enjoy it.
Yes, but I’ve seen people ask ridiculous prices for those too.
It’s over for normal people…everything else costs too much to be able to save up for decent milsurps.
Personal question, are you standing on the shore of Hartwell? Area looks familiar. Steve C.
I think I was in Modoc, SC. I have been to Hartwell before though, a good friend’s father lives there
Right now, I'm focused on increasing my stocks of magazines and some guns that may be soon at risk. With regard to milsurp collecting, I keep my eyes open and my wallet securely held. If I see something that strikes my fancy, I'll go for it, but I try never to be in a rush with that part of my armory. Milsurp collecting is an interest, not a need--need in the sense of something for which I have a practical use--and I can wait. There will be another wave of interesting surplus soon.
Well said and good strategy. Patience is a virtue
I honestly think if there were an economic downturn or recession I think prices would be required to come back down to earth.
Indeed
Good seeing you in Aiken this weekend. Thank you for sharing your expertise. Camera man didn’t get my good side in this video.
lol good seeing you too
Thanks for the info, let us know how Your shopping went. And I know exactly where You were filming this video. Keep up the good work.
Thanks!
They can keep them at those prices...
I’ve just become more patient. I frequent the local shops in my area and once in awhile I’ll find a steal on consignment. It is definitely harder to justify the hobby when I could spend my disposable income on better gear, optics, or modern firearms. With the younger generation I think they are enthusiastic with milsurps but will prioritize modern firearms especially with the uncertain political climate. As always thank you for the video and keep the content coming!
Thanks for the support!
Yeah, when you've only just hit legal adulthood and you're trying to look for something that costs less than $500 because you don't have a job and nobody is hiring, you're not going to spend it all on Elmer Fudd's beat-to-shit Mosin with rifling so worn out you'd swear it was a smooth bore.
99% of the new Gen Z firearms enthusiasts will absolutely foam at the mouth over historical firearms, but will likely never actually own them, instead using a Palmetto AR-15 and a simple no-frills Glock for all their shooting needs since the older stuff just isn't very affordable considering how little you get out of it compared to modern weapons.
That, and people like me living in places like New Mexico who've recently turned 18 having to now wait until 21 to own firearms will probably kill off any interest in the hobby.
The show in Greenville, SC is put on by the SC arms collectors association and prices have always been high there. I saw a few people buying firearms but attendance, too me, seemed a little down compared to past shows over the years. By the way, it was great meeting you there and thanks for the M1 carbine mag.
Great meeting you there as well!
You are 100% in tune with the market.
HDR video sucks for iPhone users just so you know
Well i just recently found a Remington built Mosin 91/30 and it was only 500.00 bucks. I know they use to be a bit cheaper but these days 500bucks aint much! lol same with a 1943 built Enfield i bought for 500bucks as well. The Czech VZ24 i have my grandfather took off a German Conscript during the war and i purchased an Italian stored Carcano. Not the one with the huge bayonet on it! A TS! LOL that i got for 350 and all are in great shape! The other two mil-surps i want are an M1Garand and a Japanese Arisaka. Then for now my WWII collection will be done. Although i did spend 1800 bucks on two SKS's lol one a Chinese Corinco
Wow… also, if you want to save a little on a Garand purchase, check out the Civilian Marksmanship Program
You fools always blame the seller. It is the buyer who is at fault for high prices. If people stop paying ridiculous prices for these guns, the prices will go down. The problem is the younger generation puts everything on a credit card so they will spend the extra money because they can instantly buy it. But if any of you think these rifles will go down in price, you are crazy. There is only so many military surplus rifles out there.
I’ve referenced this in depth analysis in another video. I mentioned that I saw $1k Mosin m91/30 sell from some of the local shops, so buyer didn’t do the research! But that was mainly during the pandemic
Those guns are too high right now.
No, just have to know where to look.
Yes!😁🍻
it's not over yet, but a scary concept i've been thinking about lately is that the entire idea of buying military surplus rifles will eventually just be over completely unless the laws change in the future. it's a long ways off, but one day the only rifles in actual surplus will be fully automatic, and future generations of gun collectors won't get to experience this type of collecting unless the FOPA is overturned.
Remember when the obama state department blocked the import of 87,310 M1 Garands and 770,160 M1 Carbines from Korea. Pepperridge Farms remembers.
I mean why spend 5-600 on a 100 year old possibly shot out Mosin, when you can get a sub moa guaranteed rifle new out of the box for 550-800
That’s not the point of collecting.
Even a minty Finn Mosin isn’t going to be that accurate anyway. If you are looking for top notch accuracy, milsurp is not, nor was it ever, where that’s at.
Shot out military surplus, I usually pass. They don’t make these rifles like this and the few that they do cost a lot to produce. Also, people collect them for the history, the range experience, the aesthetics and many more reasons.
Everything going up but my paycheck 😢
Ikr!
@@BattlefieldCuratorI get paidnless now than i did 10nyears ago
The first mistake is buying at a gun show.
Brick and mortar stores aren’t any better, at least where I live.
I went to a gunshow a few weeks ago. Dealer wanted 950 for a yugo sks. 700 for chinese type 53, and over 1000 for an Enfield mk3 clearly from the Ethiopian lot. He also complained that he wasnt selling anything.
lol 😂 wow yea I wonder why he not selling anything. I also had to say that I did see some ok deals at this gunshow and I’m sure some savvy folks snagged some good priced milsurps
Quite a few contradictory statements.
First!
Keyboard Quickdraw champion 😁🍻
the Carcanos and the M95s have become the new Mosins price wise, I got quite a few now cause of the reliability and how cheap they are now at least from RTI I remember when they first started importing them in 2020 the M95 long was 399 now as low as 150
One thing I really like about RTI is that guns that were almost impossible to find previously can now be had at reasonable prices. Some good examples are the Mannlicher 1888/90, Vetterli M1870/87, and the Berdan rifles. I should also mention that a Steyr M95 in 8x50R was as rare as hen's teeth before RTI started importing them.
@@TreeWizard648 oh yeah especially all the different variants like the Vetterli TS, M1888/95, the Gras rifles ect. And though some people may complain RTI rifles are junk I still find it great we are getting something brought in that isn’t $500 plus like Chinese SKS or Mosin
@@TreeWizard648 I have bought Mannlicher 1888/90s, 1890 carbine, Gras rifles, Berdan II, and Vetterlis from RTI. You can't really expect to see these things pop up at a gun store or a show unless it comes from the same source. And there been some good deals from RTI like their warehouse clearance sales for their Enfield rifles (both no1 and no4) for $150. The prices for the Mannlicher are bad for the clearance price. If they put it out as 100$, then people will be clearing them out obviously.
@@tomc6255 I have saw many of these RTI guns show up at gun shows, especially the Steyr M95s. Back in the day, an M95 you see at a gun show would be almost certainly an 8x56R gun. Nowadays, you have to look for the presence of an S to determine the caliber. Usually they are going to try to sell those guns for a way higher price than RTI, especially if it was a nice one.
@@tomc6255 I bought a B-Grade Mannlicher 1888/90 from RTI for 200 bucks, and I received a really nice and accurate rifle. I guess I got lucky with that one.
i did not even bother to go....nothing to buy at reasonable prices
I saw some ok deals but really enjoy talking with folks, learning history, and making new friends