I Just Got An E-Mail From The Actual Venue...
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- Опубліковано 30 тра 2024
- While we've been discussing aggressive security staff at venues, it seems I've caught someone's attention... Because the actual venue (Fete Music Hall) of said aggressive security just sent me an e-mail, pinning a lot of what happened on the We Came As Romans Tour.
00:00 Intro / Drama Makes The World Go Around
01:55 A Quick Story Refresher
03:20 The E-mail Intro
04:27 How Many People We At The Show
05:12 The Tour/Venue Security Meeting
06:54 "Eye" Witnesses
08:17 The Venue's Existing Reputation
10:46 Video of "Security" Hitting A Girl
12:08 Someone Got Fired Over This
13:00 Did The Touring Crew Start The Fight?
16:24 The Venue Didn't Want The Show Cancelled
19:44 Did Fans Confuse Security With Touring Crew?
21:10 Where's The Videos?
22:32 My Gut Instinct On What Happened
24:07 More Fence Sitting / Outro
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#security #wecameasromans #roadiereactions #tankthetech
I've seen some people asking about the validity of this e-mail, as in who sent it and where it came from, so I just wanted to attempt to clear it up:
This was not sent from someone's personal e-mail address who just claimed to work at the venue. The e-mail received came from an @fetemusic.com address, which is the official domain of the venue. The person gave me their full name as well as job title, both of which I was able to confirm were legitimate before I even talked about this on Twitch. I replied to them asking if they cared if I were to bring up this e-mail on stream, to which they replied with a second e-mail stating that it was fine as long as I omitted their name or anyone else at the venue's name due to the ongoing threats they were getting towards the venue.
This entire thing sounds like someone in management who is going off of whatever their security team has told them.
@@dragoslove I've gotta imagine that's the case, considering at one point in the e-mail he states when he actually showed up to take place in a discussion.
For the "non music" people, might be a good idea to explain what "full gear" for road crew *is*.
This isn’t fence sitting. It’s journalism. You’ve presented the events from the perspectives of the venue, the tour package, and the attendees, and presented info you’ve found to add context and information to the story. It’s unbiased journalism. Some people have never seen it before, so they don’t know how to handle receiving information without a bias.
And frankly it's refreshing to have a more balanced take on things from the metal world. I don't always agree with Tank BUT it sure as hell beats the click baiting of sites like Metal Sucks, Metal Injection, Loudwire, etc.
very that. and further, he wasn't there, so it's not like he can know for certain, no matter how many witnesses like myself leave comments and give our statements. I TOTALLY understand tank not wanting to state things as facts that he has no way of knowing if they're actually true or not. That's just irresponsible and asking to get slapped with a libel/defamation suit
And that's what tank does. He doesn't say that 'this is all facts' or he knows for sure 'what happened'. All he is doing is reporting on all the information he has been told/read/seen. I know he is very good at his what he does and until EVERYTHING comes to light, this is an investigation which may OR may not be true.
But I myself am inclined to trust tanks judgement.
Exactly. It is the way Tank clearly states what is fact, what is viewpoint, and what is speculation that makes the video worth watching. I'd much rather this than hear someone's uninformed rant, thank you!
Yah it's actually nice to see some coverage that doesn't try to use feelings to try to to make people feel a certain way, and let's everyone come to their own conclusion. I'm not sure why people are so interested in news/journalism that forces a bias, other than to confirm their bias which is wildly disingenuous.
Now that the drama trilogy is complete let's hope you don't have to do an extended director's cut or something.
THE SUPER SPECIAL EXTENDED BEHIND THE SCENES DIRECTOR'S CUT COLLECTOR'S EDITION
@@TankTheTechThe Snyder Cut
Well... I'm not so sure about that.
Recently... Or perhaps even the past year or so, I've been what we call it in Sweden "killgissa", which translates to "guys-guessing" and I have a rough 80-90% correctness of my guy-guessing in anything from stupidity to stuff at work, and I've been working professionally within the events industry since my first stagehand job in July 2008.
My guy-guessing is that this story won't end here, but when a couple of more videos surface, someone from the crew sends you an email, more witnesses shares their saying and perhaps a few other details present themselves, there's gonna be a 4th and maybe a 5th video where everything will be clear as a 15 times distilled vodka alternatively natures purest water.
I have worked as a security on hundreds of events of any kind, concerts, sports, political, and others, door security at bars, military and others outside of events... This should never ever happen anywhere! The security staff are just not trained professionally and that's necessarily not the staff themselves fault, but rather their bosses at the company they are employed by. It is a crowd-management issue up to the top. The owners, their Head of Security, and the Supervisors aren't professional and teach their security crew how to handle different types of crowds.
"Security" is just a too hard word. More event security companies should rather do what one of the companies I work for, print "Service & Safety" on the clothes. Within "Service & Safety" there's a silent "Security".
Event security is just my part-time job because I freelance and have been working more within the tech part of the industry, stagehand, stage tech, touring etc, so after over 16 years within the industry I have a pretty good picture of the while industry.
All the beet Tank and stay safe! 👊🤙
Featuring Jermey Clarckson and James May
@@TankTheTech steel book edition?
If the problem was with the road crew, we'd be hearing about issues across the entire WCAR tour, not just at this one venue.
Well, I'll be at their show in Nashville on Sunday so we'll see how it goes.
Nah man it's an industry secret you can only get away with jumping security once, MAYBE twice if you do the second one on the last stop, per tour. That way they don't catch on to yah
🤫😉. Also gotta be sure to shake down the venue & make sure they let your angry mob of fans buy merch to support to make the tour more money.
We Came As Mormons?
@@TankTheTech That'll be a solid piece of content for you to see first hand. I don't know how Nashville fans are but you know how it's different state to state. It's just a look at this giant pie depending on locale. You know this, doesn't need to be said but look forward to your breakdown. 👍
@@jerryh9526 fixed, my bad
Just look at the Google reviews of the venue, people have been having issues with their security for YEARS before this whole fiasco. Plus the owner gets super angry and defensive in his responses, I think it's pretty clear they're always scrambling to cover their asses
That’s not conclusive. I’ve read reviews from people who don’t like fish going to red lobster and complaining about the restaurants lack of non-seafood items. I’ve read reviews of pork belly complaining about how fatty it is. I bet their are complaints at a lot of venues about security that’s doesn’t mean security is actually a problem that just means people have written complaints.
@robertp457 that's where you learn to differentiate bullshit from legitimate. The fish guy at Red Lobster is an asshat but I feel like most of the reviews that single out this venue's security will have a pattern to them
one of the managers of the venue was trying super hard to defend the venue in jeff rosenstock's tour post on instagram, kinda hilarious to watch
@@robertp457 That's a pretty terrible analogy. What if there was a long history of complaints about people being beat up by security at said Reb Lobster?
@@robertp457you can definitely tell what's bullshit and not.
Anecdotal but when you look at the number of reviews they have that mention security vs their total review, and compare that to a local venue near me that is known for having overly aggressive security, the rate is double which leads me to think they're pretty bad.
It would be a lot of very weirdly targeted bad reviews to get it that high.
And with the responses the owner is giving to many of the reviews, is very confrontational which doesn't exactly dispute the narrative of aggressive staff.
"Which establishment in their right mind would assult or mistreat a customer unless they stepped out of line?" The person who wrote the email is not to be trusted if they would write such a thing and not understand its meaning.
This destroyed a lot of their credibility and demonstrated they probably did not know how to properly handle the situation.
Also kinda reads like "Yes someone broke the (our) rules and therefore we mistreated them". What?!
Nailed it
That’s assuming they did something wrong, though.
We Came as Romans and Left as Nutless Pussies
Are you telling me they don't have security cameras that would show the staff getting jumped? For get no cell phone videos, it's even more suspicious that the venue won't release any vof their video showing the wonderful professional behavior of their security staff being innocently assaulted by road crew....
If they claim road crew assaulted security staff where are the police reports?
You saw how crappy the phone camera footage was, right? How much money would the venue have to spend on cameras that are good enough to capture low light video good enough to be usefully?
@@edcrichton9457where are the police reports about security?
@@robertp457They never said they called the police.
@@robertp457 Your average home has security cameras that you can buy for cheap online that records in lowlight in 720p... so there's far more likelihood of a fixed _commercial_ security camera picking up an altercation in the areas near the doors & outside the venue than anyone capturing it on a phone in the crowd.
I know several venue owners/managers & they _all_ have extensive camera coverage of the entrances/exits for insurance purposes, as well as for venue & event security... you don't want people sneaking in through fire exits without paying, or trashed patrons passing out in low traffic areas & having a medical emergency.
So the irony is... by this employee trying to use the argument that no-one _in the crowd_ has footage they have only highlighted the _venue's_ reluctance to release the footage they more than likely have.
Tank, thanks for staying a fence sitter! It's because of people like you that we can actually find out properly what went on.
he's doing it to protect his career😅
im glad im from the Midwest, shows in Detroit/Cleveland/Chicago/Pittsburgh we have SOSF or BFL crews back in the day we had Courage Crew, and staff got FVCKED UP if they got outta line.
@@eatassonthefirstdateit’s interesting that you think no one would actually want to be impartial & unbiased, & that they must have some underhanded motive for not taking an extreme position on an issue where they weren’t there & they don’t actually know what happened.
@@eatassonthefirstdate I'm curious how you think I'm protecting my career? I don't work at a venue. I've never worked for any of the bands on the tour. I literally have no personal connections to either party. 😂
@@TankTheTech to be fair, i imagine you probably do have to be somewhat careful of what you say, given we live in the age of slapp suits, and no one needs to get hit with a libel/defamation suit.
but more importantly, you weren't there, so no matter how many people like me give you first hand accounts, you don't truly have a way of knowing what happened and what didn't. and i for one, appreciate the unbiased reporting of the facts, and the info that you've been given/info you've been able to verify, as well as laying out what all you've heard and what your OPINIONS are. to me, it seems like level headed, unbiased journalism, and i appreciate that
If the venue had any inkling that the security might be at fault here for ANY of it, would they have just been better accepting the blame and saying "we understand the issues and complaints with our security staff and we will immediately look to rectify the situation moving forward"? They have now dug their heels in so hard, that if any bit of footage comes out that a security guard laid a finger on anyone (also for ANY future shows), they are going to get slaughtered in the social media channels.
Legally speaking: If they admit this, then they are liable .. I am sure their legal team has advised them to pass the blame so they retain their outs
@@thestew57 I completely get that viewpoint. I would imagine there would be a legal method of saying that they are hearing complaints about their security staff and that they will do an internal investigation and assess, that does so without admitting guilt, that they could soften the blow. Any shows at their venue for the foreseeable future are going to be scrutinized so hard, that if their security had minor cracks before, they will be tested now. Just imo.
@@priorisgod22 Of course. It really is a CYA approach to mitigate any potential liability/fault either for the venue and the tour at this point in case there is any sort of lawsuit brought on by the individual involved. Also I am sure there is limitations even to the event space with their "Liability Waiver" either on the ticket or posted in the venue if there is any that may still leave room for potential liability to the tour or venue even still. But if the end result results in more competent security being hired, or better practices, then that is a step in the right direction. No one wants to get hurt at a show, the whole point is going and having fun enjoying the experience and even making new friends. Anything to enhance the experience and safety and getting rid of bad actors I am all for.
Or if the band does the same thing at another venue.
Maybe the venue owner has financial stake in the security operation too? Maybe its a bit dodgy, mobbed up or something?
Gotta pick a side, gotta pick a team, its us against them. This mindset is a terrible thing and divides us even further.
Hey, it works for police unions in the USA.
Pick a side? No! Make up your own mind what to believe. The information has been presented. You do what you want with the info.
This is how scenes die. I'm old and been through all this. It's like watching the past. Except now we have internet and YT and smartphones. Less AIDS cases these days so I guess that's good.
Everyone want black and white answers to grey questions
so true . us against them , what the jail staff told me before. judge no man by his job , skin color , skinny , fat , don't care ,if good to me , I'm good to you, ex wife may argue that one but , she had a twin , come on
8:50 Listen, I always comment on your videos through the lens of my own professional experience in public relations, and this statement/ clarification e-mail from the venue is my fucking worst nightmare!!!! It didn't start strong to begin with (deflecting blame, inability to take ownership of what occurred at THEIR venue, I could go on), but the time stamp I tagged made me audibly groan. I’m begging these people to outsource an agency or contract someone to help them. I have no idea how this was approved to send to ANYONE, let alone someone with a platform as large as yours, to attempt to rectify the situation or clear their name. Jesus. Christ.😭
As a french person I can guarantee the way you pronounce fête from the very beginning is the correct way. Don't know who told you otherwise but probably not french native speaker. Other than that, this drama is very entertaining 😅
Funnily enough, it is (as you say) pronounced "fet" in French. But then when we borrowed it into English, we mangled it into "fate", and now correct people for saying the original. Pretty standard English behaviour, really.
Or they are Canadian French, possibly even worse the French rural people around New Orleans/Southern Louisiana area.
I love when businesses fire people but also claim the person didn't do what they're acused of. That's shady af.
"Which establishment in their right mind would assault or mistreat any customer unless they stepped out of line?"
By that reasoning, you would think no business ever mistreats their customers.
Only time I was ever allowed to fight back is if a customer was a threat to my saftey or the saftey of those around them. The worst I ever did was tackle a person cause he was waving an ice pick around. ( This was before metal detectors so yea I’m old.) we treated all concert goers with respect.
I demand a part IV-IX. We need as many videos of this as there is Star Wars.
Here's a story Disney won't fuck up. Siked!
We also need spin-off series, a toy line, and a Christmas special.
About "Being fence sitter" honestly these type of things are kinda damned if you do damned if you don't. Somebody is getting pissed in every scenario. Much love Tank I and most your followers know you just don't want to add to an already ugly situation
Fence sitting is usually the closest position to the actual truth. Which usually lies sonewhere between the two stories. The one thing I would hope all venues take from this is to have security cameras everywhere. And maybe that should be sonething the booking agents look for when booking shows to protect all parties.
I wonder how all the lights might impact any cameras.
@@SafaridorThe quality of cameras these days do quite well in those situations.
I was actually told that this venue has security cameras in it.
Picking a side is the cancer of America.
@@TankTheTech I would find it hard to believe otherwise. Those CYA cameras go the other way too.
This is why security managers need to pregame. If you know 'X band/act' is coming to the venue, you should look up live footage of them to gain insight into what the crowd may be like. Once they have an idea, they should meet/call/video chat with the tour manager to come to an agreement on what will and will not be allowed. Then, relay that information to your security team before the show, and even showcase clips of stuff that security MAY mistake for unwanted behavior; moshing, hardcore dancing, crowd surfing, etc. Shit like this would happen a lot less if people would stop being fucking lazy and put the slightest bit of effort into their job and communicate.
in one location I worked the security always had a 2 hour briefing before the show of what they might expect that evening. be it a a hardcore show or just a poetry slam
and in the 10 years there never was an incident
@@OperationMadDog same and for the festivals the venue held we had a day long briefing and venue walk through.
People sending threats to them have no shame. That is pathetic.
As a former promoter, the "stay inside after a canceled show to buy merch" part is totally plausible. I had a band back in the day that did EXACTLY that. It's definitely not out of the question.
If safety were a concern after all of this stuff going on, I find it unlikely that either party (the band or venue) would want people in their longer than necessary. Could have happened, but I find it odd.
@@TankTheTech To be honest, I find that comment plausibe too. Money in the first place.
I would kinda prefer if this was more common of a thing, tbh. Sometimes I wanna enjoy the band lineup and not the merch table lineup while the bands are playing.
Totally get that. But in this specific situation, if there really was an issue with security, the bands, and the safety of the crowd, having them stay in there for 45 minutes past the show getting cancelled is a real head scratcher to me.
I guess that does go towards the side of them not really being afraid of security or feeling they were in danger. You're right, when you put it that way. It does make it sound like they're inflating how 'scared' they were of the venue staff when you think about it objectively. @@TankTheTech
I really appreciate your impartiality and genuine perspective and also being a nice human being that understands not everything is black and white. Keep being you old bean. Your opinions and views are of a level headed person and I always appreciate them.
I concur.
I call Bullshit on this venue staffs entire statement. They are yet again trying to shift blame away from their staff and venue. 🤦♀️🤦♀️🤦♀️
Being in so many pits, definitely not a place for phones unless you want them accidently flung out of your hands and broken lol
That's why I always either leave my phone with someone else I came with or I put it in my battle vest pocket where there's lots of padding. Can't be losing expensive stuff to humbug shit.
I typically am in front of the pit up by the rails so thats why I have a crossbody purse to put my phone, wallet, ect in so I lose nothing its the best purchase ever haha
Although I can't completely vouch for someone after only working with them once, I can say that I'm a FOH at a venue Sam came through on tour and when working with him he was super sweet, laid back, friendly and extremely easygoing. I have a really hard time believing that he would just jump security staff out of the blue. He seemed really in love with the lifestyle of touring, really happy and fulfilled, and went out of his way to give me advice about how to get touring work and what being a touring engineer is like, and has kept up with me on social media since. He seems like a genuinely great guy.
People can surprise you
I was present at the show. it was a small crowd at this point in time because it was still early. when bodysnatchers started, a pit opened immediately. now comparatively to other shows this pit was very small and only a few folks getting their dance on. i saw at least two big security doods walk into the very center of the pit right away and point their flash lights into concert-goers faces both whom were in the pit and at the outskirts of the pit -- im assuming to communicate this is a no-no. the pit dispersed and folks went about their business. i did not see the other shenanigans because it did not happen near me. but at one point the crowd did start a fk the security chant, but realistically that went on for like 20 seconds, it was a blip. The band did warn at one point if security kept throwing people out or whatever they were going to stop. At the beginning of another song the vocalist said fk security have fun so a second pit opened. Something transpired and they cut off their set shortly after and it was over. at one point there was a security guy walking from the back to the front near the barricade yelling something along the lines of "fk around and find out", he seemed ampd up for a brawl -- my take on his deameanor. Now there was another security guard walking by me sort of on a mission and he stepped on my foot and this dood was suuuuuper apologetic and asked me multiple times if I was cool, so I don’t think all the security guards there were part of the problem. BS cleaned up their gear, very slowly, and then no one came out or said anything for 45 minutes. they then announced show cancelled due to technical difficulties and i high tailed it out of there because i was standing around doing nothing for 45+ minutes and i was annoyed at the whole thing. i dont recall a comment about merch during the statement but i also could have just ignored it. seems like security staff may have acted stupidly and overly aggressive in some points, but also seemed to me that the band may have exacerbated it as well by coaxing that second pit. but i mean, people there to have fun. there is a certain energy that comes from the pit even when you are not in it, and when the security guards broke up the first it definitely robbed some energy from the room. I don’t think the bands had to cancel the whole thing over it because for the most part 99% of the fans in the room was enjoying the show very peacefully. very disappointed situation overall. i feel like it went from 0-60 way to fast and we were robbed of a good show. Such is life. At least we got some drama to talk about in our small town of providence RI.
Out of curiosity, from someone who used to both play and go to many, many local metal shows in the early 2000s, do clubs not let people mosh anymore?
these guys definitely had a sign on the front door that said no moshing or crowd surfing. webster theater in CT has similar signs. but those are the only two i have come across. half a dozen other clubs up here (NE) that are fine with it. sort of kills the vibe of a metal show to ban it. hopefully it doesn't catch on as a thing @@mrr5835
@@mrr5835 depends on the place. some places have a no moshing/crowd surfing policy. otehr venues are totally fine with it, and security is mostly just there to make sure no one gets insanely wild.
a great venue in this general new england area is the Palladium in worcester. They let you do it all, mosh, surf, even stage dive at their smaller upstairs shows. And i've never once seen security intervene unless someone is ACTUALLY fighting or someone is injured. Otherwise, they just keep an eye and let people have fun.
but there are a few other local venues in boston that don't allow moshing, like Brighton music hall. Paradise rock club says it's not allowed, but they'll still let people do it, so long as no one goes too wild.
Alchemy is right in Providence, and i was just there. it's a small venue, and people were still surfing right up to the stage. again, no issues, except for the singer having to once or twice mention, hey guys, keep your hands up, don't drop anyone.
it's very much an individual venue thing, but most are pretty cool about it
i was also there (i'm the girl with the light up shoes). and everything you said is right. security absolutely had flashlights, and i don't think we could've gotten them mixed up, since they were wearing those gray shirts that literally said security.
i was near the merch tables in back for bodysnatcher, and i saw them drag the guy out too. They were not being gentle or nice about it, and he wasn't walking on his own and "cooperating" because they didn't give him that chance. shit was so stupid, cuz like you said, most of us were just there vibing peacefully
First off, Tank, THANK YOU for being grounded enough to resist the tribalistic "pick a side" mentality. It's refreshing these days and you just gained a sub for that.
Second, watching your twitch chat is just as refreshing, you seem to have a great community there dude!
Finally, the guy who wrote that email really needs some pointers on his communication skills. That was one of the least professional mails I've seen in a long time, and I've read a lot of really shitty emails 😂
I appreciate that you're fair and try to look at everyone's side as objectively as possible and giving the finger to tribalism. Your doing great work Tank, keep it up amigo 🤙🥃
I know for a fact that Fete music hall has security cameras. You’d think they’d release the footage to clear them of any wrongdoing, as the email states.. Right?
“For a fact” doesn’t mean anything without objective evidence.
@@robertp457 I honestly don’t care that much to gather and present evidence. So take my comment however you’d like
They did...to the proper authorities, not people who have an agenda.
Them admitting they fired one of their security guys from that night doesn't give me the vibe they're being honest about the situation. That, and several details throughout the email seemed very suspicious to me.
But, thank you for bring these details out and not giving off "this is what I think and you have to believe it" vibe as I prefer getting to the bottom of issues rather than just taking sides
I think the security footage not being released says everything that needs to be said. They can clear everything up very quickly.
So, I've played this venue about 6 times, and I can say that I've never seen security with flashlights. The stage crew and sound guy had them, but not security. With that being said, as a whole, the security guys were generally fine, but most were guys not from or familiar with that scene and on one occasion I had a problem with one of them and it almost got nasty. I have seen some get overly rough with patrons.
Back and forth- ridiculous your praising them in one sentence then try to talk shit get a fkn grip already your just an idiot troll, obviously
For me the history of this venue speaks volumes. This was NOT a one off aberration. As Tank said, this venue has YEARS of on line criticism from fans who complained the security was violent and out of line. Based on this history they simply don't get the benefit of the doubt. Maybe something good can come of this. I think the venue must realize this is bad for business. They need to overhaul the security detail and get some professionals in their to run a better crew. Having a couple cool heads calling the shots can make all the difference. (See Dalton from Roadhouse)
Not going to oppose you but if you take a closer look at their reviews, the overwhelming majority has nice things to say
@danielchatzopoulos1501 I've seen those reviews good and bad. But there are a good # that complain about security. Maybe it's a problem that only arises during metal shows with moshing and extreme "dancing."
One point to consider, the sender of the email was not witnessing what happened. He is basically writing what he's been told happened. He said himself that he was notified after the fact. :/
Thank you Tank for your insight and journalism on this. We usually don’t get to have information presented to us like this.
I think you're 100% right on this. Based on everything it seems like whatever did happen falls somewhere in the middle of both stories. Security crew didn't handle the situation well. Band and crowd end up antagonizing the security. Altercation happened and that's about it. Ive seen this situation play out so many times where one fuck head is getting too crazy in the pit and turning moshing into actual assault. When the crew handles it well and the band handles it well. The issue is resolved and the show goes on.
Tank, I will say, love your stance in the middle, and showing all sides to a situation as fairly and impartially as possible. You are right, nowadays people jump sides and to conclusions, and your spirit in handling this like a true journalist is applaudable (and even most if not all news networks struggle with this).
All to say, keep doing you man, and thank you for bringing us content!
That dude that hit her even immediately asked "are you okay" and she responds with "yeah". Soooooo I doubt she complained to security about him and I doubt he was picking fights...
yeah, you can very clearly hear that part
stepping frame by frame, it looks like someone threw a drink glass into the crowd and it hit her.
@Tank dude you’re one of the best who does videos like this.. When I saw it pop up in my feed, I’m like what now another venue… Total opposite, stand your ground about being on the fence… You are one of the most genuine people I watch… Keep up the great work…
I'm on the fence as well, but there should definitely be an inherent distrust to online comments of people who can't have their Identities validated in a meaningful way. I don't think Internet comments should ever be taken at face value unless the person can show the video footage you have been desiring to see. Someone saying "I was there" doesn't actually prove anything except that a peson online is claiming to have been there.
So he is saying security didn’t have flashlights when they normally do and also didn’t have vests or gear to identify them as security when they normally do, and that they wouldn’t assault someone unless it’s necessary. Either they are lying or they are admitting they had lax unprepared security and they are ok with that level of operational unpreparedness which is not a good look
as someone who was there, i can tell you that's a flat out lie. They had flashlights. And also shirts, grey polo shirts that said SECURITY on the back in black letters. cuz duh, all security has shirts
@@bottomofastairwell that makes sense, this is an established venue, this isn’t their first show, far from it so the very idea that they weren’t properly equipped is ludicrous at best I just find it rather interesting that the person who sent this email had the option to go with ANY story they chose to paint their side in a better light but chose to claim they were incompetent and underprepared rather than incompetent and violent yet doesn’t seem to realize that he still made them look bad. And somehow still failed on the non violent part by saying they have an established threshold for when assault is viewed as proper, whether that is a poor wording choice or not, this person came out with an official response and did not take the time to make sure it was actually professional which in the end just lends more credence to the idea that the Fete Establishment is incompetent at best, if not downright a reckless danger to the community.
@@sociallyineptclownprincech8731 right? That "unless" really got me. So like, okay, if a patron dm behave, then no, you can't start shit. But apparently if a patron does get unruly, THAT justifies the staff assaulting them?
That's how it read at least.
And like, I've been to hundreds of shows (90 of them this year alone, coz we're trying to hit 100), and never once did staff not have flashlights. If the lights get turned down, staff has flashlights, otherwise it's just unsafe. Hell, i even had a flashlight when I was bartender at a nightclub to signal security of we needed it.
Like, what? Of all the things to lie about. They could have just said, "yeah, we have flashlights for safety reasons." And just denied shining then in people's faces, made up some lie about how maybe people mixed up their lights and the stage lights or something. That would've been more believable, even if it was still a lie
Been to Fete many times. Never had an issue there, but I also would 100% not be surprised to learn WCAR comments were true. We actually had tickets to this show specifically to see Bodysnatcher and Emmure. While I’m gutted we missed this whole fiasco, I got a refund for a show I was going to otherwise just eat the cost of 🤷🏼♂️
Part 4 will be someone from both parties doing a live interview/discussion with Tank. Let's get Matthew and someone from the venue, maybe the fired guy if the venue won't do it, on a call at the same time to both tell their versions.
The fired guy I bet will be like Trump in a live interview with more then one person and interrupting 100% of the time.
Go back into show comments going back months, even years. This venue has a LONG history of their security attacking people. They wont share the security video. Why? When a venue wont share the video I dont think its unfair to assume they are hiding it because they know its bad for them and I feel like they are afraid of a lawsuit.
Edit: Also, notice he says "After the singer said what he said I was informed of the situation." This guy didnt see ANY of it. He just admitted it. He is only telling you what other people, likely the security at the center of all this told him. His side of it is heresay. He didnt see any of it so he isnt even a witness.
I went to a concert 20 years ago featuring an opening band whose name I forgot, Further Seems Forever, Juliana Theory, and The Ataris in that order. Despite standing in line to get into the club well before doors opened, my friend and I didn’t make it inside until partway through FSF’s set which still sticks in my craw 20 years later because I was a FSF fan. So it’s highly possible that attendees of this show at the Fete were still waiting to get in. Some whacko gunning up a public place wasn’t a concern in 2003, so I imagine security is tighter these days.
This guy from the email must be some kind of olympic track star to be in all these places to witness everything firsthand.. or he's just as "unreliable" as everyone he's calling out to be "eye" witnesses
I think a lot of what he said was repeated to him by staff.
feels like extreme he said/she said at this point without any real evidence on either side. we may never know. foolish to pick a side on something with no actual proof of anything
Its very clear that they were stating things told to them. They literally said at one point "this is when I was notified and went to find out what happened"
@@yuugur666 yeah, obviously. It should also be very clear that I was just pointing out that this information is just as unreliable from the staff’s perspective as the attendees’ perspective. I didn’t think it would be too difficult for all the smart individuals out there to detect sarcasm
@@sethpatterson8143 flat text on a screen makes things hard man, and I'm not digging deep into reading comments cause, while I could, I don't want to spend hours in the comments section talking about things I'm many times removed from lol. If I had taken more time I probably woulda realized that, yeah
and the plot THICKENS!
You can go onto Google maps and see 3 cameras on the exterior of the building. I would think if they have cameras outside that they would have some inside as well, now if they are real cameras is a different story. but, like you said if they have the footage they need to release it if they care to clear their name.
Timestamps look juicy. Cant wait to wrap up this saga
I brought up a lack of security footage in the first or second video. It’s really simple! Just release the UNCUT footage with multiple angles and we will know what happened.
I also appreciate that you don’t take sides. Better to remain impartial and let all of us decide based on the facts. That’s the professional thing to do. Tank is always pro!
I was at this show, and two points you mentioned stuck with me.
21:50 I was standing roughly behind the person escorted out at 13:32, and the whole incident happened so quickly that I doubt anyone caught any footage. The whole incident was maybe 20 seconds. One second he's being escorted out by one or two security guards with no resistance, and then the next second I remember seeing him being shoved into a corner as he became more unruly. I remember four more of what I assumed were security guards rushing over, and the last thing I remember was strobe flashlights being shined towards us as they exited through the side door.
18:23 After Bodysnatcher's set was cut short, we waited about 45 minutes not knowing if the show would continue. There were no announcements or communication until they told us the show would be cancelled for "technical difficulties". I don't remember anything about merch being said, all I remember was me, my friend, and most of the other concert-goers leaving the venue. I walked around the block to stretch my legs, and by the time I returned to my car, the same security that organized the lines pre-show were closing the doors.
also, 23:59 the chants lasted maybe 20 seconds. I understand if security felt threatened by this, but the crowd simmered down as we returned to waiting for any updates. There was another moment where a few people started chanting "Emmure" hoping they'd still play their set, but for the most part, people in the crowd stood around or tried asking security/staff what was happening.
I'd be more than happy to share my experience that night if anybody has questions. With all the new information from every statement, I'm more on the fence about the situation.
yep. i was there too (the girl with the light up shoes) and know exactly which corner you're talking about, (right next to Archetypes Collide's merch table) cuz i watched them slam that guy into the wall in that corner, shine those flashlights (that they "didn't have" right in his face like they were the freaking police) and then drag him outside. it happened so fast i didn't even think to get my phone out, cuz i was so busy watching and thinking, WTF???
i don't recall them saying anything about buying merch or whatever either. I know they DID allow us to stay long enough for me to buy an Archetypes hoodie, so they weren't botting people out immediately, but that's normal. you let people use the bathroom, settle up tabs, buy merch at the end of a show. it just got cancelled due to "technical difficulties" instead of naturally ending.
my questions are 1. in regards to the supposed 5 warnings this guy received, WHEN? cuz bodysnatcher played like 3 songs before they ended their set and walked off. so when exactly did this guy receive all those warnings?
and if he was escorted out and cooperating, then why were multiple dudes taking him out? (he was also facing the crowd, not the doors, and was dragged out, so i mean ,the whole thing about the guy cooperating is BS, cuz they never gave him that chance)
lastly, there's a local article from a RI newspaper that covered what happened, including a statement from teh guy in question who was dragged out.
YT won't let me link it without deleting the comment as spam, but for anyone interested, if you google [Providence Club and Patron Exchange Charges Over “Spitting” Incident] it's the first link that comes up, by GoLocal Prov
@@bottomofastairwell I only saw security come into the crowd to "warn" him twice, tapped him on the shoulder and told him to calm down or something. To be fair, he seemed intoxicated, but you're right about him being dragged off and slammed into the wall. I distinctly remember that right before Bodysnatcher's said they'd stop the set if another person got thrown out for having fun.
@@OverallMeatBall
yeah, i remember that too. and then they were like "eff them, have fun" and it was only after security threw the dude into the wall that bodysnatcher ended their set and walked off. which, understandable, cuz i'd legit just watched what happened, so i was like, yeah, wtf.
it's crazy to me too, because we go to the palladium ALL THE TIME, and they're always a blast. The team there exemplifies what good security should be. They let people have fun, get a little wild, but they're always there to ensure everyone's safety and take care of things if they're needed, and there's always a ton of guys at the front to lift down crowd surfers and make sure no one falls or gets hurt.
i've only personally seen them intervene twice, and both those times were absolutely warranted. the first was at hawthorne heights, when some dude started a fight in the pit, like actually fighting. and the pit pretty instantly sorted that shit itself, grabbing both guys and separating them, pulling the dude who started shit out and signaling for security to come over. they came immediately, the guys in the p[it handed the one dude who started the fight off to security, and they took him away. i heard later they even let him stay, so long as he kept his ass in a seat upstairs on the balcony.
the other time was just nuts. this random guy somehow scaled the electrical cabling from the ground/pit area all the way up to the freaking balcony like he was effing spiderman or some shit. and that's not a short distance from the ground to the balcony, like damn. so security descended on him like flies. like so many dudes swarmed this guy you would've thought they were pouring out the walls. police very quickly followed, and it was the police who took the guy away. but it happened so fast and was dealt with so swiftly that the band didn't even have to stop playing. funnily enough, i wanna say that was at WCAR on the first leg of their darkbloom tour. (could be wrong on that one though)
but that's my point, security at the palladium is always great. they're always there when you need them, they keep everyone safe, but they never really escalate situations or make things worse (at least not that i've seen and i've been there probably 25-30 times this year alone). they just do their job and otherwise let people have fun and get a little crazy. and it's wild to me, looking at the stark difference good security makes in terms of how a show goes down. cuz i've never had a single issue at the palladium. but fete? i mean jesus h. granted, that was only the second time i've been there, but given what we saw, i damn sure won't be going back.
That email reeks of bullshit and seems pretty damning for the venue.
Both sides sounds like they are lying about something.
That’s your confirmation bias showing my friend
@@jacksonconstantine5740 we aren't friends, bud. If you read that email and thought the guy writing it sounds like he's telling the truth I'm glad we aren't.
@@secretninja35 we aren’t buds, pal. I don’t know because I wasn’t there. Some of things he said sound plausible, some don’t. Some of the things the band said sound plausible, some don’t. I’ll wait until they release the security camera footage before accusing strangers I don’t know of lying
@@jacksonconstantine5740 the venue would have already released the footage if it helped them at all, schmuck
I love that you're corrected on the pronunciation of the venue and are like "nope. I'm sticking with it" lol - that's awesome
It's been a fascinating event.. something of a clusterf**k. Thanks as always for the coverage though man.
Thank you for fence sitting on this. There hasnt been official video from it, and you're presenting both sides as equal as possible. Keep being great bro 🤘🏻
I'm only a few minutes in and I want to comment on what you said about doing a "journalistic style" video, right. Well when it comes to "fence sitting" that's what journalists do! They DON"T take sides. They tell a story. So thank you for NOT taking a side and telling a story that needs to be heard.
I like that you are sitting on the fence on this one, even with your lived experiences in the industry. I have been on stage, and ran shows at a number of clubs, including some shows where it was anticipated that the crowd would get rowdy,
As you said, both sides messed up. Clearly the club has hired security staff with little experience in this kind of show - a MAJOR failing on their part. Security should have experience in slamming and hardcore pit shows to understand what is normal and what is not. When I ran shows, any security staff I hired would be very familiar with the kind of show I was putting on, or I'd leave them running the door. Security staff should have also had a very clear chain of command, and it sounds like this was not the case.
When I was on stage, I was there to give the crowd one hell of a show. Some of the bands I've played with would have fostered some very aggressive pits, but in the end the band wants everyone to enjoy the show, and I almost always found that working WITH the club and WITH security was the best way for that to happen. Using my mic and my position on stage to antagonize the show runners or security was never on my mind as that is a really great way to promote bad things happening, and to get.a bad name in the industry. Promoters talk, word travels fast.
And yeah, as a promoter I had one band cancel a show because the drummer ghosted, but still asked for that I let them keep their merch table up. That was a big frikin nope from me. And yeah, I've seen some road crew cause some crap like this in the past as well.
I am on the fence on this one. Both sides messed up, but I am still absolutely shocked that the club can't produce any video to back this stuff up. That raises an eyebrow. I think WCAR are stuck in the middle of a big ol' clusterfck, I wouldn't want to have been in their shoes that night. They are the only ones that get a pass from me at this point.
Peace, y'all.
i have this feeling that this is by far the last we hear about this. its really cool you wanna cover these sort of things. much love brother 🤘🤘🤘
Oh its a freakin telenovela... Thanks for allowing us to sit on the fence with you.
Sometimes you have to choose your side, but that's only true for the important things in life. Like [insert any subgenre] metal sucks.
But for this? Thats whats missing in a lot of media outlets today: it's a balanced presentation of knowledge enabling the consumer to thibk for themselves.
Keep on rocking!
We’re gonna need another video once you get the next email. There really isn’t anyone else I’d want to follow this drama with! 😂😂😂😂😂
It's interesting to hear the other side. Just sad that they are basically saying "Yeah, stuff happened, but that wasn't us." There's more than what is being said and I agree with Tank that the truth is somewhere between the two, just need to know how close it is to one side or the other.
First time I’ve seen your content. Very fair and balanced, insightful and Intellegent. Subscribing now. Great work.
Glad you felt comfortable not picking a side. Like you said, truth is likely somewhere in the middle here
The best Thing here is you having a balanced opinion and telling people to use their skills to come up with their own :).
Whenever somebody gets hurt in the pit I always think of the Downtown Brown song Sit in the Pit.
there is not a tour manager in the world that would call the fans of the band "scary" or anything of the sort, ESPECIALLY not during a security briefing...
Just stopping by to say cheers, Tank!
Tank, I appreciate you being unbiased and trying to be objective. Something very difficult in today's social climate.
Thank you Tank for fence sitting and supporting your stance when there isn't obvious, certifiable proof of either sides account. It isn't an opinion, it's an actual event(s) that may or may not have happened and you can't just alienate the other side and what they say just because.
Duuuuuuude, I have been with you since your beard was about an inch. As you are a musical road crew professional you do have that insider view that most of us do not have. that being said, why in the lovely blue planet we reside in, are you getting involved in this matter. This is a no win scenario for anyone involved. I am 51 one years old right now and I understand that my knowledge is from back in the day. Pre-social networks we all knew that these kind of venues existed where security are assholes and many have been shutdown in the past by the bands. Now I am a major slayer fan and our moshpits then were one of the hardest out there, if you would go in, you will not come out of it unscathed. I remember one particular outing in Rotterdam the Netherlands where I wend in a group of 10, all of us had to go to the 1st aid section to get treatment, i myself got stitches in my hand. We all were treated and got back in there. Long story short: you are at a metal concert, shit happens! Security has become much better throughout the years, but assholes are everywhere and the venue has to deal with that. It would be better if all the bands at the venue just speak their mind to the venue, that the concert will stop, if security misbehaves. And just continue when that has been resolved right there and then. In closing, stand too close to the flames, you will get burned!
"You know what's going to happen,it's a pit."
Yeah but there are pits and then there are hard-core pits.
I have not heard these bands,also perhaps things have changed but in the 90's when I was going to shows there was a clear distinctive difference between a death metal pit and a hard-core pit.. Both can be violent however with hard-core,people are getting punched in face intentionally,knocked down and not necessarily helped back up..Whereas with death metal,even the most extreme bands,if you,rather when you get knocked down there is a sea of hands picking you up.. Even the over all vibe between the two was different..With death metal,we were there for the music and violence came with it however it seemed with hard-core that they were there for the violence and the music came with it...
I am simply commenting on the nature of hard-core pits and not on the incident at hand.
Venue says there’s security footage yet doesn’t want to bring that receipt into play… chooses to throw pity party instead… wouldn’t expect anything less from anyone who should be held accountable. It’s the trend of 2023
Stories like this and Blueridge are pretty interesting. It's like Tank the Heavy Metal Detective is on the case, shifting through the clues and getting to the bottom of things. To me, it kinda just looks like small things started going back-and-forth getting incrementally bigger and just snowballed out of control, a case of no one being "the bigger man" and "taking the high road."
I was listening to this video on my commute home from work. I am now home and situated on the couch with my dog. And I just cannot get over the fact that they said their security team didn't have flashlights. That ironically sounds like a safer issue.
that's a flat out lie. i was there, they had flashlights. And grey shirts that said "security" so there was no way we were getting security mixed up with road crew
You go ahead and fence-sit on this one Tank. You're doing ethical journalism here and trying to remain unbiased, allowing us to come to our own conclusions by getting as much information from all sides as possible.
You gave us a glimpse of the venue's easily searchable history with rough security over the years and the fact that everyone other than the venue is telling basically the same story. We also got to see two very different accounts of what happened by someone from the venue. I was already less inclined to believe the venue because of the fact so many eyewitnesses confirming what the band and crew are saying coupled with the history that the venue has with their security people...but their official statement and the one you were e-mailed giving two very different stories is just sus and pretty much guaranteed I wouldn't believe them. I get giving more information, but when that information not only contradicts the official statement but contains things so important that if they'd actually happened it should have been mentioned in the aforementioned statement I can't help but think the venue's story only took place in their imaginations.
Also, them saying you haven't been completely fair by looking at comments from people who were there so you could get eyewitness information was just uncalled for. Where else did they think you were going to get that information?
I don't recall a show I've ever been at where security didn't have flashlights. In my opinion, security would be incompetent if they didn't have them.
perfect morning, coffee, No class today, and an upload from Lord tank
I just went to see WCAR last night here in CO. Same bands, same energy, and everything was just freaking cool. Moshpits and crowd surfings just fine! 😅.
Scala in London UK had to fire their entire security. Im an accredited Press photographer and i got falsely accused of something i was not doing and was frog marched out, but I know they threw a photographer down the stairs.
When i was in the foyer i pulled my press card and head of security got nervous. I did way in on the twitter aka X feed on the Music Venue trust post on treatment of photographers.
I loved this "Saga." I was hooked.
Somone else said this down below, but if the issue was with the WCAR and other bands road crews, there would be issues at every venue and tour date, but it was just there.
I saw WCAR on the first Darkbloom tour, and this video made me greatly appreciate the security at my local venue. The guys they hire are so cool, check in with fans, talk with us and joke with us. JT from Erra even shouted out the security, and then proceeded ti make them work by telling us all to crowd serf. Not one complaint from security, the laughed and took it like champs. I even have a clip of one of the security gaurd jumping around to Black Hole XD
But this venue and just seems to trying to shift blame and not take any accountability
I just keep thinking about how Providence is still an old school mob town, and how the venue most likely hired their muscle, and that that prooooobably has something to do with why their security is constantly being too aggressive and yet the venue keeps protecting them.
As an example: A friend of mine moved into an apartment there and the next day her place was robbed while she was out. Her TV, her computer, everything valuable was gone. She told the landlord. The landlord said, "Don't talk to the cops. I'll get your stuff back." A few hours later, a couple of huge, scary looking dudes showed up with all her stuff. The landlord told her that would never happen again and that was that. She came to understand that somebody had robbed her without the mob's approval, so the mob went and found that somebody and rectified the situation for their client, the landlord.
Just saying, a lot of these discrepancies start to make more sense when you consider these security guards may be protected by somebody outside the venue.
Lol. It's really hard to explain Providence like that. But yeah there is still a mob feel at a lot of establishments / nightlife venues.
I don't think I'd be brazen enough to film security beating someone and not think I'd lose my phone and get beaten myself.
@@jayrific no question, I'd definitely avoid recording strangers up to questionable activity pretty much anywhere in Providence lol
Props to you for not giving in to social pressure to pick a side! Fence sitters unite against the world of emotional children!
I think you're more than cool letting us judge the info for ourselves and not putting a hardline take out there when you don't feel like you have enough info to do that.
14:41 I thought it was weird that some dudes building a road would get involved. Thanks for clarifying
I talked to some of the guys from archetypes collide and apparently security had also taped signs onto their stands on stage saying something along the lines of "no moshing, crowd surfing" without permission and they didn't notice until Kyle went to scream during one of their songs.
Back in the day when "Goth" was pretty much just post-Punk in black we had what was known as the "War Chicken" dance. I feel sorry for that lass that got clocked on the noggin. Sometimes the inner War Chicken comes out.
The admission about security clearing out before the crew would strike the stage says it all.
I’m just bummed that this incident happened like a WEEK after my band booked a headliner there for this Friday😅 We’ll see how it goes!
I would imagine it will be fine, considering this has happened and the venue is probably under a microscope right now.
Years ago I remember having a tough time with this venue. I played in some smaller local metal bands from 2006-2016 and in that time I had an opportunity to play there a handful of times. The first time I played at fete they made this big deal about moshing and they would point flashlights at anything that resembled moshing. We were explicitly told if we encouraged any kind of moshing we were done and would be kicked out. I no longer play in any bands but I remember this venue had kind of a bad rep with all the local bands because they were really douchy so when I saw this it didn’t surprise me.
Honestly I'm glad you didn't necessarily "pick a side". These videos you do are like watching the news for me, so I'd expect you to go over facts, argue points, then it's up to me to decide what to do with that information
Three minutes in and a big THUMBS UP for not picking sides!
Honest journalism should sit on the fence and cover both sides with equal fairness. I personally appreciate that both sides are being covered in this series, even if the conflict involved isn't big enough to be covered by national media sources.
Played a show there once, and at least at the time pretty sure the electrical outlets were not properly grounded. The entire set I was anxious that I was going to get zapped to oblivion.
At the same time its also very telling that the venue hasnt released any type of security footage. Especially, if their security team didnt do anything "wrong"/out of line.
“He is no longer with us” definitely sounds like they killed him lol 12:35
😂
So, anyone know about a history of any of the bands fighting with security elsewhere? Seems like we look for a common denominator here.
I've never toured with any of these bands, but I have friends that work at other venues that have had them before and I've never heard of anything like this happening with them.
Emmune's road crew has fought security once because a security staff member was creeping on under age fans at a festival but that was a one off situation and not on this tour.
I started going to shows in the early 80s and by the end of the 80s there were pits at many shows I went to. It was NEVER a problem at any of the venues I've attended (Diamond Ballroom, OKC - Myriad, OKC, Bricktown Live, OKC, Arena in Tulsa, OK - Deep Ellum Live, Dallas TX - Amphitheatre in Dallas TX - Amphitheatre, WPB FL - Bronco Bowl/Canyon Club, Dallas TX - many, many more locations around Texas and Oklahoma primarily). Why it's such a big deal now is confusing. Are people PUNCHING in pits now? That didn't used to be a thing..
I'm a licensed security guard and while they supposedly backpedaled on the statement about not escorting, we're trained (here in Australia at least) to have a second guard to escort someone out of a premises even if they're complying. You never know when that person may stop complying and try to overpower you, especially if they have received several warnings already. To be fair as well, they never said they didn't escort anyone. The statement reads "was not dragged, kicked, have his head smashed on the wall or the ground".
Bastards that DO use aggression like that give a shit name to our industry and I hope they get barred from being a guard ever again.
Edit: I do want to clarify that I also believe certain bits of this email don't sound right either. This is just to try and clear up the escort section.
That person has posted images of their injuries and bruises if that's security's gentle escort I don't want to know what they consider aggressive
I've run security years ago infact we've meet years ago I'd gladly talk to you about if you're interested!!! Thank you for all the great content
dubidubidu inspector tenktech 🤣