Lads don’t be afraid to stand on combat sports athletes’ toes. It’s not like we’re going to track you down for saying that doing heavy squats on a bosu ball for ‘conditioning’ is a bad idea 😂.
Huge Wonderboy fan here from his homestate of South Carolina and I'm glad you guys did this. These issues are rampant within the sport. Firas Zahabi seems to have a better grip on these training issues. Perhaps you could look into his work. Either way it's great what you're doing in these critiques
Definitely second yall looking at Phil Daru, he's kind of known as the gold standard in mma S&C. The gym he works at probably has the highest budget of any mma gym aside from the actual UFC Performance Institute
Awesome video guys. I really like these breakdowns it really helps me find flaws in my own training. I would love to see a breakdown of Brian Alsruhe’s training methodologies. His videos got me into strongman training. He also mixes things into a big ball of wax but I feel like it’s in a unique and effective way.
This was one of my biggest issues when fighting I found out later. The mix and match sessions which do get you fitter, but never really improves drastically on anything. When I split up my work. Running for cardio, weights for strength and explosiveness and technique with a 70 to 75 percent effort I began to compete much much better.
My mind on S&C has changed so much. I think a lot of movies made us think we need to run every day. I used to run every day & under eat. did remotely zero heavy lifting. I had cardio for days but I had low power. Strength training & pylometrics has made a huge difference in performance. I also thought going balls to the walls every day was good. Then I started talking to elite athletes/coaches & they showed me the way. So much bro science still in combat sports
This was so cool! The recomodations also was great. Do these more! I really liked that you explained that not the exercises, but the struckturing is the problem, and you followed up with improving ideas.
I'm an optometrist and your comment about peripheral vision training intrigues me alot. Love to have some more content on this. All in all, great video.
It's funny how olympic weightlifting is now trending as a good supporting training for athletes, especially for grabblers, and at the same time a judo dojo I know markets themself as great supporting training for athletes, for example they trained some ice hockey players in the off-season. Now I've got no problem with that, I remember all the body control and confidence in contact I got from judo (and frankly I never got so ripped so fast elsewhere), but now I'm doing two supporting training sports without a main one to apply them to ;)
Fighting is chaotic in power exertion, stances, fatigue management, and angles. Strength and conditioning must replicate this chaotic nature. I believe there is huge value in the kind of training Wonderboy and other fighters do. Many well-conditioned fighters are following the exact same "unscientific" yet effective approach to strength and conditioning, yet they get/are strong like a beast, explosive and full of stamina. Look at videos of training from Frankie Edgar and Rich Franklin to Khabib and Gilbert Burns.
If you think those training methods are bad you should check out how people train for swimming. Regularly swimming multiple sets of 500 yards to train for a 50 or 100 yard race is extremely common and its why most people get worse when they go to swim in college (among many other things).
agreed with a lot of points here, but ladder/footwork drills at the end of session, when tired, are an essential (IMHO) part martial arts, it could be the difference between closing out a points win and getting caught at the end of a fight, knowing you can move well in a tired state is advantageous
Great video. Brilliant detail on the stability horseshit. Another video idea would be machine weights vs barbell weights with relation to the difference between physio and training and why there is confusion and crossover.
One summer when I was a kid I got a skateboard and skated all summer. Didn't pick up a a fotball at all. When fall came and fotball practice started up again I tried doing some tricking and immediately doubled my pb. Felt I had better balance(always had terrible balance) and I assumed it was from all the skating. Was I wrong since going from a unstable environment to a stable one doesn't make you more stable? This is 17 years ago and I still remember it as one of the biggest changes I have experienced, going from shit balance to decent balance and all of a sudden feeling stabel when tricking a fotball.
I think the point is that you learned to maintain a stable position on the board. When Wonderboy was doing his stability work he was never really maintaining a stable position, he was constantly rocking one way or another.
This seems like a good question. I think what's clear is that instability strength training is bad strength training, but I still wonder if it can be useful in some ways as a type of semi-specific skill training. For example, for fighters (I'm not one, I just watch it) couldn't it be useful to practice striking from an unstable position to simulate trying to ground and pound over someone's guard? If that's true, couldn't it be useful to practice pushups from that position? (This second step is sketchier, I realize.)
@@hamm0155 the best ground and pound practice is ground and pound. It's no different from learning how to pass a guard, no training implement will work as it's a skill that needs to be trained.
Is there a specific time and place for instability training? A personal example would be ring dips which feel great for me in terms of muscle recruitment and being an "effective training tool", however for a fighter who has experience with them, would stable dips still be better for gpp due to better force production potential? When it comes to single leg stability there's obviously a benefit in training them for being a generally better functioning person, and that's learning to stabilise from a less stable condition. So as you alluded to, there's certainly benefit to some level of instability or else we'd all be using purely machines for S&C. The question is then are balancing drills useful at all for athletes and in what context? For example, would single leg balancing drills with distractions be a good or bad balance exercise for a fighter? It may help strengthen foot muscles and works on a more stable surface than bosu balls but fighting is pretty much never done in a static position on your feet. Also, wouldn't proprioception increase coordination which would benefit athletic endeavours?
Great content again guys! Thank you for taking the time to enlighten the masses. Could we have a video on your thoughts about David Weck - the inventor of the Bosu Ball. His training methods are very alternative and are being applied to some high level athletes Lots of good content in that, I would say.
Great video. Do you think that hang power cleans with straps are dangerous? I find that even with hook grip, it's becoming not viable to do hang power clean sets of 3 with heavier weights. Hook grip does work nicely for single reps though
They covered in the video that they think it's dangerous? Being from the floor or hang is irrelevant, it's bailing that can have nasty consequences if you can't let go
So just to check guys? If you only had time for 1-2 S&C sessions a week due to the other training sessions you have... you advocate working in this order during the session: 1) sprint work/plyos etc. 2) power moves (hang cleans etc) 3) heavy moves - deadlifts/squats etc. 4) isolation moves, core/arms etc. ??? I always used to do heavy moves first so I had most energy for them/could lift more, but is that wrong then?
Hi guys, great video as ever. You say straps are a big no, no for power cleans. I've read that they aren't advised, but you seem to categorically against them - is this a safety thing, or technical break-down thing?
Missing a clean with straps can lead to hyperextension or even dislocation of your wrist. If you really want to use straps on cleans, at least use weightlifting straps (easier to release).
alot of your video seems to be arguing for the “transfer principle” could you do a video or explain more about this concept especially in sports sci and S&C.
Ever checked out Phil Daru's or Nick Curson's work? Curious what you'd think of that. Also what would you recommend for someone who is doing jiu jitsu tournaments back to back or multiple tourneys within a couple of months for S&C?Just maintaining the strength they've acquired or focused on the conditioning and speed work? thanks
I enjoyed the vid, thank you for sharing your insight. I have a few questions regarding your Strength Training for Combat athletes. I train mma 3-5 days a week, grappling 2x striking 2x and 1x mma full sparring. I now have just over a years experience. My goal is to compete in the amateurs before I’m 40! I also have a job 5-6 days a week 7-4PM. I have done strength programs in the past that revolved around templates; specifically Starting Strength and 5/3/1. I have trained Strength and MMA practice but it was tricky to progress. I was the most consistent with 5/3/1, since it was only one working set, and I would usually end up strength training after practice. My concern with investing in your program would be the time required to implement it. How much time is required per session? Also 4 days a week seems like a lot, can this be altered? Also I have been looking into strength training methods that would involve auto regulation, maybe like APRE. Would your program be able to account for fatigue outside of training under the bar? For example Starting Strength was almost impossible for me to follow due to my lack of time to train, but also by Wednesday-Thursday I was already getting tired, and wouldn’t feel like doing any extra work, especially after 2 days of grappling/rolling. Sorry for the long reply/question. But I really enjoy your content, and would be willing to make the investment in your program, provided it’s the right fit for me. Thanks in advance 🤜🙏
Honestly 5/3/1 is amazing for combat sports as it isn't high volume/fatigue and it auto regulates especially the app in the store does it for you. Combat sports athletes will definitely do full boy workout when doing their training. So doing 5/3/1 with some light volume is great.
Rippetoe advocates his 2 factor model for any sport where you basically train with a barbell for strength and all the other sport performance attributes will come through you practicing your sport. What are your thoughts?
Hi I have a question/video idea. I need to improve my grip strength as it is a limiting factor in many of my lifts/exercises. However when I allocate any notable volume towards it the quality and volume in my other sessions drop massively. For stuff like rdl’s it just means less reps but for pull-ups the range of motion and speed goes down. Passive grip training doesn’t allow me to progress my grip a fraction of the speed that my overall strength improves. I could explain more in detail but maybe you know of some good way of dealing with this kind of problem?
So if you want to be strong and have good condition, then you cant train it in one day? If I train weightlifting (snatches, squats, etc.), and at the end of the workout kb swings, db snatches, etc., is it wrong and I should divide it into weightlifting/strenght day and "condition" day?
Idea: a comment on LeBron James’ workouts. I believe there are quite a few available on the Tube and he is known to be a gym rat and taking great care of his body.
Gotta disagree on the shoe suggestion. You want to train your feet at all times for MMA, that powerclean has most of a correspondence with a fifty fifty wrestling position. So for wonder boy, as a striker, it's even more important for him to train strength with his shoes off as he's typically the weaker guy in the cage and he needs to train his balance while stuffing takedowns.
Just train the lift with shoes to get maximal value out of the clean and then do the wrestling position barefoot? Actual high level wrestlers(greeco-roman and freestyle) do olympic lifts and complexes with shoes seperately from their mat sessions. Stability training thru actual sport specific exercises, strength+explosivity from maximally effective lifts and conditioning thru sport specific + maximally effective exercises.
Feel the need to preface this comment with a no troll disclaimer. So... Not trolling. Has the guy on the right ever considered gyno surgery and/or medication? What's stopping him?
Not the analysis the combat community deserves, but the analysis that they need. I am Sikaman
🤣🤣🤣🤣
One of your best S&C coaches reaction videos yet lads, so much useful information tightly packed into 20 minutes
Thanks Erico!
Lads don’t be afraid to stand on combat sports athletes’ toes. It’s not like we’re going to track you down for saying that doing heavy squats on a bosu ball for ‘conditioning’ is a bad idea 😂.
But you might do a leg sweep or throw since they're already unstable/off balance standing on your toes...
Huge Wonderboy fan here from his homestate of South Carolina and I'm glad you guys did this. These issues are rampant within the sport. Firas Zahabi seems to have a better grip on these training issues. Perhaps you could look into his work. Either way it's great what you're doing in these critiques
Thank you very much for the comment, I've heard some of Firas's older stuff but not much recent.
Last I checked giras zahabi was recommending fucking supple leopard bullshit
@@OnkelTomAngelriper yes, he's not immune to fads or voodoo coaching stuff to be honest lol
@@OnkelTomAngelriperare you talking about the supple leopard book by Kelly starret and if so what is the issue with it?
Definitely second yall looking at Phil Daru, he's kind of known as the gold standard in mma S&C. The gym he works at probably has the highest budget of any mma gym aside from the actual UFC Performance Institute
Awesome video guys. I really like these breakdowns it really helps me find flaws in my own training.
I would love to see a breakdown of Brian Alsruhe’s training methodologies. His videos got me into strongman training. He also mixes things into a big ball of wax but I feel like it’s in a unique and effective way.
We'll have a look 👀
This was one of my biggest issues when fighting I found out later. The mix and match sessions which do get you fitter, but never really improves drastically on anything. When I split up my work. Running for cardio, weights for strength and explosiveness and technique with a 70 to 75 percent effort I began to compete much much better.
My mind on S&C has changed so much. I think a lot of movies made us think we need to run every day. I used to run every day & under eat. did remotely zero heavy lifting. I had cardio for days but I had low power. Strength training & pylometrics has made a huge difference in performance.
I also thought going balls to the walls every day was good. Then I started talking to elite athletes/coaches & they showed me the way. So much bro science still in combat sports
saw the title, instant like, great content!
Loved this, I didn’t really know the difference between S & C before this.
This was so cool! The recomodations also was great. Do these more!
I really liked that you explained that not the exercises, but the struckturing is the problem, and you followed up with improving ideas.
Really constructive. Cheers lads.
Hope you've never seen Tony Ferguson's workouts, surprised the man is in one piece (mostly)
I'm an optometrist and your comment about peripheral vision training intrigues me alot. Love to have some more content on this. All in all, great video.
Great format lads, remids me of how More Plates more Dates does it
Brilliant as always
It's funny how olympic weightlifting is now trending as a good supporting training for athletes, especially for grabblers, and at the same time a judo dojo I know markets themself as great supporting training for athletes, for example they trained some ice hockey players in the off-season. Now I've got no problem with that, I remember all the body control and confidence in contact I got from judo (and frankly I never got so ripped so fast elsewhere), but now I'm doing two supporting training sports without a main one to apply them to ;)
Finally a video made specifically for me
Do Joel Seedman next
This was a brilliant one, thanks guys
Very enlightening, thanks for he info fellas!
Fighting is chaotic in power exertion, stances, fatigue management, and angles. Strength and conditioning must replicate this chaotic nature.
I believe there is huge value in the kind of training Wonderboy and other fighters do.
Many well-conditioned fighters are following the exact same "unscientific" yet effective approach to strength and conditioning, yet they get/are strong like a beast, explosive and full of stamina.
Look at videos of training from Frankie Edgar and Rich Franklin to Khabib and Gilbert Burns.
If you think those training methods are bad you should check out how people train for swimming. Regularly swimming multiple sets of 500 yards to train for a 50 or 100 yard race is extremely common and its why most people get worse when they go to swim in college (among many other things).
agreed with a lot of points here, but ladder/footwork drills at the end of session, when tired, are an essential (IMHO) part martial arts, it could be the difference between closing out a points win and getting caught at the end of a fight, knowing you can move well in a tired state is advantageous
Great video.
Brilliant detail on the stability horseshit.
Another video idea would be machine weights vs barbell weights with relation to the difference between physio and training and why there is confusion and crossover.
Liam Harrison s&c. Pro Muay Thai fighter he recently posted a video on his UA-cam of his s&c session
And by recently I mean 8 months ago
Will you link because I can't find one 😔
@@sikastrength ua-cam.com/video/YOoL-PeZC30/v-deo.html
GSP and McGregor (Ido Portal era) had some of the best training i.m.o.
Maybe you guys should do a crossover with Phil Daru. Seems to have his head screwed on
Love these lads👌
One summer when I was a kid I got a skateboard and skated all summer. Didn't pick up a a fotball at all. When fall came and fotball practice started up again I tried doing some tricking and immediately doubled my pb. Felt I had better balance(always had terrible balance) and I assumed it was from all the skating. Was I wrong since going from a unstable environment to a stable one doesn't make you more stable?
This is 17 years ago and I still remember it as one of the biggest changes I have experienced, going from shit balance to decent balance and all of a sudden feeling stabel when tricking a fotball.
I think the point is that you learned to maintain a stable position on the board. When Wonderboy was doing his stability work he was never really maintaining a stable position, he was constantly rocking one way or another.
This seems like a good question. I think what's clear is that instability strength training is bad strength training, but I still wonder if it can be useful in some ways as a type of semi-specific skill training.
For example, for fighters (I'm not one, I just watch it) couldn't it be useful to practice striking from an unstable position to simulate trying to ground and pound over someone's guard? If that's true, couldn't it be useful to practice pushups from that position? (This second step is sketchier, I realize.)
@@hamm0155 the best ground and pound practice is ground and pound. It's no different from learning how to pass a guard, no training implement will work as it's a skill that needs to be trained.
Great videos! Could you do an S&C vid for Dancesport athletes? ie. Ballroom dancing
Could you do one video on Khabib Nurmagomedov's prowess? What makes him so 'strong' that he manhandles all his opponents.
Is there a specific time and place for instability training? A personal example would be ring dips which feel great for me in terms of muscle recruitment and being an "effective training tool", however for a fighter who has experience with them, would stable dips still be better for gpp due to better force production potential? When it comes to single leg stability there's obviously a benefit in training them for being a generally better functioning person, and that's learning to stabilise from a less stable condition. So as you alluded to, there's certainly benefit to some level of instability or else we'd all be using purely machines for S&C.
The question is then are balancing drills useful at all for athletes and in what context? For example, would single leg balancing drills with distractions be a good or bad balance exercise for a fighter? It may help strengthen foot muscles and works on a more stable surface than bosu balls but fighting is pretty much never done in a static position on your feet.
Also, wouldn't proprioception increase coordination which would benefit athletic endeavours?
i'd be very interested to hear what you guys think of maces and clubs
Great content again guys! Thank you for taking the time to enlighten the masses. Could we have a video on your thoughts about David Weck - the inventor of the Bosu Ball. His training methods are very alternative and are being applied to some high level athletes Lots of good content in that, I would say.
Great vid
Great video. Do you think that hang power cleans with straps are dangerous? I find that even with hook grip, it's becoming not viable to do hang power clean sets of 3 with heavier weights. Hook grip does work nicely for single reps though
They covered in the video that they think it's dangerous?
Being from the floor or hang is irrelevant, it's bailing that can have nasty consequences if you can't let go
The Ironmind "short and sweet" style straps are probably preferred over the lasso type.
awesome content. what did you guys study in university?
So just to check guys? If you only had time for 1-2 S&C sessions a week due to the other training sessions you have... you advocate working in this order during the session: 1) sprint work/plyos etc. 2) power moves (hang cleans etc) 3) heavy moves - deadlifts/squats etc. 4) isolation moves, core/arms etc. ??? I always used to do heavy moves first so I had most energy for them/could lift more, but is that wrong then?
Would you analyse muay thai training like what superbon posted recently?
Hi guys, great video as ever. You say straps are a big no, no for power cleans. I've read that they aren't advised, but you seem to categorically against them - is this a safety thing, or technical break-down thing?
Missing a clean with straps can lead to hyperextension or even dislocation of your wrist. If you really want to use straps on cleans, at least use weightlifting straps (easier to release).
alot of your video seems to be arguing for the “transfer principle” could you do a video or explain more about this concept especially in sports sci and S&C.
Ever checked out Phil Daru's or Nick Curson's work? Curious what you'd think of that. Also what would you recommend for someone who is doing jiu jitsu tournaments back to back or multiple tourneys within a couple of months for S&C?Just maintaining the strength they've acquired or focused on the conditioning and speed work? thanks
I enjoyed the vid, thank you for sharing your insight. I have a few questions regarding your Strength Training for Combat athletes. I train mma 3-5 days a week, grappling 2x striking 2x and 1x mma full sparring. I now have just over a years experience. My goal is to compete in the amateurs before I’m 40! I also have a job 5-6 days a week 7-4PM. I have done strength programs in the past that revolved around templates; specifically Starting Strength and 5/3/1. I have trained Strength and MMA practice but it was tricky to progress. I was the most consistent with 5/3/1, since it was only one working set, and I would usually end up strength training after practice. My concern with investing in your program would be the time required to implement it. How much time is required per session? Also 4 days a week seems like a lot, can this be altered? Also I have been looking into strength training methods that would involve auto regulation, maybe like APRE. Would your program be able to account for fatigue outside of training under the bar? For example Starting Strength was almost impossible for me to follow due to my lack of time to train, but also by Wednesday-Thursday I was already getting tired, and wouldn’t feel like doing any extra work, especially after 2 days of grappling/rolling. Sorry for the long reply/question. But I really enjoy your content, and would be willing to make the investment in your program, provided it’s the right fit for me. Thanks in advance 🤜🙏
Honestly 5/3/1 is amazing for combat sports as it isn't high volume/fatigue and it auto regulates especially the app in the store does it for you. Combat sports athletes will definitely do full boy workout when doing their training. So doing 5/3/1 with some light volume is great.
Yes the boys!
Doing everything in circuits/rounds isn't that just a symptom of the crossfit disease? (wrote this before getting to 15:25 ...)
Rippetoe advocates his 2 factor model for any sport where you basically train with a barbell for strength and all the other sport performance attributes will come through you practicing your sport. What are your thoughts?
On this note, can you review a lomachenko or usyk training footage
Weird was looking at his stuff before Thompson actually
@@sikastrength oh yeah usyk did that video with torokhity a while ago. Their movement and training style is just unlike any other boxer I've ever seen
Fridge going bear mode I see
Hi I have a question/video idea. I need to improve my grip strength as it is a limiting factor in many of my lifts/exercises. However when I allocate any notable volume towards it the quality and volume in my other sessions drop massively. For stuff like rdl’s it just means less reps but for pull-ups the range of motion and speed goes down. Passive grip training doesn’t allow me to progress my grip a fraction of the speed that my overall strength improves. I could explain more in detail but maybe you know of some good way of dealing with this kind of problem?
I've been passive grip training with COC hand grippers, honestly been working well for me. Just a suggestion, since CoC grips get super difficult.
So if you want to be strong and have good condition, then you cant train it in one day? If I train weightlifting (snatches, squats, etc.), and at the end of the workout kb swings, db snatches, etc., is it wrong and I should divide it into weightlifting/strenght day and "condition" day?
You'd likely be overdoing it. You only have a finite ability to recover. If you take chemical assistance, you could certainly train more.
8:40 What is the difference between power and velocity training?
Fatigue seems to be one difference
@@hookoffthejab1 I meant in essence. I thought power and velocity training is the same?
Basically explaining why crossfit is the safest sport! 👌
I’m 9 minutes late, and I’m still first. You kids scared of combat or something? Wouldn’t last a day on my planet
Bruh.. 😂
*Saitama has entered the chat*
@@INDAMOMENTFilms I’m the fusion dance of Omni man and Saitama
Do they do hair transplants on your planet?
YES YESS YESSS YESSSSSSS YES YES
review diego sanchez training footage
We'll look for it!
@@sikastrength tony ferguson would also be a good laugh
So basically the same criticisms crossfit gets.. high skilled movements, in high volume, for time... probably not the best use of your time
Ahhh, so this is why Clarence and Hayden play touch butt in the park
pew pew.. pew pew...
I disagree with what they said about stability! Surfers for example need that because their field is unstable
I personally think there's not enough touch butt in the park in his training.
What's wrong with Darra's hand? Looks like he got into it with someone at the pub.
Maybe that story about punching walls was speaking from experience
Id imagine he comments on this
your biggest weakness is your weakness.
Idea: a comment on LeBron James’ workouts. I believe there are quite a few available on the Tube and he is known to be a gym rat and taking great care of his body.
@@BuJammy I’ll search for it then, thanks!
combat "sports"
Gotta disagree on the shoe suggestion. You want to train your feet at all times for MMA, that powerclean has most of a correspondence with a fifty fifty wrestling position. So for wonder boy, as a striker, it's even more important for him to train strength with his shoes off as he's typically the weaker guy in the cage and he needs to train his balance while stuffing takedowns.
Just train the lift with shoes to get maximal value out of the clean and then do the wrestling position barefoot? Actual high level wrestlers(greeco-roman and freestyle) do olympic lifts and complexes with shoes seperately from their mat sessions. Stability training thru actual sport specific exercises, strength+explosivity from maximally effective lifts and conditioning thru sport specific + maximally effective exercises.
Feel the need to preface this comment with a no troll disclaimer. So... Not trolling. Has the guy on the right ever considered gyno surgery and/or medication? What's stopping him?
our right or their right? in the US it isnt cheap to get it done, idk about the UK. some people dont care about the way they look either
I can't see any gyno mate
My man, obviously you considered this an okay thing to say.. but gad damn that's a ridiculous comment to make.
Sir I believe what's stopping him is the fact he has no gyno...
Tsk, you're lucky BaldOmniMan isn't here to see this..
@@orlandoswift7398 First off, it was a dumb and rude comment. Second, they are Irish.