Audio podcast version on The VPZD Show, links, transcript, and more: zdoggmd.com/vpzd-4 0:00 Intro 2:17 Boosters for All? 8:47 Young people + Covid, flawed CDC studies? 12:45 Natural immunity, Myocarditis, population risk vs. benefit 21:15 The narrative of simplicity and one-size-fits-all in public health 27:12 How we’re treating college students re: COVID quarantine, boosting, testing 30:45 Omicron, animal source? 34:08 Journalistic responsibility, and natural immunity revisited, what healthcare CEOS should do 43:28 Dr. Oz and the state of politics due to COVID disruptions in economy and freedoms 47:40 Socioeconomic status effects under COVID policies 53:59 Why so slow to learn more about vaccine resistance and omicron? The role of media 57:31 Therapeutics like fluvoxamine (Luvox) vs. molnupiravir 1:04:50 Zero COVID is a delusion, so focus protection where it matters 1:05:27 Fluvoxamine and the hydroxychloroquine/ivermectin debacle 1:08:23 Fauci’s foibles 1:12:12 Gain of function research 1:21:56 Listening to doctors 1:26:45 Pandemic of lunacy, gain of fear, and Fear-naught values 1:32:57 Cloth masks, and masking as distraction from real risks 1:34:58 Chemotherapy shortages
I take 3 antidepressants so I must be 3x protected. And I live in Pennsylvania. The sorry thing about my state is if you are rich and want to be a senator move here.
You're the first doctors I've witnessed, since the very outset of the pandemic, to speak rationally about it. If only people like you were in charge, the world would be in much better shape.
This is possibly the most based, honest, comprehensive, and intelligent yet accessible conversation around covid that I've ever heard. Rational intelligent conversation is as precious as it is rare in this era. Thank you.
I disagree with you only based on this fact. these great gentlemen need to be talking to someone who disagrees with them to present their side of the argument and to challenge them on their comments. that would make the conversation much much more valuable
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 that's fair. In my mind the part of that other perspective was inhabited by some of Z's past takes compared to his current stance. It's been interesting watching the emotional reactions & staunch takes soften and change over time toward this area of better balance than before. Not excusing the absence of a dissenting voice, just laying out where my own perspective came from.
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 the entirety of the corporate media and government health officials disagrees with them! Only these guys are actually citing good data.
For someone that majored in and microbiology in college, I was starting to doubt my basic knowledge on how viruses work and how to look at data objectively. I have friends and family members that are comparing this to Polio which blows my mind. Thank you for helping me make some sense of it all.
I am a nurse and we can not find nurses… they are leaving in droves.. I have been with my hospital for over 40 years and can’t wait to retire…5 years ago I thought that I would work part time after retirement age but after the last few years between covid and lack of respect by the upper management makes many of us want to leave sooner than later.
I've been a nurse my whole life almost and trying to find a non-nursing position is also a pain in the ass but I want no part of any of it right now if ever again
If I was a nurse I’ would leave too ! I’m a Vietnam veteran (pilot) and in the military back then they would line us up and get vaccines , one was the swine flu etc my point is that in the military back then we didn’t have a choice we were the property of the government , these mandates are looking and feeling very familiar ! But the US citizens !are not in the military God help us🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Phenomenal discussion..question, has anyone here seen where the quoted studies that they are referring to and if they are compiled by anyone on this thread. There are too many gems here.
This conversation was worth triple its time. Spot on information, hilarious, and heart-warming rapport. As an immunologist, I strongly commiserate with Dr. Makary's frustration re: public health officials completely overlooking the more comprehensive infection-acquired immunity - which actually is better at stopping transmission than the COVID vaccines we're using in N. America. It is not only terrible health policy that's borderline medically unethical, but completely irrational to deny these individuals access to public life and/or mandate they get vaccinated with a platform that comes with non-trivial risks and which presents with worse side effects in those with infection-acquired immunity. Dr. Prasad projected my response to Dr. Damania's leaf blower use. It's the most obnoxious invention.
Dr SK: I appreciate your spot- on commentary re medical/Mental health costs and will post a reply soon... BUT IN THE MEANTIME CAN I JUST SAY: Thank you so much for pointing out the almost unforgivable complicity inherent in ZDogg's comments re: LEAF BLOWERS. LEAF BLOWERS SHOULD BE EXECUTED (and then burned and buried, so we dont risk a LEAF BLOWER VARIANT showing up! While I can and will forgive ZDogg's DEAFNESS () on this topic, I'm not sure I can get over his complete reversal from his EARLIER MESSAGING RE: LEAF BLOWERS!!! For those who do not remember the lyrics to all of ZDpgg's music parodies, please see "Doctor Man" ua-cam.com/video/R4pRYbA9aLo/v-deo.html Luv you ZD: but this was too good to resist!!!
I haven't been able to find any evidence that naturally acquired immunity > than our vaccines. Most of what i read has been that natural infection can be extremely variable with its immunity. What have I missed!
@@nygreenguy There have been over 100 studies, so it appears you've missed a lot! Infection-acquired immunity has been the "gold standard" of immunity - and is the basis of vaccination. The closer the vaccine mimics natural infection (like live attenuated vaccines, e.g. small pox vaccine - the only disease we've eradicated via vaccination), the better the vaccine. The mRNA platform is the farthest thing we could have developed to mimic an actual respiratory viral infection. I've written up a little summary for folks (re: "natural infection>>vaccines_, but I'll share with you these few pieces from validated sources: www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19/94258 and this is a summary of 30 of them: brownstone.org/articles/natural-immunity-and-covid-19-twenty-nine-scientific-studies-to-share-with-employers-health-officials-and-politicians/
@@avicenna1977 I checked the information you provided via the links in your reply. The large study from Israel is an observational study, non peer reviewed, and my understanding after reading other medical and scientific publications is that the main takeaway from that study was that the COVID19 vaccines wane with time, and are less protective against the delta variant of the virus. In August, right after that large study, Israel started a large campaign to boost the vaccine recipients, which is ongoing as we speak. This study, as well as the ones the other links lead to are preprint, non peer reviewed studies. So for now, I’m still not clear what should people believe, based on science.
The world needs more of this nuance. As a healthy 24 year old who was double vaccinated with Moderna last January, I caught delta and will not be getting a booster any time soon. It just doesn’t make sense to me how we are almost completely ignoring natural immunity.
@@LuisCarruthers Exactly. The delta variant AKA indian variant has a bunch of mutations that make the vaccine a little less effective at preventing infection, although prevention of severe disease and death remains just as strong. I know a fully vaccinated person who got a mild case of the delta variant back in September
I LOVE watching intelligent people having a conversation with different opinions and they all stay friends at the end! THank you the 3 of you. I really appreciate your insight.
The most disturbing aspect of this whole pandemic, has been the silencing and dismissal of medical professionals who do not tow the ever changing official line.
I think it’s easier to reach the logical conclusion that all this is about greed and political power/points, than that it is about safety-ism. I don’t believe for one second that those with all the power at the top truly have our health as their top priority. Which is why EVERY American should be for smaller government, because, due to reality of human nature, absolute power corrupts absolutely!!!!
Guys you have no idea how necessary it is for us to have you guys. I absolutely love listening to your logic, common sense and humour that is all underpinned by critical evidence. Please keep this up. The world needs you guys!
Who said it’s ignored? You have a higher level of protection. You think it’s ignored because there is no social recognition? I agree that it should count as a vaccination in terms of getting in events and restaurants. The science still says it makes sense to get vaccinated.
Thank you Marty. We are in a scary country. Im so sad about how the government has driven fear and irrational policies regarding Covid. Let doctors do their job. And they may have different ways to go after the issue. But many oncologists have different preferences of treating the same cancer. We don’t demonize them or kick them out of the system.
Listening to this conversation was like taking a long, cool drink on an oasis in a desert. The desert, of course, being mainstream media. Thanks, guys!
I stopped watching TV many years ago when I noticed non-fiction programs using music, the presenter's tone of voice, and other elements to manipulate me into fearing specific groups of people. BTW, all, yes all, TV stations do it. Read "Virus of the Mind" by Richard Brodie. My life is peaceful and happy now that I don't watch TV.
@@kimberlycooper4170 the ads here in scotland are fucking shocking. Vaccine advert - upbeat music with a nice womans voice soothingly telling you "its safe now roll up our sleeves AGAIN" Omicron advert- no music, and eery silence in the background followed by a deep "scary" male voice. "COVID19 particles are in the air STOP THE SPREAD"
This is exactly what I needed as the crushing weight of potential reputational damage from not getting boosted as a resident of the Northeastern United States bears down upon me.
What? CDC only recently made a pronouncement recommending boosters for the Gen pop. The shamers go by government decree, they can't fault you for following gov recs.
By far the best, most rational, and evidence informed discussion about the medicine in times of the pandemic. Thank you to all 3 of you for being voices of reason
Right. You are so on for many topics. Linking the fear to HIV was a good analogy. My daughter just asked me 'should I vaccinate my children 11 and 8 because they come in contact with you.' I said no. I am 70 with CLL leukemia, but I chose to have the booster. I really don't want children to be a part of this experiment. I am enough, leave the children alone.
Jane Rawluk I think your a kind person with what you said. Kids lives are hard enough these days. I had a question about your vaccines and booster with you having CLL. I know someone with CLL they have been vaxxed and got a boster. This person's oncologist said studies have found that the vaccine may not work for CLL patients. We're you told that? That you for any input. Stay safe.
I know right but don’t hold your breath. It will never happen as it goes against the narrative of government control. I already have a few friends in their early 40’s who are taking about getting their 4th booster shot. I am all for getting the original series vaccine but this booster crap for healthy younger individuals is absurd.
Just when I yet again allow myself to be gaslighted into thinking I’m the crazy one, you post an interview that confirms my “Alt Middle, fact-based, whole-big-picture” thought process, although in the minority, is not alone in this mess, and more importantly, that confirms I’m indeed NOT the crazy one here, but instead one of the rational ones. During these dark times, that validation brought me comfort today. Thank you. Sending this one on to many who need to hear. Signed, an ED/ICU RN who IS crazy enough to still stay at the bedside after 24yrs; even with all the rona-induced moral injury, on top of the pre-covid moral injury, just not ready to walk away from my calling.
Whenever VP or M&M show up on the show, I know it's gonna be a riot and an infodump at the same time. I wish Marty could be a mainstay for the VPZD podcast, but scheduling all three of you long-term is probably a bureaucratic nightmare.
I'm so glad you guys are discussing this. As a nurse in critical care, I find myself with an unpopular view when I question why we are doing what we are doing.. It's one of the things driving some of us out of the profession. Thanks for starting conversations.
When Dr. Makary said "we now have an accompanying pandemic of lunacy" - truer words have never been spoken. This was such an amazing and entertaining discussion - wish I could have a beer with all of you.
I thought it was bad last year when once a week I was shaking my head and thinking the world has gone insane. Now it is every single day I am doing that.
So refreshing to be able to laugh along with these sane, rational, humanist, nuanced incredibly smart doctors. Thank you Drs Z, VP and Marty M! Appreciate you 🙏🏻
Had COVID LATE IN 2019,Chose not to have shot due to lung swelling with asthma. Not wanting to risk side effects & knowing I may have some immunity.Now As a Sr. Senior, I cannot eat out with friends, or socialize with my Senior Ctr. so I have been living alone on my ranch for 2 yrs. Since I seem not to be one of the pack, I am staying away from the public. Does anyone think of seniors being very, very “ lonely ?”
I understand, I got vaccinated but chose not to socialize, one friend at a time in a private setting only. I lost faith in society....it can be very lonely and it's worse when it is imposed on you
It is an insane time we are living in. Here in New Zealand they have just brought in these ridiculous so called vaccine passports. I refuse this sort of discrimination totally. The govt leader here has openly acknowledged that she is happy to have an apartheid country! She only takes questions by a set of chosen favoured journalists . I watched Dr. Julie Ponesse in Ontario speak , one of the things she quoted was , it’s better to have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned. Should find on you tube. I hope this all goes away soon and we all can live normally again.
The government may shun you but there are plenty of people who wouldn't care if you're vaccinated or not you don't have to be a complete hermit. I got vaccinated and am trying to get the booster but the online scheduling tool is so bad I'm not having much luck. If I get COVID before I can schedule the booster I'm not going to get another booster for a year or two and if I have to live like a hermit because of that it is what it is. I beilve in immunity from natural infection and the only thing that is motivating me to get to booster is not getting sick/not missing work and losing pay if I get a natural infection that motivation goes away.
@@sassysandie2865 I know a couple that's in doors 24 /7. When they go out. It's only to Dr's visits. Just thinking about not going outside have my brain ,scream let me out of here!
This is like watching a hit Netflix standup with the commercial breaks being a hard-hitting science docuseries. Science + Humor - the best combo! Keep em coming guys! Been following along for some time now. Thank you for all that you do!
Thank you for bringing up the fact that so many people died alone. I. had a mother and son both tested positive. The mother was discharged , the son died and they refused to let her come be with her son. She had it,recovered from it and they still refuse. I think back and am so ashamed that I didn't stand up
Such a important, intelligent and rational discussion about all topics. I love the charisma between the three of you and could watch this "SHOW" every week.
One of my biggest concerns now, concerning the CDC and their data, is that as a nurse, our associations decided to make a statement that said we should have our license possibly revoked if we come out against anything that the CDC or the FDA says. Basically, they said we shouldn't spread misinformation, and that includes speaking against the CDC and the fda.
Dr. Marty Makary and Scot Atlas are my go to doctors for covid-19. This episode was a breath of fresh air in an otherwise polluted world of covid information.
Your videos during study breaks I take in medical school continually motivate me to one day become a doctor as rational, humanistic, open-minded, and enthusiastic as you three.
I used to have great respect for the CDC. The way they would track outbreaks of infectious diseases, etc. This episode has exposed them as politically motivated clowns. I will never listen to anything that comes from them again.
Same. As soon as they started pushing masks is when I lost respect for them. I don't like people who promote useless theater to make the public feel safe when we know they aren't safe
This discussion was so important and I thank all three of you for making the conversation easy to digest for all facets of viewership. This example of frankness, intuition and dedication to rational thought processes is deeply constructive as we work our way out of this pandemic. Truly appreciate the three of you coming together and giving this gift of a conversation to the rest of us. You are all wonderful.
This discussion should win an award! Thank you so much for making me laugh, making happy, and making my day!
3 роки тому+1
Aspiring physician here; outstanding conversation. Really appreciate the nuanced perspective, and even the light-hearted tone (frankly, we desperately need that after ~two years of this pandemic). Thank you!
We have 3 young male friends with myocarditis months after their shot. I only know 6 young males who got it. What do we do with that? We need to truthfully look at that.
No, their answer to everything is correlation doesn’t equal causation. Which is the dumbest god damn answer since it’s used as a blanket statement. It’s called a SIGNAL
@@rachaels1136 - The CDC claim the shots have killed nobody in America. All 10k VAERS death reports were coincidence. In Scotland the number of deaths linked is like 6. Norway had 50. Germany had 400. My point is Scotland has a population of 5 million. If we have had 5 deaths America should have had 340. At least. But they are saying zero. It doesn't make sense.
@@colinthomson5358 exactly. They lie and cover up any data. They don’t ask the questions, don’t do the studies because the don’t want the truth out there. Except it already is.
Thank you all for the insight, and humor. Everything we do involves risk and consequences, and we need our policy makers to clearly, and truthfully inform us of both.
This was a great podcast by three brilliant, pragmatic, humane and laugh-out-loud funny doctors. I had not heard of Dr. Makary before and will promptly find and subscribe to his podcast!
The most important and true conversation too date. The lack of peoples ability to critically think in a time like this is quite scary. We’re too comfortable and humans are too adaptable that we will do anything as long as we are offered our comfort and normalcy back in return even if it’ll cost us dearly in the end. Thank you ZDogg
No one believes those channels. And for very good reason. Corporate media has proven itself corrupt, non-critical, superficial and as running cover for fraud, lies and corrupt policy.
The main reason they wouldn't air this information because their sponsors would be furious. (You can go check who their sponsors are and you'll get it)
We need to start hearing from Cardiologists. Dr Aseem Malhotra in the UK says specialists there are alarmed at the real level of cardiomyopathy in young men, that it's not "rare" and telling people it's a mild reaction is disingenuous because it's still permanent heart damage and will likely lead to the need to meds, heart transplant or potentially death in 15 or so years. I spoke with my family cardiologist and he says he's seeing "an alarmingly high number of young people" coming into his office in the last few months that suddenly developed, Myocarditis, pericarditis or endocarditis and he firmly believes it's from the vaccine and it's not rare at all. What happened to do no harm?
It is caused by poor practice in giving the injections. In short people are giving the jab without aspirating first and then injecting the vaccine directly into the blood stream... If that happens you are in trouble. Oh and it is rare... Not common as you may believe as we have good data on that. Dr John Cambell has a lot of videos on this problem.
@@bigbobjoee9990 not much comfort to those that suffer lifelong issues. Its time to sue the vaccinators for administering the vaccines in an unsafe manner...aspirate before injecting...its so easy to avoid this. Turns out the same poor vaccination techniques are also likely responsible for the clotting issues in the AZ shot...
@@arthol51 'it (myocarditis) is caused by not aspirating' I'm not sure that entirely explains it. Although it seems reasonable that intravenous injection does lead to myocarditis, I think post vaccine myocarditis can also happen even without inadvertent intravenous injection... Why else would post vaccine myocarditis occur multiple times more frequently after the second dose, compared to the first dose (in young men specifically) ? If post vaccine myocarditis only occured by intravenous injection, we would expect it to occur more evenly between the doses... Granted, maybe it takes a cumulative effect of intravenous injections in people whose arm anatomy predisposes them to getting an inadvertent intravenous injection... but I dunno... What do u think?
My go to source when I feel out of sorts by this crazy ass world- esp love the geek out Dr. moments which bring lightness and brevity. Please keep going fellas-we need so much more of this-
You guys rock! I’d have loved having you as Attendings back in the day. Evidence based medicine is huge, but, as my late, venerated IM prof drummed into us, keep your eyes and ears open, you can’t distinguish the horses from the zebras without both.
Once again, agree with much of what is said, with the exception of the continued denial of IVM efficacy in real world cases... We get it, clinical trials are not being regularly held, because who would pay for them without profit... But too many communities across the world have shown such benefits that it seems negligent to continue denying it.
Will be 56 tomorrow. No co-morbidities and un-boosted! Rearrange the letters in Omicron and it spells moronic, which is the word for the government's response to Omicron!
I want to sit at YOUR 'cool kids table' at school! I'm vaccinated, boosted, and potty trained. Love this - I laughed, cried, learned a lot, and I might have peed my pants a little. You ALL are great :)
You’ll probably be peeing your pants more often if you keep playing Russian roulette with your Neurological system by getting jabbed so much. I could tell you true stories of people I know who have got the vax & were hospitalized, taking out from work on a stretcher and found many clots in legs and lungs, etc… I just beat the CCP virus naturally for a 2nd time 👍🏼
Audio podcast version on The VPZD Show, links, transcript, and more: zdoggmd.com/vpzd-4
0:00 Intro
2:17 Boosters for All?
8:47 Young people + Covid, flawed CDC studies?
12:45 Natural immunity, Myocarditis, population risk vs. benefit
21:15 The narrative of simplicity and one-size-fits-all in public health
27:12 How we’re treating college students re: COVID quarantine, boosting, testing
30:45 Omicron, animal source?
34:08 Journalistic responsibility, and natural immunity revisited, what healthcare CEOS should do
43:28 Dr. Oz and the state of politics due to COVID disruptions in economy and freedoms
47:40 Socioeconomic status effects under COVID policies
53:59 Why so slow to learn more about vaccine resistance and omicron? The role of media
57:31 Therapeutics like fluvoxamine (Luvox) vs. molnupiravir
1:04:50 Zero COVID is a delusion, so focus protection where it matters
1:05:27 Fluvoxamine and the hydroxychloroquine/ivermectin debacle
1:08:23 Fauci’s foibles
1:12:12 Gain of function research
1:21:56 Listening to doctors
1:26:45 Pandemic of lunacy, gain of fear, and Fear-naught values
1:32:57 Cloth masks, and masking as distraction from real risks
1:34:58 Chemotherapy shortages
How will the high HIV population in SA affect data? There has to be a lot of untreated HIV.
I take 3 antidepressants so I must be 3x protected. And I live in Pennsylvania. The sorry thing about my state is if you are rich and want to be a senator move here.
Can you guys also discuss the covid pill from pfizer? Is ivermectin a 3cl protease inhibitor too?
The deer where whitetails in Iowa not Idaho.
It was in Ohio, the deer/Covid thing. Lol
An Indian doctor, an Egyptian doctor, and a Persian doctor walk into a recording room... I'm sorry, I just couldn't resist 🤣... I love you guys👍👍
Wait
Which one is persian? Vinay?
@@bullymaguire632 Zubin is Persian. Vinay is Indian.
You're the first doctors I've witnessed, since the very outset of the pandemic, to speak rationally about it. If only people like you were in charge, the world would be in much better shape.
This is possibly the most based, honest, comprehensive, and intelligent yet accessible conversation around covid that I've ever heard. Rational intelligent conversation is as precious as it is rare in this era.
Thank you.
Agreed!! And funniest-these guys are hilarious together. That was so informative and so entertaining!! :)
I disagree with you only based on this fact. these great gentlemen need to be talking to someone who disagrees with them to present their side of the argument and to challenge them on their comments. that would make the conversation much much more valuable
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 that's fair. In my mind the part of that other perspective was inhabited by some of Z's past takes compared to his current stance. It's been interesting watching the emotional reactions & staunch takes soften and change over time toward this area of better balance than before. Not excusing the absence of a dissenting voice, just laying out where my own perspective came from.
@@robertpadillosandiego2821 the entirety of the corporate media and government health officials disagrees with them! Only these guys are actually citing good data.
This conversation is a gift to humanity ❤️ The fact that it's being allowed to be aired fills me with a lot of hope ❤️🙏🕊️
The 'Fact Blockers' can't sort out what is humor and what is higher level cognitive thinking.
I don’t know when I’ve laughed so hard and learned so much in one episode. Honestly, we need about 100 hours of this ❤️
I agree. These 3 are Great alone , but together they are “ Priceless!” Miss Dr Monica G. Thanks for the stress relief guys & the laughters✨
@@cindybogart6062 Monica has sold out to the left tribalism. Which is sad. She jas not taken in hard questions on her positions in over a year.
🤩👍👏
Can these 3 fill the 9pm time slot on cnn that’s now open!?! How can we make this happen?
I agree with you Melissa Glassford and Cindy Bogart. These three and Dr Monica G.
For someone that majored in and microbiology in college, I was starting to doubt my basic knowledge on how viruses work and how to look at data objectively. I have friends and family members that are comparing this to Polio which blows my mind. Thank you for helping me make some sense of it all.
Me too was not adding up from day 1 with the natural immunity
I am a nurse and we can not find nurses… they are leaving in droves.. I have been with my hospital for over 40 years and can’t wait to retire…5 years ago I thought that I would work part time after retirement age but after the last few years between covid and lack of respect by the upper management makes many of us want to leave sooner than later.
I've been a nurse my whole life almost and trying to find a non-nursing position is also a pain in the ass but I want no part of any of it right now if ever again
Same management who failed to provide enough PPE in the pandemic as well
This lack of respect from upper management, is everywhere, in all fields. It is very difficult to hear that it is in the medical field also.
If I was a nurse I’ would leave too ! I’m a Vietnam veteran (pilot) and in the military back then they would line us up and get vaccines , one was the swine flu etc my point is that in the military back then we didn’t have a choice we were the property of the government , these mandates are looking and feeling very familiar ! But the US citizens !are not in the military
God help us🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Phenomenal discussion..question, has anyone here seen where the quoted studies that they are referring to and if they are compiled by anyone on this thread. There are too many gems here.
This conversation was worth triple its time. Spot on information, hilarious, and heart-warming rapport. As an immunologist, I strongly commiserate with Dr. Makary's frustration re: public health officials completely overlooking the more comprehensive infection-acquired immunity - which actually is better at stopping transmission than the COVID vaccines we're using in N. America. It is not only terrible health policy that's borderline medically unethical, but completely irrational to deny these individuals access to public life and/or mandate they get vaccinated with a platform that comes with non-trivial risks and which presents with worse side effects in those with infection-acquired immunity. Dr. Prasad projected my response to Dr. Damania's leaf blower use. It's the most obnoxious invention.
Dr SK: I appreciate your spot- on commentary re medical/Mental health costs and will post a reply soon...
BUT IN THE MEANTIME CAN I JUST SAY:
Thank you so much for pointing out the almost unforgivable complicity inherent in ZDogg's comments re: LEAF BLOWERS.
LEAF BLOWERS SHOULD BE EXECUTED (and then burned and buried, so we dont risk a LEAF BLOWER VARIANT showing up!
While I can and will forgive ZDogg's DEAFNESS () on this topic, I'm not sure I can get over his complete reversal from his EARLIER MESSAGING RE: LEAF BLOWERS!!!
For those who do not remember the lyrics to all of ZDpgg's music parodies, please see "Doctor Man"
ua-cam.com/video/R4pRYbA9aLo/v-deo.html
Luv you ZD: but this was too good to resist!!!
I haven't been able to find any evidence that naturally acquired immunity > than our vaccines. Most of what i read has been that natural infection can be extremely variable with its immunity. What have I missed!
@@nygreenguy There have been over 100 studies, so it appears you've missed a lot! Infection-acquired immunity has been the "gold standard" of immunity - and is the basis of vaccination. The closer the vaccine mimics natural infection (like live attenuated vaccines, e.g. small pox vaccine - the only disease we've eradicated via vaccination), the better the vaccine. The mRNA platform is the farthest thing we could have developed to mimic an actual respiratory viral infection. I've written up a little summary for folks (re: "natural infection>>vaccines_, but I'll share with you these few pieces from validated sources: www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-once-confers-much-greater-immunity-vaccine-vaccination-remains-vital www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19/94258 and this is a summary of 30 of them: brownstone.org/articles/natural-immunity-and-covid-19-twenty-nine-scientific-studies-to-share-with-employers-health-officials-and-politicians/
Agree with everything you mentioned! What a great episode!
@@avicenna1977 I checked the information you provided via the links in your reply.
The large study from Israel is an observational study, non peer reviewed, and my understanding after reading other medical and scientific publications is that the main takeaway from that study was that the COVID19 vaccines wane with time, and are less protective against the delta variant of the virus.
In August, right after that large study, Israel started a large campaign to boost the vaccine recipients, which is ongoing as we speak.
This study, as well as the ones the other links lead to are preprint, non peer reviewed studies.
So for now, I’m still not clear what should people believe, based on science.
Thank you all for this peek into what a dinner party of MDs must be like. I appreciate you sharing your candid conversation with us.
i always wondered about the people who want to peek through keyholes.
I've been to some and few of them are this entertaining.
The world needs more of this nuance. As a healthy 24 year old who was double vaccinated with Moderna last January, I caught delta and will not be getting a booster any time soon. It just doesn’t make sense to me how we are almost completely ignoring natural immunity.
So why did you even get "double vaccinated" in the first damn place?!
@@lorirhodes870 Presumably because she got Covid after getting vaccinated.
I agree that it would probably not make any sense to force someone like you to get vaccinated again.
@@LuisCarruthers
Exactly. The delta variant AKA indian variant has a bunch of mutations that make the vaccine a little less effective at preventing infection, although prevention of severe disease and death remains just as strong. I know a fully vaccinated person who got a mild case of the delta variant back in September
@@LuisCarruthers um yeah but still makes not a lick of sense clinically and physiologically
I love and respect Dr. Marty Makary, a hero to human beings with the highest of moral ethical standards, the man walks his talk. Thank you.
The fact that this conversation is being had - with such honesty, open heartedness and wisdom - is reason for optimism.
I LOVE watching intelligent people having a conversation with different opinions and they all stay friends at the end! THank you the 3 of you. I really appreciate your insight.
From those of us in the medical profession who are trying to sort out all of this crap, thank you!
Oh man I was just thinking how awesome it would be to have Marty and Vinay in a video together! Ask and ye shall receive!!
The most disturbing aspect of this whole pandemic, has been the silencing and dismissal of medical professionals who do not tow the ever changing official line.
I think it’s easier to reach the logical conclusion that all this is about greed and political power/points, than that it is about safety-ism.
I don’t believe for one second that those with all the power at the top truly have our health as their top priority.
Which is why EVERY American should be for smaller government, because, due to reality of human nature, absolute power corrupts absolutely!!!!
Guys you have no idea how necessary it is for us to have you guys. I absolutely love listening to your logic, common sense and humour that is all underpinned by critical evidence. Please keep this up. The world needs you guys!
I'm almost a year out from my severe covid infection. And my antibody count is over 2,500. Still! Why is my natural immunity ignored?
It doesn't make money
@@Majestros Come on now. Its about so much more than money
Because it's not about health.
Same here! >2500 and I’ve had mine tested each month for three months straight now. Had Covid back in Jan 2021.
Who said it’s ignored? You have a higher level of protection. You think it’s ignored because there is no social recognition? I agree that it should count as a vaccination in terms of getting in events and restaurants. The science still says it makes sense to get vaccinated.
Thank you Marty. We are in a scary country. Im so sad about how the government has driven fear and irrational policies regarding Covid. Let doctors do their job. And they may have different ways to go after the issue. But many oncologists have different preferences of treating the same cancer. We don’t demonize them or kick them out of the system.
Listening to this conversation was like taking a long, cool drink on an oasis in a desert. The desert, of course, being mainstream media. Thanks, guys!
Exactly! Great analogy
I stopped watching TV many years ago when I noticed non-fiction programs using music, the presenter's tone of voice, and other elements to manipulate me into fearing specific groups of people. BTW, all, yes all, TV stations do it. Read "Virus of the Mind" by Richard Brodie. My life is peaceful and happy now that I don't watch TV.
I'd give this conversation 4 out of 5 stars, if youtube had such a rating system, the way Amazon does. Why doesn't it?
@@kimberlycooper4170 the ads here in scotland are fucking shocking. Vaccine advert - upbeat music with a nice womans voice soothingly telling you "its safe now roll up our sleeves AGAIN"
Omicron advert- no music, and eery silence in the background followed by a deep "scary" male voice. "COVID19 particles are in the air STOP THE SPREAD"
Yes I agree! Was trying to think how to put it. You nailed it!
This is exactly what I needed as the crushing weight of potential reputational damage from not getting boosted as a resident of the Northeastern United States bears down upon me.
What? CDC only recently made a pronouncement recommending boosters for the Gen pop. The shamers go by government decree, they can't fault you for following gov recs.
Now imagine living vaccine free in liberal America for the past year
@@PrimetimeNut that’s meeeee!
So get vaxxed. Problem solved.
@@cdavidlake2 yeah, for immune naive. But OP's talking about boosters.
By far the best, most rational, and evidence informed discussion about the medicine in times of the pandemic. Thank you to all 3 of you for being voices of reason
Right. You are so on for many topics. Linking the fear to HIV was a good analogy. My daughter just asked me 'should I vaccinate my children 11 and 8 because they come in contact with you.' I said no. I am 70 with CLL leukemia, but I chose to have the booster. I really don't want children to be a part of this experiment. I am enough, leave the children alone.
Jane Rawluk I think your a kind person with what you said. Kids lives are hard enough these days. I had a question about your vaccines and booster with you having CLL. I know someone with CLL they have been vaxxed and got a boster. This person's oncologist said studies have found that the vaccine may not work for CLL patients. We're you told that? That you for any input. Stay safe.
Yes!! Bless you!!🥰
@@LilCraftyNook You too stay safe.
@@sandiemom8888 following.. my mother has CLL as well. Her oncologist recommended she get a booster.
@@k.pep.1253 I'm so sry your mom has CLL. How long has she had it. The person I know has CLL and another cancer called "ET" hugs
What I loved the most of this podcast, is that close proximity of friendship, watching you two share a mic. So many of the population have lost this.
Mannnnnn if only discussions like this were nationally televised...SMH...Great Job!
I know right but don’t hold your breath. It will never happen as it goes against the narrative of government control. I already have a few friends in their early 40’s who are taking about getting their 4th booster shot. I am all for getting the original series vaccine but this booster crap for healthy younger individuals is absurd.
I AGREE!!
ZDogg, Vinay, and Marty - this is absolutely the best conversation among all of the incredible discussions I have seen from the three of you.
THEE best 3, MD, communicators on the internet!!..... By far!..... And very funny, down to earth guys. IMHO, of course.
Just when I yet again allow myself to be gaslighted into thinking I’m the crazy one, you post an interview that confirms my “Alt Middle, fact-based, whole-big-picture” thought process, although in the minority, is not alone in this mess, and more importantly, that confirms I’m indeed NOT the crazy one here, but instead one of the rational ones. During these dark times, that validation brought me comfort today. Thank you. Sending this one on to many who need to hear.
Signed, an ED/ICU RN who IS crazy enough to still stay at the bedside after 24yrs; even with all the rona-induced moral injury, on top of the pre-covid moral injury, just not ready to walk away from my calling.
Whenever VP or M&M show up on the show, I know it's gonna be a riot and an infodump at the same time. I wish Marty could be a mainstay for the VPZD podcast, but scheduling all three of you long-term is probably a bureaucratic nightmare.
Thats a fantastic idea! 🤩👏
I'm so glad you guys are discussing this. As a nurse in critical care, I find myself with an unpopular view when I question why we are doing what we are doing.. It's one of the things driving some of us out of the profession. Thanks for starting conversations.
Same message about fix it with pills and drugs. How about changing or adding the message of a healthy diet and life style, exercise, lose fat?
Vinay and Marty are always good guests. I must say the three together is a greater sum than the parts.
I need more Vinay and Marty. This was great.
When Dr. Makary said "we now have an accompanying pandemic of lunacy" - truer words have never been spoken. This was such an amazing and entertaining discussion - wish I could have a beer with all of you.
This is my new favourite.....brilliant dialogue and you guys are hilarious, no fear mongering or panic felt here, thank you all
"how has our fear become so great, we can't show compassion or humanity to people" thank you so much for saying this. This is what the world needs
I thought it was bad last year when once a week I was shaking my head and thinking the world has gone insane. Now it is every single day I am doing that.
So refreshing to be able to laugh along with these sane, rational, humanist, nuanced incredibly smart doctors. Thank you Drs Z, VP and Marty M! Appreciate you 🙏🏻
Had COVID LATE IN 2019,Chose not to have shot due to lung swelling with asthma. Not wanting to risk side effects & knowing I may have some immunity.Now As a Sr. Senior, I cannot eat out with friends, or socialize with my Senior Ctr. so I have been living alone on my ranch for 2 yrs. Since I seem not to be one of the pack, I am staying away from the public. Does anyone think of seniors being very, very “ lonely ?”
I understand, I got vaccinated but chose not to socialize, one friend at a time in a private setting only. I lost faith in society....it can be very lonely and it's worse when it is imposed on you
It is an insane time we are living in. Here in New Zealand they have just brought in these ridiculous so called vaccine passports. I refuse this sort of discrimination totally. The govt leader here has openly acknowledged that she is happy to have an apartheid country!
She only takes questions by a set of chosen favoured journalists .
I watched Dr. Julie Ponesse in Ontario speak , one of the things she quoted was , it’s better to have questions that can’t be answered than answers that can’t be questioned. Should find on you tube. I hope this all goes away soon and we all can live normally again.
The government may shun you but there are plenty of people who wouldn't care if you're vaccinated or not you don't have to be a complete hermit. I got vaccinated and am trying to get the booster but the online scheduling tool is so bad I'm not having much luck. If I get COVID before I can schedule the booster I'm not going to get another booster for a year or two and if I have to live like a hermit because of that it is what it is. I beilve in immunity from natural infection and the only thing that is motivating me to get to booster is not getting sick/not missing work and losing pay if I get a natural infection that motivation goes away.
@@sassysandie2865 I know a couple that's in doors 24 /7. When they go out. It's only to Dr's visits.
Just thinking about not going outside have my brain ,scream let me out of here!
@@sassysandie2865 truth
This is like watching a hit Netflix standup with the commercial breaks being a hard-hitting science docuseries. Science + Humor - the best combo! Keep em coming guys! Been following along for some time now. Thank you for all that you do!
Thank you for acknowledging Natural Immunity. Great show!
Thank you for bringing up the fact that so many people died alone. I. had a mother and son both tested positive. The mother was discharged , the son died and they refused to let her come be with her son. She had it,recovered from it and they still refuse. I think back and am so ashamed that I didn't stand up
That just brings me to tears, Rebecca. Oh, humanity! I think that painful experience is going to motivate you to do good. Go get 'em.
🙏🙏🙏
On top of the informational benefit of watching, the complicity between you guys is so wonderfully contagious! You guys are beautiful!
Dr. Makary is my favorite! Thank you for having him on!
3 kings of sanity in the midst of a media driven cacophony of confusion. Thank you gentlemen!
Such a important, intelligent and rational discussion about all topics. I love the charisma between the three of you and could watch this "SHOW" every week.
You are the Heroes we need and Deserve. Thank you for the intelligent, accessible and fun conversation.
Thank you for having on Dr Vinnay best thing I ever got from this channel.
One of my biggest concerns now, concerning the CDC and their data, is that as a nurse, our associations decided to make a statement that said we should have our license possibly revoked if we come out against anything that the CDC or the FDA says. Basically, they said we shouldn't spread misinformation, and that includes speaking against the CDC and the fda.
They can bring it I’ll gladly bring all my evidence and research in front of a jury trial.
Agree
Medial authoritarianism.
Dr. Marty Makary and Scot Atlas are my go to doctors for covid-19. This episode was a breath of fresh air in an otherwise polluted world of covid information.
Your videos during study breaks I take in medical school continually motivate me to one day become a doctor as rational, humanistic, open-minded, and enthusiastic as you three.
I used to have great respect for the CDC. The way they would track outbreaks of infectious diseases, etc. This episode has exposed them as politically motivated clowns. I will never listen to anything that comes from them again.
FDA, FBI, Social media, government….big pharma, doctors and nurses
Same. As soon as they started pushing masks is when I lost respect for them. I don't like people who promote useless theater to make the public feel safe when we know they aren't safe
This discussion was so important and I thank all three of you for making the conversation easy to digest for all facets of viewership. This example of frankness, intuition and dedication to rational thought processes is deeply constructive as we work our way out of this pandemic. Truly appreciate the three of you coming together and giving this gift of a conversation to the rest of us. You are all wonderful.
I’m glad that in the states these talks are being had… Oh wait! Only by these doctors!
Get on it folks… Make America great again!
This discussion should win an award! Thank you so much for making me laugh, making happy, and making my day!
Aspiring physician here; outstanding conversation. Really appreciate the nuanced perspective, and even the light-hearted tone (frankly, we desperately need that after ~two years of this pandemic). Thank you!
I love the point of the corporate press’ handling of the WMD story to what is happening now
Thank you all so very very much!! Knowledge , wisdom and keeping us all sane. Much love to you all.
I’d vote for any of these guys. It’s refreshing to hear a rational moderate discussion on COVID.
As an ER MD I really appreciate this episode. I wish it was more accessible for the Joe on the street that is not fluent in the lingo of science.
there has been some discord in my family lately regarding vaccinations. the voice of reason from these doctors is so nice to hear.
Don't normally stick around for a video this long but probably would have listened for another hour and a half. Great talk and unfortunately truthful.
We have 3 young male friends with myocarditis months after their shot. I only know 6 young males who got it. What do we do with that? We need to truthfully look at that.
Horrible, sad 😳….ugh
It won't be truthfully looked at, too much money involved.
No, their answer to everything is correlation doesn’t equal causation. Which is the dumbest god damn answer since it’s used as a blanket statement. It’s called a SIGNAL
@@rachaels1136 - The CDC claim the shots have killed nobody in America. All 10k VAERS death reports were coincidence.
In Scotland the number of deaths linked is like 6. Norway had 50. Germany had 400.
My point is Scotland has a population of 5 million. If we have had 5 deaths America should have had 340. At least.
But they are saying zero. It doesn't make sense.
@@colinthomson5358 exactly. They lie and cover up any data. They don’t ask the questions, don’t do the studies because the don’t want the truth out there. Except it already is.
Thank you all for the insight, and humor. Everything we do involves risk and consequences, and we need our policy makers to clearly, and truthfully inform us of both.
This was an amazing conversation. Smart, funny, and the joy of their being together and mutual respect is clear. Thank you.
Thank you all! Great conversation.
This was a great podcast by three brilliant, pragmatic, humane and laugh-out-loud funny doctors. I had not heard of Dr. Makary before and will promptly find and subscribe to his podcast!
I could listen to Marty all day. Brilliant and so damn witty!
The three of you are awesome together! Would love to be a fly on the wall if you all went to a cocktail party together:) Thank you for your service!
The most important and true conversation too date. The lack of peoples ability to critically think in a time like this is quite scary. We’re too comfortable and humans are too adaptable that we will do anything as long as we are offered our comfort and normalcy back in return even if it’ll cost us dearly in the end. Thank you ZDogg
Thank you doctors for sharing your time, intelligence, and humor. This was so great and so greatly appreciated.
Finally, honest and informed discourse.
Can CNBC, CNN, ABC, FOX News, and every other platform play this in its entirety for every American to see, PLEASE!!
No one believes those channels. And for very good reason. Corporate media has proven itself corrupt, non-critical, superficial and as running cover for fraud, lies and corrupt policy.
@@toddr3644 unfortunately , most people get their opinions from those channels.!
@@mariamurmis4915 It's a shame, I go to their UA-cam comments and the psychotic people on there are too much.
The main reason they wouldn't air this information because their sponsors would be furious. (You can go check who their sponsors are and you'll get it)
Thank you. Call me crazy but this conversation sounds like real news. Refreshing and so rare.
We need to start hearing from Cardiologists. Dr Aseem Malhotra in the UK says specialists there are alarmed at the real level of cardiomyopathy in young men, that it's not "rare" and telling people it's a mild reaction is disingenuous because it's still permanent heart damage and will likely lead to the need to meds, heart transplant or potentially death in 15 or so years. I spoke with my family cardiologist and he says he's seeing "an alarmingly high number of young people" coming into his office in the last few months that suddenly developed, Myocarditis, pericarditis or endocarditis and he firmly believes it's from the vaccine and it's not rare at all. What happened to do no harm?
It is caused by poor practice in giving the injections. In short people are giving the jab without aspirating first and then injecting the vaccine directly into the blood stream... If that happens you are in trouble. Oh and it is rare... Not common as you may believe as we have good data on that. Dr John Cambell has a lot of videos on this problem.
The vast majority of cases of myocarditis are mild, and it is not permanent
@@bigbobjoee9990 not much comfort to those that suffer lifelong issues. Its time to sue the vaccinators for administering the vaccines in an unsafe manner...aspirate before injecting...its so easy to avoid this. Turns out the same poor vaccination techniques are also likely responsible for the clotting issues in the AZ shot...
What part of the world do u live in?
@@arthol51 'it (myocarditis) is caused by not aspirating'
I'm not sure that entirely explains it. Although it seems reasonable that intravenous injection does lead to myocarditis, I think post vaccine myocarditis can also happen even without inadvertent intravenous injection...
Why else would post vaccine myocarditis occur multiple times more frequently after the second dose, compared to the first dose (in young men specifically) ?
If post vaccine myocarditis only occured by intravenous injection, we would expect it to occur more evenly between the doses...
Granted, maybe it takes a cumulative effect of intravenous injections in people whose arm anatomy predisposes them to getting an inadvertent intravenous injection... but I dunno... What do u think?
You three just expanded compassion's circle to its greatest circumference ever! Thank You!
This was your best show in this topic. Thank you! All 3!
This might be the best podcast I’ve heard in two years. Thank you all for doing this and great job!
Damn my head is exploding from the sheer intellectualism!
This is a SUPERIOR discussion. On every level. Truth: factual, a meta-perspective. This is at the top of the pyramid. Of reality.
Damn!!! I was hoping you would do a roundtable like this and you did. Awesome!
So glad to see you 3 together ❤ Thankful for you guys! Keep up the good fight and keep teaching all of us!
This show was awesome! Dr.Z was so happy having these guests
My go to source when I feel out of sorts by this crazy ass world- esp love the geek out Dr. moments which bring lightness and brevity. Please keep going fellas-we need so much more of this-
You guys rock! I’d have loved having you as Attendings back in the day. Evidence based medicine is huge, but, as my late, venerated IM prof drummed into us, keep your eyes and ears open, you can’t distinguish the horses from the zebras without both.
Finishing up Dr. Makary's latest book. What an eye opener! So glad to have these voices available to us 'common' folks! Well done.
What's it about?
Best Saturday night entertainment. Awesome dudes. Folks, let's stop panicking. It's going to be fine. 🙂
I love all 3 of you, but all 3 of you together is AMAZING!! Thanks for all you are doing!
The best podcast I've heard this year. Thank you, guys!
Egyptian follower here. Great seeing fellow Egyptians doing great things! Dr. Makary is extremely well versed on the data. Great discussion.
You guys are so much fun to listen to and watch.i appreciate the information you put out.
More honest conversations are long overdue!! Thank you!!
The colab we have all been waiting for. These three are awesome.
I am watching this for the second time. This is the kind of open discussion I have been desperate to find. I love the laughter.
Thank you.
Once again, agree with much of what is said, with the exception of the continued denial of IVM efficacy in real world cases...
We get it, clinical trials are not being regularly held, because who would pay for them without profit...
But too many communities across the world have shown such benefits that it seems negligent to continue denying it.
India and Mexico deaths and cases down since ivermectin. Also began in Japan with great success
You would think Uttar Pradesh would be enough. Same with Japan. Nope. It worked for 9 of my family members almost instantly. That was enough for me.
Will be 56 tomorrow. No co-morbidities and un-boosted! Rearrange the letters in Omicron and it spells moronic, which is the word for the government's response to Omicron!
I want to sit at YOUR 'cool kids table' at school! I'm vaccinated, boosted, and potty trained. Love this - I laughed, cried, learned a lot, and I might have peed my pants a little. You ALL are great :)
You’ll probably be peeing your pants more often if you keep playing Russian roulette with your Neurological system by getting jabbed so much.
I could tell you true stories of people I know who have got the vax & were hospitalized, taking out from work on a stretcher and found many clots in legs and lungs, etc…
I just beat the CCP virus naturally for a 2nd time 👍🏼
Wait how did I miss this classic line? Can you point me to the rough time stamp where you heard this??
These men are unbelievable! A powerhouse force! Keep it going. I appreciate what you do.
JJ, MD here. Always enjoy your videos. Keep the knowledge flowing
I love all 3 of you so much!!!! Thanks for sharing truth!❤️🙌🏼🙏