21:55 And on top of that, if I'm not mistaken, Malaiko completely switches teams in between episodes, doesn't he? Lol. One episode, he's being cheered on by West Kaio, and then in the episode where he's defeated by Goku, South Kaio is cheering him on.
Holy crap! I think you're right! There's so much about this tournament that doesn't make sense that I didn't even pick up on every individual thing. Geez, this was written sloppily!
The dub actually tries to correct this by having South Kaio say "I know you're not from my quadrant, but I want you to pound that rookie!". Interesting to find out that it was a big ol' error.
Goku using Super Saiyan and Kaio-Ken simultaneously, since he can get away with it now that he's dead, is a really fun bit of fanservice and I'm glad whoever was writing this actually thought to use this opportunity.
Honestly I love the way this arc and the saiyaman arc were aired back to back in the anime (or what funimation would refer to as Season 7 with the Orange Bricks) Idk just the idea of Gohan being a main character while Goku has his own adventures in the afterlife is just so appealing and a good way to meet everyone halfway, rather than what they did with the Buu Arc. Its a fresh approach that unfortunately just didnt get fleshed out. Oh well, hopefully you dont lay into this arc too much!
Think it'd be cool to have those two fronts intersect like in Fusion Reborn. Imagine, Gohan's just living life at OSH when all of a sudden, Zombies and then he has to coordinate what's happening with a dead Goku whilst still trying to stay under the radar from a still suspicious Videl.
It's also weird that the tournament audience all have their bodies. There sure are a lot of great heroes in the universe. It would have made things a lot easier for Toei to have an audience full of spirit clouds.
It’s too bad that Toriyama didn’t introduce SSJ3 when this filler arc came out because they could have explained that Goku trained with the Dai Kai-oh, and learned it during the training. I know Goku technically “lost” the tournament, but if SSJ3 existed during this arc, the ending could have been tweaked to explain that Goku won the training with the Dai Kai-oh. It would make sense because we never learn how Goku officially learns SSJ3.
Together with the Ginyu force during Cell arc filler, I never understood how the bad guys get to keep their bodies so easily. But it makes sense if Kaio requested it for the Ginyus. Glad you called it out. Especially as Vegeta is shown to get his body back in the Buu arc, under special circumstances
I honestly like the scenario enough not to care about the continuity being compromised there. The major villains causing a ruckus or even just whining in hell seems a lot more entertaining and fun
Jules: What do they call Vegeta's Big Bang Attack? Vincent: Big Bang's a Big Bang, but they call it Le Big Bang. Jules: Le Big Bang. 😆 What do they call the Rasengan? Vincent: I don't know, I didn't watch Naruto.
I think out of all the Tournament participants in this arc, the best one was Aqua. He had a neat ability, and his scatterbrained personality was pretty charming. He did pretty good for the 10 minutes of screentime he had.
Tournaments typically tend to not be fun if everyone fights the same way and the more unique gimmicky abilities are rendered useless because of stronk And yes, they did repurpose this weird in-between Super Saiyan form for a card game
@@AntonioCardenasT It's different. False Super Saiyan was an unstable half-way form that gave his body and hair an orange tinge and his pupils are gone. In this, his hair just spikes up but he gains no hue or anything
@@kaihedgie1747 he has the ss hue, if he didn't it wouldn't really count since his hair used to spike sometimes before going ss for non ss related reasons. So i guess the only difference would be the pupils thing.
@@samueloak1600 I say this as someone who's number 1 favorite anime is DBZ and who's writing as a comic-book writer, artist, and novelist was heavily influenced by DBZ:"One-Piece has better world building." And while many Dragon Ball fans might prefer the fights and power ups, you've got fans like me, and MasakoX who care deeply about the world building.
Except that’s not really the case. Goku was the first person in MILLIONS OF YEARS to train under King Kai. So he shouldn’t really have any real competition. That was the whole reason he decided to use his one day back on Earth.
This was actually a really good filler arc, it followed on from the end of the Cell arc pretty well and didn't feel needlessly inserted and padded out the way the Garlic Jr. arc did between the end of the Freeza and beginning of the Androids/Cell arc. I thought this worked well before the seven year time skip and Gohan being a teen with starting high school, and the concept of a tournament outside the regular Tenkaichi Budokais with deceased warriors of long past felt like an interesting area to explore.
I'm going to be generous and say that black haired SSJ can be considered that return of that false SSJ garbage that we saw in the Slug film lol. Regardless, great analysis Mistarefusion! This filler is one of those neat ideas that really could've benefited from more care put into it since the concepts are pretty great. Pikkon especially since I absolutely love his design (which already makes me like him over Jiren at least lol). I think he's a bit better in the Fusion Reborn film despite his short screentime though.
The weird false Super Saiyan thing just seems like an especially odd addition at this point in the timeline for me. At this point Goku was able to just be Super Saiyan indefinitely without a stamina drain… Why would he use anything other than Super Saiyan, especially since Cell at this point was stronger than him, when his Super Saiyan is so easy to use?
"False Super Saiyan" was originally literally just Toei trying to beat Toriyama to the punch with what they thought Super Saiyan woudl look like, though. It's not *really* a form in its own right, and isn't even explained well in the 4th movie itself. I think it just makes more sense if Toei just decided that they'd make Goku power-up, but neglected to change Goku's eyes in accordance.
It's always been weird to me how the anime tries to get away with the obvious plot of hole of letting villains keep their bodies. It was said multiple times that Goku only keeps his body in the afterlife due to the good deeds he did in life. Hell, Vegeta even asks Piccolo if he can meet Goku in the afterlife and Piccolo bluntly tells him that Goku only got his body as a special exception as opposed to being the rule I know in Super, Freeza has a body while in hell, but it seems to be more of a special type of punishment exclusively for him. Freeza only has a body so that he can be tortured in his own personal hell, which is actually a neat idea since it's a good inversion of how Goku gets his body. Freeza is so evil that he is granted body so that he can be punished.
in reverse ... that could be explained with that Super scene like Frieza Cell the Ginyus ecc just keep their body to get tortured even tho that would make Yenma pretty sadistic
@@Mepphy99 Yeah its sadistic but mind you everyone in Frieza's conglomerate were responsible for the subjugation and genocide of entire WORLD'S of people, with the Ginyu Force operating Special Forces so its natural they'd have a massive kill count. They'd, frankly, deserve their punishment as sadistic as it is. Cell also devoured entire cities in his goal to become perfect so it tracks for him too.
One thing I would have liked in this filler is that they reintroduced Grandpa Gohan, I don't know why. I suppose because I would have liked to see Goku interacting with his adoptive grandfather, and apologizing to him for killing him by transforming into Ozaru.
This arc would've been so much fun if Cell and Freeza were also on Kaio's team (along with the other north galaxy guys) instead of just giving Goku vs Paikuhan the spotlight and glossing over everything else.
I always really liked this arc. It's just fun for fun's sake and another tournament, with no real stakes, and in a different setting entirely, and with nothing but new characters for the most part. It also never overstayed its welcome. Some of it makes no sense, but whatever, it was fun anyway.
I recently lengthily and exhaustively explained the hierarchy of super saiyan transformations to my friends as a joke, but it seems like I neglected to include Quarter-Pounder Super Saiyan in my explanation. Welp, I guess I'm gonna have to start over from the beginning again!
Which makes no sense seeing King Kai would know that he's weaker than Yamcha and wouldn't hype him up if so. I think the fact that happened is more proof the staff didn't know what to do here at all.
Whatchu talkin' bout Willis. It's clear Olibu just let Yamcha win out of pity after hearing how his life went into a downward spiral since leaving the desert. Poor dolt.
After rewatching this arc for the first time in almost 20 years in preparation for this video, this is still a pretty enjoyable mini-arc, and after watching it, my opinion of Pikkon still stands with the picture I posted on Twitter of Marge holding up the potato saying "I just think he's neat".
i only ever remember this arc because of that beautifully animated studio cockpit episode. nothing else ever sticks but god that's some of my favorite z anime animation
Mistairefusion, I was a hardcore longtime fan but I don't think I can take your nitpicks anymore. Quarter pounder super Saiyan is a masterpiece no matter what you say!
Your line about transformations in games just reminds me of Xenoverse 2... Your custom character can be one of 5 races. Each also has a unique transformation. Freeza race goes gold, Namekians go giant, etc... Except SAIYANS, WHO GET 5, SOON 6 FORMS.
Technically with Kaio ken and Potential Unleashed they each get 3, but Saiyans STILL get like what, 9 if you count each super saipan form individually? It's a shame they'll never make more transformations for the Frieza clan or Humans
@@havoc697 yeah. Like, the Frieza thing I at least kinda get since the forms look so different, so applying that to a custom character would be super hard but... Why do humans only have Nimbus? The worst "transformation" in the game? I'd have been happier had they taken the easy way out and given the the super holy water or something.
I was hoping you would remark on that not-quite Super Saiyan form. I thought it was just a silly animation error. I hadn’t made the connection that they would have half-assed covering it up to make Super Saiyan a surprise later.
The Church of the Algorithm gives this video its blessing, and must it stay clear of the blasphemers from The First Algorithmic Temple (and the many people impersonating their members).
6:27- Perfect Cell: What do you have what I don't? Pikkon: For one, I make the prominent lip look badass and not as a total doofus. Cell proceeds to get enraged.
"I bet someone's going to tell me it was brought into the games and called quarter pounder Super Saiyan or something" Me: "... 'Super Saiyan Power', actually..."
Meanwhile DBS managed to make a better tournament arc with the U7 vs U6 tournament. The battles aren’t too long, most of the opponents have personalities and interesting gimmicks, some characters got character development, including the opponents (mainly Cabbe and Hit) as well as Beerus. Vegeta became a mentor to Cabbe, and Hit changed from stoic badass to guy who gradually enjoys a good fight with Gokū, with both of them having room to improve themselves. Hit threw the fight against Monaka in the end because it’s not fun, even if Hit would have gotten the cube otherwise. Of course, the tournament wasn’t that fantastic. Boo literally does nothing but sleep, Piccolo is only used to prove that Frost cheated, and then he’s told by Vegeta not to take the win, so that Vegeta can beat up Frost himself because Frost turned out to be Freeza, but a fraud version of that. They gave most of the wins to Vegeta who defeats more than half of the opposing team, whereas Gokū managed to lose twice. You know, why not let Piccolo defeat Botamo, then lose to Frost who is then immediately caught cheating by Jaco, and then letting Boo and Vegeta fight the rest, and then Gokū vs Hit where Gokū can still throw the match. BTW, the 23rd Tenkaichi Budōkai is still the only tournament Gokū has won.
U6 tournament had potential but it's execution wasn't that good and felt rushed. Not to mention it's ending (like in most Super arcs) was terrible and made no sense. That whole Monaka thing was stupid. Hit had no reason to let him win . Goku lost because he couldn't continue and would have lost anyway but Hit could easily beat Monaka. I feel they should include a bit more fighters, maybe Android 18 and a U6 Namekian.
I wish we could've seen a story about Olibu's adventures and feats. He also has #16 stereotype, which would be something cool to see in afterlife: for his sacrifice to Earth, #16 was granted a soul.
Frieza and Cell making a takeover in Hell could’ve filled out an arc by itself, but that probably would’ve been repetitive (just look at Fusion Reborn and the Super 17 Saga from GT).
"If the teachers are rivals, so too are the students. Their squabbling persists through the story arc, to the point where there's a shot of Paikuhan that seems to suggest the students are going to say the hell with this and mutiny against their petty overlords who want to make them fight." ....soooooo, the ending of the Universe 6 Tournament from Super?
This is a fun thing that's mostly specific to me, but I was largely introduced to Dragon Ball through video games and the Collectable Card Game created by Score at the beginning of the 2000s. I won't go deep into the game's mechanics, but each expansion in the game was based on an arc of the series, though much more divided up than DBD. The thing is, in the expansion that covers the Other World Tournament, almost every finalist fighter gets their own set of cards, which led me to believe they were all going to be important, prominent characters at that point in the series. Heck, Tappuka (or Tapkar, as the CCG went with) was the linchpin of several topping competitive decks. Needless to say, when finally watching the series proper, I was surprised how little these characters do, or how little impact they have on the story xD
I remember 2 decades ago at school where one of my friends had DB character cards and we had mistaken Grand Kaio for Dr. Gero being goofy for some reason. What can be said, does afterlife counts as isekai?
6:20- Personally, I prefer Grand Kai over both Supreme Kai/Old Kai any day due to having a much more lively personality that would've bounced off the cast in less awkward ways. In fact outside of Zamasu/Gowasu- only the dead Supreme Kai of Universe 7 have any real intrigue for me- they all seem like glorified aides to the more visually memorable and personable Gods of Destruction
The reason is different, but Goku's not quite super saiyan transformation isn't entirely unique. Previously, during the the finale of the Garlic Junior arc, Gohan powered up with a golden aura as if he was right at the edge of actually transforming. Likewise, when Vegeta fought Frieza's final form on Namek, he also occasionally had a golden aura during his larger attacks. Personally, I've always considered it to be just another variation on the same "transformation" we see Goku use in the Lord Slug movie. It references super saiyan without actually being the real deal.
On top of this, Toei added gold streaks to Goku's Kaioken aura while he was flexing in front of Ginyu. It was a neat hint that he was getting pretty close to the real deal.
Despite the problems with the story itself, this is another example of something that would've had much more of an impact if Goku wasn't set to make a grand return only a handful of episodes later
Hey on the bright side Paikuhan is gonna get some more characterization in his next few appearances, right?….Right..? Also it never occurred to me how rushed this arc was. A lot of the stuff that was in here just felt like it was done without much of a script or other planning beforehand..Eesh. (Yes I know the entire series we made up as it went along)
He is awesome to play as in Raging Blast 2, and sadly a boring character. Wish they played more with him being Namekian given all the lore you could pull from
@@talesfromthenuzlocke1619 He's not a Namekian. As far as we know, he's just some alien who did something impressive enough on his planet to keep his body in the afterlife, like Goku.
This tournament is so.... meh, don't remember anything that happened, the only thing I can remember is how funny every old top 10 list put paikuhan at the strongest/best dbz characters, and started removing when the concept of filler got spread lol
Not sure if ur gonna see this but Bro I really admire your dedication towards this and the main series (DBD) Honestly kinda inspirational in its own way to see you consistently put notable effort into these discussions and dissections Keep doing what you’re doing man I’m definitely a fan of these videos
Goku was already back in the Manga, but I guess the anime staff was probably still thinking the Majin Boo adventure was still going to be a one day deal Btw so nice to catch a video on release for the first time I'm a bit surprised this series still ongoing, pretty impressive :P You do a great job on them so I guess quality over quantity is at play
I don't know if you're ever going to get the super, But man it's gonna be really weird how this innoculous filler arc really did inform dragon ball 20 plus years late.
This was literally my introduction to DBZ. I had just missed the Cell Saga when I started watching it on Toonami and straight up thought the whole series was about fighting tournaments.
Some ideas to improve this story. Add in Grandpa Gohan Make Pikkuhan a Namekian and confirm in the animated continuity that Namek is in the western quadrant.
I grew up with this arc on VHS, used to love the Goku vs Paikuhan fight. Coming back, I love everything OUTSIDE of that. The world building with dead heroes from other galaxies, the other Kais, the Grand Kai, the silly joke fights with tickle caterpillars and fish men, I LOVE all that. More than I did when I was a kid. But what it ultimately all built up to was… a soulless version of Goku vs Piccolo. Paikuhan is Piccolo without the character, Vegeta without the gravitas, and Hit without the fun gimmick or mystery. I could care less about their fight. But it doesn’t ruin the whole for me, I love this little aside from the main story.
Paikuhan for some reason is very popular, because "He is cool". But he is just Z's Jiren. What's weird is, there are a lot of people complaining that they should have brought back Paikuhan for the ToP in Super, but then in the same sentence complain about Jiren being boring. The irony.
@@succubastard1019 That's not the point. The point is demanding Paikuhan while saying Jiren is boring. They are the exact same character, Paikuhan would be pointless.
I know what you mean by time loop whenever you watch this arc. It's the same for me in the Wedding Dress filler arc and the G8 Arc in One Piece. Even though I like the latter.
When the final line is so beautifully savage you have to leave your very first comment (at least i don't remember making one before now..) Love your DBZ breakdowns, here's to many more and more wonderful heartfelt savagery
I’ll be honest, I actually enjoy this more than the Tournament of Power, better character designs, better animation overall, it’s pretty breezy which is good for something that came straight after the drama and high stakes of the Cell Saga. It also actually feels more otherworldly compared to the stuff in Super. Not my favourite filler obviously, the Learning to Drive arc still takes that crown but it’s otherwise pretty fun.
It's funny how I remember having a lot of these same thoughts about this arc back in the day. I definitely would have wanted to explore the world of the afterlife rather than this. Dare I say it might have been more interesting than buu...and most of gt
I wholeheartedly and unabashedly love this arc. Im a big King Kai fan and love his dynamic with Goku. Plus I love tournaments and this one is low stakes. Not to mention it ends with one of the most intense and Z style battles ever. Pikkon within five episodes becomes and immediate fan favorite. I will still but out my orange brick season seven disc one and watch it with the Faulconer track just for that good hit of nostalgia.
26:42 You are correct that this "form" has been repurposed in video games under the name "Super Saiyan Power!", because Dragon Ball video games are super weird about naming literally EVERYTHING from the series. To cite the wiki: "Several cards featuring artwork of Goku using this power is featured in Dragon Ball Heroes. The card has the ability Super Saiyan Power! (超サイヤパワー！ Sūpā Saiya Pawā!), which makes it that, if Goku transforms into Super Saiyan on the second turn after a Kamehameha, his power is +2000, or +5000 if it is greatly successful, transforming him into Super Saiyan 2. Goku also appears with black Super Saiyan 2 hair on the cover of Dragon Ball Z: Extreme Butōden's demo version."
That’s weird though I remember this arc and I really like the character Mijorin where you mentioned em as losers. He had an interesting back story when he was alive. I remember he knew something about Goku that was different than when he first saw him. Heck for all we know he probably didn’t even enter. Lol
Decent enough filler arc, obviously 100x better than Garlic Jr. arc. And it did lead to the creation of Pikkon and grand Kai, who both have really cool designs...
The best thing about this arc is that it gets the public ready and invested for the Fusion Reborn movie. Paikuhan might not be a very interesting character but damn it if the *I KNOW WHO THAT IS!!!* effect didn't work on me back in the day.
I wish this arc had a pair of competitors that use the fusion dance. They could go up against goku and it could be the lead in to him learning it for the Boo arc
Fusion hadn't yet been introduced in the manga, so they would've had no clue about what it would even be let alone make an accurate version of the dance
At least Paikuhan's antics with the Hell barrier and Janemba is kinda fun. And yeah, I'm definitely calling Goku's black-haired SS-esque form when fighting the Ginyu Force in Hell "Quarter Pounder Super Saiyan" from now on. Thanks, Lance lol
19:11 So he's Kermit with the Swedish Chef's voice and Jigglypuff's Final Smash. 26:46 Looked it up, it was repurposed as an ability called Super Saiyan Power in Dragon Ball Heroes. Because Pseudo Super Saiyan was taken by Movie 4's transformation, I suppose.
Ahh yes, the Black Haired Super Saiyan or "Super Saiyan Power" where Goku can utilize his Super Saiyan Power without transforming. I feel like this was the inspiration for "Saiyan Beyond God" from Resurrection of 'F' where Goku and Vegeta can utilize the power of Super Saiyan God without having to transform. While the milky white aura is unusual compared to most aura's, I had no idea this was considered a transformation until I saw it on the Dragon Ball Wiki. And sure enough it's because it's only explained in a pamphlet that came with the movie. Don't you love it when your franchises require manuals to explain things not mentioned in the source itself?
Most time I’ve seen it mentioned (which really isn’t that many), black haired Super Saiyan Goku from this arc is associated with his "Fake Super Saiyan" transformation from the Slug movie.
Well, either one is as interesting as you think he is. Don't take my word for it. I will say that Paikuhan definitely benefits significantly from his scarcity. It's much easier to get tired of someone who bores you for as long as Jiren does.
@@MistareFusion I think what made Paikuhan interesting was partly the mysterious vibe he gave off. Jiren, to me, was initially interesting due to the mystery vibe he gave off as well. One of the reasons Jiren fell flat is the mystery of his power and back story are cliche. Since Paikuhan's origins have never been explored, his mysterious vibe keeps him very interesting (at least to me).
21:55 And on top of that, if I'm not mistaken, Malaiko completely switches teams in between episodes, doesn't he? Lol. One episode, he's being cheered on by West Kaio, and then in the episode where he's defeated by Goku, South Kaio is cheering him on.
Holy crap! I think you're right! There's so much about this tournament that doesn't make sense that I didn't even pick up on every individual thing. Geez, this was written sloppily!
As long as north kai loses they win
The dub actually tries to correct this by having South Kaio say "I know you're not from my quadrant, but I want you to pound that rookie!". Interesting to find out that it was a big ol' error.
Toei don't even know the meaning of the word "consistency" 😆
@@Vitamin-L Rare dub W
Goku using Super Saiyan and Kaio-Ken simultaneously, since he can get away with it now that he's dead, is a really fun bit of fanservice and I'm glad whoever was writing this actually thought to use this opportunity.
And then Toei brought the idea back for Dragon Ball Super and Toriyama worked it into the manga briefly.
Im waiting for thr day toriyama finally commits to a gag where goku actually explodes from using the kaioken too much
@@vegettoblack7852 i mean in the super manga he kinda was since he couldn't handle it
Honestly I love the way this arc and the saiyaman arc were aired back to back in the anime (or what funimation would refer to as Season 7 with the Orange Bricks) Idk just the idea of Gohan being a main character while Goku has his own adventures in the afterlife is just so appealing and a good way to meet everyone halfway, rather than what they did with the Buu Arc. Its a fresh approach that unfortunately just didnt get fleshed out. Oh well, hopefully you dont lay into this arc too much!
Think it'd be cool to have those two fronts intersect like in Fusion Reborn. Imagine, Gohan's just living life at OSH when all of a sudden, Zombies and then he has to coordinate what's happening with a dead Goku whilst still trying to stay under the radar from a still suspicious Videl.
Goku: Grand Kai? Can we get Picollo?
Grand Kai: No, we have Picollo at home.
Picollo at home: *Paikuhan*
Paikuhan is dope
Poor Paikuhan. They didn't even bring him over to Super, like they did for Gregory.
I think he's named Piccolo in the Big Green Dub or the Malaysian Dub.
@@najadamu2724 why would he
@MaxArceus
Gasp, how dare you? Paikuhan is awesome.
Almost thought this said "annoying Budokai arc"
In some ways, it fits. ;-)
where's the lie?
Ha! Ngl I did too
It's also weird that the tournament audience all have their bodies. There sure are a lot of great heroes in the universe. It would have made things a lot easier for Toei to have an audience full of spirit clouds.
Hordes of involuntary blood donors?
15:09 I like how the Grand Kaio lives in the Fresh Prince of Bel-Air mansion.
It’s too bad that Toriyama didn’t introduce SSJ3 when this filler arc came out because they could have explained that Goku trained with the Dai Kai-oh, and learned it during the training. I know Goku technically “lost” the tournament, but if SSJ3 existed during this arc, the ending could have been tweaked to explain that Goku won the training with the Dai Kai-oh. It would make sense because we never learn how Goku officially learns SSJ3.
The grand Kai trained both pikkon and goku because they had a great fight. Ah he learned ss3 then
Another Note for the Trivia About this Arc: Episode 198 aired the same day Plan to Eradicate the Saiyans - Part 2 was released onto VHS.
Neato
"Going back to Hell is a fun idea."~Mistare fusion 2021
Together with the Ginyu force during Cell arc filler, I never understood how the bad guys get to keep their bodies so easily. But it makes sense if Kaio requested it for the Ginyus. Glad you called it out. Especially as Vegeta is shown to get his body back in the Buu arc, under special circumstances
I believe it was implied they fought and escaped with their bodies.
I honestly like the scenario enough not to care about the continuity being compromised there. The major villains causing a ruckus or even just whining in hell seems a lot more entertaining and fun
It's like Toei do and don't acknowledge the main continuity's version of Hell and the afterlife rules when they see fit.
Considering Freeza got to keep his body this entire time? It shouldn’t surprise you.
I only remember this arc because of Paikuhan and the amount of "theories" about the Black Hair Super Saiyan
26:47 In France, it's called Saiyan Without Cheese (since they have the metric system)
Omg that's hilarious
Jules: What do they call Vegeta's Big Bang Attack?
Vincent: Big Bang's a Big Bang, but they call it Le Big Bang.
Jules: Le Big Bang. 😆 What do they call the Rasengan?
Vincent: I don't know, I didn't watch Naruto.
I think out of all the Tournament participants in this arc, the best one was Aqua. He had a neat ability, and his scatterbrained personality was pretty charming. He did pretty good for the 10 minutes of screentime he had.
Tournaments typically tend to not be fun if everyone fights the same way and the more unique gimmicky abilities are rendered useless because of stronk
And yes, they did repurpose this weird in-between Super Saiyan form for a card game
Isn't that the pseudo super saiyan form from the slug movie?
@@AntonioCardenasT It's different. False Super Saiyan was an unstable half-way form that gave his body and hair an orange tinge and his pupils are gone. In this, his hair just spikes up but he gains no hue or anything
@@kaihedgie1747 he has the ss hue, if he didn't it wouldn't really count since his hair used to spike sometimes before going ss for non ss related reasons. So i guess the only difference would be the pupils thing.
what's the form called if it's not False Super Saiyan?
@@jaybee27D It's just called "Super Saiyan Power!" in Dragon Ball Heroes
"world-building is the icing on the cake and not the cake itself"
99% of the DBZ fandom: *eats entire plate of icing
Nah this isn't that prevalent in the DBZ fandom at all
Rings more true for One Piece tho!
@@samueloak1600 except the one piece cake is also gourmet 5 stars
@@jeremiahbennett3004 Not denying that
@Magmafrost13
Can you blame us? With how little world building Dragon Ball does, we take what we can get.
@@samueloak1600
I say this as someone who's number 1 favorite anime is DBZ and who's writing as a comic-book writer, artist, and novelist was heavily influenced by DBZ:"One-Piece has better world building."
And while many Dragon Ball fans might prefer the fights and power ups, you've got fans like me, and MasakoX who care deeply about the world building.
it was a fun filler arc that always had the potential to expand. like you said, for goku even in death, new challenges can still come.
There was no point to any of it and even the fighting was crap
Except that’s not really the case. Goku was the first person in MILLIONS OF YEARS to train under King Kai. So he shouldn’t really have any real competition. That was the whole reason he decided to use his one day back on Earth.
I always wondered why, in hell Goku's hair was black when he cleary should be a super saiyan. Thanks for pointing that out.
This was actually a really good filler arc, it followed on from the end of the Cell arc pretty well and didn't feel needlessly inserted and padded out the way the Garlic Jr. arc did between the end of the Freeza and beginning of the Androids/Cell arc.
I thought this worked well before the seven year time skip and Gohan being a teen with starting high school, and the concept of a tournament outside the regular Tenkaichi Budokais with deceased warriors of long past felt like an interesting area to explore.
I'm going to be generous and say that black haired SSJ can be considered that return of that false SSJ garbage that we saw in the Slug film lol. Regardless, great analysis Mistarefusion! This filler is one of those neat ideas that really could've benefited from more care put into it since the concepts are pretty great. Pikkon especially since I absolutely love his design (which already makes me like him over Jiren at least lol). I think he's a bit better in the Fusion Reborn film despite his short screentime though.
The weird false Super Saiyan thing just seems like an especially odd addition at this point in the timeline for me. At this point Goku was able to just be Super Saiyan indefinitely without a stamina drain… Why would he use anything other than Super Saiyan, especially since Cell at this point was stronger than him, when his Super Saiyan is so easy to use?
@@bellowingsilence he was trying to hide ssj from pikkon or some shit like that
Nah, it was simply Toei screwing up as always.
In the NEP, Goku has the classic golden SSJ hair, just like in Masunaga's original genga.
Actually i see it closer to the ikari form broly uses
"False Super Saiyan" was originally literally just Toei trying to beat Toriyama to the punch with what they thought Super Saiyan woudl look like, though. It's not *really* a form in its own right, and isn't even explained well in the 4th movie itself.
I think it just makes more sense if Toei just decided that they'd make Goku power-up, but neglected to change Goku's eyes in accordance.
It's always been weird to me how the anime tries to get away with the obvious plot of hole of letting villains keep their bodies. It was said multiple times that Goku only keeps his body in the afterlife due to the good deeds he did in life. Hell, Vegeta even asks Piccolo if he can meet Goku in the afterlife and Piccolo bluntly tells him that Goku only got his body as a special exception as opposed to being the rule
I know in Super, Freeza has a body while in hell, but it seems to be more of a special type of punishment exclusively for him. Freeza only has a body so that he can be tortured in his own personal hell, which is actually a neat idea since it's a good inversion of how Goku gets his body. Freeza is so evil that he is granted body so that he can be punished.
in reverse ... that could be explained with that Super scene
like Frieza Cell the Ginyus ecc just keep their body to get tortured
even tho that would make Yenma pretty sadistic
@@Mepphy99 Yeah its sadistic but mind you everyone in Frieza's conglomerate were responsible for the subjugation and genocide of entire WORLD'S of people, with the Ginyu Force operating Special Forces so its natural they'd have a massive kill count. They'd, frankly, deserve their punishment as sadistic as it is. Cell also devoured entire cities in his goal to become perfect so it tracks for him too.
One thing I would have liked in this filler is that they reintroduced Grandpa Gohan, I don't know why. I suppose because I would have liked to see Goku interacting with his adoptive grandfather, and apologizing to him for killing him by transforming into Ozaru.
Too heavy for what they’re going for
Or maybe just have Goku talk to him about how he's permanently dead and won't be going back to Earth and stuff.
@@Xeno574 they actually already did that when it was discussed whether they should resurrect him or Upa’s father Bora
@@pn2294 I meant Goku talking about himself
26:47 Quarter-Pounder Super Saiyan is what Goku used when he was conceiving Goten.
I thoughy it was Go for Ten?
This arc would've been so much fun if Cell and Freeza were also on Kaio's team (along with the other north galaxy guys) instead of just giving Goku vs Paikuhan the spotlight and glossing over everything else.
Then it really would be the Tournament of Power!
I always really liked this arc. It's just fun for fun's sake and another tournament, with no real stakes, and in a different setting entirely, and with nothing but new characters for the most part. It also never overstayed its welcome. Some of it makes no sense, but whatever, it was fun anyway.
I recently lengthily and exhaustively explained the hierarchy of super saiyan transformations to my friends as a joke, but it seems like I neglected to include Quarter-Pounder Super Saiyan in my explanation. Welp, I guess I'm gonna have to start over from the beginning again!
I like how they hyped Olibu up, just for him to get his ass whupped later by Yamucha.
Which makes no sense seeing King Kai would know that he's weaker than Yamcha and wouldn't hype him up if so. I think the fact that happened is more proof the staff didn't know what to do here at all.
Whatchu talkin' bout Willis. It's clear Olibu just let Yamcha win out of pity after hearing how his life went into a downward spiral since leaving the desert. Poor dolt.
I like how that technically means Anime Buu Arc Yamcha could beat up Cell, because Olibu was hyped as a peer of Paikuhan.
After rewatching this arc for the first time in almost 20 years in preparation for this video, this is still a pretty enjoyable mini-arc, and after watching it, my opinion of Pikkon still stands with the picture I posted on Twitter of Marge holding up the potato saying "I just think he's neat".
Millhouse: "Do you have my Paikuhan?"
Marge: "......No."
20:40 i like how the guy on the left is pretty much just cell.
Well, that explains that weird black haired SSJ in that episode.
i only ever remember this arc because of that beautifully animated studio cockpit episode. nothing else ever sticks but god that's some of my favorite z anime animation
aww noooooo you disagreed
Mistairefusion, I was a hardcore longtime fan but I don't think I can take your nitpicks anymore. Quarter pounder super Saiyan is a masterpiece no matter what you say!
Your line about transformations in games just reminds me of Xenoverse 2... Your custom character can be one of 5 races. Each also has a unique transformation. Freeza race goes gold, Namekians go giant, etc... Except SAIYANS, WHO GET 5, SOON 6 FORMS.
Technically with Kaio ken and Potential Unleashed they each get 3, but Saiyans STILL get like what, 9 if you count each super saipan form individually?
It's a shame they'll never make more transformations for the Frieza clan or Humans
@@havoc697 yeah. Like, the Frieza thing I at least kinda get since the forms look so different, so applying that to a custom character would be super hard but... Why do humans only have Nimbus? The worst "transformation" in the game? I'd have been happier had they taken the easy way out and given the the super holy water or something.
I was hoping you would remark on that not-quite Super Saiyan form. I thought it was just a silly animation error. I hadn’t made the connection that they would have half-assed covering it up to make Super Saiyan a surprise later.
The Church of the Algorithm gives this video its blessing, and must it stay clear of the blasphemers from The First Algorithmic Temple (and the many people impersonating their members).
CHUUUUUCH!!!
Wow, this arc ended exactly the day i was born.
I really do wish this arc was expanded.
This arc was easily the best filler arc (Not filler stand alone episodes that are in the Saiyan saga).
6:27- Perfect Cell: What do you have what I don't?
Pikkon: For one, I make the prominent lip look badass and not as a total doofus.
Cell proceeds to get enraged.
"I bet someone's going to tell me it was brought into the games and called quarter pounder Super Saiyan or something"
Me: "... 'Super Saiyan Power', actually..."
Meanwhile DBS managed to make a better tournament arc with the U7 vs U6 tournament.
The battles aren’t too long, most of the opponents have personalities and interesting gimmicks, some characters got character development, including the opponents (mainly Cabbe and Hit) as well as Beerus.
Vegeta became a mentor to Cabbe, and Hit changed from stoic badass to guy who gradually enjoys a good fight with Gokū, with both of them having room to improve themselves. Hit threw the fight against Monaka in the end because it’s not fun, even if Hit would have gotten the cube otherwise.
Of course, the tournament wasn’t that fantastic. Boo literally does nothing but sleep, Piccolo is only used to prove that Frost cheated, and then he’s told by Vegeta not to take the win, so that Vegeta can beat up Frost himself because Frost turned out to be Freeza, but a fraud version of that. They gave most of the wins to Vegeta who defeats more than half of the opposing team, whereas Gokū managed to lose twice. You know, why not let Piccolo defeat Botamo, then lose to Frost who is then immediately caught cheating by Jaco, and then letting Boo and Vegeta fight the rest, and then Gokū vs Hit where Gokū can still throw the match.
BTW, the 23rd Tenkaichi Budōkai is still the only tournament Gokū has won.
Fuck no. This tournament is 1000x better then the shit super arcs
U6 tournament had potential but it's execution wasn't that good and felt rushed. Not to mention it's ending (like in most Super arcs) was terrible and made no sense. That whole Monaka thing was stupid. Hit had no reason to let him win . Goku lost because he couldn't continue and would have lost anyway but Hit could easily beat Monaka. I feel they should include a bit more fighters, maybe Android 18 and a U6 Namekian.
you just praised something about dbs? get that ass banned!
I wish we could've seen a story about Olibu's adventures and feats. He also has #16 stereotype, which would be something cool to see in afterlife: for his sacrifice to Earth, #16 was granted a soul.
Frieza and Cell making a takeover in Hell could’ve filled out an arc by itself, but that probably would’ve been repetitive (just look at Fusion Reborn and the Super 17 Saga from GT).
"If the teachers are rivals, so too are the students. Their squabbling persists through the story arc, to the point where there's a shot of Paikuhan that seems to suggest the students are going to say the hell with this and mutiny against their petty overlords who want to make them fight."
....soooooo, the ending of the Universe 6 Tournament from Super?
Yeah but this came first
@@young_shaad5227 yeah but this didn't actually do it
This is a fun thing that's mostly specific to me, but I was largely introduced to Dragon Ball through video games and the Collectable Card Game created by Score at the beginning of the 2000s. I won't go deep into the game's mechanics, but each expansion in the game was based on an arc of the series, though much more divided up than DBD. The thing is, in the expansion that covers the Other World Tournament, almost every finalist fighter gets their own set of cards, which led me to believe they were all going to be important, prominent characters at that point in the series. Heck, Tappuka (or Tapkar, as the CCG went with) was the linchpin of several topping competitive decks. Needless to say, when finally watching the series proper, I was surprised how little these characters do, or how little impact they have on the story xD
sounds like my hero academia
Incredible! Goku went
O~~~~~~~~FALUSE SUPERA SAIYAJIN NI~~~~~~~~O
in this filler! This forme is Super Saiyan Grade 0.6!
I remember 2 decades ago at school where one of my friends had DB character cards and we had mistaken Grand Kaio for Dr. Gero being goofy for some reason.
What can be said, does afterlife counts as isekai?
Since isekai means “another world” and they do refer to the afterlife as “other world” I want to say technically yes?
21:21 Hey look, SSJ3 Goku's in the audience, and he shaved his head!
6:20- Personally, I prefer Grand Kai over both Supreme Kai/Old Kai any day due to having a much more lively personality that would've bounced off the cast in less awkward ways. In fact outside of Zamasu/Gowasu- only the dead Supreme Kai of Universe 7 have any real intrigue for me- they all seem like glorified aides to the more visually memorable and personable Gods of Destruction
Did you enjoy the Moro Arc of Super?
@@TheAzulmagia yes, it had its bumps that I definitely acknowledge, but I enjoyed it
All things considered, these episodes are better than all of Super and probably inspired it in a lot of ways.
7:19 "going back to Hell is a fun idea"
Y'know Lance, i dont know if it is. I dont know if it is
A DBD is exactly what I needed first thing in the morning
The reason is different, but Goku's not quite super saiyan transformation isn't entirely unique. Previously, during the the finale of the Garlic Junior arc, Gohan powered up with a golden aura as if he was right at the edge of actually transforming. Likewise, when Vegeta fought Frieza's final form on Namek, he also occasionally had a golden aura during his larger attacks.
Personally, I've always considered it to be just another variation on the same "transformation" we see Goku use in the Lord Slug movie. It references super saiyan without actually being the real deal.
On top of this, Toei added gold streaks to Goku's Kaioken aura while he was flexing in front of Ginyu. It was a neat hint that he was getting pretty close to the real deal.
Despite the problems with the story itself, this is another example of something that would've had much more of an impact if Goku wasn't set to make a grand return only a handful of episodes later
Hey on the bright side Paikuhan is gonna get some more characterization in his next few appearances, right?….Right..?
Also it never occurred to me how rushed this arc was. A lot of the stuff that was in here just felt like it was done without much of a script or other planning beforehand..Eesh. (Yes I know the entire series we made up as it went along)
He gets to look goofy in the Janemba movie, I guess. Haha.
He is awesome to play as in Raging Blast 2, and sadly a boring character. Wish they played more with him being Namekian given all the lore you could pull from
@@talesfromthenuzlocke1619 He's not a Namekian. As far as we know, he's just some alien who did something impressive enough on his planet to keep his body in the afterlife, like Goku.
This tournament is so.... meh, don't remember anything that happened, the only thing I can remember is how funny every old top 10 list put paikuhan at the strongest/best dbz characters, and started removing when the concept of filler got spread lol
I nearly forgot that this arc ever existed.
When I was little, my friends and I thought Goku used his Quasi-Super Saiyan from Movie 4.
Not sure if ur gonna see this but
Bro I really admire your dedication towards this and the main series (DBD)
Honestly kinda inspirational in its own way to see you consistently put notable effort into these discussions and dissections
Keep doing what you’re doing man
I’m definitely a fan of these videos
Goku was already back in the Manga, but I guess the anime staff was probably still thinking the Majin Boo adventure was still going to be a one day deal
Btw so nice to catch a video on release for the first time
I'm a bit surprised this series still ongoing, pretty impressive :P
You do a great job on them so I guess quality over quantity is at play
Ahhhhh been looking forward to this one.
I don't know if you're ever going to get the super, But man it's gonna be really weird how this innoculous filler arc really did inform dragon ball 20 plus years late.
Oh wow, was the DBD for Garlic Jr already 2 years ago?
It will have been this New Year's Eve!
This was literally my introduction to DBZ. I had just missed the Cell Saga when I started watching it on Toonami and straight up thought the whole series was about fighting tournaments.
A youtube video of this whole arc was my introduction to dragon ball.
I always wondered when this was supposed to take place, was this immediately after the Cell arc or is it prior to the Boo arc.
I think it takes place 2 years after cell arc.goku has been in otherworld a while in in this arc.
Some ideas to improve this story.
Add in Grandpa Gohan
Make Pikkuhan a Namekian and confirm in the animated continuity that Namek is in the western quadrant.
I grew up with this arc on VHS, used to love the Goku vs Paikuhan fight. Coming back, I love everything OUTSIDE of that. The world building with dead heroes from other galaxies, the other Kais, the Grand Kai, the silly joke fights with tickle caterpillars and fish men, I LOVE all that. More than I did when I was a kid. But what it ultimately all built up to was… a soulless version of Goku vs Piccolo. Paikuhan is Piccolo without the character, Vegeta without the gravitas, and Hit without the fun gimmick or mystery. I could care less about their fight. But it doesn’t ruin the whole for me, I love this little aside from the main story.
Paikuhan for some reason is very popular, because "He is cool". But he is just Z's Jiren.
What's weird is, there are a lot of people complaining that they should have brought back Paikuhan for the ToP in Super, but then in the same sentence complain about Jiren being boring. The irony.
Because this arc lasts only a few episodes, whereas the Universe Survival Arc lasts over 30, even even less is going on there.
@@succubastard1019 That's not the point. The point is demanding Paikuhan while saying Jiren is boring. They are the exact same character, Paikuhan would be pointless.
Can we appreciate someone named Midori voices two characters who the primary color associated with them is green?
Three
I enjoyed it for what it was. After this we had Gohan in high school...
I know what you mean by time loop whenever you watch this arc. It's the same for me in the Wedding Dress filler arc and the G8 Arc in One Piece. Even though I like the latter.
I have always found this arc to be very visually appealing, also, it surely didn't overstay its welcome.
When the final line is so beautifully savage you have to leave your very first comment (at least i don't remember making one before now..)
Love your DBZ breakdowns, here's to many more and more wonderful heartfelt savagery
I love you MRFusion. Thanks for your work in this community
I’ll be honest, I actually enjoy this more than the Tournament of Power, better character designs, better animation overall, it’s pretty breezy which is good for something that came straight after the drama and high stakes of the Cell Saga. It also actually feels more otherworldly compared to the stuff in Super.
Not my favourite filler obviously, the Learning to Drive arc still takes that crown but it’s otherwise pretty fun.
It's funny how I remember having a lot of these same thoughts about this arc back in the day. I definitely would have wanted to explore the world of the afterlife rather than this. Dare I say it might have been more interesting than buu...and most of gt
I wholeheartedly and unabashedly love this arc. Im a big King Kai fan and love his dynamic with Goku. Plus I love tournaments and this one is low stakes. Not to mention it ends with one of the most intense and Z style battles ever. Pikkon within five episodes becomes and immediate fan favorite. I will still but out my orange brick season seven disc one and watch it with the Faulconer track just for that good hit of nostalgia.
The art style with these episodes were legendary.
The Annoying Budokai
26:42 You are correct that this "form" has been repurposed in video games under the name "Super Saiyan Power!", because Dragon Ball video games are super weird about naming literally EVERYTHING from the series.
To cite the wiki: "Several cards featuring artwork of Goku using this power is featured in Dragon Ball Heroes. The card has the ability Super Saiyan Power! (超サイヤパワー！ Sūpā Saiya Pawā!), which makes it that, if Goku transforms into Super Saiyan on the second turn after a Kamehameha, his power is +2000, or +5000 if it is greatly successful, transforming him into Super Saiyan 2. Goku also appears with black Super Saiyan 2 hair on the cover of Dragon Ball Z: Extreme Butōden's demo version."
I swear I never get notifications for your videos and they only ever pop into my recommended days after they were posted.
That’s weird though I remember this arc and I really like the character Mijorin where you mentioned em as losers.
He had an interesting back story when he was alive. I remember he knew something about Goku that was different than when he first saw him.
Heck for all we know he probably didn’t even enter. Lol
Decent enough filler arc, obviously 100x better than Garlic Jr. arc. And it did lead to the creation of Pikkon and grand Kai, who both have really cool designs...
Another great video. As someone who did not watch the anime, these videos are a great watch.
The best thing about this arc is that it gets the public ready and invested for the Fusion Reborn movie.
Paikuhan might not be a very interesting character but damn it if the *I KNOW WHO THAT IS!!!* effect didn't work on me back in the day.
He and some of the other otherworld fighters also pop up when Buu's testing out instant transmission, so that's cool.
I wish this arc had a pair of competitors that use the fusion dance. They could go up against goku and it could be the lead in to him learning it for the Boo arc
Fusion hadn't yet been introduced in the manga, so they would've had no clue about what it would even be let alone make an accurate version of the dance
@@jeremiahbennett3004 I know that, I just think it'd have been neat in retrospect.
These were some of my favorite episodes when I was little.
At least Paikuhan's antics with the Hell barrier and Janemba is kinda fun.
And yeah, I'm definitely calling Goku's black-haired SS-esque form when fighting the Ginyu Force in Hell "Quarter Pounder Super Saiyan" from now on. Thanks, Lance lol
19:11 So he's Kermit with the Swedish Chef's voice and Jigglypuff's Final Smash.
26:46 Looked it up, it was repurposed as an ability called Super Saiyan Power in Dragon Ball Heroes. Because Pseudo Super Saiyan was taken by Movie 4's transformation, I suppose.
I got excited when You mentioned Shock Treatment
Whoa two people who have seen shock treatment! I still get the theme song stuck in my head sometimes.
@@Charonchan I can't get Lullaby off mine.
yaaaaas been waiting for the chips of this arc to get peeled like some nice old paint chipping
My favorite piece of random trivia for this arc is that there are several Dragon Quest characters in the crowd.
You should do a ranking of the filler arcs of dragon ball at the end of dbd!
17:21 MistareFusion throwing punches!
9:38 - YES!
I would love to hear you talk about Shock Treatment someway.
Ahh yes, the Black Haired Super Saiyan or "Super Saiyan Power" where Goku can utilize his Super Saiyan Power without transforming. I feel like this was the inspiration for "Saiyan Beyond God" from Resurrection of 'F' where Goku and Vegeta can utilize the power of Super Saiyan God without having to transform. While the milky white aura is unusual compared to most aura's, I had no idea this was considered a transformation until I saw it on the Dragon Ball Wiki. And sure enough it's because it's only explained in a pamphlet that came with the movie. Don't you love it when your franchises require manuals to explain things not mentioned in the source itself?
Most time I’ve seen it mentioned (which really isn’t that many), black haired Super Saiyan Goku from this arc is associated with his "Fake Super Saiyan" transformation from the Slug movie.
Ah yes, the Tournament of Power arch before the Tournament of Power.
No? Literally NOTHING is at stake in this arc, Tournament of Power has existence of universes on the line.
I remembered Paikuhan as a more interesting Jiren.
Turns out they were both uninteresting.
Well, either one is as interesting as you think he is. Don't take my word for it.
I will say that Paikuhan definitely benefits significantly from his scarcity. It's much easier to get tired of someone who bores you for as long as Jiren does.
@@MistareFusion I think what made Paikuhan interesting was partly the mysterious vibe he gave off. Jiren, to me, was initially interesting due to the mystery vibe he gave off as well. One of the reasons Jiren fell flat is the mystery of his power and back story are cliche. Since Paikuhan's origins have never been explored, his mysterious vibe keeps him very interesting (at least to me).