Credit Card Scam:How American Airlines & Citi Trick You into LOSING, Not Saving!
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- Опубліковано 7 тра 2024
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Timestamps:
00:00 - Intro
00:36 - Credit card signup for discount
01:29 - American Airlines flight order page
01:55 - American Airlines/citi promotion - $200 STATEMENT credit!
02:03 - Macy's, amazon, many other vendors honor their advertising on credit card signups
02:23 - My citi application is declined
02:50 - Citi signed me up anyway ????
03:23 - Citi sent me a physical card
03:33 - Citi signs me up for a $99/year annual fee!
04:32 - I didn't get credit - I got 3565 miles
05:29 - What are miles worth?
06:05 - I got $34 for a $99/yr fee.
06:43 - Airline miles are NOT credit card statement credit!
07:22 - Confirming I didn't get $200 off my flight from my American Airlines receipt
07:52 - Why credit card companies & banks do this
08:40 - Why I don't touch debt
09:05 - Being controlled by a credit score is no way to live
09:40 - The sacrifice to not take on debt - STILL WORTH IT!
10:45 - random rambling
12:02 - Conclusion + more rambling
12:40 - This is something every company will eventually do - why voting with your wallet is not the only solution
Oh man. I didn't realize this guy was another Dave Ramsey-ite...
1) I do not invest in mutual funds that have 5% front load fees.
2) I do not suggest that my subscribers invest in mutual funds with 5% front load fees.
3) If I ever did suggest you invest in a mutual fund with a 5% fee, it would be because I have become brain dead, not because I am getting commissions as a result of you paying higher fees on your investments.
4) I do not charge people money to be listed on my website as a credible advisor. If I tell you that somebody provides good advice on board repair, it is because I know them to be a good technician and an honorable person; not because they have paid me money to be on a list.
5) The people that I suggest you go to for advice are not giving you biased advice based on any potential affiliate fees or kickbacks they get as a result of recommending that you invest in mutual funds with a 5% front load fee that barely, if ever, beat the S&P 500.
6) I do not sell my reputation in exchange for the ability to seem credible while giving people financial advice that leads them to paying 5% front load fees that they would not otherwise pay with other funds, suggested by other financial advisors.
I believe in avoiding debt, I believe in the lower anxiety lifestyle that I lead as a result of it, and I believe in the discipline that I am able to exercise as a result of doing things the way I do it, and how my behavior in the long term is more important than simple numbers on paper.
That being said, there are many differences between myself and Dave Ramsey. It's very important when looking on UA-cam for videos on either philosophical topics, dating topics, debt, and how to manage your money, or even this industry to separate entertainment from consulting. Someone can provide exceptional free advice and sometimes damn good entertainment, but that does not mean that they are going to provide you with a great value when it comes to consulting. They are providing the entertainment or the advice for free and they're going to make that back by Providing you with goods and services that may not be in your best interest while claiming they are in your best interest because it earns them a commission. Another example, Peter Schiff. He explains things really well. It can be a great form of entertainment. Then you look at his funds with high fees and how every single one of them has been completely and utterly destroyed by the S&P 500 over a damn near 20-year time period. You can enjoy the entertainment.
I have no problem with you enjoying the entertainment, nodding your head at hearing people talk about different topics from different viewpoints. I don't want to shame anybody for this. I just want to point out that people who provide this level of entertainment are going to make their money back in some other way. And that what I'm doing here is very, very different than what Dave Ramsey is doing.
Always be wary of this, and most importantly, realize that I don't take part in these practices. If I do start taking part in these practices, unsubscribe from my channel.
Lol nice reply
@@rossmanngroup I WAS in the Ramsey CULT for a while. It is actually 5.95% front load, so effectively, 6%!
i mean credit is pretty stupid. i would love for the entire credit system to just go away and for rich people to pay their fair share in taxes but hey tis life :/
@@rossmanngroup you need to man up and take the sam hyde pill, anything other than debt-maxxing is foolhardy
If you cannot pay off a credit card balance in full, EVERY month. then do NOT have a credit card. It is a fast route into crippling debt. I know. Been there.
Yep, and annual fees are just the rape cherry on top.
This is absolutely correct. Unless it’s an emergency, don’t be getting loans in general (with exceptions for housing and possibly cars of course)
I'm 20 and I don't have a credit card. I don't plan on getting one because I'm not confident in my ability to pay the balance in time. Besides, I don't like IOU machines that charge me a fee every year to use them.
@@samtinkle9076im 20 and was forced to get one. It’s miserable 😎😎😎
I'm in debt thanks to my ability to pay only the minimum each month.
the law should be simple: If you have a one-step "accept" or "subscribe" button, you need a one-step "decline" or "unsubscribe". period. reciprocity or whatever lawyers call it.
EU law demands this. But I understand not everyone likes to live east of the big pond.
Yes! I look for that, too. If companies don't do that, I don't buy from them.
@@hb-man EU does? I didn't know. I know there are a lot of laws in favor of the customers and it it a lot better here, than in the US, but I know at least a few companies that are defensively make it harder to unsubscribe from stuff, that accepting it.
@@GalacticCommanderMarsxSport enters the chat. Cancel your credit card or you're shit out of luck with them
I would accept having some captcha on unsubscribe or clicking on "yes, I really want to cancel". But in general, yes. Unsubscribing must be as hard as subscribing.
"The more you spend, the more you save!"
that's always my favorite line.
And my favorite rebuttal to said line: "You save 100% if you don't buy it at all."
@@crisp_like_dylanI know but now we got the pot and the money😂
Once at my grocery store, I bought a single item of an item that had a 2 for less than "price of item × 2". (example: 1 box of cookie is 3$ but 2 for 5$) The cashier, when I was checking out, told me "you know you can save by buying multiple right?". Yes, I'm sure I only want to buy one. 3$ is still smaller than 5$ last time I checked. If I wanted two, I would've picked two of them. But I only want ONE of them and buying more will make me spend more, not less.
@@Lebon19 and if you have the free points card for that grocery, to get some of those deals, you can typically buy one item, and they'll charge you $2.50, so you get the discount anyways.
Can't afford not to
Every video of Louis starts with "hey, hope you're having a lovely day" and then tell how every mega corp is trying to scam you :-)
Yes. Thanks to what he does he imrpoves the lives of everyone. Thanks to him i have found ways to ne happier and live a better life.
Damned megacorps.
and at the end, "FSCK YOU X COMPANY, AND FSCK YOU Y COMPANY!" I love it!
I love the intro, you can tell how upset Louis is by how fast he gets through it.
"Hey, hope you're having a lovely day (because I'm about to ruin it)."
@@wesleyhoward5599 He doesn't ruin my day... I love hearing how my years of avoiding "cloud services" etc has paid off handsomely.
You managed 5 stars because you have integrity, which is a rare and precious thing in today's world.
I had this exact experience with Sears.. I decided to buy a new fridge, washer and drier for a new place. There was a good deal on their card, so I applied for the card and was declined. Well, I still needed the appliances so I bought them anyway. And a week later the card showed up in the mail. I ripped the poor support person a new one - but it was extremely shady to decline the card for the savings and then issue it anyway.
One phone call would get you the adjustment to undo the screwup... I swear, I have dealt with credit card issuers, and even the worst ones do not correct mistakes marketing creates.
I often wonder if this is just to get your data or sell it for some reason to make money.
@@MickeyMishrayes both, all our data is being collected, it’s in the small details when we don’t read the user agreement 😅
Please be kind to the CSRs. It's not their fault that their employer is a scumbag operation.
Statement Credit means that they give you $200 towards your CC Bill. Meaning, if you owe $500 on the CC, the $200 statement credit would make it so you only owe $300. The miles math, this is not relevant because you earned those 'points' with the purchase, they didn't give you those points. Also, notice that above your $200 statement credit in your screenshot, they were going to give you 40,000 point (additionally) with the $200 statement credit.
It is shady that the get you in, then decline you (so you get none of the promises) but then approve you after the fact. That part is super shady
The math he did is relevant inasmuch as it tells you how much your loyalty points are actually worth (very little). Unfortunately, the only way to find out how much (if at all) Citibank honored the statement-credit is to buy things on the card.
@@amicaaranearum yes, but it wasn't 'given' to him - it has nothing at all to do with the credit
This was about my view of it too.
He was unambiguously rejected for the card that gave $200 credit, but secretly approved for a card with no credit but otherwise presumably identical terms.
This should not have happened, and I wouldn't be surprised if it was illegal.
But the miles/points on the card are a completely separate issue, and the only scammy part there is how worthless the points are.
This really sounds like a form got double submitted and Louis has no idea how airline credit cards work. They are often worth the annual fee if you fly a lot, for example giving free checked bags and stuff. But if you fly 2 or 3 times per year (with a given airline) they are not worth it.
@@amicaaranearumthe miles can be worth quite a bit but it depends on what you book. He picked a random example where the miles happened to only be worth 1 cent per point. For 60,000 points that could get a person from Chicago to Tokyo in business class. That value is somewhere around 6+ cents per point
I gal I dated moved away and went to work for Citi.
A little over a month after she started with them she called me up and told me if I had a card with Citi I should cancel it and tell eveyone we know to do the same.
wife her right now !!!
The Citi Card I’ve had since 1978 has NEVER charged me ANY interest. NOR any FEEs.
Um why? Not that I used Citibank credit cards, but I heard they have some good cards like double cashback and their Costco cobrand card is pretty neat if you're a regular at Costco.
I've had a Mastercard Citicard for many years and never had a problem. Even when someone was charging multiple airline tickets for hundreds of dollars to my account. I think their Cashback card is the best. No fee and good cash back to reduce your bill.
@@salkryeful One of the things she mentioned that stuck with me was that they would collect mail from their PO drawer in the afternoon(this was turn of the century when payments were still mailed in).
The user agreement stated that payments had to get there before 11:00 AM on the due date. So any little hickup like a mail truck delayed, etc., you'd get a late fee.
If you need to bump your score:
If you can get a card with no fees, do that. If not, get the lowest fee you can.
Use it once in a while ONLY for things you can afford outright and pay it off fully on the due date, don’t let it accrue interest.
Then every year request a limit increase and hold that card forever.
If you close your oldest credit line, your score plummets unless you have a similarly old one still open. So don’t close it, just stop using it.
If it has a fee, get your score up fast and get a card without a fee and keep it instead.
Never pay for what you can’t afford
I have a credit card with a local credit union that has no fees and a minimal interest rate since credit unions are non-profits. Your credit score is less a measure of your ability to pay debt and more of a measure of your profitability to credit issuers, so if you want to build up a credit score sometimes it's actually worth it to just buy something relatively small, maybe a hundred or so bucks, and just let the card slowly tick down with the minimum payment each month. Paying a bit of interest can help sometimes help your score more than just paying everything off so long as you are making that minimum payment on time. Same reason paying the monthly payment on a load gives you better credit score than paying the entire loan off right away. Holding debt and paying interest regularly and never missing a bill is more reliably profitable for the bank than never holding any debt and paying everything off instantly, so that's the kind of person they want to loan more to, and thus that's the kind of behavior they give better credit scores to.
It's all a scam so scam the scammers.
nahhhh just be like louis, where a score doesn't control your life.
buy what you can afford, save up
cy@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@@
Be careful of keeping an unused account open. That can be a source of identity theft, especially if you forget about it.
@@nonamesleft136 Set up text or email alerts on all your cards so that even if $1 is spent, you're notified of it. That way you will immediately know of any fraudulent activity and can take action.
Pretty much what I did, except I got several cashback / rewards cards; It's nice to get at least a bit back into my pocket. It's a lie that you need to pay some interest to increase your credit score. I paid most things with my credit cards, never with money I didn't have, paid the cards off immediately. Now I'm 27 with an 800 credit score.
Wendover Productions has a video called “How Airlines Quietly Became Banks” that explains why airlines make more money from their loyalty programs and credit-card partnerships than they make from flying passengers. (Airlines sell loyalty points to credit card companies, which can offer them as rewards, and the airline gets a commission if you sign up for the card.)
The moment the biggest tech company (Apple) came up with a credit card instead of a new tech product, you know its over. Usury its the only thing left, theres no innovation, theres no improvement. Its OVAH!
...and I guess it goes without saying that banks are criminal organizations.
Thank you for pointing that out ! When I travel, I buy the ticket and that's it ! My friends make fun of me and tell me I'm missing on deals because I do not take any " offer" like miles, etc... What deals ? This is total BS in my opinion. Airline Cies are not here to be generous with you , to give you gifts ! Whatever you think you are getting from them, you are actually paying for it ! Just buy your flying ticket and move on !
Aren’t credit cards unsecured debt. So if you don’t pay it, there is nothing you’ve secured against the loan if you can’t pay it back. Credit score. So what?
The thing that scares me the most about all these sorts of deceptive business practices, is that since they are becoming so normalized, more and more of our economy is being essentially driven by scams and gambling mechanics like this. More and more companies show growth by getting better at cheating, not getting better at what they do. Even in the mind of the most cynical person out there benefiting from this stuff, how is this sustainable?
It's sustainable because these companies are making billions and number go up, which pleases the shareholders.
since when has anyone in wall street cared about sustainability?
Hey buddy, wake up, NONE OF IT is sustainable and we are under attack. There is literally an invasion happening right now. WAKE UP PLEASE
It doesn't, eventually this kind of shtick will crash the economy and cause a panic or depression.
its very normal in capitalist system
Credit scores are used for being good enough to get an apartment. I once had several thousand dollars in a bank and could prove it to an apartment management company. I had no credit. When it has been reported that 65% of Americans didn't have $400 in the bank for an emergency, I asked them; who would you rather have in your complex, somebody who has many thousands of dollars in the bank or a current tenant who misses a week of work and can't pay the rent? It didn't sway the hourly employee in charge of approving my application.
Employers and insurance companies often check your credit score as well.
I was in that position many years ago. I offered to pre-pay 12 months rent before moving in. They realized I was serious, let me sign the lease and didn’t even ask me to pre-pay.
@@amicaaranearum Becaause it is easy, not because it is a meaningful measure of your overall fiscal discipline.
@@MonkeyJedi99In part. Insurance companies do it because, statistically, people with bad credit are poor risks. I can see their point. Bad credit is often a sign of someone who is undisciplined, lacks self-control, and that's a trait that affects all areas of life. Someone with no credit is an unknown quantity. However, I still don't understand why a person's bank account isn't taken into account; looking at renting an apartment in other countries, they want to know what your income is and don't care about your bank account. What do rich people do who don't have a job? They have millions, but no job income. Maybe their investment income counts?
@@edennis8578 I can't agree 100% with the bad credit score argument. I had bad credit for a while, not because I'm not disciplined or lack self control. It's because I got royally screwed by "family court" and the child support system that took too much money ($3,500+) and refused to return it to me. I don't pay support any more; thank goodness. During that time, I took on extra work when I could without it affecting my support payments, I rented rooms, instead of an apartment to keep my housing costs stable. I've always driven used cars and I repair them myself (saving a boatload of money). I kept a fund specifically for parts which was never touched. I cooked my own food, because I can cook. I have a number of food allergies and can't eat most prepared foods.
My entertainment expenses were kept to the absolute minimum ($10 per year to buy games). I mostly played the few games I manage to get for $10 or I played free online games. Thank goodness for Kongegrate as terrible as it was. I kept the same computer for 12 years before finally building a new one. I had one credit card the entire time I paid child support. I locked my credit because I didn't trust my ex and my full SSN was in the court papers; which I never liked or understood why they did that. I declined limit increases (I never updated my income which was a criterion used to determine limit increases) because I didn't want to be in a bad position. While my income was stable, it was my ex who would ask for increases every 3 years. Family courts are very biased against men, ask me how I know. I live in an apartment now, my habits are the same with a good credit score.
To answer your question, yes investment income is counted because it's taxable. What's not counted is alimony and child support received.
"You need to have your own farm, mill, sewing machine, electronics lab...so you don't have to deal with this stuff..." Wait. You just described exactly my life goal.
Retirement goal same as a very, very poor person..... the shear LUXURY of no cell phone
Same, at least long-term. Somewhere in Appalachia, maybe Blue Ridge or Piedmont. Chickens, veggie garden, and at least a dozen apple trees on one side of the field, windmill, forge, and firepit on the other. Garage/shed combo for the cars and tractor. Clean room in the basement for the 3D printer and PCB work. Who knows how long it might take to get there? Probably the greatest obstacle is doing it alone. Godspeed.
My life was more fulfilling raising children. But you do you.
@@MickeyMishra Not suggesting you do anything about it, but if your life goal _was_ to raise children and you've already done it, what are you sticking around for?
My kid to graduate. After that? Thailand and the East along with Europe. I don't really have much time anyways. @@Narangarath
As an Asian guy, I can confirm Louis’ algebraic equation checks out 😂
Angry Asian dad here :"Why you no doctor yet"
It is super irritating that you can't rent a car anymore unless you have a CC. They will not accept cash. They will not accept debit. I understand there are "work arounds" and other rental companies *may* allow it, but lets just keep this to mainstream. Either way, it is entirely embarassing to not have a CC for years on end and then can't rent a car due to it. I had bad scores for a while due to student loan debt and I cut myself off from any CC due to temptation. Once I got my life together and paid everything off, I more or less had to wait the full 6-7 years before a lender would even consider giving me a CC or even a car loan, which was then difficult due to the amount of time I didn't have any credit. It sucks. The US system is a scam.
I am an olde farte. When I was 22, I took a friend to Disneylandworld ( the Florida one ). We had booked the Omni International in downtown Orlando, which was VERY VERY NEW and VERY VERY NICE.... On arrival at airport, we went to the ALAMO RAC van, and were driven with a shuttle full of people to a literal car rental island. Half a thousand of people , 50 or so lines.....two full hours later, when our turn came up.... they would not accept my reservation using a business check....on the SAME ACCOUNT I MADE THE RESERVATION AND DEPOSIT WITH a month earlier when I prebooked ! A half hour of shouting got us nowhere, AND THEY REFUSED THE SHUTTLE RIDE BACK TO AIRPORT. We had to hire a cab, and took it directly to the hotel. The front desk clerk told us not to worry, just pick up the wall phone that says AVIS, and a real nice couple a block away will pick us up at our preferred time from a local pool of cars. I pick up the phone, we arrange for a 8am pickup, and we take driver back to their repair shop rental yard. Thumbs UP to the Omni, and the real nice private Avis contract station in Orlando. Yeah, they were FINE with a business check.
This one event prompted me to getting a credit card. I never roll over balances, unless I have forgotten to pay on time a phone call ALWAYS got the penalty and interest removed.
Developing credit is useful, if you use it only as a convenience, and not as a financing mechanism. I have all my suppliers autopay my invoices on my business card. I used to spend a day or two cutting monthly checks, about 75 of them... Now I cut payroll checks, and the rare other check.... maybe 3 or 4 a month.
Pretty sure it's illegal to not accept cash. I bet someone could do a class action lawsuit. There's a similar lawsuit against parks right now.
@@AmyKaylasVegas Yes, I thin I it's illegal to not accept legal tender as payment. Her in Norway (and most likely in any country with a central bank responsible for issuing the official coins and notes) it is illegal to not accept money as payment.
A business may say they don't accept cash for safety reasons, such as avoiding being robbed for cash, but they should then at least have a clearly visible notice at the entrance and a list of accepted payment methods. Then the potential customer can decide up front if they want to do business there.
@@LarsV62 You see, that is how things work in a sane country. Here in the US we let the corporations control us sadly
Don't get me started on that!!!!
And if this ever makes it to regulators, they’ll fine Citi less than they made from the scam.
And none of that fine actually goes to the people they ripped off.
gotta love american justice
YOU KNOW IT!
Guaranteed.
fines anymore just seem to be considered yet another acceptable cost of doing business
a slap on the wrist
There was a hilarious episode of a consumer show here in Canada with a group of people trying to actually use their Air Miles. One got so fed up that she cut up her card.
She got so fed up with the lie that others have told her. So good on her.
They are extremely easy to use?
American sucks the big one. I traveled for one job and got 90k miles 12 years ago when they were a little more valuable. Became unemployed like a lot of people in the fallout of the financial crisis, and those miles expired.
I really couldn't give less of a shit about a company that says "you earned this" and then takes it away through completely arbitrary rules. Now I haven't flown American in 12 years. They really showed me, huh?
how did they take it away? did those points belong to the company you worked for and youre crying because you didnt get to keep something that wasnt yours?
@@the_chomperconsidering that those miles don't appear from nowhere, but paid for by him and you and me through credit card upchrage...
They were his, but they were taken away
@@bionmccool Ive come to realize that you should never pay before any service/product before you get it, since the person providing that to you will think "oh hell yeah i got the money, lets throw this product at the guy and call it a day" instead of thinking "i need to do a good job getting this product to the customer otherwise he wont buy it". Same applies to saying you'll 100% buy something.
My boring life story if you wanna read:
I was searching for dirtbikes to buy, and i did find one really far away. Over the messages the guy seemed honest and cool, but after driving 60+ miles, it turns out the dirtbike doesnt even start. The guy blamed it on the battery and cold weather, but I think that's bullshit since the day before he told me he "just started it up" in - degree weather somewhere after 8pm. Hope nobody ever bought that piece of junk, now I upgraded to buying slightly newer pieces of junk.
I do not fly often. Only once a few years to see my parents in Canada and collected some miles. AA expired all of my miles collected when they changed their TOS. Air miles is a scam.
That's why I only do cashback cards.
"If you don't like it, don't do business with them" - it's not that simple - you don't know you don't like it until you attempt to do business with them and discover how shady they actually are
The guy on top said he found terms, with nearly 30% APR and 99$ fee. But yeah, most people are not nerdy enough to scroll through small text PDFs
@@vadnegru 29.99% is the APR I usually see, which is insane/laughable/sad all at once
@@djstacktrace untill you look at overdraft, which is 60+% here. My mom got enormous sum just from buying with debit card and somehow it went into overdraft. Then, a few years later, she got SMS that she owes the money. It grew from 17 to a few thousands. Not a USD but anyway.
whether it's legal or not, businesses use credit scores for a lot of stuff not just approving loans, and you don't have to actually use credit to get a high score, you can get a high score from having having unused credit lines
Reminds me of something one of my English 1 teachers once said commented that, "the biggest issue of debt was because of credit," it was something like that, but he did more or less blame a lot of spending issues people have and debts to the credit card.
The Us Government is in 30 Trillions dollars in Debt.
Let that sink in.
Credit card annual fees are a complete joke. The company provides literal $0 value but charges the consumer every year for the "privilege" of using their card.
Yeah. Lol
Well the “value” is being able to buy stuff beyond your liquid cash ability and then being able to pay it off slowly instead of having to pay it all at once.
While this can be dangerous, it can also make it possible for people who are smart about it to actually afford things they wouldn’t otherwise
This is just wrong. For example, my Marriot card is $120, but provides a free night a year, which far exceeds $120. My Venture X card costs $395 a year, provides $300 travel credit, unlimitedairport lounge access (worth $60/visit) and 10,000 points; far exceeding the annual fee. If your credit card has a fee and provides “literal $0 value” then it’s a shitty card.
If they give you way more benefits, I can see it being worth it such as amex giving you a free streaming service and a high % back.
But!
Most are garbage
@@OctagonalSquareguess it depends on if it’s a charge card or not. If so then you have to zero the balance out every month.
There should be a law that a company has to provide the same service for cancelling as they do for starting a contract.
In short if you can buy via the website you have to be able to cancel via the website.
Looks like system declined your application, but it went into reconsideration department where it was approved later. You should get $200 statement credit when first billing period closes, also you should get 40k miles when you complete sign up requirements (like spend x amount in 3 months). Also this year annual fee is waived, you can close the card next year before or shortly after annual fee posts (they will refund the annual fee as long as you cancel within 30 days of it posting). This deal is decent.
I do agree the 100$ annual fee is crap but yeah looks like it would be a pain but I would imagine you should be able to get the promotion rolled out on this card, probably takes like 1 month after completing your booked flight to get the 40k miles. If you were going to do 2 flights in the year probably a good option but I don't know would kinda be a wash for me if you were only going to benefit from the up to 200 off(probably only gelt like 50$ off for a 400$ flight)
@@LumpinLoafthe $100 annual fee is waived for the first year
Yup I used to work for Academy sports and outdoors and the management forced us to advertise the living shit out of that credit card. I looked into the interest rate and saw something like 29-32% and was convinced that it was a scam… but if you don’t push the customer to sign up for it you lose your job… I hate how credit is a absolutely necessary part of life now,if my mom hadn’t placed me on one of her credit accounts to boost my score I wouldn’t have been able to get loans for college….
You think credit is a scam but not student loans, huh?
Welcome to USA's social credit score. China is such a good role model. Or was China's social credit score inspired by the capitalist credit score? Hard to say... which should tell you sth
Do you actually have to take a loan to be able to go to college? Most of the colleges in Europe are free of charge. Even in China, you don't need to get a loan to go to university. Bad communists.
@@chaoscheese1168luuuulz
Thanks for catching this! Love the work you do for people in general.
The credit score mafia is a clear RICO violation. Honestly i would be more comfortable paying a Gangster. Atleast they are honest about what they are doing
You mean the Mafia
Vote often and early
And when they offer protection, they give you protection. The same cannot be said for government. I give you an old story i had:
Decades ago I had two friends that had their car stolen. One went to the police, got his car back 2 months with everything taken out of it.
Another went to the local boss instead. Withing one day he not only had his car intact but with a full tank. And an apology note from the thief.
A big thing to add to this is American Airlines points aren't the statement credit. In my experience, the statement credit you receive is done AFTER you make a purchase, but not immediately. I have an Amex Platinum and I get a statement credit for Hulu. So after I renew my Hulu subscription, at some point later in the month, I receive what is essentially a refund applied to my account. Same for Walmart+ (which I signed up for because hey, free subscription so why not?)
What you received were just generic AA miles which are totally separate. That's not to say it's not the least bit shady that you got rejected from this card but ended up getting approved (however I have heard this happens some times so it's not like it's unheard of), but you're confusing points earned (which you get by default for spending money on that card which is probably what happened here when you booked your flight) for a refund that you get a little while later.
Thanks for shining a light on these scams! Please keep doing this!
Louis Rossmann, the Internet consumer rights advocate honey badger.
Louis it says "Earn *up* to 200$". You see this is a marketing trick, you are CLEARLY at fault for believing you'll get a 200$ discount. They are legit bro, it's clearly the customer's fault for understanding otherwise...
Also you looked like a chad back in 2010! Goated!
As an immigrant from a 3rd world country who moved to the US 14 years ago, I've found that a lot of people in the US fall for the dumbest things very easily. It boggles my mind how some people fall for some really obvious debt traps by big corporations. And I don't mean this in any disrespectful way, it's just something I've observed during my time here.
Payday loans are the worst example
As an immigrant, I improved my English reading the fine print and the credit card applications. It saved me from traps, and it improved my English.
@@landshass2849 That's awesome and funny at the same time 😂
So glad you brought this up! Nothing but bait and switch from CITI and American.
Only way they make forever increasing profit
man also be super careful of banking sales scumbags calling you to give you a "free card upgrade" to platinum or similar. it was a legit employee from my bank and all, but they said the card they were offering me had no annual fee and had some lil freebies, so it was a no brainer, then months later they charged me a yearly card fee that i otherwise wouldn't have had.. what they Meant was "you spend enough on your card regularly that you meet the criteria for annual fee waiving Currently, but only if you continue to use the card at least this much".
if you have an x days interest free + no annual fee card, absolutely make sure nobody from a bank ever scams you out of it. they will surely try.
Louis also didnt mention that clicking on that little ad takes you to a page that actually explains the credit card in depth. He completely omitted that fact. It doesnt just take you to an application.
This rant sounds like a mixture of a person that jumped into something without doing basic research along with some user error.
Im willing to bet he somehow submitted the application multiple times hence the reason it mentioned him asking for credit multiple times.
I submitted the application once. I did not submit the application multiple times. That is a bet you would lose.
The idea that having misleading advertising upfront and then an explanation of something very different is an omission, rather than the point of the view, is bad faith. If you take this offer at many other merchants, even the shittiest ones, a discount is applied immediately. If they offer statement credit(which isn't the standard), that is available immediately.
This method of offering the "discount" is not standard, and is a move in a less consumer friendly direction.
@@rossmanngroupstatement credit are applied at the end of the billing statement. During the first month of receiving the card a statement is not generated until the period usually 30 days past
Every video of Louis starts with "hey, hope you're having a lovely day" and then tells how every mega corp is trying to ruin it and me....
The way I see it, life is win-win.
When the world sucks, I have something to work towards improving, something to strive to work towards; a right to repair bill passing in Colorado so that people can get their wheelchairs fixed without waiting six months to have their freedom back, something to be excited about, and something to look forward to. Seeing the world become a _little_ less shitty as a result of something I took part in, is really motivating for me.
If I run out of things to make content on, well, I'm out of a job - but we'll be living in a MUCH better world by then!!
Win win.
But the latter, I feel, is a loooooong....long way away
@@rossmanngroupOne must imagine Sisyphus happy
@@rossmanngroup The modern megacorps have cracked the code - East India company.....
@@rossmanngroup corrrection, the latter will never come to be. You will be employed forever.
my company pays the annual fee for for my AA exec card. You get access to the Admirals club which is more than the annual fee. While I use that card for business expenses, I never keep a balance on it. So it makes sense, as long as you have the discipline not to carry a balance at 29.99% interest.
Are there admirals in the airlines? I think they have the air and water confused.... that scares me just a little bit! lol
I'd be lucky to afford a greyhound ticket so I can safely say I'll never get screwed by an airline
You'll be happy to know that Greyhound tickets are nearly as much as flights now.
@@TheAxebeard Christ on a bike.
axebeard beat me to it, but yeah... took a greyhound cross-country back in '18 & they were even then indeed almost as expensive as flights. only reason it was better for me to take the bus was i had a bunch of luggage with me & for shipping Greyhound Package Express
😜
@@TheAxebeard This right here. You can usually just choose a different airline when it comes to flights, so they have to keep the fares low and the margins razor thin. For a long distance train or bus Amtrak/Greyhound basically don't have any competitors except the airlines and each other, so they set their prices JUST BELOW what the airline tickets are (and, at least in the case of Amtrak, somehow still manage to lose money and need to be subsidized by the Federal government). There may be reasons to take a bus or train rather than fly, but price is not one of them unless you're incredibly sensitive to price (e.g. you can afford to travel if the ticket is $380 but not if it's $400).
The last part caught me off guard!😂 Keep up the good work Mr. Rossmann!
Agree with you bigtime on credit, credit scores, and airlines, . We've got a pretty good score, I keep an eye on it to make sure nothing funny is going on. But the last time we got a loan was in 2015 and that was at a credit union where the loan officer drew a big slash through the application form and just asked "how much do you need?" We've banked there for years and they know us by reputation.
every time you pay with a credit card your merchant gets 3% less so all the prices are 3% more by default.
credit cards make all pay more
if you have a balance on a credit card that you cant pay off every month in full then you should not use a credit card.
This is the way.
I hope they get sued or face some consequences besides this bad press. That seems illegal to tell someone they didn't get approved and then charge them the $99 annual fee.
the idea to get something with credit/debt, that you normally couldn't afford, is so strange to me.
Isn't it obvious that you either have to pay for it or pay for it even more?
The only exclusions are house paying (good luck with that anyway if you are younger than millenial) or maybe car leasing although the worst thing is basically "bad financial decision for like 2 years".
The idea to live on the devil's edge - as people seem to have never learnt dealing with money- to achieve better credit is truely american
On average, most people are poor at delaying gratification, and many people are unable to understand compounding interest.
Credit cards have gone from being a convenient way to carry significant purchasing power with much lower risk than cash, to convoluted bait and switch "gotcha" schemes that will utterly destroy you financially if you miss the wrong detail in the reams of fine print, or mistakenly believe that they have to honor their written agreements the way YOU will have to.
not true. Credit cards are fire. They can help you save alot of money by bonus intros and cash back. However they can also burn you if used incorrectly. Credit cards are not hard to use. Just make sure they are 100% paid off every month
@@Theaverageazn247 LOL
@Theaverageazn247 Then what's the bloody difference to using debit for everything? Or heck, even cash, as many small business owners charge less if you pay in cash?
"Hey, I hope you're having a lovely day" will never get old
Thank you for exposing the shitty business practices of these companies, Louis. You are doing a good thing for this world!
In debt we trust was a wonderful credit card documentary
Wait, people trust debt?
After being offered $3000 limit credit cards at 18, then that number dropping to $300 when I had a real job, I lost all trust in credit cards because that shit makes no sense.
Never saw the documentary, but what a weird title for an industry that's genuinely sketchier and scarier than being involved with actual gangs.
Is this the documentary: ua-cam.com/video/Cltc4Og6HKo/v-deo.htmlsi=JUTzgpCarYT9Jb5t
@@andrewcook_Yeah, when I graduated high school they sent me a card with three times the limit I started with. I just threw it out because I didn’t want to be spending that much anyways.
@@andrewcook_I mean the entire American economy (and in turn the majority of the world's economy) relies on debt, so yeah...people trust debt. If they didn't, then the majority of the population would be rioting and looting everything they could get their hands on since the USD would worthless, but the lack of panic indicates the majority trust debt.
Louis. I don’t have any debt either. However having a strong credit rating helps in other ways other than for borrowing Eg. reduced insurance rates. 😮
Reminds me of this one time my bank at the time, St George, tried to cancel the credit card that I had and move me to a different tier of credit card.
For context, low annual fee, zero interest for like 21 days or something plus rewards. Anyway they unilaterally decided to just straight up send me a new card for their other rewards card that had a much higher fee and were very tight lipped on the credit cap.
So I queried them and was initially told $500, though I was later told my cap was at something like $5000 and that they'd used my original documents which stated that I would have had trouble repaying that money. (My income at the time would have been easy but that's beside the point.)
So basically my bank was going out of it's way to screw me. Not only that, they locked the card twice during the argument and actually closed the card with extra money on it which I had to go into a branch to get back.
I closed every account I had with them and switched banks. If they're that willing to screw me over and destroy my credit rating for a few extra dollars, they don't deserve my money.
Louis, American Airlines did the exact same thing to me
I remember being told by a close friend that in places like Great Britain, if you have no credit, you'll actually get more benefits, and that it was a culture shock when she got here and it was the opposite.
credit cards are still a weird thing for us europeans as most of us have enough debit on our account that we generally don't need a credit card to pay for all our stuff.
I think you get graded as good (light green) without any credit history but if you want to get in the very good (green) category, you need some history.
At least my mom had such a "credit" score while never in her life being in debt.
In modern times, the debt-capitalism is more common as highschoolers want all that shiny fashion wear/shop on cheapo china exports 100s of clothes per year.
Nontheless actual collected 100k credit debt like I've seen on reddit this week is basically unheard of lol
Benefits (welfare) here has absolutely nothing to do with credit scores and makes no reference to them.
In some european countries the credit card limit counts as if you have a loan already (because you can technically spend your card limit without actually having that money in the bank) so if you apply for a big loan (house, car etc) you will get worse rates or even get declined. What people do is cancel all their credit cards first before applying for such a big loan.
@@MHWGamer in the US using a credit card is safer than your debit card. Scammers can drain your whole bank account if they steal your debit card, but if it’s your credit card you can just report fraud and not pay.
28%+ APR on all these credit cards should be illegal. It's ridiculous.
Go look APR for a buy now pay later it's even worse than credit card 🤡🤣 crazy
And since the economy took a turn the APR is way up, I think the highest one I've seen was 35%. 😮
It should be illegal, but if you think of which entity is responsible for passing laws and which entity bank's are tight with, you'll find what the issue is.
But the biggest issue is the reason why they can charge such exorbitant interest rates is because there are people who will pay it.
Curiously, CC interest in Brazil is over 400% a year. Because of that, it's common knowledge that you cannot, under any circumstances, not pay the balance in full every month. People only pay partially if they had an emergency (or are addicted to shopping), the vast majority pays in full or has no cc at all.
@@capybaraRed 400% APR, woah 😮
I'd be calling Citi and making sure they applied the right promo. Looks like a legitimate effup, if I can be honest.
PS: I routinely apply for introductory offers as a middle finger to these companies. They give me 20-40% off of mandatory spend items(while IMPROVING my credit score), set calendar reminder to cancel card and place in drawer to never use again, cancel about a year out, rinse and repeat. Works nice and it's juiced my CS to over 800
I'm not always having a lovely day.
I always learn something valuable from this channel.
Sometimes, I learn a new expletive.
Never appreciated it as much as I do today!
You need credit. If you plan on making a big purchase. Credit is good if you manage it properly. Rewards are a trade off, travel cc are good for travelers.
I'm always laughing about the American credit system and how Americans don't see the similarities to the chinese social credit system
@@Lorem_the_Ipsumeverywhere else has the same thing they just don't quantify it into a number like Americans do.
@@Lorem_the_Ipsum…cuz the “social” credit system is based off of credit systems.. it’s in the name lol
Small purchase credit cards...large purchases debit card
it seems these days you can't walk into a store without them offering you a credit card
I love you Louis keep up the good work of keeping people informed
Hey Louis I hope you have a lovely day from this point on, thanks for the video
AA also had their pilot hawking the card on my flight! Please fly the plane and stop trying to sell me a credit card on my flight! It's distracting and just makes me not want to fly on your plane.
Wendover Productions has a video called “How Airlines Quietly Became Banks” that explains why airlines make more money from their loyalty programs and credit-card offers than they make from flying passengers. (Airlines sell loyalty points to credit card companies, which can offer them as rewards, and the airline gets a commission if you sign up for the card.)
Thank you, keep working.
That's exactly why I always say "If you want a credit card, do not jump on the points sh*t ride, always cashback"
I have a couple credit cards but thank god I haven't had to use them in a couple years. Thank you for this, Louis
credit card also hurt the business you are shopping at with processing fees. often times at small business you can negotiation whatever cash back your CC give you by paying cash. You also do not get tracked.
the worst part is most people will just go with it. Modern day econimics which are pretty much run by businesss advisors have to try new ways to scam people. What is hilarious is that they high five each other when most people fall for it. I agree just never do credit.
Good video, love you deep diving anti consumer practices
Hello Louis, im so thankfull for all your videos!
Yo're a hero for me.
You gave me and alot of other unknoledged people so much wisdom & taking care of us.
Everyone s*** company is trying to humble us! ;(
Keep going!
Louis I love your videos but I do have to comment about a misunderstanding you made in your video. The miles you saw in your Citi portal is just the miles you already had pre-existing in your AAdvantage account and isn’t related to the $200 credit. The $200 credit advertising has indeed been a known scheme but I did want to mention that about the miles.
So it's even worse. Lovely
It's hidden in the application details that if they don't approve you for that offer specifically, they will approve you for a lower tier card that does not offer the intro, interest or promotion. This means you may or you may not get the $200.
Also the miles on the card is not for getting the card / statement credit, those are the rewards miles for his recent flight(s).
:)) man.. you're just a bundle of joy. I loved the outro. Also thank you for the advice. After i finish my loan im done with loans. Never again.
I used to always only use debit cards / cash, but a lot more than just loans use credit scores. Some landlords use rent as a factor, and many insurance companies use credit score. After getting turned down for stuff I got rewards cards with $0 annual fee and pay it off every month treating it as a debit card still meaning that I now use my credit cards to make money. As you said though it does require self-discipline to not spend more than you have.
If you stay in hotels a lot, that's a good reason to have a credit card which you don't use except when you check in, and pay the bill with your debit card when you check out; I've never had a hotel refuse to allow me to pay with a different card than I used to check in. The reason for this is that hotels put a hold on of potentially several hundred dollars on your card at check in to cover "incidentals", and it can take several days for the residual hold (the difference between the hold and your actual charges) to be removed after you check out. If the hold is on a credit card which you only use for checking into hotels, no big deal, but if it's on your debit card it could mean you suddenly have an "available balance" of $0.37 despite having over $500 in your checking account.
Credits are a tool to control people
It's only illegal for them after they get caught and you win a class action lawsuit, otherwise these companies can do whatever they want, even those class action lawsuits aren't enough to actually damage them
Thanks for pointing this out! Someone finally gets it. Credit card companies make it difficult to know which reward is the best reward. Paying for points on Amazon vs using point for a billing credit may wind up being two totally different credits. Booking a flight through a rewards card may actually be more expensive. Really got to watch.
Preach brother!
Reward credit cards usually have annual fees. Airlines make more of their profit from mileage programs/co-branding than from flying planes. In 2020 United Airlines market cap was $10.5 billion while its Mileage Plus Program was worth $22 billion so without the Mileage Program United would be negative $11.5 billn. Same for American Airlines with $21.0 billion for mileage program and $10.1 bill mrkt cap leaving a negative $12 billion.
Yip. I went through the exact same thing when I was booking a flight with American. Like a lot of stores will do, I was enticed by the "$200 off" offer. Yet I always dig into the fine print when looking to apply for any of these kinds of cards. The moment I saw just shy of a 30% APR and a $99 annual fee, I immediately said "nope, I'll just pay full price for the ticket". Very shady and scummy...
1:40, “up to” has been subject to dark patterns especially for discounts and wages. Small text in relation to the number.
Great Ending Dude !!!
I don't know if it's the case in the USA too but in Canada a bad credit score leads to higher insurance premium for your car and home...
It's the same for a lot of insurers in the US too
In europe there is no benefits to having a credit card apart from being protecyed from fraud amd that. idk what about these complaints
in the US if theres theft on your debit card, thats your money. thats your problem. with a credit card, thats the companies money, you tell them its fraud and they deal with the rest. in general using a credit card is just better as long as you keep up on the bill
The only benefit is the chargeback option which is much smoother than disputing a charge with traditional banks (at least in Portugal). Other than that, debit cards all the way
Most businesses don't even accept it here. Cash is king.
the mileage calculation sheet looks exactly like my geometry test when they ask to prove vectors of coordinates.
I feel you. I also don't do credit cards for the same reasons. I have also had a bank sign me up for a credit card when I said I don't want one...
I think what happened was you tried to sign up on their shitty website, it got stuck and signed you up twice. Occam's razor tells us that this is more likely.
Thank you for putting chapters in your video. I was able to deduce how this scam works simply from the chapter titles and thus saved myself over 12 minutes of screen watching.
I am an impuisive buyer also. I just make sure I have the funds in the bank to pay the statement when it comes.
It's not easy. Takes discipline, easier than paying crazy. Interests FEES
found out recently that if you want to cancel your gym membership without jumping through hoops or tanking your credit you can convince them to terminate it by walking into the locker room and pretending to take photos of people's dangly bits until they tell you that you aren't allowed to come back anymore. and what is really cool about this is that if speedrunning a ban becomes the normal way to deal with predatory cancellation tactics, other members will also want to leave to avoid random hooligan activity giving the gym a much greater incentive to allow people to just walk up to the desk and cancel
U da man Louis!
Entertaining but that is not how it works . The credit card is tied to your miles account and it simply shows the regular miles you received for booking a flight. Shall you have booked using the CC you would have received an actual statement credit. All else about the scam that fee CC are is true.
Agreed, according to the terms then it's a $200 statement credit on AA purchases. So if he books another AA flight within the next 6 months using that card then he'd receive the $200 credit
AA and Citi USED TO have an amazing CC deal offered during flights only - take an application and sign up to get 60,000 miles per card, and they allowed up to 2 per household.
This was 60,000 pre-covid miles, which was enough to fly round-trip to Europe. You had to spend $3000 in 3 months (per account) to get the miles, but since we use out CCs like debit cards, that’s easy for us.
I was about 5 days from grabbing the deal to fly me and wife to Belgium for essentially free, then rona-19 hit. Amazing to see how now, short domestic flights are almost what a round-trip Europe flight was!
Wendover Productions has a video called “How Airlines Quietly Became Banks” that explains why airlines make more money from their loyalty programs and credit-card offers than they make from flying passengers. (Airlines sell loyalty points to credit card companies, which can offer them as rewards, and the airline gets a commission if you sign up for the card.)
Calling loyalty points “miles” when it’s not a 1:1 translation is pretty misleading, IMO.
AA hasn't actually been devalued as much as the other airlines (yet) so 60,000 is still usually enough to fly roundtrip to Europe. Also the Citi AA card currently offers 75k miles which is enough to fly roundtrip to Asia
Please keep informing us !!!
Louis, there's wrong way to handle debt and you've emphasized on it, but there's also a right way to handle debt. Now I don't say you should get in debt on a credit card, I just want to make a general statement: if you get in debt to buy stuff, it's mostly wrong way to handle debt, if you get in debt to get profitable, that can be right way to handle debt, provided you don't get the risk you can't handle. Of course it's more complicated than that, I just wanted to make the point.
That called investment
Dave Ramsey borrowed money to buy property and went bankrupt because of it.
Better to just use a rewards card to buy anything which you would've bought anyway and avoid other debt.
Of course, if you are living in Turkey and want to buy an iPhone, it would be insane to pay it cash. But these guys have around 12% interest rate while inflation soars at over 60%....
Canceling the card if it has no fee is completely unnecessary. Having the higher line of credit with low utilization is good for your credit score.
Also, annual fees are not a scam if you use it enough to get more value from the rewards than the annual fee. My saphire card i got 1600$ in airline miles and paid 95$ in fees.
louis, i dont think this was intentional. Big companies like this have no incentive to scam you, they will get their money back from most consumers.
You probably should call them and ask them what happened, then update us. Ive had all major CCs with offers, and they always come through.
This video contains some genuine GOAT LOL's. Man oh man, keep bringing us this content.
never had a credit card
never had a bank loan
if I ain't got the cash for it...
ain't getting it.
keep spitting Truths Sir
I have a Debit card there will be no debt
Take it from me. Stay far far away from buy now pay later services. I, much like you Louis, am extremely impulsive but unlike you, willingly give into that impulsivity to my great shame and ultimate downfall. I’m still picking up the pieces of this hell I’ve wrought upon myself. Don’t do it. Just don’t. Great video as always, you’re doing God’s work.
I find the easiest way to stay far away from buy now pay later schemes is to consider the fact that 99% of the time, you're buying junk
Yes. But in my case it’s audio processing equipment, dynamic and condenser studio microphones and cameras… 😅
For socks you don't want a sewing machine; you want a circular knitting machine.
Stinging nettle stalks make surprisingly good fibers for yarn, they just need freezibg weater once or twice to be at their best. You process them much in the same way than linen: Put them in water, preferably running water so the non fiber tissues rot away, dry them in the sun, alkali ash water bath and straining (8 times), then rinse, dry again, beat them so the fibers separate, and spin.
I think there was a minor error in the algebra. As AA + Citibank should equal lying cockrag + lying cockrag or 2*(lying cockrag).
Or perhaps you're defining "s" as a new variable, which, in this case is equal to 2.
Wherein our final result is:
AA + Citibank = lying cockrag(s)
In which case I fully agree.
QED.