Edit: hey everyone, if you're watching this video as of November 16th 2022, you may notice there are a few parts missing from this video. This video was flagged for self-harm, so I cut a few parts and submitted the video to UA-cam support for a second look. And it has since been reinstated. I will eventually revert the video back to its original state so that those parts will be put back in. But I will do so only once the heat has died down. I want to say first of all, I know there are other similar videos on this topic, but I made sure specifically not to watch any of them so that I know everything I'm saying is my own words. If I repeat anything from those videos, I assure you, it's a pure coincidence.
I think more then anything else in the new games and in the books that go over his transition into the new world he’s in it showing with the new things in his life he’s learned to temper his anger and his trauma and is still going over in the new games
Best one I've seen, I'll share this everytime I see some jagaloons that say similar things. Also the DC comic explain the gods azzholian ways along with the first 2 books.
id like to point out that in 19:35 he went to a completely different universe which is the main reason why everything isn't destroyed, its not retconned, he still destroyed an entire world and had to live with that knowledge, getting ptsd like trauma from in before the events of god of war 4, but seeing that this is an old video its ok
The gentleness in kratos Voice when he is with his daughter truly shows how much he loves her now I see why it was so hard for him to grow close to his son
That was one part of it but I think he also doesn't quite know how to raise a child either. Even with his daughter, Kratos was a Spartan general on campaigns, while his wife had control of the household. When u get to GoW4 he doesn't quite know how to raise a child alone so he's forced to fall back on the only thing he knows about raising another person from his experience. He starts to give Atreus spartan training and discipline. At least that's my head cannon of why Atreus only starts to train with his dad after his mom dies. It could just be that Atreus was always so sickly and frail that Kratos struggled to get close to him, lest Kratos either hurts him or loses him but I'm still a bit lost on when Atreus was sick outside of when he was little.
@@1ProAssassin It was purely a plot device. Apparently not knowing your nature can straight up nerf and harm you in the GoW universe. Kratos damn sure didn't know his true nature and he did very well as a general until he almost got clapped by a a basic looking Barbarian guy so maybe there's some merit to the concept XD
@@w47765 I wouldn't say it was purely a plot device, since Kratos has reasons to choose to be distant from his son. First and foremost, he seems to know that his son's sickness is due to his own nature, since it ultimately is the rage within Atreus that makes him ill. Seeing that Kratos spent his life letting his own rage control him, to the point of murdering his wife and daughter, he probably felt that staying away and letting Faye deal with Atreus would be best. Also, in the games there is the recurring theme of children killing their fathers (Zeus killed Cronos, Kratos kills Zeus), so Kratos had all the more reason to be fearful of what might happen if he stayed close to Atreus, and what effects it might have on his son. Lastly, Kratos might just not know how to deal with having a son, and deal with the constant ptsd trigger of what he did to his old family. He might just be afraid of losing control of his own rage, and killing Atreus, which is why as the game progresses, Kratos allows himself to grow closer to his son. But keep in mind that during the first two acts of the game, Kratos tries to physically touch his son but backs off, because he doesn't know how to show affection. For him, being distant might have been the best course of action to protect his son
@@R0n17 by the end Kratos did not want to sacrifice Pandora for his revenge, if only Hephaestus hadn't tried to kill Kratos he would also been alive. Kratos is brutal and relentless but so is nearly all spartans.
@@darkemperortheobscureone694 Yes! Ares end goal was to overthrow Zeus using Kratos. Sadly for him, Kratos killed him! but hey, atleast he made sure the rest of olympus would follow. So, that is another chance for the god of war to try and rule the olympians in the after life
My take is that the Kratos we meet in the Norse games is who he really was deep down, without constant abuse and tragedy he would be this serious but calm man who loves his family and cares for others; The pantheon took that from him leaving this angry husk of a man that did the equivalent of an animal backed into a corner
Yup. In GOW 2018 it broke my heart seeing Kratos be genuinely afraid of the chaos blades. That pause before wrapping them around his arms, only accepting it because it was what he had to do for his son.
Greek Kratos was raised as a Spartan warrior, lost his family to the gods Norse Kratos is just a dad with issues, nothing of the great warrior he used to be in the past
Ghost of Sparta was really the only game i had and played when i was a kid. but i kept up with the franchise and watched the games so i feel like i have a say lol loved GOS tho
GOW was always that deep before the Norse Beginnings; This minigame ALONE proves that (There's also a lot more scenes and minigames that prove it, but none as much as THAT)
"Good character" doesn't automatically mean "morally good." Kratos is complicated, and the PS4 game was just the next step in his character development
@@alphalax7747 can you please zip it with the alignment chart? It's a horrible metric for judging moral character, not to mention an outdated mechanic for a tripe game system.
The ending of God of War 1 is made even more painful for a couple of reasons. 1) He tries to end his own life to finally end the pain and the gods then "reward" him with immortality. His sanity is hanging on by a thread and the only thing that kept him from ending it sooner was his belief in the promise that the gods would take the pain away and his need to get revenge on Ares, but then they tell him that there is no chance that his pain will ever go away as long as he lives and then they make it so he can never die. And they call it a "reward" or believe it is a gift for his service when it's the exact opposite of what he wants. 2) Before jumping Kratos says, "Now there is no Hope." But according to the ending of God of War 3, Kratos used the power of Hope in order to defeat Ares. He absorbed Hope, in its purest form, but his guilt and depression are so much that he can't feel that Hope inside of him at all. His depression is so much that even Hope can't escape it causing him to want to end his own life.
Funny enough, Athena does say "Complete this final task, and your sins will be forgiven". I think Kratos mistook Athena's words as they would erase his memory so I don't think it's right to blame Athena for Kratos assuming Athena was going to erase his memory. However, I do agree that it's messed up that the Gods reward Kratos with immortality after he tried to kill himself. Even in the GOW book Ares and Athena mention that Kratos is quite insane but I guess, if we want to go there, to Athena, have Kratos replace Ares basically meant trading one blood thirsty son of Zeus for another.
Another great character moment that always stuck with me was his conversation with hercules. You can tell that he has no desire to kill hercules because he has no reason to fight him. He hasn’t wronged him in any way. Hell they haven’t even had a single interaction before gow 3. He even calls him brother which shows he has some respect for hercules. But by the end of the fight, Kratos lets his rage consume him and he devolves back into a bloodthirsty monster. Adds a layer of tragedy to that fight. If Kratos from ascension was in the same fight, I don’t think he would’ve killed him. And even if he did ascension kratos wouldn’t have killed him in such a brutal way.
Hercules was, at that point, willing to destroy the entire arena just to get rid of kratos, all for his personal ambition and sense of missed glory. Kratos wasn't doing anything wrong by punching Hercules to dust. If Kratos didn't do anything, he would have been dead. The visceral nature of how a guy dies mid-combat is irrelevant. To kratos it's just a means to an end. Hercules had everything coming to him that Kratos gave him. But I think people tend to focus on the sheer brutality of a kill, rather than the actual context of it. So no, I don't think Kratos from ascension would have spared Hercules. Hercules was a threat to him, so he had to go down, plain and simple.
@@RedFloyd469 Hercules no hubiera muerto si simplemente no fuera tan egocentrista. Incluso Hercules podria haber pedido piedad a kratos si hubiera querido, dando una pequeña oportunidad de que kratos no lo mate, aun asi kratos esta en todo su derecho de matarlo.
Everyone: Praise GOW 2018 for "Finally being mature and with a good story." OG GOW Fans: "And here I thought your kind were supposed to be so enlightened, so much...better than us, so much smarter."
"Finally being mature and with a good story." No one that has played the God of War series would say that. I never gave a second thought to all the slaughter, that we did as Kratos, the very least because we knew his story, and we liked that story. The fact that the first game even had a story was just a bonus, we like killing things in games. It's just a game, after all. When I found out that Kratos would have a bit of further character development in the final game only caused me to worry that they will ruin the character. But after It came out, I found out that his character development made sense in regards to the games history, and we still get to kill things. Patriarchy? Misogyny? Give me a break! That's not the type of bullshit that people play GoW would even cross their minds.
I think what a lot of people forget about Kratos is that he's supposed to be the Protagonist of a Greek Tragedy, he gets what he wants in the end (Especially At the end of Valhalla) but by then, it's come at a very great cost.
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 they could've been allies, or at the very least acquaintances, but it was Hercules' pride that made that go left. Kratos had no beef with him, but he took the attention of Zeus that Hercules craved so immensely for the majority of his life, and he couldn't let that go, and that was his downfall
GOW 1: Loses his family GOW 2: Loses the trust of the pantheon GOW 3: Destroys Olympus GOW 4: Starts Ragnarok GOW 5: Lets go of his son Valhalla: Lets go of his trauma
I honestly love all the main line God of War games. I do agree that kratos's story arc in the fourth game felt really safe and done before. But it felt like the natural progression of his character. A man can only continue to get more angry and depressed after so long and after killing literally everything then himself. The fourth game felt like a breath of fresh air.
19:37 Kratos destroying the world wasn't retconed, the Greek Mythology world is still destroyed, Kratos just ended up in the Norse Mythology world by heading north. Dad of Boy even shows other mythologies and travel between them by people like Tyr and Mimir, hell Mimir even admits he's from the Celtic Mythology world originally.
so technically, only the Greek mythology side of the world was 'Destroyed' and everything else like Japanese and Norse mythology was fine? now that sounds like a form of genocide on Kratos part, But to be fair the Greek gods had it coming.
@@wdp1a73r Yeh, though when Kratos killed each of the gods. He unleashed a terrible disaster upon the world. Wouldn’t those tragedies be still in that world, unless, travelling far enough from one land allows you to cross a barrier of some kind where they have their own way of operating. If that’s the case, then I agree with you!
It's just like Mimir said, "The pantheon had it coming." They toyed around with the mortals' lives so much for too long that one had enough and brought them down. Kratos just wanted peace and the Gods used him. He realized that they weren't the good wise all-powerful beings that they are said to be, they were selfish tyrants. He wanted vengeance for what they did to him and his family.
Kratos and his spartans were literally destroying and conquering greece and the gods told him repeatedly to stop. They were literally too lenient on him and should have stopped him earlier.
@@Xer405 if you're referring to when Kratos served ares, that was ares not Kratos, which is why they told Kratos to kill ares. If you're referring to gow 2, that was a point in time where Kratos was very angry with the gods so he was fucking wit them by conquering their cities cuz he was bitter. That moment was the calm b4 the storm, Kratos didn't like the gods one bit, but still decided to exist with them until Zeus killed Kratos and all of him soldiers.
@@Xer405 yeah, that happened after Kratos realize that Zeus raped his mother and kidnapped Deimos due to Oracle's prophecy and let's not forget that both his mother and brother died because of Gods action....
@@Xer405 mortal lives should not concern the gods that much regardless not as much involvement as they had with Kratos even though it did not happen like dat as you say
People seem to ignore his interaction with Deimos, Spartan soldier, Pandora and Ares son. Especially with Pandora death he finally accepted how his revenge has cause destruction to innocent people, that was the point he started to move towards better future rather than going solely for revenge.
Literally the ending of god of war 3 shows kratos realizing what he had done and that ultimately the revenge he achieved wasn’t worth it in the end. “Pandora’s sacrifice was in vain. She died because of my need for vengeance”
@@ninjafrog6966 I don't believe it was in vain, Kratos does though. With his final sacrifice, releasing hope without it having a dedicated owner he resets the cycle of life. Everything that was rotten is gone.
@@wiseforcommonsense I think the message goes deeper. He may have had it since the first time around but hope isn't something you "equip" and then use it at will. You have to unlock it each time. Pandora helped with it. Kratos could only beat Zeus when he was cocky and subsequently in despair, unlocking hope again. Zeus weakened had no power to resist a foe that is dead and still stands up, breaking his will. And that's the message Kratos left behind. Hope belongs to everyone not just one single entity, and each has to unlock it.
He Wanted To Do what every man wants to do he just wanted to protect those he cared about and keep his home safe and prosperous He Didn't Ask To Be Created Because Of Zeus's Stupid Mindset Of Arrogance.
Part of the issue might be exposure to just GoW3. “Lack” of plot and motivation because it is entirely an extension of 2’s plot and motivation, but without playing 2 it’s just angry man killing gods cause he wants to kill gods
@@hubguy yeah, GOW3 literally picks up right from the end of GOW2 and I know some people don't bother playing previous games in a series if they start from sequel
In a way its kind of fitting. In the games everyone thinks Kratos is nothing but angry brutal man in the initial trilogy and everyone thinks he is a mean but stoic person in the 4th one Only the players who experienced Kratos's tragedy with him can understand him better
He killed millions and destroyed the world but has always been a good man? Have you ever seen the oryginal games? He was a murderer, sadist and psychopat.
Let's be honest: Game Journalist are mostly hacks. They either don't know how play the game and complain about it being " too hard" or won't pay attention to the game overall and just want blast through so they get their reviews out so the can get paid. Sometimes both
Average gamers can give a better review than those game journalists. Since we actually play and enjoy the games without skipping cutscenes and shit. I love all God of War games. God of War 3 being the most brutal but one of my favorite ones.
That narrative about GOW not being deep until recently is pure history revision. The series has always been very mature in more ways than just sex and violence
Always hated people saying he was nothing but a mindless killing machine and monster. He was never mindless but he was made to be a killing machine and turned into a monster. i hate how people ignore his character development throughout the last 7 games because the violence is what is remembered. Everything they love about GoW 4 and 5 was well established in the last games only thing they built on was him working on controlling his anger. Kratos is still the same old kratos, with these games just being much more story rich then the last games. which to be fair is a lot easier to do with todays games and technology then it was back in 2005. games then you could buy and beat in a day if you actually wanted now thats simply not a thing for most triple A games as they have become so long and story rich.
That's how it always is with these kinds of things. "Ew, it's edgy and gory, it's probably as deep as a 14 year old's diary". A lot of people simply refuse to accept anything of that nature.
This is a bit late but in Spartan Culture, suicide was paramount to turning your back on your Culture family and every value they stood for so that makes Kratos jumping off that much more impactful
@@anima94 well the man reach his limit. He views himself as honorless and his loved are dead both by his actions and the gods actions. When jump off he took a good time to contemplate willing himself to jump means he still feeling held back on staying on his spartan honor but willed himself nothing more than a broken man that wants peace to reunite with his family in the afterlife
Another thing to remember is that in Greek mythology the "hero" was not always a good person. They were the protagonist who has been given a quest to accomplish and you see this in characters like Heracles who did absolutely monstrous things in their stories but are still considered heroes.
@@Onikag he also got parts from the others. He has athena at his aid like odeyssey He got the gifts/powers from the other gods like Pandora (if you want to count her) He killed a gorgon like perseus. Etc... They gave him a cool part from every tragic greek tale.
For those wondering: Spartan male citizens *were* groomed into war from a very tender age. When a Spartan Male citizen was born he was taken by a significant member of society (priests come to mind) to be examined for genetic/physical deformities. If they were deemed 'unfit' they would literally be cast off a cliff and left to die of exposure and/or wild animals. Males were allowed to live in their birth home until the age of 8 years old, at which point "Agoge" aka "The Raising" began. Spartan boys lived with each other from their 8th to 21st birthdays and certain parts of their training included being left in the wilderness to fend for themselves, stealing whatever they needed. The act was not punishable unless they were caught and in fact Spartan youths were even *Encouraged* to straight up murder helots (the slave class of Spartan society) to conceal their crimes. There were in fact ceremonial parts of the year in Spartan society where the youths were set loose on Helots to terrorize them to ensure they remembered their place in society. On top of this Spartan males were also given their education in philosophy; learning their numbers and letters among others. "Proper" spartan males were essentially the noble elite 20 some percent of society. Also worth pointing out that while many get an idea that women belonged in the kitchen in early society, Spartan women were also groomed not just in tending the homestead but being viciously ready to protect it themselves if the army was out and away and in some ways even ruled over the males of society. In a twist of irony, while many consider Athens "The birthplace of democracy", Sparta was a very egalitarian society where women had an equal say in courts and in many cases actually had significantly more influence at court than Athenian women did. Spartans were also extremely big on heroism and standing up to your enemy, no matter the odds, go down swinging and never give up. I recall passage of one of the Spartan 300 setting off for Thermopylae, wherein one of the wives of the men setting of was handing him his shield. She gave him very simple instructions "Come home with this shield, or upon it", basically either return victorious or die fighting and return being carried on his shield for burial.
It should also be noted that Spartans were formally banned from any combat sports in the Olympics because they were too cutthroat and even if they were losing horribly, it'd be a worse shame to return home a loser. Therefore, there were Spartan youths who made their opponents kill them to avoid that fate- which saps the fun out of what the Olympics was supposed to be.
@@MrDefault08 “sap[ping] the fun” is certainly not the _first_ thing I’d think of when describing spartans wanting to be killed after defeat but i guess it’s not untrue
@@renmcmanus “source: trust me bro” Its not a competition, my guy. Nobody’s saying women haven’t suffered thing’s men don’t, but pretending that men don’t also suffer is ignorant
Honestly, after the ending of Ragnarok, I am so excited for Kratos's future. Where he almost cries as to what the future may hold for him. Something he wasn't even able to imagine. For the first time, I think Kratos actually has a dream and it's beautiful.
Valhalla was a great epilogue for the game that explored just that. And now kratos finally found the inner peace that was lacking for him for so long, came to terms with his past and accepted the role as the new god of war and hope of the Norse world
Thank you for this. The narrative that Kratos was a "shallow character" is one of the most disingenuous sentiments in all of gaming. But it goes to show how short attention spans are, how often the masses can succumb to group-think, how easily copy-pasting a popular formula wins over critics, and just how little gaming journalists actually know about writing.
@@ravenmunnin8109 Because he never shows an evolution or mutation of character, there is no development. There is no depth to his character. He wants vengeance for his family, but he killed thousands and thousands of innocents families, and he never reflected on what he did. He blames the gods for despising humanity, but he is a god and despised humanity, and never intended to make a difference in that matter. There is no depth or evolution. Just a one dimensional being.
It's stupid that most people who played GOW 2018 never played or care to play the original Greek saga to see how Kratos' character developed over 6 games
Sony marketed gow 2018 as a reboot, so I played that without playing the other games 1st. I noticed a lot of nods to past entries while playing that I wasn't able to fully appreciate. I wish there was a gow collection on ps4, I don't want to play them on the cloud or dig up and re hook my ps3 then have to hunt down ps3 collection copies at gamestop or ebay.
@@KingDDDuke I actually prefer to play PS2 era games on my actual PS2 console. You play the game as its original form and brings more nostalgia when going back. Also, sometimes when trying port games from that era to modern consoles can ironically downgrade the quality of the games, the perfect examples were the PS3 Ratchet & Clank original trilogy collection and Deadlocked.
@@KingDDDuke That was one of the most stupid choices Sony made. The new game ain't no reboot, it's most certainly a sequel and is completely enriched by playing the originals. Sony did a real disservice to people by trying to convince everyone that God of War 4 is a reboot. Absolutely absurd.
I Want To Point Out That Even In GOW3, Where He's Considered Completely Ruthless, He Still Shows Some Humanity Towards The Other Gods. He Tried To Talk Sense Into Hercules, Tried To Avoid Fighting Hermes, Tried To Leave Hera Alone, Tried To Give Helios A Chance, But They All Pushed Him. It's Easy To Ignore The Little Things When His Violence Is Louder, But The Fact Remains He Gave Them A Chance And They Kept Provoking Him.
In Ascension, Kratos helps people for absolutely no reason. Random people. He repaired the aquafer and pushed a guy out of harms way. This was a random ass guy who was never brought up again.
@@aeoyndjuric1679 Gods betraying others is not a new event. And that IS a choice, its just one they would likely refuse. At that point they CHOSE to risk their lives for Zeus.
"The obsession of being mature comes of ironically immature" that is really great it makes me think back then a lot of the times when i just cringe at myself of thinking about my past past self, right now i just think cringing at myself back then just looks so immature, I think i can appreciate the steps I've taken myself more than to bash on it.
It's a modern take on a classic quote, I think by C.S. Lewis. "When I became a man, I put away my childish things, including my fear of being seen as a child."
I don't think Kratos destroyed the "entire world" at the end of God of War III, but merely the entire "Greek World". This explains why Scandinavia would still be around and untouched by the destruction that Kratos caused. The ancient Greeks were also extremely full of themselves so labeling their world as "the world" makes sense thematically speaking.
They explained he traveled to a completely different realm. Two wolves dragged him as he was unconscious and he woke up in the new world. So the new God of takes place on a different "world"
@@southeastpaw1722 well no shit it didn't exist during god of war 3. Im explaining that it wasn't a retcon. It was just an explanation on why the norse world wasn't affected. Because the Greek world and Norse world are two different things
Something not enough people bring up in that scene with Pandora is that she doesn't break free from his grasp, since not even the gods seem able to do that - he LETS go when she says he's hurting her. The look of shock on his face makes me think he had an instant where he didn't see Pandora, but Calliape. THAT'S what makes him let go.
Even so many years ago they were so good at visual storytelling. Playing Ragnarok, even if it may be "safer" or whatever, is so satisfying to see how much they're able to fully realize their ambitions with modern technology
@@SmoothAsFelt tbh it does feel like a technical downgrade due to the lowered amount of enemies on the screen, the larger than life scenarios in 3 had such good graphics and performance, the titan fight took months to develop and it was worth it. The new gameplay style really hurts the spectacle
I always enjoyed the idea as well that characters always comment kratos is either slow, stupid or nothing without his strength when the first game is him pretty much only solving puzzles
Yeah, my favorite examples are the temple of Pandora, where those challenges were not only about brute force but also required a lot of intelligence as well, not to mention the fight against Cronos where instead of attacking directly in a stupid way, Kratos takes advantage of his small size to attack at strategic points to the body of Cronos to make him completely vulnerable to his mercy, there are examples throughout the Greek saga, demonstrating why Kratos certainly deserved his place as general of the Spartan army being such a good strategist.
That's actually a good point! Kratos could solve all of these puzzles, even the most complex ones of them. It just shows another aspect of his character which is intelligence.
The Thamur thick Ice Lake challenge proves his iq again: M: "Not even Thor with Mjölnir at hand could break so much ice." K: "Then Thor is a fool." A: "Why are we climbing up this giant hammer?" K: "Think." A: "Okay... We can't find a way around the ice, so we need to break it, it is too thick for our weapons and magic won't work. So we'll need something ridiculously heavy to... ooooh."
As far as aesthetics go, I always thought the design of Kratos was really cool, especially the lore behind it. The scar on his right eye is from Ares (foreshadowing his servitude to him and is a reminder of his failure to save his brother), the red tattoo on his body is a tribute to his brother's mark, the the ghostly look is from his wife and daughter's ashes following his murder of them, and the scar on his chest comes from Zeus. Just a crazy cool look.
And all of them has meaning and symbolization behind them. It's not just a cool little design thing that the dev thought out because they were edgy but it's actually a genuine marks of his life and shows the progression of Kratos's journey of revenge starting from the scar that would mark his future revenge and killing of Ares, the ashes of his family to signify the start of his revenge and eventual regression as a person due to his rage and anger, to the scars that Zeus gave him which mark the start of both the end of Zeus and the start of the second war of the giants
I really love kratos as a character. A year ago I lost my fiancée to a housefire due to bad electrical from a bunch of slum lords A year before I got evicted by a different group of slum lords. And before that I had all my pets die(3 cats and 2 dogs) in the same year. I’m 22 now and my entire adult life has been loss so far.( with quite a few good things as well) I am still currently working on the rage building inside me. I’ve made good progress especially in one year. Kratos hits home for me because growing up I always felt helpless. I grew up in an incredibly religious family and rarely got time to play GOW but when I did something felt different in me. I looked at the world around me as I grew up and what my family told me felt wrong deep inside my heart. I hated myself but then I felt powerless. Kratos challenges the gods to escape his own destiny and to make his own legacy. Seeing him be the best father he can is heartwarming to me. Like he finally got what he always wanted. Freedom and love. The chains on his arms always seared into him as if to say his fate was his legacy. He was a slave to forces beyond his power. Kratos was stubborn and a born warrior so he said “No”
imagine how much would mean a simple hug for Kratos, after all the death suffering and torture he went through, a simple act of kindness would mean the world to him
I dont get how anyone would say that he wasn't a good character in the original series!?!? The story was extremely captivating and he was a tortured soul that you really want to see get his revenge.
i really can't think of any scene where he seemed misygonistic and so is a 'bad' character for critics, is it bc he killed female gods? that's just equality
Absolutely agree. Everyone acts like he was just this angry for no reason one dimensional character when he wasn’t. His anger was for a reason. And to the 2018 fanboys, the older wiser kratos wouldn’t be the character you love in the new one if it wasn’t for his past. His past self is what makes when he’s older all the more beautiful and special:)
The blades of chaos scene in GOW 4 would not be emotional without the previous games. The previous games had a lot of impact on this scene since kratos is using the same blades that he used to kill his wife ,daughter and many people who deserved to be killed and those who did not and now he is using the same blades of chaos to save his son. The scene will never have an impact on someone who has never played the old games. I had tears flowing from my eyes during that scene.
Same as Asura and Doomguy really. Sure they are defined by the rage and violence they portray, but when you pay attention, you see they are still people with complex feelings and motivations that drive them to these extremes. Asura is fairly similar to Kratos. Doomguy much less so since all we know is Doomguy has a sense of right and wrong, loved only his rabbit, and did always take violence to its logical extreme.
@@thomasallen9974 Yeah, I don't see how people can be so stupid. Either they don't pay attention or they skip shit. Because understanding a character is a basic human trait which those journalists obviously lack. They make me feel smarter for simply able to understand a character, story and game. Kratos is one of the best and strongest video game characters ever. Both from a mental and physical standpoint. I recently played Asura's Wrath Demo after finishing Kratos' Greek adventure and he immediately reminded me of Kratos. Consumed by rage, strong, yet still having humanity inside. I still gotta play the full game so can't really give a proper review.
@@codafett But what about him always killing random mortals, whenever he encounters them? Shipcaptain, Princess, random guy on a window in olympus? i always thought..wtf?! why did he do this now?
@@derfuzzy8854 The Captain of the ship he explain in the books were he is a lot brutal, he says: "I hate cowards!" he left the man to die because the old man tried to flee leaving his man behind, and before they got in that Hydra situation they had a lot of trouble with that captain chasing him for days because he broke some kind of deal with Kratos and tried to flee.
On the note of GOW being more "grown up" I'll let this quote do the talking. “Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” ― C.S. Lewis These know nothing game "journos" are themselves infants. *People I watched the video, this comment was a pre video thought.
I love this quote because the last sentence is classic subversion and elaboration. C.S. Lewis is a Christian, and the last sentence is actually an excerpt from 1 Corinthians 3:11 (When I was a man I put away childish things) which is what people, namely christians, use to justify the seriousness of being grownup and the desire to become "adult". Then he subverts it and says THAT. Kinda cool.
I'd like to add a scene from GoW2. It is right after he learns that Sparta, his home, his people, are gone. Kratos ends up experiences so much rage that he pretty much breaks. As the Kraken comes up to kill him Kratos refuses to fight and any attempts to make him fight results in Kratos yelling lines of fury. Think about that for a moment. Kratos is so pissed off and done with the gods. That he attempts suicide for a second time willing to allow the Kraken to kill him off so that he his rage may finally end. Rage so self-destructing that a man, a demi-god, whose power is fueled by his rage. Breaks because of it. If Gaia didn't intervene Kratos would've died to the Kraken unable to go on any longer his own rage overwhelming the god of rage.
@@godzillazfriction He would have let it kill him. Kratos is super strong but he isn't invincible. A child can kill an super heavy weight adult if they let them.
@@godzillazfriction Yes actually I've seen the entire GoW series multiple times and I know very damn well how powerful the guy is. But apparently you haven't. Because clearly you don't remember how defeated and willing Kratos was going to let himself die. If you did we wouldn't be having this conversation.
@@godzillazfriction you're missing his entire point. whether the kraken would've been able to kill a Kratos willing to die or not doesn't matter, its the fact that Kratos WANTED it to kill him. "dumbass."
@@godzillazfriction Dude. The very fact GAIA intervened THERE AND THEN, at least, shows that the Kraken could have done significant damage to him. It's not unreasonable to say the Kraken could kill him given how she was pretty much in a hurry to persuade him to keep fighting.
Fully and utterly agree. Finally had a chance to play GOW4 when it came to PC earlier this year, and while I absolutely loved Kratos' journey in that game; *none* of it would be as potent or as meaningful to me without the older games. The themes of fatherhood especially are enhanced by the fact that, yes, Zeus *was* Kratos' father, and he treated him in a way that no father should. And I love that the writers play into that, with the Helheim story bit. Kratos' buried rage hits a lot harder because you *know* him. You know what he's capable of, you've followed him through every major chapter of his life. You know the fury he keeps in check to pursue a better and less destructive life. But you also know why it has to come out. He was always a good character, GOW4 just allowed him to start a journey towards being a *good person* . I would've been fine with him simply passing after the end of GOW3, with the Greek world rebuilding in his wake. But there is something interesting about an exiled Kratos trying to pick up the pieces and build some semblance of a decent life afterwards. All while clashing with a pantheon of Gods that's just as awful, if not more. I can't wait to see what Ragnarok does with his story, and I hope they continue to keep the older games in mind when it comes to his characterization.
@@c.wubby.u861 Definitely not by the end of GOW4. But that's what I meant by "starting the journey". He took the biggest step towards that in the last game.
what was meaningful? The saccharine father son thing? Do you SERIOUSLY think Kratos would be that distanced from his son? He loved Calliope so much! He would have been close to Atreus from the day he was born. It doesnt work for me from the beginning
Very well said. Kratos's development in 4 is a very pleasant and interesting thing to see, and it's only enhanced by the six games he had in the Greek era that showcases how he changed as a person.
I've always hated how people talked about "young" kratos. They always say he's evil and had no reason for his actions (also calling him misogynistic) but you definitely laid it all out in a very informative way. To me he's basically a different version of Guts from Berserk. They were both betrayed and lost everything,which made them into the same monsters they were fighting against and to top it off people never understood Guts and the reason he was like that. Just 2 broken men trying to make it through the world.
Mysoginist how? Because he fucked consenting women to try and ignore his trauma? They're mysandrists for ignoring a man's feelings and why he became terrible in the first place
One thing you forgot to mention was that in the end of GoW 3 Kratos was more focused on getting his revenge, and did not care about any of the powers acquired by the gods he had killed. In a moment he seems to be debating on giving the powers to Athena who he has seem to care about in GoW 2 and is shown to be the most selfless out of the gods, aiding Kratos in his quests, from when he was little, all the way till the very end. Making Kratos believe that she was different. It wasn’t until the end where she mistakenly revealed that she knew that there were evils in the box and hope to stop those evils, that Kratos realized that once again Kratos his entire life has been a pawn to them, to stop Ares. Upon retrieving the box of pandora the first time, the plot was for the evils to latch on to Kratos, and the hope to latch on to Zeus. Giving Kratos the madness, sins and evil to destroy Ares, and Zeus the hope needed to destroy Kratos when needed. They were trying to do the same thing as Areas was trying to do, which was to control kratos “the ultimate weapon” through torment and madness. That’s why whenever he did an useless task, all they did for him was offer him more power and riches. They though that the evils from the box could be controlled with fantasies of power. This is why the gods disapproved of Kratos using his powers as a god to do tasks that were not dictated by the gods themselves. This is also why Kratos actions of raining war upon the other cities of the other gods was seen as if the evils that were thought to be possessed by Kratos were becoming too much and they need to be stopped. But in reality it was the hope in Kratos that was able to see past the god’s masks and see that the gods were truly evil and they were a plague, and the evils that has latched on to Zeus made Zeus mad and made Zeus think that Kratos was a useless servant that was threatening his power, they could do anything to him. And why he ended up killing Kratos in GoW 2. Even when he came back Athena still thought that Zeus had the hope in him and Kratos had the evils. I think that It was till the beginning of GoW 3 when Kratos died for the 3rd time and managed to come back with hope of getting his revenge that Athena saw that Kratos was filled with hope. She helped him destroy Zeus. Once Zeus was destroyed, she expected Kratos “the dumb servant” to give up all the gods powers unto her, so she could become the next Queen goddess of Olympus. That’s when Kratos saw that she was no different than anyother god and she was as power hungry, sinful and Evil as all the others gods, willing to destroy anything in their path to have power. Kratos understood that to defeat the gods he had to be like the gods, but in his last moment he gave that up and did the most humane thing. He gave his life, his godness, powers and released the powers of the gods unto the world for the world to be free. Foiling Athena’s plans. Amongst all the gods, the god of war was the only good one. Even in god of war all the gods he kills that fought against him, all sought a selfish reason for their glory, power, godhood, etc. Kratos only did the things he did because he knew that the only way for the world to be at peace, was for there to be no gods. Including himself. Also taking his revenge.
just one thing, it is a accepted notion that the sins released from pandoras box, Greed, Specifically, gripped athena. She was actually truthful and caring about kratos up until she died, and there it is said she couldnt hold back the greed any longer and the sin took hold of her, hence her actions in gow 3 ending. Thats why her spirit form and she when she was alive are so seemingly different
& wit that being said (great record recovery btw) I just question how Pandoras box had hope in it? & How Athena didnt kno Kractos had it, werent u task'd with trying 2 recover this box at the very start of GoW??
One thing I will always love about Kratos as a character is the fact that he embodies the very concept of drive and determination. If he wants something, whether it be revenge on someone who wronged him or a monster's heart to save his son, literally nothing is going to stop him. Not gods, not demons, not even the jaws of death itself can keep him from achieving his goal
i always like to think that him giving the power to the people at the end of 3 is just one last middlefinger to the Gods and puts him back on a better path.
God of War Ragnarok has made me tear up multiple times and how much Kratos has been through. His father son moments with Atreus is so amazingly done that I can’t help but smile to how far he’s come to return to being such a loving father. Such an amazing character that teaches so many lessons.
Kratos telling Atreus that he was wrong to tell him to close his heart to others, to open his heart to their suffering and help them in any way he can is one of my favourite character moments ever. Kratos well and truly changed his nature and if he stays the path will become a God of peace and prosperity rather than destruction and wrath, beautiful character arc.
I think even GOW PS4 missed a lot about his previous characterization. It's painted like everything was his fault due to his anger, but kind of ignore how horribly he was abused and betrayed over and over. At that point what else could he do but fight back. The series was always a power fantasy, but not just for powerful violence, but to feel like maybe if you could just fight back against anyone who has used and hurt you if you get angry and indignant enough. Kratos was a product of the world around him and eventually destroyed that world bc it was broken. The more he's betrayed and manipulated the angrier and more violent he gets. Even when he tries to do things differently or end it all he's just used again and forced into the cycle. And it's interesting how the true way to have stopped him would have been kindness, but there was no kindness in the gods, so he had to give up his humanity. But yet, in his last act, he shows kindness and releases hope back into the world.
They hardly mention anything from the first game. They also act like killing Zeus was the worst thing he did. Btw, Mimir does say that "the pantheon got it coming".
I think you're missing the point : Every human being, after they commited a serious crime against innocents just because they stand in their way, feel like they weren't right on doing it. I doesn't blame himself for killing the gods, he blame himself for making that deal with Ares and for killing many people who wasn't deserving his Anger
I didn't actually know about all those articles, they have no idea, the first God of War is basically a greek tragedy, everything from a pretty unsympathetic hero to a very tragic and sad ending
People dismiss Kratos' plight for the same reason people ignore male suicide. Obviously, this is a fantasy story with the pain he's enduring pushed to the extreme. But trauma on weak men is justified by them being weak, and trauma on macho looking men that got that way from struggle isn't real because they are strong. It's such a toxic interpretation of how men deal with trauma.
Kratos is like travis bickle but on steroids. He was betrayed and wronged and no one understood him, yet he's painted as a monster because he fights back against the hatred and those who shunned him.
On god. He is one of the few characters in video games to have CANONICALLY COMMITTED SUICIDE in front of the viewer and their reaction is "Wow toxic masculinity". Bro how much does the guy have to suffer before you look past the fact that he is a man?
I’d also like to say that even if he is a monster in Gow 3, he still has some morals. He doesn’t want to kill Hercules or Hephaestus until they actively try to kill him. While he does kill the princess and the entire world, he has a heart scrap for those who remind him of what he’s lost. A father protecting his daughter and a brother, although he does viscously murder both of them in the end.
Kratos may even be simpathetic towards Hercules (or the accurate version Herakles/Heracles) seeing as Heracle was a honorable Demi god and God who killed his own family after Lyssa send by Hera made him lose his mind.
Love this video. It disgusts me when I hear people say that God of war was never had a good story until it becomes like the Last of Us with God of war 4.
Also I don't know how it was a retcon if the end credits shows that Kratos was still alive. The only retcon in GoW4 in my opinion is that Kratos has the blades of chaos and not the blades of exile which would make more sense and they did the same thing with the flashbacks in hell in the game and they don't use the old voice actor so it doesn't sound right to me.
@@EthanTheDinoNerd Its stated in the old games that he put away the blades of chaos, he only has them because they're bound to his soul and they appear around him no matter how many times he tries to get rid of them. None of it is a retcon, it's all following up from the old GoW games and I don't buy for a second that the old games are forgotten or disrespected. People just say shit
@@User-es3em It's still a plot hole. because Ares, their maker, stripped him of the blades, they were gone. and he was gifted the blades of athena in return to killing ares, which evolves later to the blade of exile. So it doesn't make sense how the baldes of chaos returned out of the nowhere ! Also it was never stated that blades would follow kratos. what is said is, the blades chains are forever attached to kratos flesh and can never be removed.
one big point you forgott to mention is that kratos doesnt go the extra mile to kill. all the gods he killed he did because they were o his way to zeus or didnt allow to go after zeus. he didnt want to kill hercules as he says...this is not between us hercules. but hercules kept on insisting that by killing kratos he will earn the grace of approval. hermes he could not have been bothered to kill but hermes dropped those fire bars and kratos got triggered. imagine turning your back to a tiger or provocating him. perses the titan he one shots with the blade attacked kratis first. kratos was just flying the icarus vent but perses attacks him. not all fights have been started by kratos. that is important to remember
Agreed I’m surprised he never mentioned it cause that plays a big part in his humanity he didn’t kill everybody in his way cause he had to but because it was necessary at particular times and sometimes not point being hey at least he tried
Even with Zeus’ wife, she provoked him. He should’ve had self control, but she also should’ve known better than to go at someone who is as angry as Kratos how she did
Except for that one time in God of War 1 where he just geabs the key to the door on the ship and drops the captain down the Hydra's throat. Sure, the captain isn't a god, but still, it was a bit unnecessary. But I gotta admit, it still cracks me up to this day how he just casually drops him.
@@mark030a yeah. hahahah we dont talk about that. nah just kidding. i always felt that that was somehow even for kratos out of character. i never felt like it was the right thing he did. lets not forget. he killed him like 3 times lol.
I love the growth of Kratos from the beginning. A man in extreme emotional pain, fighting for release, to a father with a loving son and at least some peace.
Kratos's wife and child was supposed to be in Sparta. Ares placed them in the Oracle's village to manipulate Kratos into killing his own family. Kratos was possessed by the power given to him by Ares and in his blind rage and loyalty, he killed his family without realizing it.
13:26 This idea is beautifully put in God of War (2018) as well, when Freya says to Kratos "You are just an animal! Passing on your cruelty and rage; you will never change!", to which Kratos responds "Then you do not know me."
Ares also thought that in completing the blood oath by killing his wife and child, that Kratos will always serve him as enforced by the furies. Kratos was under their illusion since he started serving Ares but the illusion broke once he killed his wife and child. Ares probably didn't know this would happen. But even if so, the furies were supposed to enforce Kratos servitude due to the blood oath, but Kratos defeated them. He was the first to ever do this, so Ares probably didn't think Kratos was strong enough to do it at this point.
Iirc, it's implied that during Kratos' ransacking, Ares blinded him with rage, which has mythological basis. Hera did something incredibly similar to Hercules, even leading to Herc killing his wife and child in a similar fashion, leading to his 12 labours as atonement I maintain the time travel thing was a good call. He's so detached from who he was he doesn't even consider the idea he could save Sparta or his family, it just doesn't occur to him. He's THAT completely tunnel visionsed with pure fury Great vid 👍
I think you've summed up Kratos's characterization really well. Because even though I was convinced at one point that he was a rampaging monster in human form, in a subconscious level, I was actually questioning that notion. And your explanation of him brought that to a conscious level. And for that, I thank you. As a sort-of aspiring storyteller writing a book, I would go on and dare say that the first God of War game actually follows the three-act structure quite well. And here's how: Story's premise: Kratos goes on a journey to stop Ares from threatening Olympus on behalf of the gods. (External conflict) Internal Conflict: Protagonist's desire - Kratos wants to have his nightmares erased from his mind. Protagonist's fear - Kratos is constantly reminded of his misdeed of killing his own family. Protagonist's misbelief - If Kratos accomplishes certain tasks for the gods, his nightmares will be erased from his mind. Act I: The Hook - Kratos is shown fighting the Hydra on behalf of Poseidon showing us players from the get-go what kind of game we're all in for. After Kratos (the player) kills the Hydra, backstory is shown about Kratos about what Kratos is and why he is this way. In the first few minutes, Kratos's internal conflict is shown through backstory during his time as a Spartan military leader, pledges himself to Ares, and consequently, Kratos under Ares's lust-for-blood spell ultimately leads Kratos to murder his own wife and child. The Setup - Kratos, on the verge of defeat and death, pledges himself to Ares. After Ares hears Kratos's call out of desperation, Kratos is given the Blades of Chaos by Ares. The Inciting Incident - Kratos goes on a rampage for the glory of Sparta and as a catalyst of Ares as the perfect warrior. Eventually this leads to Kratos unknowingly murdering his own family in a temple they were taking refuge in. And as a consequence, Kratos is forced to wear the ashes of his dead family on his skin for all to see what he has become. The Build-Up - He's confronted with the horror of what he's done and is now forced to live with the reality of his actions and the consequence of pledging himself to Ares. 1st Plot Point - Kratos decides to throw away his pledge to Ares and wants to have his nightmare of his actions erased by serving the gods instead of Ares. 1st Pinch Point - The gods wish to use Kratos to stop Ares after Ares decides to threaten Olympus itself. The reason for this is because Zeus forbids the gods from waging war with one another. Act II: Pre-midpoint action hero - Since Ares knows what's going on with Kratos, he sends hordes of his minions to stop Kratos. Midpoint - Kratos is tasked to obtain Pandora's box which is supposed to help him in his quest to stop Ares. Post-midpoint action hero - Kratos goes to the Desert of Lost Souls to obtain the box from Pandora's temple which is strapped onto Cronos's back. Kratos knows how next to impossible this task is but accepts the task regardless. 2nd Pinch Point - Ares is soon made aware that Kratos is in the Desert of Lost Souls and knows that Pandora's box is there. Act III: Supposed victory - Kratos finally reaches Pandora's box. But he has no idea that Ares knows of this. Disaster - Ares throws a massive column that travels across the world and impales Kratos effectively killing him. And in the process, Ares's minions take the box away from Kratos. Dark moment - Kratos is falling into the underworld as he is now dead. Recovery - Kratos fights his way out of the underworld. With the help of the mysterious gravedigger, Kratos knows that Olympus is still on his side after all this time. Climactic Confrontation - Kratos opens Pandora's box and goes toe-to-toe with Ares. This is the final boss battle in the game. Victory - Kratos eventually kills Ares after a long and arduous fight. Resolution - Kratos is eventually shown the true colors of the gods as they never meant to wipe away his nightmares as he himself believed that they might despite the fact that this promise was never made to him in the first place. Because his misbelief has been laid out for him in the end, Kratos tries to commit suicide but the gods don't allow this. Instead they allow him to become the new god of war in place of Ares. Which wasn't really something Kratos actually wanted to begin with. Which also sparks a series of Kratos giving the gods that what-for for not granting him what he asked for in the first place. Sorry this was a long comment post but after playing the game and beating it and then going it over with the three-act structure I now use to tell my own story of a former Army Ranger going on a quest for revenge of the man that assassinated his mother, I just had to do a little comparison of the three-act structure to God of War. And from what I find, the developers for the first game have done this beautifully. God of War will always be one of my all-time favorite video game series despite the fact that I no longer own a Playstation and instead play on PC.
In the novels, for me, the best parts are the politics of the gods and Athena was watching Kratos battle with Ares and they had an interesting exchange. It went more or less like. Athena: "So, father, after defeating Ares, Kratos is goign to have his sins forgiven, won't he?" Zeus: "Yes yes" Athena: "And forgiving his sins is going to take the nightmares away, right?" Zeus: "Who said anything about nightmares?" Athena: "What?" Zeus: "Killing your own family is a heinous crime, one that comes with a curse that even I live with me to this day. Kratos won't have his nightmares removed, but rather, we are going to honor him with Ares' throne instead as the new God of War." Athena: "Father, you can't just do this! You can't dangle the promise of removing his nightmares to get ten years of service and then cast it all away like it's nothing! Kratos doesn't need forgiveness for his sins, but rather a decent night of sleep!" Zeus: "Shut up, now let's watch the battle, it seems like Ares has the upper edge on your champion."
Idk if this comment is being condescending to the writers or complimenting the writers. Of course the GoW games had good writing in it, that's why they are regarded as good games.
I will respectfully disagree on the Ares part for a specific reason. He wanted Kratos to have no ties to the mortal realm and become stronger. Ares likely didn't have a clue what killing them would do because already to him, why should anyone one care? He's a god, what need does he have for family? That and literally having a god complex probably meant that Kratos being distraught would make no sense to him.
@@TBP that's fair, I think the implication is that Ares had moved Lassandra and Calliope from Sparta to this location and, like many others, used Kratos lust for conquest against him. The last part I see being Ares fault, but the family part isn't fully explained. Kratos regardless is still at some level of fault.
The Furies did that under Ares order. "They were not there by chance Kratos"-The Fury while in her Oracle form Also supported by the Queen of the Furies knowing how his wife looked to appear as her
@@TBP I think there was a line in the first game where it tells u that Ares gave Kratos the mission to attack Athena's temple or something like that so that at least gave a little foreshadowing. I doubt Kratos is foolish enough to think that Ares wouldn't know that his family is there.
What makes Kratos a compelling character is the fact that he’s very much shaped by his tragedies. Losing Deimos to Ares and Athena completely hardened him, and eventually drove him on a quest for power to prove his strength, and remain true to his Spartan origins. His wife and child were killed because Ares manipulated Kratos’ brutality into absolutely blind rage, and as a result, he killed Calliope and Lysandra. Ares thought that power meant more to Kratos, and wanted to sever his earthly tethers to make him the perfect warrior. He taught, because of his pride and power, that he was untouchable but didn’t take into consideration that Olympus will aid his bastard half brother. The irony here is that he moulded Kratos into the beast he became, and didn’t think that beast’s power and skill would exceed his own. Ares was resourceful but he was no match for Pandora’s box’ power. All this, coupled by Persephone causing him to lose Calliope again, and then losing Deimos and his mother, absolutely devastated him and left him with nothing but vengeance. His own father ruined him, caused his brother’s death and torment along with his mother, then betrayed him and made him lose the last thing The Ghost of Sparta cared about- Sparta. Kratos was always an incredibly compelling and somewhat understandable character, and was always likeable, but the sequel humanised him completely and made him completely likeable. He’s a man who found strength even in the darkest moments, quite literally, whether it be his absolute rage against Thanatos after he killed Deimos, or his drive for redemption causing him to kill Persephone after abandoning Calliope, or his desire for revenge and peace after realising Sparta’s fate. Also I definitely agree that Kratos has PTSD. He had visions, tremendous amount of guilt, nightmares, prone to rage, and avoided telling his son the full truth of his past. The overwhelming guilt and shame still greatly affects his life till this day, even if he forgave himself. Although he loves Atreus, he’d wish his family was still alive.
I always felt Kratos's rage toward Zeus happened initially during the events in 'Ghost of Sparta' because this was when he found out that Zeus was his true father, who then proceeds to warp his mother into the monster, forcing him to kill her at the moment he finds she is still alive.
No, it was a total shock to Kratos, when Athena told him that he is Zeus's son. His mother tried to tell him about Zeus, but she never managed to actually do that, turning into a monster.
7:34 actually what really happened when kratos was raiding that village was normal. He was sent by ares to destroy that village. At first his wife and daughter were not there in that village but then area transported them there in that house right before kratos killing them so in reality it really was ares fault since he was the one who teleported both his wife and daughter there knowing that those were his only connections remaining and not knowing that his mother and brother still live. Area thought that this would make the perfect warrior who would be able to defeat gods like in gow 3.
That use of the button mash to show Kratos’ struggle with leaving his daughter, is both the greatest use of a bottom mash I’ve ever seen in a game, and shows to me that the original GOWs were far more then just ‘immature toxic masculinity’.
That moment with Caliope is the definitive moment that I remember from the original series. Not any of the gruesome executions, the one moment where he has to leave his daughter behind. And it was put in a game that not many people played.
That had to be the most difficult thing for Kratos to do in the game like imagine yourself in Kratos position you're finally reunited with your daughter who's been dead for years but then having to leave her to keep her from being wiped from existence?
I followed most of Kratos' story from beginning to end, and while I agree, I'd like to point out God of War 3 had an additional narrative element that really made me think. It actually runs across your point of context surrounding the circumstances. The Greek gods were corrupted by that time. As much as they were dicks before, they got worse after Pandora's box was opened. And my speculation of why they safeguarded the box was not because they thought that it had power that Kratos could take, but it was a means to absorb or remove the corruption that took hold. They themselves don't know it, but the shadow that is influencing their actions could have and made moves to do so. Of course, that's an opinion. And I don't actually see any retcons on the PS4 era. We see at the end of GOW3 Kratos actually survived, a blood trail moving away from where he stabbed himself. And Mimir pretty much confirms that the 'world' is split up into different areas where a certain group of Pantheons reside in. So in essence, Kratos didn't destroy the world, and it was okay again in GOW4. He most likely destroyed Greece and its neighboring countries that worshipped the same gods, though, but left enough power for it to rebuild itself. And I can see why he acted so restrained with Atreus around, but I also saw glimpses of his old self when fighting his enemies (Atreus comments on that randomly too, "You scare me sometimes") or when boy was getting a little too uppity when he was finally cured off his long time disease and got recognition from his father (the 'normies' attribute it to just arrogance, and I attribute it to him being too happy, and then annoyed when Kratos tries to keep him in check). All in all, despite the words of the director, they maintained his character, bringing him in the direction of how he'd act if he got another chance in happiness, and desperation to protect his only living son whilst also teaching him to survive the long life of suffering Atreus will most likely experience. I'm just hoping that Ragnarok doesn't stray too far from that.
This is why I love GoW4. They didn't wipe the slate clean. They built upon Kratos and how he has tried to be his own person rather than the one society made him.
I feel like this video makes the ending of Ragnarok so much more rewarding. After everything he has done and been through he has finally earned his happy ending and his redemption.
Kratos is essentially a product of his upbringing. Everyone in youth starts off innocent & pure. Only through processing the pain & adversity’s faced can a person still maintain their good within them. For some people, though? That built up anger & bitterness is permanent.
This was great to watch as I do miss old kratos than dad of boy. Honestly, I was really hoping you’d talk about the Kratos and sweet tooth conversations from PlayStation battle royale lol
@@godzillazfriction nah bro old gow are play alot thats why he said i miss old kratos he want more new games with young kratos atleast one short game with young kratos
Excellent video! And great job showcasing Kratos's motivations and layers in the original run of games. Devil's advocate, what games journalists are clumsily trying to say is that "Greek Kratos"'s primary motivation is vengeance, whereas "Norse Kratos"'s primary motivation is love - respecting his dead wife's wishes, teaching his son to be better, keeping the demons at bay - it's a more relatable and nuanced character trait, than having succumbed to his (arguably justified) rage. Fantastic vid and congrats on the 1M! 💚
You know, not to be one of those guys, but it's interesting to see you here. Back when I was at peak wrestling fandom, I used to watch you, Dalyxman and Foolkiller99 religiously.
19:33 Although it is heavily implied that all the destruction from killing Greek Gods is world-wide, from God of War 2018 you can infer that it was localized, possibly to Greece or just the Mediterranean area, so I don't really see it as a ret-con as much as a sequel to a vague end of God of War 3
@@jalenwise9800 Yes, because each pantheon is it's own world, not planet because it is infinite, with the seas, sky and cosmos being so, and in the norse pantheon they have there own realms which are basically universally infinite, which also has the world tree which contains all of existence, which does not exist in the greek world.
@@stormzy-_-4238 I think the simpler interpretation is that the Greek gods rule over Greek lands, not necessarily their own _literal_ worlds, but rather their own realms - regions.
@@Resi1ience Although some would think it would be different lands, and kratos just travelled by foot, some would say it is different realms/worlds, etc
Kratos is one of my favorite protagonists ever. Everything about him is just so well done, from his design to his glimpses of humanity, and even his temper tantrums
Watching this video brought me a new admiration for Ragnarok Kratos. How he carries himself through his actions, his own acknowledgment of how he can slip back into his senseless killing in GoW3, and how much he is terrified of losing his son due to his past.
I'm a woman myself, and I watched the entire GOW series cutscenes from beginning to end. He isn't mysoginistic, he kills Gods of any gender XD And his grief is for two women, his wife and daughter. I don't get how he's seen as sexist??? Kratos is an awesome character and I love his story! He's brutal, badass, but also really misguided by revenge. Everyone he ever meets seems to die, minus GOW4 though. I kinda like him better in 1-3 than 4 because the rage filled Kratos is honestly cooler XD But it's good that he had redemption.
The reason why games journalists claim that GOW is sexist is because of the sex mini games.... and that's the only reason. Just people trying to make a quick buck out of complaining about something so minuscule.
@@ilikebeanies3499 Something I've noticed as time has gone by is that there will be people who get offended at literally *anything* and use that to voice their opinions, whether or not those opinions make sense.
Why is everyone so against revenge? Kratos was treated APPALLINGLY. Why shouldnt he have wanted revenge? Not saying I approve his methods.... but turning the other cheek is simply enabling evil people.
Hades was definitely the one god with the most creative liberty taken in his depiction in the games. Dude was pretty chill in the actual mythologies, only becoming a player in a conflict due to the hero of the week trying to mess with the natural order of things.
I think a key point you missed is that when Kratos decides to choose humanity over himself at the end of God of War 3, he says "My vengeance ends now." It is Kratos finally admitting to himself that he is responsible for his problems. It's a beautiful ending detail that really must be praised.
13:12 I'd say that it takes that much strength not just because it's emotionally difficult for him, but also because he wanted to get her off of him without hurting her.
I think the villain in the games was always Athena. She was the one who asked Ares to leave Kratos alive. She was the one always telling Kratos what to do next. Even in the end of GOW remastered, she wanted Kratos to give her the hope to give it to mankind but she would've never done that and Kratos by killing himself actually gave the power to the world. Athena even said: They won't know what to do with it, showing she intended to keep it for herself
Athena in GoW 1 was decent to hbe fair, she just became a manipulative asshole after Kratos opened Pandora's Box and infected the gods with the evils of manking. We know Zeus got Fear, Ares got Grudge, Poseidon got Rage, Aphrodite got Lust (probably), Hermes got Arrogance, Hercules got Ambition etc And Athena got Greed. In GoW II novelization, she says that Olympus was upside down and how stuff was changed and different and she was no exception: saying, that, for times, her mind just wandered and she just did stuff and said stuff she didn't remember.
I always assumed Kratos did take blame for the murder, he's referenced it a few times. Even in 3 saying "I'm sorry...." and blaming ares for the setup.
Agreed w everything in the video up until GOW4. I don’t think Kratos’s characterization was built to be “oscar-based” or “standard good-guy” or even that that particular genre has become tiresome. I really just think they wanted to emphasize the fact that Kratos has become older, and (typically) with age comes wisdom. Kratos is wiser, and now that he has someone else to live for (Atreus) he has to cling to the little humanity he has left and build upon it for the sake of his *BOY*. I think it’s a perfect way to continue his story, quite honestly. He’s burnt out from being the monster he once was, and all he wants now is to become better, which he even says multiple times throughout the game. Don’t sleep on God of Boy, man. Yes, it’s different from the main line of GOW games, but it’s for a good reason. Not just to appeal to modern gaming (completely, anyway)
I am so glad someone said this! The way they are building the story makes sense, they didnt want to just make 'another god of war game', their development of kratos wasnt just to appeal to the modern audience, it was because they know people are done with angry man kratos and people would prefer a new type of kratos, A man trying to be better and to give Kratos a second chance to be a father again and make up for all his mistakes as a father and as a man.
Absolutely! I think it's the perfect progression for the character. God of War 3 is basically a psychotic episode for Kratos, who stops at nothing to achieve his revenge. All that rage and bloodshed happens maybe in the span of one day, and is basically Kratos' version of a mental breakdown where he destroys everything and everyone on his way. After all the pain, destruction and basically genocide, it would honestly make no sense to keep him acting the same way after the adrenaline dies down. He has to eventually own up to his actions and try to be a better person and that's what he does in God of War 4, so it's not generic, it just makes sense.
Yeah honestly after having played and experienced it for myself I felt it was much the opposite of Kratos being an oscar baitey wise man who knows everything character, sure he's wise, but often enough I found him fairly quiet during moment when a normal goody two shoes would give the perfect answer to everything. Kratos is headstrong and makes nifty little snarky or annoyed comments, or just stays quiet during a lot of things, silently judging letting others do the work, but also opening up sometimes when he feels like it. And slowly growing to open up more over the course of the game. I was reminded of this video and other critical perceptions and just had to think that Kratos, surprisingly, feels very much like the same character as the in the original games. Don't get people's problem with either dissing the old for being super edgy or the new for being an "oscar" game while both are neither. Looking forward to Ragnarök.
The only issue with killing Poseidon’s princess for me is that damn trophy that trivializes the story beat. The act itself within the context of the story works and makes sense. That stupid “I didn’t do it…but I wish I did” trophy is what makes it fucked up in a meta-sense. I don’t know who’s idea that was, but whoever they were I can tell you that I don’t respect them at all.
Kratos always had some depth to him. I think just the insane change in his character from 3 to 4 make it stand out so much and it was the first time his character went through a development like that
''If all on olympus will deny me my vengeance, then all on olympus will die''. He didnt crave the destruction of entire olympus. Maybe he even wanted to CHANGE olympus, to make them better, turn them from dickheads to gods who actually care about mortals. But he wasnt given a choice, zeus was afraid of being overthrown so he sent all the gods into the blender even someone as petty as hermes. Kratos would not have killed Hera either, he was aware that she posed no threat whatsoever but only killed her when she talked shit about pandora. Hercules would not have died either.
Yea kratos literally told Hercules that he didn’t want to fight him but Hercules decided to get in the way of kratos getting his revenge so kratos killed him
And Hercules decided to fight kratos over jealousy seeing how kratos was outshining Hercules while they were both serving the gods and doing their tasks
Please correct me if i'm wrong, but iirc he didn't kill Aphrodite. At least you don't see him do it. Also Athena is still there since she pulls the sword out of him after he stabbed himself. Doens't that mean the pantheon does still exist in some form?
@@Equinoksl somewhat I agree. I think four gods survived his attack. Athena who is some kind of specter, Aphrodite who survived for very tempting reasons, Artemis who if I remember right didn't even appear in the game, and the god of wine. Seriously I doubt he would have tried to kill Kratos. Just offered some booze
in 19:35 he went to a completely different universe which is the main reason why everything isn't destroyed, its not retconned, he still destroyed an entire world and had to live with that knowledge, getting ptsd like trauma from in before the events of god of war 4
This is an absolutely amazing and great character breakdown. And in my opinion, it makes the way he's shown in the new games even greater. Too go from being that broken, and growing to be almost human again, shows a lot of internal strength. I especially love how you explained how much effort it took him to leave his daughter. Absolutely amazing explanation.
This is nothing unusual. I've always known that Kratos was never a complete bad guy but was forced to be enraged due to tragic life that followed him. If I lost my own family for the same reason, I'd also be engulfed in flames of rage and wouldn't be the same "Mr. Nice guy" anymore
I loved GOW3 so much because its the point where he finally breaks and becomes absolutely ruthless. He doesn't care about anyone, and doesn't care what happens to them.
The thing is, Kratos from GoW1 to 3, has nothing more to lose and bet than his own life, except times when he has to care for Caliope or Pandora... In GoW4 and Ragnarok, the thing is not just about him, but about Fey's will and the Boy. Having something to fight besides your own life or revenge, changes everything always.
Edit: hey everyone, if you're watching this video as of November 16th 2022, you may notice there are a few parts missing from this video. This video was flagged for self-harm, so I cut a few parts and submitted the video to UA-cam support for a second look. And it has since been reinstated. I will eventually revert the video back to its original state so that those parts will be put back in. But I will do so only once the heat has died down.
I want to say first of all, I know there are other similar videos on this topic, but I made sure specifically not to watch any of them so that I know everything I'm saying is my own words. If I repeat anything from those videos, I assure you, it's a pure coincidence.
I barely ever played any GoW but I think you narrate it pretty well
I think more then anything else in the new games and in the books that go over his transition into the new world he’s in it showing with the new things in his life he’s learned to temper his anger and his trauma and is still going over in the new games
Best one I've seen, I'll share this everytime I see some jagaloons that say similar things. Also the DC comic explain the gods azzholian ways along with the first 2 books.
id like to point out that in 19:35 he went to a completely different universe which is the main reason why everything isn't destroyed, its not retconned, he still destroyed an entire world and had to live with that knowledge, getting ptsd like trauma from in before the events of god of war 4, but seeing that this is an old video its ok
I appreciate you for making this video, it was a good one! It’s nice to know other people think the same way 😄
The gentleness in kratos Voice when he is with his daughter truly shows how much he loves her now I see why it was so hard for him to grow close to his son
That was one part of it but I think he also doesn't quite know how to raise a child either. Even with his daughter, Kratos was a Spartan general on campaigns, while his wife had control of the household. When u get to GoW4 he doesn't quite know how to raise a child alone so he's forced to fall back on the only thing he knows about raising another person from his experience. He starts to give Atreus spartan training and discipline. At least that's my head cannon of why Atreus only starts to train with his dad after his mom dies. It could just be that Atreus was always so sickly and frail that Kratos struggled to get close to him, lest Kratos either hurts him or loses him but I'm still a bit lost on when Atreus was sick outside of when he was little.
@@1ProAssassin It was purely a plot device. Apparently not knowing your nature can straight up nerf and harm you in the GoW universe. Kratos damn sure didn't know his true nature and he did very well as a general until he almost got clapped by a a basic looking Barbarian guy so maybe there's some merit to the concept XD
@@w47765 it doesn't make him weak just because he doesn't know his nature, he just can't reach his full potential
@@w47765 I wouldn't say it was purely a plot device, since Kratos has reasons to choose to be distant from his son. First and foremost, he seems to know that his son's sickness is due to his own nature, since it ultimately is the rage within Atreus that makes him ill. Seeing that Kratos spent his life letting his own rage control him, to the point of murdering his wife and daughter, he probably felt that staying away and letting Faye deal with Atreus would be best. Also, in the games there is the recurring theme of children killing their fathers (Zeus killed Cronos, Kratos kills Zeus), so Kratos had all the more reason to be fearful of what might happen if he stayed close to Atreus, and what effects it might have on his son. Lastly, Kratos might just not know how to deal with having a son, and deal with the constant ptsd trigger of what he did to his old family. He might just be afraid of losing control of his own rage, and killing Atreus, which is why as the game progresses, Kratos allows himself to grow closer to his son. But keep in mind that during the first two acts of the game, Kratos tries to physically touch his son but backs off, because he doesn't know how to show affection. For him, being distant might have been the best course of action to protect his son
It's a animated drawing.
I always loved that the only thing Pandora had to say to be free of Kratos's grip was "You're hurting me". He instantly let her go, pure dad reflex.
I did not think of it that way damn...
Nice catch!
i think he let her go because he saw zeus
@kmtheO Zeus wasn't even there yet
@@R0n17 by the end Kratos did not want to sacrifice Pandora for his revenge, if only Hephaestus hadn't tried to kill Kratos he would also been alive. Kratos is brutal and relentless but so is nearly all spartans.
In my opinion Ares won in the end. He created the perfect worrier who made Olympus fall which was Ares goal.
He did succeed but not in the way he expected/hoped since he wanted to rule Olympus
@@darkemperortheobscureone694
Yes! Ares end goal was to overthrow Zeus using Kratos. Sadly for him, Kratos killed him! but hey, atleast he made sure the rest of olympus would follow. So, that is another chance for the god of war to try and rule the olympians in the after life
Well his soul is still tortured so nah
In Kratos' word, he succeeded. He just didn't live long enough to see it.
*Warrior*
My take is that the Kratos we meet in the Norse games is who he really was deep down, without constant abuse and tragedy he would be this serious but calm man who loves his family and cares for others; The pantheon took that from him leaving this angry husk of a man that did the equivalent of an animal backed into a corner
When you treat a man as a animal starve him beat him isolate him he will become an animal
they released his fight or flight mode
This.
Yup. In GOW 2018 it broke my heart seeing Kratos be genuinely afraid of the chaos blades. That pause before wrapping them around his arms, only accepting it because it was what he had to do for his son.
Greek Kratos was raised as a Spartan warrior, lost his family to the gods
Norse Kratos is just a dad with issues, nothing of the great warrior he used to be in the past
The PSP games were a goldmine in terms of Kratos's character development, particularly his relationships with his daughter, mother and brother
Very facts true truth + true
"Development" so he changes his views and actions? Or does he do the same thing over and over?
@@colinnixon7739 That’s character progression. Character development is fleshing out the character.
Ghost of Sparta was really the only game i had and played when i was a kid. but i kept up with the franchise and watched the games so i feel like i have a say lol loved GOS tho
Not only that but they performed fantastically for a psp
About that ‘leaving daughter’ scene: That button mash mini game is a lot harder than any other version of it in CoO or another GoW.
Let that sink in.
GOW was always that deep before the Norse Beginnings; This minigame ALONE proves that (There's also a lot more scenes and minigames that prove it, but none as much as THAT)
That also proves he didn't want to leave her but in doing so will kill her too
I haven't played it but it sure looks harder than fighting Baldur several times
I'm 400th like
I played that game and I felt it.
"Good character" doesn't automatically mean "morally good." Kratos is complicated, and the PS4 game was just the next step in his character development
You sum it up quite nicely and concisely.
TBH 4 was a good game, it just didnt feel like a GOW game
He's chaotic good
@@alphalax7747 can you please zip it with the alignment chart? It's a horrible metric for judging moral character, not to mention an outdated mechanic for a tripe game system.
@@comradesam3382 Indeed. I especially agree when it comes to the gameplay.
It also needs to be stated good character doesnt mean good person. Just means well written and complex
Bojack Horseman
@@shlokwaghela9560 Lmfao
@@xdictionary6162 Why?
@@shlokwaghela9560 I laughed becuase I was caught off guard seeing his name here but i agree😂
@@xdictionary6162 isn't a Kratos pfp guy named "The Gamer" commenting "Like Walter White." Is in place?
The ending of God of War 1 is made even more painful for a couple of reasons. 1) He tries to end his own life to finally end the pain and the gods then "reward" him with immortality. His sanity is hanging on by a thread and the only thing that kept him from ending it sooner was his belief in the promise that the gods would take the pain away and his need to get revenge on Ares, but then they tell him that there is no chance that his pain will ever go away as long as he lives and then they make it so he can never die. And they call it a "reward" or believe it is a gift for his service when it's the exact opposite of what he wants. 2) Before jumping Kratos says, "Now there is no Hope." But according to the ending of God of War 3, Kratos used the power of Hope in order to defeat Ares. He absorbed Hope, in its purest form, but his guilt and depression are so much that he can't feel that Hope inside of him at all. His depression is so much that even Hope can't escape it causing him to want to end his own life.
Yup.
I love that other people are willing to see how deep Kratos is. He isn't a "Good guy" but he is sympathetic to an extent.
And people suck the djcks of those yandere characters whom are power fantasy garbage
@@Kainpound Truly a breath of fresh air
Funny enough, Athena does say "Complete this final task, and your sins will be forgiven". I think Kratos mistook Athena's words as they would erase his memory so I don't think it's right to blame Athena for Kratos assuming Athena was going to erase his memory. However, I do agree that it's messed up that the Gods reward Kratos with immortality after he tried to kill himself. Even in the GOW book Ares and Athena mention that Kratos is quite insane but I guess, if we want to go there, to Athena, have Kratos replace Ares basically meant trading one blood thirsty son of Zeus for another.
Another great character moment that always stuck with me was his conversation with hercules. You can tell that he has no desire to kill hercules because he has no reason to fight him. He hasn’t wronged him in any way. Hell they haven’t even had a single interaction before gow 3. He even calls him brother which shows he has some respect for hercules. But by the end of the fight, Kratos lets his rage consume him and he devolves back into a bloodthirsty monster. Adds a layer of tragedy to that fight. If Kratos from ascension was in the same fight, I don’t think he would’ve killed him. And even if he did ascension kratos wouldn’t have killed him in such a brutal way.
Self defense dude I don’t care who u are, you don’t put your hands on people
@@thetest8777 that’s fair.
@@CED-ue6ww unless you're kratos or some higher magical human
Hercules was, at that point, willing to destroy the entire arena just to get rid of kratos, all for his personal ambition and sense of missed glory. Kratos wasn't doing anything wrong by punching Hercules to dust. If Kratos didn't do anything, he would have been dead.
The visceral nature of how a guy dies mid-combat is irrelevant. To kratos it's just a means to an end. Hercules had everything coming to him that Kratos gave him. But I think people tend to focus on the sheer brutality of a kill, rather than the actual context of it.
So no, I don't think Kratos from ascension would have spared Hercules. Hercules was a threat to him, so he had to go down, plain and simple.
@@RedFloyd469 Hercules no hubiera muerto si simplemente no fuera tan egocentrista.
Incluso Hercules podria haber pedido piedad a kratos si hubiera querido, dando una pequeña oportunidad de que kratos no lo mate, aun asi kratos esta en todo su derecho de matarlo.
Everyone: Praise GOW 2018 for "Finally being mature and with a good story."
OG GOW Fans: "And here I thought your kind were supposed to be so enlightened, so much...better than us, so much smarter."
How much that line fits
"Finally being mature and with a good story."
No one that has played the God of War series would say that.
I never gave a second thought to all the slaughter, that we did as Kratos, the very least because we knew his story, and we liked that story.
The fact that the first game even had a story was just a bonus, we like killing things in games. It's just a game, after all.
When I found out that Kratos would have a bit of further character development in the final game only caused me to worry that they will ruin the character. But after It came out, I found out that his character development made sense in regards to the games history, and we still get to kill things.
Patriarchy? Misogyny? Give me a break! That's not the type of bullshit that people play GoW would even cross their minds.
That was smooth
😂😂😂👏👏👏💯💯💯
I love it, but what if the reference?
I think what a lot of people forget about Kratos is that he's supposed to be the Protagonist of a Greek Tragedy, he gets what he wants in the end (Especially At the end of Valhalla) but by then, it's come at a very great cost.
His story starts as a copy of hercules tale.
@@odoggow8157 which is ironic, you'd think this Hercules and him would be allies and not enemies
@@thatitalianlameguy2235 they could've been allies, or at the very least acquaintances, but it was Hercules' pride that made that go left. Kratos had no beef with him, but he took the attention of Zeus that Hercules craved so immensely for the majority of his life, and he couldn't let that go, and that was his downfall
I was just thinking the same thing
GOW 1: Loses his family
GOW 2: Loses the trust of the pantheon
GOW 3: Destroys Olympus
GOW 4: Starts Ragnarok
GOW 5: Lets go of his son
Valhalla: Lets go of his trauma
I honestly love all the main line God of War games. I do agree that kratos's story arc in the fourth game felt really safe and done before. But it felt like the natural progression of his character. A man can only continue to get more angry and depressed after so long and after killing literally everything then himself. The fourth game felt like a breath of fresh air.
True though I don't think we can call it a reboot
@@dimitrischronis146 exactly it's part of his character development every God of war done great developing kratos's character
What do you mean reboots?
When was there ever even one reboot?
@@Omega-jg4oq I think Ragnorak will fix this for us.
Me too bro my favorite is god of war 1 or 2
19:37 Kratos destroying the world wasn't retconed, the Greek Mythology world is still destroyed, Kratos just ended up in the Norse Mythology world by heading north. Dad of Boy even shows other mythologies and travel between them by people like Tyr and Mimir, hell Mimir even admits he's from the Celtic Mythology world originally.
I always thought he had a Irish accent
Talk to em!
so technically, only the Greek mythology side of the world was 'Destroyed' and everything else like Japanese and Norse mythology was fine? now that sounds like a form of genocide on Kratos part, But to be fair the Greek gods had it coming.
@@wdp1a73r if only the god fulfil kratos wish instead of ignoring it
@@wdp1a73r
Yeh, though when Kratos killed each of the gods. He unleashed a terrible disaster upon the world. Wouldn’t those tragedies be still in that world, unless, travelling far enough from one land allows you to cross a barrier of some kind where they have their own way of operating. If that’s the case, then I agree with you!
It's just like Mimir said, "The pantheon had it coming." They toyed around with the mortals' lives so much for too long that one had enough and brought them down. Kratos just wanted peace and the Gods used him. He realized that they weren't the good wise all-powerful beings that they are said to be, they were selfish tyrants. He wanted vengeance for what they did to him and his family.
Kratos and his spartans were literally destroying and conquering greece and the gods told him repeatedly to stop. They were literally too lenient on him and should have stopped him earlier.
@@Xer405 if you're referring to when Kratos served ares, that was ares not Kratos, which is why they told Kratos to kill ares. If you're referring to gow 2, that was a point in time where Kratos was very angry with the gods so he was fucking wit them by conquering their cities cuz he was bitter. That moment was the calm b4 the storm, Kratos didn't like the gods one bit, but still decided to exist with them until Zeus killed Kratos and all of him soldiers.
@@Xer405 yeah, that happened after Kratos realize that Zeus raped his mother and kidnapped Deimos due to Oracle's prophecy and let's not forget that both his mother and brother died because of Gods action....
@@GamerConnoisseurRei I mean sure but he is still responsible for the death of his first family lmao mf literally slaughtered them
@@Xer405 mortal lives should not concern the gods that much regardless not as much involvement as they had with Kratos even though it did not happen like dat as you say
People seem to ignore his interaction with Deimos, Spartan soldier, Pandora and Ares son. Especially with Pandora death he finally accepted how his revenge has cause destruction to innocent people, that was the point he started to move towards better future rather than going solely for revenge.
There also was no one left alive who wronged him.
Literally the ending of god of war 3 shows kratos realizing what he had done and that ultimately the revenge he achieved wasn’t worth it in the end.
“Pandora’s sacrifice was in vain. She died because of my need for vengeance”
@@ninjafrog6966 I don't believe it was in vain, Kratos does though. With his final sacrifice, releasing hope without it having a dedicated owner he resets the cycle of life. Everything that was rotten is gone.
@@brodude7194 but it was in vain. The box was empty, he already had the hope/power to kill Zeus in him all along
@@wiseforcommonsense I think the message goes deeper. He may have had it since the first time around but hope isn't something you "equip" and then use it at will. You have to unlock it each time. Pandora helped with it. Kratos could only beat Zeus when he was cocky and subsequently in despair, unlocking hope again. Zeus weakened had no power to resist a foe that is dead and still stands up, breaking his will.
And that's the message Kratos left behind.
Hope belongs to everyone not just one single entity, and each has to unlock it.
This is why I love Kratos. A lot of people only know him as the angry guy who killed all the Greek gods, but there's a lot more to him than his anger
He Wanted To Do what every man wants to do he just wanted to protect those he cared about and keep his home safe and prosperous He Didn't Ask To Be Created Because Of Zeus's Stupid Mindset Of Arrogance.
Part of the issue might be exposure to just GoW3. “Lack” of plot and motivation because it is entirely an extension of 2’s plot and motivation, but without playing 2 it’s just angry man killing gods cause he wants to kill gods
@@hubguy yeah, GOW3 literally picks up right from the end of GOW2 and I know some people don't bother playing previous games in a series if they start from sequel
@@SebasTian58323yeah 3 is just the final act after 5 games, cant really expect to know the characters if you only know the end of their story
In a way its kind of fitting. In the games everyone thinks Kratos is nothing but angry brutal man in the initial trilogy and everyone thinks he is a mean but stoic person in the 4th one
Only the players who experienced Kratos's tragedy with him can understand him better
"Wait, Kratos is a good character?!"
"Always has been"
New gen kids be dumb like that, commenting on a game that came out before they were born.
He killed millions and destroyed the world but has always been a good man? Have you ever seen the oryginal games? He was a murderer, sadist and psychopat.
Kratos is good but the gods ruined his life made him a monster
@@Shadz2025 Honestly he was a Spartan before the gods did anything and go look at some of the things Spartans used to do especially to little boys
@SOUL SEEKER same
“Game journalism is the corpse that keeps twitching” couldn’t have said that better myself lol
Unfortunately it's not a corpse. It's very much alive, grossly fat in it's voracious devouring of great media in name of woke
Let's be honest: Game Journalist are mostly hacks. They either don't know how play the game and complain about it being " too hard" or won't pay attention to the game overall and just want blast through so they get their reviews out so the can get paid. Sometimes both
Sad part is to these people who put no effort into “reviewing” these games negatively affect a lot of the developers, story writers, etc.
Average gamers can give a better review than those game journalists. Since we actually play and enjoy the games without skipping cutscenes and shit.
I love all God of War games. God of War 3 being the most brutal but one of my favorite ones.
@@Awesmman the sonic series
That narrative about GOW not being deep until recently is pure history revision. The series has always been very mature in more ways than just sex and violence
Always hated people saying he was nothing but a mindless killing machine and monster. He was never mindless but he was made to be a killing machine and turned into a monster. i hate how people ignore his character development throughout the last 7 games because the violence is what is remembered. Everything they love about GoW 4 and 5 was well established in the last games only thing they built on was him working on controlling his anger. Kratos is still the same old kratos, with these games just being much more story rich then the last games. which to be fair is a lot easier to do with todays games and technology then it was back in 2005. games then you could buy and beat in a day if you actually wanted now thats simply not a thing for most triple A games as they have become so long and story rich.
And yet we don't see nothing in screem or out of it that isn't sex or violence
Even the way how the characters talks seems goofy
@@strenuousspider9525 Nad what was Kratos develooment pre-2018?
That's how it always is with these kinds of things. "Ew, it's edgy and gory, it's probably as deep as a 14 year old's diary". A lot of people simply refuse to accept anything of that nature.
It's sad how people nowadays think that showing cutscenes every 5 seconds and having cringy banter between characters passes for good narative 🤷♂️
This is a bit late but in Spartan Culture, suicide was paramount to turning your back on your Culture family and every value they stood for so that makes Kratos jumping off that much more impactful
He already lost all that
TBF he's called the ghost of sparta, he's already a disgrace.
@@pxolqopt3597 At the point he tried killing himself Sparta still existed
@@anima94 well the man reach his limit. He views himself as honorless and his loved are dead both by his actions and the gods actions. When jump off he took a good time to contemplate willing himself to jump means he still feeling held back on staying on his spartan honor but willed himself nothing more than a broken man that wants peace to reunite with his family in the afterlife
Another thing to remember is that in Greek mythology the "hero" was not always a good person. They were the protagonist who has been given a quest to accomplish and you see this in characters like Heracles who did absolutely monstrous things in their stories but are still considered heroes.
Yes
I always saw kratos as an amalgamation of all the greek heroes.
@@N.I.A23 he's based primarily off of Hercules who killed his own family in his madness
@@Onikag he also got parts from the others.
He has athena at his aid like odeyssey
He got the gifts/powers from the other gods like Pandora (if you want to count her)
He killed a gorgon like perseus. Etc...
They gave him a cool part from every tragic greek tale.
He killed the Hydra instead of Hercules, the Minotaur instead of Theseus, Medusa instead of Perseus, freed Prometheus instead of Hercules
list goes on
For those wondering: Spartan male citizens *were* groomed into war from a very tender age. When a Spartan Male citizen was born he was taken by a significant member of society (priests come to mind) to be examined for genetic/physical deformities. If they were deemed 'unfit' they would literally be cast off a cliff and left to die of exposure and/or wild animals.
Males were allowed to live in their birth home until the age of 8 years old, at which point "Agoge" aka "The Raising" began. Spartan boys lived with each other from their 8th to 21st birthdays and certain parts of their training included being left in the wilderness to fend for themselves, stealing whatever they needed. The act was not punishable unless they were caught and in fact Spartan youths were even *Encouraged* to straight up murder helots (the slave class of Spartan society) to conceal their crimes. There were in fact ceremonial parts of the year in Spartan society where the youths were set loose on Helots to terrorize them to ensure they remembered their place in society.
On top of this Spartan males were also given their education in philosophy; learning their numbers and letters among others. "Proper" spartan males were essentially the noble elite 20 some percent of society. Also worth pointing out that while many get an idea that women belonged in the kitchen in early society, Spartan women were also groomed not just in tending the homestead but being viciously ready to protect it themselves if the army was out and away and in some ways even ruled over the males of society.
In a twist of irony, while many consider Athens "The birthplace of democracy", Sparta was a very egalitarian society where women had an equal say in courts and in many cases actually had significantly more influence at court than Athenian women did.
Spartans were also extremely big on heroism and standing up to your enemy, no matter the odds, go down swinging and never give up. I recall passage of one of the Spartan 300 setting off for Thermopylae, wherein one of the wives of the men setting of was handing him his shield. She gave him very simple instructions "Come home with this shield, or upon it", basically either return victorious or die fighting and return being carried on his shield for burial.
It should also be noted that Spartans were formally banned from any combat sports in the Olympics because they were too cutthroat and even if they were losing horribly, it'd be a worse shame to return home a loser. Therefore, there were Spartan youths who made their opponents kill them to avoid that fate- which saps the fun out of what the Olympics was supposed to be.
@@MrDefault08 “sap[ping] the fun” is certainly not the _first_ thing I’d think of when describing spartans wanting to be killed after defeat but i guess it’s not untrue
That is so fucking cool to know. Thank you for sharing this.
@@renmcmanus “source: trust me bro”
Its not a competition, my guy. Nobody’s saying women haven’t suffered thing’s men don’t, but pretending that men don’t also suffer is ignorant
@@renmcmanus Look another feminist bitching and making herself look as a victim.
Honestly, after the ending of Ragnarok, I am so excited for Kratos's future. Where he almost cries as to what the future may hold for him. Something he wasn't even able to imagine.
For the first time, I think Kratos actually has a dream and it's beautiful.
Nah he did cry, it was really great to see
I got so teary-eyed when he realized he could become someone who is *worthy* of being worshipped.
I hope kratos becomes the hold of peace once he reaches his point
Valhalla was a great epilogue for the game that explored just that. And now kratos finally found the inner peace that was lacking for him for so long, came to terms with his past and accepted the role as the new god of war and hope of the Norse world
Thank you for this. The narrative that Kratos was a "shallow character" is one of the most disingenuous sentiments in all of gaming. But it goes to show how short attention spans are, how often the masses can succumb to group-think, how easily copy-pasting a popular formula wins over critics, and just how little gaming journalists actually know about writing.
Kratos IS a shallow character. There is no depth to him. Not then, not now.
@@cafre289 Sorry but I have to say this, that assessment is pure Bullshit. Tell me how he shows shallow character and lack of character development?
@@ravenmunnin8109 Because he never shows an evolution or mutation of character, there is no development. There is no depth to his character. He wants vengeance for his family, but he killed thousands and thousands of innocents families, and he never reflected on what he did.
He blames the gods for despising humanity, but he is a god and despised humanity, and never intended to make a difference in that matter.
There is no depth or evolution. Just a one dimensional being.
@@ravenmunnin8109 6 games. Same personality in the first, and in the last. No evolution.
@@cafre289 u make a fair point
It's stupid that most people who played GOW 2018 never played or care to play the original Greek saga to see how Kratos' character developed over 6 games
Sony marketed gow 2018 as a reboot, so I played that without playing the other games 1st. I noticed a lot of nods to past entries while playing that I wasn't able to fully appreciate.
I wish there was a gow collection on ps4, I don't want to play them on the cloud or dig up and re hook my ps3 then have to hunt down ps3 collection copies at gamestop or ebay.
@@KingDDDuke I actually prefer to play PS2 era games on my actual PS2 console. You play the game as its original form and brings more nostalgia when going back. Also, sometimes when trying port games from that era to modern consoles can ironically downgrade the quality of the games, the perfect examples were the PS3 Ratchet & Clank original trilogy collection and Deadlocked.
@@KingDDDuke That was one of the most stupid choices Sony made. The new game ain't no reboot, it's most certainly a sequel and is completely enriched by playing the originals. Sony did a real disservice to people by trying to convince everyone that God of War 4 is a reboot. Absolutely absurd.
@@Omega-jg4oq It certainly is the worst GOW
@@Omega-jg4oq It’s so cute when nerds get stuck in nostalgia. Enjoy never enjoying anything new.
I Want To Point Out That Even In GOW3, Where He's Considered Completely Ruthless, He Still Shows Some Humanity Towards The Other Gods. He Tried To Talk Sense Into Hercules, Tried To Avoid Fighting Hermes, Tried To Leave Hera Alone, Tried To Give Helios A Chance, But They All Pushed Him. It's Easy To Ignore The Little Things When His Violence Is Louder, But The Fact Remains He Gave Them A Chance And They Kept Provoking Him.
@Dichang Feng Whoa, Didn't Know That, That's Interesting
And being with pandora resurrected his fatherly side since she reminded him of his daughter
@Dichang Feng @Dichang Feng Kratos was inspired by cratos, the Greek God of strength and brute power. That Hercules inspiration is a misconcept.
In Ascension, Kratos helps people for absolutely no reason. Random people. He repaired the aquafer and pushed a guy out of harms way. This was a random ass guy who was never brought up again.
@@aeoyndjuric1679 Gods betraying others is not a new event. And that IS a choice, its just one they would likely refuse. At that point they CHOSE to risk their lives for Zeus.
"The obsession of being mature comes of ironically immature" that is really great it makes me think back then a lot of the times when i just cringe at myself of thinking about my past past self, right now i just think cringing at myself back then just looks so immature, I think i can appreciate the steps I've taken myself more than to bash on it.
That a good way of looking at it
It's a modern take on a classic quote, I think by C.S. Lewis. "When I became a man, I put away my childish things, including my fear of being seen as a child."
I don't think Kratos destroyed the "entire world" at the end of God of War III, but merely the entire "Greek World". This explains why Scandinavia would still be around and untouched by the destruction that Kratos caused.
The ancient Greeks were also extremely full of themselves so labeling their world as "the world" makes sense thematically speaking.
They explained he traveled to a completely different realm. Two wolves dragged him as he was unconscious and he woke up in the new world. So the new God of takes place on a different "world"
At that point in time, the entire world means literally that. Norse world hasn’t existed nor planned yet.
@@southeastpaw1722 but it is still explained to be a different realm entirely. It is not a reason like the video said
@@austinkenyon6178 does that explanation have existed in GOW 3, or it’s only added in GOW 4?
@@southeastpaw1722 well no shit it didn't exist during god of war 3. Im explaining that it wasn't a retcon. It was just an explanation on why the norse world wasn't affected. Because the Greek world and Norse world are two different things
Something not enough people bring up in that scene with Pandora is that she doesn't break free from his grasp, since not even the gods seem able to do that - he LETS go when she says he's hurting her. The look of shock on his face makes me think he had an instant where he didn't see Pandora, but Calliape. THAT'S what makes him let go.
I thought it was because he saw Zeus standing there
@@HouseofRedWine Rewatch the scene: Pandora yells "you're hurting me," he lets go, she runs to the box, then Zeus pops in front of her.
Even so many years ago they were so good at visual storytelling. Playing Ragnarok, even if it may be "safer" or whatever, is so satisfying to see how much they're able to fully realize their ambitions with modern technology
@@SmoothAsFelt tbh it does feel like a technical downgrade due to the lowered amount of enemies on the screen, the larger than life scenarios in 3 had such good graphics and performance, the titan fight took months to develop and it was worth it. The new gameplay style really hurts the spectacle
I always enjoyed the idea as well that characters always comment kratos is either slow, stupid or nothing without his strength when the first game is him pretty much only solving puzzles
And the people who say that end up getting fuckin killed...
Yeah, my favorite examples are the temple of Pandora, where those challenges were not only about brute force but also required a lot of intelligence as well, not to mention the fight against Cronos where instead of attacking directly in a stupid way, Kratos takes advantage of his small size to attack at strategic points to the body of Cronos to make him completely vulnerable to his mercy, there are examples throughout the Greek saga, demonstrating why Kratos certainly deserved his place as general of the Spartan army being such a good strategist.
His battle Iq is fucking high
That's actually a good point! Kratos could solve all of these puzzles, even the most complex ones of them. It just shows another aspect of his character which is intelligence.
The Thamur thick Ice Lake challenge proves his iq again:
M: "Not even Thor with Mjölnir at hand could break so much ice."
K: "Then Thor is a fool."
A: "Why are we climbing up this giant hammer?"
K: "Think."
A: "Okay... We can't find a way around the ice, so we need to break it, it is too thick for our weapons and magic won't work. So we'll need something ridiculously heavy to... ooooh."
As far as aesthetics go, I always thought the design of Kratos was really cool, especially the lore behind it. The scar on his right eye is from Ares (foreshadowing his servitude to him and is a reminder of his failure to save his brother), the red tattoo on his body is a tribute to his brother's mark, the the ghostly look is from his wife and daughter's ashes following his murder of them, and the scar on his chest comes from Zeus. Just a crazy cool look.
chest
you mean stomach?
And all of them has meaning and symbolization behind them. It's not just a cool little design thing that the dev thought out because they were edgy but it's actually a genuine marks of his life and shows the progression of Kratos's journey of revenge starting from the scar that would mark his future revenge and killing of Ares, the ashes of his family to signify the start of his revenge and eventual regression as a person due to his rage and anger, to the scars that Zeus gave him which mark the start of both the end of Zeus and the start of the second war of the giants
I really love kratos as a character.
A year ago I lost my fiancée to a housefire due to bad electrical from a bunch of slum lords
A year before I got evicted by a different group of slum lords.
And before that I had all my pets die(3 cats and 2 dogs) in the same year.
I’m 22 now and my entire adult life has been loss so far.( with quite a few good things as well)
I am still currently working on the rage building inside me. I’ve made good progress especially in one year.
Kratos hits home for me because growing up I always felt helpless. I grew up in an incredibly religious family and rarely got time to play GOW but when I did something felt different in me.
I looked at the world around me as I grew up and what my family told me felt wrong deep inside my heart.
I hated myself but then I felt powerless.
Kratos challenges the gods to escape his own destiny and to make his own legacy.
Seeing him be the best father he can is heartwarming to me. Like he finally got what he always wanted. Freedom and love. The chains on his arms always seared into him as if to say his fate was his legacy. He was a slave to forces beyond his power.
Kratos was stubborn and a born warrior so he said “No”
Damn, that's sad bro. I'm sorry.
Every person has their story to tell and yours is indeed powerful. Stay as powerful as an individual if not more powerful than the story you have✊🏾
Dare I ask what kind of religious upbringing your family forced upon you, and your objections to it?
Stay strong brother!
Why did you burn your wife?
imagine how much would mean a simple hug for Kratos, after all the death suffering and torture he went through, a simple act of kindness would mean the world to him
I honestly think that would be the best way to beat him cause I think he would just break down in tears
@@Flash_332 Something like Pig, the film from last year!
Press "O" to initiate the hug action
That's what Faye did to him. Giving him the second chance for a peaceful life he thought he lost after the death of his first family.
I think either Faye or Atreus would be one of the only few people who would give Kratos a hug
I dont get how anyone would say that he wasn't a good character in the original series!?!? The story was extremely captivating and he was a tortured soul that you really want to see get his revenge.
I know, right? Anyone saying he wasn’t a good character in the original series clearly knows nothing about making a truly great and amazing character.
i really can't think of any scene where he seemed misygonistic and so is a 'bad' character for critics, is it bc he killed female gods? that's just equality
Yeah That's just Game Journalists saying that garbage, any real gamer knows Game Journalism is run by a bunch hacks.
Absolutely agree. Everyone acts like he was just this angry for no reason one dimensional character when he wasn’t. His anger was for a reason. And to the 2018 fanboys, the older wiser kratos wouldn’t be the character you love in the new one if it wasn’t for his past. His past self is what makes when he’s older all the more beautiful and special:)
The blades of chaos scene in GOW 4 would not be emotional without the previous games. The previous games had a lot of impact on this scene since kratos is using the same blades that he used to kill his wife ,daughter and many people who deserved to be killed and those who did not and now he is using the same blades of chaos to save his son. The scene will never have an
impact on someone who has never played the old games. I had tears flowing from my eyes during that scene.
I actually thought he had good guy qualities in the first games, but he was so consumed by rage that not many saw it.
Same as Asura and Doomguy really. Sure they are defined by the rage and violence they portray, but when you pay attention, you see they are still people with complex feelings and motivations that drive them to these extremes. Asura is fairly similar to Kratos. Doomguy much less so since all we know is Doomguy has a sense of right and wrong, loved only his rabbit, and did always take violence to its logical extreme.
@@thomasallen9974 Yeah, I don't see how people can be so stupid. Either they don't pay attention or they skip shit. Because understanding a character is a basic human trait which those journalists obviously lack. They make me feel smarter for simply able to understand a character, story and game.
Kratos is one of the best and strongest video game characters ever. Both from a mental and physical standpoint.
I recently played Asura's Wrath Demo after finishing Kratos' Greek adventure and he immediately reminded me of Kratos. Consumed by rage, strong, yet still having humanity inside. I still gotta play the full game so can't really give a proper review.
Kratos has a lot of good guy moments
@@codafett But what about him always killing random mortals, whenever he encounters them? Shipcaptain, Princess, random guy on a window in olympus? i always thought..wtf?! why did he do this now?
@@derfuzzy8854 The Captain of the ship he explain in the books were he is a lot brutal, he says: "I hate cowards!" he left the man to die because the old man tried to flee leaving his man behind, and before they got in that Hydra situation they had a lot of trouble with that captain chasing him for days because he broke some kind of deal with Kratos and tried to flee.
On the note of GOW being more "grown up" I'll let this quote do the talking.
“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.”
― C.S. Lewis
These know nothing game "journos" are themselves infants.
*People I watched the video, this comment was a pre video thought.
Wow….that’s an awesome quote! I gotta remember that one!
Very well spoken
Hell yeah! I proudly watch my Ben 10s and read my Donald Ducks 🦆
I love this quote because the last sentence is classic subversion and elaboration. C.S. Lewis is a Christian, and the last sentence is actually an excerpt from 1 Corinthians 3:11 (When I was a man I put away childish things) which is what people, namely christians, use to justify the seriousness of being grownup and the desire to become "adult". Then he subverts it and says THAT. Kinda cool.
The guy from the video quotes this exact same quote near the end. Do people actually watch the whole thing?
I'd like to add a scene from GoW2. It is right after he learns that Sparta, his home, his people, are gone. Kratos ends up experiences so much rage that he pretty much breaks. As the Kraken comes up to kill him Kratos refuses to fight and any attempts to make him fight results in Kratos yelling lines of fury.
Think about that for a moment. Kratos is so pissed off and done with the gods. That he attempts suicide for a second time willing to allow the Kraken to kill him off so that he his rage may finally end. Rage so self-destructing that a man, a demi-god, whose power is fueled by his rage. Breaks because of it.
If Gaia didn't intervene Kratos would've died to the Kraken unable to go on any longer his own rage overwhelming the god of rage.
@@godzillazfriction
He would have let it kill him. Kratos is super strong but he isn't invincible. A child can kill an super heavy weight adult if they let them.
@@godzillazfriction
Yes actually I've seen the entire GoW series multiple times and I know very damn well how powerful the guy is.
But apparently you haven't. Because clearly you don't remember how defeated and willing Kratos was going to let himself die. If you did we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Also, when he sees his wife, the way he says 'Im so sorry my love' is so heartbreaking. TC Carson did such an amazing job with Kratos, I miss him
@@godzillazfriction you're missing his entire point. whether the kraken would've been able to kill a Kratos willing to die or not doesn't matter, its the fact that Kratos WANTED it to kill him. "dumbass."
@@godzillazfriction Dude. The very fact GAIA intervened THERE AND THEN, at least, shows that the Kraken could have done significant damage to him. It's not unreasonable to say the Kraken could kill him given how she was pretty much in a hurry to persuade him to keep fighting.
Fully and utterly agree. Finally had a chance to play GOW4 when it came to PC earlier this year, and while I absolutely loved Kratos' journey in that game; *none* of it would be as potent or as meaningful to me without the older games.
The themes of fatherhood especially are enhanced by the fact that, yes, Zeus *was* Kratos' father, and he treated him in a way that no father should. And I love that the writers play into that, with the Helheim story bit.
Kratos' buried rage hits a lot harder because you *know* him. You know what he's capable of, you've followed him through every major chapter of his life. You know the fury he keeps in check to pursue a better and less destructive life. But you also know why it has to come out.
He was always a good character, GOW4 just allowed him to start a journey towards being a *good person* . I would've been fine with him simply passing after the end of GOW3, with the Greek world rebuilding in his wake. But there is something interesting about an exiled Kratos trying to pick up the pieces and build some semblance of a decent life afterwards. All while clashing with a pantheon of Gods that's just as awful, if not more.
I can't wait to see what Ragnarok does with his story, and I hope they continue to keep the older games in mind when it comes to his characterization.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
I wouldn't call him a "good person" by the end of that game....
more like "neutral"
@@c.wubby.u861 Definitely not by the end of GOW4. But that's what I meant by "starting the journey". He took the biggest step towards that in the last game.
what was meaningful? The saccharine father son thing? Do you SERIOUSLY think Kratos would be that distanced from his son? He loved Calliope so much! He would have been close to Atreus from the day he was born. It doesnt work for me from the beginning
Very well said. Kratos's development in 4 is a very pleasant and interesting thing to see, and it's only enhanced by the six games he had in the Greek era that showcases how he changed as a person.
I've always hated how people talked about "young" kratos. They always say he's evil and had no reason for his actions (also calling him misogynistic) but you definitely laid it all out in a very informative way. To me he's basically a different version of Guts from Berserk. They were both betrayed and lost everything,which made them into the same monsters they were fighting against and to top it off people never understood Guts and the reason he was like that. Just 2 broken men trying to make it through the world.
Does that make zeus, Ares, or Athena Griffith?
Mysoginist how? Because he fucked consenting women to try and ignore his trauma? They're mysandrists for ignoring a man's feelings and why he became terrible in the first place
funnily enough I think Santa Monica would make a great Berserk game
Everywhere I go, I can't escape the Berserk references.
It truly is one of the best pieces of media ever.
GRIFFITH!!!!!!
One thing you forgot to mention was that in the end of GoW 3 Kratos was more focused on getting his revenge, and did not care about any of the powers acquired by the gods he had killed. In a moment he seems to be debating on giving the powers to Athena who he has seem to care about in GoW 2 and is shown to be the most selfless out of the gods, aiding Kratos in his quests, from when he was little, all the way till the very end. Making Kratos believe that she was different. It wasn’t until the end where she mistakenly revealed that she knew that there were evils in the box and hope to stop those evils, that Kratos realized that once again Kratos his entire life has been a pawn to them, to stop Ares. Upon retrieving the box of pandora the first time, the plot was for the evils to latch on to Kratos, and the hope to latch on to Zeus. Giving Kratos the madness, sins and evil to destroy Ares, and Zeus the hope needed to destroy Kratos when needed. They were trying to do the same thing as Areas was trying to do, which was to control kratos “the ultimate weapon” through torment and madness. That’s why whenever he did an useless task, all they did for him was offer him more power and riches. They though that the evils from the box could be controlled with fantasies of power. This is why the gods disapproved of Kratos using his powers as a god to do tasks that were not dictated by the gods themselves. This is also why Kratos actions of raining war upon the other cities of the other gods was seen as if the evils that were thought to be possessed by Kratos were becoming too much and they need to be stopped. But in reality it was the hope in Kratos that was able to see past the god’s masks and see that the gods were truly evil and they were a plague, and the evils that has latched on to Zeus made Zeus mad and made Zeus think that Kratos was a useless servant that was threatening his power, they could do anything to him. And why he ended up killing Kratos in GoW 2. Even when he came back Athena still thought that Zeus had the hope in him and Kratos had the evils. I think that It was till the beginning of GoW 3 when Kratos died for the 3rd time and managed to come back with hope of getting his revenge that Athena saw that Kratos was filled with hope. She helped him destroy Zeus. Once Zeus was destroyed, she expected Kratos “the dumb servant” to give up all the gods powers unto her, so she could become the next Queen goddess of Olympus. That’s when Kratos saw that she was no different than anyother god and she was as power hungry, sinful and Evil as all the others gods, willing to destroy anything in their path to have power. Kratos understood that to defeat the gods he had to be like the gods, but in his last moment he gave that up and did the most humane thing. He gave his life, his godness, powers and released the powers of the gods unto the world for the world to be free. Foiling Athena’s plans. Amongst all the gods, the god of war was the only good one. Even in god of war all the gods he kills that fought against him, all sought a selfish reason for their glory, power, godhood, etc. Kratos only did the things he did because he knew that the only way for the world to be at peace, was for there to be no gods. Including himself. Also taking his revenge.
just one thing, it is a accepted notion that the sins released from pandoras box, Greed, Specifically, gripped athena. She was actually truthful and caring about kratos up until she died, and there it is said she couldnt hold back the greed any longer and the sin took hold of her, hence her actions in gow 3 ending. Thats why her spirit form and she when she was alive are so seemingly different
Nice essay
& wit that being said (great record recovery btw) I just question how Pandoras box had hope in it? & How Athena didnt kno Kractos had it, werent u task'd with trying 2 recover this box at the very start of GoW??
best comment. This comment deserves a hole video on it .
Unbelievably good comment 👍
One thing I will always love about Kratos as a character is the fact that he embodies the very concept of drive and determination. If he wants something, whether it be revenge on someone who wronged him or a monster's heart to save his son, literally nothing is going to stop him. Not gods, not demons, not even the jaws of death itself can keep him from achieving his goal
i always like to think that him giving the power to the people at the end of 3 is just one last middlefinger to the Gods and puts him back on a better path.
Layer Cake
Especially to Athena, her reaction is priceless
we must be better!
God of War Ragnarok has made me tear up multiple times and how much Kratos has been through. His father son moments with Atreus is so amazingly done that I can’t help but smile to how far he’s come to return to being such a loving father. Such an amazing character that teaches so many lessons.
Gow 4 is kratos spirit meeting his sons spirit in valhalla
When he stopped his son from killing the deer. That scene was fucking heart wrenching.
@@mihronoh1123 i was so offputted by the scene until kratos stopped him, then it hit
Kratos telling Atreus that he was wrong to tell him to close his heart to others, to open his heart to their suffering and help them in any way he can is one of my favourite character moments ever. Kratos well and truly changed his nature and if he stays the path will become a God of peace and prosperity rather than destruction and wrath, beautiful character arc.
I think even GOW PS4 missed a lot about his previous characterization. It's painted like everything was his fault due to his anger, but kind of ignore how horribly he was abused and betrayed over and over. At that point what else could he do but fight back.
The series was always a power fantasy, but not just for powerful violence, but to feel like maybe if you could just fight back against anyone who has used and hurt you if you get angry and indignant enough.
Kratos was a product of the world around him and eventually destroyed that world bc it was broken. The more he's betrayed and manipulated the angrier and more violent he gets. Even when he tries to do things differently or end it all he's just used again and forced into the cycle.
And it's interesting how the true way to have stopped him would have been kindness, but there was no kindness in the gods, so he had to give up his humanity. But yet, in his last act, he shows kindness and releases hope back into the world.
I’m with you on that.
They hardly mention anything from the first game. They also act like killing Zeus was the worst thing he did.
Btw, Mimir does say that "the pantheon got it coming".
I think you're missing the point :
Every human being, after they commited a serious crime against innocents just because they stand in their way, feel like they weren't right on doing it.
I doesn't blame himself for killing the gods, he blame himself for making that deal with Ares and for killing many people who wasn't deserving his Anger
@@leonpaelinck
Indeed
@@axelkarsis3576
Fair enough
I didn't actually know about all those articles, they have no idea, the first God of War is basically a greek tragedy, everything from a pretty unsympathetic hero to a very tragic and sad ending
People dismiss Kratos' plight for the same reason people ignore male suicide. Obviously, this is a fantasy story with the pain he's enduring pushed to the extreme. But trauma on weak men is justified by them being weak, and trauma on macho looking men that got that way from struggle isn't real because they are strong. It's such a toxic interpretation of how men deal with trauma.
Kratos is like travis bickle but on steroids. He was betrayed and wronged and no one understood him, yet he's painted as a monster because he fights back against the hatred and those who shunned him.
On god. He is one of the few characters in video games to have CANONICALLY COMMITTED SUICIDE in front of the viewer and their reaction is "Wow toxic masculinity". Bro how much does the guy have to suffer before you look past the fact that he is a man?
@@speedking7224 Travis Who?
@@SimoneBellomonte bickle
I’d also like to say that even if he is a monster in Gow 3, he still has some morals. He doesn’t want to kill Hercules or Hephaestus until they actively try to kill him. While he does kill the princess and the entire world, he has a heart scrap for those who remind him of what he’s lost. A father protecting his daughter and a brother, although he does viscously murder both of them in the end.
Suffer none who stand before a man and hinders him in his quest for vengeance -probably Kratos
Kratos may even be simpathetic towards Hercules (or the accurate version Herakles/Heracles) seeing as Heracle was a honorable Demi god and God who killed his own family after Lyssa send by Hera made him lose his mind.
Love this video.
It disgusts me when I hear people say that God of war was never had a good story until it becomes like the Last of Us with God of war 4.
Also I don't know how it was a retcon if the end credits shows that Kratos was still alive.
The only retcon in GoW4 in my opinion is that Kratos has the blades of chaos and not the blades of exile which would make more sense and they did the same thing with the flashbacks in hell in the game and they don't use the old voice actor so it doesn't sound right to me.
@@EthanTheDinoNerd Its stated in the old games that he put away the blades of chaos, he only has them because they're bound to his soul and they appear around him no matter how many times he tries to get rid of them. None of it is a retcon, it's all following up from the old GoW games and I don't buy for a second that the old games are forgotten or disrespected. People just say shit
It disgusts you?
@@godzillazfriction and I see you didn't forget GoW Betrayal
@@User-es3em
It's still a plot hole. because Ares, their maker, stripped him of the blades, they were gone. and he was gifted the blades of athena in return to killing ares, which evolves later to the blade of exile. So it doesn't make sense how the baldes of chaos returned out of the nowhere !
Also it was never stated that blades would follow kratos. what is said is, the blades chains are forever attached to kratos flesh and can never be removed.
Kratos is like an onion, he has many layers.
Gods have *L A Y E R S*
Nice Shrek reference.
Spot on
And makes ne cry
Well, he did climb to the highest peak on the highest mountain. Much like shrek
one big point you forgott to mention is that kratos doesnt go the extra mile to kill. all the gods he killed he did because they were o his way to zeus or didnt allow to go after zeus. he didnt want to kill hercules as he says...this is not between us hercules. but hercules kept on insisting that by killing kratos he will earn the grace of approval. hermes he could not have been bothered to kill but hermes dropped those fire bars and kratos got triggered. imagine turning your back to a tiger or provocating him. perses the titan he one shots with the blade attacked kratis first. kratos was just flying the icarus vent but perses attacks him. not all fights have been started by kratos. that is important to remember
Agreed I’m surprised he never mentioned it cause that plays a big part in his humanity he didn’t kill everybody in his way cause he had to but because it was necessary at particular times and sometimes not point being hey at least he tried
Even with Zeus’ wife, she provoked him. He should’ve had self control, but she also should’ve known better than to go at someone who is as angry as Kratos how she did
"Hermes dropped those fire bars and Kratos got triggered"
Sorry, but I just pictured Hermes dropping a diss track about Kratos to his face lol.
Except for that one time in God of War 1 where he just geabs the key to the door on the ship and drops the captain down the Hydra's throat.
Sure, the captain isn't a god, but still, it was a bit unnecessary.
But I gotta admit, it still cracks me up to this day how he just casually drops him.
@@mark030a yeah. hahahah we dont talk about that. nah just kidding.
i always felt that that was somehow even for kratos out of character. i never felt like it was the right thing he did. lets not forget. he killed him like 3 times lol.
I love the growth of Kratos from the beginning. A man in extreme emotional pain, fighting for release, to a father with a loving son and at least some peace.
Kratos's wife and child was supposed to be in Sparta. Ares placed them in the Oracle's village to manipulate Kratos into killing his own family. Kratos was possessed by the power given to him by Ares and in his blind rage and loyalty, he killed his family without realizing it.
A re used story from Heracles
13:26 This idea is beautifully put in God of War (2018) as well, when Freya says to Kratos "You are just an animal! Passing on your cruelty and rage; you will never change!", to which Kratos responds "Then you do not know me."
chills bro, damn
Ares also thought that in completing the blood oath by killing his wife and child, that Kratos will always serve him as enforced by the furies. Kratos was under their illusion since he started serving Ares but the illusion broke once he killed his wife and child. Ares probably didn't know this would happen. But even if so, the furies were supposed to enforce Kratos servitude due to the blood oath, but Kratos defeated them. He was the first to ever do this, so Ares probably didn't think Kratos was strong enough to do it at this point.
Ares is the best definition of “be careful with what you wish”
Iirc, it's implied that during Kratos' ransacking, Ares blinded him with rage, which has mythological basis. Hera did something incredibly similar to Hercules, even leading to Herc killing his wife and child in a similar fashion, leading to his 12 labours as atonement
I maintain the time travel thing was a good call. He's so detached from who he was he doesn't even consider the idea he could save Sparta or his family, it just doesn't occur to him. He's THAT completely tunnel visionsed with pure fury
Great vid 👍
*Heracles
I think you've summed up Kratos's characterization really well. Because even though I was convinced at one point that he was a rampaging monster in human form, in a subconscious level, I was actually questioning that notion. And your explanation of him brought that to a conscious level. And for that, I thank you.
As a sort-of aspiring storyteller writing a book, I would go on and dare say that the first God of War game actually follows the three-act structure quite well. And here's how:
Story's premise: Kratos goes on a journey to stop Ares from threatening Olympus on behalf of the gods. (External conflict)
Internal Conflict:
Protagonist's desire - Kratos wants to have his nightmares erased from his mind.
Protagonist's fear - Kratos is constantly reminded of his misdeed of killing his own family.
Protagonist's misbelief - If Kratos accomplishes certain tasks for the gods, his nightmares will be erased from his mind.
Act I:
The Hook - Kratos is shown fighting the Hydra on behalf of Poseidon showing us players from the get-go what kind of game we're all in for. After Kratos (the player) kills the Hydra, backstory is shown about Kratos about what Kratos is and why he is this way. In the first few minutes, Kratos's internal conflict is shown through backstory during his time as a Spartan military leader, pledges himself to Ares, and consequently, Kratos under Ares's lust-for-blood spell ultimately leads Kratos to murder his own wife and child.
The Setup - Kratos, on the verge of defeat and death, pledges himself to Ares. After Ares hears Kratos's call out of desperation, Kratos is given the Blades of Chaos by Ares.
The Inciting Incident - Kratos goes on a rampage for the glory of Sparta and as a catalyst of Ares as the perfect warrior. Eventually this leads to Kratos unknowingly murdering his own family in a temple they were taking refuge in. And as a consequence, Kratos is forced to wear the ashes of his dead family on his skin for all to see what he has become.
The Build-Up - He's confronted with the horror of what he's done and is now forced to live with the reality of his actions and the consequence of pledging himself to Ares.
1st Plot Point - Kratos decides to throw away his pledge to Ares and wants to have his nightmare of his actions erased by serving the gods instead of Ares.
1st Pinch Point - The gods wish to use Kratos to stop Ares after Ares decides to threaten Olympus itself. The reason for this is because Zeus forbids the gods from waging war with one another.
Act II:
Pre-midpoint action hero - Since Ares knows what's going on with Kratos, he sends hordes of his minions to stop Kratos.
Midpoint - Kratos is tasked to obtain Pandora's box which is supposed to help him in his quest to stop Ares.
Post-midpoint action hero - Kratos goes to the Desert of Lost Souls to obtain the box from Pandora's temple which is strapped onto Cronos's back. Kratos knows how next to impossible this task is but accepts the task regardless.
2nd Pinch Point - Ares is soon made aware that Kratos is in the Desert of Lost Souls and knows that Pandora's box is there.
Act III:
Supposed victory - Kratos finally reaches Pandora's box. But he has no idea that Ares knows of this.
Disaster - Ares throws a massive column that travels across the world and impales Kratos effectively killing him. And in the process, Ares's minions take the box away from Kratos.
Dark moment - Kratos is falling into the underworld as he is now dead.
Recovery - Kratos fights his way out of the underworld. With the help of the mysterious gravedigger, Kratos knows that Olympus is still on his side after all this time.
Climactic Confrontation - Kratos opens Pandora's box and goes toe-to-toe with Ares. This is the final boss battle in the game.
Victory - Kratos eventually kills Ares after a long and arduous fight.
Resolution - Kratos is eventually shown the true colors of the gods as they never meant to wipe away his nightmares as he himself believed that they might despite the fact that this promise was never made to him in the first place. Because his misbelief has been laid out for him in the end, Kratos tries to commit suicide but the gods don't allow this. Instead they allow him to become the new god of war in place of Ares. Which wasn't really something Kratos actually wanted to begin with. Which also sparks a series of Kratos giving the gods that what-for for not granting him what he asked for in the first place.
Sorry this was a long comment post but after playing the game and beating it and then going it over with the three-act structure I now use to tell my own story of a former Army Ranger going on a quest for revenge of the man that assassinated his mother, I just had to do a little comparison of the three-act structure to God of War. And from what I find, the developers for the first game have done this beautifully. God of War will always be one of my all-time favorite video game series despite the fact that I no longer own a Playstation and instead play on PC.
In the novels, for me, the best parts are the politics of the gods and Athena was watching Kratos battle with Ares and they had an interesting exchange. It went more or less like.
Athena: "So, father, after defeating Ares, Kratos is goign to have his sins forgiven, won't he?"
Zeus: "Yes yes"
Athena: "And forgiving his sins is going to take the nightmares away, right?"
Zeus: "Who said anything about nightmares?"
Athena: "What?"
Zeus: "Killing your own family is a heinous crime, one that comes with a curse that even I live with me to this day. Kratos won't have his nightmares removed, but rather, we are going to honor him with Ares' throne instead as the new God of War."
Athena: "Father, you can't just do this! You can't dangle the promise of removing his nightmares to get ten years of service and then cast it all away like it's nothing! Kratos doesn't need forgiveness for his sins, but rather a decent night of sleep!"
Zeus: "Shut up, now let's watch the battle, it seems like Ares has the upper edge on your champion."
Idk if this comment is being condescending to the writers or complimenting the writers.
Of course the GoW games had good writing in it, that's why they are regarded as good games.
Love this
Get a real job ! Ur all such leaches to society 😔
@@d.tsukuyomi1869 jeez Zeus was an ass even in the actual mythology he wasn't a good god
I will respectfully disagree on the Ares part for a specific reason. He wanted Kratos to have no ties to the mortal realm and become stronger. Ares likely didn't have a clue what killing them would do because already to him, why should anyone one care? He's a god, what need does he have for family? That and literally having a god complex probably meant that Kratos being distraught would make no sense to him.
I just think they should have made it more clear that it was the deception of Ares. The presentation seems a bit wishy-washy.
@@TBP that's fair, I think the implication is that Ares had moved Lassandra and Calliope from Sparta to this location and, like many others, used Kratos lust for conquest against him. The last part I see being Ares fault, but the family part isn't fully explained. Kratos regardless is still at some level of fault.
@@TBP it's in the novels
The Furies did that under Ares order.
"They were not there by chance Kratos"-The Fury while in her Oracle form
Also supported by the Queen of the Furies knowing how his wife looked to appear as her
@@TBP I think there was a line in the first game where it tells u that Ares gave Kratos the mission to attack Athena's temple or something like that so that at least gave a little foreshadowing. I doubt Kratos is foolish enough to think that Ares wouldn't know that his family is there.
What makes Kratos a compelling character is the fact that he’s very much shaped by his tragedies. Losing Deimos to Ares and Athena completely hardened him, and eventually drove him on a quest for power to prove his strength, and remain true to his Spartan origins. His wife and child were killed because Ares manipulated Kratos’ brutality into absolutely blind rage, and as a result, he killed Calliope and Lysandra. Ares thought that power meant more to Kratos, and wanted to sever his earthly tethers to make him the perfect warrior. He taught, because of his pride and power, that he was untouchable but didn’t take into consideration that Olympus will aid his bastard half brother. The irony here is that he moulded Kratos into the beast he became, and didn’t think that beast’s power and skill would exceed his own. Ares was resourceful but he was no match for Pandora’s box’ power. All this, coupled by Persephone causing him to lose Calliope again, and then losing Deimos and his mother, absolutely devastated him and left him with nothing but vengeance. His own father ruined him, caused his brother’s death and torment along with his mother, then betrayed him and made him lose the last thing The Ghost of Sparta cared about- Sparta. Kratos was always an incredibly compelling and somewhat understandable character, and was always likeable, but the sequel humanised him completely and made him completely likeable. He’s a man who found strength even in the darkest moments, quite literally, whether it be his absolute rage against Thanatos after he killed Deimos, or his drive for redemption causing him to kill Persephone after abandoning Calliope, or his desire for revenge and peace after realising Sparta’s fate. Also I definitely agree that Kratos has PTSD. He had visions, tremendous amount of guilt, nightmares, prone to rage, and avoided telling his son the full truth of his past. The overwhelming guilt and shame still greatly affects his life till this day, even if he forgave himself. Although he loves Atreus, he’d wish his family was still alive.
I always felt Kratos's rage toward Zeus happened initially during the events in 'Ghost of Sparta' because this was when he found out that Zeus was his true father, who then proceeds to warp his mother into the monster, forcing him to kill her at the moment he finds she is still alive.
No, it was a total shock to Kratos, when Athena told him that he is Zeus's son. His mother tried to tell him about Zeus, but she never managed to actually do that, turning into a monster.
@@dan_man3087 My mistake. It was when he found out his brother was still alive.
7:34 actually what really happened when kratos was raiding that village was normal. He was sent by ares to destroy that village. At first his wife and daughter were not there in that village but then area transported them there in that house right before kratos killing them so in reality it really was ares fault since he was the one who teleported both his wife and daughter there knowing that those were his only connections remaining and not knowing that his mother and brother still live. Area thought that this would make the perfect warrior who would be able to defeat gods like in gow 3.
That use of the button mash to show Kratos’ struggle with leaving his daughter, is both the greatest use of a bottom mash I’ve ever seen in a game, and shows to me that the original GOWs were far more then just ‘immature toxic masculinity’.
That moment with Caliope is the definitive moment that I remember from the original series. Not any of the gruesome executions, the one moment where he has to leave his daughter behind. And it was put in a game that not many people played.
That had to be the most difficult thing for Kratos to do in the game like imagine yourself in Kratos position you're finally reunited with your daughter who's been dead for years but then having to leave her to keep her from being wiped from existence?
I can agree that the moment in CoO when Kratos had to give up his daughter was so profound and fantastic writing. Great video
I followed most of Kratos' story from beginning to end, and while I agree, I'd like to point out God of War 3 had an additional narrative element that really made me think. It actually runs across your point of context surrounding the circumstances.
The Greek gods were corrupted by that time. As much as they were dicks before, they got worse after Pandora's box was opened. And my speculation of why they safeguarded the box was not because they thought that it had power that Kratos could take, but it was a means to absorb or remove the corruption that took hold. They themselves don't know it, but the shadow that is influencing their actions could have and made moves to do so. Of course, that's an opinion.
And I don't actually see any retcons on the PS4 era. We see at the end of GOW3 Kratos actually survived, a blood trail moving away from where he stabbed himself. And Mimir pretty much confirms that the 'world' is split up into different areas where a certain group of Pantheons reside in. So in essence, Kratos didn't destroy the world, and it was okay again in GOW4. He most likely destroyed Greece and its neighboring countries that worshipped the same gods, though, but left enough power for it to rebuild itself. And I can see why he acted so restrained with Atreus around, but I also saw glimpses of his old self when fighting his enemies (Atreus comments on that randomly too, "You scare me sometimes") or when boy was getting a little too uppity when he was finally cured off his long time disease and got recognition from his father (the 'normies' attribute it to just arrogance, and I attribute it to him being too happy, and then annoyed when Kratos tries to keep him in check).
All in all, despite the words of the director, they maintained his character, bringing him in the direction of how he'd act if he got another chance in happiness, and desperation to protect his only living son whilst also teaching him to survive the long life of suffering Atreus will most likely experience.
I'm just hoping that Ragnarok doesn't stray too far from that.
I just feel like it would have resonated more with me if they kept the original voice actor.
This is why I love GoW4. They didn't wipe the slate clean. They built upon Kratos and how he has tried to be his own person rather than the one society made him.
I feel like this video makes the ending of Ragnarok so much more rewarding. After everything he has done and been through he has finally earned his happy ending and his redemption.
I remember being amazed at the scene where he's fighting and giving all his health to his wife and daughter..thst made me love the first game
Kratos is essentially a product of his upbringing. Everyone in youth starts off innocent & pure. Only through processing the pain & adversity’s faced can a person still maintain their good within them. For some people, though? That built up anger & bitterness is permanent.
This was great to watch as I do miss old kratos than dad of boy. Honestly, I was really hoping you’d talk about the Kratos and sweet tooth conversations from PlayStation battle royale lol
That ame had a really obvious rivalry to do with Kratos and Evil Cole.
@@godzillazfriction nah bro old gow are play alot thats why he said i miss old kratos he want more new games with young kratos atleast one short game with young kratos
@@godzillazfriction then play the new games instead of complaining about people saying "I miss the old Kratos" like stfu.
Excellent video! And great job showcasing Kratos's motivations and layers in the original run of games. Devil's advocate, what games journalists are clumsily trying to say is that "Greek Kratos"'s primary motivation is vengeance, whereas "Norse Kratos"'s primary motivation is love - respecting his dead wife's wishes, teaching his son to be better, keeping the demons at bay - it's a more relatable and nuanced character trait, than having succumbed to his (arguably justified) rage. Fantastic vid and congrats on the 1M! 💚
You know, not to be one of those guys, but it's interesting to see you here. Back when I was at peak wrestling fandom, I used to watch you, Dalyxman and Foolkiller99 religiously.
19:33
Although it is heavily implied that all the destruction from killing Greek Gods is world-wide, from God of War 2018 you can infer that it was localized, possibly to Greece or just the Mediterranean area, so I don't really see it as a ret-con as much as a sequel to a vague end of God of War 3
didn't kratos leave that realm when he passed over to norse god realm?
@@jalenwise9800 Yes, because each pantheon is it's own world, not planet because it is infinite, with the seas, sky and cosmos being so, and in the norse pantheon they have there own realms which are basically universally infinite, which also has the world tree which contains all of existence, which does not exist in the greek world.
@@stormzy-_-4238 I think the simpler interpretation is that the Greek gods rule over Greek lands, not necessarily their own _literal_ worlds, but rather their own realms - regions.
@@Resi1ience Although some would think it would be different lands, and kratos just travelled by foot, some would say it is different realms/worlds, etc
@@Resi1ience I prefer thinking of it as worlds/universes though, especially if you know just how big the God of War world is.
I always respected Kratos for his depressing and painful past. His new tone in the newer games makes sense to me.
"To call those journalist surface level would be an insult to the ground floor."
-Me not stealing jokes from iDubzz
Kratos is one of my favorite protagonists ever. Everything about him is just so well done, from his design to his glimpses of humanity, and even his temper tantrums
Watching this video brought me a new admiration for Ragnarok Kratos. How he carries himself through his actions, his own acknowledgment of how he can slip back into his senseless killing in GoW3, and how much he is terrified of losing his son due to his past.
I'm a woman myself, and I watched the entire GOW series cutscenes from beginning to end. He isn't mysoginistic, he kills Gods of any gender XD
And his grief is for two women, his wife and daughter. I don't get how he's seen as sexist??? Kratos is an awesome character and I love his story! He's brutal, badass, but also really misguided by revenge. Everyone he ever meets seems to die, minus GOW4 though. I kinda like him better in 1-3 than 4 because the rage filled Kratos is honestly cooler XD But it's good that he had redemption.
The reason why games journalists claim that GOW is sexist is because of the sex mini games.... and that's the only reason. Just people trying to make a quick buck out of complaining about something so minuscule.
@@macgyver42563 What???? 🤣 That reminds me of GTA5s prostitute feature lmao. That's not sexist, just absolutely hilarious 😂
@@ilikebeanies3499 Something I've noticed as time has gone by is that there will be people who get offended at literally *anything* and use that to voice their opinions, whether or not those opinions make sense.
@@macgyver42563 that's the only reason why. It's as if none of them played a single GoW game, I bet they didn't even play 4 either.
Why is everyone so against revenge? Kratos was treated APPALLINGLY. Why shouldnt he have wanted revenge? Not saying I approve his methods.... but turning the other cheek is simply enabling evil people.
As a fan of the series since the very first game, I very much agree with this video. Good stuff!
Hades was definitely the one god with the most creative liberty taken in his depiction in the games. Dude was pretty chill in the actual mythologies, only becoming a player in a conflict due to the hero of the week trying to mess with the natural order of things.
Can you imagine if Hades was more mythically accurate in the games?
I think a key point you missed is that when Kratos decides to choose humanity over himself at the end of God of War 3, he says "My vengeance ends now." It is Kratos finally admitting to himself that he is responsible for his problems. It's a beautiful ending detail that really must be praised.
13:12 I'd say that it takes that much strength not just because it's emotionally difficult for him, but also because he wanted to get her off of him without hurting her.
I think the villain in the games was always Athena. She was the one who asked Ares to leave Kratos alive. She was the one always telling Kratos what to do next. Even in the end of GOW remastered, she wanted Kratos to give her the hope to give it to mankind but she would've never done that and Kratos by killing himself actually gave the power to the world. Athena even said: They won't know what to do with it, showing she intended to keep it for herself
Yeah she used and manipulated him just like everyone else.
In GoW4, Kratos even hallucinates Athena. Even he himself realized that it was Athena who manipulated him the most
I think she wanted the hope again from the beginning
Athena in GoW 1 was decent to hbe fair, she just became a manipulative asshole after Kratos opened Pandora's Box and infected the gods with the evils of manking. We know Zeus got Fear, Ares got Grudge, Poseidon got Rage, Aphrodite got Lust (probably), Hermes got Arrogance, Hercules got Ambition etc
And Athena got Greed. In GoW II novelization, she says that Olympus was upside down and how stuff was changed and different and she was no exception: saying, that, for times, her mind just wandered and she just did stuff and said stuff she didn't remember.
I always assumed Kratos did take blame for the murder, he's referenced it a few times. Even in 3 saying "I'm sorry...." and blaming ares for the setup.
Also he blatantly saves the civilian at 14:15, which was just a cool detail.
Also kills civilians just for green orbs
Agreed w everything in the video up until GOW4. I don’t think Kratos’s characterization was built to be “oscar-based” or “standard good-guy” or even that that particular genre has become tiresome. I really just think they wanted to emphasize the fact that Kratos has become older, and (typically) with age comes wisdom. Kratos is wiser, and now that he has someone else to live for (Atreus) he has to cling to the little humanity he has left and build upon it for the sake of his *BOY*. I think it’s a perfect way to continue his story, quite honestly. He’s burnt out from being the monster he once was, and all he wants now is to become better, which he even says multiple times throughout the game. Don’t sleep on God of Boy, man. Yes, it’s different from the main line of GOW games, but it’s for a good reason. Not just to appeal to modern gaming (completely, anyway)
I am so glad someone said this! The way they are building the story makes sense, they didnt want to just make 'another god of war game', their development of kratos wasnt just to appeal to the modern audience, it was because they know people are done with angry man kratos and people would prefer a new type of kratos, A man trying to be better and to give Kratos a second chance to be a father again and make up for all his mistakes as a father and as a man.
Absolutely! I think it's the perfect progression for the character. God of War 3 is basically a psychotic episode for Kratos, who stops at nothing to achieve his revenge. All that rage and bloodshed happens maybe in the span of one day, and is basically Kratos' version of a mental breakdown where he destroys everything and everyone on his way. After all the pain, destruction and basically genocide, it would honestly make no sense to keep him acting the same way after the adrenaline dies down. He has to eventually own up to his actions and try to be a better person and that's what he does in God of War 4, so it's not generic, it just makes sense.
Yeah honestly after having played and experienced it for myself I felt it was much the opposite of Kratos being an oscar baitey wise man who knows everything character, sure he's wise, but often enough I found him fairly quiet during moment when a normal goody two shoes would give the perfect answer to everything. Kratos is headstrong and makes nifty little snarky or annoyed comments, or just stays quiet during a lot of things, silently judging letting others do the work, but also opening up sometimes when he feels like it. And slowly growing to open up more over the course of the game. I was reminded of this video and other critical perceptions and just had to think that Kratos, surprisingly, feels very much like the same character as the in the original games. Don't get people's problem with either dissing the old for being super edgy or the new for being an "oscar" game while both are neither. Looking forward to Ragnarök.
Kratos has quite the dark and melancholic backstory filled with bloodshed and betrayal. that’s rough man…☹️
Like even kratoses dad shish kebabd him through the guts like good grief
“You are cruel, arrogant and selfish…but you are more than that. You have always been more than what others saw…you *are* more than that.”
Yeah whatever
The only issue with killing Poseidon’s princess for me is that damn trophy that trivializes the story beat. The act itself within the context of the story works and makes sense. That stupid “I didn’t do it…but I wish I did” trophy is what makes it fucked up in a meta-sense. I don’t know who’s idea that was, but whoever they were I can tell you that I don’t respect them at all.
And look at Kratos eyes when he ties her there,there in nothing inside,scary af
@@newhybrid101 Yep, within the story it’s a great moment.
still tho the trophy felt in estimate necessary 2 comment on its own meta sense
Kratos always had some depth to him. I think just the insane change in his character from 3 to 4 make it stand out so much and it was the first time his character went through a development like that
You didn't play till the end of God of War 3. God of War 4 is a follow up to Kratos' character arc at the end of God of War 3.
''If all on olympus will deny me my vengeance, then all on olympus will die''. He didnt crave the destruction of entire olympus. Maybe he even wanted to CHANGE olympus, to make them better, turn them from dickheads to gods who actually care about mortals. But he wasnt given a choice, zeus was afraid of being overthrown so he sent all the gods into the blender even someone as petty as hermes. Kratos would not have killed Hera either, he was aware that she posed no threat whatsoever but only killed her when she talked shit about pandora. Hercules would not have died either.
Yea kratos literally told Hercules that he didn’t want to fight him but Hercules decided to get in the way of kratos getting his revenge so kratos killed him
And Hercules decided to fight kratos over jealousy seeing how kratos was outshining Hercules while they were both serving the gods and doing their tasks
Please correct me if i'm wrong, but iirc he didn't kill Aphrodite. At least you don't see him do it. Also Athena is still there since she pulls the sword out of him after he stabbed himself. Doens't that mean the pantheon does still exist in some form?
@@Equinoksl somewhat I agree. I think four gods survived his attack. Athena who is some kind of specter, Aphrodite who survived for very tempting reasons, Artemis who if I remember right didn't even appear in the game, and the god of wine. Seriously I doubt he would have tried to kill Kratos. Just offered some booze
That CS Lewis quote though... Really does sum up the argument nicely. It was a tough read for me but the Abolition of Man was really eye opening.
This man deserves any and ALL happiness that comes his way
All I have to say is that Guts got real fucking easy and that's saying something!
in 19:35 he went to a completely different universe which is the main reason why everything isn't destroyed, its not retconned, he still destroyed an entire world and had to live with that knowledge, getting ptsd like trauma from in before the events of god of war 4
This is an absolutely amazing and great character breakdown. And in my opinion, it makes the way he's shown in the new games even greater. Too go from being that broken, and growing to be almost human again, shows a lot of internal strength. I especially love how you explained how much effort it took him to leave his daughter. Absolutely amazing explanation.
Your final conclusion about how he's a man of contrast sums him up probably the best. Couldn't have said it better myself. Good shit, bro.
This is nothing unusual. I've always known that Kratos was never a complete bad guy but was forced to be enraged due to tragic life that followed him. If I lost my own family for the same reason, I'd also be engulfed in flames of rage and wouldn't be the same "Mr. Nice guy" anymore
But he always brutal man until he meet a woman who make him less brutal
I loved GOW3 so much because its the point where he finally breaks and becomes absolutely ruthless. He doesn't care about anyone, and doesn't care what happens to them.
The thing is, Kratos from GoW1 to 3, has nothing more to lose and bet than his own life, except times when he has to care for Caliope or Pandora... In GoW4 and Ragnarok, the thing is not just about him, but about Fey's will and the Boy. Having something to fight besides your own life or revenge, changes everything always.