Thanks again to Tim Rodier from Omni Music Publishing for his analysis and notes on the cue that inspired this whole video! Did you notice the use of the Fate Motif that makes cue so unique? I didn't until after the scorebook released and I sat down to really study it. But subconsciously I could never follow along with the brass/percussion and the strings at the same time. It was there all along without knowing why until now!
You can thank Tim Rodier for the technicalities, basically everything this video is built around! It's well above my level. He's even the one to point out the Fate Motif's appearance in Mysterious Creature.
@@FilmScoreandMore i dont actually really know much about music as in how Its constructed but man i love listening to it! Especially all the httyd scores, they are all so good in every possible way!! I like listening to ppl talking about it tho :)
I would love to see an analysis video on the cue simply titled "The Hidden World". Especially with those ethereal voices provided by Jonsi during the start!
@ryanhartley211 That’s definitely a possibility. I have some notes about it. The first portion is really strange though, I struggle to follow along on the page.
Amazing as always! I love hearing the analysis of these scores, makes me love the films more. I especially love the translated lyric of 'safe without ignorance' 😊
Missed your videos, man! Great work as always. I really should listen to The Hidden World more. The depth of your analyses always surprises me. You’re by far the definitive voice on HTTYD music on this site.
Glad to see you again! This is probably the most technical one yet, much to my own dismay. This was way too much detail to handle, and the cue is only a minute long.
The level of technical skill, story writing, and mastery present in this movie trilogy--even beyond the soundtrack in this context--is mind bending, and I can only hope to reach that level some day. Oh yeah, by the way, SUPER underrated video. How the hell has this not broken a 6 digit view count?
John Powell really has a mastery of musical storytelling. He knows what he's doing, even when it's unconventional. If it makes you feel better this video is performing very well. It currently has 1.1k views, which is the same amount my last one has gotten in the month it's been out.
@@FilmScoreandMore Yeah, he's phenomenal. He's my personal inspiration as an aspiring producer. As for this video's performance, I'm elated to hear it's doing well relative to your other videos, but I still feel like it's vastly underrated. It matches the quality of most other videos at 6 figure view counts, and you deserve far better. I wish you luck! :D
@SnadMusic What are some of your favorite Powell scores and cues? What do you find inspiring? I appreciate your encouragement! I know each video needs to be high quality. And I think it will all build. It should come. By the way, how long have you been watching my channel? Which of my other videos have you seen?
I'm a novice with limited understanding of music theory, so I'll probably sound like a complete noob, but "Forbidden Friendship" is jaw dropping to me. The way it subtly plays with Toothless' motif, introducing its elements into the melody in subtle ways as its prevalence ramps up--signifying the developing relationship between Hiccup and Toothless--is mind-bendingly awesome. At your video quality, popularity is a question on WHEN, not IF. I know you shouldn't really listen to a guy with less than 100 subs, but I do encourage that you've got massive, massive potential. I'm a bit ashamed to admit this, but this is actually my first video of yours. I promise you this, though, that I have Subscribes, and I do plan on watching more. :)
@@SnadMusic Thanks very much for the encouragement, I’m glad you found the channel. I think you should watch this video next. It’s very much about the development of the those main themes. ua-cam.com/video/hBWhQxznEQA/v-deo.htmlsi=efyyEGSXH1S8CAw7
It’s so nice to finally hear someone talk about the Fate Motif! It’s oddly one of my favourite motifs out of the trilogies and its significance for some reason kind of baffled me because it didn’t always play in the most dramatic parts of the film so it’s really nice to get a different perception of the theme and its meaning. Thank you!
It’s in the score more than I thought! And I could see it needed some attention. I actually didn’t pick up on it for a long time beyond its brief use in “Exodus!” (not the Bob Marley one). Tim Rodier is the one who pointed out its use in “Mysterious Creature.”
@@FilmScoreandMoreReally? I’ve actually heard it many times in the score but I will admit, it’s hard to catch it the first few times. I really loved its usage in the first part of “As Long As He’s Safe (Ultimate Sacrifice)”. Even then I discovered it even plays in the middle of “The Hidden World” segment and after “The Viking Wedding”. Powell does a great job with using motifs. There’s so much to discover!
Good job catching all of those, it really is all over the score. Powell says he overwrites. Each HTTYD score has six new themes and several new motifs, but each has a story role and a reason to be there.
Yes, I do it all myself! Editing takes about half the time of the process, but it still makes more sense for me to do it myself than to outsource the work. I was looking through effects in Final Cut Pro and stumbled upon that earthquake one, so I felt I should use it there. It makes a huge difference in adding intensity. It feels anticlimactic without it.
@@FilmScoreandMore I just love how it starts off as slow and mysterious before slowly building up with the brass/strings and exploding with the singers/brass. It just perfectly captures the scene of Astrid and Hiccup discovering something completely otherworldly and mythical
Love your analysis here! I always thought Powell's work for The Hidden World was underrated and as soon as I saw that the deluxe album was released I got super excited lol
The most odd thing I see and was confused about in the score is that the horns are in alto clef! WHAT!? note to all composers/arrangers, DO NOT put horns in anything other than treble or bass!
Yeah, I almost made a comment in my last video about how the french horns mostly work the same (as opposed to trumpet four, the subject of the video), apart from the fact they suddenly play in alto clef for half the score. Very odd. Especially when trumpet four plays the same thing but in treble.
@@FilmScoreandMore It's a good question to ask, but idk WHO to ask. I unfortunately don't have any connections with the horns on the score to see if they actually got alto clef parts or what. My only guess is to prevent a ton of clef changes for the score, but that feels like a weak argument
@@FilmScoreandMore so many things, but especially the strings being in a différent rhythm as it is something i did once when trying to compose a disturbing music and it was funny to hear it in more details
@@FilmScoreandMore I hadn’t consciously noticed the brass layering with that technique, now that I know, it’s very clearly there but it was cool to kinda hear that isolated. I also love the Latin translation. Well done on the video in general :)
It was the same for me. I couldn’t make out what I was hearing until I looked at it. And the lyrics are nice to have too (assuming they’re roughly accurate).
@@FilmScoreandMore I really wonder what the reason was to write the horns in that clef... Because personally I can't read it that well to play a whole piece in alto clef 🙈
As someone who took latin in highschool I think it's awesome that the choir layered in the soundtrack actually translates to give the score deeper meaning. Don't know why but it adds so much more depth to it all...
@@FilmScoreandMore Not too fresh to be completely honest, but based on my knowledge those translations sound pretty spot on. Latin is so context based like other languages but the root words I recognized felt very accurately translated.
I never knew that is twas called the fate motif, but it has been confusing me since I first heard it in 2019. Thanks for helping us to understand it a bit.
Wait, I thought the "fate" theme for the third movie was the melody from the beginning of "Cliffside Playtime/Legend Has It" (as seen in your video on that track).
Yes, there’s a Fate Theme from the first movie, one from the third that you’re talking about, and a Fate Motif. I know it’s confusing, I’m planning a video about it.
John Powell certainly knows how to write for each group, solo or combined. And I have a bad habit of naively writing videos that will give me a ton of work. I'm looking forward to making a video that uses little or no sheet music on the screen!
Thanks again to Tim Rodier from Omni Music Publishing for his analysis and notes on the cue that inspired this whole video!
Did you notice the use of the Fate Motif that makes cue so unique? I didn't until after the scorebook released and I sat down to really study it. But subconsciously I could never follow along with the brass/percussion and the strings at the same time. It was there all along without knowing why until now!
Your videos feel like I'm back in school with a really fun music teacher.
You can thank Tim Rodier for the technicalities, basically everything this video is built around! It's well above my level. He's even the one to point out the Fate Motif's appearance in Mysterious Creature.
Aarghh i love that we now got the deluxe edition and the scorebook for the third movie
Absolutely, it's great! The better to study it with!
What cues are you most interested in?
@@FilmScoreandMore i dont actually really know much about music as in how Its constructed but man i love listening to it! Especially all the httyd scores, they are all so good in every possible way!! I like listening to ppl talking about it tho :)
@xRandom.editsx I don’t know that much either, that’s why Tim is here! This whole video was inspired from a short email chain with him.
I would love to see an analysis video on the cue simply titled "The Hidden World". Especially with those ethereal voices provided by Jonsi during the start!
@ryanhartley211 That’s definitely a possibility. I have some notes about it. The first portion is really strange though, I struggle to follow along on the page.
Amazing as always! I love hearing the analysis of these scores, makes me love the films more. I especially love the translated lyric of 'safe without ignorance' 😊
Thanks! I’m only assuming that translates correctly, it seems right.
@@FilmScoreandMore well if it is or isn't it's still a good line lol
@NewOrca It is, yeah. Anything else interesting stand out to you in this video?
Haha I love the camera shakes with that base!! The way you broke this down was so awesome, I love this score!
Thanks! I just found that effect in my editing software and it adds a lot to that part.
Missed your videos, man! Great work as always. I really should listen to The Hidden World more. The depth of your analyses always surprises me. You’re by far the definitive voice on HTTYD music on this site.
Glad to see you again! This is probably the most technical one yet, much to my own dismay. This was way too much detail to handle, and the cue is only a minute long.
The level of technical skill, story writing, and mastery present in this movie trilogy--even beyond the soundtrack in this context--is mind bending, and I can only hope to reach that level some day.
Oh yeah, by the way, SUPER underrated video. How the hell has this not broken a 6 digit view count?
John Powell really has a mastery of musical storytelling. He knows what he's doing, even when it's unconventional.
If it makes you feel better this video is performing very well. It currently has 1.1k views, which is the same amount my last one has gotten in the month it's been out.
@@FilmScoreandMore Yeah, he's phenomenal. He's my personal inspiration as an aspiring producer.
As for this video's performance, I'm elated to hear it's doing well relative to your other videos, but I still feel like it's vastly underrated. It matches the quality of most other videos at 6 figure view counts, and you deserve far better. I wish you luck! :D
@SnadMusic What are some of your favorite Powell scores and cues? What do you find inspiring?
I appreciate your encouragement! I know each video needs to be high quality. And I think it will all build. It should come.
By the way, how long have you been watching my channel? Which of my other videos have you seen?
I'm a novice with limited understanding of music theory, so I'll probably sound like a complete noob, but "Forbidden Friendship" is jaw dropping to me. The way it subtly plays with Toothless' motif, introducing its elements into the melody in subtle ways as its prevalence ramps up--signifying the developing relationship between Hiccup and Toothless--is mind-bendingly awesome.
At your video quality, popularity is a question on WHEN, not IF. I know you shouldn't really listen to a guy with less than 100 subs, but I do encourage that you've got massive, massive potential.
I'm a bit ashamed to admit this, but this is actually my first video of yours. I promise you this, though, that I have Subscribes, and I do plan on watching more. :)
@@SnadMusic Thanks very much for the encouragement, I’m glad you found the channel.
I think you should watch this video next. It’s very much about the development of the those main themes.
ua-cam.com/video/hBWhQxznEQA/v-deo.htmlsi=efyyEGSXH1S8CAw7
It’s so nice to finally hear someone talk about the Fate Motif! It’s oddly one of my favourite motifs out of the trilogies and its significance for some reason kind of baffled me because it didn’t always play in the most dramatic parts of the film so it’s really nice to get a different perception of the theme and its meaning. Thank you!
It’s in the score more than I thought! And I could see it needed some attention.
I actually didn’t pick up on it for a long time beyond its brief use in “Exodus!” (not the Bob Marley one). Tim Rodier is the one who pointed out its use in “Mysterious Creature.”
@@FilmScoreandMoreReally? I’ve actually heard it many times in the score but I will admit, it’s hard to catch it the first few times. I really loved its usage in the first part of “As Long As He’s Safe (Ultimate Sacrifice)”. Even then I discovered it even plays in the middle of “The Hidden World” segment and after “The Viking Wedding”. Powell does a great job with using motifs. There’s so much to discover!
Good job catching all of those, it really is all over the score.
Powell says he overwrites. Each HTTYD score has six new themes and several new motifs, but each has a story role and a reason to be there.
I like the editing (which I assume you do yourself) "the loudest thing you've ever heard" and music notation page starts shaking. Nice. 😂
Yes, I do it all myself! Editing takes about half the time of the process, but it still makes more sense for me to do it myself than to outsource the work.
I was looking through effects in Final Cut Pro and stumbled upon that earthquake one, so I felt I should use it there. It makes a huge difference in adding intensity. It feels anticlimactic without it.
I LOVE this song from the soundtrack. I get chills every time!! Genuinely amazing
What blew you away so much about it?
@@FilmScoreandMore I just love how it starts off as slow and mysterious before slowly building up with the brass/strings and exploding with the singers/brass. It just perfectly captures the scene of Astrid and Hiccup discovering something completely otherworldly and mythical
The gradual build and reveal really help. It’s effective.
@@mooyah5839those low brass chords are SOOOO good
Love your analysis here! I always thought Powell's work for The Hidden World was underrated and as soon as I saw that the deluxe album was released I got super excited lol
Can you believe we finally have all three?
And yes, Powell's Hidden World score is definitely underappreciated. That's part of why I'm here.
The most odd thing I see and was confused about in the score is that the horns are in alto clef! WHAT!?
note to all composers/arrangers, DO NOT put horns in anything other than treble or bass!
Yeah, I almost made a comment in my last video about how the french horns mostly work the same (as opposed to trumpet four, the subject of the video), apart from the fact they suddenly play in alto clef for half the score. Very odd. Especially when trumpet four plays the same thing but in treble.
@@FilmScoreandMore It's a good question to ask, but idk WHO to ask. I unfortunately don't have any connections with the horns on the score to see if they actually got alto clef parts or what. My only guess is to prevent a ton of clef changes for the score, but that feels like a weak argument
@AndrewMerideth It could still be the answer.
Weird
Great work man, love the video.
Glad to hear it! What did you like most?
Great work and it's always incredible when you analyse powell's music and how complexe it is
Thank you! There's so much to share!
What stood out to you in this one?
@@FilmScoreandMore so many things, but especially the strings being in a différent rhythm as it is something i did once when trying to compose a disturbing music and it was funny to hear it in more details
@@christophermusique It definitely works in a different way. Most people probably wouldn’t think to do it.
Awesome video man. Very informative, told me some things I didn’t know. Cheers!
Thanks for checking it out, glad to see you here! What stood out to you the most?
@@FilmScoreandMore I hadn’t consciously noticed the brass layering with that technique, now that I know, it’s very clearly there but it was cool to kinda hear that isolated. I also love the Latin translation. Well done on the video in general :)
It was the same for me. I couldn’t make out what I was hearing until I looked at it. And the lyrics are nice to have too (assuming they’re roughly accurate).
Very interesting video, thank you 👏
What did you find the most interesting?
@@FilmScoreandMore As a Horn Player myself probably the function of the Brass Section as another consistent rhythmic structure 📯
@melona1001 Oh, interesting! As a horn player what do you think of the horns being written in alto clef for half the score?
@@FilmScoreandMore I really wonder what the reason was to write the horns in that clef... Because personally I can't read it that well to play a whole piece in alto clef 🙈
@@melona1001 The first two scores don’t do that either, it’s just this one.
John Powell, one of the greatest musical writers of our time
I had no idea he did anything quite like this.
As someone who took latin in highschool I think it's awesome that the choir layered in the soundtrack actually translates to give the score deeper meaning. Don't know why but it adds so much more depth to it all...
How fresh is your Latin? Because I have no idea how accurate any of those lyrics are.
@@FilmScoreandMore Not too fresh to be completely honest, but based on my knowledge those translations sound pretty spot on. Latin is so context based like other languages but the root words I recognized felt very accurately translated.
@Carissa.I Really? That’s good to know, thanks!
I never knew that is twas called the fate motif, but it has been confusing me since I first heard it in 2019. Thanks for helping us to understand it a bit.
It's always confused me a bit too, I didn't even notice the extent to which it appears in the score for a long time.
Wait, I thought the "fate" theme for the third movie was the melody from the beginning of "Cliffside Playtime/Legend Has It" (as seen in your video on that track).
Yes, there’s a Fate Theme from the first movie, one from the third that you’re talking about, and a Fate Motif. I know it’s confusing, I’m planning a video about it.
Sectioning off each instrument group for demonstration purposes is quite OP in my opinion. 🫡
John Powell certainly knows how to write for each group, solo or combined. And I have a bad habit of naively writing videos that will give me a ton of work. I'm looking forward to making a video that uses little or no sheet music on the screen!