Tesla with LFP battery achieves RECORD breaking efficiency in highway test
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- Опубліковано 11 вер 2024
- Tesla with LFP battery achieves RECORD breaking efficiency in highway test
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We're first time EV owners. Took delivery of a '24 M3 RWD with the LFP. It's an amazing car IMO. Yes, the battery is already obsolete, but it performs better than advertised. That probably says more about the rapid technological developments that EV makers face than it says about Tesla producing crap. Tesla will probably switch to the M3P LFP battery within the next 6-12 months.
I'm a retired petroleum engineer. Fossil fuels are a rip off. Don't be afraid to switch. Tesla's ride better, are safer, are 7x more efficient, are maintenance free, etc. The combined effect of the new model 3 and FSD V12.5.1.3 is amazing. Throw in UA-cam Music and suddenly driving is the most relaxing thing I do all day. I can listen to The Electric Viking while driving.
Ignore the trolls!
I had a 2019 "Series 1" Fremont Model 3 RWD with the original Lion "standard range" battery - without trying hard I used to get 250wh / mile or 4 miles per KWH. A genuine 250+ miles range.
I can listen to the Electric Viking while driving my diesel SUV! lol
Looking forward to 5 minute recharges and 350 mile range. By then my 2023 gas truck will ripe for replacement. I wonder if anyone will want my old truck? lol. Maybe I'll donate it to a museum.
While I like my Tesla Model Y for its technology (i.e., FSD 12.5.1.3) they are not maintenance-free. The maintenance is different.
@henrylawson430 our model 3 uses
Tesla is amazing. They started from 0, no experience, no workers, no technology, no factories. Now they can compete with anyone.
Everyone learnt from them, should have patients, Tesla is a cool car for sure.
And it took only 10 years... 😁 Chinese 2 years.
@@xaviart4727oh those copycats 🤔
I grew up in Detroit during the 1960s and 1970s and have followed advances in the automotive industry closely for many years. I wondered why Tesla has done what no other US automaker seems to be able to do. About two years ago I looked at the demographics of Tesla and GM and Ford. One thing stood out: the average age of their engineers: GM & Ford the average age of an engineer was 54. At Tesla it was 31.
That says a lot about Tesla's advantage over the others and why their cars fart.😊
You make it sound like they started with absolutely nothing. I would look into how much taxpayer money we put into this business. Give me millions of dollars of taxpayer money and I guarantee you I will make a successful business. As a matter of fact, anyone could.
Hi we just did a trip from Perth Western Australia to Brisbane, Sydney, Canberra, Melbourne, Adelaide and back to Perth via Albany… more than 12000km (~7,500 miles) on the hwy we mostly did 110km/h and averaged 155w/km not bad for a Late 2021 STD range LFP model 3. So that figure is no surprise for the much updated model 3. By far the best and most reliable car I have ever owned and my last few cars were new Toyota Corolla and several VW Golf’s all noted as good all rounders and very reliable but not even close to the Tesla. I know it’s twice as much but near zero maintenance, never been back to the dealer ever since new no issues at all and near zero fuel costs we have solar on our house really takes some beating. Plus it is a better car now after more than 10 free updates since new adding several new features including safety features. A great car.
Amazing. After all these years, the Tesla Model 3 is still the gold standard, but you know, haters are gonna hate. It's what they do.
Like you said the haters are gonna hate even the truth is in front of their faces.
New model 3 is by far the bomb of the world , 99.9% of the world don’t have a clue how incredible it is
Nothing special. Small drag area. CW 0.22 front area 2.22m2.
Elon still won’t fuck you bro
It's just new technology for you. It's a nice car, but there are more cool and fun cars out there. Even gas ones...
@@georgevigil7001there are better ICEs? As a TM3 owner who got my car last month, and someone who had driven all kinds of cars, I can tell you there is no ICE out there below $150,000 that is better than a TM3. I agree with with Hector - 100% with you the new TM3 is insanely good.
@@jamesgallagher2434 Are you saing 0-60 or overall?
Hi Sam, I can attest to Tesla efficiency. We have had our 2022 Dual Motor Model 3 for 28 months, and live in a northern climate (Ohio). Our lifetime average over 23,000 miles is 220 Wh/mile (4.55 mile/kWh). Couldn’t be happier with it.
The Low Consumption is probably a result of very high Aerodynamic Efficiency, low weight, 18 inch wheels, motor efficiency and great software and tuning of the systems.
exactly it has nothing to do with the battery chemistry
@@joeblack4026 well its not nothing the the batteries do heat up and that is waste energy but yeah we are speaking of a percent or so.
I own M3RWD 2023. I use FSD everyday. I cannot see myself driving any other car. I get about 4.0 to 4.5 miles per kWh. Amazing 😻
FSD is trash Elon lied people died
You're putting your life at risk it's absolutely garbage 12.3 is a joke
@@jeffufcfanaticrosenberg All of the stats say otherwise
Big Oil Industry TROLL! Trolls are the most pathetic losers.
This video is correct, no bullshit or click bait, to get a good idea you can take a vehicle's efficiency over a long journey, and to get accurate numbers it has to be done under all weather conditions and temperatures.
So i will help here, I have a model Y std range LFP battery bought 22/2/2023, it's now 21/08/2024 so about as much winter as summer.
It has 18,000 miles on the clock and has averaged 218 wh to the mile so 4.587 miles to the kwh in normal driving.
I don't drive like a pensioner or like a racing driver.
Which country are you in? Would be interested to know how much road tripping you do ( say 200 mile round trip journeys). I’m in the UK and have a GV60 Premium RWD (June 2022) with 77.4kWh NMC chemistry with similar mileage and after 2 years getting 3.5mi/kWh I do 70mph on the motorway typically road trip weekly on average during the UK Summer.
SUV shape of GV60 and greater weight but shows the efficiency of Tesla.
@@Antiguan_Dart Good afternoon, I live in the UK, quite a few trips to LHR and Stanstead 200 and 300. The last 3000 miles it's been up to 5 mpkwh but that summer, and must be both to be fair.
Bjorn Nyland is the Daddy of all ev testers,it was him who when testing the bz4 discovered you couldnt fast charge more than once during a 24 hour peroid ,he emailed toyota @ night and they came up with a software fix,he had to completly redo his 1000km test,it wouldnt harm you to pin a link for his latest Tesla video either :)
113Wh/km @ 90Km/h is insanely good!!!
who cares? we want new design
Worse than a 2012 Nissan leaf.
10kw consumption at 90 kmph.
LFP are great batteries.
LFP efficiency is getting very good lately.
this crap batteries are not recyclable, pure waste, they must be banned.
@MrVanre That's 1000% inaccurate.
There are multiple methodologies for recycling LFP cells.
Great for cost and longevity. Performance is...meh
@@MrVanre LOL - LFP batteries are 95%+ recyclable, they are actually being recycled right now into black mass with an over 95% recovery rate.
I Remember that Bjorn did what he calls a Sunday Drive in Thailand with an MG4 51kwh, and did 435km or 11.4kw/100km i.e. 80km/hr. CATL rubic cube LFP battery.
The new model 3 does have a new motor. It has been enhanced. I have a Highland and use it to go to the office 3 times a week, errands, church and going out. I only charge every 10 days up to 65 percent and have about 30 percent left. I have the 2170 NMA batteries and have no problem at all.
I don't believe there was any change to the motors or batteries. The performance version gained a new RWD motor but unfortunately no upgrade to the batteries which suffer under extreme load.
@@GDM22 - Actually - no there was a revision to the motors in the highland upgrade - more efficient and the batteries are just fine. I have the LR version and I have had consistent charging, range and performance. The 2170 battery in the Model 3 was changed from NMC to NMA.
@@RagnarinVa I have watched numerous reviews, there is no evidence they are quicker or any more efficient, and I read no change to batteries or motors. The Highland would get slightly better efficiency at speed due to 5% better aero.
@@GDM22 - There were improvements made to the original motor - reflecting similar improvements to motors in other models in addition to new suspension, new rear frame, new wheel frame and brake hubs, new suspension bushings, reworked rear frame, and the changes to the body improved drag.
@@RagnarinVa I am aware of all the other changes, if you are aware of changes to the motors, post the old (23 build) and new code. Obviously we are talking about the Shanghai version.
The model 3 is very impressive for efficiency. I have just over 11,000km on a long range highland with 18 inch rims. Life time consumption is 125wh per km. I think this equates to 5 miles per kw.
In some ways it’s a shame that they use old battery tech. I was okay with it as I know it’s tried and tested. We have proven data on the batteries reliability.
I am loving the Range from my LR RWD. drive 100 mi each way drive about 70 mph and avg 180 kwh. my battery was showing 217 mi left when I got to work but the Range estimator said over the last 30 mi you will get 264 miles projected. !!!!!!! Tampa FL. my 2021 M3 could not do this
Sadly we cannot get that spec in the UK. This would be my preference - LR RWD
@@user-jt4fy4od9r Sure you can - the Long Range RWD (with the NMC pack) was first released in in Europe (and UK) around 4 years ago, It was the most common fleet offering from Tesla, not available on the website to configure but often showed up as inventory cars.
@@TB-up4xi Thanks for this - I will keep my eyes open!
j'ai une Hgl 2024 rwd 18" Je peux confirmer ces chiffres sur mes dernier voyages !!! 320 km à 100kmh réelles de moyenne autoroute 129 wh/km soit 4.82 mi/kwh !
Sur la période depuis avril 2024 12070km moyenne 4.78 mi/kwh route autoroute 110.
en circulation 90 autour de paris je fais du 5.55 mi/kwh !!!
Donc autant qu'une ioniq 28 de l'époque !!
Et la qualité de roulage est 2x meilleure que ma LR RWD 2019 !
LFP is naturally very efficient as a chemistry. Pair that with aerodynamic efficiency and you have a very good package.
LFP is naturally very low-density, the worst of all types. Elon uses them because they are the cheapest possible battery. He wants to bud them as cheap as possible.
@@sandyfordd1843 LFP is also a far safer chemistry. It doesn't oxidise in decomposition and is far less prone to thermal runaway than other chemistries, namely NCM.
NMC bat in TM3 has almost the same efficiency!
@@sandyfordd1843 LFP batteries are far superior to other chemistries from a chemical stability perspective with 3 times the duty cycle of an NMC or NCA battery.
@@TB-up4xi yes, LFP are perfect for stationary devices like power walls. Cheap and low density.
Please always add metrics in the metric system as well! There are only THREE countries in the world who still uses the imperial system. :) Love your channel even though I cannot keep up with all videos.
5100klm on the odometer 80% highway driving. Current consumption on the dashboard 174wh/klm.
Always AC on at 21-22 Celsius and I had 172 before summer (40+ Celsius outside temperature). Average speed on the highway 130+.
Base model 3 2024. Efficiency is amazing. Car drives amazing. If you live in a country with sufficient charging network, the best car for its price tag out there.
Regen does not increase range (with respect to driving steadily), it just means less is wasted (when you do stop start). Driving slowly is why city driving is more efficient. Pushing the air out of the way is where all the energy goes on long trips.
Regen puts charge back into the battery, of course that increases range
Wasting less is the same as increasing achievable range.
@@rogerphelps9939 its not, if you stay at a steady 35mph you will use X amount of energy. If you repeatedly stop you will be use more energy even with regen. X will be less than if you sit at a steady 60mph.
Many seem to think that regen in the city is the reason you get more range in the city and some suggest having regen running all the time or adding an alternator etc. Seriously you have no idea how dumb people are.
@@karlwest437 I know that, but it doesn't increase it more than driving at a steady speed of the same average.
Talking about regen is irrelevant when comparing city with motorway driving. The reason city needs less energy per mile is because of the lower speed. Regen may somewhat compensate for stop start driving, but it is not the reason city driving needs less energy per mile than motorway driving. Having to use regen with stop start driving actually increases losses.
Of course its better than no regen, but thats not what we are comparing.
@@tonystanley5337 I think you're arguing semantics, of course just moving the car will use energy, the point is, no matter where you're driving, you will be able to go farther if you use regen than if you don't, because some of your kinetic energy usually wasted when you brake will be put back into the battery, why do you think cars have it otherwise?
I have the 2024 m3 long range RWD for two weeks now. Average over 600 miles 200 wh/per mile or 5 miles per kilowatt. I have had it down to 180wh/mi on longer drives. The key is to keep it between mph to 65 mph.
Between what and what?
@@pb25193 0-65mi....kidding, curious, too!
I just purchased a 2024 M3 RWD LR because it was the least expensive Tesla I could buy ($34,990 after tax credit). After driving it 580 miles its average consumption was 205 wh/mile (4.88 miles/kwh). About 220 of those miles at speeds in excess of 75 mph.
My model 3 RWD used 14kWh/100 km over the 7500 km we did in the last 2.5 months. We drove through half Europe with lots of highway, driving at 130 km/h and very hilly roads in France and northern Spain. We also live in the mountains in Switzerland. We are more than surprised by the efficiency of our Highlander. Our other car, a GV60 from Genesis is way way more thirsty 😂
I bought my 2024 Standard Range model 3 with LFP battery. I drive 70mph on freeway and get better range estimated. This car is amazing, and I even feel miss it when I am not driving❤
My wife has a late 2023 pre-facelift model 3 (Brisbane). Over 13337km and the lifetime average for her car is 113Wh/km and 122% efficiency.
I got a model Y a month later and my lifetime average is 99%. Thought it was maybe the way I drive but when we switch cars they get similar efficiency.
She just seems to have won the battery lottery :-)
Wow 122% efficiency, energy from nothing
Yep I have the same car (2023 Model 3 LFP) with a lifetime efficiency of 108wh/km (174wh/mile)
I get down to 93wh/km (149wh/mile) over extended distances in summer.
My experience supports that of Bjorn Nyland. I have a 2022 Model Y LR. On my work commute, which is about 1/3 surface streets (45 mph) and 2/3 highway (75 mph), I get about 225 Wh/mile in summer driving, or just over 4 miles/kWh. In Winter it’s about 300-350 Wh/mile, depending how cold it gets in Michigan, which is still not bad. In about 2 years of driving, my average efficiency exceeds Tesla’s claims for the Model Y. When I take the back-roads route to work (50-55 mph), I get almost 5 miles/kWh (205-210 Wh/mile).
Imagine how efficient the car would be with top of the list LFP batteries. Do not forget that they have the best BMS and they have Octovalve which accounts for a LOT
My personal experience with my Tesla Model 3 (MY22) with about 60% driving between Brisbane and Newcastle and Sydney gives me 125W per KM. For example, the trip from our home to Islington, Newcastle (768 KMs) takes about 96 to 102KWs to get down there. Even if I used the Tesla charger, recharging would only costs between $67.20(96KW) and $71.40(102KW), whereas using highway priced fuel, it would cost around $160.00 for the same journey in an ICE car.
I'l tell you how they do this: "The optimize everything at reasonable costs"
I got one and I knew it was going to be CATL LFP pouch, at the end of its manufacturing life cycle. I therefore knew it was a safe battery as apposed to something new on the market. I am expecting the battery to outlast me.
bingo
It’s not pouch.
Model 3 runs at about 140 Wh/km. Lucid at about 160 Wh/km
who cares? just make good looking cars
What speed?
@@jimgraham6722 It's not stated. But my guess is a combination of city, urban and highway speeds eg WLTP testing.
Fibre made body and body panels. If you think about it this could be the solution and/or answer to the to heavy EV’s of nowadays. If farmers are allowed to grow marihuana, only the plant not the buds/flowers, then these super strong environment friendly fibers can be, together with a resin, used to mold bodies/panels from. Together with Tesla’s Italian invented Alu molding process could give us light weight EV’s. This will expand their range, lower emissions of production, save on raw materials for producing batteries etc. etc.
It's small frontal area and high cD make it very efficient.
Our 2022 (bought used with 60k miles) has LiFePO4 battery and gets around 4.5 miles/kwh at 70mph!
I have a 2022 Tesla model 3 RWD with the 60kWh CATL LFP battery and I couldn’t be happier with my purchase decision. Also worth mentioning, I live in Iceland and our weather situation isn’t the greatest 😂people manage with a Toyota Yaris, then you can manage with a RWD model 3, no reason to be FOMO’d into buying the more expensive trims if you don’t have to!
I switch from ICE to a new M3 LR Highland in March.. and over the last 9500 miles it's returned 215wh/pm including a 3000 mile Euro trip around the Alps and a lot of motorway.. It's averaging over 5 miles per Kwh most of the time which I'm very happy with.
Tesla battery management system is simply the best. And they will stay ahead of the game.
Really like how you laid this out bro. Down playing the M3 then 👊
Hitting straight to the point, the Model 3 is an absolute marvel of engineering.
Really enjoyed it.
Keep at em' 💪
I owned a Lucid for 2 years and really didn't see this great efficiency. Loved the car
I am very impressed with the efficiency of my Tesla Y RWD SR produced in Germany with LFP batteries purchased 1. July 2024. Sunday driving from Grödig south of Salzburg to Strobl at Wolfgangsee lake and back. Much traffic, slow traffic, 112 Wh/km.
The new Model 3 is absolutely brilliant- love love love mine ❤❤❤
I got instant sellers regret when I sold my 2019 Fremont series one M3 RWD std range. A new Model Y helped cushion the blow.
Not a very practical shape and far too low.
Bjørn's tests are always a reality check for EV range claims. It's impressive to see the Model 3 exceeding expectations, especially at highway speeds where most other EVs struggle.
The model 3 is doing more with less. That's a major breakthrough in engineering. Rock on!
I just came from my vacation.
It was around 1000km trip that we did in around 11h, including two stops for charging with Tesla Model 3 LR ( 2022 model with 82kWh LFP battery , Shanghai factory ).
I was driving around 130km/h and getting 14.5kWh and when AC was working 16.7kWh / 100km.
While on vacation spot, while we were driving around, the average was around 10kWh/100km on the mixed roads with 50% being on the road that you can go up to 100km/h.
Its just amazing.
PS: My total average after 37'000km since I bought the car is 15.2kWh/100km. That comes a bit less than a 3 liter of petrol here. But i have a car that can go as fast as a really good sports car.
Lucid wont be lucid for much longer
I watched Bjorn’s video a while ago so I don’t remember the exact details. However, I recall that he achieved these numbers in less than ideal environmental conditions. Pretty amazing.
Well, Lucid is only a decade behind Tesla in terms of turning a profit.
We have a 2021 Model 3 SR+ from China with the LFP battery. Over the last 3 years (according to the car) we have averaged 134 KW/100 KLM. That equates to over 4.5 Miles per KW/H. This is living in Athens with mixed mileage although I should point out that we are both in our late 50’s and don’t race. The new model 3 is the first car I have seen that seems to get better efficiency than that.
My '21 M3LR has a lifetime efficiency of 4.6 mpkWh. On a good day, INCLUDING motorways, i get over 5 mpkWh.
I have a 2022 M3 in Sydney with the LFP. 25,000kmon the clock and the efficiency since new is displayed on the screen for all to see - 127w/km. The windscreen sticker when new said a very optimistic 132w/km but I have even bettered that. I'm very easy on the car but even so, when I read about VW ID3's getting 180 I am just so thankful to have this thing.
The air resistance increases with the velocity squared, that is why you use more energy per mile at higher velocity and why drag coefficient is so important.
I own an American 2023 Model Three with 10k miles - LFP equipped. It is an amazing car and exceeds expectations on all levels!
I have a 2021 Tesla Model 3. I drive at 68mph on the highway. With the 2170 battery pack it consistently gave me 5mi/kwh. Last month the 2170 battery pack failed and Tesla replaced it (at no cost to me) with their current LFP battery pack which is 240lb heavier. I'm delighted with the LFP battery. I now consistently get 4.4 mi/kwh. Range is 263 miles - a bit higher than when the car was new. The car rides better (they adjusted the suspension for the extra weight), regen braking is stronger and LFP degrades at half the rate of the 2170 pack. It costs me U.S. 3.5 cents/mi to drive. Mysteriously, regen braking works well even when the battery is at 100% charge - so I'm guessing "100%" is not really 100%. Sandy Munro is puzzled by Tesla's efficiency too, saying it is due to their "secret sauce".
The ‘24 M3 RWD with LFP is impressive. At 78-80mph, I’ll get 4 mi/kW during a 200mi highway drive. On my 50 mile daily commute on roads ranging from 45 mph to 65mph, I can get over 5mi/kW. What is interesting is that temperature has a noticeable effect on efficiency during the daily commute. I am in a hot climate so I might only get 4mi/kW when it’s 95F/35C due to the high A/C load trying to cool the car down over the first 10 minutes of the drive. If it’s 80F/27C, high efficiencies are easy to attain. It’s common knowledge that EV’s get lower efficiency at cold temps but it also happens at high temps.
I would pick tried n tested safety anyday, over tiny incremental power and density claims.
One thought about Lithium IRON batteries is that they have a MUCH flatter charge and discharge rate than Lithium ION batteries. This flatter discharge curve allows the batteries to deliver a longer discharge time since the voltage stays flatter and the rate of discharge remains flatter to delivered the same wattage.
In Lithium ION batteries, the lower the voltage falls, the higher the discharge rate becomes to maintain the same wattage (power output). Since the voltage falls faster and the discharge amperage increases faster, the faster batteries discharge faster.
Tested by Bjorn Nyland: Model 3 RWD Highland averages at 154Wh/km and Lucid Air Dream Edition Performance averages at 198Wh/km. both numbers is on highway at 120kmh speed (75mph)
Very clean design. And efficient motors.
Nothing on the outside that doesn’t need to be there to reduce drag.
4 miles per kwh is very good. I've been averaging 3.3 in my Mach E. Average of 20 miles per day 50/50 mix of highway and in town.
I've been routinely getting 5mi/KWH (200Wh/mi) on my 2023 RWD LFP, albeit not fully highway driving, but some mix ... and that is on 19" sport wheels, not 18" aero!!
My 2018 LR RWD is still closer 250wh/mi, lifetime at least, it matches EPA. Strange magic. 2023 Drives&rides better, too
Long time Tesla owner since 2012 MS and do not think Tesla batteries are crap! My wife's 2018 M3 RWD LR has averaged better than 4 miles/kW over past 6 years and my 2022 MSLR is averaging better than 4 miles/kW. Not bad and certainly not crap IMHO.
I honestly thought nothing would beat my ioniq electric 38kwh in efficiency but damn that is crazy! I did get around 12-13kwh/100km in highway as long as its 100km/h on my ioniq, I too bad my car doesn't have bigger battery model
I have an LFP battery M3 and a LRMY. I get better daily range from the LFP M3. 100 to 0 the MY wins by a little (25 ish miles extra), but usable daily range the LFP M3 wins. I also love the fact with LFP I don't have to be scared to charge above 80%. Every time I charge over 80% in the LRMY I feel like I am damaging my battery (even if its fine to do occasionally). I am really excited about the 600 miles battery Samsung recently announced. I drive 50-100k miles per year and a lot of long distance road trips for work. I would definitely do the 600 miles battery even a higher up charge. 600 miles is about the max I do in a single day. Charge at hotel while sleeping and go from there. I really try to avoid supercharging for cost and degradation reasons.
@teslabjorn is driving 56 mph (90 kph), which is not very fast and a way to get very high efficiency. Results are great for sure, but not insane. He shows his sheet at the end of his video where he compares to other cars, so that should give you some perspective.
Lucid: "Nobody is buying our cars."
Also Lucid: "We're so much better than the other guys."
I got the new tesla 3 2024 LFP battery with Photon aero Wheel . At 68 mhp , air conditioning off , I get 5.9 miles /kwh .
Previously I got 2022 with LFP battery . I don’t know why but my 2024 is a way better !!
EPA consumption ratings are measured from the wall when charging. This includes heat losses in the on-vehicle charger and battery, about 10%. This should not be directly compared to energy consumption measured at the battery output, as Tesla and other OEMs report on the car's info screen.
The larger the vehicle, the higher the drag.
Drag, the aerodynamic resistance acting on an object, and by inference the power required is proportional to the square of the speed.
To go twice as fast takes four times more energy.
Drag can be minimized by;
Lower velocity through the air - slower speed on the road.
Smaller sleeker streamlined vehicle
Great vid btw. Can you specify the type of battery you want in the dealship if you were to walk in and order a Tesla. Also : The Hyundia Ioniq Electric 2019 (Not the 5) Is the only other car that has done this. I had one for 3 years and frankly, it was truly impressive. Cruise Control (adaptive) set at 85 MPH and it always hit its documented target. Many people were getting 200 miles plus around town, even though it had a 165 Mile range. I now have a Kona 2024. What a joke in comparison. Faster, Yes, with a WLTP of 319 ! Yer right ! . Real world summer range of 270 Miles at best. Lucky to get 230 in Winter. (same speeds, same journey in both cars)
On average I spend less than 8% in my 2024 model 3 RWD going 25 miles going 60-70mph on average with AC set to 2. It’s very satisfactory for me
I would be driving a Tesla 3 but I canceled my order when I found out Aptera was back in business, 2019. It "will be" (2025?) the most efficient car ever by a factor of 3, at drag .13, wt. about 1000 kilos. I ordered 3.
'Highway' tests by Bjorn Nyland should be regarded with caution as speed limits in Norway are low compared to the rest of Europe. Drag increases with the square of the speed.Thus, cruising at 70 mph (UK motorway) or 112kph versus his typical 90kph results in a 50% increase in air resistance, which has a significant effect on efficiency and range.
Damn, what would we do with you, Sam. Great report.
Ok, so I had had the new model 3, RWD single motor, for nearly 8 months now. Living in NZ, I’ve done about 8000km in the car. I have NEVER seen anything near the quoted range (513km) at best it states 430km on a full charge. Actual driving ranges are probably 370 (winter) to 410. Most of my driving is 80-100kph with minimal city driving. It is the one aspect that I am very disappointed by. So either they have a newer battery in the cars that were tested or there is something else going on.
I've heard that the only car that gets tested for aerodynamics with the wheels on is the Tesla. The rest of the cars get tested for aerodynamics without the wheels, which makes a huge difference to the overall result
Don't be daft. Tou were being told ridiculous porky pies.
Perhaps they mean only vehicle tested with the 'wheel covers' on.
@@dvader3263 no they take the wheels off in the wind tunel test. Tesla test the car with the wheels on.
@@shonlondon7566
Yes the only plausible explanation is a deep state covert ops massive conspiracy
Can you point us to the evidence for that? I really can't believe that manufacturers would be allowed to use different ways of measuring the CD ratio.
Rob Maurer did a calculation on the Lucid Air. The "efficiency advantage" over the Tesla Model S could be entirely explained by the reduced frontal area of the Lucid Air. In other words, if Tesla just made a slightly shorter, narrower car with their technology from 4 years ago, it would have the same efficiency as a Lucid Air.
very impressive, plus it can only get better. a move to 48v it would save weight, battery tech is still getting better, if they got rid of mirrors that be even less drag and weight
Just drove 549 miles in my 2023 rwd LFP --speeds between 60-80mph and consumed 245wh/mile === used 134kwh total. AC on whole time. Convert that to gasoline (33.7kwh to a gallon) and we got 138mpg. Nothing touches an EV when it comes to energy usage, its just battery packs are just not anywhere near as energy dense as fossil fuels.
Saldy, there are no such uncentives here in the UK, so the best buy here is the standard range....the lfp batteries can be charged to 100% whereas the long range should only be regularly charged to 80 %, so both cars will give you very similar everyday range, so a good saving to be had. on the cost of the long range.
I have a long range, I will definitely buy the standard range at my next change.
I have driven a standard range and prefer the drive compared to the dual motor long range.
Unless you are regularly doing long distances I see no benefit to having the long range dual motor.
I have M3 highland RWD with LFP battery coming from a Kona EV i thought that was efficient but th Tesla is amazing i get over 5miles per kw without even trying to get it efficient
I like your content but one thing you missed in this comparison is the weight factor. The TM3 weight 702-1474 lbs less than the Lucid Air. A better comparison would be the TMS Plaid which depending on the LA configuration could weight 200lbs more or 500lbs less and gets 2.6-3.6 mi/kWh.
Why am I not surprising? Because it was absolutely obvious to me, as an aerodynamicist, that Tesla, or presumably Musk, had employed some competent aerodynamicists to minimise the drag coefficient of their car. The key place where this is done is at the rear end of the car. When laminar air flowing round an obstacle encounters a sharp reduction in cross section, it separated from the surface leaving a turbulent low pressure region behind the vehicle that sucks it back. Tesla's body shapes have a beautiful smoothly converging shape that causes the airflow to converge, and recover a higher pressure, before cleanly separating behind a much smaller area of back entrance than most cars. About 20 years prior to Tesla, Toyota did a similar job on the Prius, but Tesla have excelled them...
Oops, back end, not back entrance...
With EV's having a low drag coefficient is extremely important. Tesla does extremely well, with the Model 3 being better than the McLaren's Speedtail concept. However Lucid Air claims to beat that.
It's not where Tesla gains its major advantage though.
Most of Tesla's gains is where EV's must spend energy to save energy and that is in thermal management. No EV company so far as come close to Tesla's KISS design of the octovalve and the associated modes of heating and cooling.
Munro has a very good tear down and comparison. They decided to compare to an OEM manufacturer, stating that the best design they'd seen on any other OEM was the Ford Mustang Mach-E. But the teardown showed it was significantly more complex, 3x the weight and 3 times the length of hoses required.
The octovalve and heat pump system is straightforward needing only the radiator, chiller+ condenser combo with the PCS (Power Control System), Battery and Drive Unit being in the loop.
The octovalve is simple two four way valves. But it's a keep-it-simple (and patented) way of not overthinking the problem. 12 possible heating and cooling modes are achieved (many we will never need in Australia because a lot of them deal purely with temperatures below -10C)
... but what it allows for is a very simple way of ensuring at any particular time, the battery, power unit and other components are exactly the temperature they need to be to operate at maximum efficiency.
No other car manufacturer can achieve this as easily, because to be able to actively cool &/or warm all of these components simultaneously requires multiple ways to redirect the heat and cooling from the heat pump. And no other systems seem to do it as straight forward, with many resorting to heating batteries in far less efficient ways.
For the really technical overview, suggest reading the technical published paper "Octovalve Thermal Management Control for Electric Vehicle", Wray Et al. (23Aug2022). But the Munro tear down gives a good overview.
There are also videos which cover many of the modes.
Furtherstill, you can go into service mode on any Tesla and see the thermal mangement mapping in action (it literally can show the position of the 2x4 valves in action.
I watched a very fair comparison of a Tesla and a BYD and for me, I would buy a Tesla every time, also
there is a video of a Chinese mechanic taking apart a BYD and showing how they use quote...crap bearings.
Model 3 is the corolla of the future? But lucid is a sweet ride but expensive test drove in south Florida??
Thanks!
The magic source is the heat management system. Moves the heat around the car.
I drive a non LFP Y, it’s the LR one. And over 20K kM i do 17kW per 100KM, it’s crazy good. I only drive cruise control and always on chill though. But always at legal max speed
Sam…. Could you do an updated Altman-Z comparison of all the auto manufacturers including Tesla/BYD/toyota/Lucid/GM/Ford/Stalantis/Mercedes/VW ? Thanks
That efficiency is exactly the same I get from my Chevy Bolt EUV, in fact my all time average is 4.1 after 18 months of use. The Bolt model was probably designed by 2015, a dinosaur by today's standards.
This test was at highway speeds, everyone here is getting much better average lifetime values, where the average speeds are much lower
Sam, Tesla does a super job in balancing product with profits. All other companies with the possible exception of BYD have all kinds of problems achieving profitability which is exactly why businesses are in business. Battery evolution continues at a remarkable rate.Elon at this very moment has to decide if he wants to adopt the latest battery tech from CATL or the latest tech from BYD or possibly improve the battery tech of the 4680 cell. He may of course decide to pursue all three of these options concurrently. I for one would like to see Tesla offer options of different battery packs for different models giving the customer the choice of different packs for different prices and let the market decide. I’m sure Elon deals with these kinds to problems every day. Remember he has to balance the battery tech with government incentives and tariffs all at the same time. Good luck with that.
3:40 - Incorrect information the EPA rating of the RWD model 3 in the USA is 272 miles - the usable battery is 57.5kwh = 4.73 miles per kwh not 4 miles per kwh.
It’s batt is better than u think
Efficiency has very little to do with the batteries other than how much they weigh (a lower kWh/kg means a heavier pack). Two identical cars where the weigh is kept the same, one with the most advanced li-ion batteries and another with NiCad batteries, will have the same efficiency. The one with Li-ion will go way farther due to having more energy capacity, but that doesn't mean the efficiency is higher any more than if you put a bigger gas tank on a gas car and tried to say that because it can go farther.
That’s why I bought a new highland rwd, I had one previously and the highland is much improved. 209wh/km at steady 140km/h in Germany, not efficient my bum. Easily 400km at everyday driving and yes, hate Elon all u want but the cars are just so good now
My 2018 M3 Long Range Dual Motor has 264 wh per mile on the dash right now. Costs about $8.00 to charge.
"Don't believe what Chinese manufacturers say about their Stats!!" - Electric Viking 21/08/2024
"XPeng Destoys the Model Y on stats. Tesla in trouble!!" - Electric Viking 3 days earlier.....
The Electric Swivel 😊
In the 70s during the gas shortage the highway speed limits were 55 mph. Over that and efficiency falls off a cliff.
We are at an odd time where EV tech is surpassing ICE vehicles , but in some aspects it still makes sense to drive ICE. In 5 years I don’t think there will be many use cases where ICE will make sense.
I think towing, driving long distances, charge times, and weight of the battery (which affects various aspects of performance, particularly off-road ) will all be problems of the past as battery tech continues to improve.
I am still waiting to get an EV truck. I am not dropping 100k on a cybertruck. I will probably shop around in 5-10 years when my truck needs replaced.
I have a model 3 rear wheel drive 2000 and it is currently showing an economy of 214 kWh per mile life time average. 14630 miles. At the moment I am returning some 170 kWh per mile.