10000% agree. Haven't queued once since realising the situation. Saying "just join a premade" doesn't take into account the fact that you kind of need to be a hunter or priest to get an invite. Aggrend has basically destroyed solo queue, which was always one of my favourite things in WoW. Otherwise, loving SoD, but WSG is a big fail.
Big true! Premades become ineffective if youre queing into other premades, so people will just go back to small groups. I'm a solo random bg enjoyer, I grind out rank 10 in classic just queueing all 3 BGs and doing whatever popped.
not true, if you're really grinding rep, you just decide after the first battle mid. If you win, you go for the caps, if you lose, you go for straight loss 5-6 min, which is still good rep
it doesnt work because huge groups sync queues on a big discord, and only join the games when both 5 mans queues pop, its been done in AV premades on era for ages
Premades are lame. They ruin the fun for other players and it’s never about “the social dynamic”. No one is queueing with 9 of their friends to hangout with the gang. It’s about getting with 9 others to stomp pugs for optimal rewards as you stated. This needs to change.
Yes, this shit needs to stop. The devs being intellectually dishonest on their Twitter/X platforms grinds my gears so much; it's so obvious to everyone what is going on with premade BGs
Part of why I loved WSG solo que in the past was becuase every BG was a mix of different classes, leading to different and fun PvP. Great take on the post, really enjoyed.
premade stomp is 100% a thing. My most enjoyed game however, was vs a premade. We actually got a good grp and kept them in there 45 minutes. They won 3-2, but they had to work for it
Stopped playing SoD all together after 2 weeks and a few raids for this reason. Bgs as pug just means afk dead at gy. Zero fun. I’d rather listen to music/pvp then be forced into picking 2-4 classes and discord just to pvp.
When you join a premade and don't immediately speed stomp the other side, it's actually crazy how mad your team will get. it's obvious that premades are created with the intention to farm groups that aren't as good as yours, not to actually have a challenge. I did a premade vs premade last night and the amount of toxcity that I experienced from my own faction was insane. We actually won 3 -1 and everyone quit after 1 game because we didn't dominate them in less than 15 minutes. I think Wille said this, but premades right now are pvp, meaning priest vs priest.
You are absolutely spot on. It's actually unbelievable how every single point Aggrend made was pretty much easily debunkable, and that post on forums proves it. I love PvP but the current state of WSG has nothing to do with it and people running these premades are not in it for pvp but for rep grind. I joined these premades when farming exalted rep and we just afk-ed on opponent's graveyards for hours on end with an odd premade matchup where there was a good game. That means about 60% of time it was an unenjoyable rep grind where neither us or our opponents did absolutely nothing. The easiest solution would be to make the tooltip when joining true - join as group, or join as solo. The only rule you need to implement is that two groups cannot join at the same time at the same faction and you're good to go.
they just need to make it so if we only have 10dps random queing it cant go against a 3healer premade or even a random group with healers. most trade made premade fall apart when they lose once against a random group that had healers
@@TheZeagon I can agree with almost every suggestion apart from this now as there being absolutely not a SINGLE rule implemented when creating a wsg matchup is just broken. Everything would be better than this mess we have right now
the funny thing here is that Blizzard knows EXACTLY what will happen if they make it premade vs. premade queues. the result is going to be that queues literally die and nobody does premade anymore, because suddenly the workload has gone from nonexistent to actual sweat vs. sweat levels of workload required to win. when premade teams were stomping randoms in Overwatch and blizzard put on premade vs. premade, everyone stopped premading because taking your chance at fighting other people queuing solo and hoping they have a bad player on their team led to higher win chances across the board compared to the premade vs. premade queues.
I totally agree with the 5 man limit idea and a separate 10v10 queue BUT I think they should give bonus honor for 10v10 premades so that it doesn't fall to the wayside because it's inefficient. It doesn't need to be the most insane honor farm but it should be worth doing
Since atm people are grinding WSG rep (and soon AB rep), create TWO different marks as rewards: the classic mark that you will get when you go in as a party which will give you 100 rep when you deliver 3 of them, and the solo mark that will give you, oh, 120 rep when you deliver 3 of them. See how quickly this will balance things. P.S. so far really deep in the grind, but having made over 10+k of rep against premades, solely by losses, forced surrenders and being relegated to watching shit on the other screen while in GY, it's a GRUELLING HORRIFYING experience. Unfortunately I am too deep to stop now, but boy is it a punishing thing.
Actually you can stop and lose nothing. The ashenvale event gives 1000 rep now, so in 11 weeks without any more WSG you will have exalted. I really really doubt the lvl 40 bracers reward will be made available in p2. But in any case, you will still get there anyway and be ready for p3 and beyond.
@@zepho100 You mean will they remove it completely? I don't know of course but seriously doubt it. People will want their alts to gain rep and if Blizzard denies them there will be drama. Or anyone starting late would effectively be denied the chance to get exalted with silverwing unless they make an incredible time commitment, from neutral to exalted (42k rep total). Now it might be harder to win as fewer groups will form to nuke bosses. They have already changed it so it starts at max 3 hours after the previous even end. So it will not be a problem to get to 100% for both sides. In fact, it might actually be experienced as it was intended and be -god forbid somewhat fun too. in any case, all it takes is a single grunt kill and loot. they are easily pullable and soloable despite being lvl 25 "elites"
I 💯 agree. I only have a few hours a week to play. The only person I play with is my brother. We both love pvp. And having a five person cap on premade is a fair balance I think. You do a couple wsg that last a hour a piece so some premade can farm us totally discourages me from wanting to play. Great video!
Even with 5-mans being the max, people will find a workaround to get into the same games somewhat reliably like they've done in the past. Coordinating 2 groups of 5 to queue at the same time is really not that difficult. A max of 3 would be much better suited to not be exploited as easily.
Premades should be vs premades only, give them a bit more honor for premade games so its worth to play competitive. In my opinion the warsong issues are more fundamental, it was never designed to abuse bug walljumps to run in circles forever, i know some people like it, but its bad for the game since we have no timer in classic. Also premade vs premade isn't fun for most people, because its just min maxing bug abusing and has nothing to do with original vanilla - Most people q with a premade to grind honor faster and not because they just wanna pvp, its just not the same pvp as if you que with randoms.
I couldn't agree more. I actually like PvP in WoW, but in Classic SOD I ONLY PvP until I hit the rank cap and max rep and after that I rarely hit WSG -or- Ashenvale with any of my characters because there's no benefit after that and I am not interested in joining premades just to rofl-stomp players nonstop... it's NO fun. PvP is fun when it's challenging, not when it's just a nonstop insta-win or getting mowed over with no chance to win.
"Aggrend" is completely stupid. His argument is nowhere near compelling. It's worth less than my fart. He's defending the premade meta for the subset of disingenuous premade scrubs.
As a rogue, I’m nearly BIS geared, use consumes and perform well in PVP but unless I start my own premade I will not get into one on my server. Sooo many times I send a query, “BIS rogue LF WSG” and get a reply from a raid lead, “I don’t take rogues”.
I feel like the solution is to add some kind of MMR system if the population can support it so premades that are winning a bunch naturally get matched against each other. Maybe the rewards for losing in WG can also be looked at so losing isn't so punishing. It would be nice if it at least gave you some honor even if you don't cap the flag once. it's an MMO. It should encourage you to play/group with others.
I ran into eight premades in a row and never queued again. It's a horrible experience. SoD is supposed to be more casual friendly. Overall less sweaty... So it's extra confusing as to why Blizzard digs their heels in on this topic in order to defend the minority player type. There's even a premade meta. If you're not one of the meta classes to fit into the comp... you also can't easily get into a premade. I'm with you on killing queuing as a raid and going group-only. I love PvP but this situation is a train wreck of an otherwise fantastic version of the game.
I totally feel for you. Being a not meta class/spec, right now, as a tankadin, I am singularly effed. You can't imagine how many times I questioned my life's choices so far while I am forced to surrender at GY to go for the next game, the next surrender, the next loss, the next mark. P.S. if you want to get quick rep, get to EU servers. Horde single handedly cleans house in WSG.
Well I grinded exalted as a pug all my life playing classic. This time at first I joined a few pugs - and it was horrible - and then decided to always spend those extra 10 min and find a good group. Wow, the experience was sky and earth. Yes, the matches are long af. Yes we lose as well. But it was most fun ever - to play Warsong in a premade versus other premades. I’m already done with both of my toons this new ashenvale rep def helps grinding things faster.
separating queues obviously not the answer anyone who has played the game before knows this, they need to add some sort of reward system for solo queueing.
Bruh anyone here that says they get in a 10man premade because they love the 10v10 exp is just spewing garbage from their mouth lol. I ranked to 14 in 2019 during peak covid and can tell you that none of us wanted to do that grind willingly and none of us ever wanted to see another premade bc it hindered our honor per hour. Also once alterac valley comes out no one will ever touch WSG or AB unless they have been rotting their brain in AV all day and want a change of pace for 1 or 2 games out of the 16 hour grind people will do.
In my current rep grind to exalted...if I see the other team is a premade, I see how the initial clash goes...if its a wipe I don't even try and would rather let them cap quick and move on to the next one. I promise, once exalted, I will never queue into WSG until they do something with the premades...it will be awful in AB also.
I do casual premades fairly often and it's true a lot of people just do it for the rates, but i will say without fail, at a certain point during the session, people in the premade start wishing that they would run into another premade just to have an actual real game of wsg. The funniest part about this is that most premades are not really pvp players and literally just fill out a powerful comp of overtuned classes/specs/runes and faceroll. And when those players face any kind of adversity in a match, or even worse, they lose, they get upset and start making excuses. Like 9/10 times the atmosphere in a discord will go from happy go lucky people getting that sweet ego boost of destroying people that had no chance to begin with to "this is so unfair he's doing the jumps. He's popping consumes what a tryhard." etc. The 5 man que is honestly a great idea and sadly no matter what you do with a 10v10 que it will be dead except for wargames like people setting up times to premade against others of equal caliber because the truth is all the top pvp players running premades will effectively steam roll 99% of the player base and kill the que themselves. All these PUG premades you see in chat spamming will frankly just feel like the people that currently solo que into games vs premades having 0% chance at winning. I would LOVE if they implemented these changes. It would let tryhards that want competitive pvp get what they want and it would increase the quality of wsg matches overall no question. WSG should be fun for everyone but at this point it's pretty much a mindless activity 99% of the time premade or not.
Blizzard not adding in premade prevention is the reason several of my friends are reluctant to play SoD after the shit show that was classic pvp battlegrounds.
Just queue against premades of similar size. If the queue is long or doesn’t pop, then that’s your decision to stay or leave and queue solo. This will solve it. But a 10 man rated BG q would be sick too
Solo q BGs at the moment are just like a "stay afk in ghost and wait for the lose while you do something else in alt tab" thing; no fun, but just a really slow farm of 100 rep from 3 lost BGs
I like Warsong but I stopped playing because if I Q I have a 50% chance I have to afk for 10min at the graveyard until the other team is done farming and gets the flagges. I don’t got time for this to be honest and it’s sad
The difference in playstyle seems to be those who want fast games vs people who want to have a challenge. I personally have always disliked WSG purely because I spend more time dead than alive, when the other team realizes I'm a decent pvper if left to my own devices. I play healers and dps flex heal/support most of the time.
Premades are most commonly a rep farm or an honor farm. Premade vs premade queue likely isn't realistic because a competitive match is an inefficient farm. The queue times would be much longer and matches that were competitive would last far too long. They would have to offer an incentive that solo q doesn't in order for them to exist without 30-60m wait times. There would be little to no premades if it were implemented. The solution to their current problem is to up the rep for warsong so people get that grind done faster. Premades would still exist but there would be far fewer. Players typically don't have a huge problem with premades, but currently there are a ton of them running so it feels bad solo-queing into every other match being a 7 minute waiting room for 1 token.
100% agree. Bgs were never competitive activity, even in retail there are like 5 people doing rbg. I've been playing wow for 15 years and I guess now it's the first time in the whole history of wow when I cant solo queue bg.
I like the idea of 5 cap on premades. I suck at pvp but when its randos vs randos i usually have a chance to get kills and get wins. But getting rofflestomed isnt fun for me.
It's crazy Aggrend doesn't see or understand this. Premade vs pug isn't good gameplay. It's for stomping pugs and farming bis honor/rep for hour. Isn't that the exact kind of thing SoD is supposed to avoid or amend? I got wsg exalted almost strictly solo queueing, Im a bis rogue and I spent an hour+ some days failing to find a group because all anyone wants is a priest and hunter. I cba to form my own group and I shouldn't have to. Every pvp game has solo queue as the main way to queue. Lvl 40 will probably come out before they do anything about it. I wonder if AB will be as bad with premades
Ya I stopped solo queing cause it's brutal when half the team just gives up right off the bat when they see it's a premade. Can we get a surrender choice so we don't have to wait as ghosts for the premade to run the flag.
I stopped queing up for this reason. I was tired of getting stomped by full 10m premades with 3 priest and you could never do any dmg and get no kills then they just camp your GY and the 3 cap you like they're the only ones in the WSG.
OH yeah because I love when I solo queue and I get no healers on my team and people just want to AFK or get hard carried instead of actually playing the object, oh yeah I sure love that ! That feels amazing, I also love when people just want to zug middle and do absolutely nothing 👍
BGs now is like a Raids, you cant go there solo... Every time I wanna chill solo que at bg, I remeber about premades and skip BG chill, just going doing other things like farming gold
They told us no RBG style battle grounds. There are many people who wargane WSG. We are about to get rid of premade because terrible pugs comps. The priest went 10-1 solo because how good having a healer is. Idc if bad pugs don’t have fun losing, I want harder BGs to be rewarding because right now the only people not trying in BGs only want the pvp rewards for pve, so why care? Why change pvp stuff for casual players and leave the people who like to pvp in the dust
Funny how SoD is marketed as casual but has the biggest sweat/meta chasing gigachads I’ve seen in wow to date, not only has it overflown into the pvp scene now but the fact pug BFD’s require world buffs and check logs is just comical to me
There are no solutions. Doing nothing though is worse than doing something. If you separate the queues it is only the illusion of choice. Are you really playing by yourself? Whether it’s a queue into 9 random players or 9 random players from Trade chat. Once again, the illusion of choice. The clear advantage is the choice of composition which can be addressed as role queue. Again another illusion of choice in SOD because classes are diverse due to runes.
I have been running in premades to get exalted as a druid. It has been easy to find groups and if you get your group to join voice chat in discord you have a huge advantage over other premades. You fight against other premades about half the time in my experience as Alliance. I have enjoyed premade vs premade bgs a lot but it definitely is shitty to have pugs vs premades
I don't do pvp. If I decided to give it a try, I would stop giving it a try if I don't have fun doing it - and that's regardless of any skill/gear/experience considerations. If I were to find myself in a scenario where I did decide to finally give battlegrounds a try, and our side consistently never gets a single kill, the healthy response is to go do something else - you don't perpetuate a broken system. Coincidentally, I've heard pvp mains oppose dual specs because it means that they are less likely to encounter players in pve spec when doing pvp, as in, it makes it harder for them. That tells you all you need to know about your average pvp player.
i RFUSE to queue wsg in sod because of premades i got honored through ashenvale and thats it the grind for the current wsg exalted gear just isnt worth it ill get honor through horde isnta queue av when it comes out. unless they add better epic gear for exalted wsg its not worth going past honored and fyi ab will be 10 man premades as well it will be as bad as wsg.
I consider premade to be the same sort of evil as players who go through the first rush loose the mid battle and quit the BG forcing some poor smuck into a already loosing game. People premade because they want to slaughter the other side wanting to fight pugs and feel important by being nothing more than be bullies.
5 man limit is the way - on the bright side me and 2 buddies que’d into a crusader strike premade and absolutely destroyed them and it felt very nice 🤣
Other thing I was talking to my guild about this the other night- about 20 of us in disc all agreed Nobody seeks out premades except for it’s the only affective way to get rep in the current meta.
@@zStC1 for sure always will be some. What is your solution do nothing? I’d rather lessen the amount of premades/make them unorganized then just keep it how it is. You are right people will always abuse the game, doesn’t mean we should make it easy for them.
@@zStC1 no matter what you do people will abuse it so pretty shit take. Lower percentage of people doing something does help the over all community. The future is now old man.
Give rep & honor for participating in WSG instead of just for kills & caps. I think that will make the feels bad feel less bad. Right now if you que into a WSG, get rofl-stomped & 3-capped, you literally walk away with nothing and you’ve wasted your time. This also means giving the winning side a bump in rep & honor if they win.
Watch any Vampire Clan Wargame - ALMOST NO ONE WANTS A REAL 10 v 10 PREMADE v PREMADE - say goodbye to 3-6 hours of your life in the most stressful wow environment possible.....
Aggrend: People want that awesome 10 vs 10 premade epic battleground where it feels like you're in the finals of a rated BG tournament! Well that's what you think. In reality the people who premade do so to absolutely shitstomp casual players and turn people off from engaging in BGs altogether. It is a system that very easily turns inherently toxic and promotes toxicity. Especially in a version of wow where the difference between a regular level 25 character with regular dungeon gear and regular runes vs fully kitted level 25 raid gear and optimal runes is unbelievably big, it's not even a contest. If the result of the BGs of premades vs premades were say 50 honor kills vs 10 honor kills, then maybe in some way the non premade could stand somewhat of a chance, but that's not the case. vast majority of the time they don't even have 1 honor kill against like 30 or 40. All premades I've gone up against our team didn't even score a SINGLE kill. Not a SINGLE one. I'd say at that point you know something is fcked.
Problem is there is too many sweat lords that will just find a way to do this exact same thing to any update they come out with for it, classic wow players will find a way to min max and ruin it almost immediately - Get rid of the bg rep gear rewards try to just have warsong queue for fun (5man queue is a great start)
If your argument is "some people live for 10man premades" but adding pre-made vs pre.ade would kill their fun then they are not living for premades, but actually for farming
5man wont work. at least not in the way people are hopping for. the meta will just shift to: 2 priest, 1 FC, 1 Fc Killer, 1 flex. and the dps will queue solo. people will just give the disc at the start of the bg. and you will get a premade basically. and no premade has its own problems as well. Not saying that premade are a good thing, but there is no easy solution that people think there is. And we still got AB next phase, where premades will be a LOT more prevalent. this should also make so premades barely do wsg. so that's a plus for those who like wsg
Youre imagining that this happens always and everytime. It doesnt and it wont. The demand from 3 priests per premade goes to 4... if youre composition is to be believed. So every 5 man premade wants 2 priests, thats overall 1 more than a 10 man premade. I doubt premades will be as prevalent in AB due to the BG being larger... its easier to get 10 people than 15, i mean not by much but thats why people whine about 40 man raids because its harder to coordinate 40 instead of 20. So the bigger we go the less likely players wanna do it. WSG is also more condensed and you can run around in a single group easier than AB where you need to split up to win, ive won more AB's against premades over the decade+ than WSG due to this difference in battleground design. Their healers cant be everywhere at once and if they split up we can gank em easier. But also AB has a timer and even if you lose you gain rep most likely... there are thresholds to gaining rep/honor if i remember correct, in WSG its ONLY from capping the flag so if the premade stops you from capping a single time then you gain nothing. In AB you can get rep after a small amount of points so if the premade isnt able to 5 cap without you not getting a single node then youll get some rep for sure. (which is guaranteed reward if people stay at farm/stables for even a little bit)
You don't have to WSG at all anymore. With the weekly giving 1k rep, if you ashenvale to revered, you will be exalted by 60 without stepping foot into a single WSG. They did this after my 171 WSG games of solo que. 41% Win rate. Most all losses from premade groups. At least my alts can benefit from it. Getting my alts to rank 3 it seemed like more casuals/solo que people encountered when the weekend was up, wish it was up every weekend at least till 25 phase ends.
@@Based_Chameleon exactly. We have no knowledge of this happening. Heck, we don't know if they will keep BFD on next phase (having 5 lvl 40s clean up the raid in 10-15 mins to give the world buff would be an amazing bonus come Gnomeregan). With the dead time until Feb 8, getting WSG rep and pre-farming as much proff stuff as possible for next proff level are the only sensible activities. These 2 and ofc doing your lockout run.
i agree with 5 premade, because nowdays when you see premade 9 druids balance 1 priest, 7hunters 3 priest , 10 priests shadow, i want to quit instant game because is ruined.
I can't stand fighting premades all day. Its just troll to fight 3 hunters 3 priests in a full 10 man group with the priests shielding the pets..They have world buffs and consumes and we get decimated in the opener.. I've hit high warlord multiple times since 2004 and this has just become so unfun I don't even wanna que up right now.
WSG is one of my fav Bgs and i think is ruined by full premade grp, i play horde and alliance and both sides are terrible full of premades, the only good side about horde is that q's are instant but ally are 5 to 7 minutes wait, these are my statistics so far both factions, this weekend i did 104 BG's 76 were premade we won against premades just 2 times and pug v pug were almost 50% 50% win rate (ally have higher win rate in pug v pug), i didn't join any premade this weekd bc first i do not enjoy stomping the other side and premade v premade are boring af bc if one side loses a flag then they just call it, its rare that a premade put some effort on another premade also a thing i notice when you are in a premade you get more pugs than solo q'
"some ppl live for 10 mans" aka some people only play the game to stomp on puppies and burn insects with a magnifying glass. can you imagine if they had tried to use this excuse back when Warcraft 3 TFT competitive RTS was in its prime in like 2002-2008 or whenever that was? yeah good luck convincing the playerbase of the past that facing a 4v4 Arranged (premade) team of sweats with discord while you were somehow thrown in there despite the fact you queued up for 1v1, and all you have to work with are random people of differing skill levels who may or may not even be able to communicate in english over text chat.
No, premade Vs premade only, solo q Vs solo q, just ruins it for casual players plus you want to Vs a premade as a premade makes it alot harder and more interesting
the premade thing is very weird, sometimes you can coordinate with your pugs and actually win because the premade are just trash players who didn't expect a fight
Ez fix, dont split anything. Just make sure the que is max focusing to match premades v premades. And after 20 mins of looking it can que you against a pug. Same thing for part premades. If you are ok with just running into premades or waiting 20 mins for a game ? Then you deserve to play in a premade.
@@bobbyr5536 Trash idea that premades run primarily into premades ? Not sure how. I mean if you are just bad and wanna smash unorganized grps with out healers, then thats one thing. But if you want a proper fight, then fighting organized teams is what should be fun.
The aggrend post has done too much damage already. Now all the rep farmers just cite it as gospel and conversation ender. As the tryhards reach exalted, and with the Ashenvale event granting 1000 rep, the problem might actually solve itself. The incentive to farm rep and honor though WSG will diminish and people will play it for fun. So more pugs. We'll see what happens in AB and AV later on, but the greatest problem with abusive behavior by far was always WSG , even in vanilla/classic.
Aggrend just wants to keep abusing warsong parties that's it, I don't see why he would be opposed to limiting premades when it's obvious it's giga abusing matchmaking...
Easy fix, incentivize solo ques. Bonus honor and a 5-10% bonus health and damage to solo qued players. Extra 75 rep at the end of the game for solo que.
I barely have time to play the game let alone make a pre made get on disco and then what i play 2 games and gtg leaving my pre made having to find another person. I love playing bg and i no longer play the game cause its just not worth it atm
Hot take people do the rep grind for 60 gear advantage you shouldnt care for 40 bracers you get exalted from ashenvale in 21 weeks that will be lvl 50s phase easy dont pvp
I like solo shuffle but queue times were abysmal and made me stop playing at the time because no one wants to heal and they won’t make a dps vs dps mode or even mirror match dps because they are afraid of the chaos
And this is a bad thing why? Why not start the end game content with some significant advantages that will allow for more mistakes, more casual gameplay, less sweatiness and less bickering about what dropped and who got it? Rank14 gear is ~BWL level gear, which means that Ony/MC can be farmed on day 1 - plus allow the non sweatty people catch up with some gear. Is it bad to want to simply roflstomp on the game (no, I don't mean "oh you go in with patch 1.14 talents and patch 1.14 gear and world buffs", I mean literally humiliate the raids, e.g. go in Garr, gather everything together and aoe it down, get Executus and the rest of the lads on the pit in the circle, and cleave everything down, etc. What's wrong with that? Why not simply eff things up a bit? Just this once?
I think they might barrier level 60 from getting r14 at the start to test content. Once alliance gets a taste of AV loses I still think people won't get r14 😂
The guy saying trash players want to play in premades is spot on right. The same trash players that would stop playing if they add a 10vs10 premade que because they are actually bad at pvp
PLEASE BLIZZARD IT ISNT FUN. Seriously even when me and 4 of my buddies queue, we have to try SO HARD to win vs people backpedaling and we’ve been pvping for fucking 10+ YEARS. All because the enemy has a shit ton of meta comp picks running it down our other teammates throats. We don’t have complete control over what classes the other 5 people play and we’re only queuing with 1 healer. It’s actual dogshit to face a bunch of priests and pallies CONSTANTLY. Whenever we fight a pug we shit on them and even some bad premades but in most cases we get steamrolled by a clusterfuck of noobs stacking up that are unkillable with all the prayer of mendings
I think premades are horrible and horrible for pvp. I was kind of excited to pvp in SoD because the cap being 25 means I can slowly learn the character I chose in pvp and learn new macros etc etc etc.... instead I get qued into premades almost every single time I que up which turns into 1 of 2 things. They quickly cap out and no honorable kills are made or they farm you at the graveyard with no honorable kills being made. It is one of the worst experiences I've ever had in pvp and I refuse to que and will continue to refuse to que until AB. At least in AB I know if they 5 cap us it's done is seconds and if they decide to start farming us at the graveyard.... /afk because the debuff is likely going to be faster then waiting for them to finish farming us anyway.
@@TheZeagon because everything takes time and I'm not willing to take time to make a premade. I did it once... and it took about 30 minutes for the group to just break apart before we even did one because we couldn't get enough people of the right classes to do it. To be honest we couldn't even get 10 into the group to begin with.... sooo why waste the time?
@@TheZeagon ORRRRRR I could use that time to instead get groups for pve content in half the time and do it myself and just ignore everything that has to do with WSG.
10000% agree. Haven't queued once since realising the situation. Saying "just join a premade" doesn't take into account the fact that you kind of need to be a hunter or priest to get an invite. Aggrend has basically destroyed solo queue, which was always one of my favourite things in WoW. Otherwise, loving SoD, but WSG is a big fail.
Hunter / priest isn’t even the main comp these days - it used to be.
Ditto on not queueing once for the same reason. I'd love to play Warsong, a lot, but god damn I just don't want to suffer lol.
I've exalted two characters with WSG, a third is nearing completion. Every class is viable and has their place right now.
Stacking hunters and priests isn’t even the best after the latest nerfs. You can always make your own group too if you’re not getting invited
Farmed exalted in premades as a boomkin and warrior so this is not true at all. Also been in as mage. But the system is still bad yes
Big true! Premades become ineffective if youre queing into other premades, so people will just go back to small groups. I'm a solo random bg enjoyer, I grind out rank 10 in classic just queueing all 3 BGs and doing whatever popped.
not true, if you're really grinding rep, you just decide after the first battle mid. If you win, you go for the caps, if you lose, you go for straight loss 5-6 min, which is still good rep
@@MadsThorlundthis argument is why premades shouldn’t exist.
I really like the 5-man limit idea.
@@zStC1why doesn’t it work
Might as well try it out.
just premade, problem solved
Nah that’s an L take, form your own pre-made
it doesnt work because huge groups sync queues on a big discord, and only join the games when both 5 mans queues pop, its been done in AV premades on era for ages
Premades are lame. They ruin the fun for other players and it’s never about “the social dynamic”. No one is queueing with 9 of their friends to hangout with the gang. It’s about getting with 9 others to stomp pugs for optimal rewards as you stated. This needs to change.
Yes, this shit needs to stop. The devs being intellectually dishonest on their Twitter/X platforms grinds my gears so much; it's so obvious to everyone what is going on with premade BGs
Part of why I loved WSG solo que in the past was becuase every BG was a mix of different classes, leading to different and fun PvP. Great take on the post, really enjoyed.
premade stomp is 100% a thing. My most enjoyed game however, was vs a premade. We actually got a good grp and kept them in there 45 minutes. They won 3-2, but they had to work for it
That’s what it’s all about ! GJ
I just want a 20 minute timer
Stopped playing SoD all together after 2 weeks and a few raids for this reason. Bgs as pug just means afk dead at gy. Zero fun. I’d rather listen to music/pvp then be forced into picking 2-4 classes and discord just to pvp.
When you join a premade and don't immediately speed stomp the other side, it's actually crazy how mad your team will get. it's obvious that premades are created with the intention to farm groups that aren't as good as yours, not to actually have a challenge. I did a premade vs premade last night and the amount of toxcity that I experienced from my own faction was insane. We actually won 3 -1 and everyone quit after 1 game because we didn't dominate them in less than 15 minutes. I think Wille said this, but premades right now are pvp, meaning priest vs priest.
You are absolutely spot on. It's actually unbelievable how every single point Aggrend made was pretty much easily debunkable, and that post on forums proves it.
I love PvP but the current state of WSG has nothing to do with it and people running these premades are not in it for pvp but for rep grind. I joined these premades when farming exalted rep and we just afk-ed on opponent's graveyards for hours on end with an odd premade matchup where there was a good game. That means about 60% of time it was an unenjoyable rep grind where neither us or our opponents did absolutely nothing.
The easiest solution would be to make the tooltip when joining true - join as group, or join as solo. The only rule you need to implement is that two groups cannot join at the same time at the same faction and you're good to go.
they just need to make it so if we only have 10dps random queing it cant go against a 3healer premade or even a random group with healers.
most trade made premade fall apart when they lose once against a random group that had healers
@@TheZeagon I can agree with almost every suggestion apart from this now as there being absolutely not a SINGLE rule implemented when creating a wsg matchup is just broken. Everything would be better than this mess we have right now
the funny thing here is that Blizzard knows EXACTLY what will happen if they make it premade vs. premade queues.
the result is going to be that queues literally die and nobody does premade anymore, because suddenly the workload has gone from nonexistent to actual sweat vs. sweat levels of workload required to win.
when premade teams were stomping randoms in Overwatch and blizzard put on premade vs. premade, everyone stopped premading because taking your chance at fighting other people queuing solo and hoping they have a bad player on their team led to higher win chances across the board compared to the premade vs. premade queues.
I totally agree with the 5 man limit idea and a separate 10v10 queue BUT I think they should give bonus honor for 10v10 premades so that it doesn't fall to the wayside because it's inefficient. It doesn't need to be the most insane honor farm but it should be worth doing
Since atm people are grinding WSG rep (and soon AB rep), create TWO different marks as rewards: the classic mark that you will get when you go in as a party which will give you 100 rep when you deliver 3 of them, and the solo mark that will give you, oh, 120 rep when you deliver 3 of them.
See how quickly this will balance things.
P.S. so far really deep in the grind, but having made over 10+k of rep against premades, solely by losses, forced surrenders and being relegated to watching shit on the other screen while in GY, it's a GRUELLING HORRIFYING experience. Unfortunately I am too deep to stop now, but boy is it a punishing thing.
Actually you can stop and lose nothing. The ashenvale event gives 1000 rep now, so in 11 weeks without any more WSG you will have exalted. I really really doubt the lvl 40 bracers reward will be made available in p2. But in any case, you will still get there anyway and be ready for p3 and beyond.
@@bspuswill it be going on post phase 1 though? Won’t it be dead?
@@zepho100 You mean will they remove it completely? I don't know of course but seriously doubt it. People will want their alts to gain rep and if Blizzard denies them there will be drama. Or anyone starting late would effectively be denied the chance to get exalted with silverwing unless they make an incredible time commitment, from neutral to exalted (42k rep total).
Now it might be harder to win as fewer groups will form to nuke bosses. They have already changed it so it starts at max 3 hours after the previous even end. So it will not be a problem to get to 100% for both sides. In fact, it might actually be experienced as it was intended and be -god forbid somewhat fun too.
in any case, all it takes is a single grunt kill and loot. they are easily pullable and soloable despite being lvl 25 "elites"
I 💯 agree. I only have a few hours a week to play. The only person I play with is my brother. We both love pvp. And having a five person cap on premade is a fair balance I think. You do a couple wsg that last a hour a piece so some premade can farm us totally discourages me from wanting to play. Great video!
Even with 5-mans being the max, people will find a workaround to get into the same games somewhat reliably like they've done in the past. Coordinating 2 groups of 5 to queue at the same time is really not that difficult. A max of 3 would be much better suited to not be exploited as easily.
wow, what a quality video, im gonna share this with my grandmother, she is in brazil right now getting a butt lift.
Premades should be vs premades only, give them a bit more honor for premade games so its worth to play competitive. In my opinion the warsong issues are more fundamental, it was never designed to abuse bug walljumps to run in circles forever, i know some people like it, but its bad for the game since we have no timer in classic.
Also premade vs premade isn't fun for most people, because its just min maxing bug abusing and has nothing to do with original vanilla - Most people q with a premade to grind honor faster and not because they just wanna pvp, its just not the same pvp as if you que with randoms.
I couldn't agree more. I actually like PvP in WoW, but in Classic SOD I ONLY PvP until I hit the rank cap and max rep and after that I rarely hit WSG -or- Ashenvale with any of my characters because there's no benefit after that and I am not interested in joining premades just to rofl-stomp players nonstop... it's NO fun. PvP is fun when it's challenging, not when it's just a nonstop insta-win or getting mowed over with no chance to win.
"Aggrend" is completely stupid. His argument is nowhere near compelling. It's worth less than my fart. He's defending the premade meta for the subset of disingenuous premade scrubs.
As a rogue, I’m nearly BIS geared, use consumes and perform well in PVP but unless I start my own premade I will not get into one on my server.
Sooo many times I send a query, “BIS rogue LF WSG” and get a reply from a raid lead, “I don’t take rogues”.
I literally haven’t even queued for BGs in SoD bcuz I don’t want to get stomped by premades. 😟
I feel like the solution is to add some kind of MMR system if the population can support it so premades that are winning a bunch naturally get matched against each other.
Maybe the rewards for losing in WG can also be looked at so losing isn't so punishing. It would be nice if it at least gave you some honor even if you don't cap the flag once.
it's an MMO. It should encourage you to play/group with others.
I ran into eight premades in a row and never queued again. It's a horrible experience.
SoD is supposed to be more casual friendly. Overall less sweaty... So it's extra confusing as to why Blizzard digs their heels in on this topic in order to defend the minority player type.
There's even a premade meta. If you're not one of the meta classes to fit into the comp... you also can't easily get into a premade.
I'm with you on killing queuing as a raid and going group-only. I love PvP but this situation is a train wreck of an otherwise fantastic version of the game.
I totally feel for you. Being a not meta class/spec, right now, as a tankadin, I am singularly effed. You can't imagine how many times I questioned my life's choices so far while I am forced to surrender at GY to go for the next game, the next surrender, the next loss, the next mark.
P.S. if you want to get quick rep, get to EU servers. Horde single handedly cleans house in WSG.
Well I grinded exalted as a pug all my life playing classic. This time at first I joined a few pugs - and it was horrible - and then decided to always spend those extra 10 min and find a good group. Wow, the experience was sky and earth. Yes, the matches are long af. Yes we lose as well. But it was most fun ever - to play Warsong in a premade versus other premades. I’m already done with both of my toons this new ashenvale rep def helps grinding things faster.
separating queues obviously not the answer anyone who has played the game before knows this, they need to add some sort of reward system for solo queueing.
ah yes punishing people for wanting to play with friends classic blizzard que system mentality
@@TheZeagon "with friends" you mean "with other people wanting to maximize honor gain"?
Exactly: different bg marks, with the solo ones give more rep when you deliver 3 of them. So simple.
@@TheZeagon other people in the premade arent your friends, they are in it only for themselves... not because they like you.
Bruh anyone here that says they get in a 10man premade because they love the 10v10 exp is just spewing garbage from their mouth lol.
I ranked to 14 in 2019 during peak covid and can tell you that none of us wanted to do that grind willingly and none of us ever wanted to see another premade bc it hindered our honor per hour.
Also once alterac valley comes out no one will ever touch WSG or AB unless they have been rotting their brain in AV all day and want a change of pace for 1 or 2 games out of the 16 hour grind people will do.
No wow player have friends, so "being able to queue with friends" is not a valid argument
In my current rep grind to exalted...if I see the other team is a premade, I see how the initial clash goes...if its a wipe I don't even try and would rather let them cap quick and move on to the next one. I promise, once exalted, I will never queue into WSG until they do something with the premades...it will be awful in AB also.
L
@@bobbyr5536 getting matched against premades over and over really is an L
I do casual premades fairly often and it's true a lot of people just do it for the rates, but i will say without fail, at a certain point during the session, people in the premade start wishing that they would run into another premade just to have an actual real game of wsg. The funniest part about this is that most premades are not really pvp players and literally just fill out a powerful comp of overtuned classes/specs/runes and faceroll. And when those players face any kind of adversity in a match, or even worse, they lose, they get upset and start making excuses. Like 9/10 times the atmosphere in a discord will go from happy go lucky people getting that sweet ego boost of destroying people that had no chance to begin with to "this is so unfair he's doing the jumps. He's popping consumes what a tryhard." etc. The 5 man que is honestly a great idea and sadly no matter what you do with a 10v10 que it will be dead except for wargames like people setting up times to premade against others of equal caliber because the truth is all the top pvp players running premades will effectively steam roll 99% of the player base and kill the que themselves. All these PUG premades you see in chat spamming will frankly just feel like the people that currently solo que into games vs premades having 0% chance at winning. I would LOVE if they implemented these changes. It would let tryhards that want competitive pvp get what they want and it would increase the quality of wsg matches overall no question. WSG should be fun for everyone but at this point it's pretty much a mindless activity 99% of the time premade or not.
sorry for brick of text. also nerf starsurge.
Blizzard not adding in premade prevention is the reason several of my friends are reluctant to play SoD after the shit show that was classic pvp battlegrounds.
Just queue against premades of similar size. If the queue is long or doesn’t pop, then that’s your decision to stay or leave and queue solo. This will solve it.
But a 10 man rated BG q would be sick too
Solo q BGs at the moment are just like a "stay afk in ghost and wait for the lose while you do something else in alt tab" thing; no fun, but just a really slow farm of 100 rep from 3 lost BGs
I like Warsong but I stopped playing because if I Q I have a 50% chance I have to afk for 10min at the graveyard until the other team is done farming and gets the flagges.
I don’t got time for this to be honest and it’s sad
Yesterday i was playing few WSG premades. And for some reason all 6 games i did had enemy premades in them. Most fun ever!!
The guy with 42% premade rate was lucky. Whenever i que i get 9 out of 10 games against premades which made me stop playing bgs at all
@@morten8586 yeah bro i feel you. But just saying yesterday felt wierd. Cause all bgs i qued whit a premade i had a premade against us.
If it’s WSG weekend then it’s only premades.
I think its absolutely embarrassing that blizzard has not found a solution to this and implemented it yet
The difference in playstyle seems to be those who want fast games vs people who want to have a challenge. I personally have always disliked WSG purely because I spend more time dead than alive, when the other team realizes I'm a decent pvper if left to my own devices. I play healers and dps flex heal/support most of the time.
Premades are most commonly a rep farm or an honor farm.
Premade vs premade queue likely isn't realistic because a competitive match is an inefficient farm. The queue times would be much longer and matches that were competitive would last far too long. They would have to offer an incentive that solo q doesn't in order for them to exist without 30-60m wait times.
There would be little to no premades if it were implemented.
The solution to their current problem is to up the rep for warsong so people get that grind done faster. Premades would still exist but there would be far fewer.
Players typically don't have a huge problem with premades, but currently there are a ton of them running so it feels bad solo-queing into every other match being a 7 minute waiting room for 1 token.
100% agree. Bgs were never competitive activity, even in retail there are like 5 people doing rbg. I've been playing wow for 15 years and I guess now it's the first time in the whole history of wow when I cant solo queue bg.
fairly certain the lead of the classic wow team recently said that if you want to win, you need to premade
I like the idea of 5 cap on premades. I suck at pvp but when its randos vs randos i usually have a chance to get kills and get wins. But getting rofflestomed isnt fun for me.
ppl in premades only want fast wins and rep. they dont care about having fun in bgs
if the blizzard system will put 10 dps against 3 healers premades why would you want people to use the rng que system instead of premade?
It's crazy Aggrend doesn't see or understand this. Premade vs pug isn't good gameplay. It's for stomping pugs and farming bis honor/rep for hour. Isn't that the exact kind of thing SoD is supposed to avoid or amend?
I got wsg exalted almost strictly solo queueing, Im a bis rogue and I spent an hour+ some days failing to find a group because all anyone wants is a priest and hunter. I cba to form my own group and I shouldn't have to. Every pvp game has solo queue as the main way to queue.
Lvl 40 will probably come out before they do anything about it. I wonder if AB will be as bad with premades
Ya I stopped solo queing cause it's brutal when half the team just gives up right off the bat when they see it's a premade. Can we get a surrender choice so we don't have to wait as ghosts for the premade to run the flag.
I’d still enjoy premade vs premade. I hate queing into pugs and nobody has any idea what’s going on, nobody pushes for flags and lets efc run past.
I stopped queing up for this reason. I was tired of getting stomped by full 10m premades with 3 priest and you could never do any dmg and get no kills then they just camp your GY and the 3 cap you like they're the only ones in the WSG.
OH yeah because I love when I solo queue and I get no healers on my team and people just want to AFK or get hard carried instead of actually playing the object, oh yeah I sure love that ! That feels amazing, I also love when people just want to zug middle and do absolutely nothing 👍
BGs now is like a Raids, you cant go there solo... Every time I wanna chill solo que at bg, I remeber about premades and skip BG chill, just going doing other things like farming gold
They told us no RBG style battle grounds. There are many people who wargane WSG. We are about to get rid of premade because terrible pugs comps. The priest went 10-1 solo because how good having a healer is. Idc if bad pugs don’t have fun losing, I want harder BGs to be rewarding because right now the only people not trying in BGs only want the pvp rewards for pve, so why care? Why change pvp stuff for casual players and leave the people who like to pvp in the dust
bad logic... you just want fast wins if you want tougher this is the perfect timne for you to solo queue then...
I just want to do battlegrounds in my game...but I cant. What the hell else am I suppose to do for another month waiting for p2?? It sucks.
So true. I played 10 games and won 3 of them because it was pug vs pug….the other 7 we were gj farmed and waited till they captured 3 flags.
a pre made in discord calling where the flag carrier is fighting a none pre made in my opinion is the equivalent to wall hacking in CS
Funny how SoD is marketed as casual but has the biggest sweat/meta chasing gigachads I’ve seen in wow to date, not only has it overflown into the pvp scene now but the fact pug BFD’s require world buffs and check logs is just comical to me
I haven't touch Warsong at all.
PLEASE make the 5 man idea or solo/premade que
Beating a premade as a pug is the buzz... its rare tho... would live pug v pug
There are no solutions. Doing nothing though is worse than doing something. If you separate the queues it is only the illusion of choice. Are you really playing by yourself? Whether it’s a queue into 9 random players or 9 random players from Trade chat. Once again, the illusion of choice. The clear advantage is the choice of composition which can be addressed as role queue. Again another illusion of choice in SOD because classes are diverse due to runes.
I have been running in premades to get exalted as a druid. It has been easy to find groups and if you get your group to join voice chat in discord you have a huge advantage over other premades. You fight against other premades about half the time in my experience as Alliance. I have enjoyed premade vs premade bgs a lot but it definitely is shitty to have pugs vs premades
I don't do pvp. If I decided to give it a try, I would stop giving it a try if I don't have fun doing it - and that's regardless of any skill/gear/experience considerations. If I were to find myself in a scenario where I did decide to finally give battlegrounds a try, and our side consistently never gets a single kill, the healthy response is to go do something else - you don't perpetuate a broken system. Coincidentally, I've heard pvp mains oppose dual specs because it means that they are less likely to encounter players in pve spec when doing pvp, as in, it makes it harder for them. That tells you all you need to know about your average pvp player.
Logged in to do wsg with one friend tonight, queued into 3priest 7boomie pre-made had us at our gy in a minute.. we afkd out and logged off fk that
i RFUSE to queue wsg in sod because of premades i got honored through ashenvale and thats it the grind for the current wsg exalted gear just isnt worth it ill get honor through horde isnta queue av when it comes out.
unless they add better epic gear for exalted wsg its not worth going past honored and fyi ab will be 10 man premades as well it will be as bad as wsg.
I consider premade to be the same sort of evil as players who go through the first rush loose the mid battle and quit the BG forcing some poor smuck into a already loosing game. People premade because they want to slaughter the other side wanting to fight pugs and feel important by being nothing more than be bullies.
5 man limit is the way - on the bright side me and 2 buddies que’d into a crusader strike premade and absolutely destroyed them and it felt very nice 🤣
Other thing I was talking to my guild about this the other night- about 20 of us in disc all agreed Nobody seeks out premades except for it’s the only affective way to get rep in the current meta.
@@zStC1 for sure always will be some. What is your solution do nothing?
I’d rather lessen the amount of premades/make them unorganized then just keep it how it is. You are right people will always abuse the game, doesn’t mean we should make it easy for them.
@@zStC1 no matter what you do people will abuse it so pretty shit take. Lower percentage of people doing something does help the over all community. The future is now old man.
Give rep & honor for participating in WSG instead of just for kills & caps. I think that will make the feels bad feel less bad. Right now if you que into a WSG, get rofl-stomped & 3-capped, you literally walk away with nothing and you’ve wasted your time.
This also means giving the winning side a bump in rep & honor if they win.
Only solo WSG ive won is sneaking into a premade after the 10th guy missed his que
Watch any Vampire Clan Wargame - ALMOST NO ONE WANTS A REAL 10 v 10 PREMADE v PREMADE - say goodbye to 3-6 hours of your life in the most stressful wow environment possible.....
Aggrend: People want that awesome 10 vs 10 premade epic battleground where it feels like you're in the finals of a rated BG tournament!
Well that's what you think. In reality the people who premade do so to absolutely shitstomp casual players and turn people off from engaging in BGs altogether. It is a system that very easily turns inherently toxic and promotes toxicity. Especially in a version of wow where the difference between a regular level 25 character with regular dungeon gear and regular runes vs fully kitted level 25 raid gear and optimal runes is unbelievably big, it's not even a contest.
If the result of the BGs of premades vs premades were say 50 honor kills vs 10 honor kills, then maybe in some way the non premade could stand somewhat of a chance, but that's not the case. vast majority of the time they don't even have 1 honor kill against like 30 or 40. All premades I've gone up against our team didn't even score a SINGLE kill. Not a SINGLE one.
I'd say at that point you know something is fcked.
If they make premades 5 man or remove them totally, I stop playing in premades I just want optimal honor/rep per hour.
True, i played with my 2 buddies and growed tired of queueing
If they don't fix bgs the best thing to do is trying to get your rank 3 and then push ashenvale rep for 21 weeks
They just need to add RBGs and problem solved. The premades would be doing RBGs.
We never asked for another vanilla we asked for classic +.
Blizzard is just waiting for Phase 1 to be over so they don't have to fix wsg gulch
my thoughts exactly. This is why they did the "oh, the weekly gives 1k rep" thing, just to have an excuse.
Problem is there is too many sweat lords that will just find a way to do this exact same thing to any update they come out with for it, classic wow players will find a way to min max and ruin it almost immediately - Get rid of the bg rep gear rewards try to just have warsong queue for fun (5man queue is a great start)
If your argument is "some people live for 10man premades" but adding pre-made vs pre.ade would kill their fun then they are not living for premades, but actually for farming
5man wont work. at least not in the way people are hopping for. the meta will just shift to: 2 priest, 1 FC, 1 Fc Killer, 1 flex. and the dps will queue solo. people will just give the disc at the start of the bg. and you will get a premade basically. and no premade has its own problems as well. Not saying that premade are a good thing, but there is no easy solution that people think there is. And we still got AB next phase, where premades will be a LOT more prevalent. this should also make so premades barely do wsg. so that's a plus for those who like wsg
Youre imagining that this happens always and everytime. It doesnt and it wont. The demand from 3 priests per premade goes to 4... if youre composition is to be believed. So every 5 man premade wants 2 priests, thats overall 1 more than a 10 man premade.
I doubt premades will be as prevalent in AB due to the BG being larger... its easier to get 10 people than 15, i mean not by much but thats why people whine about 40 man raids because its harder to coordinate 40 instead of 20. So the bigger we go the less likely players wanna do it.
WSG is also more condensed and you can run around in a single group easier than AB where you need to split up to win, ive won more AB's against premades over the decade+ than WSG due to this difference in battleground design. Their healers cant be everywhere at once and if they split up we can gank em easier.
But also AB has a timer and even if you lose you gain rep most likely... there are thresholds to gaining rep/honor if i remember correct, in WSG its ONLY from capping the flag so if the premade stops you from capping a single time then you gain nothing. In AB you can get rep after a small amount of points so if the premade isnt able to 5 cap without you not getting a single node then youll get some rep for sure. (which is guaranteed reward if people stay at farm/stables for even a little bit)
You don't have to WSG at all anymore. With the weekly giving 1k rep, if you ashenvale to revered, you will be exalted by 60 without stepping foot into a single WSG. They did this after my 171 WSG games of solo que. 41% Win rate. Most all losses from premade groups. At least my alts can benefit from it. Getting my alts to rank 3 it seemed like more casuals/solo que people encountered when the weekend was up, wish it was up every weekend at least till 25 phase ends.
That will only be the case IF Blizzard decides to keep the Ashenvale event in the game.
@@Based_Chameleon exactly. We have no knowledge of this happening. Heck, we don't know if they will keep BFD on next phase (having 5 lvl 40s clean up the raid in 10-15 mins to give the world buff would be an amazing bonus come Gnomeregan).
With the dead time until Feb 8, getting WSG rep and pre-farming as much proff stuff as possible for next proff level are the only sensible activities. These 2 and ofc doing your lockout run.
They already talked in one of the interviews about BFD still being in the game at the later phases.@@PhilipAlexanderHassialis
I’m very tired of going against premades as I am a solo q”er … it makes it not fucking fun at all I say that from the heart
i agree with 5 premade, because nowdays when you see premade 9 druids balance 1 priest, 7hunters 3 priest , 10 priests shadow, i want to quit instant game because is ruined.
I can't stand fighting premades all day. Its just troll to fight 3 hunters 3 priests in a full 10 man group with the priests shielding the pets..They have world buffs and consumes and we get decimated in the opener.. I've hit high warlord multiple times since 2004 and this has just become so unfun I don't even wanna que up right now.
WSG is one of my fav Bgs and i think is ruined by full premade grp, i play horde and alliance and both sides are terrible full of premades, the only good side about horde is that q's are instant but ally are 5 to 7 minutes wait, these are my statistics so far both factions, this weekend i did 104 BG's 76 were premade we won against premades just 2 times and pug v pug were almost 50% 50% win rate (ally have higher win rate in pug v pug), i didn't join any premade this weekd bc first i do not enjoy stomping the other side and premade v premade are boring af bc if one side loses a flag then they just call it, its rare that a premade put some effort on another premade also a thing i notice when you are in a premade you get more pugs than solo q'
"some ppl live for 10 mans" aka some people only play the game to stomp on puppies and burn insects with a magnifying glass.
can you imagine if they had tried to use this excuse back when Warcraft 3 TFT competitive RTS was in its prime in like 2002-2008 or whenever that was?
yeah good luck convincing the playerbase of the past that facing a 4v4 Arranged (premade) team of sweats with discord while you were somehow thrown in there despite the fact you queued up for 1v1, and all you have to work with are random people of differing skill levels who may or may not even be able to communicate in english over text chat.
Everyone I know loves pvp and isn't queueing wsg because it's not fun. Fortunately, world pvp has been a lot of fun in SoD.
No, premade Vs premade only, solo q Vs solo q, just ruins it for casual players plus you want to Vs a premade as a premade makes it alot harder and more interesting
the best way to interact with WSG is to never go in one
ill wait 21 weeks for exalted no problem
this is great game design
the premade thing is very weird, sometimes you can coordinate with your pugs and actually win because the premade are just trash players who didn't expect a fight
It killed the fun of pvp in classic, and its doing the same to SOD pvp.
Ez fix, dont split anything. Just make sure the que is max focusing to match premades v premades. And after 20 mins of looking it can que you against a pug. Same thing for part premades.
If you are ok with just running into premades or waiting 20 mins for a game ? Then you deserve to play in a premade.
Trash idea
@@bobbyr5536 Trash idea that premades run primarily into premades ? Not sure how. I mean if you are just bad and wanna smash unorganized grps with out healers, then thats one thing. But if you want a proper fight, then fighting organized teams is what should be fun.
The aggrend post has done too much damage already. Now all the rep farmers just cite it as gospel and conversation ender.
As the tryhards reach exalted, and with the Ashenvale event granting 1000 rep, the problem might actually solve itself. The incentive to farm rep and honor though WSG will diminish and people will play it for fun. So more pugs.
We'll see what happens in AB and AV later on, but the greatest problem with abusive behavior by far was always WSG , even in vanilla/classic.
Aggrend just wants to keep abusing warsong parties that's it, I don't see why he would be opposed to limiting premades when it's obvious it's giga abusing matchmaking...
Hey man, what happened to the outro music? Love that part, brings me way back every time.
I played 3 warsong gulches since sod began
All 3 were against pre mades
I will never do another one its complete bullshit
Easy fix, incentivize solo ques. Bonus honor and a 5-10% bonus health and damage to solo qued players. Extra 75 rep at the end of the game for solo que.
I barely have time to play the game let alone make a pre made get on disco and then what i play 2 games and gtg leaving my pre made having to find another person. I love playing bg and i no longer play the game cause its just not worth it atm
It's this bad when you only need like 4500 honor from rank 2-3.
I can't wait to see what it's like when you need 500k.
Hot take people do the rep grind for 60 gear advantage you shouldnt care for 40 bracers you get exalted from ashenvale in 21 weeks that will be lvl 50s phase easy dont pvp
They literally made solo shuffle in retail to combat this. Obviously solo que is necessary
I like solo shuffle but queue times were abysmal and made me stop playing at the time because no one wants to heal and they won’t make a dps vs dps mode or even mirror match dps because they are afraid of the chaos
Another thing is when we can get to level 60, everybody is going to be rank 14 with this new no-decay honor system that has no standings.
And this is a bad thing why? Why not start the end game content with some significant advantages that will allow for more mistakes, more casual gameplay, less sweatiness and less bickering about what dropped and who got it? Rank14 gear is ~BWL level gear, which means that Ony/MC can be farmed on day 1 - plus allow the non sweatty people catch up with some gear.
Is it bad to want to simply roflstomp on the game (no, I don't mean "oh you go in with patch 1.14 talents and patch 1.14 gear and world buffs", I mean literally humiliate the raids, e.g. go in Garr, gather everything together and aoe it down, get Executus and the rest of the lads on the pit in the circle, and cleave everything down, etc. What's wrong with that? Why not simply eff things up a bit? Just this once?
I think they might barrier level 60 from getting r14 at the start to test content. Once alliance gets a taste of AV loses I still think people won't get r14 😂
The guy saying trash players want to play in premades is spot on right. The same trash players that would stop playing if they add a 10vs10 premade que because they are actually bad at pvp
PLEASE BLIZZARD IT ISNT FUN. Seriously even when me and 4 of my buddies queue, we have to try SO HARD to win vs people backpedaling and we’ve been pvping for fucking 10+ YEARS. All because the enemy has a shit ton of meta comp picks running it down our other teammates throats. We don’t have complete control over what classes the other 5 people play and we’re only queuing with 1 healer. It’s actual dogshit to face a bunch of priests and pallies CONSTANTLY. Whenever we fight a pug we shit on them and even some bad premades but in most cases we get steamrolled by a clusterfuck of noobs stacking up that are unkillable with all the prayer of mendings
Either remove 10man premade quing pvp or remove solo quing.
Either way solves the issue.
I think premades are horrible and horrible for pvp. I was kind of excited to pvp in SoD because the cap being 25 means I can slowly learn the character I chose in pvp and learn new macros etc etc etc.... instead I get qued into premades almost every single time I que up which turns into 1 of 2 things. They quickly cap out and no honorable kills are made or they farm you at the graveyard with no honorable kills being made. It is one of the worst experiences I've ever had in pvp and I refuse to que and will continue to refuse to que until AB. At least in AB I know if they 5 cap us it's done is seconds and if they decide to start farming us at the graveyard.... /afk because the debuff is likely going to be faster then waiting for them to finish farming us anyway.
why not find 9 friends and que? find guildies or even the cecpool premade trade groups instead of just queing solo in a mmo
@@TheZeagon because everything takes time and I'm not willing to take time to make a premade. I did it once... and it took about 30 minutes for the group to just break apart before we even did one because we couldn't get enough people of the right classes to do it. To be honest we couldn't even get 10 into the group to begin with.... sooo why waste the time?
@@thesoulcounter then get your friends to do it lmao
Just get your friends who don't care about wasting 5-10min while you play a second game tabbed out. What I did getting Max rep
@@TheZeagon ORRRRRR I could use that time to instead get groups for pve content in half the time and do it myself and just ignore everything that has to do with WSG.