DBZ's New Era of Animation - DBD TV: The Cell Arc Part 2
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- Опубліковано 23 жов 2024
- Dragon Ball Dissection's look at the animated Cell Arc continues. Big shakeups occur with the animation studios, leading to some big improvements... and a few meme-worthy falls from grace. More filler storylines, as well as anime-exclusive corrections and mistakes, round out this adaptational examination.
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Obviously, since there are two Yajirobes, only one of them died to the androids while the other one was smart enough to hide away with Master Roshi in his submarine.
Okay, love this! Kinda jealous I didn't think to use that joke.
You deserve a cookie!
hahaha
@@MistareFusion i always wondered why the freeza death trunks sword swing scene in the second episode looked so bad and why goku vs cell was animated so stiff with no impact on the hits..now i know why....
Youre Reffering to the Art on the back of the Manga arentcha because if that the case there are 2 Gokus Aswell!
We did our best to introduce American fans to Unmei no Hi!
And you did a fantastic job! But I guess there are still underprivileged DB fans out there, and I have the utmost sympathy for them. :-D
Huh. Maybe I should have checked the credits more often, but I never noticed that KaiserNeko is a patreon of MistareFusion.
@@MistareFusion I often get the impression that English dub fans of anime in general tend to ignore or gloss over that other countries exist whenever they vocally support their English dubs.
@@PrimeroJinJusuke Which is especially sad considering how many English dubs out there... reeeeaaally aren't that good...
I started watching DBZ in English back in '98 on Toonami when I was 5 and I LOVED it as a kid... but when I was around 15 I started getting the Orange Brick box sets (yes, they SUCK and I do NOT own them anymore, but back then it was the first time I could watch the whole series all the way through. Tho eventually I replaced them with the Dragon Boxes which I bought retail price when they were still new back from '09-'11 and still own), and while at first I watched the DVDs dubbed, I eventually decided to check out the Japanese version since it was the first time I had had that option available (the only DBZ I owned on home video before that was a few of the old VHS tapes that only had 3-4 edited dubbed episodes on them), and while it wasn't immediate, the more I watched the show in Japanese, the more it grew on me and the more I realized how BAD the dub is in comparison. Nowadays I haven't watched any anime, DB or otherwise, dubbed in well over a decade. Only time I ever put on DBZ dubbed is to laugh at it with friends lmao
@@TheBigBlueBugofJustice I generally prefer dubs but after switching to sub for super so I wouldn't have to wait, I can't NOT listen to Masako Nozawa. She's too good and too underrated in the west.
20:53 I think the anime put more emphases on damage than distraction. In the anime, you can clearly see Cell stagger a little from Vegeta's blast, whereas Piccolo and the rest did nothing to him. This makes sense since Vegeta is the closest to Cell and Gohan in terms of power.
In the manga, Vegeta(in his base form) just blasts Cell once in the face and Cell then very stupidly looks over to him. That version is a lot more anti climatic, whereas the anime makes it seem like Vegeta's attack did enough to make Cell wobble for Gohan
If you prefer the distraction angle, I think that still works, since Vegeta was the only one wasn't trying to help, so Cell was actually caught off guard when he finally did intervene at the last second. All in all, I prefer the anime to manga here, but everyone's free to like their version.
Agreed, I reckon that's because the anime wanted to emphasize how much the crew actually helped Gohan by dealing some damage to Cell whereas in the manga it is pretty clear that Gohan has it in him to actually overpower Cell by himself and just needs some kind of psychological trigger to really go at it and give it his all, which is the purpose served by Vegeta
I definitely prefer the anime. The overall execution worked, it showed Vegeta's eye for strategy...Cell would sense the others behind him and be aware of and brace for their attack...blasting from much higher out of range WOULD genuinely catch Cell of guard and make more of an impact.
"it's the punch you don't see coming that knocks you out"
I also never liked the "Vegeta's blast was a distraction" angle as much as "Vegeta put everything into that blast and it hurt Cell enough to give Gohan his moment" to make it more of a combination of the two of them defeating Cell as opposed to just 'giving Gohan a brief opening'
I always wish that...to sell(no pun intended) the damage Vegeta's blast did...that we could have seen Cell's wings blown off by it on top of him being staggered...maybe some overall damage to his back. JUST to communicate that "Yes, Vegeta hit him with a hell of a blast and it hurt him a lot and played a key role in Gohan's victory"
Also...to credit the US score...the scene with Faulconer's track REALLY emphasizes the impact of Vegeta's blast on Cell...so it always felt like more of 'heavy, damaging blow' as opposed to just a 'distraction'
When you watch that scene in Kai...it feels hollow.
Makes sense. When Cell goes perfect the first time, Vegeta literally blows half of him away. Were it not for his Namekian genes and abilities, that right there would be his death. If one of the still alive people would do some damage to him, it would be Vegeta.
There is also another element. You can read it as an attack on Cell's own ego/pride. Cell thought he broke Vegeta, first by basically making him literally just wait for and ultimately depend on Goku and Gohan knowing he wasn't enough (which TFS absolutely capitalized and made it as obvious and open and explicit as possible). Then killing Trunks, and then putting him down so hard during his enraged avenge attempt that all Vegeta did was get the only person that could kill Cell at that point hurt compromising yet again everything. His last words to Vegeta were literally mocking Vegeta's pride. Vegeta getting back up, put his pride aside and help another, let alone even mustering enough energy to make Cell's "super perfect" form feel the attack of someone he ruled far beneath him, that must have struck a different kind of nerve.
Good point.
I personally have always preferred the desperate distraction idea. The idea Vegeta jumps in, knowing full well he's severely outclassed, in such a weakened state and that it's very likely they're all going to die and still does one last attack because he wants to at least try to stick it to Cell works. Honestly I don't even think at this point he's really doing it to help Gohan so much as it's just him letting Cell know that even if he's dying, he's dying with the idea he did everything he can to try and take him down and to give credit to the anime version in general, it helps support this depending on how you look at the events. Everyone dives in to help Gohan, probably knowing full well there's a good chance they won't be of much assistance but they do so anyway because if there's even a single chance this could help bring Cell down they're going to take it and Vegeta watches as they all fail and at a certain moment, he doesn't care. He has lost so much, he has nothing more that he could truly lose and so he unloads one last desperate attack.
Vegeta being enough to hurt Cell... it never did anything for me to be honest, especially because I don't think the moment should be like that for Vegeta. I always felt it was much more poignant and resonant to have it be a desperate last ditch attack that doesn't work and doesn't affect Cell that much damage-wise but it gives just enough of a moment of pause for him to see Vegeta that Gohan is able to make that final push.
I really like the second Tao Pai Pai filler episode! Instead of having him be a generic cocky bastard and stupidly assume he could take on Goku for no reason like so many filler bad guys seem to do, he actually remembers the defeat he's suffered and tries to trick Goku so that they don't end up fighting at all. I really wish characters were allowed to be smart like this more often.
And then he quickly gets into the oil business in order for that Playdia game to happen during this time!
@@BagOfMagicFood What?
It was also insanely funny
I just love his TFS version where his immediate reaction is to SCREAM his head off
@@BagOfMagicFood I got the reference
The "Z-Fighters" teaming up to blast away at Perfect Cell during Gohan's beam struggle always left a big impression on me. It was like a love-letter to all of those individual characters' contributions to the franchise (before becoming irrelevant), and I think you are right that it accentuates the significance of Goku's sacrifice. I was disappointed to learn one of my favorite moments had no basis in the source material, and even though it might diminish the "courage" of Vegeta, I think the trade-off is worthwhile.
The silent intro feels a bit eary, but understandable. Great episode as per usual!
I thought my headphones stopped working.
I think I’m missing something. Why was it silent?
@@ssjalpha6593 in the previous video, he had Unmei no Hi as intro song, like in the DBD videos for the cell arc. However, this time he got a copyright claim, so decided to make this video without that piece of music
Did you bring up the discrepancy of Trunks’ Anime memories of an aged-looking Buruma and the canon manga (and later Anime version) of her looking younger?
Also, I’d like to add how the Anime adds to bonding scenes of Goku and Gohan outside the RoT&S. Gohan breaking into tears over seeing his cured father, and Goku patting his head to show everything is okay. The fishing scene. Gohan’s birthday party, where Goku and Gohan slurp noodles and being ignorant to how everyone recognizes their resemblance.
Originally I felt Kuririn’s inclusion to those scenes was an intrusion to a family-only story. But I’ve warmed over it. Kuririn is pretty much family to the Sons. He should be there.
I love them.
Hum? Future Bulma looks old in the manga, too.
In the Anime, Trunks has several memories of his mother talking about Vejita (to show the contradiction of the man his mother told him vs the reality). Buruma there is portrayed elderly with lots of wrinkles, etc. When Trunks returns to his Era, Buruma still looks older than present-day Buruma, but isn’t looking as aged as those flashbacks portray.
@@agerard6297 When Cell appears, future Bulma looks younger because she got a haircut. Though we barely see her face in the manga when that happens. In the anime, though, I have no idea since I haven't watched it entirely.
My comment is focused on the Anime-only scenes of Trunks remembering Future Buruma telling him the “truth” about his father.
The change in production during the Cell arc was much needed for the series. The Off Model look that Studio Live and Last House was doing started to creep up near the end of Frieza arc, but their work became much more apparent here. By the time the Buu Arc started Dragon Ball's visual was vastly improved.
Those filler episodes with first-form Cell are indeed a great showcase of how the more Perfect Cell became, the more Generic he got, as presenting him as this slasher-film villain was a very effective way of showing how terrifying he could be. The episode where he pursues the woman and the kid, who are ultimately saved by Krilin was really good.
6:06 it was at this point that Naotoshi Shida was poached away from Last House to Toei's main staff. The rest was history.
not to mention it was recently revealed that the key animation for Frieza's death on episode 120 is done by none other than Shida!
One thing I really liked about animating the Cell fight is when after Gohan goes SSJ2, Cell decides to power up fully, and we're greeted with a 5 minute power-up scene with Cell shaking the earth, and causing general chaos across Earth. The music they use is the creepy Dracula-esque organ music they've used a few times before, but then it shifts to the angelic "Goku kills Buu with the Genki Dama" song (because I don't know what it's called) all while Cell is still powering up, topped off with Norio Wakamoto's screaming. It's a one-and-done scene in the manga, but damn, if that shot of the clouds whizzing past that city skyline doesn't get me every time.
It's also pretty funny that after all that time powering up, he gets his shit wrecked immediately
Fun fact for those who didn't know: Studio Junio also animated the beautiful Sonic CD opening animation.
What other series did they work on?
Cell was said to be made from Goku, Vegeta, Piccolo, Frieza, King Cold and “various other organisms” so I find it reasonable to assume he has small amounts of DNA from Krillin, Yamcha, Tien and possibly others who were around the battles. I mean one of the cell jrs uses the kikoho in the anime so we know at least he has Tien’s cells in this continuity
The anime dub kind of fixes this. He just says he has the DNA of "The greatest fighters in the universe, including you Piccolo!", which is pretty ambiguous so the audience is left to assume whatever they want.
Vegeta's blast makes Cell buckle since he is much stronger than the others. Cell wouldn't have expected Vegeta to step in due to his pride (as shown when he let Cell become Perfect), and thus doesn't count on Vegeta making the pragmatic decision to sucker punch him for the sake of victory.
You took the words right out of my mouth. Cell got hit with a big bang Ofcourse it will shock Cell momentarily
Also, it made so much more sense out of all the characters that needed to do it, this definitely had to be Vegeta. I mean, the guy himself ended up apologizing to Gohan, right before this last action from him that eventually made the difference this time, after making him loose an arm by saving him because of another attack failure from him and for the first time, he acknowledged that was his fault ! Talking about character development, that's a huge one, actually...
Exactly. In the arc gohan was the strongest, second was goku, and third was vegeta. With goku gone and gohan on the ropes it was up to vegeta throwing one last big attack to help gohan. You even see it. Cell is knocked back alittle and vegeta is breathing heavy showing he used all his energy into that blast.
@@modernwarrior24 You're right, but beyond power levels matter it was also a symbolic one : Vegeta screwed up with Cell mainly from letting him get his perfect form...and then a second time by giving Gohan a handicap, pretty much, for the last stand against Cell.
So by apologizing to him for the first time he ever did to somebody in his life and then distracting Cell at the right time, this was a first step to redemption path for him, basically, before Majin Buu Arc...
Yeah but in the Manga it didn’t happen though.
Eh, I'd say Vegeta's blast in particular surprised Cell because he didn't expect it from Vegeta of all people. Vegeta was never really a team player especially in this arc, so to see Vegeta coming out to help Gohan probably shocked Cell because he didn't think Vegeta had it in him. It also helps that the people Cell is made up of would never expect that from Vegeta also and Vegeta is also apart of Cell. Those also probably helped with the shock factor.
Well it also comes off as a different kind of surprise.
The other fighter's blasts were annoying and Cell definitely could feel them, but they didn't hurt. It was just irritating that he needed to put any extra effort to keep them off of him.
Vegeta's blast *actually hurts.* Even in the manga when Vegeta freaks out and attacks Cell, Cell has to brace himself for Vegeta's oncoming attack in order to No Sell it. Vegeta isn't a threat to Cell by himself, but he is considerably stronger than the rest of the Dragon Team by several country miles. The second time Vegeta blasts him, Cell isn't in any position to defend himself and he's already ramping up the rest of his Ki to overwhelm Gohan.
I don't think the surprise comes from the fact that he didn't expect more distractions, the surprise comes from the fact that *he just took damage* coupled with the fact that he was so sure he had ultimately broken Vegeta prior. This gives the other characters a major hand in defeating Cell; They had just as poor odds at doing anything as Vegeta believed he did, but they tried anyways. As despondent as he was at the time, it's impossible to say witnessing that didn't give him the motivation to step in.
Maybe Gohan smashing through a tree isn't all that impressive for the Dragon Ball world considering Goku was able to perfectly chop wood barehanded himself as a child. But a toddler being able to seriously damage an opponent Goku can't seem to scratch with his best moves... I dunno I kind of feel like the impact is still there.
"I didn't know it was possible for Cell to look like he has a mullet-"
And now I will never unsee that anytime I see images from this saga of the anime.
And seriously? People don't know Tamashii Tai Tamashii? It's like one of the most iconic songs of the entire franchise.
It was so damn cool seeing Tao Pai Pai again after all those years though. Growing up my parents had the Tankobons of the series up to the start of the 23rd Budokai so I got to see him as his cyborg self (which was shocking enough on its own since it seemed like he'd been flat-out killed during the Red Ribbon Army Saga), but to see him pop up again so late in was just a joy to me after having been so long without older characters that weren't the main ones (who were already getting shoved to the side for all that Saiyan garbage).
Personally I'll always prefer the anime version's "all-the-characters distracting Cell" with their blasts as it gives them a combined effort to shine and participate when they normally don't get to by this point, is somewhat symbolic of him being made of various different fighters that are present, and because I honestly don't care about Vegeta much at all. Yeah he's there for Trunks's death but that's about the most investment I get from his participation.
Love how you go through the different studios and their styles. It’s interesting learning why the show sometimes looked better, worse, or just, weirder than usual.
BTW, despite the German dub using the Kikuchi score, Unmei no Hi was completely replaced by something instrumental, at least in the TV version.
The Mind Power KI got a German cover in the dub, but the intro leading up to the chorus and the music after the flashback were completely cut, so there was silence whenever Trunks was talking during that scene.
In the German dub, Trunks still calls the cyborgs C-19 and C-20 when he was warning Gokū.
Is there a clip of them?
@@matt0044 Gohan’s transformation: ua-cam.com/video/egS3NKx3w5A/v-deo.html
@@PrimeroJinJusuke So was the "Wing" music composed for their dub or liscensed.
@@matt0044 I don’t know. The German used the Kikuchi score, but there’s some weird licensing going on with certain songs.
@@PrimeroJinJusuke I wonder how they came about the decision rather than dubbing Unmei No Hi. Most German dubs back then did good covers of Anime songs.
Vegeta blasting Cell was a big moment of character development for him. It was him realising that the stakes and the things he wanted to protect were bigger than his ego. So instead of "waiting for his turn" as he would have before, he concedes to kill Cell at all costs, which meant subtly admitting that he had no chance against him and that Gohan was the only hope. That's why there was no way Cell could have seen the attack coming, even if the others had jumped in before. I think the anime does a good job portraying this. Vegeta's expression of exhaustion and desperation after the blast tells you all you need to know.
Damn! Didnt even realise there were people that hadnt heard umei no hi. What a shame, felt robbed when I saw the scene in Japanese for the first time
Think of us who did only get the Movies, Big Green dub.
I personally really really like the episodes done by Seigasha for the exaggerated poses. And there my favorite animation team just for that. But I like the other animation teams as well.
Here's my issue with the anime ending of the Cell fight and my interpretation of/why I love the manga version.
The anime makes it come across like Cell takes damage from Vegeta's attack after the other attacks all fail. It's implying that he was strong enough to knock Cell off his guard ever so slightly which is what allows Gohan to win. He even crumples a bit after getting hit by Vegeta in this version.
The manga version doesn't have Cell crumple over when he gets hit. He simply turns to look at Vegeta for a split second. The way I read the manga version is that Gohan is struggling with the internal doubt of whether or not he will be able to destroy Cell without using so much power that he will destroy everything else. Right before Goku has convinced Gohan that it's okay to go all out, Cell decides he's going to end it. In the split second before he says goodbye, Vegeta shoots him in the head. It doesn't injure him at all, but it distracts him from obliterating Gohan with his full power. Gohan has decided it's okay to go all out in this time, and Vegeta landing that shot is the wakeup call/signal for Gohan to go all out.
I think the manga version is really putting a lot of emphasis on the fact that Gohan is strong enough to win by himself, he's just too afraid to use his full power and possibly destroy everything. Vegeta's attack does absolutely nothing but it stalls Cell just long enough for Gohan to decide to use his full power and serves as a slap in the face to get him to unleash it. I think that's much better than Gohan requiring assistance to knock Cell off balance before he can win.
12:00 not just Norio Wakamoto, but Dameon Clarke does an excellent portrayal of Cell in both the original DBZ dub, and especially the Kai dub.
I think Dee Bradley Baker would have been an excellent Cell voice, especially for Imperfect Cell.
Not gonna lie i only know the american dub for the videogames and i haaaaaaate all voices but Cell and 17, those are really cool.
He really nails Perfect Cell, elevating the character with a charismatic flare to him that makes you think he's having the time of his life.
For a moment I thought my device didn’t play sound.
I think the reason the anime invented the flashback about baby Gohan rage plowing through the apple tree was so they could remind the audience that Gohan is supposed to have a rage power boost thing going for him before it becomes relevant during the Cell fight. It is fair considering Gohan hasn't done anything for this entire arc, the last time he demonstrated this capacity was while fighting 3rd form Freeza.
yeah true. also even if goku knew gohan had hidden strength, the sight of him injuring raditz would still be shocking considering how strong raditz was; goku knew he had power, but never thought it could be that much
I thought it would have already been well established by then and ingrained into most people's minds.
Raditz, nappa, vegeta, then frieza's 2nd AND 3rd form. Besides, instead they could've maybe just done a flashback to previous events instead of a brand new one if they really felt that way, but i dont see the need to have to remind audiences about something not that important across a **whole** arc
The constant yet harmless attacks of the other characters could have lulled Cell into a sense of 'these people can't do anything to me' security, leaving him totally off-guard for when Vegeta hit him with something that actually hurt, creating the distraction.
It's still needless
One thing I absolutely love about some of the fight scene filler in this arc is that the writers really seemed to want to get the classic DB cast back into the action. Kuririn standing on the wing of the air car standing his ground against Cell is one of his coolest scenes from this arc, and everyone working together to blast Cell while Vegeta sits on the sidelines, then Vegeta tagging in to push their distraction over the edge is just an all around good moment for all the characters involved
21:10 because Vegeta is stronger than them and maybe that he hit him from the air. Vegeta looked like he had been charging that blast for a while. It clearly affected Cell more than the others. It was a nice bone to throw to Vegeta. Goku and Trunks weren't there so the anime made it so Vegeta was the only other person who could bother Cell in that way.
Now that I think of it this is similar to the first Broly movie where even though everyone was giving their power it wasn't enough until Vegeta contributed.
I always thought that too
I always figured Cell knew how to do the other character's techniques because of the information from Dr. Gero's ladybug droids, and Cell only had the physical attributes of the cells he got from the Saiyan, Namekian, and Freezypop subjects (ex: Namekian regeneration, Saiyan zenkai boosts, and.... Freezypop bravado?).
One thing that would have helped with the intervention during the beam struggle, would be for Vegeta to see the others trying to help Gohan, and the shame of not trying like they did, being what pushes him to have his go. You could also change it so that it's not being distracted by Vegeta that throws Cell off, but that Vegeta was able to hit hard enough to stagger Cell. After everyone else really didn't stagger him at all, Vegeta's stronger attack doing the trick being why Cell is surprised. Like he underestimated Vegeta after his previous attempt left no impact, only for this time, it does.
I definitely agree that having the other heroes participate in the final beam struggle gives more than it takes away. Arguably, it really doesn't take away anything, since the series never seems to tire of showing us that an attack from the B-squad and an attack from the Saiyan heroes are not only not in the same league, they're not even the same sport.
9:21 That scene in the anime with the lady and her little brother always reminded me of Terminator. Maybe it was also because of the Bruce Falconburger (or whatever his name is) music playing in the dub.
Faulconer.
While I do understand (and even sometimes agree with) the opposing views of the end of the fight with Cell, I like the anime version because it makes it feel like the other Z-fighters contributed (even if just the tiniest amount) instead of just standing around like they do at so many other points in Dragon Ball.
It probably helped that I saw the anime before I read the manga so I didn't have "the way it should be" in my head going into it too.
Something no one ever seems to talk about is that during the Goku vs. Cell fight, the anime inserts the lengthy animation of Goku charging up for an attack from the intro into the actual show. I think this is pretty neat: they already knew Goku was going to die soon, so they decided to use their last opportunity actually have that moment take place somewhere in the story instead of it just being a random intro animation.
I did almost bring that up but ultimately left it out because I didn't know where to put it. It is a pretty interesting decision.
I never noticed that until I watched Kai a few years back. Pretty kino choice.
I'm actually not a fan at all of the anime adding in the rest of the group, but not only because it makes zero sense that all of their combined efforts do nothing to detract from Cell's onslaught, only for that lone attack from Vegeta to finally do the trick.
Rather, I hate how it downplays the importance of it being *Vegeta* who is the only one who can-- and does-- aid Gohan in that moment. With the way the arc has played out, Cell only achieved his perfect form because of Vegeta's actions. They had the opportunity to the the right thing, but his arrogance directly lead to the creation of Perfect Cell. As such, having him be the one to help Gohan take Cell out is way more impactful and acts as a soft redemption for his actions.
Sure, he's still the final attack that helps do the trick in the anime, but I'd argue it's not nearly as poignant with him being one of many, who just HAPPENS to do the trick at the last moment.
I understand where you're coming from, and that is... eh, essentially what I was implying when I said it was a "good character moment for him," but maybe I should have been more explicit. For me, though, that moment is overshadowed by his earlier apology to Gohan. To me that's the moment that sells his redemptive nature far better than his attack later on. Not that both of them aren't important, but that's more momentous to me. Because that, and his post-fight admission of being outclassed, are intact, I don't feel his character suffers by the inclusion of the others.
@@MistareFusion I agree that the apology is part of the redemption, but it's more words than action. I think him actively taking part in the defeat of Cell AFTER the apology makes it truly effective and complete, and it's somewhat undermined by having the others go before him. But that's just my perspective~
@@KaiserNeko I dunno, I'd say it's more so his worldview shifts which leads him to apologize. It's not just words, it's actual change in Vegeta. And it's the change in Vegeet's wordlview that actually makes that moment he helps Gohan so poingnant, because really, it is still in character for the asshole Vegeta to help defeat someone who endangers him. The difference is what motivates Vegeta here. He wants to help Gohan to make up for past mistakes, instead of just helping Gohan to help himself.
idk, the anime makes a point of it being a big decision on Vegeta's part with all the tension building up on him, Between his pride, feel that it is useless, and everyone's example, kinda like the Broly Movie climax, in the manga it just sorta happens.
The blast that Vegeta hit Cell with would naturally be multiple times stronger than anything Piccolo, Tien, Krillin or Yamcha were throwing at him.
Vegeta was Super Saiyan, up in the air out of range, and likely charged up a very heavy blast.
He saw the the 'constant but weak' stuff the others were throwing at Cell were barely an annoyance. Vegeta needed to hit him with a DAMAGING blow and took the time to make his count. Cell buckles from the power of Vegeta's blast...and that gives Gohan a genuine opportunity to defeat him.
In the manga he's in base.
@@zenithpath8707 In the manga
I believe Vegeta actually powered up to Ascended Super Saiyan (Grade 2) for that instant, just for the extra firepower. He's noticeably buff in that close-up shot where he's panting from the effort.
Not gonna lie, I expected the Cell Arc on tv part to last longer.
i am so so so so glad you pointed out the pseudo mullet cell has in those last house episodes. it drives me crazy, and it's so annoying that their episodes got as bad as they did just as studio live starting putting out some good to great episodes. last house had the best fight scenes in the original dragon ball, and then by the goku vs cell fight, their barely even moving.
I'm so glad I'm not the only person to think it looks like he has a mullet!
@@MistareFusion he wasn't able to pull it off as well as gohan did either, another reason he lost.
I'm feeling very detail blind right now, because none of the "off-model" pictures of Cell look all that bad to me.
It's a weird first for me, because while admittedly I'm usually more focused on other things when watching the episodes myself, but when stills of bad animation are shown to me in isolation I can otherwise recognize them as such.
Last House made some Meme-worthy material working on this Arc.
This episode vindicated me. For years I remembered that my very first introduction to Dragon Ball was an episode that started with Cell chasing after a young couple in a funhouse filled with mirrors. To this day the extreme close up shot of cells eyes darting back and forth gave stuck in my head for years. But I could never find a single person remembering this episode nor could I track it down since I only own kai. Thank you for not making me feel like I was fabricating memories 🙌
Glad you sang the praises of Studio Cockpit. Masaaki Iwane was one of the key animators there and he would later be known as THE animator for the Pokemon anime.
fun fact about the insert songs, for some never explained reason, they never made into the latam dub, and they were not replaced with anything else, so when trunks kills freezer and gohan turns ssj2 its just silent, which never came out as odd honestly, I didnt learn of these songs until I started to listen to DB music on youtube, also cell voice in latam later became also Mr.Satan´s
wait a minute when Trunks kills
Freezer it's used Battle Point Unlimited on the Latam Dub too,
but yeah Day of Destiny
wasn't used when Gohan turns SSJ2 in fact to my knowledge, Day of Destiny was the only piece of music that never made it to DBZ in Latam Tv, at least I never heared on Tv on my country.
I always have thought that OST never was use
because the people in charge of the dub didn't want the scream of Gohan's voice actress to be overshadow with the song
Same happens in the kikuchi score Funimation English dub. Moments with insert songs are just left silent.
May not agree on every animation take, but enjoyed this video immensely! Sal and Fliza are fucking hilarious. I never noticed those before.
As far as Studio Carpenter go in this era, Shimanuki took the role as chief animation supervisor for their stuff, so basically all of their episodes are redrawn by him. Almost every shot in this is from Nuki. Probably why they don't bother you hugely at this stage.
I didn't even notice those names were supposed to be in a Latin alphabet until this video made me stop and look closely!
11:11 Gotta love how all of them are misspelled:
SonGocu
Picoro
Vejiea
Fliza
Sal.
Something interesting that happenned in the latin american dub, for some reason instead of "Day of Destiny - Spirit vs Spirit" playing in the background while Gohan turns into the definitive super saiyan transformation, there was... nothing. That's right, no music. I don't know the reason, i doubt it was for copyright infringement, but in the original transmission of the show we ended up with sheer silence in the background. It might be nostalgia but i think the silence enhanced the scene especially when it was broken by Gohan's scream. In later reruns they added the song but you can still find the original transmission on YT, i recommend to look it up. It's an even more powerful scene.
That sounds pretty eerie, which works quite well with the tone of the scene.
Happened in the "Remastered" dub of those accursed orange bricks because FUNi was too damn cheap to pay for music rights. Hell, they didn’t bother to use either of the Japanese openings either. Half-assitude galore.
You’re the only person that I’ve heard talk about studio animation per arc. Really love that
Cell was so surprised by the ssj2 he birthed an 8th cell jr
At last, Studio Cockpit! When I saw screenshots of their animations, I immediately fell in love. Such beautiful details and expressiveness. 😍😍😍
Surprised you didn't mention any of the added material during the fight with the Cell Jrs. Well, at least the the moment where Tenshinhan and Yamcha team up and manage to save Goku from a Cell Jr. that was taking advantage of his weak condition to trash him. It was a nice moment for fans of those characters who miss the days when non-Saiyans were still worth a damn in Dragon Ball, haha.
You are right that that is an awesome moment. However, I don't really have anything to say about it other than that I liked it. It's not really feasible for me to mention every single filler thing, so I was hoping that my using an image from it during these videos was enough to represent that I acknowledge that it exists.
@@MistareFusion Yeah, makes sense, it's a moment that speaks for itself. Either way it's cool to know you find it awesome as well. :)
As a wrestling fan, seeing the Hulk Hogan pastiche Mr. Satan getting 3 more wrestling pastiches in Big Van Vader, Shawn Michaels and Sensational Sherri copies filled me with joy. Which was followed up by a Stan Hansen lookalike in the Bojack movie.
9:46 When watching the anime for the first time, I found it weird that Piccolo made such a big deal out of Cell using the Kamehameha, yet he completely glossed over him using the Makankosappo. When reading the manga, it all made sense... or more so it did in a relative sense as it's still no big deal there. Everyone and their dog can use a Kamehameha.
Yeah, it was literally a plot point back in Dragon Ball when Tenshinhan whips it out at the tournament just to basically mock how primitive/easy it was compared to his techniques
@@bellowingsilence Cell using Makankosappo / Speacial Beam Cannon (used only by Piccolo in all the series).
*Piccolo:* I sleep.
Cell using Kamehameha (a move that everyone and their grandma can imitate).
*Piccolo:* OMG!
TOEI sometimes shits the bed with their filler.
If anything, Toei should’ve flipped the scene to have Piccolo shocked that Cell can use the Makankõsappō, but treating the Kamehame-Ha like it’s no big deal.
this was my favorite arc in the anime easily, got a lot of fond memories watching this on Toonami.
Regarding the thing about who's cells Cell actually has, I dislike the idea that Cell knows the techniques he does based on his DNA in the first place, as if the Makankosappo is baked into Piccolo's genes or whatever. It'd make a lot more sense if the explanation was that Cell knows all of their techniques because of the footage Gero's insect robots obtained.
Also, your rant about Mr Satan's underlings reminded me of what happened to them in the TFS version, and now I can't stop laughing.
Oh, I definitely agree, but I wasn't here this time to pick apart what I think would be better writing. The characters treat it as if their cells are responsible for Cell's repertoire, so I'm just going with what they're saying.
I also was always under the Impression that Cell was using some of the techniques because of the recorded data of the spy robots rather than their cells, regardless what the characters were claiming.
@@PrimeroJinJusuke I feel like that would make decent sense considering that Cell has cells from characters like Gokū, Tenshinhan, Kuririn, Yamucha, etc... characters who have all demonstrated the ability to mimic techniques pretty easily after just seeing them once. After all, if they can copy the Kamehameha and Taiyōken just by seeing someone else do them, why can't the being who has all of their cells combined?
@@TheBigBlueBugofJustice Cell didn't have any human cells...
@@Blasckk Maybe it's from the spy robot, but he did use the Shishin no Ken and the Kienzan. Though that was only in filler, and Piccolo uses the Shishin no Ken against Nappa in filler, so who knows
Dragon Ball Z Abridged was the first time I heard Day of Destiny so thankful to them and later you for brining more attention to the song
Firstly thanks for reminding me about that wow wow wow wow song it's so good and funny and I love it. Secondly I feel slightly conflicted like you with the anime change to the others helping Gohan. On one hand TFS explained that it hurt or at least lessoned Gohan's moment to show his power and prove himself and I can get that. However I very much agree with the idea that it is more to show everyone is trying to do something to fight Cell and shows how much stakes are in this for everyone to use their powers to eventually kill Cell. Either way I love it. Also really people don't know about the intro song you used...I just..it's iconic though like I thought it be the one track you use with lyrics that actually is known.
People underestimating Piccolo’s power. He was slightly stronger than 17 before he entered the time chamber... I’d at least say he was as strong as if not stronger than semi perfect Cell.
You're right. Because he was strong enough to resist at least a little against one Cell Jr. (pretty much like Trunks and Vegeta, but a little less efficient though, such as Goku himself who didn't have the time to recover after his fight against Perfect Cell himself), which was basically right between Perfect Cell and Semi-Perfect Cell as a matter of power levels, once again, of course...so that already said something about it.
@@798jeremy True, though Piccolo was also working with the humans to keep Goku standing. Though I’m uncertain if working together with the humans helped or if it was more of a hindrance for him.
On the subject of lookalikes, Gohan's whip-happy tutor looks a lot like Pamput from the 22nd Budokai. And Caroni looks like General Blue with long hair.
i highly enjoy every video u come out with very knowledgeable stuff. facts that i didnt even know about and im a somewhat diehard lol. been a follower since that Zyuranger Review u did back in the day and i was hooked to your channel.
I like the shorter intro but I've been so used to music playing at the start of your videos that I thought my headphones were broken or there was a rendering error at first.
edit: Oh copyright claim, of course
sometime ago I was lowkey proud of my old self for recognize the different styles of animations even knowing nothing about this thing work with studios and all... and used to attribute this to an "artistic vein"...
but looking now, I don't know how anyone would miss the differences, XD
anyway, great video as always... love the analysis.
Same lol. I would always see the previews for the next episode and would figure out that the filler episodes were the ones that looked like melted dogshit. If it looked awesome, then it wasn't filler and was worth watching next time.
Cell being called Sal just makes me want an alternate dub where he is voiced by someone doing an Italian movie mobster voice.
Now, I don't feel crazy for thinking that Battle Point Unlimited reminded me of the Seinfeld theme. Glad someone else was thinking the same thing.
Gohan met Karin-tō at the end of the sayajin arc after the last fight when they picked everyone up (they didn't speak to each other though)
I'm aware. That's why I mentioned this rewriting as a correction. I had complained about the discrepancy when I covered the manga.
15:03 Well... not really? He did meet Korin in the Garlic Jr Arc.
He met Karin at the beginning of The Freeza Arc. The manga has Gohan greet him as though they've never met. The anime version fixes this.
@@MistareFusion Oh I misinterpreted, I completely forgot about him being in the plane.
@ That is what makes it great. Because Vegeta's arc is about him becoming humbled, it would not work to have him end it as a great hero. Accepting the role of great hero is not something that requires humility. But filling a support role which anyone could have fulfilled as a mere distraction to the main villain for the main hero does require humility. Ending it like that also makes it more believable that he would give up on being a warrior.
I love how Vegeta's arc ends in the Cell saga. IMO it is really unfortunate that the Buu saga rewinds his arc to undo the original ending from the Cell saga. I think that they ought to just have dropped Vegeta into irrelevancy, making him a broken man until he dies and goes to hell. It would have been a sad but righteous story.
21:17 Obviously because the rest of the attacks were weak.
He got blasted multiple times by weak attacks and suddenly.... something damaged him!!!
Who could do that? Piccolo???? Tien????
It's a great idea if you haven't read the manga
It was Piccolo's and the others' involvement with Cell despite knowing they will die that motivated Vegeta to go Super Saiyan and launch an attack. In that sense it solves a big issue the manga had by making everyone's involvement at least somewhat necessary.
It feels like an eternity for each episode, but well worth it.
I honestly wonder, if Cell came back in the next super series (that they mentioned after the DBS super hero movie) how he would react? Knowing everyone is stronger (even krillin thanks to the TOP and his new awakening) and the fact that he himself isn't perfect.
Sure he realised it after gohan beat him but he died before we could see him fully express it beyond disbelief.
"He was programed to destroy and be drawn to large cities. But without it, what does he have now? What is it like to have... nothing? Nobody to go home to, or to comfort you in the night?" - Jumba Jookiba (Lilo and Stitch)
19:46 - (I can still hear this scene in my head)
Mr. Satan: "It's a trick! It's ALL a TRICK!!"
Caroni: _"I can't believe that you're STILL saying that!"_
Your analysis and videos on DB, are a highlight of my month!
So that's what the song was named when Trunks is walking through the future! Mind Power...Energy...! I always found this song so cool even if it lasted for a little bit!
That unique samurai-shaped flesh piece from Sal's nape always bugged me as a child. 😂
The flashback for trunks works better for me than the intro for history of trunks special - I like the idea of the future androids hunting them one by one, it feels like a more natural place for the present androids to go if they actually caught up with goku and got him and there was no cell - just moving onto another target and gradually becoming more evil. Also resolves the oddity of the future versions randomly being much more evil from the get go
I said this last time but I'm really happy seeing you talk about this version. It was my favorite arc growing up. I thought I'd need to wait until after the Buu arc manga to see it so thank you very much.
Some things I wanna say.
1. I've always known about day of destiny, spirit versus spirit as a song. Even before your videos and I love it.
2. I never thought about the Yajirobe point, so funny thinking Super used that so long after this series ended.
3. Cell having a mullet I think is just hilarious.
4. Sal could be a great channel joke for Cell here like poor dolt for Yamcha.
5. I love that filler episode with Goku. One of the best in the series I think.
6. I remember growing up and finding Mark's students really funny as a kid and seeing them fail.
7. I've always really liked seeing everyone do something in the last battle with Cell vs Gohan. Not just having them do nothing and watching, all of them being part of Gohan winning here. A team effort in a way if you will.
It pains to me admit but even I didn’t even know what Unmei no hi was at first as I saw the scene in English. But hey, kudos to TFS for eventually showing me the light. It really is sad to think about especially when several other dubs kept the song in
¡Sr. MistareFusion pásame la Sal!
I'll always find amusing how Norio Wakamoto doesn't change his voice that much for different roles and how the majority of his roles are villains and still he does a lot of different archtypes, eccentrics, intimidating ones, charismatic... etc etc and still that same voice he uses for all those types of characters usually fits just right.
Yeah, I gave a listen to the Japanese dub of Transformers Animated recently, and I was like, "Megatron sounds familiar..."
I thought you were gonna say that Wakamoto doesn't change his voice that much for the three forms of Cell, although he makes more of those weird blubbering noises for his first form in Kai, whereas the Funimation dub was like, "He looks like a bug! Do a Zorak impression until he changes!"
7:27 Not gonna lie. Goku’s neck and shoulder placements in this frame freak me out. 😖
Excellent work as always. Will never be able to unsee the Cell Mullet now.
Amazing video once again. I've never completely read or watched the Cell arc (outside of DBZA, though it's not complete watching tbh) so these videos are quite amazing to watch.
16:50 If Japan made Jurassic Park, that maybe WOULD have happened.
Also, that's way too mean for Gohan to do that.
7:07 funny thing is that this could've been easily solved if Uchiyama erased the green parts below the ears, that part is supossed to be hidden in front shoots at least, but the worst thing is that he consistently did it. Did he even take a look at the character's sheets properly? Since characters don't have ultra pointy noses or stalactites-looking hair and let's not even talk about how he drew character muscles.
Threre is also an issue with the senzu beans. In the anime they had 6 remaining senzu which Krillin,Tien and Piccolo split between them. The 4 were used for Vegeta,Tien,Piccolo and Trunks, 2 more for Piccolo/Tien later and 2 more for Krillin/Vegeta which made them 8. The anime tried to correct that by not having Krillin give a senzu to Piccolo and Trunks after the Android fight as they weren't heavily damaged or anything.
It was not just the Americans who missed out on "Day of Fate"!
I'm from Portugal and our dub also did not have it... I'm guessing it was a licensing issue since many other songs are also missing...
Thanks for introducing me to the Red Ribbon Army song!
Appreciate you man. Thank you for the quality content
I thought my headphones weren't working in the beginning
Also, Unmei no Hi wasn't exactly available on the American DVD releases. They cut that out, even from the English voice track with Japanese soundtrack.
Yep and all because of ridiculous rights issues that prevent stuff like that.
I always looked at Vegetas attack as his way of saying Sorry to Gohan for getting his arm snatched up protecting him from his rash attack...That embarrassment was enough to make him say he would never fight again
I'll just assume that Yajirobe barely got to eat a last resort Senzu Bean just after the Artificial Humans left him for dead, so he went alive and well for Dragon Ball Super. After all, he's very well known for always stealing them from Korin himself, at least in Toei's material.
It threw me off when the intro didn't have any music. I was worried something was wrong with my speakers.
I understand that you got copyright claimed, but I hope you find some other music to use. It's just weird having a blank there.
Well, considering there will never be any more DBD Cell videos after today, I don't think my reluctance to use Day of Destiny is going to be a concern again. I don't think I need to bother finding anything else now that we're done here. =P
@@MistareFusion What, you don't consider the afterlife tournament part of the Cell arc?
21:18 in defense of that, you could say that Vegeta's hit had more of an impact than the other guys' mosquito bite attacks, then again that is a pretty flimsy excuse.
Oddly enough the dvd release of DBZ I has growing up had an, "English voices + Japanese music" setting, which is what I watched, but all of the vocal themes except for the credits were removed. Maybe the backing tracks that were given to Funimation already had those songs missing or something.
May have cost extra to license!
@@BagOfMagicFood It's usually that reason actually. To my understanding, while anime generally has a pretty comfortable time licensing out the background tracks and so on for use in dubs, insert songs and even the OPs and EDs can have a VERY rough time being brought over here, especially when it comes to getting them in their original form whether it's outright due to licensing issues or the license-holders themselves have just made a mandate that they can't really use them.
I enjoyed this a lot! I had to cancel my various patreon subscriptions due to money issues a year or two back but I'll be able to subscribe again soon! :)
I'm so sorry you're having financial troubles. I hope everything is okay. Take care of yourself. :-D
I wouldn't think Vegeta's attack would be random. Among other Z Warriors, only Vegeta's power could make any difference and Vegeta made it happen. He focused all his energy, all his living energy into one, specific attack on Cell's weak spot (the back of the neck is usually a weak spot for most living organisms) so it was enough to distract him for a split second.
I loved this episode / so informative! Glad someone is talking about this!
WE LOVE YOU MISTARE FUSION FUCK YEAH can’t WAIT UNTIL YOU TALK ABOUT OTHERWORLD TOURNAMENT FUCK YEAH
My headcanon is that he just ate a Senzu bean after getting blasted by 18. It makes enough sense.
Pretty sure that most fans around the world actually got their first exposure to Unmei no Hi by watching the JP original online / in home media or internet uploads of their dubs with the song added back in because, as with almost every other insert song of the original run of the show, it was removed from several international dubs most likely because the additional royalties that needed to be paid to keep those in. So the scene played out with only the voices and SFX. A notable exception was the Catalan dub though, which not only kept the song, but actually DUBBED IT. Such a great fact to learn once you look it up how the show fared in certain European markets. Catalonia loved this series from day 1.
I was under the impression that the lack of Unmei no hi was a stylistic choice for DBDTV follow up parts, alas I was later mistaken
Fun fact: presumably to avoid another Saiyan Arc Vegeta situation, Toriyama colored Cell from the title page of Chapter 362 for the anime staff since he hadn't appeared in color in the manga yet.