XCOM, Civilization, and Heroes of Might and Magic are the standard bearers for me. Someday someone will create a new HOMM game and include a map maker. Player created maps was one of the best parts of that game.
There is a fanmade expansion to HOMM3 called Horn of the abyss. Its updated the UI, added a faction and much more. The team that made the expansion is working on another one too. There is a vibrant community over on twitch, so check it out
Moo2 is the best one ever made by a long shot after all the bugs were crushed and the game balancing issues were fixed by talented fans. This game in multiplayer mode is very deep and entertaining.
I applaud the effort but a list like this has a problem with recency bias. For instance, Civ IV is the peak of that series and no one has come close to topping Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. Then there's MOO2 and MOM - often imitated but never duplicated or equaled. There's nary a wargame on the list - what happened to titles like Panzer General, Order of Battle or even something like Jagged Alliance? The Banner Saga probably deserves a spot rather than multiple Total War games (and Warhammer 2 tops that list, not 3). And those are just one off the top of my head.
Well your comment has a problem with nostalgia bias, same thing different result, in the end it is an opinion and therefore he does not have to account for any bias
@@Shosara in the end, opinions are based on individual thought, which in itself can be considered bias by others. So let us just enjoy that the comments can give us so many reference of good games that are otherwise might be forgotten.
@@petenell5807 I wouldn't say so. Clearly the combat at least is heavily 'inspired' by XCOM but there is so much more to the game than that - the character builds alone can provide endless hours of tinkering.
I see that but this list was clearly made by a PC gamer all games are PC games. So Fina Fantasy Tactics had no chance ( i mis Fire emblem and its not here for the same reason guess)
I play a lot of Civ 4 and 6, but my Civ 4 hours still outpaced my Civ 6 hours by about 20% in 2022 according to Steam. Amazing that such an old strategy game still keeps my attention despite all this competition.
the original Xcom UFO defense is still the best out of the whole series. Everyone who has played through this game would likely agree. If you are including classics, this honestly should replace to new Xcom game.
X-COM v1 was the only game that could ever actually scare me. For example, I'm carefully, slowly, moving a soldier a few squares, and out of the blue there's a flash of light and startling sound that some alien has just shot me. In a way, those instant reactions actually violate the idea that it is a "turn based game" because those instant reactions occur OUT of a player's turn.
No Civ IV which is the largely the best one, No Master of Orion II or Age of Wonders Shadow Magic more complete than the third, only one HOMM at the 10th rank, no Sid Meier Alpha Centaury or Warhammer II... damn.
No Master of Orion 2 is so glaring an oversight I can't even trust the list. I still pick it up and build a new race to play once a year. An almost 30 year old game that doesn't just hold up, but stands at the top of 4x games. Agreed with Civs 4 being the best. Other pretty big absences are no Shining Force 1 or 2, no Fallout 2, and no FFT.
battle for wesnoth- it's free and kind of unique. I mostly enjoyed modded multiplayer games but some of solo quests are interesting. also quite a few people did their thesis for programming in it and they still do so there are some crazy advanced techs other games might use later. hero generations- it's kind of small and you might get bored of it in a few days, but there are some unique things, like each step is a year so you are spending your life with movement, and you convert towns for bonuses and fix them up. there are a few interesting strategies to either set up economy for next generations, or rush trough enemies with strong heroes, and it's the genetics and randomness that makes it fun.
Always glad to see Battle Brothers make the cut on these kind of lists. It's tough and unforgiving, but deep and amazing, too, for the right kind of player.
That's funny as that was the only game on the list that I thought didn't deserve to be there. Not a terrible game, just doesn't belong on a list of "best of ALL TIME". No depth, but then again, I didn't like Banner Sagas that much either. Just breaking down someone's armor is just boring. Needed some magic and healing, and not JUST by the necro AI enemies.
I would have put it at the top of this list. It doesn't do a lot of things but it does it perfectly : RPG elements mixed with Management and Strategy. And almost endless campaign and replayability if you can get past its difficulty.
Am currently in a game of BB with Legends and PTR mods, with this video running on the background to maybe get some good suggestions, what to try next, so this was a fun surprise.
And mighty and heroic ^^. I have a soft spot for HoMM2 orchestras as well though. HoMM3 is definitely a much better game but I might rank HoMM2's music higher than HoMM3's.
The pinnacle for me is Sid Mier''s Alpha Centauri I played it so much when I was young. Another turn based game I really enjoyed from the 90's was Lords of Magic, It was kind of ike Heroes of Might and Magic but I liked the combat better.
Alpha Centauri has upper hand over all Civ games up to this day. You can build any unit that you logically should - for a price of course. You can make you own social system, gameplay is 3D - height has huge impact on gameplay! I don't understand why so many 3D games only just have 3D models, but are in fact 2D. AC is opposite - graphics is 2D, but gameplay is 3D! Name one civ-like game in which you have all of this. Maybe newer Civ games have some elements, but newer all of them. Only issues were: lack of faction balance and AI cheating on highest difficulty levels - although with expansion you get extra 7 factions to chose, so everyone can have strong faction - or everyone can have weak one. BTW: from semi-turn based it's worth mentioning Fallout Tactics, which is a hybrid as you can mix turn based and continous-turns mode.
I'm never going to agree the TW series is a turned based strategy game. I know no one who skips 100% of the battles which are a major part of the game. It's a hybrid game.
A perpetual favorite of mine, Silent Storm, so rarely makes these lists. But you had individual characters, skill trees, fully destructible battle maps, a crazy story, and by the end bipedal MEC suits. All from a game released in 2003!
My friend, you made my day. I was looking for the title of that game I played 20 years ago and I couldn't remember, it was Silent Storm! The first turn based game of my life, can't wait to play it again. THANK YOU !!
Thank for bringing age of wonder planet fall . This game is so underrated . Honestly , it is quite deep to love it at some first hours . It is a master piece
I loved 2 and 3, but just can't get into Planetfall. I've sat down with it and tried a few times but it just seems to be missing that intangible that pulled me in so hard with the other two.
The list is kinda weird. It mixes turned based strategies like Civilization or Old World, with the clear turned based tactics, like X-com and Battletech. Most of the games listed here are indeed great, but to call them all TBS is incorrect IMO. And as for Total War franchise you've probably chosen two worst examples: a very raw and buggy WH3 and a very strange Three Kingdoms, which they stopped supporting very fast. Attila or Shogun 2 would be much better.
Glad to see HOMM on the list. My brother would be thrilled also. But i only came to see if Vandal Hearts PS1 was on the list. Ive been dying for someone to make a new or updated version of that game for many years...
I own about half the games you showcased. I paused the video and either bought or wishlisted about half of the ones I didn't already have. Excellent video. Endless Legend and Endless Space 2 are permanent fixtures on my hard drive, Amplitude is my favorite studio. I wanted to give a shout-out to Fallen Enchantress: Legendary Heroes. It's a mix between AOWIII map exploring and Endless Legend's troop customizing. Brought to you by Stardock, developers of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations. Try it :)
@@cedo3333 So funny, cedo. You mess with me so much... I really did play about half of the games showcased. My first computer was an Atari 400 in 1985. My parents saved all year and it was the only present I got that Christmas. I wrote programs and recorded them on a cassette tape. Floppy disks weren't mainstream yet. It is possible I have more hours in games than you have hours in life. Man up, cedo!! You are acting like a child.
@@cedo3333 I can see that you had no ill intent since you said, "you didn't play half those games" Joke with your friends, I advise. I found nothing funny. Good day.
Rites of War had potential, and Final Liberation was great back in the day. I'm a fan of Fallout Tactics too but that has a real time mode as well as turn based.
Disciples 1 Sacred Lands has Left the Chat Disciples 2 Dark Prophecy has Left the Chat But for real not mentioning these two Games but Warhammer and others Multiple time, is a Total Crime how dare you.
Not having Wasteland 3 in this list is a huge mistake. It's easily a better game than virtually all of this list. Aside from Darkest Dungeon, but you cant compare the 2.
Thank you for including Darkest Dungeon! HoMM III cannot be at 10th place. I recommend the new King's Bounty series, especially Dark Side and Crossroads.
Great list - I’d have Gladius in here - amazing gladiatorial SRPG by Lucasarts on OG Xbox and PS2 (PS2 has terrible timing controls - Xbox version is awesome)
Classic board games are usually in their own category and rarely included in "turn-based strategy games" list. Probably because it would be too unfair to all these video games, who could compete with chess, go, shogi or even texas hold'em? :)
Shadow empire yeah but not sure it can be top 25... I like this game a lot but sincerely the replayability is limited. You play 30-40 hours and there's this feeling that all games are the same. But for a one man studio it's a great game!
It sounds like a, "puzzle" game where you have to figure the exact optimal placement/use of everything to win the fight and be able to progress. Either that or it's a procedural rogue-like where you have to get lucky to win. Guess I could have just looked it up, lol. Anyway, happy gaming!
@@contumelious-8440 An interesting analogy. You do have to navigate a Timeline with some skill to do well, and some boss fights may require set tactics to defeat. I imagine that's true of many turn based games. I think there are many options in how you can use your characters, however.
Of all the total wars I’m surprised he didn’t go you picked those 2 huh 🤔. I seriously think you picked 3 kingdoms for the sake of dynasty warriors. Medieval 2 and Rome total war were so revolutionary. Of course as a long time fan, the series wouldn’t have gone anywhere without shogun total war I would’ve put at the bottom of the list.
I love the topic, but it does say 'of all time'. Lists like this are usually biased towards newer games, and by newer I mean in the last 20 years. Civlization, Heroes of Might and Magic 3, XCOM, MOO and MOM are the top 5 'of all time' in IMHO. They all got sequels, and were insanely popular when they came out, and elements of them were copied to this day.
For me the best classic science fiction TBS will always be, both Master of Orion 2 and X-com: Terror from the Deep(the first part in the series was way too easy and less terrific, part 2 went all out) I know there are modern x-com games, but i am not sure they work on me like the classics, they are different. And for fantasy i still thing, both Heroes of Might & Magic and Age of Wonders series are the best you can play, in both cases the earlier games are the better ones.(Homm2+3, AoW1+2) And if it has to be a JRPG tactical strategy game it has to be Ogre Battle + Shining Force Series. Since Total War games are mentioned my favorite was the very first game Shogun: Total War, did not like Shogun 2 as much as the first one. Think every fantasy or history based game should use a heir system, too and there should be units that cannot be replaced stay dead forever. In that light the best indy game is Dominions, it has a lot of units and those can permanently die or have afflicitions it addes some fresh new sytems to an old genre and it holds up till this day. Seems i am not so fond of modern games...unfortunately they do not work on me, wish it was just nostalgica but its not i double check regulary. :-/ Nothing can beat the golden age of 90ies gaming when it comes to strategy games and JRPGs, but Dominions did impress. :)
Apparently, there was a bug in Enemy Unknown which reset the difficulty to Beginner after the first mission. This went unknown through Terror’s development so they made it much harder in response to fan complaints of the original.
I was going to mention Dominions, but it's not entirely turn based. I mean the strategic part is, but battles aren't exactly under your control. I just bought 5 a few weeks ago and played the crap out of it and I'm a fan of the Conquest of Elysium series which feels more like a TBS than Dominions. If you include Dominions, I guess you could include things like Carnage Heart. I'm not trying to be a purest, put whatever you want in the category. I'm just kinda talking to myself in your thread, lol.
When it comes to TW Warhammer if you are new to the series I HIGHLY RECOMMEND geting TW:WH2 before WH3. When it is on sale it is much cheaper and campaign in WH2 is much better than in WH3. WH3 really shines when you already have WH1 and WH2, because then you get access to great map with whole world from all 3 games.
Ok so this list has no: - final fantasy tactics - shining force 1, 2, or 3 - triangle strategy - banner saga 1, 2, or 3 - midnight suns Sorry to say, but it's missing many of the best turn based strategy games that have ever been made. I get it, you're PC biased, but it kinda makes your list basically irrelevant to the topic.
If you want to go old school for this I highly recommend PTO Pacific Theater of Operation for the Super Nintendo. Koei made a bunch of games in the early 90s that were way ahead of their time.
Im seriously thinking of getting a KOEI tat. Liberty or Death, I played for years running every type of way to win. But my all time favorite game is, hands down, Uncharted Waters. Too much fun as a kid with dreams of world travel that was fascinated and would later specialize in the subject of history.
The only explanation I can understand for not including any of the Romance of the Three Kingdoms or Nobunaga's Ambition games is that you haven't played them, which is fair. Rot3K X on PS2 is fantastic, and worth checking out.
Love the video and the comments! One underrated gem that competes with Total War for TBS players imho is Field of Glory:Empires. It's not as polished but replaces RTS battles with turnbased which I loved!
About your lists: Top 25 Best Turn Based Strategy Games of All Time: One of the best lists i see in my life Top 15 Best Indie RPG Games of All Time: one of the most disappointing (too much metroidvania and almost none rpg,reconsider redoing the list without the metroidvanias) but I confess that I am in awe of the quality of the videos in general, keep up the good work
Advance Wars Dual Strike, AW Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict in EU, AW 1-2, Battle Isle 2, Heroes of Might and Magic 1-4 and over 6K user maps, Heroes Chronicles, Fire Emblem franchise, XCOM 2 and WOTC, XCOM EU/EW, Warhammer 40K Chaos Gate Classic, Warhammer 40K Rites of War, Age of Wonders 3 probably worth to mention, tried out AOW Planetfall in PSPlus Extra and it is really good, Ogre Battle, Ogre Battle 64.
I like this video a lot, however without , Original series, the only Japanese turn based game made to the list is not from KOEI, not FF tactics, but Valkyria Chronicles...and there is Civ 6 but no Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri...I mean...once again, great video and props to the creator, but can't really agree with this list, especially I don't think Total War can even get close to top 10...
Nice list.... I just wanted to mention a few of my favorites throughout the years that didn't make this list; Shining force, langrisser, Ogre Battle, and Battle for Wesnoth.... Oh and i was taking a break from Battle brothers when i watched this video... lol
Nice list. I'd definitely add "Gears Tactics" to the (high tier of the) list. Classic in its approach, it's a real pleasure to play from start to finish !
i have about 12 of these. i have a trio of turn based games but are table top war games A.pike and shot campaigns B.field of glory ancient battles C.fields of glory medieval they are all turn based battles in different periods historically interesting (well, for me , i tend to recearch the real battles afterwards)
Sure i think too this list lack of proper table top war games . But he went for "mainstream" title apparently and you know those game aren't popular in "mainstream" culture.
@@hicetnunc1129 I'm really fond of Darkest hour with the mod WWI. I'm not that expert on those games but the order of battle serie is must have played. And there is a lot of fan made campaign which is better than the dev's. Hum... there is one title on the US civil war the title don't want to come up... Edit: Oh i found it: Ultimate general civil war. I would add the unity of command franchise but it lacks a little about management according to me.
I want to recommend X-com 2: Terror from the deep. In my opinion the best X-com game ever. The new X-com games doesn't really catch my interest so I always go back to the classics
It is a sequel so of course it is similar but with a new story, new weapons and new features. And it is a huge improvement of UFO Defense. I still play both games but prefer TFD
I wouldn't say it was the best turn based strategy game, but I quite enjoyed Othercide and was pretty surprised it didn't make the list since you have a fair few more obscure titles.
A good list, no doubt! I would have liked to see ''Fallen Enchantress LH'' there. Among recent games, ''Solasta'' and ''Wartales'' are excellent in my humble opinion. Good job, anyway.
Good games, but Solsta is straight up RPG. I love it. Close to an X-Com build, but not quite. Wartales definitely a decent choice. Didn't keep my attention overlong initially, but I'm waiting to see what more they bring to it as time goes on.
Nice list, I can't say I can agree, but to each his own. I must admit I haven't understood yet the appeal of the Warhammer Total War games. I have the second one after all the hype and I don't seem to grasp the logistics outside of combat or the chaos inside the combat (as beautiful as it is). I will give it a try someday, maybe after a good tutorial. That being said, maybe you could add the year of release for the next list, and maybe talk just a bit more about your likes and dislikes about them (to understand their places on the list). It would be a plus. Thanks.
First of all, Civ 4 was the best of the civ series. Second, if you want to make a list of "all time" you need to include Master of Magic For Windows with Caster of Magic DLC. This DLC improves the original game (that came out in 1994) by a lot. Caster of Magic combines Civ series-style empire building with a complex magic system that grows more powerful as the game progresses, leading to a strategy challenge with almost unparalleled depth. More important, it is brilliantly designed. Many games tried to imitate the original Master of magic, but none really succeeded. Caster of Magic just works where its copycats don't. And there are few games that scratch that desire to be an all-powerful mage quite like end-game Caster of Magic.
Finally, someone old enough to remember the masterpiece that was Civ 4. Nothing quite matched it - in terms of its combat, AI, pace, soundtrack, the actual achievement of Wonder building, etc - since for myself either.
@@HSQadri I think I probably played Civ IV more than any of the others, but the oldest Civ CD-ROM on my shelf is Civ III. I, however, am a far older gamer than that. I finished the original Bard's Tale on my c-64 in 1988. Lord, if I still had my maps and notes from that.....(darkness+spinners! FU to whichever developer thought that up!) I could never summon the patience to map those areas out now, especially while fighting random encounters. Ooops, sorry. I went down the rabbit hole. Ignore me, everyone! Just another shout-out to past games is all.
What a great list! I even learned about some games that I didn't know existed. Which I find weird since I consider myself a fan of the tactical turn-based genre. Thanks!
I'll never understand why 4X are considered strategy and not management. They play more like a city-builder than a war simulator. There are exceptions of course, like Gladius, because 40k, and Age of wonders which is closer to Heroes of M&M with a bit of diplomacy and economy/city building thrown in. Shouldn't the 1st entry be total warhammer series instead of 3 ? The 3rd game alone seems to not be so good, with the mediocre campaign and limited faction variety (5 of them are demons with a lot of unit overlap). You also need the first 2 games to get to the good part with the sandbox DLC. Other than that, nice to see names not often seen like Invisible inc or the first 2, but in a 25 best of all time of all kinds of genre ? Bold move
It would be fine if you said this was a PC-limited list (which it is - every single game here is available on PC according to your own video description). Very strange to say "all platforms of all time" and then leave out a substantial number of the most famous TBS games - Fire Emblem, Advance Wars, Disgaea, Final Fantasy Tactics, Shining Force, Front Mission etc etc. And oh look, what do they all have in common?
Almost nobody plays TWW3 for the "focused narrative". Before they release Immortal Empires, the actual big map, there were about 3-4k players . After the big map was released the number is around 20-30k
My favorite game by far is still Lords of Magic, after over 20 years its still the best turned based game for me. I own all the games on this list, and have beaten them all. Lords of Magic is just better to me, I truly wish someone would make a remake of it. I would gladly pay full price for it. Its conquest and world domination attracts me, but not just that. There is character creation, factions, multiplayer, well generated AI, story mode, and even a bonus hidden mode. You have armies, city management, resources, etc. Aside from Lords of Magic id have to say baldurs gate one is my second favorite, after that probably warhammer 2. I do enjoy civilization type of games, but I dislike the fact it doesn't stay in a specific era. It changes over time and I don't like that, I prefer more medial games and fantasy, not guns, tanks and technology.
To me it´s all about Kings Bounty, HoMaM and Xcom. Xcom I´ve never played the old original but both of the new ones and even Chimera Squad was great to me. And HoMaM? I am like one of the 1% who says even the VII is pretty good game.
Warhammer 3 is a good game but it doesnt deserve to be number 1. Medieval 2, Shogun 2, and Rome1 are CLASSIC Total War games and much better than the ones you have on your list.
XCOM, Civilization, and Heroes of Might and Magic are the standard bearers for me. Someday someone will create a new HOMM game and include a map maker. Player created maps was one of the best parts of that game.
Me too
There is a fanmade expansion to HOMM3 called Horn of the abyss. Its updated the UI, added a faction and much more. The team that made the expansion is working on another one too. There is a vibrant community over on twitch, so check it out
Wake Of Gods really made a boost for HOMM3
Hey guys, give songs of conquest a try. I think you'll enjoy it
Moo2 is the best one ever made by a long shot after all the bugs were crushed and the game balancing issues were fixed by talented fans. This game in multiplayer mode is very deep and entertaining.
So many great memories of Master of Orion II.
yeah and this loser didn't add it. Thats called failure.
I applaud the effort but a list like this has a problem with recency bias. For instance, Civ IV is the peak of that series and no one has come close to topping Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri. Then there's MOO2 and MOM - often imitated but never duplicated or equaled. There's nary a wargame on the list - what happened to titles like Panzer General, Order of Battle or even something like Jagged Alliance? The Banner Saga probably deserves a spot rather than multiple Total War games (and Warhammer 2 tops that list, not 3). And those are just one off the top of my head.
Dead on with Alpha Centauri being the best of the Sid Meiers stuff. Still have a physical copy of this that I won't get rid of.
Man! I haven’t thought about Panzer General in nearly 30 years. That WAS a great game.
Alpha Centauri was amazing. I still hate Miriam 20y later
Well your comment has a problem with nostalgia bias, same thing different result, in the end it is an opinion and therefore he does not have to account for any bias
@@Shosara in the end, opinions are based on individual thought, which in itself can be considered bias by others.
So let us just enjoy that the comments can give us so many reference of good games that are otherwise might be forgotten.
Wasteland 3 is a great game, Troubleshooter: Abandoned Children, Metal Gear Tactics, Hard West 2, and Encased. There's another five games right there.
I’m guessing he will/did put wasteland 3 on a tactical rpg list. Fantastic game
Troubleshooter is great. Too bad it doesn't get the recognition it deserves.
Was gonna mention Wasteland 3 also.
@@VenlyssPnorr it's just an XCOM clone for the most part isn't it?
@@petenell5807 I wouldn't say so. Clearly the combat at least is heavily 'inspired' by XCOM but there is so much more to the game than that - the character builds alone can provide endless hours of tinkering.
I really think Final Fantasy Tactics is one of the best out there. Even after all those years, it still holds up.
Ogre Battle was my fave.
This was the 1st game I looked on the list for, and I agree it's easily in the top 5
I see that but this list was clearly made by a PC gamer all games are PC games. So Fina Fantasy Tactics had no chance ( i mis Fire emblem and its not here for the same reason guess)
Literally went right to the comments to say this! Agree 1000%!
@@KiryuZer0 Other than the fact that FFT isn't TBS, nor is Fire Emblem. SRPG and TRPG are different from genre from TBS.
I play a lot of Civ 4 and 6, but my Civ 4 hours still outpaced my Civ 6 hours by about 20% in 2022 according to Steam. Amazing that such an old strategy game still keeps my attention despite all this competition.
That's because Civ 6 is shit
My Civ 4 hours eclipse the entirety of the rest of the series combined in all likelihood. Favorite all time game, hands down.
Civ 2 is the best Civ ever made, the fact that this idiot didn't include it says a lot.
I like Civ V the best, CIV 6, just haven't gotten into that.
the original Xcom UFO defense is still the best out of the whole series. Everyone who has played through this game would likely agree. If you are including classics, this honestly should replace to new Xcom game.
X-COM v1 was the only game that could ever actually scare me. For example, I'm carefully, slowly, moving a soldier a few squares, and out of the blue there's a flash of light and startling sound that some alien has just shot me. In a way, those instant reactions actually violate the idea that it is a "turn based game" because those instant reactions occur OUT of a player's turn.
The original Xcom is hands down the best Xcom.
Playing in the dark, the music, and seeing that first sectiod would creep me out as a kid. The atmosphere of that game hasn't been matched.
No Civ IV which is the largely the best one, No Master of Orion II or Age of Wonders Shadow Magic more complete than the third, only one HOMM at the 10th rank, no Sid Meier Alpha Centaury or Warhammer II... damn.
Also no Disciples (II). Maybe Lords of the Realms 2 (although the fights are RT.. but he added similar games). The list is pretty decent though
No Master of Orion 2 is so glaring an oversight I can't even trust the list. I still pick it up and build a new race to play once a year. An almost 30 year old game that doesn't just hold up, but stands at the top of 4x games. Agreed with Civs 4 being the best.
Other pretty big absences are no Shining Force 1 or 2, no Fallout 2, and no FFT.
battle for wesnoth- it's free and kind of unique. I mostly enjoyed modded multiplayer games but some of solo quests are interesting. also quite a few people did their thesis for programming in it and they still do so there are some crazy advanced techs other games might use later.
hero generations- it's kind of small and you might get bored of it in a few days, but there are some unique things, like each step is a year so you are spending your life with movement, and you convert towns for bonuses and fix them up. there are a few interesting strategies to either set up economy for next generations, or rush trough enemies with strong heroes, and it's the genetics and randomness that makes it fun.
Always glad to see Battle Brothers make the cut on these kind of lists. It's tough and unforgiving, but deep and amazing, too, for the right kind of player.
That's funny as that was the only game on the list that I thought didn't deserve to be there. Not a terrible game, just doesn't belong on a list of "best of ALL TIME". No depth, but then again, I didn't like Banner Sagas that much either. Just breaking down someone's armor is just boring. Needed some magic and healing, and not JUST by the necro AI enemies.
I would have put it at the top of this list. It doesn't do a lot of things but it does it perfectly : RPG elements mixed with Management and Strategy. And almost endless campaign and replayability if you can get past its difficulty.
Thats exactly how i describe my penith
Am currently in a game of BB with Legends and PTR mods, with this video running on the background to maybe get some good suggestions, what to try next, so this was a fun surprise.
@@CruentusDK1 Vanilla is ok, I got a lot of games out of that, but once I discovered the modding scene, it has become so much better.
Heroes 3 soundtrack is just magic...
And mighty and heroic ^^. I have a soft spot for HoMM2 orchestras as well though. HoMM3 is definitely a much better game but I might rank HoMM2's music higher than HoMM3's.
I think Fantasy General should have made the list. Masters of Orion is another master of the genre that was overlooked.
Surprised that Master of Orion 2 is not on this list. If it was it would probably take #1 spot.
One of the first 4x games also master of magic is also a great game
Brigandine is brilliant. However, there is no any other game like this. Hopefully, one day I can make another one.
Agree. The unique characters, monsters, and upgrades were perfect.
Heroes 3 easily beats every game out there.
Except heroes 3.5...
agreed
I still have it installed, been playing that thing since it came out in the early 2000s. That is some incredible longevity.
Try Heroes 5.5... a perfectly polished gem
HoMM3 is fantastic, but it's not the best. I still have a soft spot since it got me into the genre but there's tons better once you dig deep.
The pinnacle for me is Sid Mier''s Alpha Centauri I played it so much when I was young. Another turn based game I really enjoyed from the 90's was Lords of Magic, It was kind of ike Heroes of Might and Magic but I liked the combat better.
Alpha centauri is a huge omission.
Alpha Centauri has upper hand over all Civ games up to this day. You can build any unit that you logically should - for a price of course. You can make you own social system, gameplay is 3D - height has huge impact on gameplay! I don't understand why so many 3D games only just have 3D models, but are in fact 2D. AC is opposite - graphics is 2D, but gameplay is 3D!
Name one civ-like game in which you have all of this. Maybe newer Civ games have some elements, but newer all of them.
Only issues were: lack of faction balance and AI cheating on highest difficulty levels - although with expansion you get extra 7 factions to chose, so everyone can have strong faction - or everyone can have weak one.
BTW: from semi-turn based it's worth mentioning Fallout Tactics, which is a hybrid as you can mix turn based and continous-turns mode.
invisible inc is an underrated gem
I'm never going to agree the TW series is a turned based strategy game. I know no one who skips 100% of the battles which are a major part of the game. It's a hybrid game.
A perpetual favorite of mine, Silent Storm, so rarely makes these lists. But you had individual characters, skill trees, fully destructible battle maps, a crazy story, and by the end bipedal MEC suits. All from a game released in 2003!
My friend, you made my day. I was looking for the title of that game I played 20 years ago and I couldn't remember, it was Silent Storm! The first turn based game of my life, can't wait to play it again. THANK YOU !!
@@knicksnation9210 Silent Storm is a Classic! Really love that game! Also it is on Steam and Good Old games so pick it up - it's super cheap!
Mutant Year Zero is an amazing game. My favourite of the genre I think.
"of all time" might be a bit of a stretch. This list is more like a "of the past 10 years". Great list nonetheless!
I also recommend Imperiums: Greek Wars. I've already played it 600 hours and still plan to explore it.
That one is in my library, I just haven't got to it yet. Glad to hear it has some fans!
Thank for bringing age of wonder planet fall . This game is so underrated . Honestly , it is quite deep to love it at some first hours . It is a master piece
I loved 2 and 3, but just can't get into Planetfall. I've sat down with it and tried a few times but it just seems to be missing that intangible that pulled me in so hard with the other two.
@@yaburu We love fantasy world . I am looking forward to AOW 4 .
The list is kinda weird. It mixes turned based strategies like Civilization or Old World, with the clear turned based tactics, like X-com and Battletech. Most of the games listed here are indeed great, but to call them all TBS is incorrect IMO. And as for Total War franchise you've probably chosen two worst examples: a very raw and buggy WH3 and a very strange Three Kingdoms, which they stopped supporting very fast. Attila or Shogun 2 would be much better.
It was actually a good list and nitpicking doesn't help
@@mitchclark1532 No, it wasn't, and it's not nitpicking but constructive criticism. What you offer is blind praise without any reason.
1. Age Of Wonders Shadow Magic
2. X-COM 2
3. Etherlords II
4. Darkest Dungeon
5. Heroes Of Might And Magic V
Total War games, has turn based elements, but I would definitely consider them RTS not turn based.
Definitely chosen the best background cover for this episode with Age of Wonder 3. After all these years it’s still my favourite game.
Its like who ever tried AOW3 is auto hooked
Glad to see HOMM on the list. My brother would be thrilled also.
But i only came to see if Vandal Hearts PS1 was on the list. Ive been dying for someone to make a new or updated version of that game for many years...
... Jagged Alliance 2 🤔
I own about half the games you showcased. I paused the video and either bought or wishlisted about half of the ones I didn't already have. Excellent video. Endless Legend and Endless Space 2 are permanent fixtures on my hard drive, Amplitude is my favorite studio.
I wanted to give a shout-out to Fallen Enchantress: Legendary Heroes. It's a mix between AOWIII map exploring and Endless Legend's troop customizing. Brought to you by Stardock, developers of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations. Try it :)
Just joking but you didn't play half those games o_O AHAHAH i mess with you ;)
@@cedo3333 So funny, cedo. You mess with me so much...
I really did play about half of the games showcased. My first computer was an Atari 400 in 1985. My parents saved all year and it was the only present I got that Christmas. I wrote programs and recorded them on a cassette tape. Floppy disks weren't mainstream yet.
It is possible I have more hours in games than you have hours in life.
Man up, cedo!! You are acting like a child.
@@contumelious-8440 I was really joking. I started with amstrad. I was just joking without ill intent.
@@cedo3333 I can see that you had no ill intent since you said, "you didn't play half those games"
Joke with your friends, I advise. I found nothing funny. Good day.
Rites of War had potential, and Final Liberation was great back in the day. I'm a fan of Fallout Tactics too but that has a real time mode as well as turn based.
Disciples 1 Sacred Lands has Left the Chat
Disciples 2 Dark Prophecy has Left the Chat
But for real not mentioning these two Games but Warhammer and others Multiple time, is a Total Crime how dare you.
Not having Wasteland 3 in this list is a huge mistake. It's easily a better game than virtually all of this list. Aside from Darkest Dungeon, but you cant compare the 2.
I put it in tactical rpg.
I'm missing Jagged Alliance as a grand daddy of many later games such as X-com 2
Glad to see Endless Legend on the list, since I love the game, but my favorite would be Disciples 2
I have played all. In my top 10 there would be Battle for Wesnoth and Disciples II for sure. Thx for video.
Tactics Ogre should definitely be on this list
Ogre Battle!
No, it should be on your list whenever you get around to making one
Hey Joël, your video has the best overview list of turn-based games I’ve seen so far. Congrats.
Glad you think so!
if you play divinity 2 on four stars definitely a strategy game worth mentioning
It's an amazing RPG but no matter the difficulty setting nor the mods, it doesn't really qualify as a strategy game :)
Thank you for including Darkest Dungeon!
HoMM III cannot be at 10th place.
I recommend the new King's Bounty series, especially Dark Side and Crossroads.
Thumbnail reminds me of Wonderboy and Young Nastyman.
Rigoo goo goo rigoo goo goo.
Be careful with Civilization, players often experience a serious affliction called Justonemoreturnitus.
Altough it goes away quickly since late game in civ 6 is boring
Where is Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri ?
Great list - I’d have Gladius in here - amazing gladiatorial SRPG by Lucasarts on OG Xbox and PS2 (PS2 has terrible timing controls - Xbox version is awesome)
Gladius one of my fave all time games. I would of added skies of arcadia as well.
@@nelsonortiz3751 respect 👍
very few people remeber that. it was one of the best rpg's of the time. so sad it never came out on pc.
I forgot about that one. I know I've run through it at least 3 times. Great game and good job remembering!
Gladius one of my favorite games of all time
I can't believe Chess is not on the list.
Classic board games are usually in their own category and rarely included in "turn-based strategy games" list. Probably because it would be too unfair to all these video games, who could compete with chess, go, shogi or even texas hold'em? :)
Heroes of Might and Magic not even in top 3 is laughable. I like that you mentioned Battle Brothers tho.
HoMM IV is my favourite. I didn't know of Battle Brothers and it looks cool, thanks gonna buy it!
- Pandora: First Contact.
- Sid Meier’s Colonization (with the “We The People” mod).
- Shadow Empire.
- Interstellar: Space Genesis.
Shadow empire yeah but not sure it can be top 25... I like this game a lot but sincerely the replayability is limited. You play 30-40 hours and there's this feeling that all games are the same. But for a one man studio it's a great game!
I highly recommend Othercide. It's darker, and requires you to actually lose frequently to progress. But it has an excellent story and is unique.
Great challenge too! Xcom levels of “av if player one”
It sounds like a, "puzzle" game where you have to figure the exact optimal placement/use of everything to win the fight and be able to progress. Either that or it's a procedural rogue-like where you have to get lucky to win. Guess I could have just looked it up, lol. Anyway, happy gaming!
@@contumelious-8440 An interesting analogy. You do have to navigate a Timeline with some skill to do well, and some boss fights may require set tactics to defeat. I imagine that's true of many turn based games. I think there are many options in how you can use your characters, however.
Othercide looked cool, and had a few interesting mechanics, but I found it tedious and quickly lost interest.
I've put thousands of hours into Civ and Total War titles, but I still swing back to Birth Of The Federation once in a while. Is worth a mention.
Of all the total wars I’m surprised he didn’t go you picked those 2 huh 🤔. I seriously think you picked 3 kingdoms for the sake of dynasty warriors. Medieval 2 and Rome total war were so revolutionary. Of course as a long time fan, the series wouldn’t have gone anywhere without shogun total war I would’ve put at the bottom of the list.
How Rome: Total War and TW:Shogun didn't make in the list? Is this even an objective list or you just through out your personal ratings there?
I love the topic, but it does say 'of all time'. Lists like this are usually biased towards newer games, and by newer I mean in the last 20 years. Civlization, Heroes of Might and Magic 3, XCOM, MOO and MOM are the top 5 'of all time' in IMHO. They all got sequels, and were insanely popular when they came out, and elements of them were copied to this day.
For me the best classic science fiction TBS will always be, both Master of Orion 2 and X-com: Terror from the Deep(the first part in the series was way too easy and less terrific, part 2 went all out)
I know there are modern x-com games, but i am not sure they work on me like the classics, they are different.
And for fantasy i still thing, both Heroes of Might & Magic and Age of Wonders series are the best you can play, in both cases the earlier games are the better ones.(Homm2+3, AoW1+2)
And if it has to be a JRPG tactical strategy game it has to be Ogre Battle + Shining Force Series.
Since Total War games are mentioned my favorite was the very first game Shogun: Total War, did not like Shogun 2 as much as the first one. Think every fantasy or history based game should use a heir system, too and there should be units that cannot be replaced stay dead forever.
In that light the best indy game is Dominions, it has a lot of units and those can permanently die or have afflicitions it addes some fresh new sytems to an old genre and it holds up till this day.
Seems i am not so fond of modern games...unfortunately they do not work on me, wish it was just nostalgica but its not i double check regulary. :-/
Nothing can beat the golden age of 90ies gaming when it comes to strategy games and JRPGs, but Dominions did impress. :)
Apparently, there was a bug in Enemy Unknown which reset the difficulty to Beginner after the first mission. This went unknown through Terror’s development so they made it much harder in response to fan complaints of the original.
I was going to mention Dominions, but it's not entirely turn based. I mean the strategic part is, but battles aren't exactly under your control. I just bought 5 a few weeks ago and played the crap out of it and I'm a fan of the Conquest of Elysium series which feels more like a TBS than Dominions.
If you include Dominions, I guess you could include things like Carnage Heart. I'm not trying to be a purest, put whatever you want in the category. I'm just kinda talking to myself in your thread, lol.
When it comes to TW Warhammer if you are new to the series I HIGHLY RECOMMEND geting TW:WH2 before WH3. When it is on sale it is much cheaper and campaign in WH2 is much better than in WH3. WH3 really shines when you already have WH1 and WH2, because then you get access to great map with whole world from all 3 games.
If I'm not mistaken u have to own wh1 to play mortal empires on wh2 as well.
Battletech
Xcom2: war of the chosen
Mechanicus: heretec
Chaosgate
Gears of war: tactics
Ruined King LoL
Darkest Dungeons
Mutant chronicles
Ok so this list has no:
- final fantasy tactics
- shining force 1, 2, or 3
- triangle strategy
- banner saga 1, 2, or 3
- midnight suns
Sorry to say, but it's missing many of the best turn based strategy games that have ever been made. I get it, you're PC biased, but it kinda makes your list basically irrelevant to the topic.
The fact that jagged alliance is not on the list shows that people have not actually never played deep tactics game yet
If you want to go old school for this I highly recommend PTO Pacific Theater of Operation for the Super Nintendo. Koei made a bunch of games in the early 90s that were way ahead of their time.
Im seriously thinking of getting a KOEI tat. Liberty or Death, I played for years running every type of way to win. But my all time favorite game is, hands down, Uncharted Waters. Too much fun as a kid with dreams of world travel that was fascinated and would later specialize in the subject of history.
XCOM2 and DOS2 are my fav of all time.
The only explanation I can understand for not including any of the Romance of the Three Kingdoms or Nobunaga's Ambition games is that you haven't played them, which is fair. Rot3K X on PS2 is fantastic, and worth checking out.
I don't think the Total War series counts as turn-based games. Most of the game's action you'll be doing in real-time.
Tremendous list, thanks for sharing.
Thanks for watching!
Love the video and the comments! One underrated gem that competes with Total War for TBS players imho is Field of Glory:Empires. It's not as polished but replaces RTS battles with turnbased which I loved!
About your lists:
Top 25 Best Turn Based Strategy Games of All Time: One of the best lists i see in my life
Top 15 Best Indie RPG Games of All Time: one of the most disappointing (too much metroidvania and almost none rpg,reconsider redoing the list without the metroidvanias)
but I confess that I am in awe of the quality of the videos in general, keep up the good work
X-COM is amazing, recently I’ve been playing Battlemech and it’s fantastic especially if you know a bit of the lore.
Roguetech is the way to go for me! I love it!
Definitely check Gears: Tactics - similar play style to XCOM. Not as good as missing the base building, but still a good turn based tactical game.
Advance Wars Dual Strike, AW Days of Ruin/Dark Conflict in EU, AW 1-2, Battle Isle 2, Heroes of Might and Magic 1-4 and over 6K user maps, Heroes Chronicles, Fire Emblem franchise, XCOM 2 and WOTC, XCOM EU/EW, Warhammer 40K Chaos Gate Classic, Warhammer 40K Rites of War, Age of Wonders 3 probably worth to mention, tried out AOW Planetfall in PSPlus Extra and it is really good, Ogre Battle, Ogre Battle 64.
Battle Isle series?
I like this video a lot, however without , Original series, the only Japanese turn based game made to the list is not from KOEI, not FF tactics, but Valkyria Chronicles...and there is Civ 6 but no Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri...I mean...once again, great video and props to the creator, but can't really agree with this list, especially I don't think Total War can even get close to top 10...
this list should just be named top war hammer series games
front mission 1st remaster just came out on the switch recently and it's pretty fun
Front mission 3 is my favorite game. I still play it
Nice list.... I just wanted to mention a few of my favorites throughout the years that didn't make this list; Shining force, langrisser, Ogre Battle, and Battle for Wesnoth.... Oh and i was taking a break from Battle brothers when i watched this video... lol
Brigandine is a remake, there is a few more old Turn base that is very good, even better than most of the turn base today.
How there's no modern Total War game based on The Lord of the Rings by now is beyond me.
Nice list. I'd definitely add "Gears Tactics" to the (high tier of the) list. Classic in its approach, it's a real pleasure to play from start to finish !
💯
Gears Tactics is a really underrated game. in some aspects its better than XCOM 2.
@@Ansprechen_und_Aufklären_1 wish there was a pt.2 or level creator for Gears Tactics
@@Ansprechen_und_Aufklären_1 Agree, very underrated and imo better then XC2
@@Ansprechen_und_Aufklären_1 thats a bold statement 🤔
Thanks for the recommendations! I would suggest 40k Mechanicus, Steamworld heist and Wasteland 3.
i have about 12 of these. i have a trio of turn based games but are table top war games
A.pike and shot campaigns
B.field of glory ancient battles
C.fields of glory medieval
they are all turn based battles in different periods historically interesting (well, for me , i tend to recearch the real battles afterwards)
Sure i think too this list lack of proper table top war games . But he went for "mainstream" title apparently and you know those game aren't popular in "mainstream" culture.
@@cedo3333 So, apart from those listed by Dave Wright, what are great table top wargames on pc? I love actual tabletop, have never played it on pc.
@@hicetnunc1129 I'm really fond of Darkest hour with the mod WWI. I'm not that expert on those games but the order of battle serie is must have played. And there is a lot of fan made campaign which is better than the dev's. Hum... there is one title on the US civil war the title don't want to come up... Edit: Oh i found it: Ultimate general civil war. I would add the unity of command franchise but it lacks a little about management according to me.
@@cedo3333 Thanks man, appreciate it. Will certainly check out Ultimate General.
@@hicetnunc1129 You are welcomed
I want to recommend X-com 2: Terror from the deep. In my opinion the best X-com game ever. The new X-com games doesn't really catch my interest so I always go back to the classics
XCom 2 TFD is just a clone of XCom UFO Defense...
It is a sequel so of course it is similar but with a new story, new weapons and new features. And it is a huge improvement of UFO Defense. I still play both games but prefer TFD
@@mpthorvonericksen I enjoyed both titles immensely. The 2-stage bases of TFD were fun.
I wouldn't say it was the best turn based strategy game, but I quite enjoyed Othercide and was pretty surprised it didn't make the list since you have a fair few more obscure titles.
The BattleTech game is ok. The RogueTech mod is what the original game SHOULD have been.
Jagged Alliance 2. That's the winner for me.
A good list, no doubt! I would have liked to see ''Fallen Enchantress LH'' there. Among recent games, ''Solasta'' and ''Wartales'' are excellent in my humble opinion. Good job, anyway.
Good call!
Good games, but Solsta is straight up RPG. I love it. Close to an X-Com build, but not quite. Wartales definitely a decent choice. Didn't keep my attention overlong initially, but I'm waiting to see what more they bring to it as time goes on.
solasta is (partly) turn based but it's an RPG not a strategy game.
Nice list, I can't say I can agree, but to each his own. I must admit I haven't understood yet the appeal of the Warhammer Total War games. I have the second one after all the hype and I don't seem to grasp the logistics outside of combat or the chaos inside the combat (as beautiful as it is). I will give it a try someday, maybe after a good tutorial.
That being said, maybe you could add the year of release for the next list, and maybe talk just a bit more about your likes and dislikes about them (to understand their places on the list). It would be a plus. Thanks.
It is to easy. Play Shogun 2 Fall of the Samurai or medieval 2 with dac mod. Or one of the Best rome 2 with divide et Impera mod
First of all, Civ 4 was the best of the civ series.
Second, if you want to make a list of "all time" you need to include Master of Magic For Windows with Caster of Magic DLC. This DLC improves the original game (that came out in 1994) by a lot. Caster of Magic combines Civ series-style empire building with a complex magic system that grows more powerful as the game progresses, leading to a strategy challenge with almost unparalleled depth. More important, it is brilliantly designed. Many games tried to imitate the original Master of magic, but none really succeeded. Caster of Magic just works where its copycats don't. And there are few games that scratch that desire to be an all-powerful mage quite like end-game Caster of Magic.
Finally, someone old enough to remember the masterpiece that was Civ 4. Nothing quite matched it - in terms of its combat, AI, pace, soundtrack, the actual achievement of Wonder building, etc - since for myself either.
@@HSQadri I think I probably played Civ IV more than any of the others, but the oldest Civ CD-ROM on my shelf is Civ III. I, however, am a far older gamer than that. I finished the original Bard's Tale on my c-64 in 1988. Lord, if I still had my maps and notes from that.....(darkness+spinners! FU to whichever developer thought that up!) I could never summon the patience to map those areas out now, especially while fighting random encounters. Ooops, sorry. I went down the rabbit hole. Ignore me, everyone!
Just another shout-out to past games is all.
Great video man! You've definitely put a few games on my radar. Thank you.
You forgot Jagged Alliance. For me, it is one of the best!
What a great list! I even learned about some games that I didn't know existed. Which I find weird since I consider myself a fan of the tactical turn-based genre. Thanks!
what are you 5? Great list?
Gears of War Tactics is criminally underrated.
I'll never understand why 4X are considered strategy and not management. They play more like a city-builder than a war simulator. There are exceptions of course, like Gladius, because 40k, and Age of wonders which is closer to Heroes of M&M with a bit of diplomacy and economy/city building thrown in.
Shouldn't the 1st entry be total warhammer series instead of 3 ? The 3rd game alone seems to not be so good, with the mediocre campaign and limited faction variety (5 of them are demons with a lot of unit overlap). You also need the first 2 games to get to the good part with the sandbox DLC.
Other than that, nice to see names not often seen like Invisible inc or the first 2, but in a 25 best of all time of all kinds of genre ? Bold move
MOO2 and XCOM. Old school for an old dude.
Have you got a Turn Base Strategy Game for Multiplayer. I think Civ 5 is one of the best
It would be fine if you said this was a PC-limited list (which it is - every single game here is available on PC according to your own video description).
Very strange to say "all platforms of all time" and then leave out a substantial number of the most famous TBS games - Fire Emblem, Advance Wars, Disgaea, Final Fantasy Tactics, Shining Force, Front Mission etc etc. And oh look, what do they all have in common?
Wow. no Jagged Alliance 2? everyone who played this game tells you, this is the best turn based stategie Game EVER.
i put it in the classic tbs list
@@JoelRPG Yea it is old, to be fair 🤣
Almost nobody plays TWW3 for the "focused narrative". Before they release Immortal Empires, the actual big map, there were about 3-4k players . After the big map was released the number is around 20-30k
My favorite game by far is still Lords of Magic, after over 20 years its still the best turned based game for me. I own all the games on this list, and have beaten them all. Lords of Magic is just better to me, I truly wish someone would make a remake of it. I would gladly pay full price for it. Its conquest and world domination attracts me, but not just that. There is character creation, factions, multiplayer, well generated AI, story mode, and even a bonus hidden mode. You have armies, city management, resources, etc. Aside from Lords of Magic id have to say baldurs gate one is my second favorite, after that probably warhammer 2. I do enjoy civilization type of games, but I dislike the fact it doesn't stay in a specific era. It changes over time and I don't like that, I prefer more medial games and fantasy, not guns, tanks and technology.
To me it´s all about Kings Bounty, HoMaM and Xcom. Xcom I´ve never played the old original but both of the new ones and even Chimera Squad was great to me. And HoMaM? I am like one of the 1% who says even the VII is pretty good game.
Warhammer 3 is a good game but it doesnt deserve to be number 1. Medieval 2, Shogun 2, and Rome1 are CLASSIC Total War games and much better than the ones you have on your list.
Incubation is also great and pretty unknown