A Discussion On Chrome Lining, Melonite, And Other Barrel Treatments.
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- Опубліковано 12 гру 2017
- What barrel treatment is better then another? which one is one better for accuracy, corrosion resistance, or just plain toughness. Nathan Schueth formerly of Faxon Arms shares some insights on the topic to help you make more educated purchasing decisions.
I'm not even going to listen to the expert in the video, I just came for the expert advice in the comments.
ha ha. I love this comment.
Right!!🤣 Gotta keep it light and fun with the growing “serious” crowd... ✌🏻
It’s so nice to hear this discussion from someone who knows what they’re talking about. The same myths that you see about Chrome being so much better are also floated out there about the cold hammer forged barrels. People are paying hundreds of dollars extra for CHF and it isn’t typically any better than button rifling. It’s amazing the money that the manufacturers and aftermarket folks can make off of widespread ignorance
That’s the best seven minute video I have watched in a long time. Thank you
The first question he asked is what brought me here. Great video, very informative.
Awesome. Thanks for stopping by.
Wow! Very good explanation. I appreciate the simple terms.
Awesome video! Thanks for the dumned down but useful knowledge.
Dumbed* lol
Great video!
good video. thanks for the comparison video.
Thanks for the feedback
Great info. Just saved me some money
Outstanding vid
Thanks man. Still dialing things in.
Great video
Thanks Kevin!!
I didn't realize that nitriding was applicable to stainless steel barrels ... good to know. I still question the ding against chrome linings for accuracy due to the variability of the chrome plating process ... once it's applied, the bore is defined, and you set your sights to wherever the bullets impact. Nothing changes after the barrel leaves the factory. The chrome doesn't shift. Am I missing something?
It’s not as smooth.
Problem I have with Faxon is the gas port diameters of their barrels. .081 is getting into the Jenna Jameson zone. I been running CHF FN's from Rifle Gear that are .076 and they are pretty good. Not near as gassy. And I've even run crap ammo through it. In conjunction with running an A5H2 buffer.
Jenna Jameson one lmfao
Which belt fed LMG barrels are nitride??
So why does Faxon chrome plate their FN15 5.56 Patrol carbine when it's semiautomatic only and not fully automatic ?
The price difference is way more than 5 to 30 dollars. Heck one has to really search to find chrome lined barrels . Yes BCM and DD and Faxon Make them but for every chrome lined barrel there are 30 Melonite . And 9 of 10 times or more than not. When one finds a Chrome Lined Barrel it comes CHF .
Since im not rambo or an 0331..nitride it is!
James H May I ask what you meant by a 0331?
mdredheadguy1979
Machine gunner , it’s an MOS in the Marines
I know this is an old video. With that being said, I'm not a metallurgist. I'm not a barrel expert or a gun smith either. What I am is a shooter who has a Criterion chrome line barrel on my rifle. Its hand lapped, and a great price. It shoots any factory 75 or 77 grain load .750 ten shot groups.
If I put hornadys 73 grain eld bullet over 23.6 grains of 8208 I get .600 ten shot groups. According to the criterion rep I talked to, I can expect a Sub moa service life of at least 20,000 rounds so long as I stay away from mag dumps and that sort of thing.
I have never shot a mellonited barrel so I cannot comment on them.
Yeah man. A good barrel is a good barrel. Criterion makes some good stuff.
companies like cz produce chrome lined barrels feratically nitrocarburized with a rockwell of 68, sub moa barrel with a service life sub moa at 4000 rounds. typical non treated barreld service life will be around 2000 rounds or less. my assumption is, they use quench polish quench to achieve that kind of rockwell
I have a few Criterion barrels. They are awesome.
What about a stanless steel cold forged nitrated treated chrome lined barrel.
Yeah, I'll have a half double decaffeinated half caff...
Okay. Here goes... Can a barrel be deep nitrided and then thick chome lined and electropolished, with the blanck being 5R rifling of course? Yes i am actually interested in this answer.
I'm interested as well. Nathan moved over to HK and has been tough to get ahold of lately. Anyone else have info?
Shooter Opinions So he has embraced the HK culture of not giving a flip about the customer.
Are we paying his salary ? Then yeah he went for the people who will pay for his expertise and work experience.
Remember you DONT have to buy HK...
As much as I love a QUALITY barrel with at PROPER chrome lining, If I were a barrel company I would do nitride simply because its easier to do CORRECTLY.
You can have a half moa chrome lined barrel if you do it right BUT IT AIN'T EASY and very few house put in that level of effort.
some companies do both process .on one barrel
@@godwetrust1436 which ones? And which are reputable?
What is the average round count barrel life of a 7.62x39 AR-15 barrel when shooting bimetal jacketed ammunition like Tula and Wolf? Does 7.62x39 as a cartridge put more or less wear on a barrel than .223/5.56 with the same type of ammunition, same rates of fire, etc.? Or is there any real discernible difference there?
I'll see if I can get an answer for you.
Google 10000 rd ammo test. runs thru bi metal boolits...much harder on barrels and copper jacketed. I've stopped shooting bi metal...unless shtf...then whatever goes.
7.62x39 barrel will last longer if the two barrels are the same. That's cause 7.62x39 is a lower pressure and lower velocity cartridge then 223 556. It's also a bigger bore with a modest charge.
I trust my heavy contour stainless barrel
Does melonite chambers aid in reliability like chrome does?
Yes. Have a Glock 17 that is now 25 yrs old ( and a GLOCK 22 that’s 21) neither have lost accuracy or show signs of rust ...
Nitriding sounds like a kind of case hardening...which is common in knives...and...samurai katanas.
Not an electroplating...
He was explaining chrome barrels when he said that. He clarified that.
I am new to ar's, and am going to build a budget ar that i can shoot paper but would also like to go to mu uncles farm and maybe shoot some coyotes. Which way would be best to shoot paper mainly and a coyote on the weekend here and there on a budget?
Your best bang for the buck will probably be Palmetto State Armory. I've built several from this kit.
bit.ly/2zDVUGz
Palmetto State Armory
Bear Creek Arsenal
OutdoorsportsUSA
There is a search site that I use and searches all dealers and online stores and finds the best deals.. It's my go to site, called: gun. deals
@@ShooterOpinions That was my first AR-15. Love it.
So is a non chrome lined phosphate barrel no good?
Doesn't mean they are no good it just means the bore isn't as resistant to corrosion.
has Glock barrel carrying nitride or chrome finish ?
Nitride/Melonite
UA-cam needs more experts from the industry and less experts from the comment section.
What's better, chrome or nitride?
Answer: 5R rifling.
My first Ar is an S&W M&P15. Before 2013 they were 1/8 5R rifling.
If you shoot a lot, especially at combat load volumes (300+ rounds per outing) performing tactical training, firing rapidly @ steel targets, or shooting low to mid grade ammunition) go with nitride/melonite.
If you’re looking to group on paper and taking your time or cycling a lot of high quality cartridges, chrome will do just fine. But don’t be afraid to let it rip when you want or need to...
5R rifling is excellent; very accurate and helps a bullet retain its integrity better than conventional lands and grooves.
Note: I’ve been seeing lots of posts with people raving about their high shooting volumes without malfunctions as long as their guns are kept wet... We’re generally taught that our semi’s love oil above all else (certainly vital) but don’t neglect proper cleaning of your bore, chamber, and BCG. A properly cleaned AND oiled system will operate even better/last longer. And don’t believe all the posts and videos saying to dump oil in your trigger group, it’ll only grab more grit and grime, resulting in a gritty trigger (unless you find yourself shooting high volumes in the desert...). Keep it clean and dry. As always, safety depends on you. ✌🏻
@@curtisdeanmusic You don't even have to tell me that it shot very extremely accurately, because I already know. lol
@@tinman6514 Wait, do you have chrome and nitride mixed up here? I thought the guy said chrome lined can take more rounds and more heat and the nitride is slightly more accurate but a little less durable?
Question. What's with the big laugh after you ask him about the new products?
If the accuracy difference is 2% between chrome lined and non chromed lined barrels, why don't we see more bolt action rifles chrome lined then ?
Being within 2% of each other isn't comparing them to a match grade barrel. I'm willing to bet that a true match grade barrel is better off left "untreated"
He just explained that the main advantage of chrome is putting a lot of rounds down range in short amounts time....its a bolt action bro.
^^^what he said....chrome line gives an advantage for rapid fire (very hot barrel) for the average shooter that's not an issue, esp. On a bolt gun
Also don't forget, there is no reason to spend extra money on the chrome lining process on a rifle that can not shoot rapidly or also the fact that no one is going to shoot corrosive surplus ammo out of a bolt gun.
Cryogenically freeze the barrel and call it a day!
Manganese phosphate? Zinc phosphate? Aren't you talking about parkerizing, aka bonderizing? Old and widely known treatments.
Also on terminology: is Melonite™ a proprietary form of nitriding? Does the DLC treatment have any relation to these last two?
I'm not an expert like Nathan but I believe you can Parkerize with both Manganese Phosphate and Zink Phosphate but the end results have slightly different properties and Melonite / Nitriding are different terms for the same process.
melonite and tenifer(glock) uses a process called quench polish quench. melonite is a tradmark name for it.
this process increases the rockwell to around 62 to 70. diamond has a rockwell of 72
You know guys you can get both on a barrel.
@@agreene8696 also make sure it has 5R rifling.. (much better accuracy)
@@agreene8696 check out DSA barrels
Melonite? Did they even mention it?
Exactly why I was watching in the first place. I don't think they did! Doh!
Melonite is a trade name- it’s basically the “ same” process as nitride
Chrome Lining is far better nuff said
Depends on what your applications are; clearly stated by the expert in the video. All the UA-cam “experts” and their all or nothing propositions. Having the inability to have an honest dialogue regarding firearms only hurts our sport, and confuses new-comers. As always, safety depends on you. ✌🏻
Far better than plain 4150.. yes.. Far better than stainless.. yes--- But "far" better than nitride? That's just not true. Plenty of people have done tests with many 10's of thousands of rounds with both to compare, and they prove to be very similar.
So, chrome is better.....
Electrilized
Get a stainless barrel, and call it a day.
If it like a point percentage away from one another then what's the fucking difference,...duhhh.
I heard nothing of melonite. disappointed
Pretty sure melonite, nitrided and qpq are all interchangeable, plus there is a pluthera of ways to do them
The lack of accuracy scare? Lol!
Anything but chrome is a scam.
Go chrome or go home.
sworn merican Says the guy that doesn’t understand CMV science
If it’s not full auto ( and even cops or military guys in combat don’t routinely go “ full”) nitride is good for the avg citizen; but there’s nothing WRONG with having both- my LMT , Colt and BCM are chrome lined CMV, my PSA “ extra family loaners” are all nitride ...
Never trust a mechanic with perfect shiny tools. Get deadly precise with that ugly stick you have. Like Pawpaw’s old rusty 1100 that has taken thousands of doves and ducks. He ain’t worried about no fuckin coating.
Unless you're an Olympic marksman you won't notice the difference in accuracy. If you fire 5,000 rounds through your barrel it's rifling will be gone my then.
All these videos are useless -- they all say "oh no different in accuracy. Oh, no difference in longevity. Oh, no difference really"
Great video!