"Sun Tzu said that! And I think he knows a little more about draven than you do, pal, because he invented it! And permabanned it so no living racist can best him on the summoners rift!"
@@hunterkinsella5303 "Then he used his mom's credit card to buy every skin on his main, and then he joined a new game, and then he beat the crap out of every single one!"
One thing I really like about Draven's design is that it is also a very good, albeit unintentional life lesson. He is laud, obnoxious and overly aggressive and the way you win against him is by not engaging with him at all.
Cool dude but he's bad at showing these concepts. Says let me explain in fighting game terms and only shows smash and also the opposite concepts that he's trying to explain. Sometimes the stuff he says is straight up wrong, like when he mentioned soulcalibur in another video as an example of a game where stages don't matter when thats literally the only game where the stages *do* matter. Sometimes I can't tell if this guy is just trying to check off a weird list when he makes a video or what
Solo queue players are understandably risk-averse. They know that there's already a REALLY strong chance that they have a troll or rager on their team, and the last thing they need is to add a "go big or go home" champion pick to the mix.
idk about "understandably" there's this video by veritasium " Would You Take This Bet? " he asks people if they want to bet 10 dollars on a coin flip they all strongly disagree even when he ups it to 12 dollars to their 10 they disagree even at 15 to 10 they refuse and at 20 to 10 there's nothing understandable about it as far as I see it. why would you not take 50/50 odds to win 2x your money. if you keep taking those odds you'll infinitely gain more money
@@huathebard I think you're responding to me yeah you don't get 2x, but I'm saying if you're the adc and you're banning draven. or if you're on a team and you see your adc's hover and you still ban draven you're choosing to ban a 48% winrate (if you're in bronze/silver/gold) just because it feels bad to lose to him when he stomps I guess.
Ezreal and Draven players get hated by their pre pick because they are skill relying champions and for Draven is added risk taking into the mix and even some Ezreal players will take mor erisk than nessessary becaus of their E
@mysticflow467 that's probably because you dont seem to understand what 50/50 odds is. The net return of infinite flips would be $0, as you do not have a 50% chance of doubling your money anf 50% chance of nothing happening, you are staking $X on a 50% chance to recieve $X, which if it fails(as it will half the time, its a coin flip), the $X you staked is lost. Whether you keep the amount flat($10, $10, $10) or double it on every win($10, $20, $40) it's not likely to to work out for you. The first method you can technically come out ahead with enough tries, but you are just as likely to end with a net loss within a set of bets(and the guy offering the bet will drop out if you are coming out on top, so that he minimizes losses to an acceptable level), and for the second all it would take is one loss to set you back to zero. Quicker gains, but far more volatile(as you are using the winnings to increase the ante, which means that you dont have a pool in reserve to continue the gambling off of your winnings). And, for the record, 50/50 odds _are the bare minimum_ for an acceptable risk, as below that is the realm of desperation, and then below that is stupidity. Something being described as a coin flip in league is not used in a positive way, as it's inherently bad to give up control of a situation to gamble on lukewarm odds in a team game that is typically won based on skill in macro and micro mechanics...
Was looking for this comment. It's not a draven vid without it. (I would also properly capitalize his name as it should be but my d key is shot. I have it permabound to copy-paste.)
No other adc is oppressive as him when ahead in early game. If a good Draven gets a couple of kills in the laning phase the game is pertty much over. He's gonna twoshot everything from that point, so its better to avoid this nuisance and ban him.
yeah zed is definitely more of a menace than rengar. people try to say, you have to know how to play the champ to actually skyrocket. normally that is barely ever true. rengar is one of those few who it is ABSOLUTELY TRUE. zed... meh, not so much. riot always manages to overbuff him for the hardstuck master zed players then he ends up infesting all ranks like fire ants. rengar however, for better or for worse, still played by his otps, and they are actually good at him.
I just picked up Draven after playing zeri/aphelios ever since I started playing 9 months ago. I can say playing Draven just makes me more toxic bc of the power you have. I understand tyler1 now😭
I'm pretty sure junglers are the ones banning Draven the most. No matter what team Draven is on, if he's in the game both junglers are glued to botlane by force all game or they auto lose the game. That's just straight up not a fun way to play jungle.
That's exactly what I was gonna say. I feel like either on mine or the enemy team, draven is way more impactful than most other adcs and not playing around him is basically just coin flipping whether you win or lose a game and I feel like a lot of junglers(myself included) don't really like how that one pick makes you have to change your entire game plan
You're glued to botlane either way because botlane decides who gets dragons and since ADC is the DPS of the team also deciding in who gets Baron/Elder in the late game
It's not just Draven though, when I see an enemy playing Yasuo I typically just camp his lane by default (arguably I main mid and not jungle, but I find Yasuo players are often needlessly aggressive and fairly easy to gank).
Players want to have control over the course of the game but if win is decided by Draven getting kills or no, it take agency from other. It's not weird he is banned. BTW This it's so fitting that he is the center of attention considering his lore.
I remember a Kayn game where he wasn't even ahead, I had a pretty good Caitlyn x Senna against him and Janna. My botlane won lane so Draven moved to mid, got an Ahri shutdown, then roamed top and even when I killed him, he took my Garen with him. That was it. That was the end. He was 2 shooting everything from 4 screens away and suddenly he was 16/8 but still outdamaging Caitlyn. So fun I still remember it.
I've only met one handful of decent Draven mains and they're amazing to play with. Meanwhile, the toxic ones don't even try to hide their inept mechanics. I've had one that just wants to run directly at a Zyra and auto her to death. In a high Diamond lobby. Could imagine how that turned out.
Its just low elo brains logic. I play draven i must all in, either it works or it doesnt. High elo draven 1tricks know when to play aggro when to play safe. Mechanics are one thing but macro and game sense is the key to victory
Vid was spot on. Facing or playing with a Draven is always a scary situation as when you make 1 mistake, either against or as them, the lane is basically over.
I think it's important to mention that a reason draven doesn't scale well is just the way damage interacts with survivability, and how his kit kinda locks him into a certain play pattern. His midgame generally consists of him running AT people because he can actually afford to take their spells and still come away with the kill - the way axes work incentivize this. Running in lets you keep chaining them repeatedly, kiting with them artificially lowers your attack speed by moving you out of the enemies range, and not catching your axes isn't really an option. The later the game gets, the less he's able to actually stand his ground and the more forcing him to kite back and miss damage matters. He's very clunky to play later in the game because of this.
Yeah. Plus he is also purely single target burst with a pretty shit survivability, so Im running into the enemy team doesnt help. He is also not very good at dealing with tanks
As someone who used Draven to get to D1 back in s3-4 I always loved him. I don't play him anymore especially after the mentioned toxicity that came with T1 at the time but there's nothing, absolutely nothing that scares me more than seeing an enemy Draven because you know he's a ticking timebomb, except he has friendly fire on so he'll either absolutely blow up your team and make you feel absolutely miserable or get so tilted he'll singlehandedly lose the game.
Yeah, I do think is strength is over exaggerated at times. I've versed a Draven as a Jinx and I had no business doing anything that game, but if you just sit back and let him do his thing, 6,7-, or 8-minutes pass and he starts watering from the mouth thirsty for a kill and will just run into tower over and over again.
Mmmh, I might stop perma banning him when I play jinx to see this. Nothing better than getting a solo kill in midlane on a greedy assassin who dove u under turret. I imagine it's the same feeling.
It's worth noting Draven's old passive, where instead of spinning axes granting stacks of potential gold, they'd apply an infinitely stacking bleed instead, which was also applied whenever Draven landed a crit. It is interesting to me that while you make a lot of good points about how well designed his current passive is, and how well it ties into the rest of his character, but it wasn't even the passive he was originally intended to have.
I main draven and i get so geeky when i see him anywhere. He was the first champ i picked up and i still main him. I like to think i'm pretry decent but it is so hard because all supports just hide behind me and nobody picks engage supports
How lucky, meanwhile me as a jinx otp I get mages and engage supps then flame me because I cannot deal the same amount of Dmg as Draven on early game. And I'm like... I just wanted a lulu or a millio
One thing is incorrect, you dont only have 2 empowered autoattacks. You can juggle more than 2 axes if you activate Q while one autoattack is still flying so if you really want to you can juggle 3-4 axes if you build a lot of atkspeed.
Binary state champions feel bad. Assassins are often in that same boat. When a champion has severe advantage or disadvantage states it makes the game feel fragile and concluded long before the actual end screen.
I like the 'skill check' aspect of the game- if an opponent is better than me, they should win, and if I am better, I should win. Unfortunately there is nothing skillful in Q-empowered autoattack that literally takes 50% of my hp. I cannot kite, I cannot dodge that, and my dps is not as huge. No skill is cheched here. If I get too close I get one shot. Not because the enemy is better, but because it's Draven. That's why I hate him
Realistically these 1v9 or int champs have alot more to do with matchmaking than bad odds... If you're consistently playing well enough you can complain about a x/10 yasuo/yone/draven, you're probably getting bad teammates to fix your wr, and nobody has fond memories of a match against a 15/0 hypercarry
Love the idea for this series. Here are some champs I have “perma” banned for varying lengths of time throughout my league career of like a year and a half lol. Draven was perma ban for me at one point, then I realized I hate other champs more, Samira being one of them because absolutely fuck windwall abilities. Then I decided I hate blitzcrank more because while the previous two champs can be outplayed especially if you have a decent support player, blitzcrank just forces you to concede lane with how oppressive his presence is (no I am not gumayusi so I can’t just walk up and start pressuring them fully confident in my skills to dodge hook on reaction with 99% success rate, the rest of us mortals just have to agree that blitzcrank existing in lane makes your own existence unsafe) and finally right now I’m perma banning senna because she’s too broken, she has a decent enough early game to where she consistently scales into 1v9 hyper carry monstrosity status, and I find the way she just kills you from outside your screen in just 4-5 autos when she’s fed a little too frustrating. it’s also kinda toxic how she perma slows while also getting so much movement speed and healing from her build and runes and shit and she can build full lethality without sacrificing her late game scaling because her passive gives her an unholy amount of stats anyway :))))))))))))
I mean do you really need a series for this? Most if not all champs are going to be in the same category - "All damage, no utility and no neutral". It will be more interesting and informative if you pick champs that are banned more than expected for reasons not as obvious.
I am support main and i am happy when i have an Adc how loves action, in the early game. Maybe it is because i play champs like Nautilus (engager) and Pyke (play maker) the most with sometimes an enchanter in the mix ( and that is most the time Renata).
Should be a fun series to see champions from the perspective of ppl who ban them instead of pick. Im predicting to see maybe an episode on Yi, Shaco or Yone (lol)
I'm more of a Dota 2 watchet, but from what I see Draven is a mixture of Alchemist and Leigon Commander. Alchemist has a passive that gives him a little bit of extra gold when he kills creeps. This bonus increases every time he kills, up to a point, and goes away if he doesn't kill for a while. He's desinged to farms faster than anyone else in the game and use his overwheming net-worth to roll the enemy team before he get's outscaled. Legion has an Ult called Duel where she targets someone and forces both Legion and her target to autoattack each other until either the duration runs out, leaving no winners, or one of them dies. Whoever wins gain incresed Auto Attack damage with no limit as to how much damage one can have. She's desinged to get kills early on with her Ult to gain more damage, which makes it easier to get more kills, so on and so forth until she's dealing like, 500+ damage from just the ult alone, not even including items. With that in mind, Draven takes the gold generating ability of Alch, which insentevises Draven to kill creeps and lots of them, but lockes it behind killing another player like that of Legion's Ult, which incentivises agressive plays to secure player kills, even at the cost of his own. As lone as he dies second, he got his stack, and there's nothing you can do about it. Kill early, earn money, kill more. No kills, no money, no power, irellevent. Prime example of a snowball character. However, I feel there's one big flaw in his desing, which is that he HAS to get a kill before he can get his gold. It's not so much the requirement itself being the problem, it's the counterplay to it. Which is to simply not engage him. At all. It works thematically, Draven likes to show off, get's restless because he couldn't, plays stuipd when the chance arises for him to show off. But like, gameplay wises you want players to be actively engaging each other or find ways around each other and what not, so the counter-play being to simply leaveing them alone, at least until they join teamfights, idk, just kind of seems bad and supports toxicity. Cause if Draven's is on your team, you are now obliged to support him, else you're gonna be playing the game 4v5 and a masive gap in your teams networth. Draven players know this, and thus get's salty when their team don't give them the support they need. This happens a lot with Carries, understandably, but it's amplified with Draven as he can't just sit and farm all day, he NEEDS the kills, which is why Draven players can get even more salty than normal Bot lanes. If it was like, he can cash in half his stack when he destroys a Tower, then Draven players wouldn't be as toxic as they are now today, as that gives them another option, another path to power if the enemy team doesn't show itself, and gives a reason for the enemy to actaully engage and kill the Draven as to stop him before he can cash in his banked money. And in doing so, might've just given him the kill he desires in the first place. And this could be any tower, so if Draven's haven trouble finding kills, he can just rotate over to mid or top and help blow up the towers there. Now I think about it, all this is basically making Draven the center of why Team fights occures. Wherever Draven goes, blood will be spilled. Feels kind of fitting.
I'm pretty sure the bit at 9:50 about axes being capped is wrong. Yes, you can only have 2 stacks which is a big deal, but you then go on to say that you can only juggle 3 even if you're some kind of freak. If you're a freak and juggle perfectly, there IS NO LIMIT to how many axes you can be juggling. Only 2 can be held, but as many can be in the air as you want. As such it's SUPER niche and will VERY rarely actually come into practice, but esp if you're turning from Baron or smth you can build up a number of axes, and juggle 4 or 5 axes in theory.
I think another thing to add about Draven is that 99% of the time, the adc matchup doesn't matter, it's all about the support. For example if I'm playing Draven into Kai'sa (A great matchup for Draven) but I have a Janna that sits behind me doing nothing all game while Kai'sa has a Nautilus that gets pressure and roams, I legit can't play the game unless they're all squishy and just have to pray my team carries. On the other hand, if I'm playing Draven into Senna or Kog'Maw (bad matchups because you can't reach them) and my support is constantly setting up plays where I can actually auto them while their support is a Morgana who doesn't press E for example, it feels like the most free win ever even if the adc is actually good. Draven Is a champ that relies on support way more than other ADC's imo at least in early laning phase
Wallahi, Vars understands Draven Mains. He posted the first video of the series on The First Day of Ramadan. Ramadan Mubarak, my brothers and sisters. Whether in chains or embroidered in Gold, we shall make The Hajj.
Oh looks it's Draven, time to not interact and farm under tower and hope my support doesn't int a kill or after playing perfectly boring for 15 min get 4 man dove and Draven cashes out regardless. Definitely a great designed champion, at least I can interact with Yone in lane.
@@jamieeebaby1 Because for some reason a lot of you people cant comprehend that a characters state in the meta isnt the only thing that can make someone hate them. Yasuo is dog water, people still complain because WW and his E are annoying. Zed isnt good either, but he's still the most banned champ in the game because legit no one enjoys playing against Zed. I see this in every game where people for some reason think a characters state in the meta is everything and it just isnt. Some characters just arent fun to fight and will be despised no matter the balance state.
To be fair Draven is easily countered by engage supports as well as being high skill. If you manage to interrupt a Draven from catching his spinning axe he literally becomes one of the worst adc's in the game.
If Arcane's setting is Demacia what would it change. For my money: the story of the region, the champions places with in it, its goverment, its aesthetic, its history, everything except the champions personality. But what do you people think Arcane will change about Demacia?
i love fighting draven, if he doesen't get fed he falls apart mid to late game hard and it takes a skilled player to play him in the first place. Also his axes from personal experience makes him pretty predictable in team fights.
Another well designed part of draven is the vulnerability of his axes. Having to catch them shoes your opponents exactly where you want to be, allowing other champs such as hwei and neeko to punish that, or zone you off, thereby cutting your damage significantly
Can I request a video on the peculiar power curve of Pantheon? From playing him, he's powerful in laning phase and stat checks most opponents. In mid game, it feels like he lacks damage, utility and tankiness to the point he is merely a stun bot. However come late game, he excels in both team fights and split pushing, being able to lock down backline carries or peel for his own team. This I feel like goes against what is the usual scaling of every other champ (strong early -> weaker mid/late or vice versa).
One thing you forgot to mention is that way back trading with Draven was way worse because he used to have a bleed effect on his empowered autos. They actually removed this and replaced it with his current passive because his old one was far more oppressive in lane.
The annoying thing about playing against Draven is, that you win by playing the laning phase as boring as possible until you outscale him or he fucks up when trying to force interaction. As you said, if he doesn't win, he loses.
I'm a draven main since 2019 and the most tilting thing about him is precisely how the playarbase interact with his kit ( or the lack of), people, it seems, go out of their way to remove a draven player's advantage or possibility of getting kills as much as possible, it is quite rare for a jungler or support to actually help me, instead of stealing a kill whilst I have 250 stacks, wich, of course, is extremely tilting. That's why I hate playing it at emerald I.
I love Draven's design. He's so simple to understand yet impossibly hard to master with incredible execution of a unique gimmick. Fuck I hate fighting him so much man. Like my God you cannot walk up to the wave or you get run down hard it's so frustrating
Interesting tip about the axes is that it apparently follows where your mouse cursor is. So in this case since you’ll be kiting alternating between moving and attacking timing the cursor to where you want it to be to catch the ax is the key it having good uptime with his Q
A good way to balance Draven for us lower ELO schlubs (silver/gold) in my opinion would be to give him another 25 attack range, but also add 50 range to where his spinning axes can be spawned so he HAS to position himself more frequently in order to keep the uptime of his Q going, and is rewarded for that extra micro with a touch more range to really make sure he can do something against some very painful matchups where being within 500-550 range is just not plausible unless your team has managed to CC the target for like 6 seconds solid. Things like Jax, Briar, Lee Sin, Wukong, Renekton, Aatrox, Darius, Garen, Gwen etc when played well are impossible to kite and abuse the fact they know where you want to be by seeing the axe location to deny you resetting your axes, or punishing you for doing so with BIG damage or even being CC'd. They could also maybe tune his numbers a bit to be lower but scale a bit better with crit to get rid of the obnoxious Lethality Draven builds that I've seen about where he takes Hail of Blades and gets Hubris, Collector, Youmuu's, and Opportunity, and just pops his W and Youmuu's the moment he sees someone and sprints at them at like 800ms and deleted them with 2-3 autos before they can react, giving him infinitely stacking AD in the process.
My issue with fighting Draven is if you lose, your toplane bruiser gets the ADC experience of being 2 shot by autos. If you do what you're supposed to and just don't interact and feed him, you're also in an awkward position, because you're not necessarily winning lane. You're neutralised, and probably letting yourself get repeat pushed under tower so Draven doesn't suddenly Blood Rush towards you into a Q empowered auto to chunk you for free. Then all that waiting patiently gets thrown out the window when your Mid, Top or Jungle gets a bit too cocky and feeds Draven all those stacks he's built up over the course of the game. I also had an extremely upsetting experience where me and my duo tilted a Draven off the face of the planet by killing him and getting him to drop his stacks. He then claimed mid as his own and was rewarded for it. The Karma mid came bot instead, and a Janna/Karma lane felt impossible to interact with. Meanwhile Draven got to get fed for free by cashing in his newly gained stacks on our Zed. A huge lead thrown because the enemy ran it mid in rage and his team actually adapted to it. TL:DR, Losing against Draven sucks. Going even against Draven sucks. If you're not completely stomping Draven, he feels awful to play against. Also I dislike playing Draven as well, because it's not fun to get those giant stacks, only for the double kill to be yoinked by your Support and or Jungle. Needing the last hits to cash out sucks so bad.
The worst about draven is that... most adc do like a neutral trade specially with your creep pushing behind -_-, not untill pretty high elo around diamond people know to not let him kill even once
The description Spinning Axe isn't actually that accurate, you can only have 2 in arms, but in air you can have unlimited, with high attack speed juggling with 3 axes is not so uncommon to occur
As someone who used to main Draven for a long time but quit I feel the need to share my own opinions on the champion. Draven's super fun to play. The feast or famine is like crack cocaine. You get one game where you cash out and you're giga fed and bam, you're addicted forever. On the other hand...you have multiple games in a row where you're suffering from withdrawal. I can't count the number of times I've had my support or jungler steal a kill and when I spam ping passive they'll type something along the lines of "no one is going to just give you kills." At least, that line has permanently stuck with me from one of the times a jungler stole a kill that was guaranteed mine if they just didn't auto faster than me while I had 300+ stacks. Draven is honestly a pretty balanced champion in my opinion. He just suffers from the problem that no one wants to play around ADC anymore. They all want to play around their own individual win con...which is fair. You can't realistically put your trust in someone else to carry you. This is however, why I think Draven is a poorly designed champion. I would gladly take a nerf to the passive to allow it to work on assist and not just kill. Every other kill effect on the game works if you get the assist or kill. Draven's works differently because thematically it makes sense. Game-play wise, its miserable. Obviously this gets better in higher elos, but that is true for anything involving ADC. I do not think Draven mains are naturally toxic. I believe playing and maining Draven makes one become toxic. His passive is the main issue, but I think it stems from the fact that Draven is already a very mechanically intense champion. You have to be juggling axes. You need to time your Blood Rush to reset your Autos and not cancel them. You need to pre-emptively throw Stand Aside to not be jumped on and die. You even have a skill check on Whirling Death. You should time the recast to recall the blades with when they'll hit the enemy so you can guarantee hit them twice. (Doing it the normal way gives them plenty of time to flash/shield/heal. That is on top of the fact that if you're using it globally you already have to account for their pathing. His entire kit is mentally taxing and mastering it should reward you, however, it does not. The only thing that rewards you for being good at the champ is getting a cash out, which, in a lot of situations is completely out of your control. Your support's ignite might kill the target, you might not crit on your last auto, your team mates might take the kill (accidentally or on purpose), etc. There's too many variables to make it viable for you to play around Draven's passive reliably. You can force cash outs in a lot of situations if your team mates can punish mistakes and funnel gold to you, but almost no one in solo queue wants to do this. This ultimately is what makes Draven players toxic. The fact that they *have* to out-preform and do better than any other adc in the game while their reward is entirely situational and not guaranteed to be given to them. You can only lose 150+ stacks so many times in a play session before it sticks with you and makes you lose your mental. Other gold generating champions can more or less guarantee that they scale and get the gold they need. Gangplank can guarantee his Q one-shots casters pretty easily even when behind. Twisted Fate just has to kill minions to get his passive going. Both of them are balanced around having that extra gold. They do not have to play a minigame to generate that gold either. They have to do relatively simple combos to generate free gold and have much more utility/safer means to escape death. GP with his cleanse and TF with his gold card makes them relatively harder to gank and both aren't skill-based compared to Stand Aside which not only requires you to throw it before the target is on top of you, but also requires you to aim it.
@@killerkonnat This is true for literally any champion that is not Draven. Preventing a Draven from getting the last hit on a garunteed kill is absolutely not acceptable and is only going to harm your team's chance of winning.
Nice episode. Can next one be on Sion, please. One more thing, wouldn't heartsteal be broken on Draven? That should keep him relevant in the match. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Higher pickrate doesn't mean lower winrate, that's a very common misconception. Some of the most popular champs are also some of the most mained(and vice versa), zyra, lux, yasuo are all rather popular yet highly mained champs, the thing that a higher pickrate does is increase the possibility of getting destroyed by said champ, which usually increases frustration and banrate, "forcing" riot to nerf them
You forgot to mention that his axes become harder to catch in the late game since you have to dodge more skillshots on top of everyone having more movement speed.
personally i dont like banning draven because i play late game champs and when my duo and i see him locked in we play a super safe lane and just farm, the only time i get scared of draven is if there is a hook champ with him because blitz hook from under tower into a spinning axe is a surefire way to lose your entire lane but him going 0-0-0 is way more worth than losing minions
Ever since my ADC main friend started playing draven pyke with me, draven has been perma banned unless my friend is on him. I have seen what a somewhat competent draven does. I do not need to play against that ever. Once he backed for dirk it was just open season every single time on the enemy botlane. If I landed even a single hook that was a kill and essence reaver was soon to follow. We never lost or went even in lane without me absolutely turbo greifing. As long as I behaved we won. And of course occasionally I would turbo grief and then I'm looking in the shop on a gray screen and then this maniac gets a double kill on his own cause the enemy botlane doesn't know what a draven is
I played with exactly one draven main in my life and the way he wanted me to bodyblock the wave as Senna support told me all i needed to know about the people that play him. Moved to mid after that.
draven is also highly used by smurfs, contributing to his banrate. you can win against smurfs if they arent 2 items up and 3 shotting your tank midgame
I only ban Draven not because I’m bad at fighting Draven. But because if my Support over trades (which they usually do) and feed Draven the whole laning phase is over lol
I`m not even a Draven player, but I think he's one of if not so the best designed champion in the game His kit feels complete and cohesive, he has everything he needs, nothing more (no overloaded abilities and shenanigans) nothing less, and he fits perfectly into his role. And the best thing is, he requires skill and rewards not attacking standing still (trust me a lot of adc players do that) Not to say that his animations are so. damn. satisfiying! His autos have so much weight it's beautiful
" They are not banning Draven , they are banning the creature behind Draven". - Sun Tzu
True
I am banning the smurf on the enemy team and the animal on my own
As the creature, youre right, but im not happy about it
"Sun Tzu said that! And I think he knows a little more about draven than you do, pal, because he invented it! And permabanned it so no living racist can best him on the summoners rift!"
@@hunterkinsella5303 "Then he used his mom's credit card to buy every skin on his main, and then he joined a new game, and then he beat the crap out of every single one!"
One thing I really like about Draven's design is that it is also a very good, albeit unintentional life lesson. He is laud, obnoxious and overly aggressive and the way you win against him is by not engaging with him at all.
i never noticed this, thats really funny haha
Aside from the occasional "putting him in his place" moments.
You also win against him by having everyone try to kill him. Junglers perma bot
A literal bully, I love him
@legendarybanana37 to be fair that is literally the counterplay to every champion unless your name happens to be illaoi
"let me explain fighting game terms: advantage means advantage and disadvantage means disadvantage" lmao xD
Cool dude but he's bad at showing these concepts. Says let me explain in fighting game terms and only shows smash and also the opposite concepts that he's trying to explain. Sometimes the stuff he says is straight up wrong, like when he mentioned soulcalibur in another video as an example of a game where stages don't matter when thats literally the only game where the stages *do* matter. Sometimes I can't tell if this guy is just trying to check off a weird list when he makes a video or what
Solo queue players are understandably risk-averse. They know that there's already a REALLY strong chance that they have a troll or rager on their team, and the last thing they need is to add a "go big or go home" champion pick to the mix.
idk about "understandably"
there's this video by veritasium " Would You Take This Bet? "
he asks people if they want to bet 10 dollars on a coin flip they all strongly disagree
even when he ups it to 12 dollars to their 10 they disagree even at 15 to 10 they refuse and at 20 to 10
there's nothing understandable about it as far as I see it. why would you not take 50/50 odds to win 2x your money. if you keep taking those odds you'll infinitely gain more money
That logic is sound, but it’s not analogous to league. You don’t get twice as much as LP for winning with Draven on your team.
@@huathebard I think you're responding to me
yeah you don't get 2x, but I'm saying if you're the adc and you're banning draven. or if you're on a team and you see your adc's hover and you still ban draven
you're choosing to ban a 48% winrate (if you're in bronze/silver/gold)
just because it feels bad to lose to him when he stomps I guess.
Ezreal and Draven players get hated by their pre pick because they are skill relying champions and for Draven is added risk taking into the mix and even some Ezreal players will take mor erisk than nessessary becaus of their E
@mysticflow467 that's probably because you dont seem to understand what 50/50 odds is.
The net return of infinite flips would be $0, as you do not have a 50% chance of doubling your money anf 50% chance of nothing happening, you are staking $X on a 50% chance to recieve $X, which if it fails(as it will half the time, its a coin flip), the $X you staked is lost.
Whether you keep the amount flat($10, $10, $10) or double it on every win($10, $20, $40) it's not likely to to work out for you. The first method you can technically come out ahead with enough tries, but you are just as likely to end with a net loss within a set of bets(and the guy offering the bet will drop out if you are coming out on top, so that he minimizes losses to an acceptable level), and for the second all it would take is one loss to set you back to zero. Quicker gains, but far more volatile(as you are using the winnings to increase the ante, which means that you dont have a pool in reserve to continue the gambling off of your winnings).
And, for the record, 50/50 odds _are the bare minimum_ for an acceptable risk, as below that is the realm of desperation, and then below that is stupidity. Something being described as a coin flip in league is not used in a positive way, as it's inherently bad to give up control of a situation to gamble on lukewarm odds in a team game that is typically won based on skill in macro and micro mechanics...
Not Draven
Draaaaaaaven
Was looking for this comment. It's not a draven vid without it.
(I would also properly capitalize his name as it should be but my d key is shot. I have it permabound to copy-paste.)
Kleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed
Nah, just Kled
No other adc is oppressive as him when ahead in early game. If a good Draven gets a couple of kills in the laning phase the game is pertty much over. He's gonna twoshot everything from that point, so its better to avoid this nuisance and ban him.
agree
FF
@@GengUpinIpin”We don’t do that here.” 🤚🏾
@@Step43099 "it's ok bro, we scale"
You've never played against a good Kalista
I'm calling it next episode of this series will be on Zed
Knowing Vars Well,next Is Zed,then Yone.(I Remember that Yone has a High ban rate)
yeah zed is definitely more of a menace than rengar.
people try to say, you have to know how to play the champ to actually skyrocket. normally that is barely ever true.
rengar is one of those few who it is ABSOLUTELY TRUE.
zed... meh, not so much. riot always manages to overbuff him for the hardstuck master zed players then he ends up infesting all ranks like fire ants.
rengar however, for better or for worse, still played by his otps, and they are actually good at him.
I'm willing to bet we're gonna get Sion somewhere within the first 5 episodes of the series 😂
@@redrosewick Sion has a 0.4% ban rate
Maybe kasadin?
Draven, the all time king of toxicity , GG
Bad game.
I just picked up Draven after playing zeri/aphelios ever since I started playing 9 months ago. I can say playing Draven just makes me more toxic bc of the power you have. I understand tyler1 now😭
Katarina still Beats him
I enable it by playing Renata,
Bail out gives so much attack speed and move speed while rewards aggressive plays well suited for Draven.
@@dizzyheads I like renata with Draven.
"He's the darius of botlane". That's why they're brothers
Hes also the darius of toplane
@@xy5844 and mid XD
its so satisfying roflstomping a xerath, sylas or tf :'D
I'm pretty sure junglers are the ones banning Draven the most. No matter what team Draven is on, if he's in the game both junglers are glued to botlane by force all game or they auto lose the game. That's just straight up not a fun way to play jungle.
That's exactly what I was gonna say. I feel like either on mine or the enemy team, draven is way more impactful than most other adcs and not playing around him is basically just coin flipping whether you win or lose a game and I feel like a lot of junglers(myself included) don't really like how that one pick makes you have to change your entire game plan
You're glued to botlane either way because botlane decides who gets dragons and since ADC is the DPS of the team also deciding in who gets Baron/Elder in the late game
It's not just Draven though, when I see an enemy playing Yasuo I typically just camp his lane by default (arguably I main mid and not jungle, but I find Yasuo players are often needlessly aggressive and fairly easy to gank).
@@Wavinto was gonna write the same, these gluesniffing jglers srsly thinking they have time to gank top XDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDD
Players want to have control over the course of the game but if win is decided by Draven getting kills or no, it take agency from other. It's not weird he is banned.
BTW This it's so fitting that he is the center of attention considering his lore.
The balancing factor to that is that bot lane outcomes are almost entirely decided by the support, not the adc. Nobody wants to talk about that though
@@prismriot4910 dont forget the jgl^^
I remember a Kayn game where he wasn't even ahead, I had a pretty good Caitlyn x Senna against him and Janna. My botlane won lane so Draven moved to mid, got an Ahri shutdown, then roamed top and even when I killed him, he took my Garen with him.
That was it. That was the end. He was 2 shooting everything from 4 screens away and suddenly he was 16/8 but still outdamaging Caitlyn.
So fun I still remember it.
I've only met one handful of decent Draven mains and they're amazing to play with.
Meanwhile, the toxic ones don't even try to hide their inept mechanics. I've had one that just wants to run directly at a Zyra and auto her to death. In a high Diamond lobby. Could imagine how that turned out.
Its just low elo brains logic. I play draven i must all in, either it works or it doesnt. High elo draven 1tricks know when to play aggro when to play safe. Mechanics are one thing but macro and game sense is the key to victory
Vid was spot on. Facing or playing with a Draven is always a scary situation as when you make 1 mistake, either against or as them, the lane is basically over.
I think it's important to mention that a reason draven doesn't scale well is just the way damage interacts with survivability, and how his kit kinda locks him into a certain play pattern.
His midgame generally consists of him running AT people because he can actually afford to take their spells and still come away with the kill - the way axes work incentivize this. Running in lets you keep chaining them repeatedly, kiting with them artificially lowers your attack speed by moving you out of the enemies range, and not catching your axes isn't really an option. The later the game gets, the less he's able to actually stand his ground and the more forcing him to kite back and miss damage matters. He's very clunky to play later in the game because of this.
Yeah. Plus he is also purely single target burst with a pretty shit survivability, so Im running into the enemy team doesnt help. He is also not very good at dealing with tanks
As someone who used Draven to get to D1 back in s3-4 I always loved him. I don't play him anymore especially after the mentioned toxicity that came with T1 at the time but there's nothing, absolutely nothing that scares me more than seeing an enemy Draven because you know he's a ticking timebomb, except he has friendly fire on so he'll either absolutely blow up your team and make you feel absolutely miserable or get so tilted he'll singlehandedly lose the game.
New series? I dig it
Yeah, I do think is strength is over exaggerated at times. I've versed a Draven as a Jinx and I had no business doing anything that game, but if you just sit back and let him do his thing, 6,7-, or 8-minutes pass and he starts watering from the mouth thirsty for a kill and will just run into tower over and over again.
yeah after ~7 mins they give in and start running it down
Mmmh, I might stop perma banning him when I play jinx to see this. Nothing better than getting a solo kill in midlane on a greedy assassin who dove u under turret. I imagine it's the same feeling.
It's worth noting Draven's old passive, where instead of spinning axes granting stacks of potential gold, they'd apply an infinitely stacking bleed instead, which was also applied whenever Draven landed a crit. It is interesting to me that while you make a lot of good points about how well designed his current passive is, and how well it ties into the rest of his character, but it wasn't even the passive he was originally intended to have.
I main draven and i get so geeky when i see him anywhere. He was the first champ i picked up and i still main him. I like to think i'm pretry decent but it is so hard because all supports just hide behind me and nobody picks engage supports
How lucky, meanwhile me as a jinx otp I get mages and engage supps then flame me because I cannot deal the same amount of Dmg as Draven on early game. And I'm like... I just wanted a lulu or a millio
What an incredible choice of song! I LOVED the mirror b music in Gale of darkness 🤙
Great Video, I think Akali fits into this category of videos pretty well.
Would recognize Miror B's XD theme anywhere, great taste my dude!
Best theme in pokemon to this day man. XD
@@einjharrelraca so true !
One thing is incorrect, you dont only have 2 empowered autoattacks. You can juggle more than 2 axes if you activate Q while one autoattack is still flying so if you really want to you can juggle 3-4 axes if you build a lot of atkspeed.
true, this part really irked me
Binary state champions feel bad. Assassins are often in that same boat. When a champion has severe advantage or disadvantage states it makes the game feel fragile and concluded long before the actual end screen.
good video - i didnt listen to a single word you said but the music was jammin
I like the 'skill check' aspect of the game- if an opponent is better than me, they should win, and if I am better, I should win. Unfortunately there is nothing skillful in Q-empowered autoattack that literally takes 50% of my hp. I cannot kite, I cannot dodge that, and my dps is not as huge. No skill is cheched here. If I get too close I get one shot. Not because the enemy is better, but because it's Draven. That's why I hate him
Realistically these 1v9 or int champs have alot more to do with matchmaking than bad odds... If you're consistently playing well enough you can complain about a x/10 yasuo/yone/draven, you're probably getting bad teammates to fix your wr, and nobody has fond memories of a match against a 15/0 hypercarry
what a fun upbeat background song i wonder what other videos have used this for the background
i want that video
@@madman9220 lot of people do
Love the idea for this series. Here are some champs I have “perma” banned for varying lengths of time throughout my league career of like a year and a half lol. Draven was perma ban for me at one point, then I realized I hate other champs more, Samira being one of them because absolutely fuck windwall abilities. Then I decided I hate blitzcrank more because while the previous two champs can be outplayed especially if you have a decent support player, blitzcrank just forces you to concede lane with how oppressive his presence is (no I am not gumayusi so I can’t just walk up and start pressuring them fully confident in my skills to dodge hook on reaction with 99% success rate, the rest of us mortals just have to agree that blitzcrank existing in lane makes your own existence unsafe) and finally right now I’m perma banning senna because she’s too broken, she has a decent enough early game to where she consistently scales into 1v9 hyper carry monstrosity status, and I find the way she just kills you from outside your screen in just 4-5 autos when she’s fed a little too frustrating. it’s also kinda toxic how she perma slows while also getting so much movement speed and healing from her build and runes and shit and she can build full lethality without sacrificing her late game scaling because her passive gives her an unholy amount of stats anyway :))))))))))))
I mean do you really need a series for this? Most if not all champs are going to be in the same category - "All damage, no utility and no neutral". It will be more interesting and informative if you pick champs that are banned more than expected for reasons not as obvious.
I really like the idea of this series, can't wait to see and learn more.
I am support main and i am happy when i have an Adc how loves action, in the early game. Maybe it is because i play champs like Nautilus (engager) and Pyke (play maker) the most with sometimes an enchanter in the mix ( and that is most the time Renata).
Should be a fun series to see champions from the perspective of ppl who ban them instead of pick. Im predicting to see maybe an episode on Yi, Shaco or Yone (lol)
Isnt Pyke actually really bad with Draven since Draven wants the kill to proc his passive?
just dont steal the kill with pyke ult and he is a perfect supp for him
I'm more of a Dota 2 watchet, but from what I see Draven is a mixture of Alchemist and Leigon Commander.
Alchemist has a passive that gives him a little bit of extra gold when he kills creeps. This bonus increases every time he kills, up to a point, and goes away if he doesn't kill for a while. He's desinged to farms faster than anyone else in the game and use his overwheming net-worth to roll the enemy team before he get's outscaled.
Legion has an Ult called Duel where she targets someone and forces both Legion and her target to autoattack each other until either the duration runs out, leaving no winners, or one of them dies. Whoever wins gain incresed Auto Attack damage with no limit as to how much damage one can have. She's desinged to get kills early on with her Ult to gain more damage, which makes it easier to get more kills, so on and so forth until she's dealing like, 500+ damage from just the ult alone, not even including items.
With that in mind, Draven takes the gold generating ability of Alch, which insentevises Draven to kill creeps and lots of them, but lockes it behind killing another player like that of Legion's Ult, which incentivises agressive plays to secure player kills, even at the cost of his own. As lone as he dies second, he got his stack, and there's nothing you can do about it.
Kill early, earn money, kill more. No kills, no money, no power, irellevent. Prime example of a snowball character.
However, I feel there's one big flaw in his desing, which is that he HAS to get a kill before he can get his gold. It's not so much the requirement itself being the problem, it's the counterplay to it. Which is to simply not engage him. At all. It works thematically, Draven likes to show off, get's restless because he couldn't, plays stuipd when the chance arises for him to show off. But like, gameplay wises you want players to be actively engaging each other or find ways around each other and what not, so the counter-play being to simply leaveing them alone, at least until they join teamfights, idk, just kind of seems bad and supports toxicity. Cause if Draven's is on your team, you are now obliged to support him, else you're gonna be playing the game 4v5 and a masive gap in your teams networth. Draven players know this, and thus get's salty when their team don't give them the support they need. This happens a lot with Carries, understandably, but it's amplified with Draven as he can't just sit and farm all day, he NEEDS the kills, which is why Draven players can get even more salty than normal Bot lanes.
If it was like, he can cash in half his stack when he destroys a Tower, then Draven players wouldn't be as toxic as they are now today, as that gives them another option, another path to power if the enemy team doesn't show itself, and gives a reason for the enemy to actaully engage and kill the Draven as to stop him before he can cash in his banked money. And in doing so, might've just given him the kill he desires in the first place. And this could be any tower, so if Draven's haven trouble finding kills, he can just rotate over to mid or top and help blow up the towers there.
Now I think about it, all this is basically making Draven the center of why Team fights occures. Wherever Draven goes, blood will be spilled. Feels kind of fitting.
I'm pretty sure the bit at 9:50 about axes being capped is wrong. Yes, you can only have 2 stacks which is a big deal, but you then go on to say that you can only juggle 3 even if you're some kind of freak. If you're a freak and juggle perfectly, there IS NO LIMIT to how many axes you can be juggling. Only 2 can be held, but as many can be in the air as you want. As such it's SUPER niche and will VERY rarely actually come into practice, but esp if you're turning from Baron or smth you can build up a number of axes, and juggle 4 or 5 axes in theory.
Just curious are you going to do a vs video again? If so, I have an idea, Ornn vs Volibear, the demigod siblings.
the editing on this is phenomenal
youre making me want to play draven sooooo bad rn man 😭
I think another thing to add about Draven is that 99% of the time, the adc matchup doesn't matter, it's all about the support. For example if I'm playing Draven into Kai'sa (A great matchup for Draven) but I have a Janna that sits behind me doing nothing all game while Kai'sa has a Nautilus that gets pressure and roams, I legit can't play the game unless they're all squishy and just have to pray my team carries. On the other hand, if I'm playing Draven into Senna or Kog'Maw (bad matchups because you can't reach them) and my support is constantly setting up plays where I can actually auto them while their support is a Morgana who doesn't press E for example, it feels like the most free win ever even if the adc is actually good. Draven Is a champ that relies on support way more than other ADC's imo at least in early laning phase
Wallahi, Vars understands Draven Mains. He posted the first video of the series on The First Day of Ramadan. Ramadan Mubarak, my brothers and sisters. Whether in chains or embroidered in Gold, we shall make The Hajj.
Oh looks it's Draven, time to not interact and farm under tower and hope my support doesn't int a kill or after playing perfectly boring for 15 min get 4 man dove and Draven cashes out regardless. Definitely a great designed champion, at least I can interact with Yone in lane.
draven sucks rn I don't even know how u could complain about the champ
@@jamieeebaby1 Because for some reason a lot of you people cant comprehend that a characters state in the meta isnt the only thing that can make someone hate them. Yasuo is dog water, people still complain because WW and his E are annoying. Zed isnt good either, but he's still the most banned champ in the game because legit no one enjoys playing against Zed.
I see this in every game where people for some reason think a characters state in the meta is everything and it just isnt. Some characters just arent fun to fight and will be despised no matter the balance state.
To be fair Draven is easily countered by engage supports as well as being high skill. If you manage to interrupt a Draven from catching his spinning axe he literally becomes one of the worst adc's in the game.
@@Vaestus lowbob in ear
that goes for any lane bully really
They really cooked with the mirror B theme, i just listened to 14 mins of it and was ready for more
Excellent choice of background music
For anyone wondering what the music for the video is, it is Mirror B from Pokemon XD Gale of Darkness.
4:38 i know hes got spinning "axes" but thats gotta be the manliest run i have ewer seen
1% crit runes with full ad meant you could sometimes 1 shot someone at lvl 1 with Draven when he had a bleed passive. Fun times.
what was his passive?
Had to watch for a second time. I was too busy vibin to Mirror B theme
Really nice concept and analysis! Keep it up 🎉
If Arcane's setting is Demacia what would it change. For my money: the story of the region, the champions places with in it, its goverment, its aesthetic, its history, everything except the champions personality. But what do you people think Arcane will change about Demacia?
As a draven main watching this is just repeating "welcome to the league of draven" For 10 minutes, really good video
i love fighting draven, if he doesen't get fed he falls apart mid to late game hard and it takes a skilled player to play him in the first place. Also his axes from personal experience makes him pretty predictable in team fights.
Another well designed part of draven is the vulnerability of his axes. Having to catch them shoes your opponents exactly where you want to be, allowing other champs such as hwei and neeko to punish that, or zone you off, thereby cutting your damage significantly
Can I request a video on the peculiar power curve of Pantheon? From playing him, he's powerful in laning phase and stat checks most opponents. In mid game, it feels like he lacks damage, utility and tankiness to the point he is merely a stun bot. However come late game, he excels in both team fights and split pushing, being able to lock down backline carries or peel for his own team. This I feel like goes against what is the usual scaling of every other champ (strong early -> weaker mid/late or vice versa).
One thing you forgot to mention is that way back trading with Draven was way worse because he used to have a bleed effect on his empowered autos. They actually removed this and replaced it with his current passive because his old one was far more oppressive in lane.
Sayong "neutral" and showing it for a total of 2 seconds till Luigi hit his grab was hilarious.
Draven is the embodiment of "I gain more lp making this game end faster than you trying to save it."
The annoying thing about playing against Draven is, that you win by playing the laning phase as boring as possible until you outscale him or he fucks up when trying to force interaction. As you said, if he doesn't win, he loses.
Help me, brothers - I hear those spinning axes calling my name again. I don’t know if I’m strong enough to resist…
I'm a draven main since 2019 and the most tilting thing about him is precisely how the playarbase interact with his kit ( or the lack of), people, it seems, go out of their way to remove a draven player's advantage or possibility of getting kills as much as possible, it is quite rare for a jungler or support to actually help me, instead of stealing a kill whilst I have 250 stacks, wich, of course, is extremely tilting.
That's why I hate playing it at emerald I.
100 % true lmao.. you get ganked 50 times over a span of 8 games but your own jg ganked for you 7 times maybe in that same span...
Q and R are some of the most fun abilities in the game for me and being able to parry enemy dashes with stand asside is pretty fun too.
As someone who plays enchanters and mages, I perma ban Blitzcrank. Would be fun to see a video on him in the series.
My first thought of a champ banned regardless of win rate was Zed. I could never pick that champ up because he was always banned.
Love the Pokemon gale of darkness theme u have in ur background
Would love to see a video about Kassadin and the shutdown system in general
I love Draven's design. He's so simple to understand yet impossibly hard to master with incredible execution of a unique gimmick.
Fuck I hate fighting him so much man. Like my God you cannot walk up to the wave or you get run down hard it's so frustrating
Interesting tip about the axes is that it apparently follows where your mouse cursor is. So in this case since you’ll be kiting alternating between moving and attacking timing the cursor to where you want it to be to catch the ax is the key it having good uptime with his Q
its the direction you are facing, like riven Q, not the cursor position
A good way to balance Draven for us lower ELO schlubs (silver/gold) in my opinion would be to give him another 25 attack range, but also add 50 range to where his spinning axes can be spawned so he HAS to position himself more frequently in order to keep the uptime of his Q going, and is rewarded for that extra micro with a touch more range to really make sure he can do something against some very painful matchups where being within 500-550 range is just not plausible unless your team has managed to CC the target for like 6 seconds solid. Things like Jax, Briar, Lee Sin, Wukong, Renekton, Aatrox, Darius, Garen, Gwen etc when played well are impossible to kite and abuse the fact they know where you want to be by seeing the axe location to deny you resetting your axes, or punishing you for doing so with BIG damage or even being CC'd.
They could also maybe tune his numbers a bit to be lower but scale a bit better with crit to get rid of the obnoxious Lethality Draven builds that I've seen about where he takes Hail of Blades and gets Hubris, Collector, Youmuu's, and Opportunity, and just pops his W and Youmuu's the moment he sees someone and sprints at them at like 800ms and deleted them with 2-3 autos before they can react, giving him infinitely stacking AD in the process.
My issue with fighting Draven is if you lose, your toplane bruiser gets the ADC experience of being 2 shot by autos.
If you do what you're supposed to and just don't interact and feed him, you're also in an awkward position, because you're not necessarily winning lane. You're neutralised, and probably letting yourself get repeat pushed under tower so Draven doesn't suddenly Blood Rush towards you into a Q empowered auto to chunk you for free. Then all that waiting patiently gets thrown out the window when your Mid, Top or Jungle gets a bit too cocky and feeds Draven all those stacks he's built up over the course of the game.
I also had an extremely upsetting experience where me and my duo tilted a Draven off the face of the planet by killing him and getting him to drop his stacks. He then claimed mid as his own and was rewarded for it. The Karma mid came bot instead, and a Janna/Karma lane felt impossible to interact with. Meanwhile Draven got to get fed for free by cashing in his newly gained stacks on our Zed. A huge lead thrown because the enemy ran it mid in rage and his team actually adapted to it.
TL:DR, Losing against Draven sucks. Going even against Draven sucks. If you're not completely stomping Draven, he feels awful to play against.
Also I dislike playing Draven as well, because it's not fun to get those giant stacks, only for the double kill to be yoinked by your Support and or Jungle. Needing the last hits to cash out sucks so bad.
1 intresting point vars didnt go into is how much diffrence it could be if draven had his old bleed passive still
"which is why adcs are often accompanied by their supports"
The adc with the perma roaming supp getting, dived again: 👁👄👁
Idk what song plays throught the video but is so good, it realy fits Draven
As a Renata player there's no one i like laning with more than my friend who is a Draven main. The sheer insanity of the duo is so fun.
Darius is an obvious one to do an episode on later. Maybe Master Free too.
I enjoyed the talk about neutral.
The worst about draven is that... most adc do like a neutral trade specially with your creep pushing behind -_-, not untill pretty high elo around diamond people know to not let him kill even once
Next video should be about Season 3 Kassadin who achieved a historical record of nigh legitimate permaban that peaked at 99.55%
The description Spinning Axe isn't actually that accurate, you can only have 2 in arms, but in air you can have unlimited, with high attack speed juggling with 3 axes is not so uncommon to occur
I like how of all things, Draven players don't complain about him being banned 24/7 compared to Zed players.
As someone who used to main Draven for a long time but quit I feel the need to share my own opinions on the champion. Draven's super fun to play. The feast or famine is like crack cocaine. You get one game where you cash out and you're giga fed and bam, you're addicted forever. On the other hand...you have multiple games in a row where you're suffering from withdrawal. I can't count the number of times I've had my support or jungler steal a kill and when I spam ping passive they'll type something along the lines of "no one is going to just give you kills." At least, that line has permanently stuck with me from one of the times a jungler stole a kill that was guaranteed mine if they just didn't auto faster than me while I had 300+ stacks.
Draven is honestly a pretty balanced champion in my opinion. He just suffers from the problem that no one wants to play around ADC anymore. They all want to play around their own individual win con...which is fair. You can't realistically put your trust in someone else to carry you. This is however, why I think Draven is a poorly designed champion. I would gladly take a nerf to the passive to allow it to work on assist and not just kill. Every other kill effect on the game works if you get the assist or kill. Draven's works differently because thematically it makes sense. Game-play wise, its miserable. Obviously this gets better in higher elos, but that is true for anything involving ADC.
I do not think Draven mains are naturally toxic. I believe playing and maining Draven makes one become toxic. His passive is the main issue, but I think it stems from the fact that Draven is already a very mechanically intense champion. You have to be juggling axes. You need to time your Blood Rush to reset your Autos and not cancel them. You need to pre-emptively throw Stand Aside to not be jumped on and die. You even have a skill check on Whirling Death. You should time the recast to recall the blades with when they'll hit the enemy so you can guarantee hit them twice. (Doing it the normal way gives them plenty of time to flash/shield/heal. That is on top of the fact that if you're using it globally you already have to account for their pathing. His entire kit is mentally taxing and mastering it should reward you, however, it does not. The only thing that rewards you for being good at the champ is getting a cash out, which, in a lot of situations is completely out of your control. Your support's ignite might kill the target, you might not crit on your last auto, your team mates might take the kill (accidentally or on purpose), etc. There's too many variables to make it viable for you to play around Draven's passive reliably. You can force cash outs in a lot of situations if your team mates can punish mistakes and funnel gold to you, but almost no one in solo queue wants to do this. This ultimately is what makes Draven players toxic. The fact that they *have* to out-preform and do better than any other adc in the game while their reward is entirely situational and not guaranteed to be given to them. You can only lose 150+ stacks so many times in a play session before it sticks with you and makes you lose your mental.
Other gold generating champions can more or less guarantee that they scale and get the gold they need. Gangplank can guarantee his Q one-shots casters pretty easily even when behind. Twisted Fate just has to kill minions to get his passive going. Both of them are balanced around having that extra gold. They do not have to play a minigame to generate that gold either. They have to do relatively simple combos to generate free gold and have much more utility/safer means to escape death. GP with his cleanse and TF with his gold card makes them relatively harder to gank and both aren't skill-based compared to Stand Aside which not only requires you to throw it before the target is on top of you, but also requires you to aim it.
Killstealing does not exist. It's a myth for toxic low-rank players.
@@killerkonnat This is true for literally any champion that is not Draven. Preventing a Draven from getting the last hit on a garunteed kill is absolutely not acceptable and is only going to harm your team's chance of winning.
12:26 I wanna know how many takes it took for that line. You could hear Vars begin to corpse right at the end
Miss his old bleeding passive with crit. It made it more like him and his brother we're actually Brothers
Nice episode. Can next one be on Sion, please. One more thing, wouldn't heartsteal be broken on Draven? That should keep him relevant in the match. Correct me if I'm wrong.
never heard of sion being banned much. i think darius, vayne, akali, zed, or any of the horsewomen would be more likely candidates
Higher pickrate doesn't mean lower winrate, that's a very common misconception. Some of the most popular champs are also some of the most mained(and vice versa), zyra, lux, yasuo are all rather popular yet highly mained champs, the thing that a higher pickrate does is increase the possibility of getting destroyed by said champ, which usually increases frustration and banrate, "forcing" riot to nerf them
idk if its just me but the music is so fitting for draven
SONG IS “MIRROR B. BATTLE THEME” ITS FROM POKÉMON XD: GALE OF DARKNESS. YW!
You forgot to mention that his axes become harder to catch in the late game since you have to dodge more skillshots on top of everyone having more movement speed.
Can't wait for the Permanently Banned Morgana episode
soo how do u win lane if u statistically can not kill him first? (no jgl intervention) if he doesnt fck something up.
personally i dont like banning draven because i play late game champs and when my duo and i see him locked in we play a super safe lane and just farm, the only time i get scared of draven is if there is a hook champ with him because blitz hook from under tower into a spinning axe is a surefire way to lose your entire lane but him going 0-0-0 is way more worth than losing minions
Man I love this dudes voice, it calms me 😤
“Mah ass hurt” - probably sun tzu at some point
Droben
Ever since my ADC main friend started playing draven pyke with me, draven has been perma banned unless my friend is on him. I have seen what a somewhat competent draven does. I do not need to play against that ever. Once he backed for dirk it was just open season every single time on the enemy botlane. If I landed even a single hook that was a kill and essence reaver was soon to follow. We never lost or went even in lane without me absolutely turbo greifing. As long as I behaved we won. And of course occasionally I would turbo grief and then I'm looking in the shop on a gray screen and then this maniac gets a double kill on his own cause the enemy botlane doesn't know what a draven is
Nothing feels better than fighting with 3 spinning axes at the same time
" Pick a god and pray cause u about to meet em" had me in tears
I played with exactly one draven main in my life and the way he wanted me to bodyblock the wave as Senna support told me all i needed to know about the people that play him. Moved to mid after that.
Sigma Draven made you role swap lmao
he told you what you should be doing
Lol yeah i guess
If he didn’t get 3 nerfs back to back was there going to be a why everyone is playing teemo
draven is also highly used by smurfs, contributing to his banrate. you can win against smurfs if they arent 2 items up and 3 shotting your tank midgame
I only ban Draven not because I’m bad at fighting Draven. But because if my Support over trades (which they usually do) and feed Draven the whole laning phase is over lol
I`m not even a Draven player, but I think he's one of if not so the best designed champion in the game
His kit feels complete and cohesive, he has everything he needs, nothing more (no overloaded abilities and shenanigans) nothing less, and he fits perfectly into his role. And the best thing is, he requires skill and rewards not attacking standing still (trust me a lot of adc players do that)
Not to say that his animations are so. damn. satisfiying! His autos have so much weight it's beautiful