"The Brotherhood and the Enclave were estranged siblings, pieces of a broken nation that could never be put back together, fighting over an inheritance that had already been spent." That line really did hit the nail on the head. I *knew* they were like mirrors of each other, but I could never put my finger on the actual dynamic.
@@Quackerilla Oh, indeed. The Brotherhood has been fighting the Enclave before there was even a Brotherhood to *speak* of. Before the Great War, even. Because there's no doubt in *my* mind that the Enclave was behind the Mariposa experiments that caused Captain Maxson to mutiny.
A fellow Michigander here who came across your channel not too long ago. Found fantastic videos in your back catalog and I continue to work my way through them. Great work.
I know that Fallout: Tactics flopped to the point that many fans don't consider it canon, but I'd still like to see something based around the northern midwest that actually worked, maybe Dubuque area. That'd actually be a great place given that it's a major point right on the Mississippi River, making it a crucial trade and gathering hub (the city is practically the meeting point for people in three states, plus everyone traveling along the highways).
Please keep making more videos. I hope that in anticipation of 2024’s election year, you can make some on Turtledove’s Southern Victory series and the rise of the Freedom Party
I didn't read much of it after the Great War. Sometimes Turtledove's speculation is really interesting, but other times he relies too heavily on one-for-one equivalencies. After "Walk in Hell" it started to feel a little forced to me. But I suspect I won't make it through 2024 without at least one big American Civil War analog.
I'm planning to do a second part after Amazon's Fallout series finishes its first season. Whether good or bad, it seems sure to add some things worth discussing to the lore.
Agreed, I'm very much looking forward to your part 2. Thank you for making these videos, they usually contain things, or approach things in a way I don't really see anyone else doing.
This in many ways leads to the frustration I have with the Brotherhood both in New Vegas. The BoS are content to sit and die inside a bunker while surrounded by three hostile nations more than enough of in a position to destroy them. Any rational commander would recognize the situation is Fubar and would work to find a way out, but when one of his scribes, a prodigy of his old boss no less, goes out of her way to present them with several ways out, they just dig their heels in even harder. It's one thing to hold to tradition, it's another to just become stupid because of it even as your nation dies around you, and it makes any real replayability of that entire questline essentially moot as its only punchline is making the quest giver in question sad and delivering a rather hamfisted message about fundamentalism. While this works in a vacuum story, it sadly doesn't work well in the game itself given the BoS become little more than a one-off waste of game ram, with little to nothing to actually contribute to the story, narrative or gameplay outside of producing one likeable character.
@@seand.g423 there's also the "not taking advantage of the setting" reason. One of the elements that made _Fallout 3_ so engaging for me was the essentially alien moonscape of post-war Washington D.C., where people struggle to survive in the shadow of cratered monuments to the glories of a lost civilization. FNV, by contrast, takes place in the Mojave Desert, which is _already_ a blasted wasteland, no nukes necessary.
@feralhistorian I think a long form would allow you to expand on micro analysis of decisions and actions taken in the different media you analyze, as you are excellent at providing the 30,000ft view.
For my part, I'm riffing on the game being non-Canon in Bethesda's reckoning. On its own merits I don't recall it being more bizarre or incoherent than the other Interplay-era Fallout games.
Pretty awesome AI art. The thing about game factions is that they pass a cursory review but if you start doing an in-depth dive into the details the whole thing starts making less and less sense. The brotherhood's idea of "preserving technology" sounds noble and all but in practice it's just an excuse to wander around the wasteland bullying locals. Their xenophobic world view and unwillingness to recruit wastelanders will probably lead to a genetic bottleneck sooner than later. Lastly of course while they're content in keeping to themselves the world is moving on and by the time the brotherhood wakes up to this fact, it'll be too late.
Hehe Foundation of Civilization is built on Commerc. I like that. A lot of people fail to realize Society is built from the ground up, not the top down. The Government itself is not as important to society as a McDonald's Store, that McDonald's store effects people's lives more, they interact with it more. Society is Built on and by the Private Sector, the Public Sector just leeches off it. Ran into a Socialist yesterday who said calling Socialism State Ownership was wrong, it's Social Ownership and Stateless then described how the Government Controls the means of production. I literally had to present the Definition of "State" being "A politically organized community which Governs a piece of territory." Biggest problem people have is they don't know how society works, they think the Government is ultra important and don't even speak the same language. They use the same words but not the same definitions.
Initially, there was no such thing as a "Private Sector" and a "Public Sector". The idea of having large independent Corporations is a very new idea. In Medieval England, every market in the Kingdom operated under a royal charter. The same was true for ocean trade, where only a small number of designated ports were granted the charter to be a trade hub. The American colonies that became America were founded and operated under royal charters. Having independent mega-billionaires is an entirely new invention. Go back in time 250 years, and the only way to get rich, was to walk hand in hand with the Monarch. You must keep in mind that Libertarianism is a branch of Socialism. And you must keep in mind that there is no such thing as Economic Ideology. It does not exist. Socialism is not an economic ideology. It is a Social ideology. Economics is simply a tool they use to achieve their goal. Fun fact. Female suffrage is hardcore radical Socialism. Just because people have gotten so used to it does not make it any less radical. If you believe that women should have the vote, then you are marching and fighting shoulder to shoulder with the Socialist that you talked to yesterday. If you love Teddy Roosevelt and think he was a great President, then you are riding the same wave of Progressivism and cultural destruction that your friend surfs on. ----------------- On that last part, about words. I will recommend you go and read "The Death of Words", which was an article written by C.S. Lewis. (I think during WW2). Where he, you guessed it, talks about the death of words. Words such as "Gentleman", which once upon a time was a statement of fact, had degraded down to an opinion from the speaker about another person. Or to go more modern in current political discourse. Take the word "Racist". The Red Team would tell you that everyone can be a racist, as racism means any discrimination based on race. While the Blue Team will tell you that to be a racist is to be a white supremacist. So when a Blue person hears a Red person say that black people can be racist. What the Blue person hears is that black people can be white supremacists. Which, obviously, is pretty unlikely. And then the yelling starts. ---------------------- For reference, I am a Puritan and a Whig.
@@Hugebull Private Sector doesn't equal billion dollar Corporations. It's called "Going Public" for a reason. They may not be part of the Public State but are Public Entities still. Private means Individual or Family owned. Corporations are neither. Some try to define Corporations as Private but they're anything but. It's owned by Individuals Plural ie Group/Community/Collective. In the case of an American Corporation, Share Holders. Which can number from the hundreds to millions of Share Holders. Not exactly "Private." 😕 The Private Sector has been the corner stone of society in the industrial age. They rose from the Town Folk, or Freeman of the Middle Ages, became the Smiths, Artisans, Bakers. Men/women who were not serfs on a Lords farm. What became Merchant Class or later called Middle Class. In fact much of the early Socialist doctrine was developed in opposition to this new class. Championed by Aristocrats and Nobles who saw the Serfs fleeing the country side in the 18th century to the cities. Robbing their Fiefs of Servants. This is why the term bourgeoisie used by Marxist decades later came from the French word for Middle Class despite Marxist use it more broadly. They recycled the term from Earlier Socialist. It's honestly why Commiservative is a fun term to threw around. As Socialism was originally a Conservative movement until Serfdoms stopped being the Status Quo. In many respects still is as it will lead to enslaved masses and a ruling class governing society.. on the People's Behalf they promise. Brings mankind back to Serfdoms with new names for Fiefs like Unions, Fasci, Soviets, Councils, Syndicates, Corporations etc.
The key thing to remember about corporations is that they are creatures of government. Corporations aren't independent, their legal status as corporations is granted by the State. They are the direct descendent of the old Royal Charters and we can see their evolution historically with organizations like the Hudson Bay Company or the British East India Company. Which means the old bugaboo of needing the government to regulate rapacious corporations is pure tail-chasing.
@@feralhistorian Also run into things like the Hudson River Steambot Association, a large Cartel of Riverboat owners who monopolized riverboat trade. It was a Collectivized Union which profits were shared evenly among it's members. As nice as it may sound on paper, it was a nightmare for citizens of the Hudson River. Prices were steep, routes limited, number of boats trips per day were restricted.. Vanderbilt came in, bought a few boats, charged light fares, eventually free. Shook up the whole thing.. despite political pressure because the States were on the side of the Cartel, basically ended the Monopoly. It's a example in history on how Evil Capitalism is..(how it's told) but in actuality the Capitalist was Superman and made life for the common folk of the Hudson River more tolerable.. sadly that isn't how history by in large remembers it. 😕
@@Alte.Kameraden If you consider the private sector to only make up small independent Middle Class businesses, then my comment is entirely moot. But when the word is generally used, it mostly covers Corporations. I have never heard of a story where a Congressman left politics for the private sector, and for that private sector to mean a small mom-and-pop store. And for that last part. Even in the USSR, it was the Academics who riled up the proletariat to go after the kulaks.
11:38 gonna have to stop you there, the root of civilization is neither politics nor commerce, but production, more specifically *surplus production* over and above what is required to sustain the lives of the population. Commerce might move the surplus around, and politics might control how and where it is moved around, but both are secondary to the production itself and the energy (human, animal, natural, and fuel--what Marx got wrong was focusing only on human energy to the exclusion of all other sources, especially foolish in an industrial economy where fuel energy provides the overwhelming majority) used to turn raw nature into product. A crude sort of civilization can exist with no money and no formal power structure, but no civilization whatsoever can exist without the constant accumulation of surplus. The real stupidity of Fallout economics is--who makes everything? Who grows the food? Where do the Brahmin come from and who feeds them and cleans up their shit? Who turns the postapocalyptic garbage strewn about into useful objects for the living? Why are people still living in squalor after 200 years? Where are all the horses and the people supporting working horses? Why are people living in a dead city anyway when rural back country would be far more livable and productive (and far, far less irradiated)? DC is utterly worthless except as a source of raw materials for artisans and craftspeople, there is no reason for places like Megaton, Rivet City, etc. to exist.
It's kinda splitting hairs though. Commerce requires some surplus production, otherwise it's just scrambling for subsistence like raccoons. And surplus production without commerce is just a pile of stuff. Granted though, the world of Fallout doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
Not so fast, bucko. Commerce is how you get surplus; very few people have the skills/resources/tools to produce everything they need _and_ a surplus; you need a market (commerce) and specialization to consistently get that. I think it was Shamus Young who first pointed out to me how little sense the Bethesda _Fallout_ games make, setting wise. The Interplay games are different, because they're set so much closer to the war, but even _Fallout 2_ is stretching things with how hard it leans on salvaging the old world. The Bethesda games are just plain absurd.
The whole still living in squalor 200 years after the bombs dropped I believe was a problem introduced by Bethesda in Fallout 3. In Fallout 2 & New Vegas it’s more of a frontier setting than an apocalyptic wasteland. As for horses, I believe they’re extinct as far as I know.
@docholiday7975 No. People didn't live alone in the wilderness; they lived in tribes, and tribe members could specialize. They could figure out that John's tanning was better and he got more usable hide, Ivan caught more fish, and Jean was better at tracking deer. Would Jean more-or-less know how to tan hides and fish? Sure. Would it make sense? Not while there was tracking to be done.
Either the proto-Brotherhood hung out in that base for a long time, or crazy aggressive bandit gangs formed incredibly fast if they were aggressive enough to attack soldiers, even if they had dependents along.
In my head-canon I like to think it was a fight with another group of cut-off American soldiers trying to take the same bunker and Maxson whitewashed it for the kids and the next generation. Of course I have no basis in published for that.
I can believe that people, without the comforts and restraints of modern society, could quickly revert to raiders if forced by the circumstances. Especially since most people don't know how to live without the comforts of society, and would turn to banditry as soon as the easily available food either spoiled or was consumed.
"The Brotherhood and the Enclave were estranged siblings, pieces of a broken nation that could never be put back together, fighting over an inheritance that had already been spent."
That line really did hit the nail on the head. I *knew* they were like mirrors of each other, but I could never put my finger on the actual dynamic.
"Old enemies, older ties."
@@Quackerilla Oh, indeed. The Brotherhood has been fighting the Enclave before there was even a Brotherhood to *speak* of. Before the Great War, even. Because there's no doubt in *my* mind that the Enclave was behind the Mariposa experiments that caused Captain Maxson to mutiny.
A fellow Michigander here who came across your channel not too long ago. Found fantastic videos in your back catalog and I continue to work my way through them. Great work.
Thinking like Lieutenants instead of Generals huh? Excellent analogy.
Great breakdown of lore presented as though it were real, I loved the "Scribe's" attitude coming through in the end!
I know that Fallout: Tactics flopped to the point that many fans don't consider it canon, but I'd still like to see something based around the northern midwest that actually worked, maybe Dubuque area. That'd actually be a great place given that it's a major point right on the Mississippi River, making it a crucial trade and gathering hub (the city is practically the meeting point for people in three states, plus everyone traveling along the highways).
I like the choices of color in the video, very cool
I love your more philosophical videos but I also love the faction break downs! Plus good use of footage!
This makes me think that S. M. Stirling's "Dies the Fire" might be a good topic, as he really dives into the "founder effect".
I've been working on a Dies the Fire one for a long time now, never quite tying it all together. But one of these days . . .
@@feralhistorian will look forward to that
I love your channel, its like being in a super fun social studies class which always was my favorite subject
He is very good at using pop culture as a vehicle for his thoughts/lectures.
Criminally underrated channel.
I feel like if the pizza were really that good, then they'd be more willing to talk about what went down in Chicago.
I expect another BoS video down the line with some thoughts on the Chicago chapter, Fallout 4, and whatever Amazon does to the lore with their series.
@feralhistorian aww Hel.
I'd take another _Bethesda_ Fallout game before whatever tf _Amazon_ would do to that mess...
We needed this.
Thank you.
Eexactly what ive been looking for 💯 AD VICTORIAM 🔥🔥🔥
*They have no vision, they have no future, they are a dead end.*
- Mr House
Caesar actually said that
Season greetings & Happy New Year.
Please keep making more videos. I hope that in anticipation of 2024’s election year, you can make some on Turtledove’s Southern Victory series and the rise of the Freedom Party
I didn't read much of it after the Great War. Sometimes Turtledove's speculation is really interesting, but other times he relies too heavily on one-for-one equivalencies. After "Walk in Hell" it started to feel a little forced to me.
But I suspect I won't make it through 2024 without at least one big American Civil War analog.
@@feralhistorian (shrug) they're pleasant easy reading when i need to relax after a Draka book…only so much impalement one can take
@thedragondemands5186 "...before it starts to feel too much like the familiar daily shafting from on high" yeah, I get it...
I've been looking forward to this.
Extremely good summation of the brotherhood, though I feel it ended quite abruptly. Are you planning a part 2?
I'm planning to do a second part after Amazon's Fallout series finishes its first season. Whether good or bad, it seems sure to add some things worth discussing to the lore.
Agreed, I'm very much looking forward to your part 2. Thank you for making these videos, they usually contain things, or approach things in a way I don't really see anyone else doing.
Beautiful late autumn scenery. I can almost catch the scent of fallen leaves and cool damp earth.
Not too many fallen leaves up on the mountain, but quite a few turkey feathers that day.
Keep up the great lore videos! Great job!
How long did it take for you to notice the vertibird?
This in many ways leads to the frustration I have with the Brotherhood both in New Vegas. The BoS are content to sit and die inside a bunker while surrounded by three hostile nations more than enough of in a position to destroy them. Any rational commander would recognize the situation is Fubar and would work to find a way out, but when one of his scribes, a prodigy of his old boss no less, goes out of her way to present them with several ways out, they just dig their heels in even harder. It's one thing to hold to tradition, it's another to just become stupid because of it even as your nation dies around you, and it makes any real replayability of that entire questline essentially moot as its only punchline is making the quest giver in question sad and delivering a rather hamfisted message about fundamentalism.
While this works in a vacuum story, it sadly doesn't work well in the game itself given the BoS become little more than a one-off waste of game ram, with little to nothing to actually contribute to the story, narrative or gameplay outside of producing one likeable character.
And that's why I hate New Vegas (well, one of the reasons).
@@CanadianPale the non-bug reason...
@@seand.g423 there's also the "not taking advantage of the setting" reason. One of the elements that made _Fallout 3_ so engaging for me was the essentially alien moonscape of post-war Washington D.C., where people struggle to survive in the shadow of cratered monuments to the glories of a lost civilization. FNV, by contrast, takes place in the Mojave Desert, which is _already_ a blasted wasteland, no nukes necessary.
Have you thought about doing, or do you have a long form podcast?
I have thought about it, but so far not done anything of that sort. Eventually I want to do some kind of panel discussion.
@feralhistorian I think a long form would allow you to expand on micro analysis of decisions and actions taken in the different media you analyze, as you are excellent at providing the 30,000ft view.
unrelated but I like your voice, you sound like Clint Eastwood if he was a phyilosophical bookworm
Hope you got some good loot out of that downed Vertibird.
Ad Victoriam, brother.
Nice
8:35 “we don’t talk about Chicago” --honestly, why is there so much hating on Fallout Tactics?
For my part, I'm riffing on the game being non-Canon in Bethesda's reckoning. On its own merits I don't recall it being more bizarre or incoherent than the other Interplay-era Fallout games.
@@feralhistorian oh i know smiled at the joke
Because it isn't.
Pretty awesome AI art.
The thing about game factions is that they pass a cursory review but if you start doing an in-depth dive into the details the whole thing starts making less and less sense.
The brotherhood's idea of "preserving technology" sounds noble and all but in practice it's just an excuse to wander around the wasteland bullying locals.
Their xenophobic world view and unwillingness to recruit wastelanders will probably lead to a genetic bottleneck sooner than later.
Lastly of course while they're content in keeping to themselves the world is moving on and by the time the brotherhood wakes up to this fact, it'll be too late.
Either the algorithm exists, or it does not.
Hehe Foundation of Civilization is built on Commerc. I like that. A lot of people fail to realize Society is built from the ground up, not the top down. The Government itself is not as important to society as a McDonald's Store, that McDonald's store effects people's lives more, they interact with it more. Society is Built on and by the Private Sector, the Public Sector just leeches off it.
Ran into a Socialist yesterday who said calling Socialism State Ownership was wrong, it's Social Ownership and Stateless then described how the Government Controls the means of production. I literally had to present the Definition of "State" being "A politically organized community which Governs a piece of territory."
Biggest problem people have is they don't know how society works, they think the Government is ultra important and don't even speak the same language. They use the same words but not the same definitions.
Initially, there was no such thing as a "Private Sector" and a "Public Sector". The idea of having large independent Corporations is a very new idea.
In Medieval England, every market in the Kingdom operated under a royal charter.
The same was true for ocean trade, where only a small number of designated ports were granted the charter to be a trade hub.
The American colonies that became America were founded and operated under royal charters.
Having independent mega-billionaires is an entirely new invention.
Go back in time 250 years, and the only way to get rich, was to walk hand in hand with the Monarch.
You must keep in mind that Libertarianism is a branch of Socialism.
And you must keep in mind that there is no such thing as Economic Ideology. It does not exist.
Socialism is not an economic ideology. It is a Social ideology.
Economics is simply a tool they use to achieve their goal.
Fun fact. Female suffrage is hardcore radical Socialism. Just because people have gotten so used to it does not make it any less radical.
If you believe that women should have the vote, then you are marching and fighting shoulder to shoulder with the Socialist that you talked to yesterday.
If you love Teddy Roosevelt and think he was a great President, then you are riding the same wave of Progressivism and cultural destruction that your friend surfs on.
-----------------
On that last part, about words.
I will recommend you go and read "The Death of Words", which was an article written by C.S. Lewis. (I think during WW2).
Where he, you guessed it, talks about the death of words.
Words such as "Gentleman", which once upon a time was a statement of fact, had degraded down to an opinion from the speaker about another person.
Or to go more modern in current political discourse.
Take the word "Racist".
The Red Team would tell you that everyone can be a racist, as racism means any discrimination based on race.
While the Blue Team will tell you that to be a racist is to be a white supremacist.
So when a Blue person hears a Red person say that black people can be racist. What the Blue person hears is that black people can be white supremacists.
Which, obviously, is pretty unlikely.
And then the yelling starts.
----------------------
For reference, I am a Puritan and a Whig.
@@Hugebull Private Sector doesn't equal billion dollar Corporations. It's called "Going Public" for a reason. They may not be part of the Public State but are Public Entities still.
Private means Individual or Family owned. Corporations are neither. Some try to define Corporations as Private but they're anything but. It's owned by Individuals Plural ie Group/Community/Collective. In the case of an American Corporation, Share Holders. Which can number from the hundreds to millions of Share Holders. Not exactly "Private." 😕
The Private Sector has been the corner stone of society in the industrial age. They rose from the Town Folk, or Freeman of the Middle Ages, became the Smiths, Artisans, Bakers. Men/women who were not serfs on a Lords farm.
What became Merchant Class or later called Middle Class. In fact much of the early Socialist doctrine was developed in opposition to this new class. Championed by Aristocrats and Nobles who saw the Serfs fleeing the country side in the 18th century to the cities. Robbing their Fiefs of Servants. This is why the term bourgeoisie used by Marxist decades later came from the French word for Middle Class despite Marxist use it more broadly. They recycled the term from Earlier Socialist.
It's honestly why Commiservative is a fun term to threw around. As Socialism was originally a Conservative movement until Serfdoms stopped being the Status Quo. In many respects still is as it will lead to enslaved masses and a ruling class governing society.. on the People's Behalf they promise. Brings mankind back to Serfdoms with new names for Fiefs like Unions, Fasci, Soviets, Councils, Syndicates, Corporations etc.
The key thing to remember about corporations is that they are creatures of government. Corporations aren't independent, their legal status as corporations is granted by the State. They are the direct descendent of the old Royal Charters and we can see their evolution historically with organizations like the Hudson Bay Company or the British East India Company.
Which means the old bugaboo of needing the government to regulate rapacious corporations is pure tail-chasing.
@@feralhistorian Also run into things like the Hudson River Steambot Association, a large Cartel of Riverboat owners who monopolized riverboat trade. It was a Collectivized Union which profits were shared evenly among it's members. As nice as it may sound on paper, it was a nightmare for citizens of the Hudson River. Prices were steep, routes limited, number of boats trips per day were restricted..
Vanderbilt came in, bought a few boats, charged light fares, eventually free. Shook up the whole thing.. despite political pressure because the States were on the side of the Cartel, basically ended the Monopoly.
It's a example in history on how Evil Capitalism is..(how it's told) but in actuality the Capitalist was Superman and made life for the common folk of the Hudson River more tolerable.. sadly that isn't how history by in large remembers it. 😕
@@Alte.Kameraden If you consider the private sector to only make up small independent Middle Class businesses, then my comment is entirely moot.
But when the word is generally used, it mostly covers Corporations.
I have never heard of a story where a Congressman left politics for the private sector, and for that private sector to mean a small mom-and-pop store.
And for that last part.
Even in the USSR, it was the Academics who riled up the proletariat to go after the kulaks.
The better group out there minutemen they can improve life wasteland
The Minutemen are an interesting case. Sooner or later there will be a video on them too.
11:38 gonna have to stop you there, the root of civilization is neither politics nor commerce, but production, more specifically *surplus production* over and above what is required to sustain the lives of the population. Commerce might move the surplus around, and politics might control how and where it is moved around, but both are secondary to the production itself and the energy (human, animal, natural, and fuel--what Marx got wrong was focusing only on human energy to the exclusion of all other sources, especially foolish in an industrial economy where fuel energy provides the overwhelming majority) used to turn raw nature into product. A crude sort of civilization can exist with no money and no formal power structure, but no civilization whatsoever can exist without the constant accumulation of surplus.
The real stupidity of Fallout economics is--who makes everything? Who grows the food? Where do the Brahmin come from and who feeds them and cleans up their shit? Who turns the postapocalyptic garbage strewn about into useful objects for the living? Why are people still living in squalor after 200 years? Where are all the horses and the people supporting working horses? Why are people living in a dead city anyway when rural back country would be far more livable and productive (and far, far less irradiated)? DC is utterly worthless except as a source of raw materials for artisans and craftspeople, there is no reason for places like Megaton, Rivet City, etc. to exist.
It's kinda splitting hairs though. Commerce requires some surplus production, otherwise it's just scrambling for subsistence like raccoons. And surplus production without commerce is just a pile of stuff.
Granted though, the world of Fallout doesn't make a whole lot of sense.
Not so fast, bucko. Commerce is how you get surplus; very few people have the skills/resources/tools to produce everything they need _and_ a surplus; you need a market (commerce) and specialization to consistently get that.
I think it was Shamus Young who first pointed out to me how little sense the Bethesda _Fallout_ games make, setting wise. The Interplay games are different, because they're set so much closer to the war, but even _Fallout 2_ is stretching things with how hard it leans on salvaging the old world. The Bethesda games are just plain absurd.
The whole still living in squalor 200 years after the bombs dropped I believe was a problem introduced by Bethesda in Fallout 3. In Fallout 2 & New Vegas it’s more of a frontier setting than an apocalyptic wasteland. As for horses, I believe they’re extinct as far as I know.
@@boobah5643 And yet that pretty much describes the neolithic and before.
@docholiday7975 No. People didn't live alone in the wilderness; they lived in tribes, and tribe members could specialize. They could figure out that John's tanning was better and he got more usable hide, Ivan caught more fish, and Jean was better at tracking deer. Would Jean more-or-less know how to tan hides and fish? Sure. Would it make sense? Not while there was tracking to be done.
Hey I see that you are into fallout, how would you like if you are a part of the brotherhood of steel, and make it real life thing
Either the proto-Brotherhood hung out in that base for a long time, or crazy aggressive bandit gangs formed incredibly fast if they were aggressive enough to attack soldiers, even if they had dependents along.
In my head-canon I like to think it was a fight with another group of cut-off American soldiers trying to take the same bunker and Maxson whitewashed it for the kids and the next generation. Of course I have no basis in published for that.
I can believe that people, without the comforts and restraints of modern society, could quickly revert to raiders if forced by the circumstances.
Especially since most people don't know how to live without the comforts of society, and would turn to banditry as soon as the easily available food either spoiled or was consumed.